Breaking Points with Krystal and Saagar - 11/3/25: Kash Defends Private Jet Use, Israel Explodes Over Prisoner Abuse, GOP Civil War Erupts

Episode Date: November 3, 2025

Krystal and Saagar discuss Kash defends private jet use for girlfriend, Israel explodes over prisoner abuse, GOP civil war over Israel erupts.     To become a Breaking Points Premium Member and watch/listen to the show AD FREE, uncut and 1 hour early visit: www.breakingpoints.comMerch Store: https://shop.breakingpoints.com/See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Hello, America's sweetheart Johnny Knoxville here. I want to tell you about my new true crime podcast, Crimeless, Hillbilly Heist, from Smartless Media, campside media, and big money players. It's a wild tale about a gang of high-functioning nitwits who somehow pulled off America's third largest cash heist. Kind of like Robin Hood, except for the part where he's still,

from the rich and gifts to the poor. I'm not that generous. It's a damn near inspiring true story for anyone out there who's ever shot for the moon then just totally muffed up the landing. They stole $17 million that had not bought a ticket

to help him escape. So we're saying like, oh God, what do we do? What do we do? That was dumb. People do not follow my example. Listen to Crimless, Hillbilly Heist on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcast. The murder of an 18-year-old girl in Graves County, Kentucky, went unsolved for years,

until a local housewife, a journalist, and a handful of girls came forward with a story. America, y'all better work the hell up. Bad things happens to good people in small towns. Listen to Graves County on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And to binge the entire season ad-free, subscribe to Lava for Good Plus on Apple Podcasts. Samihante, it's Anna Ortiz. And I'm Mark and Delicado. You might know us as Hilda and Justin from Ugly Betty.

Welcome to our new podcast. Viva Betty! Yay! We're re-watching the series from start to finish. And talking to iconic guests like Betty herself, America Ferreira. There was this moment when the glasses went on and it was like, this is our Betty. Listen to Viva Betty on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey guys, Saga and Crystal here.

Independent media just played a truly massive role in this election and we are so excited about what that means for the future of this show. This is the only place where you can find honest perspectives from the left and the right that simply does not exist anywhere else. So if that is something that's important to you, please go to breakingpoints.com, become a member today, and you'll get access to our full shows, unedited, ad-free, and all put together for you every morning in your inbox. We need your help to build the future of independent news media, and we hope to see you at breakingpoints.com. Let's turn now to the FBI. There has been more beclownish behavior there from the FBI. director Cash Patel. Let's start with a fishy story right now. Everybody should keep their eyebrows up. Let's put this up here on the screen. The FBI director, Cash Patel, announced the disruption of a major terror plot on Hallows Eve. And he said that the FBI, through the heroic action,

had stopped this upcoming case of a plotted attack on Halloween. However, the defense lawyer for the suspect is now disputing the allegations that his 20-year-old client and four other young suspects were planning to carry this out at all. So announcing the arrest, Patel said more information would be coming soon. However, FBI and Michigan authorities have now offered, quote, few details about the case. Spokespersons for the state, national FBI, and the U.S. attorney are not responding to any messages. The investigation involved discussion in an online chat room involving at least some of the suspects taken into custody. They spoke to the AP on condition of anonymity. The group allegedly discussed carrying out an attack around Halloween, referring to Pumpkin Day,

the other person briefed on the investigation confirmed there had been a, quote, pumpkin reference. However, the lawyer who represents one of the men from Dearborn, who was detained Saturday, said federal authorities have given him not many details about the investigation. He concluded that no terror event was planned. He said he doesn't even expect any charges to be filed. Quote, I don't know where this hysteria and this fear-mongering came from. He described an all-male group of U.S. citizen gamers who, they said, range in age from 16 to 20, young men on forums that they should not have been on or things in nature, then we'll have to wait

and see. But I don't believe there's anything about illegal, about the activity that they were doing. All of this actually just comes down to the professionalism of the FBI. Obviously, look, any defense lawyer is going to say his client's innocent. So who knows? Let's rate and see whether the charges were filed. But the point remains that the FBI announced that the terror plot had allegedly been disrupted without offering many details. There was no criminal case. And lawyers immediately were saying, hey, by coming out and making these claims, If they don't hold up, this can then be used by the defense in court to combat them. And so it's like, well, hold on.

Were you just trying to get a headline? Were you just trying to maybe, you know, curry some political favor? Let's say with the president. That's where it's not that you should believe the defense lawyer. It's that you should look at the fact that no charges filed. There's no indictment yet. There's no nothing, really, in terms of the investigation. We're dealing with some chat room gamers, which, look, I'll save my gaming commentary.

But, you know, the point remains, there is such a thing. trial in this country and their clownish behavior from the Tyler Robinson case to now this one shows that in many cases their lack of professionalism will eventually come back

to bite them in the ass in court as it has multiple times now for Trump administration. And also the FBI has never been above just like inventing some shit and like, you know. Retch and Whitmer. Yeah, this is going back

to the war on terror and before that, but in the modern era the war on terror stuff and this has some of the hallmarks of, you know, one of those invented plots, you have, like you said, the biggest red flag is no charges filed.

Okay, if you got them dead to row, they're plotting a terror attack on Halloween, wouldn't you think you would have some charges ready to go? Okay, that's number one. Number two, government being extremely cagey about any of the details, won't tell you what it was they were planning, any of, you know, any of the specifics of what was going on here. Defense lawyer, obviously, is, I mean, listen, defense lawyer is always going to say their client was innocent, but this guy was going particularly hard in the paint of like,

this is absolute and total bullshit. There was nothing illegal going on here. We will be vindicated, et cetera. So you've got all of that. And Max Blumenthal also flagged in the CNN reporting. They mentioned that there was like an FBI agent in the chat from early on. That's a given. Which is another like.

I mean, and that's one of the things they would do during the war on terror era, which apparently is back full force. Because these were apparently appear to be young Muslim men in and around Dearborn, Michigan. So there's a political angle here, too, of, you know, they're very set on painting all, you know, making us all scared of Muslims again in this country. And there's a whole effort going on among a number of individuals to, like, denaturalize anyone who is Muslim and wasn't originally born in this country, including, you know, Jen Cueger being threatened by Katie Miller on Pierce Morgan. But in any case, you know, there's a political incentive, again, to create a hysteria

around potential terror plots. And so I would be deeply suspicious of the. details of this supposed foiled Halloween terror plot. Oh, 100%. And who is this man that we are looking at, Mr. Patel? Who is this gentleman does he spend his private time? Let's go ahead and put this third element up here, shall we? So, what do we have here? The FBI has now fired a top official amid Cash Patel's outrage over reports of agency jet use. So let me just I'll read some of the details. A top FBI official with 27 years standing

has now been fired by the Bureau from its director after he became enraged by press stories revealing he had used a government jet to travel to see his girlfriend sing the national anthem at a wrestling match. Stephen Palmer, who had worked at the Bureau since 98, was hired as the head of FBI's Critical Incident Response Group, which is responsible for handling major security threats

as well as overseeing the agency's fleet of jets, the third head of the unit to be dismissed by Patel since the Trump administration. Bloomberg Law, which broke the story, said three unnamed sources had expressed astonishment at the sacking given that Patel's flight schedules were fully public and trackable on websites

like Flight Aware. A day after her performance, Patel himself reposted photos showing him together with his girlfriend country singer Alexis Wilkins on his Twitter account. And according to Bloomberg, Patel became furious after stories were published about the event and his use of the FBI jet

to go on a date with Wilkins. So Patel fires the individual in charge, I guess, of the agency fleet of jets and also puts out this statement from his personal account. Let's just go ahead and read some of this, shall we? Proud of the work of this FBI, we're taking violent criminals off the streets, blah, blah, blah. Let me be clear we will not be distracted by basis rumors or the noise from uninformed internet anarchists and the fake news. I have always said, criticize me all you want, but going after the people doing great work, my personal life, or those around me is a total disgrace. The disgustingly baseless attacks against Alexis, a true patriot and the woman I am proud to call my partner in life are beyond pathetic.

She is a rock-solid conservative and a country music sensation who has done more for the nation than most will intend lifetimes. Now, again, I'm not familiar with Ms. Wilkins or her country music. I will note she is 26 years old and he's, you know, in his 40s, and I guess that's the way he's talking about his 26-year-old girlfriend, who's a country music singer. I mean, it's nice to see him ride for his woman, certainly. If she's your partner in life, she'd probably put a ring on it there, Mr. Patel. But, you know, there is just something a little grotesque about defending your use of a private jet, which costs tens of thousands of dollars, flying it at the government expense, presumably, or maybe if you are reimbursing, you should at least

say that we don't know the full details but yeah um that's that's where we're at is cash patel is now posting about his girlfriend has done his 26 year old country music girlfriend has done more for this nation than most will in 10 lifetimes again not an attack on miss woken's uh but i wouldn't say that about any country music singer including the ones who are enormously successful um well at least has he been consistent on the issue of uh government jet use at taxpayer funds so what did he say in 23 about Christopher Ray and him using the government G5 to go on vacation. Let's take a lesson. And I'm not saying take all their funding. I'm not to defund everything guy. I'm just saying Chris Ray doesn't need a government funded G5 jet to go to vacation. Maybe we ground that plane.

$15,000 every time it takes off. I agree. I absolutely agree. If you want to see a girlfriend in, where was it, Nashville or something like that. Okay, hop commercial, brother. There's six flight today from DCA to Nashville. It's pretty cheap. He can go sit back there and coach. if you want to. Guess it's not enough. It must be nice to fly private all over the world or all over the country to go see your girlfriend sing. It definitely, it's a luxury indeed that should of course be befitted to all of our law enforcement officials. This is at a time when the government is shut down when you have many, you know, hundreds of thousands of government workers who are continuing to work, many of them and not get paid when you have food stamp benefits being cut off

and you are flying around at taxpayer expense to go watch a girlfriend saying the national anthem. And also, I mean, he's just like incompetence personified. You know, I mean, his handling of everything is a joke. Everything he claimed that he stood for before he came into this office is a complete and total joke. He's out there, you know, was writing books about how he would run the FBI. And, of course, was a leading, leading proponent, released the Epstein files, blah, blah, and we've seen how that is gone. The handling of the Tyler Robinson, you know, Charlie Kirk's murder has been pathetic. And so, you know, in a sense, he's become a kind of a unifying figure because I do feel like there,

is a cross-partisan level of contempt for this man who he is and the way that he has performed his duty series. Oh, I was telling you, the Valhalla thing is a meme. Like, the whole, people who aren't even political know the Valhalla. I mean, it's not funny. Like, it's crazy that you would actually say that at a national public press conference. And, like, that's a sketch across the country right now. Even people, again, who aren't even into politics can make the Valhalla joke

and everybody knows what they're talking about. A lot of people went for, as Cash Patel. kind of breakthrough. Yeah, and you know, it's funny. Somebody texts me, they're like, why did you put cash with a dollar sign in our headline the other day? Did you all notice the pin that he was wearing?

It said cash with the dollar sign. Because of him, because he was doing this crypto thing. We're just giving him the moniker that he himself has chosen. I'm using his own moniker, okay? All right, that's where the cash. What a clown. The cash thing comes from. Yeah, it's literally a joke.

So congratulations to Cash and to Alexis Wilkins. All I know is what I've been told, and that's a half-truth is a whole lie. For almost a decade, the murder of an 18-year-old girl from a small town in Graves County, Kentucky, went unsolved, until a local homemaker, a journalist, and a handful of girls came forward with a story. I'm telling you, we know Quincy killed her. We know. A story that law enforcement used to convict six people, and that got a story. The Citizen Investigator on national TV. Through sheer persistence and nerve,

this Kentucky housewife helped give justice to Jessica Curran. My name is Maggie Freeling. I'm a Pulitzer Prize-winning journalist, producer, and I wouldn't be here if the truth were that easy to find. I did not know her and I did not kill her, or rape or burn, or any of that other stuff that y'all said. They literally made me say that I took a match and struck and threw it on her.

They made me say that I pour gas on her. From Lava for Good, this is Graves County, a show about just how far our legal system will go in order to find someone to blame. America, y'all better work the hell up. Bad things happens to good people in small towns. Listen to Graves County in the Bone Valley feed on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcasts. And to binge the entire season ad-free, subscribe to Lava for Good Plus on Apple Podcasts. Michael Lewis here. My book, The Big Short, tells the story of the build-up and burst

of the U.S. housing market back in 2008. It follows a few unlikely, but lucky people who saw the real estate market for the black hole it would become and eventually made billion. billions of dollars from that perception. It was like feeding the monster, said Eisman. We fed the monster until it blew up.

The monster was exploding. Yet on the streets of Manhattan, there was no sign anything important had just happened. Now, 15 years after the Big Short's original release, and a decade after it became an Academy Award-winning movie, I've recorded an audiobook edition for the very first time. The Big Short Story, what it means when people start baseman,

betting against the market. And who really pays for an unchecked financial system? It is as relevant today as it's ever been, offering invaluable insight into the current economy and also today's politics. Get the big short now at pushkin.fm. slash audiobooks or wherever audiobooks are sold. Samihante, it's Anna Ortiz. And I'm Markandale. You might know us as Hilda and Justin from Ugly Betty. We played mother and son on the show, but in real life, we're best friends. And I'm all grown up now.

Welcome to our new podcast. Viva Bethy! Yay! Woo-hoo! Can you believe it has been almost 20 years? That's not even possible. Well, you're the only one that looks that much different. I look exactly the same.

We're re-watching the series from start to finish and getting into all the fashions, the drama, and the behind-the-scenes moments that you've never heard before. You're going to hear from guests like America Ferreira, Vanessa Williams, Michael Yuri, Becky Newton, Tony Plana, and so many more. Icons, each and every one. All of a sudden, like, someone, like, comes running up to me, and it's Salma Hayek.

And she's like, you are my ugly bitchy. And I was like, what is she even talking about? Listen to Viva Betty as part of the My Cultura Podcast Network, available on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Let's get to Israel, our great ally. Let me give you some of the backstory here for you guys who don't recall. We can put these images up on the screen. Horrific video leaked a while back showing the abuse, including sexual abuse, of this Palestinian hostage.

You can see the way that the IDF there, and this was in this notorious city-tamen prison facility. And so once this comes out and they go to actually arrest these men. who were involved in this abuse and this rape, what you saw there was a riot broke out, a right to rape riot broke out in Israel, including some politicians from the governing coalition and the ruling party who were involved in this,

who were not upset about the abuse. No, of course they weren't upset about that. They were upset that there might be any sort of charges and accountability, even some like sort of bogus sham investigation, which is what it has totally turned out to be. they were horrified that there would be any recriminations against anyone that was involved with the literal sexual abuse of a Palestinian prisoner that they were holding there. By the way, this was not a one-off.

This was not a one-off. We've seen numerous reports from international organization testimony from people who have come out of this facility in particular, but others as well. We've seen New York Times reporting about the systematic rape and sexual abuse of Palestinians being held by the IDF. So what happened here, apparently, is, you know, if you want to avoid getting the ICC involved as a country, you have to show that you are taking seriously the allegations against your own people, any sort of like war crime allegations against your own people.

So Israel will occasionally do these like sham investigations effectively to try to keep their image of, oh, no, we're the, you know, we're democracy in the Middle East, we, anything that goes wrong, we have accountability, et cetera. etc. So this was so bad that the video was leaked and they did this sham investigation. By the way, all of these guys continued to be free, etc. Okay. So what has happened since then? Let's put D3 up on the screen next to give you the backstory here. So it has been revealed who it was, this IDF legal chief who ended up leaking the video. So first, she, her name is military advocate general. You Fatt, Tomair, you're a shalmi. So first, she resigns. Then she actually disappears, and they found

what appeared to be a potential suicide note in her car, because there is this mass backlash in Israeli society, not again over the abuse of these prisoners, but of the fact that she leaked this video so that the world could see what was actually going on. So the headline here, IDF legal chief avoided probes into the Gaza war crime, citing right-wing backlash, source to say amid resignation. So just so you understand who this lady is, this is not some, you know, lefty, liberal person. This is someone who avoided in significant instances, including the strike on the World Central Kitchen workers, including on multiple hospital strikes that killed civilians, including reporters. This is someone who buried all of that and refused to investigate

all of those things. Why? Because she was worried about right-wing backlash. So, now that we have the information that she was the one who leaked this video, they are calling for her head. And I mean, literally, all the way up to Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu himself. Let's go ahead and show D2. So Bibi is saying here that the rape of the Israeli soldiers, the Palestinian prisoners in Citi Taman, caused enormous damage to the image of the state of Israel and the Israeli army and our soldiers. This may be, he says, the most difficult propaganda attack that the state of Israel has faced since its establishment. I don't recall an incident centered with this degree of force. This requires an independent investigation, not affiliated

with any party, and I expect such an investigation to be conducted. And then at bottom, you see the image of the rapist. This is them publishing a photo boasting while masked after a press conference so as not to be identified and prosecuted judicially abroad. And the most important thing this person says is that in all of Israel, no one is talking about the heinousness of the rape, but rather the anger is focused only on the leak of the videos that expose the crime, and this is what really bothers them. I mean, just what a twisted, what a twisted society that there's no ups. I mean, listen, we got, we criticized this country all the time.

You know, when the Abu Ghraib photos came out, that was a genuine scandal, right? People were horrified by it, okay? Now you have this come out, this isn't a scandal that these soldiers were raping Palestinians. the scandal is that the information came out and they are calling for literal lynch mobs against this woman and she's going to be charged and, you know, it has already had to resign is like threatening suicide

because she's so, you know, terrified of what they're going to do to her societally, completely insane story. Most Americans are good people. During Abu Ghraib, even, you know, Iraq, invade Iraq, you know, chest beating warrior people were all still horrified by the viz.

video and there were bipartisan outrage over what happened. And I mean, I remember even the names of some of those interrogators. Those were household names here in the United States. Over there, yeah, not so much because they want to protect them, I guess. The whole thing is just so crazy. And it's just so funny from Netanyahu to be like, this is one of the worst things that's ever happened in the history of the state of Israel. The leak of the video, again, to be clear. Which she, it's not like she put it out because she was really like. concerns about, you know, what was going on there.

She was worried about the ICC getting involved. That's what all of this was meant to forestall. Like the video was out there. The abuse was undeniable. And so this was an attempt to, you know, be able to, okay, we'll do our investigation. Don't worry. We care about these. We totally care about

these things. And so that was the course that she ultimately took. And then as I said before, you know, reporting from Harats was that she passed on a bunch of investigations and our whole thing was to bury things to cover them up, to delay, to push them off, even things like, you guys remember all of the tumult over the World Central Kitchen strike because it was huge news, Jose Andres involved.

You know, there was, the Biden administration was concerned, like, because people knew this guy and the Israelis promised there would be this investigation. This is the lady that buried all of that. So that's who we're talking about. And even that is not enough because she didn't just completely cover up and bury every single instance of Israeli war crimes. It's literally like a mob that's running the show over there. It's crazy. It's just so crazy. And at the very same time, there's like this whole fight over here about pro-Israel support and it's a Western country and it's North. They're just like a,

they're actually better than us. They have a better military. They're safer. They conduct things in a more humane and humanitarian way. Again, I don't know how you can look at this. There's only one case for Israel now at this point, which is like the Uber-hawk, like, Zionist case where they're like, yeah, they do whatever they want to do. It's like a right-wing authoritarian-ish-type government, and they back us up so we should back them up. It's like the same argument you would make on Saudi Arabia. I can't accept that. I don't, like, I don't believe it. I think it's wrong, and I think that costs us much more. There's no liberal Zionist case anymore for this country. In my opinion, like, it's dead. It's over. Not just in terms of the war, but also.

in terms of the way that their entire society is structured. And clearly the Democratic out, that's another thing. How can we just deny it at this point? These really people very clearly had no issue with the war in Gaza. They just like really didn't care. We need to accept that. That's just, that's just reality. They had differences opinion

on how to handle the hostas. That's it. Yeah, like that's basically it. So be it. I mean, again, I can kind of understand how they got there just given their history and their media environment. I don't agree with it, but whatever. We need to accept that that is genuinely with the Democratic direction of the Israeli government.

But now here you see a literal breakdown in the thing that they sell to us about why they're so different than the rest of the people in the Middle East. I've said this now for several months. I think they're all pretty much exactly the same. They're the same. And so you don't be coming to me talking about barbarism and all that stuff elsewhere. Oh, we're the children of the light. I'm just like, okay, listen.

The children of the right are the ones having right to grape riots. I would happily just deal with you in the same way that we deal with all other Middle Eastern countries. What's in it for us and what's not? And right now, the fact that an entire axis of U.S. politics is literally determined to protect this country from its own mistakes and to give them shelter at the ICC, the International Court, to take over their problems in Gaza, to spend hundreds of billions of dollars over the last several decades to justify and contort, you know, our own moral image and political rhetoric, to justify the bombing the deaths of tens of thousands of women and children for purposes that, again, remain

completely mysterious in terms of any beneficial to us, not to mention, you know, the horrific scenes that we all see. There's no words for this. And the only word is to ignore it, which is what the entire Western press is doing about this. They are just not a word. No. Okay?

Not one word about any of this stuff. You wouldn't even know. Ask your average Zio supporter. Do you know about this rape case in America? They won't know anything. Yeah. Literally, there's more controversy in Israel than there is here. Yeah.

It's crazy. True. And to your point about the liberal Zionist case being dead, which I think is reflected in the Democratic Party base and how much they have just completely, they're like, this is disgusting, it's a genocide, we don't want anything to do with this country. Here's, you know, an instance, put D5 up on the screen here. This is Ben Kavir, and you can see him, you know, pointing at these hostages, Palestinian hostages, who are there handcuffed, zip tied,

you know, on the floor, face down. And what he says here is, do you see them? This is how they are now. But one thing remains to be done. And that is to execute them. Okay. Those are our great allies, these great Western-style democracy in the Middle East. So, you know, don't kid yourself about what this government is. And don't get yourself about what the society supports at this point. this is the reality that we're dealing with. Yeah, I don't even know. No words for it. Seriously. Absolutely none. Whatever. All I know is what I've been told, and that's a half-truth is a whole lie.

For almost a decade, the murder of an 18-year-old girl from a small town in Graves County, Kentucky, went unsolved. Until a local homemaker, a journalist, and a handful of girls came forward. with a story. I'm telling you, we know Quincy Kilder, we know. A story that law enforcement used to convict six people and that got the citizen investigator on national TV. Through sheer persistence and nerve, this Kentucky housewife helped give justice to Jessica Curran.

My name is Maggie Freeling. I'm a Pulitzer Prize-winning journalist, producer, and I wouldn't be here if the truth were that easy to find. I did not know her and I did not kill her. Or rape or burn or any of that other stuff that y'all said it. They literally made me say that I took a match and struck and threw it on her. They made me say that I poured gas on her. From Lava for Good, this is Graves County.

A show about just how far our legal system will go in order to find someone to blame. America, y'all better work the hell up. Bad things happens to good people and see. Small towns. Listen to Graves County in the Bone Valley feed on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And to binge the entire season ad-free, subscribe to Lava for Good Plus on Apple Podcasts. back in 2008. It follows a few unlikely, but lucky people who saw the real estate market for the black hole

it would become, and eventually made billions of dollars from that perception. It was like feeding the monster, said Eisman. We fed the monster until it blew up. The monster was exploding. Yet on the streets of Manhattan, there was no sign anything important had just happened. Now, 15 years after the Big Short's original release, and a decade after it became a an Academy Award-winning movie, I've recorded an audiobook edition

for the very first time. The Big Short Story, what it means when people start betting against the market, and who really pays for an unchecked financial system, is as relevant today as it's ever been, offering invaluable insight into the current economy

and also today's politics. Get the Big Short now at Pushkin.fm. slash audiobooks, or wherever audiobooks are sold. Samihante, it's Anna Ortiz. And I'm Mark and Delicado. You might know us as Hilda and Justin from Ugly Betty. We played mother and son on the show, but in real life, we're best friends.

And I'm all grown up now. Welcome to our new podcast, Viva Betty! Yay! Woo-hoo! Can you believe it has been almost 20 years? That's not even possible. Well, you're the only one that looks that much different. I look exactly the same.

We're re-watching the series from start to finish and getting into all the the fashions, the drama, and the behind-the-scenes moments that you've never heard before. You're going to hear from guests like America Ferreira, Vanessa Williams, Michael Yuri, Becky Newton, Tony Plana, and so many more. Icons, each and every one. All of a sudden, like, someone, like, comes running up to me, and it's Selma Hayek. And she's like, you are my ugly bitchy. And I was like, what is she even talking about?

Listen to Viva Betty as part of the MyCultura podcast network. Available on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Speaking of Israel, it is now destroying the Republican Party much in the same way that it absolutely destroyed the Democratic Party. And it's exposing a schism between the party elites, the people in power, the old guard, and the younger generation, which is increasingly going into dramatically different directions. And there is a full-blown campaign right now amongst Republican Party elites to cancel. Tucker Carlson and really also to just silence any critics of Israel. Let's get specifically to the recent Republican Jewish coalition meeting here in Washington where multiple speakers took the podium to denounce Tucker Carlson to justify support for Israel. Let's take a listen

first to Randy Fine. Today, Tucker Carlson is the most dangerous anti-Semite in America. Multiple speakers have talked about the rise of anti-Semitism on the right, but it is not enough to speak in platitudes or generalities about the fight. We must call evil by its name. It's chosen to take on the mantle of leader of a modern-day Hitler youth to broadcast and feature those who celebrate the Nazis, those who call for the extermination of Israel, to defend Hamas, to even criticize President Trump

for stopping Iran's nuclear ambitions. Yes, how dare he criticize President? and Trump for stuff. Anyway. I love what they had, they had Tucker is not magazine signs, like printed up. Right, not an op whatsoever, right? Clearly not designed at Kinko's in a room of 150 people. There, by the

way, did not just, was it just the self-described Hebrew hammer of Republican Randy Fine? We also had Mark Levin, a very vocal supporter of Israel, openly supporting cancellation, de-platforming. Let's take a listen. Hitler admires, Stalin admires,

Jew haters, American Haters, Churchill haters, you're damn right, we're going to cancel them and de-platform them. It's called the market system. They don't have a lifetime job like a bureaucrat who we're going to protect. And if they're your friend, there's something wrong with you. No Hitler admirer, Holocaust denier, platformer should be anybody's friend, as a matter of fact. get to wrap your psychotic, mental, unhinged, Nazi, Klan, jihadist bullshit around American patriotism. You don't get to claim your MAGA and America first when you're lining up with the Marxists and the Islamists and Hamas and the terrorists.

That's not America first. That's sick. We're going to cancel. We're going to cancel. We're going to de-platform them, and then finally, my personal favorite pitch from Lindsey Graham about what MAGA really is all about, take a listen in his own words. I feel good about the Republican Party. I feel good about where we're going as a nation. We're killing all the right people and we're cutting your taxes. So to those who worry about these stupid interviews and far-off places, don't worry. The Republican Party has figured it out when it comes to Israel.

We understand that Israel is a friend of America to the bitter end. We are cutting your taxes and we are killing all the right people. That is now Lindsey Graham's pitch for what MAGA is all about. And all of this is in the context, the fallout of the Tucker Carlson and Nick Fuentes interview, which has caused like massive consternation here in Washington. Let's go and put this up here from Heritage Foundation, which previously put out a video, which you guys covered. on Friday in defense of Tucker Carlson, but also saying, I disagree with Nick Fuentes.

Here's like a long tortured statement from Kevin Roberts, the president of Harage, saying, yesterday I said I abhorred views by Nick Fuentes and a long thing about racism and anti-Semitism are not relics of the past. Actually, anti-Semitism and all that is a huge problem. Let me just zoom out and kind of give my general take about what's happening here. Yeah. This is the same thing that happened in the Democratic Party. Israel has been ripping apart the coalition from the beginning, which is young people who are skeptical of war who are also deeply concerned about the financial system and the traditional three-legged stool party elites. Trump was a band-aid during the campaign, which could somehow convince

an RFK Tulsi supporter to vote for him in addition to the Republican Jewish coalition and others who say this is most pro-Israel president of all time. Why did that fall apart? Because like Biden, you're not just in the campaign anymore. You have power. When you have power, you make discrete choices. You made a discrete choice to support Israel. In the vacuum of that, what the Republican Party elites did is throughout the entire Biden administration and the early Trump administration, any critic of the government of Israel and of U.S. support for Israel was branded anti-Semitic from the beginning. There was a concerted effort to make sure any critique of Donald Trump on the state of Israel was entirely anti-Semitic. So what happened with a significant portion of

young podcast, curious, young dudes who were pro-Trump and who were anti-war. Where do you think that they started to seek out some of their Israel and Trump criticism? That's kind of a secondary part. And this is a sickness that is currently in MAGA media. Nobody is ever able who is quote-unquote pro-Trump or who is not a leftist to just say basic critiques about Trump administration. And so there is also a huge appetite for people who are critical of Trump, not even just say from the right, but who are not leftists.

That's what a lot of people, who voted for Trump and who disagree with what they say, want to hear. That is the vacuum through which Mr. Fuentes has been able to resuscitate much of his image. Let's all remember where Nick Fuentes is before October 7th. He was working on the Kanye campaign doing screeds about, you know, whatever, black IQ or whatever on his show. Okay? That's where he was. And yes, he was canceled to within an inch of his life. He was off Twitter.

Elon unbanned him. There's a perfect circumstance that led to him. to October 7th and the re-rise, let's say, on Twitter. That is, but though, this is the, this is what drives me crazy about the whole thing. They act like it came out of a vacuum. It is a creation of the unending cancellation rhetoric from the Zionist right that has now pervaded all of politics for the last two years, which has pushed people to the point where any criticism of the state of Israel is conflated with anti-Semitism, the definition itself no

longer means almost anything to anyone and they don't want to hear it anymore. And then finally, this kind of gets to the whole rhetoric thing. I saw this from Dave Smith. How can I be lectured about racial politics and divisive language after watching these people cheer on the deaths of starving children over the last two? You're going to lecture me about morality and about race politics when you support an explicitly racially aligned state in this. the Middle East and you create your whole identity around this, you have no moral authority over me to lecture me about how my country should act in relation to this other. That is the vacuum through which this has all been created. And there's so many, I know so many young people,

they're not leftists. And yes, even with Israel, they're not, you know, genocide posters or Kaffi-awarest at protests. They're just disgusted this is being done, both in our name and that we're paying for it and of the obsession of foreign politicians, well, they have an inability to succeed financially in this country. That's the entire thing that is about it. So that's the schism. Charlie Kirk was doing his best, by the way, to try to maintain this. And his loss, really, what has erupted. You know, I think with his shows how frankly valuable he was to the state of Israel, I think in his ability to try and to square the circle. But this conflict was inevitable because of the situation that they created. And so I don't know.

I just, I can't stand like so many of this Randy, I mean, think, about the things Randy Fine. Randy Fine said he wants to nuke Gaza. Yeah. You're going to lecture me about morality. He called for them all to be start. He called for them to be starved. And you're going to lecture me about Hitlerism

and about racism and to, you know, morality police. It's like, fuck you, you know? Well. And that's, that is, you know, and this is a long way before, because this is what I want to make sure. I'm not saying I'm no fan of Mr. Fuente, who probably thinks I should be neat, denaturalized

and deported, and then my interracial marriage is horrible, right? You know, but, you know, I can also sociologically understand why so many people would find that type of rhetoric very, very convincing and entertaining, frankly. Who else? I mean, me, a few others who can criticize Trump, there's not very many of us out there who can say it legitimately. And there's a massive appetite for it. Look at Theo, look at Andrew Schultz, look at Tim Dillon, you know, all of these guys who were Trump curious and are now very critical, there's a massive audience for it. And then finally, people are blaming Fuentes Tucker and others. That is not why kids in Maga hats at Ole Miss are showing up to TPUSA events

asking about Israel. It's not. You can convince yourself all day long that that's the case. You could literally de-platform Fuentes and that he would never have a platform ever again. Those kids would still be showing up there. You have a reality problem in this entire thing. And this is an unsquirable circle right now in the current politics. Yeah. It just does not, it's not capable, frankly, of being squared with the current Republican Party elites, which are in power. I mean, I think the cat is out of the bag. And in terms of, you know, your assertion that these young guys would still be showing up and asking questions about Israel and whatever.

But I also think a lot of those guys are Fuentes fans and they are Grovers. And he is incredibly, he is incredibly influential among young Republicans and young Republican men specifically. I think the point that you're making is that effectively Republican elites have lost the moral standing to gatekeep in any way. So even when it comes to a literal Nazi, which Nick Fuentes is, I mean, he is a holocauster, he does love Hitler, like, you know, back in Kanye as he said, I love Hitler, all that, right? He is those things. And yet, because, number one, they have the elites of the party have supported an outright genocide that's happening in our timelines. number two, because they've tried to conflate any criticism whatsoever of our foreign policy vis-a-vis Israel as anti-Semitism.

They have lost any moral standing to gatekeep and say, this is the bounds of acceptable discourse within the Republican Party. I think that's a problem because I actually do think that you should keep Nazis out of your coalition. I actually do think that that should be a line that you can draw. And obviously, like, they have completely failed through their abuse. of the term anti-Semitism to maintain any sort of moral legitimacy. And not just through the use of the term,

but also through their own actions. I mean, you point to Randy Fine. You can look at what this administration is doing. You have lost any ability to tell people this is where the line is and this is what is acceptable. And I think it's a real problem because, you know, that Tucker, that Tucker Fuentes interview, first of all, Tucker before he interviewed Nick was going very hard in the paint saying he's a gay, loser who lives in his mom's basement, then when they're face-to-face, very patty cakes, you know, I would just explain to me in your own words, not bringing up any of the specific things that he

said for him to have to grapple with. And Fuentes realizes he's got this opening. Because guess what, if your narrative of the world is like, the Jews are the problem for everything, you know, the fact that the state of Israel and their defenders have done their damnedest to conflate every Jew in the world with their genocidal actions is doing half of the propaganda battle for Nick Fuentes. They are doing that. So you can say, I agree. I agree that Israel is equivalent to the Jews and just look at what they're doing and look at how our politicians are acting. So through our complicity in this genocide and through our pushing of the propaganda that, yes, every Jew has to be conflated with the horrors that are being done in their name,

that also helped to solidify the opening for Nick Fuentes. And here's the other dynamic in politics. Like, Tucker will, you know, Tucker, especially when he was on Fox, I don't know how much he does it now, but especially when he was on Fox, he talked all about the great replacement theory. He's saying replacement, replace, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. He does enough to give himself plausible deniability because the grander part of that conspiracy is that it is Jews leading the great replacement theory to replace whites. He did not say. No, that's, Sagar, let me finish my point. He doesn't say that part, right?

He uses, you know, it keeps it on the like, oh, it's a political project of the elites. Maybe he says like the global elites, but he maintains this plausible deniability. Guess what? The person who actually comes in and says the freaking thing, and that's Nick Fuentes, who says it's the Jews, who are coming in and replace the white people, the person who actually says the thing out loud, they are going to be the ones who win that rhetorical debate. This is what Trump sees on in, you know, 2015, 2016, with his rise. the things that Fox News would dog whistle and hint at, he would come out and say. So that's the dynamic that's going on right now with Tucker and Fuentes and Candace. And that's why, you know, I think Hanania and his assertion that like this is the direction of the Republican Party,

I think he's right. Because what, you think Mark Levin's going to be able to pull this back? You feel like who's going to be the person that's going to say, no, this is too far. We don't want to be an actual Nazi party. Let's talk about why he's actually, why I think that Hanania is right in a sense. I think what he's right in a sense is that the Republican Party establishment doesn't have legitimacy for a significant portion of young people. Not everyone are a bunch of leftists, okay? Many of us have like very, I mean, you know, even the framing, frankly, about immigration that you just gave. like there is a legitimate case to be made about immigration, apportionment, and the census.

That's not a grand Jewish conspiracy. It's reality in terms of the way that the demographic change of our population happened under the Biden administration. We've had endless arguments about that, but there's a non-racial case, which I believe most people who voted for Trump on immigration, actually do believe whenever they wanted control of our border and particularly to want to know that and think that that's an insane system. Now, however, what has happened is that under the Trump administration, with their flagged, basically conflation of Jewish identity with the state of Israel, which, by the way, Trump says himself all the time.

Oh, yeah. Oh, these Jews don't even support me, even though I'm so pro-Israel. Pro-Israel. Maybe there's more to them than Israel support. But also, the Israel supporters do it themselves. John Put Heretz, who is from a Nepo baby commentary writer, literally tweeted that Trump can say Shylock all he wants because he bombed Iran. So Trump can say the word Shylock, which according to him is a,

anti-Jewish slur because he did a foreign policy action, which is beneficial to the same of this. So you're the ones who created this reality. So to the extent then that the whole Republican Party is going in this direction. Again, why is that? Because young people, particularly a lot of young men, are deeply angry at the state of the country. They feel as if they cannot advance. The reason that they cannot advance is because of a bipartisan establishment elite. They also do not feel that they will ever be able to make enough money to support themselves and get married, even though they want to, a lot of these guys desperately want to get married. Many of them, by the way, let's even look at the entire phenomenon of spending all your time online, getting

into racial politics. That is a loser behavior. And it is downstream of gaming, pornography, marijuana, spending all your time buy your, so. Why do you think I rage against all this stuff? Because it creates these maladjusted, so antisocial freaks who, by the way, in all of society, when you have underemployed angry young men, what direction does politics go? This is not to excuse it. This is simply to show you where things are headed. This is why I rail against degenerate libertine society because I understand the consequences of it. And we've seen it dramatically throughout history. And then finally to like the conservative point about why did Kevin Roberts, why is TPSA having these issues?

issues. Why? Because it's a down, it's a bottom-up phenomenon. I can't tell you, from my criticism of the state of Israel and more, I get more private support than probably on any other issue. I agree with you. I agree with, but they can't say it because their jobs depend on it. That's not an anti-Jewish conspiracy. That's reality. Is that even if you are an econ staffer at a conservative think tank, if you have a dissidence view of Israel, you're dead, okay? You're not getting a job. You're not going to get a job at the Trump administration. You're never going to work again in this town. That's the reality they created. That's not an anti-Semitic point. That's just simply, again, a statement of fact. And that is slowly bubbling up. And then let's

take Tucker on top of all of this. Tucker, who is the most, in my opinion, influential, I mean, look, actually just go look at the download charts, number one conservative podcast in the entire country, far outpaces everyone else. In the conversation with Fuentes, I personally would have liked to see more critical. I'll say it. And Tucker is a great friend, and I support him. I liked being on a show, and I hope to be back on again, I wish he had been a little bit more critical of him in terms of, because I know he can do it. Look at the Ted Cruz stuff, right? He's a master interview if he wants to be. The thing that comes down to it is that the friend-enemy distinction is becoming much more difficult because you have to also consider the way that they have

tried to destroy his own life. They literally, with Tucker, I mean, there's recently this daily mail piece where they said Tucker Carlson, quote, needs to be neutralized, okay? That's the type of rhetoric that is now coming from the more Zionist right wing. They're calling him Hitler Youth. They're saying like the most dangerous anti-Semite in the country. Genuinely, like an all-out campaign to destroy his business, to destroy his personal life, to destroy anybody who's associated with him, that mentally, I'm saying, because I suffer from this too. For me, man, it is like whenever they want me to cancel somebody else, especially for the whole Israel thing, I have a lot of difficulty with it. I really do because of the level of vitriol that I have gotten. I can't even

criticize the Barry Weiss deal without being bombarded with you're a Jew hater, right? As if I care that Barry Weiss is Jewish, that it has anything to do with. No, it's only about Israel. I don't care about any of that. And so I'm saying from my own personal experience, the level of personal vitriol that you get as somebody who is in any way, you know, more on the right wing end of the spectrum, critical of Israel, I think it might be ten times worse. than from the Democratic side, like the level of money, the amount of, you know, personal, just nastiness that comes away times me by a hundred. And that's where Tucker Carlson is currently sitting. That's, that's, you know, this is, this is why it is just like, these people deserve

everything that's coming to them. They created this reality. And then there's also politics on top of this, which is somebody who tries to run on the mantle of Trump again in 2028 and who especially wants to win back these young people, I think this is a non-starter. I really do. Because the Israel question, if you cannot answer independently and honestly, you can still be pro-Israel, but you have to be able to admit certain things, like that kid said, ethnic cleansing. If you can't say those types of words and you just, you know, little Washington platitudes, that is a message that you are either controlled, part of the system. And we can't have that anymore when we're young, not when my health insurance is going up by 20%. And I'm 99% sure that if you get elected and you talk

that way, that you're going to be shipping bombs there, and there's not a dollar coming my way or anybody else. That's why it's not just about Israel. It's about control. The Democrats are figuring this out right now, and I think the Republicans, you know, they're in for a rude awakening. And if you don't give an inch, then yes, Fuentes will be more popular than ever. It's not an inevitability. That's the irony of it. I just said pre-October 7th, you're working for Kanye. You're doing nothing, all right? And it, but the reality of Israel criticism being slowly pushed out. How else do you think Myron Gaines and Nick Fuentes and Dan Bolzarin? I mean, Belzarian, nobody even heard of the guy for five, six years before that. He was selling vapes

with girls in bikinis. Now he's literally doing nothing, playing poker, I guess, whatever it is, he does. Now all of a sudden, Israel, right, comes out of nowhere. This was the back, the niche that they were able to fill because of the reality that they created. And then for many people who are not, racist, anti-Semitic, or anything, for many of us. I mean, the personal vitriol smear campaign, and, as you and I know, privately, public or private campaign as well in terms of what has been used against us. It's one of those where, you know, I talked about this in my interview with Tucker. You have to fight every day not to become the thing that they want you to be. They want you to hate Jews. They want you to fulfill their conspiracy. They want me to give a diatribe about

global jewelry or anything. And I'm not going to do it. You know, I don't believe it. I think it's ridiculous. But they want us to become the mere image of what they are. Well, because it proves their point. And this point Ryan's made, which I think is true and also is something that has been true since the foundation of the state of Israel, the state of Israel and the government benefits

from a rise in genuine anti-Semitism because then they're propaganda. We have to have a safe space for Jews. like that has more credibility if you see, you know, Myron Gaines when the like Nazi posting or I guess internal group chat of the quote unquote young Republicans came out. He was like, we're done with this. Yeah, we like Hitler now. We're going to say it. Like that's who we're talking about. I mean, just so you guys know, we're not just casually throwing around the tantrum anti-Semitism. These are people who genuinely are like Hitler was based. We like Hitler. We support him. Talk about the global jury. Like, you know, really like go full out with the great. replacement theory is led by Jews. I mean, all in the most anti-Semitic shit you could possibly imagine. That's what we're talking about here. And so, yeah, I mean, on the Democratic side, you've had effectively the Israelis have kind of like given up on Democrats.

You know, the base of the Democratic Party is 90% against Israel at this point. 80% say it's a genocide. Like there's a huge disconnect between the leadership, the elite election. of the Democratic Party and the base, that is being sorted out right now as we speak and the writing is on the wall. Yeah. The part of the reason why in the Republican side, it's so incredibly fierce and contested right now is number one because Trump's in power, so he's the one who's actually like

doing the stuff. But number two, because you do still have a majority of Republicans who are very Israel supportive. You know, if you are over the age of, let's say, 40 in the Republican Party, you still have that very like there are ally, sort of Cold War mentality. We're with them no matter what. You buy the propaganda. You probably haven't really thought about it all that much, right?

It just, yes, we support Israel, period, end of story. And certainly the elites in the Republican Party are almost all lockstep on board with Israel no matter what. And like when the Democratic Party, a lot of the donors are very committed to Israel. And that's their view as well. So that's why this is, I think, so like hot and fiercely contested. within the Republican Party right now is because you do have, even among the base, you have a genuine divide where still the majority

is very pro-Israel. It's very generational, but the majority is still very pro-Israel. So that reckoning is gonna take a long time to come. And it is all generational. And I mean, let's also just consider like some, like they literally support Israel, many of these people for religious reasons.

And then they get mad when Tucker was like, I think it's heresy to purport. your dispensationalist view of the Bible to say that the political state of Israel is described there, and that's why we must support them, as he showed, with Ted Cruz. Why is that an anti-Semitic point? Why is that even an anti-Christian talking point? You're not allowed, Tucker is not allowed to debate Christian questions of theology? That's the real. I mean, this is what they're creating. They're doing all of the, you know, the cancel culture, de-platforming discourse from Mark Levine and others. They are no different, you know, than any of the.

the woke left was on the issue of race at the height of 2020. And that's also, I think that's another thing that really gets a lot of us is if you don't religiously care about Israel, you can't help but look at the same tactics by so many of the pro-Israel supporters to the same woke leftists on the issue of race

who we despise. And here we're not talking about trying to cancel Nick Fuentes. We're talking about trying to cancel like, you know, Dave Smith. Yes. You know, people who just have like a, legitimate critique of Israel or, you know, yourself or myself or whatever, where it's like you can't even say these things because I think there's a case for canceling Nick Fonta. I think there's a

case for like it actually did work better. When he was de-platformed, he had a lot less power. Now, the moment is different, et cetera. But, you know, I do think that there are lines that should be appropriate to draw in society and maybe being an overt Nazi is one that we could talk about. It's difficult. But with what your point is, is that they drew the line at you literally cannot, you cannot protest Israel. You can't write an op-ed about Israel. You can't talk about it at all. If you do your Hamas, you know, everybody's Hamas, everything that is negative about Israel is Hamas, et cetera. And if you're going to try to draw the line there, then, yeah, people are going to say, and again, this is not defending, because again, we're talking earlier about personal responsibility. Like, these people are responsible for the stupid, hateful Nazi views. But if you're going to try to draw the line there, yeah, people are going to say, you're anti-Semitic smear doesn't work. And by the way, you're, like, actually low-key convincing me. of the most extreme position, the actual hateful position on this issue. Absolutely. And look, the cancellation thing, like we talked about Charlie Kirk.

I mean, everybody does believe in a little bit of cancel culture. And if we're all being honest, the question I also think comes back to political effectiveness. And I can't just help but just point to the pre-October 7th consensus of where things were. That is the reality is different. And that's, again, I just want to bring it back to Dave, who recently had a debate with somebody. And they were like, oh, Nick Fuentes said that. And he was just like, again, what is more damaging to society to norms is edgy, trolling, and in some cases genuine racism and overt pro-Nazism, or cheering on and politically supporting the slaughter of tens of thousands, if not hundreds of thousands of people and using our money and perverting our political system on that question.

It's pretty obvious to me, which one that is. This is not a defense. Again, these people hate my guts. They think I'm some, you know, they'll call me a jeet. They'll call me, you know, whatever. My child, they'll say is a mongrel, okay? So fuck them, all right? I have no, you know, political ground or any of that to be made whenever it comes.

But, you know, the question comes back to. Bingo, right? So, yeah, where's your moral high ground? And unlike them, you know what I think? We still have to live together. We all need to live together in this country. And, you know, to borrow an AOC-type leftist talking point in many respects. If you hold those views, I feel bad for you.

I pity you. I genuinely think most of the time you are that way because you got dealt a very shit hand in life. And yes, you have absolute and personal agency for the horrific things that you believe. And yes, on a personal level, if you ever said that to my face, I would probably beat the shit out of you if I could.

But at a major sociological view, I can and do understand how people with views like that, first of all, should be overtly condemned on a personal level, and we should do everything we possibly can to prevent it. And I can understand how with our libertine, disgusting, degenerate society, of gambling and all the other things, that we will create 10 times more of people who hold those types of abuse,

which is why I go to war with it. Well, my analysis leads to a different layer, which is that you have to deal with the material content. Like, people have to feel like they have a stake in society, like they're going to be able to succeed, like there's a path. Well, it's just not just success, but some sort of meaning, some sort of purpose, right? Because if you don't have that, then it's going to, you know, then yeah, you're going to spend your life, you know, traveling whatever, using whatever opiate your society has available to you at this moment. And the one thing our society is fantastic at generating right at this moment is high octane opiates to all of us, you know, to get addicted to and colonize our minds and distract us and preoccupies us.

So we can get our minds off the fact for, you know, a lot of individuals that life looks very bleak. If you don't deal with that, then you are going to have ugly, hateful politics. And that's what we're seeing right now. And so especially, you know, if you have young people who come from middle class upbringings, who, you know, we're sold the, you go to college and do the thing and take on all the debt and you're going to be able to get a good job. and then, oh, whoops, we created some AI and there are no jobs anymore. Like, how do you think this is going to go? So, you know, you have to, on the one hand, like, abhor,

certainly the influencers, the McFuentes of the world who actually have power, you have to abhor that. And I do think that, you know, I am more open to some, like, level of gatekeeping when it comes to and cancellation, when it comes to overt Nazis. But I also understand, you're not going to cancel your way out of this problem. You're not going to cancel your way on the problem.

cancellation, I'm like, listen, you know what? You literally here have an Indian guy trying to make the case here for why that's not going to solve your issue. Why are we here? Like, you can't ignore that. We have to live in this heterogeneous, multicultural society, which was created. We have a lot of differing views about how to get them, but we have to live together. You can't actually cancel your way out of it. It's impossible. If we could have, it would have worked. Seriously, it absolutely would have worked. I will. I will maintain, though, that when Fuentes was canceled. He had a lot less power. And I do think, look, he's, he's, he's like funny, he is talented, you know, he has a hold on. He has power. I mean, that's part of why you see

so many right now on the right, like, you know, having him on and having a little patty case, and they're afraid because he has a, he not only has a significant audience, but he has a lot of clout and sway with that audience. And so if you're in the camp that has been Israel, real critical, you likely share a lot of fans with Nick Fuentes and you're a little nervous. I mean, these are the incentives and people can talk themselves into a lot of things, but your incentive is, let me be a little kid gloves here. Let me not piss off my own fan base. Let me, you know, let me not look like on some like loser, woke, scold, cuck, cringe, whatever.

And so, you know, that's part of what's going on here too. And Fuentes realizes he has this moment and he's trying to moderate, you know, with Tucker. He was, oh, no, I don't hate anybody, blah, blah, blah. It's like, which is why you have to go back? Okay, well, why did you say this about you? Why did you say this about black people? Why did you say they should, they're all criminals. They should all be locked up, right?

So he's trying to mainstream himself right now, and it is, it's working. It's working. To the extent of the influencer point, you're definitely correct. Yeah. But I actually really think a lot of this is friend and enemy. I think that's what it mostly is about. But, you know, I mean, this is something you all have to be careful of, is you all fall, you know, a lot of people fall for the enemy of my enemy is

my friend. That's just not always the case, okay? Like, sometimes you have to have a lot of personal agency to make sure you don't go down that hole. And that's why, you know, on a personal level, I really detest a lot of these people. And they've said some horrible, horrible things about me. But I can see it literally, like me personally, but also, you know, anybody who is Indian American. But the point I always come back to is I'm like, okay, this is really bad. And we need to make sure that this doesn't become like a bigger thing. Now, how do we make sure that that's become a bigger thing? Well, we take a look at why anybody would potentially even be influenced by this in the first place.

Because you can't cancel your way out of this, especially now. You know, it's out in the open, right? The gatekeeping shit, it doesn't work anymore. We literally live in the age of the printing press where anybody with a voice in a megaphone can get a voice at any time. Yes, perhaps there's some downsides to that. But there's a lot of benefits to it as well. And to the whole original point around free speech, and you're talking about material conditions, I don't think that it's all that ultimately difficult to make sure that things don't go down this dark direction. You just have to have democratic legitimacy with the people. That's true. That is why there is so much despondency. When we think back to the early days of fascism in the 1930s and with Mussolini, you have to understand that the why Republic was doing okay prior to the Great Depression. And it was a multifactoral decision,

ultimately to pursue the path of Nazism and of fascism in Italy. Most of it came back to the failure of the Treaty of Versailles. So a lack of faith in the political elite, the stab in the back theory, the game's legitimacy, a lack of faith in the economic institutions, and a fundamental belief that this previous way of doing business was not a way to solve our practice. and make it so that we can have any sort of legitimate say in our affairs, which is why people went down that road. You can go and read Richard Evans, the Richard Evans series on the Third Reich. It's one of the best series of books I've ever read.

And when you read it, you will not justify it, but you will understand. And I think that that's what more people need to understand. I'm not, by the way, I don't think we're anywhere close to that. But I'm only saying, though, that to demographically try to understand and save your own country. You have to make sure that you don't create the same way that they tried to at that time of, oh, well, you know, they tried to solve it through violence or, as you said, cancellation, right, outlawing literal political party. They believe that that was a way that you could pursue your own ends. It wasn't true, ultimately. So you have to learn from a lot of those things, you know,

finally. And we have a successful example here. I was going to say, I have that freedom from fear book right behind me. And the reason I do is because that book is about how FDR says, you know, America from a communist or a fascism, a fascist revolution. We were going down that road. I really believe that. In the 30s, we had an actual choice. Or if FDR it died in 1934, like in some sort of alternate history, things would have gone in a very bad direction. Yeah. But that's a real example, by the way, of how, you know, you can solve a lot of it. And there were serious similar problems at that time. What, you think anti-Semitism brahma now? Go back to the 1930s. You think racism is a problem now?

Now, listen, man, like you have no idea what you're talking about from the rise of the KKK and all that at that time. Not to me, go take a look at any Confederate statue on any battlefield. It'll all say built in 1933, all right? It's not an accident for why all of that came to be. So, yes, study your own history and examples and see how you don't have to go down that direction. Do I have faith that any of our political leaders will go down then or take us out of this? No, I actually don't know. These are the choices that are on the table.

If anything, I don't know, maybe this is like a live narration of our own downfall. but there you go. All right. Dark, dark sometimes. Okay, we'll see you later. Johnny Knoxville here. Check out Crimless, Hillbilly Heist, my new true crime podcast from Smartless Media,

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or wherever audiobooks are sold. This is an I-Heart podcast.