Breaking Points with Krystal and Saagar - 6/19/24: Candace Owens SOUNDS OFF: Ben Shapiro, Israel, Trump VP Pick

Episode Date: June 19, 2024

Saagar sits down with Candace Owens to talk Daily Wire firing, Israel, and why she's supporting Trump in 2024. To become a Breaking Points Premium Member and watch/listen to the show AD FREE, uncut and 1 hour early visit: www.breakingpoints.com Merch Store: https://shop.breakingpoints.com/See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an iHeart Podcast. I also want to address the Tonys. On a recent episode of Checking In with Michelle Williams, I open up about feeling snubbed by the Tony Awards. Do I? I was never mad. I was disappointed because I had high hopes. To hear this and more on disappointment and protecting your peace,

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to expand coverage, upgrade the studio, add staff, give you guys the best independent coverage that is possible. If you like what we're all about, it just means the absolute world to have your support. But enough with that. Let's get to the show. Very excited now to be joined by Candice Owen. She's newly independent. She's launched her own show, and we are very excited to have her here on Breaking Points.

Candice, thank you so much for joining me. Thanks for having me. I'm glad we could finally make this work. Absolutely. Well, I guess it's been a long time coming. It's kind of something I wanted to talk to you a little bit about. So I've followed this story with great interest. A friend of the show, Glenn Greenwald, reported, we can put this up there on the screen. He had reported previously that you'd been secretly hit with a gag order. And we wanted to just hear from you in your own words to the best that you're able about what happened here in the departure from The Daily Wire. You know, in my own words, I can't really say much at the moment. Unfortunately,

I obviously have been paying attention to everything that has been said publicly, and there may be an opportunity for me, hopefully in the near future, to make a statement of some sort. But I do also want to respect the process, the judicial process, and not do anything that would get me into trouble. Fair enough. All right, well, then tell us a little about you. You've launched your own show. Clearly, this is a result of some of the comments that you had made previously in the months prior, specifically about the Israel-Palestine conflict. I have seen you very mischaracterized in some of the comments that you have made.

So I actually just want to give you the opportunity. What do you think about the conflict after October 7th? You know, I have been probably one of the most consistent public commentators when it comes to foreign conflict. I don't believe that we should be getting involved in Ukraine's war, Israel's war. I did not believe that we should be involved in Afghanistan. You know, my position is now being characterized as isolationist. I'm comfortable with that. I don't see how the people that have been rah, rah, rah, let's go to war all the time can still stand on the idea that war has been beneficial for America.

It makes entirely no sense for our news coverage to be wall to wall about Israel's borders and not our own. When America is cleaned up and when America's borders are secured, you can maybe ask me about whether or not I believe we should be reaching overseas to help other people. But I just don't feel that way. And I think it's really disgusting that people try to use World War II propaganda

and imagery to suggest that if we don't, that there's something wrong, that, well, why don't you want to go defend Jews? You know, they're kind of putting it in the context of Adolf Hitler in World War II if you don't want to help out or secure Israel. I'm America first. I'm unapologetic about being America first. And also regarding Bibi Netanyahu, he has said things that if you are a true American patriot, you should be outraged. That man has openly said that he is controlling elements in America.

Don't worry about America, he said. We've got elements in America. Don't worry about America, he said. We've got them under control. Don't worry about America. We're getting laws passed. If any person criticizes Israel, they will get into trouble. How dare you purport to be America first and then stay silent on a foreign leader of another country speaking as if they've got America under siege, as if Israel is what is controlling America. And when you add that up with the things that we have heard when

the ADL John Greenblatt was sort of caught on the hot mic talking about TikTok, it should make every American uncomfortable. I believe in national sovereignty, and I'm not fearful to stand up and speak out when the question is Israel, no more than I was fearful when the question was Zelensky. And he was talking like a thug and a gangster. Right. It's very interesting, right? On the issue of Ukraine, all of us can agree on that. And yet there seems to be some sort of exception whenever it comes to Israel. I think you and I are both in a place where it's like, look, I don't have anything against Israel, but I just think we should treat it like any other nation and any other nation that would be actively lobbying or pressuring things inside of our

nation. I'm just going to object to that from an America first principle. Why do you think, though, given you had a lot more experience than I have inside some of the highest echelons of the conservative movement, where does the exception come from? Why do people either want to stay silent or create the exception for Israel in their rhetoric? I think left and right, what it comes down to is that we have people that protect the military industrial complex. I think a lot of people purport to be conservatives. They're not conservatives. What they ultimately serve is the higher power of the military industrial complex, which has been controlling our media for a very long time. I mean, show me a war in which the

media wasn't on board with, in which the media said, oh, maybe we shouldn't get involved. I mean, I'm talking, it feels like since 9-11, it has been nonstop war. And I go back to 9-11 only because that's kind of the first indelible mark on my childhood, where suddenly we were being propagandized into believing that dropping bombs forever was a sensible foreign policy position. And I think now you have people who are truly America first, who are calling out neocons and saying this makes no sense. Why is Nikki Haley signing bombs?

I mean, it's completely psychotic. I don't care what country it's for. I wouldn't sign the bomb even if it was for on behalf of America. It's not something that someone should do. And so, yeah, I think what's really happened is the American mindset is shifting. But within the media, it does seem to me that they are just pro-war in general. And then, of course, there are some people where you do have to question their allegiance to America in general. There does seem to be some individuals who seem to have more allegiance to Israel than they do to America. And that might be because of money. Maybe they're perceiving money. Maybe they're, pardon me, getting money in some capacity, receiving money from Israel in some capacity. I don't know that for sure. But some of it just

doesn't even make any sense of why they would be this committed to Israel outside of some financial incentive. Well, let's stick with that because I had Tucker Carlson on this show and he got into a lot of trouble when I asked him about Ben Shapiro, one of your former colleagues. You don't have to comment if you don't want to, but he got a tremendous amount of criticism for questioning why exactly somebody would have such a deep attachment to a foreign nation. That was characterized, I think, unfairly as anti-Semitic. We put it previously, just like I discussed, if you put that on any other nation, it's obviously within the realm of discussion. If you see, and there previously, I think, many conservative

commentators who could get upset about people waving Mexican flags at an immigration rally and say, what exactly is going on here? So on that ground, you were talking there about money and foreign influence, et cetera. How do you find the amount of incoming criticism? How are you able to wade through that and to try and to speak both honestly and then protect your flank? Because clearly you have suffered a lot of criticism and also now professional consequences as a result of what you've been talking about. Yeah, I'm just proud of myself.

And I'm also proud of the American people because they just didn't accept it. They knew that it was a nonsense. And I think that they're recognizing like the old guard is failing. So the idea that if you are America first and you're unapologetic about being America first, that they're going to be able to take you out by calling you anti-Semitic, racist, sexist, misogynist. I mean, throw it on the list. I could care less at the end of the day. What I'm being called, what I care about is what the American people know and what the American people understand. And the American people believe in me. They know how I'm coming at this issue. And they know that there isn't an anti-Semitic

bone in my body. If there was one, why would I go work at a company that was partially founded by Ben Shapiro? Why would I go work for PragerU for two years? It doesn't even make any sense. And so they're asking the American public not to believe their own eyes. They believe in their old witchcraft where they could take a person and then completely delete them from the universe by calling them a bunch of names. And I'm stronger than that. And I think the mentality of people that follow me is stronger than that. And I think they're frustrated.

You can sense their frustration that it's not working anymore. And that brings me great pleasure. It does. It brings me pleasure to know that these old tricks aren't working. So what they are going to have to do if they realistically want to stomp out people and ruin their lives for the crime of criticizing a foreign nation is they're going to have to compete in the battle of ideas. They're going to have to come to us and say, this is why it makes sense for you to send

money overseas. And they're going to have to win on that basis. You know, they're not on the basis of feelings and emotions, but on the basis of the proper facts of why it would make sense for any American to pledge their allegiance to a foreign country above America. And guess what? There isn't a fact where that makes sense. And Candace, I mean, what you just referenced, this battle of ideas. I mean, this was canon for a lot of these, you know, like you just mentioned, two individuals, Dennis Prager and for Ben Shapiro. On this issue, though, it does just seem to be like substantively different. I want to ask, you know, in all your years

of the conservative movement, has there been any other issue where it invited this much criticism internally and ultimately attempts at cancellation? Well, a lot of it for me is reminiscent of BLM. And so I didn't encounter this in the conservative movement because the conservatives were anti-BLM. But it's all of the exact same tricks. When I stood up and I said, no, obviously you can't just use your identity and say, I'm a black person, so now you can't criticize me or criticize my movement or criticize the Black Lives Matter Corporation. Black Americans were really upset. They were like, but look, we've had this traumatic event. It wasn't October 7th,

but it was George Floyd, right? And how dare you question anything after George Floyd was killed? Well, you're seeing the exact same narrative play out right now post-October 7th. How dare you question anything after October 7th? What about Jewish people? What about black people? What about anti-Semitism? What about racism? Post-George Floyd, they were going around calling everybody racist. Everybody was a collective guilt. Everyone was responsible for what happened to George Floyd, except for George Floyd, who overdosed, obviously. But that was the perspective. Same thing post-October 7th. Everybody is responsible. Everybody's anti-Semitic. How dare you question what we're going to do?

And in reality, what you had when it came to BLM was people that had become racial extremists accusing everybody else of being racist. And I'm seeing that right now. You see a small group of people who have become, in fact, racial extremists that are accusing everybody else of being anti-Semitic were simply remaining rational and thinking about things in the context of rationality and what

makes sense for America. So I'm not moved by their emotion whatsoever. Candace, I want to ask you about the free speech. Again, similarly a principle, one which was held up, I think rightfully by both of us and really watched as, like you said, during BLM, there were several attempts at cancellation. And free speech, at least ostensibly, was a bedrock principle of the new kind of conservative movement. But we've also seen some recent attempts, not just in your case, but at an institutional level to really go after, to silence and perhaps even use state power on this issue of Israel and of free speech. What's that been like for you watching that, possibly from some people who you used to make common cause with? Yeah, well, it goes back to what I was saying earlier about listening to Netanyahu say

that he's got his legs in different states and they can control speech and no one will be able to criticize Israel. People should go pursue that clip and listen to it because that's deranged. That is a person that has no respect for your country, but believes that your country has actually been subjugated to his country. And to the extent that any conservative would defend that or pretend that he didn't say it

or pretend that it's not problematic, let me tell you, you're not looking at someone who is a conservative. They're not a conservative whatsoever. And like I said, I have a very positive perspective on it because despite the attempted public hanging, the public lynching of Candace Owens, so to speak, it didn't work, right? It didn't work. And so that tells you that Americans are fed up. They are fed up with this. They need to get more creative if they want to take out

people for being America first. I don't know, maybe what's next for me is they're going to say 10 years ago, Candace looked at E. Jean Carroll funny. I don't know. I think they're going to have to move to their other favorite strategy of trying to take somebody out. But we're here to stay. The America first movement is here to stay. And we make no apologies, and not even in the face, whether it's Israel, Ukraine, Afghanistan, Iraq, we make no apologies for prioritizing our families, our country, and our Christian beliefs first for many of us. Candace, I want to ask you about Donald Trump. So previously supported Donald Trump. I think you've defended him. You've done one of the better jobs I've seen of defending him. But on the issue of Israel, how are you squaring some of the rhetoric that he's had on this conflict? We have, for example,

just a soundbite from one of his more recent interviews. I'd like to get your reaction and kind of how you're thinking about it as an America first conservative control. And we can go and play that, please. So number one, they have to finish the job. Israel has to finish that job. They have to finish it quickly, strongly, and they have to get back to life again because it's taking too long. They have to finish the job. You're saying go in, win, and finish. You gotta win.

Gotta win. Israel was the most powerful lobby in the country 15 years ago. Today between Tlaib and AOC and all of these people, what they're doing. Israel, they don't have the backing that they once had. You'll give it to them. Yeah, I have, I'm good. I'm good. But they don't have the backing. Even Schumer has become like a Palestinian.

Chuck Schumer, Jewish, always strong for Israel. He's become like a Palestinian. He's been called for elections in the middle of a war. Yeah. It's a very bad thing. It's a very war. Yeah, it's a very bad thing. It's a very sad thing. And it's a very dangerous thing. What do you make of that, Candace?

Yeah, it's interesting. I would also love to interview him on the topic of Israel. It'd be super fascinating. I think what he is rightfully hitting on, though, is that Israel is facing a PR crisis. There's no question about that. You've never heard people speaking about Israel in this manner. I mean, even in terms of me, I've never questioned anything when it came to Israel. And yet you're starting to see people ask questions and start to research. And I think partially it's because they've overplayed their hand. They just started

acting like bullies and like thugs. Same thing with BLM. I keep going back to that because they basically ran the BLM playbook. Like you will be subjugated to us. You will say what we want you to say. These are our talking points or we will ruin your lives. And that doesn't work long-term. What works long-term is actually standing on truth and standing on reason. And so he is correct to say that the Israel lobby, despite the fact that it is the most powerful

and that it, you know, AIPAC is the most powerful lobby. I think next to Big Pharma, Big Pharma might be a bit more powerful. So you'll have to fact check me on that. But they are two of the most powerful lobbies in DC. Despite all of that money, you are seeing that the people are not accepting that that should be a reason that we have to pledge our support to Israel. So they are going to have to shift gears. And in regards to what he's saying about Israel needs to end the war, as long as he's saying Israel, Israel, Israel needs to and not America, America, America needs to, I'm comfortable with that.

Interesting. So I guess I want to follow a little bit on this. I've seen, for example, reporting Miriam Adelson gave some $100 million to the Trump campaign, largely, I believe, in exchange for, not the Trump campaign, to a super PAC, in exchange for allowing Israeli governance over the West Bank. We've seen Trump adopt, I mean, frankly, some more pro-Israel rhetoric than President Biden. Just again, on the sticking of the America first kind of theme, how are you going to evaluate that in your support for Trump going forward? For me, if he gets into office, and I hope that he does, because the truth reality is we have between two candidates to choose from. And

obviously, Trump is the candidate that people should be voting for. But to the extent that he is going to use the office to further Israel interests above America, I'm not going to be happy with that. His base is not going to be happy with that. And his feet should be held to the fire over that. And not even just Israel, just Ukraine-ish interests. It doesn't matter. Any foreign country right now. America is not in a good enough situation to be helping any foreign countries right now with anything.

That is the reality. And so I would hope that he is not taking money from any individual with some implicit promise that he's going to do things for other countries. That's not the way it should work. I don't even think lobbying should be legal. Yeah, well, don't disagree certainly on that one. Sticking again on the Ukraine theme, what is your confidence level here? Last time around, I think we could say it's relatively mixed bag. Trump, in terms of, I was there, I covered the White House at the time. There were any neocons from John Bolton to occasionally listen to Keith Kellogg. This time around, what's your confidence level that he really would bring

the war in Ukraine to an end, that he would kind of retrench the United States from NATO interests, like in terms of expansion on Israel and in foreign influence? How are you feeling about the state of things right now for him? You know, I have heard about some conversations that he has had, and I hope I'm not wrong, but I do, I feel confident that when he gets back into office, he is going to be remarkably America first. I think he actually regrets some of the things in his first term. And largely that was because, I mean, in four years, you're kind of just playing catch up. He thought that he was going to get into office. The media was going to leave him alone. I mean, they kept the fire on him the entire time. And I think that he did sort of trust other

people around him to do things. And from what I'm hearing, he has some regret about that. And he would do things differently this time. I hope that what I'm hearing is correct. Obviously, we're not going to know until he assumes office, if they allow him to assume office and they don't come up with another pandemic. I think they're talking bird flu now. We're going to have to radically change elections. But this is a huge issue. We need actual American first people in control of America. That is the truth. And we haven't gotten that in a very long time. And there are tons of reasons for that. And I think namely, a lot of it seems to me to be fear. They seem to be fearful. Either they're crooks and they're

accepting money or they're fearful, which begs the question, how many of our congressmen are blackmailed? It's a huge question. Listening to Thomas Massey talk about the foreign influence, it's a huge wake-up call for Americans. We cannot go on like this. We cannot be a nation if we are not sovereign. Candace, who do you think Trump should pick as his vice president? Vivek Ramaswamy. Interesting. Okay. Why do you think it should be Vivek? Because I think that Vivek Ramaswamy is just one of the most brilliant minds

I've ever been around. And I think what he needs is not a person that is saying to him, oh, you know, there's so many documents being thrown at them. Take a look at this bill. Vivek Ramaswamy will do the work. He will read everything.

He will grasp the difficult concepts. And he will be able to present to Trump why what he is doing is or is not America first in a way that is clear. And that's what he needs. He needs a business partner, not someone that doesn't have that capacity. I think Vivek Ramaswamy is the way to go. And I'm nervous that if he picks somebody that is a neocon, so to speak, they're going to do everything they can to make sure that Trump is taken out

and that person becomes the president of the United States. He's got to pick someone who's unapologetically America first and not somebody that is afraid to say things boldly. Yeah, Tucker Carlson said he wouldn't vote for Trump if he picked Nikki Haley as vice president. I wouldn't either. Is that how you feel? Interesting. Yes. Also, what about Tom Cotton? What about Tom Cotton? What about Mike Pompeo? Any of those other folks? If they were to have a place in the Trump administration? He should not go within 10 feet of neocons. And if he's reading the room correctly and he's seeing where America, where the American conscience is, especially under the MAGA party, we want real, unapologetic America first.

Candace, what did you make of Mike Johnson and the passage of the Ukraine aid? I mean, allegedly did it at least with some Trump support. Were you disappointed in that? I am disappointed. Listen, my dream for president right now would be Thomas Massey. Okay, because it seems to me that he is the only person that does not make any concessions. And obviously, I understand that given Trump's position in terms of what he's trying to do, inevitably, we can preach and we can say, oh, here's what I would do.

You inevitably are going to make some concessions. But I think Thomas Massey has the correct perspective on the way things should be handled. So he would probably be my number two in terms of actually, I'd be happy with a big Ramaswamy or Thomas Massey in the VP role because these are individuals that I think they know do not care about which way the wind is blowing.

They are actually principled America first leaders. And it's disappointing. It's disappointing that money keeps being sent overseas, especially when you understand how difficult it has been for Americans suffering at the gas pump, suffering to put food on the table and constantly being lectured

about some higher moral aim. What about Ukraine's borders? I don't care. As a strong statement, I literally do not care about their borders. I don't care about Israel's borders. Stop asking me to care about somebody else's home before mine. I won't do it. Candace, tell us about your new show. You've rocketed to the top of the charts. It's doing pretty well, as I understand it. I'm pretty sure the media doesn't like it. Nobody's been reporting it. I've been there. I understand, too, what it's like to be the top. Nobody wants to acknowledge. What's it been like now that you've branched out on your

own and you have this new platform? It's been absolutely amazing. And I'm so grateful to everyone that made that early investment on locals.com or just come back and be independent. It's been amazing to be independent because there's no fear. You know what I mean? You actually get to decide what you want to talk about every single day and you get to get that immediate feedback from people and there's no constraints.

So there's no, well, we got to be careful here. We want to make sure we don't upset this person or we want to consider this. The energy has been amazing. The team is excited and we're motivated. Like I'm motivated in a way that I haven't been motivated in a long time. And so despite obviously the global trend of my exit

and the many things that were say, at the end of the day, I know that God wanted things to happen in just the way that it did happen. And I feel so much that God has been with me on this journey and on this path. And I'm just grateful, you know, to be number three overall on Spotify,

number five overall on Apple, and doing it truly on my own with my very, very small team around me is amazing. And also I want to say to be on the top of the charts with Tucker Carlson and Joe Rogan, that is a very strong statement to the establishment. Like us three there, that's a strong statement. It is letting you know that the American people don't care what you have to say.

They just want real conversations. They don't care if people disagree. They want to know that they are being brought different perspectives. They know when they're being lied to. Yeah, I mean, I think that's an excellent point. And that's one, obviously, that for some reason people don't pay attention as to what exactly people are yearning for. Just if you could speak a little bit more on that topic of freedom. I felt that really psychologically as well, no longer being attached to a larger organization, leaving for principles, and then launching our own thing that really blossomed into the platform that we have right now. I think a lot of people wonder from

the outside what it's like to work in a media environment where ostensibly you can say what you want, but there are a lot of outside pressures. What is it like to work in that system, if you could tell others about it? Yeah, I mean, what I would say, and obviously I've moved through different corporations, what I would just say is that if you are sitting at home or you're sitting at work and you are having that urge and you're thinking, should I take a chance on myself? Well, if I don't, there's this security. And what if this happens? If you feel that urge, you should do it.

And I think that for me, I just didn't feel that I could, I don't know, I guess, say everything that I wanted to say. And I'm not blaming that on anybody, but I am saying that I feel a difference now. And I feel very motivated by the response. I think people can sense my happiness. They can sense that psychological freedom. And there is a reason that people are responding to it in the way that they are responding to it. And so I want people to just be encouraged and to know that when you pursue truth,

you inevitably end up at God. And when you stand on the side of goodness and on the side of faith and on the side of God, you will be rewarded. That is my honest belief. And so I just want everyone to feel encouraged because in the end, we win. Truth wins in the end.

So be on the side of truth. Well said. Candice, where can people find out more? Well, if you guys, I'm on, I'm on YouTube and you can, I think we put on 250,000 subs in 60 days on YouTube, which is absolutely incredible. So you guys can find us on YouTube. We're on Spotify. We are on Apple at the top of the charts. And if you guys want to support our work, please find us on Locals.com. If you can give a gift monthly or annual, do it. And if you can't, just pray. I'm telling you, it is the prayers that kept me safe during that public lynching.

People all around the world have been praying for me. And your prayers are working. Well, there you go. Candice, thank you so much for taking the time. I really appreciate it. Anytime. I also want to address the Tonys. On a recent episode of Checking In with Michelle Williams,

I open up about feeling snubbed by the Tony Awards. Do I? I was never mad. I was disappointed because I had high hopes. To hear this and more on disappointment and protecting your peace, listen to Checking In with Michelle Williams from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is your girl T.S. Madison, and I'm coming to you loud, live, and

in color from the Outlaws Podcast. Let me tell you something. I've got the voice. My podcast, the one they never saw coming. Each week, I sit down with the culture creators and scroll stoppers. Tina knows. Lil Nas X. Will we ever see a dating show? My next ex. That's actually cute, though. And Chapel Rome. I was dropped in 2020, working the drive-thru, and here we are now. Listen, make sure you tell Beyonce. I'm going right on the phone and call her. Listen to Outlaws with T.S. Madison on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your

podcasts, honey. This Pride Month, we are not just celebrating. We're fighting back. I'm George M. Johnson, author of the most banned book in America. On my podcast, Fighting Words, I sit down with voices that spark resistance and inspire change. This year, I'm Jeff Pearl. Fighting Words is where courage meets conversation. Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Jeff Perlman.

And I'm Rick Jervis. We're journalists and hosts of the podcast Finding Sexy Sweat. At an internship in 1993, we roomed with Reggie Payne, aspiring reporter and rapper who went by Sexy Sweat. A couple years ago, we set out to find him. But in 2020, Reggie fell into a coma after police pinned him down, and he never woke up. But then I see, my son's not moving. So we started digging and uncovered city officials bent on protecting their own.

Listen to Finding Sexy Sweat coming June 19th on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I know a lot of cops. They get asked all the time, have you ever had to shoot your gun? Sometimes the answer is yes. But there's a company dedicated to a future where the answer will always be no. This is Absolute Season 1, Taser Incorporated. I get right back there and it's bad. Listen to Absolute Season 1, Taser Incorporated on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an iHeart Podcast.