BTC Sessions - WHY ARE WE BULLISH? TC, Alex Thorn, Asanoha ep427

Episode Date: July 20, 2024

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What's going on, everybody? Welcome to this show. Another Friday, another episode of Why Are We Bullish. We've got an awesome panel here to get bullish on a Friday evening. I hope you're all having an awesome week. I hope our audience is still of sufficient size, given that half of the world is now bricked or whatever the hell is going on. Seems like an exciting Friday. But Bitcoin still running. We can smile about that. Of course, this is live. Anything can happen. So I defer to my friend Bill here. We'll do it live. Do it live. I'll write it and we'll do it live. The thing sucks.

If you have not already, please do like, subscribe, share, all those things. They help a ton getting this content in front of my eyeballs. I am Ben with the BTC sessions. This is your daily session. Before we bring in her guests, Let's take a quick look at where we are in the market.

We're going to be taking a peek at timechain calendar.com. I'm pulling it up right now. And simultaneously, I'm going to be pulling up the live chat. Everything you say into the chat from here on in will be live for the world to see for better or worse. And off we are. So we're sitting at 66. Sorry, six, geez, cannot get it out today. I'm distracted because before it was like 6969.

and I, you know, a missed opportunity. Should have started the show earlier. Anyways, we're at $66,994 dollars per coin. A single U.S. dollar will grab you, 1,493 sats. In terms of fees, next block, seven sats per byte. And in terms of Bitcoin mined, 19.72 million of them, that's 93.94% of the total supply. We're going to give a quick shout out to our sponsors. and then we will be right back with our panel.

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They're also a publicly traded company under the ticker BTCW on the TSXV. Check them out over at Bitcoinwell.com. Check out my full tutorial on how to use them. And you can check out the links in the show notes down below and sign up today. As some of the best hardware on the market today to secure your Bitcoin. The cold card queue is an absolute powerhouse and is my daily driver. On top of this, they have plenty of other goodies including the Mark 4, the tap signer, open dimes, the block clock,

and much more. If you head over to their website, make sure you use code BTC sessions at checkout to get a nice discount. Links are in the show notes down below. All right, we are back in, and it's time to introduce you to our panel. I want to welcome to the Stage TC,

The Man, the Myth, the Legend behind Time Chain Calendar. We're also going to bring up an excellent Bitcoin artist. I hope I say this right, Asanoa. I believe that's correct. You can correct me in a moment. And of course, Mr. Alex Thorn, thank you, everybody for being here. Let's take a moment and go around Robin and give ourselves a quick intro. Who are you? What do you do?

And T.C., I'm going to start with you. Welcome back to the show, man. Glad to have you. Can you give yourself a quick introduction? Yes, thanks for having me back, Ben. I think this is my third time. I'm honored to be here once again. I am T.C.

I'm a software developer. I am a bitcoiner. I've been in Bitcoin for quite a while. And in the last couple years, I built timechain calendar.com. And it is my primary focus these days. It's a project I work on every day. And it is a website, a tool, an app that you can use to see where Bitcoin is at, exactly like Ben just demonstrated at the top of the show. So that is me.

Hell yeah. Well, I'm happy to have you back, man. And let's drop down to our next couple of guests here, brand newbies to the show. Asanoa, am I saying that correctly, by the way? It's Asanoa. Asanoa. Okay. Dude, welcome to the show. Please give yourself an intro. Thanks for having me on here. This is really exciting. I feel like I'm finally made. I'm a Bitcoin artist. I'm a Bitcoin maximalist. I make physical Bitcoin artwork. And yeah, China. I also help with the simplest Bitcoin book ever written. My good friend Kesa wrote that book. So I help promote that book. It's an excellent book. You can get a free

PDF version at the simplest bitcoinbook.net. And I'm also the art director for Bitcoin trading cards. You may have heard of Bitcoin trading cards, the world's first official physical Bitcoin only trading card project. And then I make my own physical artwork here. So, yeah. I love it, man. And congrats, you're going to be, you're going to be showing off some of your stuff soon. And again, the stuff that you make is incredible.

So if anybody hasn't, please do check out Astonoa's awesome, awesome stuff. I'm sure we'll touch on it coming up soon. But before we do, I want to also give Mr. Ali. Thorne a chance to introduce himself. So Alex, welcome to the show. Can you give yourself an intro? Yeah. Hey, Ben.

Hey, Asanoa. Hey, TC. Great to be here. I mean, I've watched why we're bullish a number of times. And honestly, I'm not sure I can be bullish enough considering all the stuff I've seen. I need to be, I am incredibly bullish. But so I'm head of research at Galaxy. I used to work at Fidelity for my entire career before that.

Worked on the Bitcoin custody stuff. I worked on Bitcoin research and did VC. Now I'm head of research at Galaxy or a big Bitcoin miner and VC and trading company. Hell yeah, man. Well, I'm glad to have you and I'm glad to hear how bullish you are. And that's what we're here to do. So we're going to dive right into it. First off, everybody in the chat, thank you for being here.

Keep those messages coming yellow. It's good to hear that you're doing well. Thanks for being here too, buddy. But we're going to dive right in. Anybody unfamiliar, this is, why are we bullish? Simple concept of the show. Each one of us has come with a reason why we are bullish in and around Bitcoin. And that can take many forms.

It could be a personal experience, a video that we watch, an article that we read, a new app or device we've tried, or maybe a current event that has recently happened. Either way, the flow of the show is, number one, somebody's going to drop their reason why they're bullish. This is their chance to rant and get whatever. excitedness they have off their chest. Number two, altogether, we're going to riff on that reason, comments, questions, whatever rabbit holes we decide to go down. And number three, finally, we're going to rotate to the next person until we've all had a turn. So reason, riff, rotate, and we're good to go. So with that, I'm going to get started with my reason for being bullish

to kick us off here. And what we're going to be, what I want to chat about is, um, uh, some something in and around, a new development in Nostr. And so I'm going to bring up this, this window that I have here. And this is something relatively new. So this is from Pablo. He's doing some awesome looking in and around Nostr. And this is a recent post from him. He said, the money is in the Nostr.

And so what does he mean by this? So if you're familiar with Noster, or if you're not, effectively a censorship-resistant way of posting stuff online, notes and other stuff. And it's basically you can have a quasi-Twitter clone. You can have things like blog posts, and you can have much, much more than that. But we'll just kind of leave it at that for now. But it's also uniquely positioned to integrate things like Lightning Network and peer-to-peer payments within Noster. And most, a lot of Noster clients either have plugins or natively have Bitcoin lightning wallets built into them, which is super cool because rather than liking posts, you can zap them. You can send a small Bitcoin transaction.

And so what he's done here is typically your Bitcoin, wallet and your Noster client, they're not necessarily explicitly linked. Or, aka, let's say you are using a Noster app called Primal. And you can easily migrate from Primal to Iris to snort to all these different, all these different clients where you can have the same connections, see your history of posts, see the same people that you've been following in the exact same feed. So that part travels between clients. But what hasn't yet has been, if you have a Bitcoin wallet, associated with a particular client. And this is what Pablo has fixed, I suppose.

So he said, create a new NPUB and do nothing else. No need for wallet of Satoshi, no need for Noster wallet connect pairing. Absolutely nothing. instantly receive zaps, send zaps, and most importantly, access your wallet from any client on any device. And these zaps are verifiable, way faster. They are immediate, since the sending of the eCash is the zap, instead of waiting for a lightning node to maybe publish the zap receipt. And just like our contact list, follow us around, just like our profile data and our shit posts pop up on any Nostri application. so do our sats. The money is in the Nostr,

and he did a little video here as well. But the point being that he's utilizing an e-cash system, cashew on top of Bitcoin, in order to pair your private key for Nostr as the private key that also owns the e-cash, the SAT denoucash, the SAT denouc. nominated e-cash, which I think is really cool. Again, effectively what he's saying here is the private key for your social media profile also becomes the private key for your wallet

that you're using on social media. And I quite like that. I think it's really cool. Obviously, there's tradeoffs with e-cash systems. I'd say, you know, there's always trade-offs depending on what you're going to use full self-sovereign stuff if you're self-hosting it is going to be a little bit more complex to deal with for your average person. But this could go the way of being some, you know, like a pretty decent in terms of privacy alternative to something like a wallet of Satoshi or a custodial lightning option. You can move to something that's, uh, like a cashew mint that maybe has a longstanding reputation. And you can say, I'd also like that fantastic privacy that comes with it.

And I'd also like it to just easily link with my Nostra profile wherever I go, whatever client I use. So I just, I thought this was cool. And this is my reason for being bullish because, again, it just kind of shows that all this tinkering and everything, everything's kind of becoming interoperable and easier to do. you no longer have to say to somebody, try out lightning. Also, try out Noster.

Also, here's a tool to link the two together. Now, now it's just try one thing and you've got both. And that's pretty cool. So I want to open it up to you guys and get your thoughts in and around this. And if you've been using anything of the like, whether it be Noster, whether it be if you've tried like the cashew stuff, or if it's all completely new to you, let me know. So anybody who wants to dive in, go ahead. Well, I'll tell you, I was thinking about eCash right before this because there's this person I know. Let's just call him Orange, for lack of a better name.

And we're going to say this guy actually took some E-Cash. And if you know, eCash is a long string of text essentially. So you could have any number of SATs and it's represented as a string of text, which means you can transfer it any way that you can transfer text. you could put it into a text message or a DM or an email. And this guy, orange, I'm doing air quotes. You can't see them, but I'm doing them. He actually took a string of eCash and broke it up into three different pieces and transmitted it in the memo field of three different bank transfers.

So through a bank in the traditional finance system, this character sent some eCash unbeknownst to the bank. And not only that, he took eCash split into three pieces, which then could be reassembled by the recipient and, you know, redeemed for its value. This is phenomenal. The topic here at large is really just that we have more and more ways to use Bitcoin, more and more ways to transfer Bitcoin denominated value. And eCash absolutely is a good example of something that comes with tradeoffs. There's some incredible benefits to it. There's some tradeoffs that you give for that.

But how bullish is it that we have now this additional way to move around sat-denominated value on top of lightning and on top of layer one Bitcoin? I mean, this is something that some people out there, usually outside of Bitcoin, feel like Bitcoin's sort of dinosaur coin or not much is going on. But if you actually know and you know where to look and you're paying attention, the last year or two has been just an absolute explosion of innovation. And the eCash stuff is one of the really exciting areas where there's just a ton of really cool stuff being done. And I got to say, by the way, Pablo is the man. That guy is an unbelievable monster of developing power.

So, yeah, I tip my hat to him. Makes me very bullish, Ben. I love that eCash was transmitted low-key through the memo field in banging transfers. That's fantastic. Again, it speaks to the, to the, you know, like, come and stop me kind of nature of all this stuff. Like if you can do that and send eCash through the traditional banking system unbeknownst to them, unhindered just through like general memos and any other type of communication, good luck shutting this stuff down. So that's awesome. Gents, I curious your thoughts as well.

I think eCash is awesome. I've been following Kaye for a little while. And it's, I think it's super, super exciting. I've got the E-Nuts on my phone. So I've been messing around with that a little bit. And I encourage anybody listening to go to the, if you got an app, is it on Android? I don't have an iPhone.

If you go to the app store and you download E-Nuts, you can, you got to connect the Mint, which you can look it up. Where would someone look that up sessions? It's very easy to do. It's like a few clicks, and you can send Lightning into your E-Nuts wallet Yeah.

From a lightning wallet on your phone and it gives you a ticket and eCash string of text, and you can then send that to anybody. So it's really easy, really fun to mess around with your friends and just see how it works in real time. And I'm super bullish as well on eCash. Absolutely. It's super slick. Like again, just to give people an idea of how easily you can do this, even within a browser

on your mobile device. This is just cashew.me, C-A-S-H-U.me. And it'll take you here. It'll let you know what a cashew wallet is. You can download a little file as a backup and just save it if you want to. But nonetheless, I'm going to hit continue to add a mint. It gives you options down below. You can discover what mince people are using right now.

A lot of this is still very early. So in terms of reputation, that will be built up over time. But I'll just pick one of the mints and I'll copy it. Maybe I'll use this mini bits mint here and I'll just add it there. And I'll just call it mini bits and I'll add it. There we go. And now my wallet's set up. I can receive a regular lightning transaction.

So maybe I'll send over 100 sats and create an invoice. I'll copy that invoice and I'll send it over from Albi. And then in a moment, I'll have eCash. There we go. I now have ECash in my cashew wallet. And now I can send eCash, which is instant zero fee. and near perfectly private to anybody, anywhere, at any point. So I can send eCash and maybe I want to send 50 SATs.

I'm going to send that. And if anybody has an eCash wallet, you'll be able to redeem that. In fact, what I'm going to do is I'm going to drop that in the chat. Yep, there it is. If anybody has a cashier wallet, you can copy that and you can claim those sats. So the text is the money at this point. So it's a very different concept than lightning than Bitcoin. That string of text is worth 50 sats.

So somebody would need to copy that, paste it into their cashew wallet. I'm sure, obviously, like, this is the same type of thing as looking at a lightning invoice where people are going like, oh, my God, like, that's a lot to deal with. But what did we do? We then streamlined with lightning addresses. We streamlined with reusable payment cones and things like that. That stuff will come to.

And it's very exciting to see. But there's your quick demo. Nice demo, Ben. Yeah, do what I can. Now everybody's like, I can't copy the text. Well, 50 stats. You know. Go ahead.

Nothing. I was going to say, I'll, I'll post some on a Noster or on my Twitter or somewhere. Yeah, I can actually, maybe I'll do that as well. I'll jump on primal here. And I'm just going to paste in that, that cashew code. All right. So it's on my Noster now.

So anybody on Noster, somebody's going to claim it in like a second one, they see what it is. So I'm going to post a couple on both my Noster. And I don't, I'm not verified on Twitter. so I don't have a long enough thing on Twitter. But if you're following me on Noster, I'm going to post a couple right now. They'll probably get snagged by somebody else in about five seconds.

Yeah, yeah, exactly. Well, if anybody's following me on Noster, 50 stats are up there. So go take them. But Alex, I want to toss it to you and get your thoughts in around this. Yeah, I love the idea of you cash. I've never played with it yet. I was talking with Calais in Bedford, actually, when we were there for Pete's Peter McCormack's conference in April.

So it sounds super cool, but Noster, and I think it's worth pointing out today with the crowd strike outage, which isn't exactly DNS. A lot of times when like swaths of the internet go down, it's actually an attack on, you know, the three DNS servers in like New Hampshire and wherever else that service the East Coast of the U.S. But very similar, very similar, and Noster can serve a distributed DNS quite easy. That's basically what it does. So I love the resiliency of Nostr. I still, you know, I just started using primal instead of Damos, although I like both, but I find primal to be better. I still, the problem I have with, this is what makes me, not what I'm going to say later about why I'm bullish, but why I love Nostr the most, isn't even for social. It's for distributed communication networking because, you know, a website that resolves over H. TPS via Noster nodes, I think. incredibly resilient. Did it work?

Did you get those stats? Are you sharing sats? I was sharing sats on Noster. Oh, there we go. I said I was going to post some E-Nuts, some nuts on Noster sides. Perfect. Perfect. Get those no. No, no, I just mean, yeah, aside from the e-catch, the resiliency of distributed, Nostras are very powerful distributed network protocol. And, you know, the web like basically went down for a large

portion of the world today and all the airplanes in the United States had to land so I'm saying yeah very positive on Nostr as more than just notes and other stuff but but you know data and networking and other stuff as a protocol for that so amazing to see I guess I shouldn't be surprised that you know Cassu is using you know Nuts is using Noster now yeah yeah it's it's pretty wild and again Calais and everybody working on on the e-cash stuff. I think it's super valuable.

And I think, again, it's just another tool in the tool belt of Bitcoiners to, you know, to escape from being under the boot of central bankers everywhere. So LFG, I suppose. But with that, I'm gonna put a little bow on that topic. Either way, worth checking out. If you haven't played around with the e-cash stuff, it's pretty cool.

Try it out. And aside from that, if you're not on Noster, also check that out because I think the world has yet to grapple with the fact that it exists, let alone Bitcoin. So, yeah, very, very cool stuff coming out of all these little projects here. But with that, we're going to do a rotation. And I'm going to go down the line. I'm going to toss it over to TC. TC, I'm going to queue you up. You're going to get the same question everybody else gets.

Why are you bullish? Well, I'm still recovering from my bullishness about eCash here. I have to collect myself. I have to light some incense, calm down a little bit, because I'm going to get a little bit deep on this one. I am bullish because I've realized Bitcoin is a calendar. This is a concept that I've been thinking about actually for a couple years, and it's manifested in my time chain calendar project.

But essentially, the idea is that we have these systems of timekeeping as humans, and we've developed calendars over the millennia, and they've constantly changed, but they're attempting to kind of track passage of time. And these systems of timekeeping have really influenced humanity in an extraordinary way, because we're we're trying to track passage of timekeeping. because we sort of structure our thinking about reality around them. Meanwhile, here comes Bitcoin. And Bitcoin kind of functions like a calendar in a very unique and different way. You know, one really good example I like to use is that when we have a moment in time that we share as humans, let's say New Year's Eve, we kind of experience it as, oh, here comes the New Year's Count. down and the fireworks, but we experience that in waves across the time zones as people's time zone catch up to that so-called moment. So that moment becomes fragmented by the time zones

around the world. Meanwhile, a Bitcoin block, think of the having block. And everybody's watching for when my website's going to crash and the having block's going to happen. And everyone on the whole globe experiences this moment at the same time. There's something incredibly powerful and meaningful to me about this idea that we have sort of a new timekeeping mechanism in Bitcoin that allows humans to experience these moments in time globally as a global consciousness. And it's kind of a trippy thing to think about, you know, the nature of Bitcoin as a timekeeper's, little weird because we have this sort of immutable past of the of the time chain of the blocks and and where they are and we have this sort of uncertain future as far as we

don't know exactly when the next block's going to happen and so we don't know when a thousand blocks or a million blocks from now is exactly going to be so it's a unique kind of timekeeping thing but the bottom line is I get incredibly bullish when I think of the fact that we have here not only a you know decentralized monetary system. We have a new timekeeping system. We have a way for humanity to experience things in a synchronized way that we've never had before. And my mind kind of goes wild thinking about the possibilities of what that means for humanity. So to sum it up, I am bullish because Bitcoin is a calendar. I love that. And I want to tell you why I love that. It's

Bitcoin is a low time preference calendar in that it's not as useful in short periods of time, but over longer periods of time can be quite useful. And the way that I've been using Bitcoin as my own, I guess, kind of like a life calendar is I gauge my life and my successes in Bitcoin epochs. from having to having because you can be disappointed about shit that goes wrong day to day, week to week,

month a month, maybe you even have a bad year. But if you bust your ass and you work hard, odds are that in that 210,000 blocks or that, yeah, those 210,000 blocks between epochs,

you can make meaningful improvement in that period of time. And so this last having, I looked back at where I was at the previous having in around 2020. And, you know, at the time it was a little dicey because I was kind of questioning where I would go next and like what things looked like for me. I was on the cusp of questioning whether or not I should go and find a day. job at another company or if I should just go it alone and just focus solely on the channel. And I decided to focus solely on the channel. Four years later, it's the best decision I ever made.

I get to do what I love every single day. And I'm way better off than I ever was with a job working for somebody else. And so when you measure, again, when you measure over longer time frames as, you know, using Bitcoin as a calendar does for you and requires of you, you start thinking about time differently. So what a great topic. I love that. And I'm curious what the other gents will have to say. So go ahead, guys.

Yeah, I'll go. I love it too. I love that Bitcoin is, you know, the blockchain is advanced by the use of energy, which is the force of the universe. And so if you take, what do we have the, what are they called the Augustine calendar? What are we using the Caesarian calendar? Forget what it's called, but we should have. The Julian calendar.

Thank you. It's closed. The Julian calendar. If it was 13 months long, it would fit better. But in any case, you know, there's the predictability and connection to the physical properties of the universe. Also, I think it for me makes it feel like a better global, you know, ticking clock to follow. I remember the blocks when my two kids were born.

I've thought about it that way since I've, you know, not, you know, not like, oh, man, I got a, I got that appointment tomorrow at block height, XYZ, but like, you know, major milestones I've followed and thought about what the block height was, released a rap song with Captain Youth at a block height, you know, so I love it. I love that it's, you know, widely accessible to everyone on Earth. Very easy. I'm just here on MMPool. At space at the moment, I was going to look up a different date.

When I got married, I'm not sure what the block height was then. I should know that. Have you tried the date search on Time Chain Calendar? Let me go. I didn't know I could do. That's exactly what I was looking for. There you go. Time Chain Calendar.

By the way, I loved Time Chain Calendar at the having the whole animation, like, video thing was amazing. Sweet. Yeah, it's awesome. Yes. That's exactly what I was looking for, by the way. Here we go. Do you have a date for me? What year was?

Yeah. Yeah, put in December. Oh, yeah, 2016. You got your, married the same year as me. December 3rd. December 3rd. You could put a time in, too. Yeah, let's put in the time.

I think it was at 2 p.m. Okay, right. Put in like 2.30 because I think it was kind of a long ceremony. Okay. We'll say, we'll call it, 2.30. Go. What block was that? Time same change calendar does its thing.

It's checking. All right, block. Let's go. 441-78. Oh, man, $765 Bitcoin? You know, I asked, we asked for Bitcoin donations in lieu of gifts, and I got a couple. Oh, shit. I was just going to say how much of that ceremony cost you.

But if you got some Bitcoin gift, I might have paid it back. Yeah. Well, unfortunately, we didn't. I only got a couple like, well, I mean, Now, you know, I only got a couple and I used a static QR code receiving address from Coinbase at that time to receive it. That's awesome. So that's fantastic. Look at the SATs per dollar, almost 131,000 sets.

Oh my God. That's the, that's the more striking, like 765, like you think of, oh, but, you know, Bitcoin's like damn near, you know, it's like 67 right now. But it's the, like, you can't get, you can't quite get 1500 sats for a dollar right now. You could have done. 12 billion dollar market cap too. Unbelievable. Unbelievable. Unbelievable.

We're at 1.5 trillion now. Yeah. Unreal. This is one of my favorite things, again, about timeshink calendar. I did not know you had this. Look up. That's crazy. Super cool.

I love that. The future, too. You can do a date search into the future and it'll estimate the future block. yeah that's amazing i i totally agree i love the predictability i also love um who's the guy that does the um the physical like big giant like clocks is that is that fractal cryptos yeah yeah similar like reverence i think for the calendar nature of the of the blockchain yeah 100% also no i want to i want to hear your take here too um i think the time chain calendar is awesome. I think it's a much more logical. Like you said, short term, I feel like there

might be some sort of solution to figure out a short term timekeeping system that's connected to Bitcoin. I mean, there's got to be something. But for low time preference, it's definitely, I mean, all of my, I was never super into conventional, traditional holidays to begin with. I don't really celebrate Christmas. I don't, you know, I've never been big on Halloween, whatever. I don't. I you know the new year like you said it's kind of all over the place what is the new year i'm voice felt more drawn to like the older celtic calendar i think some you know i think alex you'd mentioned 13 um you know and so forth so with with the time chain i'm like this is great it's uh these are these are the holidays that uh that i that i care about a lot more now than

any other holiday i've ever cared about uh also the whole like time is money money is time i mean it's kind of it's kind of perfect you know like it it ties in really good and so yeah um i think it's freaking awesome i actually have been doing some some of mempool dot spaces visualizations and then and then painting them this is actually a major cut wood uh and then hand painted each of the transactions in there and i've done a couple to kind of like you know you know commemorate certain blocks and so forth. So I'll have some in Nashville on display that are actually made out of printed circuit boards with ModioTech, this German pleb that I've been making some stuff with.

But these are pretty cool, yeah. That is so cool. Wait, so, are these just blocks that are important to you, the ones you've picked to do there? Well, I've had a couple commissioned that were important to those people. This is Ocean's third block. So this is the first block that they mined that they were able to omit all but one pesky inscription, which is right down there. I didn't color it in.

I'm going to, yeah, I'm trying to think of a good time in place to auction this one. But at Nashville, I'll have the four-having blocks as printed circuit boards. So same idea, but there will be printed circuit boards instead of laser. cut hand painted wood and then emotieotech and i are working on a hal finney block so it's just a block from the day hal finney died commemorating hell finney and he's actually got a bunch of like a bunch of ogs signing it and i think we're going to auction that uh during the als fundraiser run in january and so we'll auction the signed one all the proceeds from that uh i believe we'll go to the as ls that foundation and then we have a couple more a couple additions we've made so we'll sell those so yeah but

i'm open for commission if anybody's got a block they want to memorialize um hit me up shoot me a DM and we can talk about options so i'm thinking about doing digital like a jicley print version that's a little bit more affordable because the hand-painted ones are of course a little price here and then the PCB boards also i've got to charge a bit more for them but i want to do like jaclay prints of any any block that you want and then try and get that price point down so it's actually you know just you know more within reach for the plebs to you know whatever whatever it may be so yeah i've got a future commission for you what did you say i said i've got a future commission for you i already know what it is uh in two years time it'll be the 10 year anniversary of me doing the

show. And so I'm going to look back and see when I, exactly when I published my first video. And, but I have one special request that look, but I need my signature paint splotches just like throwing at the at the piece. Absolutely. We definitely do it. Let's do it. Bitcoin art makes me bullish. Bitcoin art makes me bullish. I just wanted to say too, I think T.C. I don't know, have you been doing it with torture? T.C. got some stuff going on where you can get the blocks from time chain calendar. Yeah, the Memento. What are those?

We call it a time chain calendar Memento. There's a little shop button on the time chain calendar site, and it's on there. It links to his site where you can get it, but you can basically get a custom plaque 3D printed with a particular block of import, proof of birth of your child, proof of marriage, proof of business getting founded. We had one guy who got one that was the block, his first. block that he mined as a minor. So kind of cool way to commemorate these special moments. So if anybody listening wants to commemorate a moment that was important to them,

hit me up or hit up TC or get on time chain calendar and hit the shop button and get yourself a little memento there of that block height. That's great. Prove of birth. That's fantastic. That's awesome. That's really cool. Well, so we guys. guys. Okay. So again, love that topic. I think it's a lot of fun. We are going to put a ball on that one. We're going to do a rotation. But before we do, I've got to give a quick one-minute shout out to our remaining sponsors here. So we will be right back in one minute. Stick around because I'm also going to be giving away some sats when we get back. So get your lightning roll. It's ready because we've got some stuff to give away. So I'll see you guys in just a

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and even earn rewards when you spend. head over to speed.app to download the app on your mobile or desktop today and use the link down below to get 5,000 sats for free and have the chance to win even more. All right, we are back in. And before we get into our next reason for being bullish, I want to give away some sats here. We've been doing this on the news show lately, but I'm integrating it because it's fun into the Friday show as well. Anyways, this Bitcoin well, they're in Canada and the U.S. And basically the way that they work is as you do things, sign up, buy and sell Bitcoin, refer friends. You get points.

And then those points are redeemable as throwing a coin into the well, which potentially gets you anywhere from 500 to a million sats. And so you can redeem it with an LN URL accepting Lightning Wallet. So we're going to go ahead. We're going to do, I think last time we got 2,100 sats. So we'll see what we get today. I'm going to throw in the well and get those lightning wallets ready. I'm going to enlarge this. So people have the chance to scan it.

And there's your 500 sats. Scan away. I'm going to give you guys like, I don't know, 5, 10 seconds. Otherwise, you're going to have to scrub back through the video to snag them. But congrats to whoever gets it. And if you do get it, let me know in the chat or on Noster or on Twitter or wherever you may be, shoot me a DM or shoot me a message on there and let me know that you snag the sats.

Best of luck to everybody. Awesome. And with that, that's all the time you get, guys. You've got to be prepped and ready. But Azo Noah, I'm going to toss it to you. We're going to continue the show. And I'm going to ask you the same question. Why are you bullish?

I am bullish for a couple reasons. Number one, I want to say that I am bullish because. Kisa of the simplest Bitcoin book ever written has just finished her second edition of the simplest Bitcoin book ever written with a whole chapter featuring Noster. So now it's the simplest Bitcoin and Noster book ever written. And you can download the free PDF version at the simplestbitcoinbook.net. It's published under a Creative Commons license. So if you or anybody you know is working on a project, a Bitcoin education project, reach out, Dekisa. I think I want to say, I think Bitcoin and Kasi was printing their own versions over there.

So yeah, it's a, it's an awesome book and it's great for orange-pilling friends and family. It gives you all the basics and has an extensive resource section in the back, which includes legends such as BTC sessions. And so that's, I'm super bullish on that. These books, the second edition, this is one of the first editions. I don't actually have the second edition in print in hand yet, but they will be available for sale in the official conference merch booth at Nashville, Tennessee during the Bitcoin conference. So I'm excited about that. I am also bullish because I will have my Seed cipher artwork, which is a way of encrypting a Bitcoin seed phrase into a painting. Or I should say using a painting to decrypt a seed phrase off of a custom titanium seed plate that I've made here in collaboration.

with stamp seed and I'm really excited it's going to be on auction and on display in Nashville I'm going to have 21 limited edition serigraph print and plate sets available in the official conference booth merch store at Nashville so that's super exciting and yeah I'm just I'm I'm bullish on Bitcoin I'm bullish on Bitcoin art and yeah I'm feeling good I love that man I I'll bring up the a couple of websites here as well just for. Kisa was on the show I want to say

a month and a half or two months ago. Awesome, awesome. Really enjoyed having her. And she's fantastic in all the spaces and everything too. Just such a good educator. What an absolute legend and what an absolute you know, necessary

part of the community to help people kind of level up and learn about Bitcoin. The more educators, the better. And I do have my copy of the simplest Bitcoin book ever written here. I'll have to get the second version, of course. And of course, we've got to highlight, this is the right sovereign remnant.com. Is that where I should be pointing to? It is. Thank you very much. Yeah, man. And there's all kinds of goodies on here. I love, I love these little guys that you've got. Those are so what are these? These are printed circuit board. Those are printed circuit boards. So that's, it's made the same way motherboard or any kind of computer chip is made with silicon wafer actually and then a screen printing process. And I believe it's 22 karat gold on there. And so I've been making these. with a really cool German club named Modio Tech or who goes by Modio Tech. And so that's the same process, same material that the motherboard of Satoshi's computer was made from, you know, same piece or that, you know, but it's the, it's the same process.

It's the same kind of material that every ASIC chip currently securing our sovereignty is mounted upon silicon wafer like that printed circuit board. So it's really kind of cool, cool form of Bitcoin art. That's really cool. Yeah, I thoroughly enjoy all the stuff that you put out. And again, like the prints and everything are fantastic. Again, if you guys are looking around for sure, check out Sovereign remnant.com and check out the simplestbitcoinbook.net. Or go check out all of it if you're going to be down in Nashville because you'll be able to snag the books and the art live. Again, you're right. Bitcoin art, bullish as hell. Super stoked about that. I'm going to enlarge you here so that people can see what's up.

And I'm just going to, there we go. That's fantastic. Oh, that's so cool. This is a much awaited. I designed this artwork for the cover, Volume 20 Citadel 21. And I've finally done a fine art print run of it. So I will have these available for sale on my website. everything will be on my website but in the official merch booth as well so this is doesn't it looks better in

real life than it does on my crappy camera but i got prints sticker packs and pins so when you're okay so i guess i guess i've got a question for you then um you know everybody comes at bitcoin are a different way and i think in the early days not not blanket but in the earlier days if it's it's if you went back five, 10 years or something like that in Bitcoin's history, Bitcoin art was slap a bee on it and be done with it. And it has evolved so much since then. And I think Bitcoin art is becoming its own, almost its own subset of art in that not all Bitcoin art is actually just, is actually necessarily Bitcoin related.

Like there's there's a lot of little hidden messages in art often. But what I mean is I think we're kind of seeing the play of the live play out of low time preference taking hold in the art space with Bitcoin. And what I mean is people used to be like, there's a Bitcoin B on it. I'm going to buy it. And now, like, try, you know, try going and standing up against the quality of Bitcoin artists that are hitting the circuits now and trying to sell something like that. And it's just not going to fly because sats are precious. And you've got to do something really special to convince somebody to separate with their sats. So we're kind of getting this, this quick trajectory of, like, really fine art when it comes to Bitcoin that,

You know, you kind of, you know, I initially scoffed a little bit when I read the, the chapter of the Bitcoin standard where he talks about art because it is subjective. But also, I think there's some truth there where, like, some dude can just, like, put red paint on a canvas in, like, a minute and a half. And then it sells for, like, 2.5 mil. And you're like, you know, like, it just, I feel like. We're starting to see a recognition of craftsmanship and skill in Bitcoin art. But I don't know if you guys echo that. I would love to jump in right there because for me, I am falling down a Bitcoin art rabbit hole the last year or two, so much so that I actually built a gallery into time chain calendar.

Asanoa's work is in there. Modiote's work is in there. Fractal and Crypt, who we mentioned before, it's in there. I'll tell you what you were just talking about, Ben, is so on point because I see it from the point of view that Bitcoin is this deeply sophisticated complex topic. We all know that when people first encounter Bitcoin, they have such the wrong idea and they don't understand it at all. And it takes so much time and energy and an open mind and proof of work to actually learn it and understand it. And to me, the Bitcoin art is a very particular method and angle for not only understanding this stuff, but think of what the artists are doing. They're taking in some cases like literal technical aspects of Bitcoin and revealing them to people, putting in front of your eyes where you're disarmed in the sense that you're viewing a piece of art and you see beauty and you see form.

But in there is Bitcoin itself. I mean, look at this man. He's got this like cipher thing behind him an ode to cryptography. And we saw that piece of art with the transactions in the block. It's like this is a very special and effective way of teaching people about Bitcoin and spreading these ideas. Because at the end of the day, Bitcoin is a bunch of ideas. And that's what it takes to kind of wrap your head around. it is kind of, you know, digest these ideas.

Art is kind of like helping you do that in a very particular way. So I find it incredibly important. And the more that I, the more of these Bitcoin artists that I discover and the more of this art that I find, I'm experiencing exactly what you were talking about, Ben. Like this stuff is is really incredibly done and really thoughtful. And it's not just slapping a bee on it. like we would see much more of just, you know, only a few years ago. The whole Bitcoin art world, I feel like, is evolving at lightning speed right now.

And it's really incredible to see if you haven't checked this stuff out, check out the gallery on time chain calendar, come to the conferences and go to these art galleries. It's now sort of a regular feature of a lot of these conferences to have these art galleries because I feel like it's a critical perspective. Absolutely. Alex, I want to get your take. And then maybe after Alex, you chime in and any other thoughts. There's a couple other artists that I also wanted to give a shout to one,

Osanoa that we were kind of back and forth about on X just before this. But Alex, you go ahead first. Yeah, well, I wanted to shout out crypto graffiti, who I've been buying t-shirts from. I haven't, you know, sacked up enough to spend the amount on his amazing physical artwork. I've seen some of it in person. I've had his T-shirts for years. I also want to echo T.C. and Ben, both, you made this point. Like, I mean, I've been buying Bitcoin stuff for years, and it literally was like,

oh, someone's got a Bitcoin hat on Etsy. Like, you know, and there's still good stuff on there. I don't want to throw too much shade, but, like, I mean, you know, what's her name, a coin artist. She had that famous cipher hidden in her painting like seven years ago as one of the first people to do something like that. But there was very few true craftsmen doing stuff. And one of the main things that I like in the Bitcoin standard

to sort of echo your point, not even so much about the Sophenine's criticism of modern art, which I actually love really weird modern art museum. I really enjoy going to modern art museums. But the low time preference and the architecture, which I think plays into the same thing. You've got people like Brecky literally carving marble, right? I mean, I might buy something with my sats. I can tell you for certain I'm not buying a home made out of, you know,

vinyl siding that's going to deteriorate before the mortgages do, right? But maybe one built out of stone or brick. you know i'm not going to buy a probably not going to buy something that you printed out on a laser printer at home but maybe something that's made with you know a silicon wafer and gold flakes maybe something carved into wood right it does it in that incentive as especially as bitcoin value goes up and as you know long-term hodlers effectively become wealthier um there's incentive for artists to become even more to evolve further right

And I think we've obviously seen that. I mean, it's like there were a couple back in the day. Even fractal and cryptic, I think it's been around a long time, if I recall. But so is crypto graffiti and Marguerite coin artist was around. But like now there's dozens. I didn't even know about your stuff, Osanoa. And I'm definitely going to check you out in Nashville. And I love that.

That thing behind you has a seed phrase hidden it. Is that what you're saying? What's in that thing? So this is, I'm calling it Seed cipher. for it's a they're arbitrary glyphs. I made them up late one night. And so you've got 12 words on there. So it's just the,

it's four characters per word. So you got your truncated seed words. And you only need your first four letters from any seed word, just in case anybody on listening doesn't know that. All, all bit, all 2048 seed words can be truncated down to the first four letters. That's all you need.

So you generate your own seed phrase. you assign each of those symbols a letter in the, you know, consecutive order of your seed phrase. So, you know, you know, session S-E-S, and then so forth. And then you stamp it into the seed plate here has those symbols, but they're scrambled up. So you assign your letter to your symbol and you find the symbol on the seed plate. You stamp it in, but it's all scrambled on here. So if somebody finds this, they can't decrypt the seed phrase from the plate alone. And you actually need the painting to tell you the correct order of the seed phrase.

So there sort of is if if if Bitcoin is the knowledge of a seed phrase, then yes, the painting is Bitcoin. And I've tested it. I would say it's a provably secure way to actually store Bitcoin. And so each of the, they're this painting and each of its prints will come with two seed plates. that you can fit 12 words on each one. So you can do a 24 word seed phrase and then it comes with a little backup seed plate that's got the same sequencing of the glyphs as the painting in case, you know, your house burnt down in the painting or, you know, got stolen or something.

What's interesting though is it's user loadable and reloadable. I really like Bitcoin collectibles, but you know, the whole key generation thing is a little bit of a, it's a total trust issue. So this is cool because you can load as much Bitcoin as you wanted onto a seed plate, use the painting to decrypt the seed plate, hide your seed plate, and then tell friends or whoever you wanted, hey, there's X amount of Bitcoin. This is encrypted using this painting. And it's impossible for anybody to get that seed phrase because it would be the same chance as guessing any 128-bit private key. It's really cool. It's like a, it's a cipher. And I guess, yeah, you can reassign

the glyphs later to different letters, right? And theoretically make a new one. wallet. It's pretty cool. Thank you. Very cool. That's amazing. It's clever. In addition to it looks really beautiful as well. Like, but it's, and that's sort of, I think, in a emblematic of the, I mean, art is a game of evolution in a lot of ways if you study, right, like I'm sure you guys probably have like classic painting, right? You go from, you know, rudimentary to very detailed, something like Hieronymus Vash that's like ludicrously detailed but kind of disproportionate and you get Impressionism and all this different like these have current like everybody's sort of evolving the medium over and over again and it's clearly happening in Bitcoin very cool yeah it's it's amazing I

also know I wanted to give a shout out to that that little thread that we're on earlier about another artist and you're like oh have you have you seen his work before. And actually, yes, I'm going to bring up his website here, but there's a guy he goes by the name of Gareth. Gareth Eckley, I believe, is how you say his last name. Anyways, Gareth, he does some awesome work. And recently in my home city of Calgary in Canada here, we did a, it was our third iteration of the SAT market. And so what the impetus for that was, it kind of struck me last year where, you know, there was a lot of concern in and around. There was pressures from exchanges to begin flagging any coin joint transactions and preventing people from doing certain things. And so

that was kind of, people were getting really pissy about it. And, and, and, and, worrying and getting angry, but I didn't see a whole lot of action there. And to me, the greatest action, the way that you get away from the worries of being able to have on and off ramps is to not need them anymore. And to actually use your Bitcoin and live on a Bitcoin standard and be able to get everything that you need locally with people that you know with Bitcoin. And so nobody here was doing it, so I just did it. And now we have a market. And we've just done our third one. And so we get all kinds of different stuff at this local market. But it's all Bitcoiners, all people that are accepting Bitcoin for what they do. We made a big effort to get people that are

farmers that would have beef and eggs and dairy and all that kind of stuff. Also tradesmen, people that can actually build you shit that you actually need or fix stuff when it breaks. So we We had plumbers. We had roofers. We had people that could frame houses. We had all kinds of different stuff. Barbers, you know, you name it. We got it. But then we also had things like artists. And one of the artists that we had at the last sat market was Gareth. And so I wanted to quickly give him a shout out and do a little showcase of his stuff. He was, if I'm not mistaken, and he was a jeweler for years, and he would, like, actually cut gems,

do things like that. And so he has put together just this incredible stock of different pieces that he hand-carves himself. So there you see Nat with one of the necklaces that he made, and that's the necklace that she had on. But he does some really, really interesting things. And each one of these has a story and a ton of Easter eggs involved in them. This one I thought was really, really cool.

But he just has such a unique way of approaching this. And all of these are like the stuff, the materials that he uses are precious stones. And so it's very unique. And all of these, the wiring here, like there's a story behind. that there's a reason why he chooses certain types of stone when he's working with it so uh uh like some of this some of the the stone here is is actually meteorite inside of an egg like like there's there's stories behind every piece that he does and i think it's just really cool what he's doing so anyways if you get the chance check out art of satoshi dot com super cool stuff there and then

i've got to give a shout out to my friend uh made x because he does fantastic stuff too. He's been in the game for some time now. He was an artist before he found Bitcoin. In my opinion, he became an even better artist as he found Bitcoin. And he does just some fantastic stuff. And I actually just picked up my first piece from him. It's actually on the wall behind me.

And I'm going to show it off because I'm super happy about it. One sec here. And so he does these hand-painted. totems, they're on wood, and on the back of them, they've got like an open dime to mark kind of like the block that it was finished.

And yeah, I really quite like this one. There's a story behind the Rubik's Cube here. And the story, the reason why I bought this piece and it involves Maidx himself was I went to Baltic Honey Badger in Riga in 2019. and Bull Bitcoin hosted a dinner in this crazy underground restaurant

that actually used to be used by the politicians of the time to basically discuss what they were going to do with the populace and say like, oh, here's what we want to do. Nobody's really going to have a say in any of this. We get to decide. And it was just a very unique instance to have Bitcoiners infiltrate that space. and kind of it was like a little bit of a metaphorical middle finger to the top down pressures of the past

as Bitcoin begins to take hold. And so during that dinner, there's a lot of crazy like OG Bitcoiners down there, one of them being Adam back. And Maidex rolled up to dinner, ends up getting sat beside Adam back. And as only Adam back, Adam back would do, he of course had a Rubik's cube in his pocket. And over dinner, he pulled it out. And then he was teaching Maidex how to solve a Rubik's cube over dinner. And I remember, like,

sitting across the table thinking that this guy was cited in the white paper. And like, I was just kind of like getting rolling in my kind of Bitcoin journey. And it was a really wild and surreal moment to me. And that just kind of stuck with me. And we, and myself and Maynex shared a room for that trip. And so when I saw this piece, I was like, that has meaning for me. So I need this piece. And so there we go. Now I've got my Rubik's Cube, Maidx, that goes up on my wall forever from here on

in. But again, it just kind of speaks to these little things where somebody would just see a Rubik's cube on a piece of art and say, oh, whatever. No, that holds a very deep meaning, I think, for him. And he's done a number of pieces with Rubik's. Cubics cubes involved in them, and I think it all stems from that moment. So I love Bitcoin art when it's done well, and I think there's beginning to be this special crop of Bitcoiners that are just have the skill and the drive to create incredible pieces

that will, that will be sought after, and that will have a place in Bitcoiners' homes for generations to come. So, Asano, I'm super glad that you could touch on that aspect of Bitcoin for us. Thank you. It means a lot being up here. And I just want to encourage everybody to go follow Gareth. I think he's highly underfollowed on Twitter for the art he makes. It's crazy. The first time I saw it on was like, that's wild.

Nobody else. I haven't seen anybody else doing what he's doing. And then Medex, of course, is a total legend. and I guess I assume everybody on here already knows Maidex, but if you don't, go follow Space Bowl on Twitter. Bitcoin art's awesome. I like to think of it as, you know, it's all the way from, you know, for the newcomer, it's, there's a lot of people who aren't coders, they aren't developers, they aren't very technical people, you know, orange coin good kind of plabs, but art can speak too. I like to think at least the most, the widest demographic, you know, you can see something and you can see it right there.

And Bitcoin's, you know, it's a difficult concept to wrap your head around. It's not very, you know, it's not really a tangible thing. I mean, maybe if you get to go see a mining facility, but how many people, you know, coming into Bitcoin actually get to go see something like that. So, you know, being able to look at a piece of art, you can see it right there in front of you. You could touch it. I mean, potentially, you know.

And that, that's kind of huge, I think, in, in, you know, the grand quest to like conceptualize Bitcoin, which of course I think is impossible to ever do. But that's kind of beautiful to the pursuit of perfection. And knowing you're never going to, you're never going to achieve it, but you keep trying. And so I think that the Bitcoin art holds an important place. It's a big part of the culture.

Culture is often, you know, just built around art in a lot of ways. And so for newcomers, it's really, it's a great way to start conversations. I like to think or hope, I guess, that some of my prints that sold are in people's houses and their friends ask them, what is, what's that on your wall there? And it's, you know, an opener for them to start talking about Bitcoin at the dinner party.

And then also, I think you guys had mentioned, you know, eventually, you know, after, you know, an epoch or two or three, you know, someone reaches some stacking goal of theirs and they want to celebrate. And, you know, what are you going to spend your precious Bitcoin on, you know, maybe a trip with your family or something? I don't know, there's lots of things, but a nice piece of art's a cool way to do it. And to remind you, you know, maybe why you get up and get after it in the morning and go get those sats. As you're walking out the door, you look over and see that piece of art on your wall. So there's a lot. I got a lot more to say about it, but I won't draw a lot. That's awesome.

That's awesome. It's a great topic. And I'm glad it's one that's a lot of people are very fond of. So that's great. Again, if you haven't checked out Asanoa, then please do. And of course, Gareth, that we mentioned, Madex and CryptoGraffiti. There's so many good Bitcoin artists there. Keep your eyes peeled.

And when you're not stacking stats, stack art. So with that, we're going to do a little rotation. Alex, I know you've been patiently waiting, just brimming with bullishness. And they need to go to you. So I'm going to give you the same question these gentlemen got. Why are you bullish? I'm bullish because the Overton window has meaningfully shifted. It continues to shift.

our favor and this is you can see this all over the world i'm going to talk about the united states a little bit but and and not just the fact that both uh you know the former president is campaigning at least with bick mourners i don't i'd be surprised if he has a cold card um or you know a ledger or something but but the vice presidential candidate does own bitcoin he owned between 100 and 250 000 worth of bitcoin in 2022, which I think could be as much as 350K of BTC today, depending on how much he owned. And not just because of that, because of things that aren't even specific to Bitcoin. There is power being returned to the people. You see this around the world.

You see the sort of mask off moment in the, whether it's elite media or elite traditional politics, elite education. I really believe that really even just the last six. months has been a meaningful movement in the direction and in the favor of more personal liberty. And I think Bitcoin to me is a major tool for liberty. It's the only, probably the most secure value you can possibly own. I mean, you know, I like when people tell me that, well, gold is good. And I'm like, you know, try using gold like over a distance more than five feet. It's basically useless. It's also like the value to weight ratio, you know,

I'm going to need like five backpacks to move my life savings in gold if I'm if I'm fortunate enough, whereas, you know, I can take the back of a Maidex painting or a, you know, a seed cypher plate and or memorize it, right? So, but there's a bunch of things happening now. And one thing that's really interesting is the, is the interest of the super elite wealth management crowd, the hedge fund guys, the Ray Dalios and Bill Miller is like, these guys. have been trading Bitcoin. I mean, they were trading it with us two, three years ago, but they're trading it. They're like, oh, wow, like, you know, like 41K, like we think it could go to like 52 and we could, you know, make 25% on the trade. The attitude is really shifted now. You've got major sort of people like Ray Dalio and Stan Drucken Miller talking about Bitcoin

is a genuine hedge on the fiscal situation in the United States for the first time in my lifetime. I've been listening to gold bugs and such. I worked on Ron Paul's presidential campaign in 2008 when I was in college, and he was crazy for talking about the national debt. Now it is obviously well known. Everyone knows it. I don't know if anyone's going to do anything about it. You know, former President Trump claimed last night at the Republican National Convention

that he would do something about the debt. I find that unlikely. He spent a lot of money last time he was in office. But people know that the mask is kind of off on a lot of the frauds that we've been seeing happen. I think people are ready to take matters into their own hands. And I mean that peacefully by storing your own wealth or building up your own communities, you know, transacting with local artists, eating local food, right? I feel like there's a real renaissance happening that Bitcoin is a major part of.

And that makes me extremely bullish. So I got a question for you. Yeah. You're absolutely right. There's a deeper understanding of what's going on right now, more so than at any point, definitely in my lifetime. But I think in at least a couple of generations before ours. And what I wonder is, you know, I solidly believe that Bitcoin is the solution.

obviously that's why I'm here. I wonder if the majority of the population will truly understand why they are acting the way that they are as they move to the solution, or if it will just be the incentives playing out that they just kind of naturally have those behaviors and navigate towards Bitcoin. And don't truly understand. the malicious nature of the legacy system, just that they were getting screwed before and now they're not.

Do you think that we'll get to a point where like society as a whole will look back and be like, oh my God, we used to trust a handful of dudes in a closed room to decide how our money would work and how much of it there would be and whether interest rates would go up and down or do you think people will just be like oh yeah like we use bitcoin now and we used to use this other like paper stuff and didn't work as well i actually definitely think it's the latter and i wish that weren't true but um i think it is true i think the vast majority of people today have no idea how any of the major systems that they interact with work and and you know that's okay um i do think bitcoin educators like you ben and and the bitcoin movement in general has done a great job

bringing in, you know, to me when I hear the term Bitcoin Pleb, one of the things I think is that it's people who might not otherwise care. They're not, it's not people that work at banks and know how the flow of monetary policy works. It can be, but it doesn't need to be, right? I think we're adding a lot of new people to that group that will know when that happens. I think most people won't know. And then that will be okay. I think the vast majority of people swipe a card or pay a loan and if it just it just cost what it costs and they try to earn enough of the of the currency unit to be more than what they owe and they just live their daily lives and by the way a huge portion of people in the united states have no savings at all so they're either running less

than they owe or they're earning exactly the same amount i think if it were sats or uh you know dollars they may never really know and in which case though they'll still be a major benefit of a system that is constrained by scarcity that isn't as manipulatable by unelected technocrats that you know i was i work in markets i have to watch the fed speak as they call it and j powell every time they have an fomc many i just like chuckle at the at the kind of ludicrousness of it um it on one hand it does matter should it matter probably it definitely should shouldn't matter. It shouldn't really be a thing that, you know, 12 people meet in a meeting and decide the cost of money. That's basically what they decide. How much money costs. How much to print

or not print, how much to require banks to pay an interest. And they're like, well, you know, they're like the unemployment rate. It ticked up 0.1%. That is going in the right direction. Maybe we can start thinking about making money cheaper. And I'm like, it's the shortest term thinking you could possibly imagine. And then they asked the Fed chairman, well, there was a 60 Minutes interview a couple months ago where Jay Powell was asked finally because frankly losing credibility by not commenting on the national debt. And he doesn't comment on it because of this idea that the Fed is somehow independent of the national government. Well, ironically, it is independent because it's not part of the government, but that's a whole separate story if you know about the creature from Jekyll Island.

But so he's never commented on it. And they finally pinned him down. He was like, oh, yeah, it's totally unsustainable. And it's like, but why aren't you telling that to the American people every day? Why are you focused on what the, you know, 10 bips or 100 bips change in an arcane metric is month to month as you, you know, weigh the economic and monetary lives and futures of millions of people in your hands by turning a tiny dial? That I think people do know is ridiculous. People who, you know, it's kind of like the history is decided by the people who show up. You know, I saw Bitcoin debit here in the chat.

She lives in New Hampshire. She saw a $33 trillion license plate. It's already 34 and I think it's about around the corner to 35. History is decided by the people who show up. Not everybody is going to be able to show up. That's just a fact. There is a distribution of interest, intelligence, time, right? But I do think that even those who don't really know about it don't really have an active role in shaping the future of whatever it is,

in the case of more acutely, the money that we use. One of the great things about Bitcoin, as with all defenses of personal liberty, is that they will benefit also anyway. The reality is that unelected technocrat shouldn't be deciding every aspect of your life. that's the purpose of the United States government is to protect the life, liberty, and pursuit of happiness of its citizens. That was why it was, that's why the government was created, right? And so I, but the bullishness to me, I mean, it's, you know, I saw another, Larry Fink from Black Rock was on CNBC just like two days ago, very bullish appearance. But he, he was kind of a dumer.

He said that Bitcoin is an investment that you may use as a hedge. and that that may become more required, right? And that's a really negative way. It's not an investment for optimist, and that's a very negative way of thinking about a very positive thing, which is the return to personal sovereignty and the ability to keep what you earn and control what you earn. And this is an important, obviously it's important for not being debased

and having your money inflated away by elites, but also storing it yourself. To me, this is I think probably personally more important to me than Bitcoin's, inflation resistance properties is it's self-custody capabilities and unsensurable money but you know six and a one-half-thousand both very important i think but even people that's one thing i love is even people who don't self-custody and choose to use somebody else or custodian or whatever they would still benefit from the constraint put on the monetary system by bitcoin scarcity and um it's just it's not

you know, there isn't a, there isn't a national self-custody bill being approved in Congress at the moment or anything. We're not there yet, you know, we're not, it's not, but, but the pieces are starting to slide in our favor pretty significantly. And I think, you know, we just have to keep our foot on the gas. Yeah, you're, you're right. And, and again, I like that you outline that, even the people that don't understand will still benefit and even beyond that I friendly believe that

while they won't reap all the benefits that the people that came before did the very last person on the entire planet to adopt a Bitcoin standard will still be better off than when they weren't on a Bitcoin standard because now you're

like just just the very virtue of how things currently are you accept a wage at a certain dollar amount per hour of time and you have an understanding of what that can purchase you at that moment well i mean inside of a year that contract that you've signed is is effectively moot because the the purchasing power that you had in your head no longer exists and over time that just degraded and it's on the blue collar worker to beg plead and negotiate to maintain a standard of living, not to improve your standard of living,

just to maintain it. So you've got this top-down power structure where the people on the lowest rungs of the latter are the most screwed, and they have to fight just to stay where they are. And on a Bitcoin standard, it's completely reversed. You say, this is how much, you know,

if you're valuing, if you're getting paid in time, you're valuing your time in sats, those sats, those purchasing power, the purchasing power of those sats, gradually, and let's go to a point where everybody's using Bitcoin, those sats over time will gradually increase in value in purchasing power. And so, you know, and so does human ingenuity and efficiency. So hopefully that stays relatively in lockstep. And so the employer sees

that, okay, well, we've had some technology gains. We can make things quicker. You're employed here. and so that kind of keeps up with it. But if it doesn't for any reason, it's now on the employer to then go and negotiate with the employee and say, like, listen, your productivity is lagging with the productivity gains and the purchasing power of the sats that we're giving you. So we're proposing that we cut your pay by this many sats

and you'll just maintain your living standard instead of doing better. And the employer has to then weigh with that with like, what are the chances this person's going to take a hike and go to another employer and how much is that going to cost us in Sats to replace the person with somebody new and train them? And so the power dynamic completely shifts. And I think that's a really unique thing about if we get to that. I think we will get to that place because people won't put up for anything less.

But yeah, that'll be. I mean, you're totally right. For most goods and services that people have to buy in their everyday life. lives, things like rent, food, gasoline, right, energy. In just the last four years, $1,000 of purchasing power and a savings account's worth about $5 or $600. Like basically you can't save under this system.

And well, I mean, the average person can't invest. They don't have a broker at Fidelity they can call. Like most people don't, right? So it is the sort of, you know, the working class that is most taken advantage of by inflation. And there is no real, I mean, that's the answer. You're at Warren Buffett. He says, well, you know, I have a great inflation hedge stocks, right? He invests in cash flow generating businesses. They're all going to raise their prices in the case of inflation and

everything will price higher. But we've all seen those charts of like the, you know, the Dow Jones priced in gold. Like it's not up. Not really. Like maybe you maintain your purchasing power. But the average person doesn't have a brokerage account. And so, you know, if you had it, a Bitcoin denominated a savings account or economy in general, yeah, you wouldn't be able to be debased, right? I mean, inflation is created in Washington. Yes, 100%. I want to get takes from Asanoa and T.C., so whoever wants to jump in first, feel free. Yeah, I was going to say, going back to the original bullish point about the Overton window shifting,

I think it's really incredibly interesting and synchronistic that we had these ETFs go live at the beginning of this year and then we just had a halving. And those two things, almost coming from two different directions, have really highlighted the supply of Bitcoin and more specifically the scarcity of the supply of Bitcoin and the increasing scarcity. And it's been interesting to watch, you know, just even on like Bitcoin Twitter, you've got a whole new crop of people that are around all the time. A lot of these guys come from traditional finance and they're coming from that sort of traditional Wall Street world. They are looking at things from that point of view. And yet it's almost like the supply of Bitcoin is the next easy metric for people to focus on. It's like the price is the obvious first one that people focus on.

But now I feel like there's a lot of attention on the supply of Bitcoin. I love this because I'm hoping that, you know, maybe another couple cycles. Everyone will be staring at the difficulty adjustment with the same intent. You know, it's like this is how the world learns about some of the nature of this incredible technology, this protocol, and really look beyond. the exchange rate to the Fiat and in doing so, start to appreciate what's actually important here. So I really love it. It makes me bullish too. Awesome. You go ahead too. I think it's I think it's I'm I'm bullish as well. I think it's interesting how you know, I don't want to be,

I don't want to be kind of morbid, I guess. But regardless of, of whether everybody's self-custodies or there's large swaths of people, you know, on custodial solutions or there's some sort of, you know, I hate to say it, but CBDC, you know, in certain jurisdictions, even if that stuff is just backed by Bitcoin, it would be such a game changer from what we have now. And now, of course, the vision is, you know, a truly free market, Bitcoinized, fully world with everybody self-custody. But it's just, you know, there's a lot of hope and just if it could be just even a little

bit better than it is right now would be, would be amazing. I'm younger and I, Bitcoin gave me a new lease on life. I, you know, I don't know if I'll ever be able to own a house where I grew up, you know, or raise my kids in the same zip code that I grew up in. And that's really sad. I don't know if I, currently I don't know if I'll be able to ever own a house. you know, as it stands right now in this, in this immediate kind of situation. So I mean, you know, the chance at, you know, just a normal life for myself and everybody out there,

you know, being able to own a roof over my head, you know, hopefully paid off before I die. And Bitcoin gives me that hope. So, you know, it's it's a, a fucking hill worth, fucking hell worth dying on. And you know what? if it ends up with some parallel milkshake kind of situation, at least there'll be those few or hopefully many of the remnant who figured out the self-custody and, you know, got in early enough to have one foot in and one foot out of the system because the, you know, microchips are fucking coming. And so, you know, this is, this is it. This is your, this is your phone booth out of the

matrix. Dude, I will say that I firmly believe that, again, if you, if you follow the playbook and, you know, and what I think is coming comes, I think what you're in store for is, you're, you're kind of at the peak of, you're at kind of the peak of, you're at kind of the peak of the, the, the fiat bullshit system right now. And you've also, as you said, have one foot in and one foot out. And I think, and I'm just going to, I'm just going to, there we go. And I think because you have one foot in and one foot out and because you're creating value for other Bitcoiners and, and you're able to earn in Bitcoin, at least a portion of what you're doing. If you're able to spend less than you earn, I think that you're going to see that entire

equation flip on you. Like right now, again, this is the common sentiment, and this is why an entire generation and, you know, we'll say probably anything prior to millennials and some millennials captured and the same thing saying like there's no fucking way I'm ever going to own a home. And if the system as it exists right now continues and there was no opt out, you'd be right. You'd be 100% right. Even just looking like I'm my parents were not well off. They were only finally able to afford getting a home like starting a mortgage when I was

graduating high school. And so like that was like I was on my way to eventually like moving out with friends by then. And so like they didn't even begin to start paying for a new home until I was like 19. And and so for them that that came much later. But I'm looking at the cost of their home from 20 years ago to now is triple. And sure as fuck, wages. are not triple, right? And think of the crushing reality that brings on that next generation that comes up 20, you know,

over those 20 years to adulthood, saying like, how in the hell am I supposed to even think about getting a home? But I think what we're going to, where on the cusp of seeing is the exact opposite, there's this kind of crescendo of unaffordability of stuff. and people sinking their money into anything that can preserve purchasing power, but we're seeing a shift of people just using a different money and realizing, I don't need to sink money into something to save me money. I just need to hold the money.

And so what happens to housing. Housing goes to the, as Jeff Booth says a lot of the time, it drops to the price of actual utility. And so I think your money, if you're able to, spend less than you earn, your money will increase in purchasing power, and the thing you're trying to purchase is going to drop. And contrary to your initial worry of, I'm never going to be able to afford a home. I think you will afford a home. And then I think that, you know, if you decide to have a family, if you have kids and they have grandkids, each generation moving forward

is going to have an easier and easier time affording all of the necessities of life. And And then plenty of extravagant things to enjoy their life even further and explore and build even cooler and greater shit. So I think that we're heading that way, but we're definitely at that crescendo of despair right now, in my opinion. Amen to that. And I, yeah, I agree with you. It's something's got to give in the near future here. You know, so I'm going to keep sailing towards that orange glowing light. the horizon 100%.

T.C., do you want to try you? Yeah, I mean, the trends are really clear. We're going to see more weird clown world stuff and the purchasing power of the government issued money is going to continue to dissolve. Those trends, I don't think, are going to go away. And so just even without, you know, major shift in the way the world works, Bitcoin offers,

you a lot more certainty in regards to your purchasing power in the future. And, you know, the real hopeful and very bullish thing about it, I think everyone who's been in Bitcoin for more than a short period of time, you start to see these changes. The perspective shift and the realities of your purchasing power actually being there for you in the future changes your behavior. It changes your outlook and your perspective. And it causes you to live in, I would argue, demonstrably better ways. And so, you know, as the Overton window shifts and as more people discover what Bitcoin actually is beyond just a price chart, they're going to inevitably have some of that, if not a lot of that, impact them. And so I

I feel like it's the brightest beacon of hope amidst all this craziness that's going on. I'm here for the long haul. Let's go. Hell yeah. LFG. Alex, I'll give you the opportunity. If you have anything else that you'd like to tag on there on your topic there, then feel free based on what the gents said. No, I mean, I just agree with it all. I think we're taking it, let's take it back to eCash.

in the background of all of this sort of more macro trends in the world or in bitcoin ownership adoption ets and institutionalization and all that stuff is the the cyperpunk movement is still strong and growing as well so i love to see that i think to me it doesn't need to be what everyone does but it absolutely needs to be what many people do and that you always can do so like when it comes to you know, I talked to people like, you know, I was, take my mom, I was telling her, like, you know, she had Bitcoin on Coinbase for years that I had convinced her to buy. And I was like not really feeling that confident. I could teach her how to use some of the various self-custody methods.

And then the bit key from cash app came out, which I think is a great device. It's very easy to use. Maybe the easiest UX for a hardware wallet I've seen. And that's going to keep happening. think it's okay for people to get in however they feel comfortable and then learn you know and in the meantime you know the people at the core of this movement are developing new ways for either to do more advanced things or to do old things in a simpler easier way and it all sort of comes together and i i don't you know i don't worry about right now although it is something

that the corners need to always be ever vigilant about i don't worry about the takeover of Bitcoin by, you know, the, you know, when I talk about these elites that are getting interested in Bitcoin, it doesn't worry me. It makes me very bullish. You, Bitcoin remains a very strong, and I think getting stronger tool for opting out and protecting it yourself. And it's okay if, you know, you think about it, like if you think about hyper-bitquinization, it's got to be in every, the dollar is in every app. It's in every account. It's you can get dollars in your bank or dollars in your PayPal or dollars in your cash out or dollars in your money market fund. Right.

Like I think we have to be prepared for the idea that winning might not look like everybody using, you know, the seed cipher or the block, you know, something from coin kite or whatever. But that's okay. I think that's okay. And at the same time, we can keep expanding that world of the real plebs who know how to use that stuff. And I think you're going to find a lot more people in the end learn and know how to how to use Bitcoin actually and know how Bitcoin works than ever understood how the current system works. I love that. Yeah, that's fantastic. Well, I think that's a good note as ever to begin rounding out the show. And so I'm going to start doing that now.

I'll put a ball on that final topic. And so, Jens, the way that I like to round out shows typically is to just do one last. around the circle here and just get any final thought that you may have based on anything that was said during the show today. And secondly, and more importantly, a recommendation. And the recommendation can take any form that you like that could be as simple as just a piece of life advice that you wish you had known when you started your Bitcoin journey. It could also be a check out this podcast or video or something cool that you've seen recently

or try out this app or try out this device or, you know, whatever it may be, totally up to you, but something that you think people may find useful. And so I'll get started with that and then you guys can stew for a second while I get mine off my chest. But my vibe today from the show was optimism. The world is just full of,

full of so much pessimism right now. and and just people, again, based on this, again, kind of stemming from this last topic or, you know, this last little line of conversation, I'm never going to make it. I'm never, you know, like this thing and this thing and this thing is impossible. And, you know, humanity is always finding new ways to innovate and create new things and be more efficient at things. but when your system is inherently designed to siphon away that progress and place it into the hands of an elite few, then of course, people are going to feel defeated because everything should be getting easier and cheaper and it's just not. It's going the opposite direction. And I think we're about to witness a change of course and a hard turn in the direction of those benefits being fulfilled. filtered out to everybody that partakes in society and contributes in some way to a point where they're

able to, on average, spend less than they earn. They will reap the benefits. If you're providing values for others, you are going to fucking kill it in this coming decade and beyond. And so if you can just keep your head down, work hard, and figure out what creates value for others and spend less than you earn and save in a money that nobody can print, you are going to absolutely flourish in the near future. That's what I truly believe, and that's what I love about it, about being in Bitcoin, because it's just the inverse of sentiment of what we've seen this past decade. In terms of recommendations, I'm reading this book right now, and it is,

blowing my fucking mind. If you get the chance, please pick up a copy of Fiat food because my God, the guy who wrote it, Matt Lysak, Lisiac, I'm not sure how to pronounce his last name. Anyways, he read the Fiat standard from Savadine,

and then there was a short chapter on Fiat food and, and, you know, what happened to create the environment of terrible food that you see in the U.S. and North America and other markets. And he was like, wow, it's pretty out to lunch. And he was actually an investigative journalist for two decades. And so he started to fact check it. And he was like, oh, actually, Savadine has vastly understated the corruption that has taken place with the food,

the food infrastructure in the U.S. And it is unreal. Like I'm rethinking every single thing on my shelf. And I'm, you know, before I would generally think, oh, this is unhealthy,

I shouldn't have it. And then, you know, I'm pretty bad for, you know, like my, my food is my one vice where I will, I will try and make a change and it's cold turkey or nothing.

this book is making me rethink all of those choices out of anger for how much I've been had by these bullshit industries and the incentives and how they've aligned. And so if you do one thing for yourself, read Fiat food. And if anything, if you want a taste of what's in the book, Preston Pish did an interview with him recently. and I paused that podcast multiple times saying

no fucking way is that a real thing and I would look it up and I'm going to give you a taste right now in the early 20th century so like in the early 1900s there was a cult that thought there was going to be

that the end of the world was coming but they gave a specific date came the date came and passed didn't happen and and and but the the leader of this cult or one of the higher ups this woman um she firmly believed that the we just didn't see that the apocalypse was upon us and that we needed to uh we needed to purify body and mind in order to prepare uh for for the apocalypse and and transcending into the next realm and and And part of the problem that she saw is that too many men were masturbating. And she saw the cause of that as too many people were eating meat, which gave too much

testosterone, which caused more men to want to masturbate. And so she then went about and found somebody in between trying to interject herself with major like health institutions and governments and everything to get people away from meat. She found a gentleman. She said, could you put together a breakfast alternative to meat because Americans by and large would consume a lot of meat at breakfast, lunch, and dinner? Could you put together a breakfast option for food that would be an alternative to eating meat in the mornings and the gentleman obliged and came up with this this new this new invention he's like here we go this is the replacement everybody should have this at breakfast and through a whole bunch of

different connections and interesting things it became a staple of our breakfast nowadays the last name of the gentleman that this cultist enlisted to create a breakfast alternative to meat. His last name was Kellogg. Kellogg's corn flakes was the product. So you're replacing eggs and meat and all that stuff with, you know, like all of these refined grains and corn products and everything. And since the government started advising people on diets in and around the 70s, and there's a whole story behind that, look at the obesity rates in the United States.

it's like the connections drawn in this and again this guy brings the receipts you need to read this book my mind is being blown i'm not even finished yet i've got about a third of the book then you stole my thing i was literally going to recommend fiat food i just passed 10 months on my carnivore diet i've been on it for 10 months now and about three months ago i read fiat food i gobbled that book up in two days. It is a fabulous book and it is the most amazing rabbit hole to go down what happened with the food in the last hundred years in the West. And the truth about it is absolutely shocking. It's scandalous. There's fraud. There's lies. And this stuff will hit you hard because, you know, if you remember anything from even just as far back as like the 90s or the 80s,

you'll remember some of these events that took place and the guidance that was given to the American people about what was healthy. And it's so upside down. It's so backwards. And now that I've been doing carnivore diet, I've actually tested this myself. And it's unreal what happens when you actually start eating the right things and stop eating the wrong things. Yeah, sorry, I just had to pile on because I was just saying, yes, yes, yes, the whole way along when you were saying that, Ben. It's unbelievable. And again, I'm trying to tell my wife about it.

And like she's on board with like, yeah, foods kind of shit and everything. But I'm telling her these stories. And she's like, I feel like this can't possibly be true. And I'm like, no, you need to. You sound like a crackpot being like the guy who created Kellogg's Cornflakes was a religious fundamentalist who. Have you seen, Ben, have you seen the drunk history episode about this? There was a show on Comedy Central called Drunk History about a decade ago, and one episode was about the Kellogg Brothers,

and it's so funny. This drunk woman's basically telling this story. But when you read it in the book, it's amazing. What's really crazy is the whole thing with the grains that really comes from that Seventh-day Adventist, Cookie point of view and what they were trying to actually stop. But the oils, the vegetable oils, the seed oils, that's a whole other scandal and the sugar and the amount of sugar that's put in everything.

And by the time you finish this book, you realize that the entire food system is just as corrupt as our monetary system. And a lot of that corruption was facilitated because of fiat money too. So it's an incredible parallel rabbit hole to go down. I'm going to recommend that. That's going to be my closing. That's insane. I've literally, I was like, I got to see this drunk history thing. can I just show

this isn't even the drunk history one but the second search topic is meet the psychopath who invented your breakfast it's unreal so anyways it's a thing you guys should probably look into it that is insane T.C. do you have

any other like final thoughts anything that you wanted to close out with for the this has been such a fun conversation and I really appreciate it I love the topic of the art. I think that the Bitcoin art is something that's really worth people taking a closer look at. And there's just an extraordinary amount of passion and intent and really brilliant work happening there. So I encourage people to check out this art.

It's one of the reasons I put a gallery on time chain calendar. If you click the little gallery button or you go to slash gallery, I am working on building a gallery of artists that features Asanoa and a lot of the other people that were mentioned. And I'm going to keep adding more art there. So I encourage people to check that out. And then just, you know, on the higher level, I am more bullish than ever as far as all the other topics we discussed. I feel like we're at a real special moment. I've been around long enough. This is going to be my third bull run and I know what part of the cycle we're at. And it's exciting just looking over the next six to 12 months knowing what's coming so um let's fucking go hell yeah

i love it uh also no i'm going to toss it down to you final thoughts and if you have a recommendation that'd be amazing yeah i just wanted to add on to what you're talking about the food there and just recommend to everybody listening that the money is only a little part of it it's a big part and it's a part that interestingly will help fix the food part and the medicine part and all the other parts but don't don't you know don't wait on on buying organic non-GMO food strictly for your home because you know you're not going to get to enjoy any of the Bitcoin you save and you're not going to have healthy kids if you're not healthy and they're not going to get to enjoy the Bitcoin the sats you save and get to enjoy this hyper-bitcoinization beautiful Bitcoin world we're going

towards if we keep you in a bunch of junk foods so I just could not be in more agreement with that. And I also wanted to just, you know, mention the medicine and, you know, it kind of goes all in the rabbit hole. But just remind everybody to keep, stay sharp and keep, keep learning and keep deep diving. Recommendations, I want to recommend everybody go to the simplest bitcoinbook.net and purchase a physical copy of the second edition of the simplest Bitcoin book. If you don't feel like spending the SATs, at least download a free PDF copy. I also want to recommend everybody check out Bitcoin trading cards because this is a super awesome project that has major potential to Orange Pill a lot of people out there.

Our goal is to get a large print run of these cards into big box stores. So check out Bitcoin trading cards and check out the Spirit of Satoshi, the world's first Bitcoin-centric AI. We just launched the first of our collaborative series of the cards with the Spirit of Satoshi team. They are super awesome, all of them over there. shout out to Alex Fetke and you can go and chat with Satoshi AI. So it's another excellent tool in helping those friends and family of yours that you are trying to orange pill.

Give them a copy of the simplest Bitcoin book. Send them a PDF version of it and shoot them over the Spirit of Satoshi website and they can ask it questions all day long. I just want to say once again how much I appreciate you letting me up here and appreciate all you. It's been awesome chat in TC. I don't know if I'll see you in Nashville, Nashville, but if not, I'll see you at the next one. And Alex, it would be great to meet you in person sometime. Hell yeah, man.

I'll echo the Bitcoin trading cards thing. I love those guys. Aladdin is a legend. And I got to say he was gracious enough to make a card with my stupid face on it. and and World of Rusty was the guy who designed the art for it, who was awesome, and I've got the foil of my card and like a special little case up on my shelf to the side here. And I used to collect like Marvel cards when I was a kid and seeing like a cartoon kind of like epic version of myself in like a workshop with a blow torch was beyond. my wildest child dreams

to have that as a trading card. So Bitcoin trading cards, those guys are awesome and they're such fun and educational collectibles. Check them out. The website is BTC-TC-com or BTC trading cards. So BTC-TC.com. Alex, I'm going to toss it to you.

Final thoughts, recommendations. Go ahead. Yeah, it's been great. Thanks for having me here, Ben. Great to talk with you guys. S&O at TC. I will be in Nashville next week as well, most of the week. I'll be spending a lot of time at Bitcoin Park as well.

Shout out to Bitcoin Park. They also throw great events there. Yeah, a couple recommendations. I'm just going to throw in. I haven't read Fiat food, but I literally just bought it. I am a proud, continuous owner of a bunch of local beef, and I eat a fair amount. I get a quarter cow about every nine months.

That's actually going faster now because my kids are getting older. They're eating more. So I can't, yeah, and I'm big, we're very anti-seed oil in our family, so I know we're going to enjoy this book. So I will check that out. And also check out the Revolution of Money by Sam and Ben Baker is one of my favorite, very simple, like history of money. Why did it go wrong? There's dozens of those types of books. It's a good one, though.

Check it out. And also resistance money by, like Warmke, Andrew Bailey on Bradley Rettler. I think it is a very interesting way to approach. introducing people to Bitcoin through a philosophical perspective. If you, I haven't studied philosophy at length since I was in college, but if you think about sort of the fundamental reasons why something may be moral or not moral or ethical or not ethical, it's worth checking out that book. It's very, very accessible book.

All three of these authors are scholars affiliated with the Bitcoin Policy Institute and really, really enjoyed this book. And I'm going to see these guys in Nashville next week as well. So excellent. Check those out. Both very good for orange-pelling normies. This one, resistance money is more about like why Bitcoin. Is it a good thing? Should it be part of the world? Revolution of Money is sort of an intro to the history of money. There's many of these. And by the way, you might see that someone really great wrote the forward to that book. So I have to show. Oh, I know.

I don't get any money from it, to be clear. That's awesome. Well, this is great, guys. I thoroughly enjoyed this. This was a blast. I want to say cheers to you guys. Also, cheers to the 4,300 people that tuned in over the course of the episode. So, cheers to everybody across YouTube, X, Noster, and a few other places. Thank you guys for being a part of the episode and the people that will be watching and listening to the this after it airs live. I very much appreciate all of you and everybody that's been in the chat. Love you guys. Keep coming back. We love the conversation. But gentlemen, I'll just finish off by saying,

thank you so much for taking the time to get bullish with me on a Friday evening. And you're all welcome back anytime. Thank you, Ben. Cheers, guys. Have a good evening. Oh, yeah. Please. Later, guys.

And everybody watching, thank you so much for being here. And of course, if you haven't on already, please do like, hit that subscribe button. And most importantly, if you had fun here, if you enjoyed it, please do share it wherever you may be, whether you're on X, whether you're on YouTube, whether you're on. If you're on Facebook, even share it there. I'm not really there that much, but that's okay. Share it wherever you may be. It is very, very helpful. And yeah, thank you guys so much for being here.

What a blast. I really enjoyed this conversation. So we'll round it out here. Of course, again, all those good things, like, sub-share. If you want to help the show in another way, you can hit up the sponsors. They are all listed down below. All of our guests are listed in these show notes as well. So if you want to follow them on their socials, go check them out.

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