Call Her Daddy - Introverts & Extroverts: Dating Edition

Episode Date: November 13, 2022

Are you an introvert, extrovert or somewhere in between? This week Call Her Daddy explores the dynamics that can arise between introverts and extroverts while dating and in relationships. I’m an extrovert and I feel rejected when my introverted partner needs alone time, how do I respond? My extroverted partner is overwhelming me with plans and I feel like the boring one in the relationship, what do I do? Dating as an introvert is absolutely exhausting, is there any way to make it more manageable? Kati Morton, licensed marriage and family therapist, is here to talk us through these specific situations and more.

What is up, Daddy Gang? It is your founding father, Alex Cooper with Call Her Daddy. Katie Morton, welcome to Call Her Daddy. Thanks for having me. I'm excited to be here. Okay, Daddy Gang, listen. Katie is a licensed marriage and family therapist, YouTube creator, author, podcaster, and speaker. I'm so excited for our conversation today to discuss introverts and extroverts and how those dynamics can play out in friendships, romantic relationships at work, et cetera. So listen, I think people have an understanding obviously of like the basic meaning of introvert and extrovert, but I don't

think we always know how to respond when tricky situations arrive within our relationships. So before we get into some different scenarios, just in case someone isn't completely familiar, can you explain what is the difference between someone who is introverted and someone who is extroverted? Yeah, of course. I think the easiest way to kind of discern in your brain, or at least for me, is to think of introverts as getting energy from spending time alone and extroverts getting energy from spending time with others. And that applies to a lot of things like making decisions. Extroverts like to make those out loud, think out loud. What about this? And contemplate. Introverts like to make those out loud, think out loud. You know, what about this? And contemplate.

Introverts like to do it on their own, in their own head. They can be more imaginative, more observational. Extroverts are more engaged, you know, and gregarious. Can someone have both introverted and extroverted tendencies? Most people do. That's the kind of the, I guess the secret or a misunderstanding is that we're one or the other. We're all kind of around the middle and we'll have some tendency towards one or the other. Like personally, I am exhausted from being in a group of people I don't

know well, but if I'm around my people, I love it and I can be energized. And so, you know, you'd be like, which one does that fit into? It's a little bit of both. That's really helpful. Cause I think again, like, obviously we live in a world that loves to put things in boxes. So to make everyone like, understand like, Hey, you can have both. So I think sometimes it's like when people are like, Oh, you're an introvert. No, but I'm sure you have some extroverted tendencies and vice versa. So I love on my show sometimes to just like get into scenarios so people can really feel like, okay, I'm in a situation. I can paint the picture for myself and really feel like I'm seeing it clearly now.

So I'm going to read some scenarios and then we're going to get your expert advice. So, okay. The first one is things are getting serious between you and your new partner and you want to introduce them to your friends and family. However, when you bring them along to social situations, they don't open up or engage in much conversation. And this has left your friends and family with a bad impression of the person that you're dating. How do you explain to your friends and family that your partner is just an introvert and not to judge them for that. Yeah, I think there's kind of two conversations that need to be had. First, talk to your partner, because even if you're more introverted, we all know we can turn it on a little bit. And I know

it's exhausting, but maybe you like don't see somebody for three days before leading up to this like social event. So you can really put it out there. So I think talking to your partner and telling them, you know, and be honest, I feel like sometimes we feel like we have to sugarcoat things or like, I don't know, navigate around the truth. I find direct communications usually best. So saying something like, I know you're more introverted. That's why I love you. However, you know, I want everybody to know you and love you like I love you. So can you just try to share a little more than you normally would or be a little more talkative? I would really appreciate it.

And then on the flip side, talking to your friends and family, you could just say, I love Alex. She's great. I want you to love her. Just know that she's a little more shy and that doesn't mean she doesn't like you and that she's not having a good time.

It just takes her a while to open up. And just trust me, when you do get to know her,'re going to love her as much as I do. And I think it's just that direct conversation. Also relationships take time. And if people are going to judge them right away, like I don't really, you know, it takes a while. I completely agree with that. And I love that advice because I do feel like sometimes introverts are made to feel like the outcasts and there's something wrong with them. And the point is though, is like when you get to know the introvert and they feel comfortable around you, that's probably when their extroverted tendencies are going to come out. And so I love

the conversation with like your friends and family of like, Hey guys, just give it a minute because I also bet someone can relate to that, but they're in an environment that they're comfortable with everyone. So it's like just having an understanding that like give everybody a chance. And I think when we're also just important to remember when we're thinking about family, especially we're usually attracted to other people because they're somewhat similar to our family. So like you said, chances are there's someone in your family that's like, oh, I totally resonate with that. And like, I don't open up to people, but it's their family. So they're like, they're already comfortable.

Totally. Is there a way to, if you're the extrovert, is there a way that you can support your partner and make them feel less overwhelmed when meeting friends and family for the first time without it being an unhealthy dynamic of it being like codependent. Yeah. I think probably preparing them ahead, like not springing things on them last minute, because that can be really overwhelming for someone who finds that exhausting because you don't know what kind of day they've had or week they've had or whatever. And so I think planning and then letting them know some things about the people they're going to meet because introverts

like to do a lot of like pre-thinking, pre-prep, like the preparation part, you give them information and they can kind of figure out things they could talk about. Maybe it just helps them feel better prepared overall. And then we're kind of like setting them up for success. When you meet people to try not to do it in huge groups, if your partner's an introvert, I know you might want that. And you're like, let's just get it over with. But to them, that can be even more overwhelming. So maybe like one or two at a time. And intimate settings, like we're going to have them over to our house. So they have home court advantage, right? They feel a little more comfortable.

Or we're going to go out to this restaurant that's kind of quiet so you can make sure they can hear and participate. Because my husband's not necessarily an introvert, but his hearing is not the best because of, you know, I don't know, rock and roll music, hockey, all sorts of things. So for me to have him meet someone at like a loud bar would be like the worst because I know he wouldn't hear them properly. He'd just be like nodding and smiling along. And then that would totally suck also. I really agree with that. And I think there's something to be said for when you are an extrovert with an introvert, like you don't need the first time you introduce them to your family. If you want it to be successful, you bring them to goddamn Thanksgiving.

Like let's find like a little bit more of a happy medium where it's so helpful. If maybe you have, like you said, them meet like maybe your siblings first and then maybe your parents at one point. And it's like, it's like a little gradual. So then once it's the big event, they already know some familiar faces. Great, great advice. Okay. My partner is extremely extroverted and always has a weekend full of activities planned. Their friend group is great at making me feel welcome and included in things, but constant group activities

are just not how I would ideally spend my weekend. I find myself saying yes to more things than I normally would because I'm starting to feel self-conscious about being the boring one in the relationship. How do I combat these feelings and find a balance of how I want to spend my free time? Talk to your partner. We have to communicate. They might not realize it. Like we're saying,

if we're more extroverted, we're like, this is awesome. And we're doing so many things and activities and adventures. And I can even understand that point of view because my husband likes to do a lot of activities. And sometimes I want to do nothing. I'm like, I don't want to use my brain. I don't want to use my body. I just want to like zone. And you have to be able to communicate that with them. And there also has to be some compromise. They shouldn't be all them or all you, but maybe you're like, Hey, last weekend we went out three times. Can we just stay in this weekend? Or maybe only go out once or, you know, you'll have to navigate that with your partner, but making time for those conversations and having those conversations like on a Tuesdayuesday don't have them on a friday when they've already made plans and then

they're going to be bummed right it's something that we have to like plan out for and not don't push yourself to that breaking point either because if we wait until we're like you know they have all this stuff set up and we're like i can't do this anymore well then we're gonna fight about something that could have been prevented had we we just communicated. It's so true. And I really like you saying planning because I also think that it can become a buildup and it's also not fair to your partner fully if you're not articulating your needs and they're thinking that like, you're totally fine with going along with it. I also would just say to like my listeners, daddy gang, I know that a lot of you are like in your twenties and I would just have your guard up a little bit. If you feel like you're

constantly feeling the boring one in the relationship, it could also not be the relationship for you. You may be at a different point in your life with this person where they're wanting to go out and rage all the time. And like, you're just at a different point in your life where maybe those activities are no longer of interest to you. And so maybe there is like a deeper rooted thing happening where you feel so on a different page than your partner, rather than this is like an introverted extroverted thing. Obviously that may not be the case, but just wanted to kind of like hip check you guys and make sure that this is also a healthy dynamic. Totally. Cause especially in your twenties, I feel like there's a shift and it's different for everyone right stages of growth

We have all these expectations around when we're supposed to want to settle down or do this or have a career Nobody knows what the fuck they're doing. It's okay, and everybody's different So don't feel pressure if you're 24 and everybody else who's 24 is like rage all weekend You know start starting thursday all the way recover on sund. And you're like, I can't. That's okay. Everybody is different. And I think that is great. Because the one thing I do find is people always have these old adages like opposites attract. And I'm like, a little bit.

I don't want to date myself. That would be boring, right? But we don't need to date polar opposites. There's reasons we're attracted to people. A lot of it has to do with our upbringing and also where we are in life at the time. A lot of relationships are timing. I know romantics out there are like, no, it's meant to be. But if you find yourself with someone who's on the same page or in the same time in their life, even if you're around the same age, it is okay to cut your losses, move on, find someone who is.

And I do think a lot of times in your 20s, there is a point where you may start to really feel like the odd man out, but it's actually not because these people are bad people or they're wanting to make you feel like the odd man out. It's really, you are changing and evolving and it's not a knock to them and how they're living their life. They may get to that point eventually too. But I do think that like taking care of your own energy and space of realizing, like, don't then waste a couple of years of your life, just like going through the process and like continuing to do something that you're so unhappy with, but you're thinking like, oh, they'll phase out of it too.

Like prioritize yourself in those moments, because then you're really going to get resentful of everyone around you and yourself. I 100% agree. And I think sometimes we think that if a relationship doesn't work, friendship or romantic relationship, we're like so quick to jump to it's toxic, right? And they're the problem. And sometimes it's not that they're the problem or we're the problem. It's just a bad recipe, right? Maybe when I was a kid and you're going to think this is weird and gross, but I used to love to eat peanut butter and pickle sandwiches. I love it. I don't like those anymore. So it's not that it's a, you know, it was a good recipe back when I was like 10 years old. I ate them with my dad.

It was a thing. I don't know. But now I'm 39, you know, and we grow and change and we should feel supported to do that. And that might mean that we schlep off old skins of ourselves, and that can come with friendships and romantic relationships and maybe just who we thought we were. I think it's healthy and normal to lose friends. I know that sounds bad, but lose friends and relationships along the way, not because we hate them or they did something bad, but just because we're kind of like we diverge, like they're going this way and we're going that way. And we don't really have anything in common anymore. And that's not a bad thing. We're both growing and it's okay to support that. I think there's like a shame around it that people get anxiety of like, should I put in more work? Am I a bad person for like,

wanting to like step away from this friendship? Cause I'm not at a place where like this person is anymore. And I love your advice of like, Hey, things change. And instead of feeling icky about it and feeling awful, I'm like, Oh, like why, why is this happening? I'm just going to stick it out longer. Like, Hey, that's actually completely normal. Just like maybe you aren't friends with the person you were like best friends with in middle school. That doesn't mean that you guys are either bad people or it was toxic. It was like, Hey, you guys have such different interests than when you were in middle school and you like to like play with Bratz dolls. Like things have changed. Totally. And back when we grew up too, you have like this small little bubble that you live in. You know, I grew up in a really, really small town in Washington state. And I think there

were like 200 people in my graduating class. So like the bubble of people I spent time with was small and I was picking the best people for me at the time. But not only has my bubble expanded, right? I lived in LA for 20 years. We're now in Austin. Like I'm around different people. I went to college, grad school, like such different experiences. Also, I don't want children. A lot of people, you just have these different life choices. I got married. Not everybody wants that. There's just different things. And I feel like we sometimes feel pulled into the past like, oh, but I've been friends with this person for 20 years. I have to be friends with them forever. I remember there was an episode of New Girl like eons ago where Zooey Deschanel is the main character and her

best friend were saying, if we met today, would we be friends now? And the answer was no. We have nothing in common. And sometimes I think we stick... Sometimes those friendships are healthy and good and they can be grounding, but sometimes they don't serve us anymore. And it's okay. It's part of growth. If you don't mind me asking, just because we're swerving all over, I've had a lot of women write in and I think that there's this pressure I've been talking about recently on my podcast of like, the goal is like you get engaged and you get married, then you get a house and you have kids and you blah, blah. And like, as a woman, there's this pressure. How do you handle the pressure of when people, like when people naturally look at

you and are like, what are you sure? Like what, like, do you know what I mean? Like, how do you deal with that? I think part of it, I take it as this, and this is my best advice and I'll kind of tell you what I say. So it says more about the person than it does about you. Because some people want to give into societal pressures. Oh, I have to go to college. I have to have this career that looks like X, Y, or Z. I have to get married i have to have a find a partner by all these time for and i feel like women for whatever reason i maybe it's the baby clock kind of idea but we seem to be more pressured but we want careers too we want different things too you know and so i think we get more of that and so we got together when i was 24 and we got married when i

was 29 and immediately people were like when you are you going to have kids? Are you going to have kids? And we'd already known that we most likely didn't. And so what I would say is I'm happy with my relationship the way that it is. And I just don't see children as being part of that. And then people be like, oh, do you not like kids? And I was like, no, I love kids. I just love being the crazy aunt. And that's my role. I buy ridiculous things like Uggs for babies and just shit they don't need because I don't have, you know, and I was like, that's just my choice. And then I would sometimes reflect if it was a close enough friend, I'd reflect on something they did. Like, just like your choice to move away from home or just like your choice to

take this job or, you know, it's just a life choice. And at this point people have stopped. So if you're out there and you're like, is this ever going to stop? It does. And I do regret getting like angry upfront in the beginning. Cause I was like, get out of my, what? You know, but I did find the people who are asking a lot where people who really wanted kids and hadn't met the person again, just remember that it's actually not about you. That helps me. You're so right. It's such a projection and like this fascination and it is so inappropriate how much it's more about women. No one is as fixated on the men. And it's just like, I think that's such, it's really helpful. And I appreciate you sharing

that because I've had a lot of women write in that are just at that age where it's like, I just got married to my now husband. And people are like, so when are you having kids? And there's, they're like, well, I don't even know if I fucking want them. And if I do, I don't want to do it on a timeline that's based off of pressure of other people around me that are making me feel like I have to hit the certain deadline. So I really respect you for how you've approached it. And I actually completely understand why at first there was probably this like rage of like, shut the fuck up. Why do you care? Yeah. Cause I'm like, I just got married. Let me enjoy it. And we should enjoy life. Don't feel pressure to jump to the next stage because

it goes by fast enough as it is not to be an old lady about this, but life goes by quick. I'm like, how is it 2022 a thing that's already almost over? Like what? Right. So we have to remember that everybody's life looks different and it's okay to go at your own pace. And we need to normalize that. It's great to talk about because I feel like we're obviously not the only ones and we should support people moving at their own pace. And I even catch myself, like, don't ask people like, oh, are you going to buy a house or oh, you're going to do this? Like, just ask how they are, if they're happy, how you can support that. Yeah, I love that. Making it more of a neutral, like, what are your plans?

Like, what are like, as opposed to specifics that really are coming from your projection of what you would want. I love that. And I think you're so right. We all have different lives. And I think there needs to be a larger amount of respect for other people choosing different paths than your own. So this is a great question. Dating as an introvert is absolutely exhausting. I dread having to go on first dates and make small talk so much that I feel like I can't relax

and be myself. And sometimes it prohibits me from even going out and actually pushing myself to go out on the date in the first place. Do you have any advice to making dating as an introvert easier? I think two parts, one kind of like we've talked about resting ahead of time. Like don't schedule a first date on a Friday. If you're at work at that office and you've already gone out three times, like that's not, that's not going to work. We're going to have to have like a lull of a week and then schedule it. Cause it's going to be exhausting either way. And I think we'd have to be like, I'm going, I'm doing this. So there's that. And then second, I would choose activities that feel balanced. Like not to say like the old version, because I don't go out to movies

anymore, but maybe some people do, but like dinner and a movie. Dinner is interactive. It's kind of maybe more exhausting. Movie, not. You can kind of balance it so that you're not all out or put an activity in like mini golf or something where, so you're doing something that's not so like focused chit chat. That's such good advice because I think that there is such a pressure when it comes to, I mean, even as an extrovert, like there are some nights that I used to go on dates and I'm like, Oh, like I got to be on my game. Like, what are my talking points? Like when you're going on a date and you haven't met the person I can imagine for an introvert,

it is this daunting experience that you're dreading. And really, you know, like you want to meet people, you want to go out, you want to go on these dates. So doing a date that allows there to be an activity that is the base for the conversation. And then if you want to elaborate and to have little chit chat while you're doing it, like mini golf, even the movie, doing something that allows you to have something for the conversation. So it's not all on you. And again, daddy gang, do not give up on the first date. Like I've talked to a lot of friends on this, like unless it's horrific, it was a little awkward. I would say a second date is usually going to be better. Yep. Agreed. Okay. My partner

is an introvert and we live separately. There will be nights. She declined my offer to sleep over and says that she needs some alone time. I can't help, but feel rejected in these moments and sad that we aren't seeing each other that day. How should I express these feelings to my partner while still respecting their need for alone time? Relationships are compromise and you're going to have to talk about it again. I know we keep going like harping on this communication thing, but we can't expect people to read our minds. That's one of the most toxic things we can do. And I've done it. Trust me. I'm like, he should know what I'm upset about. Spoilers. He doesn't

because I haven't said anything. Uh, yeah. So tell them, Hey, I understand you need alone time and I respect that, but can we compromise a little bit? I don't know how often they're seeing each other in the moment. Like, let's say you spent the last three nights with them and they're like, Hey, I need to get away. That's going to be your compromise where you have to say, I respect that. I hate it, but I understand. Right. And so finding a balance that works for you, but you're going to have to communicate and test things out. I'd encourage you even just to ask like, Hey, on an average week, how many nights do you think we could spend together without you feeling drained? Cause then you're like respecting their boundary,

but you're also, you're wanting to let them know you want to see like you, it sounds like you probably want to live with them. You'd love to see them every night. They just might not be able to meet you there. So where can they meet you? And then here's something in all relationships. I just want to put it out there, not necessarily for this specific thing, but in relationships, there are going to be expectations or assumptions that we make about the relationship. Then there's going to be what that person's able to give. There's always a difference. And we have to decide if what they're able to give is enough. I know that's hard.

It's uncomfortable. And sometimes there's grieving. With family, we have to grieve that difference, right? Because our mom or our dad, they're still our parent or our sibling. We can't just, you know, it's not like they just disappear. But especially in dating, it's important to acknowledge that and just see like, okay, well they can't meet me this here. Am I okay with that? And be honest with yourself. I love this advice because I've had a friend that was very introverted and her partner was always, always like feeling very rejected by the, her need for

alone time. And it was interesting because there was just a, yet again, a lack of communication. And it was the early days where he was feeling very rejected of like, why do you always want to be alone? Like, is there something I could do better? And it took them just the natural time of like a push and pull of a relationship to set these boundaries where he eventually understood because she started to also recognize, fuck, I need to make a little bit more of an effort to let him know it's not him. This is just a need of mine. And it allowed them to get to a better place. But it was definitely rocky for a little bit when it was like, how do we combat this? Like feeling of he's feeling rejected. She's feeling like pulled out of, she's not able to do what she needs, which is a need of hers. I really appreciate you saying like, there are going to be some dynamics and relationships where eventually,

once you get to that push and pull of understanding each other, there's also the scary, but realistic thing of like, Hey, but maybe you guys aren't compatible because maybe there's something where this person literally just cannot give you what you need. Because if they were doing that, they're then not being honest and loyal to themselves and being honest of how they would actually be in a relationship. And then it's just like, Hey, you just don't, it's just not meant to be. And that's okay. But forcing it is not the right way to go about a relationship. Totally. Cause it will never get easier if you're forcing it. Cause then either one of two things are going to happen. You're number one, you're pretending to be someone

you're not, or number two, you're not getting the needs met and either way that's can build up resentment. Right. So in both are, there's just no, there's no winning with that. And you can't force something that's not working. I know people are like, Oh, good relationships take a lot of work. I don't really like that because they take communication and shared respect. I completely agree. I guess my last question would be like, is there like a last kind of statement you would like to make to extroverts, introverts listening in relationships that are just trying to find that balance of how to be respectful of each other? Like, is there anything you can leave us with? Yeah, I guess I'd say that over communicate. I know sometimes like, well, I don't really think I need to talk about it's not that big of a deal. We try to minimize all the time and invalidate

ourselves and other people. So my encouragement is if you have a concern in healthy relationships, we should feel okay to, to talk about that concern. Do it when you're not emotionally charged, meaning don't do it in the middle of another fight or when you're super tired or haven't eaten. Let's not set ourselves up for a shit show. Instead, on a casual day, be like, hey, you know something that bothered me or I'm concerned about is X, Y, or Z. Do your best to use I statements, no finger pointing. Say, I felt misunderstood or I felt pressured to do this and give them an opportunity to respond. Sometimes we want things to be fixed automatically. We expect them to read our minds

and all of that just leads to us feeling worse and them feeling worse. And maybe the relationship ending when it probably could have worked out. And so just over-communicate. Whenever you have concerns, I don't think anyone would ever tell you the relationship can be harmed by you at least expressing, again, not emotionally charged, about something that's upsetting. Again, as long as we make it about ourselves, we're going to be fine. And I know, trust me, I know it's uncomfortable. I know we hate it. And I know we're worried they're going to be like, why are you so bitchy? But a good person's not going to be like that. And if a person responds to you that way,

then good thing we know now, bye. Katie, I am so grateful for you coming on because I think that this is one of the most relatable topics that so many people just grapple with and sit by themselves and wonder how to manage introvert, extrovert. And I know sometimes people are like, is that even a real thing? It is. And it can, as long as you recognize who you are in your relationships, in your social life alone with yourself,

I think there's a better way to manage it. If you've been stressed about it at all. Thanks for having me.