Bros & Shows - RHOC Reunion: The Fall of Emily Simpson (Part 2 of 2) (RHOC Reunion Full Recap)

Episode Date: November 13, 2024

What's up Bros? It is part 2 of our RHOC Reunion Recap and in this episode Katie takes center stage. Heathers vendetta against her has not let up. And surprisingly Emily has joined in on the fight and we listen to a 20 minute witch hunt where the right side of the room has clearly dug up as much dirt on Katie as they could possibly find. Old lawsuits, a road rage incident. The obsession with a newcomer is bizarre. Why Heather is so stuck on the paparazzi thing makes no sense to us. But we listen as Katie defends herself against the road rage incident in claiming she was the victim, while Heather claims via court documents that the other man involved was the victim. Katie never received her court summons to defend herself so was immediately found guilty. The story adds up when you listen to Katie's retelling but again, the right side of the room has zoned in on her. Then we listen to a patent lawsuit that was dismissed and Emily, the patent lawyer, who has reminded us ad nauseam this episode that she is a lawyer, doesn't have anything to add to the one area of expertise she has. Instead she decides now is the time to question the custody battle that Katie went through, implying that Katie was either an unfit mother or didn't want to be involved with her kids. In the strangest of low blows, Emily's stock just plummeted for us. The episode caps off with Jen and Ryan and again, Emily leads the charge. Look, we understand Ryan still has a lot of red flags and question marks. But at the end of the day, Jen is an adult and made her decision AND Ryan has immunity. So while we don't necessarily expect this to end well, its time for the ladies to move on. Why Emily needs to hear that they can at least admit some wrongdoing is again strange. Why do you care? Want more BravBros content? Join BravBros Members to receive weekly Bravo News Updates, Monthly community zooms and more! Click the link below to sign up! thebros.memberful.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

When you're with Amex Platinum, you get access to exclusive dining experiences and an annual travel credit. So the best tapas in town might be in a new town altogether. That's the powerful backing of Amex. Terms and conditions apply. Learn more at Amex.ca. www.ca slash yamex Did you lock the front door? Check.

Close the garage door? Yep. Installed window sensors, smoke sensors, and HD cameras with night vision? No. And you set up credit card transaction alerts, a secure VPN for a private connection and continuous monitoring for our personal info on the dark web. Uh, I'm looking into it.

Stress less about security. Choose security solutions from TELUS for peace of mind at home and online. Visit TELUS.com. Total Security to learn more. Conditions apply. As there's a drive in a deep left field by Castellanos. Oh man, it's 8 o'clock. And so that'll make it a...

I don't need the spotlight. I shine just fine. Hi, I'm Karma. And yes, I am a bitch. Brov Bros. Welcome back, everybody, to another episode of Bravo Bros. Your favorite podcast from The Bros for everybody. Whoever wants to listen.

I am your co-host, Steele Russell, joined as always by the one and only oof-mogoof. I use it already. Got to come back quick, right? Otherwise, you're going to forget. I almost forgot it. Well, if those of you keep being score at home, this will be our third episode tonight. Things get wacky in the second episode. I think we did pretty well in the second episode of the night.

I don't know about this one. Oh, shit, this is our third one. We're going to get crazy. Yeah, this is going to be a good time. Hey. But we have a lot to discuss. Obviously, we left off with the Shannon issue and Tamara and all of that. I'm sure there's no way that's the end of it.

There's so much more there that I would imagine that I'll be back. Like we talked about episode one, I'm not sure what we have in store for episode two of this reunion. There's a lot of ways we could go. It looks like it's going to be Alexis coming out. You think so? So that'll obviously kickstart a lot more between Tamara and Shannon because Tamara's going to take Alexis aside. Let's be honest. and uh yeah i guess maybe and then johnny jay episode three you think he's coming out oh without a doubt

yeah definitely johnny jay i would imagine we're gonna get johnny jay in the beginning of the episode please yeah love of god trigger warning trigger warning johnny jay and his fake dumb teeth and his fucking scarf yeah i bet me he wears a scarf in his cross and a fucking affliction t-shirt under a jacket probably that's what he's gonna walk out mark my words he's coming out wearing that because he thinks he looks cool because Alexis said he does. I could see him shaving his head and going bald like Lex Luthor. I could see that too. Or I could also see like a cool guy haircut.

Or no, he'll go for like the new John Travolta look, a big beard and then the shaved head. The shaved head and huge beard. That's an interesting premise. I would imagine that we're going to get a Johnny J appearance. There's no way that that dude didn't sign a waiver. Even if he will. He probably sent one to Bravo without being asked.

Yeah. I'll be there if you want me to. And he just comes out in a giant, giant penis costume. That would be great. Peter the balls. Just waddle out. Just waddles out. Yeah.

And then your head actually is a dickhead, you dickhead. But let's get back to business. We start this one with Katie, who, look, she had a terrible start. And I don't know looking back if she was set up by Gina, if she was using Gina to set this thing up. It's all a little bit convoluted when you, when you, when you, think about it. But the root of the whole thing is, who gives a shit about the paparazzi anymore? If I'm Heather and she comes out, it's a newcomer, you're swinging at Heather Dubro with some old bullshit, you talk to the head of paparazzi, whatever the fuck that means, you swung and

missed. The only reason this drug on as long as it did was because Heather suddenly had this hatred for Katie, like, how dare you? It's not that deep. It's a housewife show. She tried to swing, she missed, and then she played all season playing catch-up, and guess what? Did a good job. Katie, by the end of the season, earned her right to come back next season. Heather, playing it the way that she did and taking it very seriously, really just confirms, one, that the paparazzi thing is true. I'm going to go as far as to say, maybe even the cheating rumors are true.

Like, who the fuck knows? Like, seriously, like, as angry as she's getting and as pissed off as she is and going after Katie for even bringing it back up. we saw her flounder last year again we said it wasn't that big of a deal it would have been funny if you had said well you know maybe we did maybe we did there was a lot of rumors circulate and so we just wanted to kind of put them to bed and it's kind of funny that would have been fine we would have been over this nobody would have had the need to go back into this katie a newcomer wouldn't have tried to stumble onto the scene with this dumb story again you would have been in the clear but you handled it like shit last year and then this year for it to get under your skin so so much is insane to me and just tells me that everything's true. It's a red flag. It just tells me that everything is true and that you are still not good with it. Yeah, it's a, it's a crimson flag.

That shit is bright as hell. But during this initial intro to Katie, Gina is such an enigma to me in so many ways. You can never tell where she lies. No, you can't. And like, what I do know is that she does not want to piss off certain people. She always wants to be cool with Heather. She's up her ass, no matter what. She's afraid of Tamara.

She's terrified of Tamara. She's only going to go after people, and we saw it this season. Who are the only two people that Gina set her sights on? Just Katie and Shannon. And Jen. Shannon, not really. She kind of went after Shannon a little bit, but... She went, okay, so Shannon...

I think that was just low-hanging fruit and everybody was kind of doing that. So, okay, to further my point, you went after somebody that was very... very vulnerable, easy to attack, and Shannon. You went after Katie, who's a newcomer, and he went after Jen, who is her second season, and she had a top of year last year. That's the only people that you're comfortable with going after because you're afraid of the other women in the group.

And that bummed me out, because there are moments where I really like Gina. There's moments that Gina pisses me off. All said and done, like, I enjoy Gina on the screen because she's such a wild card, but what pisses me off is the groveling, pointing fingers at other people so you can stay in the,

good light of other people like that's what gets really annoying to me and it starts out immediately it's like why do you have a vendetta against gina still thinks that katie set gina up yeah but watching it's funny because it's not what hathies like did gina set me up right and the chances are if both of you were looking at each other saying did you set me up then neither of you were set up right that's what it says to me it just seems like you guys kind of fumbled through this whole thing Gina, when we get to see the scenes from before when they do that and they're bringing up the whole paparazzi thing,

Gina laughs initially and then has a few days to think about it and says, oh shit, this is almost sort of like the Heather talking to Angie Kay in the other show. Oh shit, that was on camera. I don't want Heather to be mad at me because I was laughing at that. Meanwhile, we did also see Tamara and

Emily sitting there snickering about this saying, oh, Heather's not going to be happy about this, but boy, oh boy, am I happy that that's true. Yep. We don't hear anything about that. Of course not. This was in the show. We all saw it. Why is Heather not looking at the two idiots next to her on the couch and saying, you guys said that it was true in your little fucking date over there when you heard about this? No, of course we're not going to talk

about this because we're still going to go after Katie. So yes, the two of you set each other up, which means that neither of you were set up. Right. It just doesn't make any sense to me. It makes no sense. And the fact that Gina's first real line of this show, other than the Shannon stuff is to attack Katie about her house. It was bizarre. She's like, well, you told me that you owned your house. She's like, well, I don't. What the fuck was going on with us?

Yeah, who gives this shit? She's like, well, we leased to own. She's like, well, you moved. You moved and he lived in a different house. And Emily jumps in, she's like, well, that's confusing. And the only thing. I'm a lawyer. Yeah, and I'm a lawyer.

So I need to know the ins and out to this whole thing. Gina just says there's inconsistencies, which in that point I'm like, okay, fine, fine, fair. There's inconsistencies with some of the stuff. that she says, okay, there's inconsistencies with the majority of housewives because they say certain things to certain people. I don't even know if they're lying at that point. I think they forget what they say sometimes. But Jen, I love Jen. Like, Jen's so great and she had such a great season. And I love that she can play middle of the road, like genuinely, because everyone's like, I'm neutral. And then they're not. Jen just goes, look, just ask her. If you got a problem,

just fucking ask her. It's so easy. Hey, I thought you moved. to San Diego and then you took a dig at Emily on Instagram, which is fucking funny. Take all the digs at Emily on Instagram, especially as something like where you're like, I'm in my backyard in Orange County. I'm here in Orange County. That's funny. When Jen sticks up with her, they're like, oh, you're just going to believe her. It's like, why wouldn't? She's giving me no reason to not believe her. The other side of the couch was so, this was the dumbest part of the entire reunion. I feel like, it was a witch hunt. Just because, yeah, it was a full-on witch hunt. And we should have thought that this was going to go way too far. And it did

go way too far. I just wanted this part to be over. Because it was so dumb. You're playing semantics with where she lives and what's going on. And Gina, I get it that you're hungry for another real estate sell and you want to make some money. I can talk about this one. I can talk about this. And maybe if you let me get in there,

I can get some commission so I can build more bunk beds. I understand that because that is your livelihood. That makes sense to me because you're a little confused about what's going on there because you're still new to the game. Whatever. Emily sat on the other side after Jen said, ask her and said, that's

the thing with you. There's always an excuse. Katie's fucking explaining, which seems like a very convoluted situation where her, what was it, her father was dying? Her father in law? Her father-in-law was sick and, like... No, that's when she was going to go to

see her birth bomb in Korea. Right, but no, she did also have to go to San Diego a lot because somebody was sick in the hospital. Maybe that's who it was. I think that's who it was. Okay, so we already know. So there you go. This works. She has to go, and she's in San Diego for a long period of time because she's taking care of a family member who's sick. Makes sense to me, but you say that you live in Orange County, you were in San Diego for a while.

I'm sorry. Do any one of you except for Gina have a fucking job? Heather lives in L.A. half the time. Heather lives in L.A. all the time. Nobody gives a shit about that. Andy asks how the renovations are going. They get to talk about their renovations together because they're both Uber rich. Fine, whatever.

You get to go after Katie because she's in a different city for a little. little bit of time, taking care of somebody who's sick, and then call her out on what asset she owns and doesn't own, this whole thing was so dumb to me. And for you to say all she has is excuses all the time when she's just trying to explain and answer the question that was given to her, what is going on here? Well, this is what happens. And it's very, it's, you know, she didn't expect to answer this, so she doesn't have anything ready, but she goes through it and it makes sense to probably anyone with common sense

watching. I just don't understand how you're going to sit there and go, there's always an excuse with you. For what? You're not accusing her of murder and she says, yeah, I was in San Diego at the time. That's an excuse. You're taking care of somebody who's sick. Well, you could have been around here for the murder. Like, no. It's just not at all how that works.

And I just didn't get it. And it just showed how goddamn dumb Emily is. Like, it's just a peek behind the curtain. You're not a real lawyer. You're a patent lawyer. Sorry at all the patent lawyers out there. You're smart. You're smart. Emily's not because she's not practicing. it's just crazy that they took this approach and then you can tell there was definitely a pre-reunion meeting

between the ladies on the right usually i'd like to be a fly on that wall i don't want any god no i don't want to be that because they're sitting they clearly dug up as much as they possibly could on katy again why there's a vendetta against katy is beyond me it makes no fucking sense i also think it's the dirtiest way to play this game and not in a fun way when you just go back and somebody's past and start pulling things out that have no relevance to what we're talking about now. She's like, well, what about the lawsuit about the T-shot? Let's talk

about that. She's like, oh, the one that was dismissed because somebody claimed that they overheard somebody talking about a product that we then went on to sell. Yeah, that's over and done with. By the way, that was unseen footage because it got scrapped because it was probably boring. There's nothing there. Why are we bringing it up

at the reunion? And why do you think that this is some big fucking hit here that you're going to be like, oh, we got you? And then you bring up Sutton, who decided to get involved. She was saying that she used me because she promised to bring golfers to Augusta. I went during the Masters and she didn't. All right, fine. A big deal.

We were invited to that, too. We were invited to that. We couldn't make it. We're going to get down. We're going to get that point. But, all right, there's an inconsistency, sure. But why is that relevant to what's happening here? They're trying to paint her as this big liar, but all the stuff that they're bringing up

is relatively trivial and it all is trying to point and this is what they were trying to do Heather we got you girl we're going to paint her as a liar so we can finally prove once and for all that this paparazzi thing isn't true so we can put it to bed finally as you've said in two episodes now back to back if Heather had stopped discussing it if she had leaned into it and said yep you got me any of those you're the one furthering the rumor Heather you're the one. We've now been talking about paparazzi for two years. Yep. That's not a joke. Two seasons of talking about this non-issue because you Heather take it too seriously. You Heather continue to push this stupid-ass narrative. And then we get to the Christmas party of it all. Like Sutton's

Christmas party. Well, I've heard three different stories and Katie's like, this is the story. Katie's like not for me. Yeah, like the story was, I walked up to you. You were at the bar with Camille. you saw me and you looked the other way. I'm still speaking. I'm still speaking. Shut up. Everybody talks over each other. You're not more important than the other women in this room.

That's a tough look as well. You don't get to play the fun Heather Dubrow, turn your nose up at other people card right now because you're not playing well. When you're playing well, that's funny. When you're not, it seems dismissive and rude. That's what's happening now because you look like shit. This does not seem like a real fucking problem.

This seems like a weird attack. on a newcomer because she hurts your feelings and question the paparazzi thing and you just can't get over it. I just don't understand it. Like, how does a housewife who's been on a show for this long not have the wherewithal to understand?

If this is really something that you want to go away, you have to ignore it or you have to downplay it. Those are your options. It is very simple. Anybody living can tell you. That is the only way that you can get some sort of weird rumor out is by, either owning up to it in a funny way, i.e. downplaying it or just ignore it and just let it go

because guess what? She's a newcomer. You shouldn't be threatened by her. Correct. You shouldn't be worried about what kind of information she might have. She already fumbled over herself by saying that she talked to the president of the paparazzi in L.A. That's enough right there. That person doesn't exist. No. Nobody exists like that. You could just point to that and be like, oh yeah, who are you talking to? This guy and this make up a fucking name. That's all you have to do because you can immediately attack her credibility in a funny way, and then Katie will learn and she'll move on, and nobody will bring it up again.

During the Volvo Fall Experience event, discover exceptional offers and thoughtful design that leaves plenty of room for autumn adventures. And see for yourself how Volvo's legendary safety brings peace of mind to every crisp morning commute. This September, leased a 2026 X-90 plug-in hybrid from $599 biweekly at 3.99% during,

the Volvo Fall Experience event. Conditions apply, visit your local Volvo retailer or go to explore Volvo.com. The twisted tale of Amanda Knox is an eight-episode Hulu Original Limited series that blends gripping pacing with emotional

complexity, offering a dramatized look as it revisits the wrongful conviction of Amanda Knox for the tragic murder of Meredith Kircher and the relentless media storm that followed. The twisted tale of Amanda Knox is now streaming only on Disney Plus.

Oh, this is it, the day you finally ask for that big promotion. You're in front of your mirror with your Starbucks coffee. Be confident, assertive, remember eye contact, but also remember to blink. Smile, but not too much, that's weird. What if you aren't any good at your job? What if they demo out you instead? Okay, don't be silly, you're smart, you're driven, you're going to be late if you keep talking to the mirror.

This promotion is yours. Go get him. Starbucks. It's never just coffee. Katie brought it up that one time. She talked to Gina. Yes, she did talk to everybody else in the group before she talked to you. Again, nobody points out that Tamara's the one who jumped the gun and told Heather.

I don't know why. Low-hanging fruit. Very easy. We just watched it. They don't do that. You just need to ignore it. Otherwise, you're going to get talking heads like me sitting over here saying, Terry probably did cheat on you.

So, like, that sucks for you, Heather. But now you keep telling us. and over and over again that this is a big deal. And now I'm wondering why it's a big deal. And it's probably because your husband cheated on you. So that sucks. You keep saying. I'm really, I'm doubling and tripling down at this point because she won't let it go.

So it means that there's something there. Something's not adding up. It doesn't make a lot of sense that you are carrying this this far. And I agree. It points to a lot more red flags than if you had just let it go. Gina jumps in again. She's like, well, you know, this nothing adds up with you. And at least, at the very least.

Katie's like, look, Gina, I'm sorry. This was not a setup. I was new. Seems plausible. Heather, that's it. She's a newcomer. She took a shot. Trying to make a name for herself.

Yes, and it didn't go well. But bury her then in the beginning of the season. Turn your nose up at her in only a way that Heather Dubrow can do. Turn your nose up and say, I'm not dealing with this. You're new. And then she got dragged back in because Tamara was probably up her ass and Gina was up her I was saying, I can't believe Katie. We saw Gina do it all season.

Out of nowhere, she would bring up Katie to Heather because she knew she could get, like, close to Heather and, like, pal around with her. She's like, oh, can you believe what Katie did? She's such a liar. Isn't she, Heather? And Heather gets amped up. And now we're here talking about it still.

And now we're pulling things from Katie's past up to just try to discredit her for a dumb paparazzi rumor. She's a fucking newbie that had a mediocre season until the end. And she does not deserve this type of attention. But we agree that she did a good job somehow recovering from that and then became a nice person towards the end and she's friends with Jen and we love Jen and that's good because that'll solidify her moving forward.

She does not deserve this type of attention from veteran housewives. No, crazy. Correct. Correct. And instead of now letting it lie, this is when that side of the room really outs themselves for wow, you guys just sat in a room together digging up shit about Katie and you thought that it was going to play well to the audience. That's my favorite part about these setups and these ambushes. You can tell that they sat around going,

oh, this is going to be good. Oh, we got her now. We got her. We got her because falsely accusing people, that's kind of your thing. Katie already knows. She's like, here we go. She's like, oh, my God. And we get into this road rage incident.

And she goes to the whole story. Which side of this story is true? I do not know. I don't have police footage. I don't have anything that will tell me, What actually happened. What I do have is from the Bravo docket did a great breakdown of this whole scenario. Because when we get into the road rage incident, allegedly, Katie was texting and driving.

Some dudes saw it, started barking at her on the street, yelling at her, pulling in front of her, chasing after, whatever. She probably told the guy to go fuck himself and gave him the finger. Whatever. Chaos ensues. He swerves in front of her on a side road, gets out of his car. she calls the cops he gets tased or some shit and and knocked down and taken to jail that's her side of the story heather's side of the story she followed him to his house got out called the cops said he wasn't leaving her alone wouldn't let her leave cops tased him put him in jail whatever apparently this court summons was sent to her current address which was the address of her

ex-husband that she never received therefore never showed up in court wasn't able to defend herself. And when that happens, I forget the exact term. It's on the Bravo dockets page. It's a very interesting post. But when that happens, it's a no contest, whatever. So she wasn't able to defend herself. She wasn't there. She's immediately found guilty on the matter. And that means that her side of the story is never told. It means the only thing that goes in the report was the side of the story of the other guy. So that's why when you read the police report, it's like, okay, or the court documents, I mean, here's what happened. And there's no disputing it because she wasn't there to defend herself.

When the rest of the ladies there are like, well, that doesn't make sense. They have to serve you in the Bravo docket. They say, this can happen. They can send a summons to your house. If you're not there to receive it, it can still be sent there if it's your legal address, which it was still her legal address. All of these things are adding up. What actually happened?

I don't know. But the big thing that they're holding on to, Emily, most specifically, which is is the most ironic fucking thing in the world because she works for the innocence project and she's sitting there going oh so the cops lied yeah guess what they do sometimes that's not fucking crazy at all you work for a association that tries to get people out of jail because they're falsely accused who are they falsely accused by and then imprisoned by the police you're literally the walking contradiction I've ever seen in my life.

How on earth can you sit there and be like, you think the cops not when you work against people that lie? It is fucking insane. And the more that Katie talks about it, obviously, she expected it to pop up in some weird part of her brain, which, why would this come up? But I'm happy that she was at least ready for it because she immediately rolls her eyes. She says she was with her kids. Let's just use our brains here.

We don't know what the fuck happens. but the idea that she then chased some guy down and followed him back to his house so that she could then confront him while her kids are in the car and they're young is pretty crazy it's pretty fucking nuts if that's true then she's certifiable yeah which doesn't seem like she is i didn't get the vibe nope not really catching that kind of vibe i don't think so especially if she's already going through a divorce with her husband at that point and she's already fighting for custody and doing all of that and the fact that once she starts talking about me with my kids do you think I would do that and you guys say well what is the deal with your kids that is unbelievable it was that they would stoop so low i have a very low bar for people like tamara but i thought that emily and heather were much higher than that hether didn't say it i don't want to love to say it and heather did apologize after which it's okay you know what you're exonerated a little bit whatever because you at least did have a heart she's just whatever on the thing she's just hanging on by a threat and hope I can't get that out of my head. Thanks a lot, Meredith and Seth. She is just sitting there, and she's along for the ride at this point. Emily's leading the charge. I can't even blame Timor for this as much as I want to.

Oh, this is Emily. Emily is going full bore after her for fucking what? She brings up a custody issue over what? It's unbelievable to me that you would stoop that low. I was astounded, especially considering Emily has children, especially considering more often than not, she's fairly level-headed. I was stunned when she goes, well, let's talk about your custody issues. Why did your husband have full custody of the kids?

And she goes, it's weird to me because here in California, well, it's not fucking California. No. It's Georgia. She was in Georgia. It's a completely different state. And there's different laws in different states. As you should know, because you're a lawyer, sure. The only thing going through my head is I bet you it took her like 50 times to pass the bar.

Because we do know that it took Shane like 80 times to pass the bar. Yeah, Shane took quite a few times again. And by the way, who was paying for your lifestyle while Shane was studying for the bar? The in-laws. Yeah, the in-laws. Okay. Her going through and doing all of this was insane. You just did the craziest thing in the world by bringing up something like that from eight, nine years ago.

You could have just stopped there. Why push it? You should have. You shouldn't have gotten that far to begin with. Why on earth do you feel the need? I know what you're doing. We all know what you're doing. You're just trying to discredit her to get Heather's back, which is fucking insane to begin with.

why do you need to go this far? Especially to take it to the point where you say on camera to a mother whose kids are going to potentially see this show either you were unfit or you didn't want anything to do with them and I feel like not enough attention is being called to this on socials and other platforms because that is such a deplorable thing to say to somebody and now she has to defend herself and say, was fucking homeless after my divorce. I was living in a facility. We don't get more information

on that. We don't know what kind of facility that was. And if she doesn't want to share it, then we don't need to know. And the other part of it is she had full contact with her kids throughout this whole thing. She was trying to get her life on track. And to make it worse, you try to lawyer yourself out of this by explaining this to us as though we don't have common sense. This is not something where we need a legal explanation. Well, like you said, in the state of California, you're either unfit or you have to sign away your rights to the kids. Like, yeah, no shit. I'm pretty sure that's universal. All right? That's not that crazy to think about. But now she's sitting here defending herself as to why she didn't have custody of her children,

which I'm sure that was the toughest time in her life. You're reminding her of that. She has to remember when she didn't have her kids, how hard she had to fight to get her kids. And now she's sitting here defending herself to you? Why? Because you want to be buddy, buddy with Heather? So you dug up some deep, deep shit to try to go against her. Like, this goes so far beyond rule number one of leaving the kids out of it. This is such damning behavior on Emily's part that I was stunned. I was like, you're a fucking asshole, bro. Like, that's the meanest shit I think I've ever heard.

You just told her that she was either unfit to parent or she didn't want to have her kids. And her kids are going to potentially see this. And in Emily's head, I'm sure this is justified. because her 19-year-old daughter may have talked to her eight-year-old kids about Heather being mean. Correct. That seems comparable. That's not even remotely. It's not the same thing.

Seems like the same thing. Got you back. Instead of, oh, my God, how cool is it that you are so down on your luck, you fought your ass off, got your kids back, built a life for yourself, and now you're co-parenting with your ex. And that's the other thing that this mess on. Misses on this all the time. That is a good moment after all of this, which I'm sure half the cast didn't. not know and it seemed like Shannon Shannon was genuinely

bewildered. No, she was like, she kept checking in like, wait, what happened? Yeah, whoa. Can we talk more about this? I don't know. Where were you? What happened? Nobody goes like, yes, Heather goes over and apologizes afterwards whatever, but no one else sits there and goes, Katie, you

were able to do all of that and then get to this great life with Matt to the point that your daughter who, by the way, if you're really going to question her motherhood, her daughter is getting her name change to Matt's last name because she feels comfortable and safe and loved in that household.

But yeah, we're going to question what she did. Fuck off. The absolute scumbag behavior by the two of them. I don't under, or mostly just Emily. I don't understand how they're able to do that. And how is no one else going over and saying, good for you. Like, you got this far. You're on this fucking TV show. You have a beautiful

house. Rent to own or own. I don't give a shit. Who gives a fuck? You live there. You live there. I just can't imagine that nobody else goes over and says congratulations. Like, that's crazy. I didn't know that you started from that. Which, we didn't know that she started from that.

She's a new housewife. We didn't get into any of that because she didn't feel comfortable sharing it. Why are you blasting it now on a reunion just to get Heather's back or because you're still upset that maybe her daughter as a babysitter did that with your kids? It's fucking insane to me. Talk about three children, a teenager and two kids under the age of 10 that were, quote, unquote, talking shit. How embarrassing for you.

Everybody needs to go on social media and drag it. Emily. I mean, it was just ridiculous. I was stunned. I was like, you, you look awful in this moment. Of course than what Tahermer's done. It is. You came after her parenting. Like, legit. You questioned whether or not she wanted to be, like literally, let me lay it out in black and white. You questioned whether or not she wanted to be a mom to her children on national television and acted as though you were justified in doing so because you're trying to paint her as a liar. This has zero relevance to the show. Zero relevance. to Katie's character. It honestly speaks to Katie's character because, like you said,

wow, you went through all of that and look at you now. That's pretty fucking impressive, Emily. What did you do? You and Shane fucking sit there and take the in-laws money. What? What? And this is somebody that I've liked for a long time. I was an Emily fan. Fuck that. I'm out now. The fact that she can stoop to that level tells me all I need to know. Hit pause on whatever you're listening to and hit play on your next adventure. This fall get double points on every qualified stay. Life's the trip.

Make the most of it at BestWestern. Visit bestwestern.com for complete terms and conditions. This episode is brought to you by MuMeu. Introducing Mutine, the new feminine fragrance by the iconic fashion house. Mutein captures the youthful, unconventional essence of the Mewewew Girl, brought to life by a gourmand, intimate and enveloping, scent of wild strawberry and brown sugar accords. Mutine is not a statement, but a knowing glance, a sweet rebellion, lighthearted and laced with wit, a gesture made for oneself. Discover the new

fragrance, Mutine, now available in Canada. When your investors, customers, and workers demand more from your business, make it happen with SAP. The AI-powered capabilities of SAP can help you streamline costs, connect with new suppliers, and manage payroll, even when your business is being pulled in different directions to deliver a quality product at a fair price while paying your people what they're worth too so your business can stay unfazed learn more at sap dot com slash uncertainty and i think one of the worst parts about all of this is based on what happens in this next segment emily was just getting warmed up oh she's just getting started she's just getting she's brushing off her law degree she's brushing off all of her books you have to explain to us immunity

God, damn it, dude. Like, I can't imagine going through and doing all of that to another human being and then feeling like I still have energy left to discuss the community. Like, that is crazy talk that you're able to do that. How do you not watch all of that unfolds, then take a breath? Because they do take a break after this. And you come back with more energy for more lawyer bullshit? Crazy.

I just, like, you should, it should set in, like, what the fuck did I just do? Yes. And that just shows that you have. no morals. Yes. That's all it is. Yep, but that tees us up for Jen and Ryan. And this is news to us, and I thought it was interesting. So like Jen knew about the FBI thing. Ryan knew they'd known for about seven months because Ryan reached out to the FBI. Now look, there's obviously some things that will raise red flags here. There's obviously a lot to this story that we don't know. Yes, we're all aware that if you get immunity, it means you're offering something in return.

Whether or not that's access to the account, the phone, the computer, whatever you needed to do, whether or not that's flipping on somebody and being a snitch, I don't know because we're not privy to that information. What we do know is, yes, obviously, Emily, that's how you get immunity. If you've watched one Law & Order episode of any of them in the whole franchise, any Dick Wolf show, you know what fucking immunity is. A second time Dick Wolf's call. Yeah, a lot of Dick Wolf. But Dick Wolves? For her, Dick Wolves, plural. But for her to sit there and be like, I'm a lawyer, let me go ahead and explain this to all of you.

Such dead air, too. It was crazy. It was five minutes of her explaining something that we already knew. I was so stunned, bro. And they didn't get us any closer. And look, I know what you're trying to do. You're trying to say he must have given information on Matt in order to get immunity. We all know that.

We all know that. And Jen says, well, he wouldn't. flip on him, that's his best friend. We all know that Jen is very oblivious to the things that go on around her. Absolutely, yes. So that's, you know, I'm not agreeing with any of that. He may have flipped. We don't know.

We may have flipped. We don't know. But it sounds like she knows a little bit of information. Giving the FBI access to the bank account, that seems like all he did. I'm sure there's more involved, of course. There's definitely a lot more red flags there. We did not need five minutes of Emily explaining something that we already knew. We could have spent that five minutes.

a lot better, maybe some questions, maybe ask Jen a little bit more. And it seems like Jen's M.O. for this whole part was, well, I don't know. And that's the right move. She probably doesn't, by the way. Ryan definitely only tells her what she needs to know. Yes. And we know that. That's why she didn't know what he did for so long.

He just lives life. He loves life. It's great. Like, he doesn't do anything. I love going to the Bahamas. Yeah. Twice a week. The more that I watch all of the interactions of the right side of the room with

Jen. The more I hear disparaging comments, them questioning Ryan's relationship, all of that. All I'm thinking of is there's a whole lot of jealousy going on in this group, and it's because Jen, who was down and out on her luck, moved in with a guy that they don't approve of, doing

some borderline sketchy shit, and lo and behold, when the dust settles, they're still fine. And he's still rich. He's not going to jail. Jen gets to ride off into the sunset with his dirt bag, and all is well. and all of them are left sitting there with their hat in their hand going,

fuck, it worked out. I was so sure this guy was the biggest piece of shit cheating on her, all of this. Are we sitting here saying Ryan's a great guy? No. Are we sitting here saying Ryan took care of her kids, took her in, paid for all of her shit, and didn't seem to bat an eye? Yes. So credit where credits do sometimes.

And I think that the root of all of this is all of the ladies that were talking shit, all of them that believed that Ryan was the worst guy in the world, that this was going to blow up in Jen's face the fact that they were proven wrong via immunity in a deal I think drives them fucking insane and they look stupid and they're jealous of this situation

Jen gets to literally live her life and go to the Bahamas the day after she gets home from London buy whatever dresses she wants put it all on Ryan's card live in this beautiful house with their kids and she came from like getting kicked out and evicted from another house

and never had to struggle and all of the other ladies are pissed off that it worked out. They're very jealous. They're super jealous. They're super annoyed at all of it. And the thing that I've been thinking about is he lived that lifestyle. And we always thought, you know, maybe he is siphoning some money from this. He's probably getting paid here and there or whatever. He wouldn't, in my mind, he wouldn't have gotten full immunity if he was involved financially.

If he took seven figures or more, there's no way that he gets immunity. because they would give him a latent sentence in my mind. Again, we're not lawyers. We don't know how this works. And yes, the business partner, his best friend, whatever, is going to jail. Yeah. He's going to have to pay hefty fines. He's going to jail for like 18 years or something.

But if Ryan is getting full immunity and probably not paying fines as we've been reading over the last couple of weeks as more information comes out, then he probably didn't have his hand in that pot. Yes, he was still going to Vegas. Yes, he's still going to the Bahamas all the time. But maybe he's gambling here and there with his own money. He clearly has some sort of. of source of income that is not from all of this, that is getting him a lot of money and is

able to pay for Jen's stuff. That's an even better point. So why do we care? Because if he was doing sketchy shit and the FBI's digging into his account, they're looking at everything else. So if he's spending $2,000, which we'll get into in the next episode, if he's spending $2,000 at Nordstrom for a dress that she's going to wear to a tea party, it would probably show up on that account.

Yes. And again, we're not sitting here saying that there's not some shady shit. shit that Ryan's done or he doesn't appear to be a little sketch. We're just going to be objective and point out if we're looking at all sides of this argument, when it comes down to it, the last clip

of the last episode, the season finale, Ryan was never charged. In this episode, he got immunity. For what? We don't know. That means he did something to get immunity. For sure. Is he blameless? Clearly not. He's got immunity. So something happened. Was he charged?

No. So you don't have a fucking leg to stand on your whole advocacy. They just go about it the wrong way. There's just an easier way to go about it. They go so hard. All you have to do is just poke and ask a couple of questions. And let her go. And let

her go and talk about it. And you know what? At the end of the day, yes, he is still a sketchy person. Yes, he still does have a checkered past going after women who are married. Those things are still true. They are still valid. But for whatever reason, you guys put all of your eggs into this basket and then the basket comes crashing

down because he gets immunity and you're stuck you don't know what to do all you had to do was just question his motives and call him a little shady and say jen we're just a little worried for you that's enough that could at least raise an eyebrow and get people asking questions instead they do this and they go full bore and it's just not there anymore she's like it's the opposite of everything i read it doesn't matter he's got immunity period well i read congratulations emily you can read yeah i read this it doesn't matter he's got immunity well i saw this it doesn't matter he's got immunity. She even said she was reading it like for nights. Yeah, why? You're so weird. That's a bizarre thing to do just to prove a fucking

while you were also reading case studies from fucking eight, nine years ago before Katie. Over a Katie's thing. Like what you have too much time on your hands and then she ends it with if you guys just admit that he made bad choices. Why do you need that? And I already figured it out because then it gives you some vindication on this witch hunt that you've been on for Ryan that it wasn't off or not that you gain something out of this that all the time and energy you've spent researching your friend's boyfriend

is worth something because they can say we made some bad choices guess what Emily if he has immunity and then says some shit like I made some bad choices that may implicate

you can't say that and also Jen's not privy to it so she's not going to say that not to mention she's dating the guy so why the fuck would she sit here and disparage him to you who's trying to find every loophole you can because you've been up patent lawyering all night trying to find holes in the story and at the end of the day it's the same thing we said at the season finale he was not charged he has immunity every single

point that you're going to make has been made irrelevant by the court by giving this man immunity so you're sitting there you're an old man yelling at the clouds this has no weight it doesn't fucking matter he could have had his hand in the pot he could have guess what he's got immunity let it go like if you're worried about jen like you said say hey we're a little worried it seems sketchy we don't know all the details i read a lot of crazy shit we want to make sure you're good but by going out it so hard for so long all you're saying is i want to nail your boyfriend against the wall and my only sticking point is gone now and I look

stupid because I've clearly spent too much time thinking about this and I need you to at least admit something to at least tell me that it was sketchy. At least say that. Do something. Do anything because I'm losing my mind because I have too much time in my hands and I'm researching other housewives. You know what just occurred to me? What's the one

thing that Emily didn't actually get overly lawyery about? We went through like weird cases and all this shit she didn't the one thing that maybe she might know about was the shot tea the t shot oh yeah the which is a patent thing why didn't you get involved in that why do we have to hear you drone on and on about what immunity is and going eight nine years ago into katy's past but you don't talk about the one thing the patent law actually might know Jesus I didn't think about that that is so

stupid what would have been the one area of expertise that we might actually listen to you Because it would be patent law. But instead, we're here talking about practice. Like, what the fuck? What a swing and a miss? It's so stupid. It's, oh, man, but I will say, as far as reunions go, it kicked off. Just as the season left, fucking flawless, no notes.

I mean, the right side of the room's a goddamn disaster, but they are burning out in tremendous this fashion. And it is enjoyable to watch. I'll tell you that much. But let's get to some questions. First one here from Becca Berzadeleon. That sounds right. That's definitely it. Did anyone believe Heather when she said she wasn't digging stuff up? No. What do you mean? Absolutely not. Oh, boy. from Mrs. Tanya 183, do you think Emily was Team Heather this reunion? What did you watch?

I don't know if it's a sarcastic question. Oh, okay. Did you put a smirk emoji on there? Nope, no smirk emoji. I'm just reading that as a sarcasm question. I hope that was sarcasm. I fucking hope so. Love you.

A little crossover question from Simply underscore Oni. Who is more delusional in their first? relationship. Jen from O.C. or Stacey from Potomac? Ooh. Probably Jen, just because the fact that she doesn't have more questions is alarming to me. And they might have questions behind closed doors, but there should be more questions. Like when you say publicly, I don't know what he does. And you live

in that house and you go to the Bahamas. You should ask a little bit. As far as Stacy goes, the jury's still out. Yeah. Because T.J. seems like he's into it. I don't know. And it's just a very strange relationship. I don't even know if they're allowed to hug. From Stacey Moss Seals. Why did Heather apologize to Katie when she clearly kept talking about her kids slash legal stuff? I think it's pretty much what I said that Emily should have felt, which is remorse.

Damage control. And feeling bad after watching it unfold. Yeah, after hearing like, wow, we just questioned whether or not she even wanted to be a mother to her children. I think Heather was like, I'm a mom. that's fucking mean and also damage control. From J.T.I. Inc., do you think Katie will be back next year? I hope so. I think she's earned it. I think her, like we've talked about many times, tough start, solid finish, and I think her saving grace is her friendship with Jen because

it's fun to watch. From Miranda E. 412, do you think more stuff will come out about Katie if she returns for a second season? I think hopefully not like crazy shit from 10 years ago but I do think that maybe you know the book was opened a little bit on Katie and if it invites her to talk more about what she went through and if she's open to doing that I think she could do that next year and kind of yeah and maybe and that's the other part like if there's more dirt if she has this checkered past of being kind of shady then maybe that will come out

I don't fucking know I do know that she's earned a right to come back here's a great one from which we addressed from S.E. Foster 430 working for the Innocence Project shouldn't Emily understand the police lie? Bro. Yeah.

That was that is a crazy connection. It was so fucking funny that she was like oh the police lie I was like you work for a company that legit goes up against the law.

What are we doing? And one last one here from K.H.8.01 Was the cast told to treat Shannon so horribly? Why did Bravo allow this behavior?

I don't think they ever tell people to treat it. I think they point people in certain directions at times or maybe say, hey, this is working. I think if you look at Tamara's behavior for her entire tenure on this show before she got whacked and then when she got back onto the show, this is her M.O. She goes for the jugular. She doesn't care what she says to get to her end goal. She'll say literally lie about anything. So no, I think that that was just the low-hanging fruit. and I think the biggest part of that was the backlash

that Shannon originally got last year. Tamara thought it was a home run. She's like, oh, I'll just go after her all season because people hate her. Little did they know that people would start to give Shannon some grace as she was working through it. I agree. That's all I got.

Well, can't wait for next week, or this week, I guess. This is a good reunion. It's a great show. Great season, and yeah. Brow brothers are out of here. See you later. The Old West is an iconic period of American history and full of legendary figures

whose names still resonate today. Like Jesse James, Billy the Kid, and Butch and Sundance, Sitting Bull, Crazy Horse, and Geronimo, Wyatt Earp, Batmasterson, and Bass Reeves, Buffalo Bill Cody, Wild Bill Hickok, the Texas Rangers, and many more. Hear all their stories on the Legend

of the Old West podcast. We'll take you to Tombstone, Deadwood, and Dodge City, to the plains, mountains, and deserts for battles between the U.S. Army and Native American warriors, to dark corners for the disaster of the Donner Party, and shining summits for achievements like the Transcontinental Railroad. We'll go back to the earliest days of explorers and mountain men, and head up through notorious Pinkerton agents and gunmen like Tom Horn. Every episode features narrative writing and cinematic music, and there are hundreds of episodes available to binge. I'm Chris Wimmer. Find Legends of the Old West, wherever you're listening now. American history is full of infamous tales that continue to captivate audiences,

decades or even hundreds of years after they happened. On the infamous America podcast, you'll hear the true stories of the Salem Witch Trials and the escape attempts from Alcatraz, of bank robbers like John Dillinger and Pretty Boy Floyd, of killers like Lizzie Borden and Charles stark weather, of mysteries like the Black Dahlia and D.B. Cooper, and of events that inspired movies like Goodfellas, Killers of a Flower Moon, Zodiac, Eight Men Out, and many more. I'm Chris Wimmer. Join me as we crisscrossed the country from the Miami Drug Wars and Dixie Mafia in the South, to mobsters in Chicago and New York, to arsonists, kidnappers, and killers in California, to unsolved mysteries in the heartland and in remote corners of Alaska.

Every episode features narrative writing and cinematic music, and there are hundreds of episodes available to binge. Find Infamous America, wherever you get your podcasts.