BTC Sessions - WHY ARE WE BULLISH? Brandon Quittem, Timothy Kim, Shinobi, Steve Barbour ep185

Episode Date: July 10, 2021

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Wasabi wallet and fairly private. What's going on, everybody? Welcome to the show. Another great Friday. My favorite part of the week, we are doing, why are we bullish, where we just get an awesome panel of Bitcoiners to shoot the shit and talk about why we're bullish. I am sipping on an old-fashioned here. And yeah, we've got a killer panel.

Very excited for this. Welcome, everybody. I see you guys piling into the chat already. And as always, of course, this is live. Anything can happen. I defer to my good friend, Bill, here. We'll do it live. Okay.

We'll do it live. Do it live. I'll write it and we'll do it live. Fibing thing sucks. Of course, make sure you smash that like button. Give this a share. There's already over 100 people in here watching live. Let's get even more eyeballs in.

As always, I am Ben with the BTC sessions. This is your daily session. All right, before we bring in our panel, let's take a quick look at where we are in the market right now. We're sitting at $33,914 per coin. A single U.S. Cuckbuck, we'll pick you up. 2,949 sats. 89.3% of all Bitcoin have been mined.

And in terms of fees, we had that historic difficulty adjustment recently. recently. We're sitting at 23 sats per bite for the next block. You don't have to pay that. If you're willing to wait 30 minutes or more, one sat per bite will do you right now. The mempool cleared earlier today. We're still on track for another downward difficulty adjustment estimated at 9.5% coming up around July 17th, so about 8 days out. So we'll see. And that's been pretty consistent in last little bit. So even cheaper fees coming your way.

If you're looking to do some lightning channels, if you're looking to move some funds around, do some coin joins, whatever you're doing. Good time. Good time to do it. Of course, shout it to sponsor the show.

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But enough of me rambling. Let's get our panel in here. We've got a killer panel here. We've got Timothy, Kim. We've got Shinobi. We've got Steve Barber. And we've got Brandon Quidam. Gentlemen, welcome to the show.

Very excited to have you guys here. I'm going to go quick down the line. Let you guys introduce yourselves before we get rolling here. So I'll toss it to Tim. just let people know who you are and what you do. Hey, thanks for having me. My name's Tim Kim. So my job isn't in the Bitcoin space.

Unfortunately, I work in the Fiat world. I'm a previous vice president. Now, a semi-retired director at a mid-sized perimeter access control company based out of Los Angeles, California. I say semi-retired because I spend like a crazy amount of time on Twitter, like, trolling Elon and the other doge coiners and stuff like that. So that's what I do. I'm also an author. I have a book called Words in the Cash that was a number one bestseller in the blogging category on Amazon for four weeks. But it's kind of outdated. So don't, don't buy it. You're really selling yourself there, man. Yeah. It's like two, three years. I mean, it's just one of

those things where online stuff goes so quick, you know, it's kind of outdated. By the way, I drank a little bit, so I'm feeling a little weird. We're all, we're all drinking. We're going to be hammered by the end of this. Yeah, it's going to be great. BQ, uh, quit him already. He, he was an hour early and smashed a rye. So, uh, you know, I'm looking forward to that. But I'm glad, uh, we're all, we're all enjoying a little beverage, except for Steve, who is driving, but maybe you'll join us in one. Yeah, and it's real quick. As Bitcoin goes, I've learned about it early 2016, but it really took me a while to kind of get it.

And even when I kind of got it in 2017, I lost money. I lost quite a bit of money trying to trade it and stuff like that. So yeah, that's kind of how I got into it. But I actually haven't been following Bitcoin Twitter. I've only just found out about Bitcoin Twitter. early this year. It's kind of interesting. Yeah, yeah.

Bile by fire, man. Baptism by fire. It's an interesting place. Well, I mean, Bitcoin Twitter welcomes you, unless you say dumb shit, in which case you'll get roasted. But, you know, it is what it is. But let's keep going. Shinobi, let people know who you are, what you do.

I'm a random person from the internet who spends way too much time learning how Bitcoin works. I do a small podcast with a couple buddies Block Digest, which I swear to God, the schedule is going to stop being chaotic if you're a listener in this week. But yeah, I mean, other than that, none of your business. Look at my Scorpion avatar. That's all you're ever going to see. That's perfect.

Awesome. I love it. Quit him. Mr. Brandon Quit him. Let people know who you are, what you do. Hey, what's up, guys? I'm just a Bitcoiner trying to form symbiosis with this superorganism we call Bitcoin. And I work at Swan on marketing things.

And at Swan, we consider education marketing. The more you know, the more you buy, which is pretty fun. And we think it's the best place to buy Bitcoin in the U.S. Maybe people have disagreements there. At least that's our goal. And in Bitcoin land, I'm most well known for writing an essay called the mycelium of money, which essentially explores Bitcoin through the lens of a living organism. yeah I'm pumped to be here happy to be back

awesome man glad to have you again and Steve uh take it away to let people know who you are what you do for sure man you said that I was the only one not drinking but man I've been living in small town Saskatchewan for several years all we do is you can't drive anywhere without a pills are in your hand man so you jump too soon at that

but no I'm just kidding I'm just driving back to my place in Calgary so no I'm not drinking. And I'm also surprised you invited me on this show, man, because I'm trying to build a reputation for being a perma bear. And like, I want to be like the only Bitcoin maximalist perma bear that's always bearish. So it was weird to be on this,

why are you so bullish show? But I was trying to think of some reasons why I'm going to be bullish. So it was hard, but I'm just joking. You're like the anti-Maddodal. Yeah, he's a little bit. overkill on the bullishness sometimes. Just sometimes.

Yeah, I just build Bitcoin mines for a living. I'm trying to grow a small business around that based in Canada. And yeah, that's about it. Awesome, man. Well, gentlemen, I am very excited to have you all here.

Easy show. Anybody that's watching that has never seen this before, we go by the three R's. Somebody gives a reason why they're feeling bullish. We all together riff on reason and then we rotate to the next person very easy there your reason can be anything it can be a story it can be an app it can be something happening in the market it could be a warm fuzzy feeling i don't give a shit as long as you're uh talking about something bullish so i'm going to get us

rolling here i have a reason why i feel uh bullish and my reason comes with uh an accompaniment of something i want to pull up on a page here but the reason i guess kind of in cash to a thought is that regular people are now rejecting, actively rejecting the mainstream narrative around money and the economy and it shows. And so I just want to show a couple things to kind of back up what I'm talking about. Earlier, what is today? The ninth, so yesterday CNBC tweeted out an article called, it was called, inflation's silver lining, higher salaries.

And they got just destroyed on Twitter. People quote tweeting them and just, you know, basically saying that this is not the onion or Babylon B. They are serious. A lot of people, you know, basically making, what was it? Somebody, somebody tweeted out, the silver lining of house fires,

lower heating costs, things like that. Everybody was making all these jokes about how ridiculous. And not just like Bitcoiners. I'm talking about just regular kind of normies out there on Twitter as well, thinking it was just ridiculous. And to add on to this was the Financial Times article entitled, Let's all please stop calling dollars, fiat money. Currencies are not memes that only have value.

because governments say they do. And it goes on to basically say, guys, please, that's mean. Don't talk about the dollar that way. It is effectively the gist of the article. But people are kind of looking at this, seeing how ridiculous it is, seeing what a ridiculous narrative that, oh, hey, inflation is going up and maybe I'll make more dollars eventually to keep up with said inflation. How stupid of an argument that is.

or, you know, people coming out saying, please don't call it Fiat dollars, even though that's actually what it is. People are just kind of seeing through it and just fully rejecting it. It's they're given the president set over the last, you know, I mean, number of decades, but especially the last year and a half where just trillions are created out of nothing. people understand that something is broken and they see articles like this and just think, well, what in the hell is that? That's ridiculous. I think we're at a point where there's an all-time high in questioning of mainstream media in the first place. But then to see headlines like this just juxtaposed into the economic backdrop that we're all experiencing is laughing. and people are understanding that.

And I think that's bullish for Bitcoin, even if said people don't fully understand Bitcoin yet, they see that the current system is broken. So I'm going to toss it down the line, or actually I'll toss it out to the group of you, if any of you have thoughts on kind of this phenomenon of Normie's questioning the status quo given where we're sitting. So if anybody wants to chime in, take it away. Well, when you see now hiring signs at literally every single business you walk into that just stay up for months on end, even the dumbest person kind of has to go, something's happening here. This is not normal. 100%. And I've heard horror stories about from a number of business owners about that. somebody I know in Florida was saying that they have friends that own a restaurant and they get a ton of applicants.

They get resumes in and then they go to call the people dropping off resumes and the people say, oh, no, no, no, I don't actually want the job. I just have to prove that I'm looking for one in order to get the government check. And the same thing is happening here. You know, like Canadians especially have been getting paid out the ass at first from something called curb and now just straight employment insurance, EI. But basically,

like if you lost work due to COVID, at this point, you know, you still get paid out as long as you are unable to find work. And so people are just playing the system. And when you think about it, the incentives line up, right?

If you're getting plenty to survive and get by, and you can make marginally more by by giving up 40 hours per week. Who's going to take that deal? Nobody. It's hilarious. But yeah, like people are rejecting the narratives. I don't know.

Tim, Brandon, do you have thoughts regarding kind of this rejection of the mainstream narrative of where we are with our economy? Yeah, I can jump in here. I'm probably not quite as optimistic as you've been on these recent examples being broadly applicable to Normieville. It feels like maybe the very early. critical thinkers in society, like maybe one, if we think about society as a sphere, let's say Bitcoiners are on the edge of that sphere, thinking critically, questioning the narrative, maybe just one layer in of Normieville, those folks are. But I would say that the burning hot nucleus of Normieville is still absolutely clueless. But I will say, I think that the state has

a tricky challenge here, which is they have to navigate a transition to an entirely new financial system while trying to manage public sentiment and try to convince us that we're going to be happy owning nothing. They're going to try to convince us to eat bugs, convince us to go on the pod. And so I would say they have a really tough challenge ahead of them. And I think that over the long haul, truth will rise to the surface. And in a modern world where information is freely accessible, you know, you can manage propaganda from their angle, which they're quite good at. But at the same time, I think young people are better at the internet than the old folks in charge right now. And so I think people feel like something's wrong. And yeah, I guess eventually I'll be

hopefully more optimistic just right now. I think we have a long ways to go. Most people will never understand what's going on. They'll just have the little thing click in their brain like shit. Maybe I should have some Bitcoin instead of dollars because all those people are doing better and they'll probably never get past that they're not going to realize the problems and the woes of the world they're just going to learn just through having it beat them over the head nonstop year after year that one thing that they can do to get fucked a little less how about you tim do you do you have uh like do you have a good group of a normy friends and and do they have thoughts about where we are are they just oblivious do they care like

No, it's mostly, I mean, most of the people that I hang out with on a day-to-day outside of my closest friends are just people at work and they're, yeah, they're clueless. It's just, it's really weird. They do know, though, that things are getting expensive. I mean, everybody, I think, it's like a no-brainer. You know what I mean? I actually, like a week ago, I put something on Instagram and Snapchat about like a place. I was here nearby, it was for a waiter position. And it was like fifth, something like $15 to $45 an hour.

I mean, like that's insane. I mean, when did it jump to that extent? You know what I mean? Like I just, it blows my mind. I don't know. I don't know. Is the government forcing up wages, right? when when you're forced to compete against free money for nothing you can't you can't have

like minimum wage you have to effectively whatever the government's shelling out you got to add i i've got to imagine at least 25 percent maybe 50 percent maybe i don't know what would get me out the door if i could basically live for free and do anything that i wanted with all of my time what you know what what changes your mentality when you're in a position you'd have to pay actually substantially more than what you could get for free you can't just you can't just get paid the same amount of even at my my company we we have like right currently the past i don't know like year or so we'd have about we had about 50% turnover i mean just people it's just so it's just too easy to get free money. So I'm feeling really nervous about where we're heading. So,

yeah, Kathy, Kathy was saying something like, you know, deflation, but I don't know. I don't buy it. I'm kind of, I'm very nervous, especially here in California, you can't find anybody willing to work. You'd have to pay them 100 grand. That'd be very basic. What's the end game here? Because when you think about it, okay, so businesses want to run, they need people working for them in order to actually function. They're basically going to have to raise wages to get anybody in the door if they're competing with free government money. And then they're going to have to raise prices in order to cover said employees. but then all of the people that were living on the government dollar at a certain level,

then experienced the inflation of prices of things that they could previously afford. And then what? Does the government up the money to give them a living wage even though they're not working? Do those people then go seek out those jobs? Like, what's the end game here? Where do we go? The only end game is UBI on a mass scale. consistently for everyone. That's the only outcome here. Everything reinforces itself

leading to that endgame. And after that, I don't know. It could take a very dystopian turn. It might work in the short term, right? People last year in 2020, they felt more wealthy because they were getting stimulus checks, they were staying home. So there's this like honeymoon period where people think everything is okay. But eventually it undermines itself. And that's when I don't know what's going to happen. But thankfully, we have Bitcoin. Yeah.

It's, I mean, at one point or another, shit's got to hit the fan, right? You can't just go on with free money forever unless people making stuff and have everything just remain at equilibrium. So I guess time will tell. But I did enjoy the conversation around this topic. I'm going to keep us rolling into the next. Everybody that's in here, of course, everybody that's in the chat watching live, smash the like button, give this a share.

Let's get some more eyeballs in here. We got like 220 people watching a live. So thank you all for being here. And keep those comments coming in because I will continue to bring them up like this. Truth will level the nonsense from Randall. Thanks for that, man. And apparently Jim Kramer is talking about Tether. That's fun.

Fuck you, Jim. Anyways, we're going to keep rolling here, and Steve has made it into his home. We'll see if his camera comes on here. Oh, there he is. Oh, man, looking good. You're so the camera angle, you're already tall enough as it is, and then you get this camera angle pointing up. You're like seven-foot tall. I just don't want to show you the freaking mess on my floor.

All right. You want to see it? We're doing some rentals. I got shit all over the place. Oh, yeah. There you go. I got to tilt it up. Awesome. Well, we just wrapped our first topic. We're going to jump onto our second. And I'm going to toss it over to Tim. And Tim, man, what has you feeling bullish this week?

Oh, man. It's insane. I feel like there's so much bullish news out there. It was really hard for me to pick one. So I just felt like I just needed to pick something that's just more kind of like fundamental. And my, My reason for feeling bullish, you guys hear me by the way? Oh, yeah, you're good. Is this 50% plus crash that we had? It sounds insane, but I have four. Price or hash rate? Yes, very bullish. Oh, that's a good point, but price.

Both, both, both. But here's why. I have four reasons, okay? So the, so one is these major pullbacks, are what bringing new users onto the network. So I saw something from William Clemente the third yesterday, I believe. He is the third, right? I think he is the third of the William Clemente's.

I saw something from Pomp and it was William. And he said something like Bitcoin hit an all time high in new users coming onto the network. So I feel like these major pullbacks are what bring in. a big portion of the population. So like retail, normies, institutions, hedge funds. And I think that there are basically, you know, again, very generalized, but there are two types of people who end up buying Bitcoin. There's a certain portion of the population that's very like yolo.

And they get enticed when prices are constantly going up. They're kind of like the more gambling types. And then there's the more conservative portion of the population, which do the opposite. The higher it goes, the less likely they will buy. So when prices tank, it gives them an opportunity to feel good about buying it at a discount from recent prices. And I think the number one thing, I don't know about you guys, but the number one thing I most often hear from Normies when I ask them why they haven't bought any Bitcoin yet is they say that they're too late. They always say, oh, I'm too late.

You know, I should have bought it when it was $1. So this latter group of people usually fits that bill. So I feel like, you know, again, this is a really good opportunity for people of the latter group to come in and buy. So that's number one. I have three more reasons. Oh, man, this, dude, this whiskey. Am I talking? I feel like I'm talking.

I'm so happy you're a part of this show right now. Dude, I am like. Okay, I got to go catch up, don't I? I don't know what I'm saying. I feel like I'm talking. but it's like it's slurring. But number two is, I think Preston Pish said this. I love Preston Pish.

But he said that massive volatility is programmed into Bitcoin. And it's what helps it get more entrenchment into the financial system and allows it to eventually become the global reserve settlement money. So like basically what that means is if NGU, right, like number goes up, right, happens too quickly. without the proper, like, ebb and flow of frequent pullbacks, I mean, it kind of gives an incentive for governments to try to attempt to shut it down. So if it happens slow enough and volatile enough, it will let it gain deep entrenchment, right? So I think, again, I think kind of we talked about a little bit about the whole recent minor exodus from China.

I think it's a fantastic thing. And but China hasn't done a 51% attack on the network. So I think it, it just goes to show how deeply entrenched Bitcoin is. And that makes me super bullish, you know. And I think personally, I think we've, we've passed the tipping point. This massive volatility is what kind of gets, allows Bitcoin, I mean, to gain entrenchment by kind of like slow boiling the frog. I actually think that Bitcoin already won.

So I'm super, super, super bullish. I just want to comment on one thing. I like, I totally agree with you talking about how the volatility gives a false sense of security for nation states. I think kind of some of those major pullbacks and like longer bear markets that we've experienced in the past few having cycles have basically temporarily taken the heat off Bitcoin and given a few years of them being like, it's probably not something we need to worry about legislating and everything. like I think in the past that has bought us time. I'm unsure. I kind of feel like maybe now that we've passed like even though we're not currently, we pass that one trillion dollar market cap.

I think that got a lot of eyeballs and people are looking in in positions of power maybe saying, oh shit, what do we need to do now? But I do think that that cycle definitely bought us that first decade of like basically unabated tearing down the system before the system. noticed. I'm going to kind of dissent from the group here a little bit and say that if you go back into like 2013, 14, 15 and look at the types of analysis coming out of think tanks and intelligence working groups and things like that, you would find an amazing level of awareness

versus the idiots banging gavel in Congress. Really? Yeah. I think it's a mistake to underestimate what the state can do. Like if they want to they really wanted to I think they're well aware that they could go do a 51% and it would actually still be quite easy for them to do that. So I don't know. It's maybe that's not actually the risk. Let's put a tinfoil hat on Steve.

I think you and me are going to be bearish friends now. Why are all these nuclear power plants being shut down for no good reason right now all over the place? Think about it. Think about it. Think about it. I'm not exactly sure what you're getting at. You need a lot of electricity to do something like attack the Bitcoin network. Think about it.

Right, right. Okay. Yeah. So the state is slowly amassing in a massive amount of power. Is that what you're thinking? I mean, why not? Why do we have to be bullish, guys? Joe B.

Not to be true. the state would have to acknowledge that Bitcoin is a credible threat. Do you think that whatever we wanted to find as a state, do you think that they actually acknowledge that? My sense is that they're still quite arrogant as if Bitcoin is not credible at this point. I think that might be the case. But even if they, you know, I give them more credit. I think that like the central banking, the real, you know, the true state, the, like,

think they do know it's a threat and they do want to figure out what they can do. But is censoring Bitcoin through like a 51% attack the most effective way? I'm more along the lines of I think that these people that are, you know, benefiting from Fiat more than anyone else, like the ones closest to the central central banking spigot. They're just like us. They want to profit. So they're going to be more inclined to and they'd certainly want to protect their own interest, which is their interest in Fiat, but I think we're going to see more along the lines of what we're seeing right now in China, which is like sort of kicking people out, but also like taxing, permitting, licensing. They're going after mining pools next, I think.

I think you won't even, I think even in North America, you're going to see some major problems with surveillance regulation and that kind of thing on mining pools. But I also don't want to go way off on a tangent because I know Tim here has got more bullish thing to say, but I'm catching up to you. I got the rye. Okay, I wanted to feel, I wanted to, I wanted to feel included. That's some crown royal rye there. There you go.

I just got some Jack Daniels, bro. All right. I'm going to catch up to you, and this is going to get weird. I got two more reasons. Okay. Why I feel like the 50% plus crash is actually a bullish thing. So number, oh, man, dude. Holy smokes.

Have another sip. My world. Okay. FYI, Koreans are allergic to alcohol. Because we can't metabolize it properly. So I usually can't only drink one bottle of beer. But I'm drinking Jack Daniels. Like a proper American.

Because I immigrated here in 2004, by the way, from Hungary. My parents are missionaries. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. My parents are missionaries. They're still there. They have a homeless ministry. They have a, they used to be with, what is it? Campus Crusade for Christ, but they're not there with them anymore, but they have a homeless ministry.

So props to them, I have huge respect for them, but they're still there. I came here in 2004. I immigrated here with 500 bucks in my pocket. But anyways, enough about me, man. Number three. So I feel like these corrections are what help extend the bull bar market. You guys may disagree with me. But like I feel like these parabolic move-ups portion of the cycles post-halving happen with these pullbacks.

So it starts with these pullbacks, these corrections that purge the weak hands, right? And transfers Bitcoin to stronger hands. And Willie Wu, I know all of you guys follow him. He calls it Rick Astley's, right? That will never give you off. I know they recently kind of gave us up a little bit, but a substantial portion of these hodlers in Bitcoin have super duper strong hands. So every day, every week, every month that goes by, these strong hands, these strong hand hodlers, right?

They acquire more Fiat in their Fiat jobs like I do, right? And they'll continue to scoop up these coins and lock them up forever, never to be seen. So I feel like it's inevitable, 100% inevitable that there will come a day when all the Bitcoin sitting on exchanges will be taken off the table and taken into deep, cold storage. And at that point, you're going to have. billionaires and nation states that's going to be fighting over the scraps. And granted, yeah, you're going to have these, if you look at like Will Clemente's like posts and the comments, yeah, a lot of these people are going to be coming on and they're going to be putting back Bitcoin onto exchange to be sold for profit.

But there's going to be a tipping point, right? It'll hit this vertical part of the S curve. And it's going to be like, we're going to have a day, right? It's going to be 20 or 30, maybe even like a 100K gap up in price and Bitcoin. And relative to be a short time in time. It'll be 100K daily volatility, man. Exactly. That's the most bullish thing I'll say in this podcast.

100% I love that Steve Did I just get bearish Steve to say that Dude You're way more bullish It's called the top

How are you more bullish Than Minnesota That Minnesota Bear guy dude I think I'm truly a bowl I'm truly a bowl Yeah

Okay When you get like Down the road When you get sat sent parody When one sat goes From one cent to two cents Like that's

That's when you get those at that point does comparing to dollars even matter? Like because I've got to imagine if we're at Sat Sent parody at some point down the road that it's it's a good portion

of that is the lack of purchasing power from the dollar and the amount of printing that they've done as opposed to necise not entirely like yes the purchasing of power of Bitcoin will continue to grow but

at that at what point is it equally to blame between the growing asset that is bitcoin and the depreciating asset that is u.s dollars right like at what point do you place more blame on one than the other it's going to get weird when the uh world reserve currency starts hyperinflating like how do you like people will seek a new basis for you know unit of account and i guess that'll be bitcoin like I mean, what else could it be? And even Bitcoin's still going to be volatile at that time if you price it in anything, whether it's priced in dollars or dollars or too volatile themselves to price anything. And I don't know.

I guess Bitcoin has to be because obviously Bitcoin will be the soundest money. I also have a theory that gold is going to make a big return. And maybe things will for a while be pricing gold. But no one agrees with me on that. Oh, my God. Steve, I need to introduce you to somebody after this show because there's, and obnoxious as I'll find it. I think I have a new best friend for you.

Okay, cool, man. My theory is that as things get really weird and hairy with Fiat, they're going to retreat back to what they still control, which is gold. They're not going to go to Bitcoin. The whole idea that states will go to Bitcoin, and I know El Salvador is something different. I know that's something different. But the idea that the elite states of the world, the U.S.

are going to be like Bitcoin standard. I don't see it. I think they're first going to retreat to what they had before, which is we control all the gold, gold-based money, precious-based money. It's not going to help them, but that's what they'll retreat do. That's sort of what I'm expecting.

What about central bank digital currencies? Wouldn't they just use that instead? Kind of is the same thing. They control it in placement. I feel like that's an interim. That's like, that's like, hey, this is different. I think that's

Andrew, Brandon. It's like, think about it like this. That allows you to just leapfrog all the kinds of shit that we're doing in Bitcoin right now, trying to push this into the third world to fill in infrastructure gaps. They leapfrog that. They take that

infrastructure gap. And then on top of that, you now get to directly export your economic policy to the rest of the world, not the indirect games we play. to do so. Like straight up the people using that money now are your little play toy. You're right. I think like to see the central bank currencies, well, they're going to really push it hard now that Bitcoin is a threat. And I really think they see it as a big threat. And it's, I agree with you completely. I think they're going to say, okay, well, let's get rid of

Bitcoin's use cases to all the unbanked. We're going to bank them with CBDDCs or whatever. but that doesn't fix the unsoundness of their shit coins. So that's why I think they're going to have no choice but to retreat and say even like, even though it'll be a cluster, they'll probably back those CBDCs by precious metals. Because who controls all the precious metals? The fucking central banks do. They're not going to fucking back it with,

I don't know if I'm allowed to swear, but I already had one ride. You can fucking say whatever you goddamn well want. So I think it might be a stupid thing. but I think they're going to retreat to precious metals. And honestly, that will be a good move for them because if they can maintain control by having a sounder money, I think Bitcoin is going to force them to compete. They're never going to adopt Bitcoin.

It's just going to kill them. It's going to destroy banking or central banking. So they'll go with the next best thing, I think. I think you're all right. I think it's just on a, it's on a timeline. I think that CBDCs get introduced first as like a, hey, it's digital to fill in the infrastructure gap or to seem new and relevant because some like most normies still think that the innovation is that Bitcoin is digital, right? Like that's the basics of it is people people are like,

oh yeah, it's digital money. And then like they don't look beyond that. That's why you get idiots piling into XRP. Their marketing campaign that'll back the CBDC will be unreal. Like they're going to be like, oh, it's bringing equality to all the impoverished nations. It's going to be the biggest thing. they're going to put the most insane marketing thing. And it won't be that fat ass Augustus Carson's being the front man of it either. Yeah. And so like I see that, but then I see, okay, that then people like when the digitization of dollars all of a sudden isn't fixing the problem, when people are like, oh, fuck, the money still sucks. Then, yeah, Steve, I think you're right where they retreat to some sort of a quasi like partially bad.

gold type gold type back currency because again they still they still control that because of the abstraction right because of of the the layered approach that is not explicitly actually pegged where that peg can be broken because they think well we can say it's backed by this and then actually it's really not because we've done that in the past actually i got i'm going to give this a plug because I'm reading this right now and it's fucking awesome. There's this book called The Seventh Property by Eric Yakes. Eric Yakes, yes, yakes. Anyways, I met him at Bitcoin 2021. I started reading his book.

I'm about, like, two-thirds of the way through. Anyways, he goes through the history of like not just, okay, when we went off the gold standard entirely in 71, but he goes through the like quasi-gold and bimetalism standards that we went through through history and like all of the breaks of those pegs and returns to those pegs. I think we're sitting at one of those now where we're going to see some more of that bullshit played. But Bitcoin is literally the fix to the peg issue where you don't actually have to go away from the currency to get that assurance that is backed one to one for what you're actually spending. So I think you're going to see a lot of that hocus pocus bullshit of,

oh, we've got digital currency now, so we saved it, we've fixed it. Oh, wait, it's not backed by shit. Oh, now it's backed by something. And then the next domino is people then realizing this didn't work, this didn't work. And now the peg that they said was there is not working. And I think the only reason that we get to see all of that in such a short time is because we get to see the thing that fixes all of that side by side with it as they try to iterate through all of the bullshit that's broken.

Bitcoin is going to be the thing that calls bullshit on that. The more liquid Bitcoin gets, the more it will call bullshit on manipulated exchange rates. And there is just absolutely no way around that. Yeah. I agree. I think we just, Tim, did you have anything to add? He's only a number two. I think he's got two more.

Guys, I'm, I didn't get any of what you guys are talking about. I mean, to be honest. Okay. I mean, like, for real, like, for real, for real. Like, I'm not joking. When I go, what I don't drink almost ever. But when I go to party, when I go to places and I drink, I have one bottle of beer, right? That killed, I'm 220 pounds, bro.

Dude, are you drinking American beer? Because that's just like 4%. No, no. I have just Jack Daniels, bro. No, no, no, not right now. I'm talking about like normally because because I'm in Canada and that like the shit down in the States is like three and a half four percent. We're like five or six. No, no, right, right.

I have that watered down bullshit. No, no, no, but I have watered down fiat beer. And I'm 220 pounds, right? And it still kills me. But. And I've, I had I'm I'm I'm on this. I'm on you guys is American. like Jack Daniels Tennessee

Whiskey, right? Dude. Tim, Tim, the comments are blowing up telling you to stop drinking water. I think they're being a bad influence. I feel like, wait a minute.

You really might as well go all in at this point. There's no back off. There's no back in at this point. There's no backing off. The Bible says not to be drunk, but I'm pretty drunk right now. I'm bullish on Tim being asleep by like 9 p.m. Oh my gosh, my wife is going to kill me.

But did I say the number fourth reason? I think the number four three is I didn't think I said it. Okay, right? Okay, the number fourth reason. Number four is that even right? Okay, English is my third language, right? We're going to go for it, man. Hungarian is my second language.

So Hungarian is my fellow. There's surprisingly a lot of Hungarians, by the way, in Bitcoin. So you know what you want to put you. Anok, Dimoteu Shvedok. I hope it's Hungarian. Yeah, Hungarian. I love my fellow Hungarians. So number four, right?

This is, I feel like this recent wave of selling, right, in reacimulation, has reset cost bases. If you guys know in America, how the taxes work, right? So basically, I feel like a lot of this recent wave of selling has reset cost bases for a lot of, and it gives us kind of like a stronger floor at today's prices. So a lot of people, including institutions, right, and hedge funds, are up three times since September. September. That's crazy. It's like six months ago. So it's like it was 10K per Bitcoin. And so the recent selling from Wales were to, in my opinion, okay, not financial advice, not financial advice. But they were, it was to lock in profit. So this has been super bullish, super duper bullish because what this means is that selling pressure will be significantly lower going hard. And so they're

Hangover is entered the chest They sell and they buy in They buy back in And they reset their cost basis So there's no incentive For these people to sell, right? For these institutions and hedge funds to sell So just emotionally and emotionally

And what did I say I say emotionally and mentally It's far easier It's far easier to sell when you bought at $10,000 back in September, okay, and you're already 3x up in a period of less than six months. It's harder to sell when you just bought in at the 30 to 40K range. So all this reaccumulation that has been done at recent prices, I feel like it's giving a stronger floor for Bitcoin to move.

move up from. So I feel like we're just at this precipice, right, to just freaking, freaking parapolically move up. Oh, my gosh. Tim is, Tim is me at every party when I'm with friends.

Oh, man. I agree with, I think the original argument that these pullbacks instead of the parabolic moves distribute coins better. and more widely instead of concentrating them. And I think that is absolutely bullish as hell on a fundamental level

instead of just what idiots found up with what could tank. Everybody's got to sell some Bitcoin from time to time. Like, you know, if you've been holding for years and years and years, why not sell a few coins and get something you've wanted your whole life? Like, it seems completely natural to me. It's completely natural. I don't understand why every time there's a pullback, everyone's pointing to like, oh, look what Elon did.

Elon didn't fucking do that. People needed to go enjoy their lives. There's hodlers sitting on massive stacks that took like 2% of their stack liquidated it. Now they're on a fucking yacht somewhere, right? Like that's all it takes. We just have to pay bills and shit, dude. I've been all in for years. I sell Bitcoin every month.

It's either that or figure out a way to generate. I am the same way. I put everything I had into my business and we mine coins. We sell shit for coins and I have to sell coins or I can't do business. We have to sell coins, right? I think it's just part of the reality of if you're fully in Bitcoin. Like I, for instance, I get paid in Bitcoin. The vast majority of my earnings are in Bitcoin.

And I tend to, funny, I know not everybody here ascribes to the like four. your cycles. But I kind of, I kind of do. Like I think that at least in the early days of Bitcoin, and I think partially moving forward, at least, you know, maybe for another like couple of having cycles, we're still going to see that, okay, supply gets cut. There's a little pinch in the supply that's coming onto the market that used to be bought up normally while that supply's not there.

And you see kind of these like overshoots of correcting for that. And so I've started almost living my life in Bitcoin epochs where I'm like, okay, well, I'm living on Bitcoin. That's my income. That already kind of gives me that low time preference of like, do I actually need to sell these coins for this? Like am I making good purchases that will last me a long time? Am I spending my money in a way that actually benefits my life versus just like trinkety trash? I'm going to throw out. But beyond that, I'm I also.

it from a standpoint of like, okay, you know, we just went through a bear market and it was a couple of years and I was like trying to pinch panties and make sure I could stack as much as possible and like push off expenses. And then all of a sudden we blast through previous all time highs. We go to double for now temporarily triple previous all time high. And then you're looking and you're like, okay, well, what things would actually substantially improve? my life over the course of, if assuming maybe if that kind of cycle repeats, what would actually improve my life that I'm willing to kind of trade off. I know that it'll be difficult, if not impossible, to gain back all of the Bitcoin spent on something that's expensive. But you kind of look and you're like, well, for me last time, it was like, well, I'm having a family. you know, my daughter wasn't born at the start of the last Bitcoin epoch, right? And as the bull run started to pick up, that's when, you know, me and my wife had my daughter. And so we're looking and we're like, babies are expensive. Yeah, babies are expensive. And I lived in it. So when the price is

good, you're like, well, it's not a bad time to liquidate some and get that with that nice stroller, you know, and all that stuff to need. Well, and, and the, the, the big thing that I was looking at is I lived in an area that I would not have been super comfortable with my daughter going to school there. Like it wasn't, it wasn't a good area where I was comfortable with my, and I taught in schools for like a decade. And I knew what kind of schools were in the area that I was at. And I was like, I don't, I don't want her to be here. I don't want her to live in that kind of a situation or be that, get that kind of quality of an education. And so I made the call of like, hey, like full on, the amount of Bitcoin I had in 2017, I will never reattain that.

But you set your daughter up in a good area and a good environment, which is a million times more important than those coins. And this exactly. And so that's the tradeoff that Bitcoiners were always make. You know, if you believe in Bitcoin, you know that your coins are going to be worth more in the future. It's how substantially can you improve the life of yourself and your family in those tradeoffs moving forward? And so now I'm like, we're all much happier. We're in the home that we're going to live in for probably decades. I think that people that spend some Bitcoin are happier than the people that just go mad, hoddling, hoddling, hoddling.

I know everyone likes to stack stats. I do too. But you got to spend some from time to time and enjoy the life. that you have, man. Especially the set, like, I hate the idea of, like, you know there's guys out there that have hoddled, like really got into that meme, hoddled everything, never spent a set, and, you know, you get hit by bus. Like, it's like, yeah, that sucks. Like, you'd never, what shit happens in life. So I hate the, I've always hated the idea of just like, because people demonize people that spend Bitcoin. I know it's mostly just a meme, right? Like, it's a joke. But like, like, come on,

like spending some Bitcoin is a good thing. And it's good for the Bitcoin never. work so. So I like to like, I like to be like, too, good for you. I'm not going to sell Bitcoin, bro.

I mean, at some point you got to sell Bitcoin. You know what I mean? I mean, it's either hoddle or guy hodeling. You don't want to die. Half of my Bitcoin,

my wife, it's so hard to help, like, like, let her know, like, okay, this is my seat phrase.

This is how you get Bitcoin. This is how you got. You just bury it and draw treasure map man it's so hard for them to understand right and but the half of the other break coin it's like bro like like it's gonna it's gonna it's gonna it's gonna permanently be huddled by me if i shoot this yeah perma hoddle when you when you die you're a hoddle bro i think there's gonna be a lot of perma hodeling like when well i mean it gets to the point where you you just you just spend it right like it's instead of like

conversion to dollars. It's just you purchase things and you just have a different time preference around what you're purchasing, right? Like, again, you evaluate, okay, well, is moving, like for myself, is moving to a new area and owning my home. And I know that like some bitcoins aren't big on home ownership, but also at the time, it was actually not a bad idea for me. But. And sometimes the wife gives you no choice. Like, I wanted to rent. The wife wouldn't let me. Yeah, exactly. But you know, you know, you know what I experienced is I was like, hey, you know, we're talking about like things that could happen in the coming years. And she was like, you know, like if we've already signed like, you know, our mortgage like for a five year period

and like this rate is the same, then like why put like a big lump sum on the mortgage when it's at a set rate and we have exactly the same amount of cash? And, you're going to be penalized beyond a certain point. Why not just hold the Bitcoin? And I don't think I've ever been more proud of my wife. She's like, well, you got to huddle that shit, right? That's how I know, like, through osmosis, she's become a Bitcoiner. It's great.

Beautiful. Love to hear it. I think an interesting analysis here, I'll let you take into second Ben, but interesting analysis would be, do you see a uptick in babies during bull markets? right as the bitcoin ethos gets bigger it seems like i mean it's natural right when you feel like resources when you feel optimistic yes you're right yeah that's a good do you guys have kids by the way that's a really interesting i have two kids i have two kids i got one on the way it's funny brets man it it ain't it it ain't easy bro

brand it's funny that you say the timing that like i was i was offset if for me my first kid It was like prior, like we found out my wife was pregnant when we got back from our honeymoon. We backpacked for like five months and literally came home with next to nothing. And within 24 hours of being home, we found out she was pregnant. We're like, holy shit. And then, but that was in December of 2016. And then the bull run kicked off. And we're like, like, as it got closer, we're like, hey, we're going to be okay.

Thank you, Satoshi. I like that. That's a good thought, man. Because, like, I'm not a big, I'm not into the big four-year cycle. But, like, if the four-year cycle thing is real, like, if it keeps up, you're going to see that, man. You're going to see, like, booms every four years, like, baby booms. It's just going to become a bigger and bigger thing as, like, big-cointers become, like, more spread out. That's awesome.

I haven't really thought about that. If you think about, like, a chart, it oscillates. It's, like, small baby-booms, and then next cycle bigger. next cycle bigger. And meanwhile, all the Fiat Maxis, all the Fiat Maxis, their babies are just dropping off the cliff because they're just constantly impoverished. The Bitcoin Maxis are just like, for smart people. Yeah. It's the opposite of idiocacy. It's literally the inverse of idiocracy. It encourages reproduction because of the people that understand the implications for society. And then the Fiat bros, like, I feel like, the idiot. The, the, the, the, the, the,

movie idiocracy is just the people living outside of the citadels. That's all it is. Oh my God. They're going to have less babies. They're just going to all die off. The Fiat Maxis are going to die off. That's amazing. Meanwhile, all the Bitcoiners are like as the having is happening, they're all smashing

guts, just pumping out kids. Because it could take a while before, like, you know, Fiat really collapses. We might see these statistics and like just Bitcoin. maxi population starts exploding like baby booming every four years just annihilating the fiat maxi like just taking buying up all the homes put them out of business man oh yeah some deep shit yeah for sure i'll have another drink we're gonna okay we're gonna keep it rolling because we we spent a lot of time on the engines that tim's rent let us down and so i'm going to defer now by the way,

everybody here, smash that light, but I can give this a share, so on and so forth. We're all having beverages, especially Tim. So feel free to join us and let us know what you're drinking in the chat.

But we're going to pass it on down the line. Shinobi, dude, I'm sorry for the delay. What has you bullish? Dude, just honestly, despite what a lot of people who follow me

might think, given the commentary I make on Twitter around this topic, the shit happening in El Salvador and the little ripples I see like spreading out to places like Paraguay like Tonga, Panama. Like I feel like we are witnessing the genesis of something OG's like Beauty on have called out for like most of the last decade. It's going to be real fucking fun when Bitcoin just butts the course.

corresponding banking network out of the way, tackles Swift, gets up and keeps sprinting towards the goal line. Like, fuck you. We don't need you anymore because there's a lot of skeptics of that El Salvador stuff, but it's just another slap to the face, like waking people up that this thing is getting real. It's just the infrastructure. Like, if you have a liquidity pool in your country that will fuck with Bitcoin, like they will accept Bitcoin. They will trade off for Bitcoin, they have means to hedge against the volatility and so on. Then the Bitcoin network just became the only like settlement layer between other jurisdictions and other entities that you need. End of story. Like you don't need fucking Swift anymore. You don't need corresponding banking relationships.

You don't need any of this bullshit as long as you have liquidity in your country that will go back and forth between Bitcoin or Bitcoin all day and optimize that and hedge that to generate some kind of yield off of it because Bitcoin Rails can do that. And it doesn't matter whether it's lightning. It's the main chain. It's a side chain. Some new fangled thing that hasn't been invented today. It doesn't fucking matter. If that liquidity is there in your country and the interest is there, goodbye, Swift, goodbye correspondent banking infrastructure. And like, I could give two shits. what the price does, like, we could be in a bear market for the next four years right now, and I won't give a shit, because this isn't going to stop.

Like, this infrastructure is going to keep getting built out. People are going to keep looking at this. Like, I've spent, like, the last couple weeks, a decent amount talking to Lord Fusitua from Tonga in a lot of spaces. That motherfucker knows exactly what is going on in the world. and what the problems are. And he is looking at it as a way to solve, like Bitcoin, a way to solve problems for his people.

And not in a way to line the pockets of the government, not in a way to make some new centralized thing that can be controlled, but actually benefit the people. And this shit's not going to stop. So like seriously, 60K, let's call that the fucking top for this market cycle. who gives a flying fuck because the rails and the infrastructure to actually make material things happen in the real world for real fucking people. That snowball is going down the hill. Yeah, constantly.

Constantly going. It's constantly moving forward down the hill. See, this is what I loved about seeing people at Bitcoin 2021 is because nobody gave a fuck about the price. everybody's talking about shit like this. Everybody was like, and this is kind of the beauty of bear markets too. When you're in a bear market, like the bitcoiners that are sticking around, which are the actual bitcoins are the ones that are, you know, head down, like focusing on the important shit that's actually being built.

And the swell that's kind of coming. It doesn't matter that it's not right here, right now, and that NGU is not currently happening. It matters that people are benefiting from Bitcoin itself, regardless of the current price. And that was refreshing because, you know, when I was at Bitcoin 2019, it was very, we were literally, speaking of Matt O'Dell and the antithesis to Steve here. but Matt O'Dell was drunk on a rooftop doing a TFTC rip and literally oh yeah and he literally podcasted the local top when he was telling everybody to market buy and so I mean I'm not when I was down there um let's just say you know long long Bitcoin was something told to me and I I love the shit out of the person who told me that.

I respect them more than anyone in the space. But I totally didn't do that because it's just like, mm-hmm. And, and yeah, that pump did not happen. Yeah. Yeah.

I mean, like, I will say in Matt O'Dell's offense, he's always bullish, so he's always going to call the local top. Yeah, that's what I'm thinking. That's,

that's pretty much how it goes. But like, again, I love the sentiment that Shinobi's, is kind of zeroing in on here is the importance of what this is actually doing for places like El Salvador. Like I did

a video recently on kind of what Jack built with and yes, it's it's like a KYC thing but like I did it from the perspective of somebody without a bank account. So as somebody in El Salvador would see it.

And it like it fucking works. Like anybody can, if you're a merchant, you can then accept whatever the fuck you want. You can stay in dollars or you can seamlessly send out to your own, like self-custody Bitcoin Lightning wallet or your own self-custody Bitcoin on-chain wallet seamlessly without having to do anything. And so like doing a side by side between like strike and something like Moon Wallet where

it's just a single balance and it works with regular Bitcoin addresses and lightning. All of a sudden, it's just like, whatever you want, Bitcoin is working for you because you're receiving easy transactions from anywhere in the world instantly. You're able, if you're not on the Bitcoin train, it doesn't fucking matter because you can still use Bitcoin and hold your cuckbox and you're fine. Strike has a element of custodialship, or is it just KYC? It is a custodial. It's fully custodial.

I feel like I think that's, yeah. And I mean, I just find like, you know, you know how it is, like especially on like Bitcoin Twitter and Bitcoin Maxi Twitter, people just bash custodial options. But man, like custodial options have done so much good for Bitcoin as much as, you know, they burn people and will continue to burn people like mining. mining like mining scale through custodial options which is mining pools like people just trash custodial uh anything so much but like we wouldn't be where we're at today without with all these things that are purely trusted custodial you know uh layering but it's uh that's that to me is a

fundamental part of scaling bitcoin as long as we have the option people just need the option you need the option for non-custodial you just need the option when you need it when you need it like layer layer two lightning non-custodial you you need that when you need it you don't always need it but when you need it's there for you right like that's why it's important it's a check on the system right it's a check on the system as long as you have the option it's like as long as it's easy to run a node not every fucking person is going to run a node and that's okay but but it's important that you you should be able to if you choose to i shouldn't say you shouldn't but it's It's not exactly that important to unless you need to.

It's always what I felt about it. Well, here's another side of this too. For some people, low enough net worth, you're never going to be able to get away from a custodian. Like, I'm sorry. Long term, somebody who doesn't have more than 50 or 100 bucks to their name at any given time. Like, I'm sorry, dude. You have no self-sovereignty unless you learn how to actually accumulate more money than that.

It's just too expensive. It's true. Like, it's like, you know, there's that one idea that Bitcoin, you know, we all say Bitcoin is great for people in poverty. And it is, like it is. But it's true that like if you're in severe poverty, there are some, you know, fee issues and stuff with Bitcoin. But it's like you're complete people that say that, like that Bitcoin's not good for people in poverty because it's too costly. Like the BCH people, you're completely discounting the fact that those people that are impoverished, can pool together.

Like they can pool together. It means trusting, you know, like whether it's the head of household, like if it's the father pooling together the family's resources or if it's a group of friends or a community. But they can do that. They can pool resources and Bitcoin will help lift them out of that situation. Like that's, again, what fucking mining pools are. Like we're pooling together trusting someone because we can't do it on our own.

I'd be out of business if I had to solo mine. So what almost 99% of people, right? That's what it really triggers me. That's what makes Bitcoin beach work, man, like the Goloi stack. Like it's literally a custodial multi-sick bank amongst the community because you have to, like you have to deal with that. But also a little side tangent, fuck mining pools. We need to work on decentralized mining protocols. And that kind of just got it.

I just had to get that. No, and you're right. Decentralized protocols are important, but they're only important when you need them. Like that's why the infrastructure is important. got to build it and it's got to be like developed but like me as a business owner like I'm not going to go with a higher cost like decentralized option if I can just trust my boys at slush pool to not fuck me right like I'm just going to do that until I get fucked by them and then I have the op I got plan B I'm going to go I'm going to go to P2P pool or whatever you know because I totally

am on board with building that stuff out but it's that you got to have it there when you need and that's the way that's the perspective I look at at things with awesome I like it brandon you're going to say something go ahead yeah just to wrap up on custody I agree it's just about the threat of self-custody that's what matters and centralization is really efficient and custodial options are efficient and so we should expect that the primary use case for most people will be custodial because they want that type of arrangement but I like to analogy I like is similar to outside your house. You put a little sign that says, this house is protected by a big scary dog or this house is protected by a security system or men with guns or

whatever. It doesn't even matter if you have a dog security system or guns. Just the threat is what matters. It's like putting up gummy cameras. Yes, absolutely. Exactly. And to pile on to Shinobi's thought about Lad Am, I think this is a very fascinating moment in Bitcoin's history. And I think Ladd Am is something that nobody saw coming, although it's kind of obvious now, right? They've been historically, economically fucked, both from neo-colonialism, internal corruption. Yeah, Maxis just consisted them for years. Yeah, all kinds of stuff. And so I'm hoping that we see Laddam leapfrog a bunch of these, quote, developed countries that are clinging to Keynesianism. And who knows what that's going to happen? Like, let's be pessimistic for a second. Let's say Bukaley is just a narcissist who wants

shine to come on him. That's possible. It might even be probable. But the reality is he's bringing this freedom money into his country inside the Trojan horse. And once he brings it in there, the people will get exposed to it. And there's no way to get it out. And I think that's going to kind of cascade through Ladam. And I think honestly, if we zoom out here, the most important point here is that what Lechle did was he just gained millions of Bitcoiners as allies.

right he aligned incentives now it's our job to make sure al salvatore is successful and we have to because it makes it look bad on us right and so yeah like we're going to go in there and no matter what it's going to be successful even if it's not due to bitcoin there's going to bring capital there the countries can economically develop and other other latim countries are going to see that and they're going to say we want we want resources in our country i think place like that really quick though the important thing though is everybody who follows next in in like they rush too quick on the tails of El Salvador, are going to be able to learn lessons from what is done wrong in El Salvador, what problems were not anticipated. And each time some new player

comes on board, there's more refining and more learning and better done infrastructure and legislation based on the problems that you see from the last one. Yeah, less risk, but also less upside, right? Being first or early has tremendous advantage, also more risk. Yeah, you often just burn and people learn from you and do better. And there's a good chance that will, there will be some big hiccups with the El Salvador stuff. I mean, like, I've never subscribed to the idea that, you know, we got to get state adoption or like institutional adoption. Like, I look at it like Bitcoin's going to fucking destroy you guys. Like, it's a bottom up money. You guys are a top down benefit like you're benefiting from the top down money system this is a bottom on money system it's

going to absolutely like split you up like fraction you out the shareholders of your institution are going to start competing against each other because they're going to be competing for like a sounder money and not a dependent on like a fiat cantillan ladder effect if you know what I mean do you think uh just just to any curiosity since we're on the topic do you think that um in the grand scheme of things. Let's say, okay, so Al Salvador, adopt Bitcoin, there's obviously there's going to be some issues that arise, but in general, I would say that in the in the long term a Bitcoin standard is going to be, and it's not even a full bit. It's like a quasi like almost like a bi-metalism except for one is like a rapidly depreciating shit coin that is the US dollar. But

you have that. Do you have then some nation state that then adopts some sort of god-awful shit coin or like a mix of shit coins and then and then has it be a massive problem? Like do we see that play out on like, you know, like your your noob friend, you tell them you've been orange pilling them forever and then your new friend jumps in and they buy like a bunch of like shit. Chib token and then they That's my worst nightmare. Like yeah. Please no. Let it happen.

No, no. Please do not let that happen. Like please continue like the middle. Look man. They're already using the worst like just. Remember. Remember that this state like the state, any country, they're already using the worst shit coin invented in the history of man like

Fiat money. If they go to any other shit coin like any other cryptocurrency, it's almost like a step. up like even if it's like even if it's a Ethereum it's like a step up I would I would I'm not I fucking hate Ethereum but I put it above yet I say

you got yet at the fucking bottom Ethereum is one one notch right up there like one notch above I'm going to slap you okay you ever meet in person someplace and I'm going to slap you for this I have I have a memory that is if you slap me I'm going to know who you are in real life

dude so you're gonna when I get slapped by some random guy at a conference you just docks yourself because I'm remembering this and then I'm taking a picture of you bro you need like a body cam Steve needs a body cam so we can docks

just like please God don't let that happen like there was enough of that in 2017 I know I know I don't think I don't think it's gonna happen and I'd be ridiculous I honestly sort of think the El Salvador like the state endorsing Bitcoin doesn't really make sense because it's like incompatible with what makes the state. Bitcoin, Bitcoin strips the state from a sign your age like printing money.

It strips them from that. So they can't they can't fund themselves on printing money. Two, it makes taxation way harder because yeah, Bitcoin can be surveilled to some degree, but not like Fiat can. So it makes it harder to tax. So Bitcoin is not compatible with like like state taxation. It reduces it, right? it reduces their scope and their ability to do things. So like it's weird to me that even,

it's not weird, I guess, for El Salvador, because they're already getting fucked so hard by, by, you know, foreign influences. But like,

you know, I think El Salvador, if that didn't never happen, that awesome thing, that announcement, they didn't get into it, make a legal tender. I think El Salvadorians wouldn't be much different off.

Because I think that, that spark and flame is already growing. And it was just going to grow. It's growing everywhere as it is, and it's just going to keep growing, right? Well, like, I'm not really familiar with Buceli or the government down there beyond what I've tried to catch up with since the original announcement. But he is continually described and compared to me as like a Trumpian figure down there.

And, you know, what was Trump? Like, let's rip the government apart. People's a man of the people's way. Yeah. And fucking let people solve their own problems. So if you, if you have that kind of guy doing something like this, also in a way, They will take taxes in Bitcoin. The government will definitely be building their Bitcoin war chest.

That just incentivizes them to continue moving in that direction and be efficient. Like mind your own business unless there's a real fucking good reason for it because you actually have to go ask people for funding when you need to pay for stuff. You can't just play the games that you do now. And they're going to, I mean, if El Salvador does tax and use Bitcoin in the, treasury they are going to out compete you know any any direct well i mean every country i guess competes in a way together but even their direct neighbors they're going to outcompete them as a as a as a as an economy like no you're right like you're you're you're right that it's totally a good move um i like to think it's going to happen either way it's going to catch fire and i think you guys

all agree with that but uh i see an idea it wasn't it wasn't weird to me to see his face is like he's like, I have to say something now. I've seen it on his face. Holy shit. That could be the rye speaking through my face, but I do have a point. And the point is that we should be aware that, you know, with regard to incentives, like why would a country will only give up their senior age? In El Salvador's example, they were dollarized already. So they have no senior age. They have no ability to control the monetary system. So they're essentially importing U.S. inflation, and they have no, they get no benefit from that, whereas American citizens do. And so I think we're going to see, yeah, I think we're going to

see the dollarized nations, at least they have the most incentive to flip over quickly. Whereas I agree otherwise, why would you ever give up senior age unless you were forced to? And so we might have a dozen countries that matter that might flip here in the next, let's say, 18 to 24 months. But after that, it starts to get a little bit hard. because you're giving up serious power. You're absolutely right. Like signer is just such a powerful tool for a country and to have their own central bank and to print their problems away.

And if they can't, if that's the situation in El Salvador, you're absolutely right. Like they've already been stripped of that corrupt, you know, mechanism for keeping power. So it's a good point, man. And see, an interesting thing here, though, is like nations like in a dollarized or already relinquished situation like that. if this is successful in dominoes, like, you know, I hope most of us hope it does. That brings more liquidity to the overall network, which go to the other end, like hyperinflationary countries that still have senior ageability, et cetera.

While now it's more liquid, more relatively stable, it makes more sense for those types of countries to get outboard. And even if they don't want to get on board, it doesn't. those are the kind of places where your people are going to go, fuck you, we're going to do this anyway. What are you going to do about it? Yeah, it's interesting. Like countries like America, China, like maybe the two top countries on the planet. I live in Canada.

You know, we consider herself a first world. I feel like we're third world sometimes. But yeah, I feel like we're going to be like the people of Canada, of course, are in a position where they can go out and become Bitcoiners. like it's a wealthy country, but like the government, like the state of Canada, doing anything to adopt Bitcoin, you know, we're already so close to the, you know, upper echelon of the Fiat Maxihood. So like it's, you almost expect us in the U.S. to and the Chinese to be, and all the other top, you know, maybe G7 nations like the in, in club nations and whatnot to be the last to ever consider any like any like legalization of like legalization or, like, legalization or

tendering of Bitcoin. And that's good because, I mean, it's the places that need it most. Like, you know, I hope they win and I hope they've, I hope they show. I really hope what we see over the next few years, like El Salvador, just boom. Like, I really like that story on the ATM business going there. Just read a little bit about it. But like, if it can show that, you know, it's going to be job creating, it's going to be like a real economic boom. Man, that'll be just savage.

It'll just catch fire. Yeah, 15K. I can't remember the name of the company, but 15, they're slated to do 15,000 ATMs in the country, but in like tranches of smaller batches of them going out. But, yeah, could be interesting. Can I pivot into why I think this, why I'm bullish on this episode?

Yeah, man, let's do it. As I'm on my, like, fourth shot of riot, and I'm about to lose any coherency. Like on the same topic, like, you know, I love, I just love seeing any startup, especially any Bitcoin related, like pro-Bitcoin-related startup do well. One of my favorite follows on Twitter is like Tahini's restaurant,

like a little franchise that's like big into Bitcoin. And you know they're going to kill it because like just having Bitcoin in your treasury makes it so difficult for any other competitor to any other competitor. Like you could be a, They're a restaurant business. Any other competitor that's in a restaurant. That's a tough freaking market to be in like the restaurant business. Like that's one of maybe Bitcoin mining is like the only harder market because it's

it's so easy to get into. But like restauranting like it's an easy business. It's a low barrier to entry. Tough margins. But Tahini's like I don't know who else in like who's their direct competitor in their area. I think they're based in Ontario. It's probably a million charma places that did like what Tahini's does.

But he's going to. team's going to fucking kill those guys. They're going to kill all their competition because they might have the exact same profit margin. They might have, you know, at the end of the year, 10% profit, just like every other competitor in the area, sort of like plus or minus a few percent, some guys in the negative whatnot. But team is going to kill them. They're going to kill them because they're going to have this Bitcoin treasury. And I was saying that locally on a local podcast in Lloyd. Like I got this small oil field business.

We're getting into motors and stuff. Like we're not doing, aside from the Bitcoin. mining focus that we have, what we're doing is actually not that different than what a lot of oil service companies do. And I said on this podcast locally, I'm like, my competition will have no chance to compete with me if they don't adopt a Bitcoin treasury. And they don't even have to build Bitcoin mines. They can just, all you have to do as any small business owner is convert a little bit of your treasury and your profits into Bitcoin and to hoddle it and to speculate properly on it. And you're going to crush your competition, like your FIA competition. So my bullishness that I wanted to bring to

this episode is like, I think that small businesses and small, like true entrepreneurs, not Fiat entrepreneurs, not the guys like just going out and trying to get raising money from these VCs and not really building anything. But actually true entrepreneurs, people going out starting small businesses, I think we're going to see finally a true like economic boom in small businesses that we've seen suppression over for over 100 years, like over 50 years for sure, ever since like the full on, you know, 1971 Fiat standard. But, you know, I've like, you know, when I showed up on the show, I was driving, right? I do a lot of driving around Alberta, Saskatchewan. You know, you know Alberta well, uh, sessions. You know, we go through all these small towns. Every small

towns are fucking same. And I think about it from like the Bitcoin or perspective. I'm like, all these small towns are identical. They have the same franchises. They got the like Mr. Lube. They got like the Petro Canada. They got gas station. They all got franchises.

There's no fucking small businesses anywhere. They're all dead. They're dead. Like everything's a franchise now, right? Which is a which in and of itself isn't a problem. But the fact is like these people are just licensees of a business model. They're not finding their own supply chain to build a small business. They're going out and becoming a licensee of a big fiat, you know, like a big corporation.

that ends up benefiting from like the fiat. Can I just go down a random rabbit hole that I haven't thought about in months that you just completely unlocked it? So I get really high a lot and I do really silly things with my time. Me too. Randomly decide for a work or a week that I'm going to make a bunch of different hamburger recipes. And so when I do stuff like that sometimes I have funnier ideas. Like what if we open source to franchise model where I specifically lay out the exact. exact process of something, like how it's supposed to be done, like how you're supposed to

cook this food. And I open source it and anybody can do that. But if I catch you fucking up, if I catch you deviating from that brand, oh, I get to sue the shit out of you and take a bunch of money from you. But if you follow everything to the tea, everything's yours. I was actually thinking of something like that. Like I'm really like, I don't know, I'm really open with like what we do in our business and like I want to well I've always tried to help people and educate people in the oil field space about Bitcoin mining and I was thinking like okay we did a lot of work on building these designs for Bitcoin mines and I want Bitcoiners to go out and be successful whether they're like oil companies whether they're like semi-competitors or not I'm like maybe

I should open source all my designs so that anyone like open sources so that like you know we're not going to legally do anything against anyone that builds exactly what I build. I'll give them all the spec, all the anything, like suppliers, because there's a lot more to business than just like how you build something. You guys still do it well. And part of my idea was like maybe I'll just go do this. Like a rising tide ends up lifting all boats anyway. Like it's going to make more credibility around what we do in our little niche market. And in the end, I'm going to get more business anyway and me and and and sort of what you're thinking as long as they don't um uh i don't know try to try to like bring in their own legal uh say like you know patent something and try to bring in their

own like little legal monopoly around what they're doing based off our stuff our designs then it's totally open market um i don't know i think that's like a very interesting interesting idea um something i've actually been thinking about a lot because like i'd like to sort of maybe open source all the stuff that we designed in house that like right now like we would we would probably like certainly if it wasn't me at the helm like it was just like a regular fiat maxi at the helm we would go after anyone that like copied it um but right now we're sort of cool with like what goes on but i didn't mean to interrupt you you can keep going but the liquor's starting to hit me hard oh no i i'm happy to hear that i'm not the only one thinking along those

lines because it's like I am exactly on the same point with you like all of these small businesses dying and being cannibalized by these massive franchises like it's sickening like I when I was a kid I used to go around places and every place I want is the new unique thing for that area and that locality and like let's go find those things and experience them and they're all fucking gone you know back like not that long ago like I come from Newfoundland there was a lot of and it's would be the same anywhere, but I'm just speaking from my own experience. Like, like, my family history, like, there was, there was always, like, in this, in this small town in Newfoundland where sort of my, my people come from. Like, there's always mom and pop. So, like, it was like father

and son shops. Like, you know, like back in the day, maybe mostly men doing a lot of the business stuff. But it was always like this guy and sons or these brothers and like, you know, like doing all that stuff. And the theory, you know, the Fiat sort of Keynesian thinking on this is like, well, The Walmart models like pushed them all out and stuff. Like it's no. No, no, it's not the Walmart model or the Amazon model that killed small businesses. It's fucking Fiat money printing that killed small businesses. It's not it's not the fact that these guys made these big distribution chains.

It's the fact that they've- How did those get paid for it? It's the fact that their access to capital, like their cost of capital is less than everyone else. That's why kills small businesses. And fuck, like I remember when I started my business and I was like, just trying to try to get sales like i would go to these like clean tech conferences like in alberto like emissions reduction like we do massive emissions reduction stuff so i went to these emissions reduction like clean tech conferences and like i'm looking around at like what people

are selling and like i would do like a little pitch event like a little pitch contest to see if i could get interest in our business and stuff and i'm not a great pitcher really but the uh there these like really polished people like pitching their products but i look at their products and they're fucking they stink like they're terrible. They're the worst. They're not scalable in any rational world, but these people are just running around like these circuits of like emissions reduction conference, clean tech, you know, and it's the same with like, you know, all the buzzwords like AI, you know, blockchain conferences, all that

shit we dealt with in like 2017. It's like all these non-scalable crap products with these like, you know, entrepreneurs raising money but not actually getting customers. Raising money is the metric for success but not getting customers. It's like customers is all that matters. Sales, customers, product, service.

Sorry? Oh, we work? We work. Yeah. Oh, like, that's like one of the biggest fiat, like maxi disasters ever. Like the I mean, everyone's about raising money. I'm just like ranting at this point because I'm like buzzing, but like you go on

like LinkedIn. It's just, it's just fucking everyone's congratulating patting each other on the back for raising money it's like why don't you talk about the sales you made like the customers you acquired because that's what's fucking important in real life but it's just oh yeah look at all the money we raised at this valuation like congratulate that's all it is on there and like all society is that way now and then you see all these shows you got like shark tank dragons den in canada's version of shark tank and all these like entrepreneurial shows like startups like mostly not really a lot of people like not really bringing much to market but just like it's just like this VC hype scene which is a whole

another rabbit hole which triggers me is like the VC like aspect of Twitter which is like all these VCs on Twitter that are like look man a VC is like a Fiat maxi like there's no way around it and like there are all these people clinging on to Bitcoin it's like Bitcoin's going to destroy your core business model like in the long run it's just like this weird juxtaposition where all the fiat maxis are like pumping into bitcoin but i guess it's just people doing it about sending their own best interest but like the business models are incompatible with bitcoin but it's just people doing what's in their own best interest and profiting in the short term but it's like a weird it's like this weird phenomenon it's like in the future when bitcoin and sound money returns there's not going to be this

VC culture we're seeing right now which is which are basically the dependent of the money printing, like, uh, hierarchy, right? Like it goes down to the VCs and I don't know. I'm just like, uh, getting there, but. Yeah, it's like you just, I'm bullish on small businesses, man. I think small businesses are going to be insane. Like I can't wait for the Bitcoin standard.

And I really promote like, I'm straight up promoting my own competitors in like, uh, our locality like the Lloyd, Alberta, Saskatchewan area. Like guys, like, accept Bitcoin's payment or if no one wants to pay in Bitcoin, which is still hard to do. I have a lot of customers paying me in Bitcoin because they're minors, so they have Bitcoin. But like you guys, you're just selling motors. You're my competitor.

I don't give a shit. Sell your motors, convert your profit to Bitcoin and stay in business. Because that is how you're going to win as a small business right now. Brian. Yeah, Steve, to your point there, I think you identified a ton of issues that we're having right now. And they all stem from the fact that money is easy. Right.

And what that leads to is a cascading effect of the bigger you are, the closer you are, the more access to capital you have, et cetera, that's what drives all behavior. So until we change incentives, we're not going to see anything change in the real world. I have a slightly more charitable view of venture capital. I think what we have now is obviously an extreme overgrowth of that. And it's way too much money sloshing around there. And you can see portfolios in VC land are directly correlated do how easy the money is during that during the period of their fund. No surprise.

And so I think what we need is a Bitcoin, Bitcoinized world in order to change these things. We'll see a mass def financialization, which I think is a huge net positive for normal people. Right? Like this is demons. They're deviled people. Okay. Let's talk about this for a second. I think the caricature of VCs that we see today, I would agree with.

But I would argue that there is a place, and I want to hear your guys' opinion, I think there's a place for people who place long-term bets on very risky type businesses, right? I think the model makes sense, 100 fail, and one of them changes the world. I just think that right now they have too much money. They're able to raise too much because everyone needs yield. So everyone's going further down. It's fine right now. It's so hard to find. Like, yield is so hard.

But that pushes, like, that's kind of the problem, though, is so much money slashing around is what makes them devil people. Because the same way that money printer is distortionary, they're like a secondary distortionary effect, throwing us around at crazy things wildly instead of thinking about who actually can make a solid plan and an argument to us. Who do we know and trust? And actually being, like, scrutinizing and skeptical in where they put their money. It's just like the money printer distorts things and they wind up with a pile of money. And so they go on and distort things again because they just see it as a gambling casino. So it's not necessarily it's not the role. It's what our perverted monetary system has converted the role into.

Yeah, like I would never, I have no ill will towards any VC or anyone that works in any of those like, you know, I just call it the cantillan ladder, right? center banking down to the PEP. Like anyone high up the letter, it's no problem. When you're doing what's in your own best interest and all that. But I mean, we're all working to reverse the, like just flip the mechanism of how, you know, money is created through mining and distribution through sound Bitcoin mechanisms instead of like the top down Fiat mechanism. But it's just a commentary on like, it's just this funny like, you know, you got you like I've

always thought it's funny that like some of the most prominent and influential people. like in the Bitcoin space are like people that are in positions like they're higher up to cantillan ladder like they're benefiting from fiat like they didn't like say they didn't scrap and like grow a small business into something amazing they they went to school and this is not a knock on these people individually but they it's just the system like they go to school they work for this fund and they benefit immensely and but because they're like us like they're big bitcoiners they go out and crush it uh they want they want the sound money standard too But it's just ironic to me.

It's like it's like you're sort of, it's almost like Coinbase. Like Coinbase is an exchange. The more Bitcoin succeeds, the less relevant they become. It's like you're putting yourself like out of work in a sense. But yeah, it's like certainly it's never a hate against the player. It's just like the system is such a, it's such a fucked up mess. It's it there's all this irony and hypocrisy in this whole space. That's funny to comment on because like,

It's like, well, it perverts. It perverts everybody's actions, right? Like the, the problem is I posted that, um, uh, what I was talking about at the beginning of the show. I took a screenshot of that CNBC, uh, upside of inflation increased wages. And one of my friends commented on it, um, who's like an intelligent person and is like, well off and has a good job and everything. He commented.

He's like, well, yeah, but the, the, the. the upside of that is that is that my debt gradually gets you know whittled down and and gone away but but like when you think of what induced that debt in the first place is asset inflation like you can't you can't just save money for a house nowadays and then buy your house or like only have like a short mortgage you can't just for the most part you can't to save money for a new car nowadays. You have to then you have to like get a payment plan and pay it off over five, six, seven, eight year terms now.

Like the people are looking at it from a perspective of, oh, well, like maybe it's okay in this context because it, it fixes the problem that the problem itself caused. And it's, it's, yeah, it's like the, the very base layer of. all of this perverts all of our incentives to drive us to do things that we wouldn't normally do in a system that is just a money that actually functions.

In a free market, yeah. Well, speak for yourself, but I'm perfect, and I always do the right thing. I just want to take an aside, like we haven't heard from our friend Tim. Tim. Are you alive? Is the water working? How's the water? I think he's got to...

How are you doing, Tim? You're on mute, Tim. You're muted and you're... Oh, there we go. Hold on. You guys hear me? We're making sure you're not dead? Yeah, so I think I messed up.

like my bad you didn't mess up my friend I you made your statements you had a little too much fun we had someone in the audience concerned about you

I feel like really not I think I think you're I think you're set this is effectively what this show is is a bunch of Bitcoiners

getting together and having the fun like over drinks conversation that bitcorners want to have on their Friday nights and then everybody in the chat gets to join in. And that's kind of the point. So I love it. Also that everybody's rooting for you in the chat. Oh my gosh. Everybody's like go Tim. Tim.

I saw you. I'm 20, I'm 220 pounds, but like I just can't. I can't do it. People are like, pickles might help. Somebody else said, try a cup of coffee. Everybody's got their own remedies. So sort through the chat, and I'm sure there's some great stuff. I actually had a, like, when I was working at, like, the company before this stuff,

I had a good Korean friend. She, I think had the same issue. Like, she'd have one drink. And he was saying earlier on, it's like a metabolism thing. It would go, like, straight to her head. She'd get flush red and get super drunk, like off nothing. she actually got into these like uh i don't know maybe you heard about it's like a pill and it it just like suppresses it honestly like completely uh not that not that it matters that you got

to go drink more but like it was uh she started using that and it actually worked like totally fine yeah you got to get on the cannabis man cannabis won't won't crush you so hard yeah man agree let's keep rolling with it i'm gonna i'm gonna i You know, we've been going for an hour of 45. We're going to round it out. We're going to toss it to Brandon. Brandon, you get to, you get the honor of the final reason for being bullish. So my friend, take it away.

Why are you feeling bullish this week? All right. Before I do that, I have to take one quick jab. I'm in Minnesota. So Canada's pretty close. I got to take one quick jab that are friendly neighbors to the north. And this was, and this was based off of Steve's comment, which was that we're going to go back to a metal standard. And last I

checked, the Central Bank of Canada has no gold. I'm wondering what happens. We're fucked, man. We're actually just going to become a U.S. state. I don't know what's going to happen in Canada. So you'll acknowledge reality, finally. It's okay.

Yeah, here's, uh, here. I honestly, like, I don't know why you think, uh, but as a fellow Canadian, but like, this country sucks right now, man. Yeah, it's, it's fucked. It's so. Maybe it's our Western bias and like our Eastern brethren are just like, I'm actually from the East, which is funny.

Like I, yeah, Bitcoin changed me completely. I used to be like, uh, just brainwash like left, left thinking individual like everyone in the East. And like it just completely, I even think my conservative friends in Alberta are like lefties, like what they get on with. It's so weird. Just context for what's, uh, what Brandon, uh, uh, like basically uppercutted us with is is Canada's official international reserves last released by the Bank of Canada blah blah. February 23rd, as of February 23rd, 2016, gold reserves are at zero.

This is unprecedented. Canada now stands as the only G7 nation that does not hold at least 100 tons of gold. When I'm telling you that we are a third world country, like we like it, you come you won't it doesn't there's no reason to think so but like in there's like a pack end reason that we are we're going to become the biggest dependence on like when when shit hits the fan we're going to become major dependence on like the u.s we're already dependence on the u.s we sell the us oil who then sells it back to us like without doing anything to it because we can't get any fucking pipelines in the ground we sell it to the u.s they sell it back to us on the other side of

the country they won't let us put our own pipeline in to sell our own oil to our own country. Like that's how much of a pathetic country Canada is. As much as a sound like a traitor to like hate on my own country, like it's a really ugly place right now from a, from a political perspective, not from a not from a people perspective, not from a land and opportunity perspective.

We should be actually, I always think, I've always thought that Canada should be the, like one of the biggest places for opportunity for people to be coming to right now. it's the communist that are keeping that from happening it's it's it's i would like to see more autonomy uh between the provinces right i'd love to see lays the trail and show us down here yeah right it's i you know like of all the provinces i'm actually it's funny because steve you said you like you you went from kind of being like leaning left to to

after i i came to alberta and the first thing i did when trudo Like I like before I got into Bitcoin, which is 2016, which was Trudeau sort of like came to came to the scene. Like I was like, yeah, Trudeau like I'm a liberal. And I didn't, I actually didn't vote. But then I got into Bitcoin. I was like, oh my God. Like what was I thinking? As people educated me.

Yeah. And another thing is like, you know, I'm speaking from the Bitcoin mining perspective. Like Texas is a place, Texas gets all the hype on Bitcoin mining right now, like in the North American market. Wyoming, there's other states that get a lot of hype too. But like, like you like there's certain there's certain things that are very conducive to that meme. But like if Canada wasn't such a fucked up regulatory place, like if Canada, if like Alberta and Saskatchewan and BC had more of the mentality that like Texas had is like deregulation,

more free market stuff, we would fucking dominate the United States and Bitcoin mining. Like climate, the energy, the energy. the energy waste. We have, it's insane here. Like I'm really in tune with the oil markets up here. We would absolutely dominate Bitcoin mining. But unfortunately, it's a regulatory regime that's like, that's driving interest and investment out of our country.

But it's not the resource or the opportunity. It's not that Texas or any of the other states like Wyoming, any of the other ones, Pennsylvania. You know, I'm speaking from an oil and gas, Bitcoin mining stuff's perspective. But it's not, it's not. not the opportunity. It's the regulatory regimes. Canada is this is a weird place to place money right now because they just flip-blop all the time. They won't let anything go through. You can't build nothing. Can't get no licensing for anything permitting. You can't get nothing. And they're

always changing like carbon tax rules, which I'd love to rant about sometime. Yeah, it's, it's messed up. Yeah, it's, I'm going to toss it back to Brandon because we now, now that he, he, he, he, he, he jabbed Canada and then we got to go on a Canadian ran. That's that's your fault, man. You toss it to us and then we just were like, fuck. Why do we got to, what are we going to counter this and like go after the US? I don't know. Oh, you can't like, you can make fun of Biden.

I was like, you can make fun of Biden, but Trudeau's worse. Yeah, yeah. We got nothing. All right, to the point that I am bullish about. And it's going to go on the theme for me for some reason, this whole conversation I've been thinking one incentives. And the thing I'm bullish about here is that American politicians who hardly understand Bitcoin are jumping on the bandwagon and that they find it in their best interest to promote Bitcoin. And we already know the Suarez is that dude in middle of nowhere,

Tennessee, you know, Texas, Wyoming. We know those ones. But we've had a couple of surprising ones like Eric Adams, mayoral candidate from New York, who just won the primary. And then a new one, Erica Rhodes, who's running against Brad Sherman for Congress in California's 30th district. And they're going hard at Bitcoin. Sorry, what? I was going to say, is Brad Sherman, that Fiat maxi guy? Yeah, he's the guy who understands Bitcoin. He's a douchebag who's like, Bitcoin's going to remove our political power to

play good police. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, a winy little guy. He loves. Yeah, get him out of power. The guy who's always always. financial companies and banks and payment processors and stuff like that. Yeah, it's funny because he gets it.

Like he actually gets it. But then, you know, he'll say it in Congress or wherever. And he'll be like, oh, it's going to remove all our power. We won't be able to like control the monetary system and like keep, you know, the average blue collar worker down and all of these things basically like says all of the stuff. that exactly is what Bitcoin's for. We can't keep destroying the American dream.

Yeah. But then he'll say a bunch of like bunk metrics that like, and also all the criminals are using it and and everybody's going to launder money and everything. He'll say a bunch of bullshit alongside it. And because he gets it, but he's a weasel. Yeah, yeah, exactly. And because he uses all these like bunk like only bad people use it metrics alongside like what it's actually for, everybody fully dismisses everything he says,

which is kind of like a nice, you know, like pairing of like, well, he's crazy about this shit because we know the data is wrong. And then he must be crazy about that Bitcoin is completely going to destroy the nation state too. That's the CIA's playbook you just described. The CIA came up with the word conspiracy theorist. I think it was in the 70s in order to categorize all the people speaking out against power. They made that up. And so then all you have to do is call them a conspiracy theorist and then all their arguments are bunk. It's like weaponized ad hominem from.

Yeah, climate denier, climate denier. Exactly. You're anti-vaccine because you're questioning the experimental COVID. It's propaganda. It's public relations. Edward Bernan's. Exactly. Yeah, Bernice is a legend.

But can I finish my point why I'm bullish? Yeah, man. So we have the politicians. They don't know shit, but they're. filing in. And what this leads to is politicians are here to be reelected. Right. And so if they're good at one thing, they're good at, you know, strategically finding votes. And the Bitcoin, the Bitcoin community is an asymmetric upside for candidates because Bitcoiners by and large are one-issue voters. I will not go to the ballot box unless it's either for or against

a Bitcoin proponent. And there's absolutely no constituents who are one-issue voter against Bitcoin. So by promoting Bitcoin, you only gain voters. And so I think we're going to see this more and more. And I think we're also going to see people piling into support Erica Rhodes. There's already a massive telegram group. They're raising money. There's going to be people knocking on probably every house in the district's going to be knocked on by a Bitcoiner. And so I think that, yeah, what's happening here is all the incentives are being aligned.

And Bitcoiners will get these people voted into power. Other people will see this. and it's just asymmetric towards Bitcoin. It seems like everything's asymmetric towards Bitcoin. That is, that's an interesting idea too. What do you think about the, like, and I agree with the premise of the, the incentives line up in the long term towards Bitcoin, especially in the context of what's gone on over the past year and the average person, you know, holding onto dollars and watching their

purchasing power whittle away. And just general Bitcoin kind of fixes this mentality. What do you say to the ability of Bitcoiners to kind of slay their heroes? Do you think there's going to be a lot of that with politicians in and around Bitcoin-related runs? Like, do you think that continues? I mean, obviously, I hope it continues. I love it. Yeah. And how does that play out?

Like, if somebody runs on like a Bitcoin stance and then like doesn't follow through or like. Well, the biggest, the biggest possibility right now, I guess politically wise is a what's Bucilli like the El Salvadorian maxi. Bitcoin Maxi or president. but I guess he's at risk of making a misstep and having the Bitcoiners turn on him, right? Like, because they're all, everyone's in his corner right now. So he's at risk of getting, getting, getting, getting, getting, making a misstep and becoming like a fallen angel. So I almost feel like it has to happen at some point. So like when is it going to happen and watch the context?

But will that really matter at this point? Oh, I don't think it'll matter. It'll be just fun drama, right? Like when he does something that he turns on us or does something like, you know, what we always see, while we always see in the Bitcoin space, especially as a Bitcoin. But it's like, look at Breedlove getting canceled.

Like, he's still tweeting. People are they're stilling. Like, it didn't matter shit. It was just. No, it doesn't matter. Yeah. And the bigger we get, like, the more relevant that type of shit will be.

So it's kind of like to brand. point, like when politicians use Bitcoin as a way to kind of gather attention and support or financing or whatever, like eventually they're just going to carry off on their own momentum with that. And that's not something that us yelling on the internet can really do anything to influence. They don't care about anyone but they're voters. I have a question, Shinobi. Do you think that I know we're kind of kind of going down a little bit of a, uh, a detour here, but in regards to, I guess it applies in regards to breed love or in regards to politicians or whatever.

If somebody messes up, do you think, because right now, yeah, sure, you know, the whole big clout debacle and dude has more followers than he's ever had and so on and so forth, do you think that's just a symptom of less, like only a small percentage of, you know, people actually being in tune with Bitcoin and kind of the incentives it aligns and that that shifts over time where people begin to kind of align with that low time preference ethos and eventually expect more of people and that has more of an actual impact on on their their actions moving forward or do you think that's just like a forever symptom of people just don't give a shit and they're not going to look deep enough to care? I think we're in our eternal September. And I do

think the amount of people in just pure numbers who actually start to go deeper down the whole like think more about time preference and like, you know, to what degree or what bar they hold other people like that number will grow. But percentage wise versus the people who don't don't give a shit. No, it's probably just going to keep shrinking. And like that that's just a fundamental thing here. And it's really like that that's all it comes down to. Like even personally speaking, like I don't give a shit about people dumping a shit coin or trading a shit coin. Like what like have at it. Just don't sit here and try to bullshit me about what you're fucking doing. You're dumping a shit coin to get more Bitcoin.

own it. Yeah, I think the major point here is that the immune system of Bitcoin, the toxicity, the way we police each other, et cetera, that's very important in the beginning. With any community, you have to establish norms and ways to go about things and whatever. But at a certain point, back to Eternal September, right, the new entrance outnumber the ideologically motivated people in the beginning that are incubating. And that has to happen for Bitcoin to succeed. So our job is to just simply provide cover fire so that Bitcoin can get through the door.

We're trying to incubate this thing so it becomes too big to fail. And then necessarily it must outgrow us at some point. And so, right, there's going to be that tension point. Like, are we too big to fail now? Should we relax a little bit? Or do we need to stay vigilant for another period of time? And I don't know the answer to these questions. But if Bitcoin can't accept way more.

new users that aren't ideologically aligned, then Bitcoin failed from the beginning. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And old Breedlove, like, did he, he didn't really turn on Bitcoin, like some guys in the past, like Mr. Roger Verr and others. I don't think it's even in the same conversation. Like, it's not like, I never even looked at. I ignored all the drama. He's like, man, like the guy, guy's doing what he's doing. Like, he's not directly, like, I'm not, I don't want to go into that conversation. It was like, yeah,

to me he was like, okay, like, I'm also a big tomm maxi. I'm also like, dude, that's sort of gay, like,

I'm not sorry. That's just like an old saying. It's sort of, it's sort of like ridiculous. Not, not that didn't mean to, uh, to do that.

This reminds me of that faith for that, uh, so that's the liquor. That's the, that's the, that's the, no, it's just,

uh, it's like, it's, who cares, like, like, he's not out there. scamming. Or maybe some people disagree, but,

it's this simple. Just own it. Like, I literally just own it. Just own it. This is the one thing I said. Like, don't act like you're the first person to dump a shit coin. I wanted to create my own fiat called soy coin. Like Steve owes you coins. And like, just like, you give me your Bitcoin. You give me all your Bitcoin. I'll custody and I'll give you my fiat. And you can redeem your fiat for my coins. And, like, like, you give me your Bitcoin. And, like, like I'm a I I can serve myself with Bitcoin like maxi maxi that's what I think of myself and I thought it was a great idea because I know I wouldn't fuck anyone I wouldn't like I wouldn't steal your coins but

I was joking about it online and people are ripping into me and like well you know it's not even a bad idea in some context you know it's in some situations custodial custodial options in certain situations are a good idea but I people are so people are so quick to uh just like narrow vision you know censorship resistance like run your own no like all all the memes hoddle stack sats and when you go against it it's it doesn't mean you're uh doesn't mean you're not a bitcoin maxi it's just like chill sometimes you know i i do like the uh the implications of the interim as like in the context of what brandon is talking about and politicians coming into the fray and i do like that given it's still so niche, there's that immediate pushback when you start saying dumb shit, right? Like if you're a politician. I love it when people, you know, you say something dumb, like online and you get trashed by your, by your fellow Bitcoin guys, like Bitcoin people.

Like it's a good thing. Yeah. It's a very good thing. Yeah. 100%. And I like the idea of, because like there was a guy from. It doesn't happen anywhere else, man. It doesn't happen anywhere.

You can be in any other industry and people don't call you out. It's all about political correctness. There's no, there's no like just straight to the point like be real, be truthful, be honest. Like just and if you don't be honest, like you get, man, like it's, it's, I think it's a really good thing. We literally told the richest man on the planet to go fuck himself and sell all his coins. So like the president has been set. Like like, it doesn't matter. Jack Waller's had an amazing reply to Elon, like Peter McCormack, like in that little

timeframe where Elon was being being a weirdo with Bitcoin. Like yeah, yeah. Like is that what you're talking about where we were, uh, was that we were referring to? We're like Jack wrecked him or. I'm not sure about that. What was that one? Oh, it's like when you want to turn on Bitcoin about being dirty. and then like Jack wrecked him on Twitter

with all this reasons why like you're a fraud like it was like the best thing I've ever seen in my life. We all said go fuck yourself. Jack Boyle bound why Elon was actually a fucking idiot. Yeah. It's and I like I like that idea of of because like politicians are used to okay I'm elected and then I get my term and whatever.

And then I can just kind of like. when it comes around to election time again, then I can start putting out the sound bites and sounded good. But like Bitcoiners like they still like how long ago was Segwit 2X and anybody involved in pushing that is like as soon as they say anything, it's like fuck you man. You tried to you like what you tried to do was not okay. And so like I feel like that same level.

It's only the people that didn't own it at all that are still getting shit. Because like anyone that owned it, I don't know. Was it the guy from Zappo or like one of the guys that were pushing it, then he owned it later. He's totally forgiven. Like it's like fine. Like you just got to own it right. Yeah, exactly.

Sorry. Yeah. Like he's. Yes, that was the guy. Actually fucking publicly apologized. One of the only fucking ones. And for that like it. He's, he's fucking badass in my book because that's it takes such a big person to do something like that.

Like we're so used to people never like owning anything. and like I don't know like the what I what I love about the Bitcoin space because I'm tied to the oil field and I'm tied to the Bitcoin space and I'm like sort of equally tied because I'm like on both ends of the spectrum like in oil field like all these Fiat Maxi missions fucking Nazis are like saying this is the way it's got to be you're bad you're bad for doing your business like you have to pay us a penalty and like it's ridiculous this carbon tax stuff and none of the oil companies none of the people people in the oil field are like making a platform of standing up against these people. But at least what I see in Bitcoin, like Marty Bent's a big voice. Like there's other people in the Bitcoin space that are big voices that are standing up against the bullshit. And you don't see that in normal industries because everyone's trying to be politically correct. But Bitcoin people don't give a fuck about that because most of them like real Bitcoiners

are like self-sovereign individuals. They don't care about being canceled. They don't care about like what anyone else thinks of them. And I'm saying I really have a hope that like this is going to grow and well, I'm seeing it grow. Like I'm seeing Bitcoin penetrate the oil and get like the energy industries and the oil and gas. So this is another bullish topic.

But like it's penetrating these industries. And I think it's going to change them. Like I think it's going to change them big time. Like I'm out on LinkedIn trolling people like telling them like like like stop your bullshit. Like no people don't normally see that kind of thing on LinkedIn because I'm I just think it's necessary. Like it's Bitcoin. Bitcoin maxis are considered almost like extreme intolerant individuals over bullshit.

And I think it's going to permeate as it continues to be a factor in society. Like as Bitcoin continues to be a factor in society. I think there's an important point you made there. And regarding the Bitcoin community, I think of it like a sports team or a fraternity or any type of organization, even a company who has the same. mission or same goal. And we all align to this baseline values. And we may have very different personal lives or interests or whatever. But that sports team feel is important, right?

Like getting your ass kicked every day in practice is why you win games. And so the internal attacking that we do amongst each other is in a way practice. It's sharpening our tool. We're checking each other, et cetera. And that's why Bitcoin becomes the best team, right? Because we practice hard. And we hold each other accountable. at the same time there's no tolerance of just nonsense like there's no nonsense tolerance like it's

like stop fucking around like and you just get you have to defend yourself if you if you to make a misstep as we all have found out online at one time or another by saying something stupid exactly take it's something else stupid the net just to wrap up the net of this is that it forces or it challenges a lot of people to become the best version of themselves right and that's where the magic is like you want to go right about bitcoin okay great you better spend 100 hours or a thousand hours reading the existing literature and if you're going to put something out there it better be good because you know you're you're vying for the respect of the community and so you know speaking for myself it challenges me to put out the best version of

content that I can or be a better version of myself in my personal life or whatever it is and that's extremely powerful right people eat differently they work out, they change their diet, they Chinobi quit smoking, right? There's all these examples. And that's amazing, right? Like, this is a crucible of positive development. And positive development

comes with pain and sacrifice and challenge. That's the only way. And constructive criticism, which, like, which is what we're all really doing to each other. And a lot of people can't take it, like they, in life. Like, maybe not, it's just like a, it's a hard

thing for a lot of people, like constructive of criticism. And it's just ruthless in this space. Ruthless. You can't make a misstep without getting constructively criticized by some anon on Twitter. But it's a beautiful thing. It's a really beautiful thing. It is a beautiful thing. I love how, I mean, people walking into like Bitcoin Twitter, they're like, Jesus Christ, you guys are just tearing each other apart. You're such assholes to each other. It's a meme at this point for, like, Like a person to like get the dogs attack and like the Bitcoin dogs attack. And when they say something ridiculous, like whether it's fud against Bitcoin, which it's usually something fun against Bitcoin.

And then all the big, someone finds it right online, like quote tweets it. And then the dogs attack. And it's like a, it's a mean. I smell something saying saying something stupid. Get them. That's exactly. It's wild. Because then you almost like can't stop yourself for.

fucking just like getting on there and joining in. But it's amusing to see like as soon as they say something stupid, like you see a list of big owners jump in and just grill. Yeah. It's the best thing ever. It's it is great. I love the standard that everybody's held to. And like if you can endure that,

if you can then look at responses to if you get that flack and you can endure it and look at it and go, okay like what's what's actually behind this is it is it bullshit or is it did i do something that was totally off base if you can get through that then you can you can go a long way in bitcoin just in in having that and it extrapolates out to the rest of your life right like if you can endure the criticism and then take the good criticism the stuff that actually makes you improve yourself and use it to iterate as opposed to just becoming defensive. I think that's that's a good trait to have.

And Bitcoin definitely gave me thicker skin than I used to have. That's for sure. It's also real and honest and supportive. Like let's discard, let's say 10, 20% of people who are just being mean for no reason, they can go fuck themselves. They have no value to the conversation. But the other part of it is, is it's honest feedback.

And almost nowhere in life do you get that, right? We're taught culturally to be, I mean, politically correct is what we call it now, but we kind of shy away from any amount of conflict. And what does that do? You're actually lying to your friends and your family. And we become such pussies. We can't actually say what we mean because the hard thing, the true thing is hard to say.

And oh my God, the chat is loving Timmy right now. He's the boss, man. He's the boss. feel kind of bad right now. I think you might legit be sleeping, but we're just going to roll with it, guys.

I feel bad I screenshoted the chat and posted on it. I don't want to stand, man. I've almost polished off this Twixir, man. Like, we've got to go. It's all good. I, let's just, well, I'm also Irish and Scottish, but I weigh, like,

literally almost 70 pounds. Don't talk yourself. Do you? I get. You weigh 150 pounds, Shinobi? How tall are you? Let's just say it is really hard for me to put, like, mass on and keep it. All right. I'm 6.3 and I'm 180.

I thought I was thin. Brandon, what was the last thing you're saying there? We're all pushing. Another good point. Yeah, okay. The point is that because we're politically correct, we beat around the bush. We don't say things honestly. And the thing about that is you think you're doing yourself.

You actually hurt people. Exactly, exactly. You think you're doing the right thing by not bringing up conflict, but in fact, the exact opposite is true. The hard truth is important. You have to give your friend a point. You have to give your family a point. You just made me think of like an idol of mine,

which sort of nowhere longer is Kevin O'Leary, okay? Kevin O'Leary. So I grew up like for years before, before Kevin O'Leary became big on like on Shark Tank and in the U.S. He was on Canadian Dragonsden. Remember that? sessions like he was a big boy in the wagon stand before he got really big

in the US and became a big swinging dick like a big famous guy I love that guy because I would watch that show I always wanted to start a little small business when I was younger I was like that's so cool what are these people doing I love seeing their inventions he would be ruthless he'd be ruthless to people

but he would tell them his truth whether it was the truth or his truth he would tell him his opinion and I was like man this guy's the best you don't see guys like this you don't see guys that are cutthroat your idea is shit because of this

rip their dreams down on live TV right like just rip them down ruthless he made a name for himself for doing that and he became famous went into a shark tank became famous now he's like hating on bitcoin which is sad to me to see

because I was like this guy's the fucking boss like I love this guy and now he's like clean coins and yeah ethical coins and all this stuff. I'm like, dude, you just totally ruined your image. I hope you'll eventually, you know, come to the good side and figure it out. He'll figure it out.

He'll figure it out because I feel like he's one of the good guys generally, but he's also a guy wanting to make money. But he's one of the, he's where you're saying. Like Bitcoiners, what I consider Bitcoiners are ruthless. They don't sugarcoat anything. if you go out and do something silly, stupid, even to say something stupid misstep, you're getting called out. And it's not because people are, you're right.

You mentioned like the people that are just like constantly just negative. Like, you know, we've seen those people. There's people like most of us, I think like everyone on this chat are like, we're actually just, this is constructive criticism. Like this is like what we think. We might be wrong, but like we're like, this is what we think. And, you know, we're going to give. of a Tia, like if you misstep and like say you're an idiot. And, uh, but don't like take it to heart.

Learn like, like if it were if it's the truth, like, like absorb it and be better next time. And you're right. That's why like Bitcoin is not going to lose because we got like, it just attracts the best people that are willing to be these non-politically correct, just ruthless. It doesn't matter what it means to us to not be your friend. Like we're just going to tell you what we think. In the end, honestly, I think it's going to like, Brandon, Shinobi, I actually have never met Timmy before. I would love to know him more. BTC sessions. Like, in my mind, you guys got a sick reputation, like a sick reputation. Like, I would, if we were going to do business, I wouldn't need to know, I wouldn't need a credit application to give you credit. I'd be like,

I already know things about you, like from peripherally, like listening to you guys that like, It would just be a, you get full credit. Like I just like, I know your reputations. And that's why, like, I think that's the thing that that differentiates this industry from others. Like it's just, especially in the mining space, man, like, it's such a scammy space. My only goal, my only goal is like we try to provide a good service. My only goal is to not fuck any of your customers anytime and absorb the cost of that because I know the reputation thing. It's the only thing that's going to carry us forward forward.

like a long, long time because the Fiat method of bailing out and like getting bailouts and like equity raises and stuff doesn't work. Like it's a reputational thing. Yeah. I, I,

if you know, if you know what I'm getting at. There's a, there's a different ethos and it's coming back. Yes. I get, we get like my, my, like, online like it's pretty much me and Adam like Denver Bitcoin.

I have other sales guys that aren't as online but I mean we get business because like well I think we build a good product but it's a reputation thing like it's people want to work with people that you know that won't fuck you especially in this space like I get I've had suppliers mining is a weird space like I've had suppliers that I worked with for like literally years all of a sudden screw us like so I had built up you know I thought they were a reputable supplier they screwed us because just the market changes like ASICs get pricey faster. They can't compensate us for the shit they sent us. And it just burns bridges down, whereas like I feel like the long game is you can never,

ever, under any circumstance, you don't need a legal contract. You just have to be good faith business, not screw somebody, eat the cost of your own mistake. Your reputation will live on and it will carry you to a place like you'll never get no matter what kind of contracts you get, no matter what kind of like Fiat backing you get. I feel like our company, we've never, I don't think we've ever screwed a customer. We've fucked up like a bunch of times. I've shipped guys stuff that was unstable,

like in stable A6s. I bring them back at our cost, replace them with something that works. Don't fuck anyone over. It's a small space. It's all reputation. That's the way it used to be, I think, like in my mind,

that's the way it used to be before the Fiat standard. I could buy a minor off of Reddit with no escrow from a random person and actually have the ASIC show up and not get screwed and make the money that I thought it was. Was it because, like, you had a big handle, like, people knew who you were, or was it because, like, you bought off a reputable seller? It was just because it was a dude who didn't fucking screw me. He's an honest dude. And I will never forget that. I would not be in this space right now. if that dude is not an honest dude

because I would have just... He was on Bitcoin talk or something or Reddit and had a rep, right? He had a rep. That's it. There was no legal, probably a legal contract, right? You just trusted.

Fisher, there's a comment here, Fisher J, character and integrity. And so like when you're talking about Bitcoin versus Fiat versus also shitcoins, like that seems to be the separating ethos where Bitcoin is perfectly, aligned with trying to get the best character and integrity out of everybody, because that's

what works best for an unforgivably sound money. If you don't have those attributes, then who's going to extend credit via Bitcoin? You just straight up wouldn't. Who's going to deal with you? Who's going to trust you in that way, shape, or form? It brings back truth and it brings back characteristics of personalities that that people actually want to deal with and that's, I don't see that in the alt coin space.

I don't see that in the Fiat space for damn sure. And it's refreshing to see that come back. I doubt that any shit coiners lose sleep over like failing to deliver something for like their client. Like when we, when we like, we've gone through problems where like our suppliers fuck us.

So we end up screw. like we end up letting our customers down on delivery timings like i literally can't sleep for weeks knowing that like our reputation's at risk over over something that was whether it's in our control or out of control or just poor planning it's like uh it's to me the only way to do business in this industry like bitcoin mining is a weird thing where it's like like you have to try i've been scanned multiple times and i'm like really conservative on how i who i work with i still get get scammed. Like, it's, it's wild. So it's, it's an industry, like, in my mind that if we can't build up an amazing, you can be a Fiat max, you get infinite Fiat injection to your company and, like,

try to offer service and, like, bail yourself out with more Fiat injection. But like, when you're, when you're actually a small business trying to, like, do it organically and get customers, you have to be super conservative, work really hard to, like, find the right suppliers and not screw it up. And no matter what happens, if you're going to make money on the sale and the service or not, you take the loss as opposed to fuck your customer up if you can do it that way. It's better to make your customer whole, take a loss because as soon as one guy, like, publicly, like, says, like, like, these guys fucked us. Like, it's, you know, we have to dispute what not. You're done. Like, you're just fucking done in this space. Like, this space is so small.

and I think I look at it like it starts with mining like mining is sort of the the start of the distribution point of the coin so you have to I have a theory that like if you can just build an insanely reputable business in mining you don't have to have any legal contracts you just like word of your word is going to just carry you and let you get you could sell ASICs at a price at a premium just on your word because you know your customer your customer knows that if they buy off you, nothing is going to go wrong. And that's not

something you normally see in the Fiat world. Everyone's like buying insurance and shit. You can't even get insurance in this fucking industry, like in Bitcoin mine. You can't even get it. They will, I could talk about that for a while. They're censoring Bitcoin miners to a big degree

and it's affecting our business. Shinobi's got a pushback. I can feel it. One complaint doesn't burn shit. I'm sorry. Do we not remember Cobra in 2017 shrieking how long mining is a scam for like six months? I do remember that. What's this?

What's this? Why is 10% of the entire network using over ASIC boost, which only how long hardware supports? What is that a good? Hmm. Fair enough. Okay, guys, I have to start wrapping this because I have... Just leave. Just leave. Can I give a 30-second point to Steve's?

I'm having a lot of fun. Why are you controlling this conversation? Just leave. You could just like, you could actually just go do what you want and leave your screen empty. I can imagine what I would be here. You want to go have fun with your wife and like your kids and stuff? I'm having a good time. I'd come back.

Tim would still be here. Tim is still going to be here. As long as Shonobi and Brandon want to hang out, go do your thing. Let's pause. It to Brandon. What does he have to say here? This is the best podcast I've ever been on. Okay?

And end this. For Steve here, what you're describing is you're seeing the world through a Bitcoin lens. You have long-term thinking, reputation matters. You're living in the future. Okay. I feel like I'm living in like 2077 where it's all like just this guy. Like this guy's got a name. This company's got a name.

It's 2077. It's not 2021. Agreed. And most people are living in the present or the past, which is short termism, right? Incentives lead them there. This is planned obsolescence. Just in time economy.

Get a new job every six months. Doesn't fucking matter. Just in time manufacturing. I fucking hate that. shit. Yeah, and we literally build things so that they break really soon so that we can sell them another one, right? Yeah. Everyone's steeped in Fiat. And so I think that's the major difference here is just and I think the number one thing is long-term thinking versus show-term thinking. And then also Bitcoin community puts a premium on reputation.

I am hitting the stampede. Who is that? Bring that. There's a there's a dude from Edmonton that was, I just saw him at a Bitcoin meet up the other day. Anyways, he's asking for hitting Calgary Stamped, which started today. I may, I'm not sure. Benny, are there are there Calgary Bitcoin meetups? Like, I know like, there are. There's one every two weeks. I'll put you, I'll let you know.

Why am I not there? I don't know what the fuck are you doing with your life, man. You guys are in these weird social circles. You won't invite your boys. I don't know, man. I thought you were busy. Because I came from Saskatchew. Yeah, I thought, I thought you were, I thought you were,

showering or something. I thought you're busy. You guys flung with the sheep dogs? Towers Comics. Let's go. Let's go out. I'm taking you out for some beers. Perfect.

We'll do it. Guys, I gotta, I gotta wrap this up because I have a friend's birthday. I am, they like... Me, Timmy, Shnow being Brandon, don't care.

Your viewers don't care. You're here all night. Go do your thing, Just leave your monitor on. I'll just, I'll just leave it. I'm going to just check the shit for a while. I'm sure,

I'm sure my, my family, my daughter will come in and start playing with the, with all, all the stuff here. I'm just, gentlemen, I've got to say,

it's a pleasure. I'm, I'm relieved that Tim is getting an excellent nap here. I can't wait for him to rewatch and relisten to this conversation because it was excellent. He's going to get, his wife's going to come in and like, crack him in that.

You know what? I'm going to say to everybody, there's like, there's a bunch of people watching out. What I would like you guys to do is everybody, Tim's Twitter is in the notes. I want you all to go follow him. And then I want you to regale him with your tales of,

of times when you've had a bunch of drink that you didn't anticipate the outcome. I'm literally about to get there if you keep going. Yeah. And that's, that's great. That's wonderful. And that's, partially what I'm also going to be partaking in because it's been a long time since I've been

out with some with some friends other than Miami was a bit of a mess but uh yeah I you know I I just wanted to say to all you guys I really appreciate you guys taking we two and a half hours normally these things are like hour and 15 minutes but we got chatting and it was a lot of fun and uh and I appreciate all of your time so um everybody watching of course uh all these guys uh the Twitter handles are in the the are in the uh i keep looking at timmy's fucking window and i'm like i know he's gonna wake up and be like what happened did it end when i would do i say goodbye i just have like a thing in my head where it's like the light just keeps getting dimmer and dimmer in the shatt and then his white

just comes up cracks in the back i know it's it's gonna happen he was going to make it till nine o'clock it's only 530 pacific right now just to be clear where he is all right bennie you guys all right bannie you guys You got to invite us all back. Indeed. We will do this again. Maybe we can, one of these days when we're all in a similar locale, I mean, Steve, we could just do a live one ourselves, but from the same location. But yeah, guys, I appreciate all your time.

I will speak for Tim in saying that he is a bestselling author. He does have a book on Amazon, though he advises you not to purchase it. And if you'd like to follow him, his Twitter handle is indeed in these show notes. Do follow him. Tell him, you know what? I've seen in the comments here that Timmy really carried the show. And I'd like you to let him know that you really enjoyed his input because I really did have fun in the beginning of the show with him. And I'm glad that he was at least here with us in spirit.

But I will talk about it. And they were good thoughts. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. I really want to meet Timmy in real life. Yeah. I think, you know, we'll do this in real life again. and we'll just, we'll give him like half shots or something when we go over around.

But I'm going to toss it down the line to the rest of you guys. If you get one more time, just let people know, again, who you are, where they can find you. And that's it. Shinobi, you can take it away first. I'm a random autist who spent way too much time learning about Bitcoin. I do a small podcast with some friends called Block Digest, which I swear to God, we'll get back on a normal schedule this weekend. and yeah, I don't know.

Awesome. See me here. I love it. Oh, yeah, there he is. Steve, you could go. You can sub in. Shinobi, I can't wait to come on your podcast when you're ready to invite me. Oh, dude, you stole the thought out of my head that was going to fly to you.

Let's go on there and get, I'll get another bottle of rye and we'll go wild. It's actually the funest podcast. I've been on, Benny. Like, I don't usually drink on podcasts, so. Maybe that's your problem. Went loose, you know. But my name's Steve. I love Bitcoin.

Follow me in Twitter, S.G. Barber. Love you guys. Awesome. And BQ, take it away. What do you do? What do people can find you? Yeah, yeah. First off, thanks for having me, guys.

I had a night plan, sacrifice tonight. I'm happy I made that decision. It was great hanging with you guys. You can find me on Twitter, B. Quidum. And then lastly, if any of the Canadians need to escape out of their country, you can meet me in the Boundary Waters. What state are you in? I won't ask you anything more. That's a beautiful state.

Northern Minnesota is amazing. Boundary waters. Same as Quetico in Ontario. Fantastic land there. Nice. You're coming to Minnesota, Steve? I'm coming to meet you. Let's do it.

We'll do it. We'll all do it. Awesome. Well, gents, thank you very much. I'm going to cut your audio video here, but I appreciate you all and thank you for being on. And I will see you soon. Steve, let's grab a beer. Let's maybe hit a Stampede beer.

I'm walking over your house right now, bro. Perfect. Ten minutes away. All right. I'll see you guys soon. Thank you very much. And everybody, that is watching. I thank you guys for being here

two and a half hours if you got here at the beginning and stay through you made it longer than Tim and we love him for it so you should go and follow Tim immediately on Twitter you should follow all the guests on Twitter but you should especially follow Tim and give him some kind words

tell them how much you love him how much you enjoyed his enthusiasm because he's a trooper and I've been in that boat before where you get excited you have a drink and then shit happens. So I enjoyed it.

But anyways, guys, thank you so much for watching. As always, like, subs, share. All of those things are so important. They really help get more eyeballs on the show. If you want to hit up the previously mentioned sponsors, they are linked down below,

Bit by Lead and Keystone, BitRefil and Bill Fottle over at Privacy Pros. And if you really, really loved what you saw, you can always hit me up with a Bitcoin tip via my strike page. strike.me slash BTC sessions. You can go over there.

You can type in whatever amount you like. And then when you hit the tip button, it will provide you with either a lightning invoice or a regular Bitcoin QR code, which you can shoot off. By the way, if you haven't tried Strike, it's pretty badass. Anyways, guys, thank you so much for being here, as always.

And I will see you guys next time for your daily session. Have a good one. Hottle by Bitcoin. No.