Breaking Points with Krystal and Saagar - 8/6/25: New Epstein House Pics, Trump Greenlights Gaza Conquest, Panic Over Jobs Report & MORE!

Episode Date: August 6, 2025

Ryan and Emily discuss new Epstein house pics revealed, former Epstein jail inmate exposes falsified report, Trump panics over jobs report, Trump greenlights Gaza conquest, Republicans turn on Israel, Speaker goes full apocalypse in West Bank visit, Miss USA restraining order on GOP rep, Randy Fine opponent speaks out on Israel.   Marty Gottesfeld: https://martyg.substack.com/ Aaron Baker: https://aaron4fl6.com/   To become a Breaking Points Premium Member and watch/listen to the show AD FREE, uncut and 1 hour early visit: www.breakingpoints.comMerch Store: https://shop.breakingpoints.com/See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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What is not a norm is to allow it to prevent you from doing the things that you want to do, the things that you were meant to do. Listen to therapy for black girls on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Hey guys, Saga and Crystal here. Independent media just played a truly massive role

in this election, and we are so excited about what that means for the future of this show. This is the only place where you can find honest perspectives from the left and the right that simply does not exist anywhere else. So if that is something that's important to you, please go to breakingpoints.com, Become a member today, and you'll get access to our full shows, unedited, ad-free, and all put together for you every morning in your inbox.

We need your help to build the future of independent news media, and we hope to see you at breaking points.com. All right, good morning, and welcome to Breaking Points. How you doing, Emily? Doing great. How was your family reunion? It was lovely. Good time. Missed everybody here. All the grims in one place. And I had a bunch of people were like, is Ryan ever coming back? It's like, guys, it's one week. Come on. Well, you were in Ireland. People were probably like... That's true. I was an Ireland, never mind.

But here you are. I'm back. It's back and better than ever. Week and a half. We'll see. I'm back. We're not going to get a chance to cover the burgeoning went back and forth over the redistricting.

Which, if you want to check out the context of that, you can look at the segment that Asaga and I did yesterday. But essentially, the Texas is now asking the FBI to arrest the demonstration. Democrats who have fled to Illinois, no reason why, like, it's completely unclear what federal crime would be involved here. Meanwhile, Texas governor has gone to the Supreme Court to try to basically get the Democrats kicked out of elected office. They have left the state to deny a quorum so that Republicans can't use the quorum to redistrict the state in the middle of the 10-year period. California and New York are responding by saying, well,

If you're going to redistrict, then so are we. That's basically what's going. Yeah, it's another doom spiral, but not the first time this has happened. Before we get into the newsroom, I just have to say you took another trip to Club Slay. Yes, exactly. We're talking about this yesterday. Whenever you go on vacation with your daughters, you're probably going to come back with your nails done for free. They get bored.

It's a real upside, yes. Another thing we won't get to talk about real quickly. The Boeing strike begins today. Yeah, 3,200 Boeing workers striking in St. Louis. So that's one to keep an eye on, and we will definitely be keeping an eye on it here. Some really big updates in the Epstein case. It feels like we say that every single day, but yesterday the New York Times published some absolutely wild pictures from inside Jeffrey Epstein's Manhattan Townhouse.

We have details on Galane Maxwell right now, thinking about whether or not she wants that transcript that we know was, or the recording, that we know the Department of Justice could easily release as a transcript and are debating whether or not to do so. Galane Maxwell is saying, no, so we will dive in all of that. We have new Trump comments on everything as well. And Ryan, Martin Gottfeld is back with us. Yes, he served in the same prison where Epstein died. He read through the entire IG report that looked into the prison conditions and the cameras and the layout. And he found a bunch of different things that he believes or significant discrepancies that an eyewitness could be helpful to shed light on.

I also spoke to a prisoner or an inmate who served on the specific wing where Epstein was. So I'll talk about that with Goddisfeld. Yeah, and important news because subpoenas were issued yesterday. We'll talk about this for some people who might know what happened with the prison investigation. Now, Trump did a wild interview on CNBC yesterday and then wandered up to the roof of the White House, so we will break down his comments on the economy, on immigration, and we'll try to get to the bottom of why he was at the top of the White House. Also, news about the U.S. aid plan in Gaza, Donald Trump says he just now wants, or reports suggest, that he wants the United States basically to take over the aid process. So we will bring you updates on that front, and Ryan has, Ryan and I both actually have little monologues to do on the politics of Israel Ryan's.

Bring it back the radars. Yes, we're bringing back the radars. Ryan's is, just stay tuned. It involves cows and Boris Johnson. Mine's a wild ride. Yeah, it sure is. And then Ryan, more drop site reporting. Corey Mills is a up-and-coming Republican congressman who may not be so up-and-coming.

any more. It's a fascinating drop-site report on new details in his down spiral. So Roger Salenberger has been investigating Mills and the first piece for Dropside posted last night about, actually just wait for it. It's incredible. It is, it's really

something. Miss USA is involved in this one. You're like, I think that this guy's probably nuts. You're like, oh, I didn't know the half of it. Yeah. Or like the quarter of it. It just keeps every time you think you have a complete picture, No, you don't.

No, you don't. We don't right now. Some people lead some interesting lives. There's one conclusion you will draw from this. Yes. Now, finally, our second guest is going to be Aaron Baker, who is Randy Fiennes, Republican primary opponent down in Florida. So that race has garnered a lot of attention, particularly online, because Baker has come out

against Fines really atrocious posturing on the war in Gaza. Aaron Baker's going to join us to talk about the dynamics of that race and whether or not he can unseat, Randy Fine. And he's also kind of a diehard Israel supporter, too, which makes it interesting. We'll get into that because even as we're teeing up this segment, his candidacy is so new. I think it's fair to say it's kind of an open question to the extent that he remains in the same type of pro-Israel position. A lot of Republicans were five years ago. Be such a shame if Randy Fine was shown the door, wouldn't it? shown the door.

Yeah, but if he could get through it, ooh, should I not have said that? Ouch. Okay, maybe we'll cut that one. All right, let's dive in. Ryan, the New York Times published a hell of an Epstein story yesterday with images from inside his Manhattan townhouse

and also a letter from the one and only Woody Allen that was very bizarre, compiled as, this is, so the director, Woody Allen, the New York Times writes, described how the dinners at Epstein's house, this is a book for a 63rd birthday or a collection of letters that people were sent in for his 63rd birthday, according to New York Times.

You know what they say about the 63rd birthday? It's the letter birthday. Yeah, all your friends send you letters, even though they did that for your 50th birthday. So Alan described how dinners at Epstein's place reminded him of Dracula's Castle, quote, where Lagosie has three young female vampires who service the place.

He goes on, and this is again in a letter, letter to Epstein on the occasion of his 63rd birthday to describe one of the just most bizarre settings that you can imagine where there's Chinese food buffets. Did you read this letter, Ryan? I did not read the whole Woody Allen letter. It's typewritten. I mean, there's nothing like huge in it. It's just him talking about the meager portion sizes in the Dracula castle in a very coy, Woody Allen way. But the Times, of course, included in addition to this letter for Epstein's 63rd birthday, pictures from his credenza showing him with Pope John Paul II, Fidel Castro, Donald Trump,

and a picture actually with Trump where Melania has cropped out, Bill Clinton, Larry Summers, Elon Musk, Richard Branson. So the image that you see is basically Epstein flaunting all of the people. his famous wealthy friendships with different people. There's a picture with Epstein not in it. All of the pictures mostly are Epstein himself, and he's included in most of them, except for one that appears to be just Steve Bannon

and Woody Allen. It's extremely strange. Other pictures of Epstein's upstairs residence, UC surveillance cameras peeking down at the bed. First edition of Lolita? First edition of Lolita. But not really doing much at all to try to hide. his predilections.

Not at all. No. Not at all. To advertise them. Flotting them in front of Woody Allen, by the way, who has his own questions over his own head about. Whatever you think about what Woody Allen did, the public perception of Woody Allen, is settled. Right. Right.

Extremely weird stuff. Stuff, Tiger, also in the pictures. Just a really unsettling story from the New York Times. They're being very cagey about their sourcing on it. They won't say how they got these images. or even when they got the images or where they're from. We know that Woody Allen letter is from the 63rd birthday collection, but it's sort of an interesting image dump, Brian, to come out of another.

And The Times had a line that I liked that underlines why this is such a story that won't go away, which was nobody's been able to explain how he made his nine-figure income. There's no one else that I know of who has a nine-figure at worth that where you cannot begin to explain it no and so when people are like well I think that he may have had some connections to intel

into the intel world because how else do you accidentally land on a nine figure wealth and build a mansion with a bunch of cameras everywhere and then invite a bunch of powerful people over to do compromising things

like you say like give me something more logical, more obvious than that. Yeah, it's a conspiracy theory to believe it's something else. Yes, then we'll entertain the other theory. Give me something. Where do you get the money? The real conspiracy theory is that Les Wexner was having expert money management services

from Jeffrey Epstein. From this high school teacher. Yeah, but has, of course, never addressed that or anything at all. Yes, absolutely. Well, we also have Donald Trump responding to some questions here yesterday on Epstein, we can go ahead and roll A3. And I think he probably wants to make sure that, you know, people that should not be involved or aren't involved or not hurt by something that would be very, very unfortunate, very unfair

to a lot of people. Were you aware of, and did you personally approve the prison transfer for Galane Maxwell that your Justice Department? I didn't know about it at all. No. I read about it just like you did. And do you believe that she's a very uncommon thing? Do you believe that she's credible to be listening to?

Your Deputy Attorney General sat down with her recently? Well, he's, let me tell you, he's a very talented man. His name is Todd Blanche. She's a very legitimate person, very high, I just have very highly thought of person, respected by everybody. Okay, so that's Trump referring, obviously, to Deputy Attorney General Todd Blanche. She conducted those interviews with Galeen Maxwell over a two-day period where she was seen hauling a box away from the discussions back into her prison.

She is now in a lower security prison in Texas, which has been covered on the show as well. So Trump is saying, Ryan, that Blanche, and I think we actually all understand that this is true, there are, it's obviously going to be the case that in the quote Epstein files, whatever form they are, there will be names of people who are not implicated in child sex trafficking. He had one name in particular on his tongue. Can you imagine? Yeah, can you imagine? We don't want people like Donald Trump, whose name might be in there, being unfairly tarred by what we might release. So let's go ahead and not release anything.

And we know that his name was among a group of names that was being sort of actively redacted by Justice Department lawyers who were working around the clock, apparently, in the last several months to try to release something because Pam Bondi sort of realized this was. part of her portfolio, she would have to do something on it, but there were a lot of redactions being made. The problem is, Ryan, we don't have, I mean, we have so little information from the government that we can't trust that the government is redacting the names, and that's the most obvious point.

I mean, when can you ever trust that they're redacting names of people who are just innocent? Yeah, so that's a little bit of the issue is, you know, if you're asking for that benefit of the doubt, I don't think anybody's really in the mood to give it to you. No. But if you're the president, then you can do everything you can to withhold this stuff, as long as you possibly can. And so the DOJ did, under pressure, meet with Galane Maxwell to hear her out. They're just negotiating over obviously better prison conditions and a better prison. You know, what she can get and what she can give.

That conversation was recorded. You put up A4. there's now conversation about whether or not the Trump administration will release transcript of this hearing, or this meeting, which, as you said, Maxwell is objecting to. You can put up A5 saying, no way. Yep. Like, do not want to see this happen. Interesting if they're already going to be at odds with Maxwell.

Yes. Very, very interesting. And also interesting, I mean, obviously, that they are, according to CNN, debating whether or not to release this. So this is from CNN's reporting, the administration's handling of the Epstein case, as well as they need to craft a unified response, is expected to be a main focus of the dinner. Three sources familiar with the meeting told CNN. So this is apparently a meeting that's happening tonight at the vice president's mansion in D.C., so at the, was it, the Naval Observatory? The Naval Observatory, that's right. in Washington, and they're going to be, so this is CNN says, with the exception of Vance,

the White House considers those officials, the leaders of the administration's ongoing strategy regarding the Epstein files, two of the sources said. So we can expect Susie Wiles, Pam Bondi, Cash Patel, and Todd Blanche himself to be at this meeting. And CNN reports that have also been internal discussions about Blanche holding a press conference or doing a high-profile interview, possibly with popular podcaster Joe Rogan, because that went so well for Cash Patel. This is what's happening right now and is being debated behind the scenes. The Justice Department, according to CNN's reporting, is digitizing, transcribing, and redacting the interview materials. Those are related to Glenn Maxwell. And they're actually debating whether or not to

publicly release information from the Maxwell interview. There's over 10 hours of audio, according to a senior administration officials. And, quote, portions of that transcript could reveal sensitive details like victim names would also have to be redacted, according to one of the officials. Just a little additional tidbit here from CNN. They say one official told them. These are all unnamed officials, of course, that some of the conversation within the White House has focused on whether making the deals, the details from the interview public would bring the Epstein controversy back to the surface.

Many officials close to Trump believe the story has largely died down. What world are they living in, Ryan, where the story has largely died down? and you have both coverage in conservative media and the New York Times running, for example, new details and new images. It's kind of still across the board. And new polling out shows Trump down to 39% among men,

which is rock bottom maybe ever for him among men. And so the entire Barry Weiss kind of universe has been out saying, don't believe the podcast bros when they tell you that people care about Epstein that it's fine. Trump can weather this storm. Nobody actually cares about Epstein.

What's he down at 39% over? I mean, obviously there's a lot of other problems that Trump is facing right now. Headwinds all over the place. But this is, to say that he's at rock bottom among men, while this has been the dominant story, among, in the media that men listen to for the last month

is absurd. Yeah. Right. Yeah. I mean it's, I think it's true that some of the Russia collusion details have sucked up some oxygen in the media. And I mean, that's exactly, I mean, Trump at one point said it was this two weeks ago, the witch hunt you should be looking at when he was asked about Epstein is what happened to me during the Russia collusion investigation, of course, both these can be true at the same time.

But they're not wrong. Some of the oxygen has been sucked out of the room in conservative media. And I think, you know, in some cases, these stories are very important to cover. But that doesn't mean the story has faded to the background at all. I mean, you still see it. People are still talking about it. It's still high profile. And it would be a mistake, I think probably to assume that it's over and that it's

You know, this is the end of the line for Epstein. We can all just move on if they don't talk about it. Right. Yeah. Good luck with that. Ryan, we have Martin Gotsfeld. Yes. So we can bring him in... Former inmate who served in the MCC, where Epstein also serves.

And we're going to run through the IG report that was originally put out, which was published before we had the footage of the cameras in the MCC. So we're going to compare Martin's experience in there with the cameras, with the IG report. Let's get into it. Hey, everyone, it's Jay Chetty. And on today's episode of On Purpose, I'm joined by four-time Grand Slam champion, Naomi Osaka.

What I was dealing with at the time, feeling ashamed, going against everything an athlete stood for. After I pulled out of the French Open, I flew. Ranked as number one in the world in women's singles. A four-time Grand Slam tennis champion, Naomi Osaka. We would be constantly on the tennis court and I would watch other kids go to summer vacation. And I would always think, dang, like, I kind of want to be someone else. What was the feeling like when you won your first Grand Slam at the U.S. Open?

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why we believe. Listen to hoax on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. It's the biggest party of the summer. WWE SummerSlam is here, and wrestling with Freddie is all over it. We're talking wild matches, big surprises, and our boldest predictions yet.

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Listen to Wrestling with Freddy as part of the MyCultura Podcast Network. Find us on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Joining us back on the program is Martin Godesfeld, activist, journalist, and a former inmate at Metropolitan Correctional Center, which is the prison where Jeffrey Epstein infamously famously met his end. Marty, thanks for coming back. No problem. Thanks for having me. And so we wanted to have you back on because you were able to go through the full IG report and some of the subsequent media reporting about the IG report that looked into, the layout of MCC and the camera situation, which is quite crucial.

Like, if you talk to anybody who kind of casually follows this story, you know, they're familiar with this, the famous camera shot of Epstein's door, and then there's also this like little still footage of the desk where the officers sit. And then this controversy around this, you know, missing three minutes. at midnight or whenever they kind of reset the camera. But what you seem to have observed here is that, in fact, based on what you know about the layout of the prison and comparing it to what they have published here, there were potentially two ways to get directly to Epstein's cell that would not have been covered by

any recording cameras. And so the three-minute thing is actually kind of a distraction. Is that a fair summary, and then we can get into the details? I mean, I don't know that the three minutes is necessarily a distraction. I think it's potentially a red herring. That's fair to say, but yeah. All right, so let's start actually with one of the ones you found here. It's the, it's labeled 9th floor south.

And so we'll put this up on the screen. What do you see here in this, in this layout? So Epstein's cell is at one point. and then 9th floor south and yellow is highlighted. Okay, so this one, actually, the IG was just wrong, and CBS ran with this one as if it were correct, published it as if it were correct, and they just took it out of the IG's report and just put it out there. That's not actually the 9th floor layout in the lower right portion.

Right. So how do we know that? Right. Because I've been there. That's the 10th floor layout. So that's the 10th floor Sam's unit, and you can see the little curved desk there. that's where the monitors for the cameras are. And I used to get walked through here because there's a medical evaluation room in that unit. And I was on a hunger strike in the Ninth South shoe. And rather than bring me down to like the fourth, fifth floor or fifth floor or wherever the normal medical exam rooms were, they were lazy.

And they just brought me up the shoe to the 10th floor medical exam room. And so I used to walk by this desk and I saw the cameras working on this desk. And then you see the four little rooms there just to the stacked in a vertical row just to the left. of the yellow area, those are the attorney visiting rooms from the 10 South unit. And the ninth floor layout does not look like that. And those, that area in yellow, that's not even elevators in real life. What is that? Do you remember? No, it's some kind of like staff offices or it might even be the medical examiner, but I want to say the medical examiner was further, further down the hall. It was a longer, longer walk. But the big thing is that if you look at this

diagram and you assume there actually is a camera recording there and that those are actually, actually elevators, then you're left with an impression or you're likely left with the impression that an approach to Epstein's cell through the elevators would be covered by that camera. And the Justice Department has said that it has footage from this camera, but it has not released the footage from this camera. But because this is the 10th floor layout and the 9th floor layout is materially different, that's an incorrect impression. Right.

So let's, yeah, so let's move to the ninth floor layout, which appears elsewhere in your piece here. And we can put the image up that has the kind of yellow area that is suggesting, like, where the camera footage would be with Epstein's cell kind of off to the side of it. What's important to you about that layout? So in the, so the IG provided the original for this diagram. What they did not do was block out the main elevators versus the visitors elevators. And it's not inherently obvious that underneath, if you look above the main elevators, there's that little red camera, non-recording camera. That's covering a door simple.

So that's actually like the main entrance to the shoe or the one of the first of the two main entrances to the shoe. And then you go in past the shoe laundry office and then there's another door actually before you get to the main area. the shoe, and that's where they have written America's strongest shoe. That's where you see it. But you could follow this path, right, and then up the stairs to Epstein's tier. And the way they rendered the staircases here is also really misleading. You would think that the staircase on the left, you see how there's kind of two staircases leading up to like M tier, really. So this, let's put up the one that you labeled here, streaming but not recording camera and where you've drawn these kind of red lines. Yeah, so the way they

The way they've drawn these staircases is really misleading here. I corrected it in one of my diagrams, but it was a good amount of work to figure out the angles and everything. The left-hand staircase there, it looks like it's the one that leads up. It's actually leading down. That goes to the lower tier, M-tier. And it's the right-hand staircase that actually leads up to L-tier to where they say Epstein was. And so the camera has fairly good coverage of the left staircase that does not lead to Epstein. But it does not have good coverage of the right-hand staircase, which did.

So let's also then talk about this other discrepancy you point out of these other two discrepancies you point out that are important. There's number four in your article, no showers on shower day. And then number five is incorrect plumbing, which may sound to people like, oh, it's, you know, a small thing. They just got a little minor detail of the physical space incorrect. But you say, no, these are hugely significant discrepancies. tell us why. So in terms of the no showers thing, it ties into the so-called orange shape that ascends the stairs and what we see that the shoe workers doing.

The August night, the date of the footage, or the date the footage starts, right? It goes from the ninth into the 10th, right? The night of the 9th into the 10th. August 9th was a Friday, okay? If you're in a federal shoe, you only get three showers a week, okay? And in most of those shoes, you get those showers on Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays. Okay. And on those shower days, you get a change of clothes, right? That's the only change of clothes you get. So according to the IG's report, there were 72 prisoners in the shoe on that day. That's 72 sets of boxers, 72 sets of pants, 72 towels, 72 t-shirts, right? It's a full change of 72 things for 72 guys. And so if you look back at the one of the other diagrams we were just looking at where I should, show the shoe laundering office, right? And you examine the video like I did. I went in detail

through this video. I played it all. I played it at a slightly accelerated rate, but I played it all, and I took notes. A shoe worker goes off frame really near the beginning of that video and heads towards that shoe laundry office. And because it was shower day, right, they've got 72 sets of things to wash and dry. And I don't remember for sure if the washing machines are on this floor if they send up the laundry down, but there's presumably also 72 sets of clean laundry coming in that need to be folded and sorted and put on the shelf, right? And so this guy, he leaves the frame early in the night, and it is entirely plausible to me that he would still be doing his job, that he would be out of his cell working, that they would just ghost him

during the count, so they would count him as if he was in his cell, even though he's in this laundry area. And that, to me, seems the most likely explanation for the orange blur. So it would be an inmate doing the laundry? Inmate doing the laundry, goes back to his cell at 1042. The officer goes up the stairs, which we kind of see, locks him into his cell at night, and then comes back down the stairs, which we also see. It makes more sense than the IG's explanation that an officer was carrying clothing. I agree with the video expert CBS had.

It wouldn't look like that. That's most likely a person walking up there. But there's a very mundane reason for it. And this is something CBS would have known had they bothered to actually interview anyone, who's been in federal prison, been in a shoe in federal prison, or, you know, better yet, interviewed someone who's actually been in this particular shoe in federal prison, who knows where the laundry area is. Or something the Inspector General, if they were truly interested in an accurate report.

Oh, it's not even in my top five problems with the Inspector General report. And so then the question then becomes, you know, if, and also let's get to the LT here. Sure. Since you were on here last, I spoke with another inmate who actually, served specifically on the L-tier and said that yes, that's the only one that didn't have cameras in the cells. Yeah, I didn't know that. I mean, I was all over that shoe, but not on L-tier.

So, you know, it was news to me, but it jives with the pictures we have of Epstein cell. Because I went looking through those pictures. I know where the camera would be. And it's not there. Right. Right. So that means that they chose to put their most high-profile inmate. in a cell without a camera

and also in a cell that could be approached in apparently multiple directions by somebody who would not be recorded which itself is an interesting question and then you also get in your piece to the notion of the camera is not recording. They say that they were streaming but not recording and they didn't realize that until

you know right before. this situation. Yeah. Explain out why that, why it sounds to you to be implausible that it would, they'd go for this long without realizing the cameras were recording. Yeah. So according to the IG, uh, it took NCC 10 days to discover that the, the cameras weren't recording.

Okay. This facility houses that capacity 400-something, um, federal prisoners, okay? Um, every federal facility, including this one, um, has a department called the Special Investigative Supervisors, S-I-S, okay? They're like prison intelligence. It's like a twice the oxymoron, a military intelligence. But they take their jobs very seriously, and their primary tasks are internal investigations, handling snitches, managing gangs, and they're predicting contraband, okay?

And in a facility of the size of the MCC, they get a steady stream of kites, they're called. Like flying a kite. It's a term for when an inmate drops a note, like, ratting out a staff member or ratting out another prison, okay? There's going to be a steady stream of them in a facility this size. And no self-respecting SIS department could possibly go eight days or 10 days without reviewing recent camera footage. Because when they get one of these kites, right, it's going to include, like, a date and a time and a place for SIS to go check out, you know, so that they can, you know, build a case or bus somebody or whatever it is.

So in a facility of that size, I just, it's very, very unlikely SIS would go that long without reviewing footage. And then when they do discover the cameras aren't recording, which is two days, I think, before the night in question, they did something odd or they didn't do something. You know, I was in eight jails of the prisons, okay, across my seven and a half years as a quote unquote political prisoner. It was one bid, right, but I got transferred all over the place because no one likes a guy who has media connections and litigates and, you know, all that. So I got sent all over the place. And every time I was in a facility where they had a significant camera issue, not just like one camera out, but like a systematic thing, even for maintenance, right? They lock down the whole facility. It's just too much of a liability.

They can't have people walking around. We were locked down for like two or three days in Terre Haute, Indiana, when it was like 100 degrees out for camera work. Just to give it a day. That was planned, right? So they find out the cameras are down and they don't lock down the prison. And we know the prison's not locked down because we see in the video, we see shoe workers, you know, outside their cells just like going about their days, right? And like that wouldn't happen during a camera lockdown. Right.

Okay. Now, news today, this is A7, is that just yesterday, House Republicans, James Comer, subpoenaed Bill Clinton, Hillary Clinton, but also interestingly, Bill Barr, system, former Republicans, actually even Alberto Gonzalez, who was Attorney General when the Sweetheart deal with. struck with Epstein back during the Bush administration and Attorney General Jeff Sessions. So, Martin, do you have questions? I mean, Barr, I think, would be the big one. Obviously, he was Attorney General when everything that we're discussing right now happened and would have been privy to all kinds of information about what happened to. So are there questions that you think Bill Barr might have the answer to?

Like, are there particular things that you would recommend he be asked? I'm trying to remember if Barr was on record saying that he had personally reviewed the video. I think that he was. Okay. And assuming that he was on record saying he had personally reviewed the video, you know, he went forward with this same narrative that, you know, there was no way anyone could have gotten to Epstein's cell. And there's just no way reviewing that video for someone to stake that kind of a claim. So I would certainly ask him about that.

And then, you know, I'm not sure how familiar you guys are with the Dalton's school and the connection through Barr's family with the Dalton school, but I think that, you know, bears some scrutiny as well. And just sticking on that point, your point about the video, he described it as like a perfect storm of screw-ups that had happened. He said, I can understand people who immediately, whose minds went to the sort of worst-case scenario because it was a perfect storm of screw-ups. Those were his comments to the Associated Press back in November of 2019. So I guess, you know, on the, if he's saying that all of this was basically just accidental that led to Epstein's death.

This is all just happenstance. It just was this perfect storm of screw-ups. What's your perspective as somebody who's been there and sort of knows all of these things would have had to have been? Like, if that's true, tell us what that means, like the odds of all of these screw-ups happening, quote-unquote screw-ups. Yes, I think the odds are fairly low. The problem is, you know, Bill Barr's personal knowledge,

he can claim that he doesn't have like intimate understanding of the running of these facilities, right? That when he was attorney general, that he had a director of the Bureau of Prisons, you know, to whom he entrusted, you know, these matters and that these things generally don't rise, didn't rise to his level. So I don't know, like, what in particular, you could ask him, except again, if, you know, if he's on the record saying that he watched the video and, you know, putting forth that narrative, that this video is conclusive. Now, I think he's got a real problem. Yeah. All right. Well, Marty, thanks so much. We'll continue to follow your reporting on this.

Appreciate you joining us here. No problem, Ryan. Thanks again for having me. And your substack, martyg.substack.com. Yeah, and if you want to study these diagrams closer, go over to martyg. And we'll put your piece in the show notes. Yeah. Oh, thank you.

Thanks so much. Hey, everyone. It's Jay Chetty. and on today's episode of On Purpose, I'm joined by four-time Grand Slam champion, Naomi Osaka. What I was dealing with at the time, feeling ashamed, going against everything an athlete stood for.

After I pulled out of the French Open, I flew. Ranked as number one in the world in women's singles. A four-time Grand Slam tennis champion, Naomi Osaka. We would be constantly on the tennis court, and I would watch other kids go to summer vacation. And I would always think, dang, like, I kind of want to be someone else. What was the feeling like when you won your first Grand Slam at the U.S. Open? When I was growing up, I had dreams of playing Serena in my first Grand Slam final.

It felt like a dream came true. I was just reading comments with people saying that I didn't deserve to win. Listen to On Purpose with Jay Shetty on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Have you ever looked at a piece of abstract art or music or poetry and thought, that's just a bunch of pretentious nonsense? Well, that's exactly what two bored Australian soldiers set out to prove during World War II. When they pulled off what was either a bold literary hoax or a grand poetic experiment, publishing over a dozen intentionally bad but highly acclaimed works of expressionist poetry

under the name Earn Malley in an incident that caused a media firestorm and even a criminal trial. The Earn Malley episode made fools of believers and critics alike and still fascinates poetry lovers to this day. We break down the truth, the lies, and the poetry in between on hoax, a new podcast hosted by me, Lizzie Logan. And me, Dana Schwartz. Every episode, hoax explores an audacious fraud or ruse from history from forged artworks to the original fake news to try and answer why we believe. Listen to hoax on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. It's the biggest party of the summer. WWE SummerSlam is here and wrestling with Freddie is all over it.

We're talking wild matches, big surprises, and our boldest predictions yet. From celebrity showdowns to the chaos inside a steel cage, we're breaking down every match and calling who we think walks out on top. This card is loaded. From Cody Rhodes, John Sina, Ria Ripley, and Tiffy, just to name a few, this lineup is ready to tear down the house. We'll give you our unfiltered takes, honest debates, and you already know a ton of laughs along the way.

We're covering the upsets, the wild returns, and the championship moments nobody expects. We'll get into the matches that steal the show, the storylines that explode, and those, oh my God, did that just happen moments that make SummerSlam legendary? Don't miss it.

Listen to wrestling with Freddie as part of the MyCultura podcast network. Find us on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. President Trump called into CNBC yesterday talking to a pretty friendly audience, at least he expected to be a friendly audience. But got some interesting moments of pushback because, Ryan, he was on a tear yesterday. He was on one.

So just, I was going to say, bizarre. Somebody stocked up the Sudafet at the beginning of the month. So he's going to be riding high for like another week. Let's, without further ado, roll B-1. Where do you get the notion that it's rigged, or do you have any evidence, there? It is antiquated, but it's also. very political. And, you know, I had an election recently where I did very well, won every swing state, won the popular vote, won everything, all right? Days before the election, they put out

numbers that it was like the country was on fire. It was doing so well. And then they did a revision about two weeks later, and the revision was down by almost 900,000 jobs. You remember that? Those were benchmark numbers open. That happens. They do that. They do that twice a year, and it reconciles the monthly figures with, like, the overall numbers. And it was a big number. And obviously the numbers were rigged. The numbers were rigged. Biden wasn't doing well.

He was doing poorly. Perhaps with the tariffs, some businesses delayed some spending. Some consumers may have been less certain about the future. So maybe we're seeing a slight slowdown in labor, but you're going to get exactly what you want based on these numbers. Which ones do you believe? Do you not believe the revised numbers, either? It's not what I want. I don't want that.

I wanted it a year ago. I wanted it a long time ago. Jay Powell is highly political, and I think, you know, I call him too late. Jerome, too late Powell. He's too late. He's too late always. He always has been. So that's obviously with, again, pretty friendly audience and Joe Kernan still getting

pushed back on those points. Right, and I think the friendliness has limits when it comes to Wall Street here. Because the United States' reputation for accurate financial data is central to its role as the dominant financial services sector industry in the world. Like, we don't make anything, really. And because we're able to move money around, we skim off the top. like that's the that's that's basically what our economy does right now we can do that because we have a military and because we have a trusted financial system if you are an oligarch anywhere in the world and you put your money with Goldman or with jp morgan you expect that that money is

going to be there and that if they tell you that cds are paying 4.1 percent cds are paying 4.1 percent. And that if the economic forecasts are said by the United States government to be this, that they are that. That job losses are this. That is their best estimate. And their debt. The United States debt is what they say it is. Argentina for many years, for instance, Greece, a bunch of other countries, when they got into trouble, they would fudge their numbers. Argentina was just straight up like lying and hiding debt. And so then people stopped trusting the numbers that were coming out of Argentina. And so then they would cost Argentina more to borrow.

So Wall Street actually deeply cares about this and does not want Donald Trump to play around with this. That's a great point. It's core to their whole thing. Doug Henwood, your buddy. Talk to him yesterday, actually. There you go. He's a friend of mine, Marxist economist, you know, terrific. left-wing economist. He posted the other day, chiding the left, he said, with Trump about to try

to fake economic stats, it's not very helpful for leftists to say they were already cooked. They're not. I follow this stuff very closely and have for years. They're very good and assembled by civil servants who take their jobs very seriously. So that goes to Trump's point that it's very political. It's not. Anybody watching this show knows, I'm don't have a lot good to say about the United States or the United States government. Right? Good Lord. Is that fair?

Yeah, that's fair. That's fair. That might be our primary source of disagreement. Our bureaucrats in the civil service take their jobs very seriously, whether you're, whether Trump is in the White House or whether a Democrat is in the White House. They are doing their very best to put out the numbers. Now, what could have happened in the last six months that might make it more difficult for civil servants to have done a perfect job.

Can you think of anything? Not off the top of my head, Ryan. Well, if you're spending two of your days writing an email about what you did the last five days, if a bunch of people in your office are taking buyouts from Doge, a bunch of people who are on probation for whatever reason because they just moved there, they just got hired, they just filled a spot, if they got fired, well, now you don't have them. And if you had a hiring freeze, and now you can't, you know, it's tough to hire going into the election, then you have a hiring freeze that's running basically till now. That could, perhaps, make it a little bit trickier to do your job.

Like, I mean, let's just be honest like that. Of course it would. Is that why they had a large fluctuation in the numbers and this significant correction? Probably not. I think what your buddy over at CNBC was. saying has something to do with it. Trump is throwing the economy into chaos. Like in order for these month-to-month numbers to be as accurate as possible, they get survey data in. They are obviously not counting everything in the country. Think about it. Think about how you get

these numbers. It's surveys. You talk to 0.00% of businesses to try to get an idea of where things are heading, and then you compare that to your projections and to what's been happening in the past. But if tariffs are going wild, and if you're striking deals and then breaking deals, then what good are your projections and your past results? Now you have to just kind of go off your surveys. If you have fewer civil servants to collect surveys and to input the data, then you have less data. And if businesses are consumed by trying to figure out how they're going to weather this upcoming crisis created by this completely unpredictable economic environment, they're going to be less likely to return their surveys on time. Right. Like, this is all

just common sense. Nowhere in that, also think about this. Donald Trump is saying that this Biden appointed civil servant who, you know, got like 96 votes in the center or whatever, falsely claimed that the economy was doing better after Trump's tariff rollout and then only later revised it downward. So, like, why would a Biden person, let's say they want to hurt Trump, why would they falsely elevate the numbers for Trump after his tariff rollout? If they were a Biden person trying to hurt Trump, they would lower the numbers, not increase the numbers. Unless it was this 3D chess where they know that Trump is actually going to destroy the country with these tariffs and didn't want him to see the damage that he was already doing. so they wanted to bait him all the way in.

Like, that's the only remotely plausible, like, theory you could have here. And if that's the case, then Trump would have to be like, oh, maybe this whole thing is actually a bad idea. So anyway, that's why Wall Street is upset because this is their bread and butter. Yeah. Their bread is buttered by accurate data that people trust around the world. It's their literal, like, product.

Yeah. It's like actually what their... And it's all they have. Yeah. Think that guy has anything else he can do? Mm-hmm. No. Joe Cernan?

Yeah, no way. I mean, he can talk. You can talk on TV. Yeah, you can go work for the NFL-owned ESPN. Oh, yes, that's right. That, what, would that broke yesterday? Yes, the NFL's going to own 10% of ESPN, including some media outlets. Sounds fun.

So I'm actually going to skip ahead one element, because just to make Ryan's point about Trump and Wall Street, like the limits of Wall Street's favorability towards Trump. It's interesting because Trump's position on migrants, and maybe I'm even going to read too much into whatever he says here, and you can listen to it, but Trump's position on immigration seems to also depend on who's calling up and saying that too many of their workers in industry are getting deported. So this is B3.

But we're taking care of our farmers. We can't let our farmers not have anybody, you know, These people, you can't replace them very easily. You know, people that live in the inner city are not doing that work. They're just not doing that work. And they've tried, we've tried, everybody tried. They don't do it. These people do it naturally, naturally.

I said, what happens if they get it to a farmer the other day? What happens if they get a bad back? He said, they don't get a bad back, sir, because if they get a bad back, they die. I said, that's interesting. Make it that, Ryan? Insanely racist and gross and weird. Very weird. And it's always, it always amuses me that in Trump's imagination, everyone always calls

him sir, because his dad wanted people to call him sir. Oh, is that a thing? Yeah. And so, everybody who walks up to Trump's, according to Trump says, sir. So, anyway. That's why he thanks them for their attention to any given matter. It undermines the, you know, the right often says that. that right often rightly criticizes liberals when they defend immigration by saying,

who do you think cleans the toilets and cuts the lawn and picks the fruit, as if that is a defense of a multi-tier hierarchical system in which some people have no rights and are underpaid and exploited. And this completely undermines that attempt to criticize, that rightful criticism of, liberals to say that, well, actually, we need some easily exploitable rule. We need people because if people to make paid in cash. No rules whatsoever. So if they get hurt, they just die. Yeah. So that's what we need. And that is certainly one way to run an economy and is kind of the

way that we've been running it for a very long time. But that doesn't make it right. In fact, it's quite obviously when put in those stark terms so wrong. And this is not the first time he's rolled out that argument. Obviously, there's been reporting for the last several months that Brooke Rollins' secretary, agricultural secretary, had been getting calls from business owners and corporations. Stephen Miller's playing whack them all with these farmers, basically. And Stephen Miller is his entire position on immigration. He's from the Los Angeles area, was very much forged in that kind of class cauldron of, you know, went to fancy private school and everything.

And that was essential. If you see the kind of origin story of Stephen Miller from California as being important, which I think it is, he says he saw that up close and personal and saw the way people are exploited up close and personal. And it's undermined that entire, and if that's the predicate of your immigration policy, that this is the sort of elites relying on and under the, that is not the only predicate for Stephen Miller's immigration policy, to be clear. Right.

That's not what I'm saying, but it's part of it. Part of it is that part of the argument that people on the right make all the time, and I think it's a correct argument, is that this is sort of elites who want to rely on an underpaid, easily exploitable workforce. That's not an argument against immigration altogether, you know, if we were to debate the topic more deeply,

but it is an argument against the system of immigration that we have. And so Donald Trump repeatedly, Brooke Rollins apparently as well, making these arguments and making these carve-outs, I mean, the average sort of MAGA voter is way more in the substance on this with Stephen Miller than they are with, let's have carve-outs for people in hospitality because Donald Trump knows that industry really well. And you think about all of the objections and the right to this system, they involve people, for example, stealing social security numbers, which is a real thing. A lot of immigrant laborers have stolen social security numbers and thrust people whose social security numbers are stolen, whose identity is stolen, to complete uncertainty, because cartels sell those numbers. If you are against all of those different downstream consequences of our current system, Donald Trump is making an argument that those downstream consequences are fine because the cost-benefit

analysis of what would happen to these industries works out in favor of the rich business owner. So it just, I think everyone who watches this show knows that the right makes these arguments all of the time. Sauger is someone who makes these arguments very articulately. And it's just like, Trump is, when it's when it's not favorable, not on board with, those like sort of central tenets of the post-2016 Republican Party's approach to immigration. Right. Yeah. Trump just wants to live in a land of rhetoric, not. Not actually do anything. He means he's a construction guy.

He wants to be popular with people he wants to be popular with. And he wants to, yeah, he wants to demonize people and murders and rapists, but he doesn't actually want to do the thing. Stephen Miller wants to do the thing, and that's where the conflict comes in. Yeah, that's right. Because they're not designing anything new to replace it. Because he's right, that if you go and arrest everybody and throw them out, you actually that you do not have enough labor in the country absent.

You just don't have enough labor in the country to do the things that we need done. Like that, that is true. So that's a structural question. Well, and not right now, but Stephen Miller, and I mean, many people would respond by saying that's exactly why you need to have this process of job openings. And like there was a Wall Street Journal article

that a lot of people on the right were passing around a couple of weeks ago about how, deportations at a Nebraska, I want to say it was a meat packing plant, had happened and the like waiting room to apply for the job was full of residents of Nebraska after people were deported. And there are going to be pockets where we see examples like that, but it's not going to be even spread out. And that's what Trump is doing is not, so is that anyway. Yeah, that's good because like throughout American history, um, bosses have used migrant labor,

both internally inside the United States and also internationally to undermine labor unions and worker power. Like, that's a thing that we should be aware of. Steve and Chavez was completely against it for that reason. I could talk about the evolution over time on Chavez on that, but it was not uncommon as a position at all in the 60s for the pro-worker left. And Bernie Sanders up to, what, 15 years ago, somewhere around there on illegal and, immigration as well. So yeah, I think we will absolutely see pockets of examples like that Nebraska meatpacking factory and to the extent that helps people in the community. Yeah. And if

Democrats would just make their immigration focus bosses who exploit workers, they would then they'd be able to use those Nebraska examples to their credit. Be like, look, see, we told you. It's these, it's these greedy bosses. Exactly. And don't think that those bosses aren't complicit in the system. Don't think that those bosses aren't helping people find different ways to get around the citizenship or maybe they use E-Verify or whatever it is. They drive them in, yeah. Yeah, of course. And don't think that, yeah, they're not advertising in different ways. And also don't think that the people who are going to get those jobs at a Nebraska meat packing plant are all going to be white.

They're not. There will also probably be a lot of Black Americans, Hispanic Americans who were born here or legal residents here. or citizens, I should say, who get those jobs too. So, Ryan, it is interesting because what you were saying about Trump and the data and how Wall Street is, like, has some of the red lines, he's, what he chooses, the battles that he chooses are kind of interesting. Yeah.

And unpredictable. Yeah, yeah. So let's actually go ahead and put, speaking of Trump being unpredictable, this, for some reason that I still have actually not gotten to the bottom of, Maybe it was to look at the new Rose Garden construction or the new White House patio construction. Donald Trump went to the roof of the White House yesterday, capping what was a strange, what morning, early afternoon, and took questions. Let's roll B2 here.

What are you going to roll? Mr. President, what are you doing up there? Taking a little more. Come out and talk to us. It's good for your help. Are you going to move forward? Hello, Peter. You're looking good, Peter.

Are you going to move up here? I do. Something beautiful. What is that mean? What do you? It's the more ways to spend my money. Can you give us another friend? I will, that we'll show you.

It's just another way to spend my money for the country. Are you sitting there like a story? Anything I do is finance by me. Okay, if you were listening to that, what you missed is at one point, he does the contours of something with his hands. He, like, sort of makes a, I don't even know how you would describe it. It looks like he makes a, like, a, what, a circular, an orb. Yeah, it's with his hands.

So I guess right on our best assumption is that he is looking at more construction based on that. By the way, it is just such an undignified position for the reporters to be. shouting up at the president, why are you on the roof? What are you doing? Are you considering more construction, come down and talk to us? But that is where the pool found themselves yesterday, as Donald Trump took a trip up to the roof, would not say why, and proceeded to compliment.

Could have been Peter Alexander. I'm assuming it was Peter Ducey when he said, looking good, Peter, looking good. And that was how Donald Trump spent his Tuesday. And as he continues to flirt with ways to serve out additional terms, I find it a little extra discomforting the extent to which he's taking an interest in renovations to the White House. Like, he looks like he's planning on staying. He wants to stay.

That's actually a good point because he did. He made comments about that again yesterday, right? That he said something of the extent of like he probably won't run for a third term. So I will have to find that quote. But yeah, that's a, I hadn't thought about that. They did that. He's settling in. They did the patio pretty quickly.

I can't say I'm a big fan of it. Everything on the first floor. Yeah, the last thing I want to say about that clip is when, so I was in the pool of the day he toured the Fed. And I have this video of him descending the stairs, the temporary stairs that the construction workers put up. And he pauses and spends time, like, on a catwalk, just surveying. You can see his, like, the wheels turning in his head, surveying the construction itself. And, like, this is what he loves more than anything. shouldn't he just appoint himself

like the national, like head of the capital architecture group or whatever it is? Like that would probably be more fun for him as president than president. Yeah, it's what he wants to do be a figurehead. Yeah. Like a royal figure basically. It's the head

of state but it doesn't really have to be calling Randy Fine to get his vote on debt ceiling. Speaking of undignified. Yeah. That's an undignified position to find yourself in. Hey everyone, it's Jay Chetty, and on today's episode of On Purpose, I'm joined by four-time Grand Slam champion, Naomi Osaka. What I was dealing with at the time, feeling a shame, going against everything an athlete stood for.

After I pulled out of the French Open, I flew. Ranked as number one in the world in women's singles. A four-time Grand Slam tennis champion, Naomi Osaka. We would be constantly on the tennis court, and I would watch. other kids go to summer vacation and I always think, dang, like, I kind of want to be someone else. What was the feeling like when you won your first Grand Slam at the U.S. Open? When I was growing up, I had dreams of playing Serena in my first Grand Slam final. It felt like a dream came true. I was just reading comments of people saying that I didn't deserve to win.

Listen to On Purpose with Jay Shetty on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your costs. In 1920, a magazine article announced something incredible. Two young girls had photographed real fairies. But even more extraordinary than the magazine article's claim was the identity of the man who wrote the article, Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, the man who wrote Sherlock Holmes. Yes, the man who invented literature's most brilliant detective was fooled by two girls into thinking. fairies were real. How did they do it? And why does it seem like so many smart people keep falling for outlandish tricks? These are the questions we explore in hoax, a new podcast from me, Dana Schwartz, the host of Noble Blood. And me, Lizzie Logan, every episode will explore

one of the most audacious and ambitious tricks in history, from the fake Shakespeare's to balloon boys, and try to answer the question of why we believe what we believe. Listen to hoax on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. It's the biggest party of the summer. WWE SummerSlam is here, and wrestling with Freddie is all over it. We're talking wild matches, big surprises, and our boldest predictions yet. From celebrity showdowns to the chaos inside a steel cage, we're breaking down every match and calling who we think walks out on top. This card is loaded.

From Cody Rhodes, John Sina, Ria Ripley, and Tiffie, just a... the name a few, this lineup is ready to tear down the house. We'll give you our unfiltered takes, honest debates, and you already know a ton of laughs along the way. We're covering the upsets, the wild returns, and the championship moments nobody expects. We'll get into the matches that steal the show, the storylines that explode,

and those, oh my God, did that just happen, moments that make SummerSlam legendary. Don't miss it. Listen to Wrestling with Freddy as part of the MyCultura podcast network. Find us on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And speaking of Randy Fine, let's get into new updates from the Trump administration on their plans for aid distribution in Gaza. This is a report from Axios that Trump now plans to, quote unquote, take over the Gaza aid expert,

do the Gaza aid effort according to U.S. officials. This is a Barack Ravid story. Also, Mark Caputo is on it, whose sources in Trump world, good sources in Trump world. And Axis reports that Steve Whitkoff and Trump discuss plans. for the U.S. to significantly increase its role in providing humanitarian aid to Gaza in a meeting Monday evening at the White House, according to two officials and an Israeli official with knowledge of the issue. Trump is set to make remarks, I believe he's set to make remarks at the White House tonight, Ryan. So I expect, I think it's probably fair to expect that that's what this will be

in relation to. Yeah, and we've got a little bit of Trump teasing where he is on this now if we want a role C2. Would you support Israel reoccupying all of Gaza has been suggested by some Israeli officials? Well, I don't know what the suggestion is. I know that we are there now trying to get people fed. As you know, $60 million was given by the United States fairly recently to supply food

and a lot of food, frankly, for the people of Gaza that are obviously not doing too well with the food. And I know Israel is going to help us with that in terms of distribution and also money. We also have the Arab states are going to help us with that in terms of the money and possibly distribution. So that's what I'm focused on. As far as the rest of it, I really can't say that's going to be pretty much up to Israel. Yeah, and the aid, the mechanism of aid distribution is a central sticking point in negotiations, which are now stalled between Hamas and Israel,

with Hamas insisting that the previous aid distribution system run by the UN and a cohort of international aid organizations, which have 400 pre-existing aid sites around Gaza, be re-implemented. And their argument is that if you are concerned about the trucks getting looted as they come in, then you need to send in more than five or ten trucks a day. because these crowds just swarm if they know there's only five trucks it's just a game theory situation if you know there's only five trucks coming in

for the entire day for two million people then it's worth it to you to risk your life to try to be right next to the truck so that you can pull whatever you can off of it but if you know that there are a thousand trucks getting in a day and they're at these 400 different sites then you're just going to go to the site where you're assigned to and you're going to get the rations

that you're entitled to Like, that's, that's why we did not see these violent scenes, and we can roll now, C3, this VO. It's why we did not see violent scenes like this up until Israel took over aid distribution. This is a compilation just from yesterday that with another massacre outside of an aid site. You can hear the gunshots in the background. You can see this man kind of taking his final breath. deaths. And you have this kind of this inchoate vision. If you're watching this, there's the crystal blue water in the background of this gorgeous Mediterranean scene surrounded by absolute apocalypse. And it's person after person, we're trying to get aid. And then it finishes if, it finishes with, the man who was filming it realizes that he's filming his cousin and he starts calling out his cousin's

name at the at the very end there so this is this is the aid distribution system that Israel is defending in its negotiations with Hamas and that Trump says it's that we are going to continue to fund and and become involved with involved with just to not go back to the original system. Alon Levy, who used to be the Israel spokesperson before he was fired for getting in a fight with like a U.N. diplomat. This was after

October 7th. After October 7th. Yeah, yeah. Just this morning posted something I wanted to share, maybe we can add this in post. He shared a Andrew Fox, a reporter, they brought him to a distribution site, and

Alon is sharing this, Andrew Fox's report. Alon writes, just think about this for a second. This is what Alon says, as his own, he thinks this makes Israel sound good. He says, IDF uses warning shots to control crowds outside, i.e. firing over people's heads or at open ground to deter stampedes. Andrew Fox says he is, quote, deeply uncomfortable with live fire for crowd control, but there are, quote, few alternatives. Crowds are unruly, potentially infiltrated by Hamas. So according to Israel's own propaganda, they are firing live rounds over people's heads are at open ground to, quote, deter stampedes, which is, have you ever heard of shooting at a crowd to deter a stampede? Separately, they're saying that their crowds are, quote, potentially infiltrated by Hamas.

What on earth could that possibly mean? So you are shooting into a crowd. of unarmed Palestinians or sorry, sorry, over them and into the ground, you accidentally just keep killing them every single day by the dozens, but you're say you're not, they're just warning shots. But you're doing it because they're, quote, potentially infiltrated by Hamas. This is shared by Alon Levy. Potentially infiltrated. What are you talking about? It's just dishonest because the only correct approach then would be to do no aid. And that's what a lot of people, that's what a lot of Israeli officials would prefer. We are going to talk later. Which is basically what this ends up being. We are going to talk later about Randy Fine, for example, as just someone who is in lockstep with Netanyahu essentially saying Israel has no obligation to,

provide humanitarian assistance to the people in Gaza, children, women, civilians in Gaza. And that is, I think, the much more honest position as gross as it is. It is the honest position saying that these crowds may be infiltrated by Hamas renders, because anything could be infiltrated by Hamas. It is the government of that land. Right. Why do we bomb that school? Well, could have been infiltrated by Hamas. Why'd you bomb the hospital? Could have been infiltrated by Hamas. And it's true. And I mean, so David Petraeus had a piece on, he's talked about this on and off for the last couple of years, that there's a, there are different ways to isolate military and civilian populations when you go in. He talks about strategies that the U.S. used during the surge in Iraq that he sees as having been very successful where you isolate the military, the military threats in particular areas. And then you can go and do humanitarian assistance. to people outside of like high security compounds in, for example, Gaza. But the point is, if you want to still provide humanitarian aid

because you think it helps your position in the world or because you think it is the right thing to do because children are starving, then saying it might be infiltrated by Hamas completely renders it impossible. So the only honest thing then to say is we're just not doing it. We have no obligation to do it, let the kids starve. And there's a new Sky News fact check of the Minutes. history of health casualty figures that we were going to talk about now, but I actually think it would be better to talk about it after your monologue, because it relates to it and to some of the

pushback that you got. So let's move to your piece next. All right, join me on a hypothetical journey. The year is 2014, and you're at one of the conservative movement's many annual conferences. The rubber chicken has been served at a dinner honoring some think tanks, aging Cold War veteran as coffee is poured, conversation at your table turns to maybe President Obama's latest dust up with Benjamin Netanyahu. Everyone agrees Obama is undermining a key ally, but you, mainstream Hannity watching conservative disagree. What has been happening to innocent people and children in Gaza is horrific, you contend.

The United States should not be involved in fighting nuclear-armed Israel's war with Iran. So that would go over about as well as a call for 35 percent tariffs on Canada back in 2014. There's a reason that Pat Buchanan was not invited to this dinner, and Ron Paul has been mocked as a crank during the keynote. You'd probably already be in the parking lot or in a shouting match by the time you were tablemates tucked into their slices of mediocre cheesecake. Both quotes, though, are sourced directly from Representative Marjorie Taylor Green's X account this summer as the war in Gaza approaches its two-year mark and, quote, food supplies in Gaza have dwindled, per a headline in the Wall Street Journal. Now, this is all part of what I wrote for unheard this week, and I had some interesting response. The piece was headline that Israel is losing U.S. support. Israel is losing the U.S. front, is I believe, what the specific headline was.

But I wanted to go through a little bit of it here, because some of the numbers that we're getting from polling, combined with new comments from Marjorie Taylor Green, Steve Bannon, and others, I think really signal that we've reached a turning point on the right, and it might not show up in polling overall yet, and we're going to explain why, but it's coming for the Republican establishment. So Green, who is one of Donald Trump's staunchest supporters in Congress, absolutely shattered another Republican taboo on Monday by describing Israel's treatment of Palestinians as a, quote, quote, genocide, and Green is not alone. Steve Bannon, who's, of course, one of the most popular right-wing podcast hosts in America, recently argued, quote, Netanyahu's government is out of control. On Bannon show, this was very interesting. Former Blackwater CEO, Eric Prince, accused the Israeli military of intentionally targeting a Catholic church in Gaza.

We covered that here. And Prince declared, quote, the time of subsidizing the IDF as the American taxpayer must end. So after that church was hit, Daily Wire host, Michael Knowles, we've got. covered it here, lamented, quote, you're losing me, you're losing me, when you strike churches, the only church in Gaza, even if accidentally, but especially if not accidentally, you're losing me. At Turning Point USA's summer student conference, the group hosted a debate on the subject between Dave Smith and Josh Hammer that exposed the conservative movement's new divide. This is new. Smith, who has called Ron Paul, for example, the greatest living

American hero, was greeted with cheers for many attendees for criticisms of Israel, that would have fallen on deaf ears, if not hostile ears before the October 7th attacks. Randy Fine, perhaps Israel's most aggressive defender in the House of Representatives, to say the least, has a GOP primary challenger in Aaron Baker who's on the show today and who's been eagerly hammering fine for his comments on Gazans and his backing from the American Israel Public Affairs Committee, APAC. Quote, I do not support starving children, Baker posted, adding, I do not support punishing citizens for having the worst government in existence.

Tucker Carlson, another of the country's most popular broadcasters, released an episode of his podcast last Wednesday with John Mearsheimer that was titled The Palestinian Genocide and how the West has been deceived into supporting it. Carlson and his guests have been consistently critical of Netanyahu's government for months. That is even to address the outright anti-Semitism of other fringe voices with significant but not quite mainstream social media following. on the right as well. So, of course, the Hora in Gaza right now is not an apples-to-apples comparison with the

2014 war, but that's kind of the point here. Speaking of 2014, the Obama veterans over at Pod Save America are issuing their own mayacalpas from the left. Barack Obama signed a 10-year memorandum of understanding for a 3.3 billion a year, so we are part of the problem here, let's correct it. That was Tommy Veter talking last week on the show. He was under Obama as national security spokesman. And he went on to say, when the war ends, we're not going back to the pre-October 7th status quo.

He was then challenged on X by a critic who accused Vita of exacting a grudge against Netanyahu from the Obama years. But Vita replied by saying, or stay with me here, the entire world is horrified by what we're witnessing in Gaza, which is why this conversation is happening now and not back in 2015. For example, or basically, to put that shorter, things have changed. Now, you may or may not disagree with it, but it's obviously the perception of Veter. people on the right as well, in addition to the sort of establishment left. There's little insight to be gleaned about the right itself from Potsave America, but in this case, Vita is correct that revulsion at the humanitarian crisis in Gaza is just no longer limited to progressives.

This movement is nationwide, and it's so sweeping that it's dragging people on the right away from Israel, even as conservatives triple down on the support for the war. The rights divide is sharpening, but what's eroded since October 7th is basically the stigma of criticizing Israel. Gallup has been tracking public opinion on the Gaza war since its earliest weeks. On Tuesday, the firm released stark new findings. Quote, this was last Tuesday.

American's approval of Israel's military action in Gaza has fallen 10 percentage points since the prior measurement in September, and it is now at 32% the lowest reading since Gallup first asked the question in November 2020. Disapproval of the military action has now reached 60%.

That's from the report. Gallup survey found a stunning golf between Democrats and independents on one side and Republicans on the other. Get this. 71% of Republicans still approve of Israel's military action in Gaza. That number is only 25% among independents and 8% among Democrats.

For what it's worth, the same poll found that Trump's approval rating has declined 17 points among independents since the start of his second term and only 27% of his handling, approve right now of his handling of the conflict. That number means less to Republicans in red states and primary election, But in swing districts, battleground states, and nationwide races, it's hugely significant.

Independence split evenly between Trump and Harris last November, and that itself was actually a gain for Trump because he erased Democrats' nine-point advantage with independence in the 2020 election. Back in 2022, before the war, independence fell at 71% when it came to favorability for Israel, squarely between Republicans at 81% and Democrats at 63%. It's true that even in 2024, Israel ranked low among voters' priorities when choosing between candidates, but it's also true that Republicans counted for years on the reflexive support for the Israeli government, or they counted on receiving a reflexive support

for the Israeli government from moderates and from GOP faithfuls. Now the incentive structure has been transformed, and I think that's the most important point here. For the GOP, this fissure looks poised to get much worse. A Pew survey, the spring, found that Republicans under 50 are about as likely to have a negative view of Israel as a positive one. That is 50% to 48%. In 2022, though, they were much more likely, Pugh says,

to see Israel positively than negatively. 63 versus 35%. That is a shocking change, especially as younger generations begin to comprise more and more of the electorate. Bannon himself put it best when he told Politico last week, quote, it seems that for the under 30-year-old MAGA base, Israel has almost no support, he observed.

Bannon further believes it's not just young MAGA, but that Netanyahu's attempt, quote, to save himself politically by dragging America and deeper to another Middle East war has turned off a large swath of older MAGA diehards. Ryan, there are a couple of reasons for this. I mean, there are obvious reasons for this,

one of which is that the level, the scale of devastation and destruction in Gaza is different than what we saw in 2014, as horrible as it was before. This is a different scale. I think that's obviously the most important reason, but also the erosion of the power of gatekeepers. I was going through hypothetically

yesterday, actually with Doug Henwood, thinking, you know, in 2014, would Marjorie Taylor Green say that this is a genocide when it would absolutely black out her media mentions everywhere? She would never get on Fox again. She would be treated as a pariah. Now she can go on a war room. She can go on newsmax. She can go on social media and still get a huge response for saying that, even if people don't agree with it, whatever, that would have, in 2014, the incentive structure to come out in say that didn't exist. You would have been blacked out everywhere. So I think the erosion of the gatekeepers is a big one. And also, Gen Z, younger millennials, not really remembering the time before 9-11 and just remembering the stalemates of the global war and terror after 9-11 coming

up in that era. Those are the three big factors that I think right now go into it. And the politico-social gatekeepers still remain in effect. And I'm curious for the response that you've gotten to this piece since it was published in unheard. I think it's a good piece, and it lays out the situation quite well. But to me, it's straightforward. It's mild.

It's not offensive. It's like, this is, these are the facts. These is what the polls say. This is how people are responding to this. And yet, it seems like you're still getting blowback for it. Yeah. You talk a little bit about what the reaction It's been like?

People probably saw this play out in X, but yeah, there's... But probably not, like, because we don't, like, if you're not in particular ecosystems on Twitter, like, you just don't even see what's going on. Yeah, I mean, if you were, if you follow me closely for whatever reason, first of all, that's your mistake. Second of all, yeah, there was a little bit, I had a little bit of back and forth with a fairly close former colleague. It sucks. I mean, you've gone through this on the left with some of your own people. It's never fun, but what's sad for me, and we've been really open about it here,

and I feel like transparent, at least I've tried to be transparent as my own views on this have evolved. A lot of people who I trust and listen to, like I started basically on the other side of this. I started changing before October 7th, but afterwards, a lot of people just, I listened to everything that they said and read everything they wrote, and there's just nothing that's persuasive to me anymore, that we should be sort of reflexively supportive of Netanyahu and his decisions about how to prosecute this war. So it's just frustrating because you just keep hitting a brick wall, right? That it's, you're spending too much time with Ryan Grimm or whatever. It's like, well, one of the things you cited in the piece, and as soon as I saw it, I knew you'd get some backlash for it was data from the Gaza Ministry of Health.

And you didn't call it the Hamas-run Ministry of Health. Yes. Sure, we'll make people angry. Yes. But for people who are earnestly confused about this question and wonder, like, what they can trust and should they believe the numbers coming out of the Ministry of Health, we do have something for you here. So Sky News, which is as pro-Israel a British news outlet as you could possibly find, set out to fact-check the Ministry of Health's data. And I don't know what they expected they would find. Maybe they went into it in an unbiased way. It doesn't matter because to their credit, they published the results of their investigation. And what they did was smart. They took one day of deaths reported by the Ministry of Health.

And they were, was it, 400, 404, roughly, more than 400. 465 deaths reported for March 18th. Right, right. Brutal day. So they went and found that, they found obituaries by friends, or family, for 404 of those. So 92%. They found one of those 465 people listed with an invalid ID, and they found 26 with the wrong date of death. So they were able to confirm that those people had in fact died, but they had died on a different day. Okay. And so Sky News then concludes

quote, these numbers are real, anyone's still saying otherwise is not serious. And so you could do the same thing with any other day, and you would find the same thing. And it was a smart project by Sky News because... Or not, because your theory is that they'd probably set out to debunk. Right, maybe they did. Yeah, they might have. An editor might have been like, we're going to prove that these numbers are wrong. But if somebody dies on this planet, people loved that person. somebody loved that person or some buddies and because we live in a world of social media

they're going to share something about their memory and the life that they lived and their life that was cut short and so it stands the reason that if the Ministry of Health is announcing that these people died that you would be able to find some public records somewhere if you look hard enough and Sky News was able to find it back in octa we can put up C5 as well back in October, 2023, at the Intercept, where I was at the time, we did a similar thing where I had been talking to a Palestinian who lives in Texas, and he had told me in the first couple weeks of the attack that he had lost dozens of family members. And he started giving me names of the people in his family who had died. And then afterwards, the Ministry of Health

published a list of 6,000 plus people who had been killed in the first several weeks. And so what we were able to do is take those names and those ages and compare them to the Ministry of Health, and we found almost all of them on the list. And so what we were able to conclude there is that if this was just a list of fabricated names, which is what the accusation from Joe Biden, basically, was at the time, that they're, okay, this is a PDF with names on That doesn't prove anything. Statistically, it's impossible that Hamas would have added names that this person in Texas had given me also separately.

So from very early on, it was clear that, and also the U.S. State Department and others and U.N. and I've been using, relying on this Ministry of Health, which is jointly run, by the way, by Hamas and the Palestinian Authority. It's the only ministry in Gaza that is jointly run by the PA. Nobody ever, New York Times never says, or BBC never says the PA-run health ministry, which would be just as accurate. But the PA is basically a subcontractor to Israel. And so saying that the PA jointly runs it undermines what is the attempt there,

which is to cast doubt on the numbers. So if you're curious if these numbers can be trusted, the answer is that they can. And one final thing. I didn't even cite in the piece, just the piece was a little different than the monologue. I didn't even cite just the Gaza health ministry numbers. I said it, a Washington Post analysis of the Gaza Health Ministry numbers

that was setting out to verify names and agents and sort by names and ages. It is stunning and sweeping and just God-ranging. It's horrific. If you haven't scrolled through it, I think it's worth it. But that's actually what I cited. So I cited American media analyzing the Gaza health industry numbers, not even just the numbers itself, numbers themselves. And so the last thing you just want to say on this is it's one of those issues where I think because of tribalism and partisanship, polarization, whatever you want to call it, we end up reflectively saying, oh, okay, so Hamas is the government in Gaza. Hamas is evil.

Don't trust Hamas so these numbers can't be right like oh you're you're asking me to support numbers from Hamas and obviously I'm you know I think Israel's the good guy here and I'm not gonna if Israel's saying those numbers are overstating it and Hamas is telling me the numbers are undercounting it I'm gonna go with Israel that's how a lot of people would approach this on the right and then when you start peeling at the layers and you start poking them and you know looking more deeply you realize actually there are ways to test the accuracy of the numbers. And when you do it, it doesn't look good for people who claim that the Gaza Health Ministry is making it all up. In fact, there have been academic studies that show it may be an undercount.

Well, no doubt it is. You're right, because these are people that have shown up in medical stations, like hospitals or clinics or otherwise. The number of people under rubble, et cetera, is count. at this point, literally. Yeah, yep, absolutely. So, Ryan, here we're going to get some biblical knowledge from Ryan Grimm. All right. Bidal Hour with Ryan Grum.

Do a little red heifer apocalypse talk and Emily can fact check it all. All right, stick around for that. Hey, everyone, it's Jay Chetty. And on today's episode of On Purpose, I'm joined by four-time Grand Slam champion, Naomi Osaka. What I was dealing with at the time, feeling ashamed, going against everything. an athlete stood for. After I pulled out of the French Open, I flew. Ranked as number one in the world in women's singles.

A four-time Grand Slam tennis champion, Naomi Osaka. We would be constantly on the tennis court, and I would watch other kids go to summer vacation, and I would always think, dang, like, I kind of want to be someone else. What was the feeling like when you won your first grand slam at the U.S. Open? When I was growing up, I had a dream.

dreams of playing Serena in my first grand slam final. It felt like a dream came true. I was just reading comments with people saying that I didn't deserve to win. Listen to On Purpose with Jay Chetty on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Have you ever looked at a piece of abstract art or music or poetry and thought, that's just a bunch of pretentious nonsense? Well, that's exactly what two bored Australian soldiers set out to prove during World War II. When they pulled off what was either a bold literary hoax or a grand poetic experiment, publishing over a dozen intentionally bad but highly acclaimed works of expressionist poetry under the name Erne Malley in an incident that caused a media firestorm and even a criminal trial.

The Earn Malley episode made fools of believers and critics alike and still fascinates poetry lovers to this day. We break down the truth, the lies, and the poetry in between on Hoax, a new podcast hosted by me, Lizzie Logan, and me, Dana Schwartz. Every episode, hoax explores an audacious fraud or ruse from history, from forged artworks to the original fake news, to try and answer why we believe. Listen to Hoax on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. It's the biggest party of the summer. W.W.E. SummerSlam is here, and wrestling with Freddie is all over it. We're talking wild matches, big surprises, and our predictions yet. From celebrity showdowns to the chaos inside a steel cage, we're breaking down

every match and calling who we think walks out on top. This card is loaded. From Cody Rhodes, John Sina, Ria Ripley, and Tiffy, just to name a few, this lineup is ready to tear down the house. We'll give you our unfiltered takes, honest debates, and you already know a ton of laughs along the way. We're covering the upsets, the wild returns, and the championship moments nobody expects. We'll get into the matches that steal the show, the storylines that explode, and those oh my God, did that just happen moments that make SummerSlam legendary. Don't miss it. Listen to wrestling with Freddie as part of the MyCultura podcast network. Find us on the IHeart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Mike Johnson became the first house speaker to visit

the occupied West Bank this week with a trip that has attracted intense scrutiny. While there, he said that the mountains of Judea and Samaria, the settler's name for the West Bank, belonged to Israel, quote, by right, which not only contradicts international law, but also official U.S. policy. But behind the provocative rhetoric, the media so far has missed what appears to be the fundamentally biblical nature of the trip. So the story behind the trip involves a rabbi named Yitzhak Mamo, a Texas Christian named Byron Stinson, five red heifers, Apocalypse. Now, in September of 2022, Stinson shipped five red heifers to Tel Aviv from Texas. The cattle are part of end times prophecy and are required to be sacrificed to help usher in the

apocalypse. Hamas spokesman Abu Ubeda in marking the 100th day of the war that began on October 7th, even made reference to the red heifers as a provocation to be condemned since that, since part of the of the End Times prophecy involves destroying the Alaksa Mosque and rebuilding the Jewish temple that was destroyed 2,000 years ago. On February 1st, 23, Mike Johnson, according to a source with knowledge of the matter, invited Rabbi Mamo to Congress to speak to a group of evangelical Republicans about the heifers. Boris Johnson also happened to be there. And Johnson, that's Mike Johnson, and Mike Johnson introduced the rabbi who regaled the gathering with tales of the prophesied heifers. So the meeting was held on the same day as that year's national gathering for prayer and repentance,

a high-profile evangelical convening in Washington that Mike Johnson is heavily involved with. The next year, in 2024, both Stinson and Rabbi Mamo spoke at the gathering, telling their story again where Johnson was a central figure. So, Father, we bless you for granting us. the ability to have the office of the Consolidator-in-Chief represented by your man's servant,

Speaker Johnson, to be with us today and your different servants representing the entire earth for a cry of repentance. So here's Byron Stinson at that event. You're going to be extremely excited of what you're about to hear now

as we go into this portion on Israel. I have two good friends out here with me, Byron Stinson and Rabbi Isak Mamo. And I'm going to have them to start immediately by telling the story of the red heifers. These are men who are at the epicenter of what's happening with the red heifers. So, Byron, so we start with you in this story? Byron is an evangelical Christian from Texas. Saki Mamo is an Orthodox Jew from Jerusalem. Byron, do we start with you?

Yes, sir. Okay, go ahead. everybody. How are you? I have really good news today, and I'm so happy to be here. Could I have that first slide, please? Yep. If we're going to the next slide, what we see here are the red heifers, let's go back one, are the red heifers necessary for the Messiah to come? Well, let me ask you something. When Israel was scattered for 2,000 years in the land, was it necessary that Israel, Judah, the tribe of Judah, the lion would return to the land. Was that necessary? Is it necessary that on the temple mountain of God, that there be a temple that we worship him there, as it says

in Micah Four, is that necessary that we build the land? So the first step on the red heifers is that we are going to move towards building that temple. This is the first step, and it has to happen. But my friends, I want to tell you, all of you in the nations, you need to know something. had a plan he he put his people judah into the nations to suffer because they didn't obey him here we are today we're seeing today we're doing the same thing but thankfully we have leaders in judah that love us they've reached across to us and they want to help lead us and they're reading their word and they're reading their bible and in the bible it says find a red heifer so they called me and i didn't go get find a red heifer for me, I found the red heifer for every one of you. Because the fathers of

faith said, speak to the children in the lands and bring us a red heifer so that we might do this ceremony. So just to underscore, this is the crew here that Mike Johnson brought to the capital. And here's Rabbi Mamo. This part that has not been discussed publicly in any venue, we have to have land, and that land has to be at a certain elevation. in a certain location, and what is that? By Numbers 19, again, we have to read the Bible, we have to read the Torah, and to see. It's written that it's had to be at the front of the Holy of the Holy.

So at the Tabernacle Tent time, Moses, it was easy for him. He had a tent, and he just finds the door. Today, as I mentioned before, we know where is the place of the Holy of the Holy. is on the dome of the rock. Okay, this is a view from Mount of Olive, a big cemetery, Jewish cemetery, by the tradition who buried in Mount of Olive

will be the first one that will wake up at the redemption time. But you can see the dome of the rock. So we have to be in a place that we can see the holy of the holy. And actually it's had to be the same heights that we can be at the same level of the temple. However, buying land there is impossible because if an Arab Muslim sells to a Jew,

he or she gets killed. So that's hardly an option. But somehow, God supernaturally helped you buy what? Piece of land. Don't ask me why. don't ask you how and specific don't ask me why I succeed I don't know but we a lot of I just say a miracle okay not any other explanation actually 12 years ago you said maybe we built the Red Angus Steakhouse up there when we were

getting it remember that so so we succeed to bought a little piece of land one which means quarter of an acre acre and it's as you can see here this is a photo from the mountain okay so it's at the same level of the temple it's the front of the holy of the holy place so we have the cows we have the land we are ready the Israeli government approved you to bring your five pets what you never kept in your front yard like most people do. As he says, they're in Shiloh. So what biblical town in the West Bank

did Mike Johnson visit? Well, let's take a look. Who is that American tourist in the blue shirt and the khakis there? Well, there he is. Speaker of the House, Mike Johnson. Where is Mike Johnson? Where is that crowd?

Shiloh. Checking out the heifers? Got to look at the heifers. Got to check out your heifers. When he said, your pets, by the way. When he said they allowed you to bring your pets, there is an export ban on cattle from the United States to Israel. So what they did is they said they're pets. They classified them as pets. They flew them on a Boeing 777. And it landed and they got them there. So this is the speaker of the House of Representatives. Intimately,

involved in this red heifer prophecy. What are we even supposed to do with this? It's supposed to be a news show, but this is crazy. Well, no, I mean, this is important because it gets to exactly what the motivations are, and it's where, of course, there is a kind of overlap in the Venn diagram between some Orthodox Jews and some evangelical Christians. We've talked to about this a little bit over the years. I'm an evangelical Christian. This is what you call pre-millennial dispensationalism. If you're an evangelical Christian, it's, you know, if you remember, if you're my age. Huckabee is one of these. The ambassador. They all play, you know, it's interesting. So Huckabee has played really careful with it. You can, you can kind of read into what he said,

and it's the same thing with Mike Johnson. You can kind of read into the groups that he speaks to, the people that he speaks to, and the way that he talks about having a biblical mandate, you know, that God will bless those who bless the nation of Israel. I think that's a direct quote that Mike Johnson has recited before. And this is new reporting that it was Mike Johnson that introduced this rabbi at this private event. Yes. So the significance of that seems to be that yes, Mike Johnson is one of what I would say in the U.S. is a dwindling number of evangelical Christians who are dispensationalists. It was really popular, actually around the time of the millennial. No surprise. And the left behind books fear my age. You'll remember those

were out at the time. But when you played that video of Hamas on the 100 day. Johnson, by the way, was not speaker yet when he invited, when he first invited these two figures to the capital, Stinson and Mamo. But which is I think is important. It's extremely important. But he was when they came back for that gathering. Anyway, go ahead. So you were talking about the Abu Obeda. Well, yeah. So that video is really, really important because whether or not you take Hamas their word, what is true is that provocations, which is, I know that that's the connotation of that as pejorative, but provocations at Alaksa, Dome of the Rock, Temple Mount, from some Israeli officials, and with the sort of sanctioning of

some major people in this space, you're not supposed to pray. There's a huge debate as to whether you're supposed to pray when you go up there. You're not supposed to, and a lot of people say that it's actually sacrilegious and everything, but there are others who push to be able to do it. And that is part of, I mean, the Hamas called October 7th Al-Aqsa flood after the mosque, al-Axa, on the temple mount. And so, citing of the heifers, as they call it a provocation, I think what we're seeing, whether or not you believe that this is the end times, the third temple movement among Jews is meant to follow biblical mandates to bring about the Messiah.

The third temple movement among evangelical Christians is because they believe that this will, this invites in the end of days, that this creates room for, Christ to return and conquer evil. And so setting the stage in very specific ways, I mean, I recommend people go to the Temple Institute's website and see the preparations beyond the Red Heifers, the preparations for very specific things that need to happen from their perspective in order to usher in this period. I mean, this is, if you go to their website, you can see like just the menorah. How do we find that? I think it's just Google Temple Institute and click on their website.

It's really, like, you saw Numbers 19 illuminated behind some of those speakers. You can go and you can read Numbers. That is the specific verse that talks about the specification of the Red Heifers. The Red Heifers story is fascinating because... Some of those heifers have already been ruled out, apparently? Yes, because they can't have, like, a white hair. No white hairs. Yeah, I mean, so this is why I think they're actually even sending frozen embryos.

someone would have to like fact-track that, but so that you always have on hand. No, I'm serious. I'm serious. But this is, the politics of this, think about that. If you're putting all of the effort into the heifers, obviously, you know this because you just reported this out. But it's like incredibly consequential that you have this, Mike Johnson is one of dwindling number of evangelicals, as I said in the United States, that are sort of premillennial

dispensationalists. but in Israel, this is growing. This is a movement that's getting bigger and bigger, according to the reporting. So things are heating up. The heifers can never have been under the yoke, according to numbers. Yeah, never under the yoke. They have to have a chill life. Does an embryo inside a fridge count as being under...

Is that a yoke? I don't know. I think those embryos don't count. Oh, my gosh. So if y'all do this whole thing and the Messiah doesn't come, it's because the embryo was actually under the yoke. Well, just the final, but then it's disqualified. Well, I guess that's what you're saying.

The sacrificing of the heifer. The Lord is the judge. So you have to, they've actually already. We're just guessing at what his requirements are based on Numbers 19. So, yeah. Well, in Numbers 19, it's God saying this to Moses and Aaron. But God left a little room for interpretation. Well, we didn't know where the yoke would go, yes, technologically.

But basically, the point here is that if you believe, like, after what was it, the, it was a 1967 war, there was an opportunity to blow up the temple. And Israel decided, I'm sorry, to blow up Al-Axa and rebuild the third temple, blow up dome of the rock and rebuild the third temple. They did not do that. So the politics of this are really important, because if this is a growing constituency in political Israel, then you may be approaching a point where there is destruction of a sacred site for Muslims, which was built on the single most important site in all of Judaism.

So that's basically, I mean, everybody knows this, but that is the heart of the conflict between the two parties here is this contested territory, because it is very important in Islam as well. It's where they believe that Muhammad went on his ascension to heaven. And obviously, in a lot of different streams of, or a lot of different streams of thought in Islam, Jerusalem is important for their own eschatology. So if you then have a growing constituency for just actually physically fighting over the temple itself, over the temple mount itself, over that land itself, and a rebuilding of a third temple,

the consequences of that are enormous. Yeah. And I just want to underscore it. The speaker of the House of Representatives is at the center of this. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. anyway yeah although again he's like very gen x evangelical um you know there's still people who think like this but it's definitely it was much bigger in like the 90s than it is now if that if that's any

comfort okay take that all right well thanks Ryan this has been your ryan grim Bible hour there we go all right so speaking of devout Corey Mills let's do it It's Jay Chetty, and on today's episode of On Purpose, I'm joined by four-time Grand Slam champion, Naomi Osaka. What I was dealing with at the time, feeling ashamed, going against everything an athlete stood for. After I pulled out of the French Open, I flew. Ranked as number one in the world in women's singles. A four-time Grand Slam tennis champion, Naomi Osaka. We would be constantly on the tennis court, and I would watch other kids go to.

to summer vacation, and I would always think, dang, like, I kind of want to be someone else. What was the feeling like when you won your first Grand Slam at the U.S. Open? When I was growing up, I had dreams of playing Serena in my first Grand Slam final. It felt like a dream came true. I was just reading comments with people saying that I didn't deserve to win. Listen to On Purpose with Jay Shetty on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. In 1920, a magazine article announced something incredible. Two young girls had photographed real fairies.

But even more extraordinary than the magazine article's claim was the identity of the man who wrote the article, Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, the man who wrote Sherlock Holmes. Yes, the man who invented literature's most brilliant detective was fooled by two girls into thinking fairies were real. How did they do it? And why does it seem like so many smart people keep falling for outlandish tricks? These are the questions we explore in Hoax, a new podcast from me, Dana Schwartz, the host of Noble Blood.

And me, Lizzie Logan. Every episode will explore one of the most audacious and ambitious tricks in history, from the fake Shakespeare's to Balloon Boys, and try to answer the question of why we believe what we believe. Listen to hoax on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. It's the biggest party of the summer. WWE SummerSlam is here, and wrestling with Freddie is all over it. We're talking wild matches, big surprises, and our boldest predictions yet. From celebrity showdowns to the chaos inside a steel cage, we're breaking down every match

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Listen to Wrestling with Freddie as part of the MyCultura Podcast Network. Find us on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. We have new reporting over at DropSight News by Roger Salenberger on Representative Corey Mills. We can put this first element up on the screen. Solenberger has been investigating Mills for quite some time, and this is the first in a series of pieces that we're going to be seeing. This one broke because Miss United States filed a restraining order yesterday against Mills. Now, the backstory here involves a story that you may remember from previous. If you recall, there was a Republican congressman, and it was Mills, who was accused by his

living girlfriend in southwest Washington, D.C. of domestic violence. She filed a police report. She later, as often happens in cases like this, recanted, and it was a very convoluted story about how she had bruises, but it wasn't his fault, and on and on. So if you remember that story, The fallout from that in Mills' personal life, according to Lindsay Langston, was that she discovered that he had a girlfriend in Washington, D.C. She was his girlfriend in Smyrna Beach. One way to find out. At the time. She asked Corey Mills about this relationship, and Mills, according to Langston, said, and a lot of this reporting from Sondberger is based on text messages and videos that he's saying.

sent to her. So we don't just have to go by her word here. By the way, she is a Florida Republican State Committee woman as well as being the reigning Miss USA. He told her the news made the whole thing up that he never had a girlfriend there, that this was a completely fabricated event, not just that he didn't hit her, but that the whole thing doesn't exist. She then, not being a moron, finds a bunch of social media posts with this woman and him. They're just like, okay, like, this is clearly, it seems to be the case. This happened. Like, you're lying here.

So then they break up, and that's where it gets really bad. And Corey Mills sends her an intense number of threats, which she then reported to the police. So there's a police report that she filed in July, followed by this restraining order. And according to the police report and according to Rogers reporting, she shared text messages of all of these threats, threatening her, threatening anybody that she may date in the future. If you want the sort of details, I recommend you go read the drop site piece. But I think what you'll come away with, and what I came away with from it, was I understood Corey Mills to be quite something, to put it, delicately. I was stunned. Yeah.

I was like, this guy is, this guy's beyond what your baseline assumed level of crazy. Well, it's a, I mean, on top of all of what you just explained. Corey Mills, it should be noted, was at least previously seen as a real up-and-coming star among members of... Right. Republican House of Representative, the conference, he was seen as like a big deal, somebody who would have a big future in Republican politics. And so this is a fairly significant development because I think a lot of the buzz around him since Sullenberger started doing his reporting on Mills has dissipated. This has been a saga that's played out over months now with the reporting. But Ryan, the other thing that's worth mentioning is I believe the girlfriend who filed then retracted her comments, who made and then retracted her comments about being abused,

is Iranian American, right, and works with an Iranian activist group. Mills is an arms dealer, right? He's also not fully divested. If I'm remembering this correctly, he is not fully divested from his defense. contracting work? Right. No, not at all. Okay.

He's still heavily invested in arms dealing. So on top of this being clearly an affair, and I think the abuse allegations being very credible, though she did retract them. I mean, I've covered a lot of cases like this. I can't say for sure what happened. It looks to me more likely than not that they're accurate, but of course, can't say that. I can't say that with certainty because she's taking them away. Right. She said she got the bruises days earlier, someone fell at the airport, like just stuff that wasn't even trying to be credible.

Right. It didn't check out. And again, she may genuinely just be sincerely dedicated to the cause that she's advocating for. But when you put all of these different parts together with him being a defense contractor, a member of Congress, who's not divested from that business, being in this ostensibly two-time in relationship with somebody who works for an Iranian-American activist group. group, those things are likely not a coincidence. There's something happening behind the scenes. And in the restraining order, she says, like, she blocked him all over the place on Instagram, blocked his number. He would call from the Capitol. Presumably it was him calling from the Capitol.

She didn't pick up the phone, but she showed a screenshot of the call from the Capitol. He would create new Instagram accounts to message her with these various with these various threats. And Roger has also spoken with a number of three other former romantic partners who shared anecdotes very similar to the ones that have been public, which, like I said, family program, we don't need to get into any of it now. And so there's a lot more to this story and to Congressman Mills. And we look forward to rolling that out in the not too distant future.

Well, a lot more. So the Blaze has already picked up your story, it looks like. But so the Blaze has done a lot of reporting. I don't know if they'd give you credit or not or if they got this individually. But the Blaze has done a lot of reporting from the right on Corey Mills, which is quite interesting. Corey Mills is his wife. So by the way, he's married. He's been separated from his wife since I believe.

what, 2022. And on top of that, his wife is, I believe, Iraqi. I think she's actually from Iraq. So he's, there's just so much strange stuff happening in this story. That could be, like, compliment reading Rogers, Salenberger's piece and Dropside with the reporting in the blaze because there's a lot of it. They had a really long story a few months back.

that was fascinating on this question. So there's definitely something more happening, wouldn't you say, Ryan? I mean, you've reported on this type of thing way more than I have. It just seemed like there are a lot of unanswered questions about what maybe is behind the, even behind the things that have been disclosed publicly. Oh, yes. Yes, there's a lot more to this. The arms trafficking, the business relationships, the, yeah, yeah.

There's a lot going on here. This is the lead of a blaze story from earlier this summer. Corey Mills, the Florida Republican who has in recent months faced allegations of stolen valor, undergoing a secret Islamic conversion, holding weapons contracts with the federal government when serving in Congress. And domestic of violence appears to have leapfrogged to yet another scandal this time over a luxury apartment in Washington, D.C., and they are citing the Solemberger reporting here. So just... Go where, like, he didn't pay rent for like $80,000 worth of rent.

And like, he has millions of dollars of corporate debt tied to this arms trafficking. Yeah, it's, and he's actively voting. One of the key swing votes in a divided Congress. Yep. Wow. On matters directly, that directly implicate his arms business. Great point. So, good reporting. And thanks for bringing this story to us. I'm going to have more. All right. Let's move on to Aaron Baker.

Speaking of Florida, speaking of Florida men, we're going to talk a little bit about Randy Fine with his Republican primary opponent Aaron Baker. The primary is coming up in over a year at this point, but Baker is gaining traction online by speaking out against Randy Fine's odious comments on the Palestinian people, people in Gaza. So let's bring in Aaron now. We are joined now by Aaron Baker. He is a candidate for Florida's 6th District in the primary race against

representative, Republican representative Randy Fine. Aaron, thank you for being here. Thank you. Pleasure to be here. Okay, so Randy Fine was elected in April. Your primary is about a year away still. Randy Fine obviously has a big cash advantage. You ran against him earlier this year and he had lots of money and basically ended up with I think like 83% of the vote in the primary, something to that level in a red district. So can you tell us a little bit about why you initially decided to run for that seat, that fine ended up winning earlier this year, and then why you're getting back in and running again? I had a group of Republicans from the 6th District approached me and explained to me that we

had to have someone that has morals run in the Florida 6th Congressional District. There is a very big contingent of people that do not agree with the rhetoric, do not agree with the basic principles that Mr. Fine represents, and I certainly don't believe that he represents this congressional district very well, if at all. Let's play a little flavor if people are somehow living under Iraq and haven't had the joy of being confronted by Randy Fein's rhetoric. Put F1, just roll that one. It's not Israel's job to feed and clothe and bathe and arm the Gossans until they're strong enough to conduct another October 7th. So that's my simple point. There are people starving in Gaza. It's called the hostages that are still alive.

And they need to be released and they need to be released now. And we can put up F2 where he said, you know, release the hostages until then starve away. And then the weird parenthetical that it actually they're not starving, but they should. Any day of the week, any hour of the day, pretty much, you can find Randy Fine posting something diabolically genocidal on his on his account. And he's in Israel right now, we should say. He's in Israel as we speak. Can you talk a little bit more about what the reaction has been in his district? and, I mean, isn't this kind of what people expected, like, this is who he was before?

Like, why would, why now is it going to be a problem? We knew this, this was exactly what we were going to get with Representative Fine. And, I mean, you know, you can't change the spots on a leopard. It's exactly, we knew exactly what we were going to get. That's why I ran against him in the first place. in the last couple of days last week or so, I think I've come out as the number one opponent because I will speak out against genocide and I will speak out against starvation. There's not one child in the world that should starve to death on America's watch.

So like Representative Marjorie Taylor Green, it's your position that what's happening right now in Gaza is a genocide. side. And can you tell us a little bit about, based on what you just said, and can you tell us a little bit about how you arrived at that conclusion? It's my understanding that you're, you have been a fairly pro-Israel Republican. So do you still see yourself that way? How does this fit into your sort of broader outlook on the nation of Israel? So I support the defense of Israel, but let me explain the defense that I support. I support us helping with the Iron Dome system. I do not in any way, shape or form support any offensive weapons. And there's no way that we should be paying for 70% of Israel's defense. I think even at this point, the crowd on J Street has come to the same

conclusion that I have, that this is genocide, that this is starvation. There's no, there's no two ways around it. What are you been hearing from Republican primary voters on that question? that they're absolutely appalled by every single moment that representative fine opens his mouth they're absolutely appalled and what about when you say i think we should not send offensive weapons um to israel like how to agree yeah that's great i mean this is a trump plus 30 district that's the only way that representative fin got elected in the first in the first place um this is common sense. This is America First, America Second, America Second, America Third,

America Fourth, America Fifth, Six, seventh, eighth, ninth, 10th. Americans do not want to be involved in endless wars. We need to help the people here. I hear about issues on the ground. Infrastructure, the economy, flooding. That's what we're

concerned about in the Sixth Congressional District. And I understand that as a United States representative, you're in charge of, you know, helping the rest of the United States, but you're in charge of helping the rest of the United States. You're not in charge of protecting the entire world. We're talking about a representative who has zero respect at all for freedom or the rights of everyday Americans. We're talking about a

genocidal, literally genocidal representative member of Congress versus someone, me, that will speak up and say, this is not right. I do not support genocide halfway around the world. And tell us a little bit more about how you ended up getting involved in politics, your background, because I think, you know, the question of what actually, how we define America first on the right, what that looks like in practice is sort of still being hashed out. But my assumption, based on what I've read about your background, is that Trump himself and and the moniker America first was something that sort of drew you to get more and more involved because, like, a lot of people, you heard that and said, yes, this is exactly what I

feel after watching what's happened in Iraq and Afghanistan and Syria, Libya, and we could go on and on down the list. So tell us a little bit about how you got involved and what that means to you. So I got involved with early vote action in Pennsylvania during the 24 presidential election, because I never bought into the narrative that Florida was a purple state. Florida is not a purple state. Florida is bright red state. That is not going to change anytime soon. But I'm a number, Scott. So I kept looking at, okay, how do we get to 270? How do we get to 270? And it seemed to me like the number one way to get there was through Pennsylvania. we didn't have, you know, we didn't have a crystal ball to say that Trump's going to win

every single swing state. So I said, okay, I have family in Maryland. What can I do from Florida to be involved and to make sure the President Trump gets reelected? So I would fly back and forth from Orlando to Baltimore on my favorite spirit airlines, my Florida-based airline. And it was cheap. I have a place to stay there. I could drive from the Baltimore area up to Pennsylvania, made a lot of good friends up there, and whether it was handing out signs, whether it was standing on the side of the road. And we encountered people up there that would, you know, spit at you, throw water bottles at you, curse at you. It's a completely different world than Florida. But I just tried to do everything in my power to make sure

the President Trump was elected in 24. And after that, I came home and I thought, okay, back to work. I'm a general contractor. Our business partners with a general contractor. And, you know, I just thought back to work. And then after Congressman Walts was appointed as national security advisor, then the group of Republicans approached me and said, we need someone with common sense to be able to go to Washington and say,

okay, I am not going to take APAC money. I believe APAC should be registered as a foreign lobbyist. They lobby for a foreign country. I'll do it. Sign me up. And the special election only had something like 50,000 people turn out. You know, I don't have the exact numbers in front of me. Randy, Randy Fine got like 30,000.

You got, what, 5,000 or so. So it's a small, you know, it's a small subset of the electorate. But it was a wide margin thanks to Trump's intervention and endorsement of Randy Fine. What are you going to, do you expect him to get Trump's endorsement again? And if he does, how do you still have a path? No way. If you go back and look, my cost per vote was $6. That's unheard of.

Because I get out there every single day. During the special election, I went to 68 different events. I cross pass with Mr. Fine three times. Three. That's it. It's a mail-in-election. Who can send out the most bright, shiny palm cards? And, you know, I don't have millions of dollars.

I have thousands of dollars. So I ran a congressional race on $30,000. And he ran a congressional race on a zillion dollars. So cost per vote, $6 versus cost per vote. and I'm only speaking in the primary, the general, it was off the charts, cost per vote, $100 for Mr. Fine. So I don't need the money that he has. I will get out there and I go to all these events over the weekend.

I was set up in Flagler County. I'll be in St. John's County. I live in Lake County. So I actually live in the district where Mr. Fine lives 100 miles south and thinks that he lives 6,500 miles to the west or to the east rather. Well, okay, so last question for me, Aaron, is I think in the past you've suggested on this note that it's Susie Wiles that contributed to the endorsement of Randy Fine. Susie Wiles, obviously, has had a career as a lobbyist, is very well connected in establishment Republican circles down in Florida by you. Have you learned any more on that since making that point?

I imagine you've heard from people who didn't like it, but maybe you've gotten more information on that as well. Is that still your understanding of how Randy Fine originally got the Trump endorsement and maybe would get another Trump endorsement? Well, the first Trump endorsement was a return favor for, we can say, for raising money during the special or during President Trump's election for President Trump's legal fund. We can say that it's because Congressman Fine was the first in Florida to switch sides from DeSantis to President Trump. I mean, we can say whatever we want.

I've been told and I hate to be told things because I love freedom and I love to be able to speak my mind and there's a lot to unpack. But I've been told to lay off Susie Wiles, but that's the problem. I don't have any way to slice the dice it. That's number one. That's why we're in the situation. If she had not picked Congressman Fine, the 6th District of Florida would not be embarrassed. I hear from people all across the state, and they're like, Aaron, we are so embarrassed that this is our congressman.

He supports genocide. You don't. You know, feed the children. I didn't know that feed the children is going to be a campaign slogan, but it seems to be. Yeah, it's genuinely embarrassing, I got to say. Deeply, deeply. And it's like, no offense, but to be an embarrassment in central Florida. Like, this guy's around the bend.

It's just utterly incredible. It's hard to do. But we knew, we knew what was going to happen. We knew the ethics complaints in the past. We knew the outstanding court cases. We knew the anger management that he, the court ordered anger management that he still hasn't completed. We knew all of this going in and we tried to stop it.

And the powers that be said, You are the anointed one. Well, we'll see. Again, it's going to be an interesting race, and we'll keep a close eye on it. Yeah, and keep us updated, Erin, because we're going to be covering it for sure. So we appreciate your time. Thanks for coming on. I appreciate being here.

Thank you very much. God bless you both. God bless. Emily, what do you think of Mr. Baker? Yeah, I thought it was super. Real challenge, you think? You know, there's over a year to go. Randy Fine had a lot of money in the last primary

if he maintains the support of people like Susie Wiles and others I think as long as the money's on his side these primaries really are decided by money in the presidential election and a Trump endorsement yeah in the Trump endorsement the presidential elections you start

you see money mattering less and less to be honest because it gets to the point where it's so even and when it's Trump he gets so much earned media and just like, he doesn't even need to buy commercials. But in these little primary elections, money makes a huge difference. And so if he's not able to outraise significantly Brandy Fine, who's the incumbent, it would be really difficult. But then again...

But if the breaking points audience sends him a million bucks. That could do it. But I was going to say that, again, this issue is for MAGA. So MAGA is the primary electorate. And the primary electorate in Florida is going to want to... see, I'm sure, is going to be pretty divided over this question. So I definitely think he has a chance. And, you know, we'll certainly follow the campaign. What did you make of it? He also didn't go full, like, bear hug on Israel. In the past, he's been pretty standard supporter of

Israel. Yeah. He said he supports the defense of Israel. Right. Right. And I think, you know, Partly it's him drawing a contrast with Randy Fine to come out and say, you know, only a second, you know, high-profile Republicans say that they're carrying out a genocide. But I think he wouldn't do that in a Republican primary if he thought that it would make him unviable. So clearly, you know, his finger on the pulse of the Republican electorate is that you can be a bold critic of Israel

and still get through a Republican primary. Yeah. And we'll see if he turns out so much will depend on whether Trump re-endorses fine. And I think on the one hand, Trump could because he's, fine's been loyal to him. Yeah.

But on the other hand, the guy like Aaron said is a complete embarrassment. He is. And it's starting to become I mean, he's trying to outflank literally every Republican on the question of hugging Netanyahu tighter and tighter and tighter to the point of ridiculousness, to the point where even APEC tried to distance themselves from Randy Fine recently, as you mentioned, Ryan.

So it's a, you could see Trump really going either way on this. On the one hand, like this is just sloppy and embarrassing political strategy from Randy Fine that is unbecoming, from the perspective of Trump, unbecoming of somebody in this position. On the other hand, you could just say, look, he's loyal. We don't want to take an L on this. We were the ones who backed him in the first place. So we'll see. But at some point, if the public sentiment starts to shift enough, that can force the hand.

Yeah, we'll see. All right. Well, that does it for us on today's edition of Breaking Points. Ryan, you're going to be around for the Friday show? I'll be here. Okay, cool. All right. I've been there for a while, so I'm looking forward to it.

Yes, there's something a little bit more chill about the Fridays. I mean, I guess we're all in a little. a row. Yeah, you might have. Well, no, no, no, we missed you. Yes, that's right. Exactly. The show didn't even happen if I wasn't there. Yeah, oh, if, if Ryan Grimm, if a show airs without Ryan Grimm in a forest, does anyone there to, these are the questions. All right, I'll see you then. Sounds good. See you all then. Come on, why is this taking so long? This thing is ancient.

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