Breaking Points with Krystal and Saagar - 3/24/25: Elon Gets Billions In Gov Contracts, Trump Israel Aid Folds Amid Gaza War, Billionaire Trump Sec Laughs At Social Security Breakdown

Episode Date: March 24, 2025

Saagar and Ryan discuss Elon set for billions in Gov contracts, Trump Israel aide folds to lobby, billionaire Trump Sec laughs at missed Social Security checks.   To become a Breaking Points Premium Member and watch/listen to the show AD FREE, uncut and 1 hour early visit: www.breakingpoints.com   Merch Store: https://shop.breakingpoints.com/See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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talking about is a much more obvious. We've got the president of the United States involved in a just straight up pump and dump crypto scheme. But first, the less obvious but still kind of in your face element of Elon Musk's companies being poised to reap billions more in federal contracts than they've gotten in the past. And curious to get Sager's take on this, because I think there is a defense of it on one level. But on another level, it's just not how we do government to have the CEO of a company that is getting money from the government be the one doling out the government contracts. We can put up this New York Times investigation by Eric Lipton is one of their investigative reporters. When the Times wants to do something that leaves a mark, they will give somebody like Lipton a couple of weeks

to call up his sources and do a sweeping piece that, you know, I don't listen to daily anymore, but I bet you, it gets pushed out on their various different platforms. Why would anyone listen to daily when this show is available? When we're right here. Yeah, something about Michael Barbaro's voice. It just doesn't work for me, I've got to be honest. But yeah, no, you're exactly right. The theory behind all this stuff is, oh, it's more efficient. And you know, the funny thing is, if Elon wasn't in government, I'd be like, yeah, it's obviously more efficient. But the problem is, is that the appearance of corruption is just as dangerous as corruption itself. So

like the details you're saying, the Commerce Department is now saying that Starlink will be eligible for the federal government's $42 billion rural broadband push. Now, it's pretty obvious that rural broadband by the government was an epic disaster. It literally didn't work. Actually, we had Derek on, and that's one of the main things he mentioned. He was like, this is a huge failure. Starlink seems like the logical option, but it's one of those where it's like, well, it's like, should you really be the person there who's also got their hands in there? And then in terms of like what portion of federal funding, is it really a fair process, right? I mean, it reminds me of the Halliburton stuff during Bush. I would say that's probably a little bit more self-dealing, but I remember people were like, but Brown and Root

are the best available option for this. It's like, yeah, but the vice president's still the guy who's running the war. So it's still pretty bad. Right, and I think you and I probably both agree that Starlink is a better solution. Starlink is cool. Yeah, it works great. Then roll broadband. Yes. Just a complete mess.

The government has failed to get that done. But then you're right. You're left with, all right, do we trust that Elon Musk is going to cut a fair deal with Elon Musk on behalf of the taxpayers or on behalf of Starlink? I mean, he is obligated by law to maximize profits for his different corporations. Like that's the system that we have in place. Like if you're not doing that, you are in violation of different fiduciary duties that you have to your shareholders. So is he required by law to rip off the American taxpayer? That's actually a great point is that, yeah, if you're looking out for SpaceX's business interests, you want to secure as much money as

possible. And legally, you're looking out for the government's interests, you want to secure as least amount of money as possible. And there are criminal statutes on the books that relate directly to this. If you are a government employee and you are involved in government action that you know will increase your bottom line, that is a crime. It's a straight up crime. It's not often prosecuted because it's hard to usually prove. In these cases, it's like, whoa. Well, this is the thing about Elon that drives me crazy.

Any normal employee of the government, and I know many who have had to work in the government, you have to at some points even sell off individual stocks before you come work there. Let's say that you are working in the antitrust. You're a staffer, not even a appointee. You're just a staffer. You're making, let's say, $80,000 a year. And you bought some Google stock, blue chip stock, Fortune 500 company, you obviously have no inside information. You still have to sell it if you want to work,

or you can't at least buy anymore, and you have to report everything that's there. And again, the idea that some 26-year-old working at the FTC is really going to have a massive implication on Google, not the case. I mean, even in the private sector, as I understand it, if you work at the banks or if you work in finance at all, you're not even allowed to trade, period. Like, I think you can only buy like ETFs and or mutual funds. You're not even allowed to do that. And that's in a private sector appearance of corruption because they don't want to deal with, you know, trials, et cetera. Now, here we're talking about, again, Elon and the SpaceX competing specifically for a government contract.

And something Eric actually pointed out, they have four current pending requests with the FAA. The Pentagon to build new rocket launch pads, and so basically the military building something for them. And in federal protected land. In federal protected land. The FAA has moved to now approve one of those deals, which had been pending. Now, again, maybe it shouldn't. It should always have been approved. If you ask me, it probably should have been approved. I think SpaceX and all this is a really cool company. I think they do a lot of cool work. But here, it's about the appearance. Second, they go, the first of the

awards that was approved this month is specifically after the head of the FCC was supported by Elon. Now, I know Brendan Carr. I don't think he's corrupt. I don't think that he's somebody who's been influenced by Elon. But the point is, is that it still has to raise the question because this is one about radio frequency. And again, I know this is brain dead, but billions of dollars move on this stuff. I've been in this town long enough to see Qualcomm and them spend ungodly amounts of money trying to get the right 5G frequency approved for them by the FCC. So yes, it sounds stupid. And it may be one of those like, oh, maybe it's the right thing. But you really need to comprehend how much federal or how many lobbying

dollars are spent trying to influence this overall process. And it's just, look, even if it's a bad look, a bad look is enough for me, at least, you know, especially if we're going to criticize, you know, all these other people, Democrats, like Nancy Pelosi's husband, day trading stocks. Yeah, I think it's grotesque, right? It's the same here. And Brendan Carr is a good example. He's, yeah, like you said, he's not personally like on the take, but he's very allied with Elon Musk. And so I think that's ideological. Like I said, I've known Brendan for a long time. He's genuinely an ideological, like, has a strong core beliefs around how the FCC should function, around big tech, censorship, etc. This goes back probably a decade.

But, you know, it's really not about him. It's more about Elon and the supporting of him and then the approval of said contracts. Again, it's probably the right decision, you know, to be able to speed things up, cut red tape, et cetera. But it's really more about the corruption and the appearance on his side than anything else. And it's just funny to see this huge oligarchy taking shape, layered over a federal government that is like on a micro level, like pretty corruption free in the sense that you try to take like a federal worker out to lunch. Oh, I see what you're saying. Yes. Like they won't, they won't go to like events that where there might be free food. Yes. What is it? $25? Yeah. And it's like, yeah,

to have like all of that happening, which is, you know, you, you travel somewhere, a lot of other places around the world, you know, you're shelling out money to government officials and cops and everything. Even in Washington, D.C., you want to get something approved, you grease this here and there. The corrosiveness of individual micro-level corruption is a thing. Are you, side question, are you an FCPA believer? Do you think that that's a good thing? I do because, so FCPA- The Foreign Corrupt Practices Act. Yeah.

So, and here is my argument for it. Like the thing that breeds insurgency and extremism and violence in countries around the world is corruption. And people don't really understand that link. Afghanistan, for instance, it was the Taliban's willingness to root out the corruption of those drug lords. It was financial and it was kind of like, I'm not going to say sexual, but like they were instilling sexual morality, I guess, in lieu of how things. Yeah. And they would say, well, the Taliban—we don't really like what they stand for, but they stand for what they stand for. Yeah, they have order.

Yes. Right, right, right. And that's all over the world. The thing that will feed this instability and this violence is these people are ripping me off, and I hate them them and I want them to die. So I'll get the counter case. Look at the Arab Spring. The Arab Spring, the first guy that immolated himself did it because he was pissed off at a fruit vendor inspector who was trying to shake him down for bribes and destroy his life. This was in Tunisia, correct? In Tunisia, yeah. Yeah, that's right. I mean, I'll give the difference. So for people who don't know, Trump tried to

suspend the FCPA, which basically prevents U.S. businesses from dealing with – in corrupt practices abroad. By the way, Rubio just sanctioned the former president of Argentina, Christian Kirchner, for corruption, corrupt practices. It's like, bro, like two weeks ago you said corruption is fine. So how are we sanctioning a former president for something that we say it's fine for our own people to participate in? I totally agree with that. I don't even know why we'd be sanctioning people for corruption. Because she's center left. Yeah, okay.

So it just ends up. But, I mean, how are you supposed to do business, right? Like how are you supposed to do business in many of these foreign countries? Like India famously, one of the places where you really have to grease the wheel. If we want our companies to be able to do business, aren't they at a strategic disadvantage? What, the Chinese people aren't paying people off? I mean, if we want to engage in, let's say, East Asia. Look, no offense, East Asia, but been around long enough to read exactly about the fusion of the Samsung and Panasonic and all those. You can call it

corruption or you can call it legalized corruption, but it's something, right? So how are we supposed to do business, let's say, in a country where you have to give gifts and that's literally part of their business culture? You send McKinsey consultants and you tell them how to legalize it. So you just cut it out. Yeah, that's what I mean. We're doing it anyway. So you might as well just make it, you know, instead of adding a bunch of legal red tape, it's like, yeah, we can't be corrupt here. But if other places are corrupt, like what are you supposed to do? And it's not like they don't find a way. We're thoroughly corrupt too. It's just that we've

legalized it and we call it lobbying and we call it, you know, campaign spending. Right, exactly. So are we, are we just being a little hypocritical there? Yeah, we definitely are. Oh, we're better than you? Yeah, we definitely are. Okay, good. I'm glad you agree with me. All right, let's get to the Trump truth thing. This is also important. Let's put this up there on the screen from Donald Trump. I love Trump. So cool. The greatest of them all, Trump being Trump coin. Trump coin, of course, launched famous, lots of questions.

Coffee Zilla has pointed out about pump and dump schemes and others. You can actually see at the pump and dump that happened. Let's put that on the screen. Immediately after he tweeted or truthed or whatever about it, the coin shot up to $12.25, immediately lost overall dollar value. But I mean, part of the issue here with the transparency is, you know, you don't know who owns this thing. You have no idea who are some of the people who had it, who some of the wallet holders are. There's so much anonymity behind it. And just to have, you know, the Trump, and the thing is the Trump family has made it clear that not only

they don't have no problem with this, it's part of their business strategy. Like Don Jr. and others are literally partnered with, what's that called? World Liberty Financial. I think it is just the crypto organization behind that. Also involves Steve Witkoff's son, by the way, which is hilarious. It's all a family business. So my point is, is that you can clearly see, I think that the more you see this type of stuff, and especially because people are aware of it, you even have like Dave Portnoy and people like that who are calling it out. They're like, yeah, this is too much. There's just something about this which rubs people the wrong way. And that's where with the Starlink thing I come back to, the defense will be, oh, but it's the right company. And it's where with the Starlink thing I come back to, the defense will be,

oh, but it's the right company. And it's like, yeah, maybe it is. But that's not the point. The point is, is it's about the appearance itself. And I do think that's starting to become very politically potent around the country. And it becomes more potent if things are going poorly in the country. Oh, absolutely. As you and I remember, Halliburton was a household name in 06. Everybody knew about Halliburton and Dick Cheney. And what was the pharmaceutical company that Rumsfeld was like Gilead Pharmaceutical? Oh, yeah, Gilead. I'm serious. Like, guys, 20 years ago, people who were the breaking points viewer of 20 years ago was aware of all of this stuff.

And especially around Iraq war, no-bid contracts, and all that in the federal government. There was a real feeling that not only that this war is killing America's troops, sons and daughters, for something that we didn't necessarily want or sign up for, but it was also a pretext for bilking the American taxpayer. It was a very politically powerful message. And when the war's going okay, then people were like, oh, Albertan, they're doing a good job. The second that it turns, then you have a plausible and legitimate scapegoat. It would be like, oh, you corrupt bastards can't even wage the war right. So the parallel would be Trump feeling good about the economy, they're going to be like, all right, have your fun with your Trump coin.

Yeah. And all of this weird thing where you've got a three-time CEO as your special advisor with a kid on his shoulder. That's fine because I'm doing well. Yeah. special advisor with the kid on his shoulder. That's fine because I'm doing well. If you start seeing job loss month over month, unemployment going up, and you get stagflation with prices still going up, then people are going to be like, get enough of this. You don't get to rip us off while we're suffering. You can rip us off if we're doing well. If we're all in this together. If we're all making money, then it's fine. Then that's fine.

That's the best deal. It's like win, win, win in the words of Michael Scott. All right. Look, we got to watch it. And I do think that this will eventually become, it's not just politics. Because I've also been thinking about Elon. If you are, and this is going to be, oh my God. Can you imagine if the Democrats win the House of Representatives in 2026? The number of hearings for Elon and for

SpaceX, it's going to be unbelievable. The amount of subpoenas, the amount of government scrutiny, the, I mean, look, you know, Elon and them accused the Biden administration of lashing out at them. Good luck if a Democrat ever wins the White House again. If you're Tesla, SpaceX, and all that, as we all know, it's very influenced by government contracts. It's one of those where – and then not to mention the whole brand hit that you were taking. This is like literally an existential risk. And everyone was applauding him saying, oh, he took an existential risk. It's like, yeah, it'll work out for four years, but that's not really how the American government works.

So good luck. Yes. He's, he's acting like he feels like there will never be an opposition takeover. I think we are one 18 months away, you know, when the Democrats, if, or let's say if the Democrats take, especially in the house, cause they have subpoena power. I mean, the amount of legal red tape, we're talking about hundreds of millions of dollars, just in legal fees, compliance, oversight committee, house transportation committee, specific riders in every bill that exempts Elon Musk's companies from participating in federal contract. I mean, you could see some serious, like serious, serious ramifications for Elon himself. And remember, I mean, what is it? Bannon went to

jail for contempt. Like, it's not a joke. Like, sure, they'll refer to the DOJ under Trump and they won't do anything, but Trump may not be around forever. Like, you can easily see in two years from now or four years from now, when Trump is out of the White House and whoever the Democrat is,

let's say even a normie Democrat, I don't know, like Ruben Gallego. Yeah, Ruben Gallego, John Ossoff, any of these folks, of course they're going to do it. This is going to be a core ask of the base. In the same way, like pardon J6ers and all that stuff for Trump voters, this is going to be, I think, a core demand of a lot of the liberal base going forward. So, yeah, I don't know. And the more self-dealing you are and the more government contracts you are, the more attack vectors that the future has for you.

You actually want to government proof yourself if you're going to do something like this. Right. And this is before they've, you know, broken Social Security or Medicare, like whatever, whatever calamity may befall this administration between now and then hasn't, hasn't come yet. Maybe there will not, won't be one and all the checks will go out. Yes. But if, if they don't, look out. I know a lot of cops, and they get asked all the time, have you ever had to shoot your gun? Sometimes the answer is yes. But there's a company dedicated to a future where the answer will always be no.

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I've learned one thing. No town is too small for murder. I'm Katherine Townsend. I've received hundreds of messages from people across the country begging for help with unsolved murders. I was calling about the murder of my husband at the cold case. They've never found her. And it haunts me to this day.

The murderer is still out there. Every week on Hell and Gone Murder Line, I dig into a new case, bringing the skills I've learned as a journalist and private investigator to ask the questions no one else is asking. Police really didn't care to even try. She was still somebody's mother. She was still somebody's daughter. She was still somebody's sister.

There's so many questions that we've never gotten any kind of answers for. If you have a case you'd like me to look into, call the Hell and Gone Murder Line at 678-744-6145. Listen to Hell and Gone Murder Line on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Michael Kassin, founder and CEO of 3C Ventures and your guide on good company, the podcast where I sit down with the boldest innovators shaping what's next. In this episode, I'm joined by Anjali Sood, CEO of Tubi, for a conversation that's anything but ordinary. We dive into the competitive world of streaming, how she's turning so-called niche into mainstream

gold, connecting audiences with stories that truly make them feel seen. What others dismiss as niche, we embrace as core. It's this idea that there's so many stories out there. And if you can find a way to curate and help the right person discover the right content, the term that we always hear from our audience is that they feel seen. Get a front row seat to where media, marketing, technology, entertainment, and sports collide, and hear how leaders like Anjali are carving out space and shaking things up a bit in the most crowded of markets. Listen to Good Company on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, tell us what's going on. All right, so this Steve Witkoff, Mideast envoy who famously browbeat Netanyahu into the January 20th ceasefire, which was supposed to move into phase two between February and March, instead has resulted in Israel relaunching its assault on Gaza.

You had Witkoff join Tucker Carlson for a very long and interesting interview, but also do the rounds on some of the rest of the media, in which he kind of reverts back to the Biden administration argument that actually this is all Hamas. Let's roll a little bit of Witkoff here. I know that you've said Hamas has been unreasonable in trying to respond to another round of the next phase of a ceasefire. Where do we go from here? What are the odds you get them back to the table and get these hostages home? Well, I certainly hope we get everybody back to the table and get the hostages home. I was in Doha. I met with many of the Arab leaders at the Arab summit.

I thought we had a deal, an acceptable deal. I even thought we had an approval from Hamas. Maybe that's just me getting duped. But I thought we were there, and evidently we weren't. So this is on Hamas. The United States stands with the state of Israel. There's just, that's a 100% commitment. And we've expressed that. Hamas had every opportunity to demilitarize, to accept the bridging proposal that would

have given us a 40 or 50 day ceasefire, where we could have discussed demilitarization and a final truce. There were all kinds of opportunities to do that, and they elected not to. And this becomes the alternative. And it is unfortunate. Do I think if would we be amenable to a reach out from Hamas? Of course we would be. And no different than in the Russian conflict, we want to end the killing. But we need to be clear who the aggressor is here and that is Hamas. It feels almost impossible for people here in the United States to have any clear sense of what on earth is going on because we're so propagandized about

this. If you want to have a better idea of what's going on, you read the Israeli media. You're 100% right. So, here's the Times of Israel article, and this is a kind of a right-leaning publication. This is not the Haaretz, like, left-leaning one. This is Times of Israel article. They say, quote, Hamas has insisted on sticking to the original terms of the deal, which was supposed to begin its second phase at the beginning of March. For a month, though, Israel refused to enter talks on the specific terms of phase two, as the stage's general framework requires it to fully withdraw from Gaza and agree to a permanent end of the war. In submitting his bridge proposal earlier this month, Witkoff accepted Israel's aversion to

phase two. So this is what happened. They struck a deal, the U.S. guaranteed it, and then Israel insisted on breaking the deal. And that is according to the Israeli press and also according to reality. Like, that's actually what happened. And Witkoff knows every detail of that. I think we can only assume that this is the same movement that took out Adam Boehler. Witkoff, for people, again, I need people to understand this with Witkoff. He has been the target of more assault on a Trump appointee than any single other individual. His temerity was what?

He asked Bibi to work on Shabbat and agreed to a ceasefire. You think I'm joking? They cannot tolerate this. Like any sense of America is the superpower here. No. That's why Bowler, he was disappeared, right? He's in El Salvador along with all those other guys. You're never even going to see him again. The same with Wyckoff. Like the thing that they decided on is that he's a Qatari asset, number one. And then number two is – Which is so with Netanyahu's team. Which is so ridiculous.

Again, I tweeted that. I think you saw it as well where I was like, really? Like the people who are in the Israel lobby are going to accuse people of being funded by a foreign government? Like do you have no shame? Like have you no shame? As we speak, Netanyahu's inner circle is under investigation for taking bribes from Qatar. You can't make it up. You literally cannot script it. And yet here in Washington, like you said, we can't talk about any of this. Now, the other thing you will learn if you follow the Israeli press, but not the American press,

although if you follow the breaking points, you'll hear about it. Why did Netanyahu refuse to go into phase two? Why did he choose this time? A couple different things. The head of the Shin Bet was investigating Netanyahu, so he fired him. First time in Israeli history that this happens, and he needs political support to do that. He has to finish a budget by the end of this month, and to history that this happens, and he needs political support to do that. He has to finish a budget by the end of this month, and to do that, he needed Zoltan Smotrin and Ben Javir back in his coalition. And so in order to do that, he had to restart the genocide on Gaza.

There were protests against the firing of the Shin Bet head. Big protests. Huge protests. Really real ones. Like James Comey level. As well as massive protests on behalf of getting the remaining captives out of Gaza. And Netanyahu's corruption trial was moving forward. Launching the bombing when he did allowed the trial to be delayed. I feel like you say this stuff out loud, you sound like a crazy

person. It's like, this can't, this can't be true. This can't be why hundreds and hundreds of people are getting, are getting killed right now so that Netanyahu can get his budget passed and can avoid his corruption trial and can, and can suppress these protests and the investigations into himself. Right. Yet that is precisely and explicitly what is happening. Right. But that's, you know, not enough. And Witkoff, like I said, he has just changed his tune completely.

On the Hamas question, remember Bowler, he's like, yeah, they're afraid that we might find out. They're good guys. You know, like that. Don't have horns on their heads. And he's like, I understand why they're upset, but we're not a client of Israel. Oh, oops. Gone.

Black bag. Incorrect. Literally over his head. Here's Witkoff, you know, basically sounding off on Tucker Carlson. Same stuff we've heard a million times. Let's take a listen. This is Southern Command of Israel then showed me a film of what happened on October 7th. Yeah.

And the film is horrific. Yes. It is about mass rapes. It talks about beheaded babies and stuff. It's like, I haven't seen this 47-minute video that they have shown. You easily could. They've offered it to everyone. People have been very clear about what's in it, and none of that is in it.

That's just a lie. Like, it's just untrue that that video includes any of that. It just doesn't. But yes, it does show how chastened he is from, you know, Bowler getting knocked on his heels. And so what is the consequence for people on the ground in Gaza? We put up D3 here.

So Nasser Hospital, oh so this is, by the way, that is a tent, that's a tent encampment. Yeah, those are tents. These are like 2,000 pound bombs being dropped on tents. And what Israel has been doing, that's Nasser Hospital, we'll talk about that in a second, is they acknowledged that they were responsible for that airstrike that you saw on the tent encampment there. They said there was a Hamas figure who was in one of the tents. And that therefore that's why they believed that they had the moral and legal right to kill all of the people that were anywhere near them. It is crazy to just linger on that. Not that long ago,

there's a whole Wolf Blitzer segment, you know, talking about the first tent bombing. Remember Blitzer asked him about, even he criticized, he's a former APAC employee, all this other stuff. Even he's like, hey guys, like what are we doing here?

Nowadays, it's not even a headline anymore. Bombing tent. It's just reality. It's just the day of the business. Like you said, if this is done for a purpose, like if you think back to the Allied bombing campaigns against Germany and Japan, the purpose, at least ostensibly we can argue about it probably forever, is what? It's to destroy the war machine of Germany. And the will of the public. And the will of the German public and the war machine of Germany.

Here, though, they're like, oh, well, we need to kill every last terrorist. And you're like, okay, but, you know, by your own admission, like, this has not worked. You've done this for two years. Rockets are launched from Gaza onto, was it Tel Aviv, some city in Israel, just like a last week, which is one of the core competencies that you said that you were going to wipe out, which is actually proof that it's not working. Now, you would think that you would adjust strategy. Here in Washington, during the Second World War, whenever we see, you know, we would do bombing assessments where we're like, okay, this didn't work. We've got to change to this. We're going to try this. We're going to try that. We're going to do a change of tactics. We need to change all. It's almost like the strategy, the strategic goal is nonexistent because it's tied to their political ends at home.

Exactly. And it goes back to what we were just saying. The strategy has nothing to do with a war. It's all about these domestic political interests. It would be as if FDR was bombing Berlin because FDR had a corruption trial on Tuesday. And he's trying to fire like the head of the OSS because the OSS is looking into FDR. And he's also on the take from Qatar, which didn't exist yet. So that explains why then none of it makes sense from a strategic or even a tactical perspective.

Because it's not actually aimed to make any sense. And so there are two, this is, and the last piece we showed you there was Nasser Hospital. That was the second floor of Nasser Hospital, directly targeted by an Israeli airstrike. Earlier yesterday, Feroz Sidwa and Mark Perlmutter were on CNN from Nasser Hospital talking about the crimes that they were seeing being committed by Israeli forces. Perlmutter, you famously may recall, was one of the authors of that New York Times article talking about how the Israeli forces were targeting children. Snipers, headshots, shot in the heart. It became this thing where the Israeli defenders said, this is all made up. Then you started having people online parsing the different x-rays. And so Times looked back and it was like, no, we ran this by

dozens of other medical experts and what they are saying is true. So these are high profile critics who had been in Gaza before, left Gaza, American doctors, now are back in Gaza in Nasser Hospital and are going back on CNN, criticizing the Israeli war machine. And later that day, a missile targets the second floor of the hospital. They claim they were targeting some Hamas guy. According to the medical staff there, there was a 17-year-old who was supposed to be going in for surgery. As a result of this attack, he died. He wasn't killed directly from it, but he couldn't get the surgery that he needed and as a result died. We're Sidwa told us that the explosion hit either the hospital building or just outside of it. This was in the fog of the early moments and the front of the hospital is on fire. He said a patient who was about to be transferred from the ICU to the operating room is now on hold and almost certainly going to die, unquote. That patient did in fact die you put up d6 as well this is a report from the scene you can see the

the fire in that and the hell um this uh says this is not the first time nor the second time that hospitals have been directly targeted israeli occupation forces are directly targeting the surgical department inside nasser medical complex, directly targeted with the wounded patients and medical staff all inside of the complex. And it reminds me very early in this, what turned out to be a genocide, there was this weeks-long debate here in the United States about whether or not a Palestinian Islamic Jihad rocket or an IDF rocket had targeted a particular hospital. I remember that. And since then, Israel has hit every single medical facility in Gaza and hit many of them multiple times. Earlier this week, they detonated a planned demolition of the only cancer treatment facility in Gaza.

And you compare that with this furious denial that they had attacked this one hospital back in November of 2023. It shows you where the world has gone in the time since. Because that was outrageous when it happened to the point where they had to deny that they did anything. And all these OSINT people doing their forensic work on it. And now they're like, yeah, we hit that hospital with the American doctors in it. What about it? What are you going to do? We're like, we're not going to do anything,

actually. Nobody's going to do anything. I think what is stunning to me about Witkoff is his clear about face. And it's just clear the political forces at work that are trying to move everything. The chessboard is clear to anybody who can watch it all happen. The Pentagon is developing these war plans. So Wyckoff wins in the early days, the first 50 days, I would say he's the victor. Adam Bowler is the high watermark of anybody who wanted to see a departure. But his problem is he said the quiet part out loud. We are not a client state of Israel. Boom, lopped. What happens a week later?

Yemen, Houthi bomb, right? Because what? Because people can finally point to the Adam Bowler, Wyckoff ceasefire and all that and say, no, this is not working. The convinced Trump and the people around him who are neocons and others are like, see, we have to be strong, right? So we start to bomb Yemen and the Houthis. And that leads to what? More of a policy on Iran, which is, oh, well, we previously Trump said, let's have a deal. I want to talk to you. Like, let's have diplomatic. Now they're like, oh, Iran will be held responsible for every Yemeni rocket. And then at the same time, what else happens? Oh, the Gaza war breaks

out again, which means that the increase in the attacks in Yemen and or stability all around the region is going to increase. And as all of this starts to take up, the divergence of that time becomes more clear. This is the policy apparatus and decisions that they want. They want an environment where it's much more likely to go to war with Iran, to quote unquote be strong with Iran, to bring critics and all those like Wyckoff and others to heel. And they want to get away from any reality where Trump, I think Trump didn't want that. I mean, he liked being the peacemaker.

I think he also really likes the idea of talking to the Ayatollah and signing a great Iran deal. And it's still going. Ish, right. I mean, look, I'm going to hold that hope. I hope for the sake of all of us that it does happen that way. But I'm watching the chessboard all move, where one year, two years, you never know.

It just takes one event and things pop off like that. The only hope remaining is also in the Tucker Carlson-Witkoff interview and it's Witkoff talking at length about how important a deal with Iran and a broader Mideast deal is to Trump. And as Witkoff says accurately, it all runs through Gaza. The Abraham Accords' fundamental flaw was that it pretended that the Palestine question could just be completely ignored. Now, people like Witkoff and Trump

understand that's not the case. You want Saudi Arabia, the Emiratis, Iran, all to kind of come to an actual accord. You got to figure out what you're doing with Gaza and with the West Bank. Interesting tweet, Ryan, just now, 20 minutes ago from JD Vance. Steve Witkoff is a great guy doing an incredible job. The people sniping him are mad that he's succeeding where they failed for 40 years. Turns out a lot of diplomacy boils down to a simple skill. Don't be an idiot. What do you make of that? That seems like a, that's a bad signal. Good. You know, J.D. J.D. Vance has a powerful faction within particularly the Pentagon, but also the broader foreign policy apparatus that is America first piece, much more realist. Peace-oriented. Right.

And that he's stepping in- I can't tell. Well, so he's, that's a bat signal for something. It could be on Ukraine. We'll probably cover that tomorrow. We don't have time to go into it all today because Steve also made quite a few controversial comments on Ukraine, if you're a Ukraine firster, here in Washington, basically saying,

yeah, we're gonna have to have territorial concessions. And they're like, here in Washington, basically saying, yeah, we're going to have to have territorial concessions. And they're like, oh my God, freaking out about it. But I do think that that's a subtle way of also signaling against some of these neocon attacks. But unfortunately, I'm just, I'm not sure. I think it might be too late because at this point, you know, with Witkoff, if you're going in public, you know, basically embracing the Israeli line of where the war is and sidelining Adam Bowehler and instead letting Mike Waltz and all these other guys who are just straight up neocons back into the decision making. It doesn't seem like it's a situation that's going to go in the direction that we would have hoped, let's say, in the first month or so of the Trump administration. The best hope would be that he just understands, particularly after the Bowler situation,

these are the words you say. No matter what happens, you blame Hamas. Right. And you say Israel has a right to defend itself. Now, if he does that publicly. These are the magic words. If he does that publicly and still berates Bibi behind the scenes, I'm fine with it. Right.

Okay, so let's. Right, he's still an American, so he has to say the magic words. Yeah, yeah. So maybe. It's Hamas' fault. That's right, yeah. Do you condemn Hamas? Right. Do you condemn Hamas for Israel striking the Nasser Hospital complex?

Absolutely. Outrageous on the part of Hamas. That's a good way. I like it. I know a lot of cops, and they get asked all the time, have you ever had to shoot your gun? Sometimes the answer is yes. But there's a company dedicated to a future where the answer will always be no. Across the country, cops called this taser the revolution.

But not everyone was convinced it was that simple. Cops believed everything that taser told them. From Lava for Good and the team that brought you Bone Valley comes a story about what happened when a multibillion-dollar company dedicated itself to one visionary mission. This is Absolute Season 1, Taser Incorporated. I get right back there and it's bad. It's really, really, really bad. Listen to new episodes of Absolute Season 1, Taser Incorporated, on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Binge episodes 1, 2, and 3 on May 21st and episodes 4, 5, and 6 on June 4th. Ad-free at Lava for Good Plus on Apple Podcasts. Over the past six years of making my true crime podcast, Hell and Gone, I've learned one thing. No town is too small for murder. I'm Katherine Townsend. I've received hundreds of messages from people across the country

begging for help with unsolved murders. I was calling about the murder of my husband at the cold case. They've never found her. And it haunts me to this day. The murderer is still out there. Every week on Hell and Gone Murder Line, I dig into a new case, bringing the skills I've learned

as a journalist and private investigator to ask the questions no one else is asking. Police really didn't care to even try. She was still somebody's mother. She was still somebody's daughter. She was still somebody's sister. There's so many questions that we've never got any kind of answers for. If you have a case you'd like me to look into,

call the Hell and Gone Murder Line at 678-744-6145. Listen to Hell and Gone Murder Line on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Michael Kassin, founder and CEO of 3C Ventures and your guide on good company, the podcast where I sit down with the boldest innovators shaping what's next. In this episode, I'm joined by Anjali Sood, CEO of Tubi, for a conversation that's anything but ordinary. We dive into the competitive world of streaming, how she's turning so-called niche into mainstream gold, connecting audiences with stories that truly make them feel seen. What others dismiss as niche, we embrace as core.

It's this idea that there are so many stories out there, and if you can find a way to curate and help the right person discover the right content. The term that we always hear from our audience is that they feel seen. Get a front row seat to where media, marketing, technology, entertainment, and sports collide. And hear how leaders like Anjali are carving out space and shaking things up a bit in the most crowded of markets. Listen to Good Company on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Let's get over to the economy block. We had to cover this. So Secretary Lutnick over at the Commerce Department. Yeah, I do. I like Howard

Lutnick, too, just because he is he's just built for this moment in terms of the absolute chaos where he's got the smile on his face, believes nothing, a pure, just a pure opportunist, jettisoned himself to the top of the United States government by being the Trump co-chair of his campaign. Do you remember during the campaign when he put himself in the speaking slot before or after J.D. Vance? Like he put J.D. up there and then it was Lutnik and then Elon and then Trump. And everyone was like, Lutnik? Like why is he getting star billing at this campaign? Because he's the one that put the list.

And he's still upset. Howard Lutnick is still upset that he's not the U.S. Treasury Secretary. He thinks it's a downgrade that he's the head of the Commerce Department. I mean, he's right. Yeah, no, he is. Well, ish. Because remember, commerce is so powerful with tariffs. Anyway, Howard Lutnick sits down with the all-in podcast crew, Chamath Palihapitiya and Friedberg, in this crazy set that they use sometimes over at the White House.

And in the majesty of the imperium of the White House, the capital of the global empire, he starts to make some pretty unhinged comments about Social Security. Let's take a listen. I describe it to people this way. Let's say Social Security didn't send out their checks this month. My mother-in-law, who's 94, she wouldn't call and complain. She just wouldn't. She thinks something got messed up

and she'll get it next month. A fraudster always makes the loudest noise screaming yelling and complaining and if all the guys who did paypal like elon knows this by heart right anybody who's been in the payment system and the process system knows the easiest way to find the fraudster is to stop payments and listen yeah because whoever screams is the one stealing yeah Because my mother-in-law's not calling. I mean, come on, your mother, 80 year olds, 90 year olds, they trust the government, they trust, okay, maybe it got screwed up, big deal.

They're not gonna call and scream at someone. But someone who's stealing always does. So what happens is, we need to get to, so the people who are getting that free money, stealing the money, inappropriately getting the money, have an inside person who's routing the money, they are going to yell and scream. Right. Yeah, that totally makes sense. You know, the other reason that his mother-in-law may not scream is that Howard's worth 1.5 billion. Yeah, I think she's going to be okay.

And that tends to help. You know, you don't have to worry about your $600 a month check. Yeah, you know why I scream when companies who, you know, like, you know, we run a business here, sometimes vendors or whatever, that people don't pay on time. It's because, you know, I have employees to pay, right? So you got to make payroll or, you know, whatever the, what's the alternative? If you're maybe need to pay this thing called rent. Howard, I know you haven't paid that in a long time. Mortgage. These are things that we mere mortals are lucky to deal with in the case of a mortgage. Rent, you know, in the case of, let's say, somebody who's living on this little thing called a fixed income. Ryan, you talk. I need to find the exact stats on the number of people who rely solely on Social Security. And it's a lot. And it makes, to me, absolutely zero sense that the fraudster,

usually the fraudster would be the one who is going to take as much money quietly as they can. And then when their fraud is busted, they slink on to the next fraud. Like you don't sit there and throw yourself a parade and invite a lot of extra scrutiny. Yes, but to your point, yeah, if my son-in-law was worth a billion and a half dollars, then yeah, I probably would not be sweating my Social Security check either. It's like, lady, are you really even relying on Social Security? Lady, you don't manage your own finances. Let's just call it for what it is. There's no way she knows when her Social Security check comes or what the value of it is.

Right. Why would she? That'd be weird. Yeah, it would be weird, right. It's like if you've got a billion and a half son-in-law, I would hope, at least where I come from, you take care of your bills. If he's not helping her out,

if she's relying on her Social Security check. That's actually a whole other meta-comment commentary of which I hope to get to one day. He must really hate his mother-in-law. Yeah, clearly he hates her. But while you look at that, let's jump real quick to E4 because this is related to it. At the same time that you've got Howard Lutnick out there acting like the Republicans are never going to see another voter again, you have the Social Security administrator, the acting one, doing a very similar thing. He threatens that he's going to shut down the entire Social Security administration and not send out checks because he's mad at a judicial ruling.

He's trying to make a point. And the point was, oh, this judge thinks that he can run Social Security better than I can. Let's let him try. And I'll go into the IT system. I'm just going to shut the whole thing down and that'll show him. So he's sort of threatening like malicious compliance with this judicial order. The judge cracked down on him. And as you saw now that now he's saying, he says, Lee Dudick says, I am not shutting down the agency. But think about where the Republicans are if they're at the point of their quote is, I am not shutting down the agency. Yeah. If you're explaining that you're not actually going to shut down the Social Security Administration, you've somehow gotten yourself into weird

political terrain. So yeah, something like half of elderly people. I've got it here. 47% of those aged 60 and older are, quote, very reliant on Social Security. There is at least some indication from 2020 that 40% of older Americans depend entirely on Social Security. So what's the average Social Security payment? What is it, like a couple thousand bucks a month?

$36,000 a year? $2,200 maybe, yeah. Yes, okay, so $22,000 a year. That's not a lot of money, right? No, it's not. So if we got, let's see, what is the average Social Security payment in the U.S.? $1,909. That's it?

Yeah. That's what you got? Yeah. Okay, so $1,900 a month. And they're supposed to make, let's see, they're supposed to pay tax, at least some income tax on that. I guess if you're only making that income tax. That's all you're making, you're not paying much. You're not going to pay

any income tax. You have to make rent, food, mortgage and or rent, food. Prescriptions at that point. Prescriptions. Because Medicare is not going to cover. You're going to do your extra Medicare premiums. Yeah, you're right. It's 19, oh my, I can't even imagine this, $1,976.

That is crazy. I mean, that's after the cost of living adjustment that previously went into place from January of 2024. And remember, that was a 9% increase on what there already was. So that's nothing, all right? So if you've got $1,900 a month, that's effectively poverty, which reason this exists is not to have poverty. You just have to think, like use your brain cells for having a billionaire commerce secretary going around telling people, oh, if you miss your payment, that's not a big deal. The average American is a blown tire away from complete bankruptcy, like five to $600 emergency payment. They don't have

it. I mean that, and we're not even talking about retirement. People are like retirement. That's a dream. I don't even know what you're talking about. So if you put all this stuff together, I mean, you're looking at a situation where you're basically just taunting people to vote against you. I can't think again, even the optics there, it's like this Roman-style stage. And look, no offense to y'all in guys, but Chamath and Friedberg are filthy rich. Chamath, I know, is a billionaire. I don't know if he's a billionaire. He's probably 100 million. Doing okay. Whatever. Yeah, he's doing fine. All right. So you got three near billionaires and or billionaires

on a stage talking about Social Security and about how if you complain about that, you're a fraudster. Whereas any normal person who's ever been in somewhat financial distress, if you've ever even had a paycheck come a couple days late, it's a problem. It's a serious problem. Especially when, yeah, like if we run a business, you know, we literally have to make payroll. You know, you or others probably at some time in your life at least had some times where somebody didn't pay you or whatever on schedule. You're like, dude, I need this money to like pay my rent. The amount of financial stress that they can cause in your life is immense. And is that really a society you want to live in with old people feeling that way?

That's where the program exists in the first place. So I thought it was preposterous. I want to pair that, though, with one of my favorite stories that I've seen in quite some time. Let's go ahead and put this up there on the screen. This is the state of America right now. DoorDash and Klarna have signed a deal where customers can now choose to pay for food delivery in interest-free installments. So you guys remember Klarna. It's the Buy Now, Pay Later app, the BNPL, where this type of debt is actually very hard to track. We don't have exact numbers. What we do

know is that this amount of debt is actually not counted in overall debt figures, and it is estimated that there are tens of billions of dollars of Americans who are on these buy now, pay later plans, which are not respect to Klarna, you're seeing this now applied not just to clothing and all of that, which is, in my opinion, bad enough. But now you've got it applied to food delivery. And it's just so perfect because food delivery itself is a luxury, right? It's already one where it's not only a luxury good going back for forever, but it's also one where the DoorDash, Uber Eats, and all that model is, yeah, it's convenient. But you may not notice stuff on there is like three times more expensive, let's say, than it used to be. So between food inflation, delivery fees, process fees, et cetera, everybody's – the only people winning are DoorDash and Klarna here. The restaurant, they get, what, 40%, 50% of whatever the actual order is. So they got to jack their prices up just to be able to make that. The consumer is paying more

for the food. The driver, let's not even get started on that in terms of how much they're getting out of this entire thing. And now we're financing the order. That is like the worst, literally, of all worlds. It actually also shows you how the promise of these apps was ease. It's like, yeah, ease is great if you're rich, if you can afford it. Ease also comes with a cost. There's no such thing as a free lunch. There's only tradeoffs. Well, now we see higher food prices for everybody.

We see drivers and all that who don't even work for a company getting paid, like the old pizza delivery guy, now solely reliant on contracts, contract basis, getting paid a middling amount or whatever per hour. And now the consumer who is ordering this has to pay or is in such financial distress over the increased prices of everything, they have to finance this across time. And so as people know, I'm a fan of Dave Ramsey. This was his reaction to the story. Let's put E3, please, up on the screen. He's just tweeting a picture of himself But there is something about this, which is just so

dystopian. And we can make fun of it all we want. But also, you and I know, Ryan, this is going to be a very financially successful product. And that is the true black pill of it all. And the only other thing I'd add to that is the waste. My God. Like, the delivery order comes, it's the foods in a plastic bowl with a plastic lid in two plastic bags and then they put plastic utensils in there too it's like right you send it to my home you think i don't have a fork you think i don't have a spoon some places you have to check you check it and they still put it in there oh okay all right because the last thing they ever want is somebody complaining true the customer's always right. It's like, we have forks at home.

Come on. Everybody's got a fork. This is where your European sensibilities are starting to come in, Ryan. Think about it. Think about the scale of it. I don't disagree with you. Where is all this going to go? Yeah, but then what's the cost?

The cost of the business is much higher if one person complains. Exactly. As opposed to just giving it to you. And then Klarna, like, okay, they tell you that there's going to be no interest. And yeah, okay. Yeah, folks, how do you think Klarna makes money? You think they're just giving this away to you for free? No.

It's a nonprofit. They know you're not going to pay for it. Yeah. Let me look up their revenue, actually. So, right. If you don't pay within 30 days, then they start hitting you with the fees and the fines. Oh, God. And they're also, they're now introducing, like, these different $2 service charges here and there.

One of their big things has always been no service charge, no fees. And now, they're like, guess what? Like once they've got you hooked, they're going to find ways to add the junk fees in. And you know what? Go ahead and call the CFPB and complain, you're going to get a busy signal there because the people who are funding these types of companies made sure that the CFPB is not going to be around to check the abuses of companies like this. So here's what we've got. Klarna's revenue surged 24%. This is just from two days ago. They're actually filing for IPO. They're going public.

Congratulations to Klarna. Congratulations. That's right. Media reports suggest they are aiming to raise more than a billion or 15, between one, yeah, exceeding a valuation of sub $15 billion. The BNPL market is projected to surpass 160 billion by 2032. Klarna's revenue just last year is $2.81 billion compared to a $2.2 billion a year ago. It earned some $21 million, which is actually kind of low, showing that they're investing a lot of that back into the product, some one cent per share compared to losses. So it's a profitable company, and they are making $2.28 billion. Again, not based on you, because it's like the credit card. They know you're not going to pay it. I had no idea until I started listening to Dave. 77% of people just don't pay their credit card, which is wild. I have

no idea. I didn't even know that was an option, just based on the way I was raised. But it's like, yeah, some people just don't pay it. And you're like, oh, okay. So now it's 17%. Yeah, so 17%, you know, APR, and that stacks up and it keeps going and it goes and it goes and it goes. And no wonder people are in thousands of dollars in credit card debt. So this whole buy now, pay later model like this, it's proven that the product wouldn't exist if they didn't make any money. If you actually paid it. If people paid on time, they wouldn't make $2 billion a year. We have no fees, but we have $2 billion in revenue. How'd that happen? It's devastating. Weird. It's not good. It's really, it's bad. And it's just more about people, you know, sinking into a money hole, thinking that they're getting something convenient. Yes, I think the consumer and all of that should do due diligence, etc. But there's

something just really gross, you know, about all of this being just so ever-present. It's just never been, there's never been an easier time in human history to get cripplingly in debt and ruin your life. I really believe that. Between credit cards and buy now, pay later and up charges and food delivery fees and all of this. Just like the entire ecosystem is just designed

to part you with whatever dollars that you happen to have left. And the VCs very cleverly got the whole country hooked on cheap delivery. True. Very true. It was basically free and subsidized by the VC billions. And then just gradually, they start turning the temperature up on the cost of it. And now you're hooked on getting it delivered. Yep. Sorry, guys. We didn't have time to talk about the soda story. Really wanted to, but we went long with Glenn. And I think that's probably a lot more beneficial to the audience in hearing about this. So don't worry about it. You're going to get it all on Tuesday. We will see you all then. Over the years of making my true crime podcast, Helen Gone,

I've learned no town is too small for murder. I'm Catherine Townsend. I've heard from hundreds of people across the country with an unsolved murder in their community. I was calling about the murder of my husband. The murderer is still out there. Each week, I investigate a new case. If there is a case we should hear about, call 678-744-6145.

Listen to Hell and Gone Murder Line on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What up, y'all? This your main man, Memphis Bleak, right here. Host of Rock Solid Podcast. June is Black Music Month, so what better way to celebrate you get your podcasts. Through that process, learn. Learn from it. Check out this exclusive episode with Ja Rule on Rock Solid. Open your free iHeartRadio app, search Rock Solid, and listen now. I think everything that might have dropped in 95 has been labeled the golden years of hip-hop. It's Black Music Month, and we need to talk.

It's tapping in. I'm Nyla Simone, breaking down lyrics, amplifying voices, and digging into the culture that shaped the soundtrack of our lives. Like, that's what's really important and that's what stands out, is that our music changes people's lives for the better. Let's talk about the music that moves us. To hear this and more on how music and culture collide, listen to We Need to Talk from the Black Effect Podcast Network

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