Call Her Daddy - Anna Kendrick: Pitch Perfect, Twilight & Relationships

Episode Date: October 23, 2024

Join Alex in the studio for an interview with Anna Kendrick. Anna discusses her iconic Pitch Perfect audition, how she low key forgot she was in Twilight, and how she survived an emotionally abusive and toxic relationship. She opens up about gaslighting, victim blaming, and learning to trust yourself again.

What is up, daddy gang? It is your founding father, Alex Cooper with Call Her Daddy. Anna Kendrick, welcome to Call Her Daddy. Hi. I'm so happy we're doing this. Me too. We've never met. Wait, is it tacky?

Should I get rid of my phone? Only you can put on silent. Yeah, no, I think it's totally on whatever. It's not tacky. But no, I'll just get it off of. OK, OK, OK. Sorry. Just in case you get an important call. way. Okay, okay, okay. Sorry.

Just in case you get like an important call. No. Who would be calling you? No one. No one. That's fine. Are you a big texter? Oh yeah, I'm always like,

if you need to get ahold of me, like you're gonna have to text me. If you want an email back, you're gonna have to wait like two weeks. You might as well send me a postcard in the mail. I'm so bad on my email. Are you one of those people though that has like a thousand plus emails

or are you like deleting? I think it was, you know that, okay, so you know that this is not interesting, but you know that period between Christmas and New Year's where you're like, where are we? And like time has no meaning. I was like, I'm gonna clean out my email inbox because I did have one of those,

cause it was like, well, what else are we doing? And I am one of those people because it was like, what else are we doing? Right, right. And I am one of those people, and I hate that about me. It's okay. That I'm one of those people that has like, two thousand and one hundred and a half of her. I have the same thing. And if anyone calls me, I immediately don't answer.

Well, I'm like, did someone die? This is bad news, this is terrible news. I don't like confrontation. No, I don't like communication, people, I don't know. No, that's not true, mostly. But, yeah, no, yeah, you have to text know. No, that's not true. Mostly, but yeah, no, yeah. You have to text me. Okay. Obviously like being an actress now,

like obviously director, but like, what is your like day off? Like, what are you up to when you're not working? I'm trying to get mint to grow in my garden. I'm trying to, I'm trying to really like be a homemaker, not a homemaker. That's not what I mean. I mean, I'm trying to really be a homemaker, not a homemaker, that's not what I mean. I mean, I'm trying to do something physical and tangible that I can go like, wow, and I grew this mint,

and now I'm putting it in a cocktail, because that's as close as I'm ever gonna get to cooking. And I don't know, there's something about devoting your entire life to this very weird thing of pretending to be another person and crying on cue in front of a room full of people you met three days ago and whatever, that you're like, I don't make anything physical.

You know what I mean? So I feel like I'm always trying to find, I should really take up knitting or something. I just wanna make something that I can hold and go like, I made this. Okay. To give you a little bit more credit, you are making something that, I mean like- I mean, it's not like it's not real,

but there is just something like fleeting about it or, I don't know. Are you having an existential crisis right now? Always, constantly. This whole episode is us just trying to figure out like, what is the meaning of being an actor in life. No, but I get what you're saying. You're like, I want something tangible, AKA mint.

It's a little odd that mint is the one thing in your garden. It goes in a lot of cocktails. What, are you making good cocktails? I'm trying, yeah. When I moved, I was like, I wanna be able to have people over and be able to offer them a refreshment But like I'm never gonna cook and that's never gonna happen. Okay, pretend I come over. What are you making me for a drink? Um, well, do you have like a specific I like tequila and vodka? So I'm kind of like I can go either way

I like a Moscow mule. I like a margarita. Moscow meals are super super easy. So we love that. Okay But there's like a watermelon vodka cocktail that I like. I also feel like people tend to come over and say that they drink anything but gin. But gin makes great cocktails. Like drinking gin straight is for crazy people. I don't know what that's about. But it makes really great cocktails,

especially if you want to serve something up. And also, if you want to commit to doing an egg white foam, it's really great cocktails, especially if you want to serve something up. And also if you want to commit to doing an egg white foam, it gets, it's really easy. And people are absolutely blown away that you've created something that has a foam on it. I'm blown away already. Wait, an egg white foam? Yeah. The key is doing a dry shake in your shaker with the egg white before you add ice. And then it will really, and then you add all the other ingredients before you add ice. And then it will really, and then you add all the other ingredients and then add ice and then it will actually like stay foamy.

And you know, just put a little like sprig of lavender or something on top. And like people are like, oh my God, how did you do this? Me, I'm the dumb bitch that's like, whoa, Anna. Well then that's what I would make for you. So then so that you would find me impressive. Yeah. That's okay. That's good to know.

What is one thing you can't leave the house without? Oh God, probably chapstick. Like I'm one of those people that I have like a drawer full of chapsticks and yeah. Same. And I like all the different flavors and the different. Oh yeah, what's your go-to? I really like the Burt's Bees.

There's like a pomegranate one. Are you fucking with me? What? No, you're fucking with me. No, what? People are laughing. What's happening? No, you fucking talk to someone.

Are you doing a bit? On my life, on my dad's soul. No, absolutely, wait, what is happening? Anna. You are not about to do that to me right now. You don't understand. That's sick. No, you don't get it.

I might have it in my fanny pack. I'm not joking. You brought a fanny pack. You know what? I'm doing a lot right now. Don't make fun of my fanny pack. First of all. That's it.

Now I feel like you're fucking with me. No. That's crazy. Okay. I have a bowl. I feel like you just, I feel like you're like the mentalist. Like you're Chris angel and you're like, you mean this pomegranate lipstick? Whichever one you said, you're like road lipstick.

I'm like, boom. Cause I also like the sweet violet, but I was like, well, that's not really, I guess that's a tinted lip balm. I don't know, that's something else. So I was like pomegranate. I like the pomegranate too, cause it gives you that a little bit of a tint.

The tiniest tint, yeah. I, wait, I'm not kidding you, I thought you were doing a bit. No! Where you were like fucking with me. Wait, have you like talked, am I an idiot? Have you like- No, no. Everyone that like really, really knows me,

like you know the Arthur meme where he's like got the fist? Yeah. I always have this in, and anywhere you look, like any interview I'm doing, I have it somewhere in my body and I have an entire bowl in my house and every single sweat pant- You have a bowl? I have a bowl in my house of all the pomegranate next to my bathroom sink.

And I just pick one up every day and I open a new one and I use it until I lose it. And then I go back, I love it. This is weird. This is weird. I don't like it, creepy. It's really creepy, but I think the reason I love ChapStick so much

is because I have this feeling. It's like the ick of myself is if I don't have my lips somewhat moisturized, I feel like that goes and is almost contingent with having bad breath. Like I feel like when you see someone with chapped lips, you're like, they must have bad breath. Oh yeah. I don't know.

No, I think that, yeah, I haven't thought about it, but subconsciously, yeah, you are. Yeah, you're like, I'm just gonna lean away. Okay, so you're a chapstick girl. Yeah. Good to know, so you probably have good breath. Haven't gotten close enough to you today, but we'll see you later.

What is the most high maintenance thing about you? Probably my hair. Cause I'm like a secret curly. What? I'm like a secret, like Carrie Russell in Felicity level curly. You have gorgeous hair. Well, you know, it's not really what my hair looks like.

Yeah, and I've been like, I haven't like, I started, I was on like a natural, like, you know, curly hair journey. Like I let my therapist see me with my like real hair. Oh, that's big. Big steps. And like two of my best friends in my house have like come over and I'm like, I should let you know that I have let my hair dry naturally

and I'm in a very vulnerable place. Cause it was one of those things that I always felt like messy because I think like when I really started to be like, oh, I need to like start learning how to like blow out my hair and whatever, was when like pin straight hair was it. It was when like tiny butts and super straight hair was the height of female attractiveness.

So I just felt like, yeah, I don't know, almost like the chapelep things where I was just constantly like doing that, you know, just trying to like make my hair be flat. And when it would get frizzy if I would go to a concert, whatever, I would just be freaking out about it, humiliated. But you're like, I have to leave,

I have to leave the concert. I can't even say. And I was thinking about all the fucking energy and time that I think we all spend without even thinking about it, about like, okay, well, okay, if I wash my hair at this time and then how long is it gonna take to do my blowout? And if I shave my legs on this day, I'll have stubble for that, well, but,

like, and just, it's always just running in the background. It's exhausting. It's so exhausting and it's so dumb because we notice so much more about ourselves. Like, I bet if you had your curly hair here, I'd be like, oh, I love your curly hair. What did your therapist say to you when, did you do like a big reveal of like, I'm if you had your curly hair here, I'd be like, oh, I love your curly hair. Wait, what did your therapist say to you?

Did you do like a big reveal of like, I'm gonna show you now? Was it on Zoom or in person? It was on Zoom. Oh. And I think it was like, I was still like, this is so boring, but I was still like self-conscious about it, so I pulled back, like, you know,

I did like a half up half down thing. And so she was sort of like, oh, where are you going? Like that it was, you know, that it was like, you know, I did like a half up, half down thing. And so she was sort of like, oh, where are you going? Like that it was, you know, that it was like, it just looked different. Cause I usually just like wear it in like a bun and a headband. So I think she thought that I was like going somewhere. So I was like, well, that's, that's encouraging.

She wasn't like, what happened? But yeah, I'm still like, I'm still on a journey. Well, you know what? We're going to support you on that journey. Your hair looks amazing today, but I bet it would also look amazing if it was curly. Anyways, you've been making movies for two decades. What do you think you would be doing if you hadn't pursued

acting? Oh, god. God help me. I don't know what. I really don't. I mean, I feel like obviously I don't know what, I really don't. I mean, I feel like, obviously I didn't get into show business because I hate attention. So there's that piece.

Like, when people ask me that question, I feel like I'll usually just say like, oh, I'd have a bakery or something. But like, I don't know, I would be so screwed. Like, I actually remember when I was 17, 18, whenever I moved to LA, I was really, really jealous of all my friends that were going to college.

Number one, because they felt really insecure about not going to college. I have a whole complex about it. But I was also on the phone hearing about this exciting new chapter that was laid out for them. And going to classes and joining a sorority and having this immediate community. And I was in LA.

I was 17 or 18. It's really hard to make friends in LA because of like the way the city is laid out but especially when you don't have a fake ID and even if I did I looked about 12 so that wasn't gonna work anyway and I was just like absolutely terrified and really wondering if I was like making a huge mistake. And then the weirdest thing was that when everybody entered their sophomore year, I was still like just, you know,

trying to get in the door and all of that. But I then noticed that when I would get on the phone with friends of mine who were in college, they were suddenly, all of them, sophomore year, having a total crisis. Because freshman year was like, this is so exciting and there's this new chapter and my whole life is ahead of me

and I'm making these friends. And in sophomore year, it felt like, okay, I'm back with the same people and that's great. And I'm picking my classes for this year and that's great. But what do I wanna do with my life? There's no longer just the excitement of like, oh my God, frat parties and the college experience. It's like, oh, I have to figure out what I want.

And so even though the thing that I wanted felt like a total pipe dream and like, what am I doing? This is a disaster. It's so hard to carve out a space for yourself in this industry. But on the other side of it, holy shit, I did not think, like, what a blessing

to just know what I want. And I was like watching all my friends go, oh my God, I don't know what I want, what to do. It's so interesting, like, cause I went to college and I remember from a young age, I like knew I wanted to be in Hollywood. Like I knew I wanted to create, I knew I wanted to do something in this industry,

but my mom kept just being like, no, you have to do school, you have to do school and then you can do it later. And I resented that so much for a while, but hearing like the difference, again, everyone wants what they don't have, of being in college wishing, by sophomore year, I was like, get me the fuck out of here. I know exactly what I wanna do.

But you being watching all of the kids in college and you being like, that was a big insecurity of mine. Why was it an insecurity though? Because you were like, I don't have an education technically of- Interesting. Totally, totally. So I think I don't have an education technically of interesting. Totally, totally. So I think my family really values traditional education

for good reasons, bad reasons, whatever. And so I was like the first person to not go to college. And my dad was a teacher and everything. So it was like very black sheep behavior to not go to college. Were they okay with you not going to college? Yeah, I mean, I think they knew I was gonna do what I wanted to do,

but I think there was always that sense of like, well, if things maybe don't work out that first year, it's not too late to just, you know, so I think that was always like something that they had in mind, but I don't think they were thrilled, which is understandable. But yeah, I then just worried about,

oh my god, I didn't go to college. I don't know. I get it. I think it's in a great way. I do think the concept of education now is becoming a little bit more lenient, where people are like, you don't need to go to college to be X, Y, Z. And it's interesting because you were on the right path,

but because of societal standards of like, if you're smart, you go to college. It probably felt so disorienting when you're watching all these people do the natural next step. Really, you just skipped a big step and then you got ahead on your career. But it doesn't mean you can't still feel insecure about it

of like in conversation having to be like, oh, I didn't go to college. Like I get that, especially if your family was like, go school, go school and your dad being a teacher. Totally. And I think now that I'm like older, it's less of a thing, but like early twenties, you know, that's like part of the conversation is like,

oh, where'd you go to college? Yes. I didn't like how, oh my God, I have to say I didn't. And by that, at that point, like, you know, like 21, 22, I didn't really have much to show for it yet. You know, like then some things happened and, you know, it was less of an issue, but you're like, oh, I didn't go to college

because I wanted to become an actor. And it's like, how's that going? Well, you know, I think I got a, someone's, I'm hearing my phone ring, so yeah. Right, they're like, how's that going? Well, you know, I think I got a, someone's, I'm hearing my phone ring, so yeah. Right, they're like, what are you in? And you're like, be back soon, gotta go. I get that. Talking about your family though,

you were raised in Maine, right? Born and raised in Maine. What were you like as a kid? I think I was really like hyper vigilant. Like I was really in everybody's business a little bit. But I think that I was even thinking like a couple weeks ago about how I do. One of my many toxic traits is I do kind of walk around with like a little bit of a, all right, who's trying to fuck me over? You know, and I was like, I don't know.

There's a chance that it's like, oh, you're spelling bedtime? You think I don't know what's happening here? I don't know. Just being real aggressive about how I wanted things done and very opinionated. But I can't really tell if that comes from childhood or from like working in an industry where I'm sure you've experienced,

it's like you agree to certain things and then it's like, oh, and can we also do this thing that would be really humiliating for you and not like pay you any extra money or check with you in advance and ask you in front of a group of people. So if you say no, you'll look like a bitch. So I'm just always like, all right,

who in this room is trying to fuck me over? That's so interesting that you're like, did that happen when I was younger? Or is it just like something I can't not remember? Because you started in the industry at what? Like 10, you started really getting into it? Yeah, I started kind of auditioning for things when I was 10 and I booked my first gig when I was 12.

But I mean, I wasn't auditioning all the time because I lived in Maine. And so either one of my parents had to drive me to New York City for a 15-minute audition. And they were like, well, sweetie, we love you, but Jesus. So eventually my brother and I would take a Greyhound bus from Maine to New York. And that's one of the situations where we were in that I auditioned for this show that I ended up getting.

And we were in New York and they asked me, are you cool to like stay for a call back tomorrow? And I was always just told, well, just say yes. You'll figure it out later. So I was like, absolutely. I will see you tomorrow. No problem. And my brother and I then are just like, OK,

we need to find a hotel in New York City. Anna, what are you 11? I'm 12. He's 13 or 14. So we found a hotel, and my parents called the hotel and faxed a credit card and told them, yes, yes, we'll be along shortly. And they're in Maine.

And so I wash my underwear in the sink and then just put on this. I mean, luckily, there like a thing where if you get a call back it's kind of conventional wisdom that you should wear the same thing. So that didn't seem like I was the gross kid with one pair of clothes. Same underwear.

But so then the next day the same thing happened and again it was like no problem I will see you again in the morning and had to do it again. And then they, oh, that's right. They did ask me, because I was wearing combat boots, and they were like, can you, because the part was for like a little rich girl. So they were like, could you wear something like,

you know, we'd just love to see you in more of a kind of Sunday best outfit. And specifically, someone mentioned my shoes. So I was wearing this like ratty cardigan and like ripped jeans and these combat boots. But I was like, ah, the solution will be to go to the nearest payless and find like white church strappy sandals. And so like with like the last twenty dollars that we had, I like bought this pairppy sandals. And so like with like the last $20 that we had, I like bought this pair of sandals, like dress sandals and wore those with my ratty cardigan and jeans.

And then like wandered in and I think they were just like, oh, for fuck's sake, yeah, fine, whatever, great. And then we were on a Greyhound bus home and we had this phone for emergencies, and that rang. And it was like, hey, you're going to be on Broadway. I'm trying to picture 12-year-old me walking around in New York City with my brother, who's two years older than me.

I'm like, how the hell were you not even scared? I think that we just thought it was such an adventure. And I think we also like wanted to be like cool New York City kids so fucking bad that we were just like, yeah, this is so normal. I can't remember if we were like low key freaking out or not but we, I know that, I mean, even when I went there at 17, I did this show at New York City Opera

and I remember like riding the subway to work and seeing like, oh my God, you know you see those gorgeous girls who are like going to American ballet? Yes. And being like, and like looking at them and being like, we're really doing it. Oh my God, I'm in New York and I'm going to work

and I'm going to work on the subway. And it's like not a big deal at all, which if you're thinking about it like that, it's a huge fucking deal to you. I had no chill, but that was the vibe. But that's sweet. Yeah. Okay, all of this is happening.

I know that you were nominated for a Tony award when you were just 12, so it came from that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay, what did kids in school think? It's weird. Again, like I don't know if you've experienced something like this, but there were several moments where it felt like if I mentioned anything to the kids at school, they don't

get me wrong, understandably sort of thought I was like talking about something else. Like, like, like in the same way that if someone in my school, in like middle school or high school had been like, oh yeah, I'm going to Olympic trials. I would be like, so is there some kind of like local, like, oh, it's the Olympics. You know what I mean? Like, I would just be like, no, you're not.

Like, cause that just doesn't make sense. Cause we're from Maine. Like, what are you talking about? I remember having like a really little indie film in the Sundance Film Festival when I was 16, 17, and going to Sundance. And I remember one of my close friends, one of my, like, best friends called me and was like, that's so weird.

There's something on the news about, I think it was, I could be getting this mixed up, but I think it was like the year that Britney Spears and like Fred Durst went to Sundance together. There's something, maybe I'm hallucinating, it was some other story, I don't know. But she called me and she was like, yeah, they're at like the Sundance Film Festival. And isn't that so weird because you were just saying

that you're doing something called Sundance, but it's like happening at the same time. And I was like, I'm at Sundance. I'm at the Sundance, I'm at the Sundance film. That's why I was so fucking excited about it. Right, you're like, I'm here with Britney Spears. Yes, and like she was like a close friend. So I think like there's an understandable thing

that happens where you're just like, not you, not from here. They just didn't get it. They didn't get it. So, and you didn't talk about it over the top where like people would even have a concept of it? No, no, I mean, even, I think there was a, a luckily very brief window where it was kind of like a teasing situation.

So it was like, I knew better than to be like running my mouth about it too much. Cause people would make fun of you. Yeah. Isn't that so weird? Meanwhile, it's like everyone than to be running my mouth about it too much. Because people would make fun of you. Yeah. Isn't that so weird? Meanwhile, it's like everyone wants to be a movie star. I don't know. I think just drawing any attention to yourself in middle,

like particularly this was like in middle school, like right after I did the Broadway show. It's like, you just want to disappear. Like I think people talk about high school as being cutthroat. Middle school was so much scarier to me. It was so horrible. I completely agree.

High school is actually like, I started to get my shit together. Middle school, I was terrified. Yeah, I remember feeling like, just like trying to be like a moving pile of laundry. You know, just wearing like the biggest clothes and just trying so fucking hard not to draw any attention to yourself.

Yes, so you obviously start to become so successful. Was your family like, oh, this is normal? I found some success. And then I think this is pretty typical for entertainment stuff that the money really follows several years later. There's that period where you're like, okay, I'm like low key a little famous, but I am so fucking broke.

It would make you tear up how broke I am. So you're kind of trying to fake it till you make it. But like I had brought my family to the Oscars and you know, there was a really interesting moment a few years later when I like bought my first place and I had them at my place and it was like, you could feel the energy particularly for my mom and dad of like, oh, okay, okay, okay.

And it wasn't a mansion, but it was just like, oh, okay, okay, okay. And it wasn't a mansion, but it was just like, oh, you're gonna be okay. Cause they were obviously like very proud and but there's things with like awards and reviews where that's great, but it's still really abstract. And to just see something solid where it was like, okay, our crazy daughter who didn't go to college has managed to buy a home.

It was like, I could feel not so much like pride, but that they were actually like, oh, you made it. Okay, okay, okay. It all worked out. We don't have to worry about now her going back to college and trying to figure out something else. Completely, she's not gonna move in with us and drain us dry.

Love. Love. You've been in so many great movies. I want to talk to you about a few of them today. We got to start with Pitch Perfect, obviously. What was that audition process like? Well, you know, I think that the most interesting piece or the piece that has certainly followed me around is when I auditioned, they needed you to just like prove that you could sing. And I was like, well, I know how to do this thing. There's a cup and there's this song and I could do that. So it was just cause I was like, well,

where else am I gonna do it? Cause I was like lame enough and dorky enough to have bothered like learning this thing. And so I did it for my audition, and they were like, we should put that in the movie. And originally in the script, like, Becca, my character's audition song, was I'm a Little Teacup,

which I keep meaning to ask the writer, Kay Cannon, like, was that meant to be, like, funny? How would that have worked? How was I supposed to play that? I don't know what I was supposed to do. Was I supposed to do like a Christina Aguilera version of I'm a Little Teacup? Or was it supposed to be like,

like, oh, I like resent that I have to do this and, you know, but I sound fine. So don't let me in the group. How do you think you would have done it? I guess like that. I mean, I would have been relying on somebody to tell me like what the vibe was supposed to be. But luckily I didn't have to figure that out.

So they were like, well, let's do that for Becca's audition. And I was like, great, making use of a useless skill. And then people when they saw the movie, like would ask about it and stuff. And so then the studio was like, we should release this as a single. And I was like, what are you the studio was like, we should release this as a single. And I was like, what are you fucking stupid? We're releasing this as a single?

That's so embarrassing. I'm so embarrassed for us. So they had me go into the studio for 20 minutes, a hit that was made in 20 minutes, and just sing the rest of the song. And I was in there with a stool and a cup doing the cup in this weird studio and then they were like what if we did a music video and again I was like are we what's going on this is so you guys I'm so embarrassed for you like I just was like

there's no way anybody would care about this like I whatever um. And so we make this music video. And then it like, which is, by the way, why am I saying this phrase? Why is this phrase coming out of my mouth? It started climbing the charts. Why is this a part of my story and my life? I was just like, what is fucking happening? This is so out of the realm of anything

that's supposed to be happening. And I always thought, like, because I was in the middle of making this like indie film and I'd be getting like texts from people going like, it just like got into the top 10 of like billboards, top 100. And I was like in the basement of some church, like shooting this tiny little indie film. Meanwhile, I think it was like, I think it was speaking in the basement of some church, like shooting this tiny little indie film. Meanwhile, I think it was like,

I think it was, speaking of the times, Miley Cyrus and Macklemore was like also in the top 10. And so I always just think like, they must've been like, what the fuck is this shit? Like, who is this girl? What is this? How dare you? I'm out here like busting my ass on good morning America putting on a live performance and this like freak show

Whatever this fucking is is in the top 10. How dare I what on earth? Anna I would hate me I would hate me Did you ever learn to be like damn that shit's good. They did send me a platinum record That was pretty cool. Bye bitch, that's literally perfect. You're like, I guess it was kind of good. Oh, I guess when I got my platinum record though. That was a good day.

That's insane. That you're like, this is so fucking embarrassing you guys. And meanwhile, it's like the entire world learned this shit. I remember trying to learn it, Anna. Okay. No, you did not. Oh, I tried. Of course I did. Everyone at that, that, that, that, that, that, that. Oh, I tried. Of course I did. Everyone.

Oh, I tried. I couldn't really do it. You shot your face. You fucking invented it. It's so crazy that you brought that to the movie and they were like, yes. Okay. I just realized also while you were talking,

which is fun is I have had on you, Brittany Snow, Adam Devine, and I have had on Rebel. I have almost had like the entire cast on. You're like collecting all the Pokemon. Yeah, yeah, I'm kind of having a good time. How would you describe your guys friendship on that cast? Honestly, I use this word in the truest sense of, like we are a family, like truly in the sense of like,

we didn't choose each other. Like we didn't ask to be in each other's lives in this way. And we're so bonded. And it does feel, there's something really, not to be lame, there's something really magic about it, because so often like you'll do a big job and they'll be like one or two people maybe that you keep in touch with.

And they're the people that are like the most similar to you. And we're all really, really different. And after like three movies, you're like, I think this is like a not getting rid of each other kind of situation. I think the entire world is happy. It's a not getting rid of each other situation. And also I think that I'm very avoidant.

So like actually like cracking that shell and like being in my life, like it takes some persistence. So like Brittany's always joking that her, she's like, well, your phone is all white or whatever the, you know, the blue text. Yeah, you get it, you get it. Cause she's like always texting me and just being like, I know you're not gonna reply, but you know,

I think that I'm kind of like, certainly the curmudgeon of the group, but it is like almost like everybody has a role. And you know, like, you know, Brittany kind of like brings the party and I bring the grumpiness, I guess, I don't know. But I am like, it's really interesting because even the girls that are not like

one of the closest girls, like when they're going through something, I get the call and it makes me feel so good because I do feel like that's kind of my role in the group is like, if you're in jail, like my shoes are on, we're getting you out tonight, I don't know how, but we're gonna figure it out. Whereas like, if you need help with like party invitations,

like I'm gonna freeze up and be like, I don't know, I don't know, I don't know what to do, I don't know, I have to leave the room right now. Call Brittany. Yeah, call Brittany, please call Brittany. It's so fun to know that you and Brittany Snow are so close because it, I don't know, it like sets something right in the world.

Like I like that you guys are friends. I think it also is nice because obviously as like consumers, we know that sometimes on movie sets, like people don't get along and there's something oddly satisfying about how amazing those movies are and knowing you guys are so close, like it's just a fun thing for fans. I know, it makes me really happy.

I saw some of the girls from the movie, the original, the craft, having dinner once and I was like, you guys are friends of real life. It makes you happy. Oh my God, it made me so fucking happy. So I would be like, oh, I wouldn't think anyone would like care. We care.

But seeing the craft girls, I was like, this is so beautiful. It means so much to me. So now when people are crying, when they see you guys out together, you get it. Totally. Are we getting a fourth one? Oh, I have no idea.

I'm always like, I'm always like, Rebel is kind of like the steam train of the group. Come on Rebel. Like she's always like, I think we should do it. And I'm like, well then great. We should, I agree. I'm just here for, I'll just be back like, I think we should do it. And I'm like, well, then great. We should, I agree. I'm just here for, I'll just be back up, I guess. We need it.

I would love that because like we're all so busy and I'm so happy that everybody's so like busy and successful and like doing so much that actually getting like whatever, you know, the 10 of us in a room is like impossible. So it's usually like maybe six of us at a time, trying to like have a little reunion. So it does feel like the thing that would actually

get us all in a room again is like the movies. So that's my best reason. I will watch. So let us know. Twilight. Can you believe? Can you believe? I mean, what? Okay, so someone was just asking me

about like a while ago, I had, you know, done a silly funny tweet where I just said like, Holy shit, I just remembered I was in Twilight. And people were like, you didn't like forget you didn't forget that you were in Twilight. And the answer is truly, truly yes and no, because obviously, obviously, I didn't forget the experience of making the movies I didn't forget that you were in Twilight. And the answer is truly, truly yes and no. Cause obviously, obviously I didn't forget the experience of making the movies, I didn't, you know. But those movies, like especially at the time took on such a life of their own. And like they were such a kind of like,

for better or for worse, like a kind of touchstone. Like such a reference that, you know, everybody would talk about like trying to find the next Twilight or whatever. And I would find myself in like business conversations talking about, oh yeah, I've heard that there's a book series that just got optioned, that maybe you wanna try and make it the next Twilight.

And then I would be like, oh my God, I'm in the movie. Oh my God. Because I was also so on the, just on the outside. Had a front row seat, but was just on the outside of the madness of it. And I was really lucky to not be dealing with the eye of the storm, really. I think that a lot of the folks that were in the movie,

even in the later movies where they are playing like, as long as you were a supernatural character, if you had one line, you couldn't leave your hotel room. People were crazy and people were criticizing like, oh, but she has green eyes in the book or whatever. And I just didn't have to deal with any of that. So it almost feels like I didn't't have to deal with any of that. So, so on the, it's almost feels like I didn't really have to run the gauntlet

that some of the other, I mean, most of the other people did. I just had to like show up and say dumb, funny shit and just be like, what are you guys talking about? And the kids are fucking acting weird. Okay. Everybody's really serious, bye. Like that was the, that was the gig. It was awesome. Jessica. Oh my fucking God, Jessica. Being that was the gig, it was awesome.

Jessica, oh my fucking God, Jessica. Being like, what's so great about Bella? Like I don't get it, like what's going on with Bella? Which is also crazy because when I auditioned for that, I was like, yeah, I think in the book, she's like the blonde, athletic, volleyball, captain, popular girl. So I was like, well, great, I'm not getting this job.

And the goal then becomes like, well, I hope I just like making an impression on the casting director and the director so that maybe they'll remember me for something else. And so I was like, well, I'm just gonna like try to be like weird and funny, cause I don't know. And then they were like, oh great, yeah, let's do that. So there I am with like my, with my headband

because like in that humid weather, they didn't know what to do with my headband, because in that humid weather, they didn't know what to do with my hair, full circle. They were like, it just keeps getting bigger. So it was always in a headband or pulled back really tight. And in my ratty little costume, five inches shorter than Kristen going, I don't even get what the point is. Meanwhile, she's so stunning. real, like you're like,

oh my God, I'm staring into the eyes of like a Siberian husky. She's so gorgeous. I mean, she's gorgeous on screen, but like in person, have you met her in person? No. There's a quality, let me tell you. Really? Oh my God, it's breathtaking.

And she's obviously very beautiful. And sometimes you meet certain people and you're like, what, how dare you? Right. Why are you why are you doing this to me? Oh my god So, you know the audacity of me to be like, I don't see I don't see it. I don't get it Right, you're like the right way, right? Were you ever like I'm being annoying like or you're like, it's fine. It's my role Yeah, I guess it was like I'm being annoying which means like you're doing your job You're doing your job. You're job. I'm obsessed with you being like they Yeah, I guess it was like I'm being annoying, which means like, I'm doing what I'm supposed to be doing.

You're doing your job. I'm obsessed with you being like, they trying to put my hair down and I'm like, I don't know what to do. It all comes real circle. Okay, next movie, Alice Darling. This is like obviously a bigger shift and is a basically is about a woman

in an emotionally abusive relationship. When you're taking on a more intense role, like do you hesitate in those moments or do you enjoy those type of moments that are a little bit darker? It was, oh gosh, that's weird. I'm about to use a phrase that I've been using in reference to directing.

So, but it kind of makes sense because it's a similar thing where it was like pushing myself off of a cliff and not giving myself the time to go, is this a good choice? Cause it was like, it was really scary and personal. And God, I'm just remembering like,

I remember I didn't tell, I haven't thought about this in a while, I didn't tell anybody in my life, not my like, well this was also kind of COVID-y so I wasn't talking to that many people. So again, I'm bringing out my therapist, but I didn't tell my therapist, I didn't tell like my closest friends

that I was making this movie about emotional abuse because I had just gotten out of a relationship that was extremely similar to the movie. And I didn't want anybody to tell me to not do it. Like I didn't want to get talked out of it. And I knew that there were good reasons for my friends and certainly my therapist to be like, is this the best idea for you? Like right now?

So I just kept telling them it's about like three friends in a cabin and like it's about like their relationships, which in a way it is, but yeah, I like didn't, even when after the movie was wrapped, whatever, like they didn't even know that it was about emotional abuse until like the trailer came out. Cause I just didn't want somebody to tell me, well, I don't know, maybe this is the childhood thing of Because I just didn't want somebody to tell me, well, I don't know, maybe this is the childhood thing of,

I don't want you to tell me it's bedtime, I need to do this, I'm gonna do this. Can I ask how long did that abusive relationship that you endured last? It was, it didn't follow the traditional pattern, which is kind of yet another reason why I was finding it really difficult to identify it and name it as abusive.

Cause I was like reading all the articles and going like, this doesn't look like, some of it looks like how they're describing it, but not completely. And so the relationship was seven years, but it was like an overnight switch, and that went on for about a year. So it didn't follow that more traditional, like it's like a frog in boiling water thing

where it started slow. It came out of absolutely nowhere, but was built on this foundation of, I had so much love and trust for that person. So I thought it had to be me. Like I, if one of us is crazy, it must be me. So it was very, very difficult to actually go, no, I think this is him.

I think this is his stuff. Cause I turned my life completely upside down trying to fix whatever was wrong with me. And it didn't help that for a long period of time, our couples therapist, I think, just bought his stuff, kind of hook, line, and sinker. And I've had several sessions with him in the last several years where he's apologized to me

because I think he realized what was going on like right toward the end. But yeah, that obviously made everything a lot more complicated. We always have to remember like therapists are human beings too. And a lot of times they don't know the inner dynamics. And if you are with a very manipulative person though,

that is good in crowds, like they can mask it pretty easily and you can be kind of painted to be the person that's like insane or you're unreasonable or you're like unwilling to make the relationship work. And when you have a licensed person staring at you next to the person that is abusive. Cause we project so much authority onto them, even though we kind of know intellectually, well, they're just people.

It's like, I just want, and it was also, I just want someone to tell me what's happening. I wasn't even thinking like, we're gonna go into couples therapy and he's gonna, you know, ream you out. And it's gonna, I was just like, will someone just explain to me what's going on? So, yeah, it was just like, will someone just explain to me what's going on? So yeah, it was full on, but it was also interesting

that I always felt like I was trying to stay so calm in couples therapy because I was like, fuck, in these sessions, he's so able to kind of stay calm in a way that he does not do when we're outside of therapy. And then there was a day again, toward the end where I really kind of like lost my shit. And I did think like, oh my God, like what have I done? Like, what have I done?

Like I can't, it's gonna be so bad now. Like what did I do? And- What do you mean? What do you mean it's gonna be so bad? Like if things, when I'm trying so hard to like appease this person, they're so fucking awful. So how bad is it gonna get now that I've like yelled it?

You know, and I sent after that session, first of all, weirdly he was fine, which was very weird, very interesting. Cause I think he felt like maybe a little bit like calm because he was like, see, you're fucking crazy. So it was weirdly fine, but I sent the therapist an email being like, I'm so embarrassed, I'm so sorry,

I need to control myself or whatever because I had yelled in this session. And he called me, which he hadn't done before and was like, no, no, I'm so proud of you. And that's when I knew like, oh, something has shifted. Like something's changed. And then, yeah, things ended pretty quickly after that. I mean, I appreciate you sharing this

just because I have so many women that listen that are like, what are the signs? And like, I appreciate you how you opened the conversation about this topic about like, it literally changed overnight. And I was reading all the articles being like, is this me? Well, no, that's not me. You try to justify things.

Like, do you mind sharing anything that maybe like my listeners could be like, oh, this is happening to me too that like, maybe doesn't could be like, oh, this is happening to me too, that maybe doesn't present as like, this is abusive and toxic, but the undertone is so there. God, it's so hard. It's so hard. And I, well, I don't know. Maybe I'll think of something,

but this conversation is even really complicated for me. It's like, even talking about it, I can feel like my body temperature growing up because I think that sometimes the conversation around like red flags, like those are important conversations that we should be, we should be talking about it, like thinking about it, looking for them, sharing with each other.

And I think that even the most well-meaning conversation sometimes about like red flags can be a little victim blame-y, which is hard because I'm like, well, also I wanna know, you know, and share red flags. Because it does sort of put the onus on you to be able to identify something that, by the way, someone is working so hard to make sure you can't identify.

Like, I really started thinking about it like if someone was raised from birth as like a wilderness survivalist, and they just dropped you, I mean, I don't know, maybe you have this in your background, but if they dropped you or me in the middle of the woods, I would step into a booby trap within three feet. Cause I don't know what to look for. And it's like, because I didn't spend my life learning

how to build or identify traps. Like how is it that we're meant to like be inside the mind of someone who is working very hard to make sure that you feel very unsteady and are questioning yourself. So it's really it's really complicated and it's it's it's hard for me because I there are even times when I talk about my situation where as I'm saying it I will go am I making that up? Am I making everything up? Like I Remember having a conversation with my therapist like a year after that relationship where I

Was constantly asking her to just diagnose me with like an ego-syntonic disorder so that I could just fix it and and make sure that like oh this just won't happen again or something and there was a point where she was talking about my ex and she started to say something where she was like well you know when you're dealing with a wolf in sheep's clothing, and I went, no, no, what if I'm the wolf? Like, what if it was me? Because I think that was the thing that I didn't expect was how totally convinced he was of his own victimhood. Like, I know him well enough, in spite of feeling like,

well, I didn't know him at all, but I know him well enough to know like, he's not an actor, he's not a performer, he, you know, not a great liar in a lot of ways. So I was like looking at someone who was actually kind of like suffering. And I thought like, well, if he's being manipulative, I'll know it because, you know, I'll smell the bullshit. Like I'll smell that this is kind of a performance

that he's putting on, but I don't think he was putting on a performance. I think he genuinely believed that I was like torturing him. He told me one day I was terrorizing him because I was just crying because I couldn't pretend that things were fine anymore and I just started crying and he screamed in my face, you're terrorizing me.

But it was truly from the place of a person who believed that they were being terrorized. So I don't know if that would resonate with people, but it's like even when I would watch these fucking videos, I would read the articles and watch the videos and when like Dr. Rom would watch these fucking videos, I would read the articles and watch the videos. And when like Dr. Romany, who I love, like she's doing like an impression of a fight

where some abusive piece of shit goes, Alex, you're crazy, but that's not how it actually sounds. It's like, it was like, sometimes it was so emotional. It was like, Anna, I'm begging you, like you're ruining everything you're making. Like it was so real for him that it was like, am I really, am I doing something terrible? And I think that, you know, especially with conversations about like, we are always out with your friends and trying to isolate you, those kinds of things. Like, I think they're really convinced

that you're doing something terrible to them. So the pain place is real and that can be very, very misleading and convincing. I just wanna say the way that you, everything you just said. Yeah, did any of that make sense? 100%. It made so much sense, if anything,

it's probably one of the best descriptions of it because I really, really appreciate you saying, I still am uncovering some of the fucking red flags because I'm still even in my head being like, did that even happen? Is it still some of it on me? I think that is a great message to just give to everyone listening

is like, it is not normal. You should not be like, oh, it is not normal. You should not be like, Oh, that's bad behavior. And I recognize that you're being manipulative and gaslighting a blah, blah, blah. Like when you're with someone that you love for so long and it does turn into an abusive situation, it is so hard to see. And that's why ignorant people that whether they don't have someone that they know or it never happened to them are like, why didn't you just leave? It's so,

it's so hard. It's so much harder than that. Cause even you to this day sitting here being like, I still in my head, I'm like, was that real? Like it's- And even sharing that I'm like, fuck, should I even say that? Like there's something like that feels I think incorrectly,

but feels like shameful about how am I not more solid in my like healing recovery, whatever? How am I still? But it's not that and it's like you are present in your reality today, but when you reflect back on that relationship and that inner dynamic with that person, you are still perplexed by how the person sitting here today was in a situation and how that went. Like that I think is normal. I think that's what people struggle with and that's why I'm appreciative of you talking with me about this.

Because it is so weird when you're like, I am happy and healthy now, so how can I still be affected by that? I think it would be weird to not be affected by someone that manipulated you in a way because it distorts your reality. Completely. And so you sitting here, I guess I could ask like,

how have you learned and I'm sure you're still doing it, like to trust yourself again? Yeah, it's hard. I mean, yeah. I mean, even having this conversation, you know, like in the, I know we haven't like gotten there, but in the movie that I made,

like something small, like, you small, there are all these different women in the film, and they all have very different personalities. And that felt important to me as yet another kind of small reason why it feels like, hey, I wish there was, but there is no way to guarantee protection from someone who is determined to harm you. And that sounds grim, and I guess it is, but surely like the least we can do

when someone has harmed us, when we come out of like a devastating situation, is take off that top layer of shame where we go, well, I should have known, I should have seen, I should have been different, I should have been the tough girl, I should have been the sweet girl, I should have done, and it's like,

none of that will save you, none of that will save you. And again, like I almost hate saying that because it's so bleak, but I think I have, I did and still sometimes do so much self shaming around like, how did I find myself in that situation? Like I'm a real asshole. So like, how did I not do the thing

that I would have told you that I would do? Which was immediately be like, throw a scarf over my shoulder and be like, have a nice life dick. And like, there a scarf over my shoulder and be like, have a nice life, dick. And there's something so vulnerable and kind of humiliating about the fact that I just stayed and I kept thinking, I'll just try to be, I don't know,

warmer or better or something. I mean, even when this was, our schedule was getting worked out to come and record this, it was like the next day I went on social media and I saw a video of you talking about an experience you had where you were like, why did I not just leave? And I was like, girl, you were in a fun response. And like that's the whole, like woman of the hour,

it's like fawn response. Yeah. And like that's the whole like woman of the hour. That's it's like all fawn response. It's all just like, what do I have to do to survive? Like you were doing what you had to do to survive. Thank you for bringing it up because I do now want to talk about the movie. That's kind of what we've been building to is like these themes of every woman listening. Yes, I feel like we're both like pretty strong, independent women that we've got like our careers and people could look at us and it's like, wow, like you guys have got it all figured out and we're both sitting here being like, no, no, no, like

to this day I've been in weird work situations that I'm like, wait, like Alex Cooper, the Call Her Daddy person that just like signed her big deal and all this, like, no, there have been still moments in this industry where I am having uncomfortable interactions with people. And I'm like, wait, why didn't I just like do something? Yeah, why were you just assertive? And why weren't you, ugh.

It's not that easy. And I now wanna talk about the movie because you're right, there are so many themes in it that are so brilliantly portraying what we as women go through every day. And then it also, women will be like, yup, I've been there, I've been there. And still to this day,

I don't know if men completely understand what we have to go through and why we fawn instead of scream, kick and punch in the face. Let's talk about the movie, Woman of the Hour. I, first of all, you were set to be the lead. And then you also directed it. How did this come to be? Yeah, so I actually got the script for Alice Darling

and Woman of the Hour, like the same month, at least. I wanna say the same week, but it might've been the same month. And certain movies just come together quickly and certain movies take forever. So I was attached as an actor for two years. And you're just sort of like, well, I love this script. I love this story.

Let me know. And that happens a lot in the industry. And the other thing that happens is that sometimes something will just be kicking around for a long time. And then out of nowhere, it will be like, hey, we raised the money and we have a start date, so let's try to keep this train on the tracks because otherwise it'll probably disappear again.

And so we were suddenly starting the search for a director and I basically had 48 hours where it was this voice going, Annie, you should pitch yourself, and me going, shut up, absolutely not. Everyone needs to be quiet. We're not doing that. And it was that same feeling of like, oh my God, I'm gonna push myself off a cliff.

And so I pitched myself to direct the movie because I felt like I had become slowly kind of obsessed with the script and there was a little bit of me, like where I would give like ideas, feedback, whatever, but you know, it was, there were, you know, producers, cooks in the kitchen, whatever. And I was always a little bit like, well, you know,

if it were my movie, I would probably do it like that, but it's not my movie, so whatever. And the idea of taking it and just tweaking it that little bit was really exciting to me. So I pitched myself and I got the job and then six weeks later, I was in Canada doing like hard prep for the movie and then we were like making the movie and it really was like,

I'm gonna push myself off a cliff and I guess I will find out on the way down if I packed this parachute correctly. Because if it had been six months later, I would have panicked and backed out. I would have been like, you guys are right, we should find someone way more experienced, it'll be great.

But I had also, in the like five years before that started to have the experience of looking around a film set and going, huh, oh, oh, God, I'm the most experienced person here. Oh, oh, no, I'm the most experienced person here. And I'm an idiot. This is a nightmare. Like it wasn't like, ooh, hot shit. It was like, oh no, but you are like, oh wow, I've been doing this a long time. So yeah, it felt like, okay, it's kind of a now or never thing. And I was absolutely terrified,

but I was trying to kind of just like fake it. Right. I got this. I'm a super confident leader. I should be in charge of things. And again, like, I don't know about you, but like, I absolutely overthink things and I can get paralyzed in perfectionism, all that stuff. And then when like my back was against the wall or like things were really running behind and you don't really have a choice, but to be running on like adrenaline and instinct,

there were even things in the edit where, you know, you're looking at like the stuff in between takes where I would see myself like run into the frame and like give the actor a note and like adjust a piece of set deck and I was like well that lady seems like she knows what she's doing okay like when I'm in a blind panic and you don't really have a choice I was like she seems like she's an authority figure how about that I mean it's an incredible movie and you should be so proud of yourself. I know you are, but like to know that I didn't realize it was that where you're like, should I pitch myself?

Should I pitch myself? Thank God you pitched yourself because it's awesome. Like it really is amazing coming from someone that gets so fucking scared from movies like this. Oh, I know. I know. I know. And I did tell you, I was like, well, if you made it through the first five minutes, it's

all, it's like, it gets easier from there. It gets easier. But before, like for people who haven't watched it yet, the movie is based on an insane true story. Can you give just like a little bit of a bite for them to understand what's going on? For sure, yeah. So it's based on the true story of a serial killer

in the 1970s who went on the show, The Dating Game. And it moves around through time. So it's kind of following this like more than a decade long period where he was really operating without consequence cause nobody was really looking for him, which is another interesting, and by interesting I mean enraging aspect of the story.

But I play the Bachelorette who's on the dating game. And that some of that footage exists online, but the full episode, like all the footage appears to have been kind of like lost to time. So the screenwriter kind of used that vacuum as this opportunity to, it's almost like a fantasy section of the movie, except the fantasy is, what if a woman stood up for herself? Can you imagine?

But it's interesting because, speaking of asserting yourself, it's a really fun section of the movie. It's a really tense movie, but that section is kind of fun. But as the viewer, it's complicated because you know that, OK, she's been shrinking herself and in a fun response, and she's standing up for herself, which is so fun to watch.

But we know she's getting herself closer and closer to danger. And it's complicated. Like there are times where you go, why don't I just assert myself? And it's like, sometimes it's not that simple. Women will understand those moments where you stroke the ego or you actually are like so fucking nice in situations that you're so uncomfortable in. Because in your head, you're like, the only way I'm getting out of the situation is to be so appeasing and so nice and work it. And then all of a sudden, I know I'll be able to get out at some point.

But to a normal person that's never been in that situation or isn't a woman is like, wait, why don't they just like scream and run? And you're like, first of all, if I tried to scream and run, I'm dead, bitch. So fuck you. Okay. Like clearly we're not that dumb. I think that was like something very interesting in the movie. Obviously I talked to you earlier before we got out here about like that parking lot scene, just like struck me because I think every woman, anytime you were in a dark area and you are walking

anywhere, your senses go up where you're like like, what the fuck is gonna happen to me? What the fuck is gonna happen to me? Am I gonna die? Am I gonna get murdered? How do you think this movie, like what do you think it says about how women are preyed upon in society? Yeah, I mean, well, first of all,

I just wanna say like, it's so interesting that you use the word like your senses go up, because even the way that, like that scene was kind of the first scene that I could like visualize. And I imagined it in kind of mediums and closeups. And then when that thing happens, where we've all been there,

where you're like an interaction is perfectly pleasant. And then 10 seconds later, you're like, wait, 10 seconds ago, everything felt fine. And now like something feels very fucking dangerous. It almost is like your entire, like your hearing, your peripheral vision is just like, okay, where do I see movement? Where do I hear movement?

How unsafe am I? And so that's when like the camera goes, jumps wide because it's like, oh, that's when you would be aware of like, oh, this parking lot is empty. Like there's not a maintenance man. There's not a passing couple. Like all I can hear is the buzz of the streetlights. And it really is like in those moments in your own mind,

you're like, oh, I can almost hear like the ringing in my own ears because like there's nothing, fuck. There's nothing. That is so interesting stylistically, like you having the decision-making around the camera angles and how different, not that like we love men and we love male directors, but I'm just like so curious to know like how a man would have directed that scene

where you're directing it, like so in the presence of your own body and how you would feel in that moment. Totally, man, and there were times when people were talking about, like when we were on set, people were talking about me as like, oh, I'm so glad a woman's directing this. And there were times where I was like, is it making that much of a difference?

I can't really tell. And then there were, like, you know, there were a bunch of examples like this, but there was a moment where, like where the girl in the New York City apartment, when she kind of realizes, oh, something's wrong. I don't know what's wrong, but something's wrong. And she doesn't even drop her smile, and you can just sort of see it in her eyes.

And when we were shooting that, one of my producers was like, should we just do another take where it's just more clear what's happening? And I was like, it we just do another take where it's just more clear what's happening? And I was like, it will be very clear to women what's happening. Like, I think it will be clear to most men, but I was also like, if there's like 20% of men who are like, I don't understand what's happening

in this scene, fine. Right, that's okay. That would be fine. I would much rather like actually be like, no, this is how you would handle this. Like you wouldn't let on at all. No. That's so interesting.

So yeah, it was like, oh, I wasn't really sure how like being a woman director would really show up in the movie. But then, yeah, there were a bunch of things like that where I was like, oh, no, that's not even what the scene's about, like what? No, I love it so much. And I think, again, the themes are so important for people in society

to just like grasp onto and understand. And I think this is like a very accurate depiction, obviously heightened, like we're not all not like dealing with like a murderer, serial killer. You know, there are so many stories that I hear where, I mean, even your story where you're like, why didn't I just, whatever, it's like you did what you had to do.

Are you kidding? Are you kidding? It's just so weird, Daddy Gang, we're talking about the Paris episode, the Paris story, if you haven't listened, go listen. But yes, that story, I remember being so even anxious to tell the story online at first, because I was like, oh God.

Everyone's just gonna say, well girl, what were you thinking? Why'd you get on a plane? Why'd you go? And I'm like, well girl, what were you thinking? Like, why'd you get on a plane? Like, why'd you go? And I'm like, because I thought that he was a normal nice man. Like I think that's what we all go into it. Like unless you are burned so deeply from a young age,

which is horrific. And you have your those like guards up from a young age, you go through life for a while until you hit a point where you are fucked over in a way that like will stay with you for the rest of your life. And we wish that wouldn't happen to us, but when it happens, you can't unsee it. But before it happens, you're trusting people.

You're like, I wanna trust people. I wanna have a good time with someone. Like isn't it interesting that we're so easily induced to go like, well, what were you thinking? What, like trusting someone, thinking other people are good. But then by the way, if you go like, well, what were you thinking? Like trusting someone, thinking other people are good. But then by the way, if you're like, oh, I'm kind of cagey about dating and stuff right now, it's like, well, you gotta open yourself up.

You're like, all right, oh, oh, oh, oh, this is a setup. This is a trap. Oh, I see, I see. There's no winning. Got it. There's no fucking winning. Wait, speaking of dating, as we're wrapping up, I promise. Oh no. Are you dating? Are you single? What's going on?

["Darling, I'm here for you"] Are you dating? Are you single? What's going on? No, no, I'm, I'm, I'm single, but it is funny. I was like, I was thinking the other day, I've been single for a while and, uh, and I was like, Oh God, I'm, this is very me. I'm very avoidant and I have all these kind of little traps in my head, or like escape hatches or whatever. And I think for a long time now, I've been like, ugh, nope, no prospects. Meanwhile, I'm like, Anna, every time your phone buzzes,

it's someone being like, oh, I know this guy who writes on this great, he's on that show that's so great that everybody loves, and he really wants to meet you, so just let me know. And I just put it back down and go, no prospects for old Anna. Poor, poor Anna. Nobody wants me.

Like, it's like such a game that I'm playing with myself where I'm like, oh, I'm not wanting to go there. So I just like don't see what's happening. Like people going like, I'd love to take you out for a meal. And me going like, oh, he wants to be buddies. Like, that's not even a euphemism. That's just like how people ask you on dates. And it's just amazing the way that I'm like,

oh, no one for poor Hannah. It's so pathetic. You're just not in the mood. Yeah, basically. Well, and also like, I made this movie about like the most dangerous, violent man. So there might be some bleed over there. No, I think it's, I love when people are like,

no, I'm not dating. I think like we can normalize that when people are like, you're not seeing anyone. I hate those friends that are like, come on. It's like, first of all, shut up. I'll do it when I want to. But clearly like, yes, you went through something with someone and you made this movie.

And now it's like, you're gonna get back out there when you wanna get back out there. Is there anything that's like a non-negotiable for you in a relationship? Oh, well, in spite of my not great experience with couples therapy, I was like, first of all, I'm never getting involved with a man, meaning like we're not even kissing,

we're not even gonna have a real conversation unless you are in or have been in therapy. And if we're actually like, oh, okay, maybe this is a relationship, we're getting a couple of therapists from Jump. And like, by the way, that guarantees nothing, like even that, but yeah. I love that.

A man that's in therapy. I know, it warms my heart. It's a good time. And it is not a guarantee of anything. You're right. It's not a guarantee. But at least it's a little bit more in the right direction. Completely.

Because a man that's like, I would never fucking go to therapy. I'm like, what's wrong with you? You're the one that has the most fucking trauma. Totally. Not a good time. And can I say, even the kind of going back to the red flag thing, that I'm aware that, you know,

I love that there is a bit of a community and women wanting to share like, ooh, this turned out to be a red flag. And like, you know, we should know those things and know that like, it doesn't necessarily protect us to look out for those things. But I was like, I was thinking about how, you know, a classic one is like any guy that says like,

oh, all my exes are crazy, that's a red flag. I was like, you know, all of these guys have access to the same internet and the same culture that we do. So I don't think that they're rocking up to first dates and going, oh, all my exes are crazy fucking bitches. They're like, it was a messy situation. It was, you know, and I've been burned. And look, I probably contributed in some ways too, but.

Like, I'm like, I think as we're learning it, they are too. Not to be like, oh, they're like, and I don't even think they're doing it on purpose. It's just happening subconsciously. No, like those little fuckers are fully learning off of this episode being like, don't say this, do this. No, you're right. You're right.

They're taking notes. Like they're not idiots. You're right. I had a guy tell me about an ex where he was doing, like it was almost like he was getting me to collude with him by being like, no, she was a great person. But then would tell me things about her that would make me go, that's not okay, that's awful.

And he would sort of be like, oh wow, really? Do you think it was? And then it was all bullshit. It was all full on fabricated crazy. But like, it is like, oh, they're learning. They're like velociraptors, my God. Okay, so on a first date, what do you wanna be doing on a first date?

Are you going to a dinner? Are you doing a coffee? Are you doing a fucking Zoom meeting? Oh my god. What are we doing? What's your ideal first date? Uh, I know. I'm like, is there a way to just like, have it like at my house, in my pajamas?

I mean, like you have to look nice and I will be like recording it for the authorities so don't try anything. But yeah, I am like, what, leave the house? Dinner, Alex, that's disgusting. Why would you say that? You'll do a FaceTime date. Like go to a movie?

No. What, oh my God. Your movie? How iconic? Yes. Kind of iconic. Okay, last two questions. What is your best quality that you think you bring

to a relationship? Oh God. What is your best quality that you think you bring to a relationship? Oh, God. Oh, sometimes when I feel like I've seen like memes and stuff online about like the girlfriend that will be like, this isn't what he ordered. You know, how like some men are like,

oh, that's well, this isn't, but that's okay. And I'll just eat it. Like I'm very much like the bodyguard. Like I think I'm compensating for how short I am. I'm always like, wait, wait, now hang on a second. Which is weird, cause I'm the person where if the wrong thing comes, I'll just eat it. But when it's somebody else,

and it's the same thing with friends where I'm like, where are they? No, no, no, no, no, no, no. Who said that to you? No, no, no, no, no, where are they? I just wanna talk. No, no, no, no, I just wanna talk. Like I really talk crazy to people.

It's a lot, but I don't know. I like that about myself. I kinda love that. But it's way, I don't know if you find that it's way easier for me when it's somebody else. Of course, and then to stick up for yourself, you're like, oh no, no, no, no, no, never, never. But to someone else, I'm like, oh, I got you bitch.

I'm coming in full swinging, like let's go, no. I'm like, they're already dead. I don't, we don't even have to worry about it. I slept through it last night, it's fine. That's a good friend to have. This is good to know about you. Brittany's lucky, but you're also lucky with Brittany. I am very lucky.

Last question, what do you think is like the biggest misconception about you? Oh God, I don't know. I don't know, I mean, sometimes, okay, sometimes, I don't know if this counts as like a misconception, but sometimes I truly don't know if this counts as like a misconception, but sometimes I truly don't realize how dry I'm being. I have like such nervous kid sister energy

around like real like comics. And so I'll try to like be funny, like even if someone's just funny, like I'll be like, oh yeah, I have to like keep up. And I'll go so dry that I think sometimes I don't realize it comes off like I'm being dead serious. I saw a video of myself, I saw a TikTok of myself once. I was at this party and this guy like, you know,

just got me to do like a video with him. And I was joking that he told me that he'd been like filming me from across the party. And it was fine. It was fine. Whatever. But I was like, oh, we're doing a bit about how like, oh, you were secretly filming me, motherfucker. Like, so, OK, we're doing like I'm like, yeah, we're doing a bit. And then I see the tick to, cause it like went viral. And I was like, oh my God, it seems like I'm, it seems like I'm, it seems like I'm ready to kill this man.

Which like, look, mostly am I ready to kill men at any given moment? A little, but I was like, I'm being so funny. And then I saw it back and I was like, oh my God. And all the comments were like, wait, is she being serious? And I was like, I don't know, am I being serious? My God. And it really, I'd never seen just a video of me

doing a bit that wasn't coming across as a bit. So I was like, oh my God, how many times? How many times? Cause this is the tone that I snap into when there's a comedy director or something where I was like, oh wow, there have gotta be so many situations where they're like, I don't know, I thought we were getting along fine.

And then she just snapped. She like went like dead eyed on me or something. Meanwhile, I'm like, I'm being so funny. It's going great, okay. Like I'm nailing it, Anna, you're nailing it. And that is the end of our episode. And that concludes today's session, ladies and gentlemen. Anna, thank you so much for coming on Caller Daddy.

This was so fun. You're amazing. This was the best. Thank you so much for everything. Thank you. Thank you.