Brian Windhorst & The Hoop Collective - Bucks’ Collapse, Pistons & Nuggets Make Statements, Lakers Comeback Chances?

Episode Date: April 30, 2025

Brian Windhorst is joined by ESPN's Tim MacMahon and Dave McMenamin to talk the Bucks’ epic collapse against the Pacers punctuated by Haliburton’s clutch plays, what this means for Milwaukee’s future, the Pistons holding off elimination at MSG by taking down the Knicks, the keys to the Wolves-Lakers pivotal Game 5, the Nuggets using a historic Jamal Murray game to take the series lead over the Clippers, the Celtics impressive domination and more! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hey, sports fans, the ESPN app has all of ESPN all in one place. The ESPN app is your home to thousands of live events, ESPN shows, and originals across every ESPN network and service. And now you can check if you already have ESPN Unlimited as part of your TV package for no additional calls. Visit activate.esPN.com to learn how to access your account or sign up, then start streaming in the ESPN app. It's all of ESPN all in one place. Sign up or activate now. Hello, welcome to the Hoop Collective podcast. We talk about the NBA, which we're doing on Wednesday morning after midnight. Joining us from Los Angeles, California, proudly filling in for Tim Bontemps is Syracuse's own Dave McManum.

Happy to be here. Timmy B. Don't get Wally Pipp. It's all I'm saying. It could happen. Timmy B, I don't even know who he is. Can't remember. He's from Dallas, Texas, where he continues to luxuriate after covering a sweep. It's Band McMahon. Pottie.

partners i think this should be more like a norm nixon magic johnson type of situation and we can get that that scene where they're playing one-on-one in the suits from uh what what's the show help me out winning time winning time yeah i've seen i've seen i've seen bontem's hoop now he does brag mac 10 about swatting your shot oh yeah okay there we go we had a whole two minutes before that came up but sure you did get me he got me all right did hit the final game winner yeah thank you Appreciate it. He sent me a thank you card referencing. All right.

So a big night in the NBA on Tuesday, four playoff games. I'm sure it's happened before, whether there's been four playoff games, game fours or fives. I don't remember, but it felt like a pretty big night. I guess they were all game fives. All right. I want to start with what went down in Indianapolis. Just a tremendous game. A lot happened.

Most importantly, the bucks were eliminated while the Pacers. Tyrese Halliburton with a game winner. Well, he had a game tying dunk to force overtime on a power drive. And then in overtime, it's just incredible drive and score. But really what happened was the Bucks were so gritty in this game. And Gary Trent Jr. played the role of Damien Lillard. I don't even know what he had 30-something points. But guys, and I know the thing happened with Tyrese Halliburton's dad,

John after the game, which I'll talk about, we'll talk about in a minute. I, you know, I know Halliburton had this great moment where he jumps on the scorers table, Duane Wade style, celebrating his great play. And then he tweets after the game, overrate that, which I know caught Dave in a special place because it was kind of a Kobe reference, right, Dave? Oh, yeah. So we had two references here. The amnesty of that, obviously, Kobe Bryant, after beating the Dallas Mavericks on a fade away

when Mark Cuban had suggested that the Lakers should amnesty and move off him. But also, we get the coach Beheim overrated drop here. When are you talking about Jerry McNamara after he took Syracuse's 2006? I think you're being a little, I think you're making Jackson tear up. But I do not think that Tyrese Halliburton was referencing Jim Beheim on Jerry McNamara. Amnesty that for sure. Mark Cuban flapsed his gums on the bitten skin show on the old 103.3 FM ESPN and Dallas. It's now like a whack job, religious station or something such.

And then Kobe lit them up and then let them know. Just so our listeners and viewers know, there was this thing back when Kobe was playing where you could use something called an amnesty, where you could basically take a player's contract and put it off your books. it was something for salary cap relief and like players who had big contracts who were no longer worth their contracts got amnestyed a couple of big names

and you know Kobe was coming back off the Achilles and you know was bought big money and you know whatever but so but the way Kobe tweeted it was the amnesty that T HAT in all caps and that and that was exactly the way that Tyrese tweeted it which

you know and by the way that you know Tyrese was a teenager when that went down there's no way Tyrese wasn't really remembering that. Oh, plus he's a guy, like he's a, he's got a Puma deal now, but he was a guy who wore Kobe. Yes. Like, yeah, he was, right. He was a Kobe guy. And, you know, in fact, he was just, obviously, that's referencing him just being named the most overrated player in NBA by the Athletics Anonymous poll, which Carlisle had his little thing. But I tell, what a moment, though. It took a complete collapse by the Bucks to. Well, that's what I want to talk about. I mean, I, we'll talk about Tyrese's

moment in a second. Here's the stat from ESPN stats and information. And guys, it's a jaw dropper. Okay? So first off, let me just say, in every collapse, or if you want to call it in every comeback, there's always a missed free throw. You've heard me say this in the past. It is going to hold true like almost all the time.

But when AJ Green hit a free throw with 40 seconds left in this game, the bucks went up by seven points, 40 seconds left and over. time. Seven points, 40 seconds left. AJ Green missed the second free throw, which is the one I'll always always miss free throw. But nonetheless, here is the stat. Since the play-by-play error happened, in other words, since where there's databases for this, you know, it's 1997, basically. Since 1997, teams were 0,609 in the playoffs. And I got to imagine it wasn't much better in the regular season in terms of winning percentage.

Oh, in 1600, when trailing by at least seven points in the last 40 seconds of the fourth quarter overtime. Now, the number is going to be really high because if you're down 27, you're not catching up. But the point is, you got a three possession lead with 40 seconds left. You are generally home free. Okay? And not only did the bucks lose, they lost, I mean, not only did they lose the lead, but they lost the game. They gave up an 8-0 run in the last 40 seconds. And this is what the story of this game is about.

I mean, you can look at other things. You know, we're going to talk about what happened in the extracurricular after the game. In a moment, Gary Trent had two turnovers, including the Pacers are desperate. Well, first off, Andrew Nimhart hit like a 30-footer. That was a huge three. That was a big moment. That cut the lead from 7 to 4. But Gary Trent has back-to-back turnover.

and the second one was just backbreaking. The Pacers threw two double teams at the Bucks. The Bucks defeated both double teams. They got the ball out of both double teams, and the ball comes to Gary Trent wide open on the wing. I mean, he can shoot the three if he wants, or he can just stand there and dribble the ball out. The ball just goes through his legs.

The ball just goes through his legs like a little league shortstop. After touching its hands, though, Brian, it touched his hands and then dribbled through his legs, which is it wasn't just a full width. It was like he just lost control of it. It was brutal because he played so well in overtime too. He played great all game. He had eight or nine threes.

He was awesome. So he's the hero. He goes from here to go because going back to game six at home in Milwaukee, obviously the Bucks would have momentum. No dame. Who knows? That sets you up to potentially seven. And then what I thought was amazing.

and I haven't read all of the interviews from postgame, but the bucks, you know, so the bucks are on defense, a ball gets inbounded, no timeouts. And the Pacers call a play, Pascal Seacom comes up and sets the screen for Halliburton, Yonis switches. As far as I can read by watching that, I think they ran the play to get Tyrese isoed on Yonis, right?

Like, there's no other way to read that. It'll look like. I have some texts out to some Pacers coaches, and I heard back from, I just realized I heard back from one of them. And they said, we trusted Ty to make a play. Balls. I mean, I just hope it kept the game ball, speaking of balls.

I know that's in this heated rivalry that they have. But look, man, you know, like Tyrese Halliburton was talking trashed the whole series long when it came time to end the thing, one-on-one against the, you know, The best player on the bucks, the best one of the top two or three best players in the world, beats them off the dribble, gets the layup. You know, there are all those silliness after that. Like, forget about all the silliness after that. What a moment for Tyre's Halliburton, who, you know, and one thing about, like, all the trash

talking between him and Dame and, like, it got heated. You know, Halliburton said after Dame went down, look, that's competitiveness. Like, he wears zero because of Dame. he's got that same sort of like, I want the rock in those moment type of things that Dame made a career out of. And this was his, you know,

it wasn't a buzzer beat, but it was basically his walk-off series ending moment. It reminded me of a game he had last year in the playoffs as well where he turned what looked like a sure loss into a victory. And this is the way he's been able to build, it was legacy and he was one of the guys in the U.S. Olympic team that looked like maybe he had no business being there. He didn't get much playing time. And you wondered if he was kind of benefiting from the All-Star Gaming in Indiana last year.

And the patients needed to prop up a candidate and maybe the weaker Eastern Conference, et cetera, et cetera. Well, the lighter efficiency that benefited him last year, right? but a rough physical playoff series and that guy got it done time after time after time and then in the final moments. Jackson tells us that Gary Trent only had one turnover in the whole series leading up to that.

I mean, tough man, but listen, this is a moment for Tyrese Alliburton to celebrate making those two plays. And he just, he gets to, he crosses you over, He gets the corner turned on Janus.

I'm not sure what the Bucks principles are. Kevin Porter, Jr., I don't know what he's supposed to do there. I assume that Janus, they don't necessarily normally have to help Janus. Halliburton goes right past him, as if he was passing him on the subway, just right past him. And just totally great shot. And so there's a lot that comes out of this. Tyrese Halliburton with a signature moment

against Janice in that play. There was unfortunately overshadowed by complete foolishness by his dad, but whatever. Okay. All right. So then the game ends. You know these teams don't like each other.

And Janus is involved in what I can tell are two different confrontations. Yes. One, John Halliburton, Tyrese's father, who is well known. And let me just say, I have a personal relationship with John

and I love him. I have spent time with him across the planet. Abu Dhabi, Manila, Paris, Las Vegas. I've, you know, I've been with him and spent some time with him. Love him. Love his passion. He is such a defender of his son. So proud that his son came up from, you know, Ashkosh, Wisconsin.

Mm-hmm. No. And, you know, talk to me about Tyrese's youth where like nobody appreciating, you know, all the kids from Milwaukee, you know, he and Tyler Hero kind of had similar upbrings in, you know, non-urban Wisconsin where nobody regarded them. They just saw these kids from the sticks. And John still lives in Ashgosh and still, I don't know if he's still rough. He's like a referee at the, with the why. I mean, anyway, having said all that, can't. You can't do it. First off, you can't come on the court. And you definitely can't stare down the guy who just got his guts ripped out and what might be his final moments in Milwaukee uniform and talk trash to him. And basically like you're asking for a confrontation there. And look, John Halliburton knows it. He tweeted it. I sincerely apologize to Janus, the Milwaukee Bucks and the Pacers organization from my actions following tonight's game. This is not a good reflection on her sport or my son. And I will not make that mistake again. You know, Tyrese knows it. He said my pops was not in the right. You know, Yonis said what he had to say. It's unfortunate that John Halliburton let his getting us get the best of him, want him to talk some trash and overshadowed what was the best moment of his son's career

to this point. Yes. And, okay. So I think Pat Conantin got there first. He steps in. Buck's security steps in. Then Janus goes back and basically has words with John Halliburton. E.J. McConnell came over there too, trying to kind of, you know, make sure things didn't escalate.

Right. And then Janus had words with him, which I think were kind of what Janus probably said in the postgame, which was that was disrespectful. But they left on decent terms. Then, well, I don't think it was decent. They parted like, okay. Yonis said what he had to say and John Halliburton heard it. Okay. Then Janice gets sort of chest to chest with James Johnson, which is the wrong position

to be in. I think James Johnson was trying to come in and kind of de-escalate other things. He also got into a Benedict Mathron. Well, Benedict Mathron runs his mouth too now. He does. And it seemed like Janus was telling him something along those lines. Yonis kind of had him by the back of the head and neck area, you know, like grabbing it, like, let me tell you something.

and there was some push in. And so I think James Johnson was coming in as a well-trained peacemaker. Well-trained in MMA. That's what I mean. But then I saw Janice and James Johnson like were in each other's face. And then they had another separate powwow where they left on good terms. So a lot of shenanigans went down there. I don't think any of them are relevant.

But I do want to go back to what you said about Rick Harlough. Rick Harle defended Tyrese Alliburton. which, you know, it's not surprising that he would when he was labeled most overrated. And then he put the ball in his hands against Janus and Tyrese Allberton delivered. And to me, that's the story of this game. It's not the shenanigans afterwards.

More Hoop Collective Podcast after this. Also, guys, Janus has 20, goes for 20, or 30 points, 20 rebounds, 13 assists, two steals, and two blocks. Yanis's numbers in this series are insane. And now we come... They're not close to... They got balanced in five games. Now we come to the other devastating stat for the bucks.

The last 10 playoff games that Janus has played in. And this is what Janus is going to have to confront in the offseason. And he pushed off. He was asked about his future and about whether he can still win championships in Milwaukee after the game. And he basically said, I don't want to talk about that right now. And I respect that. Yeah.

In the last 10 playoff games that he's played, he has averaged 30 points, 16 rebounds, 6 of 6 or 7 assists on over 50% shooting. And they are 1 and 9. That is just an indictment. And I know that there's been injuries. I know that there's been things out of their control. There's injuries moving forward. So and things that. But how can you look at that if you.

you're Janus. Like, look, if he says I just want to be a buck, I respect it. But if he says he wants to win, I'm not trying to be a... You can't... What am I supposed to... Dave, what's he supposed to say? Well, whom are we indicting, Brian? We're indicting the bucks in their future.

You know, that's where we're indicted. What was John Horst just rewarded with a contract extension before this playoffs began? He was. Actually, in the middle of the playoffs. And look, I'll say this for John Horst. He's made two massive blockbuster trades that have gotten Yonis to sign extensions. The first one, Drew Holliday, led immediately to a championship. The second one, Damian Lillard, didn't work the way anybody hoped that it would in Milwaukee.

And obviously, that was even before the Achilles. He's the third player in postseason history with a 30-2010 game and a loss. The other two were Yokic and Lou Alcindar. before he changed his name to Creamle of Diljabar. Oh, two bucks. Another buck, which, you know, how'd that end? Not great. I just think the conversation will shift between us and between everyone else in the league

immediately to what's the best place for him to go because clearly he's been spinning his wheels since 2021. And at least right one playoff series win since 2021 since he won the championship, but one of the most dominant clinching games we've seen in the history of basketball. Yeah. His top three MVP finished this year. But when your big mid-season acquisition for this team was Kyle Kuzma. I know I've been a Kyle Kuzma supporter in the past.

I saw him play his best pass for his career in the bubble for the Lakers, but he hasn't been that guy either. Well, Kyle Kuzma wasn't the guy tonight. He was basically nailed to the bench in this game. He played 13 minutes at an overtime game. For Lopez, by the way, played eight minutes. I believe he had as many turnovers, has made field goals in the series.

Not ideal. All right. But look, Janice answered it by not answering the question tonight, which, look, he can either lie, he can be honest, or he can not answer. But not answering is a form of honesty. Of course, he's not looking. Like, how could he look at this situation

and think, you know what? Hey, man, we're going to be okay. like we're going to be able to contend. Of course he doesn't. He'd be delusional to think he's going to have a chance to continue to contend for champion. Or I should say to contend for championships again with Milwaukee because he obviously hasn't for these last few years.

And like Dave said, it's definitely going to shift. And like it's not like nobody's been talking about this before, but it's definitely going to shift to what's the best fit, what's the best fit? what's the most reasonable fit for Janus among the teams that would have interest and assets to be able to pull off that kind of the trade. All right. The other gigantic game that took place on Tuesday night, the Detroit Pistons go into Madison Square Garden and extend the series with a huge victory over the Knicks.

I got to say, probably two of the biggest moments of the postseason so far happened over the weekend when Aaron Gordon throws down the Immaculate Put Back or whatever I don't even know. That's not even a good... I heard Brian Anderson say that tonight on TNT. I don't know if that's the nomenclature for it. Whatever it is, that's a one-off moment in NBA history and could end up swinging that series.

Denver goes up 3-2. And then the other one was the non-call on Tim Hardaway, Jr., getting fouled. Because obviously, if they call that foul and Hardaway makes two of three free three, free throws. If he makes one of three, they go to overtime. He makes two or three. It's now the Pistons up three to. We'll never know what had happened tonight that the Pistons done that. But certainly if you're a Piston fan, you're holding your head on that. But nonetheless, all of these games,

I know in game one, the Knicks ran away with it late, but all of these games have been decided in the fourth quarter. And the last four games have come down to it. And the reason that the Knicks were ahead was because Jalen Brunson was great. in these fourth quarters. Carl Towns has had some moments too. Jalen Brunson wasn't tonight. He was 416. And then in a moment that really defined what happened in the game, Jalen Brunson retweaked his right ankle with about three minutes to go in a two-point game and had to come out of the game. Josh Hart also had to come out of the game. And they were out for two minutes. and in that stretch,

Cade Cunningham, who had 13, he didn't have a great overall night, Kate Cunningham, by his standards. It was considering there was an elimination game, his first ever elimination game, it was a great game on the road. But he's had more prolific games, but he goes six or 17.

But he made like three plays and including a brilliant pass to Jalen Duren, I believe. And the Nicks, or the Pistons go up six points, and the Nicks have three consecutive empty possessions without their late game hero in there. And he's, you know, they had to call the thing is Tibbs had to call time out because he's got Josh Hart and Jalen Brunson out. Josh Hart's laying on the ground and Brunson's limping. So he has to call time out. And he doesn't even

have the ball, I don't think. Or maybe they had the ball. Yeah, they did have the ball. But he's got to call time out for an injury stoppage. Um, So he's only got one left, and he's got his two vitally important players, his best offensive player and his best defensive player, his most versatile defensive player, are at this table, and they can't get in for like two or three possessions, two or three vital possessions. Detroit makes it a six-point lead, and then New York can't overcome it. Mikhail Bridges, by the way, hit a couple of big shots down the stretch. He had 13 points in the fourth quarter.

It wasn't like they didn't play well. They played well enough to win, but that stretch, was defining. I thought that defined the game. And, you know, Azir Thompson had his, by far, his biggest playoff game of all time.

You know, he's not, he's not an offensively skilled player, but he went eight of ten. He missed six free throws, but still went eight of ten. And that was vital scoring for the Pistons because it was not one of the games

where their role players were hitting a ton of shots. So this is gritty series. And now, you know, the Pistons have a chance. a McMahon to go home and try to force a game seven. Yeah, and it's awesome experience for a bunch of guys who are playing their first playoff series.

You know, obviously, they've got some bets. Tobias Harris, by the way, they were criticized for that signing. He's really been big for them this year. You know, it didn't put up. It was still an overpay, but he has been great in this series. But it was an overpaid that, look, it's not like they're going to hit the salary cap. I understand. I'm just making a, I'm just responding.

You're right, but it was, he's been well worth what they've paid him, not just because of the production, the space and that he brings, but he's been a crucial veteran for that group. But man, I was extremely impressed with Cade Cunningham tonight. And yeah, six of seven, uh, or six of 17, five turnovers. Sure. That dude was in attack mode all night long. got to the line 12 times, 24, 8, and 8. You know, another Kobe reference.

He definitely had some Kobe assist, including one critical one where, you know, he's drawn three guys as he's attacking the basket, and Jalen Dern's there to clean up the trash and get a dunk during that stretch. You know, that guy has proven himself to be a superstar this year and is showing in this series that he's ready for this. He's not intimidated by the moment. Brian, you did mention the Pistons, role players, maybe not hit as many shots. You might have missed one of the shots taken.

We'll see if it was hit by Malik Beasley post game, where he decided to quote a Knicks fan who said, quote tweet a Knicks fan, who said, you know, watch out. Malik Beasley is getting a 44 next game. And Beasley, I'm not Malik Beasley. Malik Beasley got a tweet about Mikhail Bridges who said, watch out. Cal Bridges getting 44 next game. And Blake Beasley quote tweeted and said, Minutes. That,

probably, probably actually. Little ammo for the next. Well, Beliefie's not afraid to, you know, he's not a great A trash talker, but he's not afraid to say stuff.

I love it. Well, he's got trash talk body language with that shimmy. Been like one guy's shimmy on him. Oh, Yonis did to him earlier. Not too long ago, pretty recently this season. But, man, no.

Fun series, not a pretty series, but this is a battle. And again, I love seeing the Pistons, a bunch of guys, you know, for the most part, who haven't been in this situation, hadn't been on the stage. This is Madison's Square Garden coming off of just a gut-wrenching loss. So they feel like they got screwed. if they don't show up, the season's over. And, dude, whether they are able to, you know, make a historic run and come back and win the series or not,

I'm impressed by the Pistons. Like, this is good stuff from a young court. It's got a chance to be together for a while. Yeah, and by the way, Tobias Harris, 17 points, which was a draw with Carl Towns. And guarded towns a lot. Yep. Who steals four blocks in addition to eight rebounds?

I mean, that's, that's, you know, six stocks in a road elimination game. Like, that's playmaking right there. Hey, he had a better year than Paul George did. I'll tell you that. Empirically true. I thought the Knicks actually got good play from their bench in this game. Their bench outplayed the Pistons bench. Mitchell Robinson had 13 and 11 and two steals and two blocks.

And I think he had eight offensive rebounds. Like there was a bunch of possessions that, you know, he saved because he got the ball. And, you know, Miles McBride, you know, his stats don't look so good, but, you know, he was, you know, effective. They didn't just totally wither when Brunson was on the bench. They, I think, you know, he gave them some good minutes. So, you know, they actually, Tibbs actually, you know, played those guys. In fact, believe it or not, Tibbs didn't play anybody 40 minutes in this game, which, you know, like he actually played a rotation. that, you know, he played an eight-man rotation.

And he got, the starters all had production. Ananoi at 18, you know, Josh Hart had 15, 7 rebound, 6 assist, two steals, two blocks. Like, you know, Bruns, other than Brunson having a bad shooting night. And Cat, they've got to have either Brunson or Cat put up numbers. But what I'm saying is... Neither one of them did. They combined for 33 points on 30 field goal attempts. It's going to be really hard for them to win.

The Knicks didn't lay an egg. The pistons just took it. Yeah. Is what I want, is the point I'm trying to make. And, um, and, uh, and that's really what was, what was key. And so this, I know, I mean, like, probably the Knicks are going to win because the idea that the pistons could win three in a row is a big ask, but like, the difference of these games is, you know, you can't, you can put a sheet of paper between these two teams.

And, you know, so it's hard to know which way it'll go. Obviously the, you know, the, you know, the, you know, the, you know, the, have got to be, you know, sick that they lost games three and four at home to lose two home games. It's just brutal. But, you know, they get a chance to win and force a game seven if they can get it done on Thursday night. Hey, here's a Cade Cunningham stack, courtesy of Syracuse educated Jackson. Yeah. Only players to average 25, 8, and 8 in their first five career playoff games, Luca,

Oscar Robertson, Cade Cunningham. Not bad company. More Hoop Collective podcast after this. We're going to talk about a really important game, which was the game I was at in Miami on Monday night, which the cows won by 55. Just kidding.

Just kidding. Boy, was I glad I went down there for that one. That was a highly efficient use of my time. Bye. Hey, get this. His violin's out, baby. Yeah. No, I always love going to playoff games in Miami.

No, we're going to swing it over to Los Angeles. We got two teams Los Angeles to talk about the Nuggets took a three, two series lead on Tuesday night, winning at home over the Clippers. But we got a humongous game Wednesday night that Mr. McManneman will be attending at Crypto.com, where the Lakers try to stave off elimination against the wolves. Dave, a lot has been reacted to and said about J.J. Reddick's decision. to not substitute in the second half. You went to his press conference that he had, and he basically said, I don't take it back, if I'm not mistaken.

What was your viewpoint of the way that played out and what's left the Lakers facing a 3-1 series deficit here? You might have heard this before, Brian? Genioretic is a very self-assured young man. some may even say stubborn listen he went to Duke

what he that's your contribution I knew you were going to add that context that helps us paint the full picture of the man he in my opinion has nothing to apologize for

he made the decision a half time to make that switch pick the right time to do it in the series seemingly because that group responded with a 14-0 run to begin the third quarter with Dore Anthony Smith, the 6-9 switchable forward in there for Jackson Hayes. They won the quarter convincingly as well.

It wasn't just that start to the quarter, 36 to 23. Checked in with this guys in between the third and fourth quarter, told them, listen, if you need a blow, tell me we have timeouts. We'll use them. And that group had a seven-point lead with four and a half minutes ago in the game. at that point when you have gone 17 of the 24 minutes of the second half you're going to bring in Gabe Vincent or Jared Vanderbilt No you're bringing them to start the fourth quarter So well I mean but you you've you've already blown past that red light so yeah no he I agree

I agree with four minutes to go there were Thelma and Louise you know but I just Luca and LeBron got tired in my view well and look it didn't work out for him they look like they ran out of gas. Anthony Edwards, who played the whole second half as well, certainly did not run out of gas. And that, to me, Anthony Edwards is the guy who we need to be talking about in the end of the series. Like, hey, let's give credit to this 23-year-old ascending superstar who has snatched control of this series. And, you know, we can nitpick JJ Reddick's coaching decision. I think it's highly questionable, second-guessable, all that kind of stuff. But the reason, the primary reason the Lakers have their backs against the wall

is because Anthony Edwards has been the best player in the series, and he has willed the Timberwolves to a 3-1 lead. I just think more TV time, ink, hand-ringing when it comes to NBA coverage goes into minutes and waiver-wire acquisitions than anything else. And they are both misnomer. They both amount to nothing, quite frankly. These guys are high-level athletes. They have the adrenaline in the moment. They know what they're doing. They condition themselves year-round to be in this moment. You know, Nico Harrison might have something to say about that, but one of the guys on the court in game four. But I don't have a problem with it, honestly. And you could say they got tired. You could say it was an anomaly that leukemiss to layup. An anomaly, it's

anomaly that LeBron missed one, an anomaly that Oster Reeves missed two butt-naked threes that he's going to make every other day of his life. They had a call go against them, which the NBA admitted to that there should have been two free throws for Loco with about 33 seconds left to go in the game. They're down one. They could have been up one and had a totally different complexion to the end of things. And by the way, late in the third quarter, JJ Obrick tried to sub in, gave Vincent, brought him to the scorers table.

no break in the action from the 138 mark when he brought him over till it went below 50 seconds. And so he pulled him back to the bench at that point because he wasn't going to just have him go in for 45 seconds of cardio if a break even came. And let's say that happens. Let's say Gabe Vincent goes in with a minute 38 to go and they lose the game. And then we don't have this big stat that everyone's talking about that no coach ever in the last 27 years has played five guys for the entirety of the second half. And let's say they still lose, but that's that doesn't exist. Like, is JJ again the same type of strife?

I don't know, man. I just don't know. I just don't buy it. Luca and LeBron looked tired. LeBron didn't score in the fourth. They combined to go one of eight in the fourth quarter. Yeah, I mean, I mean, there's two shots. LeBron also had a block at the rim on Dante Vugentenzo.

No, I agree. He used to energy. He didn't look too tired on that one. No, I agree. He used to, you've watched LeBron for decades. He moderates his energy and he rests during the game. It's one of the great things he's learned to do during his career is rest during the game. I'm not saying it's one of the things I started really paying attention to it.

In his second stint in Cleveland. And it was like boxers and swimmers do this. You know, boxers, you know, and Muhammad Ali was brilliant at it. And I know for a while LeBron was super interested in Muhammad Ali. I don't know if he studied that. But, you know, boxers find ways to get little. scraps of rest in the middle of rounds. Swimmers find ways to get rest when they, you know, when they turn and they, you know, rest their

arms or whatever. And, you know, LeBron has done this brilliantly throughout his career. He slows down when he needs to rest. He was resting on offense. And he needed extra rest because he didn't get any out of the game. That's my opinion. Anybody can disagree. I will say this.

Two things about the Laker team. They're too shallow, which everybody knows. and JJ knows too because he's voting with his actions. There's no defense. They don't have a big, clearly. He doesn't trust Jackson Hayes. He played him four minutes. In the fourth quarter of the last two games,

they got outscored by 10 points in the fourth quarter of game three. They got outscored by 13 points in the fourth quarter of game four. Maybe there's a ton of reasons why that happened. I think fatigue was a factor. They get outscored in those two quarters in the paint, 20, I think, to four, 20 to six. It's hard. And we know that, like, Luca thrives on having a basket protecting lob threat.

Yeah. And they've just abandoned that because they have a basket protecting lob threat who happens to be a backup. But he can be effective. We've seen Jackson-Nays be effective. But JJ is so apparently turned off that they've taken their basket defending lob threat that helps Luca in myriad ways. I think he's a lob threat. A rim protector, I think is. Well, he's a better rim protector than Dorian Finney Smith.

He's not, they're not a better defensive team. I agree with you, but I'm saying the points in the pan are like 20 to 4. Well, and you do really run into some problems there because, you know, when Ant wants to attack and get downhill, he's pretty damn good at it. Which is why Aunt has gotten more free throws than three pointers, which is not the case in the regular season. And again, I'm sorry, the other guy, Julius Randall's having a hell of a series. It has been amazing. There's been a lot talked about about that trade. It wasn't like Kat basically paid almost immediate dividends in New York.

And the fit was being clunky with Randall and the Wolves for most of this year. But man, you want to play small ball. Julius Randall is going to be a load because he can create. And he is, he's like a, you know, like a tackle breaking tight in. I mean, he is a big physical bully ball dribble creation. And that's been huge in the series. He's been punishing them in transition. He has not having the ball stick as much.

I mean, making quick decisions when he catches on the perimeter. They're putting it right on the floor. Catch and shoot threes. He's here to draw and some fouls on those shots as well. He's been tremendous. Where I'm in agreement with you, Brian, the fourth quarter, it wasn't just in the last two games, the entire series, I think the Lakers been outscored 105-69.

they're only shooting 32% from there. Again, getting back to the Milwaukee conversation, who are we indicting? I think you could say JJ's coaching, you could also say he looks at the covered and he sees it's bare. And so he goes with the guys. Yeah, they made a decision in February to rescind the trade.

And they knew when they rescinded the trade that they were going to hamstring themselves at that position. There was no way to really address it. And Don Connect's not a rotation player in the playoffs as a rookie. Certainly not. I mean, but he started, Jay did stop playing him down the stretch of the season. Right. You know, but.

And they also, to get Luca, it was a two for one deal. They gave up two rotation players for one. So it was a trade. Look, they'll do that trade a thousand times out of a thousand. Right. Yeah. Look. And look, it doesn't mean that they can't, obviously, they got the three seat.

They accomplished, you know, they did a great job with it. There's a formula for them to win. but that formula is narrow. You know, they're what, you know, I'm not saying that the thread of needle, but what they have to pull off to win

is just narrower. Their margin for error was narrower than a lot of other teams. And by the way, you mentioned Julius Randall for sure. He was great coming down the stretch of the season, which is why they finished 17 and 4. Jade McDaniels has had three excellent games in this series as well.

After getting worn out by Luca last year in that Western Conference finals, He's been big time on both ends. The Clippers go into Denver tonight, licking their wounds from that tough loss in game four, and they hold Nikoliyokic to four of 13 shooting and 13 points. They were switching and living with Chris Dunn and James Harden on him, and it was working, and they still get run out of the building because of two reasons.

one, Jamal Murray had one of the great playoff games of his career and you know he's got a bunch. Yeah. But this is the Jamal Murray that the Nuggets paid a max contract to last summer, which was a questionable decision, but they paid it to him because they know that in the playoffs he turns into an all-star

and he was an all-star in this one. Eight of 14 on threes, 43 points. And just in general, excellent play by the role players of the Nuggets. It was what I would term a home win in the NBA, which is where your role players step up great. Christian Brown had a great game. Aaron Gordon, I mean, he's a high-level role player, but he had a great game.

Russell Westbrook in first. Russell Westbrook, 8 of 15, hit 3 out of 6-3s, 21 points. He had some suspect play in the second half, but they had built a cushion and they could withstand it. and man, four out of 13 you hold Yokich 2 you know, if you're the clippers

you let game one get away from you you absolutely have a brutal game 4 loss. You know, you figure those two games you could at least maybe go one in one and instead you go 0 and 2.

Then you hold your defensive game plan works and you hold Yokish to 413 to lose those three games in those fashions, it's tough. But the bottom line, Dave, is that it's three, two nuggets, and the nuggets have home court. They get to play game seven at home. And they look like a championship team tonight again. Yeah, and the clippers are going to kick themselves.

You know, they missed 10 free throws. When they were able to cut into it late, you know, there is a miss free throw by Zubaj. There's a uncharacteristic turnover by Powell where he doesn't kind of seem to have any plan where he's going with the ball dribbles into basically a trap with Gordon and I believe it was Westbrook in the right wing and Denver again they're going to have to go into it and try to win on the road here and show the heart of a champion some of those guys possessed that won a couple years ago I've had no means do I feel like the

Clippers are out of this thing, though. They had a slow start here. Christian Brown was great. The momentum plays he made at the end of the third quarter, again, just pushing the margin wider so that when by time, the clippers were ready to make their final push, you know, they're dealing with, I think it was like 19 or something like that, versus 12. Too much to overcome. But I love the defensive. effort we saw from James Hardin.

Kauai continues to show shades of the guys in the time finals MVP. I like the clippers still in the spot that they're in. James Hardin had an offensive dud tonight, three of nine. Now it's not in the top 15 of his worst playoff games, but

sorry to say. But let me just, McMahon, let me just tell you two plus minus numbers from this game. Michael Porter Jr. plus 34. okay in 37 minutes and the clippers lose this game by 16 and kawai played 37 minutes and his 37 minutes they're minus 7 yeah in the you know 11 minutes he's off the court court you know they're minus 11 so well and then

porter didn't do anything necessarily special but him toughing out 37 minutes with a bad shoulder I mean, it's not a shooting shoulder, but when you shoot the ball, you can't know, it's hard not to involve that other one. Shot it well, three of five from three. And, you know, clearly was at least a useful defensive player. You can't outscore the other team by 34 and 37 minutes unless you're doing something right on that end. But I tell you, man, you know, and Joe got a bad shooting night, did still have a triple double, had the 12 assists, obviously just to masterful facilitator. For him to go four of 13 and the Nuggets put of 131 points, that's pretty eye-opening.

And look, you said it like, dude, if Jamal Murray plays at the level that he did during that championship run, the Nuggets are real deal threats. And we haven't seen a ton of that for Murray this year. You didn't see it much at all last year during the playoffs. But the guy's got a reputation as a playoff killer for a reason. This is a 640 point playoff performance. And just like he was in complete control. And you know, you know you're going to throw extra bodies at a joker. If you have to throw an extra body at Murray, it's going to be tough.

by no means do I think the series is over. It is interesting to think about potential matchups for Nuggets Stunder. But, you know, the Clippers are going to have a chance. And as much as, ooh, mile high, you know, they have the 5280 jerseys on today and all that kind of stuff, they're not upbeat. I hate that. I hate when they put, you know, one of the gimmick courts down during a vital playoff game. Sorry if that makes people. Those are also terrible uniforms.

but it's not like they're unbeatable in a home game seven. They lost last year in a home game seven. That's right. Well, some people may wonder who would the Thunder prefer to play? The Thunder would prefer to play the team that has to win a game seven. Yeah, I was going to say. And then immediately fly the Oklahoma. Exactly.

More than anything, the Thunder just want this series to go seven games. They want games six and seven to be bloodbass. They want the, you know, they want whoever to, whoever emerges from this series to arrive in Bricktown all blooding and bruised. It is a compliment that we don't have to talk about the Celtics because they handle their business, which they did by closing out the magic. This is what happened last year. The Celtics, nobody paid attention to him because they went flying through the east. I just want to point something out about Jason Tatum games three, four, and five. He heard his wrist, had the bone bruise.

Go to Orlando, 36. points, nine rebounds, four assists. He did have seven turnovers in that one, but that was his game three. Game four, 37 points, 14 rebounds, three assists, three steals. And then the closeout game, 35 points, eight rebounds, 10 assists, 10 of 16 shooting. By the way, the Celtics bench dominated in this game as well. So Drew Holliday is, you know, missed last few games with a hamstring, so that's a thing. but now they'll get to rest a little bit and the Pistons winning bought them some extra days. The Cavs Pacer Series will start on Sunday.

I suspect, you know, I guess it could start Saturday, but I suspect we're looking at Monday for the start of Celtics, whomever wins Detroit, New York. So they're going to have maybe, I would guess six days off. Maybe it'll be shorter, but that was big and Tatum got it done.

By the way, Tatum tonight passed Patrick Ewing, Robert Parrish, and Charles, on the all-time career playoff scoring list. He's now 35th in NBA history, and he's just starting his prime. That's right. Ode to him. All right. Thank you so much to Dave McManneman. Thank you to McMan. Thank you to Jackson for staying up till the wee hours to put this together. Thank you for watching and listening to the Houp Collective. We will be talking to you later this week. Adios amigos.