BTC Sessions - Saylor DESTROYS 4 Year Bitcoin Cycle MYTH | Nico, Walker, Marty Bent

Episode Date: June 11, 2025

Michael Saylor just DESTROYED the 4-year Bitcoin cycle myth—and it’s changing how the smartest investors think about Bitcoin’s future. Nico, Walker, and Marty Bent break it all down in this must-watch discussion with BTC Sessions.FOLLOW TODAY’S PANELISTS:https://x.com/BITVOLThttps://x.com/WalkerAmericahttps://x.com/MartyBentFOLLOW BTC SESSIONS on X/Nostr: x.com/[e-mail] private one-on-one sessions with BITCOIN MENTOR! Learn self custody, hardware, multisig, lightning, privacy, running a node, and plenty more - all from a team of top notch educators that I've personally vetted.https://bitcoinmentor.io/—------------------------------SHOW SPONSORS:BITCOIN WELL - BUY BITCOINhttps://qrco.de/bfiDC6COINKITE/COLDCARD (5% discount):https://qrco.de/bfiDBVAQUA WALLEThttps://qrco.de/bfiD8gNUNCHUK HONEYBADGER INHERITANCEhttps://qrco.de/bfiDARHODLHODL NO KYC P2P EXCHANGEhttps://hodlhodl.com/join/BTCSESSIONDEBIFI LOANShttps://qrco.de/bfiDCp#btc #bitcoin #crypto

Michael Saylor just made one of his boldest claims yet. In a brand new Bloomberg interview, Sailor doesn't only drop yet another seven-figure price prediction. He says we may be witnessing the end of the four-year cycle entirely. No more bull runs, no more bear markets, just one long march upward from here. It's going up forever, Laura. Let's take a listen to what he had to say on Bloomberg,

right here. How do you expect the asset to continue a price increase at these levels that we've seen? I mean, can it keep that up over the next five years, over the next 10 years? And at what point do we see, you know, winter coming again? Because that's been a permanent fixture of this asset class, right? It's gone from zero or a thousand to 20 and then back down to three or four and then up to 50 and then back down to 15. And now up to 110. Like, when does it drop again? Winner's not coming back. We're past that phase. If Bitcoin's not going to zero, it's going to a million dollars. And you have all the evidence you need to determine that, right? The President of the United States has determined he supports Bitcoin. The Cabinet supports Bitcoin. Scott Peasant supports Bitcoin. Paul Atkins has shown himself to be an enthusiastic believer of Bitcoin and digital assets. Kintez at CFTC feels the same ray. The banks are going to custody Bitcoin. Bitcoin has gotten through its riskiest period. The accounting has been corrected. There's now only 450 Bitcoin a day available for sale by natural sellers. That's the miners.

At this level, that works out to about $50 million of Bitcoin available for sale every day. If that $50 million is bought, then the price has got to move up to find any natural, any seller that's price sensitive. Now, if you do the math, you'll actually see the Bitcoin Treasury companies by themselves are buying the entire natural supply. BlackRock and the ETFs are buying another measure of that. And we've got nation-state actors coming into the space. So I think when Bitcoin rallies, if it surges to $500,000 or $1 million,

then maybe we could talk about it crashing down by $200,000 a coin. But at the current price levels, it only takes $50 million to turn the entire drive shaft of the crypto economy one turn. And you've got the Trump media organization announcing $2.5 billion. You've got GameStop announcing $500 million. You've got my company that's raising billions and billions of dollars. So the writing is on the wall. Bitcoin's moving higher. How do you expect?

So with that, it may sound pretty bold, the idea of no longer having bear markets. But we are going to show something right after the jump when we get our guests in here. that does show pretty clearly that this cycle is seemingly quite different from anything that's come before it. And it does give a picture of where we could potentially be headed. On top of that, Michael Saylor has also been doing the rounds as per usual. But more recently, he visited Jordan Peterson and his 8.7 million subscribers dropping Bitcoin Truth bombs in what could be yet a another massive orange-pilling movement for a broader audience. So today we're going to discuss this and plenty, plenty more in terms of why we're bullish.

We're going to be joined by Walker America of the Bitcoin podcast. I hope it did that voice justice. Marty Bent from TFTC and Nico Moran, the master of Bitcoin news from Simply Bitcoin. This is a big one. You're not going to want to miss a beat. I am Ben with the BTC sessions. This is your. daily session. All right. So let's bring in our panel. I want to welcome to the show,

Marty Bent, Walker, and Nico. Gentlemen, how are you guys doing? What's up, dude? Better now, better now, despite your terrible impression of my voice. Should we try to predict the pot-com tweet that's going to come out? I meant to say I wanted to get an official stamp of approval pre-episode, you know, Anybody that's watching this right now, make sure you tweet at PodConf and you let them know that this event is happening. They're going to want to be present. So anyway, I am Podcom compliant, by the way, so it shouldn't be a problem.

I think we're all approved. I'm pretty sure. Sessions, do we still do that thing where if we open a drink, we have to do it without muting? I mean, yeah, it aims the microphone. I'm pretty sure that's... ASMR. That's all I want to hear. Yeah, wait, wait, wait, before we start, I just want to give a shout out to Walker for what he did with Carla at the TFTC event was fantastic.

That was incredible. Dude, that was art. It was like a theater play. That was incredible. We were a little nervous, I'll be honest. And also shout out to Pub Key. Shout out to Marty and TFTC for putting all that together. It was a hell of an event, but we'd never done a live skip before. So we were like a little bit, you know, a little bit nervous about it. like, what if this just bombs hard? Like, what if we're only funny recorded?

Luckily, it didn't. It went pretty well. We were pretty lubed up with alcohol going into it. So, like, you know, even if it did bomb, we were going to have a good time either way. Dude, me and Opti felt like morons falling out with a meme review. We're like, dude, we didn't prepare enough for this. What are we doing? It was a good meme review, to be fair.

I appreciate it. I think it was particularly impressive because people thought we were going into intermission and then the spotlights went on you and Carla and you literally put asses back in seats and put on the hell of the show. It was incredible. It was incredible. Yes.

I feel very sad to have missed that. I love a good spectacle. I wish I could have seen that. I think we're going to have to do it again as all I can say. Yeah, absolutely. Fantastic. Well, jents, I appreciate you all joining the show today.

This is why are we bullish. And just kind of get the ball rolling here. I do want to chat a little bit about what was said here just in general. And the thing I was alluding to is taking a look at kind of the difference of the past cycles here and kind of these blow off like retail FOMO tops that we've seen the past, you know, 2017, 2021, you know, and before that 2013. And it looks very, very different and it feels very, very different this time around.

just in terms of it has felt painful because it's just been this slow, steady grind. And I guess my general question to you is, do you buy Sailor's line of we're past that? We're not going to get these distinctive cycles and these massive, like, are kind of par for the course 75% corrections. Is it more of this 45 degree angle in the coming years? So I'm curious to hear your thoughts. I mean, I think the having naturally starts mattering less and less, the more havings that take place, right? Like, that's natural.

It's having a increasingly diminishing effect on the total new supply that is being issued. Of course, it's going to have less than effect. So whether or not there's a distinctive point where we can say, yep, this is the point where having stopped mattered, we're in the, I don't want to say it, but we're in the super cycle or whether or not it is kind of still just like chopping around, but that chopping starts to be a little bit, you know, more, let's say, regular. Like it's not happening in that cadence with that four-year cycle. I'm not sure.

But it, boy, you hate to say like this time feels different, but sure does feel different. Well, I would add to that too. I would not be surprised. And I think whether it's the havings or I think another important thing to take into consideration. I haven't been in this for 12 years now, which is hard to believe. You go back to like 2013, 2014 era. The way sort of these blow off tops would happen is you'd have some sort of news event that would send people to Bitcoin. The price would go up. They'd FOMO in. And then ultimately, retail would get over their skis trading shitcoins. So the sort of path in was they would go buy

Bitcoin. Then they'd send their Bitcoin to Polaniacs or BitTRAx or Cripsi, God forbid, rest in peace, all three of those. And then they trade chip coins and lose that. A lot of like the last three major cycles in 2013, 2014, 2017 and even 21 to a certain extent, we buy Bitcoin, send it to exchange and then trade shit coins with it. And the dominant flow of capital of newcomers is coming through these other mechanisms, whether it be the ETFs or proxy exposure via public stocks. And there's literally no ability for somebody to buy an Ibit stock or buy an STR and then send it to an exchange and convert that for shitpoint. So I think that's actually playing into it as well. And I think that a lot of the money going into these proxy Bitcoin exposure products, whether there's ETFs or stocks,

is stickier where people are just going to set it and forget it. So not the way I would get exposure to Bitcoin, but to each their own and many people are deciding that they want to get exposure via these products. I mean, the ETF launch, Ibit's the most successful launch ever, the quickest the $70 billion in market cap of any ETF ever launched. So I think it's a very different dynamic in that way as well. Interesting.

Niko, how about yourself? Yeah, it's an excellent story. it this morning. I mean, the fact that Michael Saylor is going on legacy financial media and he's basically saying, hey, guys, it's a super cycle. The cycles are dead. It's the end of crypto winters. I've seen this pattern before. I'm going to take a little bit of a contrarian take. I think in 2017, the thing that people saw to, like, see, the thing that people used to try to outperform Bitcoin was the ICOs. In 2021, it was kind of like the layer one alt-coys. what I'm seeing this cycle is the Bitcoin Treasury play, right?

So I think, you know, we're starting to see a bunch of copycats, of course, like the big three Michael Saylor's strategy, Jack Mahler and SoftBank and Tethers 21, and then, of course, David Bailey's Nakamoto, I don't think those are going to go away. But the copycats, which are popping all over the world, I think they're going to start cutting corners, and they're going to take leverage, and they're going to try to do whatever it takes to raise money.

money and buy Bitcoin. And then I think eventually something's going to blow up. And then we're going to have a crash. I mean, I've heard this so many times, right? You know, this is the Bitcoin super cycle. The cycles are done. We're heading to $1 million. But, you know, it's a very, very familiar pattern. But you can tell, like, sailors emboldened, you know, and rightly so, he was vindicated. He earned his stripes. I mean, he bought at the top at 2021. I remember seeing him a Pacific Bitcoin. you know, his company was down billions of dollars and he was just silent just on the VIP section, sitting in the main, like watching all the panels saying nothing. And then of course, like all of us Bitcoiners go through, he had a vindication story. And, you know, his stock outperformed.

And the guy looks like an absolute genius. And I think he is. So yeah, I mean, I think this cycles, maybe it's an unpopular take. I get a lot of heat when I say it. But I think this cycle's ICO, layer one, which is 2021, is these Bitcoin treasury companies. I think the more copycats pop up, I think the higher the probability they're going to cut corners. And then eventually someone's going to take too much leverage and then a domino effect happens. And then bomb being bum boom, we're in another bear market. Can I take the contrarian point to that contrarian point? So a contrarian, a contrarian to contrarian. Yeah. I got opting soundboard. I got opting. soundboard with

it's a contrarian derivative dude i've got a soundboard too don't make me use it sessions told me no but i might have to but no what i wanted to say is I'm not gonna get through this okay i'll be with this i'll be very quick i promise

my thought here is that i agree with you nico like it does the bitcoin treasury companies do feel like iCOs they do feel like their layer one shit coin uh hype right they could feel you could even say oh yeah it feels like the, you know, NFT bubble that also blew up around that same time. However, all of those things, ICOs, NFTs, layer one shitcoins,

those all sucked potential value that would have gone into Bitcoin and they sucked it away from Bitcoin. The difference here is that, yes, are some of these companies going to blow up? Absolutely. But the ones that blow up are probably going to have an insignificant amount of Bitcoin relative to the ones that stay solvent like micro strategy. Additionally, all of the people who are pumping Fiat into these, you know, these proxies, vehicles, they are not pumping that into shitcoins. They are pumping it ultimately into Bitcoin

via a proxy. So I think the setup is fundamentally different there. I see the concern. I share it as well. It's kind of wild how many of these Bitcoin treasury companies are popping up. But at the end of the day, if we believe that hyper-bitquinization is actually going to happen, which I do, isn't every company eventually going to be a Bitcoin treasury company? And so it just depends where we're at in that cycle. Are people going to blow up along the way? Yes. Because if you play Fiat games, you win Fiat prizes. But I think most of these larger Bitcoin treasury companies will stay solvent. And ultimately, I think that's just, that's good for Bitcoin still. I think, I think you nailed it with one specific point. Fiat games get Fiat prizes. I think

to piggyback on what Nico said, it's the fact that some of these companies and probably over enough time a lot of these companies will continue the Fiat games and the ones that aren't actually plugged into that Bitcoin or ethos that kind of understand the underlying of what's really going on

they're the ones that you know living on a Bitcoin standard doesn't work if you are spending more than you earn and that is exactly the problem with you get a company that is

not making any money and it's just bleeding capital. And then they say, hey, we're on a Bitcoin standard now. We've got our Bitcoin treasury so that they can pump their stock. But when Bitcoin dumps and then their stock dumps and then they still are like swimming in debt, they're fucked. And so I think that's probably where we see the follow. Also, the one thing that I never quite bought is when people said, well, institutions aren't buying this for the short term. Some of them, like, yeah, Sailor's going to go to his grave with all those coins. Those coins are never seen the light of day. But the majority of other companies are made up of the exact same idiots that are like retail

that dumped every other cycle before and are subject to the exact same emotions. So I think it's kind of a mix of the two. I think the ones that get it stick around. But, Nico, I'd agree. I don't think cycles are over. They just maybe look and are structured a little bit different. So, such a diplomatic Canadian answer. Can I be a contrarian of a contrarian of a contrarian?

Yes, can you give me, can you give me? Is that okay? Yes, absolutely. Let's get the contrarian take on that. Okay, so we were talking about Fiat, like Fiat games, right? You know, I love Sailor. I think what he's done for the industry has been fantastic. like you mentioned earlier, Ben, in the beginning of the show about him going on Jordan Peterson's show

and like basically, you know, speaking the Satoshi gospel to kind of the mainstream, the reality is that if you look on Google Trends, Bitcoin peaked in 2017. It hasn't come back since that in terms of the eyes of retail in terms of the eyes of the masses. So I think Sailor is definitely moving the Overton window and really getting that message out there. But there was a viral clip that went on X and it was essentially Mitchell Hoddle asking Sailor about whether strategy is going to make their reserves public or not and Sailor said like you know we can't do that you know like privacy and you know security and all that stuff like I've seen Paulo CEO of Tether literally copy paste the Bitcoin treasury address with 92,000 Bitcoin the country of

El Salvador has a public address. Anyone could see it all the time, right? And not to mention that all those ETFs and strategy all have their Bitcoin custody with Coinbase, right? So like that to me, like from a Bitcoiner's perspective and Ben, you do, you're all about self-custody, dude. That sounds like Fiat games, bro. So like maybe it's not like, you know, like direct, you know, shit coining, right?

or direct alt-coining, but, you know, like, it, like, the whole thing of Bitcoin is don't trust verify. And it's becoming like a trust me bro type of situation, right? That's the way I'm kind of looking at it. And as much as I love Saylor, as much as I appreciate what he's done for the industry, and I think strategy is going to go to the moon and more. Like, I'll be honest with you. This is just my humble opinion. I could be totally wrong here. I don't have to be. I don't have to be. have experience in the public markets. As a Bitcoinser, that answer that he gave didn't sit well with me. No.

No, I fully agree. I thought that shit was lame in terms of it adds. He was saying it's too risky to share the public addresses. But like, you know, in terms of actual risk to the underlying asset, it's the key management, right? Like, it's, if you, there's, it's different if you're, say, an individual. or you're a company who hasn't disclosed the amount of Bitcoin you have. But when you're like, hey, this is exactly how many Bitcoin we own.

And then somebody says, show me the address. And you say, well, that's too risky. That puts the Bitcoin at risk. Well, not really. It's still secured by the same keys. It's not like you can work backwards from the public address to compromise the keys. And you're already trying to be transparent with what you have. So I just really didn't buy that answer.

I thought it was pretty weak. And I got a lot of shit for it on like X and all over the place and videos and stuff like that. And a lot of people did. But I just thought it was a lame answer. You know, it doesn't mean that I don't like some of the other stuff Sailor has done. But I thought it was weak. I'm curious what Marty thinks here too. Well, I was reading James Checks latest newsletter from Check on Chain.

Apparently he was in Singapore, Hong Kong. one of the conferences over the weekend. He said that Preston Pish made a very good point, and I don't think he said this explicitly, but I heard this theory earlier this week, too, is that the sort of charade of its insecure is a facade to mess that he may have to sell at some point. And Preston's point was basically confirming something

that David Bailey said in the context of Nakamoto a couple of weeks ago, about if the discount to NAV, if the premium turns to a discount to NAV, it actually makes sense to sell Bitcoin and buy back your shares because that actually increases your Bitcoin per share if you're using that as a KPI. I forget if James said this explicitly in his newsletter, but another theory that is out there is that he doesn't want to do proof of reserves because he doesn't want people to see him moving his Bitcoin when he's about to sell to, to, to, to do a share buyback to make sure that the Bitcoin per share is going up. It's something they haven't done historically, but they've been getting increasingly creative

with their strategy. I hate the name strategy and like talking about. They've been getting increasingly creative with what they're doing in terms of financial engineering. And I wouldn't be surprised at something like that arises in the future where they actually sell Bitcoin to increase Bitcoin per share. if it gets the discounted enough. But I agree with everybody like Bitcoin makes it easy. I think that the hand-wavy, like it's insecure argument is completely BS.

There's, it's not plenty of people do it very securely, very confidently. It's been happening for years and it's certainly not insecure. Yeah, yeah. I mean, I just finished with the, we just did an HRF. Thanks, Walker. I appreciate that. It makes me funny. I just finished.

We just finished up an HRF webinar this week with human rights dissidents. And one of the people I co-host these webinars with, her name is Anna Chekovich. And she's a Russian dissident. And she worked alongside Alexei Navalny. And she's with the Anti-Corruption Foundation. And for years, that foundation had just a singular public address for Bitcoin donations. And just everything went there. And when people are like, oh, you should do something about that without fully explaining it, they're like, I mean, fuck them.

Let them see how much money we have. What are they going to do? They can't take it. So just like proof is in the pudding that the Russian government could not steal the Bitcoin from a direct opposition raising money through a singular address. Now, they did fix that after the fact because you need to obviously protect. privacy of donors and stuff in sensitive situations. And so BTC pay server works a bunch better and they coin join and all that. But the fact remains that having a public address in the most drastic of extremes, it was still secure in terms of the funds underlying. So there's that.

Anyway, go ahead. Yeah. So, I mean, first of all, first thing I'll say is like, and I heard this from an inside source. It might be wrong, but basically, like, all that Bitcoin that's custody with Coinbase is in Brian Armstrong's nightstand on a ledger. That's the first thing I'll say. The second thing I'll say is, in all seriousness, is like, these are Fiat games. What is Fiat, but not a shit coin? What is the outcome of shit coin games? Right. So, like, I'm just observing here. You know, maybe this is too sophisticated Wall Street, you know, like maneuvering and all

that, you know, this is above my pay grade but as just as a Bitcoiner that, you know, stays humble, stacks that, stay solvent, and put Bitcoin into self-custody, like, I don't know. I don't know. I think

an important thing to take into consideration too is like how how isolated is that public market proxy Bitcoin exposure, treasury play this time around. When you look at the number of demand drivers, that is one. You have nation states, the U.S. government, obviously Bhutan, El Salvador,

others talking about Bitcoin strategic reserves. You have the state of Texas. You have many other states throughout the United States thinking about this. And even if a lot of these publicly traded Bitcoin Treasury companies, I was going to set my webcam. blow up like is my question is I'm not saying it's going to go one way or the other I'm very curious to see like is there enough external demand from this pure sort of speculative attack via public capital markets vertical isolated enough like is there enough demand outside that that that play to soak up any blowups that happen if a company's force to sell their Bitcoin is there enough external demand from that strategy to just soak it up and make the the correction caused by that sell off suppressed. Well, to Nico's earlier point, retail isn't even here yet.

Like so, and not that retail is, you know, they're, you know, maybe not punching as heavy as these institutional players, but like let's not underestimate the power of, first of all, the existing army of DCA plebs that are just a constant bywall every hour of every day constantly. But then also like when we hit another stretch of kind of foma where people realize, oh, this thing is running and I need to get on board this train

because nothing stops this train. And like I don't want to be left here at the station, you know, with my dick in my hand. Pardon to my French. I think that that actually creates a massive amount of demand. And like, yeah, it's from the little fish but that adds up. And like, again, I'd say never underestimate

when we do see a correction, what do we know happens? DCA plebs like myself decide to smash by and mass. And like that does account for a significant amount of byside pressure. Gentlemen, I don't mean to derail a conversation, but this is very important. I have to bring it to everybody's attention.

I'm proud to say that this episode is a 50th. Yes. I am reposting that right now. Green checks everywhere. So proud. I mean, if they screencap this and then tweet this, that's going to be, and then put additional check marks down. That will be that much more excellent. So again, historic moment, gentlemen, thank you for making this happen. This is huge. insane signal mega podconf confirmed. I think this means we win, right? That works.

We win the game, yeah. I think this is how you break the internet, actually. I think so. Okay, so gentlemen, I'm going to shift gears here a little bit. I'm going to do a quick sponsor shout out here. But Marty, do you still have time to tell us why you're bullish? I do. I do.

I can hear what's going on out there. nobody's stressed out something good okay perfect all right vibes are high all right so uh we're gonna say a quick uh shout out to sponsor the show uh and we'll be back in just a moment if you're enjoying the show if you really enjoy how podconf approved this episode is make sure you smash that like button uh it really does help we'll see on the other side of the jump see you guys a second Bitcoin Well is the best place to be buying and selling Bitcoin in Canada and the U.S. And now with Bitcoin Well Infinite, it's also the best place to be making large buys at their OTC desk of over $50,000. Their white glove service gives you fast transactions, no slippage, and the lowest fees.

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All right, we are back in. And if anybody wants to check out Bitcoin, well, you can check them out just simply by scanning the QR code off to the right of the screen. But Marty, I'm going to toss it to you. And I'm really curious to hear, why are you bullish? What's top of mind for you right now? I'm bullish on Gen Z. I was highly skeptical of them for many years, the broccoli-headed foreign generation to me. I never understood your language. I never understood how they communicate with each other. I had the assumption that they were nihilistic

TikTokers that had no drive in their life. But at Rabbit Hole Recap, we did a mini Gen Z series series where we talked about, we were making fun of our core demo on Rapid Hole Recap. Our core demo is males age 35 to 45, or excuse me, yeah, 35 to 45. And the second biggest part of that demo is like 45. Oh, we all know that demographic well, every single one of us in the room. That's all of our demographic. Let's be honest. Our demo's there.

So we made a call out to Zoomers. We had a Zoomer series for a few weeks where we brought Zoomers on. and there are a lot of good zoomers out there that get Bitcoin. And not only Zoomers, Gen Alpha, like, my oldest, he's five. He has any cash wallet for his chores. He does chores around the house. He gets Bitcoin. We have shows like the Tuttle Twins that can, you can pump good propaganda into your kids' brains these days.

The Tuddle Twins is great for that. And then I've had the pleasure of working with a young developer, Moses Finley's 19. He helped us build the opportunity cost browser extension, and he did it very quickly. He gets Bitcoin. He gets how to leverage AI to build things. And so we're talking about, we've been talking about like institutional investors, sailor, all these old heads and old money getting into Bitcoin. But I want to throw a bone and say that I'm bullish because I think the younger generations get it,

even better than those institutional guys putting billions of dollars into Bitcoin. I love that. I'm somebody that comes right to mind is Ella Huff. She's excellent, going around to universities, if I'm not mistaken, and kind of rallying the troops and getting local student groups to chat about Bitcoin. And Arsh, who is with the Human Rights Foundation as well. Absolutely legend. I met him at Pacific Bitcoin. And dude had like a way sweeter beard than me. And I found out he was graduate. waiting high school that year and it made me feel like less of a man. I didn't realize Arsh was 21 until earlier this year. I was like, David, I thought you were like high age. He's so mature not because he looks that way. Yeah, yeah, exactly. No, he's awesome though.

But yeah, and to your point on Gen A, diddo, young daughter, she's in love with Bitcoin. She goes, I mean, Nico, you saw her at the sat market tearing it up with her with her Bitcoin wallet and she was going up to the merchants and buying stuff all on her own with her lightning wallet and the merchants that many of them that we have when we do our markets here in Calgary are often very new to Bitcoin. So they're looking at my seven-year-olds, I think she was six at the time running around being like, who is this girl, this little girl who knows a Bitcoin wallet better than me and I'm like 30. So it's really cool to see the younger generation getting it and growing up in a world where there's never been it's never not existed if you're a parent out there

and we do very limited screen time but total twins if you're looking to uh indoctrinate your kids with good propaganda that is actually um uh sort of open to human flourishing freedom and sound economic policy put on the total twins uh it's crazy i'll ask my five year old like what is bitcoin it'll be like it's hard money can't be controlled only 21 million Satoshi Nakamoto created. And I didn't push him towards it. I just put on Tuttle Twins episode one. He watches a few at a time.

And his favorite just so happened to be Bitcoin. Maybe some osmosis from hearing me and the wife talk about it every once in a while. But it is his favorite episodes. The two of them are favorite. Tunnel Twins crushes it. Yeah, Ben. He would recognize you because of that's hilarious. That's awesome. That is super cool.

My daughter was pretty stoked when she saw that episode, too. I was a proud dad moment. That's awesome. And I mean, Nico Walker, both parents now as well with a flourishing Bitcoin. I mean, between the four of us, we're raising a village here already. I mean, well, no, our wives are putting in all of the elbow grease on that one, or a lot of it anyways. Between the four of us, we have almost as many kids as Elon Musk. so we're doing okay.

Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. We're printing. We're printing Bitcoiners. And I think what Marty said about kind of the indoctrination part is so true. I mean, I think it gives like a bad name, like kind of indoctrination. It's like you're propagandizing. But like at least our cult is like based on prosperity, hope, opportunity, peace and not endless wars. and like their cult is like,

like it's literally a death cult. So, you know, like what are the options, right? You kind of have to, you know, put them in, I don't know, like steer them in the right direction, I guess, because if not, they end up in this nihilistic kind of, you know, short-term thinking type of mindset. And to go back to what Marty was saying about the Zoomers, it's really interesting because it's one of the first generations that were,

it is the first generation that's Internet native. So their ability to like grasp social media like literally makes me feel like a moron. Like they just understand it instinctively, intuitively, like I've never seen before. And then I forget where I said this, but the alpha generation, I think that's the next generation. Wow, they have such a great name like the alpha generation. Like wow. We got millennials. They got alpha.

That's pretty cool. Dude, Gen Beta is screwed though. Yeah, it's super screwed. What are you going to do? Like, can you imagine Gen Alpha like talking shit to Jen? Like, you're, bro, you're okay, shut up. Okay, beta. That is great.

Oh, man. But yeah, man, it's, it's really interesting because Gen Alpha is going to be Bitcoin native. They're born into a world where essentially Bitcoin existed. So their ability to, they're like, they're going to look at us the way like we looked at our parents when, they were like, you know, cutting checks, you know? Like, and we're just like, what, like, what are you doing? Right. And that makes me extremely hopeful about the future.

Yeah. I look forward to the day where I have to call my son over and be like, make sure I'm, I'm doing this minisccript transaction, right? It's like, all right, over. Here you go. That's fantastic. I love it. Well, Marty, I know that you're.

Oh, wait, wait. Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. The Opti in the chat is fake because I just looked at Opti. that's a fake opti in the chat. Is it? Yeah, that's a fake opti in the chat.

What? Optimus Fields. What? Okay. He's not sending me back to Bitcoin or what? Wait, are you referring to somebody that has the name Optimus Fields in the chat that is fake? Or are you talking about my opti? I'm literally the dude in the chat, not Canadian Opti, but the dude in the chat.

but the dude in the chat that's Optimus Fields is not real Opti. That's a fake Opti. What? That's an imposer. But it's very noble what he's doing. And now Opti's, you know, pressuring me. And now Opti's getting erased things to fake Opti. So really, he's like a white hat hacker kind of thing.

When we're at the age of AI, Opti could have said an agent where it's in chat. This is true. This is true. Oh, wait. Bro, my. Oh, my, my opty's turning on your Canadian opti. Oh, no. Soon your Canadian opti is going to ask you for a raise, bed.

It's coming. Oh, shit. I got to get an opti. Man, you guys all got opties? Yeah. Imagine being third tier opti, though. That sucks. Oh, the real opti just popped in.

Hashtag get opti pay. Oh, man. Podcomp is going to have a field day with this. They're going to clip this thing forever. Awesome. Marty, I know you are tight on time, so we will bid you a do and let you get to the important family-related stuff that should absolutely take priority. But I do want to say a big thank you for you join in. And am I going to see around somewhat? I don't know what you're even at this year. You're not in Prague, are you? I'm not going to make it to Prague, unfortunately.

That is one of the conferences I've never been to that is high on my priority list to get to. It's pretty dope. You're going to D.C. I will be in D.C. I'll see you there, you son of a gun. Nice. Nice. Awesome.

Well, Marty, thank you so much for joining us. If anybody hasn't, make sure you go check out TFTC. They're regularly crushing it over there. So much of your chip. It's been an honor and a pleasure. Enjoy the rest of your nights. Awesome. Awesome. And gents, we are going to give a quick little shout out to sponsors one more time.

I'm going to jump over to Walker after the hop. And Walker, I'm going to find out why you're so well. I know you've been holding it in. I kept on telling you not to say it early. Now I'm worried because I didn't think of anything. So, oh boy, better come up with something real quick. Awesome. And we may have Nathan just join us for the last couple topics here for some. color commentary so that he can get in on the fun here. So a Canadian opti may yet

make an affair. If you bring in your opti, I'm bringing my opti, bro. I mean, I don't even have an opt to you guys. Come on. I know,

Walker. Just deal with it, bro. Just deal with it. It's okay. Bro, you have Carla, dude.

What are you talking about? Oh. Hey. Hey. Oh, it's not going to like being called an opti. I mean,

that's enough thing. I like Opti, but I wouldn't want to marry him. You know what I mean? So, no offense, Opti. Awesome. Okay, well, Jets, we're going to take a quick break here.

And we'll see who we have in the room on the other side of the jump. Maybe there'll be an opt-e, maybe there'll be two. Nobody knows, really. I have no idea what's going on. We'll be back in just a moment. And smash that like button, by the way. Don't forget to do that. We'll see in a second.

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I just received word that my opti will be here in a few short moments. So, uh, rob it in guys. Obdiz. I'm getting out optied. I guess he doesn't deserve that raise, does he? No, Opti, the whole chat is literally talking about you, bro. The whole thing has become about Opti. What if Opti is fake Opti too?

Like, what if this was just kind of like a, what if this was he was running interference for himself? You know what I mean? Yeah, it's all a ruse. Oh, I see a chair. I see a chair happening here. Oh, my. Well, as we get. As as Nico co-

Oh, there he is. There he is. You know, I want to wait till he has headphones on because I want to tell him what I, what I've lovingly coined him. Opt you can hear me? Yeah, I got you. Okay.

Yo, so I came up with an endearing term for how I witnessed you at my birthday. Oh, dude. can we not talk about that? We all had lots of drinks, but I had too many. Yeah, Opti sometimes gets sloppy. Hey, hey, that's slander.

I've coined the term slopty. You know, honestly, that's pretty fitting. I'm not going to lie, it's pretty pretty pretty. No, hey, to clarify here, there is a very special person that is to blame for this, aka Mrs. Sessions. That is not untrue. It's her fault.

She did feed you all of the tequila, so. Literally all of the tequila. It was horrible. That's all right. That's right. You were still less drunk. Yes. You were still less drunk than Selly. I mean, that's literally not a feat. That's true.

Speaking of Selly, Ben, I haven't told you this. Walker, you were there so you know. I told the story about Selly pulling his... I mean, Walker already said... This is on YouTube. No, but a Walker already said it, bro. Can you not say Dick on YouTube?

Because I've been doing this whole YouTube thing wrong. But anyways. So, you can't say anything weird. I told the story... Walker, you were there. I told the story of Selly pulling his fallace out. While me and Ben pretended to be a...

sleep. Wow, you and men touch tips in the corner of the room. And then he peed on our balcony. I'm standing. There's literally a bathroom. I'm standing by Selly as you're telling the story. And he's like, are they talking about my fallas again? Like, why? Stop giving them reasons to talk about it, dude. I don't know. I don't know what to tell you. Oh, geez. Wow. Okay, well, Jets... Hey, Ben, not to cut you up, but apparently it's going live. So if you want to hear that story and me act highly regarded on stage, apparently it's going out in full.

So... I'm going to have to see that. Yeah, I got to see that. That's going to be a priority viewing for myself and Mrs. Sessions coming up. I'm looking forward to it. Anyways, I digress, gents. I'm going to defer to Walker here. Walker, sorry we've excluded you.

with our Opti Talk, but the time is here for you to get bullish. Why are you so bullish right now? Okay. Well, I do feel very excluded because of the Opti Talk. But why am I bullish? Okay, well, I'm bullish because I'm increasingly realizing how insanely early we are. Like, I know that that's a meme. I know that it's a meme to say, like, we're so early. But it's a meme because it's true. Like, memes are based in truth. And if you go around and you talk to any of your, let's say, normie friends, if you still have some left. I do and I love them to death. And many of them have become, you know, maybe they're not Bitcoiners yet, but they're stacking sets slowly, right? But if you talk to them or to the ones that aren't stacking sets yet, there's just not even

an awareness of Bitcoin, right? Like, we're not even, we're not even close yet. And there's so much popping off in this chat. Um, I, Opti gets a raise. Uh, but no, like real talk. We're fucking up Walker's reason so bad. Does my soundboard work, by the way? If I, if I go, do you guys hear that? Nope. No. It's so embarrassing.

I need to opt. You don't have a good sound board. Oh. Oh. Hold on, hold on. It's a battle. You are fake news. Oh, man.

Should I continue? Yeah. I will speak a quick tip of the hat to Nathan, a.k.a. Canadian Opti entering the chat. Nathan, thanks for jumping in to help the color commentary on the upcoming bullishness. So I will. I'm just here to make sure that an opti gets a race. Fake Opti started that movement and I am here to support it.

I just gave him a fat bonus for moving to Miami, bro. Opti's fine. He's thriving. but then he's going to lose it all because he's living in Miami. That soundboard, though. Give him a raise for that soundboard. Okay, Walker. Okay, we're going to now that everything is settled and we're clearly ready to listen. Okay, we are so early.

We started with we are so early. But you're normie friends. I do still have Normie friends as well. well, but tell me about your normie friends. Well, okay, like, I'll build this because I feel like I got to get the meat and potatoes out of this before Opti soundboards me again. But yeah, okay, so like people aren't asking the question yet of like, hey, like, are you still into that Bitcoin thing?

Like, the answer is yes, but like I'm just not getting that question yet. But furthermore, like you look at the numbers and I want to give a shout out to Jesse Myers, Croesus, Caresis, however you'd like to pronounce it, on Croesus BTC. But Jesse put together that incredible chart that Sailor has used in a bunch of his presentations. It's basically showing all the world's wealth and then Bitcoin next to it. So the total wealth of the world, if we're talking about how early we are, the total wealth of the world is up to $1,000 trillion. That's an inconceivably large number, first of all.

That's insane. And it's all printed fiat, sure. But there are some assets that actually are behind a lot of that. Inflated assets, sure. But whatever. So $1,000 trillion. compare that to Bitcoin. It's at $2 trillion. It's a $2 trillion asset.

So think about what that means. Think about how early that actually means. You've got 0.2% of the total wealth of the world is currently in Bitcoin. Like that is less than a drop in the bucket. That's like that's a drop in the ocean. So not only are we so early from a sentiment perspective, like we have not hit any sort of of phomo this cycle or whether the cycles even exist anymore. Moreover, we are just so early from a total market penetration perspective.

Like, we're just not even close to where we're going to go. And I, you know, you always hear people asking like, oh, am I too late? Should I buy this, you know, X shit coin? Like is usually what it comes down to like, I, you know, I'll get rich on whatever this. I won't even say the names of, you know, the one that's centrally controlled by Ripple that funded a disinformation campaign against Bitcoin run by, you know, a man who must not be named. But like, that's usually what it comes down.

It's like, oh, Bitcoin's so expensive by my shitcoin. But the reality is that Bitcoin is so cheap. It's so incredibly cheap because we're so incredibly early. Imagine when Bitcoin's at 2%. It's at 0.2% of the wealth right now. Imagine when it's at 20%. Imagine when it's just going to keep going. There's literally nothing that's going to stop it.

It is going to suck in all the monetary energy of the world into 21 million units. And I don't think people are prepared. for that. And that is why I'm bullish, because we are just so dang early. Yeah, that's, I approve of that air horn. The restraints to wait for that. I'm very impressed. You should get a raise for that. Give this man a raise. Yeah, I'm a professional. Technically, if I switch with Opti right now, it'd be in between two Opties. Oh, God. And then we could touch tips live. Wow. Okay.

We're touching to us. All right. I want to let's roll it back in. The whole chat is just saying Opti. Okay. Walker was just dropped. Walker just dropped hot fire, right? And I think this is something that, you know, the world hasn't woken up to.

Like, people still haven't realized that, you know, Bitcoin is literally meant to go up forever. And the world is slowly starting to realize that, I mean, you have multiple states, you know, passing law, strategic Bitcoin Reserve, the state of New Hampshire, a state of Texas, on the federal level, right? You have the Genius Act, which is a first step to the Bitcoin Act 2.0 getting passed. Right. You have the pro-Bitcoin administration, the Trump administration going in there, basically saying, hey, we want to make the United States a Bitcoin capital of the world.

They actually posted that on X. Like, that would have been unconceivable, you know, five years ago. We were, like, getting persecuted, basically. Ben, literally you were persecuted with the trucker protests and stuff. And I mean, like, look at, like, we're winning. Like, this is, like, we're winning and it feels really, really good. And if you put all the pieces together, like, with all the treasury companies and the ETFs buying the Bitcoin that they're buying, at the rate they're buying, at the quantity

they're buying, like, they're buying more Bitcoin than Bitcoin being mined, right? So eventually what happens? Like, number goes up. know, and I think we're like on the cusp of, you know, something insane. And I think it's going to happen the next four years or so. Like by the end of the Trump administration, I want to be surprised that Bitcoin was at half a million or a million dollars per coin. Like a super cycle or something, bro? This time might be different. Is this time different though, man? Like, uh, no, because it would, it would correct, bro. Like, okay, we'd peak, you know, like we'd

peak, right? And then we crash. And then it would start picking it back up again. And then it would start picking back up again and then bomb bambing bum boom we're at half a million dollars for coin yeah it's it's kind of again it's all perspective right because the people that come in when it's five hundred thousand dollars they still experience the drawdown that destroys temporarily their their nest egg right um so it's it's been the same for every single cycle like at one point $100 was the moon and then it got sliced down to next to nothing. At one point, you know, $1,200 was the moon and then it went back to like $250. So, you know, everybody's seen it and I don't feel that it would be much different yet.

Again, people are going to come and go, but we are indeed very early. Yes, absolutely. I completely agree. What are you laughing at, Nico? bro, the chat like, like, yo,

I love shouts out to the chat. Me and Ben and Walker supposed to be the famous ones. This entire thing is all opti. There's literally a chat that says, I just finished watching Simply Bitcoin episode. Now this,

I didn't see this coming. Here's for a double dose of Opti. And then it could actually. There's going to be a new, there's going to be a new channel called Simply Opti. And it'll just come. Oh, honestly,

sick. rebrand, sick rebrand. Yeah, that's a better rebrand. And then is it like, is it really a double dose? Because technically it's a triple dose, right? Oh, yeah, because there's fake opi. We got fake opi. It's a quadruple dose.

I mean, if simply opi was a super cycle of opties. When's the correction? Who's getting fired? Oh, geez. Whoa. Well, they're all be cash opi. So, you know. Not my opti because I don't have one.

I'm so bullish on this cycle that Walker gets an opti. That's how good it's going to be. It's not we're all getting girlfriends. We're all getting opties this cycle. What about me? I don't want an opti. I am the opti. Miko's missus is in the chat saying,

L.O.L, remember when Opti was at the top of the list for Penn's birthday? That was so much. Okay, I have to tell that story. So, dude, I got, I got the, I got the, I got the B-day. the B-Day list from Sally, right? And I'm like, oh, yeah, I'm so excited. You know, we're going to go to Ben's birthday, New York, you know, like, I'm going to go with the wife.

And at the top of, like, Walker, mind you, there's like Preston Pish on this, like, all the head. I get it. I wasn't invited it. You don't have to rub it in. Like all the, like all the, all the, I'm just kidding. All the big, all the big ones in Bitcoin.

And at the top of the list, number one is Opti. And I tell Sally, I'm like, dude, what the fuck? Like, what is going on, man? There was an excellent explanation for that. I promise. Yeah, all of you guys are boring. I'm the fun one. That's the reason.

Wopty did bring the parties. A little too much party. Let's be honest here. Yeah. I had the freaking Irish goodbye. That's how bad it was. Yeah. It's a good thing.

No shit. pointers watch this or there would legitimately be like a Slopty token launched on Solana like as we speak. Hey yo, hey yo. Cash me in, bro. Send me the pre-mine. The community is just so fire around Slopty. Bro, Brian DeMint from Orange Pull Up. We're all getting Opties. Dude, what the F is happening. Podcomp is going to have a field day with this. There will be more than 21 million opties just like there will be more Bitcoin than these corporate treasure. companies are buying, you know. It's gone downhill.

Opti brings it back. Yeah. I brought it back. Walker, you did say you had your fallace in your hand. So, okay. Pause. This is a family-friendly show. I don't.

You did. You did. Yeah. And you said, pardon to my French. It was French. I remember this. Yeah. I was driving at that point in time.

I don't believe I mentioned anything about my hand. Here are my hands, guys. I've got a beer. I don't know what you guys are holding. Hold up. Hold up. Can I clarify something here? You know, what can I say?

Hey, hey, hey, hey. Look, we got double approved screen. screenshot of the screenshot with the double approval. It's podcom. Wait, wait, wait. I am not podcop approved. I'm not podcom approve. I want to make that very clear.

He is, I'm not. Ted, could you go to Opti's profile? Oh, yeah, yeah. Go to my banner. Go to my banner. Can we make sure podcom approves him before the end of this street? Oh, no, please don't. Oh, yeah, we need to. Look at the top of Octet. Click it, click it. I don't know.

Can we turn that red X into a green check? I don't know. Dude, that's how you get a raise. Oh, my God. In that case, I am, I can't say it. Say it. I can't say it. I can't say it.

This is a centralized organization here. They approve who is PodConf. I can't say it. That's true. That is true. That is true. I'll take the race. And that's it.

I will take the race. Oh. Oh, Opti is Podconf approved. We now know that Simply Bitcoin is funded by Podcom. Or should be Simply Opti, excuse me. Now, Nathan, you've only been doing the show for a little while here. Do you think that you could be expedited to also PodConf approval in record time? Oh, absolutely.

But in order to make that happen, I'm going to need the Opti clan, all this fans in the chat to get behind it and really push it. I can't do it without Opti support and endorsement. Yeah. It's fair. I think so. Sorry, I'm choking on my saliva, but... Sorry.

Unrelated. This is a, yeah, unrelated. This is a cult following. The Knights of Opti are a decentralized band of savages. I do not actually lead them. They just kind of have exalted me as their leader. You should make a group like the Ben group. You know about the Ben group.

Yeah, yeah. I agree. Why are there so many Ben groups? though in Bitcoin. I know. 51% attacked on Bitcoin by the Ben. It might be. There's a lot of Ben's.

Yeah. Steve Harper named his kid Ben. Yep. Coincidence? I think not. I don't think so. Yeah. Yeah.

There's just so many. Now, also, we have to undo the damage of a few unsavory bends out there. Oh, yeah. There's been quite a bit of, who is the guy, the Ben. The guy in New York. Yeah, that evil fuck. Oh, yeah. Ben Loski is such a bag of shit.

that dude we have to undo that that name uh there's also there's also ben uh who's the guy who uh he movie star oc oh ben mckenzie oh yeah yeah yeah we got to undo ben mackenzie yeah he's really making me look though great theme song and what a bummer that that guy turned out to be such a weiner what a bummer it's so disappointing that's like guilty pleasures of the childhood How do you not have a sample of the like California? I don't know. I don't know. I do want to mention in the chat, no raise for you.

Putting pressure on Ben, Canadian Opti gets a raise, but not in Canadian dollars. Please don't denominate in moochieckles. The ice peso is atrocious. I literally do denominate Canadian Opti's pay in US dollars and pay in Bitcoin. So,

oh, it's wonderful for me, not so great for boss. Okay, so from fake opti in the chat. From the High Council of Optis, you should pay him denominated in Lira's. Dude, no. You know, shout out to the Turkish people, though, if we're talking about the Turkish Lerai. Because, like, legitimately, like, I know a bunch of hardcore bitcointers in Turkey who were made into Bitcoins because their currency, their official inflation rate is 50 to 75% for a year.

The actual inflation rate is over 100% per year. Yeah, it's crazy. The fact that business still gets done in that country and that people are still able to like make shit happen is freaking a testament to human ingenuity in the face of government mismanagement. So like shout out to anyone who has exchanged their leeras for Bitcoin because you are up massively on that trade. Yeah. Yeah. Listen. That's cool motherfucking boy.

I saw I saw a clip of, um, uh, there's a. There's a guy on Twitter financial physics, and he did an awesome little comparison to what it would be like if you had just kind of the regular wage of 1971 today. And he was saying, how would it feel if you were getting $6,000 a week was your salary? for most Americans that would completely retool your life. It would be like an astronomical change and you wouldn't have a worry in the world. And he made the comparison by saying, okay, this was the, this was the, I think, minimum wage or something like that or median wage back in 1971. It would have bought you 1.8 ounces of gold every single week. And then if you translated that

today, it'd be $6,000 US per week for your wage. Like how, and so he's like, it's not that, it's not that things have gotten more expensive. It's just like the US dollar has become that much dog shit over that period of time. It's really debilitating and people really don't realize what has happened or where to point to blame. They just know something's wrong, right? No, you're completely right. And even going back to Walker's point about being early and how early we are in this cycle.

If you remember, we started off there in this conversation as well, too. I think one of the biggest things is not only to acknowledge asymmetry, but kind of touching on when you're getting at there, Ben, is people will know things, but not even necessarily believe them in the sense that we know either Bitcoin's going way the fuck up or it's going to zero. We know that, but even now it's still hard to believe. There's a better chance I think of the Bitcoin Act passing that I think we give it credit. and even to most people in even just the U.S., they know their dollars are dog shit. They know they've lost purchasing power, but it's still hard to kind of emotionally accept that to the point where you actually take action to do something about it. Yeah.

It's also insane that like we're all ragging on the dollar and rightly so because it's lost 99.9 whatever percent of its value since the Federal Reserve was created and has lost a significant portion of its value just since 1971 when Nixon took us off the gold standard. But like, let's also remember that the dollar is the pretty old. horse at the glue factory. Like, it's the best of the worst. Like, your Canadian moose knuckle or moose shekel or whatever it is, it has done way, way worse. Canadian moose shekel. Every other currency. Like, so how many have failed along the way? Like, the dollar is literally the best of the worst. You can make the argument. Maybe the Swiss franc is slightly better than the dollar, but like,

the dollar is still the global reserve currency, right? Like, so, like, from a volume basis, like it is still the you know number one but like that's insane the bar is so low the bar is so insanely low it's just like hey what if we just had money that like didn't fucking lose it sorry i'm not i forget i forget what you lose its value all the time like what a novel concept like hey maybe you should try this bitcoin thing but then most people are still just like no i'll just invest you and i have a diversified portfolio of dividend stocks you in the uh hm p 500 and i'm really good with you know, treading water at 7% growth for year, which doesn't even keep up with the actual monetary

inflation. So I think I'm doing great. You need a voice South Park. That's fantastic. Holy crap. That's amazing. To your point, though, there was a great sailor presentation in Prague, I think, was it last year when he showed the loss of value of the American dollar?

And then he said, that's just the dollar. Let's compare what other currencies did versus the dollar. And all of them were like massively like some of them were like, double-digit drops versus the dollar. It was absolutely wild. So yeah, people really don't understand what's happening or how to fix it. No, but imagine if we actually get to that point where you have that kind of like preference can't skate that people actually realize because you're right.

If you were to stop somebody to say, should you be able to save and have as much or more next year? Everyone would agree with that, but they've completely been sci-off. Like, I hate the term traditional finance. I think that's such a joke because they've taken like traditional finance should just be, I save my money. I build up capital. But they've turned, you know, S&P 500 into basically the savings account and normalized investing. When you know fucking nothing about any of these companies. It's not tradfai.

It's tardfy. And you heard it here first. No, I mean, to add to Canadian Opti's point, like, I think you hit the nail on the head, bro. Like, the fact that you have to invest just to maintain your purchasing power is absurd. Like, the fact that people have been sciopped into that is ridiculous. And then that causes like an over financialization of Wall Street, right? Like you have like basically like if you're above a certain net worth and even if you're like a successful dentist, like you're making a good yearly salary and you have the means,

you have the privilege to be able to put some of that aside. Like you either outsource that investing to a, you know, a financial firm, which they'll screw you. Look at what happened in 2008. they were literally like just selling the poo-poo onto their own clients, right? So they don't really care. You're forced to buy real estate, right? Or you're forced to buy gold or you can buy Bitcoin, right?

Like, you know, it's crazy, right? It's so, so nuts that we live in this type of world, man. And like, why? Why can't you just focus on your craft and save your money and just go about your life? like why like why does it have to be so complicated you can just be a bitcoin podcaster and stack bitcoin and that's all you got to do right like people don't realize this like this one simple trick you can just be an opti form that strategy is opti proof well it jent okay we are going to uh move on to our final reason for being bullish here in

just a second uh so nico i hope you're primed and you're bullish and you're ready to drop that as I do want to give, before we jump to that, I do want to give a quick shout out to just a couple of things that are coming down the road here. First off, Water, we were just talking about Prague, had a great time there before. I'm heading back there in, man, I'm going to be flying out early next week, like Monday or something, but very excited to get there again. If you're in Europe or going to be in Europe and you want to check it out, please come join me. BTC Prague. There's 10% off right there with the QR code. You can grab some tickets. I think that ticket prices are going up in like 10 hours here or something like that.

So if you want to grab them before that happens, then please do. But BTC Prague is an awesome event. Huge, high signal, and the city is beautiful. I think it's probably my favorite European city now. It's just so cool. It's one of the few cities that didn't get destroyed in World War II. and that old town is just so perfectly preserved. So it's beautiful. So yeah, make sure you come out. I'll also mention that we have a pretty face in the room that is going to be here in Calgary

for the Bitcoin Rodeo very shortly. I like how they used your streak photo. You still have the tip. Dude, I still have the tip on my driver's license, bro. And that's like a 10-year commitment. Oh, man. Man. Wow.

Well, I'm sorry. But nonetheless. No regrets, bro. No regrets. No regrets. Absolutely. But yeah, we've got the Bitcoin Rodeo coming up June 28th and 29th. Very excited for that.

Eric Case and Francis Pugliott. Nico, of course, coming up. Dave Bradley. Maidex will be here. Adam O'Brien, Steve Barber, a whole bunch of Seb Bunny, Julian Figuora. How do you say his name?

Figuerra. Okay, well, I'll not do that. But also Katie from Plan B passports, aka now Citizen X, Knut Svanholm, very excited to have everybody here. It should be a good time. If you're coming up, don't forget to come to the sat market the night before.

That's going to be an awesome time. If you want to find out more about it, it is right here. You just scan that QR code, but we do it every time. We've got an incredible base of Bitcoiners here in Calgary, and it's just an evening market this time around the night before the Bitcoin rodeo, come out, spend some sats, help build the community. I genuinely do believe it's super important.

And the last little thing that I will mention is that we have the Bitcoin survival workshop happening in Banff Canada the Monday after the Bitcoin Rodeo. And so this is like a premium workshop for a small group of people. It's in the mountains. We have just a couple of spots left. So if you want to get in there quick, then please do. I believe I have it right there. And yeah, so it's going to be an intimate group of people. We're going to go up. We've got all day workshop in between. We will be doing a hike of a mountain. It includes your room, your food, cigars, whiskey, and all the workshop material and a cold card queue. So it's going to be a good time. So make sure you come out. It should be awesome. But anyways, I digress. I'm going to shut up now. And Nico, I'm going to toss it over to

you. Dude, why are you bullish? Yeah, man. I mean, like, we won, right? You know, like, one like that's pretty much you know game set match all the things that we thought were going to happen in bitcoin you know uh the fork wars the china mining ban the regulatory attacks like you know living through that there was a lot of uncertainty i mean ben you kind of experienced it yourself you know the canadian truckers protest um and kind of the regulatory environment up there and you know every single time these things happened, whether it was the fork wars, whether it was the China mining ban hash rate dropped 50%. You know, one of the most powerful countries on the face of the earth, controlled by the CCP, you know, banned Bitcoin mining within their borders and the Bitcoin

hash rate, not because of a central party or a CEO or anything, bounced back in nine months. And the hash rate decentralized in the process. And now the hash rate's reaching all-time highs. They continues to reach all-time highs, right? And then the Fork Wars, which was even scary than that, like I remember vividly back in like 2016, 2016, G-Han and Roger had so much Bitcoin that they were like artificially pumping the price of Bitcoin cash. And because G-Han, of course, founded BitMain. BitMain's the largest Bitcoin an ASIC manufacturer in the world. They were essentially mining Bitcoin cash out of loss

just to make it seem that the Bitcoin cash rate was higher than the Bitcoin hash rate. And if you're looking at it from a mining perspective, you're like, dude, technically, like theoretically, Bitcoin Cash is more secure, has a higher hash rate. Now we know that that was all artificial, but living through that time, it was a lot of, it was so uncertain.

And then, like, the final thing, which was pretty crazy, which was the last four years in the United States, you had Operation Joke Point 2.0. You have the previous administration that was they weren't like trying to destroy Bitcoin with one false route, but they were essentially trying to kill Bitcoin with death by a thousand cuts, regulatory cuts. So they purposely, like, destroyed signature bank. They proposed the 30% Bitcoin mining tax. They arrested the tornado cash developers, which set a precedent that the Treasury can sanction open source software. Mind you, sanctions are meant for individuals and countries, not open source software, but they did open source software for a reason, because you know what else is open source software? Bitcoin, right? And then when they successfully arrested the tornado cash guys and Coin Center sued them and they lost the case, a month later, they arrested the samurai guys, right? So that

backfired tremendously because they forced our community to throw our hat in the ring of politics. And the way politics works in D.C. is if you're not in the room, you're not in the deal. Bitcoiners are not in the room before this previous administration. And they kind of forced us into a corner to say, dude, no, right? And then, of course, smartly so. I don't agree with everything he does. But smartly so, Vivek Ramoswamy picked up on this. And he told Trump about this.

Ben, I think we were still doing the show at the time. and we were like going through this like these motions of you know like trump testing the waters if you vote for me uh you know i'll stop cbc's and the crowd would go wild and he'd be like oh you guys really like that if you vote for me i'll ban cbc's and it was like yeah and then a week later um it was trump basically saying look if you vote for me i'll end you know uh elizabeth warren's basically war on crypto, and then he promised to free Ross. And we got Ross Ulberg-freeed. That is a testimony to the power of our movement

as a voting bloc, as a voting demographic, right? And now we have a pro-Bitcoin president in the White House whose media organization just announced that they're buying all this Bitcoin. So we have the president who has exposure to Bitcoin. We have the vice president who has exposure to Bitcoin. of Bitcoin. Our RFK at Bitcoin 2024 at the fight basically admitted that he has the majority of his kind of net worth in Bitcoin. And he's a cabinet member, right? Tulsi Gabbard spoke at the Bitcoin 23 conference. So like we have pro-Bitcoin, the Treasury Secretary, night and day compared

to Janet Yellen, pro-Bitcoin as well. So we literally have, the administration of the most powerful country on the face of the planet, telling the world that they have the intention of buying Bitcoin and making it a strategic Bitcoin reserve isolated from the strategic shit coin stockpile, right? Because that was the fear in the beginning of the year, right? So Bitcoiners got exactly what we wanted. So I posted this on X, like, I think it was like two weeks ago. I was like, guys, like, we won.

I really have nothing else to talk about. Like, you know, it's just a waiting game at this point. You know, like, we won. Like, Bitcoin defeated what we needed to defeat, you know, and it's glorious to see. Obviously, I still think, like, you know, the IMF is a problem. I still think the European Central Bank. I mean, they're going to self-inplode if they go down the CBDC path,

but I blame that on Opti because Opti dated Christine Lagarde. And when Opti left Christine Lagarde, you know, know, she took a vendetta to like, you know, try to destroy Bitcoin and launch a CBDC. But going back to the point, that's why I'm bullish, man. Like, we won and we're winning. And for the next five, 10, 20, 30 years, we're going to continue to win. And as we continue to win, the world is going to get freer. The world is going to prosper.

The world is going to be filled with hope, peace, opportunity. and prosperity again. And we haven't seen that. I mean, like, if you think about it from like a historical standpoint, the last century, excuse my French, sucked ass. We had two world wars. We had the introduction of the Federal Reserve in 1913, which coincidentally was the same year that the federal income tax was introduced, right?

And fast forward, you know, 110 plus years later, here we are. and you have the president moving the Overton window, Howard Lubnick, Treasury Secretary, also him saying he's going to buy hundreds of millions of dollars of Bitcoin on Palm's podcast, basically a saying like, look, like, why do we have an internal revenue service? We can have an external revenue service. Like, why don't we end income tax for people that are making under 150K? Is that politically feasible this cycle? No, but you know what it is doing?

It's moving that Overton window. So in 10 years, the question, The question isn't going to be, what is money? We already won that. The question is going to be, what is the role of government in society? So I think we won, we're winning, and we're going to continue winning. And I think Trump's promise to us at Bitcoin 2024, you're going to get tired of winning. I'm kind of tired.

This is dope. He also promised $150K. Where is that? Yeah, where's that? I mean, he failed us on that. I'm not tired of winning. Walker, you just started your podcast. You bust out the air horn, huh?

Because you're spitting bars. Walker, you just started your podcast, bro. Like, talk to me in five years and tell me if you're not tired of winning. I mean, it is the fastest growing Bitcoin podcast in the world, as many are saying. So, I mean, I get it. Like, that's just what the fellow butt is in the street. You know, that's what people are saying. But no, real talk, I agree, like, we are winning.

And one thing that I want to point out to people, because I've noticed that there's, this sentiment that's like people get some people get a little bit angry when you're talking about like oh the US government is doing this the US government is doing that like you know look at this pay attention to this this is what winning looks like winning looks like every nation state and every company in the world trying to acquire Bitcoin if Bitcoin was an abject failure the US government would not be putting plans in place to try to acquire it if Bitcoin was an abject failure, companies would not be issuing debt using these fiat instruments to acquire Bitcoin. If Bitcoin was a failure, none of us would be here podcasting about Bitcoin.

Bitcoin is winning. And so all of these things are happening. Like this is a natural consequence. It doesn't matter if you like it or not. It doesn't matter if you think the U.S. government or any other nation state should not be able to have Bitcoin. Bitcoin doesn't care. That's the whole point. Bitcoin is for enemies. Bitcoin is for the state. It's also for the individual. It doesn't matter, and you literally cannot stop anyone from using Bitcoin. The moment you can, Bitcoin has failed. So instead of complaining that, oh, this government or this company or this whatever is buying Bitcoin, except the fact that this is what winning feels and looks like.

Acknowledge that. And then focus on your craft as a Bitcoin podcaster and try to stack more sats, you know. Oh, Walker, that's absolutely beautiful. And I completely agree, man. But the other thing that I want to, that kind of jumped at me as Nikon was talking is, is you're right. And there's a kind of positive reinforcement loop that results from that as well too. If Bitcoin is winning, Bitcoin's won. We're on that trajectory.

We're making an amazing ground, if not necessarily there. Think about all the people that were involved in getting it to that point, right? If it's getting to the point where they're not necessarily have to put all their time and attention there, that means that they can have the best, most productive, smartest creative people now focusing on fixing everything else as well, too. Not only with that, but also with having the additional value and purchasing power of Bitcoin behind them. So now you're going to have Bitcoiners that can basically, they can deviate some of their attention to improving their communities, improving their families, starting new businesses, getting into political offices on the local level or higher levels of needy. They can start affecting the real world changes that come along with Bitcoin winning at an even greater race. And as they do that, it's going to continue accelerating adoption.

More people are going to get on board. And it's just this vicious, beautiful, positive feedback loop where Bitcoiners can now go out and improve the world, which then feeds back and more people coming into Bitcoin. and we just race off from here. Yeah. Again, just to piggyback on that, having more time to build good relationships not only with your family at home, but amongst your local community,

because you're not in that rat race, just trying to figure out how you're going to scrape together grocery money is incredibly freeing. And I think that's part of why you're seeing so much unrest everywhere right now because shit is hitting the fan that people aren't yet living in that world. People are struggling every single day. I mean, L.A. is basically a powder keg right now. But this isn't new. The same shit was happening just a couple of years ago. You were seeing all kinds of, we saw the trucker protests, we saw the Dutch farmers, we saw all of these different

things. And it seems every week there's some new riot or massive event somewhere in the world where people are just, they're angry and they don't know where to point their fingers. So Walker, go ahead. I would just say there is a slight difference between the entirely peaceful trucker protests, as you well know. And these protests going on in America, which are, quote, mostly peaceful. I just want to throw that out there. Are they a little fiery as well, too? I remember hearing that They're fiery. Emotions are running hot. Let's just say so hot that they start cop cars on fire. But that's just people being people, I think.

And if you disagree, well, I don't know, you might be racist. Even on that note, I think what you're laying out here, Ben and Walker, you're beautifully commenting on, is the Fiat world is getting worse and it's accelerating in that direction. The Bitcoin world is getting better and it's accelerating in that direction. And remember when the Berlin Wall came down, where did everybody run? there's going to be a stampede of people joining us at some point. I love that. I condone Canadian optino on that one.

Actually, you didn't ask me about my bullish take, so I'm going to mic drop it here. I am bullish because of Bitcoin podcasters. I'm going to go eat dinner. Real talk that we need more Bitcoin podcasts. If you are listening to this and you're like, oh, I really want to start a Bitcoin podcast, but there's so many. No, there's not. You want to know why?

Because think about the number of Tardfi, excuse me, Tradfi podcast. podcasts that are out there. There is an insane amount of podcasts out there in the tarad fight, sorry, space that are literally telling people to buy dividend stocks, to invest in the S&P. They're giving them useless advice. There is a tiny, tiny number of Bitcoin podcasters. Like you can be one. You can just go on Amazon, get yourself a microphone, use your frickin' cell phone and videotape yourself and talk about Bitcoin. And you can invite guests on and they'll come on because Bitcoiners love to talk about Bitcoin. And until we have more Bitcoin podcasts than TardFi podcasts, sorry, TradFi podcasts,

we don't have enough Bitcoin podcasts. So if you're listening to this right now, you've been wondering, should I start my own Bitcoin podcast? The answer is yes, because we need more. We need to eclipse. We need to be the tsunami wave of Bitcoin podcast signal that absolutely destroys the Tardf-Fi. Jeez, I keep saying Tard-Fi podcast circuit. I got to jump in and I got to echo that really quick because Walker is absolutely right. Bitcoin podcast do not compete with one another. We're competing with all the stupid shit you see on TikTok and Twitter. It's all the other crap out there

fighting for their attention. If you want to do this, fucking do it. It's just a great another version of you can just do things. You can start a Bitcoin podcast. It's great. Gentlemen, I'm conscious of time. I do

want to put a bow on the episode. I've had an absolute blast. Hats off to Marty Bent for popping in and joining us for the first chunk of the episode. Hats off to both opties. Actually, all three opties that were integral in the episode. Walker, Nico, very happy to have had you here. Nico, I'll be seeing you in, what, a couple of weeks here, I think. So it's coming up quick. Make sure you subscribe to, geez, we got a list off some pods here. Marty Bent, who is not with us

currently, but go subscribe to TFTC, of course. The fastest, what was that again, Walker? The fastest growing, it's the fastest growing Bitcoin podcast in the world when we're talking about rate of change. That's at least what the analysts are saying. So, I mean, you know, don't trust, verify. The analysts are saying that you should subscribe to the Bitcoin podcast. And of course, Nico and Opti at Simply Bitcoin bringing you Bitcoin signal five days a week live stream at what's the time 12 Eastern. Is that correct? 12.15 Eastern and the actual fastest growing Bitcoin podcast and most viewed Bitcoin channel by a large margin. Check out Simply Bitcoin.

I can see you don't understand rate of change or but that's fine. That's okay. The live shows original content. Yeah, go check out Simply Bitcoin. And Ben, thank you so much for having me, bro. I appreciate it. I got a quick question for you. Who's your new guy? He's badass. He's got this like spacey vibes. Yeah.

Our new content creator, we just dropped a new show. It's called Beyond Bitcoin. Check it out. It's dropping four times a month. So once a week. A little bit of a different take than the news. But, you know, we're still experimenting and seeing how, you know, how it's going to work out. Yeah, I appreciate.

The wife is yelling at me for dinner. Ben, thank you so much for having me. Canadian Opti. Walker always a pleasure appreciate you guys and thanks everybody for watching smash that like button if you enjoyed I've been with the BTC sessions this was your bullish session we'll see you next time