Brian Windhorst & The Hoop Collective - Re-Drafting The 2023 NBA Draft

Episode Date: August 7, 2026

Brian Windhorst is joined by Tim MacMahon and Vince Goodwill to re-draft the 2023 NBA Draft including who got their picks right and what stars needed to be selected much higher.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello and welcome the Who Collective podcast. Welcome to our periodic summer series where we take a look back at some recent drafts. And we redraft them, knowing what we know now, because we're all smarter. And doing that with us for the first time, we're so happy to have him is Vince Goodwill. What up, though, Wendy? What up, McMahon? Should I be playing a part of Bontimps today? Should I be angry and, you know, all that?

And a veteran of this and, you know, one of the best. redrafters and all of redrafts, Van McMahon. Howdy, partners. I'm not sure about that. I think I took Christian Brown fourth overall in last year's redraft. Oh, no, you shouldn't have brought that up. Like the nuggets, I probably was a bit too high on Christian. Hey, you didn't give us the good, we talked about the NBA.

Oh, we talked about the NBA, but we're talking about the 2023 NBA draft. How are we going to decide the order here, Wendy? Okay, Vince, this is the role that you're going to have to play. I, there's certain things you know how to do a snake draft, right? I play fantasy football. I mean, come on, right? I don't play fantasy football, okay? And I botched a snake draft.

And I know that some people think that I'm doing it as a bit, but I do mess it up. And I want the position where I always go in between you guys. Okay. Is that position two? You're second. Okay. Yeah. And so you're just one at a time.

All right. All right. But Benny and I, after the first. Brown, you know, Vinnie, I'll let you pick first. All right. Would you say this? Would you rather be third or first? Would you rather have the obvious one or would you rather have to make a decision?

Oh, no, I want the obvious one. Okay, okay. All right. I'll be third. So this is the 2023 draft. It's the Victor Wenbanyama draft, which I think you're going to hear his name very soon. These are the guys who are up for extensions this summer. So it's a great time to evaluate.

Most of them, at least. Some of them are on two ways. There is one player aside from Wimby who has already signed an extension in this class. You are correct. And we'll see how early or if he goes. So we're going to redo the lottery here. And 2023, I will remember it very well the lottery that year. Oh, yeah.

Wee, windy. That's right. One of the most members, why don't we just make this our SOFI, get your money right, memory lane? One of the great assignments of my career, Vince, to be sent to Paris for the lottery. And, you know, Connor, what's their hockey players name? Conner McDavid? I'm not allowed to talk about hockey. You're right. And by the way, I want to applaud you. You have stuck to that for years now. Why are you not allowed to talk about hockey? I'm not allowed to talk about that either. Excuse me, sir. Not right now. Not now, Vince, not now. Not while I'm on vacation.

So one time when it was the Connor McDavid hockey lottery, I was in Toronto covering the playoffs, whatever year that was, 2017, 18, whatever it was. He was like the Victor Wenbanjama of that year. He was from the greater Toronto area. I was in Toronto during the playoffs. It's hard to get playoff games in your hotel room in Toronto. So I walked down to this legendary sports bar in Toronto, real sports, right next to Jurassic Park. It's a great spot.

I walk in there. It was like a regular Monday or Tuesday night. You know, I was hoping to see, you know, I don't know. Whatever first round game. Yeah, like a Bucks 76ers, you know, first round series or something like that. And the place was wall-to-wall people. And on every screen but won was the NHL draft lottery. Because the Maple Leafs were in it.

I think they had the third or fourth best chance. And they were trying to get Connor McDavid. Anyway, I'm watching the lottery. I'd never seen the NHL lottery before. And Connor McDavid is sitting down the street, I believe, at the CBC. But whatever network had it, he's in the studio. They open up the envelopes and discover Jackson help me out here, Winnipeg or Calgary or Edmonton, right?

He said it was 2015, first of all. Oh, 2015, boy, it's been years now. Edmonton? Yes. So Edmonton pulls, they pull Edmonton. Edmonton wins the lottery. The Mapleese fans are all bummed because this is one of their favorite sons from Ontario, generational player, et cetera.

And like two minutes after. after he finds out he's going to Edmonton, he's on set doing this, doing this interview. I thought it was amazing. It was amazing television that he was going to be that, that, you know, immediately, you just found out your whole life, you're going to be in Edmonton, your thoughts.

Like, real-time answer. Yeah, and you were just trying to watch us. So you were looking to watch the Bulls' Bucks. It was Bulls' Bucks. Okay. Well, listen, I don't even care with that game. I don't remember anything about that game, but I'll always remember how amazing I thought that broadcast was. So years later, with the help of our colleague Jonathan Gavoni,

I'd spent some time with Victor and his agents and his family in Paris that year. And we had this idea to see, you know, and he was very willing to do it. And the lottery happens at 2 a.m. there. And so we did it. And I went over there. And it was the last game of the regular season was that night. His team played the other Paris team in the French league. Last game in the French regular season.

Last game of the French track was season, which goes into May, I guess. I went to that game. They won. Victor played well. And then at 2 a.m. How cool of all it would play? He didn't play poorly. Okay.

I have a whole other story about Gavoni and Bilal Colobali. Should I tell this story right now? It's the summer. Why not? All right. No, I'm not going to. Because this is a great story. I love this story.

Okay. So just to illustrate how Jonathan Gavoni works. All right? So when I go over there in January, Belal Kula Bali was kind of playing on their JV team. They have like the French League. They have their senior team. Then they have kind of a JV team.

They call the Espoa. Okay. And they play at like three or four o'clock. And Kulabali had been playing on the JV team. Well, there was injuries or something. He was playing better. And they kind of promoted him to the big team. And, but there was all these GMs there to watch, to watch Victor.

There was probably like, seriously like six GMs in town, including, by the way, Brian Wright from the Spurs. The Spurs call a lot of wimby. Yeah. And for a lot of years. And there was this young teenage prospect. So this team came in from this other team and their JV team had this prospect that all these general managers wanted to see. A young, lanky wing by the name of Zachary Rishishay, who I think was 16 or 17.

Okay. And the GMs were all there wanted to see Risha Shay play against Kulibali. At the time, Kulabali was like a bubble or late 20, like late first round pick. But they were playing him on the sort of the varsity team, you know, the big team. And but these GMs. And so they knew that Gavoni had like a really good relationship with the head coach of Victor's team, Vincent Kole, who was a national team coach at the time. And I watched Gavoni successfully talk.

Maybe I should say lobby. Lobby, there you go. Lobby, Colet, into having Kula Bally play in the JV game. Just so it's a showcase him against Riesashe. Yes. And then go play in the varsity game, which is what happened. And Kulabali killed in this game. Killed had like 25 points.

It was awesome. I swear to God, he jumped 10. spots in the order after this game. And Gavoni, like, look, I don't, maybe Jonathan has a different version of events, but I'm just going to legend build. Gavoni, like, talked Colette into doing this. Kula Bali plays against Risha Shay. And then goes in the senior game.

He played like two and a half quarters. Then played, was the first guy off the bench, was a sixth man. Right out of, like, you know, 16 year old sophomore coming up to the varsity and coming off the bench, you know, or whatever. Well, maybe Kulali can play in a, uh, in a JV. game real quick here because he needs to get bumped up. What about Risha Shea? Not in this draft, but he won't go number one in the night and when we do this again next year either. Well, so anyway, they play that game that night. Did Cullaballi played? I don't remember what he did.

So they went to Nike's Paris headquarters on the Champsulise. Is this the big a huge store? You know, the store is there, but this is like the actual, they have offices there. Okay. Okay. It's not far from. from Boulevard and McMahon. Boulevard McMahon is down the street. Avenue Day McMahon. Avenue Day McMahon. I'm so sorry.

I didn't want to interrupt. You know, nothing says, you know, something French than a boulevard named or an avenue. Apparently, I've got like a great, great,

great, great, great, great uncle who was a French war hero somehow. Yeah. I'm sure he was related to you. Boy, Patrick McMahon. What a... Hey, he does.

He smells. What a French name. Yeah, right. Oh my God. He bring Jameson. Did he bring Jameson to France as well? By the way, my little nephew who's on this trip is, his name is Jameson O'Connor.

Again, it doesn't sound French. All right. So anyway, at 2 a.m., we're in this place. There's not that many people there. They kept it small. All of Victor's teammates are there. His family is there. Killing Mabapé.

is there. He was playing for PSG at the time. You know what PSG is Vince? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Paris Saint-Germain, who, you know, currently the two-time Champions League winners. So he's there.

Like, there's some French actor there. I don't know. He was a big deal, but I don't know. Girard-Depie. No, I'm just kidding. It was some young French actor. Would it be amazing

if Girard-Depidio showed up at Victor Ramos? Pepé-A-L-T. So here's the thing. So it was right in front of a Western, you know, it was our broadcast. So the deal is Victor's going to find out what happens and he's going to come over to me. And he had like no time to do this because we had to get to the broadcast. I remember talking to the truck.

I think, I feel like it was a Western Conference finals. And they told me you have 90 seconds. And then at one, then they were like, you have 75 seconds. I think I recall it being like Joker was about to tip off. Okay, so it must have been. That was Lakers Nuggets, I think. Okay. I think it might be right.

Yeah. All right. So I'm hearing the truck. The lottery is going on. And here's the thing. I'm hearing the live broadcast. We're connected through satellite, whatever, internet, whatever. I'm hearing the live broadcast.

But, you know, it's being streamed to France. And so there's a delay. There's like a four-ish, five-ish second delay. So he all sits down with his family and his agent is there. And I said to his agent, Buna. I said, Buna. I'm going to be hearing the teams that come out of these envelopes. Do you want me to tell you, like, give you a sign, like which team?

Like, you know, write it down or whatever so that you're, you know, you have some heads up. I offered that and he said, only for one team. And I will not tell you what that team is. Maybe later in Victor's career, but there's only one team that, that Boone, not Victor, just Boona wanted to know who it was. But Victor was on the record as saying he didn't care. He didn't have, he wasn't like a place he didn't want. like so it didn't matter. So yeah, so it was amazing. We had told him like that I was trying to replicate the Connor McDavid moment, right? Like this is what I was going for. And by the way,

I wrote stories and did other hits there. People, Wendy's sensitive because it went viral. The ESPN sent Wendy all the way to Paris for a 60 second interview. Well, you know why I don't like that? Because I literally then stayed up all night writing the story of the night, you know, the written story. And I was like, I should get credit for staying up until. Then I did get up in the morning. I was up straight through the noon the next day. One thing nobody can criticize is your work ethic. We know anybody. So we get through, and Victor had been like briefed. Victor, we got like two minutes once this happens because, you know, on the broadcast, they, you know, go to the spurs. You want it, you know, and all this stuff. By the way, thank you,

thank you for that. What is that? A four-year-old windy sleep update? Listen, some people have great stories of being up all night in Paris. I'm just not one of them. So it happens, and sure enough, Victor comes over, and I have 70 seconds. I think I squeezed out three questions. There's not a super memorable interview, although he was excited to be a spur because, you know, the spurs are connected to France because of Tony Parker. Yeah, and they've got a pretty good history of drafting the seven footers number one overall and turning them into or helping them develop into Hall of Famers. More Hoop Collective podcast after this.

Anyway, that's the draft we're redrafting here. Yep. Now that I've just filibustered for all that stuff. You picking Scoot Henderson number one, Denny? All right, Vince, you're on the clock. You know, this is a really difficult decision because you got both Thompson twins to pick between. But I am going to, of course, San Antonio,

I'm going to take Victor one, Benyama. Very easy choice. I would say either the last, what, 10 number one picks? He's probably the easiest or maybe 20 since LeBron. I mean, I would say he's up there with LeBron. I remember, you know, Woge created a little bit of a ripple when he said he, I think he said he might be the best prospect ever. Ever leading up to that draft.

And, you know, Wimby, like LeBron, and Wimby's got a long way to go. But like LeBron, Wendy came in the league with just. a historical amount of hype and has lived up to it so far. You know, now, I don't know if he's going to do it for 24 years, but three years in, you know, thank goodness the blood clot didn't derail anything, but the one year, three years in, Wembe is everything that you thought he was going to be. All right, so that's now my turn, right? It is, it is.

So really, this is kind of a tough spot here, one of the toughest spots, because you're going with a Thompson twin. Which twin am I going with? I mean, you don't have to go to Thompson twin. I would go Thompson twin, but I wouldn't, I don't think the choice is between the twins here. It's not, well, you're going to get to, I'm going with the Thompson twin.

Okay. You know, you can pick whoever you want third here, come up in a second and fourth, for that matter. Yes, I can. Where to get that snake draft right? I am going with Amen Thompson, even though Asar has come on extraordinarily strong. They both are having terrific careers, and I don't even really, I just, I've seen, I've watched Amman play a little bit more.

He's got a little bit more of a history and his defensive intensity, although Asar was the one who made all defense this year. They're both incredible. Their athleticism is tremendous. Amman just has a little bit bigger body of. work. That's basically why I'm doing that. I mean, we could redraft this again in a year or two. And I could, and he's a better offensive player at this point. Look, by the way, uh, big hire for the Houston Rockets, higher in Chip England. And obviously, Amin is going to be his new pet project, uh, as Lou Dwart was, as Kauai Lennar was before that, and, you know, among others. And by the way, like, I obviously could go

with Brandon Miller here. Brandon Miller has had a very good three years. I just look at Amman Thompson as a, as a true difference-making defensive player. Obviously, his offensive game is still under development. Well, it is, but in this class, he ranks fourth and points scored, second in rebounds, and second-and-assists. You know, he's a pretty good attacking off the dribble, and he's awesome in the dunker spot, obviously develop a jump shot,

or they need to surround him with a bunch of elite shooting. if he's going to be the primary ball handler. And, you know, he had the, because of Ambley's injury, he was kind of thrust into the primary initiator role last year. And it was, you know, a learning experience. I wouldn't say he failed. If somebody he used to be on this podcast, who's known for having bad basketball takes,

predicted that he'd be most improved player MVP and, you know, a lot for the Hall of Fame by the end of year. Well, yeah. So, by the way, he has shot 54% for him. his career. He knows what his bread and butter is. It's just that this, his three-point shooting is getting worse, not better. And he's just, he's just not going to get guarded in the playoffs. And that is definitely an issue. And so he doesn't have to be a 40% three-point shooter. He just can't be a 20% free-point shooter like he was this last year. I mean, I wonder if his best thing

is playing off the ball, you know, like while that jumper develops. I think he was kind of putting us, I won't say a spot of disservice that the rocket. didn't go out and get a point guard, you know, when Van Blee got hurt to sort of stem the tide a little bit. But I felt like being thrown into the fire. He was okay. I think what happens when we do these redrafts is we remove like some of the stigmas that happen in real time. Like now we're criticizing his game where it is. But when you go to a redraft and the guys being number two, like you're saying he's had a pretty successful career so far. So you're not dissecting the negatives as much as you are accentuating all the positives that he has brought in his first three years. Yeah, and look, he averaged over 18 points a game last year,

shooting better 3% from the floor, more than 5 assists. But again, offensively now, where he's at his best is when he's in the dunker spot or when he's cutting. And, you know, him and Shungoon have a really good chemistry when Shingun's catching a ball up around the elbow. You know, so he's still evolving, kind of figuring out who he is as a on-ball playmaker. But, I mean, him and his brother, there ain't five better athletes in the league. Those are the best two athletes in the league.

Yeah. I was going to say, there might not be any. Extension talk. Am I'm going to be interesting, by the way. The Rockets have a history, a recent history of negotiating hard with their own guys, Shangoon being the primary example. But with Shangoon, with Jalen Green, and very quickly last year with Jabari Smith, they got extensions done with all three of those guys.

So we'll see. I'll also say, and I've said it many times, in terms of who they value the most on that roster, Thompson is at the very, very top of that list. I'm not talking young guys. I'm talking, period. All right. You've got control.

Okay. So number three picks are going to be Brandon Miller. And remember, there are a lot of eyebrows raised when Charlotte took Brandon Miller over Scoot Henderson. And clearly, you know, that decision has ended up being the right decision. You know, last year, averaged better than 20, really last two years averaged better than 20 points per game. You'd like to see him be a little bit more efficient within the inside the three point arc. But, you know, shot at 38% last year from three, you know, big, big long wing.

Yeah, great size wing. You know, and it's still a little bit older than 23 years old. I mean, but I don't have any hesitation taking him at number three. I do think four gets to be a little bit. Oh, a little spicy. Do it, McMahon. Do it. I know what you're thinking.

Do it. It's a tough decision here. So you mentioned the Saar. I don't think he's the, I'm not sure he's even the best. I shouldn't say that. I was going to say I'm not even sure he's the best defensive player on the board. I'm not going to go that strong. But I am going to take Kaysen Wallace over Assar Thompson.

And the reason I'm going to do that one, Kays and Wallace also was an all defensive player last year. Case and Wallace taken 10th by the Thunder. Technically taken by the Mavs and there was a trade down. The Mavis Dauvus Borgon. What was the trade? Yeah, what was the trade? I don't remember that. I don't know.

But they traded the Mazz traded down and got lively at 12. And the price from now, they dumped Davos-Briton's contract. That was the lottery pick that they secured and got fined. Was it $500,000? That was the top 10. Remember that top 10 protected Nick's pick and they ended up with 10. And it took tank in late in the season, you know, to make sure that happened. And I think we're going to find out, you know, Case of Wallace has shown flashes of some real

offensive potential, you know, especially this year during the stretch when Shea was out later in the season. And then it was like Shea was out, A.J. Mitchell was out. Jaylon Williams out. Now, unfortunately, it wasn't able to replicate that in the conference finals when they really needed another playmaker to show up with a dub out and A. and A.J. Mitchell out. But I think we're going to, you know, I think he starts this year.

I'm not certain about that because A.J. Mitchell could as well. but I think Kaysen starts. I think we're going to find out how much offensive juice he has, but more of a proven offensive Komadi than Asar Thompson, which is why I'm going with him here. And again, they're both awesome defenders.

That makes my choice so very easy. I thought it was my turn. It is. No. Oh, wait. It is. It is this time. You're right. You know one of you guys know how to do a snake grab. I do.

I'm sorry. It just screwed me up, McMahon, that you picked twice in a row. My bad. I know how to do a snake. draft. That's my part. McMahon, you got to hold all of us accountable here. Yeah.

I'll keep... My bad. How many fantasy leagues will you be in this fall, McMahon? So I only do too. I don't like doing a bunch because then you're like, have conflicts of interest. So I do one that's kind of a normal thing, but it's an auction league. And then I do one that's a weekly league, but like the points accumulate through the course of the season.

So you're picking a new team every off of a salary. A salary cap. Picking a new team every week. Oh, that's a lot of work, man. Jeez. It ain't that much work. It takes me one dump to do it. Wow.

Oh, we love them. We're not going to give them away. Vince, we're going to hold on to him, you know. Not while he's taking a dump. Metaphorically. No, not all I'm picking my weekly team. Sarat Thompson was the fourth overall pick or fifth overall, fifth overall pick.

to Detroit. One behind his brother. I'll live with the Thompson twins. Made first team all defense this year. Third for defensive player of the year was a driving force. I really, the way that he competed against Jalen Brunson in the 2025 playoffs is that's where Assar really sort of put his foot forward.

Led the league in steals per game this year. Average two blocks in the playoffs. Two blocks and two steals in the playoffs this year. Like, you've rarely see that. Like, he was just a freak as far as room protection. And you don't see that with guys in his position. I just, my thing is he's just such a limited offensive player.

He's even more limited than his brother. I think he's made, he's only made a handful. Yeah, he's, he averaged 9.9 points per game this year. He's not nearly the playmaker, 9.9 points. He's made 38, 3.1.

He's made 38 3-pointers in 195, uh, regular season games. Yeah. And so, listen. defensively they're as good as it gets, both of them. And, you know, I would give him the nod defensively over Wallace just because of the versatility. Wallace is 6-3, the Thompson's are 6-7. You know, like they can guard anybody and everybody. But my choice is just based purely on the offensive limitations of Thompson.

No, I'll say this as somebody who's watched them closely. For one, and this, I don't know what this is news. anything like that. But I think there's a lot of people within the Pistons organization that hold him as the second best player on this team and not Jalen Duren, even though Duren made the All-Star team. And that affects these discussions. Yeah, it's been reflecting Duren's contract negotiations over two summers now and that are still unresolved. He's one of those guys. You don't pay to watch anybody play deepens in the league. But when you see somebody compete the way that he competes, Like, he competed against Hardin and Donovan Mitchell in the second round in that series.

Like, he loves taking on the challenge. So I think he's one of those culture guys. Like, if you take them and you're a losing sort of program and he walks into your building, he ups the care factor. And I think, to me, that's why I would have taken him if Wendy had passed him up for, you know, anybody else. Plus, you're a Detroit guy. Yes, that's right. Yes. He put on the Hennessy glasses.

I wore them on air today for NBA today whenever this is aired. Yeah. So people will be fine. I guess this is my pick now, right? Number six pick. You got two of them. I got two of them. Kianti George from the Utah Jazz.

Like, I know people don't pay attention to the jazz because- She was the 16th pick in that draft. That was one of the picks that they got from the, really go bear trade if I'm not mistaken. Believe that's accurate. And he's been so, he's made incremental like steps. Like every huge leap last year. Yeah, he took, he took the leap, even though he had the hamstring injury that sort of cost him toward the end of the season.

He had tankitis, I believe. That's a shame. It was very cute. When someone says they have a hamstring injury, I tend to believe that they have a hamstring injury. I'm not accusing Danny Ains of any chicanery, Tim McKinn. They paid their fine and they're just fine with the way it worked out. And by the way, now they have one of the most exciting backcourts in the lead with Keonté George, joined by Darren Peterson. And it is going to be really fun to see how those two, who they've already developed a really good relationship, knew each other a little bit before.

Yeah, they're represented by the same agency, which always is a basis to go. forward. They met before that even with, through the trainer, I believe, Phil Beckner, who works with Damien Lillard and a bunch of other guards, met through him before that, and Kiante made a point to be a constant presence around the summer league team. Did he want to be on the coaching staff and the league said no? Yeah, which was, you know, whatever, I got a little messy. By the way, in this class, Keonté ranked second and points and first and assists.

for his career so far. No, I like, I like him. I like him a lot. He made the huge, and he's got more efficient this year, too. Like, that was the thing that sort of got me. Like, Utah's going to be a lot better as far as competitive because you ain't tanking and you got,

you got some horses that can run, even though they lost Walker Kessler to the Lakers, like Jaron Jackson and Laurie Marketing. Like, they're going to be ready to actually compete in the West. I'm not saying playoffs or anything, but I'm fascinated about where they can go. Yeah, and for Keante, it's the first time in his career that he gets to be in a competitive situation. You know, and look, he's going to have to play better defensively. But offensively, you know, if he can carry over what he did last year, then he's really good on that in the floor.

There was a time, and I said it here, that I didn't think an extension was going to get done. And then I was told when I was out in Salt Lake City, like, hey, you know, there's a little bit more optimism than there was. was in late June. You know, it's not going to be a max number if it's done this summer. You know, he might be paid more if he waits. This is just one of those classic situations where you always got to be thinking about the second apron because, or not even the second apron, but you always got to be thinking

about the aprons because you just, even if your books are in good shape and whatever, you you can screw, you can make an overpay and it can bite you in the backside for the next three years. And so. Well, and listen, they traded for Jaron Jackson Jr. He makes a lot of money. They maxed out Larry Morkinen. Didn't trade them. Yeah. And so like they've got a very expensive front court.

Now they did save some money by the sign and trade with Walker Kessler. But no question you got to, you know, and look, they're looking at this thing long term and they're hoping, certainly. that Darren Peterson is going to be a guy who gets a huge contract extension here a few years. Number seven, Vince. This is where it gets tricky. Oh, yeah. This is what we're here for. Now we're here to roll up the sleeves and act like we know the NBA.

Tracking it, baby. This is where it gets tricky for me because I'm not operating with recency bias when I'm considering Derek lively the second here. It's a tough one, but I still have in my head. the way that he played when Dallas went to the NBA finals, like the two-way force, the length, the athleticism, like the three-point shooting isn't quite there. It's basically to me between him, Hamey Hockas, Tumani Kumar, who's, you know, a three-and-d,

traditional three-and-d guy. I mean, the three-point shooting isn't there in the sense of he's never made one in the regular season game. And he was always shooting, and the shot doesn't look bad. Like when you see him go through the process, the shot doesn't look bad. just doesn't, just hasn't been put in the position to do it. I think I'm going to take Derek lively the second.

That's risky, risky business. I know it is. This is the draft, baby. No biscuit, no biscuit. Great kid was a significant factor for a team that went to the finals as a rookie. The Mavericks diminished his value by trading, the best pick and roll player in the league when he's a freaking awesome. you know, lob threat for them.

But here's where, and, you know, this is no, like, great analysis, but it's just tough, man, when you look at games played, rookie year 55, second year, 36, last year, seven. You know, he's had that foot and ankle that's been operated on multiple times now. I really hope that it can be a case like, you know, MB, for example, where there's the foot problems early in his career and he was able to get past that and have a hell of a career.

You know, obviously he's dealt with injury status career, but he's going to be a Hall of Famer. Big men with those kind of foot problems, it's scary. I'm not an orthopedic surgeon, but the fact that he had to go have this surgery done in England, which is not something you normally hear from athletes, is to go to England. I mean, that is an indication that this is what they're dealing with

is more of a rare thing. But I will tell you, Vince, like, his impact when he is right is unquestionable. I mean, you know, bouncy, big-time athlete, impact at both ends, like. Very first. He's a smart, you know, he's like the maturity, the on-floor maturity, like playing that type of style in winning situations to me always sort of jumps out. Like, it's easy to forget who he was playing again. in those series, especially against the Minnesota Timberwood,

when he was playing against, you know, towns and Gobert and what he was able to do as far as being that pick and roll partner. I'm hoping in this pick that the foot problems are behind him because I'm a huge believer in the upside. You know, Sean Sweeney was his assistant coach that he worked with on a day-to-day basis when he was a rookie. And Sweeney obviously has gone on and was associate head coach for the Spurs, now head coach for the magic.

The guy doesn't just give flowery praise just to get it. That's true. Okay. Sweeney told me when Lively was a rookie that he thought Lively had potential to be a Yoki Noah type of defensive presence, but at 7-1 and bouncy. In other words, that type of cerebral, versatile, stretchy, do everything type of big man defensive anchor. Yeah, well, Vince is still a believer there.

All right, so I have the eighth pick here, correct? Yes. Yes, you do. The eighth pick in 2023, by the way, was Gerius Walker. Ended up with the Pacers, just so you know. More Hoop Collective Podcast after this. I am going to go with Tumani Kamara here. Okay.

And that is the guy other than Wimby who's already had an extension. Matter of fact, that, his extension kicks in this year. Well, not even true, buddy. First off, there may be more extensions by the time, but Jordan Walsh got an extension in this. Oh, there you go. So not to what about. I don't mean to what about. No, no.

Well, I like a brother. Ah, God, we've missed that from Bond Tips. Yeah, so he was with a 50-second pick in the draft by the. sons and was in the trade for he was in the DeAndre Aiton trade and the Dame trade I'm sorry in the Dame trade yeah attached to DeAndre Aiton remember that was a three-way trade and Aiton was going to Portland in that trade that Dame walk in other pieces involved and they attached him to DeAndre Aten and I covered the Sun's regular season open. They opened against the Mavericks that year is in Phoenix.

And David Fisdale was on the son's, he was the son's lead assistant at the time. And I was just talking to him and he said, man, because I say, what are you thinking about the trade? And it's like, I can't believe that we gave up Camaro. I tried to talk him out of it. Like, he told me he thought Camaro was going to start for the Suns that year, that year. He started 50 games that year. Yeah.

For the Blazers. Yeah. I mean, he's, you know, we talk about great defensive players. He's an awesome defense of players. I voted for him on the all defensive team this year. He didn't make the, he made the all defensive second team as a second year player. He played all 82 this year. And I put him on the team.

He did not make it, you know, his competition. Well, and he's shooting 37% from three for his career, which that was a big question. Yeah, he's definitely become. On better volume now than it. he was when he first got into the league. You know, you can see it. Yeah, shot seven per game last year. I don't know if you could say he could defend one through five,

but under certain circumstances, he probably could defend one through five. But certainly he can guard two, three, four, just about any two, three, four in the league. So, and last year signed a four-year, $82 million extension, which is kicking in this year, I believe. So, by the way, ranked seventh in this class and scoring. Yeah, that's not nothing. And as has proven himself to be a quality star, I'm curious what the Blazers do, by the way, with their starting lineup.

I'm curious about a lot of things about the Blazers. I know, this is true. But like if he's starting and Denny Obdea is starting, and obviously he has to start clinging, which card's not starting? Drew Holiday? I don't know. Anyways.

All right, McMahon. I'll take scoot here. All right. I'll take scoot here. He was the number three. He was the number three. I mean, you know, again, people were surprised. He didn't go second.

You know, he showed some real flashes in their playoff series last year. I honestly, like, I just asked what guard's not starting. And I mentioned Drew Holiday. Obviously, there's Dame, there's Jha. Like, I don't know where the hell is Scoot. fits in this whole picture. And if he doesn't fit, then I would, you know, do you trade him? And again, he hasn't, he has not lived up to what people thought he was going to be.

But he is 22 years old, you know, and has shown at least some flashes. You know, there's still talent there. I don't know that he's, I don't know if it's. superstar potential like people thought. But, you know, there's still some sort of a player there. And, you know, I'm okay with taking them eight right here. All right. I think that was nine.

Jackson wasn't nine? Yes. No, no. That was nine. I'm not very good accounting. Okay. I'm holding you accountable now, buddy. There you go.

And you got the 10th pick, too, I believe. I'll take Anthony Black. Oh, good one. That's who I was going to take. Yeah, who had a bit of a bit of a. a bit of a breakout season last year. Really, a lot of it was just the volume went up. But as the volume went up, you know, he maintained his efficiency.

He even got a little bit more efficient and average 15 per game last year. And he's another one. Like, this is honest, there's a lot of really good defensive players in this draft. And he's another one of those, you know, six foot seven. You know, I remember talking to Mosley about him. you know, when he was a rookie, Moses talked about like he thought he had just elite defensive potential. He's a six-foot-seven guy who could really move, who wants to guard,

you know, long wing span and all that kind of stuff. Yeah, I don't know if he's a point guard. And, you know, he's one of his guys like, I don't, he's not a pure point guard. And he needs to, that three really needs to develop for him to be like a high, high, level starter, but he's been productive and there's a lot more potential there. By the way, Taylor Hendricks went nine to the jazz in the original draft. Been a disappointment for them.

They've had a lot of successes with the draft and young guys, but this one, he hasn't done it yet. And then number 10, we mentioned earlier was Casein Wallace. He hadn't done yet. He's not going to do Utah because they traded him. That's correct. You know? So. By the way, you know who number 11 in this draft?

was. Jedd Howard. Now with the Texas Legends, the Mavericks G League team. So actually, my bad, he's on a two-way deal.

Yeah. He just recently signed. Yeah. I saw the people had unearthed, you know, Mike Schmitz, our former colleague, had,

they unearthed, you know, how he had really praised Jet Howard ahead of the every time, like, a guy, a Maver could be

having a good summer league performance or whatever, there'd be a, they'd find a Schmidt's tweet for one of the guy was like 15 years old playing at

place you never heard of. Right, right, right. Yeah, well, the Spitz has definitely been leaning into acquiring international players. Yeah. Not Jet Howard. Jet Howard up your way, Vince. It's a Michigan man. Yeah, yeah, he was a Michigan man.

He's a, you know, Nepo baby. Those things tend to happen sometimes. He was a lottery pick. He did okay. We'll see how the rest of his career goes. All right. So I'm between two players here. I'm not going to say which because I don't want to jump in front of

Vince. I'm probably going to take, not probably I am, I'm going to take Jaime Haquez here. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Just hasn't shot the ball well and it's kind of tough to, to take a 3-D guy with no 3, but he had a really good third year, had a, you know, was finished fourth in the rookie of the year. That for a time was like competing with Victor for rookie of the year. Obviously, Victor was going to win that. But hey, it had a really good start. to that season. And his second year, he was just really had a sophomore slump and bounced way back. Shot 51% this year, not good on threes, just 32% on threes. But an excellent multi-dimensional player can do a lot of different things.

Average 15 points a game off the bench, 74 of the 75 games he played, he played off the bench. So that is the role he had in Miami. Now he's been traded to Milwaukee. So I'm not really sure how that's all going to work out there. I don't really know how their team will go. He's a tank who can initiate offense. He's kind of a little bit. He's not as tall as Denny Obdia,

but, you know, like guys just bounce off Deni Obdia. It's the same thing with Hockes when he's getting downhill, and they did that, you know, they ran the offense with fewer screens and all that kind of stuff. Yeah, then, then, Noah LaRosche. He really just plays with an edge. Yeah. when he's fully engaged.

It plays with an edge. You always feel him very much of a heat player. Totally understandable why the heat drafted him. It really followed coming out of UCLA. All right, Vince. Oh, by the way, the pick. Oh, I already said Jet Howard went here in the draft. Okay, 12th pick to Vince Goodwill.

This is where it gets tough because how many hotkeys was going to be my pick. This is where it gets to what I like to call. How good are these dudes? Now, there's still, there's still one guy. No, not like, I'm not saying a bad way, McMahon. Relax. What I'm saying? When I say how good are these dudes, I mean, when I say this guy, I'm going to say this guy strictly for the conversation that's going to ensue, okay?

We'll approve. I'm taking pods. The answer is not as good as he thinks he is. That's exactly the point. The man who says, I want, I'm going to be better than step curve. Friend of the pod. We've had pods on the pod, you know. Oh, that makes sense. No, I do think that even though he's not as good as he thinks he is, even if he's not as good as Steve Kerr thinks he is, I still think that's a really good NBA player

that if placed in the right role, you know, he does quote unquote, all the quote unquote little things and everything else. He's like sometimes like a little gnat and sometimes, and I'm saying the most positive way. but this is a guy that's been really productive since coming to the league, stepping in and playing in different positions. You wouldn't call him a natural point guard. At least I wouldn't. But he's a basketball player. That's the way I'll give him.

I don't think he's as great as maybe some of the posse thinks that he is. But I also don't think that he's like the bane of everybody's existence either. You know, like Warriors Twitter, who somehow finds his way to the left side of my Twitter. page, they hate that kid. And I'm like, he's a decent enough ball player. Well, he said some things that did not. Oh, no, that's what I say. Yeah, the stuff that he says is more than what he plays, more than what he plays.

Yeah. So. But no. No, it's a quality spot. You know, so, I mean, we'll see the warriors have an interesting set of circumstances here. You know, they're always interesting. I, you know, nowadays we're always getting asked as the championship.

window. Is the championship window closed? I'm like, bros, they finished 10th, 8th, and 10th the last three years. The championship window has dust on it. Yeah, I mean, let's be honest. But here's the thing. I just want to point something out. Now, Steph can extend on on or after August 29th. And he can get two years at $130 something million. And if he wants it, he's going to get it. Okay. And then, you know, Marcus Thompson, our colleague, like, had this interview with him and he mulled whether or not Steph could delay signing that extension

just to keep the pressure on the Warriors to keep improving. And I don't, I don't think the warrior, you know, the Warriors have been somewhat static the last, but you know, they, it's not for lack of trying. It's not like they're sitting on their team. Jimmy Butler, not that long. I, you know, that's what I'm saying. And they tried to trade for a bunch of other guys. So a couple of things. First off, I want, we talked about earlier, will Draymond Green get a no trade clause? My guess would be, I mean, maybe it's even done by the time this pod comes out. My guess would be no, because just because they don't want to set the stand, they're going to give it. But Draymond's going to get a one-year deal.

Steph's on a one-year deal right now. Pajemski is on a one-year deal. He can get extended. And who am I forgetting? Oh, Jimmy Butler's on a one-year deal. So if the Warriors want, and frankly, they could make Steph a partner in this, they could say, Steph, hey, man. You can have the 130 whenever you want it.

But what if we just chill on it and see what happens next summer? Because that is dumping a hundred-something million. That would be all-time record salary cap-space. It would be something like around 100 million in cap-in cap space. Are there any big-time free agents available next summer? Well, you know, I know that Yokic said he's going to be a nugget for life and I'm not going back on it. But, you know, until he signs, he's going to be a free agent. And until he signs, there's going to be teams that are considering putting themselves in position and drop the coach.

And again, maybe this will be done by the time we discuss the time this podcast happens, Carl Towns has not signed an extension yet. By the way, you know who else could be depending on? LeBron James. Well, yeah. Just because he says his final decision doesn't mean anything. We don't know if Kawhi Leonard is going to end up going to Toronto at this point. We don't know if he's going to land in Toronto where he would sign an extension. We don't know what's happening why right now.

So I'm just saying like if Steph doesn't extend, I can already feel people be like, oh my God. And by the way, if he doesn't extend, I guess we got to treat it like Yolkich. Like, yes, allegedly a warrior for life, but until he signs, he doesn't sign. But like, I'm just, you know, but getting back to the point here,

considering that situation, if I'm the warriors, I don't know if I'm holding off on a pod's extension, not as a referendum on Pajemski, but to leave my optionality open. Absolutely. Look, if they've done all this stuff about planning for the future, for one, I don't think they're going to go and decide to go all in just on a whim. Like, that would be silly for Joe Lacob to do at this point. If you're going to commit to it, commit to it. But if I'm Steph, I want to see what these guys do. The question I have, though, is we're talking to all these hypotheticals about free agency.

I don't think free agency exists anymore, guys. Like, I don't know what team is. Right. I don't know what. You know what you have space, and even if it's not straight free agency, if you have space, a team can say or a guy can say, I want to be here. You know, I want to be a certain spot. I mean, that's modern free agency is getting traded into it as opposed to walking directly into, you know, into cap space. But I get, but your point is, you know, your point is taken. If I'm stuff, I'm not signed that extension right now.

Have they earned his trust in, in this way? I go back to the two timelines thing. And I know it's been at nausea, and we've probably talked about this in various platforms, but Wiseman, Moody, comminga, maybe Moody too much lesser

because he was the 14th pick. You wind up taking that and getting what you can out of it. But that's where it comes back to bite them. Like, they didn't, to me, if I'm Steph, I'm saying,

you guys have not fully believed in me as a leader for a championship team. That's why you go and try to commit to this two timeline thing as opposed to rioting me. So who says Steph wants to be around there for that? Like, don't you, Steph being a good guy against him or the PR of knowing that Steph doesn't want to be the bad guy against them.

Like, I think you get your feelings start playing that way. That's just me. I agree. All right. McMahon, is this you to finish this out here? It is me. We've got two more. Correct?

Yeah. So this is the pick number 13th. The 13th and 14th picks in the 2020 draft were Grady Dick out of Kansas who went to went to Toronto and is now in limbo, I think will be a clipper, but don't know. And Jordan Hawkins, picked by the Pelicans and still with the Pelicans.

Yeah. I'm going to take Bryce Sinsaba here. Interesting. I like it. I kind of like it. That's a gutty move here late in the game. Well, he's proven and scored in NBA. You know, he hadn't had a chance to prove that it can be part of a winning team.

He'll get that opportunity. Was taken 28th by it. The jazz. And, you know, kind of a big-bodied, not kind of really, a big-bodied 6-6-235, bench score shooter. Will Hardy refers to him as the crock pot. He ain't microwave. He doesn't heat up that quick.

I have not heard that that was his nickname. When he gets hot, he gets really hot. You know, when that crock pot gets cooking, he can get cooking. But, you know, he's shot at 38. We always appreciate Buckeyes. Yeah. I know we don't. 38% from three over the course of his career, average 15 in game last year and again,

you know, you can kind of poo-poo average 15 a game for a team that wasn't trying to win. So, you know, let's see what he's doing, what he does this year as the Jazz are trying to win. Yeah, this is the best compliment that you could give him. The Jazz had to start benching him in games because he was playing too well. There you go. he would like all of a sudden go away like in the third quarter because he was scoring too much down the stretch. Actually, I should get his post-all-Star game splits here. I'm going to take a look.

But he, you know, look, you got to be careful with like late season stuff. But he was, you know, to me at least he was a bit of a revelation. After the All-Star break, he played 22 games, 12 starts, okay? averaged by 27 minutes a game. Average 21 points in that stretch, shooting 40% from 3. Now, I will readily acknowledge that he was not getting a lot of stops.

Okay. Well, I will readily acknowledge I was not watching the jazz at all post-all-Star games, so I'm looking straight to with his stats. I know you watched that one game they played against Memphis. Well, that was a legendary performance on all sides. Well, they blew out the Grizzies, which showed you how hard the Grizzies were tanking. Yeah.

All right. And the 14th pick, which back in 2023, oh, I already said Jordan Hawkins. All right. Go ahead. Ah, is this? Is this me too? Yeah, I think so. Okay.

We started it with a Metropolitan's 92. Oh, all right. We'll end it. We'll end it with Balal Kulibali, who, honestly, at this point, he still was pick seventh by the Wizards. Either one must have been a trade because the Pacers actually picked him. They swapped Gerius Walker and him. They swapped in the draft. He's still a concept of a player at this point in his career.

You know, the concept is he is a good size in terms of height, super athletic wing. You know, it's... Three-point shooting has gotten worse over time. Yeah, listen. There are concerns here about a lack of progress, a lack of development. He's been in a god-awful developmental situation because the wizards have been, I mean, just a mess during his entire career. But this is a swing on the concept of a super athletic good-sized wing. still very much of a prospect.

So I don't have anything else to say. I wish him the best. By the way, turn 22 years old this week. Oh, Happy birthday. Was he there? I think I messed this up, by the way.

I think Vince was supposed to pick twice. Did that happen? I think so. But it's all good. McMahon was like, I was supposed to pick twice. He went full, you went full, You went full Bon Temps. Hey, bow.

Hey, Val. What are you on here? The Atlanta Hawks picked Kobe Buffkin in this draft. We just missed him at 15. That didn't work out so well. Bon Temps would never have allowed that if he was. Listen, in every draft, there's going to be some rough ones in there. No, the greatest drafters get picks raw.

We've mentioned a few of them. Jalen Hood, Schaffino is another one in there. I mean, you know, there's some rough ones. There's some rough ones. It's okay. some breaks happen. But you know what? Jordan Walsh might have should have been my last pick there,

but I'll stick with what I did. I'll stick with what I did. By the way, by the way, another player from this draft will be making his NBA debut will be an NBA rookie this year. Were you guys aware of that? I was not. Yeah, the Mavericks. And the in the Santiago Dama trade,

they got the rights to Tariq Biberovich. That's right. Another move by Schmitz to bring a international player. Very Schmitsy. Yeah, six-seven. Six-seven shooter who was a Euroleague vet. He's 25 years old. So they're bringing him over. They signed him. They're bringing him over. Maybe when we redraft this redraft. All right. This has been the 2003 redraft. And we're very happy that you enjoyed it on this fine August day. Thank you very much all our producers for putting it together. together. Thank you to Jackson. Thank you to Miles. Thank you to Tucker. Thank you to Mark. Thank you to Vince. Thank you to McMahon. Thank you for listening and watching.

To The Who Collective will talk to you very soon. Adios amigos.