Brian Windhorst & The Hoop Collective - CP3 To Clippers, Marcus Smart To Lakers & Western Conference Tiers

Episode Date: July 22, 2025

Brian Windhorst is joined by ESPN's Tim Bontemps and Tim MacMahon to react to Chris Paul signing with the Clippers including how far the veteran depth in LA could carry the Clippers before talking the potentially bigger reason Lakers’ fans can be excited about the Marcus Smart signing. Then, the guys tackle a tier ranking of the top of the Western Conference and talk Valanciunas committing to the Nuggets. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hey, sports fans, the ESPN app has all of ESPN all in one place. The ESPN app is your home to thousands of live events, ESPN shows, and originals across every ESPN network and service. And now you can check if you already have ESPN Unlimited as part of your TV package for no additional calls. Visit activate.esPN.com to learn how to access your account or sign up, then start streaming in the ESPN app. It's all of ESPN all in one place. Sign up or activate now. Hello and welcome to the Hoop Collective podcast. We talk about the NBA, which we are doing on Monday afternoon. Joining me from New York City, just back across the ocean from Weeks on End in Portugal is Timbontems. Hello, everybody. Join us from Dallas, Texas. Just back from Los Angeles is Ban McMan.

Howdy. Partner squeezed in a little trip to Michigan and then Wisconsin in between as well. That's right. You were on a college tour. Yeah. Go blue. Go blue and not so much buckies. Oh, really? Yeah. Michigan wins out against Wisconsin again? Yeah, it was a blowout. It was a blowout. No disrespect to Michael Finley, Devinayers, and our other Wisconsin friends. Yeah, we got a lot of Wisconsin people in media around. All right. We'll keep that under advisement. I understand you have to send your offspring to the Big Ten.

Texas can't do it. If it's my vote, we're still going to hook them. Trust me. I remember with a great story that Matthew McConaughey told about, he was either going to go to TCU or to UT. You know, one was four times the price of the other. And he told the story about when he went to tell his dad, you know, that he had chosen UT and his dad, you know,

was very excited. Sounds like you have the same thing. He's like, I always knew you were going to be a longhorn. So I don't know what speech you need, but I'm sure your investment account will have a certain opinion. All right. Her big sister is leading the recruiting efforts, but let's talk about the NBA. We talk about the NBA. We certainly do.

All right. So we have some Los Angeles teams making transactions, significant rotation transactions, the one that went down today. Chris Paul signing with the Clippers, a one-year deal for the minimum. pretty good value for a player who was a full-time starter last year in San Antonio. And I mean full-time. It's a full-time. Yeah. Actually, you want to say something about the Clippers.

I don't know what it's worth. Bobby Marks cooked up this number earlier. The guys on their bench and their second unit, and, you know, with everybody's healthy, which who knows. But the guys in their second unit, and we're talking basically Brooke Lopez, Chris Paul, Bradley Beal being the three-court guys John Collins. Yeah, John Collins, he says as a starter, but I think he has...

I would flip Collins and Beal, but we'll discuss. Go on. Well, whatever. He has said they got 287 games of starting last year. So they've got two starting units. Now, whether both of them should be starting units is a different situation.

But Chris Paul signs with the Clippers. Look, he could have signed somewhere else and gotten a bigger role. Milwaukee was in there. Dallas was in there. I'm not sure. Phoenix. I don't think, I think Chris Paul was interested in Phoenix.

I'm not sure the sons were serious contenders for him at the end. I would eventually to see him, how would that DeAngel Russell, Chris Paul rotation, have worked, McMahon. That would have been interesting. I think that one was more De Anzel Russell or Chris Paul, but certainly Milwaukee was an option right up until the end. And listen, he probably, he could have gone to Milwaukee and been their starting point guard this season. He chose to go back to the Clippers and he chose to take a smaller role

to be a full-time dad is one big factor. Yeah, so here's the thing I'm not sure about. So first off, Chris Paul, $3.6 million is an excellent value, even at 40 years old. I think last year he still had a seven to one and a half assist a turnover ratio. You know, still very efficient overall, still can run your offense, you know, still will be a great leader. But it was interesting the Clippers press release about this. Lawrence Frank is quote, he made it very clear, Chris is coming here to be a reserve guard, which, you know, from what I understand, James Harden was on board with his signing. But, you know, McMahon, you know, just in case anybody had any doubts that James Hardin will be the starter. And reserve guard was in there. I think those were key words. Chris Paul obviously

came off the bench two years ago when he was traded to the Warriors. He didn't choose that situation, but he was traded there. And he came off the bench, the majority of the games backing up Steph Curry. But he's been a starter, 98% of his career, 95% of his career. So, but I just think it's interesting that the Clippers made very clear in their release. Chris Paul's Keering coming here to come off the bench. And I'm sure he understands that. I'm sure Hardens on the same page with everything like that. But just think it should be noted that that's what the the plan is. Yeah, that exact sentence is he is joining us as a reserve point guard and is excited to fill whatever role T. Liu asked him to play, which is interesting. Something tells me that was a

negotiated sentence one way or another. Yeah. And look, last year, he went to San Antonio. I would say there were probably two major reasons that he went to the spurs. Money and a starting role. They offered both. That was part of, you know, part of the negotiation. This is very clear. He He's not coming to the clippers to start. You know, there's no surprises here. There's no, you know, there shouldn't be any bad blood, but there is going to be natural curiosity about how CP3 handles that, right? I mean, just CP3 out of minimum is a tremendous value addition.

But is CP3 one of the most competitive, proudest dudes of this generation? really going to be okay to come in as a backup who might even sit out from time to time? You know, it might even be an occasional DMPCD behind James Harden. And Chris Dunn. Why would he be a DMPCD? I don't really understand that. He's going to immediately be one of the best backup point cards in a league. He was a solid average, if not above average starter last year.

I mean, he didn't score a ton. like this turnovers off the charts he's still he had like I think five or six winshares last year like on a minimum it's a fantastic signing for the clippers

and if he plays 18 minutes a game off the bench when they have one guy who can currently dribble and if you count Bradley Beal two on the team what like why wouldn't he play every game because Chris Dunn has been their backup well and there might be nice

isn't really a point guard They could play together. There might be nice where they say, hey, there might be nice where T. Lou says, hey, we need Chris Dunn's on-ball defense more than we need CP3 or orchestrated. Why can't they play both guys? They have one guy who could dribble. The point is this. The Clippers clearly don't want that possibility to be something that would cause problems. Whether it happens or not, the Clippers want there to be the understanding of, hey, if T. Liu decides one night, it's best to leave you out of the rotation, we've got to roll with it. That's the point, not whether it makes sense regular basis.

Sure. The guy's a 40-year-old point guard who signed a minimum deal. Like, I don't know. The guy is a first ballot hall of famer. Yes. I understand. I understand that. My point is, he could have, as you guys laid out, right, he actively chose to not pick the places where he would have played for. So while in the past, we all know how Chris has structured his choices on these things, right? This time, the action here, again, actions over words, the action here very clearly says Chris wanted to be back home. And that was all really that I think all of us had heard for months now was like whether it was Phoenix, as you said, Brian, I don't know what Phoenix's level interest was, whether it's Phoenix or L.A.

After being away from Los Angeles for a while, the motivation pretty clearly seemed to be to get back there and play. And like I said, to me, he just fills a massive need for the Clippers. Chris Dunn's a nice player. I just think those two guys coming off the bench can fit quite well together. And then you roll out there with a second unit with Chris Dunn. Chris Paul, Nick Batum, John Collins, and Brooke Lopez. That is a damn good second unit. We're out there with those five guys,

and you're going to be cooking if you're the Clippers to me. At the end of the day, the Clippers season will be defined by the health of Kauai Leonard and the effectiveness of James Hardin. I would even just stop at the health of Kauai Leonard, period. That will define their season. But you need Hardin to be effective when it matters. Yeah, Hardin will be fine.

But if Kauai Leonard's healthy, they've got a chop. they've got a shot. If he's not healthy, they're going to be a really good regular season team because they're really deep. People got mad on Twitter today because I made a joke about the expendables, the movie from all the 90s action heroes from 10, 12 years ago. So I think Clippers are going to be really good. Like we talked about the other day on the pod, I look at him like that.

It's a weird comparison because of all the star power. But I compare him sort of that Denver Nuggets team after the Carmelo trade, where they had like 11 good players, no real superstars, and won 57 games for losing to Golden State in the first round. I don't know if they have like championship stealing because all the questions about Kauai's health. And obviously you have to assume he's probably not going to be healthy just based off his track record.

But they've got 10-11 really good players. And they're going to be able to roll guys out every night. Backing up your expendables. This is from stats. The Clippers rotation, this 11 deep that you're talking about, The youngest of them is John Collins, who's going to be 28 before the start of the season. So on those 11 guys, the youngest guy, I'll be 28. And only two other teams have ever used 11 players in a game, in a single game, not in your rotation.

That are that old? Where the youngest guy was 28, and that was the Clippers in 2016, 17, which I think Chris Paul was in that. He was older than 28, which happened for one game. Yes. And in 1998, 99, the Miami Heat did it for five games. So it's happened six times in the history of the league where you've had every 11 guys 28 or older. Yeah.

And if you're going to rely really old players, you better have a lot of them, right? Well, that's true. Yeah. But, Wendy, that gets back to your point about, like, Hardin's effectiveness, absolutely is going to be a huge, huge key for the clip. and you can argue the addition of Chris Paul, certainly on paper, should help Hardin's effectiveness for no other reason that it's going to get Hardin's workload back to something that's manageable. James Hardin in his mid-30s should not be fifth in the league in minutes.

James Hardin in his mid-30s should not have multiple games where his minutes are up in the 40s and he's not subbing out. You want to hear some of these guys in the 1990? 98, 99, Miami Heat, just for a little July fun. Sure. We're talking gents like Keith Askins, the great Keith Askins, PJ Brown, Blue Edwards, Tim Hardaway, Vashon Leonard, Dan Marley, Jamal Mashburn.

Mashburn must have been the youngest in that group. He must, maybe he was out for a game. Maybe he was out for, you know, he wasn't 28 then, so maybe he was out for a game. Or a couple of games. Terry Mills, Lonzo Morning, Terry Porter. Those are the Clarence Wetherspoon. Those were your 1998-99.

I guarantee it was when, it must have been when MASHPrin was out there. But anyway, I will say this. If you look at what the Clippers did with their offseason, so they gave James Hardin a contract. I think I mentioned this the other day where it was just enough money where he got a raise. He got a $6 million raise, but they kept the full mid-level open, mid-level and biannual. they were not the biennual.

I think they were just able to use the mid-level, think. No. Oh, yeah, yeah, you're right, you're right. Because they split it, you're right. So they gave $9 million of it, like $8.75 to Brooke Lopez. They gave the rest of their mid-level 5.3 in change or something like that to Bradley Beale. So that's what they split their mid-level. They're $14.5 million mid-level between those two guys.

And then they give Chris Paul this minimum. So they spend about $18 million. and they get Chris Paul, Brooke Lopez, and Bradley Beale. Three guys who, I mean, Beal did come off the bench for 15 games last year, but basically three guys who were starters last year. So that's value. Yeah, they essentially turned Norm Powell into those three guys and John Collins. Like they got a lot deeper and they were already a deep team.

Like they're going to be, I think, a really, really, really good game over 82 games next year. And then like I said, as far as the same. 16 game part. James Hardin will be who James Hardin has been for a while, assuming he stays healthy. Everything with them just comes down to what version of Kauai are they going to get and will he show up? And I certainly can understand anybody who would say, yeah, I'm not going to bet on Kauai. But to me, if you're looking at over and unders for next season, despite having all these

old dudes, like to McMahon's point, they have so many good players that they can rotate guys through and still have an eight or nine man rotation every night that's going to be. be really good in at least too deep at every position. I can't wait for our over-under bet that's forthcoming in September or October this year. I think we probably both are pretty high on the clippers here. I do think like the idea of Bradley Beale coming off the bench, I don't see that happening. He's going to start. He's going to start. Okay. He did not enjoy coming off the bench for the 15 games he did in Phoenix. Brad's going to step right into the Norm Powell rule. Right. And now, But John Collins, I do see coming off the bench because for a couple reasons.

One, it's like the Clippers, as you said, Wendy, the number one factor for the Clippers is Kauai's health. If you want to maximize Kauai's chances of staying healthy, you can't give them the toughest defensive assignment in the starting lineup. And you're not going to give it to Beal. You're not going to give it to Hardin. You're not giving it John Collins. you've got to get a primary defender in there. And if Tyloo asked for my advice, I'd say, hey, you start Derek Jones Jr.

Because that's the guy who can guard one through four. And then you've got Chris Dunn as an on-ball guy coming off the bench. You've got Nick Batum, who's still guard on ball, but much more of like a, you know, a thinking man's defender, a hands guy. You know, you've still got really good defenders in the second lineup. Plus, to me, you want John Collins. one, playing with Brooke Lopez as often as possible. I think those two guys, offensive games, is common.

Also, it wouldn't be a worse bad idea to have Chris Paul throw some lobs to John Collins. Right. I mean, that's what they're, yeah. Run and pick and roll with Brooke Lopez facing the floor. And then, you know, either way, Collins is going to be paired with a really good defensive center. But you prefer for him to be carding backups as often as possible as opposed to starters. Yeah, I mean, that's clearly what they're going to do. They'll roll out there with Harden Beal.

assuming everybody's healthy, which is a big assumption with the clippers, we'll knock on some wood. Harden, Beal, Kauai, Derek Jones, and Zubotch. I'm almost certain. We'll start. And then, again, you've got a second unit of Chris Paul, Chris Dunn, Nick Batum, John Collins and Brooke Lopez. You got shooting.

You've got multiple guys who can defend there. Like that, that's a killer second unit. So I think, like I said, I'm pretty bullish on the Clippers. I think they've done a really nice job this offseason. obviously it's going to be tough for anybody to catch up Oklahoma City. But when you look at the work they've done and the way they've deepened their rotation without sacrificing any assets to do so, I think they've really maximized their offseason and have given themselves a chance to have another really good year.

47 and a half is the ESPN bet number. I mean, which is odd because they won more than that last year and they're better. They won 50. Didn't they win 50? Yes. I don't give gambling advice. I'll give rotation advice. They don't give gambling advice. But I think there's also five teams.

They're sixth in the west in terms of where they rank and they're over under. I will bet the over on the Clippers finishing sixth. Jackson has Thunder Rockets, Nuggets, Wolves, and Lakers ahead of them. Actually, I'll give gambling advice if I get to share the winnings, but I'm not contributing to the losing. after this. The Lakers made a signing over the weekend, landing Marcus Smart, after he got a buyout from the Washington Wizards. Lakers with two buyout signings,

one of DeAndre Aten and now one of Marcus Smart. And again, I think just like with the Clippers, where you look at Bradley Beale, bringing Bradley Beale in at $5 million, you look at value. Marcus Smart here is a value addition. at, they're using their bi-annual exception of about, like, was it a 4.7 bond temps,

4.7 million? Well, it's, it's 5.1 million. 5.1 million. So, we're paying them 5.1 million. So you look at the Lakers, the Lakers use their, mid-level exception.

They sign Jake Laravia. They gave him a chunk of it. They gave DeAndre Aitin the rest of it. Well, Aitin was about 8.8 million, I believe. And then they give their biannual to Marcus Smart, so you're looking again an expenditure in the neighborhood of $19 million

and you add three players who in theory at least should be rotation players, Aiton being their starting center. Bontemp's you've talked for months about the Lakers need for perimeter defense. Marcus

Smart three years ago was the defensive player of the year. Jake Laravia plays wing. Well, Fontems, are you satisfied? I was wondering where you go out. Yeah, I don't know what we're doing there. I mean, look, here's the thing.

Marcus Smart got salary dumped last year by Memphis and just took a buyout from the Wizards. So, and this isn't like a Bradley Beale buyout where Bradley Beal, everybody could agree, is still a good player. I just don't genuinely know what player Marcus Smart is at this point because he basically hasn't played in two years, right? played a combined 54 games the last two years. He played 20 games. Two years ago, his first season in Memphis after the trade from Boston. He's had a crazy series of hand injuries in his career.

I mean, he's been hurt. Ever since he punched the mirror in when he was 10 years ago. I mean, he's had a lot of hand injuries. Yeah, I mean, the way Marcus plays, he tends to miss games anyway.

I mean, look, this is very simple. If Marcus is healthy and motivated and is anywhere near the player he was during his time in Boston, the signing will be fine. Like it'll be a good signing for the Lakers. If he's like he was the last couple of years

and he's not that effective and hurt, it's not going to be very good. And you could maybe argue Jordan Goodwin will be a better fit for the Lakers. Let's talk about that to be able to sign up. Let's talk about that in a minute. Just put Goodwin inside for a second. Go ahead.

That's the whole question. Like is Marcus going to be able to stay on the court? And can he be effective? He's not a great shooter. He's always been a willing shooter who's very streaky. It tends to be in the low 30s. But he is a guy that when he's locked in and healthy and playing well can be a guy who's obviously an impact perimeter defender.

But, you know, it's been a while since we've seen that guy. And even the last year he was in Boston, it wasn't the same as the year he won defensive player the year. So, you know, I would say I get why the Lakers did it. but I think we need to see whether the Mark is smart from the Boston days can make it to L.A. If Marcus Smart reports the training camp in shape and ready to roll, which really hasn't been the case the last couple of years, then he answers one of the most glaring questions about the Lakers roster,

and that's who's going to guard the other team's best perimeter score. Obviously, Marcus Smart, if he's right, is the answer to that. He's certainly capable of that. You know, it's hard to judge Memphis, even like forgetting about the health. Well, it's not hard. The Memphis thing was a disaster. Like, you know, they gave up. They gave a ton to get them and they salary dumped them.

Yeah, they gave up Tychocho and two-six to get them, hoping he was going to be one of the final pieces, bringing him in for leadership and performance and got neither of those things in salary dumped him after a second round rookie took his starting job this last year. I think Marcus Smart was dealing with, you know, professional heartbreak the last couple of years in Memphis. I don't believe he ever wanted to be there.

You know, this is a guy who envisioned himself being a Celtic his entire career and then just, boom, he's gone, then watches the Celtics win the championship the very next season. You know, Jackson says Jackson was out at a bar in Boston, which Jackson loves going to those bars. And when people got the Shams notification and he says there was an audible. grown there. Marcus Smart, that purple and gold is going to be tough for a lot of Celtics fans to stomach, but it is an opportunity for him to get back in a, you know, in a situation where there's going to be spotlight, you know, he's going to be in a, in a, you know, high pressure kind of

situation. And maybe that's what he needs to get his career back on track because it certainly went off track the last couple of years. Yeah, and Marcus is still only 30. He'll be 31 in March. I do think he'll be motivated and ready to go. The bigger question I have. He's got a player option. He can be a, you know, he's kind of got it. If he's ever going to get paid again, he's got a good year. This is a setup for him to get paid, going to the Lakers on a huge stage.

Can he, can he bounce back and have a really good year? My question is more, does he still have the same ability defensively? And especially, can he stay on the court? Like he played 61 games three years ago. And he played a combined 54 to last two. So if he can stay out there, yeah, he's got a chance to be an impact signing for them. And like I said, I get, I get why the Lakers did it, but it's, you know, that there's a lot less certainty about this one, I would say, than, you know,

like for example, all the guys the Clippers landed this summer, all are coming off better past years or two. Sure. On the court wise than Marcus's show. So I thought one other, one thing about this that I thought was interesting. I know this was reported elsewhere I checked on it too, that Luca Donchich did some, you know, because I heard like, oh, Luca recruited him. And I said, I want to know what, sometimes you hear like, oh, he recruited him. And then you peel back the layers and he sent him a text, like, you know, I don't mean Luca. I mean, just you hear about players as far as recruiting. And then you hear like, you know, he sent a text like, hey, bro, you know, come to come to

where. I would love to have you or whatever. Yeah, right. You know, it's like, it's like, you know, when you recruit Bontems to pick up, you know, you let him know the game's going on, but you tell them. wrong time. You know, you can say, I tell them, and I tell them, I want you guarding me. Yeah, you bring those elbows. So I check this out, and it turns out that Luca called them a couple of times, you know, and, you know, Luca's over in Europe right now. And regardless of whether

Marcus Smart works out, regardless of what the context was, I think the key here is, is that Luca is acting in concert with the Lakers front office. The Lakers front office, obviously targeted Marcus Smart. They knew he's going to get bought out. Several teams were interested in them. the Phoenix Sons I know were one of them. And, you know, Luca got the message from the Lakers and followed up on it, apparently several times. And that is not Luca's natural state. Like the first several years of his career, he basically said, hey, I play. The front office puts the team together.

I don't want anything to do with it. And he didn't grow up in like the AAU culture where, like, you know, you're constantly, recruiting guys. And matter of fact, it was news that Luca was pushing for roster upgrades the year after, when was that? Oh, yeah, it was the year after Brunthin's departure right before they got Kyrie. The news wasn't that the roster needed to be upgraded, and Luke didn't let that be known. The news was that he was actually involving himself in front office discussions.

But this is taking a step further that he had. in the past where he is being a pitchman for the organization. I believe he also had some contact with DeAndre Aitin. And I think that's actually the most significant part of all this, Wendy, because it does show that he's not only on the same page with the Lakers front office, but he is an active participant when, you know, his natural preference has been just like, hey, not my job.

I don't want to have to bother myself with that. I want to go hang out during the summer and play for Slovenia. Well, and listen, if this helps get him to sign an extension next summer, then I don't care if Marcus Smart plays three games. Right. He's like, get Marcus Smart on the, well, right, sorry, this summer, this next month is what I meant to say, not next summer. Well, that's the thing.

Like, I would just say that we can talk about the Lakers need for perimeter defense. We can question how DeAndreoum, is going to do with the way he's played the last couple of years. We can question about how Marcus Smart's going to do, the way he's played the last couple of years. All of that is relevant. The most important things for the Lakers are Luca-related. One, does he get into that contract extension?

Again, sometime before the season, it doesn't have to be in August. They can offer to him in August. I'm sure they will. He may not get into that business until later. McMahon, you have described that, you know, he typically doesn't want to do business when he's doing the national team. And two, what does he look like when he gets to the season? Because Luca was not Luca last year.

You have a number three? Well, I do have a number three. Number three, if he's recruiting this aggressively for the biannual exception and a slice of the mid-level, what's he going to do when they have max cap space? I would say that's a pretty, you know, if he's willing to put forth this kind of effort at the lower price points. Who are going to be to sign? Well, well, listen, listen.

It all starts with, it all starts with number one. And the rest of it's irrelevant, what Luca looks like in October. Does Luca Donchich sign up for the Lakers long term this offseason or not? If he does. I think he signs up for the Lakers shorter term.

Well, that doesn't matter. I mean that he's not going to be a free agent. I don't care if it's a two-year extension or whatever. That doesn't matter. If he signs an extension with the Lakers, offseason and commits to the Lakers. It's the only thing that matters because then he's with the Lakers. They can go forward and build with him because look, yes, the moves the Lakers made this

summer were fine. Aiton was a good signing for the situation they were in. Mark is smart as a good buy low. We'll see if it works out. Jake Lovia, same thing. He's an interesting younger player. He can maybe grow with them a little bit. This team is not good.

Again, I know Laker fans are going to think I'm a hater for saying this. The Lakers are not that good. they weren't that good last year. There was not a realistic path for them to be a championship contender this year to go toe to toe to with the thunder in the West with the limited resources they had. So the moves they may have been solid, but it's not about like what can they do to catch the thunder or what can they do to get in the top three teams in the championship chase in the West. I don't think any of that is realistic. It's all about getting Luca Dachich on board with the future and on board with the plan. And if that's the case, the rest of it's gravy.

Quite frankly, the Lakers goal should be a top 16. Yes. That should be for sure. They could do that. They should be very happy. I hear all that. And if I want to borrow Mack Tins' Lakers Girl uniform and put that on, what I would tell you is, hey, they were the third seed last season with Luca a shell of himself. Right.

Like Luca was not, Luca was out of shape. Right. And coming off of the worst injury of his career. And look, just judging based on what you see on social media, this is as lean as Luca has been since probably his second season in the league. If Luca, if this kind of commitment carries over, I mean, Luca's damn sure capable of an MVP type of season. I think we can put a like. He's one of the three best players in the league. But look, the Lakers, the spread from second to eighth in the league.

West was four games and the spread from third to eighth in the West was two games. So it doesn't, saying one team was third, one team was eighth is sort of irrelevant. My goal has to be just getting the top six. They were third with their best player, not at his best. Right. I think I can summarize this. The Lakers off season will be defined about whether Luca extends. The Lakers season will be defined about whether Luca's back to being an MVP candidate.

Correct. Before we go, I mentioned Jordan Goodwin. It would not surprise me if by the time. this pod posts on Tuesday, or sometime on Tuesday, that we find out that Jordan Goodwin has been claimed on waivers by somebody because I don't think he'll get through waivers. In fact, it would not surprise me if multiple teams put in claims and it comes down to the order. And the reason I think that is because Goodwin had a pretty good run with the Lakers last year. And I think their preference was not to have to release them. The reason they had to release them is to get enough money under the

apron to to because they can't sign um they can't use the bi-uninal exception and then go over the apron they have to get under the apron to use the five million so to do that they had to waive jordan good one who had a non-guaranteed contract they also waived shake milton who they got last year in the 50 smith deal wasn't it didn't they get him in that deal or i don't remember anyway the question will become and and bontemst i'll put you in charge of the arbiter being the arbiter of this for the next nine months. Who will have a better year next year? Jordan Goodwin with the team.

He goes to a Marcus Smart on the Lakers. Ooh. Well, it could be Jordan Goodwin. I mean, that's, you know, I mean, look, like, again, let's see, let's see what version of Marcus Smart shows up. But to me, I, like, I'm with Big Band. I think the most important thing of all this stuff that's gone on, these Lakers moves are fairly irrelevant in the grand scheme.

What matters is that Lucas seems to be on board with all of them. That's what really that I'm just, I mean, listen, they're good moves. Like for what the situation, they're in, they're fine. But if they're working in lockstep with Luca Donchich and he's recruiting DeAndre Aten and recruiting Marcus Smart and trying to go get guys and working with Rob Polenka, they could be trying to sign me, you and Brian. And it would. Hey, Austin Reeves recruited Jake LaRavia.

Okay. Great. That's good. I'm glad. I know he's your golf buddy. I'm happy. No, seriously. I said like, Jake LaRavia was doing,

Jake LaRavia was doing an interview, like on a podcast or some on some streaming show, and he was in a car for like the whole interview. This is like a week before he signed with the Lakers. And he did the interview. He was like 25 or 30. I don't even know, some period of time. It wasn't for 90 seconds.

And he turned the camera and Austin Reeves is sitting there driving the whole time. So anyway, that's what, you know, let's just give credit words. Do you don't get Chuck. Ravie without Austin Reeves. I think they've got the same agent. More Hoop Collective podcast after this.

All right. Bontzum, she were talking a second ago about the relative rankings in the West. Let's just talk about that real quick. So the Thunder obviously at the peak, right? One thing I want to cut in with just because it's funny because we didn't get to it earlier. When you're talking about the Clippers having all these guys who were 28 or older, the Thunder had two guys on their entire. roster we were over 27 last year. So it's a very interesting divergence and strategy.

What about when they bring Russ back? I mean, that's a trend, right? Dane back to Portland, CP3 back to Lobb City. Isn't Russ going to be an OKC? You don't see that happening? I'm sure. That's what will happen. I'm sure. You don't think they'd want him to come in there and, you know, shake things up a little bit? That's what they're looking for. I don't think there's much shaking that needs to go on. By the way, I love that the Thunder's Summer League team continued the tradition of the group interview at the end of the game. You know who else loved it? Mc10.

Got more air time, baby. Who was doing the interview. All right. So we got the thunder at the top. All right. Are we, are you going to, Bontemps, are you going to have a second tier?

Are you just going to say everybody else is in the second tier? I'll give you. I have a tear. I'll throw out the Rockets is number two and you boys can agree or disagree. I mean, I have a tier. I would say Houston, Denver,

and the clippers are in a tier. So would the clippers in that tier before the summer? Or did they, or did their season, did their off season moves? I mean, look, we've talked about it a lot. I thought the three best teams in the West at the end of the season were the Thunder, the Clippers and the Nuggets, and I think you saw it in the way the playoffs played out.

Again, like people were clowning on the Clippers for losing that seven game series to Denver because they lost in the first round. It was a hell of a series. If that Aaron Gordon tip dunk doesn't go in, they don't win the series. So I didn't think there was any shame in that. I agree. But yeah, I think the moves they made this summer have only strong. strengthened them. If I was power ranking that tier, I might have Houston second because I just

basically going from Jalen Green to Kevin Durand is going to be, I think, a gigantic upgrade. That's not bad. Not at all. But I think all three of those teams are really good. I was going to say Jalen Green's departure is going to get Reed Shepard a regular role. Yeah. I mean, Houston, I'm super, super fascinated to watch Houston this year for a bunch of reasons. Another team, it's very young, by the way. Yeah, I mean, it's got some more. guys. Like they, you know, they got Jeff Green. They brought in Clint Capella.

Their average is going to be higher than the thunder. They've got two, they've got two grizzled bets in the starting line up in KD and and Van Blee, but they've got a whole bunch of puppies. Yeah, I would, I would have those, I would have those three teams in a tier personally. Houston, Houston Denver and the clips in some more. Let me just comment, and I'm not fighting you on this, but I'll just point out that the team that's been in the conference finals the last two years, the Timberos, you don't know. I was going to say. I just think losing the Kia, Alexander Walker is really going to hurt them.

I, I think that. That's a big loss. And Mike Conley was already taking a bit of a step back. I'm just wondering if there's only two, you know, there's obviously more than two tiers. But I'm just wondering if all, I mean, like, I'm not putting the, I mean, where are you putting the Mavericks? I mean, how do you assign the Mavericks?

I mean, I would have the wolves. I would probably have the wolves in their own tier, probably. You like, see, I love that you do these tiers. It's great content throughout the course of the year. But you always have too many tiers. It's my editor's comments. 15 tears in the West. No, I would say that I think that the wolves are, to me, a better team than than all these other teams with questions. And then you've got the Warriors, the Lakers, the Lakers,

the Mavericks, if they get healthy, I'd probably have Memphis and San Antonio all in the same group. Like, okay, hold on. You could not putting the, you're not putting the freaking grizzies in the same group as the Warriors for one. What was the Warriors, what was the Warriors record. I'm trying to look it up. What was the Warriors record was 48 and 34? No, with Steph and Jimmy the Star. It was up there. I mean, it was a very impressive record.

And both of those guys could miss 40 games. I mean, good Lord, every player in the league could miss four. No, I mean, Jimmy Butler regularly misses a bunch of games and Steph is now 38 and has fairly regularly miss games. If those two guys are healthy, they've got a pretty high ceiling. You can say the same thing about your second tier, clippers.

I mean, yeah, the clippers are just way deep. The clippers go 10 deep, though. The Warriors are extraordinarily top heavy, and their top heavy is very old and injury pro. If they stay,

if they're got, if you tell me. Two and five with, with Steph and Jimmy in the lineup together. Yes, they played great with those guys down the stretch when they were healthy. So you're not put,

the same group as a freaking 80. You just yelled at me for having too few, too many tears. Now you're yelling me for having too few tears. There's one team yelling at me. Fair enough. If you want to stop at the Warriors, the Lakers, the Lakers, and the Mavs, that's fine. I think Memphis is sort of in the same boat. All those teams could win 48 to 50 games and things break right.

They could all win 42 games if things don't break right. That's all. There's just a lot of, there's a lot of boom or bust potential for all those different teams. And what are you, what are you saying about the Spurs? If Victor, like if Victor and Deerrin Fox come in and really pop, they could be really good. I would not have them in that same group probably just because they're going to be playing these young guys. Dylan Harper is going to play. Stefan Castle is going to play. How is the fit with Deeran Fox and those guys going to be. They still have some real holes. But look, if Victor is a top. five player in the league this year and plays 80 games and is a first team all be a player, then they could be in the mix for being in the playoffs and being in the mix with those other teams.

If the Spurs are our top six team, we will be discussing Victor Wimbunyama as an MVP game. Oh, yeah, for sure. No, that's not even, that's not a hot take at all. If they're top six in the West, yeah, of course we will be because that means he's going to be one of the five best players in the league easily. that that's their that's their path to zooming into one of the top i don't know six or just like mass injuries for these older teams but they just i think have too many holes to quite get there this year but but they're going to be super fun and frisky on a nutty basis for sure risky i give zach low

credit for bringing that into the NBA lexicon frisky and i hadn't heard it before then he he popularized it i i do want to you know tie a bow on one of the more interesting little sagas that we had over the summer that reached finality in the last couple of days. Jonas Valenzhenius gave an interview where he affirmed that he will fulfill his contract and report to the Denver Nuggets and make his $10 million instead of playing in Greece. He said that he had wanted to play in Greece, which was closer to home. He's from Lithuania, which is closer to home.

That, you know, it's in Europe, I guess. But he said, I'm fully committed to honoring my contract with the Nuggets this season. And I will give my all to compete for a championship. I think this, I think this situation is very clear. I think it was found Junis wasn't really all that interested in playing for the Sacramento Kings on a one guaranteed year contract. And he had a multi-year fully guaranteed deal from Panathanaikos to go back and play in Europe for one of the best teams in Europe and was ready to do that. And then he wound up on the Nuggets. I was like, all right.

Well, if I'm going to go play for the Nuggets with Yokic, that's cool. I'll do that. But I'm not going to be DeMontas's backup in Sacramento. That seems like how this played out to me. Well, he's got a $10 million non-guaranteed contract for next year. And I think he would probably have accepted it had the Nuggets been willing to pick that up to guarantee his arrival, which is maybe one of the reasons why he didn't make this comment for a month. I was going to say, do you think that interview with Basque News would have happened?

happened a little bit earlier, had the nuggets guaranteed money? I think so. I think so because it was less money to play in Greece. You know, the European contracts, they're after taxes, whereas the NBA contracts are before taxes. So the difference, especially not to get into geopolitics, but the dollar is not performing well. Bontem's can talk all about that after he's just spent euros for the last two weeks. Sure. So the father-in-law was picking up all the bills.

Don't act like Bontas. Spending the dime. Cape Bond. Capon knows how to spend money. Kibon also wanted us to talk about Clay Thompson and Megan D. Stalion as she returned to the state. She was like, what are you talking about the pod? You've got to be talking about that. It's the big episode of the day. I'm excited about that. Is she more famous in Chloe Kardashian?

We had a brief little Chloe Kardashian as one of the Mazzwags during the old Lamar-Odom era. Is she more famous? I'm not the person to ask about that. That's an interesting question. I'll have to ask the argument of that after the pot. I'll be right back. I'm going to ask real quick. Okay, before we go, you just asked the IT department, McMahon, who is more famous, Chloe Kardashian or Megan Meestallion? What was the answer?

Well, first, she inquired, famous or infamous? I said famous. With hesitance, she said, Chloe, but Megan is a close second. Now, I feel that Megan's still on the rise. there's room to grow and that this relationship with Clay is just going to amplify her greatness. So I think we're going to have a situation for that to be flipped by myself. I handled this in a very 2025 method.

I asked Chat GPT. Oh, what were the results? Chad GPT said Chloe Kardashian is more famous, but it puts famous in quotes because chat GPT can have some attitude. In terms of raw social media reach, her Instagram account is 302 million followers, whereas Megan the Stalions is only 32 million followers. Oh, 10 times.

Roughly a tenth of Chloe's audience. However, in short, Chloe Kardashian is more globally famous by visibility and follower account. Megan the Stalien is hugely famous within the music and pop culture circles, but on sheer scale, Chloe come down. comes out of hand. Yeah, Chloe,

Chloe's more famous. That's a lot of, that's a lot of, that's a lot of, that's a lot of hoop jumping to just not say the facts. Oh, Megan Claire,

are putting some content out there now, though. She, I'm telling you, let's keep an eye on those numbers. No kidding. 10X, the social media followers, I think, says the answer pretty clear.

But, you know, she's on TikTok like Wendy. What about cultural? Probably not like relevance, but they're probably both on it. Cultural relevance. Who's got more cultural irrelevance?

Chloe Kardashian. Kardashians. Well, Clay has cultural relevance. Sure. You put those two cultural relevance together, especially with China clay. I'm still going with the Kardashians on that. The Kardashians have been dating NBA players for near on 20 years now. Hey, Chris Jenner took a selfie with me.

She's big time. Only selfie I've ever taken on a celebrity. And I have to say, in that selfie, she looked spectacular. Yeah. She knows how to take a selfie. I make those older women glow, baby. With that, thank you to Jackson. Thank you to McMahon.

Thank you to Bon Temps. Thank you for watching and listening to the Hoop Collective. We will talk to you later this week. But we also will have a new cast member joining the show. Oh, boy. I didn't approve that. Did not approve that. Want that on the record?

Adios amigos. On the record.