BTC Sessions - WHY ARE WE BULLISH? Eric V Stacks, Keysa, Financial Physics ep401

Episode Date: March 9, 2024

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What's going on everybody? Welcome to the show. Another Friday, another episode of Why Are We Bullish? Very excited to have everybody here this Friday. We've got a returning guests, a couple brand new guests, and I'm very excited to have them all. Of course, I hope you guys have been having a great week. It's been interesting, seeing things kind of tap up against previous highs before

the having for the first time ever. So we'll see how things go. But nonetheless, we're here. This is live. Anything can happen. So I defer to my friend Bill here. Live, okay. We'll do it live.

Do it live. I can, I'll write it and we'll do it live. The thing sucks. If you have not already, please do like, subscribe, share, all those things. They help a ton getting this content in front of our more eyeballs.

I am Ben with the BTC Sessions. This is your daily session. Before we bring in our guests, let's take a look at where we are in the market right now. I'm pulling up timechain calendar. . I can't talk today. And simultaneously, I'm pulling up the live chat

on the right hand side of the screen. Everything you say in the live chat will be live for the viewers to see for better or worse from here on end. Anyways, back to timechain calendar.com. We're sitting at $68,416 per Bitcoin. A single US dollar will snag you 1,462 sats. In terms of on-chain fees, next block, you're looking at 20 sats for byte,

and the Mempool is purging anything south of around 5.5s. Sats per byte. And in terms of Bitcoin mined, 19.65 million of them, that's 93.57% of the total supply. If you're sorting through the tutorials on the channel, you're not quite there. You need a little bit of extra handholding. You can reach out to me at my website, BTCSessions.ca, and book me for private one-on-one education sessions.

Shout out to sponsor the show, hoddle, hoddle.com. If you're buying Bitcoin and you have some priorities in mind that include peer-to-peer, instant cell custody, no K-Y-C. This is a great place to be. You can sign up with just an email address once you're there. Choose a currency payment method and an amount. start viewing offers immediately. They also have peer to peer lending with no re-hypification. Check them out. Links are down below. Now, when you do get your hands on some Bitcoin, you're going to want to secure it with some of the best hardware on the market. I love CoinKite,

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for you. Last couple of shoutouts, Nunchuk has you covered with mobile multi-sig and assisted multi-sig with her Nunshuck program. This basically allows you to set up a multi-sig vault on your phone. You can use things like the tap signer, cold card, and plenty of other hardware options. Once it's all set up, it has baked in inheritance planning so that your Bitcoin gets to your next of kin, if anything should happen to you. You can also set it all up with no K.YC. You don't need to give up your personal information to set it up and have it work for you. You can check out my tutorial and check them out at nunchuk.io. And finally, shout out to start nine, your sovereign computing solution. We saw earlier this week pushes to impose KYC on

cloud computing on AI tools, on all of that stuff. That could be something that's coming down the pike. Anyway, Start9 allows you to do your sovereign computing, not just run your Bitcoin stack, but your personal data as well. So these are plug-and-play devices. You can run Bitcoin Core, Lightning Node, Mempool, files, passwords, photos, Noster relays and clients and AI tools as well. You can check them out at Start9.com.

They've got devices all the way from entry level, all the way up to what I'm running, which is the Start9 server pure. If you want to grab any of those, start9.com. And if you're looking at the pure, you can use code BTC sessions with a plus sign to get 18% off. Anyways, enough of my rambling. All those links are down below. But let's get our guests in the room. I want to welcome to the stage Axel, aka Financial Physics.

I want to welcome Eric V. Stacks, a returning guest. And of course, a fantastic educator, Kisa, welcome. Welcome all of you. Thank you for being a part of the show. I'm going to give myself a little swap around here, get ourselves all sorted. But let's go down the line and let's do a quick set of intros. Who are you? What do you do? And I'll toss it to Eric, our returning guests first. Dude, can you give yourself a little intro? Yeah. So I'm Eric V Stax. I'm a career cannabis farmer in Northern California. I have been a cannabis farmer for the last 15 years um and i've been a bit coiner for the last five six years or so awesome i i love it man and uh i thoroughly enjoyed last time you're on not too long ago either there was like a couple of months back maybe yeah two months ago at the most month and a half maybe yeah geez i think you're the quickest returning guests i've had in quite some times so but thanks for having me yeah uh i'm

I'm happy to have you back. So we'll bump it down to Axel. Dude, thank you for being here. You've been dropping some interesting stuff on X that I've come across lately. But give yourself a little intro, let people know who you are, what you do. I'm Axel. I'm a professional. I'm a business owner.

And I do a bunch of different things. So I currently own a trucking company and a generator company. So, you know, for electricity. and then I do videos kind of randomly when I get an opportunity. And as far as in the Bitcoin world, I heard about it in early 2010 when somebody who didn't really know how to explain to me said, yeah, Bitcoin is like the Hollywood Stock Exchange. And I ignored it until about 2016 because that's what was explained to me. And then after finding that out, you know, since then changed it and realized like I really

wish that I would have had it explained a bit better early on. I would have picked it up a bit faster. Yeah, that's fair. It's, I mean, we do need solid education to help people along their way, but glad you made your way here. And I've been thoroughly enjoying some of the stuff that you've been driving lately. I'm sure we'll get into that in a little bit. But thanks for, thanks for being here.

Oh, you're welcome. My pleasure. Yeah, no worries. And I'll toss it finally down to Kesa. Thank you. being here and i'll let you give yourself an intro as well uh let people know who you are what you do all right can you hear me then okay good so yeah i'm kisa i'm speaking out of the void today since i couldn't figure out how to get my my profile picture avatar thing up there um yeah i

first touched bitcoin well i didn't someone told me about it in 2012 and i i i really try to figure figure it out, couldn't at all, so I just thought, okay, it's too much, left it till 2017 when someone close to me suggested I look at it and pretty much been just diving, like diving like crazy down the rabbit hole. Every book I wrote a couple of years ago, it basically came out of an orange-pilling letter. I was starting and the letter just went on and on and on and I thought, okay, it's a book, and that's what since then I've just pretty much pretty much all day, every day, studying, learning, listening, can and run a bunch of spaces. And yeah, now I work with Bitcoin trade.

We'll get into that a little bit. So I'm really happy to be here. Thank you so much. Yeah, no worries. And I do thoroughly enjoy the spaces that you put on. They're great educational resources for newcomers coming into Bitcoin as well. So thank you for running those. Thank you. Yeah, no worries. And so with that, we're going to dive into the show. Anybody watching that is unfamiliar with the show, this is why are we bullish, simple

premise. Each one of us has come with a reason for being bullish in and around Bitcoin. And that can take many different forms. It might be a news item. It might be a personal experience. It might be something a little bit more specific, like a video that we saw, an app, we used, a device we tried. It can really be anything.

And so the flow of the show is, number one, somebody's going to drop a reason for being bullish. That's their chance to rant and get whatever they have off their chest. Number two, we're all going to riff on that together. We're going to ask questions, give comments, go down whatever rabbit holes we feel like. And finally, number three, we're going to rotate to the next person until we've all had to turn. So reason, riff, rotate, three hours, simple enough.

So I'm going to kick us off today and drop my reason. And to kind of get us started, I think my reason around being bullish this week, and this comes in the context of having just returned from the conference in Madeira. So they had Bitcoin Atlantis there. Madeira, anybody unfamiliar, is an autonomous zone off the coast of Portugal and the Atlantic Ocean. And this all kind of came about because there's one guy named Andre in Madeira. And he became this one-man mission to kind of bring Bitcoin to Madeira and change this island that he calls home into a bit of a mecca for Bitcoiners and build out kind of a local circular economy as well. And so my roundabout reason for being bullish is a lot more Bitcoiners are starting to put a focus. on building locally and building communities where we can kind of rely on each other and in a cohesive way quasi-opt-out of the existing system,

obviously, or maybe kind of, I guess, exist in parallel with it. And so what I saw in Madeira was I got on the ground, first of all, a ton of Bitcoin is coming into town, which is great. But the more interesting thing to me is the fact that this one guy was not only able to attract everybody here to have this event, but he's been putting in the work along with others on the ground to get local merchants to get interested in Bitcoin as well. And the reason I could tell that is because, I mean, personal experience, but also there's a tool called BTTMAP.org. And it gives you a lay of the land of any local merchants that are currently accepting Bitcoin

and using it. And when you're in Funcial, kind of the main city there, you open up that map and it's just, it just populates with all these little shops and all these different merchants and people offering services on a local level that are all accepting Bitcoin. And this is kind of the work of this one guy that took on this. this task of making these changes. And it echoes back to similar efforts that I'm trying to do here in Calgary, my home city. And so I'm, you know, we've got something called the Saturday Sat Market, which we're championing. And so here in Calgary, we're trying to do effectively, again,

a local circular economy. And we started with the local Bitcoiners. We went to. went to the local Bitcoin meetup, we said, hey, we all obviously see value in Bitcoin as a way to kind of store the fruits of our labor without it being debased by anybody. But if that's the case, wouldn't you rather than having to go through trust of third parties to purchase it all the time, wouldn't you rather have a mechanism through which you could just earn it for something that you're already good at? We all have skills. We all have jobs. We all have perhaps businesses and goods and services that we offer, why would we not then also accept something that we consider to be better than dollars, especially our useless Canadian moose shekel that we have up here? So

in that sense, we started kind of building and we built out this local market and we're doing it quarterly. We've got another one coming up here on the 23rd of March, which I'm really looking forward to. And so yeah, we basically build this out. And I see a lot more people pushing for things like this. I see a lot more people saying, let's build ground up and try to, in my opinion, make it so we are resistant to top down, top down forces that may not like what we're doing. I think that's kind of the only way that you can truly become, I don't want to say it as far as ungovernable because people can always be made examples of. But it's really difficult to stamp out literally everything when you just have a large group of people that know each other and are willing to freely interact together and exchange goods and services in a money other than the one that the government can control and print at will. And so, yeah, I'm very excited for what I saw in Madeira.

I'm very excited for what, you know, myself and others are trying to champion here at home. And I'm going for the first time I'm going to El Salvador to go see what's going on there. And I'm not so much interested in the top down, you know, stamp of approval from the government, although that's nice and it helps things and makes things easier. I'm more interested in the bottom up approach of what, of what prompted all this, which was. like a small town and an initiative that kind of birthed it all. And I think Bitcoin is inherently bottom up. It did not ask permission when it started. And so I don't think that we should defer to asking permission for it to continue to exist. So before I kind of open it up for everybody to comment, what I will freely shill is if you're in Calgary and you want to come out to the next market,

It is happening March 23rd, and we're having a Saturday market. And if you want to be a merchant, then you can go ahead and reach out to Dave at bitcoins.com. He's here in Calgary as well. And yeah, sign up to be a merchant. It's free. If you want to come, it's free to show up. We're literally just trying to build an awesome community of bitcoins that we can lean on and create good relationships with.

So if you're in Calgary, if you're in Alberta, if you're in a neighboring province, hell, if you're halfway around the world, but you want to make the trip, please come. It's going to be an absolute blast. And yeah,

I can't wait to chat with you. So yeah, Dave at Bitcoinbrains.com. Anyways, guys, please do share this as well and we'll help build it out. But so I'm going to open it up to you guys. I'm excited about this ground up movement. And I do think that this.

ground up kind of peer to peer way of utilizing Bitcoin is the only way that if that exists, is the only way that can truly be resistant to that top down pressure. And maybe if we have that, we might not even get as much of that top down pressure. So I'm curious, your thoughts, your comments, whatever, wherever we want to go with it. So whoever wants to dive in, feel free. I guess I've been very very much following the development of all of these communities or know all of them at this point. But starting with Bitcoin Beach and then the next one I became really aware. And I remember just reposting everything he posted because I was so happy it was happening somewhere else.

Since then in the last couple of years, it's like been this, as I did that, I just popped in my mind, this like literal mycelial network just spreading out. Of course Brandon has written an article about that, but I wasn't even thinking of that. I just suddenly saw mycelial nodes just all connecting. And how in stop just kind of also just clicked into my mind right in that moment. Goodness me, we've gone stop. Like we know the Bitcoin network is unstoppable,

but then the circular community. And so a story about the butterfly in the cocoon and a caterpillar, rather, goes into a cocoon. It turns into this sort of and then, and I haven't studied the biology. I don't know if this is true, but I love it.

It turns into this mush, just like soupy mush thing. And then these new cells start popping just generating or whatever. And by that, mush, and then more of them still keep popping up. And then slowly, they start, like, and more and more. And then, of course, ultimately, they become the butterfly that emerges.

That vision of these communities, like, being those, they're called the, I forget, there's a kind of special cell. So the communities are like these cells, and they're just popping up and more. and create the new world. So I just want to share that. That's really cool. I enjoy that. And I love the shout out to Brandon Quidam and his, again, Bitcoin is the meselium of money, I believe it was called.

That was a great, great article. I really enjoyed it. But, yeah, I mean, again, and I think that speaks to the, the, I guess censorship resistant nature of it when you get these pockets popping up everywhere, you can't really slap down on anything there where you have little communities in various nations across the globe. And they're just kind of naturally popping up. I think one of the most bullish things over the past number of years is the proliferation

of all these local Bitcoin communities where people are just starting to get together and say, hey, like we all have, we're in some way like, minded, why don't we get together and build something together? Bitcoin's very unique in that as a bitconer, you can kind of just waltz into literally any town or city on earth and say, hey, where the Bitcoiners at? And then you've got somebody to go have a beer with. And you've literally got, you get past the small talk phase by just by virtue of knowing that the two of you are Bitcoiners. And you kind of can create a deeper connection a lot quicker just based on that. pre-requisite knowledge of each other. So it's a pretty unique thing, in my opinion.

Eric, I'm curious to hear your when you were in your job, did you kind of get that vibe that there's there's something brewing there? Yeah, it's um yeah. Well, first off, being around other bitcoins is a special thing, especially Bitcoin only meetups because you can connect with somebody and you have so many of like, I don't know, your base layer values are aligned. So you're conversing and meeting somebody for the first time, but you know that half or more of what you believe about the world is the same. So it's this super fun thing. It's like, I don't know, we all speak to it like Normiland.

Like it's super hard to deal with people who don't understand Bitcoin because they get lost in the, I don't know, all of the details around, I don't know, what I call the old world, the pre-bitcoin world, the pre-discovery of true scarcity, the pre-discovery of inviolable property, right? And so people who don't understand that, it's, I don't know, in some sense, it's like the conversations are a little dull and boring because you want to just communicate to them like, hey, Bitcoin changes so much of this. And until we can, I don't know, integrate that, we don't even know what our real problems are. And, yeah, the energy is really is high. I think Bitcoiners because of the, the time. preference you know people have something long-term to look forward to and so on average they're healthier and they're more optimistic and for me that's i don't know it's really empowering and energizing

to be around such a large group of people that have so many aligned values that are so optimistic about the future especially when things are so dark in the world today there's such political divide there's so many challenging things going on and it's really easy to get sucked into that and one of the things that I really love about Jeff Booth's work is he mentions all the time. He's like, look, he spends all this time in the new system. He like slowly but surely ended up getting all in on Bitcoin. He works in on Bitcoin. He's got ego death capital.

And he mentions all the time. He doesn't yell at the old world because it just strengthens the old world or the old system. He focuses on the new system. And that's a pretty, I don't know, inspiring thing. And another thing that I was pretty blown away with in Madeira, it was the first time that I had used lightning. You know, I'm been a hoddler and I buy and I treat Bitcoin as my Treasury Reserve asset. And dude, it was mind blowing.

You know, I asked you, hey, what wallet do I use? You're like, hey, you know, use Phoenix. You gave me a few options. I download the Phoenix wallet. I send a couple hundred dollars from a strike. I open a channel. And the payments happen faster than they do with my credit card. I got an American Express and I'm paying for my hotel and I'm paying for my rental car.

And it's like it's glitchy. They're having trouble with, you know, accepting the payment. They're like, oh, it's not working. I'm like, I assure you there's fucking money in this. You know, this clunky old system. And we go to the conference and it's just, hey, you know, are you going to use Bitcoin, boom, screen. You know, you hit the QR code. And it's fucking instant.

Yeah. And so it's so it's funny to me all the people that are like on mainstream media talking about how, oh, Bitcoin, you can't buy. with you can't do this with it. It's like yeah, you can. And it works quite well, actually. Yeah, pretty impressive. I'm going to say to that point, I brought Lisa to a conference a couple years ago and all the merchants had lightning set up. But the payments were just, they kept failing. And I was like, wait a couple of years, you know, you go and it was work. And then this time, it was literally impressive. Boom, boom, boom, everything. So impressive. Really was. Yeah.

Yeah, a lot can change in a short amount of time. And it's, again, to your point, you know, some people, Bitcoin is many things to many people. And for some, it's a mechanism to secure the fruits of their labor well into the future. And for others, it's a way to escape kind of top-down control, you know, repressive regimes, things like that. And then for others, it's a, you know, a community-led initiative where we can all actually, you know, spend something in that we all know that we kind of equally value. And it encourages vendors to create better quality products because if you don't, then Nick, nobody's going to spend their sats with you. Again, there's actually, there's some weight to spending Bitcoin because you know that it's worth something. it's finite and so when you spend bitcoin on something crappy you make a mental note of that and you're

like don't don't buy that again whereas you know you buy some trinkety shit at Walmart or or uh you know some bad some crappy cheap furniture and it breaks what do you do again you go and you buy some more crappy cheap trinkety shit to replace it um i don't do that with bitcoin i tend to steer clear of that so it just change your man mannerisms and the way you think about spending money as well. So, but Axel, I do want to toss to you as well. And I'm curious, kind of your take on, I guess kind of these smaller Bitcoin communities, if you're kind of privy to what's going on with them or, and just your general take of how people use Bitcoin day to day, how you use it versus how you've seen others and just your thoughts

and around this. Well, in my case, I have a, I haven't been to a lot of the Bitcoin community stuff. Most everything that I've done has been because just industry-wise, you know, what I do for work, I'm very busy. I have, you know, I mean like, and you kind of, like I mentioned, I think in my, my course, when I communicate with you this morning was just pointing out like that a lot of stuff in my world can change on the fly. And it's sort of like being a fireman.

you got to go where you know where the money is and um at least for the time being um you frankly you covered a lot of it uh in fact it's the one that what you had mentioned before which was um the idea of of people wanting to have um almost a parallel economy which is a question that i got from a from a follower some time ago and i thought about it for like three weeks of how I wanted to answer that question because that's a really deep question and there's a lot of implications. So as to your question as far as like what's been my experience, my experience has really just been converting dollars to SATs and have been for many years now, only because there

isn't really any other options. I don't really buy into the stock market a whole bunch. I think most of it is turned into a glorified casino at this point. None of the fundamentals make any sense. And the technical traders out there and the program traders, you're not going to beat Goldman Sachs. I mean, you're just not. They've got, you know, they've got it down to, you know,

tens of tens of a millisecond, you know, scalping the markets. It's like, you're not going to beat those guys. It's just, they're going to beat the house. So mine is is somewhat limited, at least in that scope. though my my bullish reason if you're wanting to know what that was it's just well let's let's hold on that for a second i know i know i don't talk it too early but yeah so i mean yeah i mean you're basically saying that your your experience this far is um is again you're you're it's a mechanism for you to save the fruits of your labor well into the future is that yeah uh that's that's what i've

been using it for. Now, that's not what I see Bitcoin as. That's just what is available at least right now because small business-wise, you know, as small businesses continue to dwindle, and again, if you've seen anything that I do, I talk about small business quite a bit. And as those continue to dwindle, you know, that's be, and I think it's because of all the subsidies, it's, I mean, there's so many different aspects to, to the larger companies that they can afford to lose, you know, 20%, almost indefinitely, because they can just keep printing money and keep mailing them out and give them special interest rate loans and on and on and so to compete with that in the business world is near impossible for small businesses. So, you know, I think

that more small businesses would be switching over by default to things like Bitcoin very quickly if there were more and more and more of them. Yeah. Yeah. So it's one of the things that might give small businesses and edge. I mean, we've got, we're kind of seeing a, and I won't say that it's a small business at this point by any means, but we're kind of seeing it play out with with Microstrategy right now where, you know, Michael Saylor had a business that was a decent size, but number one, that was actually driving a profit. and it wasn't just, you know, it wasn't just being held up by, by, you know, continuous, like VC raises and things like that where there's no actual product and there's no actual income and there's. So, you know, he was able to leverage that and then put his treasury asset as his treasury asset becomes Bitcoin. And he's benefited massively from that. You can't

have some shit company that has no profit do that because they'll never survive. a bear market, whereas he flourished in a bear market because he was able to do that. On a smaller scale in Canada, there's a restaurant chain called Tahini's, and they're based out of Ontario and Toronto. And so they started using Bitcoin as their treasury asset and the growth of their business, in part, I think, due to that, because they started doing it back in. I want to say 2020. But yeah, they started using Bitcoin as their treasury asset.

And like the success of that brand has been incredible. It's expanded so much in a few short years. And obviously because they do a good job with the business as well. But they wouldn't be able to have that type of a treasury if they weren't profitable. And so I think small businesses, if they're doing a good job. And if they're one, providing value to others, two, spending less than they earn and three saving in a money that can't be debased it's it's a winning it's a it's a it's a it's a winning guide of a set of of of guiding principles not just for individuals

but for businesses as well um so i i don't know seems to be working pretty well yeah absolutely yeah i think it might oh go ahead go ahead oh i i the only thing i would add is just to say i think that it where we really see something is when, is when they don't, when those same small businesses don't have to convert back from Bitcoin to dollars to, to deal with suppliers. And in the words,

so that vertical integration aspect that, that's kind of missing for most small businesses, whether they own their property or their building or their business that sits inside the building, you know, if they're constantly having to convert back to dollars to pay rents and what have you, It's like it, once that's overcome, then I think that we're going to see some serious shit. Yeah.

And I'm glad you brought that up because I guess it brings everything back to that kind of bottom up aspect. And the reason I say that is the whole reasoning for me doing kind of a local market here is quasi selfishly. I just, I've been living on a Bitcoin standard since 2020. and I'm using some services to kind of jump through hoops to make that possible. But if I can go locally and know my ranchers and farmers nearby and get my beef and my eggs and my, you know, know the baker down the street and know my barber and all this stuff and be able to pay my plumber with Bitcoin, all of which are now at our local market, that prevents me from having to convert back to dollars ever, guys. just can sit in Bitcoin and I don't even have to use those mechanisms to jump through hoops to make it possible. It's just I've got a community and we're on the same monetary standard and it grows from there. So that's why I hope to see more of it. I think it's an exciting time to be a bitcoiner if you can

meet your local bitcoinsers and build something like this. But I do want to kind of put a bow on my topic because I want to kind of get things rolling here. I'll just, I'll just finish it out by saying, if you're interested in doing something like this, then just start. Go to your local meetup, start talking to Bitcoiners, start talking to people that are already interested in Bitcoin that already have skills and businesses and focus on them first

and then build out from there. And yeah, if you're in Calgary, come to the sat market. But anyways, we're going to rotate out. I think Kisa, I'm probably going to go to you first, if that's cool with you. And I'm going to, you are still there, right? I'm staring into the void. I want to make sure. I'm here.

Perfect, perfect. No worries, no worries. So, yeah, I'll toss it to you. I'm going to cue you up with the same question everybody's going to get, but why are you bullish? So, bullish. Actually, some of the things. You actually discussed key into it.

But what I was thinking about, you know, before the show, why, of course, there's so many apps or services or different projects that I'm really including the Bitcoin Trading Cards as this epic Trojan horse for education. But sort of beyond all of that or like foundational to all of that, really, is developers and the educators around the world. world that are growing exponentially every day, that are like as obsessed and passionate about Bitcoin as we are, and that are working today out, often without any pay of any kind of their Bitcoin work for years. And I just, like that for me is the gold here, that this is

global accessible to anybody to work on. And that they're like, and that they're like, know that they're out there, especially the developers, right, because I'm an educator, so I know what educators can do. But the developers, because that's work I can't do, I just know that they're more private and then more scale. Of course, we have sort of issues right now with some ideas about what I can kind of look like. But I sort of have this, trust in the sense that they are probably going to come forth these ideas and these tools and code is just never been written before and that's going to solve a lot of the problems that we can go to all that we want to get worried about and I just you know occasionally I go

down brought back out by that reminded that this is all happening and it's happening and it's like I said before, unstoppable and that they're obvious too, you know, and just that's one of the wonders of the internet is that this information has an internet connection and that people are making use of the information and they're teaching and it's just to me so exciting.

And then as long as well as a circle of educators, you know, every day on Twitter, you just see somebody new show up who's like to their whole community or they're creating their own materials their own website and just yeah

I think that's the thing that gives me the most hope it's like people realize that this important work of their lives and it's almost like well at least for me it's almost like there's not always that choice but it's at the same

in time it's like I'm being led and pulled forth for a this incredible brain and heart connection that I experience. And with anybody that I connect within the Bitcoin space. Just the most incredibly, intelligent, and caring people, although it's not always obvious that the outside of people, but ultimately people care.

And that's what I'm just doing this thing. And it's huge and it's organic and it's grassroots bottom part. Of course, that's just the most epic. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I agree with you. I think people are willing to, I mean, people are chomping at the bit to be involved in any way, shape, or form that they can. People, I think when they begin to understand what Bitcoin is and what it could

change in the world and they see some of the underlying problems as leading back to the monetary system and they realize there's there's the meme bitcoin fixes this but in a way you can kind of to a degree reason it does fix a lot of things it doesn't fix everything but but it fixes enough where people want to just dump all of their time and their effort and there's their real brain drain from other industries coming into Bitcoin in the Bitcoin space. And you pair that with people that are dead set on educating others about it and creating resources and everything for others to utilize, to level up and building tools. It's pretty exciting seeing how much that can compound over time, right?

Totally, totally. And to what you said there, it's like the fun. everything else. You know, I've been an activist in different phases and stages of my life. And finally, I realized that without fixing the money, the world is actually not going to fix the problems that people are spending mountains of time and pain and suffering to try and fix. And it doesn't get fixed. And that's because in the end, it's still tied back into this fake fear. debt system corruption and I can go on and on so yeah it's like it really is foundational feeling everything else I'm just so grateful that solution is here now it's here now I can't even believe it I didn't even imagine I was going to actually experience the solution so

yeah wow not you get to watch it slowly take place and then be mildly frustrated that it isn't fully embraced by everybody yet. Yeah. Yeah, but it's that low time preference, right? You just great, great, great grandchildren, really, truly. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. I maybe want to toss it over to Al Axel and I don't know if you want to jump in on any of this

and either just comment directly on something like he's said or kind of go on a tangent. But I'll kind of leave it up to you where you want to take it. Well, I guess if the question is the same, then what I think that we're seeing, this is just my take, is usually in the marketplace, you know, bad money comes in and it chases out good money. You know, good money goes and runs and hides because it's just in the case of gold and what have you. People just hoard it because it's bad money in the marketplace and it chased all the good money out. In the case of what we're doing here, this is fascinating because I don't know if there's ever been a time in human history where there's this groundswell of people that are really from the bottom up trying to use good money to flush bad money out. I don't know that that's ever happened.

Usually the bad money just collapses. It just, you know, and then, you know, you have a Roman Empire collapse and everything just falls apart. But in this case, we have, you know, a situation where with Bitcoin, you have something that can push bad money out of it if it's enticing enough. And that's going to be the trick, of course. I mean, as she points out, the education that's out there, the number of people that are talking about this. and the trick is going to be getting people out of the addiction of Fiat. That's the only, that's the only, because Fiat, you know, Fiat like fast food. It's, it's awesome, you know, at the moment.

It doesn't help you long term, but, you know, it's, but it fills a need, you know, at the moment. And it allows you to, to have, you know, the illusion of endless resources. And it works until it doesn't. And then, you know, then we have this, this whole, you know, all the people wanting to know why it is that nothing works anymore. It's like, well. which is the competency crisis issue.

Like, why are things not working? Well, because your money's not working. You know, when your money fails, your division of labor is right behind it. Because sooner or later, the guys who are doing all the goddamn work, they stop doing the work because their money doesn't buy them anything anymore. And that's just, you know, so there's, it's sort of the difference between the, you know, the middle class and the middleman class. Big difference.

There's a lot of people that are middlemen, but they're, you know, they're, they're not the actual middle class that we would think of in the, in the, in the classical sense, the people that kind of work their way up from the bottom and that they're being paid for their knowledge now. That's, that's your middle class because they're, you know, so I'm a little all over the place on that. But I mean, it's, but it's, it is all connected to it because that, at least that's what I'm seeing is a number of people that are finally starting to question all of this inflation. And they're looking a lot more people now are starting to look for a solution. And, this is where they're inevitably going to, you know, the market's going to go to the hardest money. Yeah. I mean, again, you're seeing, you're seeing two very passionate responses when you look at, we'll call them, you know, existing bitcoins, but if you look on the people that haven't come to Bitcoin yet, the people that are most disenfranchised by the existing fiat system, they're having an equally, like emotional response to it you know you see the the videos the nurses in their cars um crying

because they're like i i went to school for this this is a i thought this was a good career i'm living in my car or i're ubiquitous now there's so many of them there's so many of those videos you just scroll and scroll and there's just there's thousands and thousands of you're Yeah. And it's, it makes sense that somebody like that when they understood, when they finally clue into like the underlying problem, and then they're presented with, hey, this, this is a parallel system that actually fixes that problem. And you can, if you want, you can just kind of like step over here. It makes sense that that would capture the imagination of, of millions or billions of people. And that when they get it,

they're they want to put they're all into fixing this because they realize like if it fixes so many of the problems that they've encountered over their lives like that that that that visceral need to to contribute um to a solution that you see in the world i think it runs pretty deep with a lot of people yeah yeah that that's that's that's what i i got nothing else to add to that i i think that's what we're what we're slowly starting to see is is is more people starting to figure this out. And so, I mean, I see it from the working class side because most of the businesses that I've that I've run and been involved in are working class. And that, you know, those people are starting to see that they're being paid in dollars. And it's not, they can't afford another 20% of inflation. Like, I mean, there's already people now that are on the edge. and they're already on the bubble.

Just like, well, just like you mentioned, the nurses, for example. And it's not just nurses. I mean, there's a lot of different skill sets, you know, that are out there. They're all feeling this. And they're saying, okay, there's got to be a better way than this. Because these guys are just crushing us. Yeah, we're getting a lot of dollars, but we're going backward faster than we've ever gone. Yeah.

Yeah, it's, it's disheartening if you, if you can't see. and I think that's this is all it also stems from just a misunderstanding of where to point the blame to like you get you get all these confusing messages around well you know that these these damn businesses are trying to take you for a ride but then if you're if you're running a business you know like well but I'm also I'm getting screwed because everything's more expensive so I know that I'm not trying to actively screw anybody I'm just trying to trying to keep up. And so like it's it starts to be easy to poke holes in the narratives that you're fed. But yeah, and then, but again, people don't really understand. They don't question beyond the initial thing. This, this is expensive. This is the person that sold it to me. I'm going to blame that person. But if you think a little bit more deeply, that's where people start to go, wait. I don't know what I don't know. It's kind of the reaction. I don't know. Eric, do you want to jump in here anywhere?

Like, what are you hearing that resonates with you? Well, I appreciate the direction of the conversation because we're speaking to the pain that I've personally experienced that really drove me into Bitcoin. And I think, Axel, you've spoken to the same thing where the small business owners are struggling. And, you know, I also want to take a note out of Jeff Booth's thesis. And essentially, you know, why I'm so bullish too is is that Bitcoin is the first thing in human history that is the demand goes up, the supply doesn't change. And in a free market, you have, where you have demand go up and there's not enough supply, the market will bid up whatever it is that the market wants.

They'll end up paying more for it. As that happens, the economic incentive increases for entrepreneurs and capital to move into that sector of the marketplace and meet that demand. and with supply, making whatever it is abundant driving the value down. Unless you could build a regulatory moat around some sector in the marketplace, and a good example would be like insulin. There's two companies that have the patent to insulin. If they allowed for like the free production of insulin, if they made it a process where like you could go to your local municipality,

say I got a kitchen where I could produce clean insulin. I need a license from the state of California. And if everybody had access to the ability to produce insulin, an entrepreneur or business owner, what would happen is insulin would become very abundant and it would drop the price. And so I'm sure, you know, I'm sure Axel has similar versions of the same problem where you have to move. It's hard to pivot in your business to find that profitability. And so for me, as a great example, 10 years ago, medical marijuana in the state of California, bulk wholesale cannabis that would be sold from a producer to a

dispensary was like three to four grand a pound. Today, a better pound is a thousand bucks. But in that last three years, my cost of living slash operating has doubled really triple. So on the conservative end, I make one sixth what I used to 10 years ago. On the more aggressive end of doing that math, I make one 12th to 115th. And so in the Fiat world where the debt, we have a debt based monetary, a debt based monetary system where, the monetary units are lent into existence as debt against assets. It requires the value denominated in that currency of everything to go up. But we fundamentally live in a free market where supply is always meeting demand.

And so like and the small business owner and we could even use micro strategy since you brought him up. And so Jeff Booth and Michael Saylor really helped me to understand the forces that I was intuitively knew were causing my life to become. way harder. It's like in the famous words of sailor, the road to surf them is working exponentially harder for a currency growing exponentially weaker. And so you have two opposing forces. I got dollar denominated wage deflation where I have dollar denominated cost of living inflation. So I actually have an extreme version of what like people on minimum wage have where you go from $20 to $22 an hour, you get a 10% increase in your wages. But the real monetary expansion and the cost of living is going up at 15 or 20%, for example.

So that's real world wage deflation, even though you have the optical illusion of getting paid more. And so where the monetary units are lent into existence as debt against assets, it creates a feedback loop where the property owning class is the recipients of the new money. And then they get to use that money and go into the marketplace and buy more assets. It creates a feedback loop where if you're not in the property owning class with enough stuff, you're at a game theoretic disadvantage. So it creates this fuck.

where sociopaths who are willing to kind of plunder end up taking this rent-seeking approach where they get to a position where they own enough stuff where they can then ride off of this this this fiat feedback loop the contillionaire effect and so if you're a fiscally conservative responsible individual and we could use a local chainsaw shop owner like i have down the street this guy is struggling versus like michael sailor micro strategy was a small business that was publicly traded. And it's very interesting, though, that this individual, his fiscally conservative business approach led to him being one of the longest, the longest CEO of a publicly traded company. And he had $500 million on the balance sheet when they COVID, they shut the world down,

and they then doubled the money supply. And so he knew he had an existential crisis. He, in the famous words of sailor, he either had a slow death or a fast death available to him. So he had a large economic incentive to figure out where to put that money. And you can do a more. only a few things if you're a publicly traded company and you have a treasury reserve and it's a bleeding ice cube. You can either pay that out to your shareholders as dividends. You can go buy equity in other companies or you can buy back your own shares. So it creates the centralizing force where you're incentivized to take on debt. Savers are punished. He's a fiscally conservative guy. This guy had $500 million on his balance sheet because he wanted to hedge himself against future uncertainty. If he had a year where he wasn't profitable because of the commoditization of everything,

he could pivot his business model and he could survive a period of time without income. However, he's at a game theoretic disadvantage against the companies that are taking on debt and they're buying up other small companies. And it creates this centralizing force and this incentive to either become the biggest fish or be gobbled up by the biggest fish, take those proceeds and put them into some assets, it's real estate equities or whatever. If you can get enough, then you create that feedback loop. When I talk with people and I'm explaining Bitcoin and the contillionaire effect,

I'll use the example of you got monetary expansion of 7% and you have 7% appreciation on average over real estate and equities within the marketplace, which are predominantly the main assets in which people hold to, they save their money. We don't actually, no wealthy people have money. They have stuff, right? So if you got $100 million in your portfolio appreciates by, 7% a year. That means you can borrow, I don't know, four million of the seven million you made by doing nothing. You can go, go live some baller life for $2 million a year, take the other two

million dollars invested in more assets. And then you're getting wealthier and then the next year you get to borrow against that wealth even more. And so it creates the centralizing force, punishes savers, creates this low grade state of psychosis where everybody's just fucking all bummed out because they're getting screwed and they don't understand. And as you mentioned and like, I watched a video of Matt Cratterley, he straight up brings out the, the publicly traded grocery stores within Canada. So the government in Canada debases the currency. Then they gaslight the capitalistic business owners.

And they say, hey, these business owners are ripping you off. They're increasing their prices. And now we're going to have to put in price caps. Well, he pulls up their balance sheets and their P&Ls. And he's like, actually, no, they're making less money. And so it goes back to what I have an extreme version of. And we all have different versions of supply is always meeting demand. Where you have a large margin, you've got a large incentive for people to produce whatever it is and meet that demand with supply.

Well, it's a fundamentally deflationary force. But we have an inflationary monetary system. And every time there's a liquidity crisis, they have, there's exponentially more liabilities within the system, which requires exponentially more printing, which further exacerbates the problem and strengthens and makes that divide even larger. And so the long and short of it is, is the reason I'm so bullish is everyone on planet Earth wants money. Like in the famous words of breed love, money is essentially a call option on any good or service that the marketplace can produce. So whatever the money is chosen by the marketplace has infinite demand on it. And if you can pair infinite demand with true scarcity, now you have

the apex asset. You can call it the apex property of the human race. And in this particular case, it's engineered money. So the incentive is to buy this thing. And so with the Fabsby rules changing at the end of the year, shipbag corporations who participate in endless scumbaggery like Nestle, for example, they're going to put Bitcoin on the balance sheet instead of go drill a well in some starving impoverished area where nobody's got any resources and sell the water back to them. Because the path of least resistance to make the most to provide the most shareholder, value instead of diluting the shares, buying up some small company like Annie's Foods and pretending like Annie's isn't owned by Nestle. And I don't know if that's the case, but just as

an example, they're going to put Bitcoin on the balance sheet because it's the apex asset. It's probabilistically as long as it exists and as another thing Booth says, stays decentralized and secure. It's going to appreciate it a faster rate than everything. So it's the inversion and the incentive structure to buy Bitcoin with your surplus instead of dilute it by giving it to your shareholders in the form of dividends. And so it's going to sort of. slowly bring back solvency in an insolvent system where we have $400 trillion worth of insolvency in the world. And so I mean, I'm super bullish because without Bitcoin as a treasury reserve, for example, I'd be fucking toast. I don't know if I should be swearing or not, but I feel passionate and I want to drop some F bombs, right?

You can say what other do you want, man. Totally. What the Bitcoin as on my balance sheet is appreciating much faster than the extreme version of deflationary wage of the wage deflation that I'm experiencing. And so if I will hold, if I own for example, like a ranch that I inherited from my father who got from his father, who he got from his father, and I raised cattle. And I wanted to hedge myself against the two opposing forces of the inflationary money with the free market of deflation. And I'm, you know, competing against fiat scumbags who have these, I don't know, centralized feed lots. It's like cowshowitz, where these

animals are just getting fed, corn sprayed with glyphosate, and they're all arthritic and sick and unhealthy. But when you have an impoverished populace, they can't afford to do the right thing on average, or really a thing that they would want and buy the quality thing. If I'm producing high value beef, for example, I'm at a disadvantage in the marketplace. But if I can save in Bitcoin, wherever I have a surplus, the surplus is appreciating at a faster rate than my wages are going down on average. So it's a hedge against the game theoretic fuckness in the world that we're experiencing.

And so, yeah, it's just the inversion and the incentive structure and it's super inspiring. Yeah. I mean, that rant into my veins is what I require right now. No, that's, I mean, it, yeah, it flips everything on its head.

It takes a world that is, The incentive is to just take on debt and buy more shit. And now the people that are actually productive can utilize the same mechanism to almost implode the system in on itself. Because again, if you're not creating value for others, if you're not profitable, it is only so long. Like it eats away at the infinite dollars and in a way speculatively attacks them by buying more and more of the scarce asset with the infinitely created asset. So I saw a lot of big nods coming from Axel there. I'm assuming there's a lot of things that kind of struck a chord with you. you're welcome to tap on them as well and maybe I'll toss it back to Kesa briefly afterwards

to see if there's anything that resonated with her there. Well, briefly, I mean, I would say that the part that I agreed probably the most was when he's talking about the aspect of what the small businesses are going through because almost every small business owner that I know is going through that same thing. Their costs are increasing and their margins are shrinking because they can only raise prices so much, at a certain point, there is a, there's a cap, right, where people just stop buying. And so this is, and of course, in my fields, I'm competing in both industries, I compete with Vanguard, BlackRock.

I mean, those are my competitors, actually. They own all of my competitors. So across fields, so it's like, well, this. This is, it's very difficult to compete with that. So that's why I was, that's why, of course, I was saying this, because that's what is happening. It happens also with real estate where the values always have to go up. And this is something I've touched on in many occasions, you know, on videos I've done on TikTok and what have you. And where I point out that values, the nominal values always have to increase.

But in so doing, people keep taking more and more debt out. And it just create, it does create this, this, this, this, this, this vicious cycle of, of rent seeking wealth. And as opposed to decentralizing that ownership, which, of course, I mean, I'm big on the idea of private property and ownership and everything. I absolutely am. But the, you know, like in the United States, you guys, you know, you're in Canada, but I mean, the U.S. is essentially the same idea. You know, the founders of our, you know, the U.S. never intended all the people to be a nation of rent. renters. It's not designed or intended to be like that. It's supposed to be a nation of people who own because if they don't own anything, then, well, then what do they, what do they care?

That really is the crux of it. So you want that. You want people owning the country you tell, you tell the country that you're telling people that it's their country, you want them owning a part of it. And so that was, that was really it. And then just, of course, the other parts of that stuff was just, was just the liquidity crisis, which is always one of a hot, hot button of mine. But continue on. Fair enough, fair enough. Kisa, is there anything that popped out there that you wanted to tag on to before we kind of do a little jump here?

Just, I think that was brilliantly said. And the sly roundabout way that Huyahick, you know, that Bitcoin brings in the sly roundabout way. I had this image of, of, I realize I'm pretty visual. It's like everything's been tightened in this corkscrew or like, and to where we're not free anymore. And a bit unwind and bring that freedom. And so, you know, with regards to just keeping it on on the books of small businesses and, you know, all the things that Eric was saying. It's just like working, yeah, in the sly roundabout and wonderful way to just, so that's about it. Fair enough. Fair enough. No, that's great. Awesome, awesome. Now, I just, we got on some,

some pretty good runs there on, on, some tangents and everything. I want to, I want to double check, because sometimes when we get on runs, I don't know specifically if we dove into people's topics that they had in their head already or not. So like, Eric, it felt to me like we dove right into your reason for being bullish there. Is that, am I correct in that ascitation? Yeah. It's just, it's the, it's the inversion in the incentive structure. You know, another great thing that Booth says, where you have abundance and money,

you create scarcity and everything else. where you have scarcity in money, you create abundance and everything else. And currently, we have this Fiat, broken Keynesian monetary paradigm where the incentive is to move out of the money quickly and take and hoard assets like housing, for example. Like, why does anybody own 10 houses? It's crazy. They're treating houses as a savings account. They're speculating in the stock market. Actually, you mentioned it that the valuations are just preposterous.

And it's because America, because of the broken money system, and it was bad a hundred years ago, but it got real bad when they detached from gold in 1971. It's driving people out of the money. The money is like a hot potato and they're hoarding things. And they're using companies like Apple, Amazon, Facebook, Netflix, Tesla, blah, blah, blah, as their savings account. And so, yeah, I mean, I got a lot to say and pertains to this. But the short version of it is, is now that you have scarcity and money, the end.

incentive is to hold the money. The money is unconfiscatable. It's protected by a wall of encrypted energy and it's truly scarce. The demand goes up. The supply doesn't change. And so that means that people are selling off houses. As an example, I sold my house. I sold my business. I consult for this, this farm and I live in a rental. And I'm getting wealthier as a result of not owning the house and owning the Bitcoin. That and I have more optionality. What California is doing is fucking crazy. These people take my a lot of my tax dollars and they fund things that are absolutely preposterous and it's maddening. And so if California comes through with more chaos and bullshit, I can leave. I got this hypermobile liquid capital, right? And it's just going to go with me.

I don't have to vape 3% when I sell the house. I don't have to vape 3% when I buy a new house. And so that's a fundamentally downward price pressure on housing, which is, you know, another thing. Black Rock is buying Bitcoin right now with part of their fund instead of more house. So that's like a really good thing for people who want to buy houses. And so, yeah, we're just creating abundance and everything else now that we have true scarcity and money. And it's not even like people need to create, they don't need to sacrifice and do some like hard, selfless thing and suffer. It's the, it's the incentives for the individual are aligned for what's, what's best for the individual is now what's best for the collective. Selfishly, if I want the most, I'm going to stack sats.

And so is BlackRock and so is Nestle and so is all these businesses. And as a result, it breaks this broken, this bad feedback loop. And it frees up things that people have been hoarding. And that makes things more abundant where you got scarcity and money. You create abundance and everything. And I actually think it's kind of happening at hyper rate. And going back to what I said earlier, like it's really easy to get sucked into all the atrocities taking place in the world.

And I don't live in some delusional state where I don't think that they exist. but I'm focused on all of the amazing things that are taking place because it's happening at the same time. You know, it's the best of times. It's the worst of times. It's the most fuck that's ever been. But it's also the most amazing time in all of human history. This discovery changes absolutely everything. And so yeah, my reason for being bullish is we've discovered true scarcity, which means that over time, we're going to free up all these things that people have been hoarding. We're going to demonetize all these assets that have been monetized. The fact that people are buying Tesla or, I don't know, Facebook.

Facebook stock means that their valuation goes up and that means that they can borrow more and then they can buy out all these small tech companies. And maybe these small tech companies are going to solve some big major issue. Maybe some, maybe some surgeon is going to figure out how to like, I don't know, solve major problems for the world. But they keep the it's this centralizing force that gets disrupted. And that's just, I don't know, made me super bullish and excited, man. It's a tough, it's a tough world out there. And you can hedge yourself against the, I don't know, the scumbaggery and the game theory, erratic fuckness with. Bitcoin and you don't have to make a sacrifice.

You get paid to do it. You get paid more to do it. It's an interesting instance where when the money is broken, the incentive structure of people, again, speculating on things like homes, the hoarding of those things makes everyone else worse off. But in a system where the money actually works and holds value and accrues value over time, that doesn't actually, like hoarding Bitcoin doesn't hurt. other people regardless, right?

Like the things that they want are actually going to become cheaper because we're moving away from a system that incentivizes that. Homes are more accessible. Anything of value is more accessible because people aren't treating it as a piggy bank. And then you have people that, yeah, if you hoard Bitcoin, if you hoard it or if you just save it, you know, you're going to benefit in a long run over that. anybody who is saving Bitcoin is going to benefit in the long run over that. And even the people that maybe are just living on a paycheck, imagine denominated,

you negotiate your salary or hourly wage and sats, they still benefit if they have zero savings because their hourly rate is set in stats, which go up over time. Even if we get to a point where there's mild deflation, but we're on a Bitcoin standard, you have set out that your hour, an hour of your time is worth a certain amount of SATs which at a certain time can purchase X amount. With mild deflation, you still benefit from those that are able to save because your paycheck

goes a little bit further every year and you're no longer in a position where you have to every single, every few years, beg and plead and argue and negotiate to up your wage just to keep your standard of living. Now it's totally reversed. The company then has to ascertain, have the, I guess, advances in technology and everything stayed in line with this person's productivity so that we're still profitable with them working.

And if not, do we want to go to this person and make a case for a reduction in wage? And if they don't like that, and they leave, is it worth us having to go and find a new employee and train that new employee? Like it takes the blue collar worker and puts them in a position of power and it takes, where it should be, the person running the business, they're not longer in a position where they can outright kind of use the system to, I don't want to say exploit because it's the job of the business to be profitable.

But like, it can be exploited quite easily if they want. on. So I don't know. Like, Axel, is this resonating with you a little bit as well? Well, yeah. I mean, I suppose the idea of being, you know, as a business owner myself, I mean, you're, there's a reason I don't, I don't hire anymore. It's because, frankly, I can't, can't afford to pay somebody what I would, what I would need to pay them to, to do a good job to take it seriously. And this is a problem, um, that I think, well, again, I mean, if you saw the competency crisis video, it's, I mean, it really is the, case. It's getting harder and harder to hold people's attention with with money that

where the spending power is is dwindling and it's dwindling to the point now where we can almost watch it. It's you know, I mean like the old days of you know fast cars where you can watch the the needle move over you know when you put your foot into it and that's kind of where we're at, you know, that that type of the type of inflation that we're all experiencing the real inflation, not CPI, but you know, we all know inflation is much higher than that. And it's, it's affecting people to that degree. So, you know, and of course, that's, that's, that's really where I tend to spend most of my focus is trying to is not necessarily from the negative side, because I do see a lot of positive. Though I, I do think we have, we have challenges ahead, no

question. Because, you know, the, like I said, Fiat people, you know, they don't want to let go with that. You know, the banks aren't going to want to let go of any, you know, of that power. It's a tremendous amount of power to have. It's the power of, I mean, if you want to look at it that way, it's the way they see it is the power to create the illusion of endless resources. And we all know that's complete crap because, you know, the Earth is finite and, you know, we are a part of its mass and that's it. So as is our time, our time is finite on this planet. So, you know, everything about us is finite, yet they would have us believe that they can just create infinity. Yeah.

That's just not true. Yeah. So, yeah, I just spend more time. I've just been enjoying listening to some of this because these are interesting perspectives. And I like, you know, I like taking these ins. When I have the time to do stuff like this, it's fine. That's great. Well, yeah.

I mean, I mean, we could riff on this all evening. I am cognizant of time. We're closing in on, well, I mean, my time, 5.30, but Eastern, what is that? 7.30. So I'm going to kind of start rounding things out a little bit. I wanted to double check Axel. Did we get to the topics that you wanted to cover? Was there more that you wanted to dive down?

Or have you kind of put a bow on things? No, no, no, I mean, I think you guys covered, covered most everything pretty well. I don't have a whole lot to add to, at least from, from this, from this perspective, I don't have a whole lot to add to it because it, because there, there is a lot of reasons to be bullish. And, and I, you know, like I said, I appreciate watching these. And then some of the biggest reasons that I, that I personally see is that once again is the number of people, the volume of people that are starting to ask this question. They're starting to understand inflation. And I just like, you know, you pointed out the videos with the nurses, right? The ones that, the ones that I'm seeing are on oftentimes times are a lot of young,

particularly on TikTok, you've got a lot of young people that are, you know, let me in their early, early 20s. These are zoomers. And they're being confronted with hardcore inflation. And they don't have, they're not making anywhere near the money to cover any of these expenses. And it's starting to really affect their minds. It's really starting to affect who they are. And that manifests itself in these videos they do.

And I think that it's a, I think that's very healthy for, for these, for these people to do this because they're not, not just, I don't mean cathartically. I don't mean it like that. I mean healthy as in they are starting to really question all the bullshit that they've been fed by this system for so long. And, and more people are starting to. question all of it. They may not, they may not be, you know, into Bitcoin. They may not be into even gold or any hard currencies yet. They may not even, they may not even get to that point yet, but they're starting to question it. And they're starting to look for an answer. And I think that that's, in my view, I think that's the key, which is, and it's why it's one of

the reasons if you, again, if you've seen some of the work I've done the past, I don't bring up Bitcoin a whole bunch, but it's not because I don't believe in Bitcoin. It's not because I don't believe in any of this stuff. It has to do with trying to gently lead people down the road of asking that question of like, why the hell is all this happening? And, you know, why is it that that you've spent, you know, your whole life, you know, your parents, in a lot of cases, did the same job. And yet they had three times the lifestyle, you know, or more. I think I'll, I'll tie a bow on it just to point this off, you know, for you, was that my son, his, his uncle, worked at Boeing and he started working at Boeing, I think in 1978, right at a high school

kind of deal. And when he retired, even if you gave a Zoomer with a high school education, his peak salary when he retired, even if you gave them that salary when they came in fresh out, they couldn't afford even one quarter of his lifestyle, not even a quarter. And that's at his peak salary when he retired. So people are starting to see this. And they're starting to go, hold on, you know, what exactly is causing all this? Because you can't, you can't just chalk it all up to corporate greed. Oh, there's some corporate greed, absolutely.

But not for the reasons that you might think. It's just, you know, that companies, frankly can't afford this stuff anymore. From what I can tell. Yeah. It's, I mean, the whole thing's rotten to the, core and um again the only way to escape it is is to quite literally escape escape escape it just just leave just like there's the door there's a whole other world on the the other side of it and just walk through the door it's right here for you um yeah indeed well uh everybody i again i'm cognizant

in a time we're gonna i'm gonna start rounding things out a little bit here at the very end um i typically like to just do a quick round of, you know, any, any final thought you might to throw up. But more importantly, if you have something that you'd like to point people towards, whether that be like, you know, Bitcoin specific or something tangential that could be helpful in somebody's learning journey, something you want to point them to, or even like a resource, an app, a book, whatever it may be. It's a, always a great time to throw that out at the end. People always appreciate some of the recommendations I got tossed out here.

So it's kind of thing in the back of your mind, I'll kind of give a general final thought that I have and maybe like a reshill of like people trying to build bottom up. But yeah, I mean, we discussed a lot about the problems. And to throw back to what Eric was saying, you know, in and around Jeff Booth's mentality of don't give energy to the old system. Don't, don't yell at it. Don't scream at it.

Just put your energy towards the new system and helping build that because then you expedite that and you expedite the dissolution of the old. And you can build the future that you want to see. And I firmly believe that one of the ways that you can do that is starting locally is making the shifts in your own life. where you see fit, whether that just be using Bitcoin as a mechanism for saving for the future, or whether that be just like, you know, maybe you're not as extreme as me. You don't want to go on a full Bitcoin standard, but it is possible.

It's just might be, you will be jumping through hoops still at this stage. But one way that you can get past that is meet your local Bitcoiners. Go and meet the local people. And if they're not already doing it, encourage them to accept Bitcoin. free to request amongst Bitcoiners say like, hey, do you know anybody who offers this thing? Or, you know, I want to, I want to start using Bitcoin more often. And I think that's a noble cause. And when Bitcoiners get together, they can build some pretty special things.

So meet your local Bitcorners. It will be worth it. And help build the tight-knit community that you want to see in the world. And I'll, you know, I'll give a shout out to the same. sat market here later on as we sign off. But yeah, build local. Build your local community. Kisa, I'll go to you.

Any final thought you may have and recommendation if you want to point people towards a resource or something that you found valuable. Hey, yeah. I guess a final thought, it's just, it's on a few moments ago. Just to add to that was, that even if power didn't keep going up, if it even just stayed stable, be such a profound relief for everybody working for sets,

like once we're on this to everybody. Because if one just knew that you're saving, you know, an orange was going to cost the same when you retire, you could actually plan for your retirement in a stress could know that this is how much I will need to live at this standard of living on a monthly basis and therefore this is how much I need to save and it's just a matter of math and then putting in the and then you're just relaxing with that knowledge and you know if there's extra contribute here or there or what you're going to leave for your kids or if it all just become a problem that the

only thing you need to solve is how you're going to use your energy to get the sap I'm going to need to solve the problem of how the saps are going to buy of how like we have to today how our in the future you know which is so absurd and I think it's why all the monetization these things like houses that that should never have been that should never been monitored. Yeah, just feeling into that absolute relief of finally having money that you know. I mean, we can increase in purchasing power,

but even if it didn't, even if it was just stable, that in itself. So I guess that's my final thought. And then, so this is where you want me to do a resource or something that I think is helpful to people? Yeah, yeah. If you have something you'd like to, and I think I know what you're going to,

to recommend and I've got it queued up here just in case, but I'll let you take it here. Can I do two, but one will be really, they can both be really quick. Yeah, yeah, of course. Okay, one is my book because I did have a really nice little picture logo thing imaging that was supposed to code. Yes, because it's free download for anybody everywhere, anytime 365 in Spanish and in Brazilian Portuguese and in English at this point. So I've written, and I guess just the quick word on that is that if one takes a moment to look at it,

you'll say, to be quite a comprehensive overview, actually, of many different aspects, and even some really basic tech. But it was designed in a way that it should. So I like to really recommend it for pre-coiners or new coiners who are just not quite ready for the more enriching and bigger, books mine. Yeah. But if they really like, okay, this is interesting, then they'll be ready for just about any other Bitcoin

book primer in that way. So that's the simplest bit of coinbook.net. And then the other resource too is the Bitcoin trading cards, which are just the funnest education come across in Bitcoin. And I do work for them. So this is a, you know, a shill or whatever. I guess it's all she go.

Thank you. And we're going to be coming out with series three. Then we're going to be coming out with another big education series towards the year. A cost series. And we have right now the Genesis Pax, which we just scroll right by there. You can collect a full set, although they do not have a shiny card in the packs. Because you don't feel like, oh, maybe I have. got a really rare card.

You can just hand them out to friends and they'll absolutely love them. There's great artwork on the front and the back is really solid, like high signal information. So those are the two projects that I'm really excited about. I think this was fun.

I love it. And I will say that I grew up collecting Marvel cards. And so when these things came out, number one, I thought it was, you know, It was, for me, it was like a fun collector thing that I could kind of pick up and, and, you know, our money is intangible, so Bitcoiners like to have some sort of keepsake here and there.

But also when, and for Series 2, they put me on a card and I was very, like, nerdily excited about it. So I got it on my phone right now. So I was pretty excited about it. But yeah, it's a cool thing. I enjoy it. It's actually going to be a shortly after we end here. There'll be a live stream happening. So that'll be fun.

Yeah, and it's something where kids and adults, like it's a fun way to engage your kids, really, to me this project. It's a fun way to engage your kids to be in Bitcoin education and a sly roundabout. They're learning important stuff. They're just having fun. And it's really cool.

Yeah. I agree. If you haven't tried them, go take a peek. They're pretty fun. Awesome. Well, I'll toss it over to Axel next. Again, any final thought you may have. And if you have a recommendation, Bitcoin or not, just anything that you think people might give value of, something that they should check out, feel free to toss that out there as well. Well, one of my favorite books was, you know, years ago was a book called The Sovereign Individual by James Dale Davidson or Lord William Reed-Mogg. And it's a great book. It's a little dated, you know, with the VR stuff. But yeah, yeah, it's a fantastic book. And I do recommend it to anybody. That and, of course, the decline in fall, the Roman Empire.

If you want to tear into it. That's another great, another great book that they'll tell you kind of. where we are and but as far i mean because in rome with their their inflation rate i mean it's it's definitely there's definitely some similarities that we can learn from yeah absolutely yeah no it's a sovereign individual i thoroughly enjoyed um yeah there there's i mean for a book that was written in the mid 90s yeah they got a lot right um there there's a lot of things that kind of came to fruition some of the things that they saw as as just around the corner. It's pretty prescient for its time. Yeah, especially the part where people just begin to kind of ignore

politicians altogether. It's just more of a clown show than anything else. It's like, yeah, that's kind of where we're at at this point. Yeah. I don't think I've ever seen a group of people so disillusioned for their options going into a going into an election. It's definitely been interesting to put it mildly. Yeah, fair enough. Well, that's awesome. Yes, if you haven't read the sovereign individual people, you know, it's, you know, I'd say it's a big one. Well, it's not too bad.

It's 400 and something on pages, but there's, it's like, I found the intro to it, like the first couple of chapters. I really had to like dive into it before I got on a bit of a role and got through it. But like you won't regret. You won't regret diving into it for sure. So worth worth checking out. And I'll throw it over to Eric here. And again, any final thought you feel like thrown out there and a recommendation if you got one? Yeah.

My final thought and my recommendation, I guess, would kind of be. in tandem, I would suggest that people measure the value of the things that they want in Bitcoin. Bitcoin is a fixed unit. It's currently shredding because it's demonetizing the wealth in the world. But let's say you fast forward the clock 100 years from now and all the wealth has moved out of all of these assets and into Bitcoin. Let's say you have a quadrillion dollar market cap. Because it's a fixed unit, you can actually measure the value of things accurately. Like what's happening with houses is houses are losing value like a car does, but we're measuring the value of the house in dollars, which is another variable.

You can't solve accurately for that math problem. You can't, it's an algebraic equation and there's an optical illusion taking place. And so it seems that your house is going up in value. It's going up in dollar denominated value, but it's really bleeding energy and going back to supply meets demand. If people want more houses, there's a lot of empty space. politicians will allow for people to further subdivide parcels. There's so much area. Like if people want more beachfront luxury real estate and prices are too high in Miami,

they'll just build another Dubai. They'll just expand somewhere else where there's beachfront property. So the reality is, is we live in a deflationary world and the value of everything is going down over time because human ingenuity, capitalism, and technology, we are figuring out how to produce more for less. And so, I don't know, going back to some of the things said, Axel was speaking to his, your son's uncle worked at Boeing. Well, it's very interesting for me. I'm 39 years old and I talk to people that are older than me and they kind of don't understand the yolo culture and the high time preference.

Well, here's the deal. Like your uncle probably was able to buy a house or your child, your son's uncle was able to probably buy a house with, I don't know. 2x his annual salary was the cost of the house 4x is annual salary he probably made 50 grand in the house he wanted three and a half times yeah three and a half times now it's the average incomes let's just call it 50 gs and the house is 500 grand it's like 10x the value and so that creates this nobody gives a fuck and people are going to go buy the new sneakers and they're going whatever and so like it it's debasing our culture and it's causing people to not give a fuck they're destroying things like I tell people like look if if what you need here in Humboldt county is too expensive go to

Oakland because it's free if it's under a thousand bucks you can just walk into the store and just walk out of it they don't even arrest you it's preposterous and so but if you look at what you want denominated in Bitcoin so let's let's pretend that it's not fucking shredding the house the house that I sold a couple years ago was worth a lot more Bitcoin than it's worth today and so if you're looking at the value of something that you want in the future and you denominate the value of that thing in Bitcoin, it becomes quite hopeful. There's a monumental incentive for you to save this thing. And additionally, because it's scarce digital or meta, I like to get a little metaphysical, a little cosmic you could say, but it's metaphysical property. It's the discovery of matter in cyberspace.

It's like Satoshi merge the physical world with the metaphysical world. And so you have this scarce asset. He solved the double spin problem. It's the first thing. human history that's informational that if I give it to you, I no longer have it. If I told you anything, I could send you an email. I send you a JPEG. I maintain a copy. If I told you a thousand years ago, hey, go down the river. There's fish down there.

You know, I know. But if I send you my Bitcoin, it leaves my hands and it goes into your hands. Because it's invisible and because it's scarce, the incentive is to hold this thing. That's invisible in the hoarding of this thing, which you can never stop people from trying to hoard stuff. We're like squirrels. We're trying to survive a winter. And if we collect nuts for one winter, but we still have energy to go out into the forest slash the free market and procure more nuts for multiple winters, you're going to do so because that's a hedge against future uncertainty. And so the fact that I hold Bitcoin and we hold Bitcoin and I don't have a real estate portfolio means that this is fixing things for people who don't even own Bitcoin.

No coiners are benefiting from this. And and because that we're in this world where it's an energy. in energy out thing. And the first thing that you're going to do is you're going to assatiate your needs. You're going to do the quote unquote selfish thing. You're going to hold the Bitcoin. You get paid the most to do it. And so yeah, I guess I'll digress there. The thing that I would suggest that people do is is think about what you want in the future denominated in a Bitcoin. And yeah, I mean, that creates a lot of hope. It's a hopeful thing when you're like, you know, the house that I want or the acreage that I want so I can take care of my family

currently costs, I don't know, whatever it is, but 20 Bitcoin. Well, it's going to be 10 Bitcoin and then 5 Bitcoin and then one Bitcoin. And it completely flips things upside down. And it exposes the clown world. It like, it exposes it and it pays people to exit it. It exposes the fact that we live in a fundamentally deflationary world where supplies always meet in demand and the value of everything is going down on earth except for Bitcoin. So you have two things. that are scarce and I'll leave it at that. Your time is scarce and Bitcoin is scarce. And the resources on planet Earth are scarce. So I can say there's three things. But really, I was listening to on the Bitcoin Matrix, safety was talking about the amount of

resources. He compares it to an Olympic-sized swimming pool. The amount of resources that we're using is like, I don't know, like an eight-ounce cup of water. So there's so much abundance available in the world. And we're being trick-fucked into thinking that like there's not that stuff. And it's so hard. And the reality is, is that. it's the opposite of that. And the Bitcoin is going to usher this in. It's going to pay people who adopt a Bitcoin standard. It exposes the deflationary forces. It allows us to solve for like, I don't know, this is abstract and it might not make the most sense. But I look at like the marketplace as like a very complicated algebraic equation or like Saylor says it's a vector.

Everything's moving in different rates. It's supply and demand. And you can't measure the whole marketplace and puts one number on it. Here's the inflation. So that's a bunch of fiat bullshit where the crown world politicians are lying to us and it's a distraction. But Bitcoin allows you to measure that. And not only does it allow you to measure that, but this is where I'm so elated and so grateful is this is like, you know, I'm 39. And for the first 35 years of my life, like there's this nihilistic depression like this. Oh gosh. Like what is this all for?

And now I discover Bitcoin is like, holy moly. This is the biggest thing in human history. And this like flips all the inversion. It inverts everything because of the incentive structure. And I went from being kind of bummed. I literally used to say, like, I almost would prefer to live like a thousand years ago, like 100,000 years ago. The world made more sense.

But now I fundamentally and truly believe from like the core of my being, this is the most amazing time to be alive ever. And so as one system is just falling apart, the other system is coming to life. And it's beautiful. You know, and the last thing that I'll say is, is like people who I have debates with, and this is going to kind of segue off of something Axel said, you know, they say, oh, Jeff Bezos and all these big corporations. And I'm like, look, you got to understand this disrupts it. It takes, you have to wire new neuro pathways to see it because it inverts everything. Why don't we live in the Roman Empire?

And I'll get crickets. No, but seriously, like, why don't we live in the Roman Empire? The Roman Empire and the debasement of their currency was a centralizing force. And so they became too big. and they failed because their business model wasn't profitable. The plunder and the death and the destruction that people didn't want it. So they had to clip coins to fund it. And we have the same thing happening today.

The difference is during the Roman Empire where we were limited to the physicality of property. And we didn't have the, we hadn't discovered true scarcity. We now have true scarcity. And so I'm super bullish. I would recommend everybody measure the things and the value of stuff in Bitcoin. That's very hopeful. And yeah, and to think too, this is the last thing I'll say. We built this world based upon a yellow shiny rock.

Like that's our monetary technology. And where it lacked in portability, you people, dude, like one of the great Rothschilds a couple hundred years ago is like, oh, hey, you could bring your gold here and I'll let's you issue some paper certificates. And they became pretty scummy people. But the reality was is that he offered up a solution to a monumental problem. because the game theory says that like if you got gold and I'm a sociopath I don't give a fuck I'll just prick you and take your gold I get paid to kill you

so that means that people who were sociopath and plundered they got paid well now it's the opposite you kill someone who's got their Bitcoin and self-custody you aren't going to get their 12 words so yeah well super bullish super happy super grateful awesome awesome well I'm going to round it out here. Everybody that's watching, first of all, thank you for being here for the show, being in the chat, everybody on Noster, everybody on X, everybody on YouTube, and the other places that this show gets beamed out to. Appreciate you all. Everybody on the panel, Kisa, Axel, Eric, thank you guys for being a part of this show. I appreciate your time, taking some time to come get bullish with me on a Friday evening is always much appreciated.

And I'll just finish by saying you guys are all welcome back anytime. Well, thank you. Thank you, guys. Have you great. No worries. A week, we can, everybody. Big thanks. Yeah.

All right. Later, guys. Have a good one. And everybody in the chat, thank you guys for being here as well. Of course, if you can, give that like button a slap, share this. all that good stuff. And all of the guests, their handles are in the show notes down below.

So give them a follow. Make sure that you check up on what they are doing. Check out Keese's book. And yeah, give everybody a follow and make sure you're keeping up with all the latest, greatest that they've been pumping out. What I will also finish up by saying is, number one,

in and around the coming, I'm going to show it again, I really, it's something I believe in, but, you know, I really want to get lots of excitement in and around building local communities. And so here in Calgary, we're doing our second Sat market. We did one back in December. Well, this one is coming just around the corner. It is on March 23rd, Saturday, March 23rd, just a few days before my birthday. So I'm going to be celebrating, more or less celebrating my birthday on this one as well. But if you're in the Calgary area, If you're anywhere in Alberta, if you're anywhere in BC or Saskatchewan or wherever,

and you want to make it in and be a part of the sat market, either just by attending, that is free to do. But also by being a merchant, if you have a skill, if you have something that you create, if you have a business, if you have whatever it is, a service, please come be part of the sat market and come meet all the incredible bitcoins that are going to be there as well. It's going to be a lot of fun. It was awesome last time. I want to grow it more.

And this will be the last one before the big one that we're going to be doing in July. And you'll hear more about that at this one. So please do come be a part of it. How do you do that? Well, you can search on meetup.com. Just search for the Saturday market and look in Calgary specifically. You can also go to Bitcoinbrains.com slash market. And that will give you all the information there, even though it's not quite, there we go.

Bitcoinbrains.com slash market. This has the previous market stuff. But most importantly, it will give you contact information in order to reach out. And if you want to reach out and be an actual merchant, you can reach out to Bitcoin Brains, aka Dave. And his contact information is Bitcoin Brains, sorry, Dave at Bitcoin. brains.com. So please do reach out if you want to be a part of the market. And then finally, to round out, I just got back from Madeira. It was a blast. I had an incredible time meeting

all the people there. I'm going to be traveling around a lot in the coming weeks here. But next place I'm going to be is for the Bitcoin halving party in El Salvador. If you want to make you, if you're making your way down there, please let me know. Please say hi. I'm very excited for it. If you don't have tickets, you can, I believe, head to, what is it, Bitcoinhavingparty.com. Anyways, if you go on my website, BTCSessions.com, go to the events page. There'll be information there. I'm also going to be at the Canadian Bitcoin Conference in Montreal. That's in late May from the 16th to the 18th.

And then I'm going to be in Oslo for the Freedom Forum. And I will also be in Prague for BTC Prague, which was incredible last year. So if you're hitting any of those events, please let me know. come say hi. I love meeting everybody and hanging out. So yeah, much appreciated. You can find all that, BTC sessions.ca.ca, but I look forward to seeing many Bitcoiners in my travels. It's always a lot of fun. Anyways, guys, thank you so much. I'm going to round it out here. Have a wonderful day or evening, wherever you may be. I'll see you guys next time for your daily session.