Broad Ideas with Rachel Bilson & Olivia Allen - Keeping Up with George Griffin

Episode Date: August 10, 2025

Rachel and Olivia are joined by longtime bestie George Griffin for a crash course on all the latest trends. George opens up about the highs and lows of social media, the impact of getting likes and fills us in on the hottest new lingo along the way. Watch this episode on YouTube!Like the show? Rate Broad Ideas 5-Stars on Apple Podcasts and SpotifyThis is a Headgum podcast. Follow Headgum on Twitter, Instagram, and Tiktok. Advertise on Hollywood Handbook via Gumball.fm If you're struggling with OCD or unrelenting intrusive thoughts, NOCD can help. Book a free 15 minute call to get started: https://learn.nocd.com/broadideasSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

This is a Headgum podcast. Hax is back for its fifth and final season, and so is The Hacks podcast. Join the Hacks creators and showrunners, Lucia and Yello, Paul W. Downs, and Jen Statsky as they unpack the Emmy-winning comedy series. On each episode, here's stories from the set, what goes on in the writer's room,

and how these beloved characters close out their final season. Watch Hax streaming exclusively on HBO Max and listen to The Hax podcast, on HBO Max or wherever you get your podcasts. Sometimes to swirl. We'll talk about dogs and kids and things. We'll talk about chicks and tampon strings. We'll talk about boys.

Because people die. Welcome to broad ideas. Hello. Other. Hi. Hi. I just want to say he's a little bit behind the curtain a lot of the time. And we talk about him a lot of the time. But Georgie Griffin himself is going to grace us with his presence today.

And let me tell you, it's a very good time. Oh, boy. Roll it. It's just us for. It's just Rachel, Olivia, me and Nikki, you know. I know. Nikki, what do you have to say? What was the inspiration?

Like, why is Nikki Minaj your background? I love Nikki. And I have the flag, like the actual literal flag in my back. R2 hanging up. It's just a hyperfixation for me right now. Yeah, the Nicki Minaj flag. Oh, love it. I love Nikki Minaj.

I'm eating cherries. I'm sorry if you hear me like smacking. Chomp on some people might like that. Some people might be me. Some people might pay to hear me. This is what I'm saying. Is it good? I'm really good.

You know what are really good? Hmm. Cherries. I love. Every time I eat them, I'm like, damn, these are good. I love a cherry. I love a summer fruit. You know what I mean?

Do you guys mess with? Do you guys mess with gooseberries at all? No. Are they the, they're like the really long ones? Or are they yellow ones? They're yellow. With the leaves. I don't think, I've never seen them with leaves, but I get about the farmer's market.

They just look like blueberries, but they're yellow and kind of sour and sweet. They're good. I've never tried. I don't think I've tried. I'm in my gooseberry era. Is it seedy, though? No. The gooseberry?

Mm-mm. It's good. It's just like a blueberry, but just yellow and a little more sour and sweet. You're like a blueberry just a little bit more yellow, sour and sweet. I am, and you know, bears eat blueberries. That's their favorite fruit. Let's talk about it. We have our favorite bear.

Here I am. Finally. Finally. Official debut. Official. Yes. George. Georgie.

Yes. I've known you since you were five years old. You have. When you walked into the living room dressed up as Danny Zuko for Halloween. Was that your first meet, that your meat cute? Yeah. Yep. That was the first time we met.

Summer loving, babe. That's epic. I'm screaming. He was five. years old. Mm-hmm. Oh my God. I didn't realize that was like the first encounter that we had, but that kind of like set

the tone for everything. Forever. And his older sister is our best friend, Leah, who we also talk about all the time. Yes. And she's been on this podcast before, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Pre-video era. We should have her back. We should have her back. Oh, it was just audio with her? Yeah. We should have her back. That's who I was texting with, actually, when we.

Oh, can I not? No, it still records. Okay, cool. Wait, I thought you were going to say the first time that you met me was when I was doing my Justin Timberlake impressions. But those came later. You were like 12 years old, George. You were five when I met you. That's a big sense.

I was like 11, but that was like three or four years later. George did the most epic Justin Timberlake impression. Would we call it an impression? Can we see it? I feel like you should bring it back. I think that that chapter is closed But I mean maybe one day In person it would probably like give more than on Zoom

I don't know I think the people it's what the people need right about now They might eat it They don't know that they need it But they might eat it I think if TikTok existed when we were First singing out George would have a sensation

A sensation You'd have a YouTube channel You'd have the whole thing I could still be a sensation on TikTok People tell me that all the time that I need to make more TikToks. But I just, I don't know. It's like, I can't recreate the magic.

It's like, has to happen in the moment. Walk us through your social media expertise, like your loves, your inspirations, what makes you tick, what makes you talk. I was going to say, you talk. Oh, seriously. I'm screaming. Well, I guess I should start with the fact that I work in social media. Yeah. Husband and I have a marketing agency where it's not exclusively social, but I do all the

social media and I do the celebrity social media outreach and overseeing all the branded content that goes out through our company McGriffin media. And yeah, I've been doing it for a long time. I started just kind of at the bottom of the barrel with just doing other people's social media for them. And my first client I met when I was like an assistant at KFPR. Did you know I remember I worked there for a little bit? Yeah.

I was just like and Carrie like Carrie who runs KFPR was just like oh my gosh. You know, you kind of have like a good swag. I'm going to put you in the front of the events because she would like throw these events. And I would like walk the big names through and I would always end up making friends with people like Jamie Fox like loved me and wanted to like buy my shoes I was wearing off of me. What were the shoes? They were like random like Kenneth Cole. Like they weren't really giving. But like at the time he.

was just like really feeling my shoes. This was like 10 years ago. So they were more like unique back then, this specific pair of shoes. Anyways, yes. So Carrie put me on game initially. Shout out Kerry Feinstein. And that's where I met my first client, Malora. And Malora Hardin from the office. And I just started doing her social and getting her deals. And then once I met my husband, we got married and we like merged our businesses together because he's the CEO or he was the CEO of a big advertising agency. and he left that job to start McGriffin Media with me. And now we're running this shit through our house. And it's crazy.

It's all day. This morning I was up at 6.30 a.m. with a New York housewife, helping her get a post up for one of our clients. She's actually not on housewives anymore, but she was a New York housewife, one of the OG icons. So that's always kind of been my dream

is to work with real housewives because I love Bravo. So now I'm doing a lot of activations with housewives. and I've worked with you guys a little bit and what makes me tick what makes me talk like my icks and like I don't really have like Oh yeah let's go for it. Yeah like I'm like I don't have like please

You almost have to like ask me that I can tell you like if I if I fuck with them or not My favorite is like the social media icks that come up Like new ick unlocked like a guy scuba diving But if you pan underwater and his legs are like Doggy paddling but I have never heard of that name but it's his legs. I've never heard of that ick.

Is that like as specific to you? Or is that just what I don't know. It's just the one that popped in my head. Is that your specific ick? Is that one that people hate? That's a crazy random one for people to hate. Here's something I love about George. Oh, it makes my heart so happy.

And he knows this. I love Rachel. We do this all the time. I love like ranking things. I love playing the game. of like who's you know who throws the vibe like that's when we love to play and we'll go through all the people and be like they're either a vibe enhancer or they throw the vibe and it doesn't matter what comes to mind if i call george at any given moment in the day and i just randomly am like

is someone to a vibe thrower and he'll be like yes and here's why and you're so ready to like You're so down. We need to be a hater. No, it's not even a hater. No, I don't know what it is. You're just down. You don't even have to say hello. You could literally just answer the phone and be like this.

Who's getting clean girl vibes? Clean girl vibes. Yes, I love that. We love our clean girlies. I feel like the people who know us are going to listen to this podcast and be like, wait, are they talking about me with the vibe throwing? Okay, for sure. Yes, we are.

We are talking about you. They live among us. Wait, what's a clean-girly vibe? Who's that? Like, someone famous, though, George. Someone famous that's a clean girl? So people can relate. Haley Bieber.

Haley Bieber's totally a clean girl. Okay. It's hard for me to, like, pick off the top of my head who's a clean girl. It's the girlies that wear their hair and the middle part bun tight. Like Sophia Richie Grange. She's kind of a clean girl, yeah. Clean girl. Okay.

Yeah. It's just that specific. It's like they have the hair tight. They have their iced coffee. They have their clean, you know, kind of nails. They have their trench coats and, you know, kind of like a cute bag in a moment. Yes. I fucking love Shay Mitchell.

She's so hot. She's a total clean girl. Okay. Okay. Okay. So my new ick that I don't like anymore that I used to fuck with is, do you guys remember when I was like on the Luboo train like really early? George, Lubuos are my life right now.

Okay. Oh, now you love her. I have a 10-year-old daughter. Oh, I like them for kids. I think they're really sweet for her. Actually, are they on the couch? I think she took them upstairs with her. I was going to make a cameo.

I got my niece. I got Evia Lububu for her birthday. Yeah, I think it's cute because it reminds me of like beanie babies when kids had those. Yeah. No, it's so fun. Yeah. Yeah, I don't like them for adults. Like, if someone has like a really nice bag and they have a luboo on it, that's kind of giving an ick for me. Not to be a hater because I know people enjoy them.

but I don't really fuck with them anymore. And I used to like that. No, we want you to be transparent and honest. Okay, fuck Lubin. We're just going to play all these games. Um, yeah, I mean, I'll play any of the games that you guys want when it comes to being shady. Wait, but like, a hundred percent. I love to be shady.

Really quick, though. I have to speak on the Laboo for a second because... Go off, Queen. Like, yes, my girl, like, she is obsessed, but like, I get addicted, you know? Because I'm like... Oh, you're trying to find the cute outfits and stuff like that. No, like, we got to get the blind box. like, which one are you going to get?

And then I'll literally be like, let's go back, let's get another box. Well, you know what they say. They say it's, yes, they say it's getting kids hooked on the dopamine receptor feedback loop early and the gambling thing because it's like one more box, one more, you know, whatever it is in gambling. I don't know how to do that. But I've heard that people, like can't get them. So, I mean, like you can, but you can't.

You know? What does that mean you can't get them? Elliot asked last night, he said he wanted one. I have a, I know the spot. I mean, you can get them. But there's a lot of fake. You have a source? Yeah.

I'm not going to drop it off a lot of. You guys, let me just tell you in London, like, because in London, there's tons of, like, souvenir shops and whatever. Lafoufos abound, okay? Yeah, a lot of them. There are so many lafoufos. It's so funny. We went down a rabbit hole, like, looking it up online.

Like, how do you tell? Like, we went, like, well, there's the little barcode that you have to scan. Well, yes, that, that can authenticate. Authentiscate. Authentiscate. Authenticate. Wait. Because, not to go off on a.

random tangent, but since we're talking Labibu's, it reminds me something else that's like in the lexicon right now. Which is? Or maybe it's a little old, which is Love Island. Rachel, did you watch Love Island or not this season? I wasn't on the Love Island train, but I did watch Temptation Island. I didn't, I didn't fuck with that one.

Oh, geez. What's wrong with you? Are you watching Bachelor in Paradise, by the way? So I just downloaded it for my airplane ride. Should I be? I don't know. I mean, not to, like, publicly shade it, but it's not really giving. See, I don't even.

know the cast anymore. It's three hours long an episode, which is like demonic. What? It's so long. Yeah. Three hours? I don't have enough bandwidth for that. Like, I'm looking at my phone for most of the episodes and then I'll look up with a minute. What about Lena Dunham's new show? Great. I heard it's cute.

I've downloaded that and then I downloaded some like true crime docu-series about a woman that like vanished. Yeah. I'm going to start that too, but too much, Lena Dunham's new show. Yeah. Yeah. Oh my God, she is such a good writer. She is.

I've heard it's really good. She is so gifted. Yeah. It's really good. I loved it. I took that one down real fast. Okay. Her book is good, too, because I know you're a reader, Rachel.

Not that kind of girl. Did you ever read that book? She wrote? No. Should I? Yeah, it's all short stories. It's really cute. I read it in like one night.

She's a really good writer. Okay. I do want you to reach out to her personally, Rachel. Okay. Yeah, I feel like she does make an O-C. reference in the show. Yeah, no, she really liked the OCR. I remember her talking about it. Someone's like crying and they're like

No, don't tell me. Oh, okay. I'm going to watch it. I feel like she probably would she should follow you if she doesn't already. Wait, did you guys notice how I made, um, I took Olivia's phone the other day and I made the broad ideas page follow me.

Oh my God. Did you? This is what George does, you guys. Okay. He will take our phones and just start following people or Like your post. No, following me from any posts that you haven't, from many pages that you haven't already followed me from. But you guys all follow me.

No, but you follow other people too because all of a sudden I'm like, who's this dude? And then I unfollowed him. I unfollowed him because I didn't know who he was. And you're like, that's so tragic. You need to follow him back again. Oh, that was my ex-boyfriend. Yeah. I know, but I didn't know it.

And I'm like, who's this like dude that I'm getting along this stories? You're like, weirded man. Wait, I'm screaming. Wait, did you notice that? I had you follow me from the broad ideas page? Not I. No, but I did notice because I went on to check something and I saw that one of your stories was coming up at the top.

And I was like, oh, I thought only stories of people you follow are up there. Wow. Now you're following me, baby. You're only following me. Struck again. I'm one of them. Well, Rachel doesn't let me get access to her phone. Hell no.

I'd be having hello Rachel Wilson. I would like hack your story and be like, follow George Griffin. I'm not afraid to admit that I do love the I love the likes. What can I say? Wait, I want to talk about that. The psychology of the likes and the psychology of the follows and all of that that goes into it because a lot of people aren't familiar with that. And a lot of people don't think of the same things you think of being that this is your world.

And there's something you get from it that's unique to you. And I want to hear all about the likes and follows. And I also don't know if it's unique to me. And I will say one thing. I actually decided today I'm going to stop using Twitter because I just can't control myself on Twitter. I'm literally like I've never been on Twitter. I don't know. Yeah, Rachel Wilson's never had a Twitter, never had like a verified Twitter's profile.

I've never tweeted. It's probably for the better. Don't join now. I'm not getting off for any sort of like crazy political reason. I just, okay, so there's a whole underworld of like gay Twitter, which is it's basically horny. Twitter, but it's mixed with like sassy Twitter. So it's like, if you go to like a gays Twitter feed, there's a lot of like thirst traps and then like shady little quips, like in line at blah blah blah blah.

And this, you know, girl walked by me and she looks a mess, whatever. And then it'll be like a horny picture. And then so that's like their feed. So I got swept up into gay Twitter where I was like posting shady things and they were getting a lot of likes. And then I would post like a horny picture, you know, not my whole or poll or anything like that but like shirtless and i started really craving the dopamine of it and i would like wake up in the morning i'd be like what can i post today to like get that rush and get that like validation

more so on there than i do on ig because ig is more work focused and it's more you know professional in that sense and with twitter it's like what shirtless picture can i can i post today to get validation and a lot of gays have been caught up in that trend so i woke up today and i decided I'm going to pull back from there. And it's been how long have I been awake? Five hours, six hours. And I actually do feel a little better. So I'm going to put it here to book market that I'm taking a break from gay Twitter.

So if anyone's listening to this, I'm not on that. I'm not on that platform right now. But you can't follow my Instagram because I will always be posting that. I always be posting there. What's your Starbucks drink you got there? Ice coffee with three steveas and whole milk. I do real milk. But stevia?

Yeah, why does everybody hate stevia? Because it tastes like fake sugar. Olivia is probably down because she loves Diet Coke. Anything diet or tastes like fake sugar, I want to vomit. And you know what's so weird to hear, you guys? Anytime you get like a 7-Up or a Sprite or whatever and you say regular, it's automatically fake sugar. Okay? I don't know what.

It's like a phenomenon. And please correct me if I'm wrong, anyone who lives in London or England. Like, I don't know what's happened. We went to fish and chips and I was like, we need a god. a regular sprite for a briar and he brought it into sprite zero and i was like no like no we don't drink that you know he's like no no it's better and he was like trying to like sell me on it and i got into a little bit of a back and forth like we just don't anyway today we were at a restaurant seven up the can doesn't say diet doesn't say anything and i taste it and i'm like and i look at the ingredients and

stevia anyway just a little note i don't know what's going on maybe it's interesting yeah well That's like if you have those like whole food sodas. I mean, I think they all have like stevia in them too. I can taste it instantly. I don't mind it in my coffee, but I know what you mean. So you don't like those, you don't like those poppy drinks or those olipops or anything like that? Anything that has fake sugar, I'm not down. So you like a hardcore cane sugar experience?

I like hardcore cane sugar. Are you a high fructose corn syrup girly? I mean, I definitely have it. So you drink regular cook? Cola. Well, no. Like, I don't, I definitely prefer a Mexican Coke, you know, the glass bottle, real sugar is my- They're going to start making regular-cule.

Did Trump say something? Like, he's putting cane sugar in Coca-Cola? Apparently, RFK is going to be in charge of making sure that cane sugar goes in Coca-Cola. Okay. I mean, if that's true. Slay, I guess. Put the real sugar in Coke. You know how much a Coke?

I saw this on the news yesterday when I was at the barbershop. You know how much the equivalency of, like, drinking a regular Coke is, like, eating two and a half Hershey bars. What? That much sugar? Do you rather eat a Hershey bar? I'd rather eat. But imagine eating two Hershey bars. You would feel sick.

Yeah, you would feel sick. I'm not a big, like, I'm not a big consumer of Coca-Cola, but, like, you know when you're just in the mood for one? Mm-hmm. I have a Coke. George and I don't make it. I like diet. I know, I'm a diet Coke. Disgusting.

Kevin, if you're listening. Someone brought a good point up the other day because we were at a party and they ran out a Diet Coke. Okay. Good. And we both know we shouldn't be drinking. On Sunday, right?

Yeah. We're not blind to the fact, but it's our party drink. And so I ran out of Diet Coke. And I was like, George, do I have a regular? And he's like, I guess. Like, if there's nothing left. No, I didn't want you to. I know. No, you didn't want me to.

And then someone else was like, I hate the way it makes my teeth feel. That guy. And I was like, that's it. That's exactly what it is. Regular Coke makes your teeth feel like weird and coated and chalky. Can remember that other guy that was there at that party, though, the really handsome guy? Very handsome guy. He followed me on Instagram.

Oh, great. I think we should set Rachel up with him. Thank God. So excited. I know. It's bad. And I didn't really answer the second. psychology rant.

No, you did it. I started going on a horny Twitter rant, but... No, you can talk about the horniness. Talk about all of it because what it actually... It unlocked something way deeper and way more interesting than just merely getting a like or a follow. It's a dopamine feedback loop. That's what all those companies know that they're doing, too. They know that they're tapping into that neurosystem.

I mean, I've talked about this in therapy. This is something that, you know, as part of my... mental health stuff is like, you know, I don't even care all out myself. Like if I posted an IG post that does really well, I will be really happy for the rest of the day. If I post an Instagram post, like, I had a post that went up a couple days ago and I was so excited. I was like, this is going to eat. Like the numbers are going to be crazy on this. It was like a full on photo shoot I did with this guy.

Tanked in the algorithm. Like it didn't perform while I had to turn the likes off because it triggers something in me. And it's like, here's the thing about that. This is the T is like, I'm 35 years old, right? So imagine if you were like 13, 12, like it would be way more diabolical. Like, I don't really don't think kids should have Instagram until they're at least like 18. Because if I'm tweaking out about the numbers like that, I mean, I'm also a rare breed. Some people probably don't care as much as I do.

But if like, I don't know, like, I don't really want my nieces and nephews to be. Well, my nephew already is part of that. But I wouldn't want them being like plugged into that kind of. of needing validation. It's not good. I mean, back of the day, when I was growing up with social media, I didn't have the, it wasn't like oriented. It was more just like, because I love photography and I love sharing pictures.

And that's why I do love what I do, because I love aesthetic. And you guys can vouch for that. It's like all my girlies, all my besties, all my friends, they all hit me up. Like, is this a good picture to post? Like, you guys love to ask me to do that. And I love to do that. I love giving the feedback and editing the colors or whatever of the photo. But like, when I.

came up it was my space right and that was just sharing pictures that wasn't like like focused although there was the top eight drama i don't know if rachel you were a part of yeah rachel you didn't have top eight top eight oh top i never had my space i've never had like a facebook you guys didn't you have like a loki my space that was just like a no pseudonym no okay i don't think you did i didn't that was drama if you got off of someone's if you weren't number one's if you weren't number one in their spot. That was the Genesis, Olivia. That's where it all started.

It was top eight. I haven't thought about top eight in a minute. But top eight was crazy. Have you guys talked about top eight ever on this show before? This is kind of iconic that I get to be the one to like bring that back into the zeitgeist. Top eight on MySpace was where all the fucking drama started. Yeah. I mean, I think you were obviously always in my top eight, Olivia.

Leah was always in my top eight. And then if I had like a beef with a friend, then they would go lower. Like it would be the number one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight. Sometimes people would come out of it. Sometimes they would go back in. It's so petty looking back. So petty, but also MySpace was the first kind of taste of being able to stalk people in that way. Yeah.

And like what songs they were choosing. And the songs. Communicate through your MySpace. Like if you wanted the girl or the guy to know you were out and wanted them, you know, you could do that. And that was when it started. And then Facebook albums. Remember those? Oh, yeah.

Yeah. Rachel missed all this social media. I want to talk about the validation though, George. The validation of what? Social media. And like what? Okay. So no.

Because I think that it's kind of like whack-a-mo. Right? And so you started young. You were a musician. You were an act. you've always been kind of up front and out there. So let's say we took away social media. Do you think I have a big personality?

Yes. Okay. Someone said the other day, oh, you have a big personality. And I was like, oh, okay. Did you take that at, like, as a negative or positive? I'm screaming. Did you say that? Did you say that?

No, I think Olivia. I had big balls. It felt like a Rachel line. It felt like a Rachel line, but she. Yeah. I'm screaming. No. So let's say you take away social media.

Okay. The world tomorrow, you wake up, there's no social media. Yeah. Actually, it'd probably be me. It'd be bad for my job, but... But let's say that happened. But what inside of you needs that validation and where else do you get it if it's not from that? Like, are there healthy ways to get that validation?

Lexa Pro. What is that speaking to? Lexapro. Lexa Pro, Diet Coke, Shopping, Starbucks. No, just getting it. But not kidding. But you're not kidding. But I'm not.

Because people are going to listen to this and be like, this is the most vapid guest you've ever had. But this is just who I am. It's fine. If social media went away tomorrow, look, I wouldn't have a job, so I'd be bummed about that. But I do think I like that Instagram did give you the option to turn off the

like so you can do just like this many people and others. I think that's healthy. That's like a healthy step. I know people also do that thing where they limit the amount of time they can spend on Instagram, like a prompt will come up on your phone and be like, you've reached your two-hour quota of Instagram for the day. I think it's a necessary evil in a lot of ways for companies now to market things. So, I mean, it would just, the infrastructure of capitalism might crumble if we took away

social media. But I think the validation for me probably started, I mean, to be real with, like, you know, everything. I think being gay, you know, that was a way for me to connect with other gay people. people on the internet. So it was in a positive way. I mean, also not so positive sometimes, like, you know, talking to older guys and stuff like that.

But in a way to, like, connect with other people. And that's where I found out with all the bear stuff, man. Like, I didn't know, like, you guys probably don't remember Tumblr, but I posted a picture on Tumblr of me just holding a kitty. And it went viral, but I, because it wasn't wearing a shirt. And I got all these followers. And I was like, oh, listen, people like the way I look guys with hairy chess and not, you know, and dad bonds and stuff like that.

And I found this whole community of like bears or whatever. And that's where I learned about that. And it kind of helped with like body acceptance, to be honest. So I think maybe the validation could have started with that kind of thing. And also, I mean, I think it has pluses and I think it has minuses like anything. You know what I mean? It's not one way or another. But I think my validation personally, Georgia, started with getting attention from guys online and like realizing that that was something that I liked.

You know what I mean? Because it was kind of obtuse before that. I didn't really know how to navigate that. I didn't know where to go. I mean, I was too young to go to bars. You know what I mean? So I couldn't really do that. So I'd have to kind of go on the internet and look for guys to talk to and guys that I liked to talk to as well, even just for friends, but then also just that I was attracted to.

So I think the validation starts for there. And I think gay people have a very different experience with the internet than maybe straight people do. Because I think we live, I think a lot of people live their life on the internet. internet, but all the gays that I know and I follow, which is thousands, and the community that I've built, because I have a decent following, they, like, their life is the internet. So that's why the horny Twitter, all that, like, it's part of the zeit guys. It's part of the conversations. It's part of the gay canon.

So it is, you know, it's a different experience that a mom might have who checks her Instagram a couple times a day than a gay person who's, like, gay men at least. It's like, we're always on social media. We're always, you know, it's, in a way, it's true, though, because you guys will always asked me like what's the latest thing that's happening on Instagram and stuff like that and it's like I'm kind of tapped into it for work and from the community that I am a part of

if that makes sense. Well that was kind of an iconic answer I felt like I really like went off with that. Like did I snap? Like what's going on? Oh my god. That was a spill. You're always like all up on the like lingo like the

whatever you. That's another gay Twitter. That's another gay vernacular. And then it's like kids in Breyer's grade have older siblings that'll be like, oh, you ate that, you know? Like you just learn. Or like my little sisters or like whatever,

you know. But you always have your finger on the pulse. Or Elliot. Yeah. What is Elliot saying? Like, what is his lingo? What is his slang? LeBron James.

What's that? That's new all day long. That's not my world. They do that all day long. they do no cap No cap is big What's that? Can you explain no cap?

Cap is lying Yeah so like no cap like Is not mine A lot of them A lot of them say period Yeah He doesn't He says a lot of the like

The boy like kind of the more like Yeah Like all the You know brain rot stuff Do you guys? Brain rot is one. Brain rot is one. Do you guys know what?

Oh my, this is like another crazy thing to bring up on this podcast. Speaking of, do you guys know what gooning is? No. Oh, tell us all the things that, yes, George, there's so many things you can tell us and educate us on right now. We need gooning. Oh, God. Educating you at gooting is like not what I want to be known for, but I will. What is it?

Well. It's something like nasty sexual. Yeah. Are we allowed to talk about that kind of stuff on here? You're allowed to talk about anything you want. Sleigh. Okay, so let's talk about gooning. So that, I thought, was only something that adults knew about.

But apparently it's, like, seeped its way into the younger generation. What is it? I'm going to tell you. So, gooning is when you, like, masturbate for such a long period of time. Like, we're talking hours and hours and hours that you start gooning out and, and, like, making weird faces. It's like, and it sounds so random, but like, kids are talking about it. Now, my nephew was like, do you know who gooning is? And I was like, the fuck, I do you know what that is? Like, it's a thing. It's a trend. So it's like there's gooners?

Wait, but is it gooning because of like sloth from goony? It's like making a face. Oh, I don't know. That could be the genesis of it. I don't know where it came from. I'm just asking questions. No, ask. I mean, I... It's exactly where my brain went too. That's where you're, yeah, our 80s brains. The 80s brain. So there's gooners. which are a male. And then apparently I learned this, that there's goonets. So that's the girl gooners who are masturbating for so long, you know, that they're starting.

Who isn't doing that for hours? Kids, maybe. I don't know. Okay. I was like, I'm trying to think of, like, us. That sounds exhausting. It's not something I'd ever practice, the gooting and the gunnets. I mean.

All right. What else? Yeah, what else? Oh, my God. There's so much. I mean, even in, like, my world, you know how there's bears. There's cubs. There's otters.

Do you know what cubs are? Break down what each one is. Go. Okay, Slay. This is what you came for. So bears are, you know, there's daddy bears, which is what my husband Daryl is. He's older, gray beard, you know, beefy guy. And then there's me, which is, I guess you would call a traditional bear, which is bigger but not, you know, super big.

Those are chubs. That's a thing, too. Chubs, which sounds for jordid, but I don't think it is because a lot of people would describe themselves as. chums. There's bears, which is hairy chest. You have to be covered in hair. And usually a little belly or a big belly. There's muscle bears, which are big jacked guys. And they usually wear like a chain with a lock on it because a lot of the muscle bears are also pups. And they're owned by an alpha. This is crazy. It's a whole thing. So yeah, muscle bears usually have owners. But we need what each one is like what's a

like an example of a famous one like a pup is like a young one they don't have to be young but yeah most of the time they are because they're looking for like a father figure type situation got it and they're yeah pups there's pups and then there's masters

so you guys just it's so weird because this is like my daily shit like I scroll and see so much of this but you guys just never see this which is kind of amazing like bridging the culture together can you be a master if you you're in a different category or is this just in the bear world?

No, you could be, because there's pups and there's muscle pups, muscle cubs, and then there's just pups, which is like your average body person and they wear a pup mask. And they have a lock, and some of them go extreme where

they like live in a literal, like sleep in a cage. Oh, like really? Full blown, like role play, cosplay. And I want to be. careful about the pup community because they're very um they take it really seriously so i don't want to yeah of course no we're not we're just learning okay no i mean even on my own because yeah for sure

love being pups um so they they get you know they like go in their crate at night i think some do that's extreme i don't know that many that do that that's more rare but you know what it is is they'll wear it out to the bars so you'll go to a gay bar and you'll see you know the bears over here the daddy's over here the twinks over here. Those are also... What's a twink? You know what a twink is. A twink is like...

Like a... Like a... Like a... Zach Ephron? Yeah, he's more of like a muscle... He's a twunk now. Okay. So that's like a twink...

Take a famous person from each category so we can get a visual. Have an example. So Bieber, when he, like, had the more side-swept hair, was a twink. Do you know who Troy Savon is by any chance? No. He's a twink. Timothy Shalame, the most famous twink of all.

Okay. Skinny, hairless, beautiful face. Got it. Twink. Twink. That's a very popular. That's a very popular one. Yeah.

So, the four main appetizers that you're really going to find are cubs, bears, daddies, and twinks. And then underneath those, there's branches that come out from that. But if you're going to sign up for an app and you're looking for something, those are like the keywords, the buzzwords that are going to come up. But also, they have different apps for different subcultures. So there's Scruff and Growler. Do you guys don't know what Scruff is, right? Scruff is a dating app. It's like Tinder, but for hairy, jacked, beefier guys.

Like people always say I would do well on Scruff. I've never been on it. So there's Scruff. And then there's Grindr, which I know you guys know. Yes. That's like the more ubiquitous one. That one comes up in conversation. a lot. And that's where

twinks run Grindr, basically. That's the most popular one for twinks. And then there's growler, there's Daddy Hunt, there's whatever you want, there's an app for it, which is crazy. What would Johnny Woojack

fall under? He's a twunk. Like, he's a muscular guy who used to be a twink, but has grown up. He's also, I think he might call himself a daddy too. It's like a daddy twunk. Anyone who's over 40 or 45 is usually a daddy. Yeah.

George Clooney is a daddy. Russell Crow is a daddy. Russell Crow is actually kind of a daddy bear now. I don't know if you've seen pictures of him lately, but he's really big and belly. He's a big belly now. You know, my king, my number one of all time. I know. Who is it?

James Gandalfini. Number one. Rachel, did you see my James Gandalfini tattoo? No. I don't know if Nikki's going to cover it, but here he is. Oh, my God. Yeah. So that's my number one.

He was like a daddy bear. We hear this term all the time, like, oh, he's giving daddy. Is that just an age thing? Or is it like, would my, would Jeff be a daddy? Jeff is a daddy. He's a daddy. Yeah. What makes them a zaddy?

Yeah, what makes them a daddy? So Leah always says zes. Daddy. Daddy can be like a state of mind. But I think Zaddy is like a super sexy daddy. Like a Zaddy. Like a Patrick Dempsey or somebody like that. Like Brad Pitt. Brad Pitt. Yeah. Ultimate Zaddy. And then there's daddies that can be like sort of dorkier and they're just cute because they're older and they're daddies. But Jeff, Olivia's man is 100% daddy. That's why I told you the other day when we were at that pool party, Olivia. And I was like, There's all sorts of hot guys here. To me, Jeff is the most attractive one.

But I also like that. I love that. Look at her. She's so proud. I like it. Well, he's very handsome with his silver hair. Yes. Silver Fox.

Is that a thing, too? Yeah, but Jeff's not a silver fox yet. Silver Fox is like, I think, like, 65. You know what I mean? Oh. Yeah. Like an older gentleman. What's a, if we flash back, right, and we go, let's use the OC characters.

Peter Gallagher was like a daddy. Okay. I'm dead using the O.C. characters. Adam Brody was... Then or now? Wait, Adam Brody now? Let's do Adam Brody then and now. Then he was a twink.

Skinny, beautiful face, hairless. He had like a few chest hairs from what I remember. Twink then. Benjamin McKenzie. Twunk, right? Because he was more muscular. Yeah. So Twink is just...

Twunk is just twink, but more muscular. Okay. There's not that many guys on that show. Tate... What's his name? Tate. Donovan. Tate Donovan.

Daddy. He was almost just like a daddy or a guy next door. Yeah. Is guy next door? Yeah. I don't know if that's like a gay. That's just one that I would say. Oh, that's just...

Yeah. He's just an average... Like, wait, is that another one? No, I don't think, I mean, shit, that could be something that someone's looking for. But I don't know if Tate Donovan. I keep wanting to say Tate McRae. I don't know if Tate Donovan. Yeah, me too, you do?

Love. I'm obsessed with her. Me too. I'm going to see her in October. I want to go. I know. You should come. Wait, why are you laughing?

Like, it's so tragic you're not going. I know. He's like I don't want to. You can't come with me, but you should go. You totally can. I think she's hot, too. She's so hot. I don't know who you're talking about.

Rachel. What? Tate McCray. Guys, I'm a loser. You're not a loser. Do you mess with the new Justin? Do you mess with the new Justin Bieber album? I haven't listened to it yet, but I saw that it came out.

At least I know that. Yeah, I love it. People like it, right? Obsessed. It got me. At first, I was like, is it going to catch me? Like, I'm not sure. And I called George.

And I was like, fuck. Like, is it? Is it? You know? And he was like, it's like, I'm not yet feeling it. Now it's completely owning my life. It's so good. I love it so much.

Daisy's the best. Daisy's insane. He snapped. It's insane. Period. Rachel, you need to listen to it. I know. Yeah, I will.

I mean, some... Do you have the same categories for women? I think some. A cougar. Right? Well, that's in the straight world. I mean, so yeah. Oh, in the lesbian world?

Yeah. I don't know. I don't know the lesbian world. Okay. Mm-mm. I don't know that many lesbians, really. I would like to know more, but I don't know that many. But in the straight woman world, I think there's milf, cougar.

Mm-hmm. And there are more? I don't think it's as like labeled as intensely. Instead of a twink, it's a twat. It's giving twat. not the twilight wait this is so random and an insane change of topic but it's been percolating in my mind since you brought it up earlier i don't know if it was recording rachel why is it called tk max oh oh i don't know but it is the same thing elizzi she came to life you guys uh i'm missing

the clearance day at t j max i don't want to talk about it um with t k or t j it's t k here it's tk here it's TK Max. In the States, it's T.J. Max. Same company. Same stuff. Like, hands down, need our new suitcase. March my ass to TK. Max. Why didn't you march your ass to Marshalls?

Is that not there? No, it's not that I know of. All I know is my TK. But you would march your ass to marshals in a way. Of course. Well, no. Not about T.J. I am so diehard T.J.

You're a Maxinista. Oh, yeah. Absolutely. Wow. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. No.

I love T.J. Max. Now, do you fuck with Burlington Cote Factory? That. You are like speaking my dreams and aspirations. Yeah. I love, it's kind of jump. I love those random ass stores. Me too.

It's my favorite. Me too. I went to the- You have to have a lot of patience. I have. Well, you have to know specifically what you want. That's why I can go to thrift stores and like just sift through everything. Yeah.

You've always been the OG thrift store queen, Rachel. You used to take me to like American Way. Remember that place? Mm-hmm. It's still there. It's still there. And all those like discounted dope, like vintage stores. But yeah, you have to, Olivia, to your point, you have to know what you want if you're going to one of those like crazy Marshall's Burlington Coat Factory situation stores.

Like I went to Burlington Coat Factory last week. And I also went to nothing bun cake, which is across the street. It was good. Yeah. The little bunlets. Yes. I guess what I got. They're the little ones.

I got a lemon, I got a lemon raspberry one. Yeah. I went to get the Nikki Minaj perfume at Burlington Coat Factory, which was $19. What's this new obsession? New? I've always loved Nikki Minaj. I know, but I've always loved Nikki Minaj myself. Yeah, you love Nikki Minaj.

I saw her in concert. I saw her in concert in December. It was amazing. It's not new. It's a hyperfixation that's in rotation right now. It'll come back around when someone else. It switches, yeah. Yeah, it always switches.

It's part of my OCD brain as, you know, hyperfixations. How do we get you on the real housewives? I'm not a wife. I would love to be on the real housewives. I think it's trying to flip it. I should be on the vow. Yeah. You should be on all the house.

No, Rachel doesn't watch the valet. Does Olivia? No. No. It's crazy. But I think you should be on it, and I think you should be on one of those Bravo shows. I think it's your true calling. What do we do?

Like a petition? No. I would love to be on any sort of Bravo show. I'd love to be on any show. You should do it. Oh, fun. Right? Doesn't that sound fun?

Yeah. I think that's attainable. Yeah. You could totally do it. I want to be on a, I would love to be on a reality show of some kind. But I'd also be scared, too, because I know some housewives who have done it and they become friends of mine. And then afterwards, they have just, they feel it's, it can be traumatizing being on the TV. As much as I love watching it, I don't know if I'd want to be on it.

I think I've been asked to do the real house or the Beverly Hills one or something. Well, you know, Rachel Zoe is. Yeah, I saw. Yeah. I saw that she's. And Jennifer Tilly is on it now. Did you know that? No.

Who I love and I have become friends with and we text. And I'll ask her questions about the show. I'm like, how's it going? You love your housewives. I do. I love them. It's also part of the gay, you know, experience as a house. A lot of us love housewives.

That's like their made audience is like gays and like casserole moms, like women who live. You say casserole moms? Yeah, which you are. Yeah, no, I feel like you just gave me a title. Rachel, you're really giving cassero mom. I give like, you love Marshall. I do. I do.

I love a casserole. I'm also like, I'm also a born. to be like tradwife too. You're, yeah, you're total trad wife. 100%. Is Olivia a trad wife? Um, no. You have trad wife tendencies.

But she will, she will do the things, but she, not like flat out just like, yeah. So what constitutes, because I've given you all my gay spiel, what constitutes a trad wife? Like, this is interesting to your listeners. What's a trad wife? That's more of what you guys would know. Is that someone who just is home baking dinner or? So now they're saying. And I watched this thing last night that was saying the trad wife, being a trad wife, is the new flex.

Oh, really? Yeah, because, well, the truth of the matter is, I want to say it was like, I'm going to botch this, but it was like 70% of America has to have two incomes. And so in order to be a trad wife, that means a traditional wife, you're living on one salary. And so in order to be able to do that, that person has to be a high enough earner for you not to have to work. To be a trad wife is actually a privilege. Yeah. Yeah.

It's a privilege in the sense of you don't have to go out and get a job. They don't need your income. Blabity, blah. So also, trad wife is very much cooks the meals, does the shopping, does the stuff with the kids. isn't outsourcing. And that's where Rachel and I vary a bit. And what sense? I don't outsource.

I outsource. What does that even mean? Like, you don't go to the market? I just started to, but I'll have to like, yeah. Wait, what were you doing before going to the market? Like, she'll, like, pay to have, like, a nanny or, like, someone help around the house or, like, whatever. So she doesn't have to do absolutely everything herself. Not that she can.

And I also work. But that's still trad wife. Yeah, no, I know. You both work. But what is a trad wife not, is a traditional, a traditional trad wife not have a nanny or a babysitter to go to the market for them? I think a real true trad wife is doing all of that themselves. But so the most famous ones are like, there's the model that's like married to the other model. And she has like three or four kids, I want to say.

And she does like the, the ASMR like cooking videos. Yeah. You know what I'm talking about? She's beautiful. Gorgeous. But do you think she doesn't have help? I'm sure at this point because that is like a highly ran machine. I would imagine that it's her business.

It's her business. But I think that where the term came from, it's the same with trad dads. It's like trad dads are the guys that earn, you know, the paycheck for the family. Bring home the bacon. That's right. So I think the true form of it. would be no help. But I think it's evolved.

Why do I think of the Mormon girls from that show? You know the Mormon wives or whatever? Oh, should I download that? Is that a good show? I heard that's really good. Oh, you should also, apparently building the band is really good, too, Rachel. Oh, okay. A lot of people talking about that.

Wait, when you guys start talking about groceries, another thing that Rachel and I, because I love a market. Love a market. I'm so particular about my market. And I know you are. And I don't want to, you know, take up too much time because this is a conversation that could last for a long time. But I do want to ask Rachel, are you a Gelson's girl? Are you an Airwag girl?

Are you a whole food's girl? You're not doing Ralph's, but sometimes. No, I will absolutely fuck with Ralph's. But here's the thing. I'm particular about which Ralphs. Like, if I don't like the market or how it's laid out, I won't go. I still relate to that. But there's, like, my Ralphs that I really love, like, I will go.

or my trade of Joe's that I love, I will go. But if I don't like it, I don't like to go to it. It has nothing to do with which store it is. It's simply just like I enter it and I just know. Yeah, I know. It's a vibe. It's a visceral feeling. I started grocery shopping again because I like the sprouts we have now.

The sprouts on Ventura? I love the way it feels. I crashed out at that sprouts last week, but I do normally like, I do like sprouts in general. I like, but that's- I love it. You know what I like my favorite market? It's not Airwant. People always send me Airworn memes and buy me Airworn merch. Because I like Erwad, but I kind of troll it.

You know what my most, my best market? Gelson's. I'm a Gelsons. Let me just tell you, I'm just going to say this, and I know we have to wrap up. I love Gelsons, but it is so expensive. I know. You can only go there for specific things. Like if you go there for specific things.

Specific things. But don't do your regular shop. No. I'm not a monster. I'm a traitor Joe's. For regular shop, but not for produce. Their produce isn't always great. I get their produce.

I know, but I still. I can do a farmer's market lately for my eggs and my gooseberries. Yeah. That's great. I'll just go to Gelson sometimes. You take three shops a week for me. Well, that's the thing. You can't get everything at Trader Joe's.

It's like you can't, you know, so it's hard. You can't. You need a toilet. paper paper towels well they have those but they don't have like is that a Costco bag you know what I mean are you a Costco girl richard I'm not I used to me but I'm gonna enter but you're what I I'm gonna go back into it right Olivia I feel like you and I could have a good crash out at Costco sometime get an ice coffee and just go to Costco and just spiral blackout I want to do that so bad I'm gonna go to Gelson's after this and just clear my head and reflect

on what I said like what crazy shit I said on this podcast if you miss it I like they like They're tuna salad. Come back and go to Gelsons. Their tuna salad gives. Yeah. It really does. So does their food. I actually love.

Triton Joe's is good. Triton Joe's is amazing. And affordable, which we love. Ralb's chicken salad on Hawaiian rolls, you guys. I found gluten-free Hawaiian rolls. What? Guys, this is wonderful. This is a beautiful conversation.

Take out the stuff I said about the horny Twitter. Or leave it. People might find that interesting. This is the important stuff. I honestly, I didn't say anything about my t-shirt. I love your t-shirt. Great. There's nothing better than a perfect white tea.

Wait, do they make it for guys? I don't know. You guys want to know something crazy before we wrap up? I love Target, too. And lately I've been buying women's stuff at Target. Why not? Great. I've been buying the little sleep shorts, and I just wear them out.

And people are like, are you wearing boxers? And I'm like, they're called boyfriend boxers. I wear them all the time now. Cute. I don't care. Love it. I love it I really like it

and see this is the thing about George is you just can't get enough yeah we could just keep talking but we have no we have to wrap up Rachel's like bye I gotta go TK Max honestly I did almost buy a sweater from the little boy section at TK Max

do they have the fancy stuff I mean it was 1416 what do they have the fancy stuff because remember you got like a bag at well that you have to have the runway section at TJ Max if oh okay they don't have that end not every single one has the runway section.

Whoa. Yeah. I've never, I need to go to Gelfins and T.J. Max after this. Really like center myself. That sounds wonderful. Yeah. Well, when you come back, we can do that if you ever come back.

Sounds great. Sounds great. I know. We have, we have another recording in one minute. That's why we're. Okay, we got to go. Love you so much.

Love you. Bye. Bye. That was a hate gum podcast.