Bros & Shows - Karen Did Not Need to Be There (RHOP Reunion pt. 3 Full Recap)

Episode Date: March 5, 2026

What's up Bros? We wrapped up the RHOP reunion and a few things are clear. One, Karen did not need to be there. Two, she seems less accountable now than she did with Andy if thats possible. Three, Wendy and Eddie's case does not look great... The overall demeanor of Wendy did not give us a lot of confidence that they're going to beat this thing in court. But we are Team Weddie 4 Lyfe and we hope that theyre exonerated. For some reason Karen has put herself on a pedestal coming into this reunion and it is honestly baffling. We're not sure what next season is going to look like but it certainly will be interesting. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I'm going to get this one out of the way real quick. Karen didn't need to be here. Yeah, I don't know. I think I was looking forward to it, so in that sense, she needed to be there. But after watching her, she didn't really need to be there. No, Karen didn't need to be there. Well, that's okay. As there's a drive in a deep left field by Castellanos.

Oh, man, it's 8 o'clock. And so that'll make it a... I don't need the spotlight. I shine just fine. Hi, I'm karma. And yes, I am a bitch. Brov Bros. Good evening, everybody.

Welcome back to another episode of Brov Bros. Your favorite podcast from the Bros. For everybody, for whoever wants to listen, I'm your co-host. Steele Russell, joined as always by the one and only Shooter Mick Reunion. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Tying a bow on this bad boy.

Three-part reunions are our favorite. I will say this. because of the setup of this episode, it actually, I was captivated the whole time. Like, it did catch my attention. It's just what was transpiring on screen was not my favorite.

Yeah, no, it definitely wasn't my favorite. It was one of those situations where they stretched out, like if I'm thinking back correctly on episodes one and two, they definitely stretched out things that didn't need to be stretched out. Obviously, we had to revisit and finish off the story about Wendy and Eddie.

We had Karen coming out. We had to tie up. at Bo on Monique's segment. So the episode in general was useful. I could say it that way. But you can obviously point to a lot of things along the first two episodes that just don't make a whole lot of sense. And we know how that goes.

It's just, you know, one of the grapes that we always have with these three-part reunions. But I agree with you when we talked about it in the cold intro. Karen did not need to be there. Absolutely not. Did nothing for me other than make me like her even less. I'll talk about that when we get there. But this first part is super interesting. Yeah.

Mainly because we don't have to talk about it. Well, we do actually have to talk about it because Monique has walked it back. That's what I mean. So all of this is for not. It really is. Yeah. It's for not because we don't even know what they were showing. And she did say, and I'll read what she said for those of you that didn't see it.

But she did show something on her phone and it seemed to be some sort of voice memo or video or whatever it was from some unnamed individual talking about Stacey potentially. saying something that implicated her kids and what was going on with her and Chris. So I don't know what was done. She'll probably go into it later, but I'll just read what her statement was this week when she posted it. She said a lot of time has passed since the reunion was filmed, and after gaining more info since then, I don't believe Stacey had anything to do with any of that bullshit. I'll probably go live on IG at some point this week and give y'all the entire story. I haven't watched the reunion episodes yet, so let me catch up and get back to you,

but I at least wanted to clear her name on all of it. This, to me, by the way, is whatever she had wasn't that damning. And she also may have realized at some point maybe she didn't know at the time. Stacey has more fans than everybody else on the show, right? Oh, yeah. So if you're going to try to go, which I imagine Monique is trying to get back for another season, maybe go for an actual champagne flute next year, which I'm completely fine with, because she was actually pretty good.

And she did a good job this season. And she brought a receipt, you know, maybe it didn't land because it was. We don't even know what the receipt was. Yeah. And again, I imagine this reading between the lines on this, it's, I shouldn't go against the number one person on this show. I want to make sure that I can come back. She might also see a way where Jazeel, Ashley, are not going to let up on Stacey. So if she can be friends with Stacey, that's actually what we want.

That's a good way to slide in there. Very good way to slide in there. And you'll be ingratiated with all of Stacey's fans, which is the majority of the fans of the show right now. So walking it back and taking away from all of that, getting on Stacey's good side. then obviously promoting your own Instagram to go live this week because people will pick that up and report back. We won't watch it, but we'll watch other people that watched it. It was a good move.

This was a good move, your recent one, because I do think that she took all of that into account. Monique is very smart. She's watched this show for a long time. She's been on this show, and she knows. So, yeah, she, one, saw the writing on the wall, probably. But two, in the bigger part, is she clearly did more research or things fell apart from her story.

Yeah. I appreciate very much that she walked it back because we have plenty of housewives out there that would not have done that would have doubled down just to try to save face. So I like that she did that. And I like that she brought the receipt. Now, my problem therein lies. One, we watched an entire 30 seconds of beep

with a blurred out screen. So we have no idea what that is. We have to go off context clues, which I think it was cookie. that's my bet, which is also surprising if it was. Well, I don't, I don't trust Cookie, but. Yeah,

I don't think it was Cookie because Monique said, well, if it's somebody, if it's that person, you have to trust it. Yeah, and Monique has already said that she doesn't trust Cookie.

So it's, it's not Cookie. It's just someone else, and you have to, like, really dig deep and go back to the seasons that Monique was on the show to try to figure it out.

Maybe it's somebody in her family. Maybe it's somebody in Chris's family, somebody that's close to them. I don't know who it is, but apparently it doesn't matter. It was the waiter at, tally ho. It was, yeah, and honestly, I would believe him over everybody else. But it doesn't matter because she's walking it back. And we already know what the reaction around the room is. Kiara tries to insert herself herself. This isn't about you, Kearnah. She did herself no favors this reunion. Yeah, she really didn't. And honestly, with the news last week that Jazzy put out there that she's not coming back. Jazzy does not need to come back. She did herself no favors either. God, Jazzy was like, awful. Again, yeah. And this is the other thing in post-production. If Jazzy's not coming back, looking back at this reunion and Jazzy's input, you could have cut all of it.

Yeah. Like her entire stay at the reunion and then lit a fire under her ass and maybe she's posting things online. Like, I got cut out of the reunion. That's good press, actually, because people will be like, oh, wow, Jazzy got cut out of the reunion. Let's see why. That could work out in everybody's favor.

But I don't understand the need to have Jazzy out there. Kearn is also kind of in the same boat for me. But she's full time, so I get it. She's full time. So maybe she gets demoted. I could see a world in which she gets demoted. Monique gets put into a full-time, and then we kind of go from there with Karen coming back next year.

That would make a lot of sense to me. They don't really make the choices that make a lot of sense all the time, so I'm not expecting that. But this whole segment was just more of the same. Like, we know what Jazeel and Ashley are going to say, and they're going to double and triple down on whatever that voice memo was to go back at Stacey and be like, you were lying the whole time. Stacey's still just vehemently denying everything,

and whether she's lying or not, it doesn't really matter because the other side is so annoying about it. that we really don't care if Stacey's lying. That's been our sentiment the whole season. And early on, obviously, not everybody was in the Stacey camp. So we got a lot of shit early on that we're like, oh, you guys defend anything she does. One, like, we know and knew in episode one that she's lying.

Like, that's never been a question for us. We told you that we didn't think she was lying, but we both knew she was fucking lying. Yeah. The whole thing is exactly what you said. We looked at the situation. And on one side, you have Stacey, who is giving every single episode. She's funny.

She's weird. She's entertaining. On the other side, you have Ashley doing Ashley's shit. You have Giselle reverting back to the green-eyed bandit stays. So, no, I'm not getting on their team. I'm going to be delusional on Stacey's team. But that's so much more fun. Way more fun.

And the other part, and I think this is the most important part. and why she has so many fans, especially because this video does not land, this receipt that was allegedly something pretty bad. Stacey's lies don't hurt anybody. They're not affecting other people's lives. It's just weird shit that she lies about, which weirdly makes it funnier because it's like,

why would you even waste time lying about that? Yeah, and it also gets her in a little bit of hot water for certain situations because she lies about so much innocuous shit that when we get to, were you dating Chris Samuels, Well, and in my brain, she went on a group date and she talked to him. And she maybe got set up and said, oh, you should meet my friend Chris. And then they sat next to each other. Because again, going back to the picture that was posted, and I think it was the Bravo

Shade Room that put it up there, it's the two of them sitting at like the end of a table. They tried to crop out 40 people. Yeah, there's like a million people there. It could be a speed dating event. We don't know what this was. But because Stacey has lied about so many weird things, it does call into question whether or not she's lying about this. And that's okay.

because Stacey has made that bed and she's okay to lay in it. She seems to be fine. She knows when she's not lying and when she is lying. And you can always tell. You can usually tell when she's lying. Maybe not. This is one of those things that we'll have to keep an eye on, where if it keeps going and we're like five seasons into Stacey's tenure

and she's still lying about a lot, maybe she lies about everything. She's a psych. She's, oh, God, I'm dying over here. No. She's just a full-time sociopath. And she just lies. Yeah, she just lies about everything. But that's, you know, that's a problem with the future.

Don't worry about that. Worry about that shit right now. It was just interesting because that's the first thing I saw today on Instagram was Monique walking it back. I was like, okay. Well, that makes a lot more sense. But we get to, well, actually, before we do that, since we were talking about Jazzy, and we're not going to really talk about it for the rest of this whole thing. The shots that she tries to take throughout this.

granted they were they were terrible they didn't land i don't know why she was trying but i do have to ask do you respect the move because she probably knows that she's on the outs and she's trying to throw a hail mary at the end of this thing to try to maybe find a spot i can respect that sure yeah at least she has the the wherewithal to understand that she's on the way out yeah so let me just throw some things in there but she does herself a disservice almost immediately yeah talking to tia like her quips throughout all of this pretty much the entire time she was on stage We're terrible. They're really bad.

You can't convince me that anyone out there was really enthralled about Kearn and Jazzy going back and forth last episode. No. It was awful. Everything I saw online is why are these two fighting and why are we wasting time on it? Why do we care? No way does. We just simply do not care. And yeah, it is what it is when it comes to Jazzy.

But that's pretty much been her M.O. since she got on the show. She does a couple of things here and there where you're like, okay, Kearnas not doing anything. Maybe you can take her spot. She was on a heater for like five episodes. Yeah, pretty much all through Nevis. Like, she was great. And then all of a sudden she just took a turn.

When Mr. Sunshine. When Mr. Sunshine showed up. And then obviously the whole storyline about her wedding, it was too little too late at the end of the season, talking about whether or not Stacey wanted to go to your wedding. No one cares. No one cares. We didn't even get real footage.

Like they sent a Bravo cameraman down there. And I'm sure even that cameraman was like, why am I here? What are we doing? He just lived in the Houston area, so he just showed like, hey, you still got that camera? I got a small camera. I got my phone.

The pictures that we got, the whole thing was stupid. So she did enough in the beginning of the season to make us question it. And that's sort of what she was doing in the reunion. There was way more bad than good for Jazzy, though. Yeah. And like you said, she caps it off with certain one-liners. Like, they're going over the next segment, which is hosting and trips.

And we'll talk a lot about that. But the first thing that they talk about is the polo event. And, you know, they were there with a lot of Tia's coworkers and bosses and things like that. And she's like, well, I still am employed. And I've sold a bunch of houses. I just, I love the question. Like, what do the white people think? It was great.

I hope we can be that candid with all of our questions because that was fucking hysterical. What are the whites think about this? Let's talk about those whiteys for a sec. No, it was hysterical set up. But when they're talking through everything and Tia says that, you know, I sold a bunch of houses, Jay's like, oh, good, you can take care of your hubby now. One, I was like, why are you interjecting here? and two, you know, because Tia says,

and they're better than your $150,000 a townhome. So another dig at Jazzy, and Jazzy doubles down, all you're really doing, especially because we know that your husband is on the practice squad, is reminding us that your husband's on the practice squad, and you probably have to take care of him too. Yeah, and she probably went to Tia or Tia's group originally to look for homes, and Tia was trying to help as best she could, but Jazzy being Jazzy probably hit a point where she got mad at Tia or mad about the situation.

Couldn't afford the houses. Couldn't afford the houses because she was inflating how much money she actually has. Whatever it could have happened. We don't know. Probably that. Probably that. We don't know for sure, but I'm sure it was that. She couldn't afford it. Yeah, she just couldn't afford it. $150,000 townhome in this economy? Is it made out of cardboard? These interest rates? What are you nuts? But yeah, yeah, those little... The other thing was when she made that little one-liner to Tia about her husband supporting her husband, What does that ever come into question? I don't know.

Have we talked about Tia supporting her husband at all? Not once. Like, yeah, we talked about her being royalty in Nigeria. We talked about how she grew up and how she came over here and how she met her husband. We never really talked about it in the way of like, hey, do you have money? Are you guys good? Are you financially stable? What about your husband?

What does he do for work? Nothing like that ever came up. I know he's got a job. Yeah. So I don't really get this one. I don't either. This must have been an off-camera thing or they've been beefing over this shit. And she's like, well, you're not.

your husband's a bum or something? I don't know. It was so weird. Is he a stay-at-home dad? We didn't know that? Whatever. Great. Like, I have no issues with that.

It's just, we don't have enough context for this one-liner to it. It wouldn't have landed regardless. No. But we really don't have enough info for it to have worked with the audience, which it was just a very random thing to say. And again, Tia comes out on top as she tends to do every single time. But as we're going through the trips. one, this is not the sound bath group.

So if you're to go on a trip with a housewives cast. It would have to be that. Yeah. Yep. And I love that we got to that point. My favorite thing about Angel as they're filing through, and we'll just jump around this one, but when they're filing through all the things that did not go right,

I learned a lot that this group doesn't like trips like that. Uh-huh. No one likes a trip like the way you threw it. No one said that either. Which was bizarre, because I feel like that's such low-hanging fruit. Yeah. Like, what do you mean? What group?

Show me a group of people on a bachelor party, bachelor's at party, a friend thing, a family reunion, whatever it might be. That's going to be like, wow, this is awesome. I can't wait to drive an hour to your house. I get lost in the woods. And I get, like, if we're to believe what we were hearing, the rumors coming out of Bravo and coming out of NBC, were that this was all thrown together randomly and it was kind of geared towards making Angel look bad or whatever it may have been. And it was probably just shoddy worksmanship at the end of the day. And she probably can't say that.

But you could say things that maybe don't allude to that, but at least have, once again, this is, you know, an angelism. She does things and says things that she feels like it answers the question. Yes. And it just simply doesn't. Like, no. Like, show me anybody that would like to do that. This isn't the group to do sound baths with. Fine.

But it's also not the group to have them stay an hour away with no running water. There is no group to do that. It doesn't make any sense. Yeah. I don't know. Angel was interesting during all of this. I didn't think that she caught as much heat as I figured she would. No.

And it just kind of shows me that the rest of the group is sort of over it. Like, for the most part, because I think that there doesn't need to be heat at this juncture. Yeah. We've gotten through all of it. You guys aired her out plenty on the trip. Like she caught enough shit.

The first two episodes, we covered it enough where people were taking like slight digs, except one person. Giselle is still stuck on this in trying to hammer the whole thing home. I'm like, this is done, dude. Like, why are you going back so hard at this whole thing? And to Kiana's point, the only point I'll give her, other shit happens on trips, not collectively to where it's this bad.

But when you're going through the evidence, because first and foremost, Angel did take accountability. She said, sorry, she owned up to pretty much all of this stuff. Yeah, she's trying to soften it by like, it's just not this girl's, Why do you have a good time? She said she's not in the group chat either. Right. So now you're telling me that you guys are all talking on the side about how terrible the trip is and that there's no running water.

But you're also not telling, like, it tells me that you're not telling Angel. Like, hey, tells me you're setting her up for failure. Correct. But you're also, if you had these issues, you're eventually, like it seems like a last-ditch effort to reach out to Angel and be like, hey, we have no running water and we haven't for like two days. Like, if you're not, if you're talking about it amongst yourselves, how do you think you're going to solve that? It doesn't really make a ton of sense. And Giselle's point of, well, you should be checking in with us. You should be seeing it.

And, like, I agree with that to a certain extent. But she doesn't have, like, magical powers where she can see that you guys are struggling over there. The whole thing was fucked. We all agree with that. It was terrible from the start. It was never going to work. But there are things that they're holding her accountable for that really wasn't her fault necessarily. And I get that maybe the vibe that I was catching right there, because they weren't going heavier on her,

maybe they all kind of just took a step back, like, all right, whatever, it is what it is. Probably, and I think that's the right way to approach it. But to your point, that's why I was saying they were setting her up for failure. They weren't communicating with her in hopes that it would continue to spiral in hopes that it would give them more ammo to be like, this chick sucks. That's why they didn't do it. Now, when Angel says, I reached out to Jazzy who informed me what was going on, and I didn't want to come to you guys until I had to solve. that I get. Yeah.

That part I can understand. Now, it would have done her a lot of favors if she texted the group and said, hey, working on something, I'll get back to you shortly. That's, I'm hoping she'll do that in the future. But at the same time, one, we know the trip was, was kooky to begin with. Because we think production did most of this intentionally, and that's based on a lot of stuff that we've seen about the edits. Primarily, you know, we all shit on those four dudes that were hanging out with Bobby

Massey. Turns out that they didn't talk because that was take number four. They had talked in every other take except for that one. We've seen weird cuts when Bobby was talking. It turns out he said a lot more. That actually gives much more context to the situation. So production did her dirty. That leads us to believe they had a hand in making this trip so wacky. So we're still holding her to this standard of, or Giselle is, where it's like, are you going

to try to put this on her? Let's say she's on the show next year. Are you going to double down on this shit? I'm sure. About it again. Absolutely. Especially with Giselle. But like, it's not landing.

It didn't really land during the season. I think a lot of people have gotten to where we are now where it's like, I feel bad for Angel. Yeah, no, I do feel bad for Angel. And when she goes further into how they ended up just getting lost on the road for that entire end of the trip. Drop the pin. Drop the pin in the middle of the wilderness. As soon as you say that out loud, it sounds ridiculous. Exactly.

It's not going to show you. And I do think that maybe this is just the world we live. live in, you think that if you drop a pin, you're going to get perfect directions to that pin. Then she says, well, we were just following the directions from the pin and we were hoping, and I get like, you didn't understand that there was going to be a ton of traffic coming out of Denver for the ladies that were staying at the hotel. Fine, that makes sense. You guys got lost on a fucking side road down some weird militia path where you were probably leading yourselves to death. Like that, that's the vibe that I was catching. So you got lost on a way to your own event,

and then you throw in, which didn't really get talked about even more, but you throw in the fact that you had people go to that pin and there was nothing there. Like, that doesn't make any sense to me either. I know that. She said that somebody was at that. I think she's, this is Angel, though. She's very confusing. She never says what actually makes sense, which you could have stopped right there.

Somebody sent me a pin. The pin was wrong. It took us the wrong direction. We didn't know which road to go down and we got lost. End the story. That should have been on. the end of it, it's terrible. Like, you should have probably figured out how to get there before you left, but whatever.

You go deeper into it and saying somebody was there and sent me a pin, and then they went to that pin and there was nothing there. So it wasn't even where you guys were going. Right. That makes no sense to me. It doesn't. And I don't think that that even happened. I think she was just trying to explain it away.

And then saying, like, hey, by the way, I was still right. I was going to the pin that they gave me. So she's almost putting it on her workers. She is. Like, they sent me the wrong place. Right. But that doesn't make sense because why would they have been standing in this random place? Yeah.

It doesn't track. But it's also a reflection upon you still. You think that you're actually pushing it further away from yourself to try to exonerate yourself. Like, hey, I was okay. I was going to the right place. We just got a little lost. No. Your workers, your company, if you will, sent you a pin that wasn't going to work in the first place.

So the whole thing was fucked. Exactly. And again, she got enough shit for it. but I don't know. I still think that it's a reflection of the fact that maybe she's not cut out for this whole thing just because she doesn't doesn't think in the way that like a housewife thinks. You know, in this moment, you're trying to deflect. You're trying to come up with something to be like, that's it and we're squashing it.

Instead, you're leaving so many more doors open that nobody was knocking on. You're just walking around like opening up shit and being like, yeah. Well, wait, that's a whole different layer to this thing that we, haven't discussed Angel. She's also gotten to the place, which is very weird too, where we don't care anymore. Right. So when she does open that door, it's like, well, that door is weird, but I don't really care to go into that door right now.

We're not going through that door. Because I don't want more things from you. I'm okay. Let's move on. Exactly. I don't know. And that's pretty much a wrap on Angel. I mean, I know Karen says something a little bit later, but again, when we were thinking

about it weeks and weeks ago, and if you remember, Angel was on threads of all places, talking about all these things that she felt about the women and helping me. She was threading really hard for a while there. And we were a little worried to see what was going to come of that at the reunion because it was right after the reunion. I'm like, oh, maybe she's got this weird energy or maybe she actually did stand up for herself. Good. We didn't see any of that. Episode one, she did a good job.

She held her grounds, but I think it was very apparent that they weren't really having a ton of energy to go after her the whole time. They were kind of just washing their hands. Like if Giselle was going to lead the charge, other people probably would have jumped in. It didn't seem like everybody really cared that much. No, the only time I really saw anybody get like a tick up from just kind of neutrality was Giselle in this episode, which I thought was weird. Again, she's trying to like drum this whole thing up again. And the biggest takeaway is like you just said, Giselle, no one really cares. No.

She's still holding on to the Nevis trip. I know. It's the best trip ever, apparently. has now become the second worst trip. Yeah. Behind Angel's trip because we keep referring to Nevis. That was not the end-all be-all of great trips. No.

I'm sorry. It was fine. He did a good job. Outside of Mr. Sunshine and Catfish, named me one more thing that happened. I can't. Can't. Except for...

Angel crying because... Oh, well, yeah. That's still under the umbrella of the catfish comment. Yeah, yeah. Well, Kiarna moving rooms because of mold. We didn't see that. No, that was a different... That was last year's trip, I think she was talking about.

Because I think she said the Bahamas. She did say Bahamas. Yeah. That was last year. That's Virgin Islands. I don't know where the Nevis is. Yeah, I think it's Virgin Islands. It's down.

It's in the Caribbean. Yeah. I don't know. Geography for idiots. What am I going to do? I have no idea. Look it up? No.

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Now obviously when she gets out there, we're going to go over the niceties. You know, Giselle, she was writing letters in prison and this and that and the other thing, all of the nice stuff. But the big thing for me as we're going into this is I'm watching body language. I'm watching how she's carrying herself. the way that she's speaking about herself. To come back, and I get that she's the Grand Dame, and I get that it's Karen Hugar of Potomac,

to come back on a pedestal and berate some of these ladies after you just got out to jail for your fourth DUI is baffling to me. It's so fucking funny, honestly. I think she's riding the high of not only, and I do think I want to give big ups to, Andy because he did ask all of the questions that you needed to ask about what Karen was doing.

Thank God. But she is definitely riding the high of not only that one-on-one that she thinks she crushed with Andy, which everybody else was commenting. They're like, hey, Andy, that was great job. Like, you really covered everything. Like, that was the most that she's ever opened up. And, like, all of us at home were watching, we're like, she's not

taking a lot of accountability for anything. We didn't even talk about the poor deer. The deer is still MIA. Yeah. And like, I feel bad for that deer. But she comes in with this whole attitude and it doesn't make a ton of sense. And then I start thinking about it. I'm like, oh, yeah, she came back to BravoCon to a standing ovation. She had the one-on-one thing. Other people online, because it had been a while, because she

served her time, which is fine. Like, whatever. She served her time. So yes, she does get to move on with her life. You can't tell her to just stay where she is. And I agree with that. She's in this spot now where I think she does think, wow, people are so excited to have me back. I've actually owned up to all of my sins. I've owned up to all of my transgressions. And now I can sit down and I can do. judge everybody. And also, I can do it with this air of confidence because I've been in jail. You don't want to go to jail, Wendy? I've been there. You don't want to go. It's like, wait a minute, hold up. You came back and told Ray that they were all really nice to you. Yeah. And they were the best.

And they made sure that your stay was great. You're sitting down here now just like fortifying Ashley's fears about jail. Yeah. That's what we're doing. Pretty much, more or less. And I agree. I think that she's got this false confidence now because of how she was received with so many things. I just, I was really hoping, this was like my last chance to be like, all right, you know what, she seems to be moving in the right direction. I don't think so. And I think that the first indicator of that is the Grand Dom comment. Because she was like, well, I was going to shed it.

But then, you know, so many people are still asking me about it and calling me that. So I'm going to give the people what they want. I'm like, you're already back to who you were almost. Yeah. In one fell swoop, I'm getting no confidence. I'm not looking at this and going, oh, she seems like she's in a great place. I'm looking at this and going, oh, this is concerning to me. Because from a recovery standpoint, when we get to the alcoholic question, I think there's no way.

After seeing what has happened since then, and obviously I think I reported this before that drops. I'll take that back. But I will never understand why you have to pivot and not say alcoholic, where it's a lifetime of recovery. And then she acts like she coined that phrase, which drives me crazy. But here's why, guys, okay? and hopefully it's the last time I have to talk about this stupid shit. Like take 15? Maybe more.

I don't even know. But when it comes to this stuff where I saw a lot of people when I posted the episode about her one-on-one, they're like, well, you know, she's trying. She's doing this. There's not gray areas in this stuff. And that's because you have to fully admit what you are, who you are, in order to be able to heal yourself. So when you're still skirting around things, when you're still skirting around things, when you're You're still trying to say, I'm not quite that. You're still coming up with excuses.

When you come up with excuses, it means that you may or may not have gone down the right path. You have to be completely open and completely accepting that this is who I am. And she is still skirting around it. And that does not give me any confidence whatsoever. I hope that she stays sober. I hope she stays in recovery. But the way that she's trying to do it and then saying it's a choice, it makes me feel

more empowered. You don't get to rewrite this shit. it. Like, there's millions of us out here that adhere to certain things. I'm not saying it to be a 12-stepper. There's other ways to do it. How you stay sober is how you stay sober. But to try to say that you're not an alcoholic, it makes me as an alcoholic feel like you're trying to say that you're better than me. You're better than people that are labeled alcoholics because you didn't get that bad. You're just other stuff, but I'm not that bad. You got four DUIs, bro. Yeah. I feel like in so many ways, too, even though Andy gave her every opportunity to

just copped to it and be like, yeah. He did a great. I am an alcoholic. And again, even not knowing, because we don't have hindsight right now, because this was filmed before the interview with her dropped. So we don't really know what the audience reaction is, but Andy does know what the audience reaction is going to be. He knows that her completely denying the, or not having the ability. That's interesting. That's why it's right. It's really good. He's giving her a chance. Yeah, he was giving her a chance because he's trying to get to a point where he's like, all right, we took that interview a couple of months ago. Like, we sat down, we talked about this, you've had some more time to think about things. Maybe you're where I am, because I'm sure Andy's sitting there like, yeah, like I gave you

every opportunity to just say, hey, I'm an alcoholic. Instead, you're spinning it into this other weird narrative without copping to the fact of being an alcoholic. Let me give you another couple opportunities here. Oh, you're still not going to do it. Okay, let's go right into the rumors about legal seafood and what Wendy was saying, where you were just a frequent visitor. You were there every single day getting plastered. How does that make you feel after that comment about I'm not an alcoholic? I love that. She doesn't have anything to say. And she just completely goes back into spinning a bunch of yarn here and there. I thought that was really funny. I thought that was really well done by Andy because it's like, I can't do this with you anymore. This is brutal to try to work through. And when she's

talking about it, like, in my mind, I'm like, who the fuck cares, lady? Like, you're in your late 60s. I don't even know how old she is. I think she's like 66 or 67. You're in your late 60s. You got caught. Yes. You're fucked. Like, now you can take a point of, like, a stance of, yeah, you know, I'm in a lifetime of recovery. Just say you're a fucking alcoholic. What's the point? Like, why are you holding on to this?

It's maddening to me because, again, like, yeah, I get it. If you're, like, in your 30s or something and, like, you had a lot of shit going on and you're still holding on to that little bit of hope. Like, oh, you know what? Like, maybe this is the wake-up call I needed. And it's like, okay, yeah, it might not work out. It might work out. Who knows? I'm not going to tell you what to do.

You're in your late 60s. Your license is stripped. you're never going to drive again. You're going to have to have a driver for the rest of your life. I think, and to me, when she says all of that, it's like, a couple of years, she's probably going to start having a couple of drinks. Bingo. That's immediately what it tells me.

Like, hey, I'm not going to say that because I'm not going to be the person that says I'm an alcoholic. I'm going to say I'm in a lifetime of recovery because then I'll have like a little bit of leeway here and there as I move forward through my life, which, again, if you were living off camera, I don't give a fuck what you do. Go ahead, do whatever the hell you want. You're on camera with a platform. You can't do this shit. No, you can't. It's disrespectful to so many different people for so many reasons.

And that's exactly what it is. And now I have to say this, which I don't want to say, but this leads me to believe that you're leaving the door opens that you can have a drink on the show and say, whoa, whoa, I never said I was an alcoholic. That's fucked up. Yeah. This whole thing stinks. It sucks.

I did not care for it. And when you pair that with just her overall attitude and how she's talking to people on this stage, how the fuck are you going to say to Stacy? Just don't lie. I can't take the lying. You're still not copping to the fact that Wendy definitely talked to somebody that saw you boozing at some establishment frequently. That happened. Because we know it happened at legal seafood.

We know that you did it at Tally Ho, which means you had places that you like to frequent to go get drunk, which is very normal for alcoholics. So why are you trying to thread the needle of like, well, it's not this. It's just all that tells me is you're still rationalizing. And the number one problem with addicts and alcoholics is rationalization. We are very good at coming up with reasons why we should not stop. Yep. Why we're different than other people. Comparison is not only the thief of joy.

It's also very dangerous for people in recovery. And she is continuing to compare herself. And that is a disaster waiting to happen. I'm not going to pull punches. I don't feel confident about her moving forward. She needs to look in the mirror again and really figure out what the fuck she wants to do with this last portion of her life. Because as of right now, she's lying to us at home.

She's lying to herself. She's lying to Andy fucking Cohen. And she's putting herself in bad positions because this is going to, it's all like literally about training your brain and rewiring your brain to not operate a certain way. And the way that we operate is finding avenues to continue doing what we want to do without making ourselves feel bad about it. So we come up with reasons why it's not bad. You know, it's different.

Like I'm only drinking beer. That's stupid shit. That's what we do. That's what I saw her doing on stage. That sucks, especially because then she wants to say, I'm in a lifetime of recovery. Then fucking own up to having a problem. Yeah, or you know what? Just don't say, I'm in a lifetime of recovery.

Just say, you know what? I'm figuring it out. I've put myself in a really bad position. I got to figure out the rest of my life. And that's it. And look, yeah, people are going to still make comments. People are going to talk about what's going to be best for you. And at the end of the day, if you're not going to get into it, then you're not going to get into it.

That's your prerogative. That's the other part that I'm talking about where I'm like, you're in your late 60s. If you sat there and said, yeah, I don't know what the fuck I'm going to do. I'm going to figure it out. I'm going to see how things go. I'd have more respect for that. We would sit here and be like, all right, we'll see what happens, Karen. As long as you don't drive and you're not putting people in danger, I don't really care what you're doing, go ahead and live your life, lady, do whatever you're going to life, you're going to life, you're going to life, you even said, yeah, that was true.

without admitting that you're an alcoholic when we're talking about you going to legal seafood seven days a week and getting plastered. And we've got the evidence for that. And you even said, yeah, that was true. Ashley was finally right about something. But Wendy wasn't. But Wendy wasn't. And that's only because Wendy doesn't know the name of the person that talked to her. And that's also completely normal.

Ashley does not know the name of the person that she talked to. And Ashley also said this years ago. And she brought it back at the reunion last year. And Karen wasn't there to defend herself or try to, fight you to it, I guess. And now Karen's like, you know what, I'll cop to just that one. Yeah. Let me just cop to that one. And even the way that she acknowledges it, and when she was talking about on the one-on-one, it was like, yes, Ashley was 100% correct. That is true. And it's like, okay. She took full ownership. You're making full ownership. You sit down

of the reunion, which takes place a couple months later, and you're talking to Ashley. You're like, congratulations. Ashley finally got one. She's not lying about something for once. Don't put it on her. No, no, no. This actually isn't Ashley's fault. And again, if Wendy knew who she was talking to, you might also cop to that one, but you're not going to. And with all of this, like, my favorite visual is clearly she was watching the show, because that's another one of Andy's questions. Like, how did you feel that the ladies did? You know, do you know any of these women over here?

And she looks over at Angel. And she's like, yeah, my heart goes out to that newbie because she just didn't know what she was doing. And I love the idea of Karen sitting at home with Ray, like, asleep on the couch, taking notes with a laptop out or whatever, just going through everything, pretty much what you do when watching these shows like, I got to talk about this. I got to talk about this. And I wonder who she's talking to about the show every Sunday night when she tunes in because she's not watching it on Peacock. She's streaming it. She's watching it right at 9 p.m. on a Sunday.

Ray's watching the golf network on his phone. Yeah. And Karen's talking. He's going, oh, yeah. Raise an iPad kid, actually. Oh, yeah. That's actually a good point. Ray's watching the golf channel on his iPad. And Karen's talking to him and he's not really listening. He's going, uh-huh. Oh, yeah. What? That's crazy. That's the other thing with with Karen coming out and having all this confidence. I don't know if the confidence would fully be there if Wendy wasn't also facing jail time. I don't think it would be. I think she would still have a weird error about her. The Grand Dom stuff would still be talked about and she'd still have that weird ass answer. But it wouldn't be as, and I told you so. Right. Now I'm going to, now I'm going to school you. Exactly.

Because Wendy's facing jail time, it gives her another level to this whole thing. Exactly. I think that is 100% correct. And, you know, now I have to sit and watch Monique break down into tears saying, you know, you faced it. And I don't want to take away from the fact that she is sober, right? And she's taking accountability for some things. Like, I will not take away from that. But just the words and vocabulary being used on stage is like, you know, you were in denial and you're not anymore. She just denied being out.

I can say it. She might be sober. You can't say that. I can say it. I would never. She might be sober. And that's what. sucks about this is that when you leave the door open for speculation, rather than slam it

shut and just say, I'm an alcoholic, and this would all be fucking done. I don't understand what her angle is. You can go one way or another. She's choosing to live in this weird middle gray area. Yes. What are you doing? But that's where we live. That's my point. Alcoholics and addicts. We live in the gray area. The idea that yes, you are. Yes. That's the fucking issue that I'm having. Funny stance to take, Karen. Weird. It's really weird, but that's when the Wendy shit starts to unravel. And as we know, they were not talking. They were not friends after last season, unbeknownst to Wendy. Wendy was taken aback by the video at the end of the season. That bullshit fucking video of Karen dressed in all white, quote unquote, taking accountability before going

to jail. At that point, by the way, she'd been convicted. Yeah. And yet, still gave a bullshit video, but whatever. And as she's sitting there with Wendy now, we're going to get finally a year later, what happened? Why are you guys not friends anymore? Wendy can finally find out. Come to find out. And let me know if I got this right,

because it was slightly confusing, because we never got like a straightforward answer. Karen feels betrayed by Wendy because Karen talked shit to Stacy about Wendy. Stacey told Wendy about the shit that hath been spoke about her via Karen, Wendy believed Stacey. Yeah. Karen's mad because she got caught and Wendy believed it.

Correct. Okay, cool. Yeah, and I think there was another layer added to that where Wendy didn't reach out to Karen to say, hey, is this true? Okay. That was the only other thing that it's like, no. I still don't see it, but whatever, if you want to hold on to it. That is the basis of all of this.

Okay. And that was running, I guess, just before she filmed her weird thing, which now is incredibly applicable. Yep. That last year we're sitting at the reunion watching that clip of her sitting in her own bedroom or her own living room. I don't remember where she was. I thought she was in her bedroom, right? And she took that video? Yes.

Like the head of her bed, weirdly. Talking about all the things that she's going through and how she's not at the reunion and she can't go there. And it's just not something that she can do right now. I guess just before then is when all of this kind of came to a head. head and she's like, you know what? I'm going to thank everybody else in the cast, but not thank Wendy. Yeah.

Yep. That checks out. It just is ludicrous that that's what you're upset about, considering you were the one that was talking shit and you got caught. Yeah. Like, that's all we saw. And then to take it back, because that's where I get confused. Wendy's saying, well, you threw the first stone.

It's like, but did you throw a stone or did you just hear what Stacey said and was like, oh, I remember that scene. We were watching because it was at the dog ball. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And Stacey pretty much unloaded everything that Karen had said. Karen was trying to deny it there, but I think we both agreed. It's like, oh, she 100% said that. For sure.

I think we got a clip. Yeah. No, it was, we were talking about it, like, the way that it came about was Stacey's a newbie. Yes. Karen took her under her wing and then we'd go back even further to the weird, like, Lake in North Carolina that they went to for me. And, yeah, Lake Norman. Where they were talking about it. And Karen was like, oh, I'll take you under my wing.

This is the Karen Hugar School of Potomac. We're going to talk about all things on the show. And it's like, okay, we know what you're doing. And then, yeah, you probably did have a sit down with Stacy to talk about all the women in the group. And you had some not nice things to say about Wendy. She singled that out. And to me, that tells me, she singled out the one really mean, like thing that you said about one of the other women. You probably had a lot of generalizations that you probably thought were, like, astute wisdoms.

And in reality, they weren't because you could pick that up pretty quickly on these women. And then you went into Wendy and you had mean things to say. And Stacey took note of it and went to Wendy because she was getting closer to Wendy. All of it made sense. We all kind of figured that out last year the way that Karen was stammering at the dogball. It is what it is. Yes. It's just whatever.

So the fact that she didn't move on and now she feels like she's in a position where she can school Wendy is hilarious. It's so weird. And I guess it's not when you really look at the situation. But Wendy is saying you threw the first stone because when we were sitting together talking, and I think this was unseen footage, it was like a moment. month before all of that shit went down. And they were sitting there talking and Karen, and this is important because there is a semantics debate happening in the comments right now.

She didn't call her mom a witch. The whole thing that Wendy's upset about is that Karen brought up the witch thing on camera. Correct. She referenced the fact that people called Wendy's mom a witch, therefore bringing it back to the public eye, therefore causing problems again. okay, just because she didn't say your mom's a witch does not mean that the implication is any different because now they still have to talk about the witch thing again. And also that goes back to the season that we don't want to talk about with NECA. Like there was so much going on there that we just didn't want to deal with.

Wendy's mom potentially being a witch was part of that. Yes. We wanted to move on entirely. And we had to deal with Wendy's mom again this year, which Karen, while she's talking back and forth, has the audacity to say the only thing. I don't have a problem with your mom. I have no problem with your mom. Actually, I really enjoyed your mom this year,

especially when she told you to shut the fuck up. Yeah. The way she ties that back in later. It was unbelievable. But that was a moment where you can see across the board, everybody's like Karen. Like, what the fuck are you doing? Giselle yells it out like, Karen.

Come on. Literally. Don't do these things. Andy moves on. Like, that is a hard stop. We see Andy do this a lot where he's like, yeah, we're now we're not going to get anywhere. He even says, he's like, that really upset her.

That was a pretty tough moment. Yeah. Yeah. Thank God, Andy. said that too because like all of us watch that scene very uncomfortable all of us were on wendy's side doesn't really matter what you think about their relationship it's like no that's not something that we want to talk about and the other thing is andy was like trying to slowly wade into that discussion anyway that's not something that we have like a hard conversation about it just can and balled into it

yeah you just jumped right into it it's like oh no no that was that was really tough to watch and i'm sure really tough for wendy you're going to use that as a quip go after Wendy and then tie it back in later, which is fucking hilarious. But that's kind of the end of that discussion with Wendy and Karen because Andy's like, well, you guys clearly feel differently. I don't want to touch this with a 10-foot pole after that comment. We're going to move on because you're never going to get back to a good place. No, and her response is just insane. It's up on this high horse still.

You would think that she would have came back hat in hand. I'm just happy to be here with my ladies. Wendy, we got some shit to talk about. But it's just nice to be back. leave it to next season. Like you got invited to the reunion. Come out, have a couple of things to talk about, talk about the one-on-one with Andy,

see how everybody's doing. Maybe you have a little bit of a conversation with Wendy on stage, but you end it with, well, don't worry, we've got it all next season to figure that one out. We'll talk about it.

Or we'll talk about it off camera. I don't care what you say. But that's all you had to do, honestly. But instead, she's like, this is my moment. Yes. I'm going to go after it. Why?

But I think you nailed it earlier. She's been emboldened by her reception back onto TV because of the standing ovation at BravoCon for a four-time DUI offender. Yeah. Standing ovation, one-on-one with Andy Cohen, and back for the reunion on a season you were not involved in. The world of Sonic the Hedgehog has been thrust into a not-so-dark, not-so-stormy, hard-boiled detective story that probably nobody saw coming. Follow Sonic and the Intrepid Chaotic's detective agency as they take on their biggest case yet. This high-flying action-packed adventure will take them across the world,

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See what everybody's talking about and join us in the dark. Oh, please, not that music. That music gives me nightmares from my childhood. Could we get something a little bit lighter? Some lighter music here. Are you a fan of true crime TV shows? And what about Unsolved Mysteries? The show that jumped started all of our love. of true crime. I'm Ellen Marsh. And I'm Joey Taranto. And we host I Think Not, a true crime comedy podcast covering some of the wildest stories from your favorite true crime campy TV shows all the way to Unsolved Mysteries. Baby, you will laugh, you will cry. You'll think about

true crime in a whole new way, and you'll also ask yourself, who gave these people mics? New episodes of I Think Not are released every Wednesday with bonus episodes out every Thursday on Patreon. And every Monday, you can listen to our true crime rundown where we go over the top true crime headlines of the week. So come and join us wherever you listen to your podcast. They placed her on this pedestal. Bravo and Andy and the audience put her up there. So it actually kind of make, of course, her ego's inflated. Of course she comes into this thing. She walks in like she's the Grand Dame. You haven't been here for a year because you were in. jail. And yet you're going to come out here and throw this shit around. And then you're going to

play pretentious and high and mighty by saying the fact that you think I took pride in using that word disgusts me. You bringing up that story about Wendy's mom telling her, shut the fuck up, disgust me. Yeah. What do you mean? What's happening? I don't know where she's getting off on all of this, but pretty much the whole end is let's talk to Wendy about where you are now. Yeah. And it was a lot honestly, most of it is all stuff that we've already heard before, but now hearing it from Wendy, the way that she's going through this story, like, all right, let me take you guys back, because we'll talk about how this whole thing started. We'll talk about the break-in.

I have a question for you, too. Yeah, and it's like, all right, we'll talk about the break-in. We come back from vacation. Cam runs upstairs. She said, I think the dog peed or the dog did something up here. It's like, wait, the dog wasn't here. The dogs are the doggy hotel. Oh, boy, I think we got broken into.

Okay, something happened. A couple of months later, all of a sudden, the same thing. The same cop shows up in the middle of the night. I think it's my kids. I start freaking out. Your kids are okay. If you remember me, I'm the cop that showed up after you're breaking. I just wanted to let you know there was no break in.

Like, wait a minute, hold on. Whoa. No. There was a war. That didn't happen. There's no way that happened, right? You don't think? I do not think that the cop showed up and said, hey, I was the guy who was here for your

break in. There was no breaking. Here's what I thought. I don't think a cop would say that because isn't that on the insurance agency's they to do that? I don't know. Yeah. No, no, no.

This is, so that's what my point was. And I don't know if they filed anything from that burglary and that's what he, so there's two things I thought he could be referring to. One, that they found out there was insurance fraud via that burglary. He's saying there was no burglary. We caught you. I also thought, and this is probably from watching too much TV, did they have a warrant? And they went and searched the house while they were gone.

And that's what he was saying. there was no burglary. Oh, no, not that. No, I don't think it was that. Okay. That is a pretty fun little thing to spin around, though. I like that. I just dramatized it.

I know. That's what in my head? I'm like, ooh. What is Shane Davis called them? Vertical dramas? Vertical dramas. Yeah, it's a vertical drama. Yeah, I would watch that.

I'd definitely watch the shit out of that one. But, uh, but yeah, I don't know. And we've always thought about this. And again, it's a white collar crime. It didn't hurt anybody. It hurt insurance agencies. I love that people still get mad at us when we say we don't care. We just simply do.

not care. I mean, we've got Karen on the other side with 4DY. Could have killed somebody. Yes. Still claiming that she's not an alcoholic. And you guys are going to really harp on us talking about white color crime and how it doesn't fucking go. Oh, yeah, my premium's going to go up. No, it's not. It's not. But anyway, Wendy's going through this whole thing. That's where it's like, okay, like, yeah, we've heard this before. But like, in the back of my mind, I'm like, why are you talking so much? Like, what do you, why are you getting deep into this? And talking about the specific.

of what you're dealing with. And we talk about how she's got 67 credit cards open. She doesn't really address the 67 credit cards, but she addresses the aliases, which was, oh, it's just whenever we have packages coming and we change names. I thought that was a decent response. It is a decent response. It makes sense. But the quantity, you're right, it was not addressed.

Yeah, and I guess when you're a public figure, which, you know, you can debate back and forth if you want to if a housewife is a real public figure, enough people know, and if you see Wendy Osefu on something, you might be inclined to open that package and steal something. I get it. That's fine. That's neither here nor there. But then when Andy's like, yeah, and he kind of lumped it all into one question, which I wish that he kind of separated them, but he said, we got to talk about the alleged 67 credit cards that were open as well as the aliases. She only answered the aliases. She did not say anything about the credit cards, which, you know, smart, obviously. But again, I'm still thinking this whole time, why are you

talking so much? I don't know. You can easily, and we've seen this a million times about very petty disputes on these shows, you could just say, hey, I can't talk about that. Hey, I'd rather not talk about that. My legal team said, I can't talk about this. Perfectly fine. It might ruffle some feathers. People might get a little annoyed, especially at the end of the reunion, but you don't have to go in depth with anything. And Karen, I got something to say. It was taken out of context when I said that I really liked that your mom said, shut the fuck up to you, because Wendy, right now, you should shut the fuck up. Why are you talking so much? I'm like, I agree with you, but I hate the way you're doing that.

That's not what you were doing earlier. No, it was wild, and I'm assuming she was sitting there, and when she heard that, she goes, ooh, light bulb, shut the fuck up in a good way this time. Yeah. But I thought it was funnier because clearly, and we were saying this all season last year, she's not doing herself any favors. They're going to show this stuff as like proof of character and stuff. That clearly happened, because the way she's talking is like,

They'll use all of it against you. Uh-huh. Trust me, they're going to use all of it against you. I will say this, the things that Wendy has said, and we pointed a few out during the season, like obviously there were some moments we're like, ew, that's not going to land great. Not nearly to the level that Karen was doing last year.

No. Shit that she was doing. I was like, that's, all of this is a horrible look. Yeah, but again, Karen's not wrong, and maybe she did learn something because she probably did get to, when she refused to just dismiss that or like go through with any sort of plea deal, and she ended up just going to court.

She could have a house arrest for like a month or something. Yeah, like, and she went to court, and I'm sure they brought up things from the season. Like, hey, Exhibit A, episode three of this season, you're at Talley Ho's sneaking drinks. What's up with that? You were driving home. So clearly you're up to something. So like, I do think that Karen learned something. And again, she's not wrong in saying, and at least questioning Wendy, like, why are you being

very open about this? This is, they're going to use anything they can to go against you. And Wendy even said that, which was another weird question. And they were talking about her finances where Andy was asking her about other people saying, like, you know, allegedly you guys are pretty much broke and you're in debt with all of these things. She just said, you know, whatever their definition is of all of that is what they're going to say. And that's the end of that. I'm like, that's a weird way to answer that one too. I think that one's ambiguous enough that they won't use it against it.

Sure. Yeah. Yeah. But she's, I don't know. And look, maybe they won't use anything against her. Maybe she really hasn't. And I know production did zoom in on certain things. and we could just go over that like three episode arc where you're redoing your whole home

and talking about how much money you're spending on this, that's probably going to get used, I would imagine. Yeah. So there's a lot there where it's like, hey, you really didn't think you were going to get caught. And you just kept living this life. And it sucks, but now you should be even more the opposite end in not talking. That's when Andy went and I was like, what are you doing? Andy was shut up because he's like, you know, taking care of your mom financially,

the renovations, you know, dressing for the show. People say you're putting on it. I was like, can we stop listing things? Because they're going to be like, what about this? Exhibit A, Andy Cohen. I'm like, stop, dude. And this was right after she even said, like, by the way, Karen, everybody on my legal team, like, they know the line of questioning that I'm going to face today.

I'll be okay. And then Andy goes into specific lines of questions. Oh, no, no, no, no. Like, wait. In my mind, I'm like, wait a minute. There's no way that I know there's no way that Bravo and Andy sent the questions to her legal team and said, is this okay? That's just not what they do.

They want to poke and they want to catch them. Yeah. Like they want to help out. Not help out the, you know, the state. I think they think they want to help out because as I'm watching this, all I'm thinking about is every single year. And it is every year because every year we have a housewife in legal trouble. Every year we always say like, God, you can't always say like you're not allowed to talk

about it because it's an ongoing case, Erica Jane. No, don't talk about it. Yeah. Housewives. Yeah. This is what she is talking about. I'm like, oh, God. I don't think you should be saying that.

I know we always ask for you guys to say it. I don't think you should say it. I think you should shut up. Weirdly, it's really, it's just funny, too, because, like, I've definitely thought it before. I'm like, oh, maybe you shouldn't be talking about this. But to the level that Karen brought it, I'm like, oh, fuck. Like, if everybody else is sitting around and Karen just got out of jail and she's yelling at you from across the stage to shut up, because you are not doing yourself any good, she's probably right.

And now I'm thinking like, yeah, I'm. Maybe you shouldn't have done all of those things. I don't know. And look, we still don't know what's going to go on with Wendy. They still haven't gotten through most of their stuff. I know, you know, we get news here and there about what's going on. I don't think they've started the trial. Nothing substantial, yeah.

We haven't heard any potential plea deals or anything like that. I think the most damning things for me, and I'm still Timocepho. I'm still rooting for innocence, innocent until proven guilty, all that good stuff. I want to see Happy Eddie walk out of the. that courtroom still happy. Yep. I want everyone to go home to their kids. Now, I have to ask.

This is the question I had for you earlier. Okay. What did you think about her tone and demeanor during all of these questions? I mean, she was pretty rehearsed. Sure. Which was expected. Did you... Okay, let me ask it this way.

Based on her demeanor and how she was talking, would you say she's in a... or guilty? Guilty. I mean, I thought she was guilty the whole time. Yeah.

I never once thought that she was innocent in any of these charges. Allegedly, allegedly, allegedly, allegedly, yeah. I mean, we're not lawyers. We don't know what the hell we're talking about. It just gave...

She almost seems like she's accepting that she's going to go to jail. Yeah. She's going to go to prison because these are felonies. Yeah. I think maybe... And she is really smart,

so I think she's probably wrangling with the idea of, like, a new reality. ahead of her. And I think the only time, and this sucks, but the only time that you really see a break in that facade is when they're talking about the kids.

Yeah. When people start talking about her kids and what's going to happen moving forth, then she kind of takes a different tone and it gets too real. And you can tell like, oh, she's really preparing herself for like what might happen.

Yeah. And leaning towards that probably will happen in some way. That's the vibe I got that this is probably going to happen. Yeah. Versus, we're going to see where it goes. It was more like, we're going to see where it goes. Yeah, yeah, exactly.

Damn it. I thought maybe you saw something different. No, unfortunately, I didn't see anything different, but it's a somber note to end season 10 on. We don't know where we're going to be next year. And I don't know. I do think it was funny with Angel. I feel like she was not prepared for Andy to call her out like that. Yeah.

What'd you mean about you hope justice assert? I hope she goes home. Shit. I didn't mean that I hope. Justice is served for her kids. That's what she said. The kids go to jail? I definitely didn't mean I hope they throw the book at her.

I certainly didn't mean I hope she goes down. Juvie? Community service is what I meant. Yeah. That was funny because everyone else stands by what they said. They're like, yeah. And like the stuff they said is fair and valid. So Wendy shouldn't have a response.

I'm sure it's stung to hear those things. Angels was the only one. It's like, yeah, fuck her. I hope she goes to jail. Yeah. And when Andy called her out, she's like, Oh, God. I hope that justice has served.

She's proven innocent and never goes to jail. Please move on. I thought my reunion was over after Colorado. That's exactly what that was. I don't have anything for this. Yep, I'm going to throw up. Oh, God. But yeah, let's get to some questions.

Don't let me down, guys. I can't believe that fire lit. Ah, here you go. From R. Meb, 124. What was with Wendy's weird, quiet baby voice? Was she trying to sound less guilty? I thought made her sound more guilty. Yeah.

Especially knowing her too. That's the, yeah, that, that, that part makes it not great. Yeah. From B. Reedy 13-126. Karen should have stayed home. Thank you. I knew you guys wouldn't let me down. Hell yeah.

I love our audience. Pretty Ricky 22. They skipped over the Colorado trip pretty much entirely. Further proof production was involved. They touched on it. I don't know. Much more to dive into. Yeah, there isn't much more to dive into.

We did so much on that trip. about just ragging on Angel the entire time that I don't think much more really needed to be said. But you might also be right that they didn't want to go too deep on that trip and talk too much about it because there was... Yeah, I could see that. But I... Yeah. And furthermore, like, I am now under the impression that production had pretty much everything to do with most of it. Yeah.

Uh, bu, but, but, but, but, uh, Jay Bay the Hut 713. You think Giselle on thin ice with the no package? What's the no package? What's the no package? I don't know. What do you mean? I don't think Giselle's on thin ice anyway. I'll just answer that.

No package? N-O or K-N-O-W? N-O. The no package. No package. I don't know. I'm going to skip it. From K-Looker Woods,

why did they not have a husband-slash-boyfriend segment? All the men declined. How many men are there? Eddie was there. Eddie was there supporting her. Timo is certainly not going to go to that. Timo's traveling. Yeah, Timo is traveling.

We're not sure if it's yesterday, today, or tomorrow. Last week. You know, he travels a lot for work. Did travel. Mm-hmm. Did travel. Bobby could be there, I guess. No fucking chance.

Bobby's there. Yeah, Greg, I guess. Greg's there because he's still doing this weird thing where he's trying to act like super boyfriend. Yeah. Honestly, I do think that they really only do husband's boyfriend segments when pretty much the whole cast has a husband or boyfriend. And I think also, you know, obviously we wouldn't have minded hearing from Eddie if he wanted to sit down with Wendy during their questioning about what's going on, but I would imagine their lawyers probably said, don't fucking do that.

The only other husband I'd really want to hear from, like, I don't give a shit about Timo. Whether he was traveling or not, we know that was a polite decline of a dinner that just kept going for some reason. I would potentially want to hear from Bobby, like to answer for some of that shit, more so just to clear his name and, like, clear that whole thing up, because I don't think that he's a bad dude, and I think he got a pretty bad rap from the season. Yeah. So I wouldn't have minded, like, a quick

Bobby segment, but then again, now we're spending, like, 10 or 20 minutes on Angel's stuff, and, like, I'm good there. So I just don't think there was really a need for one this season? No, I agree with that. We got clarification on the package, by the way. Oh, well, good. Sort of. At least I think this is what it is.

From Liz Scarbs, thoughts on Giselle not getting a package. I can't decide between the lines. No package. No package. Package about her life. Thank you. Yeah, the package, like, because she has nothing going on. her segment. Yeah. That's yes. Like what did we, what did she do this year? And look,

of course I want her back. Of course, Giselle is pivotal. We need her in Potomac. I need her to find a middle ground between this season and last season. Somewhere in there would be great for me. But that's why. What did she do other than go after Angel and Stacey?

Yeah. No, really nothing, honestly. And she didn't have anything really going on with her kids. Her dad's will situation, but that was a We talked about that really quick. Yeah, she didn't really have anything else going on, honestly. No, she had a bad, this was a bad, Giselle. But it's also, again, there's so many people on this fucking show.

That too. I do think that they can do themselves some good and downgrade a little bit, but you're not going to have, you know, a bunch of personal storylines, especially for somebody like Giselle. No. He's the Heather Gay of Potomac. Ooh. Rachel Ray, oh, wait, nope, we already talked about this.

Stacey getting cleared by Monique. A lot of people asked that question. but I think you did something. Oh, why was Karen here from Rachel Ray? Yeah, we don't know. I'm going to make sure I ask all of those. Thank you. From Miranda Ann 412,

should they have cut the entire recording since it was all bleeped out, especially since Monique came out and said that she believed Stacy now after getting more info. Monique didn't come out until like yesterday. Yeah, it was very recent. Or maybe even Sunday night, and I think she was probably hoping to get ahead of it in case people were coming after her. I don't think people really cared nearly enough, but it's okay.

And we'll do one more here from Josie Tiber. Did this need to be three parts? Was nice, though, for Karen to own a bit. Own what? I know about that second part, but none of them need to be three parts. No, we say that every year. But I don't know to what you're referring to her owning things. Yeah, she was owning less now than she was at the 101 thing,

but she also didn't really own a whole lot. Yep, and I know I'm going to get comments, people trying to defend Karen. You're not going to, and I'll chalk it up to you don't fully understand. Yeah. recovery and I don't fault you for that. It's a very nuanced topic, but yeah. No. No.

No. Nope. But anyway, that's a wrap on Potomac season 10. 10, thank you. And we'll see next year. Who's back? Yeah, I don't know. There has not been.

We know Jazzy's not coming back. I think Kearna is on the chopping block. Angel's probably on the chopping block too. I would think, but that's where I was like, maybe. We haven't heard. And here's what I'll say before we go. Due to what happened this season

and the potential production fuckery that was going on, I am not opposed to giving Angel one more shot. No, I'm actually fine with giving Angel one more shot, especially knowing now that she did get a house in Potomac. She did buy a house. She'll be one of two people that live in Potomac with Karen. Yep.

And we'll see where it goes from there. I think that weirdly enough, I don't know, looking back, she is kind of funny. I think it a different light now. I'm looking at the season differently. I'm like, she can come back. If you remove Angel, not a lot of happened to this season. No. If you remove Angel and Stacey, nothing happened to the season.

So, yeah, I mean, I wouldn't be opposed to bringing her back as long as, and we already know Jazzy's gone, as long as you get rid of Kearnah, too. Kiara needs to go. She can go. You can. You can. I'd be okay with that. I would prefer just there's no reason for her to be on the show anymore.

I don't think so. And then bring Monique in and leave her as a friend of or promoter. I actually don't care. I think a good move would just friend of for a season in which she's like actually frequent a friend of, not like this past season where we got like she's here and she's not. Yeah, I agree. But that's all I got. You got anything else?

Nope. Well, that's our show. Brov Bros. Got to get out of here now. For eight years, we've been asking the same question over and over again. How did this happen? My name's Mandy. And I'm Melissa, and we're the host of Moms and Mysteries, the True Crime Podcast with over 55 million downloads. We're two Florida moms who are obsessed with mysteries. Each week, we do deep dives into fascinating true crime stories. We cover everything from infamous cases like Casey Anthony to the bizarre and complex crimes right here in our home state, like the shocking murder of FSU professor Dan Markell.

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