Brian Windhorst & The Hoop Collective - Wolves Level Series, Must Wins For Cavs & Celtics? + Thunder Big Response

Episode Date: May 9, 2025

Brian Windhorst is joined by ESPN's Tim Bontemps and Tim MacMahon to talk the Wolves leveling the series with the Warriors, if Golden State will be able to stay in it long enough for Steph Curry to return and Draymond’s technical incident. Then, the guys talk if Boston will make any changes versus the Knicks, the Thunder’s impressive response against Denver and the Cavs’ must win game against the Pacers. Plus, a special guest appearance. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hey, sports fans, the ESPN app has all of ESPN all in one place. The ESPN app is your home to thousands of live events, ESPN shows, and originals across every ESPN network and service. And now you can check if you already have ESPN Unlimited as part of your TV package for no additional calls. Visit activate.esPN.com to learn how to access your account or sign up, then start streaming in the ESPN app. It's all of ESPN all in one place. Sign up or activate now. Hello and welcome to the HOOP Collective podcast. We talk about the NBA, which we are doing on Thursday evening. Joining me from down the street here in New York City,

back from a brief hiatus, and with a special guest is Tim Bontem's. Hello, everybody. It's very nice to be back. We've got a lot of really awesome wishes over the past week or so from everybody. Listen to the pod, which we appreciate. and we got young Mr. Bond temps here. He's got a gift from some friends that we wanted to show you here, if you can see on here.

You see that? The poop collective. I love it. Poop collective, yes. Some friends of ours, including the laugh track. I think longtime fans of the pod will know who we're talking about, sent that along for a little guy. So I wanted to say a lot everybody and say thank you for all the super nice wishes over the past week.

We're doing great. hanging out. They got him a shirt, a matching shirt that they want Tim to wear. This is just messed up because this is like a human shield. I can't really go after Bond Tim, so he's got the cute little baby in his hands. This is wrong. I think he just handed him off to Mom. Oh, sweet.

That rat right there is joining us from Oklahoma City. Uh-uh. Oh, that's right. Joining us from Denver, you relocated. Joining us from Denver is Ban McMahon. Howdy partners. It is a pleasure to have bond tips back. And I've been telling folks, this is like, you know, when you,

you know those t-shirt cannons that are like circulars, like there's like two layers on the circular cannons and you just shove all the little t-shirts in them and then they start firing them off into the upper deck. Boom, boom, boom, boom. That's bomb tips with his NBA takes. He's just, he's got the takes cannon loaded and ready to roll. Well, I think we finally had kind of a normal night in the NBA playoff world on Wednesday night. The Timberwolves, I thought for a minute the Warriors made a run in the second half behind Jonathan Cumminga being reanimated.

But I thought for a second we might have another 20-point comeback. But order was restored and Timberwolves tied the series. I don't know what to predict on that. I don't know if we're going to, how many close games we're going to get without Steph, but I do know this. ESPN stats and info tells us that the Warriors have a 92 offensive efficiency, 92 points per 100 possessions when Steph Curry is not on the court in the postseason. And he is not on the court right now.

And have they given you Jimmy on, Steph off? because Jimmy didn't miss that game. I don't imagine it's pretty, but I hope it's better than 92. Well, I watched this game today, and Jonathan Cominga came on to the court. He got some extra minutes off the bench as Steve Kerr. By the way, Steve Kerr, I wouldn't say he was searching. He played 14 players in the first half.

He played Jonathan Caminga. He was absolutely searching. Are you kidding me? He played him. 13 players in 14 minutes. I think that says all you need to know. He, anyway,

Kaminka hit his first eight shots, which is what led that brief flourish. The Warriors are just, I don't know what they're going to do here. I mean, what they need to do is somehow find a way to win one game out of the next three to try to get it to game six, which would maybe enable stuff to come back.

That would be about, I think 11 days off the injury. Who knows? I don't know how he's going to feel in 11 days. He gave an interview today where he said he's still very much in the rehab process, forget about doing anything with basketball-wise, and he doesn't know when he's going to be able to come back, obviously. But, you know, the conventional wisdom is if he can get to that three-day break

next week between five and six, which means the warriors can get another win. And, you know, I mean, I don't want to take, but maybe they sweep the games in Oakland, I almost said, in San Francisco, but I don't like their chances, but if they somehow could do that, I don't want to take it off the table, but if they get one more win, they can get to game six, and maybe Steph can come back. But who knows what condition he would be when he came back. So the wolves had to win this game tonight under the circumstances. They got off to a big early lead. Julius Randall had a great game with double double with, I think 11 assists, 20 points at 11

assists. And in Edwards, maybe the most resilient physically guy in the league now. like LeBron had to give that title up. And now Ann Edwards turns his ankle, gets leg whipped, gets rolled up on. And this game got landed on his foot. Trace Jackson Davis landed on his foot. He couldn't put any pressure, barely on his foot going off the court. And we're in our group chat going, oh, my God, is it a high ankle sprain? Is it a contusion?

Is it worse? And he started the second half. Of course he did. And honestly, he missed what, the last like six minutes? and change in the first half, usually he'll go back and it's like he's back in three minutes later. So the fact he missed the whole last six minutes is like, ooh, you know, there's some mystery. There's some concern there. He came back in the second half.

He was fine. I know he is he is not shooting the ball well. I think he's like three of 20 on threes. Three of his last 20. But without Curry, the Warriors. You know, you don't maybe need A-plus basketball for Mann Edwards. But the Warriors having one game one save their bacon in this series because that will buy them some time.

All right, Bontentz, we've been waiting for a week plus to hear from you. Have you been? I'm not sure that's true. I just was looking up stats while we were sitting here. And in tonight's game, in 34 minutes, Jimmy Butler when he was on the court, the Warriors had a 100 offensive rating, which is not good.

In the 14 minutes that Jimmy Butler was not on the court, the Warriors had an 84.4 offensive rating, which is really bad. And I mean, look, it's like you said, Brian, they have to win,

if they can win one game, they have a chance probably to get Steph Curry back for game six at home in San Francisco and give Steph, Jeff, the chance to do that. It's hard to bet against Steph Curry, right? But that game won, the wolves were just abject in every way. And in this game, like, they were okay. They weren't great. They were okay. And they dominated the game. So it's going to be a pretty monumental challenge for

an older Warriors team with a already beaten up Jimmy Butler and not a lot of scoring punch. I mean, like you said, Jonathan Cominga comes in and goes eight for eight and has 16 points right off the bat. And the game's still not that competitive. I think he's probably not doing that again. And the other, well, well, the other thing we have to talk about, too, is this latest insanity with Dremont. Because the entire time I've been out, I've been watching Dremont. Hold on. Essentially every game.

Hold on. The USWB is just starting to flow. I know. It's all good. I know we're getting to it. I just want to say one thing real quick, just because we're talking about Warriors' performance. Stats Williams has this So the wolves did make 16

3s in this game Which is one of the reasons why they you know they've been ice cold from three point range They made all 16 3s were classified as open looks The most open three pointers by any team since ESPN started tracking games Wow 2014 So if the Warriors are going to have any chance to win any

here, they're going to have to defend better. And that was really their, you know, the reason they won game one was because of defense. I suppose Minnesota is just being, well, they only gave up 88 points. I mean, they had to defend a little bit. But they lost game one because the wolves were abject.

The wolves lost that game. That's how bomb tincts back. The USWB's got a double abject. It were just a few minutes in. Listen, I would like to know how many of those threes in game one were classified as wide open. Because good defense is you can say it's okay hey they scored so many points the other team they

held the other team so many points if they're missing clean looks at threes that's not good defense it's good luck yeah all right so on to draymond oh go ahead well i mean look the entire so i was i've been home not the hospital watching games for i don't know 10 days last 10 days and i think every single time i've seen the warriors play over those 10 days Drummond Green has either gotten a flagrant foul, the technical, or both. And these antics today in the second corner were unbelievable. First of all, the guy elbows and I was reading ahead. It is an obvious, obvious technical foul.

And it's the exact same thing he did to Fred Van Vleet in game seven. Exactly. You get fouled, you flail, you smack the guy upside the head. Dude, you can't do that. Again, by the letter of the law, that's a technical, not a flagrant, Because it's a dead ball. But it happened when it wasn't a dead ball. It would have been a flagrant.

Right. And both of those flagrants would have gotten him suspended. Not the actual, not the act of the flagrant. He had a few points. He'd already be at four flagrant fraud points. So he flails. He elbows when I was reading the head. The most obvious, as you said, literal definitional technical file ever.

He stomps to the bench. Can't believe why they're reviewing it. Doesn't understand what's going on. Tony Brothers. veteran official, reviews it for four seconds, says technical foul, because it's a dead ball technical foul,

as it always is. Draymond now has five, as we have talked about, man, you are the master of all technical record keeping, seven technicals. You then are suspended for a game. So he's already up to five.

You have him then walk out of the court, our friend of the pod, Tyler Ford, is standing there. He walks up to Tyler Ford and says, to his face, that's bleeping BS. to the guy's face.

Uh-oh, Draymond might have to have another apology session with the Red Warriors teammates. Well, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on. I want to praise Tyler, Big T, Tyler Ford. I want to praise him. He's five foot three in stature, but six foot three in temperament now. He's grown up before our eyes.

Because if he was a wee little fella in this instance, boom, another T. Oh, that's two. See you later, buddy. Well, listen, I wish Tyler had ejected him. Because this nonsense with Draymond, I'm beyond over it. It's truly, it's truly embarrassing the way the league has allowed this to fester to the point where this guy just walks around and acts like he is aggrieved every second he's on the court while he's committing a flagrant or a technical foul every single game to the point where Stefan Curry has to come over to him and say, hey man, I'm already. out. We can't have you doing this. And then Steve Kerr has to take him out of the game because they think he's

going to get himself thrown out of the game in the second quarter. It's nine years since this guy cost his team a title in 2016. And we are still dealing with this absolute garbage on a day by day basis. It's a joke. And the league has allowed this to turn into a circus where this guy can threaten the refs and dominate at the refs and do whatever he wants. And when he gets one technical, he knows that they're not going to want to throw him out of the game because they want the best players on the court, which is a admirable goal for everyone to have. And then he just acts like a crazy person.

And it's just, it's, I'm so tired of it on every level. They want the best players on the court unless it's a 51 point margin and Nicole you know, I'm going to take a shot here. Get me the hell out of here. I know I've got five fouls, please. Listen, man, oh, it's good to have Bon Tim's back. Wendy, did you see those t-shirts? They were landing high in the 300s.

Folks in the nosebleeds, you better be ready. They're coming to you. Those takes are getting fired. But this is a good, strong take, Bon Tempts, I can't even disagree with you. To act like this is, I can't believe your review on this week. Bro, you flailed and smacked a guy upside the head, which was the exact same thing you did to Fred Van Blit in game. Like, what are we even talking about here?

Nonsense. And this guy, like, dude, it's not an if Draymond's going to be suspended during his playoffs. It's a win. Because I don't think he can, I don't know, maybe, maybe the only way I'll be wrong is if Golden State loses than five. Maybe he can go three more games without getting at least two more T's or two more. Two more flagon foul points. Yeah, two more points. Maybe.

But the numbers aren't in his odds. The guy is seven flagrant foul and technicals combined. Framework out points of technical fouls in nine games. It's ridiculous. But he did apologize. He apologized to the team. After the game, Steve Kerr was asked, hey, was this disappointing?

You know, he'd shown poised the last two games. And what did Steve say? You haven't heard what he said because I just listened to him. while you guys are going back and forth, what do you think he said? I'll bet just guess what he said. I'm sure he excused it away. Draymond's passion is part of his greatness,

that whole crap. That's exactly right. Yeah, he excused it away. The worries have been excused this away for years. This guy sucker punched his teammate, and then his teammate was turned into the villain. So look, I give up with this whole thing. But I just, that entire,

all those histrionics in the second quarter were a joke. And the whole situation is ridiculous. us in every single game now, we're talking about every time the Warriors play, we're talking about some incident with Draymond and something like this happening. And he's constantly acting like it's everybody against him. Well, and again, when is that going to stop? Dremont absolutely, like, yes, Draymond helped hang four banners. That can never be taken away from. 100%. But, but, dude, come on, man. Like, it's every single game. And you, you, You managed to come back and you beat the Rockets, but your antics throughout that series were a distraction and were a problem.

And honestly, I thought he should have been tossed in Game 7. This thing where you get fouled and you're embellished in the contact, but you're doing it with your elbow or your forearm upside the guy's head. Dude, I'm sorry. That, to me, it's a flagrant. It's a flagrant too, or it could be considered. Like, I'm sorry. That, to me, is an objectionable offense. Right.

by the letter of the law, it is a deadball technical, which is why they keep calling it that. However, it is a flagrant act every time he has us. And look, these playoffs have been amazing. I've been ready to talk about them for 10 days. It frankly makes me angry that we spent all this time talking about Draymond, but we have to because it's a joke. Draymond has just commented. Oh, great, what he said? Well, okay.

What do we got? I'm going to listen to it again here to make sure. Well, while you're doing that, all I will say is McMahon and I, while McMahon was working at this band, I was working at the Washington Post, so it wasn't quite here yet. back in 2016, we were in Oklahoma City for Thunder Warriors. In that entire series, we spent going to morning shootarounds and practices talking about the placement of Draymont's foot in relation to Stephen Adams' private parts. Which led to my favorite quote that I've ever heard, which was, it's not that big a target, mate.

I knew what you were going to say before you said it because that whole blouse is incredible and that quote was right near the top of the whole list. Stephen Adams is just obviously an all-timer, but that to me is the best. I don't know, that or the one he gave to Wendy about his hometown smelling like farts. Those are the best to Stephen Adams quotes. Well, I miss a lot of those that first round,

but it was great to see Stephen Adams back and playing great for the Phase 3 Rockets. That was very fun to see. All right, Brian, we've filibustered enough, I think, for you to listen to this. I have a great family. I'm great at basketball. I'm great at what I do.

the agenda to make me keep making me look like a angry black man is just crazy and then he walked away and then he's okay you know what go away draymond shut up dude do not play victim here don't play the victim here stop doing stop doing i'm sick of it it's crazy and stupid stuff we're sick of you doing stupid flagrant crap on a regular basis it's not an agenda Dremont, you get break after break after break after break, after break, and you keep on pushing the line. It was not an agenda to make you look angry when you punched your teammate in the face. It was not an agenda to make you look angry when you grab Rudy, go bare and put him in the sleephole. It was not an agenda to make you look angry when you punched or smacked or whatever the hell you want to call it, Yusuf Nurkich, upside the head.

Dude, and then, you know, this is why, honestly, I love, I love Ome. Ome is great at his job, but when Ome came on here and talked about like the kinder, gentler, Dremont, and he's really embracing this counseling. Dremon is full of crap. He's just, he's so full of crap, his breast stinks. Like, what are we talking about here, dude? Steve Kerr, the end of the Steve Kerr, Dremont quote, the competition is so meaningful to him that occasionally, it goes over the line.

And by occasionally, like, like, Almost in the game. Yes, I was going to say, by occasionally we mean what occasion at a game. Just enough to keep him on the court. Why is Draymond the only one in these playoffs when every time there's a foul that he wants to embell, she ends up smacking the defender upside the head? Why is he the only one? Am I missing like this rash of forearms to the head of guys who just commit a foul,

a little touch foul out on the perimeter? Have I missed the rest of them? Or is this only Dremont doing Dremont? I would say, to wrap this up very succinctly, if there is one common denominator over a 10-year period in dozens of instances and it's the same person every single time, perhaps it is not an agenda, perhaps.

Well, I just look forward to the next Dremont podcast where he whines and cries and complains about how everybody's out to get them. Honestly, dude. Maybe it'll be tonight. He's embarrassing himself. This is an embarrassment. We all have eyeballs.

No one's trying to portray you as something. You're doing this. You keep doing stupid things that hurt your team and you refuse to take any accountability and you're going to get suspended. Your team's going to lose that game. And then you can go do a podcast from Cancun. Which we should have a live show there sometime, by the way.

Listen, if we're going international, And I'm speaking to my followers, not followers. That's the old strange. Oh, wow. The cult leader here. I was going to say. Bow down before me. If we're going to go international with a live show, it's going to be to Manila.

Okay. Let's go. I'll go to Manila. You know, my Filipino friends. It's a long flight, Jackson. It's a long flight. Yeah, but you can probably get us to PJ. I'm guessing that that's going to be a big top of.

conversation on the shows tomorrow. This is how I'm thinking. I'm thinking I'm now on get up and first take tomorrow. This is going to be the only topic tomorrow. Hold on. That was a subtle. He's become subtle with ease. That was a subtle windy sleep update.

Go on. It's actually not too bad tonight because the game, you know, the game didn't go so late. We just had to wait for an hour for Big Man's technical. The young king. The young king almost didn't make it to the pod because of how. And there was an Uber trip. I was just, you know, eating pizza and enjoying some basketball, some nuggets.

Anyway, let's get off at dream. I want to talk about fun stuff already. More Hoop Collective podcast after this. All right. I don't know how much fun it is. Jason Tatum did speak today after he didn't speak last night because there was the fire alarm. I don't know. Which was fitting for the Celtic situation.

Oh, my God. What an absolutely fitting way for that train wreck of a night to end. You guys all getting ushered out of the building because there's a fire alarm that gets put off in the middle of post-game media. Yeah. So I will say this about Tatum. First off, he spoke today. I mean, it wouldn't have been unheard of if he didn't speak today. There's two days off.

I'll give him credit for that. And, you know, he said, quote, I take full ownership of the way that I've played in this series and can't sugarcoat anything. I need to be better and I expect to be a lot better. He said that I've been working really hard on my game and my craft and prepare to be in these moments to hit these shots and it just hasn't happened in the last two games. But you can't lose your confidence.

So he is shooting, by the way, 29% in this series, 12 of 42 and 5 of 20, 25%, which is exactly on pace for the Celtics because they're 25 of 100. as we know. I was just going to say, as we know, the reason the Celtics are down to in the series is the introduction of my son into the picture, as you correctly pointed out last week.

I almost said his name, which is still secret. I almost said his name. He knows nothing but Wicks. He knows nothing but Nix being winners is only thing. That's all he knows. Lakers, Wooners and Nick's winners.

It's been a week and it's all he knows. Speaking of, Yeah, oh my gosh, you took like 12 hours of paternity leave. Anyways, speaking of the Knicks being winners, Wendy, you've watched every second in this series. You're covering the thing. How much of Jason Tatum struggles are just, hey, you know, Tatum's off right now. Like, the shots aren't falling, whatever, versus the two big-time wing defenders that the Knicks went out and got over the last year and a half, O.G. and Anobie and McCabe and McCabe and McCabe and McCabe. Bridges, Macau Bridges, the Cajonis Factor defense player the year,

release defense player at the playoffs so far because all he does is get steals to seal wins. How much credit do you give them versus saying, hey, Tatum's not playing well right now? It's both. By the way, they had Bridges and Ananoby during the regular season and Tatum average 34 against them. I know these games are obviously way more important, but it's not like, you know, I mean, it's not like he has not been able to solve them. The Celtics are definitely playing poorly. They're definitely having some questionable decisions.

And they also are on a preposterous cold streak. I mean, guys, the Knicks, the Knicks didn't play well in either one of these games. I know. That, like, that's the crazy part. That's how you fall down by 20. Well, I mean, but it's like they, even the comebacks that they had. Like, the Celtics, again, this go, it's sort of, I used the line about Draymond, like, for, several years now, we have had the same conversation about the Celtics over and over and over again,

where they're just not quite consistent enough. And so they get themselves in these spots and make their lives more difficult than they need to be over and over and over again. And they in particular, kick away games at home and then come back and win on the road. They've done that over and over and over again because they go on the road, they lock in, they focus, and they play better. And in both of these games, all of the bad habits that we have talked about a million times all came up again. And that all comes back to Jason Tatum, their best player, who's a phenomenal player, deservingly a first team NBA player, there's a reason his teams always do these same

things. He's just not quite on the same level as the Nicoli Okich is. the Shagos Alexanders, the Janice Tenacupos, McMahon has called him a what? Post. Top of the second tier. I mean, he's a phenomenal player, top five to ten player in the league,

but the Celtics are always just like a half a turn off when things are not going great. And it all comes back to Tatum. No, but I just mean... Except for when they cruised do a championship last year. No, but that's what I mean. When the Celtics, when the Celtics are out front in open air,

they're unbelievable. They look like the greatest team of all time. And when they get stuck in the mud at all, they run into trouble. And look, here's the thing. I think the Celtors is going to win this next four games in this series. I wouldn't be surprised if they win them all by double digits.

Wait, wait, hold on. That tells me. Reload that T-shirt, God. Hold on. I'll tell you, hold on, hold on. I've got to do a little investigative reporting. Fontims. Are you still on paternity leave from actually covering games? I don't think you're showing up to MSG

with those kind of takes, baby. I will probably be at MSG on Saturday. We will see. We'll see. Kbon is pushing me to go be in the atmosphere at MSG in part because she's mad that she didn't go to any games this year and shows she's sticking it to me. But look, here's the thing. If the game is close with five minutes to go, if it's a clutch time game, it's a massive

advantage for the Knicks. because Janlon Brunson is the coach player of the year for a reason. But not of the playoffs, but not of the playoffs. Go on. Well, listen, whatever. Go on. And the Celtics, we have seen overtime repeatedly mess up in those spots, including at the end of game two, including in overtime in game one. And like the Knicks are not as good as them.

They were dominated by them, frankly, for the vast majority of the six games they've played this year. but they're up to O in the series because the Celtics fell apart in the final five minutes of the game and the Knicks have the best clutch player in the league. And that's the formula for the Knicks. If they can have it be close at the end, they're going to feel like they can win any game. And it's just a matter of whether the Celtics will allow them to do that or not. Listen, thanks are going so well for the Knicks that when he's doing solo pods may interrupt by Amorris Affairs in the hotel room next door just chit-chat about how great those Knicks are.

Amorous? That is not how you say that word. Ambrus? I guess I can only assume. Amor Spanish for love. I know that. I think I think you, I think Jackson cut that out of the podcast and now you've just alerted all of our listeners. I will just say that my neighbors in the hotel last night in Boston, I believe we're Knicks fans. I can't say for sure. Probably a safe bet. They might be efforting to get one of those little poop collective onesies.

After all the after all the prices that they inflated the prices of those hotels. I think they thought even if their Celtics stands, they got to make the best of the evening. Joe Missoula was asked today. I thought this was a very good question. Because they're shooting so poorly,

do the NICs, do the Celtics, need to really lean into other things besides shooting because of variance. In other words, should you, should you do something more than just shoot three-pointers? And Joe Missoula said, we shot more free throws. We got 10 more shots than the Knicks did. We got 10 more layups than they did in game one. We got 16 more offensive rebounds. And we got 25 points off turnovers.

which is basically his way of saying there's no way we should be losing these games. And how many threes are they taking in game two? 40. 40. They were 15 for 16 in game one. They were 10 for 40 in game two. Yeah.

40 is not an egregious number at all. Well, here's the thing. They also are defending. They're defending. The Knicks are not playing well. The Knicks offensive rating in these two games is 100. It would be worse than the league this year by five, almost six points behind the Wizards.

The problem is the Celtics offensive rating is 99 and a half. Like the Celtics, the Celtics imploded in the final few minutes of these two games. Like, you know, it's, and again, we have seen this story a thousand times this year.

They were up 25 to three on the calves and lost, right? Like, this is what they, I don't know that we saw a thousand times. I don't mean a lot of games. Well, yes,

but they go up by 20 regularly and then they give the lead back regularly. They do this over and over again. This is what they do. They don't. They just go through very up and down stretches. And part of that is because they're not, they aren't a team that typically is really going to be attacking the rim. I think there's a reason why Mitchell Robinson's plus minus was as strong as it was. I thought it was weird.

The amount of questioning of him of Joe Missoula doing the hack on Mitchell Robinson, I thought was weird. Like when he's not in the game, we saw on that second to last possession when Jason and Tatum just blew by Carl Towns and got about the easiest layup in a off a deadball timeout that you're ever going to get in the final 20 seconds of a playoff game. Like, if Mitchell's not out there, there's no protection at the rim for the Knicks and the Celtics should be able to get to the rim repeatedly with the amount of shooting they've got on the perimeter. Having Mitchell Robinson out there is going to change the geometry of the court and he had a real impact in the game.

And also, look, it really can't be overstated that the Knicks go into the switching defense, which Tom Thibodeau very rarely is ever employed, this is exactly why the Celtics got Chris Sperzingis. And the fact that he is under the weather and dealing with this illness he's been off and on dealing with for a few months now, it's had a huge impact on the Celtics because this is exactly the moment when they'd be getting him the ball in the midpost and giving them a plan B to attack teams with offensively.

And without that, they then resort to a lot of the three-point shooting and it gets them in the same we've seen him get into a lot. Yes, I just want to point out that as bad as you said about the offensive rating a second ago, as bad as they have shot the ball. And there's all these stats that say this is the worst two-game run for Jalen Brunson and Jason Tatum. It's the worst two games of the season for the Celtics, blah, blah, blah. I see him at Jalen Brown and Jason Tatum?

You said Brunson. I'm just making a treat you. Yeah, I don't make a treatment. By the way, Brunson hasn't been good shooting at him. No, I knew he hadn't been either. Yes, Jason, Tadam, and Jailen Brown. I'm sorry. Too many Jailens in my life.

Not enough sleep. That's right. They lost the one game by three in overtime and the other game by one. But I will say this, this game on Saturday, the ticket prices are lunacy. Completely out of control. The ticket prices here are lunacy. I was talking to. What's to get in the building price?

It's currently $700 for the nosebleeds. Yeah. I talked to a guy today who paid $1,300 a seat. He's like, I was actually pretty happy with that. I think I got a pretty good deal. And I was like, my God. Like the garden is going to be, I mean, you could make an argument. This is the biggest game of Madison Square Garden in a quarter century.

I mentioned that on my solo pod last night. I was debating this. Alan Hahn, who covered the Knicks. He works for MSG Network now in ESPN, and he covered the Knicks for, I don't know, 15, 20 years. 20 years, yeah. He said the 2013 series against the PICS, he said the 2013 series against the PICS, Pacers. I disagree. They got upset by the Pacers in the second round.

I covered that series. After game one, I was convinced the Pacers were winning. Well, here's the other thing. Here's the other thing. LeBron James is on the other side of the bracket. Right. Like, if the Knicks can somehow beat this Celtic team, which, again, I think they're probably going to lose the next four games. But if the Knicks can win two more games and beat the Celtics, this was the team all year, we said the Knicks have no chance to beat because they played them four times. They got smoked.

So if they win, they go into the conference finals. They have beaten the Celtics. Everybody here, I'm not saying this is correct, but everybody in New York is going to be preparing for the finals. And that was not the case in 2013. They were going to lose to the heat. If the Pacers get two wins over the Cavs, two more wins over the Cavs, the Knicks and the Knicks get two more wins over the Celtics, the Knicks will have home court.

in the conference finals. Yeah. Jackson, I don't know if this is easy to look up or not, but earlier today, the Knicks were favored to win the series, but the Celtics were still favored to win the East. I can look it up in BPI and see. There's been some weird stuff with BPI, too.

But this is for, this was on ESPN bet. For betting lines. Which I know that is obviously doesn't make sense, but I think it's indicative of how this series being 2O Nix doesn't make sense. And I think it shows that the sports books and the betters don't know where to put their money either based on the lay of the land here because the calves and the series is even. The Cubs and Celtics are favored for the conference title.

Oh, disrespect. Disrespect to old doing them big ball dancing. So we. By the way, did you see he didn't get fined? Listen, I think that we should rescind all the fines that have been levied for that particular celebration. Yes, we know your pro Cajonais. We know that. So you guys want to guess by ESPN bet percentages,

what the percentages are for the Nix and Pacers to win their respective series up to O? Well, I think the Nix are even since Jackson just told us that. However, earlier today, I'm talking about BPI, not in ESPBET. Talking about our internal numbers. Yeah, well, BPI is not, I would not say it's the greatest metric ever invented. What do you think it is? Whoa, Wendy versus the nerds. That's like, oh my goodness.

What do you guys think it is? Talk about a pillow fight. I'm going to guess Knicks are 45%. The Knicks are an 80% favorite to win the series. And the Pacers are a 79% favorite to win the series.

I didn't even get to guess. I was going to say 79. I was going to say that's exactly what I was going to say. I'm sure you were. Actually, I was going to say 90. I was going to say 90 because to me. It's the first time anyone's ever. excuse McMahon of thinking like a computer.

I don't know what that means. I can't even get my computer to think for me not to turn on the damn Wi-Fi. He's on his phone right now because he can't, because the IT department is not on the road in Denver, and he can't get his computer attached to the hotel Wi-Fi.

Mr. Bontas may have had more luck with the computer situation. I hope your computer attaches to the Wi-Fi at Ball Arena tomorrow. That's all I'm going to say. Big Ball Arena? By the way, we got to see a lot of McMahon in our power, Mona Shelburne on the TV, which we were, we sitting in the Bontem's house, we're happy to see them looking good. I got a lot of compliments for that suit that I had on.

Shout out to my, my guy, etiquette, Don, takes care. Oh, here we go. Sharp, yeah. He had a pocket square in. It's a built-in, right in the suit. Just give a little yank and wall-a. Of course, it's a built-in. Of course, it's a built-in.

Everybody should know that this guy could not have a pocket square in his suit. You can't get on the Wi-Fi. he was going to he was going to look up the technique for folding a pocket square but he couldn't get on the Wi-Fi to watch on YouTube but you know what I can do I can watch YouTube TV while I'm in an Uber I can watch a game sit right in the back seat I know but when I watch YouTube TV or any when I watch any video in a New York City cab like tonight it makes me I'm car sick I can't okay you know what else I can do you know what else I can do I can watch games sit right there, my airline seat.

Oh, I've watched a lot of basketball sitting in an airline seat. Can you? I don't think so. I'm not sure. I can't get this magical airline Wi-Fi that you get. You're like, oh, yeah, I'm streaming all these games. I'm lucky if my tech... I'm with you.

He's flying 2,000 feet to Oklahoma City from Dallas, so it's just got the 5G all the time. I hate to tell you, boys, but I've flown to other places than Oklahoma City this year, many, many other places. And I've watched many basketball games while I've been on those flights. You've got something special going on. that I cannot. This is a whole other world for me. People are allegedly streaming stuff on, on airplane Wi-Fi.

More Hoop Collective Podcast after this. However, the series that you are covering, McMahon, we didn't get to talk to you last night because I wasn't waiting until 3 in the morning. I'm not sure what you make of last night's game, other than the Thunder are still good. Yeah, listen, the Thunder are still good.

The Thunder aren't like, they're not going over. Like, it was a buttwop, and obviously. The Thunder aren't going over the board. Like, oh, that shows how dominant we are. Like, they know, look. They played well. The Nuggets did in the series is one-on. The Nuggets got to split out of their trip to Oklahoma City.

The Thunder still have to regain home court advantage. Now, I think it was a reminder that the Thunder are the heavy favorites in the series and in the Western Conference. And in this series, the majority of the time, the Thunder have led by double figures. They just blew a lead down the stretch of game one. And they, you know, we don't need to go back over the, just the ways that they botched the final minute of that. But, you know, they blew game one. Now, it was to me one of the most interesting things about this game two is Mark Dagonal was very adamant. the defensive schemes didn't change.

It was the same plan. Okay. There was an adjustment, though. Chet Holmgren was not the primary defender on Joker. And, you know, he wasn't the only primary defender on Joker in game one, but he spent the majority, he spent more time anybody else on him. In this game, Hartnstein started off on him. They tweaked the rotation. Jalen Williams, J. Will.

The third big came in early, so he could bang with Joker, so he could take that matchup. and Chet was on him a little bit but not much. That to me was a pretty significant adjustment. One that made sense. Frankly, I was surprised that Chet was on him as the primary guy in game one because you would much rather have him being able to roam and have the bigger or more physical guys dealing with the most physical task in the NBA,

which is trying to keep Joker from getting to his spots. Now, haven't said all that, Joker's not going to I highly doubt Joker will have another six of 16, six turnover type performance. No, that, look, those guys got what they needed in the first game.

I think it was the fifth game in nine days for the Nuggets. Yeah, tomorrow. Six and 11 for game three, yeah. Yeah, they play six guys, seven if they're lucky. It's a lot. It's not surprising that they may be a little bit flat. You know what's, this is not

necessarily like basketball relevant, but it is pretty fascinating to me. The Russell Westbrook deal in the series. So when Russ first checked into the series, it was funny because he's sitting in the scorers table and there's MVP chance. And it was because Shane Gilgis Alexander was at the free throw line. But I'm thinking, but you know, I'm kind of. Russ is like, they still love me here. In my sarcastic little mind, I'm like, hey, they remember Russ won on MVP? This is cute. But then he checks in the entire arena game of standing ovation. I know.

I heard about that. Right? The entire arena is on his feet. It's really cool. It's like a loud standing ovation. Like Russ is always going to be a legend in Oklahoma City. We all know his number zero is going to be in the rafters right next to his white man can't jump partner, Nick Collison. But he was booed.

They booed him in game two. And he got into it. He got into it with one particular big, ugly. bald-headed tattooed fan. Feller named Big Rich and Russ were going back and forth. Oh, no. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Russ was standing on. It was Big Rich's seats, you know, our buddy Big Rich. Winnie, you haven't met his acquaintance, but you don't have any need for the scholarship

that a bar owner could give you. Um, that Bond Tim knows him well. Anyways, um, his seats are right behind the Thunder bench, like two or three rows behind the Thunder bench. And Russ was on the other side of the court, but this was early, like right after Russ had checked in, and they were going back and forth. And they know, like, Russ knows Big Rich a little bit, you know, like he's hard to miss in Oklahoma City. Anyways, they were going back and forth to the point where security came over to Big Rich. And it was basically like, hey, you need to call him to that. And Russ, right after the next time out, was coming over to in-down the ball right by there.

And he turned around and winked at our old buddy Rich. But, you know, that's Russ's way of saying, like, hey, I get it. I'm the enemy now. You know, let's go. But it's been a, it's an interesting little subplot to this series. And, uh, Russ is a fascinating character. It has been a fascinating season, a roller coaster season for him and Denver. Playoffs.

Playoffs season, career, uh, post Oklahoma City for sure. But, you know, if Denver is going to have a chance to pull off what would be a significant upset, Russ is going to have to play awfully well. in four games. And he did it in game one. They've got to have three more of those type of performances to have a chance. Well, the one other thing I'd like to see the Thunder do some more of too is we've already seen Lou Dort and Joker get into it multiple times in the first couple games. I'd like to see Lou Dort on Yolkich a little bit more. No, no, no you don't. Why? Well, two reasons. No. You need him on Jamal Murray. Well, two reasons. One, you have Alex

Caruso, you have Kayson Wallace, you have 17 other guys you can throw at. Jamal Murray. I'm not saying have a doort on him the whole game, but Blue Dort is a human tank and can stand up to Joker physically and he's a pest and we'll get into him and we'll frustrate him. And I just think that having him on him for stretches of the game and just maybe getting Yokic off his game mentally a little bit is a wrinkle I would, if I was the thunder, I'd be trying to throw out of him a little bit. The Clippers had some success, success in quotes, success with putting a smaller defender on Yokic

and on switches of course and then they would sometimes bring double teams, late double teams because if you double team Yokch early with two small guys he'll pick you apart but it was some there was some success that they had

okay but and when I say Joker had a down series it's by three time MVP standards it's by a guy by the standards of a guy average is a 30 point triple double. His numbers were down a little bit in that series. Why would you say it was the number one reason? Zubots.

Yeah, you've come along in the pronunciation. Exactly. You've got to be able to put big physical defenders on Joker. I'm not saying I haven't guarded for 35 minutes of the game, but I just think having them on them for stretches, different points, to just sort of get into them and body them and be physical. them. It's something I would consider if I were then. Well, I think Jalen Williams, Jay Will, the third big, served that purpose in game two. And again, they tweet, he was the, he went from

barely playing in game one to being the first guy off the bench in game two. I don't have the minutes in front of me because of my Wi-Fi challenges. I can't look it up right now. But he played a significant role. And like the fifth foul the Joker got, what happened? He got upset because Jay Will is getting into him. And look, and Aaron Gordon kind of spoke on this. There were certainly instances of Joker getting called for the second foul,

the first foul not being whistled. And this was one of those cases where, even though I was surprised because they reviewed this, but Jay Will, like, he was fronting him and being physical on that, like kind of boxing out almost, and then reached around and kind of hooked him. And then Joker did like a belly flop on top of.

I mean, it was a pretty violent belly flop. But again, it's being physical. It's being a pest. It's getting underneath him. It's getting on his nerves. And so I think they've got a guy who they can come in and do that. And then like for a 10th man, or 10th or 11th man, whatever the hell you want to say, Jalen Williams is in the Thunder's rotation, he's really good. He's a really good backup big.

Every time, every time they try to, you know, every time. the league wanted to find them for sitting everybody the guy to have a triple double eight win but most importantly in a series like this he can be physical with joker and he's a three-point threat he he spaces the floor and it's just you know it's catch it's shoot he's got a pretty quick release but uh and so if you're gonna leave joker on him you know you're spacing the nuggets out so i think i think that's a guy who's going to play a key role in this series and he's going to do the things that you're asking them to do with leu dort and i just think that's Lou is so valuable as a on-ball perimeter defender that you don't want to take him out of that

responsibility. All right. Before we go, take a look at what's going on in Indianapolis on Friday night, the Cavs. Cabs corner. We're not even going to mention Shay was a plus 51. That was pretty good. I was pretty good. Listen, I was covering a game that was 91.90, and I saw the Thunder had 87 points in the first half.

Yeah. A record for points in a half and a playoff half, by the way. Shea was a big part of it. More to come on that. Caz in a must-win game on Friday listed their three injured players as questionable. They always list guys as questionable in the playoffs. I think it's questionable. They list them questionable.

But I don't think- We saw this last year with Jared Allen. We've now seen him for a few games with Darius Garland. Right. Jared Allen, his reputation with the fans was damaged because he was listed as questionable every game of the Celtic series, and he didn't play, and it made it look like he was not willing to play through anything. And I think the calves were just trying to keep the Celtics off balance or off guard.

I don't think it really matters, but they do have DeAndre Hunter, Evan Mobley, and Darius Garlandless is questionable. Garland has now missed over almost three weeks, and he first suffered the injury at the end of the regular season. He's this a significant injury. I mean, if he plays on it, you know, he's clearly not going to be anything close to 100%. I'm not sure. I have heard that Hunter's thumb has made the most improvement of the three injuries. And I don't love this, like people pouncing on Darrys Garland and basically calling

him out. Like, dude, you haven't examined this injury. You don't know how bad it is. And to act like turf toe is not a serious thing, like people get surgery and get sideline for months for these injuries. The Pacers have played absolutely awesome basketball up and down their lineup. They have deserved to win these games. No, no, come on. Halliburton is, Halliburton is throwing. Brian, listen, listen. They scored like 12 points in the first quarter game two. And they had to have a completely miraculous comeback because Cavs Corner imploded. So it'll take a little star game one. Game one, they were great. Nemhart has been strong. knee Smith has been making plays all over the place.

I mean, Nemhart had 13 assists in game two. Halliburton hasn't scored a 37 point game. I'll give you that. But he's shooting percentages way up there. I thought they were phenomenal in game one. I just think they, you know, the Cavs really outplayed them

without three guys for the vast majority of that game and just implode it. Well, they didn't play great in the first half. I'll give you that, but they were pretty darn good. down the stretch the Pacers. They they were and the Pacers took it from them. They did. They did. They did. Yeah. Neesmith had a lot to do that. Halberton had a lot to do that. 100%. The people in Cleveland are furious because in the last two minute report, the officials admitted they missed lane violations

on the two rebounds that the Pacers got off of miss free throws in the last minute. Look, the lane violations were bad and they should have been called. However, here's an idea for the calves. Inbound the ball. Oh. How about don't give up 13 baskets in the paint in the fourth quarter? Well, that too, but just in the final minute of the game, just inbound the ball. I can't believe, I can't believe Kenny Ackinson won coach of the year and he hadn't thought of any of these things. Well, I know. Well, Kenny Ackinson just said they were too exhausted to inbound the ball. Well, and I will say to get open, not to inbound the ball, just to get open. In the stretch I was out, the Pacers had two of the three comebacks from down seven, 40 seconds ago with

the history of the sport, which is unbelievable. The stretch. The stretch you are out blink and we missed it. The way they play and as frenetically as they play, and frankly, when they score, they're immediately keeping the other team from it easily inbound in the ball. Like, it's a strategy that I think more teams should be trying to do if they can,

if they have the ability to bodies-wise, because like we've seen it work twice in the last 10 days. Like the Pacers really can get teams out of sorts by just making them have to work for every inch of the court after they've played a long game. And their guys are really tired. And, you know, it's, you know, obviously it's hard to put a lot of, you know, planning out of a crazy comeback like that. But the fact that they did both of them, I do think there's some truth to the way they play having an impact on how these teams are playing in the last few. seconds of games. Definitely a strategy meant to wear you down in each game and then in a series. A lot of discussion has been involved about how poorly the Celtics have shot in the first two

games. The Cavs have had their two worst three-point shooting games and back-to-back games. Now, they've got some shooters that are out, but basers get credit for that. But, you know, that's been shooting variance has been, you know, the Cavs have three key players injured, had their worst three point two three point shooting games and still we're ahead in the fourth quarter of both games. And so, is that is that your way of saying there's still hope in the land? Yes. I mean, you know, my belief there's always time.

I don't think there's a lot of excitement with the injury report. But obviously if the Cavs lose on Friday night, that series is going to be cooked. There's not a lot of time if Evan Mowgli can't play. They desperately need him because, and here's the other thing I would say, I'm curious what your take is as the leader of Cavs Corner, Brian. You're called following. Oh, followers. I do not understand why Kenny Akinson is playing Isaac O'Cicorro so many minutes.

The calves don't. Well, no, but listen, you laugh at me. He played 29 minutes in game one. He took two shots, right? Like, he's a nice on-ball defender, who's a complete zero on defense, and the other team doesn't guard him. You make a complete zero on offense, not a complete set of offense. I'm sorry, I said it backwards.

He's a complete zero on offense. And to me in this series, especially if Evan Mobley is not 100%, whether he plays or not, right? We've talked about it all year. Evan Mobley deserved to win defensive player of the year, had a great year. Jared Allen, great interior defender, right? Really good defensive big. The Cavs don't really have any. You could argue they don't have another average defender on the team.

They might have some average guys, but they've got, they're a pretty limited team, particularly on the perimeter. I don't, why do you say DeAndre Hunter is, is, is, is, is not, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to get into that. The point is. Hold on. Isaac Okoro is there other above average defender? All right. That's fine.

So you're asking, why is he playing so much? You can't, you can't do both. You can't say they need more defense and then wonder why he's playing. No, that's not what I'm saying. What I'm saying is they're not going to be able to stop the Pacers anyway. So to me, they should be fully indexing on offense. Sam Merrill, to me, is a adequate defensive player who can light it up from three. He's one of the few guys who hit shots in game one in game two.

Jackson, I need some research assistance. What's Sam Merrill's plus minus in the series? And what's Isaac Corros, please? Thank you. I mean, I don't really care what his plus minus is. He was on the court the entire fourth quarter as the game imploded. and they had most of the time they were running out of gas on offense. Like, I just don't think he should be playing.

He should not be a featured player in the series, is what I would say. He should be a bit player at best because the calves are going to have to win the series on offense. That's all fine. They're not losing this game. If they were not losing the series because of Isaac was. If they were to fit better in the fourth quarter on game, too, the series would be tied. Well, and he was out there the entire time. So maybe they should have scored some more baskets.

I don't know. And yes, they do have adequate defensive players. I misspoke before. But the point is they're not an overwhelming defensive team outside of their two bigs. And if one of the bigs is compromised, if not out, to me, you've got to be going all in on offense. Because the Pacers are going to score. They don't have the horses to slow down the Pacers. So play Sam Merrill even more than they did.

You got to get Ty Jerome going. Got to have Max Drews, keep shooting. Did Ty Jerome going. Don of a Mitchell. That's an understatement. I mean, that to me is what. the calves have to lean into. Hold on.

The thing just flashed at the bottom of my screen. What was that? What were those plus minuses? Can you read those? Sam Merrill. No, it's off his screen. He can't get it back. Sam,

he's on his cell phone. Sam Merrill was minus 10. Isaac O'Coro is plus four for the series. Oh, wow. It's almost like that's not the problem, which one of those guys is on the floor. It's almost like playing a coro is not the reason that they're losing the series

instead of playing Sam Merrill. But I could, I could be wrong and so could like facts and things. All right. The get up conference call is in five hours. Wendy, sleep update. 23 minutes. Greenberg expects attention on Friday's on that call.

I'm in trouble. Listen, skin's looking good. Hair's looking sharp. You got those big fat knots in the tie. You got a lot going on right now, Wendy. Yeah, I got a lot going on. all right. All right. Mr. Bon Temps, we're so happy to have you back. I don't if I believe that. We're so happy. I don't. I don't believe it. I don't. We're so happy to have Mr. Master Bon Temps,

which I believe you call someone who's underage, Master Bon Temps, the boy king, the boy king of the Upper West Side. Well, once again, we got a lot. I got a really a lot of nice notes from listeners and people around the league and everybody's been great over the past 10 days. So very much appreciate it. Some very nice. Everybody's doing great. Of the other west side, who only knows Nick's victories. Oh, no. We've got to get, not going to do some reporting.

Have you gotten sprayed yet? What? Oh, no. Have you gotten sprayed? No, no, no. Not a one, not a one or two? Not yet. Wait till you get sprayed with a curveball.

I ain't nothing like that. That's a right of passage for a parent. Yeah. Not yet. All right. Wait, wait. Wayley experiences the first blowout. That's right.

We have had some of those, sir. And I ain't talking about what happened in Oklahoma City. Not a thunder blowout, that's for sure. That's for sure. All right. Thank you to Jackson. Thank you to McMahon. Special thank you to Bon Temps and a special, special thank you to Young Bon Temps and to Kaye Bonnems.

Thank you for watching and listening to the Hoop Collective. We will talk to you next week. Will the Cavs and the Celtics still? be alive when we talk. We'll see. Well, like the Celtics will be for sure. If they're down 3-0, they're going to be dead. I'm going to declare them dead at the down 3-0. The teacher chain is empty. Adios me.