Breaking Bread with Tom Papa - Episode 275 - Samantha Bee

Episode Date: July 29, 2025

Today Samantha Bee joins us at the table! Warning: things get steamy, we're talking menopause! Samantha shares about her tour How To Survive Menopause and why connecting with her audiences is so precious. Tom and Sam also discuss the real reason Colbert got cancelled and why Sam will be topless in Ibiza any day now. Enjoy! Check out Samantha's podcast "Choice Words with Samantha Bee" and catch her on tour "How To Survive Menopause." Go to ButcherBox.com/papa for $20 off their first box and free protein for a year. -------------- 0:00:00 Intro 0:00:40 Patreon Shoutout 0:01:05 Touring, The Hamptons, and lakes 0:04:05 How to survive menopause 0:13:26 Connection to audiences 0:16:05 Comedy is saying uncomfortable things 0:17:15 Not publicly engaging in politics 0:22:52 Why Colbert got cancelled 0:30:35 Bread, cooking, salad 0:33:50 Getting started with sourdough starter 0:36:50 Butcher Box Ad 0:39:29 Scars, moles, surviving in the woods 0:43:59 Recurring dreams, malaria pills, and bug bites 0:48:15 Bats, country vs city 0:50:34 Uncomfortable moment 0:52:58 Coldplay concert 0:55:10 Sam at 80 years old, topless in Ibiza -------------- Tom Papa is a celebrated stand-up comedian with over 20 years in the industry. Watch Tom's new special "Home Free" out NOW on Netflix! Radio, Podcasts and more: https://linktr.ee/tompapa/ Website - http://tompapa.com/ Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/tompapa Tiktok - https://www.tiktok.com/@tompapa Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/comediantompapa Twitter - https://www.twitter.com/tompapa #tompapa #breakingbread #comedy #standup #standupcomedy #bread #samanthabee #colbert Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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place to perform. It's a great theater. I mean, that's just such a great physically dynamic spiritual place. Yeah. And the idea that that could possibly just sit empty? You know what? We're going to, Dana White is going to take it back and he's going to, he's going to recreate slap fight, which was an awesome show, too, you know, gone too soon. So we'll be having so much fun in the Sullivan in theater short. Don't you worry. Keep your chin up. Yeah, we're having MMA at the Kennedy Center. We're having slap fights at Ed Sullivan.

It's breaking bread. If you haven't joined our Patreon yet, you really should. It's pretty great. You get stuff from the road. You get extra downloads after the episode, lots of cool content. Go over to patreon.com and look up our podcast. And we'd love to see you over there.

And for those of you have already signed up, we'll see you there in a little bit. So nice to have you. Oh, my God, so nice to be here. Thanks for having me. Last night, I was looking at your name because I was in West Hampton. Oh, yeah. Performing at the Performing Arts Center where you will be performing in September. That's right.

I'm going to be in West Hampton. I think on September 6 or 7th. Yeah. I'm excited. Yeah. It's nice to see you on tour. Yeah. Like it's very light.

You know what I mean? I do this little show that I love so much and I can only take it to certain types of venues. Like it has to be the right type of intimacy for me to do it the way that I like to do it. Right. So I'm very, I'm happy. I never go to the Hampton. So this is kind of fun for me. Yeah, it was really kind of, uh, yeah.

Pretty. Really pretty. Really pretty. I know. I'm a Jersey Shore guy. Okay. I go to the shore. You go to the shore.

And my family's always gone to the shore. Okay. So when I started living in New York and then went to the Hamptons just to, you know, very rarely, I was like, oh, I get it. I get it. I see what all the hubbub's about. It's like Martha's Vineyard, but right outside the city. Well, I grew up in Canada, so I'm like a Canadian lake beach lady. So I'm very accustomed to, like, beaches that are more like mud with grass coming up.

and then you fall into a lake and trapes. You kind of like stumble past the leeches, and then you're in the water, and things are touching you all the time. I got to say, Lake, yeah, that. Lake life. Yeah, that's kind of creepy. It's gross.

It smells a little weird. Oh, yeah. We used to run a place in the Catskills, actually, on this really a pretty, like, a small lake that we kind of, we swam in it, we were swam in it constantly. And there were little, I mean, Canada, we'd call them Pickerel. They're just mean, awful fish. They're like disgusting.

They're ugly. People fish for them. When you eat them, they taste like shit. And they would physically bite me. I had like little bite marks on my body. Yeah, sometimes they just bite you. They're just like the most awful creatures. Anyway.

Yeah, Lake Life is weird. It is weird. It kind of love it. It's a little skanky. It is kind of. It's kind of why. And I know there's people listening and we're like, You don't know.

You understand lakes. But I do because everyone on lakes are drunk. Yes. To get through it. Of course. You need a pontoon boat. Let me imagine that this is the ocean. Like I don't even want to see the land on the other side of this tiny lake.

There's no one else here. It's just me. I'm in Monta. Yeah. But what a great theater, though, West Hampton. That is a nice little spot. Have you been before? No.

Oh, you're going to like it. Oh, you're going to like it. Oh, you're going to like it. It's all brand new. And the show you're talking about is the menopause show. It is. It's called How to Survive Metapause and I love doing it. I love doing it so much. Yeah. Like a crazy amount. It's really, how long have you been doing it? I've been doing it for a while and I'm writing a book. Like it's kind of, I've leaned into the age I am and the mystery. And it's very satisfying. It's very, very. like, I don't know. There's just something about it. The audiences are very, listen, it is the most self-selecting crowd that there could possibly be. Like, there's no one just wanders in like if you're performing in a mall,

like, and they just step in and they're like, could I be entertained? There's absolutely no one there that isn't hungry for that extremely specific material. Yeah. So it's so much fun to do. Of course. Yeah.

It is a, it's pretty cool. how, and I don't think it's just emerging because people in my life are experiencing it. Right. But you can tell there's a lot of voices that are like, why haven't we been trying to get answers to what is happening to us? Like it's bizarre that in 2025 for the first time people are like, hey, this is a major, major physical, mental thing that we have to go through. No one's talked about it. No one's talked. We've all been afraid or like a shame to talk about it forever until five years ago. Like it's actually, I was thinking about it the other day because now every time I talk about it, everyone's like, it's just so, it's like so interesting right now.

It's just like hot right now. And I'm like, well, first of all, yes. And so hot. But also it's so new that we're talking about it. So I'm like, don't get sick of it. Right. It's not a trend. Don't get bored of hearing about it. Now we just talk about it.

Now it's just kind of like, and there's so much more to learn. Like we don't know about our bodies. It's wild. How universal is the experience and how it seems to me that it's, it's this giant thing that everyone goes through. Yeah. All women go through.

But it also seems very individual. It's so, it's very individual. I think like there are some common, the only common thread that I think exists is that you go through like your body has an earthquake of some sort. And the variety is kind of endless. And almost nobody knows that it's happening to them when it's happening to them. And there is a kind of like a fugue state that you enter. And that is the, that's the shared experiences. I understand it.

Right. You're not really prepared in general. Yeah. For my generation, anyway, I'm 55 now. Like when I, when I entered Paramanophase, I think I was around 46 or 47 and I was, it wouldn't have occurred to me in 10 million years. Like, we're not talking about even 10 years ago. Right.

It wouldn't have, it wasn't in my mind. It wasn't in my thought process. I didn't know anything about it. Why would I have? No one ever taught me or said the word out loud. Yeah. Right. Right.

So you're not anticipating when's that coming? Yeah, no. And I had it in my head, like, I just had this thing in my head that I was like, oh, I'll probably stop having my period when I'm like 57. Like, that was just the number that I had in my head. So when I felt this eruption in my, when I just felt like so discombobulated and I was so emotional all the time, I was like, my job is so hard. Oh, I'm so busy.

I guess I'm very stressed. But there was, you know, like something. actually happening in addition to being very stressed. How slow of a, how slow of a process? Like, you say it's like an earthquake, but is it like an earthquake? Or is it? Well, suddenly you kind of, I think for me, I don't know, you know, again, it's so individual. For me, I found that there was just like, I probably cried very consistently for like a year

and a half. Do you know what I mean? I kind of was just like, what? I was crying. And it was not even about things that were worthy of tears. Like it was not, it was like, oh, a tender commercial. Right. A tender commercial by Hallmark at Christmas time.

Yeah. When the bus driver gets a card from a little boy. And I'm like inconsolably sobbing. Yeah. You know what I mean? Yeah, completely. It's not, it doesn't feel right. And even, you know, everyone in my family was kind of looking at me.

They were like, are you really? are so much more raw. Everything was raw. Yeah. My irritation, my irritability was just like, I would go from, it was just extremes. It just was like extremes for a long period of time. What's strange too or unfortunate is it also comes at a time of life where

there's a lot of reasons to cry. Like there's parents that are going through stuff and your kids are doing whatever and it is a marker. And it is a time where you're feeling it from a lot of emotions of everybody in your family. There's like a lot going on. Yeah. You know, people sort of think that babies are the hardest stage of child. But I actually think in child rearing, the older they get, the more emotionally heavy everything is.

Everything's very weighted. And you have, when you're in your 40s, you have so many responsibilities. Yeah. You are really like, the world is bearing down on you in a great way and a hard way. and all the different ways. Yeah. And so. But it's a lot.

It could just be stress. Like, it could just be mounting stress. It's believable. Yeah. You know. Yeah. There's reasons to cry.

And then you're crying and you're like, but wait a minute. This is going beyond like. Yeah. And it's funny to talk about it in a way because I don't even feel. It's not like my life was bad. It's not like it wasn't like I was sort of manageable. Like I was getting through it.

I was doing my work. I was doing. Perry was doing it all. Yeah. But it was very, it was so extremely helpful to me when somebody finally said the word perimenopause just to me out loud. I was just like, what? Shut up.

Tell me everything. Right. Because then it just gave me some type of context. Yeah. And then I didn't feel like I was going crazy. Like I worried that I was maybe had dementia. Like I was like, I can't remember anything. What's happening?

to me. What is happening? I don't know. Like what is the physical, like what is, why is it, why is nature do this? Well, I don't know. This part of your physical life is just shutting down or changing or evolving or. You be, your body basically stops producing estrogen. Right.

So that hormonal flux and the period of perimenopause is when it, your, your hormonal levels are just like they're spiking and dropping and spiking and dropping for a period of usually like typically four to like 14 years do you know what I mean it's really it's really wonderful I mean with my wife I was like oh okay well we got through it and then it was all of a sudden she had a hot flash right wait I thought this was over a couple years ago it's like no no no no no it just kind of keeps going I mean it keeps going for me in different ways. It takes different forms. Some things level off.

Some things change. Like, I don't know. I do hormone replacement therapy, which really helps me. I'm like, I really leveled out. Actually, after that, that was really super helpful. There's so much misinformation out there. There's just like a lot of choppy waters to navigate. And as always, there's always people there, ready to take your money.

Right. And pray upon your feelings of desperation and craziness. Sure. There's always people waiting in the wings. My opening act when we were heading out to West Hampton said, maybe you could ask Samantha why it's called men opause. Jesus. If I could, well, I mean, it's obvious.

You know, like, there are so many questions about it that can't even be answered Because we just literally never started seriously studying women's bodies until like 1997. Like we've just been taking half of a man's medication until like the late 90s. It's so crazy. So it's very understandable that the word men is in. But I was like, I said it's a corny joke. I said, but yeah, but it kind of makes you think like, why hasn't there been more study on it? Men is in it.

You would think it would be like... You would think it would get more money and attention. Yeah, we'd be like, hey, this is a man problem. We should... It's kind of an... It isn't everybody. Like, it touches everyone's... I don't know.

It touches everyone's lives. So when you're doing the show, and you have, as you said, your audience there for it, how cool is that connection? Like, do you feel like this is cathartic for... I do. I feel like... It's extremely cathartic. And you know what is actually...

what was surprising to me and I've done it so many times now is how many men are there, like how many just like, it's like a very equal audience and they're also having a good time and they're, I don't know, our loving partners also care about the same. Yeah. Because they're scared. I don't know. They should be. But like, yeah, it feels like a cathart.

It feels great to say it out loud. And you know, for me, I like talking about. about it because I feel like my whole career, my entire business life has been about saying terrible, like saying really difficult things out loud, like making comedy out of difficult subject matter. And at the early stages of this, it was very hard, very difficult for me to talk about.

I couldn't talk about it. And so I think as I got more comfortable, just like with myself, As I grew to understand it and as I got more comfortable with it in my own life, I went, oh, I think I should, I think this should be the hard thing that I say out loud. Like, this should be my passion. Yeah. Because nobody's really saying, nobody's talking about it to my personal satisfaction. Right.

Like in the way that I want to hear it. Yeah, yeah. It can still be a pretty anodyne conversation or like the material can be sort of boring or earnest or, I don't know, it's kind of. It's opaque, dull, or, or the conversation is very centered around like being so hot and sexy in your 50s. Like just being like never having looked better, never have had hotter sex in your life. And I'm like, holy shit. Like, that's not for me either. Can I have like, can somebody talk to me?

Like I'm a real fucking person. Right. Like, fuck off. Yeah. Like, I know you want to do movies still, but that's just not. I understand. Like, I get it. I get it, but I don't have to worry about that, so I come straight at the material in

I think a very satisfying way. It's interesting that you have a subject that's, it's, I was thinking about it like on the walk over just about my act last night and, and whenever you're thinking of like, where am I, I don't want to just retread and, sure. So like to break new ground, it often is. stuff that you're uncomfortable with. You yourself are uncomfortable with. Right. I'm sure. It's like then if you can kind of go after those subjects a little bit. A little bit. It's like maybe a little bit like Scientology. Right. You just like strap yourself into an

emeter and just keep saying the thing out loud over and over again until it dissipates. Yeah. I think that's pretty much. I mean, we're just doing our own brand of Scientology. Maybe. Yeah. Completely. It's extremely helpful. And like the more I go out and do the show, I have fun with it. I just enjoy it. I only really want to do things that I like doing these days. It's like I'm too old to give a shit about anything else.

So I'm learning too. Like I people are teaching me. So I'm getting. I'm amazed by the things that people tell me. Yeah. You said a book. Are you putting this into a book? Like the subject?

Oh, for sure. Yeah, I am. That would be great. I like it. I like writing. I sat down. I'm just, it's flowing.

Yeah. You know what I mean? When you're in a kind of a flow state, it's very fun. Yeah. Very satisfying. Yeah. When you do perform live, is there a portion of the audience? I mean, the title is the title, but how much are people looking from you for some political opinion?

I don't know. I don't know if they are and I don't, I'm not really providing it. I'm just not, I'm just not, that's not the focus of the show. I try, I actually, the reason why I gave it, why I named it what I named it is to eliminate any confusion about like what we're going to be talking about tonight. It's super duper clear. Yes. Couldn't be more clear.

Do you feel like, maybe there's, maybe you are still participating in it somewhat, but are you, is it a break from, you were so heavily into. into politics and all of it. I'm not really grappling. I'm not, I write about it somewhat in a substack occasionally. Like I don't. There's no real marketplace for me to engage with political material.

There's no real, there's no huge opportunity to do so. I was doing some podcasting with The Daily Beast recently, and I may do that again. That was pretty sad. I kind of got it out. I got a lot of it out. whenever I do that.

You still carry it. I carry it. I carry it. It's in my brain at all times. Right. Unless I go on vacation and then I really disconnect. Yeah. Have to.

I just, I did this last two weeks. You did? Yeah, I went to the beach with my family. Great. And I was like, no social media at all. Great. And I would look at the, you know, the New York Times app or whatever. Sure.

Just a poke. But I wasn't, I was really. really disengaged. Yeah. And when I came back out of it, as soon as I went on Instagram and started, D.L. Hughley, you know, all my news sources of outrage. Right. I was so quick back to, rar.

It feels like your chest is caving in. It does. There's a physical. There's something that happens. Your shoulders, like all of everything you've worked hard to cultivate relaxation. All these can be, can just vaporize. Instantly. Yeah.

Yeah. And it made me realize how, uh, it's, I don't know, I'm trying to figure it out. How, how, um, how damaging it is to just be scrolling and looking at all the outrage. But then the other side of it, of course, is, well, you don't want to just put your head in the sand while these big things are happening. But then the other side of it is, what am I doing about it? Right. What can I do about it? other than write it out and vote in two years and a year and a half.

I know it's a really, it's a really complex conversation. Like, I don't really have any answers. I feel in equal measure are pretty hopeless, but in agitated and like, like I'm like, should I run for office?

Like in my local jurisdiction, because there's a lot of book banners, you know, I mean, I don't know. Yeah. So I'm trying to find my way through it, too. I know. I feel like we went away. I've left the country actually for a couple of, we just keep

traveling. We just keep leaving the country actually. Yeah, we're just like traveling. We've been actually traveling a lot. And it's a totally, it's when you leave the shores of this great nation. Yeah. You do, it is noticeable how much people are not, like reading the news is not their hobby. right there in like across all kinds of places that I've been to in the last six months like it's just not we do need better hobbies here we do need better hobbies I agree with that but then the other side of it is but do we have to pay attention because holy shit they're destroying everything and we've got to put it we've got to try and stop it oh for sure but then you pay attention and then you go well CBS just paid him 16 million dollars like what

Yeah. You're like, wait. What are we? Yeah. Well, I'm mad about it, but what, would I, what? Yeah, then I post it. I post something on Instagram and make, you know, a bunch of people scream at me. I'm making my kids go to protests and when protest.

Like, I'm like, I don't know. Like, I don't know what else to do. I'm like, everybody, we're going to protest. And my kids are like, it's, but it's raining. And I'm like, listen, here's how it works. I'm like, this is how it fucking works, okay? When there's a protest, you have to physically go to it. And then people drive by and then they see you standing in the rain looking lame.

It's definitely a lame experience. Yeah, it's terrible. And you stand around over a couple of hours with other nice people and you say like, fuck you. You're fucking bad ideas ruining everything. I'm like, you have to. And then the people driving by and like just honking next time they park and they join you. and then more people join you and join you, and then there's people,

and you can't deny large crowds of people. Right. In the same way, that's a little harder. But listen, yeah. I have got no answers for you. I know. I know. It's a weird time.

It's a very strange, strange time. So what do you think of the Colbert of it all? I mean, Gadzukes. Oh, my God. I mean, the, the, The show loses $40 million a year. Yep. So that's a reality.

That's a reality. The parent company is trying to curry favor with the president. That's a reality. Yeah. I think both things are true. I think both things are just true and real. Like, it definitely was hemorrhaging money. I don't think that that's, you know, the, you know, these legacy shows, like, they are

hemorrhaging money with no real end to that. Yeah. In sight, people are just not tuning in. Yeah. And even remotely, comparatively, to how they used to. Well, people are literally on their phones all the time, for one thing. So they actually don't necessarily need a recap of the day's events. Yeah.

They're very well-versed in what has happened. Yeah. And they'd really rather watch, like, people just absolutely murder each other in a South Korean game show. just like watching people fall off cliffs to relax at night before nodding off. That is very true. When I'm on tour, I don't talk politics, but I would mention something about the cruelty of like Elon Musk when he was just taking all these people that got into these jobs because they really are. out of nobility and loving this country. So anyway, I would just mention that.

The only times it didn't get applause or have people react was when you really got the sense, oh, they don't know what I'm saying. Yes. They're not, it's not that they're bad people or good people. They're just not paying attention. They just don't, they're not watching the new. They've got their life and they're doing their thing. They're living life.

Yeah. Like there's a lot of. Which is similar to what you're saying about the people in other countries. Which is not to say. that there aren't problems absolutely everywhere, but like it is not necessarily a national sport in the exact same way that we are experiencing it and we extra experience it in New York and L.A.

and places where it's just all of our friends, everything we read. Like we're consuming news media all the time and I do it too. So I'm not like, but we don't relax in the same way by watching everybody get together and everybody lay down in your bed TV and watch some jokes.

and some interviews. So that is true, and it is also true that when the president of the United States has to give his sign off on a corporate merger, the thing you can't do is make jokes about him. He's a thin-skinned idiot, and we know he's like a pernicious cancer, and he cares about that stuff, and it's just true. You can't do it.

When I had my show, Full Frontal, we had like three mergers when we were in business. And it was a constant source of conversation. Really? It was like, it really just came up, yeah, it came up all the time. Really? It came up all the time. And in what way would they tell you maybe back off?

Oh my gosh, 100%. It was nobody, when a huge corporate merger is happening, nobody wants to cause trouble. You can't business trumps everything. Yeah. It doesn't matter what your values are. It doesn't matter how important you think, like, legacy media is. None of that fucking matters when you're talking about people, hundreds millionaires and billionaires literally making their business transactions.

Everything you think that is important is absolutely, like, impotent. It does not matter. It's not even a consideration. So, of course, it was leaching money. And I'm sure they had many agonizing conversations. about what they were going to do to turn the ship around, what they were going to do to make the show profitable again. And that's true probably of all the shows.

You know, how do we make this profitable? Yeah. But the extra element of it is that it's so much easier for them to cut it loose with this merger coming down the pike. Like, it makes the decision such a no-brainer and probably the most agonizing decisions they were having or about how do we float this? Like, how do we not get a lot of blowback?

I'm sure they knew it was happening a long time ago. Right. And the considerations were, like, how can we position it so that the story can be not as bad as it could be? Like, it's awful. I know so many people who work there. Yeah. I love Stephen. Yeah.

I consider him to be a friend. I think he's amazing. So I'm, I, like, shocked, not surprised, I guess. Yeah. I don't know. You know. the only bright thing and it's a horrible example is, you know, these forms are old and musty and going away. I mean, he's still three million people.

I mean, it wasn't nothing. He was still doing better than all the rest of them. Of course. But when you look at, I hate to even say it, but Tucker Carlson, you know, he leaves Fox, which is gigantic. But he has a big voice. He has a big voice with his podcast. and, you know, he's, he's, Stephen can do a very similar thing. If you choose it.

Like, if he wants to do, if he wants to do that, he, I'm certain that, like, other doors and avenues will be, like, just opening their arms for it. Yeah. Of course. Yeah. I mean, when you go on, when I would go on these late night shows in recent years, you'd get, like, on social media, like, one or two, like, good jobs or whatever. And then you go on a podcast and it would just light up with the responses.

Yes. You know what I mean? It's shifted. It's all really shifted. And it's a time for innovation. Like it's sort of, it will breed like new venues and new outlets. And it'll probably, it'll be fine. But a lot of people will be like I very much limit.

I do understand. I think probably Stephen's in hell right now because when you have a staff of 200 people, you can't take all those people with you to your next adventure and that's just a lot of people who have built lives around a steady page it's really really it's really really awful one of the awful other awful things is that theater that ed sullivan theater is the best place to perform it's a great theater i mean that's just such a great physical dynamic spiritual place yeah and the idea that that could possibly just sit empty? You know what? We're going to, Dana White is going to take it back and he's going to recreate slap fight,

which was an awesome show, too, you know, gone too soon. So we'll be having so much fun in the Sullivan Theater short. Don't you worry. Keep your chin up. Yeah, we're having MMA at the Kennedy Center. We're having slap fights at Ed Sullivan. It's all going to be great. It's all going to be great. You just need to change your mindset. You just need to get your mind right. Yeah. This is the Breaking Bread podcast, and I couldn't bake you bread because I'm traveling. That's fine.

I apologize. I'll take care of you one of these days. But Vesuvio Bakery is, they're not a sponsor, but I love them. So there's some croissants and a couple treats in there for you and yours. Oh, my God, thank you. You're very welcome. Thank you. That's so kind.

Who cooks in your house? We, so I've been married to Jason, Jason Jones. Very funny Jason Jones. Very funny. The very funny Jason Jones. We've been married for, we've been together for almost 30 years now, which is like kind of crazy. It's a big number. It's a big number.

And we share, I think we share certain things. I would say I do the Lions share, but he's always, he does a lot. Yeah. He does a lot. What's your, what's your show off dish? You know what? That's so funny. I have a list of show-off dishes.

And then I made a salad last night that was so good that I put it on my list. I wrote it down. You did. You know, like it's like a list that's like, companies coming. Yeah. What can I, I have the, like, I have a. You know, you have your staples. Oh, yeah, the go-toes.

Your go-toes. Last night I made a delicious meal, like a perfect summer meal. And I was like, oh, writing it down in case we ever have houseout. Like, nobody wants to come out to where we are in the summer. It's like kind of far away. Tell me about the salad because I'm bored out of my mind with my... Well, I made two great salads in the last two days. So I made a faro salad with all these fresh vegetables and this delicious vinaigrette and like little slim, like slim slivered radishes and tomatoes from our garden and arugula.

It was just like refreshing and delicious. And then last night I had the freshest peaches and I put it with barata and a really good olive. oil and salt pepper and something else. I made my own pesto and I put a little smear of pesto under it. Oh, man. And I made pasta with a fresh pesto from our guard. Like Jason's a gardener, actually. He grows all these vegetables. We had all this basil. And it was just like, chef's kiss good. Good job. God, it was. I'm actually in my mouth is watering. Yeah, completely. Oh, I love it. I love to, I do. I love to cook. That's great.

I love to bake. Did you always do it? Oh, you love to bake. I do. I don't bake bread, but I'm trying to learn. If you can bake, you can bake bread. I think so.

Because I'm not a great baker. Like, I'm more of a cook. Yeah. But baking is just enough room for error where you can still pull it off without being like that precision baking, that beautiful ornate thing that I don't have a. I can't do that. I can make it. I can make it delicious, but not ornate. Right.

I can't do that. But I do. Rustic. I like to say rustic. Home spun. Yeah. Homespun. Yeah.

But delicious. That's a good one. But I do have, I bought some sourdough starter. And I have, I'm like, I've got to get, I got to get this right. Yeah. I got to do that. It's so great. I mean, that's, I took over my life. Literally took over my life.

It's fantastic. Yeah. It just, I haven't stopped forever. How did you get started? I was on, I was writing on a show. Mm-hmm. on Red Oaks on Amazon. And one of the writers there, Max,

was a, he learned what sourdough was with the starter and all that. And I'd never heard of it. And he was kind of a scientific mind. And he was explaining this weird creature that that's where all bread came from. That was natural yeast. So I told my family about it at dinner. And my kids were younger. And I told them the whole story about how you put flour and water in a bowl

and the yeast just flies around and goes in the bowl and all of a sudden starts to eat it and that's where yeast comes that we use for bread comes from. And my daughter started one for me for Christmas. So she like hid this bowl and got it going and then Christmas gave me the starter. That's an incredible gift. It's a beautiful gift. So it took a little bit to be like, oh, thanks, like handing me this goo. Sure, sure.

Yeah, a jar of goo, smelly goo. Yeah. And, but then I made my first loaf and I just got hooked. I can't explain it truly. I just got hooked on it. I love that so much. I like it's kind of a wonky. Like it's particular to sourdough, too.

It's like a little, because there's enough kitchen science. Yeah. That you're like, you have to be a little bit. You have to like detail a little bit. A little bit. But you ever see those books like the, there's like a giant from like some chef from like MIT like put together this giant the modernist bread oh no I haven't seen it it's like eight volumes right 900 pages each of

the science of bread and I'm like I can yeah there's some that's insane some things go too far but I did buy too little I bought these like a farm market near my house sells little just like literally Ziplox. Like, it's so casual of dry starter from this guy who has, like, basically, I think his house must smell so bad. Like, it's just like a sour, his

sour starters from all these different eras in his own life. Right. And he dries the starter and sells it to you. Yeah. And so, I was like, all right. I've got my jars. It's great. It really is. Yeah. My children task

me with that project over the summer, because They're like, we know you want to. So that's your summer goal. Yeah, you should. If you're making stuff like that, like that, it's just right up your alley. Yeah. We have a bakery near where we live, and they make sourdough milk bread. Sourdough milk bread.

And it is so good. Really? It is soft. And it's just like the most delectable bread. That's the best. And they sell it in like a three inch cube. Yeah. It's like so expensive.

Oh, really? It's so worth it. It's worth everybody. Oh, it's beautiful. Oh, God, I love it. Hey, everybody. We'd like to thank the good people at Butcher Box for sponsoring today's program. Butcher Box is a great company that sends you these beautiful, beautiful meats, and you put them in your freezer, and it gives you the comfort and the knowledge that when you get home off the road, you are going to have amazing, amazing food just waiting for you in your freezer.

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Our listeners get $20 off their first box and free protein for a year. Great sponsor, ButcherBox. Support the podcast by pending them, paying them a visit. You don't spend someone a visit. Just Butcherbox.com. Can I ask you a question? Do you have any scars and from what? I do.

I have a few scars. I have, well, I guess you could tell by looking at me. I'm very moly. I have a lot of malls. Anytime I'm on camera, there's always one helpful person who will be like, you should get your malls checked.

I'm like, I understand. I know about malls. I know about malls. Leave me alone. Yeah. When I was young, when I was born, actually,

I was born with a big mall on the side of my body that was like the size of a mouse. Like it was huge. And it was like scary enough looking. And like, it was enough that the doctors were like, we actually have to remove that because that's going to kill her, like later in life. Wow. So they removed that and there was also one on the bottom of my foot that they removed.

So I have actually a gigantic. It's like a full, I would say it's an eight-inch scar across my side. How old were you when they took it off? I was seven. Seven? He was in the hospital for a few days. It was like a big operation. Wow.

Yeah. Yeah. They must have really, unbeknownst to me. I've known talk to me about it. They were just like, bye, see you in two days. And I was like, where am I going? I'm sure that they really excavated it because it's a substantial scar. I had a little mole on my back.

And it grew hair. Okay. Yeah. Moles are great. You know, it's the sexiest. And my next show will be about malls because it'll be again. And to fend off. And it changed and kind of faded and went away.

Sure. But, you know, when you're a kid, it's not a great thing to have at the pool. It's not. So I made up a song about it. Okay. Because to fend off, to get to the joke before the kids did. Yes. And it was, would you like to hear it?

Yeah, I would like to. Sammy on my back. Sammy on my back. What you do in there with all that hair? Sammy. You know what? I love things that keep you like humble. As a child, it's like, you know what I mean?

Like, I probably never wore a two-paced bathing suit in my whole life because of this scar. Uh-huh. Because on some level, I was very self-conscious about it. But these things make you, they make you go into comedy. They make you, exactly. That's what is these are the formative events. Yeah, that's right. If you were tossed into the woods.

Okay. Yeah. Just dropped off in the woods. Sure. What's your first move? My first move is going to be to start a fire. Well, no, to find water. I'll locate some water and then I'm going to build a fire.

What kind of water? River water. Yes, like not standing water. Definitely. Not just a tepid. I'm going to find some flowing water. I'm not saying that I could find water. I'm going to try.

That's what I'm going to try. That's what's on your mind. That's just on my mind. Yes. I definitely will be the person found dead 30 feet away from a highway. Yeah, what was that movie with the guy, the kid who,

remember Eddie Vedder wrote songs about him? Oh. It was that he got, he went into the woods and he died in like an abandoned bus. Oh, that guy. Oh, yeah, Christopher or something, in Alaska. Yeah, in Alaska.

He wrote a book about him. Yeah. I feel like John Crackauer wrote a book about it. It's a really good book. Christopher McCandless. Do I have? Maybe. I don't know.

I've named, I've outed some other Christopher McCandless who's like, fuck you, that wasn't me. I'm smart. But I couldn't get into the whole, sounds terrible, but I couldn't get into the whole,

I feel bad for the guy thing because he was kind of like did it on his own and he was literally like two miles from. He was pretty, He was close enough to, yeah. You know, I know, I know. This isn't like really like, you know, going off into the wild. Found an abandoned bus a mile from the road.

Where there's a school bus, there's probably a community. I'm just saying. Do you remember your dreams? Sometimes I remember them. Yeah. Any recurring? I definitely have recurring dreams about. my teeth crumbling, which I think has some type of significance in all the books that are like,

interpret you, James. Yeah. What does it say? I can't remember. Most of the, most of the interpretations are like, something's coming. And I'm like, well, that's not specific enough. Like, an adventure awaits you. Or like, you seek to control your existence.

I'm like, okay. I'm sure. Right. I could have told you that. I didn't need to read it. And I do have, I don't often remember them. I'm sure they're very boring.

There's often, like anytime I go on vacation, I have the worst dreams. I'll say that. Right. Like when your brain unschools, like the first three nights are like, oh, I'm being chased by another vampire demon.

And he's coming to kill me and all my children. Like great. It's just like three subsequent nights of terror. Those first three nights, Yeah, and the whole family goes through it. Everybody has like weird. Weird. Do you ever take malaria medication?

You ever travel like to Africa or that kind of stuff? Yeah, I was supposed to. I've been there a few times. And then I was supposed to, the first time I went, they were like, take this malaria medication. Yeah. And it was so, it was so hallucinogenic. Yeah.

And I was like, well, what's, tell me what's the treatment for malaria. And they were like, oh, these same pills. And I was like, well, can I just wait? and to like get malaria to take these fucking horrible pills. And so I just stopped taking them. I didn't take them. We, I have two daughters and my wife and we were and we were taking them.

And that first night, we all showed up at breakfast like, what did you dream? Right. It was so vivid. Vivid. Yeah. So intense. Yeah.

It was like, who this is like high deaf madness. Yeah. It was enough for me that I was like, I think I'll wait for the diagnosis. Yeah. get back on these humdingers. These are not fun. How are the mosquitoes where you live? They are very settled this year.

We have a lot of bats. I don't know. We haven't had... We have a lot of horseflies, actually. Oh, those are the worst. Those are the worst. My son is literally like he won't go outside. They're the worst.

They are terrible. And they're itchy. The itchiest bites you can get. They're so big. It's like a hummingbird knocking into you. They're terrible. Down at the jury. is he sure.

Oh, yes. If the wind is coming from the bay, that blows them all from the reeds to the beach and ruins the beach day. Oh, that's awful. But if the wind blows the other way, it keeps them at bay. But man, when they show up, why even go? Yeah, no, that's bad. They're so, so intense.

Yeah, they're intense. If someone could kill the mosquitoes, that would be great. Yeah. Get more bats. I'll release the bats. I know. Do you ever have a, I was thinking, because in L.A. we have them. We never had mosquitoes. forever. And now we have them.

They came over on cargo ships and now for the first time with this invasive type of mosquito. Well, my friend, I have a good, good friend of mine lives in Alberta, Canada, and she had her wedding on her, like, family homestead.

Like this beautiful, like, prairies, like, outdoor wedding. And what she didn't know at the time was that her neighbor, her crazy, reclusive neighbor, was breeding exotic mosquito species. What? Yep, as a hobby.

And we were destroyed. Oh my God. That night. And it was like all outdoor tables, and they all were under the tablecloth of the outdoor tables. So all of the guests were like, I think I might have, I might need a pint of, I might need a transfusion. It's a nightmare. Just welts covering our bodies. Yeah.

Oh my God. Who breeds? Who breeds mosquitoes? Exiled mosquitoes. Tropical level mosquitoes for fun. That is awful. Yeah. Oh, my God.

Yeah. I was thinking of installing a bat box. I installed one. You did? Yeah, I don't know that anything's living in it. Oh, really? I prefer my house. Prefer to live in my home.

Oh, really? They're in the attic? They're definitely in the chimney and stuff. Oh, creepy. Yeah, but they're great. They do a good job. We just went, we just, just went to Botswana, actually.

We just got back. It was amazing. Yeah. And we went into a tree. And then there were all these bats up in the, inside the trunk of the tree was hollow, alive, but like there was a big hollow section of it. And we went in and there were just like a thousand bats just flippie flopping around. Why'd you go in there? Well, because I like that. I like those nocturnal creepy creatures. I like to see them. I'm like, please live. We need you.

I know, but they're so creepy with their little faces and their little hands and hold on to their wings. There's something, I don't know, rodents are not my squeamosh. Like, rodents don't get me. Snakes? No, I'm no problem. For me, it's cockroaches. Oh, I can't even, oh. Oh.

Are you a country mouse or a city mouse? I think I'm both of both of, like in equal parts. I'm both. I like variety. I like dynamic variance. So I like city for a couple of days and I like country for a couple of days.

I don't like the city in the summer very much. It's rough. It's rough. And Carpourges just come into our apartment occasionally in the summer. That's when they're really primed to come out of your drain. And that makes me...

Yeah. What about rats? I don't know. I don't want them to pop out of my toilet, but they don't. Like when I see them, I don't have a reaction to them. They don't, like, scare me. I don't.

But a cockroach. Sorry. Yeah. My daughter is kind of like living in the city and working this summer. And she, one came out of her closet. And she was like, I need you to drive four hours to get here and kill it. It's in my closet. And I was like, I'll barf.

I can't help you. Now you want to live here. This is the deal. We do a thing on this show called an uncomfortable moment. And, you know, sometimes we take a deep dive on the internet and look for things on people. Oh, great. Other times it's, we cause the uncomfortable moment ourselves. Okay.

And this is one of those. Okay. I don't want you to, um... I'm ready. To judge me or anything, but, you know, I've always been a fan of yours. You always make me laugh. I always find you courageous. Oh.

And I know you're involved in your show now and your podcast and all that kind of stuff. But I have been without your permission pitching some projects with the two of us. Great. And the first one is an animated series of you and I. This is ChatGPT came up with the animation. Look at us. This is called Twisters. Love it.

And I've been pitching it. I haven't had any bites yet, but chat GPT did that. I really like it. And I'm sorry that it's not an awkward moment for me. I'm all on board. Let's get devoured by a twister. The thing I don't like about chat GPT is it's ignoring what little fluff I have in the front of my head. What is going on with your hair?

That's not correct. Yeah. But they did put me in a blazer and I appreciate the accuracy. I feel like my, the depiction of. of me is more accurate than you. Yeah, you look great. I don't think. This is one if it doesn't work out.

Yeah. I just because I was like, wow, look what Chat Chaptee did. And then I asked it to put us in Titanic. We'd like to thank the good people at Quince for sponsoring today's program. If you spend a lot of time cooking at home, it's time to elevate your game. When your cookware actually feels good to use and is thoughtfully made and looks beautiful on your counter, it just makes the whole experience better. That's what I've really liked about Quince.

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I've got these good ceramic frying pans and sauce pans. They're very cool. They're good in your hand and they clean easy, which is another very cool thing. The best part, everything at Quince is priced way lower than you'd expect. 50 to 80% less than similar brands. Go get it right now. Refresh your every day with luxury yield action. use. Head to quince.com slash Papa for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns.

Now available in Canada, too. That's quince, quince, c-u-in-c-com slash Papa, P-A-P-A, for free shipping and 365-day returns. Quince.com slash Papa. Oh, you know what? Right? We look great. We look great. I feel you do need to go back in and get your hair right. That's not correct.

Thank you for saying that. It's a disrespectful rendering of your hair. I actually was like, well, it's not, you know, my fluff's not going to last forever. It's not terrible. You look, you have kind eyes. You know what I mean? In real life and in the depiction of you. And our eyes are full of adventure.

We are. We're ready for the next face. of life. We're in love. We're just like that couple caught at the Coldplay concert. Oh, how funny was that? What a treat.

I love that story so much just because, you know, the news is so horrible and just horrible things happening. Yeah. And then we all just had like, it felt like a 1980s moment of like we're all just having fun with this horrible.

This horrible. Can you imagine? How badly those two very established couples are trying to, they're begging. They're waking up in the morning and praying to God on their hands and knees for the story to end. And we just brought it back to life. I know. We can't stop.

We really can't stop. I just can't quit it. Oh, my daughter keeps sending me TikToks of other places that are like mimicking it. Like they had the two in Philadelphia, the two mascots. Oh, my God, really? They're been fluffy mascots with the, they get caught on the camera and the one turns. This is all its shame. Oh, God, I want to say to those two couples, this two shall pass, but you have to give us a little more time to you.

It really is too much fun. Uncomfortable moments. It was so fun. What were they thinking? Oh, you've got to be. You're at a concert. You can't, if you're going to do that, you've got to accept that you can't leave the hotel. No.

You can't take it out in public. Right, exactly. There's rules. Yeah. You know what I mean? Even if it wasn't on the, up on the thing. No. Someone saw you.

There's people all around you. Right. You don't know. This is not intelligence. This is, this is, this is, this is, this is, this is, this is, this is, this is, this is, CEO level. It is. I'm untouchable.

Yep. No. No. Right. Yeah. And that's why we get to still. Talk about it for just a smidge longer. That's why our affair is going to be good because we put it in the guise of an animated series.

Exactly. We're just to tell people we're working. That's right. Can I ask you a question? Yeah. What is the best version of you at 80? Oh, God. Where do you paint that picture?

I joke about it a lot. You do? Yep. It's me and Jason. Kids are all around. We're having a family vacation. And we're just, I'm just tapless on a beach and Abifa. And I'm listening to. And I'm just like DJing for a group of 80 year olds. And I'm just eating the best food and living my life and listening to great music. Nice. You know what I mean? I feel like that would be the freest. Because I don't go. to Toplis beaches and I never would. Except I feel like it's something that I keep joking about it. I probably like there's a

portion of me somewhere that's like I really should do it. And I think when I'm 80 I will like not care at all by then. I will feel no shame. So I imagine it's just like a version of me that's totally without shame

and I'm surrounded by my loved ones listening to great music and eating great food. That's amazing. And swimming. The only flaw I see in their plan is the loved ones wanting to hang. With me Topless? They're probably

definitely taking care of this scenario. They're like, this is horrible. This is her last they're like, I had to take the time out of my job to watch my mom's knockers bounce around. And this is the worst.

And by then, they're like in their 50s. So like it's horrible for them on multiple. They have lives and responsibilities. My daughters are probably in pari menopause. Yeah, they're going through menopause. Oh, yeah, it's awful. It's funny. But I don't know because I'm in my 80s.

That's a good one. I like that though. Yeah, it's the not caring. The not, just like letting go. of all of that. The more you let go of that stuff. Yeah. I do it increasingly, and I'm sure you do too.

Like, it feels just like backpacks coming off. Yeah. Just like freedom. Yeah. So nice. Just like not looking in a mirror. It's great. It's such a great thing.

It's so great. Yeah. It's wonderful. I know. Yeah. I love it. My father's that way. And I really think he would hate that I say this.

But I think he leaves the house most of the time without thinking or caring. Caring. Yeah, I have pants on. I got shoes. Let's go. I saw, we saw a guy today. We were walking down the street. I was walking down the street with two of my three kids.

And we saw an elderly gent top off. Tiddy's out in the sun all tanned. He bore shorts. He had shorts for decency. You know what I mean? He wasn't breaking any laws. Tube sacks up to the knee. Newspaper under his arm.

Oh, geez. Like heading to the park. You know, just like slowly. Old man gate. making his way to the park, he's like, I'm, I'm, I'm tanning. I don't care. He said, I don't give a damn. I said, just walking down the street like a, like an expired rotisserie chicken.

Yes, exactly. Just don't care. Just don't care. You're like, I'm going to read the paper. I was trying to tell my daughters that I said, you see guys running, no one has a shirt on. No one has a shirt. I'm like, why can't I just go out there without a shirt? You're not ready.

You're not ready. I'm not ready and I'm not going to do that either and even when I see people without their shirts walking around like a big part of me I am wearing a ruffle collar blouse right now like very like you know you know I'm very much like well that's not I'm not hair top loves what are you doing like yeah I don't try to sell me on some bullshit that your nipples shave under a tank top I'm like I wear things over my nipples all day and all night like it's fine that is the go to it's have to get used to it. It's not a problem. But I know that that should be my future because I'm so weird about it. Right, right. In my 55-year-old life.

It's beautiful. It would be ideal if I could just full circle it. It would be great. Well, this was wonderful. I hope you had a good time. I had a great time. This is so fun. Nice spending time with you.

So nice. And enjoy this with your family. Thank you so much. And if you have any questions about your bread journey, I stand ready. Okay. Thank you. I can help you. Thank you.

Yeah. I appreciate that. There's nothing better if you do get into it. Okay. Just having the house smell like bread most of the time. It's my favorite thing to eat of all things. Like I don't understand people who don't eat bread. It's not logical.

It doesn't make any sense. Sometimes my kids are like, I don't need any bread with that. I'm like, bread is biblical. Yeah, it is. Bread was there before you. Yeah. That's why we eat it. Yeah.

And the reason people can eat bread now is because they're not eating real bread. If you make your bread. Exactly. You don't get fat. It's fine. It's good. Fine. All right.

I'll take you up on that. Thank you. I'll stand ready. Good luck with your tour. Thank you. And your podcast. What's the name of your podcast? Choice words.

Choice words. Yeah, choice words. We love it. We'll post it up in the things. Thank you. Thank you. You're the best. You're the best.

Thanks, kids.