Brian Windhorst & The Hoop Collective - Major Extensions For Luka Doncic, Mikal Bridges & De'Aaron Fox Reaction

Episode Date: August 5, 2025

Brian Windhorst is joined by ESPN's Tim Bontemps and Tim MacMahon to react to a few major extensions in the NBA starting with Luka signing with the Lakers. The crew talk what this means for the future of LA before talking about the impact Bridges’ extension will have on the Knicks’ future options. Then, we finish by discussing De'Aaron Fox signing with the Spurs and if that contract makes sense for San Antonio. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hey, sports fans, the ESPN app has all of ESPN all in one place. The ESPN app is your home to thousands of live events, ESPN shows, and originals across every ESPN network and service. And now you can check if you already have ESPN Unlimited as part of your TV package for no additional calls. Visit activate.esPN.com to learn how to access your account or sign up, then start streaming in the ESPN app. It's all of ESPN all in one place. Sign up or activate now. Hello and welcome to the Hoop Collective Podcast. We talk about the NBA, which we're doing on Monday afternoon. Everybody back in the country after being on international journeys the last couple of weeks.

Thanks for sticking with us. Joining us from San Jose, California, his West Coast base is Tim Bonteps. Hello, everybody. Just back from the Canadian Rockies is Ban McMahon. Howdy, partners? I did some hikings, kayaking, a little bit of whitewater racking. I feel like I'm just an outdoorsman now. You know, Whitewater Rafton, up in that part of the world, it gets pretty cold.

I know from experience, not that I have much of an outdoorsman, but I have done it up in Canada and that we had to wear wetsuits because it was, did you wear a wetsuit? Yeah. What suits were on. When I did that, it was a long time ago. And they, they, he's like, everybody's got to wear a wetsuit. I was like, wait a minute. What am I?

Let's reevaluate what I've signed up for here. They're like, well, it's glacier melt. You know, it's cold. I was like, holy Moses. Yeah. So, all right, you're a real man. Also, the guide was a woman, but yes. Did you go into the water?

Briefly. Oh, not during the rafting part. During the lake that we started out and we jumped in. All I'll tell you is, I did this many years ago, but it was right about this time. a year and we were about to get on the rafts. It was two different rafts and the I don't know what they call the person who's is just the guy the person who's in the back who steers. I heard him telling his buddy the other guide on the other raft. He's like, man, I haven't had anybody go in the

drink in like seven or eight days. I'm going to fix that on this one. We stayed out when we're navigating the rapids. Well, we had people go in, but it wasn't me. Thank God. All right. They're pretty low grade, too, just to be clear. Well, I don't care. It's cold. All right. Also making a stop on the West Coast this week wasn't just Bontemps, I guess last week. Luca Donchich.

Luke and I both went from New York to the West Coast last week. Both went from Europe to the West Coast. That's true. Europe to New York to the West Coast. Yeah. And so I think, you know, obviously huge news a couple days now since we've been away. But Luca signing a three-year $165 million extension on the first day he signed it. He set – it became obvious.

He set a schedule around it. The Lakers planned out a press conference, and then Mark Walter, the Lakers' incoming owner. If reporting is correct that it was him who did it, I'm not 100% sure. I just know what I read a little bit on this. But they had a post-signing journey over to see the Backstreet Boys in, Vegas at the sphere. So the key on that whole thing beyond those details is that this was planned out. You know, there were multiple players that went, you know, suites were acquired. They were all wearing matching outfits. I don't know. Is it a thing that everybody wears white when they go

to the backstreet boys? Is that a thing? I don't know. I got caught up in post-backstreet boys Uber traffic in Vegas and I've got a little PTSD from that. But it's certainly, is a thing that this was all orchestrated. The Jordan Brand Tour was orchestrated to where he would be in L.A. for this. The other thing that is very, very clear is that Barra Beth Seeger, who is Lucas' long-term business manager, was Dirk Novitsky's longtime publicist before that. She is essentially an extension of the Lakers organization at this point, which is the polar, opposite of Luca's last year in Dallas.

That is interesting. I want to talk about that in a second, but I think I, I think the point is that Luca decided a while ago he was going to sign this extension and then set his summer schedule up and everything was lined up. The Lakers knew it was coming and everything was done. And I, and that isn't just important for logistics. It's important for where Luca is with, with the Lakers. He is, you know, bonded to them. And that was not something we were 100% sure was going to be the case when the trade happened because he was shell-shocked. We talked about this throughout the last six months that the Lakers lost the ability to give him the supermax, which is repeatedly locked down players in this spot, that he had no financial incentive to sign this summer.

No, NBA contract financial incentive. Being the face of the Lakers, there's some financial advantages that come along with that. And he could make a little bit, I mean, he could make more money, but then if he signed elsewhere as a free agent, but it's not the, just so fans know, it's not the cavernous difference that's between the Supermax and the regular extension. It's a small enough difference that you at least left open the possibility he could explore free agency. Yeah, and so we also had talked about where it made the most sense for him to take a three-year extension instead of four because he could reenter free agency for the bigger number. With the player option. Right. So again, so for friends that know, he signed a two-year extension with a 30-year option, he opts out after the second year.

He can then sign a five-year deal for, I believe, 400 and a change. Yeah, 400 and change. And I believe the final year of the deal would be north of $90 million. by current cap projections by Bobby Marks, which... Yeah, I mean, that's eight years from now. That's eight years from now. But I would just say that I think the key is, Luca is now locked in for the Lakers for the next three seasons.

It was one season. And if it was one season without an extension, we're talking about minor emergency. Now the message is he's a Laker and McMahon, he said things at his press conference announcing this, which they didn't have to have a press conference. conference announcing this, you know, and, you know, when you have a guy, you know, we've seen this, you know, especially a guy who is overseas based in the offseason. They didn't have to have

a press conference, but he felt it was important to do the press conference. And so I just want to get your takeaways. You know them about better than anybody else in the media. Your takeaways from the way that all played out. Luca is operating in a way, you know, in conjunction with the Lakers Front Office in ways that he never did in Dallas, even though it was fully his intent to be in Dallas for his entire career. I think the shock of the trade has kind of woken Luca up to the importance of being business savvy in the NBA. And again, he had never been this active in recruiting players like he was with the Andre Aiton and with Marcus Smart. You know, he had never been as active.

Like he certainly had voiced his opinion in the Nico Harrison years in terms of, hey, we need upgrades or, you know, we need to get this type of player, that type of player. He had never been this kind of extension of the front office like he was or like he has been, like he is right now, with Rob Polenka and Jeannie Bus, you know, going back to what, was it Craig's of Hollywood, Wendy, where they had a meeting where, you know, you got us a real nice table one time by being a big deal. You know, going back to the meeting. I mean, by the way, we had a reservation. We walked in. They just seemed to us a little early. It wasn't like we got that special of a treatment, but they were, but they were very kind.

Very kind. There. Good grub. Probably some gluten-free options if Luke is eaten there. And listen, there's a lot of things that are different about. Luca. Gluten free is certainly one of them. Now, I will be honest with you, like Luca's done more media, I think, over the last week than maybe any full season of his career combined in terms of like outside things. Just to jump in there for one second. I have to admit, I mean, I was aware he was going to be in New York because he was going to, I knew he was going to this Rucker Park thing, but I have to admit, I was pretty stunned when I got an alert that Luca Dantzich was joining the Yankee

broadcast the other day. So like the men's health cover. What is going on with this? The men's health cover, and I guess there are three stories, I read one of them. It's a bit much. It's a bit much. Like, look, it's cool that you've committed to conditioning. I don't think you needed the victory lap, too.

And this has been like a long victory lap. But, and essentially, oh, he's sticking to the Mavericks. Okay. Huh? You said sticking it. to the Mavericks. Oh, sticking it to the Mavericks. The whole revenge Bob thing.

Yeah. This proves the Mac. Look, Luca didn't have to get in shape to prove that the Mavericks made a bizarre decision. But Luca's body changing so much this summer does confirm that those conditioning concerns are absolutely real. Like his sudden commitment to conditioning, like, bro, you're several years into your NBA career. I mean, a victory lap? I would say about time. And there have been like his second or his first summer after his rookie year. He had this kind of condition commitment. A couple years ago when he

got the body team he came in leaner. But like, I don't know, man. The whole victory lap thing to me has been a little bit odd. And the article that I read, like there was this suggestion. I don't know if this came from Luke or this is just the writers, but that he was left without guidance? Like he had to, like during the summer, he was on his own. Trust me, the Mavericks would give him all the guidance in the world. None of that guidance was feast every night and throw down a bunch of beers. And, oh, he's European.

Gordon Draggich is European. Actually, from the same hometown. He managed to stay in great shape his entire career. So congratulations on your newfound commitment to conditioning. The accountability's on Luca. The accountability is not on anybody. I'm not on the Mavericks, not anybody else but Luca. And I'm glad that he's now taken those steps.

But the victory lap has been weird. Yeah. And I know you're not insinuating this, but there have been some insinuations from people that, like, there were lots of people around the league who were worried about his conditioning to the point where they wouldn't have offered him the Supermax last summer, like Niko Harris or Summer Lake Nuka Harrison was going to do. This would like to clarify for people.

There's one person in the NBA who didn't want to pay Luca Nottrich's a Supermax contract to happen to be the guy who was running the team he was on. That's why he got traded. The idea that there was like justification for the Mavericks trading him. I'm sorry. That is not correct. All of your, and I know you weren't saying that.

All of your points about the victory lap have been amusing. Part of the reason we are collectively amused by this is Luca, which is totally within his rights, has never exactly been Mr. I'm going to do interviews with anybody ever. And now he's doing interviews across the globe this week. It's been amusing.

Especially like the fun interview, like the Yankee thing. Yeah, so going to the during the broadcast with the Yankee game, it was like what? I literally was like, what is that happening? Why is he talking to Michael King and Paul O'Neil?

The other amusing thing about the men's health deal was the correction that, Oh, no. Luca did not actually have a 42-inch vertical 2018 combine. Actually, he did not attend the combine because he was busy. Good excuse, he was busy helping Real Madrid win the EuroLeague. He's winning Final 4 MVP of the EuroLeague, yes. But the whole men's health thing was pretty bizarre, just to be honest. NBA player commissioned conditioning during the summer should not be like breaking news.

Yes. Well, look, at the end of the day, to your initial point, Brian, for all this other stuff we've talked about. If Luca had not agreed to this extension, you said it would have been a minor emergency? No, it would not have been a minor emergency. It would have been a five-alarm fire, and this entire season would have been about

what is Luca Dodgers going to do next summer, right? Yeah. You'd have probably been the biggest player to hit free agency since LeBron in 2010, if you're looking at, or I guess Durant in 2016, is the better one. That, like, that guy totally, in his prime, no health issues.

Like Hawaii in 2019, obviously he's coming off all the health issues before that. Everybody knew he's going to end up going to L.A. He would have been that level of player hitting free agency. And this whole season about what are the Lakers going to do? Are they going to be left holding the bag? What kind of moves are they going to make? And to me, like when we talked about this a couple weeks ago, my personal opinion was Lucas shouldn't sign the extension and should put the Lakers' feet

to the fire and let them prove that they can build a team around him and have a cohesive plan to have a good enough team for the next couple years before he extends. But he did them a big favor. Locking in this extension, saying he's going to be there, giving them the runway to build a team out. Like, this is a gift that he's given the Lakers. And now the question's going to be what can Rob Polinka and Jeannie Buss and Mark Walter do to repay that? Can they build a good enough team around him? They went and got Marcus Smart, DeAndreate, like they did.

like we've talked about. They had about as good as a summer as they reasonably could have with the assets they had. They don't have a ton of ability to go all in right now. They'll have three first round picks next summer. They'll have mountains of cap space next summer, almost no matter what they do with their team. We'll see what happens with LeBron next summer. But that to me is the real question going forward. Okay, the Lakers would probably be pretty good this year. Maybe they could be really good if Luka and LeBron are healthy and locked in and awesome, which are certainly capable of. but then what do they do next summer? What do they do the summer after that? And by signing this extension,

he not only takes all the heat off of this year, he gives them real runway to try to build the best possible team around them. And it's going to be very interesting to see if they're going to be able to do that. Because I will just point out that for the past several years, the Lakers have had LeBron James and Anthony Davis and have failed to build a cohesive, contending team around those two guys, which is a very difficult thing to not be able to do. Like, you should be able to have a really good team with those guys.

And for the most part, they've been a play-in quality team. And while Luke is better. Well, they finish. I understand what you're going to say here. You're going to say that they were only three games out of the end of the playoffs as last year. But they did finish third. No, I met, no, I was saying with AD and, I was saying with AD and LeBron the last several years,

they were in the play in most of the time. They were not a repeated championship contender. That's all. Yeah. Well, I think this gives the Lakers optionality. And they don't know which path it's going to be. I don't want to make, I don't think they've got it all figured out because there are certain unknowns. They have positioned themselves to pivot away from LeBron James after this season.

They're not going to frame it that way. But by not offering him a new contract, they have positioned themselves to do that. And we should also point out, I'm sure people saw this, but it was very noticeable. who is not at this presser on Saturday. No LeBron James, no Bronte James. Worth pointing out. Yeah. Yeah, I will just say when it comes to LeBron's attendance in the summer,

I've learned to be careful not to overreact to that because he's got a lot of demands on his plate. I mean, LeBron posted a video or pictures on Instagram the day before working out across town. Okay. Having said that? It was a noticeable absence. Yes.

I'm not saying it means he's not going to be there for training camp, but it was a noticeable thing that he wasn't there. Mark Stein reported it, LeBron, FaceTime his congratulations, but it was a noticeable absence by a pretty prominent family on the Lakers roster. Yeah, so let me just say, having said that, the press conference and plans were set in stone many days out. We know this because Jared Vanderbilt and Maxi Klieba and Rui Hachamura, and, you know, there was what, there was like...

The vast majority of the roster was there. And they also went to Vegas. You know, they cleared their day to get on the plane to go to Vegas to go see the Backstreet Boys. So... Maybe LeBron doesn't like Backstreet Boys. He likes Bad Bunny. Bad Bunny, yes. Backstreet Boys, no.

That's LeBron's era, buddy. LeBron was a kid in the 90s, like literally a kid in the 90s. He makes more sense for him than anybody else, including Luca. But anyway, I have learned to not overreact but it is notable that he and he did not attend. Now, I was just going to say, this gives the Lakers optionality. They are in position where they can pivot away from LeBron next summer.

They can go out and seek acquiring a high dollar player, be it through trade, be it through free agency, however it might happen. They have that option on the table. They have the option of the table of keeping LeBron, of LeBron having a great season with Luca, wanting to extend his career again and then doing that. And they have, you know, the option of completely flipping the roster over

and not having to worry about Luca not being bought in. Now, obviously they wouldn't do that without having Luca on board, but this gives them the ability to say we can focus on getting the maximum out of this season. And if we have to transition away from the Bron, we can still do that. They're not locked in any way. that optionality is valuable. It is not as valuable as a championship supporting cast around Luca that they are going to have to try to make sure that they get into place

and maybe they are close to it right now. We don't believe they're close to it. We think they've got a very competitive team. We don't see them as a championship contender, but maybe Luca will be great this year. Maybe he will win his first MVP award. We've been expecting to see that type of season from Luca. Maybe this is going to have it.

Maybe DeAndre Aiton becomes the player that people thought he would be when he was the number one overall pick. Like there's a lot of maybes. Yeah, Jackson says Lucas third and odds for MVP. Yeah, I mean, look, if the Lakers, you know, we've talked, you know, when we did the over under pod last week about the West, we talked about how if the Spurs are in the top six, you know, that's going to mean Victor is almost certainly going to be in the top five at minimum for MVP. If the Lakers are back in the top four in the West again this year, Luca is going to be. be right in the mix for MVP for sure because it's kind of mean that he you know the the revenge tour led to a big season and and the one thing you pointed out brian about the optionality the lakers

have it the biggest thing is they can go in any direction they want now to build a championship caliber roster around luka they're not they don't have to microwave it and if they want to go get a star if they want to build depth around them this even more than pivoting away from lebron This gives them the flexibility to build the team the best way possible. And there's a few certainties here that we know for absolute sure. Number one, Luca Donch, which is one of the best players in the world, has been throughout the course of his career, even with the consistent conditioning issues. Number two, Luca is in the best shape that he's been in since at least his second NBA season, if not his entire NBA career. Number three, Luca Donchich is by nature an extremely loyal person.

What's he doing later this month? He's playing Eurobasket for the Slovenian national team, which he plays for them every single game that he can if it's a competitive situation when that's not the norm for NBA players, when, by the way, he could have easily jumped onto a bandwagon with Spain back when he was a teenager. But he chose to play for Slovenia because, again, I think that is an indication of his natural sense of loyalty. And then the fourth thing we know is that Luca views his relationship with the Lakers as a partnership. Right. And you can criticize a lot of things that the Lakers have done, but they have taken a great approach in building trust with Luca and building a report.

with Luca and building a relationship with Luca. Now, they had one advantage that they had was the coaching staff. Luca already had a relationship with JJ Reddick. They were briefly teammates. They really clicked. We talked about Luca doesn't do much media. He did do a couple of podcast appearances with JJ Reddick, which is an indication of just how fond he is of JJ. Greg St. Jean is also on that staff and is working closer with Luca as he did in Dallas. but Rob Polinka, Jeannie Bus, they've done a great job of, again, connecting with Laura Beth Saker, who's essentially kind of like Lucas Surrogate mom, right? And is like she runs Lucas life, making her part of the equation here.

Also, Bill Duffy, you know, his agent, obviously they had a relationship with him before, but. How about Bill Duffy's summer? He, he, I know, look, it helps to have players to. to represent, you know. But he represents Jalen Williams, Chet Holmgren, and Luca Donchitz. That's, we're closing in on a billion there. It's not quite,

DeAndre Atene, which he made sure he got, you know, he's full, you know, he gave back to the Blazers and got that back. Bill's had a very good son. But so, so that whole picture with Luca that I just laid out with flexibility, with optionality, as he's entering his prime, I like the Lakers' chances

of building the championship contender around him. He does too, obviously. That's why he signed it, right? And look, for all... He's freely given them... He's freely given them the patience and the pathway to build out the best team they can.

And by the way, from his perspective, you're a Laker, you're going to be the face of the franchise. He kind of already is... That's a delicate topic because... No, he is now. He is for sure. I mean, look, that's what's caused all the drama this summer.

You're the face, right. LeBron is not. You're the face of one of the iconic sports teams on the planet. Yes. And they have incoming ownership that I don't know how it'll work out. But the incoming ownership promises to boost the team's fortunes and further invest in the team. In all honesty, when you look at it, it's kind of an easy. decision. But that said, because it was such a shock to the system and because there's other

stuff going on out in the world, you just weren't 100% sure. But it seems like Luca made the decision quite some time ago. And you can certainly understand why he made it. But I just didn't think we should have assumed it. If Luca didn't walk out of that dinner at Craig's of Hollywood, knowing he was committed to the Lakers, I think it was pretty soon thereafter. Because his whole summer has been plotted out to lead up to this moment. And again, the fact that he took such a lead in terms of the recruiting, which is something that that's not his natural sense. That's not something he basically pushed away from early in his career.

This is the first time he's really embraced it. That was a pretty strong sign of just how committed he was to the Lakers. But, you know, having said all that, this contract, It positions him to be able to make the most money. It certainly makes the most financial sense. If things go haywire, it also, he's going to have leverage. But the Lakers have so many advantages in terms of roster building, especially now they have the deep pockets that they haven't had before.

I would be surprised if Lugidantra does not win a championship or championships wearing the Lakers uniform. Well, look, if you look at the arc of history in the NBA, over the first 60 some odd years, the Lakers were in existence from 1949 to 2013, I guess 64 years, they missed the playoffs four times, or five times, I should say. In the last 12 years, they missed the playhouse seven times. So that's the genie bus ownership. So if Mark Walter comes in and does what you did with the Dodgers, which, again, this is an atypical

new owner's situation, this is a guy who has proven what he can do with the Dodgers. similar situation, buys an iconic team, turns it into a juggernaut. If you're Luca and you're betting on the future with Mark Walter, that's understandable. But again, if you look at the Lakers over the last 12 years,

despite the comments of some people while we were gone, I do not denigrate the title in the bubble and it counts just as much as any of it. That's a whole other deal. We'll just leave that comment right where it is. That being said, again, these guys have had LeBron James and Anthony Davis the last few years and have generally been a play-in team. So to me, I am still in wait and C mode as to whether they can actually build a championship level team around Luca Donchich. But the important thing in all of this is that one of the three best players on the planet is now locked in with the Lakers and they have the ability to be patient and do this the right way.

now it's just a matter of whether they can actually do it. Before we move on to our next topic, I have developed over 20 plus years. I'm covering the NBA. I have developed a credo, a belief that covers the Lakers Bubble Championship. Listeners of the podcast, know what it is. Go ahead and say it. Winning a championship means never having to say you're sorry. Can I come up with a credo real quick?

never winning a championship means you damn sure better not publicly judge somebody else's well I'm not I don't want to get into I don't want to get into it either I just wanted to make that

individual aspects of the statement because different people have different takes that's right I didn't just come up with that my second day on the job I watched a lot of things happen and then I decided

that that's the way I'm going to believe going forward and I came up with it for a reason because I see people people doing that a lot, trying to get people to slap asterisks on things. And so my belief system is that winning a championship means never having to say you're sorry. And I mean never. Okay. A lot more to come on Luca and the Lakers as we head towards the season. I think ESPN

will have some coverage of them. More Hoop Collective Podcast after this. All right. Another team that doesn't lack for attention, the New York NICN, with a key piece of off-season business. McHale Bridges a couple of days ago signing a contract extension four years and 150 million. So he already had one year on his contract

this year coming up, the last year of his deal that he signed when he was in Phoenix. He'll make about $25 million this year. The new extension starts in 26, 27, and bumps him to $33 million. It was slightly less than the maximum amount of money he could have signed for. He could have signed for about 156.

I really do think that we need to start really doing this more on our pod. And now I'm going to try to do it more on our coverage. Bobby Marks has been there for a while. But we need to start really talking in percentages of the cap. This year coming up, and granted, this is the first year of Jalen Brun. Actually, is it the first year of Jalen Brunson's extension? I think it is. It's the first year of Jalen Brunson's new contract.

This year. Yeah. So this year, Jalen's new contract comes on the books. And this year, Jalen Brunson and Mikhail Bridges combined account for about 39% of the NIC's salary cap. Next year, when Bridges' new contract comes on the books and Jalen's quote unquote discount, I don't always say quote unquote, his contract remains on the books. They are going to account for about 42% of the salary cap,

those two players. So this money, it's a large piece of money, but it isn't dramatically different when it comes to percentage of the cap. And that's not because of bridges. That's because of Brunson. And Brunson only being, you know, 22 or so.

this is what of some of these caps are projected because we don't know where the caps are going to go but over the next four years jalen brunson's percentage of the cap is 23 22 22 22 so he is making um and by the way the max contract as you know is can be as much as 35% of the cap or for players in his grouping it's 30% on this deal he should be making by but if you're just going by merit 30% of the cap. So he's giving them a very... So what Luca just signed for was 35% of the cap. 30.

30% of the cap, right. 30% of the cap. Jalen Brunson's making... It would have been 35 in Dallas. That's right. Galen Brunson is making 22%. And that 8% makes a world of difference in the apron era. It just does.

Just for Claire, just so people have a sense of it. So Anthony Edwards is just under 30% this year. He's at 29.5. he's making 45.5 million. Jalen Brunson is making 34.9 million. So you're talking about a $10 million difference. And in a moment when every dollar counts, your best player being $10 million cheaper than he could be is a significant advantage. Well, and when did Jaylon Brunson sign his extension, which was the max he could get at the time, but still a massive discount that he didn't wait a year. He signed it after the Bridges trade was done. So I'm pretty sure that Janen signed that with the idea of, hey, this is going to allow us to keep my guy that we just brought across town. Yeah. So, you know, there's going to, there is, I understand that, well, first off, this contract for the Knicks, getting bridges under contract, because he was limited in how much he could extend for this year.

It was not a guarantee that this was going to get done. So to get him done and to get him for a little bit less than he could have gotten, it's a good piece of business for the organization. Now, Bridges will walk around New York with the millstone around his neck of the five first round picks. And, you know, he will, you know, he didn't ask for that, but that is the reality. But the reason I bring up these percentages of him and Brunson together, what the percentage they are, it is still for a guy who is your a quality two-way wing player and your face of your franchise, it is decent business.

Let me ask you this, Timbontemps. You know how we look at contracts on this podcast. You sign a player. Can the player be traded if you have to trade him or you want to trade him for value? So I said to Bridges zone about $25 million this year. So for the next five years, he's at about a five years and 175 million is what he is owed. Is that a tradable contract? Yeah, our pal Danny Leroux from the Dunkin Pott dubbed this to Nenei test many years ago,

and Nene signed that extension with Denver and then got traded. It is an interesting question. If McHale Bridges plays like you did last year, I'm not sure how tradable the contract is. I think you could wonder. I mean, there are going to be teams with Cap Space next summer, so it is an open question, but I'm not convinced he was getting four, $450 million next summer based off how he played this past season.

Part of Mike Brown coming in is to try to get everybody to, you know, be more involved and to sort of lift, you know, lift the bench, lift the supporting cast, et cetera, around Jalen Brunson and Carltown. So we will see. as a very durable two-way wing player, it's probably a movable deal. I'm just not sure how positive it is. I mean, historically durable. Well, yeah, right, exactly.

Never missed a game, to be clear. So, yeah, I think it is. I just think it's a question of how much value it would be in the deal. But to McMahon's point, this was probably baked in last summer when the trade happened and the bronze extension happened. And for all, we've talked about the disconts. counts that these guys have taken to some degree, though Mikhail hasn't taken, I don't think, as nearly as much of one as Jalen, is those five guys plus Miles McBride and Tyler Colette for next

season are on the books for $203 million, the five starters, I should say, towns, and Obey Brunson Bridges, and Josh Hart. That is only about 18 million below the second apron, and that's with a lot of open roster spots. So you're basically looking at it. looking at those seven guys and minimums to be a, to be under the second apron. So this is the team that they have going forward. And the question is, is that team ever going to be good enough to ultimately get at the Knicks where they hope to go? That is, that is the question that's hanging over the Knicks even more than the five first round picks for Mikkel Bridges. Because for as great as the last couple seasons have been, with someone who lives in New York,

I know what everybody wants in New York, which is to finally break the half-century weight to win title. And we were just in Oklahoma City. That team isn't going anywhere. The Cavs Corner certainly is not going anywhere. Orlando is going to be awfully interesting the next couple of years after trading for Desmond Bain. So even more than the five first round picks, it's that question. Now that you have this team locked in, just how good is it? I think that remains an open question.

But I think if you're going to be that expensive, you better be a contender. And the Knicks can obviously look in the mirror and say, hey, this is a contending team. We are fresh off of a finals appearance. I do think it's reasonable to expect Bridges to be better this season, having a full season under his belt with this team. You probably say the same thing about Carl Anthony Towns, although he was pretty damn good last year. And obviously, the East is wide open. I mean, if you're the Knicks, it's certainly a finals or bust type of season. And so, yeah, if you're going to be expensive, the finals should be the expectation, that expensive at least.

Well, the reason I bring up the whole can you trade it is because this is the, we talked about the Lakers optionality. This is the Knicks optionality. I think they like this team. I think, you know, they look at the five guys that they had last year who stayed relatively healthy. they got to the conference finals and they see Boston a team that they were able to beat but they see Boston pulling down

and the calves are definitely a team to be dealt with but they are in the second apron now and the Knicks are not and that is a key factor going forward and so the Knicks have the option of riding this core out or their pathway forward is to make a trade and you know

you see bridges get extended this summer We have not heard anything about Carl Anthony Towns getting extended. And I don't think it has a commentary on Towns or the season he had. I just think that, you know, Towns has three years and about $160 million left on his contract. Actually, I think it's more than that. I think it's $170. And there would be some challenge to trade that. If you, you know, he's under the same.

Minnesota just did. well right um but uh it was arguable was arguable about the value there uh when they did it um and you know he can sign the same he's on the same contractual path as devon booker he and booker got this super max extension that they're on within a couple of days of each other or a couple of hours of each other a few years ago booker signed the extension this summer with the suns it was two years like 145 or whatever it was. Towns is in the same boat, but I think one of the reasons that you may not see that happen is because if the Knicks put Towns on a contract that's five years and he's owed approaching $300 million, I think it makes him, I think it diminishes the Knicks' optionality

with their roster. And so that's what I think the Knicks want to do. They like this team. They made a coaching change. They obviously believe that, the moving to Mike Brown might be able to get more out of this team and that they can sort of try to find some efficiencies that they weren't getting under Tom Thibodeau, or they can maneuver. And so I think their moves going forward with Jalen Brunston being the key,

their ability to stay under the second apron, which staying on the second apron is helps you with trades because it changes what you can do. So I think the Knicks want to walk that line of having a team that is competitive and having a team that if a superstar becomes available, they can go get him and put him next to Brunson. Yeah, I mean, a couple things on that.

One, I think if Carl Towns was to sign an extension, I don't think there was any real, I shouldn't say this for certain. I don't think there's been real discussions of that one or the other this summer, to your point, which I wouldn't take as any sort of a negative thing. I think it's much more likely that,

rather than the Devin Booker route, it's more like his former teammate Rudy Gober's route, where the opts out of the player option in the last year and takes less money for longer years to lessen the hit and spread out the money, get more money, and also give his team some more flexibility. And the other thing to point out, as far as flexibility at the roster goes, is that McElbridge's signing this extension when he did means that he can be traded before the trade deadline. He'll come up a few days before the February trade deadline and not saying he's going to you traded in February, but it is worth pointing out when you talk about moves the

next could make that that is something that's a... They just want to leave the doors open. They're not looking to go through the doors. They just want those doors to be open. Well, it's like, listen, when I got in that raft, go whitewater raft and we're playing and have a great time, but I damn sure put on a life jacket. You didn't want to use it. Well, you know, Pat Riley, Pat Riley, you know, I learned, I continued to learn so much whenever I

spend time around the heat organization. But, you know, one of the heat sayings, Spolstra uses it, but it's O'Reillyism. I don't know if they use this with you, McMahon. But if you fall out of the boat and you're in trouble, because I think the story goes with this, I don't know if it was in one of Riley's books, but it was told to me verbally when I was in Miami.

You have to be an active participant in your own rescue. No, I've heard that one. So if you fall out of the boat, can't just sit there and wave your hands and hope somebody comes and yanks you out. That's the way the heat try to do business. You have to be an active participant in your own rescue. So that's a whitewater rafting thing. There was some choppy waters for the heat last year. Jimmy was rocking that boat pretty good.

Yes, he was. Yeah. Jimmy was trying to throw people overboard. He was doing the exact opposite, which is one of the reasons why I think that didn't end so well with Jimmy and Pat. More Hoop Collective Podcast after this. Okay, I'm not sure this is this part's going to be in the podcast. We'll see. But we are expecting, I don't know if what happened today because today is the first day. It could happen. Actually, I think maybe even yesterday was. But sometime in the next day or a couple of days, there is an expectation that Deerrin Fox will extend his contract with the San Antonio Spurs. He wasn't eligible until the last couple of days. The Spurs traded three first round picks for him at the trade deadline. When they did that, They were pretty much saying they were going to give him a big contract number this year. And they saw him as Victor Wenbenyama's point guard. Co-star. Not just point guard, co-star.

Co-star. Sure, if you're going to pay the guy over $200 million on the contract. And by the way, his preferred list of destinations had one team on it, the San Antonio Spurs. Rich Paul's not placing a star client somewhere that he's not going to get paid. Right. And whatever you want to say about Rich Paul, the client said, I want to be traded and I want to be traded to this team and I want to get paid. And Rich Paul delivered that. So say whatever you want about him.

But, you know, his work product is there for all to see. He's good at his job. So now let me ask the question, Bon Temps, assuming that there's a contract that we expect him to get. Can you trade that contract? I mean, probably, but if you look around the league, you know, there's not a lot of teams that need point guards and there's not a ton of, I'm not sure what the interest level would be. I mean, it's the same thing as if you want to try to start constructing fake lamello ball trades or fake Tray Young trades or fake, you know, any of these point guard trades. DeAren's obviously a great player, but there's just, it's an interesting dynamic in the market. And we've talked about a bunch.

We've talked about the Spurs a lot this summer. I think one of the really interesting questions across the entire league this year, and maybe the next couple of years, is how do the Spurs sort out the combination of Stefan Castle, Dylan Harper, and Deeran Fox? Because on paper, those are three high-value, really interesting players that don't fit together. And you could probably find a way to play two of them together.

It seems really hard to find a way to play a way to play. all three of them together for extended minutes. And it's going to be really fascinating for Mitch Johnson, the now full-time head coach of the Spurs, and our guy Sean Sweeney, the now lead assistant in San Antonio, to figure out what the best way to maximize those guys is, the best way to bring along those young guys

and to see how they all fit together. Because that, I think, more than anything else, outside of just Victor's continued descendants to start them, that's the thing that's going to determine sort of what the direction of the Spurs is going forward. What is this solved to that question and what does it look like both for who do the Spurs decide to keep? How do they decide to use them? And if they move on from one of them, what is the return and a potential deal for any one of them that they move on from? And when you ask, can you trade the contract?

It's not can you trade it right now. It's down the road. And I think down the road, there will be more teams that have need at point guard. I mean, you know, you look at the clippers, for example. James Hard is still playing at a high level, but, you know, he's not the long-term solution there. And, you know, I think there's a handful of teams that would fit in that category. I think there's more teams that need point cards than you're in a game right now. I guess what I mean by that is it's a combination of need and can you get value in return.

Like, sure, a lot of teams are just here in Fox, but that's different than can you trade him for stuff you really? want back. That's more than question. And then I think I think it's too early to say how these three guards are going to fit or whether they can fit. And a lot of this year, this year definitely is a year where the spurs need to make a leap. The spurs need to be a playoff team. They, you know, they need to make major strides in year three of Wembe and hopefully a full healthy year for Wemby. But, it's also still an evaluation year. It is still, I mean, it's still wimby early in his career on his rookie contract. And it's, you know, you're still in the rookie, you know, the rookie year for Dylan Harper and the second year for Stefan Castle. And so I think it's, a lot of this year is

about the evaluation of how that guard group fits together. And, you know, especially the development, I think, of Castle in particular. You know, Castle's shooting. ability, I think, is going to be a key that can either unlock or lock a lot of things for the spurs in terms of fit, because if he can shoot it, and he's a shooter who defenses have to guard, I don't see why those three can't play together sometimes. He can, I mean, he's a big, strong dude. He can guard threes. I can promise you that. Well, again, let's talk about optionality. Because Harper, about to be a rookie, and Stefan Castle are on rookie contracts, so is Victor for that matter. The Spurs have optionality. They're not, you know, whether or not this trio works together or not,

they will have, they have maneuverability with it because they're not giving all of them nine figures, at least not right now. So that, enables them. Plus, it's interesting, you know, when they did this deal, they certainly knew what they had in Castle, but they had no idea they were going to end up with a number two pick and be able to draft the best guard in the draft. It's a good, it's obviously a good problem to have. But at the same time, it is worth pointing out, and I'm a big Stefan Castle fan. He shot 26.7% from 3-8 Yukon. He shot 28.7% last year. Deeran Fox has had one, 36% three-point shooting season. every other one has been well below that, and he's a 33% career shooter.

Dylan Harper was a 33% shooter from three last year at Rutgers. That's not going to work long term. So, yes, like at least one of those guys, and it's probably not going to be Darren Fox, because he's now mostly a formed player, is going to have to come a much better shooter, if not two of them, for that to be a viable trio. And that's why, yes, this year, I think is all about, I think is all about, observation with those guys and what do they try to do and how do they try to fit them together? Because you still have Devin Vesel.

Like there's a lot of interesting pieces there in San Antonio. And I still think we're probably a move or two away from the core of whatever the first real contending team looks like around Victor, I would think, because just on paper, it feels like there's still a move or two left to be made before this looks like the fully ready team that he'll be looking for. Well, and I asked you guys recently, do you think the Spurs would have made the Fox trade if they'd had known, which is impossible? What if they would have known they were going to get Dylan Harper in the draft? And the answer is probably not.

You know, just from a cost perspective, probably not. But like you said, Bontemps, there are a lot worse problems to have than, hey, we've got three guards who are pretty damn good. How do they fit together? The other thing, again, as long as we're talking about optionality, the Spurs have some big expiring contracts on their roster. Harrison Barnes and Kelly O'Lennick being the two biggest ones combined. They're over $32 million. That they can go shopping and that depending on what they do with those, they could also let them just come off their books. But if they go shopping during the season, they also have Jeremy Sohan who is extension eligible. So whether or not they decide

to pay him or not if they don't extend them, it's that's somebody they look to move. So Spurs are going to be doing some interesting things, but because they've got so many of their core pieces on rookie contracts, it enables them, I think, to make a big investment in a player like Fox because they believe that he has such value. They did, I think even though they gave up three firsts, I think they felt good about the value that they got in that trade. Well, and it was four firsts with a wink-wink because one of them was never going to convey as a first. And they went into it with a surplus of picks, they still have plenty of picks. Like if there's a trade to be made, they've got plenty of ammo, including draft capital moving forward. And listen, Wendy,

you've been telling us about the breakfast tacos, that Riverwalk, the proximity to Austin. And the fact that... I haven't talked about the Riverwalk. I will vouch for the fact that San Antonio has got more going for it than people want to give it credit for. It's very much a growing city. Her capita, there's as many facial on head tattoos in San Antonio as anywhere in America. But in seriousness, since they got Wemby, you've been talking about, hey, San Antonio is going to be a destination for players. And they didn't engage in the KD bidding, but they were on Kevin Durant's list. That's an example. That's an example.

And again, we talked about this a little bit with the Knicks, the next superstar player that becomes available. I don't know if that player will say the spurs are on his list, but there's no doubt that they will consider the spurs. And that is important when we talk about whether you can trade a contract and optionality and pick position and expiring contracts. You know, we're not looking to start any aggregation here, but there's a reason we're bringing it up. We're not just filling time. Well, there's only so many players in the league that if you say overrunner on MVP's 1.5, you take the over. Victor's one of them. By the way, that's the overrunner.

I sit on Luca after his rookie year. Would you take over under at this point? Still zero. You still take the over? Over. I think I would do. You know. Especially now he's got all those LA media.

I was going to say it might be easier to win MVP as a Laker. Yeah, I mean, look, I mean, we might as well end where we started. I mean, for all of the discussion about Luca and the ideas that there, you know, there's some sort of, you know, there was some sort of controversy about whether he should get paid by Dallas in some quarters. I mean, we're talking about a guy who until last year when he was banged up and got traded and wasn't eligible, had won rookie to year and then was first team all NBA the next five years in a row and is unquestionably one of the three best players on the planet as an 18-year-old,

won Eurobasket with Slovenia and won the EuroLeague Final Four as the MVP with Real Madrid and is. He's taking the team to the conference finals and a completely different support of the finals. Yes. I mean, it's like this isn't easy. Like maybe he's James Harden and he wins one. He's going to win one. My guess is he's going to win multiple. And once again, there is one person in the NBA who didn't want to bet on Luca Donchich.

Everybody else on the NBA, any questions aside would have happily bet. Now, I would not have guessed that somebody in Lucas' draft class would beat him to the NBA. MVP. It happened. It's true. Well, that guy's pretty good. You know, the Dodgers have Shohei Otani, and the thing about Shohei Otani, regardless of what he does as a pitcher, you know that for the foreseeable future, that guy is going to put up enormous numbers. You're going to get 50 homers out of him. You're going to get enormous numbers out of him. And I don't know if he'll win the MVP or whatever, but he's going to hit a bunch of home runs and all that stuff. Luca Donchich is going to put up enormous numbers This guy falls out of

28, 8 and 7th I'm saying like Some of these Luca games You'll say You'll say How's Luke it's like It'll be a third quarter

How's Luca playing? He's not really having a great night Let me look at the box score up here Oh he's got 27, 11, and 8 He's the only guy I've ever seen Who can have crappy 30 point triple doubles and I mean really it's a testament to his talent but like Luke is going to average 30 plus and near a triple double

and this only has career averages of 28.6 points 8.6 rebounds and 8.2 assists with over a steal a game and his entire and now he's in shape and not in the Lordy. Yeah I mean he there's so many nights when I watched him play where you feel where you feel like his floor he's got one of the highest floors i've ever seen um and uh jacks he's the size of magic he's the size of magic johnson i'll never forget i never forget the first time i saw him in person i was just like i cannot believe how big he is it's just because because he doesn't play because when you watch him play because you know he he doesn't play with enormous

athleticism, you can't always tell, but so many of his plays are athletic plays because of his size. Jackson points something out, something out too. Eurobasket, I believe, starts on the 17th. We're going to start, Slovenia starts playing some friendlies in the next five or six days. I don't know if he's going to play in those, but we're going to get to see Luca play here and what it looks like very, very soon. By the way, so too with Yokic. Yokic is playing in Eurobasket for the Serbians. Serbia is bringing the entire team that played and got the bronze medal last year in Paris

and almost almost beat the U.S. They're playing. He's not playing for the first time ever, basically, right? Who's that, Joker? No, I said Rudy's playing for basically, not playing for basically the first time ever, right? Yeah, yeah. France is not going to have Rudy, I guess not going to have Wemby.

But, you know, it's going to be an interesting tournament. Latvia's been at Porzingis and Latvia hosts the final four. Germany should be awfully good again. Yeah. Yeah, Latvia is a sneaky good team. Latvia almost beat Germany in the knockout round

in the World Cup two years ago. They didn't get to do anything last year because they didn't qualify for the Olympics, but they were this close. Davos Bertans had a three-pointer in the air at the buzzer to knock out Germany who are the world champions in Manila.

It was a great game and Porzingus didn't play. Porzingus was dealing with a foot issue. So come here for your American-based European analysis. We'll be watching. But all right, thank you very much for joining the Hoop Collective today. Thank you to Jackson and Key, our producers on this episode.

Thank you to McMahon and Bontemps. Thank you for sticking. with us through August with more to come. We're sticking by you. We don't take the summer off on this pod. And we will talk to you later this week. Adios amigos.