Business Innovators Radio - Chief Gene Saunders Founder of Project Lifesaver: Saving Lives and Providing Hope for Vulnerable Individuals

Episode Date: August 17, 2023

In this episode of Business Innovators Radio, host Barak Granot interviews Chief Gene Saunders, the founder and CEO of Project Lifesaver International. Chief Saunders, a dedicated public safety professional with an extensive background in law enforcement, shares the inspiring story of how Project Lifesaver was founded and its mission to address the life-threatening behavior of wandering individuals with cognitive disorders.Chief Saunders explains that when individuals with cognitive disorders wander, time is of the essence. Project Lifesaver aims to swiftly locate and rescue these vulnerable individuals to prevent injury, dehydration, or worse. The program utilizes a radio telemetry system, with each person wearing a bracelet transmitting a unique frequency. Trained teams can track the signal and locate the individual within minutes, significantly reducing search time and increasing the chances of a safe recovery.Throughout the interview, Chief Saunders highlights real-life success stories of how Project Lifesaver has made a difference in the lives of individuals and their families. He also discusses the challenges faced during the early stages of the program, including skepticism and attempts by for-profit companies to take over the initiative. However, through perseverance and a commitment to keeping the program accessible and affordable, Project Lifesaver has grown to over 1,800 member agencies across the United States and Canada.Chief Saunders concludes by emphasizing the importance of partnerships with organizations like Pilot International and the Alzheimer’s Foundation of America, whose support has been crucial to the success and expansion of Project Lifesaver International.Listeners will be inspired by Chief Saunders’ dedication to ensuring the safety and well-being of vulnerable individuals and will gain a deeper understanding of the life-saving impact of Project Lifesaver. Tune in to this episode to learn more about this remarkable program and the hope it brings to countless families and caregivers.Source: https://businessinnovatorsradio.com/chief-gene-saunders-founder-of-project-lifesaver-saving-lives-and-providing-hope-for-vulnerable-individuals

Welcome to Business Innovators Radio, featuring industry influencers and trendsetters, sharing proven strategies to help you build a better life right now. Hello and welcome to another episode of our show. My name is Barack. I'm going to be your host today. And today we have a privilege of hosting a truly remarkable guest on our show. Chief Jean Saunders is not only a dedicated public safety professional with an extensive background in law enforcement, but he's also a visionary founder of Project Lifesaver International. Recognizing the urgent need to address the life-threatening behavior of wandering individuals with cognitive disorders, Chief Sanders' pioneered a program that has since become a beacon of hope for countless families and caregivers.

Under his leadership, Project Lifesaver has grown from a localized initiative to an internationally recognized program dedicated to the swift location and rescue of vulnerable individuals. In addition, Chief Saunders is also a bestselling author of the book Deploying High, which covers his life achievements. With a heart for service and an innovative spirit, Chief Saunders has dedicated his life to ensuring the safety and well-being of those who most at risk at our communities. Please join me in giving a warm welcome to Chief Jean Saunders.

Now, Chief joins us, first of all, it's a pleasure to have you. Could you please introduce yourself for our listeners and share a bit about your background in law enforcement and public safety? Sure, I'd be happy to. First off, you gave my name, Gene Saunders. I'm the founder and CEO of Project Lifesaver International. Now, how I started out in life, I'm graduating from high school. I went straight into the military. I was there for a total of nine years counting reserve time. As soon as I came out of the military, helped a couple of other jobs,

but I always had the desire to enter police work. Part of my military, I spent in a military police unit. I think that fed the bug big time. So when I got the opportunity in 1968, I applied and was accepted to the Chesapeake Police Department in Chesapeake, Virginia. I served there for 33 years.

I retired in 2001 as a captain. I served in every bureau and every division in the police department except traffic. I never had a hanker for warning to work radar. During that time, I rose through the ranks, held every command, again, except traffic. Well, one of my collateral duties was special operations, which was SWAT and which encompassed search and rescue. In the early 90s, mid-90s, late 80s, we saw a rise in searches for Alzheimer's patients. Well, at that time, there was very little known about searching for Alzheimer's patients. So all of the old tried and true methods for searching for lost persons or hunters or whatever were the tactics we used.

We didn't know that those were unsatisfactory and that Alzheimer's patients were a whole different category of people you were searching for. So as a result, many of our searches were not successful. We didn't know there was a timeline. You had 24 hours or tragedy would probably ensue. Based on that, I kept looking for another way. I mean, when we did these searches, Barack, we encompassed a lot of manpower, a lot of time, a lot of taxpayer money, and to fail as often as we did,

was very depressing. So I kept looking for any other innovative way that we could do this in a better or better way. Well, in about 1998, first part of, I got a brochure on wildlife tracking. That led to some people called an epiphany. I just said, well, it was just an idea. So I contacted these people with this technology and started to incorporate it and found out that it worked very well.

So here I am, 25 years later, still doing it. All right. Was there a specific incident that inspired you to fund Project Life Server? Well, I think as I alluded to, it was the fact that we were searching for Alzheimer's patients and really didn't know how to search for Alzheimer's patients. We were using a lot of men, a lot of manpower. There was one specific incident that really kind of sparked my desire to find another method. And that we had a 79-year-old man wander away from his house.

We spent two weeks looking for him. We used everything we could come up with from ATVs, horses, dogs, hundreds of people, helicopters, you name it, we employed it. Two weeks into the search, we found him. Unfortunately, he was deceased. What really bothered me about that was he was less than a quarter of a mile away from his house. Wow. And he was in a direct line to his former place of employment.

So what we reasoned, because after all, we couldn't talk to him, that in his mind, because he had Alzheimer's, he was trying to go to work. When my chief asked me to do a cost estimate on that search, it came to approximately taxpayer cost of $342,000. That coupled with the fact that I was really becoming frustrated with having to tell families that we are not going to continue the search or something worse, kind of spurred me to really get into the movement of, I've got to do something different, I need to find something different.

This isn't working. It's just not working. So that kind of was the catalyst. I got it. Well, that's quite a story and quite a change, which we'll cover soon, about Project Lifeserver and what it does. But first of all, could you explain the mission of Project Lifeserver and why it's so important?

Yeah, and I'm glad you asked that. The mission is to locate persons with cognitive disorders rapidly. Why is that important? Because let's take, for instance, Alzheimer's. When they wander, 24 hours is what we call the golden time. If you don't find them within 24 hours, the chances of you finding them alive go down rapidly. Why is that? Well, I think because they get into situations that are dangerous to them,

plus they're not eating or drinking, a lot of them died due to weather or dehydration, or they become injured, trying to get over an obstacle, under or around an obstacle, and they can't move, they stop, they become tired or injured, and that's where they expire at that point. The other one, let's take autism. Well, we know that most of the autism is in the younger ages, the dangerous part of autism, the elopement or the wandering, whatever you want to classify it. you've got about 15 to 20 minutes to locate them because they are going to get into some kind of mischief or trouble. And one of the main things we have with autism is their tendency to want to go to water. Well, unfortunately, children with autism don't understand the relativity of cause and consequence.

They can't swim, many of them. So they don't understand when you get in the water and you can't swim, what is the consequence? So a large number of them drown. So these are some of the factors we look at as to why it's important. The other reason, not so as important, but I would say does have some importance to it is. What does it cost for a agency to search for these people? most of these searches last an average of nine hours at a cost of the taxpayer of about $1,500 an hour.

So that's taxpayer money that's being spent. Now, we understand it needs to be spent. The safety of the community is important. But if you can do it with two people and you can do it in 15 to 20 minutes, isn't that a better alternative? Definitely. Okay, good. So, yeah, now that we understand the mission that we're trying to get, I have some more questions for you.

First of all, how does the Project Lifesaver program work? Could you walk us through the process from when an individual is enrolled to when they might need to be located? Normally, when we bring an agency on as a member, they will promote their program within their jurisdiction. people will see that they will contact the agency. The agency will send a representative, maybe a police officer, deputy, or firefighter, to the individual's home. They will interview them, the caregiver,

and if possible, even to have some interaction with the person that's going to be enrolled in the program. They will take a profile on them. In other words, all the important information that's needed. along with a picture. They will then place the wristband, recording all of the information necessary to be able to track that wristband. The caregiver will be given a sheet so that they can check that wrist band daily to make sure it's working and activated.

Also, they will be given contact information. If this person wanders, notify this number immediately. and some instructions on don't go looking for them, call us immediately. The more time you spend looking and not finding them, the more they are liable to get into some situation that's going to cause problems. So those are the things that are encompassed when we enroll a person. Now, if they wander, the person, the caregiver will call, a train team will respond, locate the signal from the bracelet, pick them up, and bring them back home.

And if necessary, which very often is not, notify the medical authorities to respond. All right. And how is the person picked up? I mean, who is picking him up? I mean, where are you located to do your employee? It's the train team that are tracking that signal. from the bracelet, they will go right to them. The signal will lead them to wherever they are to their location. They'll stop, they'll pick up, they'll interact with them, get them into the vehicle and take them back to home or wherever their place of domicile or safety is.

That sounds great. And the average time that takes to locate them in less than 30 minutes. We've had a high resounding searches or averaging out at less than less than. than 30 minutes. That sounds awesome. Okay, good. Now, can you tell us a little bit more about the technology used in Project Lifesaver? How does the transmitter, you mentioned in the wristband and stuff and that?

How does that work and the technology, how is the technology evolved over time? Barack, it's really very simple. We use radio telemetry or, in other words, a radio signal, not a GPS signal. It's just a radio signal on a prescribed frequency. Each person wearing a bracelet will have a different frequency so that I can track that person rather than some other person. The signal is sent out. The train team is equipped with receivers.

They are trained on how to use those receivers, locate that signal, and track to it. It is really a very not old or ancient, but it is. It is a older technology that is very reliable. In fact, in World War II, that's how we track spies. Radio direction finding. We pick up the signal, we lock onto it, and then we direct into it at the strongest point of the signal. I've been used for many, many years. Very reliable.

You know, and I mentioned GPS a minute ago, why don't we use that? Because the reliability is questionable. GPS was originally designed for navigation. It's great if everything is open. You have open sky. There's nothing in the way to block it, that signal from the satellite. But if you're in a deep cover of trees or in a building or under something, that signal and that satellite can't connect.

So you can't locate them. With a radio signal, unless you're in a lead-lined room, I will find you because that signal will penetrate anything other than a lead line room. So that's why we stay with the radio telemetry. The reliability

and there's less things that can go wrong. For instance, in satellites, there are times when satellite coverage just doesn't work. And people will ask me, well, what kind of examples can you give me? Do you have direct TV?

Yes. What happens? when you have a thunderstorm or a heavy rain. Do you lose signal? Well, if you're in a car and you have a satellite radio and you drive under something, what happens? You lose signal. Anything that can block sunlight can block a GPS signal.

Plus a GPS has to be charged often, where our particular bracelets will go for 60 days before the battery needs to. to be changed. And it is constantly transmitting. Now, we don't monitor that signal every minute of the day. The only time we will monitor it or try to pick it up is if we're actively searching for you. So it's not an intrusion of privacy. Okay. Well, that makes sense. So a few things that came up while I was listening to you. So first of all, so that that transmitter, that bracelet basically has a battery, you said, right? Right.

And does that battery need to be replaced every 60 days? Is that right? Every 60 days, yes. Now, I can anticipate your next question. Who changes the battery? Okay. The team from the agency goes out and changes the battery. Why do we do that?

Because we think it's important for these people to be interacting with that family. It builds interaction and report. One of the things that I found when I was actively out searching and changing batteries is you get to know the family very well. You get to know the person that you're going to be looking for very well. So now if you have to go out and look for them, it's not just a person you're looking for. It's a personal matter, which becomes even more important to you to lock onto that signal quick. because you want to get them back. You have a personal interest here.

Plus, we found out that we became connections to services and other things that this family may need. Because many times these families become isolated, both autism, Alzheimer's, or any other cognitive disorder. Because they kind of come into an inner sanctum of taking care of their loved one 24 hours a day, seven days a week. So they're not getting out and doing some of the social things they used to do. So they isolate themselves. So now we become a bridge.

And we may do the connections or be able to direct them, who to call, how to call, what to say. I found that in many, many instances. In fact, we would get, I know I got so close to some of these families, when I'd go out to change batteries, I gained 15 pounds because it always became a little social event of cake and coffee or cake and Coke or whatever. So, you know, it becomes not just a routine matter of business. Yeah.

It becomes a personal report. Yes, and I can see that. I mean, I listen to you. And I think, well, that's great that you do that because you as, you know, as Project Lifesaber, basically, is taking responsibility fully on the battery changes so that, you know, maybe a caregiver has felt to do that or omitted to do that correctly or whatever or change the wrong batteries to an old one. So whatever, you are making sure that this is like 100% certain that that person

is protected. You're absolutely right. That way we know that it's working. Everything is good. Yeah. And you know what? I didn't ask you, but when was Project Lifesaver founded? 1999.

Our very first bracelet I placed April 9th, 1999 in Virginia Beach, Virginia. Got it. Okay, so now, as at the time of recording, this is about 24 years. that you are operating.

And you explain a little bit about the transmitter and the radio. Throughout the years, has this technology changed? Or pretty much, this is how it was from the beginning. The basic technology has stayed the same. We have improved the bracelets. We have improved our receivers. The equipment, we have done a lot of improvement on. But the basic technology is still the same.

We still use it. Why? Well, I said earlier, because we know it works and it's reliable. All right. And what is the range that your receiver can pick up signals? Well, on the ground, it's about a mile. Now, if we have to get in the air, which sometimes we do, depending, and I go back to caregivers.

sometimes caregivers, as much as you tell them, call us right away, they don't always do it. So you may have a time lag from the time they actually wandered until you're called. I've had as much as eight hours. So a person can cover a lot of time or a lot of distance in that time. We may have to go airborne in a helicopter or in a drone. Now, if we have to go up, Our distance now has increased five to seven miles. Why?

Because there's nothing to even not block the signal, but lessen the signal. The more things the radio signal has to go through, the weaker it's going to get. But standard on the ground is about one mile, which is good because most Alzheimer's patients that wander, excuse me, are found within one mile at the point last scene. the other thing that we found is if I stand there and I make a 360 and I don't get a signal what does that told me? Okay, they're not anywhere within one mile. We've got to expand the search right away.

So we're going to get in vehicles or we're going to get airborne and put a journal up. So it's not only telling you when you get a signal where they are, but it eliminates the areas you don't have to search. I got it. And what is the percentage of cases that you have to go airborne? Very small, believe it or not. During the time that I was searching, I think I went airborne twice out of 180 searches.

We probably see reports of airborne searches one in every two or three hundred. Okay. And if you have to do that, what technically, how's that done? You mentioned drones, but a helicopter or something like that, just a little bit more complicated. So how is that? A little more complicated. What we do is if an agency has an aviation asset, we will train their pilots and their operators on how to operate in a search such as this, and the operators on how to operate around a helicopter. How can you do it safely?

The pilot and the operator have to have some kind of connection. that they both know that they know what they're doing. So we'll teach the pilot methods and techniques. We'll teach the operator safety. How do you search? How do you use the equipment in a helicopter? And how do you communicate with the pilot so that both of you know exactly what you're saying when you say it?

Yeah. So you're not losing it as they say in translation because let's face it. You know, I had the occasion. I flew helicopters for about five years. Aviators have a different language at times than anybody else. So you got to stay on the same wavelength. I got it. That's pretty much how that's accomplished.

All right. So what kind of training do public safety agencies receive when they decide to implement the project life server program? The very first thing they do is we have an online course that they have to complete successfully. that goes into our history, a basic familiarization with the equipment, the terms and technologies, the standards of search methods that we use, some things on the cognitive disorders

that they should know, familiarization. Once they successfully complete that, the next step is the field training. We will send an instructor to them. They will spend a day and a half with them in the field on the equipment. How do you use the equipment? How do you troubleshoot the equipment? What methods, what patterns do you use to locate and lock on to a signal?

Once we get, and that's even using vehicles if you have to. Once they get past that training, they're going to be tested. We have a field test where they have to locate three transmitters with a, then a prescribed time, and then they have a written test on top of that. What did they just learn? I mean, we're all familiar with those kind of tests. The next day, we will take the people that have been selected to be instructors, and we will give them a class on instructing this program,

so that now they can train other people within their agency. Without having to bring us back at time and expense, they can do it in-house. And so once we leave there, they can conduct their program. We become then consultants, advisors. We keep information flowing to them about upgrades and technology, upgrades or new information within the cognitive disorders. And that's part of the training too. How do you deal with a person with a cognitive disorder? How do you recognize it?

It's one thing to locate them. now you got to get them in the car and get them home. That's not always the easiest part. I relate to the story that when I was out and if he were doing it, one of the gentlemen I had to search for was a retired Air Force officer, but he had previously been a Golden Gloves boxer. Oh, wow. So whenever I've dealt with him,

I definitely was very, very conscious of that. So I wanted to make sure I didn't get cold-cocked. I can try to get him home. But we've seen those kind of situations where they become a little aggressive or a little abusive. So we have to know how to deal with that. How do you get them to a point? And when are they at a point where you need to back off and call the caregiver?

And that's happening. So you need to recognize those things. And that's part of the training. Yeah. Are the instances that they do not recognize the caregiver? caregiver as well? Most of the time they will recognize the caregiver or if they don't recognize them, at least the caregiver knows how to calm the situation because they've dealt with it.

They know what the trigger points are with this person. We may, even though we're trained, we may not realize that there is a certain trigger point. You know, and I think it's important to say that when people wander, they're not really wandering. we coined a saying and it's been picked up by a lot of advocacy groups. They're not wandering. They're on a mission. Now, what do I mean they're on a mission? They have got something specific in mind or a place in mind that they are trying to get to.

Now, what might that be? Well, we don't know, but they do. It may be a home from 20 years ago. It may be, as I said before. going to a place of employment, although they're not employed anymore. In their mind, they are. So you don't know what is driving

this particular situation. So you have to understand that you are now interfering with their mission. I got it. You have to deal with that, just like children with autism. Something has caused them to be attracted to go. Could it have been that

the night before you were supposed to go to the circus. You didn't go for some reason. In their mind, they are still programmed to go to the circus. So if they get the chance, they're going to go. You know, they don't reason. Them or Alzheimer's patients, don't reason you can't get there from here. But when they get out there and get lost, they're not going to do like you and I would in normal thinking.

they're going to continue pressing forward where we may stop, you know, reassess what we're doing and turn around. They don't do that. They keep pressing forward. So they eventually end up in trouble. Okay. Interesting. So could you share some stories or examples of how Project Lifesaver has made the difference in lives of individual and their families? Well, there's a couple to come to mind.

I think one of them is the very first search we ever did. did. The gentleman had what we called a terminal dementia or medicinal dementia. He had cancer, and every time they gave him a particular medicine, he'd go into dementia, full blown. We'd already had to search for him several times before we instituted the program, and there was some very long searches, a lot of people involved. We got him into the program. Within about a month, and a half and he was our very first search. So you got to understand this was really a test for us. He broke out the front window of his house and took off.

Well, we got the call. We're rolling into the area. As I'm going in, I started getting a signal from his bracelet. That particular time, we recovered him in one and a half minutes. He had gone across the street into an apartment complex, into a hallway, into a storage closet. How would that have affected? I don't know that we'd have ever found him. He had locked the door behind him.

If you go to test the door and it's locked, if there's no indication they might be in there, why would you open it? So this might have been a factor that could have caused some tragedy. The other one that I, and I think there's been many, but one of them that really comes to mind quickly is in Tallahassee, Alabama. I'm sorry, not Tallahassee. Tuscaloosa.

I'll get it right in a minute. All right. They had a down syndrome, gentleman. I think he was about 16 years old. He disappeared. They started searching for him. They started getting a signal,

but the signal was intermittent. So they couldn't lock on to it. So after about 30, 40 minutes, they brought the helicopter in. The helicopter went up, started in its pattern. In about 10 minutes, they located a very strong signal. It was along a river.

Well, the river had some very high banks on each side. But I remember correctly, they were 20 to 30 feet on each side. Wow. The helicopter finally narrowed in this signal right to one of the river banks. And as they kind of hovered over to come over and put the spotlight on it, because this was at night. They saw the gentleman. He was caught around his ankle on a vine and hanging upside down on the riverbank.

Wow. So they were able to bring the ground team in. Now, why was that search important? Because I don't think you would have found him before tragedy struck without that equipment and without that knowledge. and there's been many others. I mean, we've had reports where they've been found in the ocean off of Massachusetts, autistic child. They tracked them right down to the beachfront right into the ocean.

Fairfax, Virginia, they've had several where they've tracked into the swamps and recovered them in the swamp water. So I think, I feel like, and I'm very proud to know that these agencies are making a difference because those are searches and when I look at them, if they found them at all, it would have been extremely difficult. And it would have taken a lot of time.

Now they're locating them within minutes. They're able to get them to safety within minutes, averting injury or worse. Yes, I see. I hear the difference between the incident you described when you were in the force before Project, lifesaver was operational of the gentleman that you found deceased after two weeks and 300 and something thousand dollars that cost taxpayers.

And eventually it was unfortunately unsuccessful compared to finding someone a minute and a half afterwards in a lot of closet, the storage closet that you couldn't have found it otherwise. That's, that's amazing. It's very satisfying when you're a lot of. able to do that. Awesome. That's great.

So tell us, I mean, you told us a little bit before, but what are some big, some of the biggest challenges that you face when you starting, when you, sorry, when you face in the past when starting Project Lifesaver and how did you overcome them? Can you share some of the triumphs and milestones of Project LifeSera? There's been a few. Yes. Well, first of, was just getting it. off the ground.

You know, I had this idea. I felt like it would work. I had talked to the manufacturer. They had been tracking wildlife for years. If you can track a bird for miles and miles, why couldn't we identify an at-risk person, give them a transenter and be able to track them? Well, first, I had to convince people that I felt like it would work

because I had such replies or responses as you're absolutely out of your mind. you're crazy it'll never work what the hell is wrong with you you know this is the stupidest idea we've ever heard so i had to get some some support there then okay i've got an idea but i don't have any money to put it into practice yeah our department had no money to do it and now i was in charge of the sheriff's search and rescue and that's where i took this out so i had to go to some local philanthropy organizations and I still got some of the same responses.

You're out of your mind. Can't do that. Well, finally, a local hospital gave me a pilot grant. So that got us started. And then when the first rescue took place and the press got hold of it, it kind of started really moving

into some momentum. I think the very first hurdle we ran into was I had some for-profit companies. So what we were doing decided there was some money to be made in this, wanted to partner with us, but that was a sham. They wanted to partner with us and then take us over. We ran into that several times. We had all the promises up. We're going to work with you. We're going to help you.

We're going to support it. We're going to give you financial support. and then when we got into it, we found, no, that's not what they want. They want to take it over. They want to turn it into a for-profit and make money out of it. Well, this happened on several occasions,

and, of course, sometimes it ended up in litigation. And we had to fight for our very life. You know, we were going against one of them was a very large conglomerate in this country. And it was, a real battle that went on for over a year. Finally, we were able to overcome it.

And I'll never forget what my lawyer said, our lawyer said. He said, well, you can take some solace in the fact that you beat back one of the largest conglomerates in the world. I said, well, that doesn't get us our money back. We've had to spend all this money in legal costs to defend ourselves. and in both all the situations we were in the right. But what their aim and purpose was to sue us, financially drain us so that we had to quit.

Well, I was hard-headed enough Barack. I wasn't going to quit. You know, I felt like we were doing something that needed to be done and we were doing it in the right way. And I was not going to succumb to some for-profit organization that wanted to turn it into a money-making. because one of the things I knew is that it wasn't going to be a moneymaker for them. These people are strapped as it is.

They don't have a lot of money. They can't spend high prices or exorbit fees for this kind of service. So we try to keep it at a bare minimum. Yes. And you know what? I admitted to emphasize that Project Lifesaver International is a non-profit organization. and this is an important part that we should basically stress here. And how do you get the funding for your activities?

Well, we apply for grants. We've had some grants from the government. We've had some grants from private foundations. But we also do charge a fee for the training. We are the manufacturers of our equipment now. We just took that over. so we do charge for the equipment. So that's how we survive.

Yeah. We had put in for a loan one time from a bank. The bank officer looked at me and said, this is your budget? Yeah, he said, how do you survive on that budget? So I don't know, but we do it. And we're not going to raise it. We're not going to raise these prices. these people are already, you know, just barely making it.

When you start talking about what does it cost to support caregiving for an Alzheimer's patient or a child with autism, you're talking a lot of money. So I'm not going to, you know, beat these people because I've got a technology that they need and now I'm going to charge them exorbit fees. No. No, we're here to provide a service. we're here as our motto goes to bring loved ones home and that's what we're staying with.

Yep, that's very commendable. And I have a question you mentioned about people trying to take you over with all sorts of schemes. Is your stuff, Project LifeSever International Technology, is it patented? Do you have any safeguards? All of ours is copyrighted, All of our training is copyrighted and everything that we have is legally protected.

And the way they were trying to take us over, like I said, is they would try to find something that they could come on us with a breach of contract. And then they would build on that. And it wasn't that they even had a leg to stand on as far as they were right. it was all in draining us to the point that we couldn't financially survive. And we found out one of the companies that did it had a history of doing it, going into a smaller company, suing them into oblivion, and then taking over. So we were fortunate. We were able to come up with some strategies that overcame what they were trying to do.

Well, those are quite different challenges that you have overcame. coming, building Project LifeSaver, and that's really interesting to see. Tell us, how has Project Lifesaver expanded since its inception, both geographically and in terms of the service

that it offers? Well, when we first started, I only started it from my community in Chesapeake, Virginia. I had no thoughts or aspirations of it going anywhere else. Well, after we did our first rescue, as I mentioned And earlier, we started getting calls from other agencies.

So, hey, you know that thing you're doing? We want to do it. So I had to expand it and develop a training program and then decide, all right, how are we going to, you know, in a sense, market it? How are we going to make it legitimate? Well, since that time, we have gone over 24 years. We're now in over 1,800 member agencies. it has expanded out of all 50 states into Canada.

We are in eight provinces in one territory in Canada. Now we've gone from one to over 1,800 member agencies. And right now, I think we've got about 30 agencies on the list waiting to be trained. So it's all we can do to keep up with it. That's awesome. Now, could you talk about any partnership? that have been crucial to the success and growth of project ice ever? Yeah, there's a company to come to mind right away.

One of them is a pilot international. It's a service organization that's international. And one of their objectives is brain health. So when they heard about us, they just kind of, well, I think that kind of fits into what we're doing. So many of their chapters raised money to help agencies in their localities. in their localities start the program and then even volunteered to help them in the battery

changes or the training or the searching and get certified along with the agencies. The other one I think would be the Alzheimer's Foundation of America. We've been with them since about 2004. They provide grants

for agencies to expand their programs or to start their programs. And they, do about 15 or 20 grants per year, which I think is outstanding. Plus, I get called on often to speak at their seminars and their conferences, and vice versa. So it's a pretty good partnership. Now, we've partnered and worked with others, like the Autism Society of America. They've been a good partner. We partnered with Autism Speaks, the Down syndrome, because we cover all of

those, you know, with the people that are in the agencies. So it's, but those are the two that jump right out. They were there from the beginning. They have, you know, supported us ever since and worked with us. So I'd have to say they were probably the two most important partnerships we had. Of course, every agency that becomes a member becomes a partner. So we got 1,800 other partners out there. So I think that pretty much covers it.

Yeah, definitely. So I was asking you before about the development geographically, but also was there any changes to the services that you offer? No. Okay, so basically we were focused from the beginning about those groups and how to look at it.

Yeah, we've maintained the same program ever since we started. Okay, and you mentioned that you basically work with agencies that basically hire your services or basically partner with you. So they partner. Yeah, they become members. We're a membership organization.

That's how we were told by the legal authorities that we needed to operate as a membership organization, such as ABC Police Department wants to start the program. They join Project Life Center. When they join, okay, their fee is a training fee plus the startup equipment fee. That's when the training starts. once they're certified to start up, then they're going to run their program within some guidelines. Now, we're not real stringent. I'm not going to go tell a police department,

you've got to have so many people to do this. You've got to do that, and I'm not going to do that. There's no future in it. Or you've got to sign up so many, you know, people in your program. Well, that's irresponsible and unrealistic. Every agency is different in its culture and in its environment. They may, one agency may have tons of Alzheimer's patients and one may only have nine or ten. It depends on the size of the geographic area and their population.

So we have some guidelines like how to search, who can search, methods to search, some other administrative guidelines, but they're pretty much autonomous in running their program. One of the administrative things is they have to have Project Lifesaver in the title of their program. Well, why is that?

Well, we have a lot of people that travel state to state. And we've had state-to-state rescues where they travel from one state to the other and they get lost in the state they went to and they'd be found. Well, I look at it and I use the analogy of McDonald's. If you go to Virginia and you see a McDonald's and you go to Texas and see a McDonald's, what do you know?

You know they both are just about the same. They do things the same. That's the way we want our program to be thought of. Wherever you are in this country or in Canada and you see Project Lifesaver, you know what to expect. You know what they do. Okay, that makes sense. So now you mentioned agencies partnering with you, basically becoming members and so on.

What about an individual? Let's say there is a family that hears about you and they are located in a certain place. Can they join that program, become a member, partner with you, and just like that, or does have to be agencies? We only work through the agencies. We found that trained professionals are much better searchers than family members who become excited and agitated and don't think properly when they're in stress situations involving a loved one. So we work just about 99% through agencies. We did have a program where we would have individual tracking units for individuals.

and we do offer, well, even though I'm not totally on board with GPS, we do have a GPS solution if you're not in a project like several area, but we insist that you understand how GPS works and how it doesn't before we will let you have it. So we have a solution if you want to call it that, but our main work is through these agencies because trained professionals using that equipment are much more effective in doing the job.

I got it. Do you have instances where individuals are contacting you and wanted to be on this program and then you have to refer them to an agency next? Yeah, oh yeah. Yeah, we'll have people move from one state to another and we'll get a phone call. Does so-and-so agency do this program?

well, we'll look it up for them, but actually you can go to our website, put in your new zip code, and it'll tell you. Every agency within 50 miles, it does the program. But, well, you know, we're courteous, and we'll look it up for you, and they will then enroll in that particular agency's program. So there's a lot of agencies out here to do it, and there's a lot of them to choose from. But like I said, at least you know, if you go from this agency to that one, you know what to expect. Okay, that's good. All right, so now what opportunities are there for people to volunteer with Project Lifesaber

and what roles do they do with those volunteers? Again, it would be through the agencies. Like I mentioned, Pondland International. They have a lot of their members that volunteer with the agencies in their jurisdiction to work with the Project Lifesaver program. Well, like Barissa is here in Fort St. Lucie, the police department uses volunteers to do everything with the Project Lifesaver program except search. The volunteers will go out and do the battery changes.

They'll do the enrolling. They'll administer the program. The officers are the ones that are trained to actually use the equipment on a search. There's a lot of things that volunteers can do. I've got a couple right here in headquarters that do things for us. helping training, helping the administration, you know, thank goodness for them, because we don't have the budget to support a whole lot of people. Yeah.

Okay, great. Now, how do you measure the impact of Project Lifesaver? Are there any key metrics of success or success indicators or some of that that you can share with us? You know, to put it very simply, Barack, I think we measure the Project Lifesaver successes by every life that's saved. every time I get an after-action report where the agency has located somebody and brought them home, I think that is the most exact, succinct measurement you can get.

That's what we're here for. That's what we do. And when they're successful, I don't know how you could measure it any other way. And right now, our agencies have documented over 4,000 successful rescues, averaging 30 minutes. Wow.

I don't think you can get better, you know, statistics than that, and you're within your mission. That's impressive, and that gives hope for so many people that are in that adverse situation, caring for the loved one. Because I think I heard you say, you know, when, and I think that it bears repeating, when someone with that disability of Alzheimer or autism and stuff like that, they may not respond to their name even when you search for them. It's such a different way to search for someone that gives some obstacles to regular search, right? Is that correct? How I phrase it? Well, I can tell you from personal experience, there is no, and I've been in a lot of situations with the police department,

commanded the SWAT team for over 800 operations. The best feelings I have ever had, most self-satisfying feelings were when I located somebody and brought them home. And just the reaction to the family gave me all the impetus I needed. You know, there is no better feeling than saving someone's life or being an instrument to keep them from getting hurt or worse. Yep.

That feeling is such a relief and that service is such a great value. So tell me how does project lifesaver stay innovative and ensure that he's using the latest and most effective technologies? Well, we're working with a number of things such as the drone. We're redefining and reestablishing our drone program to give the agencies more flexibility and the ability to search. especially if they don't have helicopters or these things. You know, you're talking expensive machinery. Yeah. We're also combining some technologies.

We're working with combining Bluetooth and our technology so that now if a person is in the house and leaves the house, the caregiver will know immediately. And they can call and get them even faster. Bluetooth will even be effective in knowing where they are in the house. So those are some things we're working with. I think those are the two big technologies that we're working with. But as far as our basic core technology, I don't see any need or reason to change it. If it works, that's great. If it works, why fix it?

Exactly. Okay, so now, looking back on your journey with project, Cyber, what are you most proud of? I think I am most proud, as I mentioned earlier, every time I see one of our after-action reports come in, and they have brought somebody home safely that I had some part of that. Yeah. You know, that I did something that maybe made a difference.

Definitely. Yes, what advice, and now this is kind of like a more general question, but what advice would you give to someone who wants to start a similar initiative in their own community? Maybe not in that field necessarily, but something on the order of night. to do a portrait class seven. Now, and believe it or not, I get that question a lot.

I think the biggest advice I would give anybody is if you have a passion and you have a vision, never give up on it. No matter what the obstacle is, no matter what is thrown in front of you, there's always one more thing you can do. you just have to reason it, you've got to think about it, you've got to talk to your support element, whoever that may be, but never give up,

never let them beat you. Stay with it. If you have a vision, you stay with it. You pursue it as long as possible. Okay, that's wonderful wisdom. And coming from you that made it, So great, that's awesome. Is there any question that I failed to answer you, to ask you,

is there something that you think that we have missed here in this interview? I don't think so. You know, I think you've covered this pretty well. You've gotten a lot of information, bro, me. Yeah, I think that your followers and people that are interested in Project LiveSever need to know about that. I think that the message should go. and reach those people that may not have heard of you so that they will demand agencies around them

to partner with you guys. I would love to have more partners. The more that we can do, the more we can cover, the bigger footprint we can have, the bigger difference we can make. And if anybody would like any more information, then go to one of two places now.

They go to our website, project lifesaver.org. or they can go to something you're very familiar with, and that's the book, Deploying High. Then get it on Amazon.com. But that outlines a lot of our past history, what we've had to go through, what we do and why. So I would recommend they take a look at that as well.

Okay, that sounds good. And basically you answered my last question of how to reach you. And again, I want to repeat it for the listeners. Project Lifesaver.com. Is that right? Projectlisaver.org. Oh, dot org, sorry. Dot org, yeah.

They can go to that, and they can even, in that website, there are ways to contact the individuals that are on the team. All right. Well, thank you so much for coming here today, Chief Sonders, and covering the activities of Project Lifesaver International. That has been a very good experience speaking with you and getting to know all the,

all the amazing stuff that you guys are doing. Barack, thank you very much for all that you've done to help and support us. Thank you, Chief Saunders, for your time. And to our listeners, this is another episode of Business Innovators Radio. Thank you so much for being with us and have a great day. Thanks for listening to Business Innovators Radio. To hear all episodes featuring leading industry influencers and trendsetters, visit us online at Businessinnovators Radio.com.

today.