Bussin' With The Boys - NFL Week 17 Reaction: Coach Of The Year Debate, Playoff Predictions & Momentum Vs. Analytics Talk

Episode Date: December 29, 2025

On this episode of Bussin’ With The Boys, Will Compton, Taylor Lewan, and Greg Olsenrecap Week 17 of the NFL season and dive into the biggest storylines heading into the final week of the regular season. The boys debate who should win Coach of the Year between Kyle Shanahan and Mike Vrabel, then revisit the momentum vs. analytics conversation, specifically breaking down whether the Buffalo Bills should have kicked the field goal or gone for two in a pivotal moment. From there, they look ahead to key Week 18 matchups, including Pittsburgh Steelers vs. Baltimore Ravens and Tampa Bay Buccaneers vs. Carolina Panthers, with Taylor Lewan going on record saying he likes the Panthers in that one. The conversation also takes a turn when the guys make the talk about arguably the best team in the NFL, the New England Patriots. The conversation ends again with the momentum vs. analytics debate plus plenty more reactions, arguments, and laughs along the way. Full NFL breakdowns, hot takes, and classic Bussin’ energy, enjoy. Timestamp Chapters:    0:00 Open 1:40 Michigan Has A Coach 11:00 Miami v Ohio State 22:15 Eagles v Bills 28:00 Texans v Chargers 40:55 Myles Garrett Sack Record 58:35 Panthers v Bucs – Win And In 1:01:00 Playoff Picture / Coach Of The Year 1:18:35 The Importance Of Momentum 1:42:15 New Years Resolution See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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If you've been searching for a soft place to land while doing the work to become whole, this podcast is for you to hear more. Listen to Deeply Well with Debbie Brown from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your. podcast. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome into the NFL football recap. We will talk a little bit about Michigan football. Obviously, a lot of things happened over the weekend. Very exciting on my part. Cautiously optimistic.

If you are watching or listening to the show, please do us a favor. Subscribe. Leave a comment if you're watching on YouTube, but subscribing helps our show so much. It doesn't hurt you at all. And it just keeps you up to date on everything that's going on with Bust with the Boys. This show, Bust with the Boys is presented by the one, the only fan dual sportsbook. And I got four words for you guys. It's not over.

yet. We've got a whole week of regular season football to get through, plus a few weeks of postseason play. And of course, we're capping off week 17 with tonight's Rams versus Falcons game. One thing we want to let you guys know about, if you haven't seen it already fan duels, drive, same game parley. Picture this. I want you to close your eyes unless you're on the road right now. We're going to, we're going to envision all of it. You see my hand going down over my face. That's what we're envisioning. Picture this. You see the Rams. They have a little bit of momentum, right? Stafford, he's slinking it. Pooka no cool. He catches everything. You think to yourself, hey, I got a thought. There's no way they don't score a touchdown on

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Hey, Michigan's got a football coach. We got a ball coach, huh? Got ourselves a ball coach. Kyle Whittingham, 21 seasons at Utah, over three decades at Utah, honestly spent most of his life in Utah. He played football at BYU, did a little bit over there, was under Urban Meyer, and then took the head coaching job when Urban Meyer, I believe, went to Florida. but correct. Is that my correct in saying that?

So a lot of success there comes over. Hat in hand does his press conference. He has one statement that just absolutely fires me up. Did you watch the press conference? The Michigan press conference? I didn't think you would, but it's okay because I'm going to tell you everything you need to hear. Go back and check it out. He says you will become us.

We will not become you. And that's referring to the culture of Michigan. He said all the right things in my opinion. And then you start to break down. What's this man about to bring? Because you really start to realize that Kyle Woodingham, what he is, He's a boss. He's a CEO type of individual that is going to be the name to face the culture of your franchise.

But he's going to allow the coaches who he brings in with great hires to coach these guys. And then game management, culture, attitude, toughness, the whole thing comes from winning. I believe he's worked out for more than like 6,000 days in a row or something like that. He's got some weird stat in that way. But start to read a couple of things. Jason Beck, the OC at Utah. That's his frontrunner for who's going to be his OC at Michigan. scored 41.5 points per game last year.

They were the number two offense in all of college football, the number five, a rush defense. And those two stats might be flipped. It might be two for rushing five in total. So that gets you pretty fired up. You watch Utah's offense. I've watched like four games over the weekend. Just to rewatch the play calling, all those things.

Very creative, very exciting. They love to run the ball, but they're very creative in their past game as well, which is awesome for a quarterback that I hope I pray to God stays at Michigan. Then they got this DC. who's going to be the DC? Jay Hill. Who's Jay Hill? That's the DC for BYU.

You're probably wondering what... Spicy D. How are we going to have... How are we going to have a BYU who's sworn enemy is Utah? How is the D.C. from him, from BYU, going to go with a guy from Utah to Michigan. Jay Hill at Weber State went over to Utah for a few years, and apparently has a great relationship with Kyle Whittingham.

So all that to be said, boys. Cautiously optimistic. If we could just keep this roster intact, which is a big if, right? And I think it starts at the top with that quarterback. He stays. I think the rest of him stay.

We go spend a buttload of money. We get to middle of January. I might be calling for a national championship. I might, but right now I'm cautiously optimistic right now because the more I read in this cat, the more I'm like, we've got a leader of men with integrity. You know what I'm saying? Gregi, can you hear me?

Gregi's here. One quick note to selfishly insert Baylor in here. Utah beat Baylor by completing their first pass of the game with five minutes. left in the fourth quarter put up 57 on us. They didn't have to throw the ball. They're big ugly. Tough outing for Baylor that day.

Baylor being Baylor. But I'm very excited for Michigan. I think Whittingham's going to be a great fit. And I think all the talent that he'll be able to bring in with the Michigan M, as well as just like all the prowess and all of his experience, be dangerous. Can I say one more thing? Yes, sir. You go over Twitter, you go on the search bar, you type of Michigan football.

you see a lot of opinions being made. You see some USC fan bases that are like, oh shit, Kyle Whittigham is now in the Big Ten. Like Utah was owning the Pac-12 for a couple of years. They figured out USC in Oregon and Washington all these big schools. And USC was kind of happy to get away

from Kyle Woodham allegedly. I will also say this, Utah fans, maybe the nicest group of people. They've been incredible, but I've been watching like the banter. The culture he's built over there. I've been in the shadows a little bit. just kind of watching.

And it seems like Utah fans and Michigan fans like at first wanted to do this, but then they realize like, hey, I think we're okay here. I think we're really, hey, Utah fans are really happy for Michigan fans. Michigan fans are very, like, now we're like fans of Utah for some reason. So it seems like we got some harmony taking place between Utah and the University of Michigan. Greg, do you care to comment? I just can't escape all you Michigan guys. I had to do Portnoy this morning and listen to him talk about how the block M is how you just get to select

what coach you want and you have your pick of the litter and I guess he forgot that literally if this guy didn't just leave Utah because he didn't want to be part of that private equity recruiting who would be the coach? No, you're right. Listen, I, there's a...

He's a great coach. I'm not debating all that. No doubt. We're talking about Dave Portnoy, the attitude. I can't escape you, Michigan guys. But I will say it was not looking good when it all went down.

and there was a lot of questions of who you were going to get and there was rumors about Caitlin DeBoer and Dillingham and all these guys and then they're renewing and renewing and taking themselves off the board and I don't think it could have worked considering how bad the situation was I don't think it could have worked out any better for Michigan to get him. I agree with that and let me just say Dave and his attitude about Michigan I can understand that attitude I kind of had it a little bit these last couple of years I've realized I need to fall back a little bit and just be a true fan of Michigan and just hope for the best because this whole like you know blue chip organization which they are

top five program which they are but the Michigan man the all the things the arrogance it kind of comes with it we've talked about it quite a bit yeah you've changed it up over this it's time that it's time to settle in and just realize like other than 21 to 23 since what I got there it's not been great like oh nine to now it's not been like, oh, this is the greatest program in the entire world. We need to get back to that. I think Kyle Whittingham is the guy that gets us back to that. You know what I'm saying?

All right. He's, I mean, I don't know a ton about him. Obviously, I know how good he was and how successfully he was at Utah. Any idea why he was at Utah so long? Like, why didn't he go to? I was curious about that, too. Because he did. Why wasn't he going to Alabama?

Why wasn't he going to Michigan years ago? Like, right. And again, he could have just been super loyal. and again, I don't know a ton about him. Yeah, my understanding is... He's won a million games. Yeah, winning 10, 11 games and having that kind of culture at Utah. It's not easy.

It's not, yeah, it's not easy. I think Michigan did find somebody. It's a home run. And I think from a stabilizing factor, you can just hear it when he talks. You can hear it when he commands the room. I think for everything both football and non-football going on at Michigan over the last couple years,

I think he checks a lot of boxes besides just, hey, he's won a lot of games in the past. past. I do think he's going to bring a leadership and a presence to the program that they need right now. Yeah. I agree with that. I know that there was a lot of transition taking place so far as conferences go. Like when he got in there with the Mountain West and they go to the PAC 12. And so there was like a lot of changing taking place. But I know at one point he was offered the Florida job. He was offered a multitude of other jobs when Rich Rodriguez was like the hot new name at West Virginia back when I was in high school and ended up taking the Michigan job. I know people were kind of clamoring for Kyle Whittingham as well.

And then when Rich Rod left, when Brady Hoke was the next coach, Kyle Woodyham's kind of name kind of did come up. And then when Brady Hoke left, it seemed like it was Harbaugh or bust. And even when Harbaugh left, I believe Whittingham was a name that also came up again, but they clearly hired internally, Wish Roy Moore, which ended up not being the move. Yeah. Ended up not being the move there. I feel like it's as he right, as he like, you know, as they changed the chapter,

turn the page and everything else. Like say Whittingham is going to have success at Michigan. I feel like it'll be in the spots where you even, even the years where you won the Natty or those times where all that staff and everything was together and how everything went down. I feel like it's just going to be weird to look back and want to prop those years up.

Yeah. It'll be interesting to see how like that evolves over time. That's just my own observation listening to Winnaham come in and just seeing some of the tweets that were written about him because he does seem like a good head football. I saw a Notre Dame, a Notre Dame alum kind of got on and was like,

this is what you're getting with Winningham, integrity, character, you're never going to have a scandal. This is a guy that does it the right way. It's clearly the attitude and the character, like the, the man we need at the helm after these past kind of three, four years of like,

you know, the brand kind of getting hurt from Michigan, myself being like, hey, listen, I understand that, I'm understanding why people dislike Michigan so much. Now there's a piece of me that loves people hating Michigan. I think it'll continue to be that way because fans like, oh, D.P.

Oh, Dave. Yeah, and that's fair. Because I'm watching Dave, I'm smiling and laughing at his tweets and also like, God, I hate this, dude. The way he goes about Michigan. Dave does go a crazy way about Michigan. I love it, but I'm also, I'm a realist enough to be like, yeah, in 20 years from now, all over a bag of me, like, yeah, we won the next championship in 23.

I'll be very proud of that. I think we had one of the best rosters ever, but you can't really ignore all the things that were also taking place. Now, as far as the allegations of cheating, I'll fight that to the end. It seems like the NCAA bent the knee on that with just a fine. Let me ask you this, Greg. Let's get off of Michigan for a second.

Your school play against the Ohio State. I think it's like 10.5 point dogs right now. There's something. Miami's getting woof. They're getting that. I agree. I agree. But I want to know, I mean, Homer,

I want to hear what you have to say about Carson Beck, them running the ball, it being 3.0 at the end of half, or yeah, 3.0 at the end of half against A&M. Smiling. Yeah, that's not going to cut it. That is not going to cut it. That offensive output is not going to cut it.

As you guys know, I am a fan of the forward pass. I do think the forward pass is a big asset. If you're trying to score some points, obviously I'm biased. Obviously, I'm a huge Miami guy. This is a Miami house. My wife and I, like our whole family is Miami people. Mario Cristobal is one of my favorite people in the world.

He's a friend. He coached me, recruited me. I met Mario. he was the GA at Miami. So my rising sophomore year, the summer between my freshman and sophomore year, my dad brought me. I had an older brother.

My older, I still have an older brother. My older brother was being recruited. So we went down and Butch Davis was the coach. Mario Cristobal was the offensive GA and like assistant tight ends coach. So I was 15 years old, met him down there, developed a relationship. He then went with Shiano to run. Rutgers. I'm from Jersey. They recruited the shit out of Rucker, uh, at a New Jersey when they were at Rucker. So I've known Mario, he came back my last two years and coached me. So my point

saying this is we go way back. I love him. He was the guy for the job. I always said, if he couldn't bring Miami back, nobody could. So like we are riding with Miami always. Um, weirdly speaking, my second favorite team. If they're not playing Miami, I do cheer for Ohio State. I've gotten to know Ryan Day really well and become friendly with him. and have spent some time about Ohio State the last couple off seasons. So we're riding with Miami. If they weren't playing Ohio State, we'd ride with Ohio State. But we are Miami through and through.

Could they do it? Yes. They're going to have to play much better on offense, especially in the passing game. So it's a win-win for, it's a win-win for Greg. The Olson household doesn't care about the outcome of this game. The Olson household might, the Olson household might, but I know Greg internally.

No, we want Miami to win. It sounds like he kind of. But if you lose, you're going to be happy for Coach Day. No, I want to see, I have yearned for, so my junior and senior year in high school, Miami played in back-to-back national championships. So like I, my whole recruiting process, my whole kind of going through that whole world was like Miami was the program. This is early 2000s, right? Yeah, so this was like 2001, 2002. Yeah, I forget these old.

The seasons might have been 2000, 2001 or whatever the years of the national titles. So we, my junior year, we beat Nebraska and then my senior year, we lost an overtime to Ohio State. And I ended up going to Notre Dame with my older brother, but then transferred shortly thereafter to Miami. So like, we are Miami people, met my wife there. My brother and sister-in-law went there. My younger brother went there. Like, we are Miami people. So we are riding with them.

But, you year for those moments. Yeah, I want to see Miami back on top again, right? we've been saying the U is back for 15 years. It'd be nice to actually be able to say it and have it be true. I'm with you too because anytime like a documentary comes out or anything about Miami, something about the full white, like the white face mask, the orange and green. Like I remember my first like game on PlayStation was one of those years when Miami's coming off a national championship.

And the first game that I played was a Miami Florida State game where you could see the glare off the helmet for the first time in a video game and you thought it was the most realistic thing you'd ever seen in your life so i'm with you there is a there's that that fantasy of the the the miami logo and everything coming back i just don't think that they'll have enough to to take down ohio state especially because ohio states coming why they play the game boys why they play the game baby they play the game coming off this argument with my kid you brought up the white helmets my the other day we were getting ready to watch the a and m game and my uh my oldest son he's like man i hope they go all black

and the black helmets and I'm sitting there and I'm just like, how dare you? Yeah. The Miami white helmet, especially when we went all white, white helmet, white cleats, white top, like, that is just an iconic helmet. Yeah, the Miami white helmet with the running back face mask, the little two bar on the side. All those legendary Miami games, those national title games,

those Hall of Fame players, they all had the white helmet with the you on the side. Like, that was the helmet. Yeah, man. I still got mine right here. Hold on. Yeah, show it off, man. With the dark visor. Boy, he's got two Emmys in the back,

but he can't display his helmet. What'd you ask, Mitch? Hey, that is the one, the running back three bar. You want, hey, Will, you want to see this guy lined up over the top of you on third and seven when you know you got me man coverage and I'm just set my stem.

Yeah, you're going to do something on the sticks. You're probably going to try and lean into my body, stand me inside, go up. I'm going to be a little thick in here. and hook it up around around the sticks. Look at that you. Boys, a lot of scuff on this. A lot of scuff.

A lot of scuff. How's this side look? I can't see. Not so bad. Not as scoff. I'm a left side hitter. Yeah. It's a helmet that's seen, you know, several C gaps.

Can I show you the best part of this? Can I show you the best part of this? Do you remember when our helmets look like that on the inside? Dude, that's how did we all not die? No doubt. I think we slowly are. They're just, you know, science's got to continue to come back. That's all human beings.

That's all human beings. We were fine. I got my high school helmet. I don't, I really don't know how we didn't die. Yeah, bro. How hard it is on the inside. Yeah.

And you really got like, if it got cold out and you'd put it on, it's like I need 15 minutes. Sometimes I would just leave my helmet on for the entirety of the practice and do the water, but I wouldn't take it off just so it would feel better.

That running back three bar that he has on the Miami helmet. That is. That extra two. inches at the bottom of the face mask. Look at all them decals. What'd you get the decals for? All the stickers.

Killing people. Those are just bodies. You know his dad, his dad was the head coach, so he probably made up a bunch of stickers for him. Yeah. Oh, that is brutal. You had the blue lining. Boys. I love our show.

I love our show right now. Just showing off the old house, boys. Check. Look at these. He made me wear that face mask. Look at all these scratches. Most of the scratches on the crown of the helmet too. The face mask went down to here.

Yeah, that's a brutal face mask, bro. The one at Miami was the one, especially as a backer if you got that three bar one. My first year playing at Miami, my red shirt freshman year, I wore that face mask. I have pictures of myself playing in college with the two bar Dion, but down to here. So bad. Got to protect my neck. Got to protect my throat. How much did the players kill you for that before you were like, all right, I got to change his face mask?

No, I think at the time. time I think we all thought it was cool I don't know I don't know I really look back and I'm like questionable decisions no doubt you you see like even like in the 90s like the giant shoulder pads and the cowboy collar when my junior of high school I had the butterfly collar I had no neck issues I just wanted to look bigger I was just trying to get after it my I wanted nobody had neck issues back then no no no my shoulder pads in high school were this big yeah It was about the height of your pads. And my arms were like super skinny sticking out the bottom.

And back then, I don't know about you guys, but when I played our, well, like later in my in my high school, but like early on, our sleeves were like loose, you know. Yeah. So we would twist them and then tape them. And then you like rolled the tape up to make them tight. That was before they had like elastic. Yeah. So we had like these, I still have skinny arms, but like these little skinny bitch arms

sticking out the bottom of these huge shoulder pads. Looking like straws coming out of a box. No doubt. It is the funniest look in the world. Did you see giant shoulder pads and little sticks coming out of there? I mean, think about you. You think of an image of a Miami player. It's like Ray Lewis when he had those massive pads.

The jersey was like up to his above his belly button. Massive helmet on. I never got into the crop. That was never my body type. I was always. I wanted to. Same. I would always look at some of my other office alignment brother in when they would go crop top

and I'm like the confidence on these guys to just let that thing hang out. I wish I was that secure in my body at the time. Because I think the crop top look goes hard. Goes hard. Yeah. If you look like some of those guys. I kind of, I think with the big boys doing it too,

I don't mind. I'm like, hey, the big boy's doing it. So I was like in the middle, right? Like I wasn't like so big that you just like lean into it. It's like that guy's awesome. Yeah.

But then obviously I wasn't like washboard app. So I was kind of like dad bod. Yeah. Same, bro. Once the compression shorts got on me and it squeezed the muffin top a little bit to where it seemed like it was oozing out like an ice cream cone like we're guys that seen like oh they got some athletic ability or an athletic build but if you get seen with that hanging over you're kind of like ah you're not leaning in his lou what's going on here yeah dude i would spend even in the legally i would get my compression

like shorts and i would put my feet in it with the waistband and i would pull it just to try to combat that the exact thing you're talking about sometimes i put my compressions over my my mom and i'm like i can't get caught you were like you were wearing spakes or you're like thanks kind of a couple of a few practices and then I'm just like I can't get caught doing this man the boys are gonna clown my dude but in a game though in a game you put it up a little higher

so it does just the jersey when it squeezes in like might just form fits you all the way down yeah because catching that angle dude you can't caught that angle it's a tough it's a tough go especially like in December maybe in like August training camp you're like I'm pretty good like yeah yep like I would see pictures of myself

in August right before training camp and I was like, that's a good look, that's pretty good. Yeah. December, you're just like eating pizza holding on for dear life. Cookies, pie, holiday food. You're already thinking about this off season. I'm going to do X, Y, and Z. Oh, this off season, I'm going to get back in great shape.

It's the divisional round of the playoffs. Yeah, dude, no, it's before Christmas. You're just like, I'm going to do it. I'm going to get it done. That is, that's every, we're talking, every white guy, every white guy that plays football. Because you come in. Wasn't you, you're lying. Yeah, you have this regimen about you.

You're like, I am. This is me the entire year. I'm not going to waver on this. And then week four hits and you're like, fuck it, dude, pizza, had a bad game. Pizza, sushi, Chinese food with the boy on Mondays. Yeah, there's a comfort. There's a mental comfort to all of that. God, bless.

Yeah, you're trying to hit some New Year's race. Well, anyway, that was, that reminiscing just made my day. So what else you guys got? Dude, let's talk about our tweets. My tweet. So, dude, I land. Check Twitter. Yeah.

My mentions, I'm getting killed. And I finally scroll up to the source of it all. And both of you separately tweet me, Will sends me about momentum. You're asking me about going for two-tail. I was sitting on the plane taxing, dying laughing. And you know what's crazy too is it's a little coming down. I'm like, this is the perfect scenario for us to talk about tomorrow.

And I'm thinking the bills are going to get this. They should go for two. I hope McDermin does go for two. And then obviously what happened happened, if they just would have kicked the PAT after the first touchdown, it would have been a moot point. But after the game, all of them are kind of discussing should you have gone for two, should you not have? And everybody who was like, yes, you should have gone for two, all brought up momentum as their key point. Of course, because they don't know what else to say.

Yeah. Because analytics can't measure momentum. And by the way, between I agree. Had more momentum after the back-to-back touchdown drives? No doubt. If they would have only gotten more momentum, they would have made the two-point. And they had it too. But if they kick the extra point,

it would have gotten blocked again. Well, analytically, analytically, you sit back and you look at, like here's where, you know, and by the way, I'm with you on the going for two.

I was just grinning ear to ear, knowing that this game was going to come down to. I wonder if the bills are going to go for two. I had my tweet ready to go and I just held on it. I'm like, I got to make sure the bills don't get the two-point conversion for this to work. Now you're learning. Yeah,

Now you're learning. You have to make sure your criticism comes after you know the result. Yeah, exactly. So I shoot that out there. But I'm also thinking of my head like, okay, here's a good analytical question as well. Like if you're self-scouting yourself because you're right. The one touch up before that, extra point gets blocked. So it's like, okay, well, we're going to have to go for two because the extra point got blocked.

But we're also going to go for two because that's what our game plan, our strategy is going to be anyway, is trying to win in regulation. But my question would be, when do you? also analytics within your own season come into play because yeah they got their extra point block but what's their percentage on making an extra point to go into OT versus you are before this two failed two point conversion you're one for six at going for two throughout this year as the Buffalo Bills. So they miss this one. They're now one for seven on going for two. So analytically in general universally it's like hey everything screams go for two but if you're the bills you haven't been successful at all really you've been successful one time out of six

up into that point of going for two. And then you look at the, if you look at the example last week, which it's like, why didn't the bears go for two? They end up kicking the extra point, going to overtime and win an OT. Bills,

it felt like they did, bringing up the word momentum, had all the momentum because Philadelphia had what, 12 yards passing in the second half? I think they had 12 yards total. 12 yards total in the second half. Like Philly wasn't doing anything offensively.

And they were up 13 nothing going to that fourth quarter. And Josh Allen was, Josh Allen, Buffalo, their offense was becoming that offense. So why not kick that extra point going OT? Like in my head, knowing like confidence level wise, like, bro, we are, we're taking over this team because they're not moving the ball at all. Yes, my confidence, your confidence was so high, your momentum was very high, you had just

scored back-to-back touchdowns. Why did your off, the defense was reeling, the defense was tired, I've heard all these things for the whole year. then it's even more a reason. If that's the mentality, then it's even more reason to say, keep my offense on the field, they couldn't stop us,

put the offense back on the field, and let's win the game with my hobbled quarterback who's banged up his foot. Do I want to play a whole overtime period? And they talk about, well, just make the extra point and go to overtime.

Badgley was 20 and 25 on the year, on extra points. But again, one for six on two point conversion. So I'm also asking, like, who are you looking at your own? Who are you going to? a bet that's going to go above their odds,

your third kicker of the year or Josh Allen? Your third kicker of the year? Okay, well, that's her an extra point. I would go. So are you arguing, are you arguing just to argue? I am arguing just to argue because I do want to know like, at what point are you self-scouting enough to be like, all right, I get that you're rolling the dice going this direction with going

for two. But again, you have failed to convert two-point conversion, you know, five out of the six times that you've already done. it now six out of the seventh. Yeah. And that's a valid argument. And obviously that's something that each team has to take into consideration as they look at their own two-point plays, their play calls, their strategy.

So that's certainly a fair and valid argument. I think where the argument universally, I'm not saying your argument, I'm just saying the universal argument on all of this is everyone just assumes you make the extra point. And I just watched you miss an extra point. Blah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So, like, there's always this assumption that if you go for two, you're going to miss, and it's so stupid. All you had to do was line up in the driving rain and just make a simple extra point that, oh, yeah, on your first touchdown, I watched get blocked.

So, like, there's this assumption that what happened on the previous two-point play matters, but what happened on the previous point after try is somehow irrelevant. it. I ask you this question. The night before, Texans, Chargers, Dicker the Kicker has had an amazing season. Amazing. So they are down 10. They go down and they score, the Chargers are down 10. They go down and score a touchdown. So we're watching this game at our hotel and Indy because that game was a big factor in how meaningful our game was yesterday. Yeah. The Colts needed the Chargers to come back and win for the Colts to still be playing for something against Jacksonville yesterday. So selfishly, we're like, we'd love this game to mean something to Indies. So we're watching intently.

I say all of that. Long story short, they score a touchdown. So now it's a four point game. Okay. How much time's left? That's a good question. Is it like under, you know? It's minutes to go into third.

Okay, okay, okay. That's good enough. Okay. Hold on. He's got a note. He's got now. You know, Gray, he's just, he's a detailed oriented guy. Well, it matters.

It's a great question. Will goes, it's enough. And you're like, yeah, yeah, it's not enough. That's, that's a conversation right there with my wife. It's all I need to know. I need to know exactly. 3.37. Okay, all right.

So lots of time. How many timeouts? I think they had all of them. Okay. So, and analytically, all the time in the world. Analytically, this is a time where you score and go for two, correct? I'm asked, okay, so I'm just painting this scenario. Okay.

that's this is a very so you talk about like where these teams are on the cutting edge nobody's quite ready like the down by 14 thing you're starting to see more teams after the first touchdown not everybody but a lot of teams are going for two the first time to try to make it six the 15 one we talked about fourth down this was the fourth down conversation like five years ago so there's phases to all of this i don't know if teams are ready to like regularly adopt down 10 go for two to make a field goal win it but let's just talk about what happened So they try to just take the foregone conclusion of making this extra point. This sun is blaring on my face right now.

I'm going to shut the blinds. Hold on. So they take the, they just take the points, make it a three points. It's a field goal game, right? That's what everyone's saying. Make it a field goal game. Don't make it a touchdown game. He misses the extra point. So they now are down four and they need a touchdown to win.

No longer a field goal could tie. If they would have went for two, and failed, they still would have been down four. What is the difference at the end of the game for Harbaugh? The press conference. Dicker, the kicker needs to be better. He's been awesome all year and he missed the kick. You go for two.

The question is, coach, you are there. Now, it didn't matter. They never got the ball back. But if Justin Herbert got that ball down four, that conversation, if you need a touchdown and you get goal to go and you come up short, It's like if only you were down three, you would have kicked the field goal and tied the game. Well, you missed the extra point, but now the coach doesn't have to justify. The coach just says my kicker stinks.

I'm a great coach. Yeah. That's fair. You've really gotten me on the down 14 late. You score the first touchdown. You go for two. I'm understanding that level of aggression. But 10 points.

I'm not seeing where it's go for two in the situation. Yeah, so I'm not saying it's a foregone. That's so, yeah, I guess this is where that phase is still, that gap started in close. Because I'm looking at it like you clearly just kick the extra point. I'm starting to naturally feel like when you're down 10. That's why I was asking the time. If you're within like what, six, seven minutes, I'm starting to, yeah, so fuck. If you're around that time frame, I am now starting to naturally think if you're down 10 and you score, you now go for two.

So I'm starting to get into that, you know, new world where. you know, Greg, and they're teaching you all these, this analytical side of football on what you would do. So yeah, hearing that, I'm thinking, oh, damn, that's a bad. That's a bad move on the coaching side to not go for two in that situation. Yeah, and I'm not saying that it's a no-brainer. I'm not saying that if it was me that I feel so strongly that I would do it every time. I'm not suggesting that. All I'm suggesting is we have programmed that the anti-analytics, the anti-2 crowd has built their argument from point after tries are 100% successful all of the time and two point plays are failures.

Like we have completely taken both ends of the extremes where no one ever misses a PAT and everyone always fails a two point play. And it's just obviously not true. Yeah, it's obviously not true, but still I feel like the percentages are way different. I think we talked about two point conversions being what 50%. Close. They're like in the mid-40. The mid-40s, point after try is I got to believe in the 80s.

Yeah. Oh, I bet you it's higher. I bet you it's lower. I'm just being conservative. So some guy on the internet right now is not like, actually it's this, you know? Yeah. So Taylor's bad. He's battling an imaginary hater.

Yeah, just in case. This is called covering it. It's like Will holding his tweet back for a couple extra minutes. You got to do that. Two point tries are hard. That's why you typically want multiple cracks at them. Yeah. Right. So it just, that's the whole idea. Again, the down 14, the down 15. You want multiple cracks. You want multiple opportunities to get them because going one for one is hard. Going one for one is less than a coin flip.

How many two point plays when you were playing did you guys practice? One, maybe two. On our call sheet, probably inside the five, those were probably your inside the five. We probably had five total. Yeah. Five or six. Couple runs, couple passes. There's one maybe two.

You're like, which I guess was like a separate, like that was like jumbo, 23, big bodies. And everyone had like a million different tight end play actions and fake. We did a shit ton of it with Cam. Our goal line stuff was actually really good. Obviously he was a huge factor in that because he was such a threat,

whether he was in gun, whether he's under center. So like our goal line stuff was pretty extensive just because of him. But yeah, teams have way more now than they used to. Yeah. Let me ask you this, Greg. What would the conversation? So if we're talking about the extremes on the analytic side of like,

you're not wrong trying to kick the extra point, but you know, that one right there you miss, yada, yada, yada. What would be your conversation with coach Harbaugh or a head coach on what they're thinking is or what they should challenge themselves to interrogate about themselves on why you don't go for two in that situation. Like if I was trying to convince them why. Right. Like if you're sitting there and you're in a room with these head coaches on thinking about

this level of thinking with the two point conversion, because a lot of it does come back to this presser like, hey, what is, what are we avoiding by not trying to go for two here? You know what I'm saying? Yeah. Yeah. I think the first thing I would try to just present is how. how much of your decision making is affected on your desire or lack there of of answering these questions? Like how much does that matter to you? How much does public perception? How much does

criticism? How much does the fallback matter? And I think it's a fair, I don't blame coaches who do value. And I think there are certain coaches that have built up more credits and more stock that those post-game press conferences are a non-factor, right? Their job's not on the line. They're not under constant heat. It's a very different experience in different markets for different coaches based on market size, media, how much they've won or lost, right? Like certain coaches are Teflon. You're not going to get up there in question decisions made by, you know, I mean, I guess we saw Andy Reid get questioned this year, but that seems kind of stupid. So I do think there are varying degrees of your ability to stand at the podium and say nothing. Any of you say matter. My job is

safe and I'll do it again, right? It's the Dan Campbell effect. So you first got to just decide how much is your decision making being influenced by any of those emotions? If these are emotional decisions and you value that as a person, the conversation should end, right? There's no convincing anyone that what emotions they feel aren't real. I'm never going to convince anyone otherwise, right? If that's just how you feel, you might be wrong, but I'm never going to win that an emotional battle is never going to be won. If that's not the limiting factor, and they are open-minded to just talking about,

okay, what does improve our chances? It comes down to trying to win the game when you get an opportunity in regulation. Now, regular season, post-season has changed, overtime has changed a little bit, so the odds are a little bit more in your favor with both teams getting a possession. But by and large, I would try to operate

as often as possible, if I get an opportunity to win the game in regulation, I'm going to do it. And those would probably be like my two main North Stars. And then there's a lot of nuance and situation and strengths of your team and quarterback style and offensive play caller. Like then there's a lot of like team nuance that each team has to make their own decision base. But like those two guiding principles would be where I would start personally.

Yeah. The thing I love about this conversation is that you're exactly the last thing you said is like it's not like a black and white type of thing. It depends on what personnel you have, what quarterback. And that's what makes it so much more fun to look into and see like, hey, what coach is willing to slap their balls on the table and be like, this is what we're going to do. Hey, it's us, the Jonas brothers. And guess what? We have some big news. What's the news?

Huge news. We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to... We're the first people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts throughout there. But this one's extra special.

So how do we actually come up with a name, Hey Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it. Well, we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band before Jonas Brothers. This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes. I have a very different memory of this.

We were talking about a thing. a bit for the podcast for people could call in and say, Hey, Jonas. And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it.

Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy, not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman helped make you funny. This week, my guest, S&L's Mikey Day and headwriter, Streeter Seidel, help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter.

Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The story I've told myself about love or relationships can then shape my behavior, and that can lead me to sabotage the possibility of, connection. This mental health awareness month, tune into the podcast deeply well with Debbie Brown and explore the journey of healing, self-discovery, and returning to yourself. We explore higher consciousness, emotional well-being, and the practices that help you find clarity, peace, and self-mastery in a world that can feel overwhelming. The world is becoming lonelier. We're not

becoming more social and connected. We're becoming more individualized, but we actually need to people in connection. If you've been searching for a soft place to land while doing the work to become whole, this podcast is for you to hear more. Listen to deeply well with Debbie Brown from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Week in and week out regardless of circumstance. While you were talking, I was thinking about the 15 points being down 15. You go for you go for two on the first touchdown. You don't get it. The in time you you have to you never mind you know what i've worked through it in my head you have to go for two in the second one to even tie it so never mind i'm back i'm back let again not to rehash all of that

because if you don't get the first one you're down nine right so you so that's where him trying to wrap wrap our heads around uh going for two down 15 is where i'm kind of little that's where i get a little bit more resistant yeah again it comes it comes down to take the emotion out of it from a practical standpoint, would you rather be down nine with three and a half minutes or would you rather be down two with 15 seconds? No, yeah, I understand that. That's it. From a non-emotional, not the how hard I'm going to play on defense and the defense is so

more motivated down eight that they are nine and the guys on the sideline are slapping each other on the backs. Like eliminate all of that. Yeah. Just from a practical sense, the argument against what the Phil, what Philly did and what everyone came after me for supporting was they assumed that you missed the first one

and you're down nine and you're an idiot be down eight and it's a one score game and take it to overtime but the reason I'm down nine is because I failed on the two point conversion so why would being down eight why should I assume I get the two point conversion you can't have it both ways

defense a little bit more tired a little bit more defeated like fuck they're probably gonna get this one versus the first one. My bad question started this conversation. I apologize. It's emotion. And that's why I said, if emotion's going to run it,

you're never going to win the battle. And that's okay. I'm not saying those feelings aren't real. I'm just saying they're not impactful. And if they are impactful, you should fire your defense. You should cut everyone. If Will Compton is not going to run through his agap

on a run blitz, hard down nine, that he would down eight, that he shouldn't be your Mike backer. The reason I'm laughing is I, right before he started to go, uh, your feelings like, it's fair to feel what you say, but they're not impactful. Before he started to say that, I, yeah, a switch flipped in my mind to where he's now talking to his wife.

I'm thinking, I wonder how this would go through. I'm not saying your feelings are wrong. Yeah, yeah. There's not impactful to the situation. Once he said they're just not a bad guy. I got to drop that on tail in one day just to see how it goes. Hit you boys up. Don't do it.

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that's r0.c.com slash bussen for $15 off your first order. Let's get back to the episode with Greg Olson. Did you get a chance to check out the Steelers and the Browns? I didn't. That game was going on right when my game was going on. You lost to the Browns, bro. You don't really need to know the game. But Miles Garrett obviously one sack away from holding the record from a solo standpoint.

After the game, he said they were worried about keeping me away from Aaron Rogers more worried about that than getting the win. that's what we came back to bite them. Have you ever been in a situation where, like, in your career where someone was chasing a record and what the, if there was a meeting room about that? Because it seemed like with the Steelers, and I think there was like conversations taking place. Like if he beats you, whatever, grab his face mask, do not let him get it.

And then in the game in the fourth quarter, they had multiple three and outs. But there are a few times that Miles Garrett's like basically getting there. And Rogers like, fuck this and just dumps it off to the side. Like they were, they seem very obvious. they're more worried about miles than they were, hey, let's go try to win this game. You know, it kind of reminds me, I don't know, did you guys play high school basketball?

No. No, one year in eighth grade. So high school basketball, we, you know, we were like an average, you know, we were fine. But we would go play some of these teams that were real good and they were just better than us. So this is what kind of reminds me, like before the game, like you and your buddies, you'd sit there and you'd be like,

we could lose by 50. You cannot let anyone dunk. Like, we're fast. Allen guys, we're flipping them upside down. We're sending them into the wall. Intentional fouls, text, whatever it takes, nobody dunks. That's kind of like what this reminds me of, right?

You say, we can concede the game. We're not going to give up. We're going to throw the ball in the ground. We're going to spike it. Do not let Miles Garrett live in infamy that this, that Aaron Rogers is Brett Favreve, right? Where he's the quarterback we see sacked, you know, when Strayhan breaks the record.

So, like, that's, where my mind goes on all this, whether that's real or not. I don't know. I guess you'd have to ask Rogers and those guys, but I don't blame them. Like, I didn't want teams to break records against us. You know, those years that you were losing, if you played a divisional arrival or somebody that you could knock out of the playoffs and you were already out, you're like, well, if I'm going to be home, I'm going to ruin their season. So I just think that's kind of the NFL. I don't know if anyone in the NFL wants to see in their moment, in their game, their. team get like better one-upped um so if that was their mindset and they didn't want them to break the

record then i have no problems with it yeah like i i got there's there's part of me that thinks and again i'm just assuming but aaron's playing is like he's trying to play to win but in the back of erin's mind he's like this is not another thing where i'm going to follow suit yeah far or i'm not going to take over brett farb's oh you think you think history was in the back of his mind i i yeah as a competitor like why wouldn't he think about that yeah you know what i'm saying yeah like all the things where he's kind of like he's been the next Brett Farve at Green Bay, like going and playing for different teams, like the same, the same different teams, like all of these things and just the relationship they seem to have had with everything that's come out. I'm just sure, like,

as a competitor, that that was a thousand percent probably in his mind to some extent. You know what I mean? Like, I'm not going to be, I'm not taking over Brett Farv's clip for like giving up the record. Yeah. It's so surprising to me. Like we had Dionne Dawkins on last week. He was going to, he was playing the Browns. And in that game, it's like, hey, he's coming. Like, you don't make sure you're not the guy. And it ends up not being the guy. Now the Steelers game is happening.

Now there's only one game left for him to get this. I just keep picturing in my head, like, it's the fourth quarter. There's a couple of minutes left. And who, I don't even who the Brown's playing? I think it's the Bengals. So it's a game that means nothing. Game that means nothing. Everybody right now this week is planning for, hey, where are we going in the office?

Right. And so does Joe Burrow, he'll probably get sacked anyway based on the way his, his, his, his career is gone and getting sacked. But does Joe Burrow bend the knee and kind of give Miles Garrett one to take home the all-time record? Because Miles, when he was getting close, there was like three, four games. And it was like, he had like 25 taped to his wrist. He's thinking beyond the sack record.

Like he's like, I'm going to handle this no problem. Now there's got to be a level of like, I might never get here again. I might never get to the opportunity where I can break the record. Absolutely. Panic is starting to set in probably on his camp. Like, I've got to get this fucking. record now and if I don't like I'll probably never sniff this again and the bangles like even though you say Joe B is he going to be like I don't think the division rival to me if you're the

bangles you're there is no goal for this game the entire goal should be miles Garrett is not getting this record on us but Joe Joey B is kind of got that you can see his press conferences with the bangles he's a I don't you know he doesn't seem like he's happy he's saying very vague things you say I could see Joe pulling up uh uh Aaron Rogers which not Aaron Rogers Brett Farf we're Brett was like, it was kind of known that like Brett kind of gave it to my play action fell down. Yeah, play action fell down, let him have it. Like, can we see Joe Burrow be like, let me get this guy one or two, you know, set the tone. Who's going to set it? All set it for the boy. Because this is true history that we're looking at here. It's like,

you know, it's crazy. I like thinking that this game now has true meaning. True meaning. It's a great game for Mao's Garrett to try to break it, right? Because the offensive lines poor, you know, historically the last couple years, they've been poor and they're going to throw the shit out of the ball. Yeah. Right. So you're going to get a ton of pass attempts. You're going to get a ton of passing downs. If for whatever reason, they don't give up a sack to Miles Garrett, then we have to look back on the last couple years and be like, what? How come you, when the game met nothing, you guys protected the shit out of Joe Burroughs. For the last three years, we've seen him just get his block knocked off. What's going on here?

Like, all of a sudden, you guys needed this record to, like, motivate him. yourself. That's a good point. Hey, but Greg, if you're if you were tied in on the Bengals, like what would be your goal going into the game? Like are you, are you somebody that would as a tight end be like, hey, coach, like, Chip, I'll fucking block all game. We're not letting Miles Garrett get this sack.

I mean, I did my fair share of chips. I had my fair share of like I didn't see me come in earhole shot. I didn't love that. Like, I didn't love the idea of like earholing a guy who wasn't looking at me. I mean, I did it. It wasn't something I got great pride out if I didn't feel like, oh, I'm a badass because I just earhold this guy who didn't see me. I want to run down the field. Like my life, my whole career was like running down the field far.

Like I watch a lot of these offenses now. Far. You don't be wrong. These guys are awesome. Like it's naked flat. It's naked drag. It's naked over. And I'm looking at myself like, oh my God, I would have caught 3,000 balls in these offenses.

Like, we were vertical. We were going downfield. We were middle benders. We were deep overs. We were 22 inside numbers of the hash and two yards inside the hash. I couldn't afford to chip anyone unless you just ran a flat or a check. And I had no interest at any of that. Like I wanted downfield, ball in the air, air yards.

That was just my game. So I would have a hard time playing in an offense with a whole game. I just edged and chipped. We did it. But it was not something that I wanted to make a living doing because it just really, it cuts down on the types of routes you can run. Yeah, yeah. You live.

Yeah, I'm wondering if you're ready to just sacrifice running routes. Yeah. Well, Greg, he's talking about making a living. Am I trying to hit 80 catches for a, uh, yeah, yeah, that's true.

Like, are you worried about Miles Garrett's record? I mean, what about my incentive about 80 catches? No doubt. 50 grand. Do we care about that? Greg, if you spent your life worrying about checking,

chipping people and not moving the ball down the field, you're standing up to close your blinds when the sun's in your face. Correct. instead of just hitting a button. Yeah, exactly. Like, that's... Is it a little bit better now? It is a lot better.

Yeah, you see. Here's what I will say, though, and Taylor, you'll appreciate this. And every tackle I ever played with, like, even when we got new guys, like Michael Orr came and Khalil's brother, Matt came. So we had a couple, like, tackles join us in our run in Carolina. And they all love this. So pat on the back to me,

I played 90% of the game in a two-point stance, but attached to the tackle. We had kind of formed an 11 personnel. like in passing situations. But I would, my rule was I never let the, the defensive end ever line up outside of me. So I was never going to take my split, my distance from you.

If I was lined up on the left side and I was trying to gauge my distance from you as the left tackle, I would, I would say I'm always going to capture the defensive end. I didn't want to stand so close to you. I'm three yards, two yards from you. And then Miles Garrett's a wide nine technique outside me. I go run my route.

and you sit, Miles Garrett is like six yards from you running at your face. Yeah, it's terrifying. That's terrifying. But how often you see tight ends? They come up. They set their feet. And then the defensive end picks where he needs to go. Yeah.

I would come real wide out of the huddle, wait for the defensive end to pick his landmark on you, and then I would reduce my split. And I'll never forget, I was playing in Detroit one year, Kyle Vandenbosch. Remember him? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. He'd wear those. Nebraska boy.

Lens, like, contact lenses and shit where like you didn't have a pupil. Like this guy was a maniac. And I'm messing with him in my split. I'm not letting him take these like wide ghost nine splits on pass downs. And he's losing his shit and he's trying to move. And I just keep moving with him. Just trying to capture him on the tackle.

And he looks at me and he motherfucks me and screams in my face about moving my split. I almost shit my pants. He was like a demon. I was like. dude, you're scary as shit and you'll probably kill me on the next run play, but I am not going to let you line up on our left tackle nine yards off of his ankle.

That is, uh, that is big time. And you should absolutely pat yourself on the back for that. There was nothing. The left tackle needs to be sent in. Did he send you a Christmas gift this year? Every year. Every year.

I love it, dude. I love it. Because we would, we would, uh, go through. We would play like big time, big time guys like do, uh,

Sugs or Miller or whoever. And if like, hey, we're going to chip. We would go through indie periods of, like, hey, these are how the tackles like to get, like to get chipped. And there was nothing worse to me than when the tight end would line up tight to me. And then the defensive end would line up in a wide nine on the outside of him.

And the chip would be, oh, he beat me off the ball. Let me push him in the back so he gets more of a jumpstart. And I literally, I would just tell you guys, I'm like, bro, I don't need you to do much. Just get in front of him for a second and bring him to me. That's all I want you to do. Bring him to me. You got to contain him. You got to capture him and push him in.

Funnel him in. but when you are behind him and you're pushing his ass so he gets farther up the field, I'm in panic mode now. Now I'm in, I have to get the hell out of whatever situation I am. I don't know where I am as far as pocket integrity or nothing. And it's just, it's absolute hell.

It's the worst feeling the world. When the tight end lines outside of him, I could chip him. Yeah. I could like crack him on some sort of like pin and pull outside run play. What I really liked about it, the twice a game that they asked me to pass protect, I liked being on the outside

and I would just power jump the shit out of them outside in and I would just earhole them snatch them at the line of scrimmage. I didn't want to set as a while I didn't want to set as a nine technique myself. If you didn't want to do it, I sure shit didn't want to do it. It just made the light,

the game so much easier when there was the tight end and the tackle and the defensive end lined up in between them. That's the idea. I just don't know why more people don't do it. Yeah. And I don't understand tight ends past setting.

It always always looks terrible. They don't know what they're doing. Exactly. Get on them right away. I'll come help you in a minute. Because you know it's like play action. I'm going to go into the B gap. I'm going to check my linebacker.

And the first thing I'm doing is going to check you. Just lose outside. I'll meet you between him and the quarterback. Dude, I would, I mean, I'm sure it happened a handful of times over the years. But like, if I got trapped on a pass set, we used to call it Randy Louis. We're like the tight end had the end. The line would slide away. And then the back was like my help.

But like if the backs guy came, then I was one on one. If I had that guy outside of me and I knew it was like a traditional kickset wide punch, I was like, all right, man, like this is going to be a fucking battle. Yeah. But if I had that guy inside, it didn't matter who he was. If I knew I could block him down from the outside and then just wrestle him, even if he knocked me back, he had to knock me back from the line of scrimmage, I was fine. Yeah. That's die of slow death. Like you understand the process.

You understand. I love her all talking about our fears. You blocking 101, me getting a wide nine's ass pushed. You playing man coverage. It's all hell. Anytime a back motion's out of the back field, we can't check. Yeah. To rat or replace with the safety blitzing to where I could take the blitz and he can go cover the back.

Yeah, I was in a mental health. If you have a segment where we each get to air our like worst nightmare that we had to like hide for 20 years when we played. You weren't allowed to admit any of these things suck. We just had to be like, dude, I'm good at everything. Right. Nothing I can't do. And now we have like a free. It's like a free get out of jail card.

You get like one segment of Monday where you can admit all the shit you weren't good at and that you were scared to death of doing it. Exactly. Because it's so funny how like that the plays we're talking about probably happened two or three times a game. But we would spend most of the game thinking when are these two or three times going to happen? Most of the week. Most of the week.

What situation could this come on? It's like, yeah, I feel good about this, this and this. But if this comes up, I swear to God, and then you'd be in like the second quarter being like, when's it going to happen? You're in the middle, you just finished a play. You're like, I hope it's not this next play coming up. You know it's like a third down.

You're like, it's third and six. You're looking at the sideline. You're like, don't call it. Yeah, don't. Don't. Send me on a route. I'm doing good down the field. I would tell my coaches, I'd be like, hey, listen,

I don't care about like a lot of chips. I just need one early in the game. I need one, like, legit, chip him early in the game. that way he's thinking about it anytime the tight end would come in and then give me one around the third quarter give me two and I'm happy because it makes them think and that's all I need is for them just to think a little bit then that I'll be all right but it was a terrifying my career at the end of my career when uh you know you're you're old and you just say whatever the fuck you want to say and you don't care anymore yeah we would be in like install meeting on

third down and if there was like more than one play where the tight end had to stay in and remember like back early in our careers there was we used to call it like Mustang protection where like the tight end and the running back would stand next to the quarterback. And it was like full seven man protection. And anyway, like that or when you had to block the DN, if they had more than like one or two of those, it'd be like, hey, anybody have any questions? I've got a question. And I'm like, all right, what, Olson? I'd be like, so this $25 million in end that all week I've heard we got a chip and we got to end and we got to give body presence to our $15 million tackles.

I'm going to block him on 3rd and 8 by myself while they all slide to nobody. I just want to make sure I have the protection understood correctly because for the last four days, I've been beat down my face about chip, edge, don't get wide with your split, running backs, give body presence. But now on 3rd and 8, it's like, don't worry,

Olson's got Von Miller, and everyone else you just go slide and just do this whole slide thing where nobody touches anyone. That's what we're going to call on third and eight. And everyone would laugh, but I was like, I'm not even joking. This is so stupid.

Right, right. You're not joking. Yes, I feel you there. Like when I would have to eventually soil the D-N because they wouldn't want to bam in the red zone. And I'll just back. So just, again, we want to get this clear. What we're worried about in the red zone inside, let's say the 15, we're worried

about this choice route from Darren Sproul's. You're telling me, I can't bam when I know this option route's coming because he's going be in an obvious chow alignment. I can't bam the end. You want me to cover him one-on-one? I just want to be clear, because I've asked if I could bam all week and nobody's really told me anything.

What the fuck does bam mean? Bam is when the end will come out and hit or bam the running back. He'll like, he'll like chop a guy. Yeah, the defense. Yeah, basically a defensive chip. I hadn't heard that. So that way the running back, once they get hit,

they have to just get in their route ASAP versus coming up to stem you. You got to let the tailback get a free release one-on-one in space. and then when he scores, you'll get coached up about where your alignment was and where your leverage was. Will, you got to close the distance. Stay inside out. You got to get your hands on them at some point. It's Darren fucking Sproles. But the ends are getting mad because the ends, you got to take them out of their pass rush.

Because, like, you want me to bam Sproles when you're expected to cover? I'm like, it's Darren Sprouls. I would love if I could just get a little some kind of chip on this man. Before we run, they're highly targeted their favorite route, which is a choice route in the red zone. Yeah. Meanwhile, the offensive quality control guys stood up there on Wednesday on scout team and said, hey, guys, Darren Sprouls, we got us. I could have told you it was a touchdown four days ago.

Exactly. Well, I can just imagine Will and the defensive end coming up to Will and be like, yo, what are you making me bam? He's like, bro, trust me, I'd rather not be in that play. I'd rather not be in. Unfortunately, I'm in, so I need you to, I need you to bam. It'd be Trim Murphy and Ryan Kerrig. Listen, bud, I'd rather get a fucking calf cramp and come out of the game. I'm not thrilled about it either.

Yeah. Yeah. Oh, dude. Yeah, that's, I'm glad we got to work through that. What else we got? We got a playoff game with your Carolina Panthers, Tampa Bay Buccaneers. Wow.

That's a game that means something. Winning in. Both of you guys lost over the weekend. I do like the Panthers this week. Like, if I'm leaning on anything, it's going to be the defense of the Panthers. Yeah. It's a win and in.

There is this, like, weird, not a weird scenario, but there is this, like, far-fetched scenario that if somehow the Falcons beat the Rams tonight, then even if Tampa beats Carolina next week, if the Falcons also win and they play New Orleans, that it would be a three-way tie. And then Carolina, even if they lost, they would be an eight and nine winner.

So they'd still get in. So they'd still get in. So that's if the Falcons beat the Rams tonight. That's assume that the Falcons don't beat the Rams tonight. Good assumption. To win it in. The way Carolina is very weird. Like one week, good, one week off.

They've kind of won, lost, one loss. They kind of bounced back and forth weekly over the last like eight weeks. Tampa Bay is really struggling. They just cannot find their way. This back half the season, after starting so strong, they have just not been nearly as effective and not nearly as efficient, especially on offense. So, yeah, I mean, I'd like to see Carolina make the playoffs.

I think that'd be really cool. we haven't been since 2017. So it's been a while. So I think it's fascinating that after all this, it's going to come down to one game, Week 18, most likely winner take all. But yeah, I think Carolina's got a great shot. They seem to bounce back.

They seem to lose after they win and win after they lose. So from a pattern standpoint, week 18 looks good. Yeah, I love the pattern talk. My kids are all about patterns right now. I think you're right. Like the run game, the Panthers. I think Bryce has actually looked better this year. Yeah.

He said he makes some really good throws. And it's like the inconsistency, but at the same time, you look at Tampa Bay and just riddled with injuries, something is wrong with Baker. It feels like he looks like a guy that's just like willing himself to play every single week when he needs to be on a stretcher or getting some rehab. So yeah, I like the Panthers as well. I like the Panthers. I think it doesn't really matter. I think both whichever team goes in the playoffs, it's a very short playoff run. But making the playoffs still says a lot about your franchise.

Yeah. You get into the, you get into the tournament. Yeah. You get into the tournament. Yeah. think it happened how do you see the uh how do you see the one seed sticking out because i want to get to where we're talking who we think can can make the run to the super bowl um big games next week you'll have what seattle and the niners which you'll have which has massive implications yeah

the winner of that game has the one seed yeah which is wild the 49ers 49ers which is kind of been in the shadows all year winning and taking care of yeah but you got you got to love that about them man yeah like shanahan incredible but who you got in that game I think Shanahan, I said this yesterday in our game. We had Indianapolis in Jacksonville. We were talking about the job Liam Cohen's done. And, you know, they got one pro bowler and it's the long snapper. And what a job he's done.

They won their 12th game and all that. And I made the comment that it's probably the most packed coach of the year, you know, candidacy pool, candidate pool in years. I mean, you start talking about like the one year turnarounds, Ben Johnson, Vrable and Liam Cohen. Then you start talking about the job. Mike McDonald's. done in his second year in Seattle getting that right back on track.

Arby the best team in the league. Hey, it's us, the Jonas Brothers, and guess what? We have some big news. What's the news, new? Huge news. We created our own podcast called, Hey Jonas. We invented a podcast. Well, we didn't invent it.

We just contributed to a first people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts. We're starting a trend. But this one's extra special. So how do we actually come up with a name, Hey Jonas, Jonas, guys? I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call. about what we should call it.

Well, we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band before Jonas Brothers. This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast where people could call in and say,

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this podcast is for you to hear more. Listen to deeply well with Debbie Brown. from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. You know, give or take. And then with Shanahan, you know, a guy that we've seen playing Super Bowls, a guy that's name has been in the mix of, you know, one of the top coaches in the league for a long time.

So maybe we don't appreciate because we just assume the 49ers should always be good. But, I mean, you look at what that team has gone through, right? They lost Brock Purdy for stretches of game. They lose Fred Warner, done. Bosa, done. Kittle at times. I want to say last night was Kittles like fourth or fifth missed game. They've played without chunks.

You know, Iuk just disappeared off the face of the earth. Like they have had some really interesting roster situations. And now here they are in a week 18 win. And not only win your division, but get the first round by as the one seed and play and have home field advantage through the Super Bowl potentially. So Shanahan's in that mix. I think it's remarkable. That game last night was incredible, scoring 40 plus.

I just, I worry defensively in the playoffs. We've talked about that on here a lot. I think defense matters a lot more come postseason than it does in the regular season. The teams that make the playoffs are disproportionately offensively driven. There's a few anomalies, you know, Texans. In the past, there's been some teams that have been rid, road on their defense. But it's mostly good teams that can score points. So now it's like, okay, who can actually stop?

somebody. But who can actually play competent defense, run game. Some of the things that don't have as big of an impact over the course of a long season do matter in a one and done scenario in the playoffs. So I'd still go with Seattle because I think Seattle's defense is as good if not better than any. I think offensively, they're still hit or miss. They're still not exactly sure. They got to get that past game back to what it was. But San Francisco's offense is probably the best offense of the last three or four weeks in the league. The defense scares me. Yeah.

Brock Pretty has been playing girl. The zero pass rushed by the defense right now on Fando's sports book, Kyle Shanahan is plus 130. He's the favorite right now. He's the favorite? He's the favorite for coach of the year, followed by Mike. So you would have to bet 130 to win 100?

No, if you bet 100, you'll win 130. So, yeah, it's plus odds. These are futures bets. They're always going to sit in the plus. So Shanahan's plus 130. Mike Vrabel is next at 140 plus 140. then as a big drop off of Mike McDonald at plus 500. And then Liam Kohn is at 1,500 from there,

which I thought Liam would be a little higher than that. It's, dude, it's honestly just because of the market that they're in. Like, it's the Jacksonville Jaguars. Like nobody started to talk. Braves won coach of the year in 21 or something like that with the Titans. And they're probably less than. And Ron Rivera won coach of the year. That's fair.

Ron Rivera won coach of the year twice with us. Yeah. We're a small market. It's interesting. I mean, Liam, dude, it is. But is that betting odds? Let me ask you this.

because, again, I'm not overly familiar with how the whole thing works. So, like, is there an element to that where name recognition? So for these odds makers, the Shanahan's of the world are going to just get more bets placed on them because there's more name recognition as opposed to Liam Cohen. So by they got to reduce the odds of a guy like Shanahan because he's going to get so much action. Is that part of it? Yeah, it's like, I want to say Vegas, they just, they understand the pulse of what's going to happen or what's going on at this current moment.

So, for example, like the moment Fernando Mendoza, so it was very close between Diego Pavia and Fernando Mendoza. And this is just one example of like a futures bet. They were both neck and neck going into. Diego was a favorite over Mendoza. Yeah, Diego was a favorite over Mendoza. And the talk that week was if Fernando Mendoza has a good game against Ohio State, like a good quarterback, got stats, got touchdowns, all this stuff.

Like Fernando Mendoza could edge out and could beat Diego Pavia. Well, Fernando Mendoza only through, what one touchdown yeah through about a big third down late in the game but nothing that's like he should have ran away with this but the moment that game ended Fernando Mendoza became minus 3,000 in the sports book to win the Heisman so it's like they ultimately knew who was going to win a Heisman immediately after that game concluded yeah you know what I mean to where you could

argue you could talk about the Diego all you wanted but he wasn't even close once that game ended yeah as far as the sports the sports book and the markets and the betting odds and everything else. So what Fandall is saying this is Shanahan's become a real favorite. They don't know who's going to win out of Rabel and Shanahan. That's why they're only 10 off. Who was third on the list?

Mike McDonald, but he was plus 500. Mike McDonald plus 500. And then Liam Cohen at plus 1,500 is just in the world of us arguing or debating about it. It seems bizarre because Liam Cohen has just as good of a resume, if not better than everybody else. Like I know there's a lot of great candidates. Like even Ben Johnson, he wasn't even in the top four.

he's probably sitting at, he's probably sitting at fifth in the odds. He is. And I get that they just lost and Shanahan that kind of edges him out there. But as far as how close the race could be, it seems like it's going to come down to Vrable or Shanahan. If Shanahan wins this next week against getting the one seed over Seattle, it seems like Shanahan's going to get it. If the Niners lose and Vrable, they beat, who do they play the, the Dolphins? I have that game. I got Patriots Dolphins. Yeah, so Patriots Dolphins, if Patriots win and Niners lose like Vrable, it seems like.

like he's going to be the likely one to win coach of the year. That's how the odds, that's how the markets kind of have it set up. The next two after that was Ben Johnson at plus 2,000 and then Sean Payton at plus 6,000. Yeah. So, yeah, so right now it's a two man race. It's two men race. You think they're taking into account all the momentum that Jacksonville has, though. Yeah.

He won seven games in a row. Dude, I'm with you. Yeah, I know that I know you're joking. But to me, that's why it's also so bizarre because what Cohen, Trevor Lawrence, he's been playing really well, like what Jacksonville's done this year, compared to what they go last year, four and 13. Yeah, yeah. Four and 13, the weather now, now they're only a four lost team.

What they've done, it seems wild that it's, the gap is so far with Liam Cohen being in this coach. And they had one troble player on their whole roster. Yeah. And that crazy you brought up as a long snapper. Because I know the Patriots had three or four pro bowlers. I mean, Drake May was one of them is the quarterback. Yeah, one of his quarterback.

Yeah, one of his quarterback. Who is arguably the MVP, but he was an MVP caliber. at the beginning of the year in August and September, the conversation revolving around Drake May was one more year, and he's going to be a guy in this league. And then all of a sudden, after they started with a one and two early in the year, it became like, oh, Drake May is the guy,

which would tell you that a lot of coaching took place. Guys, if you look at their roster, and I'm not very familiar with Jaguars roster, but the Patriots roster isn't a roster. It's like Ravens, Eagles, like even the Bengals. Like, they're not a roster that you're like, you can really hang on, be like this is a contending team yet i think i who the broncos play because if the broncos lose and

they win broncos play the chargers so broncos lose are the chargers and the patriots beat the beat be the beat miami they have the one scene right so that's you look at and be like oh i can see why rable should be should be a coach of your guy i think liam cole should be in that 150 160 range if he's a third put him at plus 160 because those guys do have a hell of a resume to say i should be coached the year those three especially i would throw ben jonson there as well. It's incredible. I mean, Caleb Williams is a similar conversation too. Like this year, it's like he's all these bad habits. They're kind of masking him and stuff like that. But the kid is just, he truly has gotten better every single week. So it's,

it's going to be awesome to see. And then again, I'm not taking anything away from Vrable because I think he's going to coach. I do think there is an element also for some of those guys where they're calling the plays. They're coaching the quarterback. They're like. And again, I'm not saying Vrable's not doing a ton because he obviously has won in multiple spots. I, I'm not making this an anti-variable thing at all. But like last night, when you're watching San Francisco fight that game out, you're watching Ben Johnson and Kyle Shanahan duel it out where the only reason San Francisco won is they scored 40 plus points in regulation.

Yeah, it is impressive. But that was two high-level head coaches who were also calling the plays, who are also coaching the quarterback, who are also man, like, that's, there's a big, huge impact. I mean, that's why those coaches are the ones everybody's trying to go find. The advantage New England's going to have, and this was the brilliant, I give a lot of credit to Vrable for how we did this is, if you're not going to call the offensive plays as a head coach, the next best option is to hire a formally fired offensive head coach that likely is not going to be stolen away from you anytime soon. Like, I don't know if, for as good of a job as Josh

McDaniels has done with Drake May, you don't ever. hear his name as the next head coach. You hear Clint Kubiak and you hear all these, because we've seen Josh Daniels be a head coach. And now maybe in his next time, he would do a great job. Who knows? But like, there's an advantage to hire former fired head coaches as your coordinator on the other side of the ball because you're not fearful you're going to lose them. Yeah. So that's the next best scenario if that play caller is not your head coach, a la Shanahan McVeigh, Ben Johnson, etc. So it's a good set up what New England has. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

The Shinnahan thing is so interesting to me because it reminds me of like what I'm assuming it was like when people are watching Michael Jordan or our Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, like these great, consistent players that were so amazing, LeBron James as well, where it's like they're doing incredible things. But eventually the public's like, okay, he does incredible things and kind of like take away from how successful they've been. And it's like, oh, that's just them. So you don't hold the weight of them being successful as much as you would.

Vrable who comes into here. first year at the Patriots, Ben Johnson. It's like, oh, Kyle Shanhan, yeah, he's good. He's had a great year, a lot of injuries, but people aren't really realizing what he's done for the franchise. Right. I think they're slowly starting to come about it now. Now him becoming the favorite.

It's almost like, yeah, if they win, like he'll get it. Yeah. And he should. You can stop voting? Remind me when this, like, when do all these awards stop? Does the playoffs count? The playoffs, they say do not count, but I think the voting ends after the divisional round.

You might be right. It's sometime in the playoffs before the Super Bowl that the vote happens. So playoffs, so playoffs can become a massive factor. A massive factor. Yeah, it'll be, I'm excited to see what the Patriots do in the playoffs. Because again, if you go by strength of schedule, they have the statistically the worst strength of schedule. Who's this? The Patriots.

Yeah, it'll be interesting to see them in the playoffs as well. I have them for the first time this week. So I'm actually anxious to like dive in and like study them and watch them because I've only seen them from afar. highlights. I've watched clips, but I haven't actually spent any time watching them. So I got them Miami, I got Patriots Miami in Foxborough this weekend. So I'm actually curious if my opinions of them change better or worse at the end of the week than where I am now before I haven't really had a chance to dive in yet. I think they'll, I think they'll come out better. Like, Drake May is such a baller. Everybody knows what Drake May's been doing. But just offensively,

the vibe and feel, like again, we play for these variable teams, like when they have, when the culture's hitting. Whenever, when all the vibes are going and they're winning football games, like you just see the gel going on in New England. Their defense is salty. I think you'll have a lot of fun, like diving into the weeds on the Patriots.

Yeah. The buy-ins, incredible. I think they can, where it stands for me right now, like before week 18 happens, because week 18, obviously has a lot of implications,

but let's say everybody handles their business and are slotted where they are currently slotted. Me, I see the Super Bowl being Seattle and New England. is what I would call it. I would love that Super Bowl. Seattle and New England. I would absolutely love it.

Let's talk, I mean, we got to get you out of here. Let's talk playoffs real quick. If I said to you, Denver Broncos, New England Patriots, Jacksonville, Jaguars, Houston, Texas, Los Angeles, Chargers, Buffalo Bills. And I left out Steelers and Ravens there because we'll find that out next week. Of those teams are just named, who you got? Who you think has got the best? Because I feel like people are really on the NFC, but the AFC, dude, like, I have no idea. I have no idea

is going to come out of that. I really don't. I mean, I think we've been saying this every Monday morning for the last two months. Like the AFC, I could make a really strong argument

for every single one of those teams why they could win the whole thing and why they couldn't. I'll tell you who I think is sneaky. And I'm not saying this is my number one, but I might be. I think the Houston Texans are a sneaky postseason team.

Yeah. because defense is so much more important. I've said this a thousand times. But like defenses can carry you a lot more in the postseason than they can regular season. They got off to a fast start, those explosive plays on Saturday night against the Chargers. Like that's what they need to be. Get Stroud pushing the ball downfield, hard play action stuff, throw it over the top of your head. So I think they're just good enough on offense to be just like middle the road, hang in there,

make the plays that are there, and I think they could be dominant, like suffocatingly dominant on defense. And we've seen that formula work. Now, I can make an argument for the Patriots. I do think at some point in the playoffs, like overall roster does start matter. Like when you start looking at like premier players, star players, I'm not sure where Jacksonville and New England are quite yet. You know, they're very early in this.

rebuild quote unquote. So I do think they have some work to do there of just getting prominent players at impactful positions. But I think that AFC man is just so up in here. I think LA and Seattle are the two clear cut over a long period of time. I think they're the two best teams, whether they win or lose, who knows. But I think they're the two best teams in the NFC with and then I, you know, we can debate the rest. But AFC, I think it goes like five or six teams deep. Yeah. And one team he didn't even mention. mentioned was the Broncos and they're the one seat. Yeah.

But to me, that whole team is, what does Bo Knicks do? So the way this would work out currently where it sits, because we don't know what's going to happen with the AFC North. We don't know what's going to happen with the NFC South. But where the bracket sits right now is Houston would play Pittsburgh. Houston's going to play whoever comes out of the north. And then Houston would have to go to Denver. I think Houston matches up really well against ever because that defense would be nasty.

That would be a, that would be a big. a big time showdown. Yeah, that'd be a big time showdown in Denver, Houston versus Denver. Where I would lean is Houston, because I agree with you, Greg, on that team just being like a sneaky dominant team because their defense is so nasty and violent. And they got the guys that can rush the passer. They have the secondary. They got backers who can fly around the football field.

And then coming out on the bottom side, it would be you'd have Jacksonville and the Chargers facing off. I would take Jacksonville in that game. you got Buffalo and the Patriots. I would be taking the Patriots. And then I think Jacksonville coming to New England, that's where New England wins. And then you would have whoever the winner is out of Denver and Houston,

which who knows who knows who's going to win that game. I just, dude, it's going to be hard for me to bet against Drake, bet against Drake May. And just the focus of that, that everybody's going to be focused. Yeah. But again, being in those positions like with Vrable, just knowing how he talks about the game and everything else, to me, it'd be hard to get off what Drake May can do.

And the run games come. alive too. The run game's coming alive. Drake May's still in the best deep ball since what Russell Wilson in his second year when they win the Super Bowl. Like that's kind of what it's... And New England being in a spot too to where if they were to take down the Chargers or Jacksonville in Foxborough, they'll be set up to where

if it's Houston coming out of it, they'll have to get through Denver. Like that'll be a very physical game, the winner who comes out of that to where New England will be just positioned well, especially if Houston wins, they'll be hosting that AFC championship. That's what you want. Yeah. That's what you want. The only thing I disagree with is I kind of lean Denver over Houston.

That's going to be an awesome game. That's going to be an awesome game. But I just think, I mean, their offensive lines give up the least amount of sacks to see. Yeah. And that's where it's like best on best. Let's see what we got here. But if you can slow those guys down even a little bit,

that you put yourself in a much more advantageous situation. I think how many games in a row has Houston won? Like seven, eight, seven or eight? Eight games in a row, I believe. And Jacksonville's won yesterday. Was there sixth in a row? Yeah. Oh, here we go again.

Six. Yeah. That's one of those. One of those. So again, I ask which team enters the playoffs with the most juice and the most momentum and the most energy and feeling the best. They haven't lost in months. But if you talk about New England, too, like they've really only had one bad half of football.

I know. Buffalo came back. Yeah, they lost the momentum in that second. They had all their momentum. Well, the halftime always, half time always resets momentum. Yeah. It resets it goes back to Zos. We haven't even talked about the Buffalo.

a momentum checklist. So I know like when it stops, starts, when it ends, when it resets. Yeah. I'll send you those lists. There's a point system as well as far as like three and outs, touchdowns, four goals. You're always going to hear about momentum from me after the result happens. Yeah, which is smart, which is smart. Because, you know, I would imagine that the team going in, the Texans, so the Texans play the Chargers this weekend.

Yes. So let's, no, no, they just play. Broncos play the Chargers. I'm sorry, they play the... Jacksonville plays... Oh, Jacksonville plays... Jacksonville plays the Titans. Sneaky.

Who does the Texans play? Texans play the Colts. Okay. So we don't know what's going to go on with the Colts. Does Philip Rivers play? Do they start Riley Leonard? Who knows? The Colts have lost all their momentum.

All of it. Gone. All of it. People are saying it's Sauce Gardner's fault. That's what people are saying. They... And he's one in seven, one and seven. that's a tough season.

Yeah. Yeah. So let's just say Houston keeps all their momentum and gets their like ninth win in a row. Tell me when their momentum ends if they lose in the playoffs. When the clock hits zero. Got it. Yeah, when they lose in the playoffs.

That makes sense. So they have all the momentum until they lose it. Is that fair? Correct. I think there's something to be said about winning a lot of, like winning your last six or seven games. Damn it. I didn't mean to do that.

They're winning those last games. and rolling in the playoffs with momentum, that is a thing. It's a buy and it's a real thing. I heard you say they were going to lose. I'm just saying it's going to be a battle in Denver. I like the way Houston matches up against Denver and them coming out of that game,

the road, the streak that they've been on, Houston, Texas are the team where you labeled you don't want to play them in the playoffs. They are that team. I just, in my brain, if I'm trying to predict everything right now before we get in a week 18, where the bracket sits,

like they would just then, after going out to Denver, they would then have to go to Foxborough and winning the AFC championship against a quarterback like Drake May. So that's where I would see they have all the momentum. Two teams got all the momentum. Somebody's got to lose the momentum. Wait, time out. Time out.

This is going to be. We both can have momentum at the same time. Yeah. Yeah, dude, momentum is a fickle thing. This is crazy. Yeah, they got all the movement. I wish I knew all of this. And then if Seattle wins against.

the Niners, I think it's going to be hard for Seattle to lose at home at all in the playoffs. Yeah. But they have a ton of momentum too. A ton of momentum. But if they lose to the Niners, they lose a lot of momentum. Now they become like a wildcard team. Yeah. But yeah, that would be crazy if they lost it.

But like, I guess when did they lose it would be a fun thing to dive into. Right? Just depends. Yeah. That's why you play the game. Listen, I love it. I'm fascinated by it. I think it's super interesting to look at.

at it that way and I'm going to lean more into it I think on my broadcasts yeah yeah Houston's got to be the team that has too much momentum yeah we need an under over on grade and you have too much that you actually like overdose oh yeah oh yeah that yep that's called getting cocky it's called getting hit in the mouth yeah yeah yeah yeah so we have different names like up the threshold yeah yeah there is it there's definitely a sweet spot of momentum there's a sweet spot you got to have Does everyone have a different sweet spot? Oh, absolutely. Yeah.

Okay. That's all based on the head coach. Got it. Yeah. So a guy like Vrable. Now, can that head coach loses? Like, so when did Vrable? Oh, yeah.

So Vrable had no momentum last year, got fired, couldn't win it. But then he got, when did he get it back? He went, he had to go, he had to go live in the darkness. He had to go sit with Razagul. Yep. For a year. And then he came back out of the shadows. That's the thing about Braves, man.

He can hold so much momentum. When you get too much momentum, you got a truly reset. That's why he had to go to Cleveland for a year. Yeah. Vrable's got the juice right now, too. He just randomly shot Taylor and I had texts Merry Christmas. Yeah. Merry Christmas, love Dad.

Yeah. I looked at it. I just smiled and showed my wife. She goes, he really, he really does treat you like that all the time. Well, yeah, this is my life with Braves. This might be my favorite five minutes segment. Yeah. But, dude, yeah, I think.

I just find it fascinating. and Twitter Twitter really has been educating me a lot on like all of my shortcomings of my football takes because I don't put enough stock into and again

I would I would give it more credibility if someone could tell me when it stops and starts yeah no doubt what game do you cover this week Patriots so tons of momentum tons of momentum

I'll watch Watch that game. Dolphins had no momentum, fired their GM, got momentum back, lost the momentum, benched to a next game, no momentum. Quinn yours, no momentum. Last week beat Tampa, who was playing for the division, got their momentum back. Yep. And now they go to Patriots.

So two teams with really interesting momentum. You know what he doesn't know? He doesn't know about backup quarterback momentum. or interim head coach men, but Quinn did lose the first time you went out there. Well, they got. They just had to, they had to pull Quinn of science and say, hey, man, don't, don't put so much pressure on yourself. Just go find some juice.

I'm not Sturkeesian. Yeah, go, go, yeah, go crank it this week. Yeah. Like, don't take this game so serious. Go out there and sling it. Yep. Do you think the dolphins got momentum back when the report came out that the coach wasn't going to get fired?

Do you think that built their momentum back up? Yeah, I'm sure a lot of guys got some juice from that. I'll tell you what, Greg. I'll watch the game with you on Sunday. Can you live tweet the momentum shifts? Yeah. And I'll also text you. Just make sure you just check your phone.

So I can just back, hey, it's time to talk momentum. Can we get on a group chat and we can talk momentum tonight through the game, the Monday night game? Yeah, yes. We got you. Yeah. We got you. We'll let you know when momentum comes to go. Just call us between your commercial breaks.

And we'll let you know exactly where it's at. Hey, guys. All right. Welcome back here to Snowy Foxborough Gillette Stadium 14, 17. Hey, guys, Joe, I just need to jump in. I just heard from the Bustin Boys. This momentum has completely flipped. There was no juice in the building.

And now after that last three and out, New England has all the momentum. Here's what Fox needs to do is they need to have meters. Yeah. Meeters of momentum of just like little like thermostats. And you just slowly, they gain, they lose traction. And we can come up with a whole point system of momentum. How many times a game in an average game,

Like last night, how many times do you think momentum flipped in that game? Great question. Early in the game, momentum was stagnant because both teams were scoring back to back. So like you think that first play the game, pick six, who had all the momentum? Niners. Niners give up the pick. Oh, yeah, my fault. Bears. Yeah, yeah.

Niners do the picks six. I was like, wow, you just really, that was that big, great shit. Hey, it's us to Jonas brothers. And guess what? We have some big news. What's the news, name? Huge news. We created our own podcast called Hey Jonas.

We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts. Pretty, yeah, pretty wide range of podcasts. We're starting a trend. But this one's extra special. So how do we actually come up with a name, Hey Jonas, guys?

I honestly don't remember. I think it was on a call about what we should call it. And we were thinking I'm originally calling it one of the early names of our band Before Jonas Brothers. This is how you guys remember it going down? Yes. I have a very different memory of this. We were talking about a thing, a bit for the podcast,

where people could call in and say, hey, Jonas. And then I wrote down on my little notepad, Hey Jonas, and offered it up as a potential title for the podcast. But thanks for remembering that, guys. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL, late-night comedy guy,

Not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smygel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, S&L's Mikey Day and head writer, Streeter Seidel, help an acapella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform? We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and Friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The story I've told myself about love.

or relationships can then shape my behavior, and that can lead me to sabotage the possibility of connection. This Mental Health Awareness Month, tune into the podcast deeply well with Debbie Brown and explore the journey of healing, self-discovery, and returning to yourself. We explore higher consciousness, emotional well-being, and the practices that help you find clarity, peace, and self-mastery in a world that can feel overwhelming. The world is becoming lonelier. We're not becoming more social and connected.

We're becoming more individualized, but we actually need people in connection. If you've been searching for a soft place to land while doing the work to become whole, this podcast is for you to hear more. Listen to deeply well with Debbie Brown from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. That was about to. I was like, am I missing something where a 30 through the pick and then convinced himself that was the best thing for him? I thought maybe you had like some thing. Hold on. There's something to that.

Like, what's your quarterback's biggest fear? Throwing a pick six, right? Get out of the way. Your worst fear happens right away. You can't be affected now. That's when you start to gain the momentum. Well. Yeah.

Live next to fear. Yeah. Next to it. Throw a pick. Love that. Okay. So we threw the pick six. Chicago on the road, all the momentum.

Yeah. That's a defense. that thrives off takeaways, best takeaway team in the league, Dennis Allen. So they get it first play of the game, pick six. And then they proceeded to give up 42.

Right. Well, there's a lot of things that happen. So momentum can be held in the hand, but it can't be owned just off of one point. It's all about what happens in the next series. And I love that we're thinking through this right now. Yeah.

Yeah. Got a little stagnant, realized, hey, our momentum isn't going to be defensively. It seems going to be offensively. Yeah. gun we're in a shootout yeah and uh great can i ask you a question please what when did you stop believing in momentum because i'm i'm i'm leaning into this as a joke no no no no but i you also

you're not a momentum guy gregg's anti momentum momentum you're anti momentum what what was it what was the phrase uh your emotions i understood you have emotions however they're not valid they're not impactful let me be very clear i'm going to give you my my official stance on all this because right now i'm like over i'm playing i'm having We're having fun with the conversation. We're having fun. There is no question in my playing career that there were games. I went into the game feeling better, worse, more confident, less confident, like the game plan,

didn't like the game plan, felt great about where my hands were. Like, I felt like I could really catch. And there were other games where I was like, I don't know, like there's something about this catch here that I just, it's not, it's not hitting me right. And I'm really overthinking it. And I experienced all of those ranges of emotions. And all I'm saying is it had zero in output, it had zero difference in the outcome of the game. Games where I went in and I'm like,

I'm going to catch a hundred. I'm feeling good. I just had back-to-back hundred yard games. I'm feeling really good. I'd have two catches for 17 yards. And I had two drops. We lost. I dropped the last third down.

I probably should have caught it. I was the go, the bad goat all week long. Olson blew the game and that next game you go in you're like shit I hope I get an early pass I hope I get my shit going and you get 150 like I don't know like you get your momentum back yeah you got it back I guess my momentum came and went is my point so like do I think a mo do I think this is an emotional game absolutely do I think teams and coaches should coach emotion I mean shit you guys have seen my videos of coaching the kids. Like, I am a passionate, competitive, emotional person. Like,

that's my personality. And I think football is played with emotion and football is played with energy. I'm not debating any of that is not a factor. It is. I'm just saying when it comes to decision making and trends and what we should do on the field from a decision making standpoint, I think we just put so much credibility into emotion and momentum, and it's really just a replacement of we don't really know why we're seeing what we're seeing. So we've just made up this non-measurable. You can't quantify it. It's the only explanation why a team could go touchdown, touchdown, pick six, fumble, touchdown, touchdown, miss the two-point conversion, get the onside kick. Like, it's the only thing that explains the highs and lows of sport,

and we don't know what else to call it. Momentum. Momentum. That's what I think. So he didn't answer the question. He's, look, Greg's going to become a momentum. I didn't answer the question. I want to know when you stop believing momentum.

I think I, I think I, I'm not going to say stopped believing. That's like saying I don't believe in Santa. I still believe there's a magic. The idea. He doesn't. A, polar. he doesn't hear the bell anymore he doesn't believe in the momentum good recent doesn't believe in those I started re-evaluating trends in football probably after I was done and I've gotten into this

world now where I have to now get in front of millions of people every Sunday nice and I have to based on an hour of conversations with these coaches which are varying degrees of information that they provide and I have to be able to get up there and figure out okay how do I best present this game to an audience that might be diehard fans. And this might be the first time they've ever watched either one of these teams. Right. So you've got to split that baby and talk to the diehards. But you also can't assume everybody knows what they know because they might just put the TV on this weekend for the first time to watch Drake May. So we need to introduce Drake May and Mike Vrable and all these guys to the world every single week. But we have to do that where I'm not in the

building. I'm not in meetings. I'm not in the locker room. I don't know. the juice. I don't know who's feeling good. I don't know that Taylor's ankle sore. I don't know that Will doesn't want to guard Darren Sproles and the goal. Like, I don't know about any of this. So I have to look at the game through black and white trends. Okay, how are they on offensive efficiency? How are they in defensive efficiency? What coverages do they love on early downs? Okay, what does this team do on the early down run game? How do those match? What is there a bit? And you got to start breaking the gout down the game through more of like an analytical perspective because when I put on the film,

I don't know if the left tackle was supposed to have helped by the left guard on a full slide protection when he got beaten the B gap and gave up a sack. I think he should have, but I don't know what the protection really was. I wasn't in the meeting like I was when I was a player. So I think the only way for me to fairly evaluate these teams and present the matchup is a more analytical approach

because it's really all we have. And as I dove more into these trends and then I stand up there in the booth and I watch these games unfold, more often than not, what that data, what those analytics, what those reports laid out throughout the course of the week, more times than not is exactly how the game goes. It's exactly how the team plays early downs or the coverage or the blitz rate or whatever it is. It typically holds pretty strong. I can't measure how hard you're playing. I'm assuming everyone's playing hard. So for me, it's not a factor. That is how I've now approached the game the last five years.

And as I've approached it more like that, my understanding of the game and what I say actually happening on the field has gone up. I love the way you just broke the whole thing down. Who do you call games with? Joe Davis. Joe Davis. I got to tell you something, Joe.

I got to tell you something, Joe. New England losing that game a couple weeks ago versus the Buffalo Bills was the best thing to happen to this team because it has reignited and re-spart this momentum this team has going into the playoff. Love it. You know what I'm saying, Joe? If I did that as my on-the-hammer open,

would you guys shit your pants? Shit our pants. No, no, no, no, it's got to happen. It's got to happen in the game when the Patriots score. And then we'll be in the group chat. I'll say, say the line. And then I tell you what, Joe. Say it.

Say it. Say it. Say it. I love you. Say it back. I love you say it back. Yeah. What do you think Twitter would do?

What do you think the internet? How my mentions would be a dumpster fire? No, no, no. If I said the word momentum, how much would people love to shit on me? I think people that don't see this will shit on you for it. But the ones that do will love you forever for it. It'll be a turning point to where Greg now believes in momentum. In momentum.

In the spirit of the playoffs. Right. Just before 2026. He believes in San Angnics. Greg's love for the game and the passion of momentum. 2000 is my last story. You're leaving after this? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

We got it after this. He's been, we've had him. I don't know. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He's got to go. I'm going to go do it. I got to go sauna.

I've eaten guys. I don't even want to weigh in. Hey, 2026. Yeah. Give us your story. Give us your story. It's been a bad week.

A lot of late night cocktails. I've really gotten into espresso, Martini's. We talked about that. Hey coffee. Separate conversation. Anyway, 2015, we win our first 14 games. We're 14 and 0.

On Christmas morning, we're 14 and 0. That weekend, we play the Atlanta Falcons, who we had just two weeks prior. So in week 13, our 13th win, whatever week it was. In 13th win, we beat the Atlanta Falcons like 30 something to nothing.

Week 14, we win. Christmas. Our 15th game, so week 16, we go to Atlanta. We had just beat them by 30. We were 14 and 0. We had all the momentum. We're dabbing.

We're fighting people in Tennessee in the end zone. I mean, we are, right, your fans are sending letters to the Charlotte Observer because Cam's dabbing it. Like, we, you talk about emotion. and high energy and vibes. And you couldn't be a more vibe team than we were in 2015. We lose to Atlanta.

Ooh, got too much. We lose the undefeated seat. Cucky. Cockey. Cucky. We had too much momentum. Yeah. We lose to Atlanta in Atlanta.

Week 17, we come home. A lot of debate about whether or not we should play the starters. We locked up the one seed. We play. We beat the Tampa Bay Buff. at home to finish the regular season 15 and 1. Bye week. We have all the momentum.

Long story short, we beat Seattle. We were up 30 to nothing at halftime. Apparently, we left the momentum in the locker room. We had to recover an onside kick to win the game. We then beat the doors off of Arizona. We scored like 45. We were the number one offense in the league. We scored 30 plus against Seattle.

We scored 40 plus against the Cardinal. we scored 10 points in the Super Bowl. So a year that was momentum and energy and vibes and good feelings and locker room and we scored 10 points in the Super Bowl and lost. Really? Really brings you back. So my point is like along the ride, were we good because we were good

or were we good because we had vibes? Were we good because we had momentum? I just think we were good. and I think we won a lot of games that were close and we blew a lot of people out because we were good and Cam was the MVP and we had 10 pro bowlers so like was it momentum or were we just good and then all of a sudden

did we lose the momentum or did we just play shitty like I look back on the Super Bowl and I'm like we played shitty we didn't block Von Miller I ran the first third down too short I was a yard short caught the ball and we punted like did we lose the momentum I just think we played like shit and we lost so like That's my point.

Like I look at that year and I go, if the momentum was so high, why do we lose the Super Bowl? Yeah, man. Yeah, fair enough. Makes you really reevaluate. I do feel for you. I should have ran deeper on the first third down in the game. I ran a backside. I was so worried about edging.

I had like a edge backside dig. I was late in the progression. I'll never forget it. my rest of my life. That's why I have so many espresso martinis. And I gave like a quick little edge, but I probably, I got out fast enough that I could have gotten my depth. But they were playing like quarters and the safeties were real tight. I let them dictate. And it was like third and nine. I ran like a seven rolled to eight, something like that, caught it, got hit, short. Nowadays, you probably go for it. We punted and we fell behind by multiple scores and we just

never got going. So you didn't edge enough. And I'm or to just run a shitty route. You didn't edge enough to keep it going. Got to edge enough. You got to edge enough. You lost a spring point. Yeah.

Anytime I get close to edging, there's no way I can keep the edge. Same. I always lose the edge every time. I'm close to the edge. Yeah, yeah. Every single time. I get to the edge and I just jump off the edge. I always say to myself while I'm on the edge, I'm like, do I?

This is what is right? Shut down the edge and it's always like, finish. Well, now that I know once I have the momentum. It speaks up. Oh, it's already. It's gone. Well, now that I know that once I have the momentum, I don't want to get too far to the edge of momentum

because you told me that's cockiness. Yep. But then I also have to evaluate in real time where my sweet spot of momentum is because it's different for everybody. And then the last piece I've learned today was, even though momentum is the number one factor of success, there's no way to hold on to it.

At any moment, you have to hand it back. Well, you got to recalibrate. You can't fucking drink your own Kool-Aid. Right. You know what I mean? You can't think you're already dead. Like there's ways to recapture the momentum, which I would ask you when you lost the Falcons in week 15, was there a sense in the locker room like, hey, this is, once you beat the breaks off the next team,

you're like, hey, this loss is the best thing to happen to us. Can't just suit up on a Sunday. Yeah, we're about to go into playoff mode. We are, we remember that we're the Carolina Panthers. Maybe that was our momentum recheck. Well, I was just going to say, if you guys don't lose the Falcons, you're probably bumped out in your first game, division around. Fair.

Probably out. Because then you don't have a momentum change. check you got to have it just like the Patriots did we scored 30 in the first half right but we already talked about the half resets momentum so we scored 30 in the first half against Seattle and the divisional round because three weeks two weeks earlier we lost in Atlanta exactly yeah yeah you're starting to get it you're starting to come along I'm starting to get it because you remember you're going a half and you're like oh boys hey remember three weeks ago you might not say it out loud but subconsciously in the back of the brain that's where it's at and then you thought to

yourself, we're going to beat the Broncos because Peyton's got like a broken neck and this one will be easy. He can't do the ball more than 15 yards. Which? Cucky. So, yeah, well, that's a great point. So what I'm hearing is I need to do a better job connecting two completely irrelevant separate moments, tying them together.

How do we tie them together? Momentum. Yeah. Yeah. I didn't like the way you said irrelevant because it felt like you were demeaning the conversation. You know, you know what I'm saying irrelevant factors that are. stream on both ends. I'm saying the two,

I'm saying, when he was thinking, maybe we're getting over our skis right now, Greg, instead of standing up in the team meeting and be like, hey, don't smell your own shit.

Yeah. We could lose this game if we walk in here with this attitude. He chose to stay seated. Yep. You know what I mean? Yep. Yep. Just marinating in all his momentum,

which only turns into cocky. Yeah. And he's like, no, you know what? We thought we were going to beat the shit out of the Broncos. We got humbled. This is this is eye opening Hey before we get you out of here Greg

Give me one New Year's resolution I gotta get back I'm getting back in shape Yeah Every year we talk about it Six months Every year I think six years Every year I'm bust with the boys

It's get jacked But I'm not gonna get jacked I'm like sorry I'm I hope you guys get jacked I'd be so proud if you get jacked Here's how I look at it I for 14 years I busted my ass.

Like I took my training very seriously. What I ate and my training and I was super diligent and I was never jacked. So I have no like false notions now unless I got on like the sauce or something. I was going to say now you can get on steroids. I can start doing like peptide shit, which I think is like the craze. I got to like look into it a little bit more. Get in it, bro. So if I do come back jacked, I'm here on the record.

If one day you see me and you're like, holy shit, Olson's yoked. I 100% took some sort of assisted substance. Peptide. I'm not saying juice, but like, am I microdosing some peptides and some maybe? I'm not saying I. Have you gotten on testosterone yet?

No, I'm on hot dog beers and espresso martinis. Maybe look into some tea. You're not having any more kids, are you? That's the next conference. That's next week's conversation. Next week's combo, we'll talk about after the new year

what we're doing to get our vibes, right? But having said that, Like, I just want to get back to, like, middle baseline 41-year-old dad. Yeah. Like, I'm fine, taking my shirt off at the pool. No one's going to be like, wow, that guy's in great shape. But everyone's going to be like, yeah, I could see how he used to play pro ball. Like, he's a big guy.

Yeah. Yeah. That's what you want. I'm looking for that. I'm not looking to be a hero. Yeah. Well, the thing you have going for you already exquisite jawline. So in a t-shirt, you're already running the game.

The goal is not to look like a bodybuilder. The goal is to look in the mirror and not want to throw up. And be like, all right. Yeah. I can understand why she wants to sleep with me. And that's, and then, oh,

yeah, well, you would check this out. I'd be like, this can't be the reason. It's sure not me, check. Yeah.

It's not my body. Maybe it's just my personality now, you know? Well, it's not my humor. Yeah. It's not my body. Maybe I'm just a shitty dad.

The goal, yeah. The goal is to feel good about having sex with the lights on. Yeah. Because I'm at a point where I need to be pitch black. I've got to close the curtains. I got to close everything else.

Something to be said about the senses, though. You take away a sense. the other ones get stronger. Yeah. It's nice. You can't see shit. Yeah.

Just you're all over the map. Yeah. I'm in the world where I'm having sex with a t-shirt on. Yeah. Great show. Great show. Great show. In the last four months, this might be my favorite episode we've ever.

Oh, yeah. By far. By far. It's the end of the year, man. Nothing matters anymore. Nothing matters till Thursday. The year's resolution. We're getting back in shape.

We're not going to be heroes. Not going to be heroes. I think we can do it together. We got to hold each other accountable. Caterbillough buddies. I'm leaving this call, putting on my hoodie, my sweats. I'm going on the treadmill, incline walk, sauna. That's my afternoon.

That's a great Gilleson, everybody. We love it. Happy New Year's boys. Happy New Year's, bro. See you next week, man. See in the group chat. Yep. Will, set the group chat.

I'll set it up. I'll set it up right now. Set the group chat. Set the group chat. Dude. I don't want to tell him. I got to log his name. All right. Hey, what an episode, huh?

We don't make you still roll us. I saw you press some buttons. We're good. All right. Greg, by the way. That was my favorite episode we've ever done with him. Incredible. Guys, we are going to go and now shoot our best of episode for Bustle with the Boys that comes out tomorrow, which is Tuesday at 6 a.m.

Please check that out. All the boys will be on. We have a cool little setup in the back. We're not going to talk about it. You'll be able to see it on YouTube. But once again, you've stayed this long with us. Please subscribe. please comment. We really appreciate you. Incredible year it's been. Incredible year.

Cannot wait to make 2026 our bitch. And it's all thanks to you guys viewing the show. Big hugs, tiny kisses. 21 plus and present in select states. For Kansas in affiliation with Kansas Star Casino or 18 plus and present in DC. Opt-in required. Bonus issued as non-withdrawable profit boost tokens. Restrictions apply, including any token expiration and max wager amount. See terms at Sportsbook.Fanduel.com. Gambling problem? Call 1-800 gambler or visit RG-Hash-Help.com. Call 1-888-889-7777 or visit CCPGGGT and

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or call 1877-8 Hope NY or text Hope NY in New York. Hey, guys, it's us. The Jonas Brothers. I'm Joe. I'm Kevin. And I'm Nick. And guess what? We created our own podcast called, Hey, Jonas. We invented a podcast? Well, we didn't invent it. We just contributed to it. We're the first people to do podcasts.

We get to ask other people questions because we're sick and tired of being asked questions. Well, sick and tired is a strong way to put it, but, you know, tired and sick. Listen to Hey Jonas on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Just listen. We don't care where you hear it. Another podcast from some SNL late night comedy guy,

not quite. Unhumor me with Robert Smigel and friends. Me and hilarious guests from Bob Odenkirk to David Letterman help make you funnier. This week, my guest, SNL's Mikey Day and headwriter Streeter Seidel help an a cappella band with their between songs banter. Where does your group perform?

We do some retirement homes. Those people are starving for banter. Listen to humor me with Robert Smigel and friends on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The story I've told myself can then shape my behavior and that can lead me to sabotage the possibility of connection. This Mental Health Awareness Month, Tune into the podcast Deeply Well with Debbie Brown

if you've been searching for a soft place to land while doing the work to become whole. This podcast is for you to hear more. Listen to Deeply Well with Debbie Brown from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.