Brian Windhorst & The Hoop Collective - Lakers & Warriors Ready To Contend? Biggest Questions for The Pacific Division Teams

Episode Date: October 2, 2026

Brian Windhorst, Tim McMahon and Anthony Slater preview the Pacific Division, breaking down the biggest questions facing the Lakers, Warriors, Suns, Kings and Clippers heading into the 2026 NBA season. The guys discuss each team’s outlook, the roster questions that could define their season and where they stack up in the Western Conference. Plus, who has the highest ceiling, which team has the most to prove and who could surprise? Timecodes: 00:00 Welcome To The Hoop Collective 00:20 Our 2026-27 Pacific Division Preview 01:05 Can Lakers Take The Next Step In Playoffs? 18:45 What Is The Best & Worst Case For Warriors? 28:30 Suns Overachieved Last Season, What Now? 35:20 What Can We Expect From The Clippers Now? 42:40 Assessing The State Of The Kings This Year Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello, welcome to Hoop Collective podcast. We talk about the NBA, which today is the Pacific Division. Joining us from one of the hubs of the Pacific Division in Sacramento is Anthony Slater. It's kind of a bleak time for California basketball. We're about to unveil that, but if you really think about it, I don't know a bleaker collective time for the four teams since I've been around them. Along those lines, joining us from Dallas, Texas, Ben, actually, you're in Los Angeles right now. I'm in another one of the hubs.

Yeah, that's right. We're all in the Pacific Division, lay of the land right now. As I ask this to you, Ban McMahon, can you tell me who the current Pacific Division champion is? Howdy, partners, you keep on trying to get me with this. I'm going to say it's the Los Angeles Lakers. You are correct. Proud winners of- Did they win like 52 games or something?

I think it was 53, wasn't I? Yeah. Despite Luca's late injury or mid-season injury and then another late injury, they were able to overcome and claim the Pacific Division. 53 wins. I believe I heard that was the most regular season wins for a Luca Donchage team ever, which is kind of crazy considering he's made the finals. Great stat.

It's also, you know, I would say, credit to JJ Redick, he has seemed to like squeeze out regular season wins. I mean, he's got a playoff win without Luke in uniform, a playoff series win. Jay J.J. Hey, JJ's done well. I think JJ has acquitted himself very well. I think I'll say one thing. Whether it's in Los Angeles, I think JJ Redick's going to coach in the league for a long time. A long time. If he wants to. Like, you know, I was going to say unless he just drives himself so crazy, it says, well, that broadcasting game wouldn't bad. I know. Will the winner of this year's Pacific division title win 53 games or in fact 50 games slater i would take the under 53 i would take

the defending champion lakers to probably be the champs again um but what's what's there i mean y'all probably don't some vegas over-unders at this point their own runner was in the mid 40s yeah i'm just saying like there's you know you're not you know last year all these western teams got to or at least most of them got to play Utah four times. You know, they, you know, they were, they were, and all those, and all those East teams that were tanking, like, you know. Like Memphis was tanking hard. There was some, you know, they weren't alone.

Memphis was tanking so hard. Yeah. Well, I don't know if Memphis is going to win that many more games this year, but they're not going to be trying to lose. Right. Okay. So let's start with the Lakers Slater. very different roster.

They won 53 games and turned over a big chunk of their roster. I have a basic question here. Walker Kessler, we know, fits with Luca. It was premium choice. Obviously, they paid a premium to get them two first, two swaps, $130 million. They re-signed Austin Reeves. The other acquisition,

that they made, Quentin Grimes, Colin Sexton, Mamu. Mamu's failure. Do those guys fit with Luca? Uh, oh, he asked you Slater. Well, go ahead. You're the Luca expert.

You know, Mamma... I should have asked you. I should have asked you, McMahon. My bet. Yeah, McMahon. McMahon could maybe relate it to some of those Dallas teams that Luca kind of dragged their talent further than we would have predicted. I think in a vacuum, you could say,

that each player has his own skill set that could help Luca Wright. Mom, he's a bigger player who could shoot it. That's helpful. Quentin Grimes, I think, is a nice little three-indee piece. I think he's going to be a little higher on their pecking order than he probably should be. Played with Luca, right? So there's a little bit of history. Very briefly.

Half a seat. Yeah, Colin Sexton, you know, he's a fine little, like, Ben's score at his price tag, but at the same time, did this team need to use that price tag for another, like, go get it score when they have, you know, the teams built around Luca and Austin Reeves. So, uh, the collective doesn't necessarily fit, even though I think almost every player you can make an argument, decent value contracts, I guess, ish. You know, Quinn and Grimes, um, is certainly a three. The D, he's got a reputation for being a good defender. The Dallas coaches did not share that opinion. Yeah, I'll just, I'll just be real honest with you. They, they felt

like he was pretty overrated defensively. He needs to prove that wrong in the Lakers or with the Lakers. And the things you need to surround Luka with are another legitimate playmaker, boom. They've got Austin Reeves. They've got great chemistry. Check. Yeah, he was already there, just for the record. Right.

A rim protecting, rim running big man. That's why they went out and got Walker Kessler. I'll give that a check. I will also say, Kessler needs to be a much better screener. than he had been in Utah. Like, he needs to focus on that aspect of the job. That's going to be awfully important. And I still think he needs to improve defensively.

He's a great shot blocker. Can you be a great defensive anchor? There's a difference. He needs to be a great defensive anchor. Length athleticism and shooting. You can argue they got the shooting part. This is not a team that has length and athleticism on the wings. And how they're going to get at this point,

I don't know. Who's their best on ball defender? I mean, Matisse Thiebill, you know, theoretically. They got Zaire Williams. They're hoping for these minimum signings to help. How is hoping for minimum signings to help work? I mean, you know, it's sometimes. I think that was a good swing for them because he is a really good defender.

the problem is the problems that he solves on the defense van is he creating more problems on the offensive angle? Because let's be honest, you're playing four on five offensively. And teams don't guard him. Yeah, I mean, at the risk of trigger and the Brian Windhorst, Jonathan Kaminga clock,

I mean, they went after Kaminga hard this summer, which told you they know how, you know, thin they were at the power forward position, right? They made the same pitch that the Timberwolves did. Like, come please be the starting power forward. So they're going to have to try to patch it. without him with what I mentioned, Zire Williams, Matisse Dibble.

How did you feel about Cummingo's explanation for choosing Minnesota over the Lakers? Jonathan Cominga, you know, I know him pretty well. Like, he's just like extremely diplomatic. I didn't take anything from his press conference with any like type of like real like substance to it. I know he said the winning culture thing.

But that would, that was just like the boilerplate like term that he got to the next question with, if I'm being honest. I understand. honestly, you know, he had talked to the Bulls. The Bulls didn't have the money to offer him, didn't have the money to offer him the $6 million that he got in Minnesota. They would have had to pay him less, I'm pretty sure.

People keep talking about the Lakers and Wolves, but from what I understand, the Bulls were right there. He could have gone to the Bulls. Portland came in late to Portland, that's right. Yeah. Anyway, we need to talk about him on that conversation.

More comminga content. Coming soon. Subscribe, like subscribe. You know who feels more on the clock than anybody in Lakerland right now? To me is Polinka. You know, obviously you have the ownership situation that continues to shift and evolve.

So you just wonder, you know, who new ownership will want, you know, long-term leading the team. But also he threw out a bunch of what you would seem like desperation-type contracts this summer. I'm looking at him. Kessler-Edwards 4-129 player option. Mom was valued.

Kessler Edwards, Walker-Kessler. If he had signed Kessler-Edwards that contract, he would have been fired. No offense to Kessler-Edwards. No offense. Go on. Mom was really 452 player option. Quentin Grimes, 4-60 player option, sex and 219 player option, Reeves 4-184-84-8-player option.

That is just monstrous long-term money. Maybe it's just because he's a former agent, but the player option, somebody's going to stop giving out player options. The team that stops handing out player options on every contract is going to benefit. Somebody at some point will remember that, but I'll move on.

And the role players getting four-year deals is really interesting because that absolutely bucks the trend. Like, you're not seeing a lot of guys that are not star caliber players getting four-year deals. Four-year deals with player options. Yeah. And again, the Sexton thing, I just didn't get that one, to be honest with you. And I see Sexton, I think there's teams where he would fit.

I just, the Lakers need more, you know, creation. All the role players on their whole roster, okay? if they all had one year less on their contracts, you would look at them completely differently. I know that's a big if, but like if Jared Vanderbilt didn't have the player option and he was just an expiring $12 million contract, that's something you could do something with.

If Colin Sexton just had the one year $9 million deal, he's hugely incentivized to play well this year. And Vanderbilt and Sexton together are $21 million. You know, if Grimes is on a three-year deal instead of four, if Mamu's on a three-year deal instead of, now look, they got to win, you know, they're in some cases negotiating against other teams, that, you know, they got to try to win.

But I'm just saying, like, it's like every guy on their contract, every guy that they signed this year, and Vanderbilt was signed a couple years ago, but still signed by Polinka, every contract is a year too long. The only guy whose contract, I wish, was a year longer, is Lucas.

That's the guy whose contract you wanted to get longer. and he, you know, signed a little short. So he's extension and looking for it or he's an extension zone after this season. And Luca is, you know, Luca's a fascinating case. He looks like he's in the best shape that he's been in since his rookie year. Like he's as lean as he's been since he came in the league. I don't think there's any question that the guy is going to, like, I expect he'll defend his scoring title.

I expect he's going to average something like 34, 9 and 9, which is a production that we've seen from him before. He is at the caliber of Star and at the age now in his career where we'll turn 28 this year, where it's like a player who is that good, who is yet to win a championship, there starts to be a weight that comes along with that. And he's about at that point in his career.

Remind me, so you, one of the things that you have, especially seeing Luca in this good of shape, you have, you're going to be watching is the, is the Luca dunks. So just as a reminder, let's establish this right now. Last year, Luca had four dunks. The year before he had zero, the year before he had one, the year before he had one. Actually, I take that back. Yeah, he had two and two a couple years before that.

The one year he got traded. He has not had more than four dunks since 22, 23, and his career high, is 25 as a rookie. What are you seeing this, Luca, looking at him, what do you, you are watching the dunks. What do you think?

We set an over under on this, and I took the over at seven and a half. Yes, we did. Jackson, I forgot what the pot of was, but we did this. What did we do it? What was the number?

Seven and a half. Yes, it was set at seven and a half on our October, or not October, August 28th episode. It was just like a month ago, and I, And I bet, I made the bet.

You bet. Yes, you're both involved. Who has the under? Wendy has a, you bet dinner and when took the under? Now, what's interesting is, not because I don't think he can do it. I just think that it's not something, you know, I don't think he's looking for dunks, is my point. Interestingly, I just think that he's leaner, he's going to be, and just the dunks are, he'll be a little bit more explosive. he'll be a little bit quicker.

I just think you're going to have the most athletic version of Luca that you've had since he was a rookie. And the dunks aren't even that important of a status, just a measure of kind of like, okay, he's a little bit more athletic. What's interesting is despite the fact that Luca has barely dunked, he's been one of the best finishers in the league in the restricted area year over year over year. and that's a combination of just the finesse and the touch and the craft that he has in his game. And how about six foot eight, two hundred whatever pounds? Like that's... Yeah.

Like Skinny Luke is 240, okay? And just the fact that he bullies people just to get in position to finish. But again, we talked about this last month with relatively low expectations for the Lakers who, Jackson, what was there over under again? I think it was 46 and a half, 45 and you got it right here. By the way, I've got the restricted area. So restricted area is three feet. Okay, inside three feet.

Do you see what his restricted area shooting percentage was last year? It's like in the high 60s. Oh, no. I mean, basketball reference. Now, two years ago, he shot 72. That's really good. That's elite. What did you shoot last year?

83%. I mean, it's insane. That's like what you would expect from a lob threat. That's what you get from the centers that he plays with. He also gives them about 83%. Right, right. And for a guy who the vast majority of those are off the dribble layups, and like that's just an insane number.

Like the guy, offensive skill-wise, it's a real, short list of dudes we've seen that are at its level. Luca, you were at 83% in the restricted area last year, he would say, getting fouled? Yeah, yeah. No way. It was 100%. No way. It was 83.

It was 100. Luca, if you dunk eight times, you get McMahon a dinner and he'll keep it to seven. It'll be like the technical down where you get right up into it. No question about it. He'll have his seven dunk like, you know, March 2nd, and then that's it all lays it in after that. Yeah, he's shooting fast break layups. It don't matter.

The other thing with Luca being as lean as he is now is, you know, you're talking about it's a conditioning thing. And why has he been as abysmal defensively as he's been at times? A lot of it's been fatigue or a lack of effort because he's tired or is just not quick enough to move his feet. he should this should be as good of a defensive season as Lucas had and like look he has some there are things Luca does very well defensively people don't want to hear it but the Mavericks you know the year they went to the finals the final quarter of that year they were the number one defense in the league the year they went to the West finals they were seventh in the league in defense like Luca as an off ball defender when he's locked in can be very good because he's strong because he rebounds his defensive performance his last full year in Dallas was, by his standards, excellent. And unfortunately, that has set the standard for what you expect from him, and he has not equaled that.

Well, and he's, you know, he's got, although the Lakers have overachieve what you thought they'd be defensively. He's got really good hands. He's got really good instincts. Hey, we talk about crediting J.J. Reddick. The Lakers improved, I don't, maybe not exactly, but the Lakers improved month by month defensively. One of the big reasons why they got to 53 wins was that they got better and better and better as the season went along. And JJ built in some zones that created some things. Like the Lakers were a competent defensive team by the end of the season.

True, but part of that issue was you had Marcus, well, that issue now is no more Marcus Smart, no more Rui Acha Murn, no more LeBron, you know, so many. I'm not sure LeBron was helping too much of the defensive end last year. By the time he was playing, like, you know, remember he like had to, when he throttled back some of the offense? Like, he was still having like bursts of defense, I think. And the brains are always there. The brains are always there. When you talk to scouts, they say if LeBron plays the role in Philly that he played in, with the Lakers last year, that Philly will thrive with him playing that role. If that's the role he's willing to keep playing in Philly.

I would just say the last thing I wanted to say on the Lakers was Donchich and Reeves play. This is the case for them to be at least a really good regular season team. They played 41 games together last year, 30 and 111 in those 41 games, 118.5 offensive rating in there, 1092 minutes when they're on the floor together. I absolutely think the Lakers are going to get a lot of regular season wins. I think there will be, I think Reeves and Donchich will be, that's a power, that's a powerhouse duo, at least in the regular season. If it's 50-something, then I think Luca will have a legitimate MVP case.

Agree, absolutely. If he stays healthy, the numbers he's going to put up and the games that I think the Lakers are going to win, I think he will be a strong MVP candidate. And by the way, he should be at this point. Like, it's, you know, last year the injury derailed him. Are the Warriors Slater, are the Warriors good enough to finish second in the Pacific Division this year? Can you damn the Warriors with some faint praise? I was going to say by process of process of eliminating. Well, I mean, you're talking about the Clippers, sons, and kings of the other. Yeah, yeah. Should we build out the best case,

worst case warriors? I mean, I think we know the worst case. Like, old guys are hurt, blah, blah, blah. But best case is Christopps Porzingis plays, what, 50, 60 games. You know, if you get a, like he really does a lot for them

that they haven't had. The seven footer who can rip or protect and shoot the three, spread the floor the way they need the floor spread from the floor. five position, particularly with Draymond out there. So you just get a healthier and expected Chris off sports at his season.

Jimmy Butler, we'll see where he's at in his rehab. He's going to be just doing individual stuff when camp opens. But, you know, you're talking maybe January, February. Can you get 35-ish Jimmy Butler games down the stretch? We can get into their trade, you know, possibilities where they could jolt their team at some point in the middle of the season. I think, you know, I'm already hearing very good reports. about Yaxil behind the scenes on some of these like pickup games and some of the stuff like

24 year old he's turning 24 this month like he should be mid prime ready uh but everything about him you yeah why wouldn't the oldest team in the league draft the oldest rookie come on that's so if he's 32 minutes of like high production six foot nine wing it's like man that's really something that they needed yaxil is significantly older than Jalen Duren who one of the big stories of the summer has been Jalen Duren and in an all-out brawl with the pistons on his second contract. Yeah, look, he's older than Kaminga. He's older than Pajemski.

He's older than a lot of these guys we've known for the Warriors forever. But to the point of if we're building out the best case, like, boom, there's like an injection of 32 minutes per night should play a lot of games. And by the way, like we've focused so much on these top four guys in the rookie of the year discussion, Yaxel might be a sleeper. Opportunity is there. Steve Kerr openly is talking about like, you know, he's used the start word, which surprised me. And Yaxel has used it himself because as you can see, he certainly believes he's going to step in.

Yes, I was going to say, yes. Yaxel, what we, what I know about him, he's not afraid to call. Some of his quotes this summer, I believe he said is at minimum. He should average 14, 5 and 3. Somebody asked him about Dylan Brooks and he says, I believe the quote is I'm giving him belt. people who could go look it up but yeah he's going to come in he's going to make sound bites

and he's going to be getting to McMahon's point he's going to be given a long run way on high profile team make up run McMahon I'm going to give you belt I don't think that's in my vernacular but he's old and I'm more than twice his age oh yes I'm so sorry I'm exactly twice his age I'm not thrilled about it I mean, ask this. You mentioned the possibility of a jolt with a mid-season trade.

Where are you on the possibility of Jimmy Butler's expiring deal being a trade chip? It doesn't even necessarily have to be a trade ship. It can just be an expiring $52 million contract, which has a lot of value in itself. Again, I think we mentioned it last time we talked about the Warriors, but think about what the Lakers did with LeBron. I know we just questioned some of the deals they signed, but the fact that they could sign all those deals were because LeBron James took all his money and walked away. So you could let Jimmy somewhat walk away. The other thing is, like, you know,

they, Jimmy and the Warriors really are fond of each other. And we'll see what he looks like when he does come back and we'll see what, you know, obviously Jimmy's going to want every dollar he can get. But there's a chance Jimmy and Draymond could take pay cuts next season, right? they might have, you know, market might demand that they do. So Jimmy fits really well with Steph Curry. Like we've seen that.

Draymond is another player that, you know, you're going to hear a lot of noise in the first week of camp from the Warriors about like shifting Draymond's role in some of the numbers last year. Where Draymond and Steph Curry on the floor together, it was still plus 105 last year, still good offensive rating 1, 17.7. But the moment Steph's been, was off the floor. And last year he was off the floor a lot. Their offense cratered when Draymond was.

was on the floor and was actually okay when it was no Dremont, no Steph. I've had these conversations with Steve, and again, I think you're going to hear it a lot publicly in their messaging, is they're going to adapt the offense at times away from Dremont. They're going to try to make him more of a spot-up shooter at times instead of giving him the ball. They're trying to limit his turnovers. I saw Dremont said that on his podcast. How do you feel about the idea of Dremon, the spot-up shooter?

Part of their point is, like, you know, the points per possession. If you look, he didn't shoot a horrible percentage last year. Now he's wide open on them. And they are backbreaking when he hit the. him because he then turns to the bench and just like roars in the bench's face for about five minutes. But the, you know, the other thing is I just think they want to take the ball out of his hands a little bit, which, you know, it's a touchy subject with him. But like they just felt like he was very turnover prone at times last year. Well, and that was what the whole beef, like the whole blowup

between him and Steve Kerr was on the bench was it was about Draymond's turnovers, was it not? Well, that's the funny part. Draymond fought Steve called the time out to rip him about a turnover and preemptively freaked out about it. So, yes, it stemmed from that, although in the moment, it wasn't necessarily that. But look, like, I think his, I think his, uh, Draymond's offensive role will evolve to a degree. And also, like, I think you could see him on the bench a lot when Steph's on the bench. I think they're going to really tie him and step at the hip because they still love that two-man game, but I think they're trying to figure out what they are without the two-man game.

And that bigger picture, Yaxel is an important person part of this conversation because he's kind of the next, you know, in line in that position. And Draymond, you know, the Warriors could have signed him to three for 60 this summer, something like that. Like Draymond would have been very interested in a multi-year deal at a little bit lower number, but they're like, no, it's good. We'll just give you back 127. We want our future flexibility.

And I think that says a little something about like the unknown of Draymond Green's future. Well, and that's interesting because, look, whatever you want to say about Draymond green, He's a first bout of hall famer who was an essential part of delivering four championships to that franchise. But while it's a complete non-starter to consider Steph Curry in any other uniform, that doesn't extend to Draymond, just like it didn't extend to Clay Thompson. If Clay wanted to, but that's another story. But yeah, Draymond Green thought about himself in a Milwaukee Bucks uniform during the last trade deadline

to the point that he told the Warriors, you know, try to find a third team. if that's the case. Which, you know, he's openly said. He said he didn't want to play on the bucks to them, but correct. Clearly, like, the Warriors continue to tell me that, like, they are not actively looking to trade Draymond. In their ideal world, Draymond Green walks away as a one uniform player, just like Steph. But he clearly he is more vulnerable.

There is no question about that. You know what this reminds me of. I'm going to totally date myself. And so many of our listeners are, you know, younger. And they're going to totally dating. myself back in like the 90s when i was like going into high school nbc had johnny carson and they had j lenno and david letterman and they was like someday johnny's not going to be here and who's going to get it and like for years they had to like sort of let's talk out of the side of their

mouth david it's going to be you jay it's going to be you and like it ended up blowing up in their face because letterman left anyway that's what it's kind of like with and it's You know, this would be something that Jimmy Butler and Draymond, you know, would remember because they're old like me. You know what? You kind of reminded me of Johnny Carson. Well, Johnny Carson's from Nebraska. I remind myself with Ed McMahon. Uncle Ed.

Here's Wendy. Listen, Ed got paid a lot of money. Ed did very well. You know, like on the one side, you know, they're like, oh, yeah, we're going to try to look at big trades. You know, to teach you up, you know, we've got all these first round picks. And then Draymond's like, well, are you going to trade me? No, no, no, no, no. We're not active looking to trade you.

Jimmy, no, no, no, no. We're not, you're like, they're telling both of them, don't worry. You are not being traded. You're not being traded. But like at the same time, they're involved in these trade negotiations. You know, at some point, NBC was going to have to choose between Leno and Letterman. They had to choose it sometime. They told Draymond at the deadline.

It was awkward because Dunleavy gave the press conference afterwards like, oh, you know, don't pin me into. a corner of which one it would have been. But if you were behind the seats, I mean, Dreymond did a podcast about having conversations with Mike Dunleavy about being in those trade talks. And Dundleave you tried to deny that Dremont was in trade talks. And you're just like, dude, everybody can do math. Like, well, it was also like, I remember being in the press conference.

We were like, should we pull up Dremont, the Dremont Green clip today where he said you had a phone call with him? That was, that was his stuff. Mike has handled everything really well. That was not his best moment. Jackson, do you have any idea who Jay Leno is? Yes, not that young. All right, good. I was just trying to see whether we should edit that out.

Okay, you can leave it in it. All right. Also in the Pacific Division, the Phoenix Sons, who have taken some off-season injuries here. Yeah, the Mark Williams one, you know, unfortunately, the problem with injury-prone players is they get hurt a lot, but he's hurt again. And, like, he's going to miss most of the season. and the shoulder deal he had. It's the same surgery, I believe, that Walker Kessler had that ended his season last year when he had it in the first couple weeks.

So he's like a miss-mosa season. Their lottery pick that they got in the KD trade, Calamon, Maywalk, like, they need them. They need him to produce right now. He's a project, but like they need him to produce right now. And the sons had a feel-good. good overachieving season last year. The reason was feel good is because they were such an epic disappointment in the previous

years when they had all that star power. I'm curious to see how they try to find a path to being better than an eight seed that got bounced in the first round. So change of scenery here for Miles Bridges. That was a significant mid-season or mid-summer pickup, going out and getting him. Nobody loves to trade with the Sons more than the Hornets. Those two teams love to make trades with each other. And listen, man, that son's pick.

There's teams that were like, damn, which would have been able to get in on that one. Miles Bridges, he's, I'm not going to say he's a difference maker, but he will change what they can do offensively. And in theory, help Devin Booker out. And they also got Luke Kennard. I liked a number of their signings I like. Like the Colin Gillespie contract was excellent value, I thought.

Yeah, I like that contract. The Jordan Goodwin contract that they did was excellent value. I like, you know, Luke Kinnard is one of the most elite shooters. He's going to space the floor. He's, you know, a one-way player, but he's going to space the floor. I think that helps Devin Booker. And I think a guy like Miles Bridges and actually, athlete or a floor running athlete, I think that helps Devin Booker.

And if Dylan Brooks is going to score, if that's the new Dylan Brooks, the offensive force that he was last year. Because, you know, the thing about the sons is that Devin Booker, I mean, he's being paid like he's a top 10 player. And he hasn't been a top 10 player the last couple years. You know what else, Devin Booker isn't? A point guard. So can you not start Jalen Green alongside him? Can you let Colin Shepard or Colin Shepard? Not all white point guards are like.

Can you let Colin Gillespie be the starting point guard so Devin Booker doesn't have to handle those responsibilities and you can do what he does best? Well, that would help Devin Booker too. Yeah, I mean, Jalen Green, then you're talking about minimizing them, which I'm talking about you know. bringing him off the bench. I'm talking about putting them in a sixth man role. He's their second highest paid player and he cannot out of his contract at the end of the year. Did you think he's going to be happy about?

36.2 million this year, 36 million next year. But it's a player option. He's interesting because I've been at two incredible playoff games by him in the last like what, 15 months, which was, you know, McMahon, you might have been at least one of them, but Game 2, Rockets, Warriors on that,

remember that seven-game war of a first, strong series. He had like 38. But I will also say the rest of the series, he, I think, was like, you know, basically shot sub 30 percent and the Warriors were happy at times when he was on the floor. But then you go to the play in last year. Jalen Green barely played last year. I think he only played 32 regular season games. Remember he had like some really bad recurring hamstring issues. Yeah, hamstrings. Yeah. But play in game, 35 against Phoenix in the first playing game. And then I was there the night that they, you know, this is the night that Steve Kurt, Draymond Green and Steph Curry basically looked like they were having their goodbye moment

over there on the sidelines. That was delivered by Jalen Green in that game. 36 points, 8 of 14 from 3, 14 of 20 in that game. They could not guard him. So there's still something there, and I feel like he wasn't around much last year, but then McMahon, I know you covered the first round series

where they played the Thunder, and it was, you know, what were his shooting splits in that series? I mean, the average 22, but the shooting splits were 386, 206. And listen, for the, he's played in two playoffs series in his career. He's a 38% from the floor guy and a 25.6% from three point range guy in the playoffs. And Jalen Green is a flash player. Like, there's talent there and he can have a 35 point game, any given night.

But he's not proven to be consistent. I do think, like, his future in the league long term is going to be as a microwave type of gunner off the bench. and if he doesn't like the role and it makes him opt out of his contract, so be it. He might be the tradable. If Phoenix, you know, you mentioned like this lack of like upside or like this ceiling above them right now

where you can't really see growth beyond a playing team. Maybe his contract, although I don't know, do they even have a pick to attach now that they use the one in the bridges, right? They're really good at swap and swaps of swaps and swaps. And people are interested in their swaps at this point. The problem is they're swapping somebody else's swam. They're like, you know, it's like swap to the fourth degree with him at this point.

They turn one first round pick into three and then swap them and all kinds of stuff with that. They are creative. And listen, they do a good job on the margins. You know, we're talking about Gillespie they got as a two-way guy and developed him. Jordan Goodwin is, you know, he's kind of, you know, been a journeyman hanging on to the bottom of roster. There's Oso I Godora, who's going to have to start a center for them probably, is a really nice player who was a second round pick. Like, they've done some really good things around the margins.

It's just it's tough to make big leaps when you've mortgaged so much your future in terms of the draft capital and you're a super expensive team because of the big swings that you took. If they make the play in, they'll have done well. agree? Sure. Yeah. All right.

Sounds like that's the slogan for the Pacific Division, by the way. Speaking of a team that's mortgaged their future. Well, has it been mortgaged or has it been stripped? Foreclosed. Yeah. So, look, I don't know. We're not going to get answers this year, but the guys picked five through eight in the draft. It was four guards.

They're not all exactly the same, but four guards were taken in a row. Keaton Wogler, taken fifth by the Clippers with the Pacer's pick. Mikel Brown to Brooklyn. Darius Acuff to Sacramento. Kingston Fleming's to Atlanta. Those four guys who go five through eight, that will be, you know, in the decisions that the teams have made, specifically the Clippers who made the decision with Wogler, that is going to be legislated for years into the future.

So, and frankly, with where the Clippers are, having, you know, not having a lot of flexibility with their picks. They have other, they have their Toronto picks now. How he looks this year is going to be important. Now, I don't think he's going to be a rookie of the year candidate. I think the Clippers see him as a guy who may blossom a little bit later. Like, I don't think you're going to see, you know, out of those guys, A-Cuff may be the guy who puts up the most points as a rookie. But mission number one for this year for the Clippers, Garland and Wogler, how do they look together?

Because after this season, they have to make a decision on Garland, whether to extend them or not. And the Clippers are in position to have cap space next summer. And so, you know, I have argued McMahon. People disagree with me because they keep calling the penalty a death penalty. I don't think it's a death penalty. I think the clippers are definitely badly wounded, but I think that they can survive. And a big thing that will determine that is how does Wogler look with the top five pick? And what do they do with this cap space that they've got coming to them?

But one of the big things for that, and by the way, like, there's also Brandon Ingram. Now, I don't know when Jackson is going to roll this podcast out. I don't think Brandon Ingram is going to be 100% to start the season coming off of this heel surgery. Now, on Media Day, whenever that happens, I think we'll get an update from the Clippers. I'm not sure you're going to see Brandon Ingram 100%. However, at some point this year, I expected to be fully back, and he's a factor. But it's the guards in the cap space for me, and that's where the Clippers short-term future is. It's not a pretty future, man.

I mean, it would be much bleaker if they didn't get good lottery. luck, you know, with the pick from the Pacers. You know, if this pick was a future pick and not the fifth overall pick who's going to be showing up for training camp and is on your roster. But, you know, this is kind of like where the nets were after the KG and Pierce trade, where they just had so many picks out the door. and there's no benefit to being bad. There's no benefit to bottoming them out.

Forget the new lottery rules. But there's no, like, they don't have control of their own pick for a long time. Like, when's the next year they have it? Hell, I might be retired by then. But, yeah, they're going to have to be able to kind of build from, they hope, the middle of the pack. but you know

we will see on the value of cap space as a team that's resides in sunny Southern California and has a lot of very generous team sponsors I don't know how generous they're going to be in the near future

less now yeah but mainly they've like they've got to have Keith Wagner emerge as a foundation player. Any hope for the near to relatively long-term

future of the franchise starts with him being a bona fide if not franchise guy, at least foundation guy. Yeah, I mean, you know, they're going to have to make a lot of philosophical, existential type,

you know, questions in the next couple of years of how they attack this, you know, death penalty period. And I'm not sure we know who's going to be in charge of all that, right? I mean, Are we considering what Trent Redden is, like the interim right now? Is he, you know, Brian, you may know how the evolving structure is,

but I don't think they necessarily fully know what it's going to look like. Well, Lawrence Frank is out for six months. He's not out for like five years. So Lawrence Frank will be back in charge before the end of the season. The question is, do they want Lawrence Frank in charge long term? Seems like there's some dynamics at play there. That's true. And look, right now Trent Redden,

is in charge. And, you know, whether or not the clippers do anything during the season before the trade deadline, like, I'm not sure if that's something Trent's going to do. But right now it's trend red, yes. Yeah. So, yeah, it's, you know, they got some deadline guys. Like, if they wanted to sell off at the deadline and try to like kind of reaccumulate some of their, you know, draft capital. Like Max Drew says 16 million. Rui signed a two year 28, but the second year is a team.

option. Like, that's a maneuverable contract. He's been good. Derek Jones Jr.'s on the last year of a $10.4 million deal. Like, you know, they could kind of, again, I think they have to be smart and strategic about how they attack the next several years, but, you know, there's ways to make them, you know, profitable years even while you're kind of under this umbrella. I don't know how profitable they're going to be. I don't know how many fans are getting at those games. productive years productive there you go

sorry I was taking you two literally it'll be profitable for Balmer as long as Microsoft stock does all right it'll be fine yeah I'm not worried about Balmer's pockets I'm not worried about Kawhi's pockets either I had a latest extension yes

Kawai's post career he should teach players like he should have like you know how Akeem Elijah won has that like big man school where you know you can come to him and like you know he'll work with you and everything. Kauai needs to have like a bespoke school for star players on how to squeeze and maximize all their stuff.

He gets to live where he wants. He gets every extra dollar. He doesn't have to deal with any, you know, and let's criticism roll off his back. Doesn't care. He's fine. Leaves just flaming messes in his wake. It's fine. Everything's good.

Yeah. That's what I'm saying. You know, teach. We want to learn that if you're a superstar player. All right. We recently did. One day he'll have a dinosaur statue outside of the Toronto's Arena. Your hometown Sacramento Kings and the future power rankings, which we look at in the next three years.

Somebody had to rank 30th, and that was the Sacramento Kings. I'm surprised they weren't like 32nd behind the two pending expansion teams. That would be wild. I wonder where Seattle and Vegas was slot in. Seattle, blank. Vegas blank. Well, Seattle and Vegas have much better draft positions than the Clippers do. I'll tell you that.

Yes, that they do. Yeah. So because somebody was like, boy, there's going to be a one fewer first round pick for all those years when the Clippers don't drafts. I go, no, no, no. There's going to be more first round picks because the Seattle and Vegas teams are going to be in there. Don't worry about it. There's going to be 32 first round picks, like starting a lot. like 2037 when the clippers are

paroled. All right, anyway, the Kings. Now, I'll say this. They're better positioned than the Clippers for the future. I think part of the rankings clearly are like the belief in the structure to use that positioning and push forward. But they have picks. They have their own picks.

They have the kings have the worst problem that you can possibly have as an NBA franchise. Because there's no solution for it. And you know exactly what I'm talking about. Yes, I do. If you have a bad owner, you're probably going to have a bad team.

And they've had a bad owner and they've had a bad team for damn near every single year of his tenure. They've been to the playoffs. How many times? Twice. No, and it was a spectacular series. They got beat the play. Yeah, they, you know, they won 46 and got bumped. That being, you know, era was, you know, it was a blip, but there was some positivity within that.

But again, I mean, to McMahon's point. Yeah, and the positivity was Monty McNair did a hell of a job, so did Mike Brown, and then Vevec fired him both. Correct. That's what I was going to say. To McMahon's point, like they actually had something kind of semi-Zoom in there and Vivek kind of drove it into a ditch for sure. Just kind of. Look, this is really about their. Framing was just a bit off on that one.

This is about their two draft classes. Last year's draft class, they picked up some promising guys. And then this year's draft class, we talked about A-Cuff. And then remind me, they traded up. For Caraband. Caraband, right? They traded up for that. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Whenever you trade up for a player, there's a little asterisk that goes on that guy. They trade up to 29, but yeah. I mean, it wasn't much of, you know, it wasn't like a high value trade, but, you know, they liked them. He had a concerning Summer League, I would say. The guy they actually got later in the draft Sharp from Houston, they really liked in Summer League and think he can kind of help already as like kind of a perimeter defender. But, you know, you framed it as it being about this next era, this Scott Perry drafted, you know, two groups of draft classes, which it is.

but they still have this weird tug-of-war with the old guard here, which are all more famous, more well-paid players that still are trying to, like, resuscitate their own careers, really kind of still in their mid-primes. Well, look, they have $49 million expiring contract of Zach Levine. They've tried to, I mean, the Bulls tried to trade him for a year and a half, and he got to Sacramento, and within, like, a couple of months, the Kings tried to try to trade.

him. Like, boy, who could have seen that coming. Just, no, I really like Zach. It's just his knee got hurt and he hasn't been a max player. They've got $25 million of expiring contract of D'Andre Hunter. Okay. And they've got Malik Monk, who's got a player option for next year, but he's a 20 million this year. All of those players, I think if you showed any inclination of wanting to trade for them, the Kings would very quickly return your call.

The lines are open. To a degree, you could throw Subonis in there, too. I know he's a little bit of a different thing. He's got two years and like $95 million left. And extension eligible, as we've talked about, that matters within a conversation. Just like the Anthony Davis conversation. What's interesting about them, though, you know, like I would in some ways compare their situation to Washington where you have like, you know, you have a Davis, a Trey Young while you're trying to bring this like young recently highly drafted lottery type picks in to Bans. some of those guys.

But the difference is Washington seems like there's a fusion of like, you know, the older guys kind of want to be there and they at least are going into the year with like this positively, you know. Anthony Davis is on a trial. Trey Young got a insane contract. Anthony Davis is on a trial period. I just calmed down on the enthusiasm aspect there. I will say it seems more enthusiastic than the King's veterans coming in the camp.

Well, the Kings veterans were like, get me the hell out of here. which is tough. And, you know, with Sacramento, the coaching situation is, you know, interesting too, because you have Doug Christie on a cheat, you know, at this point, he only has one more guaranteed year left on his deal. I think in a lot of ways, the younger layer of the roster that we talked about last year, the Dylan Cardwells, Rennows, all those guys, they kind of rescued Doug Christie's job. I mean, when the Kings basically came out and said, hey, he's keeping his job.

And the next year, it was about all the growth in the, the last month and when they won like eight of their last 20 or whatever it was. So I'm just curious looking at playing time early in the season and how much they lean into these young dudes on rookie deals and minimums compared to these highly priced veterans who, you know, you said getting themselves out of town. Like it'd be good for the Kings if they play well and they can work. I know it's too late for this in some ways, but Pat Riley, you know, there's some people who've taught me so much about the NBA.

Paul Silas taught me so much about the NBA. LeBron taught me so much about the NBA. I could go on and on. Pat Riley taught me a lot about the NBA. One of the things that Pat Riley says is you play the money. Okay? Now, maybe too late here, but you play the money. And the reason you play the money is because if you don't play the money,

you devalue the money and then you have a problem. And so here's what I would say about the Kings. Not that I think anybody is going to come calling for Zach Levine. But it might not be the worst idea to play the money a little bit, especially early in the season, to see if you can gin up anything. Correct. But Doug Christie is on a complete make-good type contract, and he's going to be coaching in a lot of ways for his job the first couple months.

Does anybody want to listen to Pat Riley? What do we think? How do we think about listening to Pat Riley? Hey, you need to listen to somebody who's been around how the Kings operate, though. Yeah, I know. You're in reality. He's in Sacramento. Okay.

But if Doug Christie's not their coach, like which former king could Vivek possibly hire? Well, let me tell you, Mike Bibby coaches the Sacramento State Hornets right down the road. I'm just saying that. Oh, yeah. Bibby's the SAC State head coach. Is Sacramento State like in the Pac-12 now? They are, they're just- You know what, Texas State is in the PAC 12.

What is PAC about Texas? PAC is Pacific. Big West. SACC stays Big West. Oh, okay. All right. Anyway. Well, can I say one more player that I think is going to matter?

He really faded into the background last year. He only played 23 games. Kiga Murray. He's stepping into a five-year... I sure hope he matters. He signed a gigantic contact extension. Yes. Five-year, $140 million starts this year.

This is year one of a five year, no options on the deal. I will say, like, you talk to the previous coaching staff with the Kings, the one that got this team to the playoffs, the one that had Kigemurie hitting over 200 threes as a rookie, the one that was giving him big defensive assignments. You mean the guy who won the championship this last year? Yes. They might grab coach. So they really like, Jordi Fernandez was on that staff. He's well-respected, you know, Brooklyn that's head coach. they always love King and Murray

and always really viewed him as a two-way wing who was a winning component. He started on a playoff team. That was the third seat in the West. He was a starter as a rookie. You know, the star has faded a little bit. I think anybody who thought there was maybe, you know, a potential that he was going to explode

into an all-star type talent. Like, that's gone. I think that conversation's gone. But if he's healthy, you know, we'll see if he lives up to the deal. But I think he can become a really relevant NBA player. I agree, and I just think that he's had to deal with unfortunate circumstances. He had some, he got hurt last year.

Yeah, but also just like, it's a mess there. McMahon's not wrong. He was part of the shrapnel of that whole situation, for sure. I mean, there's a reason why agents try to steer their rookies away from Sacramento in the draft. Like, I hate to just go on and on and on about it, but, like, What are we, we're going to sit here and pretend this is a functional NBA franchise? It's not. Yeah, we're going to wrap this up because I just got a text from an agent asking me for Stephen A's number.

This is when you, when you get a text like this, you're like, oh, God. Oh, you got, check social meter, okay, see what might have been said today. What did I miss? I got to go, I got to go, I got to go dig into this. Thank you, Slater. A-Cuff. A-Cuff's the other one, you know, his development, massive. We'll see what he can do.

But yeah. I look forward to you writing A-Cuff stories this year when you go to King's Games. All right. Thank you so much later. Thank you to all of our producers. Tucker and Jackson are with us here. And thank you to McMahon. Thank you for listening and watching the Hoop Collective.

We'll be back soon with another divisional preview. Light the beam and adios amigos.