Call Her Daddy - Janelle Monáe: We Should Thank Our Exes (FBF)

Episode Date: December 27, 2024

Janelle Monáe joins Call Her Daddy to discuss her personal evolution and the work required to reach her own age of pleasure. Addressing past rejection and trauma from her father's instability, she opens up about how these struggles impacted her personal relationships and how she found herself closed off to love. Janelle and Alex reflect on lessons learned from failed relationships and share why we should actually be going back and thanking our exes. Janelle speaks about her experience being in polyamorous relationships and her choice to openly talk about her sexuality despite coming from a religious family. Janelle and Alex discuss what it means if a partner refuses to post you on social media and debate whether this is actually a red flag. Janelle speaks about the inspiration for her new album, The Age of Pleasure, and what this phase of life means to her. For the game mentioned in the episode look for: Real Talk: 110 Relationship Questions You Should Only Ask Your Friends by Amil Barnes.

What is up, daddy gang? It is your founding father, Alex Cooper with Call Her Daddy. Janelle Monae, welcome to Call Her Daddy. Thank you so much for having me. First of all, I'm just so excited to meet you. I'm a huge fan of all your work. I was listening to your music on my way here and I'm like, okay, you are giving sexual, sensual, fun party vibes. It gives all the vibes. Your album is amazing. I'm so happy to have you here. Oh thank you so much for having me Alex. Of course. I'm a big fan of your show. Thank you. Of your experience rather. So I was really happy when I found out we were gonna do this. So thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank us pretend we were there with you. Oh, please.

I'm like, can we all just go on vacation for the whole summer? Come on, everybody, everybody, let's do this. Let's all agree that summers are for vacations paid for by the government. I love this energy. Paid for by the government. We're going to like manifest it here now. Because it's like when you were younger, I feel like summers were always vacation because off of school. But when you become an adult, nothing is fun anymore.

We're like, we need to go on vacation. Okay, so where were you? Okay, so I was in Ibiza, Ibiza, Spain. And then I stayed there for probably like five or six days, which was like an experience. Like it is a party place. So we did not go to sleep. I went with like 10 of my other friends and we didn't go to sleep till like seven in the morning, every morning.

I can't even say night. But it was so fun. It was that, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooo, ooo, ooo, ooo. That ooch ooch music. I kind of like ooch ooch, but I need like some hip hop, some something mixed in with it. But it was so fun. The sunsets are beautiful.

And then the second portion of the vacay was Jamaica. Oh, I've never been. Ocho Rios, beautiful people. The food, the chicken patties, the beef patties, the shrimp curry, the plantains. I had at least 152 plantains. What? One by one.

Oh. Yeah. The water. As you were saying that, I'm like, ooh, I feel like I'm there with you. It was like, it was heaven. So I will say I'm sort of mentally still there. It's okay, we can keep it chill.

We're on vacation. This is summer. Like we're just gonna relax today, okay? Let's relax. And it's so interesting that you say like as kids growing up, it just reminded me like I didn't take vacations as a kid. Okay. I think that's why I'm so adamant about it now.

I didn't, you know, my parents worked a lot and we didn't get the opportunity to go outside of Kansas. So I didn't take my first vacation until really my first album came out. And now you're like, I deserve this. I'm making up for lost time. As you should. That's phenomenal. I feel like when I go on trips with my friends, there's someone in the friend group that's like the planner, that's like the reservations and the itinerary person. And then there's people that are more like chill and just going with the flow. Who are you in the friend group?

Oh my God. I'm the one actually sending out the group texts. Like dinner, I could be at the club, it could be four in the morning. I'm like, lunch is going be served at two p.m., breakfast for anybody between nine and noon. Dinner's gonna be at eight. Like, I love making the itineraries. I'm that friend.

You're the dream though. I'm, yeah. Like, people are like, Janelle, why are you doing? And I just, I don't know. I just love curating experiences. I grew up actually I just love curating experiences. I grew up actually throwing parties with my best friends, middle school, sixth grade, seventh grade.

We would rent out this location in one of our friend's neighborhoods, sort of white building, and we would charge people a dollar to get in. And I would hide in the bathroom because I didn't know who was gonna come. I had so much anxiety around it and then once it would get packed,

my friends would come underneath the stall because I locked myself in the bathroom. They'd be like, it's packed, come out, come out, bitch. Get out, get out, get out. And so I've just always loved curating experiences for people. I mean, I think that's a great trait and quality to have. I feel like that makes a lot of sense

of what I wanted to talk to you about today is obviously your new album, The Age of Pleasure is out. And while I was listening to it, I'm like, you have such a specific great vibe that's very infectious, which I love. And I'm curious, are you currently in your age of pleasure? Have you always been? And what is age of pleasure to you? Ooh, that's a great question.

I wasn't always in my age of pleasure. I've been in an age of fear, age of anxiety, age of just worry, a fight, Just worry, a fight, you know, fighting back against systems that seek to oppress folks like myself and the people that I love and centering that. And with this album, which I actually don't even call an album, I say that it is a soundtrack to a lifestyle. It's a lifestyle. You know, we live this. I wrote this project for my friends and for me and I was just like, if we fuck

with it, that's all I care about. So I would throw parties at my house with my friends who own this party collective called Everyday People. And if I knew we were going to be having and hosting them on a Saturday, that Monday or Tuesday we would go into the studio and we would write like two to three songs that would work in the DJ's playlist. I wouldn't tell anybody it was me. I would not like make a big thing about it.

And I would be very nervous, like, oh my God, oh my God, oh my God. Are people gonna sit down? Because if people sat down, it was not gonna go on the album. If people were not shazaming, it wasn't going on the album. And so every song that you hear,

all of my friends, all of the people who were with us celebrating in this safe space, they are responsible for the songs making the album. That takes a lot of confidence, but also just like self-awareness to be like, I'm gonna play my friends my songs. They're gonna have no fucking idea, it's me. And watch, let's see if they vibe with it.

So like every single, cause I was thinking when I was singing to Champagne Shit, I was like, okay, like this is a vibe. Like I would listen to this, like getting ready with my friends, like getting ready to go out. But then I I was like, okay, this is a vibe. I would listen to this getting ready with my friends, getting ready to go out, but then I'm wondering, so you're sitting there being like, do they like it? Do they like it?

And then you're like, check, that's going on the soundtrack. Yep, I'm like, how do people move? Okay, I saw some people shazaming. And then some people would be like, wait, is this? But I never would confirm. I would go hide and be like, having somebody else tell me what's going on. But yeah, like it's, as an artist,

presenting anything before the world gets it, like for that first time, I talked to a lot of my artist friends and we're all like, it is one of the most like scary things ever, scary feelings to have because it comes from such a pure place when we create and for it not to be accepted, you don't know, you know, you take it.

But for me, I got, I was like, I'm ready. I'm okay, I had to heal some shit, you know, cause some of that is attached to just rejection issues, abandonment issues, like people don't like my stuff that could go down to the root of an issue that you just need to fix. And I definitely used a portion of this pandemic to sort of work on that and to get to my own traumas

that I had to heal and to get to a place to where I was like, wait, I've been really centering, fighting so much that I don't even know what my life is like outside of that. Who am I? You know I talk I like who am I outside of the fight? Mm-hmm. You know who am I? And so I had to sit with myself and ask myself and you know when I think about the word pleasure there is no pleasure without feeling safe. I didn't always feel safe. That's so, I appreciate you sharing that because I, one can relate in terms of like

putting something creatively out there and being extremely nervous to see obviously like are people gonna like it. On top of that obviously you infusing parts of you with your sexuality and race and growing up and your experiences. Like that's like a really vulnerable moment to be infusing something into a work of art

and then like fingers crossed hoping people like it. You kind of have to slowly be really good with yourself to be able to know like, sure I can like perfect my craft a little bit more but down to the core. Like if people don't like it, I'm still gonna be okay with myself and that must take time though Exactly, it does it takes a lot of unlearning. Yeah, it takes a lot of

Fucking with yourself, you know and and and like I have to say like You have to be like I fuck with me, you have to be like, I fuck with me. Yeah, okay, somebody doesn't like a song that I made, but that doesn't make me a bad songwriter. That doesn't make me a bad artist. That doesn't mean that I should just throw away my whole career. And you have to just understand that sometimes

we're not always in the same space that we can take in, take in the message or the energy that an artist is trying to put out. And there's nothing wrong with that. It's just like, okay, this didn't resonate with you. Okay, but I don't give you that power over me. You're not more powerful. Your thoughts about my art are not more powerful

than my thoughts about my art. Yeah, it's so real what you're saying too, because even when I was listening to you say like, I was fighting for so much of my life, like, and when am I going to get out of this stage? That's also the beauty of art is like, it will come to it when you're ready. Like, your music would have sounded so different in your fighting stages versus now when you're like, I fucking love myself, I'm more clear on who I am, I'm more secure in certain things that were eating me alive maybe when I was younger

and going through it. And you can tell, this album, it makes you smile, it makes you feel yourself, it makes you just want to live. And I don't know if that sounds corny, but like, it's facts. No, it makes you just like want to live and I don't know if that sounds corny, but like it's facts. No, it's really beautiful. It's really, really.

Thank you so much for sharing that. Every moment of your soundtrack felt very thoughtful and put together and it is a story. So I just, I'm a creative person so I just want you to know I really respect you and it's great. Thank you. You know, I wanted to focus on feeling too. I think feeling is what music gives us.

It makes us feel, it makes us wanna dance, it makes us wanna party, it makes us wanna cry, it makes us wanna feel ourselves and feel sexy, have sex, all those things is such a powerful energy. And the fact that it's a feeling that I had that I felt like, man, this is this makes me feel good knowing that that makes you feel and we are just meeting each other. That's such I think that's such a beautiful exchange. So thank you so much. Of course. It's interesting. You kind of mentioned this earlier and I want to talk about it. I know you've talked about going to therapy

and working on yourself and I know you're at a great place in your life and you know, the age of pleasure, but let's go back a little bit. What is the biggest part of yourself you had to heal in order to be who you are sitting here today? Mm. Whew, oh wow. You know, one of the things that I had to do was

again deal with my rejection and abandonment sort of trauma, where did that start from? My dad and I, who we're like this now, we're super close, but my dad struggled with addiction growing up and so he was in and out of my life and so there were just times where I didn't know if he was really going to come and pick me up. You know, I just, I did, the trust wasn't there. I felt let down. There were, you know, moments that, that, that, that happened all the way up into, you know, high school and, and other things that happened. So I had to go back to those times that were painful,

those times that I just had to forgive my dad. I was like, I have to forgive you. You were struggling with drug addiction. You were not the best version of yourself. And now that you are, we get to make up for that. We get to make up for that time. And as I healed that and I talked to him about it, a lot changed for me.

As I forgave him, I forgave my own self for spending so many years, you know, in that dark space and connecting that to my art. You know, if I thought that I had done something wrong, you know, why wasn't he showing up for me? And so when you go and you in the back of your head or thinking that I had done something wrong, why wasn't he showing up for me? And so when you go and you in the back of your head are thinking that you're doing something wrong, that your own dad isn't around,

if in your art you feel like people are not liking what it is that you're doing or they're judging you or whatever, it's so all, it's intertwined. The feeling of like them leaving you, like your dad left you, you never want to feel that. And so I had to get to a place where I was, I understood what that was, and I had to let go,

and I had to be okay with knowing that there's nothing wrong with me if folks don't want to come to my party. You know, even me hiding in the bathroom, they didn't want to come to my party, okay, that doesn't mean there's anything wrong with me. My dad it wasn't nothing wrong wrong with me while my dad wasn't around. He was struggling. He was battling and people are battling so many things. People are into different things that perhaps what you're you're doing doesn't

necessarily align with it or they just plain might not like it. And that's okay. But do you like you? I think it's so interesting when you start to connect to your childhood and how your parents raised you and what trauma did you go through. When you don't deal with it, there's just like this anger in you or there's this like resentment

and there's just a part of you, even if you don't wanna label that, like there's just something in you that you feel like you haven't resolved and a lot of times we don't have the perspective of kids of like oh like this wasn't intentional that my dad was doing this to like neglect me and make me feel abandoned but it happened and so two things can be true right like he wasn't trying to like inflict pain on you. He was going through something, but it affected you. And until you go through all of that, it's gonna influence the way that you move in life.

That you see life. But even you saying it's interesting, like it affected your art. I'm interested to know how did it affect your personal relationships with this theme of abandonment within you. It affected them for sure. Yeah, it was just like trust issues.

Breakups were intense. Cause it just mirrored that. But now there were moments where I was dating someone and we broke up and I just was like, I will never talk to this person again. The way they made me feel, I will never talk to this person again. The way they made me feel, I will never talk to them again. And after I started to go through therapy and I have an emotional support coach that I talked to,

after, which by the way, therapy, like we're benefiting from therapy. I just really wish that it was free for every person around the world. I really, really, really do wish that there was a fund that everybody could access to where they could have therapy, they could have somebody to talk to and work through. I do believe that we will be in a much better shape

as a community, as a nation, as a world. So I just wanted to say that. Because I feel like, damn, I wish everybody could experience these things. So I was like, I will never talk to this person again. And after I went through, you know, understanding and getting to the root of like my rejection, abandonment, trauma, you know what I did?

I thanked the person who I was in a relationship with and it did not work out for us. I thanked them, I said, you know what? And my emotional support coach said that I was gonna do that. It's like, you are going to thank this person because you know what this person did for you? They forced you to deal with something

that you were not going to deal with. They pushed you to go back to the root of the problem. You were not gonna do it, you were moving. You were too busy moving, you didn't have time. But that relationship, the ending of that specific relationship forced that. And I literally called that person and I thanked them. I said, thank you so much.

You have no idea. Like I was really walking around here hurt and you forced me to like, you know, and so they started sharing things with me. They were just like, I just wasn't ready. I was confused myself. I did not trust. It was going so well for us.

I'm so used to chaos that I didn't, I felt like this was not gonna end how I wanted it to end. I'm also dealing with rejection issues. So we just kinda healed through each other. And that, and it helped me in my other relationships. I was like, here are the things that I was doing because of my trauma. When I'm free from that trauma,

I'm like a really, really, really, like beautiful partner to have. And it just helped me to understand how I wanna show up for my future partners. Isn't that so interesting when you meet people in life that obviously again, like you needed to work on yourself to be able to have that hindsight and be like, wait, that was so helpful.

But like most of the time in life, in romantic partnerships, I feel like specifically like you can get so hurt by them, but that's not your family. So you're like, I can walk away, but you're always gonna learn something so incredible. And if you can get past that hurt initially, we really should be thanking all of our exes. Cause it's like, even if you cheated on me,

like I have partners in the past that I had so much resentment and anger. And I look back and I'm like, there's so much I learned about myself and my resilience and my worth. And it's like, had that not happened, of course there's moments in life where like, I wish no harm on anyone, but like certain themes that you can take,

find the good part of it rather than feeling so negative and angry because that gets us nowhere. That's interesting to hear you talk about like how you connected with that person at first being like, I'll never talk to you again. And then you're like, wait a second, thank you. Thank you, like fucking thank you.

And I will say though, I mean, I know it's like sometimes with exes, cause I also had an ex that was just like, man, I wish I really had this new version of you. Like when we were dating, I wish that I was around, that was the person you showed me. And I was just like, yeah, I agree. But listen, what do you want me to say? Like I wasn't ready, I was growing, I needed to grow.

And you know, I was growing, I needed to grow. I'm sorry. True, and you know what's interesting, I remember an ex I had kind of similar to that, but you also wonder, but if I was this new version of myself, we probably wouldn't have been together. Because you were attracted to me then,

we ended up for some reason. Because we were both toxic as hell. hell right we both were toxic and so like you can wish yeah it wouldn't you would we I would definitely would not this new version but I'm not dated right you know that that that that person I love you yes I love you but there's just no way that I could put myself back into that sort of like chaos. And it's like, again, it's like you're both growing. So for him to be even able to see your growth, phenomenal, love it, amazing.

But we probably needed to go on our own ways to actually get whole and good and feel healthy within ourselves. And maybe that's just not the right fit, but at the time it was. And so we can appreciate each other's growth, but we're not gonna grow together. We grew together and that's a beautiful thing.

I always want the best for people. Even if we're not together, as a human, that also helped contextualize breakups. It's like, even though we're not together, I don't want anything negative to happen to you. I don't want anything bad to happen to you. I don't want you to, I don't want anything bad to happen to you. As a human, I want the best for you. And if that means that it's not with me at that time

or at that season, then so be it. Yeah. If someone's listening to this and is like, wow, I really relate to you, maybe they had someone in their life that didn't show up for them and was constantly neglecting to be there and show up. What did actually working through that childhood trauma

like look like for you? Because I can see some people like, Janelle, how do I even begin to like repair this? Like, where do I start? Ooh. I mean, like I said, I just wish everybody could afford therapy. But if you can, try to get you a good therapist

that you can just talk freely to, that can help you like, and don't lie to them. Don't lie. Be transparent, tell the truth. Make sure that they're pushing you. And you need to not be afraid to do the work. It's gonna be painful. It's gonna be a lot of tears, a lot of crying,

a lot of just like confusion. But just know that you're growing. You know better, right? You're understanding you a lot more and sometimes that feels confusing to your body, to your cells because you're literally being rerouted. The way that your mind is being rewired. So it's gonna feel uncomfortable.

But just stay the course. Because I promise you that if you do the work, there is going to be, you're gonna be like, I never thought I would see the day. I literally never thought that I would be this person. It's like I planned, I sort of planned it out, but to live it out and to be living what I've dreamt about doing and the freedom in which I move,

because it's not that like, you're going to deal with issues and problems and things like that. But the way that I'm so solid with myself now, I didn't know, you know, I was free but there are levels to it. Yeah. There are levels to it. So just stay the course and you'll reach the next level. I love that advice because even hearing you talk,

it's like we all reach a point in life when we haven't dealt with our shit where it just starts coming up more and more. Relationships are failing, friendships are having issues, there's things at work, like it just starts to creep up. And those are usually the moments where in a good way, like you cannot deny you need to address it. And I love that you said it's so fucking uncomfortable.

But you gotta do the work because then you won't be uncomfortable. But you're going against something that you literally have been living this way your whole life. So you're going against the grain. You're going against yourself. Your future self is fighting your past version,

old version of yourself. Damn. It's like Looper in a sense, but different. Right, right. Anyway. You mentioned now that you have a good relationship with your father, and I can imagine there are people really relating to you today also of like,

how did you know it was time for, that you were gonna be able to forgive and have an actual relationship with your dad? I wanted it. You gotta want it too. Sometimes you're just like, I don't really want a relationship just because you birthed or helped bring me into this world.

Like as a person, you can be like, I don't really want this. And that's totally fine. I think I wanted it. Cause my dad is cool. Like my dad also had a music career, but drugs got in the way of that. And so me and him can talk music.

He understands like all my favorite artists or his favorite artists. When I put out Lipstick Lover, all of the art that I'm doing, my dad supports it. Like he's like, I want you to know as your dad, I think what you're doing is brave, is sick as fuck. I love you, I want you to know I got your back. Like as a black man living in this country,

I'm supporting you, my queer, non-binary, you know, artistic daughter, like I'm here for you. And I knew he always had that sort of, that's sort of where I get, both my parents are like shows. Like they could each have their own TV show. And people, they would not care about me. They'd be like, your mom and your dad, like, you know, they're not together

because they're very much so alike in many ways. You know, they're just super like flamboyant and their personalities can take up a room, but good sweet people. So with my dad, I always knew that like, when it was time to take risks, that was gonna be the person that was gonna affirm me. And I wanted that and I needed that.

And also for him, I wanted to give him another opportunity post like being sober to know me, you know, to know me. I think that for both of us we needed that. Like I needed to have the support of my dad and I felt like for him to have been, because he had also gone to prison. So he had been locked away for years and I was like, I want him to come out sober

and to know what it's like to receive love from me. Yeah. Was that? Not guilt. How old were you when your dad went to prison? I'm timeless. So. Yeah, it doesn't matter.

I was there. I was alive at some point. Yeah, I know. No, but I was, this was on and off, you know? Middle school, elementary school, high school, like always. You're so successful in so many different areas. Like you're an author, you're an actor, you're a singer. It's insane how talented you are.

And I'm thinking, again, it's always like, we never know what someone goes through. Like you rising to fame, having your father, having these struggles, were you ever just, was he still struggling when you first came up and started to get famous? Yeah, well no, that's when he sort of got clean. So that was great, that was good.

I needed that right at that time. Because I was gonna say like, damn, everyone probably seeing you in the tablets and everything like having all this success and yet you wanna repair a relationship with your father because there's nothing, everyone can relate. When you do something so good at work or at school or when you wanna call your parents.

Cause you know there's no one that's gonna be more proud of you. And so I appreciate you sharing that a little bit because it's like, yes, you have all the success and but family, and again, when I say family, I always make sure to clarify like, I don't care if they're blood. You don't have to be with people that abuse you

or whatever, whatever you consider who your family is to be able to repair relationships if you want it. It is kind of beautiful, because you get to share your life with people that love you and support you, and there's no jealousy. It's just like, we fucking love you. Like your mom outside the talent shows being like,

that's my baby. You're like, mom, stop. No, it's really cute. ["Darling, Darling"] You are very private about your dating life. Yeah. How have you decided to make that decision in this crazy Hollywood world that we live in? I just did I was like, hmm Just watching observing. I was like, you know the people that actually are more private Seem more happy to me

They just seemed more happy, you know, because it's like you don't have to worry about You know anybody seeing your partner over here and being like, oh, they're not, they assume that if you're not with them and they're seeing somebody else that you broke up and now you gotta go answer that question, you have to go do that. And perhaps maybe later on in life,

I'll open up a little more, but for now, I love having, I love, and it really is for the protection of them. Yeah. I don't want them to, you know, cause I can handle sort of like paparazzi or whatever, it's annoying sometimes, sometimes it's fun, I love messing with them, whatever,

but I never want anybody that I'm dating to ever feel pressure, because they didn't ask for it. You know, they didn't ask for it. So I just like to keep peace and harmony and no expectation from the public to gnar every move. I think that's really healthy, and I think in a weird way, I do always talk about on my show now,

I feel like people now more than ever can kind of relate to a lack of privacy, even if you have 500 followers. We have accessibility now to post as much as we want and I think there are people that feel societal pressure to post my partner with me because it's like, there's almost like social currency that comes with being this it couple and having it, whether you're in college or high school,

this is everywhere now where people are feeling pressured to prove something on the internet. And when you can actually step back from it, I'm not saying don't post on the internet, but try to find a balance within yourself of why are you actually doing this? something on the internet. And when you can actually step back from it, I'm not saying don't post on the internet, but try to find a balance within yourself. Why are you actually doing this? Why are you doing certain things?

Is it just to get the photo to prove something to people? It's just, it's not as healthy. Live some type of privacy is really good for yourself. Cause then you can also be with yourself, like, do I like this person? Or do I like how I'm doing this? Or do I even want to do this? You kind of have to like,

make sure you're not just doing it for the gram. Yeah, no, seriously. I think because it's the norm to people to be like, well, you must post your kids and who you're dating. And it's sort of like, that's the norm these days. Definitely, I don't feel like anybody should feel pressure. And I think that if you are in a relationship where they're like, if you don't post me, we're done.

I've had like people, we were just talking about this when we were on vacay and there was a question like, would you be upset if your partner did not post you on social media? And there were a lot of mixed questions, I mean answers, but I was just like, we have to talk about that first and foremost, and if we agree that we wanna keep things private, then no.

But also, if my love is defined by a post, you don't post me enough on social media, I really need to understand my own damn priorities in life. Is that really necessary for me? So I just think it's, for me it's not. I do think people should have conversations around it prior so that there are no expectations. Because it could hurt somebody's feeling too though

if they feel like you're trying to hide them. But that's deeper. That's like, y'all need to really, y'all need to really work through some things. Yeah. No, that's true. Cause I'm thinking about it. Like, I feel like there are some people that also now,

because social media has been like very, you know, prevalent for the past, I guess, like 10 something years, people may have been in relationships where someone was extremely adamant about posting them and they almost found like, when we're good, he posts me, when we're not, he doesn't post me. So when you go to your next relationship, I bet there are some people that have like lingering feelings

about like, well, why aren't you posting me? And someone could literally be like, cause I don't think we need to, I love you, we're sitting here together, isn't this better than us taking a selfie? So also check in with yourself be like, "'Cause I don't think we need to, I love you, we're sitting here together, isn't this better than us taking a selfie?" So also check in with yourself of like, are you comparing yourself to your friends or your past relationships?

Get on the same page as your current partner. Because they may not be being shady at all, they're actually like, no, I fucking love you and I don't feel like we need to. Or I wanna protect you from all of the scrutiny or the, you the, just things. Like that online world, it's its own matrix. And it's tough.

It's wild. What are you like in a relationship? Are you romantic? Are you dominant? Like what's the vibe over there? Ooh, that was also, we played this game called, oh God, I'm gonna, I gotta get the name of it.

Actually, it's a black guy who made the game, card game, so it's not a lot of us in that space, so I really, really have to get the name of it. Oh my God, it's the, anyway, one of the cards said- If you want, I can link it in the description. Okay. If you can have your team send it, I'll put it in.

You're so sweet. I got it, I got it. How sweet of you. Of course. Okay, but one of the cards said. I can link it in the description. Okay. If you can have your team send it. You're so sweet. I got it, I got it. How sweet of you? Of course. Okay, but one of the questions was like, what would your ex say about you? And we were just like, everybody was like, ooh wow, that's a good one.

I feel like now, I am, let me think. I mean, cause you know it's like, and so the question made me be like, well this is what I think about myself, but what if that isn't what they thought about me? Like okay, of course I'm gonna say glowing reviews

about me, you know, or maybe like a couple things that I need to work on, but you know, could have been some other things. So for me, if I was being honest in a relationship, I mean, I think I used to be a very, like, hard to know if I really loved them sort of person. Like, it was hard to get to my heart. Because I had just been hurt,

and I hadn't really, again, dealt with sort of that trauma or what it would feel like of somebody leaving me. I never wanted anybody to leave me and if they did I didn't want them to ever feel like I really loved you you know because like if you if I really told you that I really loved you and you we still didn't work then like wow what a stab in the heart, right? But now having gone to this new space, I'm a big communicator.

I believe in evolution, even in your partnerships. And even if you started out one way, I'm always open to us growing. And I wanna make sure that as we grow individually and as together, I've also been in polyamorous relationships as well, and I know what it's like to be with multiple partners. So it's very important that we're communicating

in real time about our feelings, and if things are coming up, like if one person feels like, okay, I'm having feelings of jealousy or I need some more time with both of you or how do we, if we need to work on some things, I like to know that. And I always welcome, you know, feedback.

I'm that type of person. Like I don't ever wanna be in a relationship where I'm thinking we're good and we're not. Yeah, like you're wondering, like what? Like just let me know. Yeah. Because I could probably adjust. We could adjust, perhaps it was a misunderstanding,

or perhaps like, oh, maybe you thought you knew me, or you knew how, you don't know how much I love you. I need to be more expressive in those things. And so I think I'm averse. I love it. So I can be dominant, sub. Like, you know, I'm non-binary as well. So I can go with the flow about things.

I love it. Meaning like I don't just consider myself like to be boxed in as like this type of partner. Like sometimes you need me to be more like water, okay? I need to be more like water. You need me to be more like water, okay? I need to be more like water. You need me to be more like a rock for us, okay? I'll be more like a rock for us. How did you know? Was there like a conversation or did you just know the moment when you first had your first polyamorous relationship? Like how did you know that you were comfortable with that dynamic? Well, I was already in a relationship and and the person who was

attracted To me was also attracted to my partner and so they made it very clear and we just made it work Okay, would you would you continue to have those type of relationships again? Like are you still interested in that or has anything changed? Sure I'm open to love. You know I'm like I think you know I love going to weddings and you know there are certain traditions that I love and congratulations I know you're engaged. Thank you. So I honor love and I think though love comes in different different variations and that is what I love about polyamory is it just shows us like,

just in the same way like I don't have just one best friend. I have multiple best friends and I love y'all. We love each other and we can all hang out. I don't just love one parent. I don't just love one aunt. I love all of you. And in relationships, I don't just love one aunt, like I love all of you. And in relationships, you know,

I think intimate relationships, partnerships, I think that if we can talk about what we need and what works for all of us, and I'll tell you, like it takes a lot of unlearning. Because we're conditioned, especially in this society, that this is what a union looks like. This is what, you know, it's two people in a relationship. You know?

It's like, so you're fighting against, or not fighting against, but you're constantly having to unlearn the traditional way of what love looks like. And so I love to, by being my authentic self and us being our authentic selves, challenge that notion. Yeah, I love that because what is very frustrating, and I love having conversations like this on my show, because you're right, we were all raised

with something that was like, this is the norm. And it's like, I'm so happy finally. I mean, there's still so much work to be done, but like even with sexuality and fluidity, it's just like, it's very frustrating, I think for people that see it so clearly, like let everyone do what they wanna do. And then people that are still so stuck in the way

that they want things to have been done for thousands of years prior, when you speak about polyamory, I can imagine there are people that are so judgmental of even that word. How do you even do that? And it's so small-minded and it's also half the people that are saying that are speaking from a place of insecurity because I've seen people do it and be like, isn't he cheating on his wife? And it's like, there's so much judgment, when something really frustrates someone,

I always believe, there's something internally that is getting you going, because why do you care so much? But how did you, I'm assuming at some point, you have dealt with judgment, and to anyone listening that's also maybe going against the norm, which fuck the norm, let's just make everything normal. How did you deal with that?

Yeah, always, always, always. People are intrigued, people think, I think all sorts of things, but I think education is important. I mean, we have the internet, people can look things up. And I mean, my close friends are super supportive. Certain family members have been like, hmm, but for the most part,

my circle of people that I have around have been supportive, even if they have questions and they wonder like, okay, all right, because also people are trying to figure out, well, hmm, is that what I need or what we need or? Cuz I definitely been cheating on my significant other for a very long time, but what if after all we just Needed a third we needed somebody else. You know that that loved us and we love them To to to be a part of our union, You know, people are, and people are scared.

I understand that too. Some people are scared to go against tradition and you know, some people come from conservative environments. I came from, you know, a conservative Baptist background where I was taught to fear everything. You know, even getting into the music industry, I was taught to just fear, you know,

don't be like this artist or don't be like that or, you know, it's just been a lot of unlearning. And I get that. And I think, I think though for me, I have to know that this is my life here on earth. I wasn't put here to follow every rule. I was put here to help every rule. I was put here to help rewrite them.

Yeah, I really appreciate you talking about that because it's just such a prevalent topic that still is, again, we have so much movement that we need to keep doing, but I think having conversations like this help. I'm curious to know, how did you decide, obviously being a public figure, to speak openly about your sexuality? Ooh like how did you decide obviously being a public figure to speak openly about your sexuality? Oh

how did I decide it's sort of like Decide it for me because my art is a direct reflection of who I am. Mm-hmm You know, I I have Metropolis, which is my first EP I have a lot of independent work I put out before that and then I did the Arch Android my first full length album, Sweets. Then I did the Electric Lady, Dirty Computer and all the way now to the Age of Pleasure and all those projects that have come out. I discovered that, I mean I knew when I was a child that I was attracted to not just boys

but to women and to energies. I knew that and because of my sort of conservative Baptist upbringing, it wasn't welcomed. I suppressed my sexuality, I suppressed my sensuality, I suppressed so much of me because I didn't feel safe. And so once I got to a place where okay, I know for sure for sure that you know I am attracted to these energies I'm gonna honor that

and with each project you could hear me and feel me getting more brave. You know, I created the android, Cindy Mayweather, who is representative of, in my work, who's representative of the other, you know, the queer person, the black person, the non-binary person, trans, all of us who are pushed to the margins of society. the black person, the non-binary person, trans, all of us who are pushed to the margins of society.

And so I use that as a form of coping, a coping mechanism until I was brave enough to actually say it. And I think I was always dropping hints and I was getting more brave and less afraid. and I was getting more brave and less afraid. And then finally, because also I was in a relationship in what some would say, it was a lot of things. Like understanding polyamory was something

that I wanted to explore. Well, if you're already in a relationship, you have to go have conversations with that person's family. Well, what does that mean for you guys? So I could not talk publicly about certain things because they impacted my real everyday life. You know what I'm saying? Like when I got off the stage,

I would also have to go see these communities that I was a part of. And like, if they heard about it through, you know, any other thing outside of like me saying it, then what does that mean? And I just wasn't ready to have those sorts of conversations. And so I guess to answer your question,

like, you know, I just got brave over time. And once I also felt like I had community because the albums and the art and music, what it also does is it signals like hey I'm out here I'm out here and then you meet people who come to your shows and you meet other artists and people other humans who like are like oh I identify with that or I fuck with that and then we become friends and you have a community now that supports you that sees you that even if your family you were born into

doesn't support you or see you, you have support. And so once I felt supported and I felt safe enough, that's when I started to become even more brave and I started to be courageous in the way that I started to live my life. And I think right now what I am doing, I've done this privately, is that I'm honoring all of me.

I'm not closing off my sensuality anymore. I'm not closing off my sexuality, my polyamory. If you listen to Only Have Eyes 42, that's honoring that sort of union. If you're listening to Hot From the Age of Pleasure or Champagne Shit or even Float, you know? You know, I'm feeling much lighter now on Float. I had to let some things go to get to this place

and fear of not being accepted was one of them. And once I got over that hump, everything started to change for me. Community, when you were saying that, I'm like, I hope everyone listening, if you're sitting listening to this or watching this in your room and you haven't been able to fully embrace your sexuality,

whether it's people around you, you're afraid how they're gonna accept you, there are so many people out there that will love you and are so having the same feelings as you. And so just don't limit yourself to just the people that you've been assigned as family to you. Absolutely, it gets better. It does.

Yep, as you start walking, whenever you're ready, don't feel pressure too. Cause I mean, there were moments where I felt the pressure to talk. Like interviewers would, they would just speculate based on my appearance because I was wearing a suit. They were like, hmm, you're a lesbian. That's what I would get.

You're a lesbian. And as I was trying to discover who I was and I didn't identify with being a lesbian, and I had lesbian friends, I love my lesbian family, but people would say certain things and try to force me to out what I was. Well, if you're not a lesbian, then what are you? And so I wasn't ready.

So don't feel, also feel pressured to talk about your sexuality. It is a private, it can be as private or as public as you want it to be. For me, it was seeping out into my art so much that I'm like, yeah, this is me. This is who I am. And I wanted to also free a lot of people

who were in their rooms, who could be in their rooms right now listening. Like you have family, you have a church, even outside of the church that you went to, if they disown you, there is a big church around the world with people who will affirm you people who are like you your identity is not new like it's been happening we're here we're showing up for each other and i love you i love you When I was researching, I read somewhere you don't refer to opening up to others about your sexuality as coming out, but rather coming in.

Can you explain that? I didn't actually come up with that terminology of coming in. I just thought it resonated with me more. A guy by the name of John, I forgot his last name, but I heard him say it, and he's a queer black man, and I heard him, and I was like, that's exactly what it is.

It is bringing people, bringing people into our worlds. I'm letting you in on who I am versus like, you guys are the norm and I'm just like, hi, I'm out here. Like, no, I'm letting you in to my world, which is sacred, which should be respected and appreciated. Most certainly not apologetic about it.

I love that, you're so right, because it's like, I'm letting you in on who I am. I don't, you don't deserve me. I don't have to come out to you. I don't owe you anything. Exactly. Like when I feel comfortable, I'll let you in. Like come clean.

Yeah. You're, come out of the closet. Yeah. I'm sorry, I'll let you in. Like come clean. Yeah. You're come out of the closet. Yeah. I'm sorry. I've been here. You just must not have seen me. Or I'm not even, you must not have seen me. You must think that you and your,

or you know what? Let's not even talk about that. Nope. I was gonna go down a whole stream. It was me, I could too. I could too. Yeah. How about this? Do you have a mantra you come back to

when it comes to people who actively do not agree with the way that you live? Ooh, yeah I do. I have so much. I wish I had my phone with me. But I think it comes down to power. I think when you give your power up to folks, people's opinions have more power over you

than how you feel about you. That's, I think, where things take that turn, where the depression sets in, where the constant need for approval comes in. And I think I'm a powerful-ass motherfucker, really. Just as you're powerful, we're all powerful, right? We all hold gifts that we have. And I think that, you know, again,

how I think about myself has to be more powerful than someone who is trying to take me down through their negativity, who is trying to oppress me through their fear. My power and my love for myself is greater than that. Mic drop. Yeah. Mic drop. What is something when it comes to dating and love

that you know now that you wish you knew when you were younger? Oof. Sheesh. Man, I would say, I wish I had discovered vibrators a long time ago. Like honestly, it's so fun to experience that with your partner.

It's phenomenal. It's so great. It's like what, going to the sex shop? Like I remember when I first went, see again when you come from those sort of like conservative backgrounds, a sex shop, I was full sunglasses on, like do not have me in here, oh my God,

what am I, oh my God, please nobody take photos of me. Like I did not know. I did not know the world of vibrators. I did not know the world of vibrators. I did not know the clitoral stimulation that you and your, the fun y'all can have with one. You know, it doesn't necessarily have to be penetration. It's life changing. Right, how about you?

I remember I didn't have one and my friend bought me one for my birthday in college. And I remember like the first time I tried something was the back of my electric toothbrush. And I was like- I ain't gon' front. The electric toothbrushes, if you forget, just go buy you a brand new one.

It slaps. It's got me through. It's got me through. It is a lifesaver. And so I felt the same way though of, my friend got me my first one and then I was like, oh my God, I never have to have sex again. This is amazing.

It just allowed me to recognize that I hold the power of my own orgasm and I don't need someone else to make me feel amazing. I can do it myself because being taught, we grow up and it's just like, the men will do this for you and I'm like, why am I gonna wait for a motherfucker to give me an orgasm? Like, this is amazing.

Don't wait for a man or anyone to give you, you can do it yourself. So I remember, I felt the same way in New York. I remember the first sex shop I went to with my friend. I was not famous, but I was mortified just being like, I just can't make eye contact. And I think that just comes from shame of we're not normalizing, exploring your sexuality

and enjoying, especially as women, enjoying sex, loving sex, being connected with your body. And I think it's so important that we start to have those conversations at younger ages, obviously in a safe way, but especially for young girls, you just start to feel shame and you're doing something wrong. And that's why so many women, I truly believe,

we have such a hard time in the beginning figuring out what works for us and knowing how to get off because it was basically don't touch yourself, you're a whore, you're a slut. And it's like, what? Or you're a deviant or touching yourself, gross. If it was not, you go get a boyfriend and or touching yourself, gross. If it was not, you go get a boyfriend and y'all, wait, but don't have sex actually until you're married.

So go marry to have sex. I have cousins who actually married women just to have sex because they were just like, God won't. It's a lie, it's a lie. And I will always just like, God won't. It's a lie, it's a lie. And I will always just say, my heart goes out to those of us who have clitorises. And not just those of us who are with clitorises, even for those of us who have penises or whatever it is,

the pleasure that we can give ourselves, like how that was stripped away from us. I just hope that we can reconnect again with our bodies and reclaim our bodies. That's the space that I'm in. Like I am reclaiming my sensuality, my sexuality, my pleasure, my pleasure. Like unapologetically, like I'm not apologizing

for talking about it, for taking time to myself to make up for lost times. I mean, I think I could have avoided a lot of just even sexual interactions with people who I didn't really like, but I just was like, well, this is the only way that I can feel less shame about sex is if I do it with this person.

But like that leads to so much confusion sometimes if you don't really, really, really like this person and they don't really, really like you. And it's a whole thing. And so I think you actually avoid, you have less stress when you take matters into your own hands, literally. Absolutely.

Okay, everyone listening today, we are entering our era of the art of pleasure. Okay, we're taking it into our own hands. Yes, we are. I know we've been kind of like essentially talking about this whole episode because we're talking about pleasure and finding our own voices to find that pleasure.

But what has been the most rewarding part of making this soundtrack for you? Yeah, I mean, just like, you know, we're talking about it's a soundtrack to a lifestyle. And I think so many people, you know, that I'm hearing, that's why I can't wait to go on tour. I'm on tour. Our first show is in Seattle, the end of August. I'm on tour, our first show is in Seattle,

the end of August, we're on tour, so get your tickets. We have some more, a little bit more available, but they're selling out right now, and I'll be on tour in North America through October 21st, the Age of Pleasure Tour, and so to see how people are making this their album, owning it. And like with their friends, I see them just certain songs are like,

oh my God, you're speaking to my heart. Like I needed to hear Float. I needed to give myself permission to let things go and to go into my, you know, a stage of like what hot is talking about. Like I look good, I look sexy, I look handsome. Like non-binary folks are feeling seen, trans folks are being seen.

Like the community in which I intended for it to be, and even outside of that, I think that you don't necessarily have to be a part of my community to vibe with it. I think that what it just represents is like, even in the midst of chaos, you got to find your pleasure. You have to make time for yourself. And I actually brought you something.

What? What? Oh my god. Well, I was gonna say it's so cute. No, it's so cute. You know mine. Wait, I was gonna say, it's so cute. No, wait, it's so cute. You know I'm gonna do this. Like, it's so cute. I wanted to bring you. This is so sweet.

A shirt. And if you need another size. No, this is so good. I'll give you another one. No, can I cut it, like you? Yes, cut it like me. I'm just copying you. But I've been staring at it and like it's such a vibe.

It's yours. Thank you, thank you. I adore you. It's so dope. I wanted to bring you a hand. This is so good. A handwritten autographed, that's what I meant to say.

I autographed you a copy of my book that I released in 2021 called The Memory Librarian. The Other Stories of Dirty Computer. And yes. This is bringing the gifts, right? And girl, I know you just got back from vacation. I did.

You're giving us all, you're getting us in our feels. We're all ready to go have sex with ourselves. Come on. We got a book, we got a shirt. Come on. Okay, to anyone that is like you got to tell us what is if you have to pick, what is your favorite song on the soundtrack? Oh, shoot. Wow. Everyone's gonna go listen to this one. It's so It's so, okay, it varies because all of them, man, I mean, I hate to say it, but it's not a long album.

I usually put out like, excuse me, like double albums and with this one, I wanted you to wanna replay it over and over and over again. I didn't wanna, excuse me, I didn't want it to be too long because this one was just on President Barack Obama's Song of Summer. Only have eyes 42. 42. So listen to that one. Love it. I mean, but I love every last song on this project. I'm having a hard time like figuring out what songs we're going to play on tour. I think I might have to just play all of them. I don't know, but because I love, I also thought about them from a live perspective and just how fun it's gonna be to perform Champagne Shit.

And I don't know, what songs were you vibing to? What are some of your favorites? I said Champagne Shit, is it called Phenomenal? I really like that one. Featuring Dochi. Yeah, it's a vibe where like, I don't know, I really like that one. Featuring Dochi. Yeah, it's a vibe where like, I don't know, I really like that one. But again, it feels like it's a story that's being told

and you're just like, it's almost like an anthem vibe where you're just like vibing the whole time. So I agree, I guess I could pick one too because you almost have to listen to it all together. All together, yeah. Start to finish and feel it. Because the dry red is good, the last song I love. When I was writing this album, I wrote it with friends.

I gotta give a shout out to Nate Rocket Wonder, to Bueno, to Nana Quabana, and also the features. Some of my favorite things is just to look down and be like, okay, Grace Jones is literally on this album. You know, Sister Nancy, who is like, bomb, bomb, you know, we can't go anywhere at a party without hearing her Jamaican influence, Patra, her Jamaican influence. When I think about Nia Long, who is an incredible actress coming and being a part of it. I'm array dochi Who else? Fela cutie son Shayun cutie

Horted lots of horns on this project Cks on this project. I don't know. It's just so like such a beautiful love letter to the diaspora and to To music that again has gotten us through. A lot of the influences come from a lot of my friends who were in, who are from Nigeria at our parties, Ghana, South Africa, LA, New York, know, all of us coming together and feeling safe, safe enough to explore, safe enough to be. Janelle, I can't thank you enough for coming and call her daddy.

This was truly such a pleasure. I am so happy I got to sit in the same room with you and feel your energy. Thank you, thank you, thank you. You are fantastic, Alex. Thank you so much for having me and all the beautiful work you do. Like, I don't really love doing lots of interviews,

but you have a very great way of connecting human to human with folks. And I'm sure people tell you that a lot, but I'll just say, like, I feel your aura and your energy through the screen. And just congratulations on everything. You're fantastic. You're lovely.

Thank you. Woo!