Brown Girls Do It Too - Nanis I'd Like to **** with Seema Anand

Episode Date: July 15, 2022

Does sex get better with age? Poppy and Rubina are joined by mythologist and storyteller, Seema Anand, who has sex advice from the ancient texts for all people, young and old.

This podcast covers themes that would make your elders blush, so be warned, there is swearing and scenes of a sexual nature. We do tend to take it too far, so expect phrases that would lead your nanny to throw her chumple at you. Not in a kinky way. BBC Sounds. Music, radio, podcasts. Hello! If you didn't know already...

And us naked in the thumbnail didn't give it away... This is a sex podcast. And if you can't tell from our voices... We're actually British Asian babes. We really are. I'm Robina. I'm Poppy. And this is Brown Girls Do It Too. Brown Girls Do It Too. I'm Robina. And when I'm old, I'd like to find new uses for a Zim frame. I'm Poppy. And when I'm old, I reckon I to find new uses for a Zim frame. I'm Poppy, and when I'm old, I reckon I'll have four hip replacement operations for all the right reasons. In this episode, we're talking about sex and ageing and grey pubes.

I actually have one already. Have you blocked it out? No. I'm keeping it there. It's a wise old pube. Wow. Are you really keeping it, or are you just going to leave it there? I would like to go all grey down there, actually.

Yeah, I think it could be a real statement. Yeah yeah yeah. If you're like blonde up top doesn't match the carpet and the curtains thing.

So you're going to keep it there to remind you of what's to come later. Yeah yeah. I do dye my hair actually but I am

quite grey at the moment and a bit of me is thinking what level do you know when you're going grey you can go all the way grey and I love it when you see women they you're going grey tipping point you can go all the way grey

and I love it when you see women yeah yeah yeah they own it they own it but that middle bit of going grey yeah that part is

it's the in between fuzz when you're waiting to wax or you know but your pubes you can just let go of grey yeah are Asian women getting grey and still getting laid

do you think that they're getting grey and still getting laid I think I probably have some older women in my family who are like quite cheeky. When you say cheeky?

Cheeky. What does that mean, exactly? Like, sometimes they'll randomly throw some innuendos when they're chatting to me, so I'm like, oh, I think he's done a sex. I think that Asian women are the naughtiest, kinkiest, filthiest. Like, when I see a gaggle of aunties together, the filth that comes out of their mouth,

it's like Pornhub on speed cooking curry, but without all the sex. Like, it's just all the stuff. Because I think that they're not allowed those spaces to talk

about it openly. And when they get together, it is a bit like Brown Girls Do It Too podcast. They're just having a little slumber party. I reckon a lot of them are still shagging, though.

Yeah, but this is where it gets a bit dark. Like, are they shagging and happy about it? Like, what's going on? are they shagging consensually that it's really yeah this is kind of what i think about my mother's age i think for our ages our generation is different but for our mother's age like i mean i can't bear to think about my mom and dad having sex actually i'm a grown-up i can i really hope my parents are shagging and having really good crazy sex um do they want to have sex with each other that's a

different question i don't know you're one of six so you know they did it at least six times at least six times over my lifetime yes um i hope each time they did it my mum came four times wouldn't that be nice to know that your parents conceived on an orgasm for you yeah it's funny like you speak to non you speak to most people and they're like oh i can't bear to think about my parents having sex it's disgusting and i'm like no i can i want them to have a really healthy happy sex life because they argue most of the time so if they're having a great sex life at least they're doing something right yeah i mean i do think your libido changes as you get older though i reckon you know you've got other stuff on your mind your body starts to get a bit more tired. You're taking naps in the afternoon.

Well, this is the thing. Like, I've never been able to ask an auntie, do you have sex? At what age do you stop having sex? Because I know just from talking to you and you're younger than me, you're not having sex, but you have a new baby. And I think that's the case with all mothers.

You have a baby, your life changes quite literally upside down. Yeah, I reckon there's like a fallow period between like that kind of baby making scene until your kids are like five or six yeah to be honest i'm sure we'll start having way more sex once the baby leaves our bedroom that's yeah that's gonna be them yeah when he's 18 he's not gonna leave your bedroom when he's 18 but but you know of course you will but when he's 18. But, you know, of course you will. But, like, it's kind of sad, isn't it? I mean, I don't think even white people have, well, maybe not all white people,

but we're not really allowed to ask aunties, hey, are you having sex? Do you have a lot of sex? Do you enjoy sex? Do you want sex? Are you thinking about your six kids and running the household? What's it like? I mean, I have a couple of aunties that are 100 love a bit of sex i can just tell i can just tell from the way they speak to me yeah they're like a little bit like filthy yeah yeah

as you said earlier cheeky yeah yeah yeah like i was changing the nappy of my son in front of an auntie oh god the other day are we about to go into some dark territory anyway my auntie said she said it in cututchie, she said, his chuchu vadiai. And my partner was there and I looked at him because my partner's now understanding a bit of Kutchie.

But he was like, I don't know that one. Looking at me like, what did she say? And I was like, she just said that our son has a big dick. Chuchu.

Chuchu. It's like a childish word. Kutchie, to be fair, is a language of children. Can I be honest I'm not gonna lie when I saw when I met the little bubs

and you were changing his nappy I thought the same thing oh no I was like he's gonna be fine poor kid but the fact that she said that to me in that kind of like

cheeky way I was like what do you know about that yeah exactly what have you seen yeah what are you doing yeah

what are you thinking about right yeah no well clearly she's thinking yeah what are you doing yeah what are you thinking about right yeah no well clearly she's thinking about dick um are you an aunt you because you've got loads of cousins are you an auntie now yeah yeah i have um i have i have a nephew i haven't oh my god of course because your bro's got a kid so you are you are an actual auntie i'm an actual auntie yeah wow i'm not an auntie yet oh right yeah yeah i'm not a real auntie obviously i'm like a fake auntie to like the millions no yeah i'm a proper legitimate auntie in every way how do you feel about that because you know we we spend so much of series one and two and

our lives bitching about the auntie network yeah yeah yeah how how are you gonna be as an auntie that's really interesting i haven't really thought about becoming an auntie i think i'm gonna be like a cool auntie yeah yeah but i think this the new wave of, we are the new wave of aunties that are going to change the way. I probably would give him shit if he was,

if I could tell he was being a dick to people. But I just don't think he will be. He is gorgeous and sweet and he's one, so.

He's got a long way to go before he turns into an asshole. That's the right time to start judging him. That's what Asians do. No, but like, if you think about

the legacy of aunties, and I know we, like, we men bash on this programme, but we actually do a fair amount of women bashing in terms of aunties, because they have made our lives difficult. We are the new generation, the new frontier of aunties that are going to be doing things differently.

Imagine a woke snowflake auntie. Yeah. That's what we're looking at now. It's woke snowflake auntie. Yeah. That's what we're looking at now. It's going to be really interesting. I mean, I probably will turn into a bit of a traditional auntie in some senses. Like, I want them to have good jobs,

good careers, good relationships. So what if he comes up one day, you're a nephew and says, I want to be a stripper. What are you going to do? What are you going to say? I'll be like, your dad is going to kill you. Still an auntie. I'll be like your dad is gonna kill you still an auntie i'll be like your dad's gonna kill you i don't know what to say to you you're gonna be in trouble okay cool and if he chucks you out the house you can come live with

me see that's that's how we've moved yeah i would i would be like you can come live with me okay for sure for sure if he did oh a hundred percent that conversation if him and his parents had any of a rift in any way and you needed someone to stay, I would 100% be like, you can come stay with me for as long as you want. Take anything you want. I'd look after him. But I mean, I just know his parents wouldn't do that. Because actually this generation isn't doing that whole

like cutting anyone out. I mean, really, your brother would be okay with him being a stripper? Come on. Your dad would kill you. But this is good. Like we're moving the conversation on. Like 10 years ago,

he probably wouldn't even be able to say that to his dad and then you can imagine the uncle and auntie network going absolutely crazy oh his son is a

sex worker you know like I mean it would be far worse than that for us for sure I reckon I'd be a really cool auntie because I don't

I want to have kids I would give everything to my siblings' children and I'd be I already told them if your son's gay or your daughter's a lesbian she's living with me and i think my sisters when their aunties are going to be like versions of my mum they're what they were i think they're way more hardcore yeah yeah yeah i'm way more old school it would be like your dad's gonna kill you

and i'm gonna kill you yeah and then i going to start a group chat and bitch about you. Oh, wow. Yeah, really regressive. I'm really sorry if they hear this, but I really do think that they would do that. Yeah, I mean, I guess you don't know until you get into those situations because, like, I'm a new auntie and he's very young.

But actually, if as a teenager he came up to me and asked me for advice, I wonder if some of the stuff I tell him is quite traditional. I would be like, yes, be a doctor. It's actually quite a smart decision. Like, I wish I hadn't ever bailed so much so I didn't have to do

a fucking podcast with Poppy J. And I could be, you know, a neurosurgeon and like... Mate, you know what I would tell my nieces and nephews? Go into banking.

Like, if they were like, I want to be a musician or a poet, I'd be like, don't be an idiot. Go into banking. This is the only... But this is not me

being an auntie. This is just me being Asian. Go into banking, make money. Then do what you want and then do then write your poetry because then you're not going to be selling the big issue and there's nothing wrong with that but you've just got to be smart you've got to future proof your life but i think this is because we're all terrified uh about like instability yeah and because we come from families which we have the hang-ups of i came to this country with three pounds in my pocket. We're that generation. We broke the mould so you can write your bloody poetry

and do spoken word, but go into banking first. Joining us in the studio today is a very special guest. She's a Kama Sutra expert. She wrote a book called The Arts of Seduction and she is a hot special guest. She's a Kama Sutra expert. She wrote a book called The Arts of Seduction and she is a hot older lady. Welcome Seema Anand. Thank you so much for joining us, Seema. Welcome to Brown Girls Do It Too. Thank you so much for having me. Can I just say you look fabulous. Your outfit has just lifted our spirits. I mean, where did you get this? Thank you. I was in Malta till a couple of days ago, and literally there was a shop on the side of the road.

I was driving to the airport. I saw this in the window, and I was like, no, wait. And the driver was like, but we're going to get late for the flight. And I was like, I need that dress first. And it so happens that the bloody flight was delayed anyway. At least you got the dress. Imagine the flight was delayed and you didn't get that dress. Absolutely, yeah.

There are some outfits that just like, you know when the sun lifts your spirits? I'm just like, I just want to smile. I want to grin from ear to ear. Thank you. Go on then. That's a nice way. So can you tell us how and when did you become a Kama Sutra expert? I came upon the ancient erotic texts.

And I have to say, this was 19 years ago. I thought I was going to do like a 5,000-word essay and move on, you know, academically speaking. 19 years later, I'm still over there because this is, I have to tell you, I mean, I get really excited when I talk about the ancient erotic texts of India because they are just so beautiful.

I could just see you in an archive, like, looking through. Is it like that? Is it like dusty kind dusty kind of thing unfortunately there isn't enough stuff there but yes there's a lot of dust but it is so gorgeous you know the ancient Kamasutra so there isn't just the one Kamasutra I have to say there are thousands but they're so beautiful and they're so gorgeous and they're so refined and they're so gracious. And it just makes you want to go in further and think, this is the pleasure that I have been shut away from. I want it back. And they're illustrated, right? They're like heavily illustrated.

So, no, that's the modern Kama Sutras because there is so much more to the Kama Sutra than positions. But it's a treatise. So it's written in metaphor. Most people don't understand what the rest of it is about. I'm going to tell you where my most exciting bit started, and you'll see what I mean. Unfortunately, positions is the only word that people could understand, and hence they decided to illustrate that. But I'll tell you where the real excitement for me started. It was the day that I discovered that every position—the positions, by the way, are a tiny, tiny little section of the chapter, the section on pleasure, which is, Kamsushra is written in seven sections.

The section two is the only section that talks about the arts of pleasure. And positions is a tiny little chapter in that. But I discovered that women were taught how to execute these positions by the jewelrywellery that they would wear and how that jewellery moved on their body. So every position has a piece of jewellery. And I'm going to tell you the first one that I discovered. You'll see what I mean. So in ancient times, in any culture in ancient times, the woman was not allowed to be on top. That was forbidden.

I would never come then. Yeah, because that was supposed to be the... You would be totally, I'm sorry. Wow, so they would never be then. Yeah. Ever. Because that was supposed to be the... You would be totally, I'm sorry. Wow, so they would never be allowed on top. They weren't allowed on top because it was a position of power. Right. It was when you decided when you started or stopped. Okay.

The Kamsutra, however, says you could be on top. But it tells you that the right way to do this is you only move your hips. Right. You don't move the upper part of your body. Okay. And so women would wear like a girdle with lots of bells on their upper waist right and make sure that the bells didn't make a sound wow that is that's kind of sexy and turning me on right now that's like belly dancing

on penis basically right so you're just using so you literally had to put something around you so and that made a sound. So if you moved, you knew you were moving the wrong part of your body. Yes. So basically, this was, I guess, this is something that the very accomplished courtesans might have done. But it also became a metaphor. So in our ancient literature, you never say, oh, she climbed up on top and then she humped her way to another. You don't.

You just say she put on her jingling girdle. And you know she's going to do i'm being on my jingling girdle tonight lol i've got to say though that requires yeah like a courtesan courtesan as you say like somebody with a lot of skill because when i go on top i use my upper body strength yeah to lift myself up but then also to may i think that could be a quarter because i'm mostly just grinding those hips oh wow yeah yeah i'm not using enough i'm like flat like this and then just moving my hips that is amazing yeah i'm not using any of my upper body oh wow yeah that's impressive i think when you move your upper body maybe uh one the angle of penetration changes so it's not as exciting and also maybe it's not so good for your back so yeah try that true interesting so that is insane so like every position had a piece of jewelry i mean do you want to hear about one

that is my favorite i mean this is the first and i love it but the one that i really like is where for the sitting position they would wear a seven string necklace of pearls and it was supposed to move very slightly back and forth as you made love because it would give your lover a glimpse of your beautiful breasts. But then it goes on to say, and this is the confusing part, and this is why it's taken me so many years to understand these things. It says that the woman from the village will sit on the lap, but the woman from the town, the Urbane woman, the sophisticated woman, will sit on the knees the knees and you think how the hell are you going to sit on the knees i mean like yeah how's that how do you so then i figured like i said

after many it took me about four years to find the answer to that you basically after you penetrate you lean back you put your hands on the man's knees and then you lift your bottom up okay you understand because if you're right there right up close then all you're going to do is bounce up and down. Those pearls are not really going to swing from side to side, are they? So you lift yourself up. Your hips are now up. You can move and you move according to... So you basically just make the pearls move back and forth

and that actually goes with the right kind of... This must have been the original pearl necklace. You know that phrase, the pearl necklace? This must be the origins of it. It must be, yeah. Now that's like a porn term where something comes on your chest. I mean, the Karma Sutra to me is an enigma because it was written, what, over 2,000 years ago.

It was written by a male priest, right? That's what they say, but I'm very convinced that it was actually probably written by women. Women, okay. Also because, like I said, the book was written for men, young, urbane, wealthy men, to teach them how to live their best life socially. So it really, the first section is on how to build your house,

how many rooms you should have, how you're decorated, how many hours should be spent on bathing and perfuming. Because the commentary is also about life. It's a lifestyle manual. Because the commentaries has got, it's also about life. It's a lifestyle manual. It's a lifestyle manual. So it's not just about sex. Okay. Yeah.

I thought the entire volume was just about sex, but it's about. It's about all sorts of things. How to find the right kind of wife, how to marry the right kind, you know, and so on. Section two talks about pleasure. Okay. And it's the only section which, and i personally think that was actually written to change the narrative of women because even 2 000 years ago there were plenty of misogynistic texts yeah it's not that everything was just wonderful for women so they try and change this idea and

they're trying to teach men how uh their life is going to be better if their female partner has gets full pleasure so it's all about how to it's if their female partner gets full pleasure. So it's all about how to... It's all about female pleasure, how to female, yes. It was the path to heaven. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it actually goes so far as to tell them, you know, your work life will get better, your business will be better

if your wife can... If your wife can come. Yeah. Do you know what? And they give you explanations. That's a philosophy I definitely run by. When women talk to me about, like, what can I do to empower myself? I'm like, just masturbate. Yeah. Make yourself feel good. That's the one I definitely run by. When women talk to me about, like, what can I do to empower myself? I'm like, just masturbate.

Make yourself feel good. That's the one thing you can control. You can get instant kind of gratification from that from yourself. I totally see that. I really want to hear a bit more about you, actually, Seema. And, like, what... So you got to this journey where you're obviously, like,

incredibly knowledgeable about the Kama Sutra, but also, like, a bit about your sex life and your kind of sexual awakening. Have you always been this kind of open and honest about sex? Because it's so refreshing and wonderful to see you here talking to us like this, because my mum would never talk to me like this. No, I haven't always felt like this, I have to say. So I come from a really unusual family where my great-grandmother was a working woman,

my grandmother was, you know, they were all professionals, and my mother's always worked. And so we kind of grew up in a family where we knew that women have, never have to fight for their place in society, but nobody ever really talked about pleasure in this manner. And I think that was the one area that you always fall down on because you think, yeah, I have the right to go and work. I have the right to go study. I can do anything I want. I can be brilliant at it. But you're never told about pleasure. And that's the one place where you can really be put down. And this, like I said, was a bit of an epiphany when I actually started to study the erotic texts. And it suddenly,

it came as an awakening one day about, know you suddenly open up these channels in your brain which say actually i'm worthy of that pleasure it's a good thing i know i feel it but i know i have to feel it the way i want to feel it i can't be told how to feel it and that's what had been happening all my life where i'd been told this is how it's done so in previous sexual relationships prior to this SEMA awakening section, did you feel like your sexual experiences were all quite one-sided or guided? They were very one-sided. And I also remember, you know, because when you feel that sap run through you, you know, when that pleasure gets to your brain, you're aroused,

you want to be able to do certain things. And I found that a lot of the guys that I was with would get really intimidated. They'd get really frightened. And I also wanted it to last much longer. I mean, I was aroused for a lot longer than they were. And they would be like, oh, I can't see this woman again. You know, that's it. I'm done.

And now I realize that it's okay. Because, again, like the Kamsutra i realize that it's okay because again like the kam sutra says that a man's pleasure is like fire it starts down below and it goes upwards and like fire it's very easy to start and very easy to put out a woman's pleasure is like water yeah starts up here in the head and it flows down and like water it takes forever to come to the boil and it takes forever to cool down yeah so i'm okay to be aroused for a very good metaphor for a woman that's so true because the way i come now is it's it's a mental stimulation it all starts up here because before between my um ex-husband and my ex-partner i used to be a bit of a cum machine i would just

come all the time but now i've become newly single i've not been orgasming with any of the men because actually rather inconveniently it's an emotional connection and it all starts here and then it goes down oh my god might drop that's really just put a whole new phrase on there come on baby light my fire boil my water come on baby boil my water do you think we've changed the vocabulary yeah start boiling the water i mean the other thing that we me and rabina often talk about is that we are obviously going to get older and something that we don't do in our community is i think not in just our community in society is talk about the elderly in sex like older people the they are definitely having sex but it's just something that is not not talked about oh god

yeah i mean i'm 60 and you look fabulous by the way thank you i was waiting for that no no our jaws were on the floor when you walked in but oh thank you you're so sweet no but i get this this is one of the biggest section of trolling that comes to me is like, you're talking about it at this, I don't. Why should I not feel that I need pleasure? But a lot of women of my time of my peer group were taught that you get to a certain age and you're not supposed to have pleasure. Do you feel like your sex drive or your libido has changed as you've gotten older? Because I've just had a baby. And I feel like the hormones that rush through you after that and everything I feel like my libido is just kind of, I mean, I'm not sleeping, you know, like everything around it just made me just be like oh I don't feel sexy and everything's

just kind of dipped but then I wonder if there's different phases that women go through actually then I kind of will because a lot of I don't know maybe this is like an old wives tale old wives tale great phrase for this episode um is that the whole idea of like a woman's sexual prime is much later and a man's sexual prime is like when he's like 18. A woman's sexual prime does come a lot later. But I have to tell you that I think our sexual organs have a great deal of intelligence. People don't realize that. But everything that goes on in your head actually manifests in the vagina. You know, it understands when it feels pain.

It understands when it's feeling happy it understands when you are feeling unhappy or miserable or you could make up and get dressed and if you're feeling shit on the inside you are not going to have good sex yeah you're not going to have arousal if you're bloated you're not going to have good sex you know that's why i never have sex at night so i've just had a massive meal yeah you, you can't. It actually says that, well, actually the Kama Sutra says that you don't have food before sex. You always eat it after.

After, yeah. And then it tells you how to eat it. This Kama Sutra. This whole dating, this modern dating, of like, let's go on a date, let's go for dinner. Don't do that. I never do dinner on dates. Get drunk, have sex.

Get drunk and have sex. Then eat McDonald's. And then eat McDonald's. Solo, and then eat mcdonald's solo because i've chucked them out no actually you could uh have dinner really nice dinner but wait for two hours wait for two hours yeah so if you think about your sexual journey um from your 20s to your 30s to now do you feel that you are more sexually awakened now sexually aroused now or are you having more sex are you having more sex or less sex because that that's in society in drama in music and everything we consume certainly in my perspective and in my echo chambers sadly i just

you you just don't see older people talking about sex having sex it's one of those things unless it's a very specific tab on porn hub which is like you know, grannies I like to fuck, basically. But so can you, and I know, and this is slightly embarrassing on my part, but that's why we've got you on this podcast. Please, can you bust these myths? Because it's just something that we don't talk about, even more so than just generally brown people talking about sex. So I think what's happened with me is that I've actually become more aware of my pleasure so it's better pleasure than more necessarily so it's not about frequency it's not about quantity it's about quality yeah so I understand what turns me on I understand what makes me feel good

I understand how good I feel when I'm doing a bit so it it doesn't necessarily have, we always define sex as penetration. I always think that we need to change the vocabulary. Oh, definitely. Sex can be so much more. But, you know, sometimes you could just have the biggest orgasms doing something completely different, you know, I don't know, kissing or, you know, being with somebody.

I've had the best orgasms myself. Yeah. Sometimes even conversations. So you've had an orgasm kissing someone? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I haven't, but I've heard about it. Sorry, so wait, being with somebody. I've had the best orgasms myself. Yeah. Sometimes even conversations. So you've had an orgasm kissing someone? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I haven't, but I've heard about this. Sorry, sorry, wait, wait, wait.

You're kissing someone on the mouth and you're orgasming down that? Yeah. No, I've never done that. What's that? I've never heard of it. I've never experienced it, but I've read that people can.

So, you know, this is what I mean, that as you become more aware of your own pleasure zones, every part of your body is an erogenous zone just depends on how you treat it yeah okay so every bit of you can bring you to pleasure it just depends on what you're doing and how you're feeling at that point have you ever woken up thinking you've had an orgasm and woken up from a dream and been like I'm pretty sure I had a wet dream yeah and a lot of times I've I realize I'm having that orgasm and I try not to wake myself up and I try and stay in the dream yeah like keep the dream yeah so women can do that right

because I've definitely had it and then woken up and been like wow I don't know what happened I like had a sexy dream and I just really went for it yeah and also I think I'm a bit of a pervert in my dreams because sometimes when the dream gets a And also I think I'm a bit of a pervert in my dreams because sometimes when the dream gets a bit scary or weird I'm just like oh my god quick

have sex with someone that will sort it out. Yeah. I often like I often have like dream scenarios and I'm like who wants to have sex with me?

I do exactly the same. What's that about? I wonder what the kind of underlying thing is there. Like if the dream gets like it's like maybe turning into a nightmare I quickly try and

rein it back in and be like someone has sex with me. And I always go sex yeah I do the exact same thing. The dream gets like, it's like maybe turning into a nightmare. I quickly try and rein it back in and be like, someone's sex with me. I do the exact same thing. Brown girls do it too. Everything I know about love, the TV show, is finally here

and we are obsessed. Do you want to dive with some stories or do you want to sleepwalk into your own grave? I'm Sophie Duker and I'm Olga Koch. Join us as we take

a deep dive into the romantic comedy adapted from Dolly Alston's best-selling memoir. We'll go on a journey with Birdie, Maggie, Nell and Amara as they navigate love, friendships and heartache, filled with disastrous dates, wild nights out and dancing in Camden's finest dive bars.

Don't forget grubby house shares and laughable landlords. Oh gosh, I'm having vivid flashbacks to 2012 now. How long has this thing been there? Since we moved in. Obsessed with everything I know about vivid flashbacks to 2012 now. How long has this thing been there? Since we moved in. Obsessed with everything I know about love. Listen on BBC Sounds. Brown girls do it too. So, Seema, I'm in my 30s and I already feel the ageist pressure of society,

not just in the brown community, but society in general on me. So I can't, and I suppose a part of me is dreading getting older because if i'm feeling this now and i fight it all the time i i think i'm quite similar to you in a lot of ways i i do what i want i don't give a fuck um i i refuse to be defined by my age but i feel like everyone around me constantly defines me by my age and what i should be doing at this time you know at this time well you'll find that actually society is quite happy to define what you should be doing at any age, because if you're younger, but you're not married, then you're not supposed to feel pleasure. Yeah.

If you're married, and no matter how young you are, then you're supposed to feel pleasure, but only when your husband feels pleasure. But if you're really young, you're married, and you've had a child, you're not supposed to feel pleasure because now you have a child yeah you know so yeah i'm sorry but there comes a point when you're like okay um this is why i went out to look for the literature anyway because it's like surely there was a time when or there was somebody who ever said you know what you're a woman you're allowed to feel pleasure it is your right absolutely sometimes i i often find with men and if there are any men listening it's like do yourself a favor because if you pleasure the woman you we're going to pleasure you we're going to come back for you four times it's it's just it's

so simple isn't it if you make me happy i will do everything to me i mean we do that anyway in society but like i'm so prepped and primed and ready to do anything for you, but just get me there first, you know? So I just put up this post on Instagram about, so the Kamsutra has an entire chapter on, it's called the art of the curved finger. So it says that, you know, when you use the fingers to pleasure a woman, so basically the different combinations of fingers, because women don't have just the one G spot. Incidentally, we have approximately between 22 and 24. So it's like an Aladdin's cave. Oh, inside the vagina.

Yeah. One for every hour of the day. It's like it's very hard to go wrong. I also think South Asians specifically, and this might not be correct in any way, have really beautiful hands. And a lot of our culture is about our hands. It's about eating with our hands. It's about cooking roti with our hands. And I just think Asian Indian hands are just so beautiful.

Like, kathak dancing. They're like a real artistry of our hands. And we're very connected to them. And I love, this has just given me a whole new perspective on getting fingered hasn't it right because it's like actually i don't think i've ever been fingered with any other finger except those two so the gun fans fingers yeah so apparently the index finger is an absolute no-no on its own yeah it does nothing for me on its own yeah on its own on its own but you know it needs its mate but most people most people are kind of like they will attack the woman with that one finger and then really

kind of go for it so this they say all that's going to do it's going to agitate you it's not going to pleasure the woman so don't use this index finger on it so are you always saying like go in yeah and then i like a bit of thumb action. Thumb action, yes, yes. Bit of that, bit of that. Do you know what? I've never had anyone just put the thumb in. I've had that.

Just the thumb? Last night. Didn't do anything for me. Right. But thumb going down. The hand from the top. Thumb going down and hand, yeah. Like a kind of castanet.

Yeah, yeah. I like four fingers. Pac-Man, four fingers four fingers yes yeah yeah have you ever been fisted is that when the whole hand goes in i think it's when the fist goes the fist goes in but does it go in like that or does it go fingers first thumb up pop in like that no i don't know whether you could actually do that no i've never been i think i think you need to i've had like a semi fit i've had this go in. Oh, yeah. This is fine.

No, no, no. Stop. So all the fingers kind of going conical and going in. Yeah, that's okay. No, no, no. Guys, guys, guys. This is the hole. This is the situation.

I've had that. Nothing beyond that. But that would not be nice. That doesn't feel nice. Oh, no, I loved it. Really? Yeah. I mean, like, you need to do stuff. No, but that would not be nice. Oh, no, I loved it. Really? Yeah. I mean, like, you need to do stuff.

No. In terms of, like, amount or, like, girth of the finger, I've had this much go in. But it's far more exciting when it's four fingers and curved. There's a lot of people who actually like the curved finger. I love that. It's wonderful. So a lot of these are actually mudras.

They're, you know, they would have been used in dance anyway. Because they have different... So there's one particular one that we talked about with three fingers. And it's called the Madan Kush. The Madan Kush, which means the hook of the love god. And so the Kush is what you would use normally like a goad uh you know when when you have an elephant that you're riding so that's so it's the the kush is the the goad the hook so this is called the madan kush which is the the hook of the love god and it's just you know this

whole idea that you would also use that same finger movement in dance to indicate that you know i i'm hooking you to me I'm sort of bringing you to me that's so luring isn't it come to me I love how you're still doing gun fingers it's a hook babe turn it into a hook please

it's as far as the Caribbean oh my god I'm learning so much I really wish I could have sex with myself not masturbating but I would love to know what my insides feel like on a man because I always ask I'm learning so much I really wish I could have sex with myself not masturbating but I would love to know what my insides feel like on a man because I always ask

I'm like what do I feel like inside and they're like warm and soft yeah yeah like do you know what I mean yeah no I once asked my partner what it feels like to make me cum

yeah and I remember he used this really interesting turn of phrase where he was like it's like touching a boiled sweet and then like and then like it getting to the centre of a he was like it's like touching a boiled sweet and then like and then like

it getting to the centre of a boiled sweet like there's a soft centre of a boiled sweet inside yes so it's like because you know you stimulate the clitoris

and it gets hard so it's like boiled sweet yes and then it kind of it oozes yeah it oozes I love that this guy asked

he said it's like oozing it's like a soft release of an ooze and I was like oh I'd love to know what you kind of have a vague idea you can't put your fingers inside yourself get your hook out yeah get your crush out but I'm talking about the the nerve endings here are not the same as my nerve endings inside so not as incredible. Simo it'd be great to hear from you about the different stages

of your life and how your kind of sexual journeys happened and whether you're feeling more promiscuous than you were back then and yeah and if you have any advice for women as we get older or older women any older women that are listening uh to kind of talk to them about their sex lives so i think the very first thing that i want to say is that we grow up with all of this baggage you know that as you get older you're not supposed to feel sexual you're not supposed to feel pleasure that's absolute crap because you have it within you to feel an incredible amount of pleasure. It should be like eating chocolate. You should be able to feel pleasure for the rest of your life. It's just that it changes as you get older. So if

I could have an entire chocolate cake when I was in my 20s, now I can have a slice and leave me wanting a little bit more. But if I have any more, I'm going to end up with bloating. So, you know, you kind of learn to deal with the changes in your body and your sexuality and your needs as you get older. So the first thing that I want you to know is that you will feel pleasure. There is absolutely nothing wrong with feeling pleasure. You will slow down. So it's not about throwing yourself on somebody and sort of gnawing your way, you know, to an orgasm. It's going to be slower, which is going to be more pleasant. That is absolutely okay.

As a matter of fact, the Kama Sutra says, again, I love the Kama Sutra. I think it's a great text. It says that, you know, people have this thing about, oh, we don't have any chemistry anymore. No, that goes very, very quickly, no matter how many partners you change. The best sex is with somebody that you have known for a long, long time because there's a comfort factor attached to it. And trust me, as you get older, the comfort is what it's about. I no longer want to be in the back of a car. I don't want to be made uncomfortable.

I want a nice, clean bed. I don't want to be looking over my shoulder and thinking, oh, my God, is somebody going to come in? So give yourself the time. It does take more time, but give yourself the time. Say to yourself that you're going to use that time to pleasure yourself and don't put yourself on the clock. So that's a really, really important thing. The second thing is, there is this thing that people have about aphrodisiacs. And again, the Kama Sutra says there's no such thing that you can eat that's like pressing a button and suddenly you're like, whoa, I'm an

amazing lover and I'm going to have a great orgasm. That's not how it works. The best kind of aphrodisiacs that you can have are what will release your wind so you have less bloating. As you get older, bloating is a real issue. Bloating is a problem for me now, Seema. Yeah, it gets worse as you get older. Oh, great. Great. It does. So have things that's going to make you feel less bloated because that's where your arousal depends on. You know, it's the blood flow to the genitals. If you're bloated, you're not going to the blood flow to the genitals. If you're bloated, you're not going to have blood flow to the genitals.

It actually stops you feeling aroused. And thirdly, if you really, really want that, but you don't know how to go for it, not porn, I never recommend porn because I just think it does horrible things to your brain. But there's a lot of audio podcasts out there that have guided self-pleasure podcasts. And if all you want to do is clench your thighs together in order to be able to come, just to get you back in the zone, do that.

Just do that. But don't deprive yourself of the pleasure because truly it's so beneficial. It does keep your brain working better. I'm told it helps to stave off dementia it's worth it right yeah yeah i'm seema and when i'm older i want to be able to find people who can kiss better because i think through my life I've had really shit kissers and I think that's one of the things that really really does it for me so yeah I want to find people who are really much better at kissing I want there to be a school for kissing I want people to go and learn how to kiss properly kissing with tongues is that what's your preference do you

like tongues or are you just lips so okay so now according to the Kama Sutra again it says that when you start the kiss, you should start from the left corner of the mouth and then go in very, very gradually on the lower lip, sort of giving it little nibbles and little tiny pecks and coming in and out just a little bit. And you know what? And then just rubbing the lower lip against your lower lip

because the less the touch, the more sensitized that area becomes and the more the touch, the more sensitised that area becomes and the more the anticipation, the more you're waiting for it. People who stick their tongue down their partner's throat need to be slapped really hard. You know what it is? You're so right. It's the jabbing thing again. Or the washing machine.

It's like constantly going to the mains without starting the start. Let's start with the starters and work our way. And it's the constant jabbing of the finger, jabbing of the penis. Let's stick our tongues down our throat. And it's like, you almost want to increase the senses. And it's the nibbles and the bites and the kissing. And the bearish touch. Yeah, it's the bearish.

Oh, I love all that shit. Again, it also says that you don't hold them during this time the only touch should be that you wrap one finger around one strand of their hair just to keep the head in place how gorgeous is that I'm so trying that tonight by the way I am trying that

well thank you so much Seema it's been absolutely revelatory educational and I cannot wait to get older if I could look like you and be you everything else, no, but you revelatory yeah educational yeah and i cannot wait to get older yeah i i really can't if i could look like you and be you everything else no but you i'm gonna try all of your um tips thank you for interpreting the karma sutra oh yeah there's way more to the karma sutra than to be to be explored so yeah if you're listening it's it sounds like it's a big

mine that you're still discovering yourself. Absolutely. Thank you so much. Thanks for discovering and thank you for having me. I am very interested to know what people think about this topic, though. Yes, me too. If you have any thoughts, anything that you want to share with us, do email us at browngirlsdoittwo at bbc.co.uk. And please do subscribe to the podcast on BBC Sounds. asking me out for if you don't know what to do and more relationship tremors wait so you told

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