Bros & Shows - Who is Lying, Gretchen or Katie? Oh, Who Cares? (RHOC Full Recap)

Episode Date: August 26, 2025

What's up Bros? This season is not good. Sorry if you disagree but this is not good tv. The blogger storyline is here to stay and the majority agrees that its not the right route. Tamra didn't quit and goes into one of the most fascinating and borderline scary scenes of her in therapy. Heather is irritated by Tamra but still ends up on team Tamra. Gretchen apparently said more than she's letting on and Katie continues to be the main focus of the group. The story gets more and more convoluted and Jenn seems to forget the interaction entirely. It's falling flat. Hopefully they are able to shift the focus of the season but as of now... not looking great. And to all of you that have DM'd us saying you stopped watching but still listen to us. Thanks for the support.. but making us watch in your stead is mean. Love yas Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Summer's here, and you can now get all. Almost anything you need for your sunny days, delivered with Uber Eats. What do we mean by almost? Well, you can't get a well-groom lawn delivered, but you can get a chicken parmesan delivered. A cabana? That's a no, but a banana, that's a yes. A nice tan, sorry, nope. But a box fan, happily, yes. A day of sunshine, no.

A box of fine wines? Yes. Uber Eats can definitely get you that. Get almost, almost anything delivered with Uber Eats. Order now. Alcohol and select markets. Product availability may vary by Regency app for details. Who the hell thought it would be a good idea? idea to give Gina this much screen time.

Is that really what you're pointing out is the big issue for this show? Amongst many things, but why is Gina the main character this season? What the hell's going on in Orange County? I don't, dude. It would take us forever to figure that one out. Luckily, we have time to talk about. Shows, Bros and shows. I got to have me my pros and shows.

Bros and shows. Rose and shows. I got to have me, my Bros and shows. Good afternoon, everybody. Welcome back to another episode of Bros and Shows. I'm your co-host, Steele Russell, joined as always by the one and only shooter Krook Gooder. What's up, dude? I like that one.

Oh, wait, no, no, no, no, no, no. I have to redo it because I will forget it. The one and only Alliguder shooter. That works, too. Yeah. Surrogator. Yeah, yeah, Al-Gudor was right there, right there. He still went with crock.

Well, you know why, because the first thing... Are you going to edit this to make it look like you got it right the first time? No, I'll be genuine. But I did because the first thing the guy pointed out when it was the statue and the statue was of a crocodile. And they said, that's a crock. So I got stuck on crock. You know, it's kind of funny. I had this like...

And this just shows you where this show is. The first half of this episode was fucking boring as hell. There was nothing. And I really thought to myself, is this what happens when Tamara's not around? Is it really that boring? And then Tamara comes in for maybe the worst scene I've ever seen in my entire life. That was insane. And I'm like, oh, okay.

All right. Never mind. But like still. Everyone sucks. Somewhat entertaining in a way that only Tamara and her selfishness can actually do it. But yeah, dude, this show is a dumpster fire. Once again, it's just, it's terrible. This is three years ago, reincarnate.

I feel like we're having a fucking flashback. not as bad it's not as bad i think we're almost done i don't know what episode was this this was like eight oh fuck yeah what do you mean i thought we're not even halfway through hold on i'll tell you exactly where it is you know what it was i saw uh i guess it's episode 14 for miami and i'm like oh oc's pretty much the same so i guess they're gonna go on a collision course for their reunions um man we've like we're on season 19 yeah that was episode eight no that was episode seven.

Oh, no. There's so much time left. We're not even like a quarter of the way through. Dude, wait until Thanksgiving when we're finally like getting to the rear around. But you know what? We'll pick your spirits up, everybody. If you come to our live show on Thursday, September 11th at the city winery in

Philadelphia, we got me and the Goots on stage. We're talking to some potential guests. We will know this week and we will announce some of them. uh tickets are only 20 to 25 dollars so make sure you grab a ticket come hang out with us like i said 7 30 p m thursday september 11th at the city winery in philadelphia don't be a square be there plugs now they're not going to come yeah probably not i ruined it i ruined is this what we're going to get at the show this is this the level of entertainment we can expect is this the content no i'm out anyway yeah so uh wow all right this sucks yeah i don't we just jump in

let me just dive it yeah episode seven episode seven you know what it's so funny too because it does feel like it's been on for so much longer and we've already started getting the messages whether it's comments or dms or reviews really uh from people saying that they're done with OC and they're just going to listen to us so i know maybe we were like all right yeah Yeah, that checks out for, you know, episode 12. But dude, what are we doing? Yeah. And my favorite, and I forgot to respond to him this last time.

My favorite is after every episode, we get a synopsis slash why we're wrong about Tamara from Ryan. You can always always get it from the stone man. Always expect something after the episode airs. Yeah, there certainly was a time when Tamara would have a scene like she has in this episode where I would think to myself, there's no way Ryan's going to be able to explain his way out of this one. He always does. No, he always does. Always does.

So I'm not surprised. And speaking of Ryan, we have our members community Zoom this Wednesday night at 9 p.m. Or 8 p.m. I believe. 8 p.m. this Wednesday, our members community Zoom, we are back. Our community Zoom is back. So if you want to join in on the fun and be able to talk to shoot her and I face-to-face, shoot the shit a little bit, talk some Bravo, hang out. Make sure you join our members program. Our exclusive episode is out already for the week.

We have our live episode taping at some point this week. We'll do a live Zoom or sorry, just a live recording. And if you are part of the members program, you can watch the recording, comment along, and join in on the fun. Plug. That's two plugs. That is two plugs. I'm doing everything I can to avoid starting this episode. Let's just jump in.

Just do it. The sooner is over the better. We start out with everyone calling their significant others and going over the Tamara stuff. You got Jen and Ryan, you got Gretchen and Slade, you got Katie and Matt. Here's why blogger's storylines suck so hard. It's all hearsay. All we have to go on is what one person says, what one person denies, what one person claims she knows because she talked to somebody else.

You go down this rabbit hole of, I talk to this journalist, I talk to this reporter, I talk to my friend, I talk to my maid. And you get these crazy stories, you get completely contradictory information, and we are left to sit at home and go, I believe her. Well, I believe her. And then you go on Twitter, and if you believe X, you're an asshole. If you believe Y, you're a dickhead. So there's no winning.

We're never going to get to the bottom of it. And all we have to do is sit here and wait for more people to come on screen and change the story. That's annoying. I don't think that the discourse is going to be nearly as bad as it's been in the past. People don't care. People are done. People really just do not care to even talk about the blogger stuff. Everybody's pretty much on the same page, which is very weird in the Housewives world in the big 20.

And O.C. Usually you do have a good contingent, like some sort of contingency of a lot of people over here that are believing Tamara. And this is a good storyline. And this is what we're going to do. No, nobody wants to watch this. And people are lumping it in with Beverly Hills. They're saying the same thing they said about Beverly Hills. It's just boring. It's stale. And this is once again, another blogger issue. And I think that really the root is we know, like you just said, we're not going to get any hard facts. There's not going to be any evidence. If there was evidence, we would. have already seen it. And I don't really think Kiki's the problem because she met with Katie and had a nice lunch and took a picture. The problem's still the cast because somebody in that cast for multiple people. I'm not trying to throw shade of Kiki Monique. No, no. Anyone's going to take that lunch, you know? Yeah, anybody's going to take that lunch. And it seems like they had mutual friends. So again, like I'm not blaming Kiki Oneik. It's not like the blogger that was involved in the beginning of the season because that blogger, that's not a journalist. That blogger reached out to another housewife and said, hey, I sat down with Katie.

this is what she's saying. So, like, you wanted to get involved. Kiki's more just kind of thrown into it because she took a picture and they knew that she sat down the lunch with Katie. But again, Kiki's going to come on to try to corroborate a story. We don't know what that story is going to be, which side she's going to be on, what she's going to say. The problem is that people on this cast saw that picture and said,

ooh, now I need to reach out to Kiki. Ooh, now I need to reach out to a journalist that knows Kiki to find out what happened. A reputable journalist. Just like fucking, who cares? Like, seriously. who gives a shit you all do it every housewife does it there's always things if we had this every season which we could easily have this we've had people on we've had housewives on we've had people from different shows on we've had people reach out with shit that we don't relay to you

because we think it's stupid it's incredibly stupid so if this is going to happen and it could happen with every season it would be a dumpster fire we would have to throw the whole network out and this is what it's just a low hanging fruit where it's like oh what did you have to say when you sat down with that blogger or that journalist or that interviewer like it's just ridiculous so really the root is nobody gives a shit like we do not care well this has been going on for apparently seven episodes it feels like 30 and it's been going off for so long we were done with it after the first episode we knew where this was going and it's just getting deeper and deeper and deeper and no one cares it's we had that one there's that one episode where it looked like

we were going away from this story life we were done with it yeah yeah that was exciting we had confirmation though that tamara did in fact leave shannon and emily are talking in the morning and i guess tamara left at like four a m which is scary considering what state she was in i'm shocked that she made it to her plane but yeah it's it's frustrating for me to watch these scenes with shannon because she's like you know at least she went to a confessional and said like you know we're not like cool now but she says with emily she's like we took a big step today and I'm like why why was that a big even if you believe her like great fine you believe her about the katy thing but why does that negate everything she did to you last season like that I do

not understand it doesn't but I feel like in Shannon's mind for whatever reason she truly does want to just be friends with Tamara she always wants that she wants that acceptance she always wants somebody to like be looking out for her in some way even though Tamara has burned that bridge a million times and we'll continue to do so she's still always going to be accepting and always going to be seeking that approval. And I don't really understand it. But it's just something I've grown to accept over the years that even when she goes to a confessional and says something like this, I just don't believe her. I truly don't because the one time that Shannon's got something going on and we've already seen it start, she's got a vendetta against Katie. Now all of a sudden

Tamara's going to join up and she's going to see it as an act of friendship. Oh my God, Tamara's got my back. Tamara doesn't have your back. She's just piling on. That's all she's doing. So I don't, I don't understand that. I'm not going to tell you who to be friends with because it's not like Shannon's Shannon's just a different, a different brand of crazy when it comes to comparing her and Tamara. But at the end of the day, I don't understand why you would want to be a friend with somebody like that. It just doesn't make any sense. It makes no sense to me. We do get to relive the Bali scene where Tamara quit again. I think you could probably have a montage of four or five instances of Tamara, quote, quitting and walking off the set. She quit last season when she left

Katie and Matt. Right. There's another time. So it just, it happens. frequently and it's i feel like the tamara i quit moments are when tamara gets stuck and like back into a corner and can't think of anything to to weasel her way out of it she quit's too fucked up like yeah that's the problem she can usually weasel her way out of those situations but she was too fucked up and she was too fucked up at the dinner that night too when she quit last season yeah when eddie was in the blanket like sobbing because he was just fed up I think we're seeing a correlation. Tamara, if you stop getting fucked up,

you might be able to weasley your way out of this, but I don't know. Yep, too tipsy. But she does have the wherewithal to post a mental health post. I remember this one. This one made the rounds because it was the day after she quit. And we didn't see it from her page because we're blocked by Tamara. But we did see it on other pages.

And it said like mental health is wealth or something stupid and said one reality TV doesn't make sense like it's time I don't know it was all bullshit anyway and Gretchen brings up accountability which is good and this scene in the car gave me ever so little slivers of hope and it's crushed later when I see Heather sit down with Tamara but even Heather's like she's fucking selfish and why does she do this shit and I've stuck my neck out of her blah blah blah I'm like yes finally you're seeing the light we also get in this scene Gina that she called a journalist or really reputable journalist that verified all i don't know and even if it is like here's my issue with these kinds of storylines it's like say who it's still hearsay and exactly yes

say who it is if you're going to do this and play this game who told you who's the reputable journalist is it a journalist or is another blogger like that's what we have to know but apparently this quote unquote reputable journalist verified all of tamma's claims then shannon calls and she's crying. Yeah, this scene is fucking nuts. Heather's seeing the light, or so we think,

Gina has uncovered evidence, and Shannon's crying on our way to go see alligators. Are we all caught up, everybody? I think we're all caught up, yeah. I was not surprised at all that Shannon was crying. Oh,

here we go. Why is she crying? And she was late. Look, I got it. It's fine. Look, it's okay, Shannon. Yeah, it just got this is it just takes me back again to Katie recording Shannon like didn't we just do this like now we're recording Shannon is she mad at Bravo because she they just aired that she's on speakerphone where she's barely crying like it's ridiculous you cry and freak out like every day and I'm not saying I don't have empathy for you because I know you've been through a lot of shit some of it was your undoing but like come on like so what like you freak out every day who gives this shit if somebody records you well we may it to the alligator slash crocodile farm uh it's not actually that they're going it looks like

they're going fan boating in the everglades yeah obviously they're in new orleans so it's not the ever they're going down to bay you go down to air and do some bamboating uh which is actually a lot of fun i've done that before in the everglades it seems like a lot of fun but i just i love the panic attacks that everybody's having like that's the new crocodiles around there's water what yeah everybody's having panic attacks which i'm not knocked Lord knows I've had a panic attack or two, but the reasons for them getting upset or panicky are insane to me. You're on the boat.

Like the crocodile slash, sorry, the alligator, first of all, they don't really move a lot. They're going to chill right there and look at you. I don't know. I will never get that.

And I'm not trying to sound like a tough guy. When you're on a boat and the gator is like on the shore, why is that scary? What is that thing going to do to you? Jump onto your boat from the shore to the point that people are panicking. I'm ever golfing in like gator land, if you want to call it that. I'm looking for gators. I am searching high and low.

I'm hitting different shots. I'm blaming bad shots on me going to look for gators. And yeah, sometimes I do put myself in dangerous way, but that's okay. Have I tried to touch a gator's tail before? Absolutely. That's none of your business. Yes, I have. Yes, I have.

Have I successfully done that? Yes, I have. Did I pick up a baby gator one time? I did that was dumb don't do that yeah that's yeah yeah sure I lived in so when I lived in Florida do you remember that there's a viral video of like it looked like a dinosaur it was like the biggest crocodile ever so that golf theater it wasn't a resort it's a public course like an hour away from me in Florida we went to play there to try to see that one didn't see that one but there was a little i think his name was godzilla i think he's something like that yeah

there was a there was a little bridge over like a little bit of running water and And if you look down, there was like five baby gators just chilling. We may have had a couple of beverages. I may have leaned over and snagged one. I think I have a picture somewhere. But when you said that originally, I thought you were just like at a gator farm and they were doing that thing that you might see in Joe Dirt where they're just kind of like passing gators around or whatever and then he wrestles one at the end.

Nope, you just did this in the wild. So good move. Yeah. I lived a different life before. We should have a running list of things that you've been bitten by. I didn't get bit by it. No, not a koala, a quaka. Oh, quaka.

Yeah, I got bit by a quaca. I have been bit by weird shit. Let's get back on track. This is going to take forever. We're just sidetracked because we don't care about this episode. I know. Well, Emily facetimes shame. Okay.

I guess we need to, nothing happens at the gator farm. Shannon arrives and they have the anxiety off. they have an anxiety off but I thought Shannon arrived like that's how you should if you're late and you feel bad like she's very sorry she's she's being nice and she's like look I'm really sorry

I had an anxiety attack and if she had like an actual full blown anxiety attack and still rallied and got to the boat before you pushed off that's a win but Gina again is the ringleader now for some fucking reason and Gina's will not let it go you should feel bad you should

feel bad I have anxiety from you. And Shannon's like whimpering. She's like, I'm so, I'm so sorry. I just want to, I'm just trying to do my best. Shannon's due right away. Shannon do right away why Gina had anxiety. I guess it's like a little bit thing. And I guess, you know, she's just trying to conquer her fears. So good for her.

What fucking alligators? What are we talking about? Water, I thought it was. Oh, is it water? Yeah, that's what she was saying. She's afraid of things in the water, apparently. Things in the water. You're not in the water. You're on a bobia there. Whatever. Aquaphobia.

Um, sure, but, but no, I really don't think I, I, I just, the end of this trip while they're still in New Orleans can be all chalked up to they're all tired of each other. It's been a long trip. They all fucking despise each other because they've been spending too much time. They're just ready to snap. They all want to go to bed. And honestly, at the end of that dinner later, they're all just like sitting there, like having a little bit of a sip of a drink or whatever they're doing.

They all just want to go to bed and get the fuck out of there. They're probably jealous of. camera because she was able to get out of Dodge pretty quick. They didn't want to do that last day. No, they just are all, they're contractually obligated to finish that dinner. That's why they're sitting down there. It's the last day of a bachelor party. Like, everybody's hung over and like, uh, fucking shut up.

Stop making jokes. That's why none of those should be more than, more than 36 hours. Arrive on Friday night, half Saturday and leave on Sunday. Yeah, 36 isn't enough. So there's a sweet spot in there somewhere. Well, again, another conversation that we could have that would sidetrack us for a long time. Hit pause on whatever you're listening to And hit play on your next adventure

This fall get double points on every qualified stay Life's the trip Make the most of it at Best Western Visit bestwestern.com for complete terms and conditions Oh, hi buddy Who's the best you are I wish I could spend all day with you instead Uh Dave, you're off mute

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Let's get to Emily and Shane's FaceTime. they have diagnosed Luke with ARFID, ARFID, ARFID. I'm not entirely sure what that is, but they are doing more testing to see where he falls on the spectrum. If he is on the spectrum, and Emily does feel guilty for being on the trip as they're trying to diagnose, which I can, I can sympathize with that. That is tough if you want to be there for your kid. Yeah, that's tough. But let's get to Bourbon House. This is dinner, I guess.

Is that, is this dinner? Yeah, this is dinner. This is dinner. And to your point, you can tell that tensions are just unreasonably high because Heather gets immediately pissed off at Emily for making fun of her. You always make fun of me. You can dish it, but you can't take it and blah, blah, blah. And then Gina chokes on an oyster.

And then she's mad that people aren't checking on her. I was just funny. She's choking on an oyster. It was just funny, honestly. Yeah. That was like, I will always point these out because again, like this show is tumbling into a very dark and stupid place. When we get some camp moments,

I'm good for it because the two of them just being on each other's nerves because they've been next to each other for the last three days. Tensions are just really high and Jean is choking on the world's biggest oyster behind them and getting no sympathy. Nobody gives a shit that she's choking over there because they're all just arguing in a petty way. That's funny.

That's good housewives material. Unfortunately, those moments are just few and far between anymore with the show. Yeah, that's a good point. So I should take them when we get them. But the whole dinner, centers around this alleged proof that Gina has because she tells everyone at the table. No one's talked to Tamara, but I did talk to a journalist and she confirmed this roofy thing.

Katie denies it. I never said that to her. Well, it's a credible journalist. I never reached out to anybody. And then Gretchen steps in and she starts defending Katie saying, we're making all these claims. I haven't seen any proof, which I love.

We love when we take a pragmatic approach. If you keep making these statements, Great. Show me some evidence. There is no evidence. But the table tells Kiki, sorry, tells Katie to call Kiki. Now, this is the second time we've had a get your phone out moment. Second time we have not gotten the phone out. So my whole thing with all of this when it comes to Katie, I do not believe she's this like super villain that we all must fear. But you are putting yourself in these spots because you've had way too many conversations with people on the other side of the street. You are talking to the bloggers, you're talking to podcasters,

you're talking to anybody that wants to talk to you, apparently. So when it comes to defending you, it gets really difficult because I assume somewhere along the line when you're talking to Kiki Monique, you probably mentioned the fact that Gretchen had mentioned something about the naked wasted night. That probably happened. Do I think that you said, She roofied her? I don't know. But I'm sure you alluded to that. So now we get to a place where it's like,

you probably did this. But the way it's being spun is very weird. And then we get another layer to this onion that apparently that night, and this is probably later, but who gives a shit, that night where everyone heard this story, it was like Jen, Ryan, Katie, Matt,

Slade, and Gretchen. And I guess Gretchen retold this story and said, the next morning, I had to go to the hospital and they found drugs in my system. That is such an important piece of this puzzle that Katie has not said, and I'll give her credit for that. She hasn't blown her up yet. She sat at the table, taken her beating, and hasn't said shit. So like credit there, but it makes this whole thing much more confusing. And what really grinds my gear is that amidst this dinner and everyone defending Tamara trying to throw Katie under the bus that she's the biggest asshole on this cast,

Gina is on the attack. Gina is gassed up and she is going after Katie trying to blow her out of the water, all these crazy things. I guess there was like a toxicology report that did actually find drugs now. Like this whole thing's so confusing. But Gina is defending Tamara relentlessly after we watched her not be cool with Tamara. And everyone forgets that Tamara and Gretchen points it out to everybody that Tamara has done something to everybody here. everyone here has been faulted by Tamara and yet we're holding cage to this ridiculous standard and we're just believing Tamara we're letting her go with a pass she stormed off because

she got caught in a lie or she got caught in a corner and now everything is like well she's going through a hard time fuck this i'm so done dude like this is such an annoying scene to watch and again where are we where are we after this scene the same place we've been i don't know we don't have any proof we don't have any proof and i think that's what's the most frustrating for fans to watch and people that are just casually watching the show is the inconsistencies and the seeming it seems like there's a witch hunt going on where again katie yes she probably did all of those things she should probably not be talking to bloggers and i don't like the inconsistency there where you're going to talk to kiki monique and clearly say something that alludes to what gretchen

told you when you guys were all hanging out in your couples night but then when it comes up at the table and you're getting grilled that's an opportunity for you to just say gretchen this is is what you said the day after. And Jen with her misremembering is also really annoying me because now it's like, this is moment number fucking eight where Jen was at one of these events, heard something, was present for the conversation, and just doesn't remember. Simply does not remember. And you need to be able to add more. You need to add more context. So it's just getting us to the place of we're never going to find out the truth. We're not going to have any idea. I know they've got a fucking lie detector test coming in next week. And there's already people on Reddit saying that this guy

who's coming in to conduct the lie detector has been on multiple reality TV shows and he skews the questions and skews the answers and results so that it better fits the dynamic that we already have working for us. So we're not going to get anything there, of course. Not that, you know, I don't think lie detectors are always right, but this one's definitely not going to be, right? So it's just, it's the route that we're going and where we know we're headed. And it's just taking so long to get there and the payoff isn't anything that we want. That's the problem. So we have to just endure these scenes, get through all of this, watch this happen. Again, Katie put herself in this position so I don't really feel bad for Katie.

I'm just annoyed that we have to continue to watch it. Yeah, that's a good way to put it. The one thing I will point out before we get to Tamara's therapy scene, did you watch the transition? Yeah. The guy missing the basket. Yep. Sure did. Hi, this is pretty cool.

Holy shit, did he just miss that? He was right there. missed a layup and they put it in i was like that guy is probably so upset he probably did it again and made it and told all of his friends i'm gonna be on bravo tonight and then they show the missed i'm missing whoever edited this video look i don't even i can't even blame producers at this point because i think it's a cast issue still but the producers and the editors who were sitting back there that were figuring out the transition the transition they probably just wanted to have some fun for the first time all season let's have a little fun here what do you say between that and then you

miss the one where the guy tees off in the transition scene and then they do like a fake breaking no i didn't miss it i just didn't quite register but i i do i did remember exactly what you were talking about i just didn't really realize that it happened so i guess yeah producers and editors are sitting back like this sucks let's have some transitions at least let's do some wacky graphics and stuff it would have been funnier if he missed the layup and the ball came down and like went right into the camera and then that was your that would have been a good one next scene yeah i'm I'm looking forward to seeing that. I'm more excited to watch those transitions.

That's what we're doing now. Yeah. Yep. Thanks. Let's get to this crazy fucking scene with this is the best insight, though. That's what was fascinating. It's like the best insight into how Tamara views the world and how she views her lot in life. Because this is so.

This is so ass backwards. I know. But this is like the way that she describes. everything going on and what I have seen are so fucking different but I do believe that there's a part of her that believes her own version of these stories and I think that that's where you get the root of this again credit where credits do she's a phenomenal housewife has been for a long time but this is why because she's crazy because like during this scene she's talking to this awful this therapist sucks ass too she just fucking leads

her down these paths and then just enables her and empathizes with everything at no point is she like hey maybe that was on you she's like yeah you're going through a lot yeah your friends are tough like oh that's sorry that's the thing like where's the like there's so much bias in these conversations i know if you're a good therapist you're supposed to lead her to the water but you can't force her to drink it and then see what happens and then if she doesn't do it then say keep asking questions as to why she thinks that way instead it's like i'm going to lead you all the way here but i know how you're going to answer, I'm just going to act like that's the right way to do it. I'm going to give you a hug.

It is, all of your friends are against you. I agree. That's crazy that they would do that to you. Like, what are we talking about here? And just, I do not understand that part of it. But this is probably, and I don't even know, I might be fucked up in the head at this point, maybe the show has just done this to me. I got very close to feeling bad for Tamara because I'm like, you are, this is a you in

your mind problem. Like something is wrong. Oh, you felt bad for her just. because she's so, like, out of touch with reality. How the fuck did you even get here? Like, what kind of messed up mind do you have? And then I'm starting to think about, like, all the other things that she's had going on in her life.

And obviously, she treats people like shit. So I never really feel bad for her. But to get to that point, I'm like, damn, there's something wrong with you. And I actually feel pretty bad. That's, yeah, not why she wants people to feel bad for her. But I can see how you got there because she, like, she leads it off.

She's like, I've been super anxious lately. We get the fake tears out of the gauge. She's like, I've been fighting with Eddie. And after this all went down and, like, they were so awful to me. And they were cussing at me and saying mean things to me. So I went to Big Bear to isolate. I was so distraught. You're so distraught and Big Bear that you have somebody film you sit down in a log with your dog and then post that.

That's how distraught you are. Also, you're doing your podcast with Teddy still. That sounded very nonchalant. It sounded very nonchalant when you were recapping that weekend. But now in therapy, now we're just in shambles. I think, you know, what actually, oh, man, I think what she did, and I don't blame her for this, but she somehow was able to implement clickbait audio into the Housewives season where people did go and listen to that episode, I'm sure, because she just posted that she was out. So that's fucked. Like, this is a whole show, you have to throw the entire cast out after this one because we've got Blogger Central going on.

right now where we're just trying to decipher what Katie said to the bloggers when all of them are talking to bloggers they're trying to corroborate evidence with other bloggers each cast member is doing this individually meanwhile you've got Tamara over here doing real-time clickbait for her own podcast using the show to promote herself so that she can double dip this this whole thing is fucked it sure is but not as fucked as this conversation because the therapist asks why confront her in regards to Gretchen? I wanted to give her the chance for me to believe her. What?

There's lie number one. That's actually lie number three, but in regards to what's going on on the show, that's lie number one. I understand that Teddy's going through something horrible. I understand that that has affected Tamara in a lot of ways. We sympathize and empathize there. using Teddy in this moment is fucking gross

because she says before I went to that dinner I had a call with Teddy and that was a really difficult call so because of that I took half a Xanax that's not what happened I'm sure the call was and I'm sure that that was difficult to hear but now you're using Teddy to garner more sympathy from us the audience and from your therapist

them that that bothered me a lot and then after this dinner she's upset because not one person called me and i don't think they care about me what was your role at dinner asshole you're yelling at everyone telling them to shut the fuck up and then you leave in a huff and you expect them to call you and go hey are you good and the worst part is they did Heather fucking did so you're lying again that's like three lies in one lie and watching her flip this whole dinner scene this whole trip and turn herself into 100% the victim is crazy but not nearly as crazy as saying now i feel like i have to be super careful of what i say my daughter's crying right now it's so crazy you can probably hear that i'll believe it when i see it for that one um dude like the the

things that she was rattling off during the scene were absolutely insane when she gets deeper into the uh talking i can't even get i can't even get this with a straight face talking about how the divorce impacted her is why my god yeah my dad left my mom and that's how i feel with my daughter what my dad left my sorry go ahead yeah no it i mean like you can try to put makeup on a pig if you want to is that what you're trying to no i'm saying she's She listed off her dad, my dad left me, and then Sidney left me. Your dad, okay, fuck that guy. Don't know him, but if he left you, that's shitty.

Sydney told you point blank, I don't want to be on the show. Don't talk about me on the show. Don't bring me up in any capacity. Don't post me on your socials. You did all of those things. So she decided to separate herself to better her life. You chose the show over your daughter. That is not her.

fault and yet once again for the umpteenth time just this season you have brought her up again on camera and now you've turned her into the villain by saying she left you no you left her by staying on the show let's not get that twisted that's fucked i do wonder if we're talking about sidney more and more because there's going to be some this whole gretchen thing's going to become a bigger deal are we really going to get like into the into the weeds with what gretchen was doing was gretchen actually talking to Sydney or is Tamara going to claim that she was really talking to Sydney and she found out because somebody showed her like are we going to get to that point because I'm worried that we're going to get to that point now I really don't want to deal with that yeah would

not be worth it like I don't know I'm just not it just simply would not be a good payoff I just yeah it was a crazy scene it was a crazy view into it was very quickly after I said wow this show sucks without Tamara these people are boring as hell there's nothing going on we're still talking about katie and bloggers we actually might need tamer back she comes back in the scene i'm like never mind no no we're good i don't i mean we do but we don't i'm just so conflicted when it comes to her no i understand where you're coming from i think she's the necessary evil on this show i think like with the show sucks with her on it it would be unwatchable if tamra wasn't on it like that's the biggest phrase i can give her to watch yeah i agree but this next

scene was interesting watching emily and shame and their viewpoints on what's going on with luke because i find myself leaning towards shame and his diagnosis of the situation if you will i think the answer somewhere in the middle probably i'm not faulting emily for like no getting emotional about it i do think it's interesting and look like i understand she's dealing with it and trying to figure it out and I'm sure it's a scary thing and she's thinking about it all the time. I don't, I do not think it's a good thing to be putting this all out there for Luke's like talking about it's eating disorder, you know, like it's just you're, you're talking to us directly like how you and Shane are Rocky for certain reasons. You're talking to us directly

and using the words eating disorder when talking about your son who's going to have to grow up and defend himself one day and talk about it now because you put it out there. You said last season you didn't want to talk about the kids and now that's your whole storyline it's some it's tough because of the subject matter like i i understand that but i think that the way shame said it to sum it up is more like look this might be our new normal and this is luke's normal if we act like everything's wrong and everything's crazy it's going to impact him rather than act like this is the norm because this is the norm now and this is who he is so let's accept that and be happy and supportive rather than spiral and cry.

Like you said, it's probably somewhere in the middle. With Amex Platinum, access to exclusive Amex pre-sale tickets can score you a spot trackside. So being a fan for life turns into the trip of a lifetime. That's the powerful backing of Amex. Pre-sale tickets for future events subject to availability and vary by race. Terms and conditions apply. Learn more at Amex.ca. During the Volvo Fall Experience event, discover exceptional offers and thoughtful design.

that leaves plenty of room for autumn adventures. And see for yourself how Volvo's legendary safety brings peace of mind to every crisp morning commute. This September, leased a 26 X-E-90 plug-in hybrid from $599 bi-weekly at 3.99% during the Volvo Fall Experience event. Conditions supply, visit your local Volvo retailer or go to explorevolvo.com. The twisted tale of Amanda Knox

is an eight-episode Hulu original limit. series that blends gripping pacing with emotional complexity, offering a dramatized look as it revisits the wrongful conviction of Amanda Knox for the tragic murder of Meredith Kircher and the relentless media storm that followed. The twisted tale of Amanda Knox is now streaming only on Disney Plus. Yeah, the reason that I'm saying it's somewhere in the middle is because he's still in the midst of getting tests. And maybe they have an answer now or at least some semblance of a solution or what it might be at this point in time. But while we're watching in real time on this show, he's still going through tests.

So it seems like Shane is preparing for what it could be, but he's very like, and maybe it's just how he is. I don't know. I don't really like Shane as a person, but we don't really know him that well. He seems very cold and calculated. Like, I am pretty distant. He even says as much. He's like, I'm very different with my daughters than my boys, which is, you know, that's normal.

I don't really care about that. but he seems like he's annoyed that Emily's getting emotional about this, which is crazy. Your wife is breaking down. Your child is going through something that you don't quite understand. You don't really have all the answers. So if you want to go and say, look, let's just wait and see how this goes. Obviously, you're going to be emotional about it. That's fine.

Instead, he seems annoyed that she's emotional about it. And that raises a few more questions that I'm not going to get into. But it's just, it's a weird situation. It's unfortunate because it is so real. And I feel like it's the most real thing that's going on on this show right now, which sucks because it has to do with what, what is he, eight years old, this kid? So it's just tough to even go through all of that and watch all of this because now we have to sit here and we have to, you know, anybody watching at home is getting ideas of their marriage, is getting ideas of how they are as parents, which is crazy. But this is what you open yourself up to by sharing something real. So it's almost like if you want to give kudos to Emily for sharing something so real,

I kind of understand that. If you want to say this shouldn't be on TV because of the kid and he's going to grow up and he has to watch this, fully understand that as well. You're opening yourself up to all of these things. So I just don't know what the backlash is going to be. And if she's going to get pissed off because people are online talking about her marriage, it's like you kind of open this door. Now we actually have to watch this and have opinions on it.

So I don't know. I'm on the side of I don't think this is a good idea. you had to put on TV but agreed you know not my kid not my call what do what do we know you know what do we know we only watch a billion of these shows every day yep let's keep trucking because now we got heather with tamara to completely reverse any hope that i had that heather was starting to see the light because they sit down we recap everything that's happened obviously and this is when it gets like really confusing because now enters between this and then the ladies at the bar in the next scene we get the reveal that Gretchen may have said

something and now Tamara has shifted her focus from Katie to now point at Gretchen and say that Gretchen is the problem so it's keep track but that's where we're going right now but Tamara tries to further this victim thing she she goes with uh i'm on an island alone and no one checked on me no one called me no one cares and heather debunks that immediately she said i facetined you i texted you had no response but i did hear you talk about it on your podcast and then we get the clip of the podcast and it doesn't sound like she's all that tore up about the whole thing she's very nonchalantly discussing it with with teddy so i don't know kind of seems like she's blowing this whole thing out of proportion so now heather's pissed off at her and she challenged

challenges her. And Tamara's response is, Sydney left me and Teddy has cancer. Yep, which works. But it works. Heather's like, you're right. The fact that it works is absolutely insane, of course. And it's Tamara. And like, I think we're trying and we're doing a, I think we're doing a pretty good job of giving her a little bit of grace when it comes to the Teddy situation. I do genuinely feel for her in that regard. In that regard for sure. I'm sure it is fucking her up for sure. But. She does a lot of things that make it seem like she's weaponizing Teddy's situation for her own game, such as you're on camera before you go and you call Teddy and leave a very heartfelt voicemail. I'm sorry, I'm not buying it. I'm not buying it. I'm buying that. Yeah, she's a close friend of yours. I'm buying that you feel bad. I'm buying that it's fucking you up.

But when you do that on camera and then say that's the reason why you took half as Anax, you left a voicemail. she didn't answer you didn't even go in deeper and say like when she doesn't answer i get worried or anything like that you just simply say i'm really messed up by this whole thing i'm really messed up because when we were in new orleans was the last time that we had a little bit of fun with teddy like all of these things that you keep bringing up it's like i'm sorry but i'm not buying it i just can't no but to watch heather flip and be like yeah and then hold her hand and say like look like we're besties like i'm there for you girl it's like there's a there's a i don't know happy median where it's like you can feel bad for what she's going through but if you're like a good friend then you would still check her and be like hey i know you're going through all this shit but at the same time you're claiming to have this like therapy epiphany and it doesn't compute because your actions are not matching what you're saying in regards to like the work you're doing i don't think this is really heather is buying it and feeling bad for her and immediately flipping i think heather's just like i'm not going to get anywhere if this

is really what you're going to do and you're really going to use this as your excuse for why you're being a bad friend why you did all of those things the other night when i said that i called you and you still didn't reach out afterwards and you had to go on your podcast and act all nonchalant that really fucked with me i think heather got her point across i think she said it and then immediately she was met with that and she's like okay there's no reason to do this i'm just going to be a good friend try to walk her through all of this and then once she gets through all of it and she starts feeling a little bit better then maybe i can press her again if she does something i think heather's just like whatever it's not that big of a deal she wasn't going after me she

just didn't answer my text messages so whatever i'll just leave it at that yeah maybe i don't know it's just i can't i just can't but let's finish this up because we get a split scene we got katy and matt and we got jen emily and gretchen that what looks like a very cool bar i would i would go to that bar and of course gretchen's like oh what is this place i'm like oh you just dropped like five points in my book it's a great great goose come on no no no They've got Goose is gray. It's a plastic bottle on the bottom shelf. Yeah.

But again, like immediately, the first thing Emily says is like, you know, my kid has an eating disorder. I don't know how to parent him. It's like, I feel bad for you. But again, you're saying, you're flat out just saying eating disorder and like outing that he has an eating disorder. And one day he's going to know that this was on TV. And that kind of sucks. On the flip side, Katie and Matt start talking about the Kiki stuff. But it's not about Kiki, about the.

origins of this story. Yeah. From what I'm gathering on how Katie's talking about it, Katie did say to Kiki that she was drugged or felt like she was drugged, but she got that straight from Gretchen. Gretchen knows this and is yet to come to Katie's defense and be like, look, I did actually say that. And Jen is probably not going to remember. So you're probably not going to have a lot of support there because she doesn't remember

shit. So that sucks. but where I land with this whole thing because you know we go to the other scene and Jen is at the bar saying like what the hell is going on with Katie and Gretchen's now getting to this point where she's like you know what I don't know and I don't think I believe her

and if I call Kiki like oh that's what it was like I guess in the car ride home which again is also kind of sketch is that Katie's defense is that if she calls Kiki Kiki is going to lie but in doing that she's also still protecting Gretchen because I'm very confused I'm incredibly confused and the only person in this whole situation right now that I kind of believe is Matt he's the only one who seems like he's talking

with conviction he's he's a journalist he's an actual journalist yeah so he's probably got some semblance of a believability here but I know a couple of episodes ago you know a lot of people were like don't get Matt involved Matt stay out of this this is between housewives I don't give a shit anymore. Go scorched earth. Let Matt get involved. Let Matt and Ryan be the people who actually bring this. Oh, God.

If we have to trust, and this is a slippery slope and anybody who's watched OC in the past, we're going to trust Gretchen and Slade. If now Gretchen's only purpose really for this show that could bring me any entertainment was going after Tamara, if she's going to abandon that and then flip on Katie because she said something to Katie. And again, Katie said it to Kiki,

which you shouldn't be doing anyway. But if she's going to flip on Katie entirely and start going the other way with the other kids, no, absolutely not. The people that are going to need to step up, unfortunately, are probably Ryan and Matt. And I can see Ryan doing it. I can obviously see Matt just kind of getting to his wits end where he's like, this is fucking insane. I had Slade call me and say that you need to hold the line for Gretchen. That means that that's an omission of guilt.

That means that he knows, Slade knows what Gretchen said. He now knows that Katie went and told Kiki Monique, which she shouldn't have done again. I'm going to keep saying that. And now he's calling Matt and saying, please don't say anything more, hold the line. Why would Katie and or Matt hold the line now if Gretchen's going to flip? There's no reason. And of course, we're just going to have like three or four episodes straight of this bullshit where Katie's probably out on an island by herself. Again, she did this to herself for some way, shape, or form.

But Gretchen said it. Gretchen clearly said it. So now we're having, and it seems like these conversations while they're side by side have nothing to do with each other all. Isn't that crazy? I know. It's like the weirdest juxtaposition ever. We're getting additional information from Katie and Matt, but it doesn't seem to really add up because it's not the same conversation.

And I don't understand why Katie's still defending Gretchen. It makes no sense to me. But then Gretchen's doing this other thing over here where she's talking to Jen. And Jen doesn't remember. So she's not going to say anything. And you've got Emily in that court who's going to go against Katie regardless. So it just seems like nothing's really adding up. And we already know where this is going to go.

And I'm probably going to despise every moment of it. Yep. And, you know, the one thing I will say, like, Matt at the end is like, why is this suddenly about you, Katie? It's like, well, she continues to put herself into it. Like, she keeps talking about it. That's why she's involved with this. But I don't know. It got so convoluted.

And like, like, you're just talking about the two scenes that we get side by side are not the same discussion, which makes it more confusing. And, like, on one side, you're seeing Katie called Gretchen a liar on the other side. seeing Gretchen say she's wary of Katie now because she wouldn't call Kiki. And then, of course, Gretchen's like, you know, I'm going to call her. And it's like, oh, you're going to lie to her. And this whole thing's going to get weird. As we see in scenes from this season or next week or whatever, Kiki does come on the show. And I imagine she's going to vindicate Tamara and everybody else that's claiming Katie said something.

So the question therein lies, will Gretchen step up? up and say i did say it probably not and then continue the crusade against tamara which is what will write this ship of this sinking show or is she now going to be on team tamara and everybody else and the crucifixion of katie is complete and she never comes back to this she hasn't had a chance to be a housewife because she can't do it after for two years and it's not fun and i think the fact that this cast doesn't recognize that or it's like you guys like that you're floundering because you've been on the show for years and we have the same complaints

every year and you guys just don't change anything maybe it's just who they are and that's again that's a casting problem I yeah you nailed it with that like this whole thing comes down to the cast the cast is bad but let's get to some questions I'm stoked

from Miranda and 412 is Katie the next Monica Garcia I think there's a lot more to come out I think it's not Monica was I can be that deep Monica was like making fucking memes and stuff and sending people stuff. So that's a little bit different. This is Katie being incredibly messy and not the fun kind of messy.

And I don't think she, look, I don't think she understands how to be a housewife. I don't think she knows how to. And she even said that she thought she was just like in shark infested water. And she just had to sink or swim. And this is what she came up with, which was really stupid.

But I don't think that she's actively rooting or or planning stories or anything like that. I think that she's just talking. to bloggers, and that's stupid. Yeah, I agree. Yeah, everyone's saying the same shit in here. Carmillionaire. This level of victimization and dark twist of manipulation from Tamer should be studied. It is fascinating.

It is genuinely fascinating. She's like Jacks, but a lot better. Keckles, why is this show still on the air? Good question. From C.C. Tutt. fuck is going on from Brit Mobley cast rebrands or too soon to call it rebrand

rebranded Jamie Gibbs I nominate the bros to be the bloggers of the next season no no we don't want to have at all keep us out of it keep us out of it this is funny from makeup lab why do Gretchen and Slade look like Stepford wives and Ned Flanders he does look like that really good comparison

that is very good from see right fam six am i the only one still confused about the gretchen tamara katy story no it's really confusing but to sum it up in one sentence gretchen did say that tamara drugged her katy did hear it tamara's mad at katy originally for saying that but now she's mad at gretchen for saying it and lying about it. Do you know what's funny? I don't care. The way that this is working, the way that, yeah, no, definitely don't care.

The way this is working out, there's only going to be one winner and it's Tamara. Because either Katie and Gretchen go after each other, Katie ends up losing, which vindicates Tamara because she's the one who brought it to light and maybe gets her some sort of olive branch into Gretchen again where she'll just betray her again next season if she's still on the show. or Katie's successful in some way, shape, or form. And Gretchen then is the one who looks crazy, and she's the one who's accusing Tamara of doing it,

which then Tamara can spin into another storyline for the next, like, 10 episodes. So no matter what, Tamara's going to win this. Yeah. Zoe Cove the play is Jen lying to protect Gretchen, or is she really that unreliable of a narrator? She's either the greatest housewife ever in using the I don't remember defense. or she genuinely doesn't remember shit.

I'm leaning towards the ladder, honestly. Yeah, I really have no idea. Let's do one more from B-Mangram 0727. Why do you think Jen jumped teams because of Gretchen, question mark? I really think that she forgets. I think that she genuinely forgets. But I do think there is, there's a weird component about what Jen's doing. I think she's recognizing that Katie's on a sinking ship and she's jumping ship.

and she's trying to maybe not you know i'm not even saying the misremembering thing i think she genuinely forgets all these things but i do think that she's able to identify when somebody's going down and she's already been in that position she was in that position all last year i don't think she wants to do it again so she's trying to make allegiances elsewhere and she's trying to get on on the good side of everybody else so that she has a better chance to succeed which i don't really blame her for yeah that's actually not a bad play because she's she's good at this i want her to be around for a while. So if that's what she's doing just to protect herself, then she's learning.

Yeah. I can't fault that. I think Jen going after Tamara is much, much more of a viable option. I hope that happens. I hope. Something happens. We have at least, at least two more episodes of blogger storyline.

That I do know, because we have Kiki Monique and then the fallout. You are undershooting that. I said at least two more. I didn't say we only have two more. We have at least seven more. It just feels like two years ago, dude. I know. Damn it.

And you, all of you out there listening, you admitting that you don't watch anymore, you just make us, yeah, you guys are sick. You're thick. That's all I got, you got any else? Nope. Well, that's our show. Bro's got to go.

Watch the Love Island Reunion. Yep. I'm Amy Nicholson, the film critic for the LA Times. And I'm Paul Shear, an actor, writer, director, you might know me from the League, Veep, or my non-eligible for Academy Award role in Twisters. We love movies, and we come at them from different perspectives. Yeah, like Amy thinks that, you know, Joe Pesci was miscast in Goodfellas, and I don't.

He's too old. Let's not forget that Paul thinks that dude too is overrated. It is. Anyway, despite this, we come together to host Unspool, a podcast where we talk about good movies, critical hits. Fan favorites, musts season, and case you miss them. We're talking Parasite the Home Alone. From Greece to the Dark Night. We've done deep dives on popcorn flicks.

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