BTC Sessions - WHY ARE WE BULLISH? Sooly, Coinicarus, Fustler ep278

Episode Date: August 6, 2022

FOLLOW TODAY’S PANELISTS: https://twitter.com/Coinicarus https://twitter.com/Fustler_ https://twitter.com/Sooly_Kobayashi 💪 SUPPORT THE SHOW: Shakepay is the easiest way to buy Bitcoin in Canada Sign up now and get $30 free after your first $100 purchase! https://shakepay.me/r/BTCSESSIONS LEDN Bitcoin backed loans –  get $10 free with a savings balance of $75 or more for 15 consecutive days! https://start.ledn.io/btcsessions Coinkite offers the BEST Bitcoin hardware on the market. Use this link to get 5% off anything in their store: https://store.coinkite.com/promo/BTCSessions BillFodl: get your wallet backups in solid steel. https://privacypros.io/btcsessions Bitrefill: use Bitcoin to purchase gift cards, earn sats back while you shop. https://www.bitrefill.com/buy/?code=O04UMic9 BITCOIN tips: https://strike.me/btcsessions

Hello, everybody. Welcome to the show. Another Friday, another episode of Why Are We Bullish. We got an awesome panel this week. Very excited to invite all these individuals to the show. I hope you're having a good week. It's been a good one. And today I come armed with a plethora of reasons for being bullish. There's one I'm going to zero in on. But just so you know, there's excess bullishness in the background behind my main reason. So either way, we're going to get some good conversations. going on. Of course, if you have not already, maybe I'll leave that for a second. Of course, it's anything can happen. This is live. So Bill, let them know how it is. We'll do it live. Okay. We'll do it live. Do it live. I can, I'll write it and we'll do it live. The fucking thing sucks. If you have not already, like, subscribe, share, all those things help get this content in front of more eyeballs. I am Ben with the BTC Sessions. This

This is your daily session. Before we bring in our guests, let's take a look at where we're sitting in the market right now. This is the bitbow.com. I.O. dashboard. We're sitting at $23,149 per coin. A single U.S. dollar will grab you 4,320 sats. 91.02% of all Bitcoin have been mined.

And in terms of fees, next block, a little steep, 21 stats per byte. But if you want to wait a little bit, somewhere between 1 and 3. sats should do you. Shout out to sponsor the show, coin kite.com. New sponsors of the show, super glad to have these guys on. I have a disgusting amount of coin kite stuff. I have all of the cold

cards, the open dimes, the everythings. They just have like the best goddamn hardware in the game. And I would literally, I've got like a little affiliate thing here. All of this goes back into buying more shit to test and make videos on because I love it so much. So,

So anyways, if you don't know of cold card and open dime and coin kite and the sats card and all the stuff they're doing, then rush up because this is how you up your game. So kudos to coin kite. Thanks for being here. Shakepay.com if you're in Canada, easy way to stack sats, e transfers in and out, no deposit withdrawal fees, thin spread. If you use the link down below, sign up by your first hundred bucks or the Bitcoin. They'll give you $30 for free.

You also earn the same amount when you refer friends and family through your old. link. You can shake your phone every single day for free SaaS. They got a satsback visa card. They're doing all kinds of stuff. Check them out. Lendon.io, you can use your Bitcoin for a ton of different services. These guys have been a godsend for me whenever I have a cash flow issue and I don't want to sell my Bitcoin because that's an awful feeling. But also, it's a taxable event and I don't want to have to buy back in a higher price. So in those instances, I've been able to deposit Bitcoin, get dollars to my bank account. And when I pay back those dollars, I get back the same amount of Bitcoin. Important to note, they do quarterly proof of reserve audits through a third party,

and you can actually cryptographically and anonymously check that whatever you have there is part of that audit. So you're not getting jerked around. So anyways, be sure to check him out. Start.Lend.com.com.com. And let's keep going here. Bit refill. You can get all of the gift cards, your tiny little heart desires with Bitcoin, on-chain, and, like, Lightning Network. You're in SaaSback as you shop. You're in more SATsback with referral program. You can top up lightning channels, mobile devices. And if you're in the U.S. now, they've rolled out bill payments so you can get on that Bitcoin standard. So check them out. And last up, of course, if you're storing any important Bitcoin hardware wallet, if you're

backing up any important Bitcoin wallet for that matter, get it in steel, piece of paper, not the best, right? You don't want to be worrying about fire damage, damage, all that stuff. Bill Fottle can help you out over at Privacepros.com. This is typically how I back up all my shit. With that, let me stop my rambling. Let's get our gentlemen in here. We got Phil, aka Coiniccarus, we got Suley, we got Fossler. Gentlemen, welcome to the show. I think a quick round of who are you and what do you do is in order. So I'll toss it to Phil first. Give yourself a little intro, man. Hey, thank you so much for having me on the show. I'm Phil. Or as

I'm known on Twitter, Coin Icarus. I was the co-host of the Simply Bitcoin podcast, and now recently have started the PLEB underground with Pirate Beach Bomb, which is a collective of independent content creators. And yeah, we are trying to spread the good word of the PLEB signal. I don't know if I'm frozen on your end, but I'm frozen online. I was just going to ask, how do you talk? Are you ventriloquist?

Yeah, incredible ventriloquism. That's fantastic. I may have to rejoin. I apologize. I don't know why I'm totally frozen. That's okay. I mean, I like if there are worse positions you could have frozen in.

This is true. I think the green screen was supposed to be something wild and it's just a green screen as well. Yeah, yeah, exactly. All good. You figure out your camera and we'll go on to the other intros and I will add you back in. All right. Perfect.

Thank you. All good. Let's dive to Fustler. Dude, give you stuff, intro. Let people know who you are, what you do. Hey dudes, I'm, uh, I'm just one of them plebs, you know, just a guy, just a guy trying to buy some Bitcoin. I live in Vancouver, started a meetup here a few months ago now. And it's got some legs and it's going really well and super stoked.

So yeah, um, just, like I said, just a club at Vancouver doing my thing and wanted to meet some more bitcoinsers and like-minded individuals. So I decided to create a, you know, meet up in my city and something that. about a whole bunch of new friends and it's going well. Dude, well, I'm glad to have you. I was happy to meet you when I was in Vancouver, what, a couple weeks ago now. A couple weeks, yeah. Yeah, so it was awesome to meet you in person. And you've been killing it with these workshops or not workshops, but these meetups you had Foss out a little while ago.

You're having Jeff Booth out in less than a week here. It looks like you're getting some good turnout. So stoked to hear. that you're doing the Lord's work, teaching, helping bring Bitcoiners together. So with that, let's toss it over to Suli. Dude, let you introduce yourself, let people know who you are, what you do.

Thanks, man. Thanks for having me. Thanks for the invite along with you. Basically, I'm Suli, Suli Kobayashi on Twitter. I'm Lebanese based in Europe. I rode between Europe and East and Africa for my Fiat job. And late last year, I started a Bitcoin advisory along the way,

since I'm roving around all these areas, connecting with people, oil drilling people, etc. Starting getting approached by high net worth individuals, family offices, etc. And I got the chance to start advising Swan Bitcoin on their Middle East and North Africa strategy. So, yeah, one last thing is one of the interesting Bitcoin let's say contributions we've been working on connecting with all the our plebs in the Middle East there aren't many Maxis or rationalists in the

Middle East yet or at least we're not finding them so far we've been working on yeah we have a decent team working on different contributions but yeah that's it that's awesome man well I'm I'm super glad to have you and I'm sure we'll get into some interesting topics with you. But I'll give a shout out to everybody that's already in here watching. Welcome to the show, guys. And anybody that's watching that is unfamiliar with the show, this is why are we bullish?

And the way, and Phil made it back and you're not frozen, looking good, looking good. Thanks. So I was just saying to everybody watching, if you're unfamiliar, this is why are we bullish? The flow of the show, it's super chill. Pretty simple. We go by the three hours. Number one,

somebody's going to present a reason why they are bullish, some topic that is important to them, something that's top of mind, something that they're excited about. Number two, we're all going to riff together on that reason, ask questions, add anything that we have to say,

whatever it may be. And then number three, we're going to rotate. So all of us are going to get a turn. Really simple. Reason, riff, rotate. So I am going to start us off.

And the reason I had, I was saying, I had multiple reasons. I had a few things queued up. But then there's an interaction that I was partaking in just in the past, like, hour or so, just on Twitter. Somebody had tagged me in a post asking comments on a criticism that was posted. So I'm going to share my screen here really quick just to. So this was Austin M. Craig on Twitter.

And now right now you can't see the tweet that he quoted. I think that it was Roger Bear, of course. So I think Roger might have blocked him. But anyways, he was just asking about Lightning Network because Roger had posted this video of Nicholas Weaver, who is criticizing Bitcoin and Lightning. And I'm going to play the clip so that you guys can hear the criticism. And then we'll kind of dive into why I'm bullish,

there. Okay, so let me just, let me just get myself up here one sec. Okay, here's the clip for everybody to look at. Transactions can Bitcoin perform three to seven transactions per second second worldwide. The technology is so bad, I can only teach it to mock it. Doesn't lightning solve that? No, because the lightning network can only add three to seven users per second on a worldwide basis because any lightning transaction to create a channel, refund a channel, or close a channel requires a Bitcoin transaction. So lightning does not solve the problem. How the problem gets solved is what the Shiva wallet did, where you just update entries in a central database like any other payment system. Nicholas, I, first of all, I love your arguments and I've read a lot of your

stuff and watched your... So that's the gist of what he was saying. saying. So here's here's some of the main issues with what he's talking about. And Phil, I know I know you're a tad frozen right now, but that's okay. So number one, this guy is looking at it from a perspective of first, we were starting with Bitcoin can do X number of transactions per second originally. And that was constrained to one megabyte blocks. We added a segue that changed the way that you calculate basler transactions. That extends it. We've seen blocks that are much larger than one megabyte because you're no longer having to count the signature data in that equation.

But furthermore, it obviously enabled the Lightning Network. So we've gone from a place where, you know, this is a hard cap on transactions per second to without having to change the base layer infrastructure without having to do a non-backwards compatible change to that layer and call into question the other hard promises that it gives, we're able to scale both on-chain and then add lightning network. When you open a channel, of course, the only limitations are liquidity in whichever direction. So, and then bandwidth of your actual internet connections, more or less kind of what you're dealing with. So you could do potentially depending on your connection, infinite transactions within that singular,

within that singular channel. But the network as a whole, if everybody is using lightning, you know, millions of transactions per second. I don't know what the infrastructure would cap out at, but in general, an insane number of transactions per second. Now, his other argument was in and around, well, you can only onboard the number of transactions per second that the base layer can handle. So he's saying like seven people per second. But he has

a distinct misunderstanding of what a transaction is. A single transaction can have many, many outputs. And I was kind of curious as to how many outputs a single transaction can have. Like what's the largest that we've seen? And I did some digging around. And this, might be old. This might be actually an old record for the, the largest number of outputs in a single transaction. But the one that I found was from 2018, 20,000 inputs and 13,107 outputs. And so that and keep in mind that those inputs do not have to be a singular person, right? Because you can have collaborative transactions. That's effectively what coin joins are is multiple people collaborating into a single transaction to multiple outputs.

You could technically have all of those outputs be reestablishing channels or closing one channel and opening a new one through that same transaction. And so with even just with that on its face, it takes on like in just a direct example, technically speaking, that's not seven, that's not seven transactions per second. That's in a span of 10 minutes, a single Bitcoin settlement. This one transaction could have technically been 13,000 new lightning channels. Now, there's more to it than that. I'm oversimplifying here.

But that's one aspect of it. On top of it, in terms of scaling, there's so many other things that are going on. Of course, there's whether or not you like side chains. That is a scaling mechanism. And there's definitely distinct tradeoffs there. We've most recently been hearing about things like Fediment, where you can have your own federation of people that you yourself trust, having family members, having trusted community members, basically having a pool of funds in a large multi-sig.

But you can actually own a portion of that pool, cryptographic, be able to deposit and withdrawal from that fetament at any time, which also improves privacy and on-chain scaling because you can transact as many times as you want within the fetament. You can also connect from what I've seen. You could potentially connect different fetaments via lightning, which would only increase and open up the pool of people that you can transact with. And even beyond that, and I'm losing the name of the technology,

but, uh, or the implementation, but down the line, they're looking at the ability of you actually just being able to own a portion of a UTXO, not through Fetament, but through something else.

Um, so I find all of this scaling is very, very interesting. And at the end of the day, it kind of comes down to, the argument used to be that Bitcoin, cannot scale. And now the argument is Bitcoin cannot currently scale to the entire globe immediately. And so I just find that the goalposts are being shifted. And the fact of the matter is that in 2016, early 2017, even 2018, according to a lot of people, there's no way in hell I should be able to

non-custodially be receiving fractions of a penny per minute for individuals listening to perhaps this show. But that's literally happening right now. I can pull up my lightning note and I can see, you know, sometimes one sat at a time streaming in from somebody who's listening to the podcast or, you know, a few sats at a time. I'm not worried about scaling because again, Bitcoin doesn't scale until it does. And I think every criticism that we tend to see is Bitcoin can't do this right now. But now the arguments that we're seeing is Bitcoin cannot do this. It won't be able to do this.

And it cannot do it now. And they don't even realize that it can. It's currently doing the thing that they're saying it can't. So I am bullish this week because such a large portion of the world is totally a sleep on lightning. They have no idea what it's capable of now. And if they do know what it's capable of now, like this guy, he has totally wrong assumptions about how often you're opening and closing channels. And he has totally wrong assumptions of how an on-chain transaction equates to X number of channels. He thinks seven transactions per second means seven channels per second.

But as we've seen, a single transaction could represent 13,000 outputs. So people are asleep and it's going to be a slap in the face when they realize what's actually going on. So gentlemen, I will open it up to you for any comments, questions, whatever it may be in and around lightning, how it may scale, any general scaling mention, whatever you want to say. Not to mention, Ben, that 10 minutes on the main chain, sending X amount of money across the planet within 10 minutes, final settlement is also better than the legacy system that we're already in. It's not going to scale, but it's already better than that. I can send 5 grand to someone in Portugal right now, and it'll be on chain in 10 minutes, which is vital settlement, still better than what we're dealing with now. Yeah. I have a perfect example of this, too.

And I guess this could be my other reason for being bullish. So I'm going to a conference in France in a few weeks here. I'm going to surf in Bitcoin. And the organizers were gracious enough to say like, hey, we'll, we'll bring you out here. And we'll help with the flights. And I was like, cool. Well, if you're going to help with the flights, like, can you just send it in Bitcoin? Apparently it's a logistical nightmare for them to do it as a business entity.

I was like, oh, Jesus, I'm going to be dealing with a wire. There's no way there's not going to be a headache associated with this. And lo and behold, I got grilled on the phone. First of all, I had to send them. I sent them like, you know, basically like a blood sample, a picture of my taint and my firstborn child. And it still wasn't enough. They're like, we're going to need the original address of the bank branch at which you opened your account and I was like, where was I when I opened my bank account a decade and a half ago?

Yeah, when you were 11 years old. Yeah. It's like, okay. So I finally got that information to them. And then, and then of course, I get a call today, miss a call from a bank. And I'm like, oh, God. So I, and I thought it was a marketing call. And then I get the message.

And it's like, this is actually an important call. We do need to speak with you. this in a marketing call. I wait on hold for 20, 25 minutes. I get through to somebody. They're like, yeah. So are you expecting a wire after like making me jump through hoops to ensure I was who I was? And then they're like, so you're receiving this wire. And I was like, yes, I'm being reimbursed for a flight to a conference I'm going to be at. They're like, in the notes of what was being sent, it has your name. and then in brackets it has BTC. What is this?

What is this for? What are you doing? I was like, oh, Jesus Christ. So I basically had to be like, as like bank friendly terms as possible. I was like, I do a YouTube channel that's like a tech educational technology type thing. And sometimes I deal with and I tried to just throw terms at them that would be like,

just I was like public key cryptography in and around digital assets and the guy was like okay so it's not like yeah so he made notes of it anyways

it's not through yet and it's going for further review so when you talk about scaling anything other than this is fucking miraculous It's ridiculous.

But what's funny, what's funny is that they try to tout this system as being somehow superior, all because you're going through this trusted third party. So, I mean, obviously, look, what did you learn in this experience, right? You learned that your money is not yours. You're asking for permission. But the absolute psychotic thing is that you're validating who you are to a person that has no idea who you are, that you then have to trust to then come back to you to say that you are who you are. Like that is a total, I mean, don't get me wrong, but that is just ridiculous counterparty risk that makes absolutely no sense.

And even though I didn't go through the same scenario as you with a wire, I have had to move a lot of funds recently between accounts. And let me tell you something. Okay. Like these are the situations, the wire situations when you have to move more than 10,000 bucks. These are the situations where you find out that hard line in the sand that says, no, this is not your money. and you're asking for permission, and we are protecting you from yourself, which again, makes no sense. Anyways, I'm sorry, I didn't mean to cut in, but it just, yeah, it drives me crazy with the banks

and the wires and all their stupid red tape. It's almost like none of these people have ever actually gone through their own process. Like, if they did, they'd be like, what the hell are we doing? We're making people suffer for nothing. Exactly. Bon Hoddle's got it right. Yeah, something fixes this. If we could just fill in that first word there, I think we might be set.

I just kept on thinking the whole time like, man, if like when I first asked, like, can you just do it in Bitcoin? And it wasn't, it just wasn't possible for them. I was like, just to imagine the beauty that would have been, had I been like, hey, can you do it in Bitcoin? And it was like, absolutely what's your Bitcoin address? And then 10 minutes later, it was just mine. It's been, it's been like a couple of weeks. Like it's been, it's insane. And it's still technically, it's not there yet.

And even when it does get there, it won't officially be mine until it's not in that account anymore. Listen, what you're experiencing is security. What you're feeling right now is the feeling of monetary security. That's what's happening right there with your money floating in limbo in the banking world. I do feel much safer right now. I feel safely like I'm nestled in my little cocoon without any money. It's a safe feeling.

I don't know, Sue. Sully, maybe I'll go to you. Like, what are your feelings on? How is Bitcoin scaling? What have you witnessed over your time in Bitcoin? How do you feel? Where do you feel that we're at? Skating as scalability on lighting or in general?

I'd say in general. Like, I mean, the clip that I played, the guy is effectively saying that Bitcoin, he's entirely dismissive, not only that it, has scaled, but that it will scale. So how do you feel in this realm? First off, I mean, we're lucky that the West has been having so much content about Bitcoin, with or against, okay? I'm Lebanese, born and raised in the Middle East, moved to Europe, been covering Africa part of my Fiat job, and you can see different societies perceiving these messages, perceiving these messages differently. In Europe, okay, they might comment on the scalability,

but in the Middle East and Africa, for example, they don't care. They don't even think there because there are the basic principles for Bitcoin that makes a huge difference in the human's lives that counts, which has been accelerating the adoption of Bitcoin due to the economic issues, inflation issues, social issues in the Middle East and Africa. That's been accelerating big. And when it comes to scalability, like you hear, I don't know this guy Weaver, by the way, it was the first time I see his face. I'm sure I'm not going to look him up or follow the guy. But you hear these points about Bitcoin without looking what's happening in the crypto world they call, okay, maybe look into somewhere else. What about the scalability of the other systems when it comes to privacy, cost, the issues you mentioned about the banks?

It's all about privacy, speed and costs, right? Today, the daily active user costs for other coins would be vary between 300,000k per user to 60,000k per user. Lightning is almost free. So no one looks at that. I think the word is going to always be full of intellectually lazy people that don't want to be doing the work to look into information. I learned that people only learn by curiosity or pain. And unfortunately, it's going to be the latter that will work.

Yeah, we'll get into why I'm bullish later on. But, yeah, that's my two sides. I agree. I think they only learn through pain. Roger must be a masochist then, because he's he's just really just what's this what's it called with the the the japanese where you take the samurai sword and you just he's just he's been sitting there for like five years just sepaku i can't remember how what is called but it's uh it's close to that yeah yeah but uh

yeah he's i guess he just needs more pain um fustler i don't know what what are your feelings on on scaling for bitcoin I'm, you know, are you active using lightning? Thoughts? Yeah, I'm definitely not super technical on it. I've been kind of learning the last little bit. I mean, I run my note. I've got some channels. I moved to this new place a couple months ago,

and there was literally like during the packing up of things and moving my node went down and it was totally crashed. I had to like reflash the thing. It was the whole thing. So it was like three weeks of just trying to like get my life in order at this new place to get it back online. And a bit of a just the timing was terrible. also a bunch of channels closed and stuff.

So I'm still kind of learning the, the world of lightning. But, you know, part of when I get to my my field, too, is, you know, I had Jordy from lightning labs at my house here, set up a BTC paste server to sell some merch and stuff for some of the meetup. So, you know, I've got a learning as we go. You know, I mean, obviously lightning is the solution to scaling. So, like, who was that guy? Like, do you, like I'm, you know, and again, like I said, I'm a club.

I'm only a couple of years into Bitcoin. So I'm pretty due to the space. But do we know, like, was that guy a, is that a, is that a voice in the, like, who is that guy? Yeah. So his, his, his, um, his bio on Twitter researcher at ICSI and chief math scientist, uh, CEO at scary technologies, like S K E RR, uh, why. Uh, but I looked up I C-S-I and. I'm, I'm, I'm somewhat uncertain if this is the right ICSI because it was intracitoplasmic sperm

injection. So that might be him. That's definitely. I mean, that would explain the complete discrepancy and understanding. So, yeah. You swallow a lot of that stuff. You might go a little crazy. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm not sure if that's his area of expertise, but very real possibility. I don't know. So let's just round this out. I will say anybody watching that is unsure about the scalability of Bitcoin,

I recommend you try a number of things. First things first would just be trying a lightning wallet. And you can do so non-custodially. Of course, there are custodial lightning wallets out there. They're very easy to use. But so are a lot of these kind of in-between measures where you don't need to run a node out of the gate. I do recommend playing around running a node down.

the line. But if you just want to get your toes wet and you want to try out lightning transactions, go download Moon Wallet, M-U-U-N. That's a good option. Breeze wallet, B-R-E-E-E-Z, Phoenix Wallet, which is, I believe, just on Android. There's a number of great options where basically all of the channel creation and all that is put off in the background, and there's some, a little bit of magic happening there. But the important part is you don't have to jump through hoops and know exactly how it's working. You're sending and receiving Bitcoin transactions non-custodially and using lightning. So I recommend trying that out. And then if you want to dive down that rabbit hole, then yeah, look into running a node. I've got tutorials on all that kind of stuff. But just try it out.

And if you're not convinced, then we can talk. But we'll. But we're that we'll leave this topic we're going to do a little rotation here uh so i'm just i hopefully i'm not putting anybody on the spot but i'm just going in the order on my screen so sully i'm going to you man so uh i'm going to let you rant for a little bit um but i will say first to the people in the in in the chat keep those comments coming i'll keep pulling them up uh like share whatever you can uh but sully you are up next uh what are you excited about this week what has you bullish This week, I mean, in general, we'll say. Well, I'll be forgiving with the time frame here.

That's fine. This week and in general, things on a global scale are really negative, dark, and you don't see hope anywhere. If you look really into everything, from mainstream media to economics to politics, to health, to whatever you want to call it. The same has been happening for centuries. One of the positive things that leads to my bullishness on Bitcoin is that today, I think the awareness about money is at its best compared to the last decades and the last ever in history.

I mean, today, due to the problems happening. in the world, there are so much activism. There's so much people advocating for freedom. And I think the Austrian economics, school of economics, never had so much awareness outside Europe and specific more than 2022. This in itself is a great signal that things will get faster in motion. Hello, hello. What's her name or his name Foster? You're on mute by the way. That's disco. Disco the beagle and he keeps going in and out because he wants his lunch but okay he can join the stream get him a whiskey. Cool. So like and like we were saying like people will only learn with pain. Like I've been saying things

really for Bitcoin adoption really accelerating in Lebanon, in Angola, South West Africa. And we're witnessing this starting in Europe, in the West, in the oldest continent. And things are the same are also happening in the States. Today, there's a global fear of inflation. And companies are pricing that in, but few are considering the global recession is starting in the near future. And that will have, in my opinion, I don't want to seem very negative,

but it's going to have worse consequences on everybody. And there's only one thing that people would need to learn about, and that's Bitcoin. Today, I was able to empty my Lebanese bank account with Bitcoin, like escaping from the Lebanese economic issues through Bitcoin and making a profit on it. That was my own story that helped me and that have been helping many in Lebanon

and in the world we're encountering the same issues. And I see the same signaling that happened in Lebanon and Africa. Now it's starting in the West. Bitcoin is the solution. And it's going to be just, it's going to be, I don't think it's going to be super quick, but we're still very early. So yeah, that's why I'm bullish.

I love that. I think you're right. People are starting to kind of wake up to the reality. Even if they don't fully understand what's going on, they do recognize that there's dishonesty afoot, right? They do recognize, like, they're being told one thing, you know, whether it's that it's that. that inflation isn't happening or or this is somehow good for you.

Um, or it's, it's, it's, you know, whatever other issues fault, but it's been going on longer than said thing. Um, I, I think people realize that there's, there's an element of dishonesty here and that something else can work when they see it actually work. Um, you know, like, even just in terms of recognizing what's going on, um, You have examples of, like this is from last year, but there was, there was an article from the Financial Times that was like, let's all please stop calling dollars fiat money. And that's that's an article. Like nobody ever called it fiat money before, like as far as regular people on the street. But now people, that's a term that a lot of people are familiar with.

than like the begging of people, the hilarity of somebody saying like, guys, please, let's stop. You know, it's not a meme. Come on. It's our dog. I just think it's so so funny that and the money printer go burr meme and all of these things where, again, kind of that meme warfare where people are are poking fun at how ridiculous the existence, the existing system is and that it needs to be fixed.

Even if a lot of people haven't yet found the solution, they know the problem. But I'll open it up to Phil and Fustler if you guys want to throw in some comments there. You want me to go first, Fustler? Okay. Yeah. So look, you know, this is kind of the thing, right? It's, you know, people always talk about,

I think that this has to do with hyper, Bitcoinization, what you know, what Suli was talking about. You know, people know what the problem is. And, you know, you can see the solution. And a lot of times people sit there and say, well, when is hyper-bitquinization happening? It's like, this is the point. It's happening right now. It was happening the day that that white paper dropped. It was actually happening even before that white paper dropped, you know, as Satoshi or the entity that we call Satoshi was figuring it out. You know, like all of this, like you look back at all of these pieces and they were, it's like we've said before, right? Bitcoin was inevitable.

and this was inevitable. And unfortunately, right? Unfortunately, what Bitcoin does is that it exposes all of our incentives. And this is something I've said a thousand times. And many Bitcoiners, you know, before me have said that as well. And it's the truth. And the reason why that's so important is because entities, it doesn't matter how big they are. It doesn't matter how much influence they have. Like, you know, like in your case, Suli, the Lebanese government, it's like, look, you were able to just opt right out of the system and get into Bitcoin. And now they can't do anything. They literally can't do anything with the exception of physical force to get you to physically hand over your Bitcoin. Well, let's be honest, it's not a very practical means of getting somebody's wealth. So governments are going to have to devise much more creative ways to do this because of Bitcoin. And as Bitcoin continues to essentially make its foothold in the everyday world, governments are increasingly going to going to have to figure out different ways to, you know, to essentially trick us out of custody, custodying our own Bitcoin. So, you know what? I mean, look, I'm not, you know, I'm not worried, but I'm definitely, I'm bullish on the fact that they're afraid of Bitcoin. I agree. Also, to add to your

point, big red flag of people tell you not to custody your own coins or that it's dangerous to custody your own coins. Red flag, red flag. If you want executive order 6102, go ahead and do that. But learn to self-custody. Like, Bitcoin is about personal responsibility. Have enough personal responsibility to be able to write down and keep 24 words safe. If you can't do that, then should you own a house? Should you own any other? tangible assets, you probably shouldn't fucking own anything because you're incapable of taking a little bit of personal responsibility. If you can't take 24 words and keep them safe somewhere, then maybe you need to examine your life choices. But I digress. I'm going to toss at the fustler.

Yeah, I'll like you. I made some bad life choices, but Bitcoin isn't one of them. So I'm pretty happy to have it found me a couple years ago because just a full, full pivot, you know, I think Bitcoin's pretty political, but it changed my political views, like how I see a lot of things, you know, started learning, like, I didn't know what Fiat meant. I didn't even know what that was. I didn't get the system, you know, like, reading layered money was like, I'm fucking just like, okay, that's, that's interesting. Fractional reserve banking, didn't totally get that, totally get that.

Like, you know, just to kind of build on, like, what, coin it, Chris, I think that's how you say it, right, coin knickers. You know, this magazine right here, right? Like, what Canada did when that trucker, that freedom convoy was going and, you know, shutting down millions of dollars that were trying to be, you know, sent to these people in Ottawa and, you know, shut that down. And then I'm about to get into the nuts and bolts, but I know, you know, you and Greg and Jeff kind of created a Bitcoin thing.

And then that got heat, right? That got pressure and shit, shit went side. ways there. So, you know, I think what a, what a, what a, like, global view of, like, why, like, why to Bitcoin, you know, like shutting down a fundraising platform and, like, stopping those funds from getting to those people was just, like, just such a fucking red flag. And I don't know if you guys are both in Canada as well, like Suley and Conichrist, but not, not too stoked on the directions that, that are fearless leader, Justin Trudeau, or is his take. in this country.

So a little sketchy, but it's all right. That's why we can. I agree. I think, you know, Bitcoin is needed. If one thing gave me some peace of mind through this whole cluster fuck earlier in the year, it was that when I was thinking like, oh, shit, they might actually shut down my bank account. I might be sitting here.

And in my head, I was like, well, I mean, on the bright side, they won't get a any fucking money. So that's nice. But, but it still, it would have been a pain in my ass, like figuring out, okay,

well, you know, what bills were coming out of there and I'd have to get invented. But like, at the very least, the majority of all my wealth was protected.

And I think that's, that's important. I think that's incredibly useful. And the same goes for like, even the donations. A lot of people don't, fully know exactly what ended up happening. Some of it got seized because of a timing issue and a bug in some wallet software and stuff like that. But like we're talking like 30%, 70% is in the

directly in the hands of individual truckers. And to my knowledge has not been seized. And a bunch of it has since been redeemed and put in different wallets. So and when those are the only donations that made it through, like in the face of like probably the worst best practices out of the gate because of bad assumptions of the gate, it's still, it's still got a passing grade. Seems like a use case to me. Yes, it seems like it might be useful in some instances. And, you know, Canada isn't the only example, obviously. You know, even, you know, hot button topic, but like in Russia both, for,

prior to the war and currently, you see it on both sides. Individuals in Russia that have had been sanctioned and just like can't use a regular bank accounts and they're just regular citizens, this is a way that you can transact globally. I know a girl who looked at the Canadian protest and she does a lot of working around human rights and stuff like that. And she wanted to get protective equipment into Ukraine. She looked at that and she used it as a template to be able to use Bitcoin to purchase like helmets and vests for people that weren't allowed to leave and had to stay in a war zone.

And she was able, it was going to take her weeks with Fiat ramps. It took her two days with Bitcoin. And she used the Canadian trucker protest as an example. And even prior to this, like dissidents within Russia, they, they've had a static address, a static Bitcoin address to raise funds for opposition to Putin. and we were talking to some of the people that like do the fundraising for that and we're like, you know, like just so you know best practices, you should probably get a wallet where it generates a new, maybe use BTC pay server.

And they're like, honestly, we don't give a fuck if they know how much we raise because they can't touch it because the keys aren't in the country. So fuck them. So like it just kind of goes to show the censorship resistant when like for them, when they're like, yeah, they know that we hate them and that we. We're basically dissidents. They know that we're raising money. Great.

Let them see the balance. Wonderful. They'll know that they can't stop it. So there is an element of the, you know, unfuckwithable money there at play. And yes, I would say to people in situations where, you know, you're trying to protect yourself at the same time and you want some of that privacy afforded to you, then yes, best practice does out the gate. BTC pay server with a new address every single time. Coin join those funds after the fact. Um, you know, multi-sig works, but you got to make sure that the keyholders

aren't public within the jurisdiction because then they can clap down on the keyholders. There's a lot of stuff to think about. The tools are there. But at the end of the day, you can send and receive and use Bitcoin without permission. There's no switch that they can turn off and they want to get it. they need either physical force or they need to go through the court system. And in some instances that may not even work if you're good enough with storage. So yeah, yeah, I don't know. So you get your Bitcoin off exchanges, human beings. If you're listening, that was the key takeaway there.

Yeah. If you're storing your own shit, it can't fucking get it. Yeah. Self custody for sure. I don't know. Silly, do you want to add anything like with the grants that you've heard? from anybody here. Well done.

And I've been following up closely at the beginning of the truckers and what you and the guys have been contributing to and well done. And I know I think there has been a lot of

pros and cons feedback from the Bitcoin Twitter space. But it's like, it was the first experience for Bitcoin in such like, I'm sure that Bitcoin has been used for similar situations before,

but for the first time it got so much attention from different people. And it's been like a sample for Bitcoin to be used like just in Ukraine, in Russia, and everywhere in the world. I think it's going to only make activism stronger. For me, personally, I've worked in the humanitarian world before shifting to corporate for about 15 years. I've seen cash programs in the humanitarian field work really bad.

Really bad. I'm talking about work on the borders with Syria, Lebanon. People need money, but you can't trace it. So the donors are giving away money for a specific purpose. You want to give milk for babies or like winter. kids for harsh environments for families living in tents, etc. But you have groups buying weapons, buying other stuff with cash. And they tell you that Bitcoin is being used for illicit stuff.

So let's not let's say a grill Bitcoin being pseudonymous. why don't we grill the government's not putting enough controls on sorting their shit, right? Yeah, yeah, absolutely. It's interesting because there's this kind of, there's two ways that you can approach the way that Bitcoin functions. So in instances where you need auditability and that you're not fundraising in necessarily an adversarial environment where the government's trying to decipher exactly who donated and exactly where it's going, in environments where it's just like humanitarian aid and you need that auditability to make sure

you're not being taken for a ride, you can absolutely have it. You can have a static address and then you can audit everywhere that that Bitcoin goes from there and you can demand that of the foundations that you're donating to, right? Like we want a static address. We want to see on the chain where those funds go and what they're used to purchase. And we want the fucking receipts. But in the opposite end of the spectrum, when needed, you can use the appropriate tools to anonymize those funds from the moment of donation so that you can actually shelter yourself from totalitarian governments. So it's very interesting.

And I think retaining the on-chain audibility on a base layer, but then providing the privacy tools on top. Because I mean, in an instance where, like you're talking about, a humanitarian organization, if they start using a bunch of privacy tools and coin joining, you'll be like, what the fuck are you doing? What's the money doing? Why did this immediately go into a mixer?

And you can start asking those questions or just not donate to that foundation. but in an environment where it's like, you know, and that was kind of the double-edged sword that we're dealing with, a lot of Bitcoin is don't trust verify. We want to know that these funds are getting to the right people. But when the government is like, hey, this is retroactively illegal, it's like, well, how do you, how do you then show like this is going to the right place and grapple with that or just say like, trust me, bro, it's in the right hands.

How do you, how do you do that? And so, you know, that's a whole other conversation. But yeah, you're right. You need in those instances where that's not a factor, you need that auditability. You need that accountability. And I think that's a good thing. So, yeah. I have to do something for somebody in the chat here.

This goes out. I had a request. We didn't hear an Odell pop. I'm sorry. I had my mic off. I was being courteous to my guess, but... Oh, that hurt my ears. There you go.

Very soothing. Yeah, yeah, very soothing. Shout out of D'Ell. I should probably invite him back on at some point. I'd love to have him, but... What's the bottle you're drinking again, Ben? What is it? It's few.

Few. Few. It's, uh, it is straight bourbon whiskey. It's 46.5% alcohol, 93 proof. Uh, it is, I mean, it's few. Don't need to know much else. Let me,

let me, just before we move on, he's actually one of the people I'm going to mention when I, when I do my thing. But, well, unless we're moving on, we can just,

where are we at? We moving on? Well, I mean, if you want to throw in something, oh, and actually, you know what,

I'll bring up somebody's in a second, but you go ahead and then once you're done, we'll move on to the next topic. Yeah, it ties into the bottle. So, so first, I guess,

will just start with kind of the last three months, what's kind of happened in the last three months to give people kind of an idea. So I was looking for meetups in Vancouver. I didn't really find it. This is going back even a year and a half ago. I'm like, oh, I think I like to meet some people, kind of looked it up. Obviously, we're in the middle of COVID and all the bullshit. So there wasn't a lot, kind of waited and about three months ago again. I'm like, oh, we're, you know, people are kind kind of getting back to normal. I'm sure there's probably something going on. Looked it up. The only thing I saw was Vancouver Bikwiners. Shout out to them, which is who you were here doing your sessions with

when you were here a couple weeks ago. Awesome people. Went to the first meetup that they were doing just to kind of meet a few bitcoinsers. You know, they had a few people. It was great. I'm still friends with some of them now, which is awesome, which was kind of the whole point. But kind of told that I was going to create another community as well.

So I was having a beer with a friend. He's like, yeah, you should totally do it. I'm like, yeah, I'm going to do it. so decided I would. So I created the first one. And I was hoping for 20 people was kind of like, like that would be cool. Get 20 people out. Shout out to Judah, Jadie's Barbershop, if you are in Vancouver.

That's where we did the first one. So he donated the space, you know, just created the meetups thing. Suddenly there was 30, then there was 40, then there was 50 people like RSVP. I'm like, okay, this is bigger than I thought. And I think we ended up with about 60, 60 something like that. So kind of as that was going, you know, I was getting more people. I'm like, oh, maybe, you know, maybe shake pay or like maybe there's a company in Canada that would like maybe jump on this, right?

So reached out to them. Immediately they were like 100%. Yep, we're in. So I'll just pause there for a second because what I'm bullish on. I should probably start with that is people and human beings in the space right now. So that's kind of where this is going is people and different groups So anyway, created the first one

ShakePage jumped on, great event, met some rad people Some of them are in your chat right now on YouTube. So yeah, what I wanted to do is just kind of throw out a few shoutouts because there's some great people that I've met and that's when I'm bullish on is, is human.

So Das record, who you just put up, he's a doctor here in Vancouver, amazing Bitcoin. He's DJed all, three events so far and DJing the next one. Very knowledgeable guy though as well and I've learned a lot from him in some spaces. So shout out to him. Good guy bikers in the crowd here.

He was a speaker at the first meetup we did at the barbershop there. There he is there. Getting to the whiskey or the bourbon. So there was another speaker that we had at the first one. Colin Sullivan, he's from Mint Green. That's the mining company. That's in Burnaby. which is partnering with the city of Vancouver.

It's a Lawnsdale Energy Corporation. They are already mining. I think by the end of this year, so they're basically doing immersion mining, taking that hot liquid, if it's oil or whatever they use, going through a heat exchange, heating water through the heater, and then they're pumping in the water to heat.

It's like 100 plus homes in Lower Lonsdale, which is where I just moved. So I bought this, and found out during his meetup, during his speaking at my meetup, that my building is going to be heated by the water from the Bitcoin mining, which was just like a full circle, like random thing. So shout out to Colin. Make Green, they're doing awesome things. You were showing me some photos. We had wine the other night and showing me some amazing things that are coming. And one of those things is in, it's not far from here. It's kind of up north, I think, but Campbell River, I think,

or something. So he's now creating another mining setup, but it's tied in with like a, like a, I think they do beer as well, but if not, they're definitely doing whiskey. So there's talks of some Bitcoin whiskey being being made, which is kind of like, you know, the miners are going to be heating their facility and doing some stuff. So that's pretty dope. So look forward to that. So yeah, my list here. So a couple others. So Seth Bunny, another speaker at my first event. He's partners with Greg Foss. He lives in Whistler, Greg and him. And I'm going to blank on their names right now,

but some other great Bitcoiners. They've created Lookingglass, education.com, Dazvia, I think is one of them, James Lavish, maybe, I think. So they've got this brand new sort of, you know, platform that can go on and take some courses and things.

So that's, like, amazing on the, you know, kind of education side of things. Obviously, we'll tie Ben into this, too, like what you're doing and your videos and stuff. It's always, you know, I think the first thing that people say, if you want to learn something, you go to VT sessions. So another great human that I'm bullish on. You know, Greg Foss was one quick question.

Would you come to a meetup? Yes. Like, that was it. Okay. Greg as like a default. Greg and Jeff were both like, you ask them and if they're like available. And even before you give them a date or anything, you're like, can you do a, yeah, absolutely.

I'll be there. Is it for Bitcoin? Is it for people that are interested in Bitcoin? I'm fucking there, which is great. Yeah. And that's exactly what it was. And same with Jeff.

Jeff, would you be interested in participating? Yes. It was just like, there was no, like, you know, there's no,

Greg flew on his own dime. You know, like he just, he flew here and like, went home out with Seb in Whistler and did some mountain biking. Jeff lives in Vancouver area. So that's a little bit easier to lock him down.

So he's next week. If anyone's listening, go to meetups.com and look for BTC Bend City and you can RSDP and come to that meetup next week. Super stoked on that. Another little tangent here. I was working one day, had Twitter open and I saw the person will remain anonymous. That's what they asked. But just a message came up.

Anyone interested in Bit Block Bloom, the conference coming up at the end of August in Austin? I just put it like a meme, just like someone putting their hand up, right? And within 10 minutes, I've had a ticket in my name transferred to me for the, you know, it's a thousand dollar, you know, U.S. dollar ticket for Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday. So I'm like, oh, I guess I'm going to my first conference. So, you know, book the hotel, book the flight, you know, just, just a thousand dollar ticket handed over. Thank you very much.

Artists, I've started to try to incorporate some art into the meetups as well. You know, we had 170, 10675 people at the last one with Greg. So I thought, you know, we should probably get some artists involved. So this piece here is from certain Orange. Jesse, he's from Pennsylvania. He paid $700 of his own money to ship art here. So there was three pieces to show. And I was trying to do like a silent auction type of thing, get him all the stats.

So I'm going to reshow them at this next one with Jeff. So artists, I'm stoked on. Lena is the other one. Lena, what is it? I got it open here. Lena, if you want to follow her, just Lena's art on Instagram. She does.

She looks for shoes too. Yeah, it's the kick. So she just put them in the mail yesterday. So I'm going to have one show up here. I hope it makes it in time. It should. So we're going to, same thing. I'm going to kind of sign an auction off or do whatever.

So she's sending shoes, you know, that she orange pills and puts red art on. Jordan from Lightning Labs came here like I said earlier set up my BTC pay server like it's just it's like a yes

crash the yes people everyone's like would you like you want to help me? Yes would you like to be involved in this? Yes. L-E-N-A Alien that's another girl

fucking shout out to Alien ALN. She's a writer and she's looking for some work right now she just got laid off so if she's she's awesome she's been to every event I think so far as well here in band so she's dope as well she is okay magazine can you send me

20 copies or 10 copies of the bitcoin yeah they were here within like two days um it's just like it's just i can keep going i've got a list so you know i'll probably probably pause it there um oh minor the last one the last one at the first event this home boy walks in at the end do you want do you want a minor i'm like okay so he gave me two s-nines gave Judah an S9, gave another guy in S9 because he was sad because he didn't get one. So he handed out S-9s, stayed in touch with him. I ended up with 36 S-9s. They're still in my storage locker downstairs.

So I've got a storage locker full of miners from this dude. Like, it's just hilarious, man. So I'm bullish on people, the Bitcoin community. And lastly, all of the plebs that are coming to the event, obviously the event isn't anything unless you show up. So thank you for everyone in Vancouver. That's her. Yeah, there she is. She's doing rad stuff.

So I got a sneaker on the way here. And so we'll have one of her things. She's living in Dubai right now. I don't know if she's going to stick around there or not. She's from Germany. Germany. Yeah. Yeah.

I met her. I met her when I was in Miami. I was looking at the kicks that she had up. But, yeah, she's super awesome. I think she's going to be in, I think she's going to Riga. So anybody that's going to Baltic, Baltic Honey Badger, you can probably catch her there. She's got a ton of cool shit. But anyways, we're checking out.

There's so many awesome people in Bitcoin that are more than willing to, like, give their time and just help people. And I think it's just such an incredible thing that people are willing to, you know, educate, spend time, spend money, like give away free shit. just for people to learn. I think that's such a valuable thing. Like you said, like Voss just on his own dime flying out, that's awesome. I love when people do stuff like that. I'm incredibly bullish on the people in the space, and I don't want to take up too much, too much time talking here.

But maybe I'll toss it to Bill here first, and I'll say I'll I'll toss it to Phil and I'm going to get your take on some of your favorite people in the space that you think contribute in an awesome way like in whatever way that that you've witnessed.

Oh my gosh. That is that that's tough and it's definitely tough to like summarize that. I mean, okay so I'm going to just start off by you know because I'm Canadian. So I'll just apologize for everyone that I don't mention, right? that I just completely forget that I shouldn't.

But if we're, you know, if we're talking about, I'll start, I'll start with artists, right? I'm a huge, I'm a huge fan. I'm a huge fan of Maidex. I love, I love his, I love his style. I also love cryptograffiti, right? I hope I'm pronouncing that correctly. Crypto graffiti's work is amazing. Yeah, Maidex.

He is just awesome. I bought a piece from him recently. I also like Hoddler dot rocks. I also like Vizek. These are great. These are people putting out awesome, incredibly. I find deep, very symbolic pieces. It's very interesting that Bitcoin, you know, that Bitcoin inspires people this way because

I don't know how much Fiat money has inspired art with the exception of making it cheaper and making it more available at like Walmart or Target. know, like besides that, I don't know how much of this type of, you know what I mean, this type of quality, it's inspired. Now, going back to what Fusler, you know, was saying, I'm definitely bullish on the people of Bitcoin. I think that that's absolutely amazing. And I think that, you know, right now we're sitting in what a lot of, let's say, normies or maybe even people, you know, who haven't been around like, you know, they call this a bear market, right? We're sitting at 23K well above our previous all-time highs in a Bitcoin bear market. Okay. So let's just, let's just keep that

in focus. And you've got all. all these amazing builders in the space, right? People like Seed Siner, you've got people like Jesterfer, right, that are building Ambos, which is fantastic. You know, like when it comes to lightning and everything like that, if you want to go and if you want to decide to monetize your liquidity on Lightning, you can, you know, you can go and check out the Ambos site and see what they're doing. And, you know, these guys, what they're doing is they're making the user experience

more accessible to more people to be able to use this functionality. And this actually goes back to something that you said at the beginning of the show. I don't know if it was Ben or if it was Suli or Fusler. I apologize. I don't know who said it. But essentially, oh, damn it, it's gone. I was so busy trying to figure out who said it. I forgot what it was.

Anyways, I'm bullish on the people of Bitcoin. I'm bullish on the builders of Bitcoin. And I think that this is just a really great time for everybody to get away from the noise and continue with the building because in these quote unquote bear markets, this is where the building gets done. And I just remembered what it was. It had to do with the internet. It had to do with the fact, like, I remember being a kid. I remember using the internet, having a 56k modem, having a 33k modem. Trust me, you weren't getting like, you're waiting like three days for a song, sometimes a week for a song. Okay. And everyone was sitting there telling you, yeah, that's, you know, the internet.

You're not going to be able to do much. You're not going to be able to watch movies. You know, blockbuster was like, ah, streaming. We don't need to worry about streaming. And then you see the, you see the little hay rolls blowing by the empty blockbusters now

because they're gone. Because streaming. So you know what? When people tell me that Bitcoin isn't going to happen, it's happening. And I'm bullish on all the people that are deciding to make this real. This is a shared reality that we are choosing

to make more real every day. Yeah. I would, I want to say one thing. I want to say, number one, Seed Siner, so badass. Like you can build, I've got one kicking around.

I got my little box of toys in here, but you can make one from like, this is like a 3D printed case that I got from another Pleb, Black Coffee, BTC on Twitter. The parts and everything are just like run of the mill. You can grab them on Amazon. Nobody would ever know that you have a hardware wallet or anything. You can create and manage.

Bitcoin keys on this device. It's stateless. You unplug it. It doesn't retain the seed. You retain it elsewhere. It's literally just a signing device. Pretty fucking cool. I played with it a bunch before. I've done a cobble videos on these. They're awesome. But beyond the seed signer, what I truly wanted to mention is, is there's somebody who contributes so much to Bitcoin. His name is Narwhal Tacos. And he does long form Satoshi-inspired interpretive dance. And I, I think that it's high time that somebody talked about him on a podcast. Because nobody's doing it. It's very important.

We're going to bring him on PLEB Underground. I was actually just writing his name down because, you know, he's an awesome dude. And we all need to experience this interpretive dance. I agree. I agree, Ben. It's, it's, I mean, I've got a wife and everything, but it's, it's oddly erotic to me when he does it from time to time. I think it's the injection of Bitcoin culture into his interpretive dance.

it's irresistible, might I say. Are they recorded? Like, can you go and look at the different dances that he's done? Or is this just a... I mean, I think it's usually like, it's typically a one-on-one setting, but, you know, I'm sure you can... It's not to stay off the dancing.

It makes... You know, when there's finally only sats, when you can get an only sats account, I'm sure that normal tacos will have... You can sign up and subscribe and, you know, he'll send you personal videos. So, uh,

Ben, I got to, I got to say one more piece because they're a sponsor of your show. They also have been sponsoring, uh, my meetup. So coin kite, they've been sending cold cards.

Shut up. Um, bunch of cold cards, a bunch of seed plates, some, some swag hats, all that stuff. So they've also been awesome and,

uh, and sending stuff for every event to, to give away to people at the event. So shout out to coin kite as well. cold card and make sure you have one of those and aren't using it. I'm going to put the two worlds together because here's the cold card. But Phil, you just mentioned Maidex. This case is beautiful.

So did you get that from the Maidx website or from Coin Kite? No, I need that. No, I got it from Crypto Cloaks. Crypto Cloaks makes it. Yeah. I should know this. I suck. Okay.

Yeah. Yeah. So they make these cases. Cripto Cloak sent me a few cases for the Mark 4. And this is by far my favorite one. It's just, it's so cool. If you're looking for colors, the gold with the black is pretty choice. I'm very happy with my decision there.

So, but yeah, Madex doing awesome work. So many awesome bitcoins. But again, I think the takeaway here is that interpretive dance trumps all of it. So silly, I'm going to toss it to you. So if you have maybe some Bitcoins that you think of have contributed incredible things to the space, what are you seeing? What's your favorite things that you're seeing coming out? Talk about artists.

I mean, there are many, many. I can only think of Brecki for now. Brecki's the culture. Yeah. So shout out to Brecki. Contributions when it comes to on a philosophical level. level breed love of course when it comes to economics i think gregg has been crushing it how long he's he was he got parachuted on my radar last year i think and ever since i think

yeah that's brecky and uh gregg for um macros when it comes to uh i think i mean i i I'm not going to mention too many names just because there are so many. I'm going to give just a shout out to one of the leading Arabic contributors to Bitcoin content just because there isn't many. There aren't many. His Twitter handle is Arabic huddle. And he has the main Bitcoin Arabic website. The website is Bitcoinarabic.org.

basically. And he's been, yeah, he's been working with Gigi. He worked. He did great, great translations. He's been, of course, contributing with many, many other bitcoins. But yeah, I can only think of him for now. I think it's so important that we get more Bitcoin content accessible in multiple languages.

You know, like, I know there's a ton of people working on translations in Spanish, obviously, but Arabic is another big one. If I'm not mistaken, like obviously things like the Bitcoin standard would be available in Arabic, given that also. He contributed, he did part of the translations by the way to food.

Oh, perfect. Oh, that's amazing. Yeah, I think that people doing translations are doing Satoshi's work because the more accessible you can make this to more places, the better.

I think, unfortunately, because it can be different to get content in in certain languages, certain groups of people are going to be more susceptible to the the malicious intent of shitcoiners trying to, you know, get you in on the next pump and dump so that you can be their exit liquidity. But when you have good content, once you've consumed good content and you understand what's up and you understand how Bitcoin is different, then you're much more immune to that type of malicious intent.

And you can just sidestep it. But if you don't have the knowledge, if you literally have never been exposed to it, and it's not accessible to you because you don't speak the language in which things have been translated to, then you're kind of left the wolves. And so, yeah, the people that are doing the translation are, it's so important, so integral to Bitcoin and a greater understanding and getting that Bitcoin standard going. that I hope we see more of it. So shout out Arabic hodal. The only thing I know how to say is marhabah.

Is that right? Yeah, that's right. Okay, I know how to do. What did you just call me? I'm a guest. I get guest on this show. The only other thing. So like back in the day, I dated a girl that was actually Lebanese for about three

and a half years, but I was super young. so I was like enough of an asshole that I didn't learn like much of the language. But the one thing I do recall was, and I don't even recall the like polite way to say it, but I remember how to say anabadi echo, which is I want to eat, I think. Is that correct? Yeah, correct, yeah. But that's about it. That's the extent of my knowledge of Arabic.

You don't need more, I think, nowadays. Marhabah, anabadi, acal. That's all I need to know. Hey, Ben, just before we move on to, Chris, where is, like, just because we're on the people thing, where is your number one fan? Is he okay? I haven't seen any. Oh, yeah, I know. David Wong, maybe he's just feeling down on himself because Bitcoin's not dead yet.

But anybody who's unfamiliar, my number one fan, David Wong, he shows up almost every week. He's always in the chat. He sometimes he's here, like, way in advance. At one point, he showed up to a show like two hours early. I think. So he's here for like weeks on end, watching every show. He fucking hates Bitcoin, but he's here religiously. And so he comes and he's like, he just wants to hit up the chat and let us know that we're all hideously wrong about the trajectory of this thing.

That it's, he always lets us know that his bank account and his credit cards work perfectly. And there's no need for this. He does seem to dabble in the XRP from time to time. and just in general, he just wants us to know that Bitcoin will never reattain its previous all-time high, and that is doomed to fail. And I value his commentary, and I think he's a unique soul, and I hope he continues to come back. I miss you, David, please return.

My favorite, my favorite are the people that tell you that Bitcoin is dead, Bitcoin is going nowhere, but here's my shit coin. So I think that I, this is, it's the epitome. of not taking the time to understand Bitcoin, because once you've actually understood Bitcoin, you understand, if Bitcoin goes away, your shitcoin's not replacing it. Like, that's, that's what you're not understanding. Exactly. Where's Wong? Well, you know what? David, Wong is probably wrong. But that's awesome. Dude, I love the haters. The haters are absolutely the best when they come around and they talk to you about how terrible and how wrong you are about Bitcoin.

It's like, you know what, then don't buy it. Do me that favor. I couldn't care. less. I don't need you. The best was I was on a blue collar Bitcoin. Those guys are awesome. And so they've got and they always have haters in the chat. And I was like, I would love it. If there was, if you had a hater come in and their handle was white collar fiat. And then somebody made the account and started visiting the show. So I'm super excited to see that happen. I think my favorite, my favorite moment of a meme coming to life was I did that like over a year ago now. I did that epic show and it had like Sailor and Mallors and Pish and American Hoddle and Jeff Booth all together in one show. And then near the end, like it went from like a pretty well constructed conversation.

But then it ran three and a half hours. People filtered in and out. And at the end, it was like me, American Hot. And then like it was it was, uh, Marty, it was sorry, it was Matt O'Dell. And he was like already drunk on he was like super drunk on the whiskey. And he was screaming at Bitcoin Tina for being a bear for not saying we're going to hit like half a mill by the end of the year. And meanwhile, American Hoddle just had a ham sandwich.

And he was like this close to the camera. And he was just listening and just like just like close up on his mouth as he as he ate this ham sandwich. And so somebody created a Twitter account called Hoddle Sandwich. And it's a ham sandwich with laser eyes. So then I'm at Bitcoin 2021 in Miami. And, you know, I'm meeting a bunch of people. And some guy is like, hey, man, you know, watch this show from time time.

Shaked my hand. And then he leans in really close to my ear. And he's like, I'm a Hoddle's sandwich. And I was like, oh my God. I get to meet the sandwich. So anyways, I love when memes come to life, like Marty's Owl, like all of these stupid things that just become accounts. And it's so hilarious. And it's this, like, funny thing of Bitcoin culture that everything becomes an account.

I think one time I tweeted out, like, everything that Peter Schiff tweets should just be put in, like, the inverse, like, you know, when people take something, they do the, like, the, like, the, like, like, the same. SpongeBob like, boo, and they do like the capitals and like, and lowercase back and forth. I was like, I was like somebody needs like alternate caps, Peter Schiff and somebody created an account called alternate tweet,

alternate Peter that's literally just a bot that takes his tweets and alternates caps. So I mean, I love that. I love the people that do dumb shit like that. And I love the people that build. And I think it's, it's an incredible thing. I don't know.

Does anybody have any other? final shoutouts to any any bitcoins that you think are worth a mention that that are just great people? Is Bitcoin dead? The only thing it's ever posted is no, every single day, no, no,

no, no, no, every day. With the exception, with the exception of April Fool's Day, it tweeted yes. Isn't that so great? There's some deep research in that account. You know, every single day, deep research.

It's so great. I love it. Anyways, okay, so we'll wrap this topic. I think, again, I love the topics where we can just kind of riff on whatever we see fit. It's fantastic. But we will rotate now, Phil, you're up last. So I get to ask you, friend, what are you bullish about? Okay. So I get to ruin everyone's day with what I'm bullish about.

but it's going to, I want to start off though by just mentioning because Sully was talking about everything is really a dark time right now. So I just, you know, want to point out the corny quote, right? It's darkest before the dawn. So it's fitting that it's so dark right now because we're on our way into the light and the light is not a train. Okay. It's not, it's not a train that's at the end of the tunnel. It's better things. But here we go, guys. I am bullish on Eith going to proof of stake. That's right. Okay. Now, why am I bullish on E? Everyone's like, oh, my God, I knew he was a shitcoin or no. I'm a shit. Like, I'm a shit coin slayer. I like to tear them apart. And the reason why I'm so bullish on Eith going to proof of stake, okay, is that I'm inspired by the number of wrecked proof of stake projects that you could find

on the wrecked leaderboard. Okay. And there's something else that I learned being in corporate America. It's that what you need, okay, what you need is a very wealthy, customer in pain. And that's what a business needs to thrive. And Ethereum, being the piece of crap that it is, right? Because POS doesn't just stand for proof of stake. It stands for piece of shit. Those of us who were born, you know, before, you know, before the 2000s, understand, you know, or even before blockchain, so to speak, like in its current iteration, we understand that POS is not just, you know, point of sale or proof of stake, but that it stands for piece of shit. And exactly, you can take a look at the Rect Leader board and you can see all of these projects. These are all

projects that offered governance, they offered stake. They had rules. They had rulers. They told you that they could keep everything safe if you just gave them your money. And this is exactly where Ethereum is going. Number one. Number two, they're going to have this new chain that they're going to be their stake chain that they're going to. Okay. There's currently $33 billion locked in this chain that can't move right now. So the reason, again, why I'm so bullish on this happening is that once and I'd say that maybe this is this is it once and for all we can finally watch Ethereum completely unraveled because the Deo or Dow, however you want to pronounce it, okay, I guess it's fitting that a bitcoiner calls it Deo. That's what Corey said to me once.

Look, they should have been wrecked right there. They should have been totally wrecked. It was already proven that it couldn't do what it was supposed to do and it was just another shit coin. Okay. And it's actually the worst affinity shit coin because it requires a whole bunch of other shit coins to be spawned on top of it to keep it alive. But my point is, is that this is now, I think, a much bigger balloon, right? It's a lot bigger, got a whole lot more billions of dollars locked in this other chain that can't move until Ethereum moves to it. So you know what? Exactly. Bon Haudels got it right. Stop trading. And that's exactly what we're in for. So yes, I don't have a long rant about it. I'm just very bullish on seeing this completely unravel.

because they've been stringing everyone along for six years, and I'm sorry, but they've got absolutely nothing. And I think the world's going to see it. Phil, would you also be equally bullish that Ethereum is moving to proof of stake, but simultaneously also going to remain proof of work? There's for sure going to be a fork there.

Like those miners are going to be like, yeah, fuck this. Like, it's going to be, it's going to be Ethereum Classic 2.0. But since I think the majority of Ethereum users are in the camp of whatever Vitalik says. So they'll go with them. But I think that the Ethereum for a war chain, well, given that it's been around for a while, we'll have some legs for. So there's going to be some contention there for a little bit. And that's going to be fun to watch.

Like it's just a cluster park. It's going to unravel because people don't seem to understand how many billions of dollars are waiting to dump whatever bags they have. so that they can get out of there. So I think that there's going to be, I mean, besides the initial dump, but I also think that essentially once they go to proof of stake, we are then going to see more rug pulls directly on their base layer. Like right now, Ethereum is proof of work.

So they can't do the shenanigans that are happening on top of it. But all of these proof of stake chains, you could see it as you showed in the rec leaderboard. You're talking billions of dollars in losses. This is stuff that should have never been money. It should have never been pretending to be money. It should have never pretended to be liquidity. You should have not been exit liquidity for one of these stupid projects.

And so there you go. That's what I'm bullish on. I'm bullish on this thing finally falling apart. So I'm not up to date on it, but what's to say it's going to just get pushed again like it has for the better part of the decade? Is it even going to get to where your whole piece is up? You are exactly right, Fustler. You are exactly right. I mean, who's to say they're not going to.

to kick the can down the road a little more, you know, so. Marty Bent has a great threat on this. It's when they started saying like, oh, so there's something called the difficulty bomb that's supposed to trigger and make it just impossible to mine proof of work and force a move to proof of stake. Well, they keep on doing hard forks to put off the difficulty bomb. Like it's laughable because the difficulty bomb was supposed to be there so that, nobody could stop the change from proof of work to prove of stake.

It was a necessity. It was like there's there's no way. We're going to have to figure it out by now. This is going to keep us accountable. And then they're like, oh shit, guys, we're not, are you fucking ready?

I'm not fucking ready. I don't know. Okay, well, just hard fork. Hard fork. It's fine. There's like three nodes. Whatever.

That's what keeps happening. Nobody's running a node. So they're just like, all right, yo, dudes, just hard fork. go. It was even so bad that, so I worked for an exchange for a while that had shit coins and I, you know, it, I laughed. But the long story short, over the holidays in 2019, so I had to do like the

emails of like important shit going on that like people needed to know. And and Ethereum was doing a hard fork to do whatever they were doing, whatever feature they were adding or something. They did a hard fork during like basically leading up to the holidays. We're all like, oh, Jesus, we got to deal with this. And then they do the hard fork. And then the chain starts slowing down. And they're like, what is going on? Oh, fuck, the difficulty bomb.

It's happening. It's happening. They had to fucking, they forgot that it was happening. And then they had to hard fork again. two weeks later on like new year's day and so like everybody's scrambling to be like we need to tell all the users that this is bullshit is happening and like it's going to be down for a bit and this is why and the crazy thing is with two weeks notice they were able to hard fork that indicates that nobody is running notes if you can hard fork on a dime it means that nobody is running a node. Nobody is actually running a full archival node of the entirety of the blockchain. Because it costs, look, how much it was, what is it again? It's something stupid, right? It's like 10, 15 grand or something to like run a full eath node or something. I don't know. Yeah. And even still amongst the

implementations. Like I think it was 2020. We did the worldwide audit of the Samson Mao did a challenge to Vitalik and everybody on Ethereum to say like, it might have been Pierre Richard rather, but Samson it was here. Yeah. And then Samson Mal helped coordinate the audit but everybody did an audit of the Bitcoin blockchain

and got the same number like across the globe for the same block. This is how many Bitcoin currently exist and they challenge the Ethereum community to do the same. And nobody could get the same fucking number. Like nobody could definitively say this how many eth exists. And it could

just kind of shows like it it's nobody knows what's going on it's difficult to audit it's damn near impossible to run an actual full node on ethereum it's it's not what it claims to be world computer decentralized ultrasound money i don't know guys what is it this week anyways so yeah how much money did you say is locked up 30 33 billion dollars in the beacon chain What happens when the dumps? So explain to me if I'm an idiot. So all that money that's tied up is because you're staking. And then so whoever's staking and got that money tied up has can can vote or whatever be part of the thing.

So let's say 15 billion gets dumped. So whoever's left with that last 17 billion, they're the decision makers because they stuck around. And so that's probably like five people or something. I mean, look, at this point, it costs like $32,000, you know, to set up a proof of stake ETH node or something like that, something along those lines because of the price, because of the price of Ethereum. So let's be honest, right? To your point, Fustler, you know, who's really going to be able to pay for that, right?

And who's really going to want to now? The other, actually, the other thing that I wanted to say was, was that, you know, most of these people did not take the time to understand Bitcoin. So there's not a chance that they're actually running an Ethereum node. And then the other piece that I wanted to say to what BTC Sessions said, I mean, it's laughable that anybody actually thinks they're storing any value on this chain. I mean, it's a sick joke. And I'm just, I genuinely do feel bad because there is a subsect of people out there that have done just enough research to convince themselves that they think that they know what they're doing. But not enough research to realize what they're doing is incredibly dangerous.

And they should not be storing their wealth there. But anyways, I digress. I know what taught me was getting wrecked. So I believe that getting wrecked is the best teacher. So yeah, good luck to them. Yeah. I don't know. Tully, do you have thoughts on either what we're currently on or like the topic at large?

I was a shit coiner, like most of us as well. I got lucky not to get tracked. But at the same time, I wasn't lucky from a stress. level or from a sleep level or from a family time level. So for all the above reasons and all shit corners, uh, sorry, shitcoins or anything else than Bitcoin follow Bitcoin. So why the hassle. Um, so yeah, it's worth if you're if you care about your time, your families, if you have any, or if you care about your own money, just it's worth. looking into Bitcoin if you don't, if you haven't already.

Yeah, that's it. I love it. Fustler, any final thoughts on the excitement of the move to proof of stake? No. That's great, perfect. Fuck that. Awesome. Okay, well, gentlemen, I'm good to know that you guys are all equally excited about the move to proof of stake. But what I would like to do, and what I always like to do to round out the show is I'm just going to do a round of asking you guys a couple questions. Number one would be just any final thoughts, anything that you feel like you didn't get to say that you wanted to add a comment to anything, anything that you like. And then the second thing would be a recommendation, a recommendation for it could be anything, anything that you find useful in and around Bitcoin, a piece of content. So something like a podcast or a video.

or a book that you've read or an article that you've seen, just anything along those lines, or it could be a device that you've used, an app that you've used, something that you have found to be awesome in and around Bitcoin. And that can be literally anything. So I think what I'm going to say in terms of final thoughts, I think this will kind of tie together a little bit of what Fusler was saying about the people.

And then Suli, you were talking about Arabic Hoddle and what he's been doing with, you know, he's helped with translation and everything. The people that are making Bitcoin more accessible to everyone and making it simpler to use while not sacrificing self-sovereignty. I think that's very important because, you know, there's, there's that element of personal responsibility. And that's important. But it's not to say that we can't streamline things, work on UI, work on making the bits that would be complicated more accessible. You know, we didn't always have seed phrases. And it was just like a plain private key. And it was just digits.

And that could be difficult to deal with. And the rise of BIP 39, being able to write 12 English words down and keep it safe, that's huge. Despite what some detractors would say, I think it's bullshit. I think anybody can write down 12 words or 24 words and keep them safe. I think that's a completely attainable goal. And I think it's important that we encourage people to do so. If there becomes an equally secure way that is even simpler than that, I'm all for it. But I think that the people that are working to one, help people understand Bitcoin and two,

make it even simpler for everyone to grasp and whether that be making content accessible to those where it may not be accessible because of language. I think those people are doing the Lord's work. And I hope to see more of it. and the people that are building to make it more accessible in particular. In terms of recommendations of things to check out, I think I'm going to say, because I played, I'm a little biased because I played with it this week, but I played with the tap signer.

It was cool. It was pretty fucking cool. So it's basically like an NFC card. So you can tap it to your phone as like a signer for a cold wallet. There's tradeoffs here. to be noted. So like when you, when you create the private key,

obviously like it's an NFC card. It doesn't have a screen. So you can't verify addresses and things like that. So there's a degree of like you're kind of trusting the interface that you're using. But that said, it also makes cold storage accessible to those with a lower budget. And over time, like a dinky little card like this is going to be very cheap to mass produce.

And I think that's a huge bonus for people in places where their money might not go as far, but they can still obtain a degree of cold storage. And so I played around with it this week in concert with Nunchuk wallet on mobile. And basically, yeah, you can create a private key and you just tap it to the back after you say, I want to send this much Bitcoin to this address. It says, okay, tap your card, you tap, you put in your pin, and then off it goes. So I thought it was pretty fucking cool. I think it's a unique thing.

It's a good in-between. It's better than if it's infinitely better than leaving your coins on an exchange. It's better than just a simple hot wallet. And it's in between a hot wallet and a full cold wallet, like a cold card where you can verify everything on the screen. It's a good in-between step. So I'll leave that there. You know, if you get the chance, play with the tap signer because it's a lot of fun.

Let's rotate then. Sulea, I'm going to go with you first. Any final thoughts and any recommendations? Thoughts, it's been fun. I wanted to ask a question. Are you guys attending the Amsterdam conference? I am undecided. I don't know if I can make it there.

I've been traveling a lot. So it's expensive. if there is a possibility. Like, I don't know if I'm involved in any way. If there's a reason for me specifically to be there, then I may try to be there. So I'll probably tweet about it if I'm going. Is anyone going to Austin?

I'm in France, man. Yeah, you're in France. Yeah, unfortunately. All good, all good. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, sorry, Suley. Keep going.

No, no. Until next time. And recommendations, like, been working on translating Gigi's piece about wording, the words we use in Bitcoin. I think, Ben, you've done like an episode on it. Yes. I really love the piece. It summarizes a lot.

It's worth looking into it for whoever it didn't. Yeah. Yeah. And another thing that's that I think has, I've been using to. Orangeville people in a simple way is Y Bitcoin by Tomer. Thomas Strolley. I think his website is Y Bitcoin book or something. I got to pull it up because it's it's there we go.

Oh wait, that's his that's the second link you that showed up. Yeah, I don't have a copy of it yet, but it's a beautiful book. I've seen it. I visited Jeff Booth and of course he had it out of this coffee. table. And, uh, and, uh, and, and, uh, the inside of this thing is just stupendous. So if you can get a copy of the coffee table book, it's, it's great. That's Hodler dot Rock's art piece by the way. That's definitely his work. Oh. Yeah. Let's go. Oh, he's one of the Bitcoin artist. I saw, I saw a bunch of his stuff in Miami and it is so cool. The layers to it are just

incredible. I have one piece from him. I have one piece. I, yeah. This is this is a goal of my, I need to get some more Bitcoin art in and around the office. If I got some, if I, I think if I got one of those layered pieces, it would have to go like right in the middle on the wood wall behind me. But also, I want a piece from from Madex as well. So I'm going to have to maybe I'll sacrifice some sats for that. We'll see. I have to say, when I saw Madex's pieces in real life at Bitcoin 2020, for me, I was just like, no, I'm doing this.

I don't care. I'm buying this. I need this. Oh, beautiful. Who's that? Who did this one? Oh, he's muted. Oh, Fustler, you're muted, but who did that?

Well, we're waiting with baited breath. Same guy that did this. certain orange follow him on on Twitter it's pretty dull certain orange you said certain orange orange yeah I'm gonna check him out of the art these days man I've got you send a cool little print that's downstairs

in my bathroom too like kind of like hand drawn print that he did um yeah he's doing cool shit man he actually I've been kind of trying to get made X involved him and madex are kind of like they've shared some art together and stuff so that would be a that'd be a win but yeah oh there he is that's he's doing yeah this is cool it's basically the what he used for the piece behind me but he's doing like a stencil or whatever you call it that's crazy good for him yeah uh i would say based on what i've seen so far criminally under followed he's only got he's got like 430 followers so go he's got

me following him now so there you go he's got all of us now yeah go follow at certain orange he's gonna wake up tomorrow or all of a sudden in like an hour he's like what the hell No, that's awesome. I really enjoy that. Awesome. Sweet. Well, let's let's keep, oh, and my mouse is losing connection.

Anyways, let me close that out here. So Suli, you got your recommendations and everything's set, right? Awesome. I'm going to jump to Phil. Final thoughts, recommendations, you're up. All right, final thoughts.

I always give the same ones. You know, if there's any nubes that are watching this, You're going to want to check out everyone's a scammer. You're going to want to read the 21 lessons from Gigi or listen to it if you don't feel like reading and you're lazy like me. It's still amazing. And also, you're going to want to check out the creature from Jekyll Island. Yes, exactly.

I bought the book too, even though I just listened to it. I'm terrible. But yes. And in terms of like, in terms of tech to play with, I think that one of the nodes that we don't hear enough about, even though I love the my node, I love the raspy blitz, love the noddle. I think the one that we don't hear enough about is Start 9. Okay, Start 9 is an amazing project.

It's got amazing people on that team. Those guys are doing a killer. Like, they really are just doing a killer job. They are, they are creating, I think, the killer appliance for the Bitcoin node. And I run a Start 9 embassy node and I also run a My node. And I love them both. So, you know what? Every single time I use the Start 9, I'm always impressed.

So that's the piece of tech that I've been. messing with. And the last piece that I want to say is come check us out on Pleb Underground and we've got a new YouTube show starting. We are going to record this Sunday. It's going to drop next week. It's going to be a weekly show and hope to see you all there. Awesome. I love it. The Start 9 stuff, that is my next node project. That and Raspberry Blitz because I haven't played with it yet. So I've got, I've got stuff around. Raspi Blitz will probably be second because I need to get like the screen and everything. But I've literally got like the metal crypto cloaks enclosure.

Yes. Yeah, the little one. It's like a smaller version of the Triton. It's called the Palace. So I'm going to be building a start nine with that. And then I'm going to do a Ronan. I'm going to be doing a Raspi Blitz with my old Triton one and just have it open face with the screens and everything.

I've got I've got a Ronin Dojo and of course an umbrella here. I've used my node before. Or, yeah, there's so many. I love that it's so accessible. It's fantastic. Also, go follow Club Underground on Twitter. Also criminally unfollowed. Obviously, it just started, but still, go follow.

We need to pump those numbers up, you guys. You got to pump those numbers. The rookie numbers. Love it. Love it. Awesome. And Fustler, I'm going to toss it to you. Final thoughts, recommendations.

Go ahead, man. And you're muted, by the way. My mouse is being funky, too. So I'm trying to follow PLEB underground. That's what I'm going. There it is. Boom. Done.

What were the two questions? Final thought. I love it. I love it. Final thought. And recommendations. Yeah, so it's good. And seed phrase in there as well.

And add my, okay. It's on a seed plate somewhere around. Yeah. DM it to me privately if you could. I don't have time to switch to it right now. Yeah. stories. Final thoughts, first of all, thanks for having me on, man. This is super fun. It's good to meet both of you other guys on here as well. Honestly, like the recommendation, I'm going to

go a different route. Usually it's like, you know, read this book or whatever. This is a good one. Again, if anyone's listening, Jeff Booth will be at the meetup on Wednesday next week. So please come by. My recommendation is if you are in in any city, not mine, different one, any other one. And there isn't a meetup, create one. That's my recommendation. Create a meetup. It's very simple, you know, the idea is simple.

It starts to take some time and whatever, but the process is quite simple. You're going to do it, create a meetup group page in your city, go to a bar, just say, this is where it's happening. You'll be surprised. You're going to get some people that show up. Like I said, I thought I'd get 20 and there was 60, the second. one there was 75, the third one there was 170, and there's 220 RSDPs right now for booth next week. So that's in the last three months. So, you know, all you got to do is create it, kind of you build it, they will come kind of thing, is how it feels. So that is my recommendation.

If there isn't a meetup in your city, create it. And if there is, go and meet some other Bitcoin who's in person, man. It's a lot of fun. You're already starting with this base level of, you know, Bitcoin has that base. And it's very, it's very. you to just start talking to people and everyone's at different points in their journey with it. But it's awesome, man. That's part of, that's one of the best things about these meetups now that I'm hosting is like dots are connecting and I'm seeing it. You know, I'm seeing like a Lightning Lab dev talking to, you know, whatever. It's just there's a lot of smart individuals there.

There's people all over the place. You know, there's writers. There's devs. There's just, you know, podlers, whatever. It's kind of all over. But everyone's kind of mixing and matching. and meeting each other. So it's cool to see it.

I know people are hanging out now. Like, you know, they're going to a restaurant together, but they met a, you know, meetup number one or whatever. Like there's friendships being made. So that's kind of a rather, you know, good thing that I love about it. You know, it's kind of bringing community and people together. And you never know where that leads, you know.

Maybe there's a cool idea that someone has that doesn't know how to do it. But maybe they've got the financial vacuum to do it. And they're eating a dev. And suddenly there's a new wall. it's on the sea next you know next year who knows right so yeah that's my recommendation man go to a meetup or create one if there isn't one in your city that's great a good guy biker said don't take any doge coin girls back to your house um funny enough when i was in Vancouver uh the car yeah so i know this guy is super nice guy um and uh him and he had this girl there and she has uh what was the it was a

McLaren. There's a fucking McLaren wrapped in doge heads. I was like, oh my God. And so I sat in it and I think my expression says it all. There we go.

I didn't quite know what to think there. Did you get why is this happening? Did you get a rash or anything? I was I came out on skathed. I've got I've got thick Bitcoin her skin maxi skin so but they were very like i will say they're they were super nice i know the guy

uh gary gary lechance uh i disagree with this take on doge uh but he's he's a nice dude but i i feel like i feel like this may have defiled the vehicle but yeah uh we'll just leave it at that uh gentlemen thank you so so much for being here. I really appreciate all of your time. I had a lot of fun with the conversation. I think I'll just leave it there, man. Thank you for being here,

and you are all welcome back anytime. Cheers, guys. Thanks so much, man. Thank you for having us. Don't worry. Thanks, man. Thanks, guys. Later.

All right. And everybody watching, thank you so much for being here. Did you enjoy that? Let me know the comments. Thank you, everybody in the chat. that's that's keeping them coming. I appreciate it.

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