Breaking Points with Krystal and Saagar - 12/5/25:Bannon Praises Ryan, Hegseth Boat Strikes, Pentagon Press Clowns & MORE!

Episode Date: December 5, 2025

Ryan, Emily, Griffin and Mac discuss Bannon praising Ryan's reporting, Hegseth orders new boat strikes, Pentagon press core clowned & MORE. Mac's YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/GoodPoliticGuy Griffin: https://x.com/griffinpdavis   To become a Breaking Points Premium Member and watch/listen to the show AD FREE, uncut and 1 hour early visit: www.breakingpoints.com Merch Store: https://shop.breakingpoints.com/  See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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gentlemen'scutturbin.com. Please enjoy responsibly. Hey guys, Saga and Crystal here. Independent media just played a truly massive role in this election, and we are so excited about what that means for the future of this show. This is the only place where you can find honest perspectives from the left and the right that simply does not exist anywhere else. So if that is something that's important to you,

Please go to breakingpoints.com, become a member today, and you'll get access to our full shows, unedited, ad-free, and all put together for you every morning in your inbox. We need your help to build the future of independent news media, and we hope to see you at breaking points.com. All right. Good morning, everyone. It is Friday, December 5th. Welcome to your breaking points Friday show. We got Emily. We got Ryan. And we have McCallie Holmes here in the studio today. How's everybody doing? Glad to have Mac. How you doing? Fired up, fired up and ready to go. incredible and no crystal no saga we'll make it everybody feel free to tune out now or or go big in the comments for us you know maybe support support the friday show uh this this band of pirates we have a big show today we've got more strikes on venezuela uh we're going to be talking to ryan about his war on the new pentagon press corps uh we've got some news on the january 6th

pipe bomber than cash patel uh we also have a little bit more betting news perhaps we'll get into a little bit of candace owens versus t p u s a and perhaps if we have time even a little bit of olivia nuzzi so quite a big friday show plan for you today but i wanted to start with ryan ryan we have to ask you were on steve bannon show yesterday and uh i'm i'm do you have Are you ready to issue an apology? How dare you? What happened here? Should we just throw up a clip before Ryan defends himself?

Mack, throw up a, throw up a second. Let's just give the audience some texture. Let's look at some of this, this glazing that took place yesterday. Tropical glazing. All over the story. I look forward to having you back. I want people to start going to your site on DropSight News. Where do people go?

What's your social media? Yeah, dropSightenews.com on all social. and we're on all social platforms at drop site news. I think the posse will find a lot useful there. I think they will find a lot useful. You're an intrepid reporter, sir, and a voice of truth. Sometimes people love it and sometimes people love it less, but you're a warrior. Thank you so much for joining something.

I appreciate you. You're a warrior, Ryan. No lies detected. How to go, Ryan? It was hilarious. I got to make, I'm going to, I guess that's going to have to be a new semi-ironic pin tweet. He finishes talking about me being tough as boot leather, which is just comical coming from Bannon. Awfully leathery dude, so he would know.

But it was great to be on because he's got a huge audience. And we had just published a story this week about how Kier Starrmer and his political machine had spent years. actively and secretly destroying both left wing and conservative media ecosystems. We covered the story yesterday because one of the outlets that they secretly went after, well, they went after it publicly, but what wasn't known is that it was Keir Stummer's machine that was behind it. One of those outlets was the Federalist where Emily used to work and she remembers the way that this was a quite effective, actually, attack on the monetary.

of their news outlets that were oppositional to them on the left they effectively destroyed this this major progressive publication in the UK called the Canary it's now it's just now recovering but they went from something like 20 plus you know full-time staff and an influential force in UK media to like one person um thanks to this this secret attack and the whole aim of it was to destroy Corbinism inside the Labor Party and to elevate Kier-Starmer. So I don't think Bannon has a whole lot of love for Corbinism, but he does have love for Breitbart, the Federalist and the other right-wing papers and is against having them censored. So it was a good outlet to get that story out. By the way, for the book, it's an adapted excerpt and expanded reporting from the book

called the fraud, which I have here and which people should get if they want to learn the nitty-gritty about Kier Starmer. It's by Paul Holden, a journalist over in the UK. But yeah, so that was that was fun. As Emily knows, I listen to the war room sometimes to like keep up with what the populist right is up to. So I'm familiar with the posse and the shenanigans they get up to. It was like a long-time listener, first-time caller situation. That's right. Was there a little bit of a Trump-Mam-Dani energy in the room there, you know, left-to-left-wing populace, right-wing populace? Yeah, maybe that's what it is.

This is the real mega-communism, right? Yeah. And people were asking if I asked him about the Epstein connections. I had actually asked him about that two weeks ago for a story that we wrote about Epstein, him, and Modi. trying to arrange a meeting between him and Modi. But no, I didn't, I didn't, you can go watch the interview. I didn't ask questions. I was getting questions asked of me.

Well, we accept your apology, Ryan, for platforming this figure. You just platformed him. You're right. We're all stained. Our blood's on all of our hands here. But Ryan, you will be sharing a cell next time. You guys can be bunkmates. There we go.

In the next time, you guys both go to the claim. It's 5.23 p.m. One of your kids is asking for a snack. Another is building a fort out of your clean laundry. And you're staring at a half-empty fridge and thinking, what are we even going to eat tonight? Or you could just hello fresh it. With over 80 recipes to choose from every week, including kid-friendly ones,

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And they were just like, so what do you got? What ideas? And I was like, oh, no. What? Check out Not My Best Moment with me, Kevin on stage on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcast. Have you ever listened to those true crime shows and found yourself with more questions than answers? And what is this? How is that not a story we all know?

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Listen to Crimless on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Let's get to show our top story today. More strikes in Venezuela. Mac, you can pull it up here. Pete Hegseth announced yet another strike here. And I think another thing that someone. one flagged is he seemed to do it at the request of a TPUSA producer, Andrew Polvit said, oh, it would be awesome if we could get more of these strikes. Pete Hegseth quoted it,

Mac, if we could pull that up next and said, yeah, we got it here for you. Your wish is our command, Andrew, just sunk another narco boat. So TPUSA, still very relevant in the conversation. here. Ryan, what do we make of this? I'm curious how Emily would understand this, but Charlie Kirk, you know, personally lobbied at some, at some expense, you know, Trump not to attack Iran. Trump apparently even yelled at him over it. Like, Kirk knew that what he was doing was risky and was going to cost him a little bit. You now have a TPP USA reporter in the Pentagon press room agitating for new strikes against Iran and now you've got this TPUSA producer like asking you know to blow up more more boats and to burn more more people

alive that doesn't feel and maybe I'm maybe I'm wrong and maybe Kirk would just absolutely love this stuff but it feels off given Kirk's kind of turn towards more America first isolationism It's been interesting because the divide that I expected to be at least a little, what's the best, a little more salient. It's just not there. And I don't know why it's not there. I think maybe people, I would expect it to be quieter if we were actually doing this with like Sina Loa, right? So like if the entire predicate for this alleged operation was more believable. that this was actually about the people who are trafficking fentanyl into the country every single year and killing American kids, mixing it up with cocaine or whatever. But even in this situation where you have language that feels like it's ripped straight out of 2002 and 2003, I don't know. I don't know where different people would have fallen down on it.

I do know that it's really like the America First world is pretty pretty much, pretty much fine with it. Yeah. I mean, I don't know. But I don't know if actual, I don't think they know how actual like average Republicans are going to react to this going into the future because people genuinely are sick of this. And if there's a power vacuum in Venezuela that starts to feel a lot like Iraq in 2003, it's going to look like another blunt. I think pretty obviously it's going to look like another blunder, and one of the big blind spots, I think, on the right is there's a lack of, there's a lack of, you either have to go with the normie conservatives or you have to go with like the fringe, fringe, like, bigots to get criticism of Trump. And I feel like there's a big opening because there's all kinds of decisions being made. made that normal Trump voters are like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. And Norma conservatives aren't pushing the brakes.

It's only like the fringe people who are. Hmm. Yeah, it's interesting. Yeah, like, yeah, the populist right does, like the Bat Gates types. They do all seem like, not just fine with it, but like, lusting for it. Gates had a decent question at that presser. We talked about that already, Ryan. But that was.

Yeah. Yeah, he had another good one. We can get into it in a little bit. And Berea, the guy he's talking to, not going to say he was drunk, but I'll let people judge him. You wouldn't say that. I would never, I would never suggest that they're daydraining at the Pentagon now that the actual press corps. We'll get that in a second. But, Mack, my question for you, Mac, is like, you know, it's one thing when we see the politicians, like Josh Shapiro signing bombs to go, you know, strike Palestinians.

But now it's podcasters. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I guess my question for Emily is like, if they're kind of going along on the right with the boat strikes, do you think that that dynamic will change? Would there be a fracture if we actually do the full regime change operation? Because that's like an entirely different thing. Like I can see people excusing blowing up a couple boats in the Caribbean. But like full blown regime change in the Western Hemisphere, massive destabilization. We're trying to force this Machado woman into power, like, is that not going to lead to any sort of major divide in the right? Is everybody just going to sort of fall in line on this? Because it seems like that would be a major fracture point broadly with Americans. Yeah, and Narco Rubio is really intentionally making the argument that there's nothing more America first than tending to your own hemisphere, that if you're America

first, you should be cheering this because it's about hemispheric defense. And I think that's pretty obviously, yeah. America first is in like, the Americas. Anywhere can be America. Anywhere can identify as an American border. But yeah, I think that's why he's like making that argument. Machado probably identifies as an American. Yeah, she probably does. But that's the, that's why they're making that argument. So I think they understand that people are not into regime change wars. I think what actually would really change things. And some of this is, you know, American bravado. Like people don't really worry too much about like Venezuela. It don't feel super threatened by Venezuela. But if American boots that aren't just like CIA boots, but like American troops are in an operation on the ground in Venezuela, I do think you'll have more people looking around and being like, what the hell is going on? Why are we doing this? Right. But honestly, I just think people don't see, it doesn't feel to people like a massive invasion of Iraq or Afghanistan. And so they just, they might not love it, but they also just don't care that much. that's my explanation. I guess I just don't, I don't see the how rapid the flip was between all of the rhetoric on, you know, we're not going to do the sort of unnecessary foreign wars and regime change operations. We're going to be America first to immediately. It's like, no, the neocons are actually in control. Like Lindsay Graham is celebrating Trump's actions every day and Marco Rubio seems to be steering the ship. Like it's just a complete betrayal of the vibes, the energy that I feel like the MAGA coalition. was trying to to form themselves as well Ryan pointed out the uh like Charlie Kirk flying

to Washington getting yelled at by Trump over Iran and I think that's super interesting um and Ryan you might have more thoughts on that but people felt like Trump was vindicated with Operation Midnight Hammer and that they were made to look a fool and uh you know I don't necessarily think that's a case but that's you know people felt like they had maybe a little bit of egg on their face and are potentially holding their powder. But that doesn't change, you know, going into a midterm cycle, the average right of center voter is like my grocery bills are still high. And you guys are, you have people in the ground in Venezuela? Like, what are we doing? So it doesn't change the possibility of that happening for them in the midterm year, too. Yeah, I think people,

when it came to the midnight hammer, people were happy that Trump did not. do more than 12 days of bombing. And so kind of just all collectively decided to pretend that he was a champion for stopping his own bombing. Like he, you know, he's out there celebrating himself for reaching this, the ceasefire, which is like, you're the one doing the firing. It's like, all you have to do is stop shooting. So congratulations.

And because the kind of populist isolation is right, wanted that to happen, they were like, okay, cool. Like, yeah, great job, Trump. But I don't think anybody really actually genuinely celebrates his, like, starting a, you know, starting a bombing campaign and then ending it. Right. Except, well, this leads a never-ending bombing campaign and occupation of Iran, yes, well, that's true. Well, speaking of celebrating and trying to add some public positivity to the mix on all these foreign affairs, this leads us nicely to Ryan, your war with the new Pentagon Press Corps here. in D.C. Mac, can you throw up some of the first images? I got two images here.

Here, let's get the group photo. Let's get the group photo in first. Now, there's been a, no, right, correct me if I wrong, but basically all the people in this photo have signed something saying that they will not leak or basically report any information that they get that would be considered negative or. There will be no journalism occurring in this photograph. Yeah. And we've got another one here, Mack, can you throw up the second one here? They've been taking photos of themselves, doing photo shoots in these empty offices that the journalists used to occupy. Now, the influences are here doing photo shoots. We've got an infamous Cam Higby here. He's been one of the main provocateurs. And his caption here for people listening says, journalism degrees are

useless and needlessly expensive. I just proved it. Ryan, what, What are we supposed to make of all this? I mean, he's right about that. He is. I'm pretty sure that at DropSight News, we don't have a single person with a journalism degree, like, at all. I mean, we're about 10 journalists, I think, on staff at this point. I'm pretty sure none of them went to journalism school.

He's correct that you do not have to go to journalism school. But if I were him, I would stop boasting about my lack of education. like just him personally like in general it's good that's fine you don't need to go to journalism this guy specifically doesn't seem to understand what journalism is he he and his friends are out there saying that the previous press corps um was bad because they were adversarial they they used the word adversarial with negative connotations uh they were harassed he said they were harassing the press secretary the press secretary there said that they would knock on her door all hours of the day

and come in and ask her questions. That's a level of assault. Sometimes other journalists would have an appointment and a second journalist would come in with that journalist and also ask her questions. And also they would stand outside the Secretary of Defense, sorry, now the Secretary of War's office to wait until he came out to see who he was meeting with.

Like, these were the examples that she was giving that he was elevating as the kinds of things that the press corps, you know, was embarrassing itself by doing. Laura Lumer went even further saying it's illegal to classify to, nothing wrong with what she's signed because it's illegal to publish classified information. That goes beyond what this new Pentagon Press Corps even agreed to. What they agreed to in this document that they shamefully signed is that they would not. anybody other than authorized Pentagon officials for information. Like, that's absurd. What the document does allow for is if you, even if you don't ask, as long as you don't ask, and somebody comes up to you and says, hey, I have information for you, then you're allowed

to publish that according to this document. Now, like, how are you supposed to confirm that? Like, let's say somebody hands you a document that's classified and said, like, this is a war crime. You should go out and report this. According to the Pentagon's rules that they agreed to, you can't then go to any other sources with that and say, this is what I've heard. Can you confirm that this is true? So it appears like they don't understand what journalism is because what they've agreed to do is just when the press secretary wants to talk to them, the press secretary will talk to them. Don't ask any questions, except during a briefing. Don't knock on my door, whether or not sending an email. to the Press Secretary of Counts.

Well, and didn't one of these guys put out a tweet yesterday that was like, I just spoke to Pete Hegseth for a little interview. It was off the record, so I can't tell you anything that was said, but it was a great conversation. And what's funny, too, is that the Pentagon might end up regretting, bringing in people who have no idea what they're doing. Because some of these guys came out of this off-the-record meeting and started talking about, like, what, what questions were asked and what they would and wouldn't answer and it's like

I mean, I'm all four of these guys breaking their off the record vows that they make to the Pentagon officials but like that's not what off the record means like off the record means it's off it's like off the record but these guys don't know I don't think that they were like being deceitful I just think they don't know like the basics of journalism

and so they're like it was off the record and this is what he said. It's like, uh, uh, so we might, we might accidentally get some, some news out of these guys.

We, we might. Um, now another problem that, or another problem that, it at least raises concerns. So do you see my, um,

my Matt Gates, um, yeah, is that video at the bottom. You want me to hear. So Gates, we should play this because it's fun, it's funny.

Um, and you guys will see why it's funny as you, as you listen to this guy, slurring his words through the answer. But also, and maybe Matt Gates is just really fired up about, like, the performance of the F-35 platform, and I know he has been for a long time. But when you bring in non-regular press corps that doesn't have the same kind of standards, how do we know whether or not these reporters have consulting contracts with other weapons contractors? Like, so if you're going to have, if you're going to just let anybody in who will sign this document, let's say they are working for Raytheon. Let's say they're working on the side for Raytheon or a lobbyist that worked for Raytheon doing some consulting work. And then they start asking questions about how awful this, like Lockheed project is. Like the Lockheed project might be terrible. But it's like, do we feel comfortable that this stuff is on the up and up? So let's, let's roll the Gates thing. And I'm not saying he's getting paid by Raytheon or whatever. I

I don't know, but like, what do we know about this? Platforms that I've long been a critic of. I'll start with the F-35. They cost about $100 million a copy. What percentage of the F-35 are fully mission-capable today? So that's a great question, man, and I appreciate you getting after it, because not enough. Not enough. It is the most capable fighter that we have right now.

When it flies. When it flies, you're right. It is the most capable of what we have right now. saw last, just last month in the acquisition speech is a department and leadership that's willing to get after it to challenge industry to produce better. Yeah, but what percentage of them can fly? So, not enough. Not enough.

Yeah, but you just called it our most capable platform, and less than 40% of them, by my last review of the Air Force's statements, are fully mission capable. Why is it not failure for a platform to perform at less than 40% when it costs $100 million? So, Matt, looking at it holistically, sure, you can throw out the number of 40%. But when you look at Operation Midnight Hammer, Operation Rough Rider. Those weren't after, 35 was not delivering the payload on midnight hours. But they were supporting, right? And so those B-2s wouldn't have gotten there without that.

The airplane. What would have stopped them? There are plenty of surface-air missile systems that the Iranians have. We know that. Did they shoot any of them? No, they didn't because we were so successful. And that platform, the F-35, is an amazing platform that can go after these. The video.

Okay. What's going on with him? What is going on in that interview? Ryan, I know you had some commentary attached to this tweet here. I mean, yeah, I was saying maybe this new press corps cam and the others can find out if they're day drinking at the Pentagon now. And not that there's anything wrong with that. I don't know. Hey, go for it. But yeah, but then, and I think Matt Gates is exactly right, by the way, that the F-35 is trash. It's a gigantic boondoggle. It's one more rip-off of the American taxpayer in our military industrial complex. But I also don't know, like, who's planting, you know, who's seating those questions. Like, that's, that's, that's the, you know, that's, now the old press corps is part of the old, is part of the old, is part of the, is part of the. the military industrial complex, too.

Like, they benefit, you know, a lot of the trade press, you know, sells their, you know, products to Lockheed and, you know, sells their newsletters and whatnot to, like, Lockheed. Well, yeah, not even the trade press. And all the others. Yeah, even like Politico Axios. Politico, Raythe, yeah, like, weapons makers are major funders of Washington journalism. So it's not like it would be unique. But it, but it's like acute corruption versus, like, general corruption.

Anyway, I don't know. Yeah. It's a, and all of this happened right after this, the second strike on September 2nd. Like if you look at the timeline, Hegsseth recreated, you know, what it means to be a Pentagon reporter after this. And people who are close to him think that those things are connected, that he was doing this as an effort to stop the Pentagon press from looking into the, uh, the war crimes that they're committing. So I feel like they would be doing this regardless because the Pentagon, and Ryan, you'll know this better than I do, but the Pentagon is this like massive sprawling building.

And if you give reporters a physical foothold in the door, which they had, and you're Pete Heggseth. And, you know, there are a lot of decisions that Pete Hegsseth might make to upset the war machine that we might like. There are some that are not going to upset the war machine that we'll definitely dislike, for example, the boat strikes. But there are a lot of old-school Pentagon people in there that definitely are leaking to reporters.

And so I feel like they were trying to figure out a way to make that stop and landed on this bizarre policy. So I feel like they were going to do this no matter what at some point because they don't want these, like Jennifer Griffin, of Fox News, who Hex has snapped at, if everyone remembers in that presser, they cannot stand the people who have had their offices there forever. And they know they've got those, they're getting those coffees with the leakers, people are coming in and out, all of that stuff. Because, yes, you can send classified information over Signal, for example. You can leak it

over Signal, for example, but it's a whole lot easier to say something in person. So they, they know. So Pete Hegseth. So Pete Hegseth takes over their department, has famous had a, had a drinking problem. Now I guess everyone at the department has a drinking problem. I've never seen, I've never seen someone have to slur surface to air missile system. That's hard to say drunk. That's a tongue twister.

But Emily, to your point earlier about there being sort of like this like open area where for like, there's an open niche for a more normal person to critique the Trump administration or what have you. Perhaps it's not going to be happening with Cam Higby and this press corps. Are there other people that you could say like, oh, like maybe this person could come up and rise to the moment? Or are we just seeing like a lack of a bench in the conservative commentator sphere and journalist's fear? I always wait for Matt Gates to do it, honestly. because Gates is on foreign policy, like, really sharp about these types of things. It's mostly the foreign policy. You know, he was trying to get rid of the AUMF. He was trying to get our troops out of Africa. Like, he's actually very opposed to a lot of the old school, not neocons, but like even America First type people who have neo-conservative sympathies. So it's there for the taking if Gates wants it. He definitely dabbles in it. That's for sure. Sager is somebody who does it, but Sagar has like definitely detached himself from the broader conservative movement and isn't like really a part of that world.

So there's definitely, there's a lot of room and there, I think people are misunderstanding why a lot of folks turn to like the French commentators. It's like they're the only ones criticizing this insane Venezuela policy. Like, that's it. Like, where else are you going to get it? You either have to, like, listen to the left or, I don't know, like, Ben Shapiro. It's 5.23 p.m. One of your kids is asking for a snack. Another is building a fort out of your clean laundry.

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Go to Hellofresh.ca and use promo code Mom50. That's Hellofresh.ca promo code Mom 50. Hellofresh.com. HelloFresh. Canada's number one meal kit delivery service. What up, y'all? It's your boy, Kevin on stage. I want to tell you about my new podcast called Not My Best Month,

where I talk to artists, athletes, entertainers, creators, friends, people I admire who had massive success about their massive failures. What did they mess up on? What is their heartbreak? And what did they learn from it? I got judged horribly. The judges were like, you're trash. I don't know how you got on the show.

Boo, somebody had tomatoes. I'm kidding. But if they had tomatoes, they would have thrown the tomatoes. Let's be honest. We've all had those moments we'd rather forget. We bumped our head. We made a mistake. The deal fell through.

We're embarrassed. We failed. But this podcast is about that and how we made it through. So when they sat me down, they were kind of like, we got into the small talk. And they were just like, so what do you got? What ideas? And I was like, oh, no. What?

Check out Not My Best Moment with me, Kevin on stage on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcast. Have you ever listened to those true crime shows and found yourself with more questions than answers? And what is this? How is that not a story we all know? What's this? Where is that? Why is it wet? Boy, do we have a show for you?

From Smartless Media, Campside Media, and Big Money Players comes Crimeless. Join me, Josh Dean, investigative journalists And me, Roy Scoville, comedian As we celebrate the amazing creativity of the world's dumbest criminals We'll look into some of the silliest ways Folks have broken the laws Honestly, it feels more like a high-level

prank than a crime Who catfish is a city? And meets some memorable anti-heroes There are thousands of angry horny monkeys Clap if you think she's a witch And it freaks you out He has x-ray vision and how can I not follow him?

Honestly, I got to follow him. He can see right through me. Listen to Crimless on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Wow, a plethora of options here. Well, I wanted to move us to this next story. Emily, I want to throw to you for this one. This is the January 6th pipe bomber.

Folks, we got him. Mission accomplished. Mac, if you could throw up this tear sheet. And Emily, you could kind of fill in the details. But it says the Trump DOJ has suspect Brian Cole arrested and facing explosive charges. What do we know about Brian Cole, Emily? Yeah, we're starting to learn more. So what happened is out of absolutely nowhere yesterday, the FBI announced that they had made this arrest.

They had a very vague press conference. And then Cole was charged in court. So Cole was in Woodbridge, Virginia, so a suburb of Washington, D.C. And 30-year-old right now, so it would have been about 25 back in 2021. The charging document, I have it up in my screen, says he is five feet, six inches tall and wears corrective eye glasses. That actually is important because as the hoodie suspect who placed those pipe bombs behind the Republican National Committee and the, the DNC then as well, was said to be roughly in that height range, sort of a short person for a man if it was a man, but now the blaze came in hot a couple of weeks ago and accused

a woman who currently works for the CIA of being the person in the hoodie according to gate analysis. They retracted that story yesterday. This person has an alibi. They were said to be working for Capitol Police at the time. So all that is to say, charging document makes it look a whole lot like the FBI under the Biden administration had all of the pieces of the puzzle and just did not put them together. And maybe that was for a nefarious reason. Maybe that was out of incompetence. You know, it's always important to remember incompetence is a good explanation for a lot of what happens in D.C. But for example, during 2019 and 2020, the affidavit says, coal purchased multiple items consistent with the components that were used

to manufacture the pipe bombs placed at the RNC and DNC. The FBI obtained records for the checking account and three credit cards for the time period from January 2018 to January 2021. Three additional credit cards were obtained for the time period of January 2018 to November 2025. The FBI reviewed the transaction history for all of these accounts. It looks like it was really basic police work, to be honest. And the pieces probably could have been put together a long time ago.

So where this is going. They pinged a cell tower and then they found that he bought parts and equipment, right? For the bomb? Right, exactly. So like pipe heads, all of those things. They were able to, again, do what's fairly basic police work. And so where this is going politically, Kathaels Ambonjino, Pambani, they have all said that there was nothing new that they did. They were just combing through the preexisting investigation.

looking for scraps of information that may already be there. Obviously, they didn't trust the investigation. And from there, they kind of found a break in the case. They said it was, quote, forensic evidence. So where this is going politically is already leaks have gone into different media publications that Brian Cole may have some Antifa connections. It looks like his family is left wing. Everyone should be careful with that, too, because that could, even if that is, quote,

Antifa, even if he does have some type of like Antifa motivation, you then have to ask what the FBI's involvement with that Antifa group might have been, because that's where this is all heading is if the FBI was aware of this information years ago, why did they stop or why did they not figure it out publicly, at least? I think there's some open questions. Yeah, and there were, they were very coy about assets in the crowd and actual agents of the crowd on January 6th for a long time. And then Thomas Massey and others kind of forced them to come to the table and say they did have assets who were there. Some who were just there by happenstance. They had been working with the FBI as informants essentially and were there. Others, I think it was a couple at least

that were there intentionally. So I was at January 6th. I was like reporting. And Okay. Good to clarify. Yes, I always had to clarify that. Reporting, report, quote, unquote, reporting. Well, actually, I started that day at the ellipse at Trump's speech because there had been, like, legit Antifa activity on BLM Plaza, which was right where Trump's speech was going to be, that whole summer. And so that's why I went down there that day. And I ended up walking and trying to get interviews with people who were walking over to the Capitol. And I saw legitimate, genuine MAGA people be whipped into a frenzy. Like, that was not, they were, they were not, it wasn't just a crowd of feds. It was a lot of like average, you know, I saw a soccer mom at one point like ushering people over, you know, it was like the craziest thing I've ever seen. It was not a crowd of feds. There were a lot of people who have come out since because they were prosecuted for it, told and said exactly why they did what they did. It's because they thought the election was being stolen. So if there were feds, we need to know. If they were people contributing to the whipping. of MAGA into that frenzy, we need to know. It doesn't undermine the fact that there were a whole lot of people that did heinous illegal activity that day who weren't, you know, just doing it because feds were whipping them up and telling them to. They have agency too. So I do think, and Ryan, I'm curious where you make of that. That's where this is heading is a question of whether the FBI just didn't want some type of link to the pipe bomb placement, which has always been very weird. They didn't. want some some type of link to it to come out into the public view yeah i think they're going to have to explain why it took this long to make an arrest if they weren't really relying on any new information and they were just you know that it was out there for them um i think also the blaze

looks like they're going to cook over this uh you know that that that story that they did immediately when you read it reeked of defamation you're like hold on whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa you're like you know the the defenses against defamation are you know one if they're a public figure then there's a much higher bar for that public figure to be able to come after you for saying something false about them this woman that they singled out was not remotely a public figure and seemed to have a decent alibi so like if you're if you're if you in their retraction, you know, it is clear the retraction was written by a lawyer. And they're saying, like, you know, we, we published this information in, you know, good faith with the, with our belief that it was accurate. But we're now retracting it because it looks like it isn't. But in order to get out of defamation, you have to show that you, you know, that you, that you, you know, if they can show that you knew or should have known that what you were writing was, false. Then you're in trouble. And they kind of should have known because, you know, she had a real

alibi. They didn't really have enough evidence to stack on the other side of that. This like weird, like they compared her gait and like they did some gate analysis. It's like, whoa, guys, you can't accuse somebody of being a pipe bomber. And the other thing you need for defamation is to prove like actual damages. And I can imagine that this woman suffered like legitimate, serious, genuine damages from millions of people thinking that she's a pipe bomber. So I think, you know, Blaze's defamation insurance is going to get a workout, I would suspect from this. So, Ryan, what do you make of the evidence on Brian Cole? Now, there's this, they say that they pinged or his cell phone pinged cell towers that were in the area.

We have this, like, these photos, this video footage. And, you know, they say that he bought parts that could create a bomb, but those parts are bought over the course of months, if not years, if I'm mistaken. And he went to, yeah, several different years. And he also went to multiple different locations, it looks like. Now, I believe everything Cash Patel says. That's my, that's my particular hill that I die on on this show. But, Ryan, what is your, what's your believe meter at right now?

Yeah, Ryan. Are you with Massey on this? Let's see what they've got. I'm not buying it. Thomas Massey posted at 9.22 a.m. yesterday after the arrest was announced. I think it is good practice to always be skeptical of all federal indictments. Just as citizens, we should be demanding, you know, extraordinary evidence when claims are made. So that, like, you can't, you can't believe what's in an indictment just because the feds put it in an indictment. you know we'll see um you know i'm not i'm certainly what saying i'm not on i'm not saying he's didn't do it either like i don't know that for um for certain either i mean who knows if this is all that they have but it does seem like a lot of the stuff that's that you're putting up here emily is just like circumstantial stuff like you would need more than this to actually convict him right to say oh he bought some component parts and his phone was generally in the but, like, that wouldn't be enough for a conviction, right? I guess it'll depend on the jury.

I mean, if you're pinging it, if your cell phone, you live in Woodbridge, and your cell phone's pinging in the area of the RNC and DNC the night of January 5th when they say the, well, they have video of the bombs being placed. If you roughly resemble the person on the video, and then they have these credit card records here, well, also the other thing that we're missing is this car was a half a mile from the bombs where the bombs were in January 5th, so it was parked on capital, Hill. And then they have all of these credit card records that see him allegedly buying the black end caps for those pipes. And if people don't remember what the pipe bombs looked like, it is always

worth revisiting. They're so hilarious. I'm sorry, but like they look cartoonish. They have literal like oven timers strapped to PVC pipe. It's like, yeah, let's see. It's completely insane. Like something I would make. Yeah. I'm with Ryan like always be completely skeptical of all the stuff. So he can't be a real Antifa member. He's not a real Antifa super soldier because they would have, they would have had spotless practice on that. They would use cash at the Home Depot. Right, right. Well, I think they said in the indictment that he did use cash in one of the places. Yeah. Oh, at other places use cash? Yeah, it's some of the places. They just have video of him going and buying it. I guess, yeah, or maybe a cell phone pinging or something

like that. Here, I got a picture here of what one of these pipe bombs supposedly looked like here. so I guess that's what that's what it looks like according to I mean yeah he's got the it's a kitchen timer it's like a literal kitchen timer that you would have and then it's yeah wiring into the pipe but yeah and I don't know uh I imagine the detectives were like okay there's only a few hand home depots you know within 10 miles of here but but who amongst us hasn't purchased 12 black end caps and two galvanized end caps from four different home depots in northern Virginia yeah we've all been there bro you yeah you gotta get your gotta go to ohio or whatever to get your and like it it does show like this is not the 1970s like they can they're gonna catch you doing this stuff like you can take you can pay in cash you can take cautions um but you know the surveillance state is impressive yeah so so emily what's the significance just like hey Home Depot, like, who bought 12 caps and a kitchen? They're narcs.

They're narcs, as we know. Home Depot is going to mark you out. Like, Home Depot, like, if you were, if you were. Yes. If you thought Home Depot was ride or die for you, no. Not happening. So, Emily, like, what is this larger significance of this January 6 pipe bomb around the event of January 6?

And, like, what is the Trump administration or DHA trying to do with this to kind of like maybe reframe or re contextualize the event? because what I know from the pipe bombs is that a lot of the authorities said that those pipe bomb threats diverted resources during really crucial hours that could have allowed them to contain more of the January 6th event and also this sense that well if the bombs replaced that some of this was premeditated right that this wasn't just an in-the-moment fervor but if someone planted these bombs that there was a larger plan before the Trump rally and yada yada. What do you make of all that? Yeah, so I'll read a post here from

Julie Kelly, who's one of the kind of people on the right who's followed this really closely. She said, this is where she's going with it. She says Washington Post also reporting Cole's quote-unquote extremist political views. As I've already said on an interview this morning, it appears the Ray FBI buried the pipe bomb investigation in early 2021. After discovering the hoodie individuals seen on January 5 was not MAGA but was Antifa. That would have not only decimated the developing January 6th insurrection narrative at the time, but completely contradicted Ray's early insistence that Antifa played no role in January 6, huge scandal, if true. I'm saying that just to give a sort of flavor of where everyone's going with this, but I think

it does test a couple of the narratives that people on the right have had going into this, which is one of them was, was that in the circles on people on the right who followed this story closely, they would point out, rightfully point out, that, first of all, that, first of all, there are bomb-sniffing dogs around the DNC at the time that the alleged pipe bomb was there. Nobody caught it. Kamala Harris was being moved around through that area. There was no, like, intense panic about the fact, like, it's, that stuff was genuinely a bit strange. The man who was one of the FBI officials overseeing the Gretchen Whitmer fed kidnapping plot as Nick Ters and others. And Ters is still at the intercept, right, Ryan? That was, yeah. And I think,

you probably were still there when that reporting was happening, probably edited some of that. Yes. Excellent reporting. And that guy had been reassigned to D.C. And all of a sudden, J6, pipe bomb, all of that stuff happens. And so the suggestion by people who bring that up is whether any of this was organic. So what that tests is this idea that it's Antifa, unless Antifa is like working hand in glove with the feds. And so I don't think anybody has a clear victory, like a clear narrative victory going forward. There's just so much. The pipe bomb story is just, it's very hard to believe that some random lib did all of this and all of the strange stuff that happened afterwards was just because Chris Ray was trying to bury an Antifa plot. I don't know. Honestly, I think there's some more weirdness happening. It just, it seems too strange that these things were there, and nobody saw them for 15 hours. Nobody caught them for 15 hours. But yeah, to a reference point, that is, the implication is that in some way the pipe bombs were used

to divert resources from the Capitol so that the Capitol would fall, and then you would have this, like, false flag thing to pin on MAGA. So it gets really weedy and complicated with pipe bomb theories, but if what the MAGA FBI is saying, is that it was just an Antifa guy and there was no FBI involvement, then other than bearing the story, then some of those theories get challenged. Like, what would be the narrative then that they're trying to sell if it was an Antifa guy,

that he just happened to do this the day before to try to pin it on MAGA or something? Or what's the logic behind that? Yeah, to create, yeah, that's why I think it challenges some of those narratives. I wonder that the FBI put them up to it. Yeah, it could be that too. Yeah, the Fed, The Fed line makes a lot more sense to me.

I agree. But it could be Fed Tifa. Could be a combination of both. Not impossible. Mack, you've seen that, haven't you? You've seen Fed Tifa. You've seen that? We've seen a couple Fed Tifa's out there.

Oh, on your D.C. protest observations. You've seen some Fed Tifa. D.C. Atlanta a few times, yeah. Very interesting. Yeah, that's a thing. Well, January 6th, the story. that keeps on giving. I wanted to move us over to Palantir and the deal book summit.

What a summit that happened. All sorts of characters that Andrew Ross Sorkin was speaking to. But we wanted to focus on CEO Alex Karp of Palantir, who was getting really excited about his business. I think that's the most, I don't know, PC way to describe it. Griffin, I love how you shepherd. us through the news stories like it's American bandstand

like let's move on to Palantir I'm trying to keep a brisk pace because we have so many stories to get to Mac why don't we play this first clip from CEO Alex Carp what is the biggest problem in this culture

I'll tell you the biggest problem no one believes the institutions are credible and why don't they believe they're and I struggle to believe they're credible too because these business leaders make completely stupid decisions and they get bailed out a year later they're getting huge bonuses what do the american people get nothing that's a huge problem like if you make like so i think the real version is like i made a

lot of decisions when we began talking annoying each other 10 years ago hopefully i'm annoying you as much as 10 years ago uh it or more when when i made you know this every decision palate you're made. FTEs, going public, building products, enterprise, large data sets, going to government, acknowledging American superiority, being pro-Maritocracy, launching an AI platform, calling into question that AI models would actually be able to perform without orchestration. Every single one, every single one of those was viewed as stupid. You know what? I actually have grown to appreciate about capitalism. All the people who made the right decisions went break. are going out of business or now have to copy us. Microsoft Lawsonatology. Everyone wants to do

FTEs. Everyone basically copies me and Palantir. This is the stable leadership that I want in charge of my mass surveillance death company. Everyone that we have to watch now is like, yeah. I mean, is everyone that we watch now either drunk or geeked out? I mean, Ryan, like, what do we make of this, like this Alex Carp guy? I mean, he's the, he's our philosophy. for a king right um you know he's he's the he's the he i guess he's the surveillance god that we deserve um this is we're we're headed to a pretty pretty dark place um and the people that we're empowering um aren't aren't obscuring from the public you know who they are and what they're about um we also have another clip here mac uh where he we that's you know slightly more

substantive about the inner workings of the Palantir business here and that he talked about eliminating or not valuing the humanities department of Palantir why don't we take a listen to that take the media out of it there's a group of 13 more Palantir employees who wrote an open letter to you and they stated quote that Palantir's leadership has abandoned its founding ideals we have 5,000 ex palatirians and 4,000 current Palantirians and by the way we encourage a culture of disagreement, which you know exists. Anyone can come visit us. You'll find half the people disagreeing with me, at least on any issue.

But I just want to say, we have 5,000 ex-Palatirians. You have 13, half of whom were like in the Humanities Department of Palantir, which is a little bit like being in the printing press part of New York Times. A very important part, but no one's really listening to your opinion. So it's like, it's, yeah, you know, if you have an organization, I'll tell you what, A lot of Palantirians, Palantirians are mostly uncomfortable. Most Palantirians are like you. Okay, I don't know who you are because because you're an objective journalist.

But they broadly are okay with, they like the work with you in Ukraine. By the way, could Europeans finally stick up for us since we're basically between us and Russia? But they're very proud of that in general, although that's also very controversial in non-elite circles. That's important to remember. they're pretty okay with Israel stuff, especially since a lot of the BS written about us on the right, primarily, not primarily on the left, that somehow we're doing facial recognition stuff

and we're building a database. Any technical person knows that's BS. By the way, if you've heard that and you believe that, listen to the person who told you that, do 10 minutes of research, and you'll see who has credibility for you. So is he denying there at the end that he's working with the Israelis on targeting in Gaza?

Is that what he was doing at? the end there? I think what he's doing is denying, and it is a sort of cliche about Palantir mistake that some people make, which is that they are themselves doing the like CCTV, like pulling all of that data. Instead, what they do, as though this is much better, is Hobbsley government streamline and the analysis of these mountains and mountains of data. Technically, that's, I think, the distinction that he's trying to make. And obviously, it is a real distinction, but it's still, they're still obviously massively bolstering the surveillance state. Palantir was started with money from the CIA's venture capital firm, which is a thing that exists. And one of the reasons is that Teal had this idea to outsource surveillance analysis in a way that was like civil libertarianism. And the CIA obviously sees that and is like, great. you have the veneer of civil libertarianism for this massive surveillance analysis technology and Teal claims that it's better, and carpal claim that it's better that it's better that Palantir does it than the government itself or someone else because Palantir has all of these guardrails and civil liberties and that sort of thing. So that's, I mean, that's where they go with this. But, you know, I don't think anyone's happy to say like, oh, or anyone's like super supportive of these.

the idea that people are making massive profits off of streamlining the analysis of mass surveillance. And Ryan, what do you think about the checks and balances within the Palantir if he's not really listening to anyone in the humanities department? Do they have a humanities department? I don't even understand what that means. I was just searching now. Maybe he's referring colloquially to some other department that they do have. what would a Humanities Department do at Palantir?

But sure, I don't know. Maybe there's some, you know, room for disagreement in there. But, you know, Karp seems like a guy that doesn't lack for confidence in that, you know, he's going to, you know, he's going to make a decision. He's going to execute it. And I think he'd be proud of that. His point is fair that, like, all right, you got 9,000 current and former employees. You're going to be able to find some that are critical of it. But the entire, you know, whether or not, you know, people inside Palantir are critical of it.

I think like, basically the entire world is like, I wish this wasn't happening. Wish this company was not doing the things that this company is doing. But they're still doing it. So. And I think there is something to be said about like this, this bizarre era of the billionaire celebrity, the CEO celebrity with how comfortable all of these people who are doing, I think, objectively evil things around the world. doing public appearances like this publicly defending themselves trying to be celebrities to hype up their their stocks and things like that i think there's something deeply dark about that in my view because i feel like a long time ago in this country we used to have billionaires sort of just

mind their own business and just sort of fade into the background and now it's like every single one of them has to be out in the public eye they have to be celebrated they have to be praised they have to you know be viewed as some sort of like gods and i think there's there's something thing extremely dystopian about that. The other thing worth mentioning is that CARP has been, for a long time, like a Democratic donor who backed Kamala Harris in 2024, which is just hilarious on so many different levels. He was against Donald Trump. He said he was voting against Donald Trump.

And then Palantir has just been showered with contracts in the Trump era from Republicans, one big beautiful bill and such. Um, so it's all, I mean, they're, they're winning no matter what at the end of the day and, uh, you know. So he was like, he was a K-hiver? He was in the K-hive. Wow. That's crazy. He was doing mass surveillance on the Bernie Bros. Well, maybe he made the K-hive. Oh, I probably did. Yeah. Um, but, but yeah, to, to Max's point, there is this sort of like unimpeachableness about all these guys going out there. I mean, we had the call she CEO who looks like a sound cloud rapper saying that we're going to financialize. like every aspect of your life.

We've got Peter Thiel being like, I am not the Antichrist, wink, wink, wink. Like, yeah, it seems like there are these terrible, terrible public advocates for their businesses that could only make you concerned or worried about the future, which is the exact opposite of what a spokesman should be for a company, which to me only kind of like exudes the fact that how unimpeachable, how kind of they have the whole keys to the kingdom here,

and they can say whatever the hell they want. Yeah. I mean, the Palantir is not going anywhere. And the reason I mentioned that is to say it's not going anywhere in a Dem administration either. Like it's Palantir is here to say. The government is addicted to Palantir's analysis software. So that's that's our future. Should we listen to this last clip that we have of him, I guess, trying to portray Palantir as being a champion of the working class somehow? Okay. Let's go ahead and watch this last one. Maybe he watches War Room with Steve Bannon. In this country, you have 1% of the country in prison, 1% who were in prison and therefore have no rights. Do you know what happens to you when you go to prison?

They take you away from your kids. You know who that happens to? Disproportionately, working class, disproportionately black and Hispanic men and white men in the underclass. Where are the thousands of articles about them? Nobody cares, and they don't care because it does not either serve the ability, the desire to force me to vote for one party, which basically takes away all my power. That's effectually what it does.

If I agree to say this is the worst thing in the world, I essentially have given up my vote. My vote is not for you. My vote is for these two issues. The second reason they don't care is because somehow no one has empathy with any of those people, because none of us really deal with those people. At Palantir, we are obliged of working class Americans. We support people who go to the military. We save their lives.

We bring them home safer. Our AI actually makes workers more wealthy, more valuable. And the 10 to 15 million people that love me despite what's written, half of them made a lot of money on us. And you know what they're like? They're like people like me who think, you know what, we have to do better. Of course we have to do better. All right. I'm deeply confused about the transition that he just did.

from, like, talking about, you know, the mass imprisonment of Americans to Palantirers on the side of the working class. We're making American workers wealthy because we are enriching the American military's capabilities to do warfare overseas. I'm not really tracking the through line there. Ryan, do you have any idea? I mean, I— Ryan's, like, deep meditation on it. I think we broke Ryan. Yeah.

I mean, yes, he's making people safer on the battlefield is his claim. So that's one claim. AI is going to make workers more productive and therefore richer. Like, I don't know how he, all productivity gains have flowed to the top. Two people like Alex Carp over the last 40, 50 years. So I don't know what policy he's pitching that is going to actually break that. So I don't see how he can make that claim with a straight face. And is he saying they help put the right people in prison as opposed to like that's the part where like with Mac I'm like, I don't know what he's saying.

I mean, maybe it's like, you know, Larry Ellison had said like when, you know, absolute mass surveillance is everywhere, then people will behave better. And maybe it's good that people behave. I don't know. Like that I'm. Well, it almost seemed like he was getting to like there's a structural like racism problem with the prison industrial industrial complex. with policing, but then it's like Palantir is working with ice. Palantir is working with local police outfits. So, like, aren't you kind of reinforcing whatever structural issues that you see with that system? Like, I'm, I don't know. They still see themselves as people who are

disrupting those systems and making them better. They've been doing that for a long time now. So I don't know. Like, that's what they've been doing what they've been doing for a long time. So if they were making the system better, they would, you know, have to show significant structural evidence of improvement, I would say. I think it's pretty clear that what their technology does is make mass surveillance a lot easier. They will say it makes it a lot more in line or a lot more aligned with like your constitutional rights and a lot more efficacious in ways that, you know, if it's if it's more effective and it's more aligned with your constitutional rights, then how could you possibly be against what Palantir is doing? If it's not Palantir, it's going to be

some worse type of actor, which I don't think is a great argument for Palantir, to be perfectly honest. There's also, he calls them Palantirians. There is this sort of almost like, this like cult-like movement that he's trying to establish, right? If you're on our side, you're a Palantirian. I think that's very Silicon Valley post like, or Silicon Valley around like 2008, 2009. They were like Googlers and they were all doing that.

Yeah, yeah. I don't know. He does have some coalition of like cultists that that support him and hype him up. So I think he is trying to directly feed into that and do sort of a performance for like a select group of the population that that enjoys hearing him cracked out in interviews like that. That's probably true. I think and I think there's some element to the idea that like if your entire life is helping to facilitate, you know, blowing up Palestinian children and having, you know, helping ice to, to ship families to overseas concentration camps, then, like, maybe you do need to take the edge off every once in a while. Yep. Maybe they're helping, like, weigh the ICE employees because there was that guy that got kicked out for being, like, 460 pounds.

We need an ice weight database, an ice obesity database. Oh, I'm sure they have that. I'm sure they have that. All right. Well, I'm feeling, as a member of the working class, I'm feeling good. and I think that will leave us here for the free half of the show we got big stories that we're saving

for the second half for premium users we're getting into the battle between TPUSA and one singular Candice Owens we're also maybe going to be Ryan told me he's been doing a lot more research into the Olivia Nuzzi story and we have an incredible Olivia Nuzzi impersonation from Emily

always ready on deck so get the sunglasses ready And we've got a few other stories. Maybe we'll get into a little bit more of the Kalshi betting superfunding of politics. And Griffin, let's get your, let's get your reaction to Netflix Warner Bros, too, in the second. Oh, yeah. And we'll talk about Netflix. Folks, if you like going to the movies, you know, and savor it while it lasts because it is doomed at this point.

We'll get into all that and more. You can go to breaking points.com to sign up become a member. We'll also answering questions from the audience. And we'll see you all there. I know he has a reputation, but it's going to catch up to him. Gabe Ortiz is a cop. His brother, Larry, a mystery Gabe didn't want to solve until it was too late. He was the head of this gang.

You're going to push that line for the cause? Took us under his wing and showed us the game, as they call it. When Larry's killed, Gabe must untangle a dangerous past, one that could destroy everything he thought he knew. Listen to the brothers Ortiz on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Have you ever listened to those true crime shows and found yourself with more questions than answers? Who catfishes a city? Is it even safe to snort human remains? Is that the plot of footloos?

I'm comedian Rory Scoville, and I'm here to tell you, Josh Dean and I have a new podcast that celebrates the amazing creativity of the world's dumbest criminals. It's called Crimeless, a true crime comedy podcast. Listen on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Stefan Curry, and this is Gentleman's Cut. I think what makes Gentleman's Cut different is me being a part of developing the profile of this beautiful finished product. With every sip, you get a little something different. Visit Gentleman'scuturban.com or your nearest Total Wines or Bevmo. This message is intended for audiences 21 and older. Gentleman's Cut Bourbon, Boone County, Kentucky.

For more on Gentleman's Cut Bourbon, please visit gentlemen's cut bourbon.com. Please enjoy responsibly. This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed human.