Brown Girls Do It Too - Poppy Revisits... Joty Kay

Episode Date: January 17, 2025

Poppy and Rubina are joined by Los-Angeles creative Joty Kay to talk about her handbook in making partners hate you, getting over heartbreak and how to deal with exes.Have a message for Poppy and Rubina? If you’re over 16, you can message the BGDIT team via WhatsApp for free on 07968100822. Or email us at [e-mail] you're in the UK, for more BBC podcasts listen on BBC Sounds: bbc.in/3UjecF5

Hi, I'm Poppy Jay and I know you've all been waiting with bated breath and asking yourself the age-old question when is Brown Girls Do It 2 coming back? Well, Rubina and I will be back very soon I promise. We'll have our usual

brand of cackling, which I know you all love an interesting and broad range of guests who will no doubt have something fascinating to say. And as ever, the Shagney aunties will be back to lend a shoulder to cry on. If you'd like to share any problems that you might be experiencing with the aunties, then email browngirlsdoittoo at bbc.co.uk. Or if you're over 16, you can leave us a WhatsApp message on 079 68 100 822. I want to share an episode from Brown Girls Do It Too where I mostly just remember laughing nonstop.

I think there were a couple of tears potentially, laughing tears. And that episode was shout out to my ex, remember laughing non-stop. I think there were a couple of tears potentially, laughing tears. And that episode was shout out to my ex with Joy TK, who's a creative artist from America. So she was shooting a film in London and we just had to get her in the studio to talk about our exes. She shared with us her hilarious handbook on how you make partners hate you and how you get over them. Since that episode, I've had a real shift in exes because really the only two exes I had was my ex-husband and that was a car crash and my ex-partner and that was the opposite of a car crash. But then I did have an aberration of 2022. I call it my Wall Street crash of 2022. This guy I went into a toxic rebound situationship with immediately after my ex-partner of 10 years. And how I feel about

him, I don't know. I still am not over how angry he made me. And I want to shake myself for being in that relationship. Sorry, situationship, for as long as I was. And I need to, myself for being in that relationship. Sorry, situationship for as long as I was. And I need to, I guess, be a bit kinder to myself and a bit more forgiving. But sometimes I look at myself in the mirror and I'm like, how could you be in this situation? Like, what were you thinking? What was wrong with you? And so what I've learned from that whole experience is if you see a combination of red, amber flags, you run. So I mentioned in that episode that I hadn't been dumped,

which shocked Rubina. And I can still say a few years later that I still haven't been dumped. But I know that I will be and it will hurt. I can feel it in my loins, okay? Heartbreak is going to be coming my way. It's on the cards. I can see it. So I say I look forward to it loosely. I look forward to the experience because Rubina said that it teaches you so much about who you are and how you deal with things. So it's coming. I'll keep you all informed on whether or not I experienced

heartbreak in series six. But here's Shout Out to My Ex with Joy T. Before you listen for even five more seconds, we must ask, is the use of strong language a deal breaker? Because if so, you need to love us and leave us. And if you can't handle us at our worst, or themes of an adult nature, you don't deserve us at our best. I guess this is goodbye. Brown girls do it too hello i'm rabina and i'd like to thank my ex for dumping me and setting me free and i'm poppy and i'd like to thank my ex for making me believe in love again you're so true it sounds like you're so you're like one of those people that's like so adoring about their ex still that I kind of think

somewhere in the future you might get back with him you know my other most people are like my fucking ex I'm gonna kill that guy yeah yeah yeah

my other best friend she was she's visiting from New York and she said the same thing to me literally four days ago she was like I'm convinced you two are gonna get back together again

I'm like well noted neither of us feel that way now. But, you know, never say never. Don't know what the future will hold. Look at JLo and Ben Affleck 20 years later. That's true.

There is literally not one of my exes I can imagine getting back together with. Not one of them. Also, you need to remember I've only got two exes. Oh, right. Yeah, fine. I think I've got like, I would say I've got three solid relationship exes. Would you go back to, like, say your current partner was in this? No way. Like all of them

ended so badly and they were like, they were good relationships but they ended so badly that I was like, oh, I could never, ever,

ever. You couldn't be friends with them? No, because they ended so badly that like the badness of how they ended was so hard. You can't forget that.

You can't walk away from that. Never, never, never, never. It's all very telling the way someone breaks up with you. Yeah,

so it's like how much respect they have for you when they break up with you telling you their character their personality so and it's awful it's horrible because when when you're with somebody and then they like dump you or they cheat on you or something like that because you're like what was the point like i felt like you know and i remember i was in one relationship and i said to the guy if you like want to if you like fancy someone else you know and you want to like cheat on me before you cheat on me do you want to just like check in

with me because I might be okay with it or maybe we can open it up or whatever like I just want to have like really

transparent like conversations with you I don't want you to lie like come on but then I found out recently through one of

these guys I'm dating they like I'm all for like open honest you know me open book let's get it all

out yeah let's be honest. I ironically probably wasn't honest with my ex-partner, but that's another episode for another time in terms of what I wanted. But generally going into relationships and open relationships,

I feel like you need even more comms, right? And they were like, they like the cheating element of it because it's the thrill. And I'm like, fucking hell, of course. How did I not think of that? It's so obvious. But my ex-husband, that was a car crash. That was character forming.

That changed my soul and my personality. Obviously, we'd never get back together with him. But I think fundamentally, I'm actually a really good, decent person. Because I would wish him as well, nothing but the best. You were kids. You know, but I want him to be happy. I'm not like sticking like needles in a in a in an ex-husband i'm definitely like there now like

looking back at those people i definitely want good stuff for them i don't have any problems with any of my exes but there is a small bit of me that like wants them to be happy but not as happy as me is that bad thing no i think that's a lot of people a lot of people say that so i have the opposite with my ex-partner, who I just worship. Yeah. Like, I want him to be happier than me, if that's possible. Like, I just... Why?

Because he's so wonderful. It's just like such an incredible... And my ex is fresh, right? We talk about this on this podcast. It's like, what, six months ago? No, eight months ago now, nine months ago. So we're still in the sort of throes of it. I don't know.

I don't know if I've processed it don't know i don't know if i've processed it really i don't know if i've you know whatever um that's another conversation for another time but um there's so much love and respect there and it was a mutual breakup yeah when it's mutual that's the key i've never had a mutual breakup this is so tragic but every single relationship i've ever had that has broken up they dumped me oh no yeah oh no actually that's a lie there was one when i was like 12 or something doesn't count oh no yeah oh no actually that's a lie there was one when I was like 12 or something doesn't count oh no but we were together for like three weeks and he got me a special girlfriend teddy and when he gave it to me I was like this is over because I thought

it was the cheesiest thing so that's it so yeah I have yet to be dumped yeah you left both times yeah I left both times oh man everyone already thinks you're the hot one. Now you're the one who doesn't get dumped. No, no, no, no. It will happen. It will happen. I guarantee you it will. But I've not had that feeling.

And both times have been very, you know, that first one was a marriage. It was toxic. It was just under very different circumstances. I was a virgin. You know, it's not normal. It's not normal. Well, if you're Asian, it probably fucking is normal. And the second one was mutual, long 10 respect love we still see each other i'm supposed

to pick up a chair after this podcast but i don't have time so i've got to work so i've not lived really in terms of exes but i can't wait for you to get dumped that's what i'm serious for i mean you learn something though don't you you learn yeah yeah and you learn about what what you want as well. I mean, I have dumped a few people, but they were like short-term fling things. But like my proper serious relationships all ended. If you don't mind me asking, why did they end it with you?

First one? I think I've talked about this. Their university school boyfriend who followed me to university dumped me basically because, well, we were living on opposite sides of the country by the end of it so that makes sense yeah but he also told me that had a drinking problem that guy that guy yeah fuck him no he was actually great he made a whole album about me yeah and then like the main like the other like big relationship that broke up was because he met somebody else that's terrible yeah and i like that does happen though if you fall in love with

somebody else like what are you gonna do would And that does happen though. If you fall in love with somebody else, what are you going to do? Would you rather someone break up with you because they fell in love with someone else or fell out of love with you? Fell in love with somebody else, I think.

See, I'm a fell in love with somebody else. Yeah, sorry. Yeah, that's going to be way easier. It's way easier. It's like, I wasn't enough for you. I want to be single so bad

that I'm out of love with you. Yes. But if it's like, I just met somebody else and I feel different. Different. And then that happens, right? It happens.

Like people are connected. They're better suited. I know I would love to keep my current partner in a box so he doesn't meet any girls and like that would be absolutely great. But the reality is he's a man who's very attractive and he's going to live his life. And now he's, now he's got a baby. Pussy magnet. Yeah.

Dads are man. They are. I hate to admit this. He's aging very well. He's aging very well. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Just anytime you see a good father doing good father. You think good luck. Yeah, dads are, man. They are. I hate to admit this. He's aging very well. He's aging very well. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Just any time you see a good father doing good father-ish things, you're like, good fuck. And you wouldn't be wrong. Today we're joined by someone who has triggered the aunties and uncles just as much as we have. Her thirst traps are trapping, and she is as unapologetic as can be. She's a content creator, podcast, and radio presenter. It's Jyoti K.

Hooray! That is the best intro ever. Today we're talking about exes. Shout out to our exes. Shout out to my ex. Clearly not Rubina's exes. No, I'm not speaking for her. I'm not really trying to shout out any of those exes either.

Good, thank God. So puppies basically came out of a relationship eight months ago. And she talks about her ex with such love. She's always like, is he very good? Thank God. So puppies basically came out of a relationship eight months ago. And she talks about her ex with such love. She's always like, oh, he's a mutual breakup. She's like, he's the best man ever. He's so wonderful. Oh, that's cute. That's nice.

Okay. But I've never heard most. And me and you are like, fuck this. Fuck that guy. I want him dead. Yeah. I do a little bit sometimes. I don't wish him the best at all.

No, I really don't. I mean, I feel like I should because that's like the mature thing to do but really if you are human one day and if they hurt you it's going to feel that way

talk to us about your exes what is your ex history what's it saying okay so I have like it was like my ex-boyfriend my real ex-boyfriend the one that I'm talking to now is just like

one of those like relationships that aren't relationships that you've never said was one. OK. Yeah. So let's go back to the real one first. OK. So that one like he was he it was during COVID and I was lonely.

I met him through my friends and it was nice. We were together all the time and it was nice. But then when COVID was over, he realized how social I was and he did not like it. Yeah. So is he an Asian? Was he a brown guy? No, that's the funny thing about it. I dated a non-brown guy thinking they would be non-brown. They're all the same shit.

They're the same. Mic drop. You learn something new every day because I did that classic slightly maybe internal invasive racist thing. You all said he was brown straight away. No, because I was like, brown guys usually are like, you can't go out. My mom's going to do it. You do that.

It's a trope. And I'm sorry I did it. It's serious. I think it's just cultural. Hashtag like, brown guys usually are like, you can't go out. My mom's going to do it. You do that. It's a trope. And I'm sorry I did it. But it's not all brown guys. Hashtag not all brown guys. And that's why I asked immediately. It's cultural men. Because he's Puerto Rican. Oh, he's brown.

He's brown. So proving my point and my theory. Mic drop. Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, baby girl. What is that? They're like dominant

or they're just like what is it it's because I'm like an alpha so I need a man to like out alpha me it's weird yeah but I would say

you have definite alpha energy which is amazing but I would say you need the right kind of alpha to feed off your alpha because if he's

if he out alphas you you need to he needs to like raise you out alpha that's true not put you down and block you out alpha and that's out alphas you, he needs to like raise you out alpha, not put you down and block you out alpha. And that's what happens to me. They try to be like, you don't need to do this anymore.

Because once they got you, because look at you, you're stunning. Once they got you, it's like, stay home. Yes. Are you sure you want to go out with that girlfriend again? Are you sure you want to put up that TikTok again?

And then the snidey comes. And then you're in a coercive controlling relationship. Why do you have your tongue out on the photo? I'm like, I always have my tongue out. Oh my God. Tongue out. my tongue out. Oh my God, tongue out. Cut these men.

Oh my God. How did you break up though? Tell us the story. It was the longest breakup of my life. For me, I'm in one of those. You know when you break up and then you're just like still talking to each other. So it's just like, do I get mad at you?

Do I not get mad at you? Do we have sex? What's going on? We do. Obviously we do. The sex would probably be great. It was great sex, but that was it was it other than that it would just confuse us and it was just easier to like fight about things like well we're not even together but it was convenient to be

together so long story short like how long did that phase last for because I'm sort of in that phase right now yeah so we were together for a year and then our breakup was like six months like six months and it like took me to I'm a horrible liar by the way and we're Asian really double yeah and like he didn't understand that because I lied about going to Vegas yeah but I'm just stupid because I feel like I have social media like he's gonna find out yeah and he found out and then you know even though I wasn't doing anything bad you know when you lie it just seems like you're doing something bad you're automatically got a cucumber up your ass yeah automatically you're in an orgy and it was and you're in vegas so you obviously are yeah a hundred percent yeah so to him he was just like she must be up so i'm

like no i just lied because you make drama when i go somewhere and i just don't want that is a that is a not an amber flag that is a red flag where you are lying about where you're going. And you're not even doing anything on top of that. And you're not even doing anything. You're probably just in Las Vegas watching Netflix. Why do you want someone to be so controlling though? Yeah, he was just in my space. That's too much. So it got too much. And after I lied,

so it was kind of like I messed it up, but I'm so happy that I did because I think I would have kept holding on if I didn't mess up to say you need a big catastrophic event or something to happen yeah to then cut it because that's what it is yeah oh my god I love a good breakup argument where you're like I fucking hate you I love this better than you and then and then when you have like a little dramatic right like it's I just feel like I I like I say I don't like it, but I feel like I do. I love it.

Is this where you're at right now with this one? No, no. So this one, he's been like, he's the in-betweener of the relationship. You know what I mean? He's the filler. Yeah. From the Puerto Rican to the next one you're going to have. Yes, exactly. He's the one I'm going to leave when I find my husband.

You know what I mean? Nice. You know what I mean? But also he's, I'm not going to say who, but he's a rapper in the hip hop world. And we've been on and off like for years it's always like oh he's a year

he's like you've got there's history there history so he's like a fuck buddy yeah no I think I think fuck buddy

with boltons no but we also have feelings for each other yes yes there's feelings they make pasta you cook they cook

they do he cooks for me he cooks for me I He cooks for me. I'm not judging you here. Yeah, he says I love you. They do couple-y stuff. Yeah, we do couple-y stuff. But the thing is, but when it's convenient,

both of us can disappear for days because we're not together. That's the one where you've not said, this is who we are. But do you want to marry this guy? No, so the plot twist. He has a baby mama. And also growing up in our, you know, the brown community, but do you want to be do you want to marry this guy no so the plot twist plot twist he has he has a baby mama and also growing up

in our like you know the brown community you don't deal with where did you grow up sorry we should cover this yes well I was born in America but my first generation

so but still like you still have like those values within you like being a baby mama I mean nowadays I don't mind you know it's fine but like

sorry when you say baby mama he has a he has a child he has a child with someone else oh yes child with but they're not together anymore no but it gets it gets yeah it gets sticky so he had one before i met him and i was like okay whatever he has a baby i didn't know him them no problem so um he comes back around this time perfect timing after i'm done with this long breakup and everything's going great we have a great personality like he has a great person i have a good person we're around this time, perfect timing after I'm done with this long breakup and everything's going

great. We have a great personality. Like he has a great person. I have a good person. We're having fun. And then one day he's like, I have to tell you something. And I'm like, ha ha. What are you going to say? You have a baby on the way? Cause that was my one thing with him. Like when you have another baby on the way, I'm done. Right. And he's like, it's not that black or white. And I'm like, what the fuck do you mean? it's not that black or white? So when he broke up with his last girl, he went and slept with his baby mama

and she said she was taking vitamins while she was taking birth control. And she had, and then it interfered. We're women. I take vitamins,

everything with my birth control. It's doing great. Why do women, I don't understand. It absolutely, whoa, whoa, whoa, hang on. It takes two.

It takes two. He put his penis inside her and came. He gave her the cream pie. But did he want to get pregnant? Was his intention to get pregnant? So I would say... He trusted her in that sense. He trusted her. If she's on the pill,

like, come on. And she took vitamins. Oh, no. And then he was telling me... I'm squarely blaming her here. But I mean, look, I was a baby mama myself. Which I am.

Don't worry, Pina. My future is a baby mama. It's fine. I'm a baby mama myself which I don't want you to my future is a baby mama it's fine I'm a baby mama myself and I'm just saying that if you have one kid with somebody genetically

you kind of want the other kid to be like that Raveena babe I know it's a trap this guy I know it's a trap this guy

oh you're not marrying him he's definitely after the second baby I was like okay so what did you say then you dumped him no she didn't no well I don't have anybody else so I'm baby, I was like... Okay, so what did you say then? Oh, you dumped him. No, she didn't. No, well, I don't have anybody else, so I'm like... I don't have dick on time.

Yeah, so I was like, you know what? I mentally, in my head, was like, okay, this is not going to... Before, I was like, maybe. Now, it's like... Oh, now it's done. It's done. You buried it. I buried it.

So now, it's just... Does he know that? He'll know it now, but does he know it? I just block him when I post this, right? I feel like he has a feeling, so he's being more sweet. Like he bought me a chain. He gave me like... Because he realizes now he's over...

He's doing those things. But don't let him overcompensate with buying you shit. Oh no, it's not happening. No, no, I'm too smart for that. So I'm just enjoying that. I'm just enjoying the necklaces. Until I find my husband. Then we're out.

Josie, have you ever been dumped? You didn't start with me as a girl who's ever been dumped. No, no. So I haven't been dumped, but I stick around until I fuck up. And then they're like, can't talk to you anymore. So that's what I'm doing now. So it's like, it's complicated. I totally get that. I totally get that yeah like i totally get that

like they'll uh we'll break up but then we'll still be talking and then i'm just i just do such reckless stuff that they're just like just go away yeah you sort of take it too far yeah like it's that's what it is so no i haven't been dumped but i've i've pissed people off where they don't want to talk to me so what what what is the Jyoti playbook of how you get to that stage before they're like, I don't want to talk to you anymore? So, like, what do you mean? Like, how do I have them hate me? Yes.

I mean, where do I start? Okay, well, number one. Let's teach our listeners. Number one, lie and get caught every time. Rule number one, lie and get caught. Okay. Rule number one, lie and get caught. Okay. Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Every way you can get caught. Every way you can get caught, do it. Okay. Yeah. Good. Rule number two. Rule number two, when you get caught, act like you're sorry. Do it again.

Rule number three, do it again. And that's how they leave you. Oh my God. That is such a simple flavor. It makes total sense. I'm so sorry. I didn't mean it i will never do it again do it again you're like the guy quote unquote guy i love it it's like a power no i like it like it is it's also like uh it's also like what i was i think about the things i do afterwards because you know sometimes i'm like why do i do this I think it's an ego thing so like after we break up to me it's like I want to see if you still want me you know and I want you to want me oh god yeah

I've done that too yeah and then it's so toxic because it's like I don't want you but I want you to think I want you I want I want to know that you still want me I think that's what it is I wouldn't be fucking up yeah I wouldn't be fucking up if I wanted you, but I keep doing these things and I'm, I don't know. It's, it's, I don't know. Do you think that you have,

do you think you find it hard to break up with people that you know you need to break up with? Yes. And I think it's daddy issues, but not in the sense of like, my dad wasn't there. It was just like, he was there and then he became an alcoholic and into things. And he was my best friend and he was very absent, right, when I needed him.

So I feel like I kept getting in these toxic relationships with these hyper-masculine men to fill that void. Yes. And then I would fill these voids and not really be happy. So then I started doing toxic stuff because I'm like, I'm not really in it. You know what I mean? And then you just feed off each other's toxicity yeah you do and then all I've seen is toxicity all these like my parents weren't

together they slept in separate rooms so I've seen this growing up so to me it's normal yeah so yeah yeah because you just play out the relationships you see with your parents like I had the same thing without realizing it yeah of course or you just you think it's like normal or you think it's love you think weird stuff's love yeah you're like he's obsessive he loves me yeah you know he wants to keep me

locked up oh my god he loves only me so all of us are on quite different spectrums of this x x spectrum i said spectrum i said x spectrum did you do you know that and maya song that's like stick in the forest Maya song that's like Casey the X. What you gonna do when you can't save me? There's still that stick in the forest. In the desert even. I used to live in an apartment and used to teach the girls how to do the dance

with the stick. No way. Yeah, I swore I was Maya. Oh my God, I know all the words to that song. She was the closest thing to an Indian girl that we had.

Yeah, oh my God, that's so true. Maya, you're right. That is so true. She does have that thing. Was she Indian in any way? No, she swam in the Black Muff line.

She looked like it. She looked like it. And then MIA came along. And then that was a game changer. The real Maya. The real Maya. Good one.

Can't remember my point because that was so good. No, sorry. I took us on a tangent. No, but I was saying on our X spectrum, we're all in different stages. You, sadly, have been

dumped. You dumped a 12-year-old, but you've been... No, I'm 12-year-old? She dumped a 12-year-old. Oh, she was 12. We're really on a different spectrum. No, she's not a pedophile.

I jumped the other 12-year-old. She was 12 when she jumped these other 12-year-olds. I basically said that all of my past relationships, of them, most of them I've been dumped. Because I think similarly to you, actually, now I'm looking back, I probably did do some pretty kind of crazy toxic shit, like including being quite wild and drunk. And one of them was like, you've got a drinking problem.

And broke up with me because he thought I had a drinking problem. Girls that have drinking problems? Yeah. I hear this all the time as well. Maybe you should stop drinking. No, I don't think that's the problem. No, that's not it. That wasn't it for me.

You're the problem. No, no, no. You need to handle my drinking problem. Exactly. That's fucking healthy. Exactly. You need to handle my drinking problem. Exactly. That's fucking healthy. Exactly. You need to help me through this. Yeah.

You need to take me to rehab. Yeah, you need to take me to rehab. You need to pick me up from where I'm at. Yeah. That's such an Asian way of thinking, isn't it? A good husband. He's like, I'm rehabbing. Drops me off. Poppy once said this really interesting thing to me that really stuck with me.

She was like, what I do when I get in relationships is I meet somebody and I like get them to fall in love with me and then I slowly show them I'm crazy that's what happened it really stuck with me because I was like oh god

that's that's what I do men have so much choice hello look at you two they show you so you have to you have to like

make them fall in love with you then show the crazy yeah they do the same thing though they do the same thing they're like oh I'm understanding

yeah you can go out you can I'm a secure man they do the same shit I don't care if my girl goes out with her friends and wears skirts we're not geniuses

in that sense by the way six months later why are you wearing that yeah yeah yeah there you go wait what that's how you met me yeah exactly

you liked this before yeah yeah yeah totally but like I've been I've left I've been in two relationships my whole life. So I've left them both. You've been dumped and you are in this weird middle bit of the ex spectrum where you're like, I make them hate me and then they leave. Some of them come back though and I get really surprised.

I'm like, you really want this again? Like you want to go through this? Okay, so I was going to say, very neatly segueing back, you would never get back together with your exes as we've deduced. No, no way.

No way. A lot would have to change in my life to get me to a point where I was like that desperate. Is that a horrible thing to say? No, no, no.

A lot would have to evolve where I'd be like, wow, okay. I'm like, you're not even my type anymore. What was I thinking? Yeah,

exactly. Have you got together with an ex and would you consider it with um just the just the rapper guy but that's because that's more a thrill yeah yeah we're not really together there's not really like he's just a filler he fills up a space and then he's a fun filler like you know it's a good time but other than that no because I think like they catch me at a time where I'm like like you said we have a lot of they have a lot of choices. We kind of have to like, okay, you know, he kind of cuts off the boxes. He's a nice guy.

So then after I get over you, I'm like, oh, like, what was I thinking? You know? So no, I wouldn't. Do you ever like Google your exes? Do you ever stalk your exes? We Google them right when we started talking. Like, hold on, where is this guy? LinkedIn.

My friend, call her. Hold on, look up his everything. Afterwards, no, I don't. When I'm this type of people, like, once I'm over you, I don't want to... Oh, do you rip cord? You're done.

Yeah, I'm done. I'm done. Really? Yeah, I can't. So, are you not on good friendship terms with any of your exes? You're just like, out, done? No.

When they try to come back around, like, I'll be nice. Yeah. Like, I'll be like, oh, hey, hope you're okay, whatever. But when they try to, back around like i'll be nice yeah i'll be like okay hope you're okay whatever but when they try to like get into it with me like i can see the flirtiness i'm like oh no no no you're not even my type anymore satan go away yeah it's like i've grown and now i've grown yeah and you're not yeah yeah like once you're out of my like hemisphere i don't even care what you do but i'm kind of interested in exes because they

say so much about who you were at that time yeah and I find that fascinating like I have occasionally gone through like old emails when I when I was 18 I had this boyfriend right yeah and we were like really much in love and we were together for like two years yeah this is the one that dumped me for having it I was like this is everything and he like basically we I grew up in London and when I went to university in Edinburgh he like followed me to Edinburgh he was on his gap year and he came to live where I was at university so I was like this is forever shit and the other day I started looking through Facebook because I was like trying to look for something and I like accidentally landed on in my inbox of like him I was like what's he up to now and I ended up like going back and reading some like

old face messages we'd sent each other and it's so weird like but I was like this person who was so in a relationship with this person that was having like familiar yeah familiar conversation like I love you I'll see you then catch up with you oh I'm sorry I did this let's do this okay you can see my mom all this kind of chat when I was looking I was like that was a different girl yeah it was literally different girl and I looked back at that girl and I was like god she was so idealistic before you before you came here I was saying like my ex-husband it was like it was like character building like my personality shifted like you you grow with each ex and like my ex-partner now who is amazing who I'm like talk about him in a very loving way like he helped like he so I met him when I was at my lowest ebb

after my ex-husband and he kind of helped build me and raise me and gave me confidence and love and it was all very like so fucking cheesy but all those beautiful things all those good things and then you god it sounds even now

I obviously haven't still properly processed it because it happened very recently like you I love him I love him and I'd do anything for him

but you're sort of out of love you're not in love you have love for them but you're not in love and I think 10 years is good innings it's like

oh really good very good I feel like there's lots of people who look back at their exes and think you know what the fuck was I thinking

but also like was that actually bad for me like was I stuck somewhere that I didn't know if that you know like should I have gotten out earlier and all that stuff does it

but do you maybe this is me just being very like oh you know utopia exes but like do you feel like it sets you on a different course? A hundred percent. Who are you going to end up with?

A hundred percent. Do you know what I mean? And what are you going to do with your life? What job are you going to have? If you're in any long-term relationship, I'd say like over three years of that relationship, completely can adjust the dot. It's like sliding doors.

Brown girls do it too. Do you feel like exes in pub in like culture they're really like glorified like we talked about maya's case of the x but also like adele yeah and that's how she made like hits exactly everyone can relate heartbreak yeah and heartbreak is like i remember when i've had my heart broken and just been like i I'm never going to recover from this. When I came out. You feel like you can't breathe. Oh my God, it's awful.

Yeah, it's bad. I remember going to my parents' house after this long time relationship, like my tail between my legs being like, well, I'm going to come stay over. And she was like, what's wrong? And I was like, I was sold on this over. Yeah. And I remember just like crying to myself to sleep every night for weeks. For weeks. And then I had friends like zooming me

like it'd be like is everything okay i was like no no everything's not okay i was like how am i gonna get out of this hole like i've been that bad i've not had that kind of heartbreak and i've heard about this heartbreak a friend of mine was telling me her brother was going out with this girl he broke her heart cheated on him and he was like crying himself crying every day for three weeks into his pillow do you know what i mean i think i think like it's heartache like if you're like i feel like this has also i felt like a lot of like weird like shame like indian shame around it like a relationship failure yeah i didn't succeed i wasn't like a in this relationship also we just don't understand the concept of like every like you talk about your parents

i talk about my parents and your parents we it, like unhappy, and that's normal. Should we be together? Shouting, screaming? And then our generation's like, I wanna be happy. And then actually that's an alien concept to our family. It is, it's like, what do you mean happy? It's to be selfish. Yeah, you're being selfish.

It's like, wait, are you marrying this person or am I gonna be with this person? Yeah, yeah. It's like the resentment. Yeah, intergenerational resentment. They don't understand it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. My mom sort of gets it now,

but she's like, marry a Bengali man, obviously. But it's like, they don't understand it yeah my mom sort of gets it now but she's like marry a bengali man obviously yeah but it's like they didn't understand it obviously this is i'm not saying every asian woman of a certain age didn't know no couldn't pick up partner but it's it's definitely a thing in our community isn't it it is it is because they're like we did this for our family why can't you do it it's the sacrificing theology yeah we just love a bit of that because i think there's going to be listeners here listening thinking know, I've been in heartbreak or I've just come out of a heartbreak. A lot of people are, yeah. And like, as somebody who's been through heartbreak, I have like so much advice. Yeah.

So much advice. How do you get over a heartbreak? Because when you came out of your relationship, Poppy, and you went straight into one, and all I said to you was like, go and be by yourself. Because that was the thing that I loved the most that bit where I was like by myself having to look after myself had to rent a room in London by myself again do it all by myself I was like oh shit like I'm really good alone and I think when you're really good alone that's when like people like you yeah and they're like oh look at her she's like this amazing independent person but like that moment of being alone and I know I know

this is like a like phrase that like Sex and city use or whatever but it really helped me because it did help me to get over somebody by getting under many many oh yeah to get over someone you have to get under 100% I had like I remember the first time I had sex after being with someone for five years yes a long time and then I went on like a couple of tinder tinder dates and they were all like a bit shit or whatever okay and then I was like I was like well maybe this is good one of them just like kept snogging me and i was like i really don't sleep with you this is like great to know that i'm still wanted and i was like i need to have sex with somebody but i had this like block where i was like i just can't get to the next stage

with anyone because i keep not wanting it i keep being like same person for so long but then i remember we were at this club and there was literally the hottest french man you could meet in your entire life all of my friends were like, that guy is super, super hot. And I was like, yeah, he's really hot. He's really hot. Yeah, I guess he's really hot. And then they were all like, I think he's looking over this way. And I was like, is he?

And then I was like, I think he's looking at me. And I was like, this is fucking happening tonight. This is happening tonight. And it was just the coolest thing ever. Because we literally spoke to each other for five minutes. And then his friends came over and they were like uh yeah we are leaving and he was like oh I'm gonna go home with her just like that and I was like oh my god Frenchmen are so sexy I was like that is sick and yeah it's this

French guy and it literally like blew my mind and I'm glad I like waited to feel like I was ready for it rather than just like sleeping with somebody like snogs, dating, attention you want that straight after a breakup but to get that with sex I was like and it was just the most perfect one night stand of my life because he was like I have to go to Toulouse tomorrow and I was like that's fine please go to Toulouse yeah yeah yeah bye bye how do you get over your exes then um just just like that or um the whole being alone thing well first I go I go, I go on like this rampage, like where I'll be like, we have to go out every day. We have to drink.

I want to be around my friends the whole time. So I'm not thinking about it. But then that gets old. And then you have to really sit with yourself. And then I cry it out. Or then I start thinking, why does nobody love me? I'm unlovable. Like you start thinking those things.

And then you're like, I'm a bad bitch. I'm going to fucking gonna fucking do this yeah it's like a phase three yeah yeah and then you fall back one more time like i'm not a bad bitch you're so dear one regression yeah and then you're like no no i'm a bad bitch so then you go back to it and then you kind of just stay there yeah yeah guys you need to write a book you You've got the fucking playbook. Yeah, you do. The playbook to go around. I didn't know you were writing this. I'm too lazy.

I'm too lazy. What would be the quote on the front cover? No, get a ghostwriter. Listen to me and please write. But I think something you said as well. I think that we are entering an age, and you might disagree with me, but there seems to be a lot of like this toxicity that just is so passable now.

It is. Do you know what I mean? No, no, 100%. I mean, I was in a really like, I know I've said it a million times, loving, stable, healthy relationship with a man that really

should be the man of my dreams. On paper, he's amazing and sometimes I feel guilty. We get it. We all get it. You got it, you got it. Now I understand. Sorry, sorry.

Did I say he was amazing? Did I say we were together for 10 years? Did I tell you like he eat it. Now I understand. Sorry, sorry. We haven't had that point in a long time. Did I say we were together for 10 years? Did I tell you, like, he completed me? Did I tell you, like, I know. I fucking know. Yeah, I know. I know. Ladies and gentlemen,

listeners of Brown Girls Do It Too, they know. Sorry. I'm not going to say it again. Must be nice. I'm not going to say it again. Nice for you. No, he's not even listening to the podcast.

I did say, like, I'm going to talk about dating and stuff, so he probably shouldn't listen, so he's not listening. But there is something to be said about like our tolerance now to toxic and unhealthy relationships or am i just saying do you think it's a high tolerance or a low no high tolerance as in people are more accepting of being in shitty shady sketchy relationships or is that just me because i'm planning to

different phases like you know you go through phases where you do like allow like bad stuff to happen in relationships and then you go. I know. I'm looking at my friends and then they're in fucking shady shit and then I'm in a shady, you know what I mean? I'm just like, is it all around me or is it just my friends? Maybe it's just my friends. It's just your friends.

You can't do a census of three people and be like, you know what? Toxic relationships are all the rage. Is it how everyone does everything? No, but you're right. It is phases because i was in toxic and now when i get like one little red flag i'm like nope that i can't do it yeah but you get smarter right you get smarter like when you grow older you know the things that you want and the things you'll put up with and the things that are red flags yeah you don't know that when you're like 18 dating no no no you know you're like great and then you and you also start knowing what what like things are wrong with you as well yeah like i'm starting to realize like okay maybe i might need some therapy like yeah yeah i'm like you know what i keep doing the

same thing over and over i keep like sabotaging things that i didn't even want in the first place yeah it's because i think i get in a relationship because it feels good in it. It's nice. Fuzzy and warm. And then when I end up with them, I start thinking like, I don't know if I want to be in this. But then I'm like, but he's great on paper.

Yes. And that's what I stick. He's great on paper. This will be good on paper. Oh, he has money. I'll be set. You know, or like, oh, he's, the sex is good.

He finally made me orgasm. You know, like shit like that. I think this is the thing that women often fight with. The guy who's good on paper, i.e. car, house, home, career, whatever. Check, check, check.

Check, check, check. Certain tax bracket, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But then when it comes to real life situations, you can't go out with your mate. Why are you wearing those boots? Oh, you're calling your mum again?

Or like all of that shit. But also, don't you think that good on paper stuff is like a little bit overrated? Like what's this idea that we need this person who's got all these things?

Well, that our parents tell us. I feel like that's engraved in our head. Yeah, it's true, actually. I've never like got in a relationship with someone. But let's get real. Everyone has a good on paper. Like, I'm not being, I wouldn't consider a relationship with, God, I'm going to get fucking cancelled saying this, but like a bartender because our lifestyle.

No, you just have sex with the bartender. No, I just have sex with the bartender. I wouldn't have a girl. What if he was a bartender come writer? I think that's like with the bartender that's about it what if he was a bartender come writer so that's my next point what if he was like a bartender yeah there's tears

but like let's be honest and this is something with my ex-partner college bartender probably not you know what I mean but it's exactly

sommelier I'm in absolutely sommelier a michelin-starred restaurant but it's true let's talk about our paper, what you're willing,

women of a certain age. Guys do it all the time, right? They can go out with a waitress, but she's hot. It doesn't matter what she earns. No. Women, we don't have that. You're being incredibly candid.

You're being like, these things are important to me. I can see that. I would not. I'd fuck a bartender. Would I consider a long-term relationship with a bartender? Just a bartender?

And that sounds awful. No, I'd be lying. Because you want somebody who's got ambition, or you want that? Yeah,term relationship with a bartender? Just a bartender? And that sounds awful. No, I'd be lying. Because you want somebody who's got ambition? Yeah, if he was a bartender, he was like writing poetry and he had this big play, I'd be like, well, fucking hell, babe, I'll probably have to support you for the next five years and screw that shit up.

So no. God, maybe you're right, actually, because I was just thinking, of course I know you, you're such an alpha personality. I was going to be like, I don't need someone good on paper because I'm good on paper,

so I can support myself and then I'll support the person but actually you're right maybe I would be a bit more listen I'm telling you post ex-partner when you're just dating

and you don't give a fuck and you don't want to see these people again you would fuck anyone and actually that's your best self right they're like I just

I'm a bartender or I'm a librarian and they don't care but what if you fell in love with like a clown or something does he earn a lot of money I promise you I'm not fallingender or I'm a librarian. But what if he fell in love with, like, a clown or something? Does he earn a lot of money? I promise you I'm not falling in love with the clown.

I will promise you right now that I'm not falling in love with the clown. He's a really sexy clown. There is no sexy clown out there. If he's paying his taxes, do we earn enough money to go on holiday? Can he pay the mortgage? Then, yeah. You're right. Financial stability is actually something we still see.

You're right. Like, we're deluded into thinking oh my god I'm not 22 anymore no exactly we're not 22 we're entering the 30s you're right you're so right

of course I'm right I'm right about everything the reality like I know someone who like she's got this fuck buddy and they are amazing

on like actually the opposite on paper not amazing but in terms of emotion emotion sex everything but he

doesn't earn as much so it becomes a problem when they go on holiday and she's like i'll pay and he's like machismo which is macho bullshit blah blah but it's like but in the beginning fine but for how long the thing about comfort then comfort starts coming in right because i feel like with men they start getting comfortable like they have mommy issues i feel like they're like i'm being taken care of you know and then i feel like that's where you have to draw the line like yeah you can help support somebody's dreams but like absolutely we're past that i feel like now yeah i think you should have figured out your dreams and let's see where you're at now you know the true equality is like being able to support each other in some way yes i've been like wondering recently whether like

really truly equal relationships can happen in the same way where we're like we're both equal at the same time because you're not sometimes I got your back sometimes you've got mine

but that's the equality of it it's the constant up and down peaks and troughs they could be doing any job anything well she wouldn't

fuck a clown what would you not fuck I would I promise you there's no sexy clown out there there's no if any sexy clowns

could email us. Please email. Please send me. Oh no, I would fuck a clown. What professions are not sexy? Clowns. Clowns. What else you got?

Clowns. Magicians. Yeah. No, but he could do some sexy shit in the video. Yeah, yeah. Exactly. Do you know when you meet those girls who are like, I like him, but I don't like his fashion sense,

but it's okay, I can change that. And I'm like, you can't change that. You can't change that. You can't change the way they think aesthetically about things. That's why I'm so critical. You can buy them new clothes, but you cannot change the things that they see and they like. Do you like a project?

Are either of you girls project girls? Do you like a project? No, I am a project myself. I have no time for the project. They time for projects so this is interesting neither of us are into that so that's why when I put my relationship filter on I'm way more critical not I sound like a dick but I'm just fucking realistic I've had a divorce I've had two divorces really yeah I've been forced to be forced to be a grown-up at the age of like 19 20 so I'm just a bit more like if I'm having if I'm going if this is the ting

then you need to be like otherwise I'm not no we're not this is not yeah I'm wasting your time and you're wasting my time my brother once told me this thing was like when you start seeing somebody and you think it might go in the relationship way really early on if there's something about them you don't like just bring it up yeah it was actually really interesting advice because i like did it i did it to my current partner you know i was like how soon did you bring it also me and my current partner we were like we were like casual for like a year yeah and then we like got together and i was like you know what yeah i do actually like you yeah yeah and then like he he smoked i mean i smoked as like you. Yeah. And then, like, he smoked. I mean, I smoked as well, like, cigarettes.

And he then was, like, moving on to, like, he was on a vape. And I was like, I just don't, I really don't like the vape. Yeah. And then my husband. Whilst you were smoking? Yeah, yeah, I know, I know. That's where the trish was. That's where she was.

Really, Poppy? You were going to the bartender? Fucking hell. What's wrong with you? Why are you smoking a vape for, you pussyhole? No, because I just didn't smoke, like, in the day. Whereas he, like, loved his vape. He was addicted to nicotine, and i remember like stopping him because i

was like this is getting into a relationship i'm actually genuinely starting to like you but i will not start a life with somebody who's addicted to nicotine because you're an addict and if i want to have kids with you i don't want to be smoking in the house like i don't want that for my future and i was just like no like i you know i see something here and i'll take it there but i don't want that anymore do you have any lines any kind of going into a relationship other than

don't be a fucking clown don't be a clown and also don't be a clown mannerisms like how they treat other people waiters

and like even women yeah and like I like chivalry as well I know that's kind of dying no I love it well like opening a door

just being a gentleman just being a gentleman I feel like that's fading away lately so I like it's not cool dying. No, I love it. Well, like opening a door. Yeah. Just being a gentleman. Just being a gentleman. I feel like that's fading away lately. So I like. It's not cool anymore. Yeah, it's not cool. I love that. But drawing the line, I guess like being like a mom, being a mama's boy really does like.

Don't go out with any Asians. Yeah. No, the mama's boy thing is a lot. You don't like that. Someone's close to his mom. Like, no, it could be close. There's a line. No, no.

All right. You could be close to your mom like no it could be close there's a there's a line no no all right you could be close to your mom but like if you i dated somebody where his mom went to the pundit or something and she was like and this man is like in his 30s and she was like she was like you're supposed to be wearing red this month and this man comes home with red ugly t-shirts okay and he's like yeah my mom got these for so i have to wear these because the fund said this. Good luck. And I'm like, what? In my head, I was like writing off. Written on red t-shirts. Yeah, like stuff like that.

My name is Jyoti K. And I'd like to thank my ex for teaching me what an orgasm is. So, yeah, because it's over for you little boys. That's all I got to say. Oh, my God. That's amazing. Yeah, that's one good thing I can say about him. Wow.

Well, he gave you your first orgasm. Yeah. What the damn? Why didn't you keep him? Because once she did it once, she was like, I can do this again. I can. I'm not. No, because I can't.

I'm like, hold on to it, polyamory fucking dickhead. Because I can't come from sex, I found out finally. And he was kind of like a nympho in a way. Hang on, you can't come from sex. No, it has to be from oral. Oh, okay, yeah. And I didn't know that. Because when I would have sex and I'd just go do my thing with these magic fingers right here.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, and then he went down on me one time and because i told him this but he knew why i couldn't because he was you know i don't know he knew that and i was like oh my god like this is what it feels like go forth and get more oral yeah so now i'm like it's over for you men so yeah yeah i'll i won't throw him under the bus that was good thing he did but that's an amazing thing he did shout out to your ex yeah but that's all I got and his amazing tongue

that thing I think he was writing the alphabet with that thing oh god you remember that scene in Cool Intentions where he's writing

the alphabet on them so I'm a blazer oh yeah oh is he really oh wow I thought I made this up and then she's like do you want a blowjob

sorry I really love American accents I wasn't mimicking you it's okay we love American accents. I wasn't mimicking you. It's okay, we love your accents. A below job. Say arsehole. Arsehole.

And we're like, you can lick my arsehole. Don't you, right? That was the previous episode. We've had so much fun with you. Thank you so much for coming. And thank you for being so fucking candid. It's hard to get brown women to come on and talk like like the way you did so yeah thank you of course i appreciate i appreciate shows like this because we need more

like this because i feel like these conversations happen but undercover yeah so when we like girls like us are outspoken like people are like oh wow other girls talk like this you know what i mean so we definitely need shows like this. So thank you for having me. Aw, great. No problem. That's all we've got time for. I'm very interested to know

what people think about their exes though. Yes, me too. And if you have any thoughts at all, email us browngirlsdoittoo at bbc.co.uk. And please do subscribe to the podcast on BBC Sounds.