Brian Windhorst & The Hoop Collective - Wemby Ejected In Huge Wolves' Win, Historic Run For Knicks + Draft Lottery Winners & Losers

Episode Date: May 11, 2026

Brian Windhorst is joined by ESPN's Tim Bontemps and Tim MacMahon to react to Victor Wembanyama’s ejection in the Wolves’ Game 4 win. The guys tackle the ejection, what it means for the Spurs and what to expect moving forward with the series tied 2-2. Then, the guys break down the Knicks dominant series against the 76ers including if New York is now the favorites in the East and a legitimate title contender. Finally, we run through the biggest winners and losers from the NBA Draft Lottery.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello, welcome to the Hoop Collective podcast. We talk about the NBA, which we're doing on Sunday evening. Joining us from Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, for the last time this season at the Xfinity Mobile Arena is Timbent. Hello, everybody. I leaned into the bit when I talked up to Sixers on the pod. I backed up my words with my prediction. Didn't go so great. Wasn't a very good pick.

Heard a lot about it this week. What are you going to do? Yeah, nothing that we can say will be worse than what Bon Temps has heard from the Nick fans. I just want, you know, I've gotten all kinds of, all kinds of, all kinds of slander on the internet. People yelling at me at the games. It's all, it's all in good fun. So our guy, Rick Brunson today, he's like, I was looking for you. I said, I'm sure you were. Everybody's very happy in Nixland, as they should be. Yeah, just take it as an indication of your level of influence. Hey, I'm at people are paying attention. And the Nix are, as we will talk about,

absolutely rolling. Yes. That was absolutely, absolutely true. Joining us from a lot of Los Angeles, California, where he watched the Thunder go up 3-0 on the Lakers on Saturday night, and he will be at game four on Monday is Ban McMahon. Howdy, partners, listen, bond tips could be worse. You could have said that the Lakers were going to be the famous in the West. The results were pretty similar, but. Lordy. Well, I am in Chicago where the NBA draft lottery took place today here at the Navy Pier,

where I'm at now, and I'll talk about that later. I was in the room, and I thought it would be a fascinating experience. But first, I think we need to talk about the fascinating experience that was the Wolves game for victory by five points over the spurs to even the series at 2-2. And while the end of this game was pretty fascinating in terms of things that the wolves did very well to win it, and also things that they didn't do well to almost lose. their lead, but it's 2-2. But I think the only place that we can start is what happened in the second quarter,

McMahon. Victor Wembeyanama, you know, I haven't been on any of the socials because I've been working on lottery coverage. I don't, I suppose there's got to be, there's going to be some faction of the Spurs fan base that thinks Victor Wembeen Yama getting ejected was controversial. I felt this was unfortunately a no-brainer decision. he absolutely hauls off and elbows Nasirid in the neck. Chin first.

I guess that's true. And it's ejected. And quite frankly, you know, it decides the game because the spurs have the lead in the fourth quarter and they can't get a rebound or a stop in the paint when it matters. And Victor, Victor, and Victor, just a complete loss of composure from Victor. We have applauded him on every front, how he's mature beyond his years. It was an unacceptable choice, and it hurt his team. And he will help his team and carry his team to many wins in the future. He hurt his team, and he has extended their series in all likelihood.

And so that's just the way I saw it. Yeah, and Ms. Johnson did make, I would say, an excuse for Wimby Post game, reading from Mike Wright's Twitter. At some point, he should be protected. If not, he's going to have to protect himself. Listen, were they being physical with him? Yeah, but this was, like, I'm watching it. I'm saying, man, I hope he's not ejected. And then you're watching the replay. You're like, there's no way this could be ruled anything but a flagrant too.

I mean, it was unnecessary. It was excessive. It was like there was no gray area here. This was very black and white. And unfortunately, that momentary loss of composure did cause him a kick kicked out. The only thing I agree or disagree with you on, rather, is they lost the game. Yeah, maybe it's different. if when he's in the game, sure. But they lost the game because Anthony Edwards completely took over down to stretch. And the wolves for the second time in this series were dominant closers. So, you know, I'm going to give the wolves some credit. I don't mean to take their credit away from the wolves.

But Rudy Gober is dunking down the stretch. I'm not sure that's happening with Victor in there. I mean, they're making nice plays, but, you know. You never know how the game would have gone if Victor was playing. But the bottom line is he took himself out of the game. game and Minnesota took advantage of it. And that, that's what matters. And I was very glad he got ejected. I'm not looking for star players to get thrown out of games. No, I just mean when he made the play, I'm glad they called it the way they should have and didn't give him a flaker one because

he's Victor women yama. Like, it was a dirty play. He deserved to get ejected. If Nas Reid had done that to Victor, he would have got ejected. So I may be, you know, I'm not, I mean, I don't think, I mean, somebody asked, a friend of mine is just a basketball fan said, you know, is Victor going to get suspended? I do not believe Victor. I mean, they'll review it. Like if you see, like, if you see reporting that it'll be reviewed, all flagrants would be reviewed.

Right. But he got, he got a flagrant too. He missed a game. I think that's a more than reasonable penalty. And so that's a nods. Yeah. Well, yeah. I mean.

I know. I know. I know. Also, I thought Zach Zarber, the crew chief, he like, he very clearly articulated. all the steps of what is deemed a flagrant foul. Like he dotted every eye and then crossed every T to explain. And for his cerebral and as well-versed as Victor is, do we honestly believe he didn't know?

No. No. No. That was, he knew the camera was on him. Like, no, he, buddy, you know Flakron 2 gets you tossed. Come on. Your third year in the league. What he's referring to is the camera saw him. And he asks Harrison Barnes, what does it mean? You know, they announced Flagrin 2. And he's like, what does that mean?

And Harrison Barnes is like, it means you're ejected. And he goes, I'm ejected. And but he, but he heard it. And he didn't like fight it. He just got up and left. And to your point, McMahon, the wolves took this one down the stretch because look for a minute like the spurs might pull this one out and really put a hammer blow on the series.

I mean, Minnesota lost this game at home with victor's, but thrown out of the game. It would have been very hard to see them win in three in a row. But Anthony Edwards hits a bunch of shots. He and Julius Randall made some big plays. I have to assume who had a big bucket. Like you said, Rudy got a couple of dunks late, Brian. I mean, there's pretty much everybody that was on the court at some point made some play to help them win the game. And, you know, in a second round where we might not have a lot of entertaining series, we certainly got one with Spurs Wolves.

And game five in San Antonio is going to be super interesting on Tuesday night when you got this Minnesota team that has been. already proven it is not afraid of any opponent and has already got some big time upsets on its belt past couple of years going up against a young spurs team like we've talked about that bunch of road playoff wins too yeah a bunch of road playoff wins against a young spurs team that like we've talked about hasn't really been in a lot of these situations before and virtually other than harrison barns i would say nobody else i guess lu cornet too those are the two guys everybody else on the team has either played in the first round or not been the playoffs at all How dare you disrespect Kelly Olinic?

That's true. Forget about Kelly on the end of the bench, too. So with eight minutes, we'll call it nine minutes left. The spurs go to an eight-point lead. The wolves called timeout. Here's how it went. Ann Edwards, 11-foot pull-up, and Edwards 27-foot pull-up.

Jayden McDaniels had a couple of free throws, and Edwards 25-point, or 25-foot shot. Nas Reid driving way up and then some good some dunks from gobert 16 points in the fourth quarter for aunt six of eight shooting hit a couple of threes as I just mentioned and this is a guy who has two bad knees the runner's knee in one and a hyper extension in the other I think I said this other day aunt's never been first team all NBA but you cannot name five guys you'd rather have in the playoffs and him I would take aunt over anybody in the eastern conference That's an interesting comment.

I love Jayton Brunson. I take him over Brunson. I love Cade Cade Ciddingham. For the playoffs, I take him off Cade. I take him over, you know, if you want to put Jason Tatum. Ant is an absolute killer. He is obviously a mega talent. He's got this competitive charisma that lifts up the rest of his team.

He impacts the game on both ends of the floor, and he is just absolutely fearless. He is, I mean, he is a, he's a, he's a, he's a, he, he, peaks in the playoffs. He's just a, he's built for this. I'm not necessarily arguing with you. I just, when you said it, I was just thinking about it. I mean, he's certainly right there with all those guys. I don't think there's any at minimum, if not at all. I don't really feel like having this discussion right now. I'm just going to keep going to.

No, it's fine. No, I don't, it's an interesting comment. No, it's an interesting comment. But I respectfully opt out of the discourse. Yeah, we'll opt into 25 minutes of dissertation from the secret room later. We've got to save time for that. I mean, you know. Tell you what, Wendy. Zarbah's hair is much better in place than yours is right now.

Yeah, my, this is, it's not, it's not ideal. I'm not going to lie. It's been a long day, not compared to Bontowns. Bontown's been, you know, they had the, we'll talk about this later, but I don't want to say that the, that the Sixers didn't love their chances, but they scheduled exit interviews before the game. Well, that's, that's not exactly a fair. Okay. And then they got beat by 30.

Like every time, like every time we've covered an elimination game. There was a plan if they had season. I know. Okay, fine. Sorry. I take it all back. They got enough things to clown on him for today. They could have.

They could have. They could have. They could have. All right. Anyway, Bontem's said a long day. Nas Reid got rolled up on on his ankle in the fourth quarter there. And I was like, oh, man, that looks like a problem.

That looks like a high ankle spring is what I was. thinking and I was like, damn, like that's a potential, real loss. And then the guy comes back out and is making place. I'll tell you what.

Listen, the spurs are the more talented team. I don't know what the odds are now, but obviously they're the favorite team. The wolves, though, like you've got to love watching this team. And they fight.

They've got high-end talent. You know, they can be, they're an, extremely frustrating regular season team, but they are a flip-to-switch for the playoffs squad. And Spurs got their hands full, man. And Wemby, like we haven't even talked about his game three performance, which was just like jaw-dropping. I mean, I'm watching on a flight, and I'm just gasping at some of the things he did.

16 fourth quarter points on that game, you know, at that point a 1-1 series, he's on the road. Well, he's 39, 15, five blocks, the Akeem spin fade away that he hit over, gober and crunch time. Like, it was amazing. But he followed that up by letting his team down today. And this series is tied up and in the balance. And, you know, the wolves definitely have the advantage of having been there and haven't thrown knockout punches in the playoffs before. This reminds me a little bit of Thunder Mavs from a couple years ago. and that series, I believe, Tim, was 2-2 after 4, right?

And The Thunder missed some makeable shots in games 5 and 6. And game, you know, their youth showed up in that series. I mean, Luca was obviously great, but their youth showed up in that series. They weren't really good. And PJ Washington had the series of his life. They actually did a great job on Kyrie in that series. And for most of it on Luca. But, you know, role players won that series.

Listen, role players won. the wolves last series. Jade McDaniels is a role player who played out of his mind. They've got, you know, Nas Reid's a role player capable of swinging a playoff series. IOTUSUUUU is a role player capable of swinging a playoff series. Yeah, Desumu came back, you know, he's clearly not 100%. He's limping through it.

But he made a huge basket in the fourth quarter to help hold off the Spurs comeback. I really hate to just always focus or talk about the three. three-point shooting, but the modern NBA, it just comes down to it. And in both spurs losses in this series, they have shot the ball poorly from three, and they go six of 26 in this game. They're not a great three-point shooting team. And if they're hitting threes, they're going to be incredibly hard to beat. And if they're not hitting threes, which they definitely are capable of not hitting threes, then they're going to potentially have some trouble scoring. And, you know, I mean, it's not, you know, it's not really like the, it's not like they're all about the threes,

like say Boston is or something, but, you know, when you have Victor, like if Victor's jumper is going like it was in game three, good luck. Like, you're probably not beating them. But sure, no, you're not, when Wemby's sitting is three, you're dead. But to me, this was a case where the Wolves closer delivered and the Spurs closer, Deer and Fox, did not down the stretch. got up to a slow start then he really got cooking in the second half like fox had a stretch there where he was a big reason why they had that lead and then down the stretch you know and they weren't like

a bunch of easy shots but down the stretch he just couldn't knock down shots while aunt was going crazy and that you know fair and fox's role is to be the closer he missed six shots in the fourth I mean he made a couple but he missed six and he missed three threes and um you know like um yeah I mean it's a great it's a it's a it's a really good looking series and it's a real test for for the spurs and you know one thing i'll say is they have had a handful of challenges in this series or in this postseason and um they've stepped up and delivered they've found different guys to do different things obviously victor is really important but um there's been games where foxes played well games for castles played well games for julian champ penny has been a difference maker i do think it was

interesting but dylan harper was great tonight right down the stretch of this game, the spurs played with the tallest guy on the court being Champani. They went super duper small. And there was sort of a defining play where Nas Reid got a put back off of offensive rebound where I think he was just bigger than everybody out there. But the super small lineup gave the wolves some trouble at the end of the game. They couldn't get the fall in bounds.

Yeah, so it'll be a real challenge for the Spurs. Look, look, we say this every year. 2-2 series game five, 3-3 series game seven. obviously huge, but 2-2 series game five, reputations are made on that. 2-2 series game five. And the jackals will be ready. Yeah.

They'll have that thing rocking down in San Antonio. And listen, Aunt Edwards has a bunch of big road playoff games on his resume. So look forward to that. Unfortunately, you guys weren't on those series. You're on that series. More Hoop Collective podcast after this. Hey, y'all.

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Wayfair, every style, every home. The series that you are on, uh, Bond Temps, I'm going to have to yield to you because I saw almost none of this game. I was doing the lottery. I was doing follow-up stuff. Secret room in it. Breaking it down after. It's not a secret room.

It's a very, very easily to find room. I took a nap at half time. time. Could have taken one earlier than that. I did. I confidently decided to nap at halftime and those to a fair amount in the second half.

Here's all we got to say about game four of Nick Sixers. The Knicks made 12 of their first 13 three-point attempts in the game. And that is not to say that this is like, oh, they just hit some shots and they won the game. But they've had 43 points in the first quarter.

The game was over by the end of the first quarter. Like, they just came out. Paul George said it best after the game. He said they hit some haymakers and they kept throwing them. And it was like, yeah, they kept throwing them. And hitting shot after shot after shot. Stats Williams had the stat that they're 18 threes. They were 18 for 29 from three in the first half.

They're 18 threes in the first half were the most tied for the most in any game in NBA history, playoff or regular season. Like they came out. They hit every shot. They've been on an unbelievable heater offensively. They have three games in the playoffs of over 130. They've got two of over 140. They have the two closeout games are both over 140.

What was the stats, Williams stat on that? I think it's the, I want to say it was the first time, the first team to score at least 140 points and multiple series clinching wins in the playoffs, which again, not a huge shock. Not that many teams are scoring 140 points in the playoffs. But as I said earlier, obviously picked Philly to win the series and could not have been more wrong on that.

You're only 89 points off. Yeah, so there's only 80 points off. And look, the Knicks, the stuff that they... Is that what the spread was, 89? I mean, they won the day by 30, so... By the way, their average point differential through 10 games, remember, their two losses were both one-point games. That's right.

Their average point differential is 19.4 points per game. That's the largest going in the conference finals since it went to 16... Yeah, I mean, the 16-team format in 83-84. Yeah, I mean, look, they've had a couple close games. You know, game two in this series could have gone either way. obviously, like you said, they had the two one point losses in the first round. But since they changed their offense around after game three, they against Atlanta, they have been just absolutely molten hot.

Listen to this. No, go ahead. 185 points is what they've outscored opponents by in that stretch. That is the third best points differential in any seven game span, period. Just regular season or playoffs. and I believe this is telling me, yeah, their best fan ever and the best ever in the playoffs. Yeah, I mean, they were just, they've been absolutely unbelievable.

And, you know, like, obviously it was like, all right, they did this stuff against Atlanta. Atlanta has no size. Let's see how they do against Philly. And you could say that Embedd wasn't right. That's fine. Doesn't matter. Like, yeah, these guys came in and just absolutely blew the doors off them.

And they, I mean, This is the Knicks team that we spent all year kind of waiting to see. It was like, you know, Vinny wrote a story. Vinny wrote a story about Carl Towns. I think it was ran during the first round. And the theme of the story more or less kept coming back to the numbers say the Knicks are really, really good. But when you watch them play, you're like, it just doesn't quite line up.

And the last seven games, they've been, I mean, Oklahoma City's maybe been better in the playoffs. But, I mean, the Knicks have been the second most impressive team in the playoffs easily. They are massive favorites to beat whoever comes out of this other series, which, you know, the Pistons and Cavs have both not been very impressive at all through their first 10 games in the playoffs. The one thing I will remind you of is that the Pistons really beat up the Knicks during the regular season. That's fine. I saw the Brooklyn Nets beat the Miami Heat with LeBron three or four times in the regular season when they played in the playoffs. it didn't matter either. Like, I don't think that, that version of the Knicks we saw in the regular season is not the version of the Knicks that's playing right now.

And Detroit barely got by Orlando and they're struggling with a Cavs team that has been not impressive either. So maybe they won't win the series. They should go into the series as heavy, heavy favorites. And all they, you know, they came down here and, you know, game two was close, came down here, no G&OB. It's like, okay, this could be a little bit of an interesting situation for the Knicks. They control game three, basically from the six-minute mark of the first quarter until the end. And then the first six minutes are only because Paul George couldn't miss a shot. And tonight, like I said, they hit 12 of their first 13 shots are up 20 in the first quarter,

and it's just a laugher for the final 36 minutes of the game. I mean, six or starters are out of the game by the middle of the third quarter. Say final 44, but sure. Jackson has this stat. The fourth team in NBA history to have multiple 30-point clinching wins. The other three, 20-25 Thunder, I think they ended up okay. 2008 Celtics. Okay.

You know, that was the big three, the beginning of the big three. And the 87 Lakers. How about company? Prime show champs. And look, the Knicks had some really low lows during the regular season. Like I remember when the Mavericks went up there. like it was a terrible Mavericks team that just blew them out and I forgot exactly what it was but they were in a real rut then I don't remember the exact I think it was like seven losses and nine games or something like that but you don't have to be the best team all season you have to be the best team at this point and you know they in that way they kind of remind me of the 2011 Mavericks who that team won 57 games but like there was some they don't everybody really believed in them.

There was some real blah stretches during the season. You know, they hadn't had any playoff success for the few years before that. You know, the Knicks actually had just not enough to keep their coach employed. But, you know, what the Knicks looked like in February is not relevant to what they look like right now in May. And right now they are absolutely playing like their peak of basketball. They're playing as well. Yeah, this is the best they've looked in this whole run by a mile. Like, I mean, and obviously it's easy to say.

that when they're they're putting up these kind of point totals but i mean for again for a team that has felt like less than the sum of their parts for a couple of years in all the fits and starts they've had like the way they're i mean they're just like an absolute machine and it's fun to watch and they're i mean it's wildly impressive it's so fun to watch that 70% of the crowd in philly were yeah here's here's what i want to say about that the sixers i think completely screwed up Like, look, it's one thing for Joel to sit on the podium last week and say, hey, I don't want Nick fans to come to the game. Like, fine, Joel could say that. For the Sixers to get out here and put all, I'll do all this PR campaign stuff over the last week.

Oh, got to keep the Knicks fans out of here. We're going to geo tag tickets. We're going to do this. We're going to do that. I mean, it's absolute nonsense. It's an hour and a half to get here from New York City. There's all sorts of Nick fans that live in Jersey. It's nowhere near as expensive to go to a game.

anywhere else and to go to the garden. All these people get a chance to go to a Nick playoff game that they're never going to get to go to. They're going to pay through the nose for it compared to what people, other paces will play because they're saving a ton of money compared to go into the garden to watch a game. So the idea that the sixers were ever going to keep Nick's fans out of the building was crazy. And all they did was put a giant Clegglight on the fact there were going to be Nick's fans in the building to begin with. And then when they lose on Friday, you had it perfectly set up where it's Sunday afternoon, the Sixers are down three oh in the series. Of course, Nick fans are going to come here at Droz for the game.

And of course, they're going to have an absolute party when their team is 12 or 13 from three and completely flying along and winning the game by 30. Like, of course this is how I was going to go. And they had you as a pinata. They would add me as a pinata if there were three fans in here, let alone. How many more times does Bontems have to Mia Coppa? He's done it twice. I've had plenty of good calls.

This was not a good call. I can live with that. Missed it by that much. Hey, it's all good. Listen, I mean, you make predictions. Sometimes they work and sometimes they don't. There are some people who want us to, you know, beat you up.

But I have been wrong once or twice. I'm more than willing to beat him up for the people, for the people. So postgame, Joel Embed had his exit interview. What did that entail? He was weirdly positive, I would say, specifically about his health. Like I didn't, it's been a weird season for the Sixers. Like, even though it's been a weird two weeks. There are no weird Sixers seasons.

Well, that's true to use Brian's line about NBA games. But like two weeks ago today, right, Joel and B came back in game four against the Celtics. They got absolutely trucked. He looked terrible, even though he put up good numbers. It looked like their season was over. Then, Joel has probably the best three-game stretch of his playoff career. They beat the Celtics. They have this great comeback.

It's like, wow, maybe the season. Sixers finally have everything come together. He shows him for game one. He doesn't look right. Maxi hurts his finger in the second quarter of game one. They end up going on or game, I think it was game one or game two, either one. He messes up his finger again. They get absolutely trucked in this series.

They lose the final two games by a thousand points. That's all in two weeks. Like, it's just, it's, and this is after last season when they're coming into the year, and in the story I wrote before the season talking essentially about, hey, we just got to get to the playoffs healthy, we're going to be good. And then they completely go off a cliff. They tank to try to keep the top sixers pick. To successfully keep it.

And got a stud. Got a stud. Vijay Edgecom who had a mat, like had 23, 6, and 4 on the road in game seven at Boston Garden. Like a game, like game seven, a lot of guys don't have it their whole career. He had it as a rookie. So it's very hard to like sum up where the season was at. But everybody with the team.

But it would have been better off with a hard fought game. game seven loss in Boston. I'm not going to say. No, that's not true. To get, take that back. No. Your own home with Nix fans going bonkers?

No, I know. Come on, bro. Take that back. No, I'm not going to say that. I'm not going to say that. I'm not going to say it. The Sixers got the Sixers got curbstop by the Knicks. But I'm not going to,

I'm not going to say that they were better off not snapping their 44 year losing streak to the Celtics. Yeah. You don't have to say it. I said it. I'm, I'm really embarrassing. You want to know why I'm in trouble now because it's now my turn. Because Bontem's ridiculously picked the Sixers. You make that ridiculous comment.

It's, I'm in the, I'm up. I'm up now. God knows what it's good. You're usually pretty good at this spot. I hope it doesn't happen on the pod. Maybe he'll be on tomorrow on TV. But anyway, to get back to Embed. So Embedid said, I don't want to, I don't want to mess this quote up because I think it's worth getting

right. So he was very positive in his outlook about his knee. I'm as confident as I've ever been about referring to his health and his future. I think obviously my knee was the biggest concern and I'm not thinking about it. And as long as we keep doing what we've been doing, I won't have to think about it anymore. I'm looking at next year obviously being more available. The personal goals don't matter. I know that if I'm available and I play as much as possible, everything else is going to follow.

and he also talked about how coming into the season didn't know if his knee was going to really ever work again. And he came out of the season feeling like they've got it under control. And he's going to be able to go into the offseason and have a normal offseason of working out. Now, I am not going to sit here and say that, oh, Joella B is now going to play 75 games next season. We're talking about a guy who missed a game in the series, was playing with hip and ankle injuries in the series, had an appendectomy a couple of weeks ago, and has not had a healthy playoffs in his entire career. And has never played 70 games in his entire career. That's right.

He's played over the 65 games threshold twice. Other than that, it feels great. The last three years have been 39, 19, and 38. Yes. I hope Embed's right. But come on, man. No, listen, I agree. I'm just repeating what the guy said.

I was surprised at the, my point was, I was surprised at the level of positivity that came from him about his health. I didn't think it was going to be that I feel this good about things. Put it like this, the guy is going to be earning more than a million dollars per game play because he's due 58.1 next year, basically 62.7 the year after that, 67.4 the year after that. Well, and look, I wrote an old bit on the Sixers that's up now. And basically, like, they've got this back court with Tyrese maxi,

who's going to be an all-in-beate player for the first time and probably will be again going forward. He's awesome. We talked about Vijay Edgecom. He had a phenomenal rookie year. He showed these playoffs. He's absolutely not afraid. He's got a chance to be a full-blown star, I think. That's a great place to start.

But they have $100 plus million in Paul, George, and Joelle and Bede the next two years, and those guys have not been on the court. And because you have all that money tied up in those two guys, you can't do anything else with the roster. So you can't really trade them. And it's, you know, if they're available, great. But again, Joel could say he feels great. I hope he feels great for his sake. But you have to assume he's going to miss at least 30 games.

If he plays 50 games and is healthy for the playoffs, then you're like, that's awesome. They'll be happy with that. Right. If you could play 52 games and then be healthy for the playoffs, they would take that today. So it just puts them in kind of a strange spot where you've got this stud rookie on a rookie deal, which is exactly what you want to try to build a contending team. and because you've got these other two guys on maxes, it sort of cancels out.

Well, and they have no depth. Like Quentin Grimes was a good bench player, but like... Who is an unrestricted free agent? Kelly Ubray had a great bounce back a couple of years with these guys has turned himself into a quality 3-and-D role player on the wing after being a kind of an all-offense, no defense guy in his career. He's an unrestricted free agent. Like, are they going to pay to keep those guys?

They better. And the Thunder have their first round pick. Do they have anybody's pick? Are they, do they have a, I'm serious? Do they have a, no, I'm saying just Philly have a first rounder. I thought you were making a joke. The Sixers have Houston's first round pick, which they got from Oklahoma City as a result of the Jared McCain trade. Wait, Jared McCain, is that the guy who had 18 points and 18 minutes in a playoff win, right before the Sixers had fewer than that and a whole game off their bench?

Considering the Knicks, the Sixers have been missing open. threes all series and considering Jared McCain as we head into game four is I am not kidding nine for 11 from three point range in three games against the Lakers might have been helpful to have Jared McCain hitting some threes well at least Darrell got to take a victory lap I'd tell him the world that he's sold high on that one yeah so again it's like the sick you can't win them all guys you can't win them all as I as I'm evidence of when you lose you probably shouldn't do a victory dance. Well, and that's why everything with this team is just at such a weird place.

Because like on the one hand, the young guards are awesome. It's a great place to build from. On the other hand, they're basically hamstrung to do really anything else around them going forward. And they really are realistically, at least for another season until Paul George is an expiring deal, probably even two years until Joeline Beed's an expiring deal after that. and Paul George comes off the book. So they got to just kind of hope those guys can play, and these young guys keep getting better.

And I think VJ is going to get better, and I think Tyrese will get better, but they're not very deep, and they don't have a lot of ways to add talent. That's especially if they keep Ubra and Grimes, they lose either of them. I mean, then they're really hurting for depth, and there's just not a lot of ways to add back from there.

All right. Well, Fonts will see in the Eastern Conference finals, I guess, which, by the way, we'll, the earliest they can start is Sunday. So we'll see about Cavs Corner and Pistons. I suspect Cavs Corner will be lingering on through the week, but we'll find out on... Lingering.

That's what you say about James Harden-powered calves? That's the chatter that you have. All right, well, we'll see if we get to the Cavs here before I wave the white flag on this podcast. More Hoop Collective Podcast after this. Reeses knows a thing or two about great combinations. Chocolate and peanut butter, obviously, but there's more than one way to Reese's. From indulgent Reese's big cups with caramel

to crunchy Reese's pieces and Reese's miniatures, there's a delicious Reese's for every mood. It's the same combo you love, just with more ways to enjoy it. So whether you're snacking, sharing, or just treating yourself, nothing else is Reese's. If I did the lottery today,

flew into Chicago this morning. It was a beautiful day for a lottery, boys. Beautiful day for a lottery. You know it's one of my favorite. days of the year. I'd never done the room before. And the room will never be the same after, you know, they let the media in basically for transparency. Okay. They let, you know, a handful of media members in. It was a very strong podcast media core in there. Zach Lowe, Ryan Rissolo, myself. I feel like we could have all united, you know, if certain things didn't keep us

apart, could have all united in one big, glorious podcast. We could have done it live. You see that he's trying to push us out of the live show business content. Clearly. Clearly. Just off the pod, period. Exactly. Bigger names. I would love to trade for those two guys. Anyway, so.

He thinks they can sell high on us like more he sold high in McCain. There's no cash speeds. Trust me. We'll be in the playoffs when they've gotten sent home. I promise you that. Well done. You just redeemed yourself. for that earlier take about the Sixers.

Okay, so go in the room. And do we now go over like the concept of the drawing room? Do we give our viewers and listeners credit for knowing that the actual lottery is drawn an hour before the show? Yes, yes. Also, I think one thing that I would point out is that when you see the lottery on television, you know, it obviously goes from 14 backwards to one and four is revealed before one. But when they actually do the drawing, one is drawn first. one, two, three, and four are drawn, and then the rest of the previously established order is there.

I just point that out. So there's one representative from each team in there, and everyone gets their phones taken away from them sealed, what have you. So there's these boards. When you walk in, all the lottery companies, there's a thousand of them are all on a board, four, eight boards. And then there's this woman, she's one of the league lawyers. Her name is Caitlin Canella West. And while there's people up there like lawyers and Ernst and young people and whatnot are up there looking at the lottery, this woman, Caitlin, Caitlin, she is up there who makes, she figures out who wins each pick and makes the calls.

And she is an expert at this. And she is like the Bellwether guide. And so the boards, the eight of them, the farther left are the teams with the highest chances. the lower numbers have the higher chances. And so like if you have pick one, two, three, four, whatever, the ball, one, three, four, whatever, you have a more chance of one of the higher chance teams. And they're on the left side. And then if you pull ball 13, 14, those combinations tend to favor the longer shots.

And they're on the right side. And so Sam Presti. The Masrow right side. Correct. Right. And so Sam Presti, who, he was at your game Saturday night in, in L.A., saw the thunder go up through. Rio, blowout win, and gets in a plane, flies overnight and gets there, and he's in the room because the Clippers, they have the Clippers pick, which is a 12th pick.

Well, he can make that kind of transition now because he's using less product in his hair, so it doesn't take him as long to get, you know, he has, he has gone with a different hair look. Yeah. So we didn't talk about that. So he said, basically, he goes, I need Kate. She goes, Caitlin's a genius at this. And she's the one to watch. And he goes, I need her to go to the right. he goes, I need Caitlin to be so far right that she's almost out the door.

And if that happens. And here's the thing. He didn't, he doesn't need anything. He would prefer. Okay. I don't remember the verb he used, but he might have said want. So the first seven seats are the higher chance teams. And then there's a second row of seats.

And so the first seat in the first row is for the biggest loser, the worst record. Now, the top three, nets, pacer, and. Wizards all have the same odds, but the net, the Wizards had the worst record. So Michael Winger, team president is sitting in the first seat. Okay. Here comes the lottery. Balls 421 come out. And everyone's watching Caitlin.

She's moving left, bro. Those are low numbers. She's on the far left side. And as soon as fours, she's moving in tank territory. Right. As soon as 421 come out, as soon as the one comes out, Ted Wu, who's the assistant GM of the Pacers, he looks, I'm sitting like 10 feet from Winger. She, he looks at winger and taps him on the hand.

And what I found out later was that after three balls, the war, the wizards clinched it. They had every combination that was four to one. Dude, the Anthony Davis deadline acquisition is critical to winning the lottery. We know that now. Sure is. We'll see if the wizards can parlay that value at the deadline next year. So I don't even remember what the last one number was. It did matter.

It was known the wizard's one. So the Wizards won by a thousand. They won going away. It was a route. And Winger, who I've known for 20 years, I know him when he worked in four different organizations, he just sort of rubs his chin. He doesn't do anything.

No reaction. But I know, and this is one of the things, is that you're in this room, and I know Bontemps, you've been in this room. Each one of these guys represents like hundreds of thousands, millions of fans. And, you know, and they're, whole organization and you know in this particular case so many of these teams tanked you know

and it's one thing if it's like some random minority owner or you know some low low level staff or something in this case it's the guy who's like instituted the plan to do this you know that's a little different and it's had bad lottery luck until now yes well that's sorry wasn't bad lottery luck but right well certainly bad luck last year sir yeah bad luck last year yeah yeah So he, I know inside, I mean, you know, the decorum reigns, whatever, but I know inside that his whole. I believe they went one and 27 to end the season. They didn't do that to get the fifth pick. Yeah, they really worked for this one.

You can imagine just what he must have been feeling inside in the moment, but he betrays nothing. So now we come to the second pick, and the first ball out is 14. Caitlin is headed right, boys. Uh-oh. And the Clippers, well, I say the Clippers, it's really the Thunder. Oh.

The Thunder have 15 combinations. Okay? Eight of them have the number 14 in them. Oh, boy. So I am like, oh, and here's a thing. There is some, there is some puckered, the guy who, this league lawyer, Matt Doria, who draws the balls,

he lets like 30, I don't know, maybe it feels like 30 seconds pass between the balls i don't think it's 30 seconds whatever it's some period of time where you can look and you can look and see all the 14s on thunder and you're like oh my god like and i'm thinking like can you imagine if the thunder get the number two pick can you imagine that and um so you know i don't know what sam was thinking he his face doesn't change but so 14 comes out and she's all the way down the right um but then the next three numbers. I don't even remember what they were. They were, they were low. And, um, the word comes out that has never been said in a lottery. Uh, in 40 years of the lottery, uh, never once have the Utah

jazz ever moved up. In fact, they've only moved, they've moved down like five times, including last year, they lost like three spots. And for the first time ever, she announces Utah. All that tank had finally paid off. Tank note, baby. And Austin Aange, who was sitting there with like his, you know, he was like leaned forward, like almost like, you know, and he goes, yeah. And he goes, yeah, it was the only emotion in the room, but he couldn't help himself. He's like, yeah. And I'm like, go for it. Like, celebrate.

Like what you guys went through. And Presti's probably just staring daggers at him. After all the grief the jazz got this year across the board, when there were all sorts of other people doing the same things they were doing, including the team to pick third and got absolutely no grief for it. Memphis, we'll get to in a second. Good for, good for Austin and good for the jazz. Yeah.

So, you know, he celebrates. and now your two picks in. So, and he just, he immediately, his body language chain. He was like leaning all forward. He literally just leaned back. You know, it's funny. I remember it was a couple weeks ago where there was a tie break that they got to get the fourth slot instead of the fifth slot.

And that, and you say, well, what's the difference in the fourth and fifth slot when the ping pong balls are the same? Well, in the event that like craziness had happened in four teams from the back, half had jumped up. If the jazz had finished fifth in the lottery positioning, they could have lost their top eight protected pick in the end to Oklahoma City anyway. So even though there was a 1% chance at the time, they were kind of sweating the coin flip for that too a couple weeks ago. So, you know, it's been an interesting couple of weeks for the jazz. Okay, so they draw the fourth one, the third, the third ball pick, and the first ball out is a four.

sitting down at the end of the first row is Zach Kleinman, the Memphis Grizzlies. And as soon as he hears four inside his head, he's like bleep. Because all the combinations of Grizzlies had, there was no four. If you ever heard four, no dice. I'm sorry, it wasn't four, two. Whenever two was heard, no Grizzlies. If anything with a two in it, Grizzlies couldn't win. So Zach was like, damn, we didn't get the third.

You know, we didn't get one. We didn't get two. now we didn't get three. They pulled the numbers and it's Utah again. Yes, the jazz get two and three. So after 40 years and every, you know, they were in the lottery 11 because remember, like the first like 20 years of the lottery,

they made the playoffs every year with Stockton and Malone. So they haven't been in that many lotters, but they still, they were 0 of 11 in moving up in lotteries. Now they get up, they get moved up two in a row. So they redraw, and the first number up and the redraw is 13. oh boy we're headed right boys there goes katelyn down to the right side now uh this guy from the front office of the charlotte hornets i'd never met him before his name is jake stone young guy i think he

went to an ivy league school um he was told by the owner of the hornets um rick schnall he's like rick like the last thing he goes 13 jake anytime you hear 13 all of our combinations have 13 in you hear 13 it's money for the hornets well the hornets you know had five tens of a you know half of one percent chance so jake here's 13 he's like whoa you know whoa he's he's on the edge of his seat but you know he says to me he goes we only had five combinations like we needed we needed a lot of help beyond just a lot of luck you need a lot of luck for that so the next number was four well it's the grislies who have all the fours oh so that's when it changed and um So how are they going to how are they going to find playing time with all those you know all those guys that they had down the stretch of the season?

Anyway, the grizzlies get the number three pick. Zach Edy can stay healthy, which is a huge if either Camboos or Caleb Wilson who will probably be the two guys sitting there for them to choose from a three will be awfully fun playing next to Zach Ety. That is a very interesting spot. You know, what's interesting is we're assuming Peterson's going to be a top two pick. and then the other guards, at least, listen, we don't know. We just know what people who know what they're talking about. The other guards aren't supposed to be three or four. I can just say the lottery results will have no impact on the approach moving forward with John Moran.

Like they're going to try to find a home for John Morant regardless of where they ended up in the lottery. Okay. Well, but they ended up third. Yeah. And they did a fair amount. If you can stay healthy. Cedric Coward's a guy. Like they've got a chance to start building something back up.

I had way too much respect in decorum to bring this up to Austin, but Austin, but I was like, I wonder after they got the pick two and three, I wonder how much they were thinking about that $500,000 fine. Do you think that, do you think that was still on their minds? Costa doing business for Ryan Smith.

He was all right with it. I mean, he pays more than that for BYU's 12th man. If he didn't know he was getting the second pick and he could have paid for it, he'd have paid a hundred times that and maybe. Exactly. So, and, you know,

Memphis tanked pretty hard. down the stretch. So they, Memphis, listen, the top three hardest tank. Memphis was the

most egregious tanker. But you know what I was thinking about as in Zach was pretty passive, you know,

he explained to me later what he was thinking. But I was thinking in my head, Memphis Grizzies medical update. Now I know some of them were a little,

little shaky down the stretch of the season, but there was a lot of Memphis Grizzlies medical updates over the last couple years that were, you know,

putting karma in the bank. You know, they had so, you know. But then down the stretch of the season, let's just be clear. They managed to put together a team that would not have made the G-League playoffs. Correct. I saw Zach climbing in Kansas City at the big 12 tournament, and I said,

you're going to get to six. He said, I don't know. I don't know. I said, Zach, see what you guys are doing every day. You're going to get to six. And they got to six, and that got them to three. So they got to their spot. And they have had some lottery luck over the years. Got Jha from nine, I believe. That was part of a coin flip that, it a certain way positioning wise and they jump up got jaron at four i think that's oh that actually was under maybe the old system i don't remember exactly but um yeah no they've had some they've had some picks and like i said either one of those bigs assuming you know knock on wood zach getty who was very impressive in the little bit he was able to play that's a pretty interesting front line

phone forward if they can say on the court okay so the fourth pick this is where um this is where things got, you know, pretty nasty. Not nasty. The Clippers Pacers paradox is in full effect at this point. Yes, that is exactly what happened. So Ted Wu, again, Clippers Pacer's front office, he is sitting in sort of seat two and sitting off by the media because the Clippers did not have a sod on the dais, but the Clippers had skin in the game. And I am going to to botch this gentleman's name. I just met him today for the first time. He's a front office member. Hold on one second. Okay. I just met this gentleman today and I'm going to mess up his name. I want to apologize that I cannot pronounce his name correctly. I think it's pronounced something along the

lines of reshub Desai. I know him and I don't know how to pronounce his name. Nice guy. Great guy. So he is, so Ted Wu is sitting there and he looks over at reshub. And they have like a little one second moment where they just got to go, you know, like, oh boy, here we go. You know, because basically if the, if the, if the Pacers came up fourth, they keep the pick. If they don't come up fourth, the Clippers get the fifth pick is what it comes down to. So out come the numbers. and the first number up, I believe, is a seven. And that was really not good for the Pacers

because the Pacers had 140 combinations of the 1,000. So they have 14%. But only seven of their 140 combinations had the number seven in it. So right out of the gate, the first seven that comes up, they are down to 0.7, you know, whatever, seven tenths of a percent. Like it's, it's really bad. The Clippers percentages explode there. The next two numbers are six and I think nine. And when those two happened, the Pacers were down to one combination. So here we're down to the last ball of the lottery. The Pacers needed a one.

So a seven, six, and nine had come out. There's 14 balls, a seven, six, and nine. had come out. But they were still alive. There were 10 balls left. They needed the one to come. And if this was a 10% at that point, one comes out, they get the fourth pick. Anything else comes out. Clippers get the fifth pick. And I was watching Joe sigh from the nets sitting one seat over. And once the third ball came, the nets were eliminated. And he just looked like he was ashen. because you know what the nuts. I mean, you know, and I felt, you know, as much as I was happy for some people, I felt compassion in the room, you know.

You know, I don't know how much compassion you feel for one of the richest men on the planet. But, you know, I know what they've. They made this trade with the Rockets, and I think it was the right thing to do in the situation they were in. And they set themselves up to be awful in the two years there were loaded drafts. And they dropped four spots last year at the worst possible look they could have. And it dropped three spots this year. And it, you know, it's just, there's just not much else you could say than that, really. They just had terrible luck both years.

And then, and then next year, the Rock still have swap rights because they made a trade where they didn't even get all of their stuff back and they gave up four picks. Yeah, and I think it really wouldn't even have made, wouldn't even have made that much of, difference if they had not made that trade. I think it would have I guess they dropped I guess they only dropped back a couple spots. I guess it was two or three spots last year, not four. But yeah, like they, they were in the top five or six in the odds two years in a row and struck out both times. That, you know, that's why the lottery is a lottery and why it's far from a certainty that you're going to be up there if you're in the top four. And obviously that's the situation the Pacers found themselves in today also. So and then the

One of the king's minority owners was there. It's been one of their minority owners since even before Vivek bought the team. John Keiraitis, I think his name. I probably botched that. But he was there. And he was a very nice guy, very jovial. He was on one side, Austin Angels was on one side. And Zach Kheim was on the other.

And he's congratulating them, all of them through the whole lottery. And he's got no luck. And they slide all the way back to seven. So the last ball comes up and it's not a one. It's a nine. And on the second row, the bull. They are the team that came up from ninth to move into fourth. Obviously, a lot of excitement here in Chicago about it.

They need to jumpstart their thing. And so that's it. Bryson Graham gets a fourth pick and the 15th pick to start his tenure. Lead executive with the polls, see what he does with those. Yep. So I went down. So I will say this. As soon as the lottery ended, Sam Presti came over.

He kind of came over from far away in the room and he got to, Michael Winger and he shook Michael's hand and you know Winger worked for him for seven years in Oklahoma City. I mean in many ways what Winger is trying to build in you know in Washington is

bottled after the Thunder. I mean he hired Will Dawkins from the Thunder to be his GM and Brian Keith and old Thunder assistant coach as well. He's bounced around the league but that's true. And so Winger says to Sam hey thank you

so much for the note. And so I asked about that, and apparently Sam sent winger a note, you know, wishing him luck. So maybe he sent it to all everybody in the room. I covered all his pieces. Did he send to Austin Ainge? I don't, can't speak on that. Don't know.

The reason he's saying that is because the jazz pick was top eight protected and they were not making, they were making sure it wasn't going to the thunder. The jazz pick has been protected for three years. I think it was 10-8-8 or maybe 10-10-8, whatever. And it turns out that the Thunder just took Derek Favre's salary on as a charity project. They never got anything for it. Well, anyway, and so Winger said that he sent him a good luck note. So, yeah, so I then went downstairs and the jazz were, as you could imagine.

I mean, obviously the Wizards. Wizards were over the moon. The Jazz, you know, Justin Zannick, their GM, Danny, change. They were just... It's huge for them. I mean, they're going to end up with one of these perimeter players to go with Keonti George, who was up on the dais.

And, you know, with their big trio of Larry Markinen and Walker Kessler and Jaron Jackson Jr. and Ace Bailey last year, like, I mean, this is exactly what the jazz we're trying to do. They're trying to be bad one more year, get one more high bite at the Apple in a really deep draft and like they they could easily be in the playoffs next year like they could be really good as soon as next year like they got a deep interesting team will will hardy friend of the pod so had to deal with a lot of losing the last several years he can finally be unleashed to just coach for 82 games i'm sure he'll be excited about he's allowed to use his powers for good

yes he is so it's uh you know but they've they've been doing this for a while and it's you know They're going to be a lot of fun to watch next year. I talked to both AJ DeBanza and Darren Peterson. I had not met Darren. I met him today. I've known AJ for a while and talked to him. You're discovering, McMahon. He's got both the top two picks now.

Add him to the list. When he's like some of these agents, he's pretty good at getting the top of the lottery. He knows how to identify the big stars. Yeah. Like himself. Saw Masai Ujiri, the new president of the Maver's. Sorry guy, Mike Schmitz. And Mike Schmitz.

How about that? Mike Schmitz, our former colleague at ESPN. Congrats to Mike. Just hired as the general. manager of the Dallas Mavericks. I got to... Sorry, you got to deal with Big Band now. Yes.

He's thrilled. I know. So, yeah. Mike's great. Good for you. But in all seriousness, though, like with Maasai and Mike, they've got some guys who,

like, these are dudes who specialize and knowing what talent looks like. And obviously, they didn't have a lot of luck today. They're going to have the ninth pick. They've got the Thunder at the end of this, you know, the Thunder's pick at the end of the first round. And they've got a,

They don't have a first runner next year. Then it's Thunder Swap. And then they have got, oh, they've got the Lakers in 29. And then it's a spurs swap. I got that Cooper guy, though, so they'll be okay. Yeah, they got him. And they're going to have to nail some late first rounders.

And they've got some guys who know what they're looking at. So Kevin Pritchard, the president of the Paisers, was here. And he immediately talked after the words. And he's, you know, look, they made the trade at the trade deadline to acquire Vitsa Zubach. and the pick was top four protected, and he openly admits that he feels terrible. And, you know, his 50s. Let's call a spade a spade a pacer's made that trade because they're cheap.

Like, Vizu Zubat's a good player, but they made that trade and gave up a premium to get him because he's on a very good contract. And so they could probably stay under the luxury tax, which they haven't paid in 20 years. And at the end of the day, he's a really good player, but the second they made that trade, we were all like, wow, that is a high price to pay

to potentially have all this losing and strike out and miss on this draft. And yes, I know they get their unprotected pick back in 2031, that's fine. This is a team that in theory is going to be in the mix next year. And if they had gotten the double bite at it and gotten Zubots and a top four pick in this year's draft to go with Tyrese Halliburton getting back

and Baskos Yakum and all the other guys they have, that, you know, that would have been a heck of a move, but it was a heck of a High Wire Act take with this draft pick. And again, like they don't, they didn't have a center in the first place because they decided not to pay Miles Turner, which I can understand. Honestly, given the price that it wasn't, doesn't look bad.

I was going to say, I can understand why they didn't pay Miles Turner. That contract doesn't look great. But they paid the price they did for Zubots, both because he's a good player and because, he had a pretty cheap deal relative to his talent. Well, and, and here's part of Pritchard's post on, on X. I own taking this risk, surprised it came up fifth after this year.

I thought we were due some luck. Like, you knew it was a coin flip, basically. It was literally a 50-50 coin flip. I mean, it was like 48, 52, 48, whatever. When he spoke to the media, he articulated it a little differently. He said, if we would have paid. a bigger price if we had to trade a pick that was top eight or ten protected. We wouldn't, you know, or we do not get a player as good as Zubots.

Well, of course, of course, because then the Clippers can do the math too. And so he said, and we have our pick now in five of the next. Look, I'm not defending. I'm just telling you what he said, just to be clear. Well, it's not a matter of defending or not. Like, it just, the facts are what they are. The Pacers are not a team. The Pacers are not a team that pays a luxury tax.

They haven't played the luxury tax in 20 years. They took a risk. and it hurt in it it didn't come up now for all we know I don't know who the fourth pick or the fifth pick of the draft will be for all we know they may take that 30 number 31 pick that they have or the 30 20131 pick that they have and put it with something else and end up getting another player in the next year sure and it may work out but what he was basically saying is

you may say to me well why didn't you protect the pick to 7, 8, 10 and he's like I couldn't have gotten Zubots for that price Yeah, because then there's like no point because the clippers is like, we're not going to get that pick. That's right. And that's why they got Zubots because again, he is a good player who allows them to stay out of the tax. As for the clippers, you know, the whole at some point here, we're going to have the aspiration thing come down. It's very difficult to know what their pathway forward is until we find that out. But this, you know, this pick will enable them to continue their reset. It's going to be very insincere what they do.

I mean, the draft, there's those top four guys. It's probably going to be one of Peterson and DeBanza. Then it's probably going to be one of Boozer and Wilson. And then there's four or five guards in a row, whatever order you want to put them in. Darius Acuff from Arkansas, Keaton Wogler from Illinois, Mikhail Brown from Louisville, Kingston, Brayden Burry, some Arizona. Those are probably the next five picks. Maybe Native Men is a big wing from Tennessee.

all those guys are freshmen. But those guards are probably going to be at least three or four of those next picks. And the Clippers just traded for Darius Garland back in, for James Hardin, back at the trade deadline. That's a bit of an interesting fit going forward. We'll see what they decide to do there. But certainly for a team that's bereft of young talent and is starting to pivot another way to turn Zubots into the fifth pick in this draft when we were back in November talking about,

well, hell are the clipper is going to be a not like out of the playing kind of playoff team and give the Thunder a top 10 pick, a top 5 pick, a top 1. I mean, they were 6 and 21 at one point. So for them to, for their pick to end up at 12 and for them to get the fifth pick in the draft coming out of the season, obviously Zoo is a very good player and they traded him to get it, but that it is a pretty nice win for them to start to pivot things in other direction. As you said, is we wait to see whatever is going to happen if it ever does with the aspiration stuff. Well, and then there's also like, we'll see what happens with aspiration,

assuming they are allowed to attempt to negotiate an extension. I believe the intention is to try to negotiate an extension with Kauai Leonard, but negotiate is a key word there. It's not just like, hey, can you take just a little slight haircut from Maxis? Like, and so depending on how that goes, like there's a world where Kauai could be on the, on the block this summer too. So, we shall see. Yeah, well, that, this was a huge moment for the clippers. And also, and the chair, the, the thunder pick didn't move up. So. Yeah, but that doesn't mean the thunder can't move up higher if they want. I understand that. But if the clippers didn't get the pick and the thunder pick also moved into the top four. Oh, yes. Imagine if the pacer's are picking third and the

thunder were picking fourth. That would feel a lot differently for the old clips. Now the thunder just have to find the next Janet Williams with the 12th pick that they got from the clippers. All right. I know the Cavs Corner won, but it's late and they have another game tomorrow. We're going to have time to talk about Caves Corner because the Lake Show is probably going the same way that the Sixers show went today, tomorrow. So there'll be plenty of time to talk about Spurs, Thunder, or Spurs, Wolves, and Cavas Pistons later in a week. Sam Presti did not have any luck, but he was coming there from his team being up 3-0 in a series. There's nobody else in that room who is. Also, poor Sam Presti.

He's coming fresh off of watching a guy he picked in the second round who started his career on a two-way contract last year, completely dominate the Lakers in a playoff game. Talking about A.J. Mitchell, who, by the way, since he's been in the starting lineup, his average about 20 per game, you know, filling in for the lottery picker they got from the Clippers, Jaylon Williams, who was an all-in-B-A player on a championship team last year. Sam will be all right. It is just worth saying. The last four guys we talked about, Vita Zubon,

Kauai Leonard, Jalen Williams, and A.J. Mitchell, as you said, Mitchell and Zubots were second round picks. Kauai was picked at 15. Jaylon Mitchell was picked at 12 or Jaylon Williams was picked to 12. Obviously, there's a ton of interest in the top of the draft. And these guys at the top of the draft is here particularly really good. But as we've seen over and over again, there's talent all throughout the draft. It is not a perfect science. And just because one of these teams didn't get the top pick today to somebody. Correct. And like, the best player in the draft. Yeah. And the Nets were super bummed. But the sixth pick in this draft is a very good pick.

Yes. And also, like, listen, there's the scouting aspect of it, and then there's the player development aspect of it. Sometimes that part's as much or more important. I was talking to an agent court side before Lakers' Thunder Game 3, who was just talking about, like, dude, the Thunder, like, they don't get enough credit for their player development side of things. You talk about, I mean, think about some of the guys they have making massive impacts. A.J. Mitchell, Lou Dore was undrafted.

I mean, I think the Thunder get plenty of credit for their player, though. I'll just, well, I say that would love. They, they are the model organization. Case and Wallace. He was a lot of pick, though. But yeah, that's true. They got a ton of talent, and they've also, I mean, they do everything right. That's why they're, that's why they're the heavy favorites to repeat as champions.

I thought it was because they got a bunch of whistles. Yeah, well, I think, I think they're, I'm not going to get into that. I'm not taking, out of here jabbing. I'm not taking the way. All right. Thank you to our producer, Mark. It's a big weekend for producer Jackson. Well, I was going to say, Jackson,

I thought you were going to skip by it. Jackson finally engaged. Finally. I'm not going to put any pressure on finally, but Jackson got engaged. He's like 21 years old. The photos, I've never seen, the photo that we saw of Jackson after his engagement,

it was the happiest. He looked extremely happy in the photo. That made me happy. Well, we never see him happy because we kind of make his life different. He's got a deal. He's got to deal with you. Of course he's not happy. We kept him up till like five or six in the morning, putting the pot together the other night.

Then he got engaged like the next day. Can you imagine that? Like we were holding him up. He was worried about it. Well, privately Jackson had told us that there was a time limit and it was coming up. So I had a feeling it was coming pretty soon. I know it was going to be Friday. But we are thrilled for Jackson and Nina is lovely bride to be or both great.

Congratulations. she's better than he is, but... Yeah, she's got like a high level degree. I didn't say she wasn't. Jack's went to Syracuse. She's got like a degree from Yale. All right. Thank you for listening and watching The Hoop Collective.

Thank you to McMahon and Bantams. We'll talk to you guys later this week after the next Wolves' Spurs game. God knows what's going to be going on on Tuesday night. Fellas, let me show you how this is done. Adios megos.