Breaking Points with Krystal and Saagar - 9/25/25: ICE Shooting Details, Trump Pushes Comey Indictment, Italy Deploys Ships To Aid Gaza Flotilla

Episode Date: September 25, 2025

Krystal and Ryan discuss details on ICE shooting, Trump pushes Comey indictment, Italy deploys naval ships to Gaza aid flotillas.   Nate Soares Book: https://www.amazon.com/Anyone-Builds-Everyone-Dies-Superhuman/dp/0316595640      To become a Breaking Points Premium Member and watch/listen to the show AD FREE, uncut and 1 hour early visit: www.breakingpoints.comMerch Store: https://shop.breakingpoints.com/See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. I'm Jorge Ramos. And I'm Paola Ramos. Together we're launching The Moment, a new podcast about what it means to live through a time as uncertain as this one. We sit down with politicians, artists, and activists

to bring you death and analysis from a unique Latino perspective. The moment is a space for the conversations we've been having us, father and daughter, for years. Listen to The Moment with Jorge Ramos and Paola Ramos. on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, I'm Jay Shetty, and I'm the host of the On Purpose podcast.

Today, I'm joined by Emma Watson. Emma Watson has apparently quit acting. Emma Watson has announced she's retiring from acting. Has anyone else noticed that we haven't seen Emma Watson in anything in several years? Emma Watson is opening up the truth behind her five-year break from acting. Watson said she wasn't very happy. Listen to On Purpose with Jay Shetty on the IHart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. The murder of an 18-year-old girl in Graves County, Kentucky went unsolved for years,

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Hey guys, Saga and Crystal here. Independent media just played a truly massive role in this election, and we are so excited about what that means for the future of this show. This is the only place where you can. can find honest perspectives from the left and the right that simply does not exist anywhere else. So if that is something that's important to you, please go to breakingpoints.com, become a member today, and you'll get access to our full shows, unedited, ad-free, and all put together for you every morning in your inbox. We need your help to build the future of independent news media,

and we hope to see you at breaking points.com. Good morning, everybody. Welcome to Breaking Points. Ryan Grim. Great to have you, my friends. Always lovely to be here. Lovely, a little calm you takeover. this morning, as promised. Lots to get to, for sure. We've got, actually, thanks to our friend Ken Klippenstein's new details about this shooter at the ice facility yesterday that ended up killing one migrant and critically wounding two others. So we'll break all of that down for you, as far as we know at this point.

We've also got some new moves from the Trump administration to charge Jim Comey and Letitia James. A lot going on there. Break down those details for you. We're going to have a live report from that Gaza aid flotilla. Actually, one of Ryan's colleagues is on board, so he is going to join us and give us an update as they have been under attack. We got another Ryan special for you who actually met with the president of Iran while he was in New York. So you've got some details for us there, right? Well, I wasn't here yesterday.

So, yeah, we can break down how they're feeling about the fact that they're about to get attacked again for no reason. Yeah, yeah. Well, that will be really interesting to hear from you on that. We're also tracking a story out of North Carolina with potential national implications. Ryan and Sager covered earlier this week the way that electricity. prices are skyrocketing in part because of the expansion of these AI data centers. Well, in North Carolina, they're now trying to move legislation to make sure consumers are bearing the additional costs of these AI data centers. So this is something you definitely want to

pay attention to. And then, sticking with the AI theme, we have an expert joining us with a dire warning, as dire a warning as you could possibly get from his book, if anybody builds it, everyone dies. I just actually finished listening to this book. this morning I was telling you, Ryan, and it's fairly persuasive, and it is deeply terrifying. I would rather not be persuaded of that premise. Maybe skip this book then, to be honest with you. Maybe skip this book, because... I've read a bit about it, and it's like, oh, God. Yeah. So you can see all the near-term effects of the, you know, use of the water and the skyrocketing of electricity prices and all of these, and the consolidation of

power, all of that. But his scenario is even bleaker, which is basically the end of humanity. So some uplifting content there at the end. Do the memes keep getting made even after we're all gone? After the apocalypse. Will the superintelligence make memes? Probably so, but things in AI language that we would not be incomprehensible. Yeah. Wow.

I guess that's the real tragedy here. That's the real tragedy. All right. Thank you to everybody who's been supporting us, breaking points.com. If you're not already a member, you get access to the full Friday show. We've already got some interesting topics planned for them, but let's go ahead and get to what we know about this shooter. yesterday in Texas, targeting a Dallas Ice facility.

Three migrants were shot. One of them is dead. Two of them are critically wounded. That's the latest we know this morning. Let's go ahead and take a listen to a little bit of a law enforcement press conference from yesterday. Today at approximately 6.40 a.m. We received assist the officer call.

We responded to the call, got to the scene, and we later learned that we had four individuals that was shot. Two of them deceased, including the shooter. DPD was quickly was able to locate the shooter who was deceased. We're going to be working this investigation, shoulder to shoulder with our federal partners. The FBI is on scene. I can confirm at this time that the FBI is investigating this incident as an act of targeted violence. What I can also share with you is that early evidence that we've seen from rounds that were found near the suspected shooter contain messages that are anti-ice in nature. While we're not releasing identities of any victims at this time, what I can confirm for you is no members of law enforcement were hurt during this attack.

There are people out there who are seeing what is being placed online, and they're coming in there doing acts of violence against ICE employees. Your political opponents are not Nazis. We need to learn to work together without demonizing each other, without attacking each other. So Ted Cruz, moving there immediately to make a political point. You heard them say there that they found bullets that had anti-ice messaging. As it turns out, we can put Cash Patel tweeted this out. This is what they're saying that anti-ice messaging is, which it literally just says anti-ice.

Let me read from you his post here. And let's just also say, like, for the FBI director to just be, like, tweeting out this unverified evidence is extraordinary and may create problems down the road in other, you know, cases where you have a future trial. But in any case, he says this morning just before 7 a.m. local time and individual fired multiple rounds at Dallas, Texas ICE facility killing one, wounding several others before taking his own life. FBI, DHS, ATF are on the ground with Dallas PD and state authorities while the investigation is ongoing and initial. review of the evidence shows an ideological motive behind this attack, see photo below, and that's of the bullet casing saying anti-ice. One of the unspent shell casings were covered was engraved with the phrase anti-ice. More updates will be forthcoming. These despicable politically motivated attacks against law enforcement are not a one-off. We're only miles from Prairie Land, Texas,

just two months ago, bless you, Ryan. An individual ambushed a separate ICE facility targeting their officers. It has to end. The FBI and our partners will lead these investigative efforts To see to it that those who target our law enforcement are pursued and brought to the fullest extent of justice, thankfully no law enforcement personnel were injured, as they don't care as much about the migrants who were killed slash injured. Please pray for the injured and deceased. Trump, of course, immediately seizing on this as well. Ryan can put this up on the screen. And J.D. Vance, also, we have comments that will show you later leaning into the idea of a explicitly political, ideological, radicalized attack here. Trump says, I've been briefed on. the deadly shooting at the Ice Field Office in Dallas, Texas. It has now been revealed. The deranged shooter wrote anti-ice on his shell casings. This is despicable. The brave men and women of ICE are just trying to do their jobs and remove the worst of the worst criminals out of our country. But they are facing an unprecedented increase in threats, violence and attacks by deranged radical leftists. This violence is the result of the radical left Democrats constantly

demonizing law enforcement calling for ICE to be demolished and comparing ICE officers to Nazis. The continuing violence from radical left terrorists in the aftermath of Charlie Kirk's assassination must be stopped. ICE officers and other brave members of law enforcement are under grave threat. We have already declared Antifa a terrorist organization. I will be signing executive order this week to dismantle these domestic terror networks. I am calling on all Democrats to stop this rhetoric against ICE and America's law enforcement right now.

Trump administration is fully committed to backing law enforcement, strong border, securing our homeland, deporting violent illegal criminals, and fully rooting out the left-wing domestic terrorism that is terrorizing our country. thank you for your attention to this matter. So Ryan, obviously, you know, the national mood is quite fraught at the moment. You just had the assassination live that we all watched with horror of Charlie Kirk. You have the Trump administration using his martyrdom to, you know, grab additional national security powers. He references there the Antifa terror organization, terror designation for the Antifa organization, which isn't even the thing. that really exists, but whatever. Now he's floating another executive order to dismantle these networks, whatever that means. A lot of rhetoric coming for the administration about a coming crackdown and now feeding this new shooting into that narrative to further justify this power grab. Yeah, and the problem for Trump is that there's no evidence that, you know, quote-unquote,

any networks or any progressive Soros-run institutions. had anything to do with this shooting or with the shooting of Charlie Kirk that it would almost be hopeful in a way. Like, oh, we found the networks that are doing this. We can disrupt it. We found their funders. They're leaders. We're going to round them up.

They're breaking the law. They're trying to run a little insurrection here. We're going to roll them up and put them all in jail. We almost wish that that was the case. It's not. And so Ken Clippenstein, when you put this up on the screen, Ken is his new beat, apparently, is, you know, being the only one to do any reporting in the wake of these killings. And he was able to talk to, you know, three friends of Joshua John. Who was identified as the shooter and who took his own life.

And what's interesting and is a caveat for his reporting that he makes it in the piece. None of them had been friends with him in recent years. So there's still a lot to be learned about his life. last year or two. But what they described is a person who spent his time on 4chan, which is, how would you even describe it? It's like a right-coded, irony-laden, nihilistic den of young men, basically. Yeah. And that's where edge lords gather. And they say edgy things. They push them. They say things they don't mean in order to like get a rise out of people. You know, they, they shield themselves in all of this irony. What his friend said is that his edge lord online behavior began to

bleed into his real life personality. Yeah. And it was just brutally obnoxious. Like he was insufferable to be around. Yeah. And so people stop suffering him. Which is why, and they even say, Like, if you're having trouble finding anyone who associated with him in recent years, this is why. Because they don't exist. Because we all withdrew from him because, yeah, he was too much to take. And so how does he go from there? And then, so when everybody saw the shell casings that Crystal put up earlier that had in blue marker written anti-ice, the entire world was like, are you not even trying? Like, really?

This is utterly absurd. First of all, left-wing people don't say anti-ice. Right. They say F-ice, abolish ice, something like that. I've never heard them say anti-ice. No, and yeah. That's almost too parliamentarian. Right.

It's too establishment to just say you're anti-ice. Now, it's not. Now, his friends say, if that's authentic marking on those shell casings, it's ironic. it's like it's him sending some ironic message that is that is that is and the purpose of it in some ways is what's going on right now with us two boomers here discussing like 4chan irony and meme culture on like we're anthropologists on a serious platform like we're anthropologists they love that because it's so ridiculous it's so absurd it's the it's a violent real world shitpost in a way Yeah.

To get everybody to, you know, what does it mean and what were his politics and to create just a mess. I mean, it's a, you know, it could be seen as like accelerationist potentially as well. But I was telling you, Freddie DeBore wrote a fantastic piece in the wake of the Tyler Robinson assassination of Charlie Kirk about this, you know, the previous trend that we tend to, you know, have internalized is. there's some existing ideology, and then the violent act flows out of that, you know, that ideology. And this is more like there's an absence of idea, there's an absence of meaning, and the killings are meant to create a meaning. And, you know, I think Tyler Robinson, it's still a question mark to me, whether he fits into that, because there seems to have been, like, you know, some sort of the genuine concern over Charlie Perks. Yeah, single issue kind of fixation. But on that same day, you had this neo-Nazi, you know, more right-wing school shooter.

But again, it was all this, like, internet gobbledygook, you know, memeology. So was he really a, like, sort of through-and-through ideological neo-Nazi? It seems more like it came out of this same sort of fever swamp. And he modeled himself on another school shooter who was very similar with internet memes. the trans shooter that got so much attention in Minneapolis because of their gender identity, similar thing. Like, they put up a video with over 100 different weird online, like memes and symbols and all kinds of crap. So there seems very much to be a trend here.

And I want to read a little bit from Ken's piece because just so you get the specifics of what the friends were saying and we're not just paraphrasing. So Ken writes, none of his, none of Joshua Jan's former friends believed that the, anti-ice inscription could possibly be sincere, feeling such a serious political statement was anathema to who Jan was. His humor was deeply ironic, often offensive, and aggressive to the point of alienation. He was most certainly an edge lord, an irony guy, one friend said, edge lord being online speak for someone who likes to espouse edgy nihilistic views. Asked about the inscription on the bullet, the friend said, Josh was an edge lord who wanted someone to get blamed. I think he tried his best to write something goofy to rile people up.

Another friend showed me a Facebook post describing how Jan had flooded his friend's comment section with rape jokes, quote, playful shock humor, the friend said. Jan's profile on the gaming platform, Steam, showed the vast amounts of time he spent playing video games, particularly shooters, more than 6,000 hours on Rust, 3,000 on Team Fortress 2 and 1,000 on left 4 dead 2, even time to play 3.5 hours in the past 2 weeks, which sounds like a real downtick in his video game playing time, only 3.5 hours, that's nothing. Among the dozen or so usernames he used was one reading hashtag impeachment, when I asked if this was not a clear reference to anti-Trump politics, his friends recoiled at the idea he would express opposition to Trump so sincerely and straightforwardly. Instead, they saw it as part of the broader ironic persona, poking fun at anti-Trump resistance types. Now, they do say that he did not like Trump. So not a fan of Trump. Yeah, but that he also didn't like any politicians. The only politician they mentioned him having spoken favorably of was actually Ron Paul.

They said if anything, they'd pin his politics as more libertarian. So look, again, your caveat is important that these are people who have disassociated with this guy for a couple years. But we do also have his brother coming out and saying something similar about like he wasn't, he didn't really care about ICE. He wasn't really particularly political. And so clearly, and you also have an administration, you know, that you can't trust. Like the FBI is completely political and run by an incompetent moron in full, which is why so many people, the minute that the, you know, anti-ice bullet casings drop are like, there's fucking no way that that's real. I actually, now that I've seen this reporting, I actually am more willing to buy that that is legitimate because it is such a weird thing to write anti-ice that it does feel like something a shit poster would do. Just messing with you.

Just messing with you, exactly. So in that frame, like with Ken's framing here, it actually does make more sense to be that that could actually be something that's real. And in the end of it, though, our attempt to like make any sense of this is always going to be broken by the fact that this is a person who went and took the life

of at least one person to put two in critical condition ironically right and it's just impossible as somebody who is like just still you know well grounded um to identify with that like you can you can go back and read about like um far right uh violence or far left violence in europe in like Italy and Germany against the fascist or whatever and you say I like I wouldn't want to participate in that myself but I get it like right this this makes rational sense and there was an existential threat human history it's just impossible to get to a place where you can understand like how you go from where he was to like I'm going to get a rifle

and ironically shoot up an ice building when I don't even like care about ice that much and I'm going to care so little about it that I'm actually going to kill detainees. Right, and troll with the bullet case. And a lot of people also were noting, I don't know a lot about guns guys, but they called this a stripper clip where these were intentionally left, right?

They were not used and sort of like just intentionally left there. Yeah. And so this, like, assuming this is like if we're taking the government's word for, or in this legitimate, that was an intentional statement, like a troll, but in the most disgusting, violent way imaginable. I'm Jorge Ramos.

And I'm Paola Ramos. Together we're launching The Moment, a new podcast about what it means to live through a time, as uncertain as this one. We sit down with politicians. I would be the first immigrant mayor in generations, but 40% of New Yorkers were born outside of this country. Artists and activists, I mean,

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This new podcast will be a way to make that ongoing intergenerational conversation public. Listen to The Moment with Jorge Ramos and Paola Ramos as part of the My Cultura Podcast Network on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, I'm Jay Chetty, and I'm the host of the on-purpose podcast. Today, I'm joined by Emma Watson. Emma Watson. Emma Watson has apparently quit acting.

Emma Watson has announced she's retiring from acting. Has anyone else noticed that we haven't seen Emma Watson in anything in several years? Watson is opening up the truth behind her five-year break from acting. Watson said she wasn't very happy. Was acting always something you were going to do? I was using acting as a way of escaping to feel free. My parents, it wasn't just the divorce, it was just like the continuing situation of living between two different houses and two different lives and two different sets of values,

the career and the life that looks like the dream. But are you really happy? Fame has given me this extraordinary power. It's also given me a lot of responsibility. Listen to On Purpose with Jay Chetty on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I started trying to get pregnant about four years ago now. We're getting a little bit older and it just kind of felt like the window could be closing. Bloomberg and IHeart Podcasts present.

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By what? All the bright and shiny. Listen to IVF disrupted, the kind body story, starting September 19 on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Right. I know if Sagar was here, we would be having probably a debate at this point because we've already had several versions of this debate about, you know, he would go down the, this generacy, video games. We don't know anything about this guy's like porn. habits in particular, but he'd say porn addiction, like there's a lockdown. Like this kid suffered through, you know, the lockdown, the COVID lockdown. He might mention that too. He doesn't think, Zachar doesn't usually bring that part up. He should. That could go along with this as well.

He should because it turbocharges all of the other things. But he's more inclined to go in the direction of like, we've got to cut off the video games. We've got to like regulate porn. We need to, you know, he's more in that camp. And I am in the camp of you have to deal more with the root causes. Like, the whole world has the internet. Many Asian cultures are much more game addicted than we are and spend a lot more on video games, a lot more time on video games than we do. And yet, we're the only country that has these, only developed country that has these routine mass shootings, routine school shootings.

So there's something specific to the American political context that is creating this. And so I'm curious what, you know, what your view is on. kind of the underlying factors that are leading to now we have these repeated instance of these sort of black pill nihilist edge lord killers to me one of the only explanations well first of all the this guy's got a gun like in a lot of countries this guy doesn't have any access to a gun it's just like the idea that he could even get one to to to this kid in most countries would be absurd yeah it's just not it's just not possible have a gun his brother says he wasn't a great marksman, but that he grew up in a gun culture. Like, he was used to hiring,

to handling firearms from a young age. Obviously, Tyler Robinson, even to a greater extent, grew up in like, you know, sort of extreme, what I would call extreme gun culture. There's all sorts of family photos of them, you know, with various weaponry, etc. Right. So that's one obvious distinction. The other has to be something about hopelessness and a lack of meaning. Yeah. Which is ironic because if you look at just straight up, you know, wealth, GDP, etc., like the United States compared to every other country is doing better. Right. But there's something about the direction of the country and people's sense of whether

or not their futures are going to be better than the last generations that makes it. So it doesn't matter what the absolute score is, whether like, this guy had, you know, a lot of people around the world would love to be able to, you know, have the video game console or consoles that he had and access to a nice TV. Like, like, all the things that allowed him to play the thousands of hours of games. But at the same time, those, like, he also must have had, forget him. Like, in general, Americans have, like, a deep sense of hopelessness about the future. And so it doesn't really, so it's just telling them, well, you're doing better than people in Thailand.

Yeah. They're like, well, I don't care. Right. I feel miserable. Yeah. I mean, it's a seeming decline in living standards because while, There's a plethora of sort of like inexpensive items available, the key building blocks, housing, education, health care, more and more expensive. There's, I think the, you know, being in the tail end of neoliberalism here has hit men harder than women in a way because so much of men's like the cultural value, what the culture says to men is like, you're a man if you can provide.

And then there's, it's so difficult to be able to do those things, to be able to have the job, have the, you know, the family do the thing that your parents and grandparents did. And so, and of course you guys know, none of this is like justifying. It's just trying to grapple with like what the hell is actually going on here because it's very difficult, as you said, to understand. It's actually impossible to understand. But I think we have enough data now to say that there is some broader, deeply troubling trend that's, it saw, then this is something that Sagar has said.

Like, it would be more comforting if there was, if it was like a weather underground sort of situation. We're like, here's the Antifa network, and we're going to disrupt them. And we're going to, here is it what they want. Yeah, we're going to Jay Edgar Hoover them. And, you know, we can get to the sources of funding.

We can deal with this. This is this sort of widespread cultural social phenomenon. And there's no reason not to expect it's going to continue to expand and proliferate, which is what is so terrifying. And one of the things that Freddie DeBoer also writes in his piece, which we should put a link to and probably get Freddie on like next week to talk about as well. But that, you know, the school shooters, like that's become such a part of the background noise of American society that it barely gives you like whatever infamy and like, you know, sick meaning making that you're trying to apparently achieve with these random acts of violence. And so the sort of school shooter phenomenon may be expanding now into these like political assassinations and political attacks and that the profile of these sort of killers looks actually very similar to the, you know, the typical school shooter kind of profile. Yes. And he was 29 years old, which is actually getting a little on the older side for these for these shooters.

yeah but again you know five years of the pandemic you know i think upends upended a lot of people you know who are now 29 he was 24 when he goes into it now he's now he's 29 and as as his friend said over the last several years like he became a yeah completely obnoxious guy but i think you're i think you're exactly right that like the phenomenon that we've understood for 20 years of the school shooter type is moving into other types of things now. The school shooter mulchard. And, you know, Dallas is only, it was 2016 when the guy shot, what, six, killed six police officers, five or six police officers. Remember that?

This giant shootout in 2016 in Dallas. Which, again, like, if that happened one time and, you know. France. You know, they'd be like, they'd remember it for 100 years. Yeah, and try to do something about it. Yeah. Whereas we know no one's going to do anything about it. Another factor that I think has to be added to the mix is obviously like mental illness knows no national boundaries, but we have a vast amount of untreated mental illness here, both because of cultural stigma around seeking help and a lack of universal health care and a, you know, insufficient amount of, you know, inpatient beds and mental health resources more generally for people.

So I think that's part of it too. So, you know, in any case, let me just put up these last few pieces that we have about what we know regarding Joshua Jan, put A5 up on the screen. So he also, in addition to the anti-ice engraved bullet casing, we also have this bizarre map that was stuck to the outside of his car that showed radioactive fallout across. the U.S., don't know what that's all about, but in any case that, you know, I mean, it feels like something a schizophrenic would, like, send to one of our houses, frankly, but in any case, that's one of the things that they found as well. We've got, we could put the next piece up on

the screen. I mentioned his brother, again, early days of finding out what this, you know, to the best we can possibly understand what was going on with Joshua Jan in the days and years leading up to this murder spree. The brother says, I don't think he was politically interested, talking to NBC News. He wasn't interested in politics on either side, as far as I knew, didn't have strong feelings about ICE as far as I knew. He did, this is important to know. He did vote, and everybody's, of course, going to look at the social media profile and what can we glean about this guy. He voted in Texas's Democratic primary in 2020. That's the only record that we have of him voting in any election. So it wasn't a Democratic primary. The brother also

said that Joshua Jan knew how to shoot. Their parents owned a rifle, but that Joshua was not a skilled shooter. Apparently, he lived and, you know, was born and raised in a suburb of Dallas. Joshua was interested in moving to property. His parents owned in Oklahoma. The brother said, quote, he's not a marksman. He would not be able to make any shots like that. Photos of the rifle rounds, they said, found near Joshua's body suggests to use an antique rifle chamber and high power rounds similar to the gun that was used to kill Charlie Kirk. And if it was before a certain date, it would not have had a serial number. That was one of the things that we learned about the rifle that was used to murder Charlie Kirk, is that it was like his grandpa's rifle,

you know, potentially like World War II era rifle and did not have serial numbers because it predated the law that required serial numbers on these firearms. And the shooting itself lends credence to what his brother is saying, and also to what all of his friends are saying that he, like, if you're saying, like, he's A, not a good shot, but also B, didn't have strong feelings, actually have strong feelings about ice or anything. He fired into the building itself just indiscriminately and did not hit or hurt anybody inside the building. He then fired on a van that was just on the street. And it was one of these transport bans where they're moving detainees. Filled with migrants, yeah. And that's where he struck three people, killing one and critically wounding two.

So, right, it's so just in his mind he's just on this roofer and he's just looking down. He aims at a van and aims at an entire building, which kind of does align with the idea that he's just creating a spectacle. Yeah. That there's no real plan here. I think, you know, a lot of people who are on the right in our audience and elsewhere will look at this and say, you guys are coping. The bullet says anti-ice. Like, you just don't want it to be one of yours.

And so you're making up all this, like, nihilist edge lord stuff. And that's certainly the direction that the administration is going in. We showed you a little bit of Ted Cruz that were instantly at the press conference. And J.D. Vance also gave a speech yesterday. and, you know, also using these killings and claiming that, you know, left-wing violence is out of control and we're going to crack down and going directly after Gavin Newsom in particular. Let's go ahead and take a listen to A-7. Because here's what happens when Democrats, like Gavin Newsom did, say that these people are part

of an authoritarian government. When the left-wing media lies about what they're doing, when they lie about who they're arresting, when they lie about the actual job of law enforcement, what they're doing, is encouraging crazy people to go and commit violence. You don't have to agree with my immigration policies. You don't have to agree with Donald Trump's immigration policies. But if your political rhetoric encourages violence against our law enforcement, you can go straight to hell and you have no place in the political conversation of the United

States of America. So, Ryan, for me, I'm very worried about the underlying trend of these killings. And I'm also very worried about what this government is going to use the, killings in order to effectuate, and it won't be the first time that either one of us has lived through some sort of a, you know, authoritarian crackdown in service of, quote-unquote, safety. And look, these people, Stephen Miller, J.D. Vance, Donald Trump, they make no bones about the fact that they view anyone left of center as their political opponents to be crushed and have made it a habit, like the storyline of this administration, is using either real or imagined emergencies

in order to grab more and more power. We already have the Antifa executive order. There's apparently some other executive order coming out. Ken has been reporting about the way that they're, you know, creating new categories of quote-unquote domestic extremism. So, you know, that is the landscape that we're in right now. And, of course, we also covered this week the, you know, speech crackdown on Jimmy Kimmel and the fallout from that.

I will say I'm very heartened that the backlash to that actually ended up having some teeth. And ABC Disney felt pressured enough to bring him back on air. They're apparently putting pressure on both Sinclair and Nexstar to stop preempting his programming as well. I think the fact that you had that grassroots pushback and it was successful is a really important development. But what do you make of the administration's approach here? Is J.D. Vance listening to himself? He's saying if you're somebody who is going to use disturbing rhetoric about the other side, you can go to hell and you have no place in our policy. I know.

I'm sorry, what? Right. Like what, like, what do you, like, what do you, what are you, what are you talking about here? Like that, and I feel like with him. You can go to hell, like, and this is not a guy, this is not a poster on fortune. This is a vice president of the United States. I feel like he, he is intelligent enough that he says things like that, that he knows you and I will lose our minds over. Like, you literally just said, don't do the violent rhetoric and then you did the violent rhetoric.

And you just said, go to hell, you have no place in our politics. I think he and Stephen Miller both do that intentionally to, quote unquote, trigger. us. But, I mean, I do, like, it's in some ways, I don't know if it's the least important point, but on the politics of this, I do wonder if Republicans are going to get what they want out of this when I don't think the Republican Party led by Donald Trump is exactly known for their, like, mild, mild, careful rhetoric, civility, like, attention to detail and accuracy in all things. Like, that's not really what they're known for at this point. So, but they really are trying to apply this double standard of like, we can call you fascists, we can call you communes, we can say

you're evil, literal demons who should be destroyed and like go straight to hell, but you can't accurately describe what we're, if you call us authoritarians while we're doing an authoritarian crackdown while you just want us to be murdered. And so if the Democratic Party did not exist, which for all intents and purposes nowadays, it actually doesn't. If there was no national media whatsoever, what the public would still see would be the social media posts and the press conferences put together by this administration, which includes routine ASMR videos of people in handcuffs and chains, which includes multiple members of the administration and in Congress standing in front of human beings stacked on top of each other in that torture chamber down in El Salvador,

which includes street footage of a female student, Ramesa Ozturk, in Somerville, Massachusetts, getting dragged off the street and shoved into a ban by masked agents, which includes all of the videos we've seen of people, of all of the violence that's taking place all over the country. Yeah. Like that. National Guard in the streets, all of that.

We would see all of that. Without a single Democrat saying the F word or the G word, or without the media talking about it. And the final was, this kid, Jan, Jan, he's not the type that cares what Democrats say. Like, he does, like, he obviously hates Democrats and Republicans. You don't think this was, he was inspired by Gavin Newsom? Yeah, he's a giant Gavin Newsom fan. And when Gavin Newsom speaks, you know, he marches. I mean, Democrats literally don't inspire anyone.

So, like, killer or non, so. Right. So there is a reality. And Jay Vance says, well, you can disagree with our immigration policy. Okay, well, like, what words you're allowed to use to disagree with it? And, you know, but it clearly has become, like, a main thing. So if this kid is looking for some spectacle, a 29-year-old kid is looking for some spectacle, you know, the big thing is particularly in Dallas, I'm sure there's ice everywhere.

And so, you know, if that's what they're looking for is attention. So I would just say, like, I would caution people in assuming that, like, any of these types of people have any respect whatsoever for Democrats and care what they say about ICE. Yeah, I think that's well said. I'm Jorge Ramos. And I'm Paola Ramos. Together we're launching The Moment, a new podcast about what it means to live through a time, as uncertain as this one. We sit down with politicians.

I would be the first immigrant mayor in generations, but 40% of New Yorkers were born outside of this country. Artists and activists, I mean, do you ever feel demoralized? I might personally lose hope. This individual might lose the faith. But there's an institution that doesn't lose faith. And that's what I believe in. To bring you depth and analysis from a unique Latino perspective. There's not a single day that Paola and I don't call or text each other,

sharing news and thoughts about what's happening in the country. This new podcast will be a way to make that ongoing intergenerational conversation public. Listen to The Moment with Jorge Ramos and Paola Ramos as part of the MyCultura podcast network on the IHeartRadio app. Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, I'm Jay Chetty, and I'm the host of the on-purpose podcast. Today, I'm joined by Emma Watson. Emma Watson has apparently quit acting.

Emma Watson has announced she's retiring from acting. Has anyone else noticed that we haven't seen Emma Watson in anything in several years? Emma Watson is opening up the truth behind her five-year break from acting. Watson said she wasn't very happy. Was acting always something you were going to do? I was using acting as a way of escaping to feel free. My parents, it wasn't just the divorce, it was just like the continuing situation of living between two different houses

and two different lives and two different sets of values, the career and the life that looks like the dream. But are you really happy? Fame has given me this extraordinary power. It's also given me a lot of responsibility. Listen to On Purpose with Jay Chetty on the IHart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I started trying to get pregnant about four years ago now. We're getting a little bit older and it just kind of felt like the window could be closing.

Bloomberg and IHeart Podcasts present. IVF Disrupted, the Kind Body Story. A podcast about a company that promised to revolutionize fertility care. Introducing Kind Body, a new generation of women's health and fertility care. Backed by millions in venture capital and private equity, it grew like a tech startup. While Kind Body did help women start families, it also left behind a stream of disillusioned and angry patients. You think you're finally like with the right people in the right hands, and then to find out again that you're just not. Don't be fooled.

By what? All the bright and shiny. Listen to IVF Disrupted, the Kind Body Story, starting September 19 on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. All right, let's go ahead and get to this next piece about Comey, because this is, I think, pretty important. So just to back up for a second, Saga and I covered previously that the U.S. attorney for the Eastern District of Virginia, which is probably one of the most important jurisdictions in the country, it's right here across the river. They do all kinds of national security cases, et cetera. In any case, that U.S. attorney, who was handpicked by Trump, was forced down, seemingly because he would not bring spurious cases against Trump's enemies. We also had, which we also covered, Trump posting to true social message that—

Perhaps accidentally? That appeared like maybe he meant to send it directly to Pam Bonnie, but he posted it openly, basically saying, like, you got to go after Comey, you got to go after Schiff, you got to go after Lettisha Jane. this woman, Lindsay. What's going on? We're bringing in this woman, Lindsay. She's really great, et cetera. So putting direct pressure in public, whether it was meant to be or not, on Pambani. I mean, look, in another world, this would be impeachment worthy. And I mean, truly, it genuinely would be. And instead, we're like, you know, 10 news cycles later. In any case. So U.S. Attorney, go ahead. The Satternight massacre, which was for 50 years the biggest political scandal in this country, was when, Nixon fired some Justice Department officials because they weren't doing what he wanted.

And it was a decades-long cataclysmic constitutional rupture. Yes. And it was nowhere near as bad as what Trump is doing. Right. Trump, on Maine, posting, like, you need to go after my political opponents, what is going on and why hasn't this happened yet. And now, lo and behold, brings in this lady, Lindsay Halligan, who has never prosecuted a case. Insurance lawyer. Insurance lawyer, former pageant girl, participated in one of the Trump beauty pageants, apparently. In any case, he's brought her in, and she is apparently willing to do some of this.

So now MSNBC, which this is another interesting thing that you were pointing out, they have Carol Lennox now, who is a real reporter, teaming up with Ken Delanian, who was more of a typically like a Democratic administration stenographer. But in any case, them teaming up and breaking the story about charges against Comey are likely to be filed in the next few days, along with they're trying to get Letitia James on these sort of bogus mortgage fraud charges, which they've also tried to go after her, Adam Schiff, and Lisa Cook, who was a Fed Board, governor over similar like, oh, you said it was your primary residence, but it wasn't really your primary residence thing. In any case, let's take a listen to MSNBC's

Ken Delanian detailing a bit of this. The office is expected to charge Tish James, the New York Attorney General, with mortgage fraud. And of course, Donald Trump, we all saw it posted on Truth Social in recent days, exhorting his attorney general to charge both of those people as soon as possible. But again, you know, this is grand juries are secret. This is a fluid situation. It's also important to know, though, that the U.S. attorney, the Trump appointed U.S. attorney in this office, Eric Siebert, was essentially forced out last week, in part because he was refusing

to bring these cases. We're told that he was opposed to both, to prosecuting both James and Comey on these grounds. Put the next piece up on the screen, Delaney and also writes some of the details here. Former FBI director Jim Comey for years the target of President Trump's I are expected to be indicted in the coming days in the Eastern District of Virginia. Full extent of the charges being prepared is unclear. Sources believe at least one element of the indictment, if it goes forward, will accuse him of lying to Congress during his testimony on September 30th, 2020. About whether he authorized a leak of information, five-year statute of limitations on that charge would lapse on Tuesday. Ryan, I tried to dig into the specifics of what they're saying Comey lied about and, you know, potential, well, it looks like they don't have more than what's in the public sphere, given the fact that this previous handpicked U.S. attorney was like, I can't charge him. There's not enough there there. But effectively, you know, he claimed, he stood by earlier testimony where he had said he'd never authorized these particular leaks to the press. They're saying they have contradictory evidence. There's some question.

about whether or not that was true. But remember, if you're going to be found guilty of lying under oath, it requires that, you know, it requires specific intent that you knew you were wrong. It was a pretty high legal bar here. And one that apparently, the previous, Trump-picked U.S. attorney, did not feel that they had met. And maybe they're going to end up going with contempt of Congress, which would be a vaguer. I think usually contempt means you got a subpoena and you refuse to show up. Yeah. Because maybe they can't quite nail perjury. The timing is key, the testimony that you're referring to was September of 2020. Right.

Which, and the clock is about to tick on the statute of limitations. Literally next week or something. Five years is like, yeah, less, very soon. And so basically he was asked if he, if he leaked this information, what he did. And Comey is a slippery dude. And Comey, from my perspective, has like basically a, abused his power at the FBI, his entire career. Help get Trump elected.

And also helped get Trump elected. No gratitude at all for Comey. Because the data is quite clear. If Comey had not done both of those press conferences going after Hillary, both helped Trump, he doesn't end up winning by the 40,000 votes or whatever he won by. So we're in a completely different world if Comey had not abused his power. So that aside, the question was, did you leak these men? memos about your interactions with President Trump, particularly when Trump had lunch with him

and told him, go easy on my guy, Mike Flynn. That winds up in the New York Times. What he had done is he'd got in his car, right afterwards, typed up a memo, and then he gave it to a friend of his, and then after he was out of office, and so this is another argument that he makes for why this was fine, he authorized his friend to leak them to the New York Times. So he did not personally leaked them. Was it McCabe that leaked him? It's, no, I think it's in Richmond, Dan Richmond or something like that. That guy, whoever that was, he's a professor somewhere.

He did an interview with the prosecutors, like two or three weeks ago. That's been reported. And so it was after that interview, they were like, we just have nothing here. I didn't file anything. People can go back and read his September 2020 testimony. My recollection is that he did say, I did give it to this guy. But he acknowledged that. Like, if you go back and read the testimony, he sounds like a guy who's being deliberately misleading.

Yeah. But is trying to stay on the legal side of perjury. Yeah. And so maybe that's why they'll end up with contempt. Pretty much happens every day in this. Yeah, that's called a congressional testimony. Yeah, that's the way this works. I mean, and I think it's important to lay out those details.

I think it's also important to say it's really not about the details. Of course. Trump wants to give me something. Hates this guy, wants to go after him, made that crystal clear to Pam Pund. and now they are, along with Letitia James. On the mortgage, quote-unquote, mortgage fraud thing with Letitia James that they may be trying to indict her over. So the claim is, and there's this one guy at the Federal Housing Authority, who Bill Pulte, who's like feeding this stuff to Trump about Schiff, Tish James, and Lise. He's going through everybody's mortgage records, yeah.

And with Tish James in particular, it seems like they really don't have a leg to stand on because at least what's reportedly happened is there was a mistake in a mortgage record. application first. She was actually trying to help. I think it was maybe her daughter. It was a relative, get a house here. And there was a mistake that said it would be her primary residence. And she emailed the, you know, the person she was working with was like, no, no, no, this is not my, you know, this would not be my primary residence. So there's clear, like, documentation that there was a, sure, there was maybe a filing paperwork mistake that was made that she immediately tried to clear up. And the idea is that if it's your primary residence, you get a better mortgage, interest rate, something Trump would know a lot about as someone who engaged in routine

real estate fraud with regard to, you know, inflating assets and deflating assets and doing whatever that was beneficial for him for getting a loan or lowering his taxes, et cetera. Something that Tish James actually went after him for. So that's, you know, that's the crux of the idea of, I guess, what they would go after Tish James. Now, the other question is whether or not a grand jury is actually going to, you know, indict. Now, they say a grand jury will indict a ham sandwich, but we have seen with this administration several noteworthy times, including with the sandwich guy here in D.C., where they were like, no, we're not going to charge him. Not going to do it. Now, D.C. is a different jury pool than, you know, the Eastern District of Virginia somewhat. I mean, D.C. is the most liberal jurisdiction in the country, but Northern Virginia is also pretty liberal. So it's not crazy to imagine that you could have a grand jury look at this and be like, we're not going along with this. The requirement at justice is supposed to be that you have an expectation at trial, a jury would found them guilty. And Delanyan also reported that there

was a memo that was sent to this new U.S. attorney saying that charges should not be brought against Comey. There's not enough evidence to establish probable cause of crime was committed, let alone enough to commit the jury to convict him. So sort of career prosecutors there put this memo together for her and she's like well the big guy wants me to do it so i'm doing it yeah i wonder if any of those what those what those lawyers are going to do it would be amazing like i don't think she'll be able to pull it off like i don't think she'll be able to get a grand jury or a judge to sign off on this but if she did it would be truly amazing because i i don't expect that these prosecutors who are you know these are boy scouts and girl scouts like whatever you think of them like

um these types of prosecutors i don't think that they would participate in it And so this insurance lawyer would have to bring the case herself, who's never prosecuted case. This would be her first criminal case. Like I said, I don't think it gets past the indictment phase, but if it did, be quite a spectacle. Yeah. But it's important to say, like, if the federal government goes after you in this way at all, even if it doesn't make it to try, even if you're found in a senator, whatever. I mean, it ruins your life. Then that's the intent, right? It's meant to ruin your life, put you through ruinous discovery, have you, you know, rack up.

ruinous legal bills and just imagine that you had this federal government targeting you directly and in their sites. That would be a terrifying experience. And that's exactly what is what is meant to be done here. And I mean, it's openly admitted effectively by Trump. And you saw Ken Martin who they wanted to make the U.S. training for D.C. but he couldn't get through the Senate. So they now gave him like three jobs. Ed Martin, right? Ed Martin. Yeah. Yeah. He gave him like Ken Martin's a DNC guy. That's right. Gave him like three jobs inside the Justice Department, the weaponization of the Justice

Department. And he came after at the apparent request of Alex Jones, and the FBI agent who was first on the scene at Sandy Hook and said he was going to, he was now under investigation, wanted a bunch of information from the guy. And his boss told him, oh, no, Todd Blanche, I believe it was. was like, oh, no, no, this is, we're not doing Alex Jones' handiwork on Sandy Hook. Are you nuts? And so they completely withdrew this letter.

But still, the fact that Alex Jones can call the DOJ and get them to try to reopen Sandy Hook. Oh, my God. Shows how weaponized. How far gone we are. This institution is. Yeah. Well, there's one last interesting clip I just want to play for you. of Peter Navarro, and this is interesting because, of course, the right has been claiming that, you know, the Biden administration, the Obama administration, that they, they're the ones who weaponize the Justice Department against them and against Trump. And, you know, it's not like they don't have any case to make there. Yeah, they indicted him a bunch of times. And they did that whole Rushagate thing. They did. They certainly did. And so they've been saying, we're going to end this weaponization. They weaponize the government against us, et cetera, et cetera. And then you have Trump just brazenly, like, blowing past any sort of plausible deniability.

and weaponizing not just the department or just the entire government against his political housing administration. Yeah, the federal housing administration, you know, the freaking HHS as an anti-Semitism task force, right? I mean, what are we talking about here? So in any case, Casey Hunt over at CNN asked Peter Navarro to explain that inconsistency. Let's go ahead and take a listen to what he had to say. Great to be with you. And it is kind of funny.

I mean, I did go to prison. I did go to prison for honoring the Constitution. and I'm the only one. And meanwhile, there's a lot of people out there who should be in prison in my judgment and I think in the judgment of many people in the Trump administration, James Comey's the top of that list.

Now, I don't have any inside knowledge. Is what's going on with James Comey? How is it not? Basically the same thing that you're saying happened to you? Because he broke the law and I didn't. Simple as that. Let me lay this out for you. The big picture, and again, I don't know

I don't know what he would be charged with. There's so many things. reporting is perjury. There's so many things. So specifically, just as a refresher, Navar spent four months in prison for two misdemeanor counts of contempt of Congress. He defied a subpoena from the House Select Committee investigating January 6th. He refused to appear for a deposition or produced requested documents related to his role in efforts to challenge a 2020 election results and was sentenced to four months in prison and fined $9,500, according to Grock. So basically, they were like, they subpoenaed him and he just was like, no, I'm not

showing up. I mean, that's pretty brazen, you know, in terms of securing a conviction against someone that's pretty brazen. So what I've seen Ryan is on this, on the free speech stuff, basically some parts of the right will try to do an intellectual, like, oh, well, here's why it's different, and it's not the same, and they did it, and we're doing something completely different. But I see a lot of just like, yeah, they did it to us, we're going to do it back to them. And, you know, and we're going to come at them 10 times harder than they ever could have come at us. And you, you know, you guys were out there pressuring and getting people canceled over like COVID misinformation or whatever. Well, we're going to kick Jimmy Kimmel off the air and we have no regrets about it whatsoever.

That's where I see a lot of the energy on the right, basically being not trying to hold any sort of consistent ideological principle, just pure revenge, vengeance kind of energy. And also zero sum. I saw Steve Bannon in his show last night saying, citing these Hakeem, Jeff, Jeffrey's comments where Hakeem Jeffries said, look, let me remind you that the statute of limitations runs beyond this Trump administration. So if you're committing crimes now, you know, look out, there could be accountability, which is the irony here of like Hakeem Jeffrey is doing absolutely nothing to resist the Trump administration. Right. And then claiming he's going to do something in the future. Yeah. It's kind of the worst of all worlds. Yeah. So what Ben is saying, look at that.

what Jeffries is saying is that they were going to re-weaponize the Justice Department again when they take power and they're going to come after all of us. We're all going to jail if we don't put them in jail first. Yeah. Like that's, that's his argument. He's like, and while we move so slow, he said, you know, the Democrats, they move with alacrity. Oh my God, please. Which, it's, it's funny how what different worlds we all live in, because if you ask. He doesn't believe that. He can't believe that. There's no way he believes that because he's, he watched Merrick. He's actually intelligent. Yeah. I mean, he is one of the few people that he did go to prison. Yeah.

So he, you know, I'm sure he's got his own perspective on it colored by the fact that he actually went, was behind bars leading up to the election for the same thing as Navarro. Yeah, just refusing to testify. Yeah. Yeah. Well, we'll say if Democrats have. Democrats move with a lacquity. Yeah, incredible.

I'm going to have to look up alacrity because that's not my idea. It's not your understanding of what that term means. It's not embodied. I'm Jorge Ramos. And I'm Paola Ramos. Together we're launching The Moment a new podcast about what it means to live through a time as uncertain

as this one. We sit down with politicians. I would be the first immigrant mayor in generations but 40% of New Yorkers were born outside of this country. Artists and activists, I mean, do you ever feel demoralized? I might personally lose hope. This individual

might lose the faith. But there's an institution that doesn't lose faith. And that's what I believe in. To bring you death an analysis from a unique Latino perspective. There's not a single day that Paola and I don't call or text each other, sharing news and thoughts about what's happening in the country. This new podcast will be a way to make that ongoing intergenerational conversation public. Listen to The Moment with Jorge Ramos and Paola Ramos

as part of the MyCultura podcast network on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, I'm Jay Shetty, and I'm the host of the on-purpose podcast. Today, I'm joined by Emma Watson. Emma Watson has apparently quit acting. Emma Watson has announced she's retiring from acting. Has anyone else noticed that we haven't seen Emma Watson in anything in several years? Emma Watson is opening up the truth behind her five-year break from acting. Watson said she wasn't very happy. Was acting always something you were going to do? I was using acting as a way of escaping to feel free. My parents

It wasn't just the divorce, it was just like the continuing situation of living between two different houses and two different lives and two different sets of values. The career and the life that looks like the dream. But are you really happy? Fame has given me this extraordinary power. It's also given me a lot of responsibility. Listen to On Purpose with Jay Shetty on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. I started trying to get pregnant about four years ago now. We're getting a little bit older, and it just kind of felt like the window could be closing.

Bloomberg and IHeard podcast present. IVF disrupted, the kind body story. A podcast about a company that promised to revolutionize fertility care. Introducing Kind Body, a new generation of women's health and fertility care. Backed by millions in venture capital. and private equity, it grew like a tech startup. While Kind Body did help women start families, it also left behind a stream of disillusioned and angry patients.

You think you're finally like with the right people in the right hands, and then to find out again that you're just not. Don't be fooled. By what? All the bright and shiny. Listen to IVF disrupted, the Kind Body Story, starting September 19 on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

Buddyed by Chuck Schumer and Hakey Jeffries. All right, let's go ahead and get to this live update from that flotilla, from Alex Colston of Dropsite News. The Global Samud Flotilla, a convoy of ships, bringing humanitarian aid to Gaza, is getting closer and closer to the shore, but coming under increasing attacks from swarms of drones in the Mediterranean. And meanwhile, starting to get back up from European powers, including Italy, which has said it is sending a naval ship to assist the flotilla as well as Spain, which has said it also plans to intervene. There's some suggestions from Ireland that they may also get involved. Joining us now is my colleague over at DropSight News, Alex Colston, from the Sirius, is the ship you're still on? Is that right, Alex? That's right. It's called the serious ifa, because the boats are also named after Palestinian towns.

Got it, got it. So, and we apologize if many viewers get seasick from watching you kind of float up and down, but I imagine the seasickness is much worse among your crew. So I hope folks can just bear with us for the moment. So two nights ago, we saw, and the most serious attack yet on. the flotilla, which, you know, footage of which we just showed. Can you talk about, talk a little bit about what you know at this point about, you know, what kind of attacks there were and what kind of damage there was? Definitely. There were at least 12 attacks across nine boats. One boat was attacked twice with flashbangs. I think about four were also attacked with flashbangs. One had a chemical capsule fall to the deck, spray a member of the crew, and then it fell into the water.

The person sustained minor injuries. One of the flashbangs dismasted a boat, and that one was decommissioned, and so it's no longer sailing with us. And, yeah, they started around midnight, and they continued until about three in the morning. And around three, they tapered off, but we were all concentrated together. And it was actually kind of a remarkable scene, which is that there was just the horizon and the boats. And then every so often there'd be an explosion. And we would try to capture it because there's a lot of incredulity about the threat that the boats are under.

And so we are a bit at pains trying to, like, document the extent of the attacks. I mean, the footage you shared is from a security camera. And those security cameras are there, not merely for our security. It's to broadcast to the world that the boats are under attack. I don't know why there would be incredulity about that, given that Israel is basically calling you Hamas. We can put this up on the screen from the Israeli foreign minister. this is C2 guys. They say, we have another proposal for the Hamas Samud Floteliff.

This is not about provocation. And serving Hamas, you are welcome to unload any aid you might have at any port in a nearby country outside Israel from which it can be transferred peacefully to Gaza. Israel will not allow vessels to enter an active combat zone and will not allow the breach of a lawful naval blockade. Is this about aid or about provocation? Alex, how would you respond to that? I believe this was the most recent statement that they made. They've made a handful of them at this point. I can tell you what the organizers say, and I can tell you what I make of that.

But first to say that the organizers all say uniformly that if this were true, if Israel was willing to facilitate aid, there would be no real reason for the lotill to exist. There would be no reason for us to have independent civilian efforts. to break the siege and to get aid into Gaza. So if it's a provocation, the provocation is Israel should deliver the aid, but we know that they're not going to do that. We know that they're not going to deliver sufficient amounts of aid. They've funded UNRWA.

They've implemented a deadly, quote-unquote, humanitarian distribution mechanism that is helping to corral Palestinians, and then they are killed by Israeli forces, there's nothing to be believed in the statement that Israel is interested in facilitating aid to the people in Palestine. What have you heard from either Spain or Italy, or what have the organizers heard and what are they sharing with you? And have you started to see this Italian ship,

which said it would be there for rescue, by the way, it made clear that it would be there for potential rescue, rather, you know, which is distinct from saying we're going to be there to, you know, offer defense to the, to this flotilla. Have you, have the organizers heard from these governments or are these just statements that they're catching on social media just like everybody else? No, the members of the Syrian committee have met with members of the Spanish parliament. There's an Italian member of parliament on board who is in contact with the Italian

government. These are active and ongoing negotiations with European governments to come to an understanding about what kind of protection or support these governments are going to provide. The Italian government, for instance, has said that they would facilitate the aid themselves via a Catholic charity. The organizers have rejected this proposal. because the plan is to open up the humanitarian corridor. But at the same time, though, the organizers have also said that they welcome any and all governments to participate and facilitating the humanitarian mission.

But the fact of the matter is that we are going to sail toward Gaza with or without a military escort. Alex, how are you feeling at this point? On the one hand, you've got Israel outright attacking your boats and calling you Hamas. On the other hand, you do have at least a couple of European nations that are saying, hey, we're going to make sure that you at least don't get killed.

You know, I mean, just like as a human being, how are you feeling about your personal safety right now? So, so. It's hard to say what's going to happen. And, I mean, I say to myself, at least, and I think a lot of people agree, especially on the ship that I'm on, because we talk about it a lot.

we're trying to do what governments won't do and that requires a certain level of conviction and courage and commitment and at the same time whatever we do and whatever we're able to succeed at doing and trying to open an opening a humanitarian quarter it's it's minimal

and next to the courage of Palestinians to face being killed every day so I feel I feel a little bit like I don't want, I don't want to be over alarmed. I am nervous. And at the same time, I think the standard that has been set for courage is not with governments, but with the Palestinian people. I mean, and I think that that's good of you to say. But at the same time, there's no such thing as a courage Olympics.

and we all have one life on this planet and, you know, whether you lose it in Gaza or on a ship, because Israelis are sending some message, you've still lost a life. So, you know, I would discourage people from, and including yourself, from like, discounting, you know, what it is that you're, that you guys are going through. How are the rest of the people feeling going, it feels like a bit of a bit of a roller coaster two nights ago it seemed like they were presaging a much more violent attack and then the intervention of the the spanish and the italian navies seems like how was last night it seemed like it seems like last night was was was fairly quiet which went against the the expectations

and may have had something to do uh with the with the intervention of the europeans what's what's how was last night? It was, it was, um, it was low key, um, by comparison to the night before, uh, the waters that we're sailing into are increasingly getting more rough because there's a storm between Greece and Gaza and we're making preparations for that. I, I, just to respond to the other thing that you said, you know, I think, for me at least, uh, we can, we can control what we can control on this boat, which is that to demonstrate that we're a humanitarian mission, we're nonviolent, we're committed to humanitarian aid,

and everyone on board is also extremely conscientious and well-organized, and we take care of each other, and we, as it said, we protect us, and I think in that respect, I have to have trust in that, and I have to believe that the solidarity among the people on board and across the organization is enough to sustain our attempts, and I actually do believe in that quite firmly. I don't, of course, I'm worried for my personal safety, and of course I'm, and I think even more than that, and this is what all the organizers and crew members say on board, we're far more concerned about one another, like in the case of an Israeli interception, right? I think most of our impulse is to put our hand in front of someone and prevent them from being

harmed by Israeli soldiers or not let them be dragged off or harassed. You know, we're under strict orders not to do that so that we don't provoke the Israeli military. And I want to say that that's harder, for me at least, than to imagine being personally assaulted or whatever. Like, I just want to say that I think that's worth underlining, actually, that there is a real spirit of solidarity that's a matter of protecting those around us as we, like, have this very high-risk action that we're taking.

Alex, my last question to you, at least, is, you know, what's your fondest wish for what you're able to accomplish here? My fondest wish. Yeah, what would be the best possible outcome? That we make it to Gaza, for one, that European governments, if not the United States government, I don't have much faith in that, would help facilitate opening a humanitarian corridor that the ships that are following behind us will be able to maintain and keep it open so that there is a humanitarian corridor by sea

and that the Israeli government will be so overwhelmed by the public support for measures like this that that real significant humanitarian aid can be given the people in God. And I actually don't think I've, at the last couple of days, especially with the naval vessels joining us, I'm starting to believe more and more that it's not a wish, that there are real developments taking place that are making it increasingly likely for that outcome. And again, I understand it will be a difficult thing to achieve. But at the same time, we are in completely uncharted waters here, never as there have been a military escort. for any of these missions over the last 17 years during the blockade, never as there have been this much public pressure. So I would say the geopolitical situation is far more favorable,

even if the winds aren't favorable for us for an outcome like that. So I actually don't want to treat it like a remote possibility. I want to treat it as a live and significant one. And also, while you're here, I'll put in a plug for the work you're doing for Dropside. Alex, believe it or not, the entire time, been on this boat has continued his editing duties for drop site, including our new newsletter Dropside Daily, which the time zone is actually good for you because, right, the time you're handling is less in the middle of the night. But it's always amazing. I'll wake up and see that

Alex has already gone through like a full edit of the newsletter and then he's on to editing further pieces. How's it, how's it been to continue normal life, so to speak, speak, off the boat, while being kind of surrounded by Israeli drones and in the middle of Mediterranean, unable to see even a speck of land? Like, what's that experience been like? I mean, I missed normal life a little bit. I can imagine. I think I mentioned this to you before, Ryan, but I mean, I grew up on boats.

I'm not, you know, I don't get seasick. I really enjoyed being on boats. and you know trying to like maintain both my like day job and fix a toilet on the same day has been a bit difficult sometimes um but you know i i have a lot of i've made a lot of friends and i have comrades and people who i trust and we have camaraderie and and um and you know we we try to be happy and sing and stay afloat and I don't know I actually think compared to normal life sometimes that's a lot better because it's not isolating it's not atomizing we're all in this in one mission and one purpose yeah and as I mentioned we've got the newsletter and the editing from here on in you know just you know be safe keep your head down you know keep that toilet working keep the toilet working and you know just wishing you all the best and

the last leg of this journey. Yeah, thank you so much, Alex. We'll be following it closely, of course. Thank you so much. I'm Jorge Ramos. And I'm Paola Ramos. Together we're launching The Moment, a new podcast about what it means

to live through a time as uncertain as this one. We sit down with politicians, artists, and activists to bring you death and analysis from a unique Latino perspective. The moment is a space for the conversations we've been having us, father and daughter, for years.

Listen to The Moment with Jorge Ramos and Paola Ramos on the I-HeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, I'm Jay Chetty, and I'm the host of the on-purpose podcast. Today, I'm joined by Emma Watson. Emma Watson has apparently quit acting. Emma Watson has announced she's retiring from acting. Has anyone else noticed that we haven't seen Emma Watson in anything in several years? Emma Watson is opening up the truth behind her five-year break from acting.

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