Call Her Daddy - Kristin Cavallari: So You Want to Date an Athlete? (REVISIT)

Episode Date: August 30, 2023

This week, Call Her Daddy is on a break, so we're revisiting a classic episode - Father Cooper's sit down with Kristin Cavallari. Can you imagine being in high school and having grown men with cameras following you around to stir up drama? Kristin can - and she reflects on those Laguna Beach days and explains why MTV should now be paying for the entire cast’s therapy. And, with Alex and Kristin well experienced in the world of hooking up with professional athletes, they give the inside scoop on what it’s like to date (or marry) one. Kristin opens up about her divorce - and how she knew when it was time to end her marriage to Jay Cutler. Kristin is hilariously honest and details a date gone horribly wrong with a stuntman, why she’s attracting an influx of 26 year olds, and what she looks for in a partner.

Hi, Daddy Gang. Although it's an off week for me, it is not an off week for you. I want to revisit one of my favorite episodes of the year, and I figured maybe you missed it, and maybe you didn't, but you want to watch it again. This is the Kristen Cavallari episode. I had so much fun when I recorded this with Kristen.

I grew up watching the hills, watching Laguna Beach. So to get to meet Kristen Cavallari and be like, you're literally the best same human being in person, gorgeous, funny, hilarious, best same human being in person. Gorgeous, funny, hilarious. I just couldn't take it. So daddy gang, enjoy this week's episode. Kristen, I love you. Have fun. Goodbye. What is up, daddy gang? It is your founding father alex cooper with call her daddy are we ready okay that laugh i i'm like i know it so well it's like so weird to be in person

with you now okay okay kristin cavallari welcome to Daddy. Thank you. I have always been a huge fan. Laguna, the Hills, owned all the DVDs, would watch with my sister, would binge watch. But another reason I was super excited to have you on was because I follow you on social media. Oh, thanks. I respect everything you're doing, your career, but specifically with your children, you deciding to not really show them and keep that part of their life private. I mean, I really, I really respect it. How did you decide to take that approach and protect your children by keeping them off social media? Well, thank you. Because a

lot of people don't understand it. Um, but if you go back to when I first joined Instagram, Camden, my oldest, is on there when he was a baby, a little bit. And then we just decided that we wanted to give them the opportunity to make that decision. You know, my kids may want no part of being known or whatever. And I want to respect that and give them that chance to decide when they're old enough. Yeah. I feel like that's like a huge debate on social media because so many people with social media are posting even like their infants. Yeah. And then there's the debate of like, wait, that's kind of fucked up because they don't have a say and now their whole life is going to be documented and then they're going to get to high school and people are going to be like, I have all these Instagram photos of you.

But I think it's a really good decision and I definitely want to do that when I have children. When do you think they'll get on social media? I hope not until they're like 20. You're like I'm not giving them a phone. They're never gonna be. 16 I'd say it's probably realistic and you know long enough where hopefully they have decently thick skin and can handle some criticism because ultimately like that's my biggest concern with it is just how nasty people can be on social media. Ruthless. Yeah, and when it's your kids, it's like, I want to do everything to protect them. there was no social media when you were growing up but I'm curious did you have aspirations at all to be on television I did and it wasn't really until high school but before MTV came I wanted to

study broadcast journalism and kind of work my way in the entertainment world through hosting. But then MTV came and everything just kind of fell in my lap. And I thought, well, you know, when I graduated high school, I moved up to LA. I started at Loyola Marymount. I literally went to one class, like literally one class. And then I booked a job on UPN, which you guys probably don't even remember that network, but it was a network back in the day. I was hosting a show. And so my excuse was, well, I'm traveling around the country. I obviously can't go to college. And not that I want to like promote not going to college,

but it's the best thing I ever could have done. College would have done nothing for me. Right, because you already kind of had a career set in stone because you started in high school, which is like not normal, especially for like television. You're in high school. Now we got to go through it. Okay. And MTV picks you to be on their new show. What did your parents say when you asked them if you could be on the show? Well, so I was living with my dad in Laguna Beach. My mom was in a suburb of Chicago.

My mom definitely had reservations because of the time MTV was a little scandalous at the time. You know, that was right after the Janet Jackson boob thing happened at the Super Bowl and they didn't have the best rep. And so she was a little worried, but my dad was all for it. And because I lived with my dad, I'm pretty sure I only had to have my dad sign off on it. You're like, mom, I'm not even doing it, dad. Why do you think your dad was OK with it? I think he saw the opportunity, you I mean he just did and and well also none of us knew what the show was gonna turn into you know my dad probably at the time was like oh cute a little home movie no

problem have fun it literally probably was like a school like school project dad it just happens to be from MTV and it's crazy because reality really, like no one had gotten famous from that yet. So it was kind of like an undiscovered concept. So I can kind of understand why parents would be like, sure. Yeah, it wasn't like it is today. No one knew, you know, I mean, obviously there was the real world at the time. I think the Simple Life had already happened and maybe the Osborne show. But other than that, there was nothing really. So yeah we this was uncharted territory we had no idea I'm trying

to picture myself in high school getting cast on a show I would have failed out I would have dropped out because no way dude how did you know you would have fucking crushed it that's the point though I would have been like I'm obsessed I get to go party with boys like how the fuck yeah that was me okay I was wondering like did it fully take over your life I mean yeah well yes and no yes in the sense that yes I mean that was like what everyone in Laguna Beach was talking about we filmed every weekend for like nine months or something but because we were still in high school I mean I was actually going to class still. And so during the weeks, you know, my life was normal. I was going to school, doing whatever I was doing. And then we would film, I think, sometimes Thursdays, but mostly Friday, Saturday, Sunday.

When you came out, did people that were in your school that weren't on the show treat you guys like different? No. OK. So what happened was the first season everybody auditioned right everyone did well and then when those people didn't get it fuck MTV that whole thing and then those people were on season two and I was like oh really right fuck MTV huh that pissed me off but I mean it's understandable and then when it aired the first aired, I was a senior in high school. Talyn and I were, everyone else graduated, went on to school. That was the one time the freshmen coming in looked at me a little differently. And I was like,

okay, this is weird. You talked about the fact that your relationship with your dad was hard to heal in therapy. When you were growing up, what was that core issue between the two of you? Well, my dad wasn't around a lot, to be honest. We were living in Connecticut before my parents got a divorce. And my dad had moved to Colorado. I think I saw him maybe like once a month, like for a while. And then in Colorado is when my parents got a divorce. And my dad shortly thereafter moved to Laguna Beach.

And I was still in Colorado. Then my mom got remarried and I moved to Chicago. And then my freshman year of high school is when I moved to Laguna, moved in with my dad, my stepmom, who was 20 years younger than my dad and my brother at the time who had also been broken up with. He moved to Laguna when I moved to Chicago. Um, and honestly, my dad and I were just never close, and I just remember in high school, I never wanted to be home. Like, I just never wanted to be around that environment, so that's why I think I fell into, like, friendships a lot and going out.

I was kind of the party girl, and I was just, you know, that's where I found connections. Did you want to move to Laguna? I sort of had to because I was getting in so much trouble in Chicago, and I had a major issue with my stepbrother. And like all of the pieces just fell into place for me to move. My mom wanted to ship me off to boarding school.

And my dad said, let me give it a go. Let me see if I can control this wild beast. So I moved to Laguna my freshman year of high school. And honestly, the best thing that's ever happened to me. What were you confident about in high school? And what were you insecure about? Well, it's funny because on Laguna Beach, everyone thought I was a super confident kid. And now that I've had to go back and watch the episodes for my podcast, I don't see a confident girl at all. I see actually someone who's incredibly insecure. You know,

that saying confidence is quiet, insecurity is loud. Well, I was that, you know they that saying confidence is quiet insecurity is loud well I was that you know I was overcompensating for my insane amount of insecurity and so I think most kids are a mess you know most high school kids you don't know the fuck you are at 17 years old but I I think really probably because I didn't have a family member in my life that I was really close to my mom my mom now is my best friend but at the time we were not close wasn't living with her you know I never wanted to be home so I think that was probably a large part of it for me that is really interesting because I think like watching it back sometimes when you're in your head about whatever your insecurity is for you you're like I kind of feel like I'm alone out here doing my fucking thing yeah you kind of just have to fake it till you make it

exactly was there anything when you were social with your peers that you were insecure about no I mean that's really where I kind of found my identity I think and so I moved around a lot growing up and I think because I was always the new girl, I was a survivor. Like you could throw me in any situation and I was going to figure it out. I knew how to navigate through situations. That's maybe where like the confidence came from because I wasn't someone who's going to like, you know, crawl in the corner and suffer. I was like, boom, here I am. Let's go.

But I was faking it though. That makes so much sense. I can completely relate to that where you're like, I'm about to walk in this room and I have two options. And so sometimes being like the loud one, it just gets you in the door. And it immediately, if you exude confidence, eventually you're going to fucking be confident. Yeah, exactly. Yeah.

If you had to guess, who would you be now if the MTV cameras never showed up to your high school? Oh my God. I love that question. I mean, I think, um, wow. If I was never on Laguna beach, I probably would have gone to school and, you know, did broadcast study broadcast journalism, hopefully would have worked my way. And still, I don't know. I feel like in a lot of ways, I probably wouldn't be as far along on my journey as I am today because ultimately being on TV at

such a young age and going through everything I've gone through over the years has really forced me to grow up a lot. I think the older we get, we realize life is building blocks and everything starts to make sense. And so I feel like just everything that I've been through, like, I feel like this was supposed to be my journey. So I can't, it's hard to sit here and be like, well, if not, because I just feel like I was destined for this. I think a lot of people are fascinated because like you said, high school is hard enough. Like high school is such an awkward time.

You're trying to figure out who the fuck you are. You're dealing with peer dynamics, family dynamics. How did it feel? And I think this is where we all are so fascinated with it because it's really not natural to have grownups with cameras in your face. Like I feel like your scenes were always like you chilling in bed with Alex in the morning, like discussing what happened the night before. But it's like, how did it feel having these grownups come into your life, stir up drama

and kind of like manipulate these storylines to get a good show going when you're in high school yeah it's a weird dynamic when you really explain it like that I mean my whole life I had trust issues but then really when you're 17 18 and you have adults taking advantage of you and manipulating situations and in a lot of, just straight up lying to your face. I mean, that'll rock your boat for sure. Trust is like my biggest issue with people. And so that obviously didn't help that situation. And now that I'm older and I've been on the other side of reality shows, like Very Cavallari, I was an executive producer, which was the best thing for me to end my reality TV career with that experience

because it left a really good taste in my mouth. But it was also really eye-opening to be involved in those conversations of like, oh, these are the storylines we're getting. And no matter what you do, they're going to get the storyline they want. So I understand from a producer's perspective, now that I'm an adult, why they do the things they do they have a job to do I get all of that I just think it's a tricky thing when you're dealing with children I mean we were kids you know that's where it's like ah it's tough it's really tough because in one part it became one of the biggest shows and then on the other and it's like yo you're in high school that's your life.

When you say they would lie to your face, can you give us an example of something you remember? Well, so I look at Laguna Beach and The Hills as two very different experiences. Laguna Beach was more just no one really ever told us what was going on or like what they were trying to do, you know. No one prepared us for what was coming. I just remember one producer in particular before it aired saying, well, you know, you can definitely tell that you're not from Laguna Beach.

And I was like, oh, OK, like, what does that mean? And then it came out and I was like, oh, you mean because everyone's going to fucking hate me? And this is so not who I am, you know, but like, I don't know, a bigger heads up would have been nice. How much you guys fucked with me that kind of stuff when you say fucked with you are you saying like they really leaned in to try to make you that villain oh yeah oh yeah oh yeah and that's why I've really loved doing the back to the beach podcast with Steven because we literally go through scene by scene and break

it down and it's been therapeutic for me it's been eye-opening it's been really fun also just to break it all down because I'm not emotionally invested in it anymore where at the time I remember Steven being like that's not how it went down but I couldn't hear him or believe him because I was so upset about it and so yeah being able to go back and watch it and just get to the bottom of it I've loved every second of it when you realize like, I look like the villain in this. What the fuck did that do to you mentally? I was I was pretty wrecked for a while. I was so upset. I was really upset when I saw the first episode. It was hard. It was you and Lauren Conrad. Essentially, the first premise was like you guys fighting over a guy. Yeah. Did you and

Lauren? Was it really only over Steven or were you two just two personalities that probably would have always butt heads regardless of with if a guy was involved well we were never friends but we never fought or anything you know and so MTV coming definitely made it a way bigger thing than it ever was and Lauren and Steven did have something but it was before MTV came. And then of course MTV caught wind of that. That was like the only thing they focused on. And in a lot of ways, try to keep it alive. And that was where I felt really threatened. And so I put up walls. I was all, I knew how to do at age 17. Um, and so, yeah, it's, it goes back

to that thing where I was always a survivor. And so if I felt like, you know, threatened and people were like coming after something that was mine, aka my boyfriend or whatever it was, I was going to get scrappy. I mean, that's just what I knew how to do. I have had many of your now castmates on. I've heard. And being on Laguna Beach and the hills and getting to like directly interact with Adam DeVello. What was your experience with him? I mean, it was it was never great.

I had my issues with Adam without a doubt. And again, I mean, I kind of said it earlier, but I understand now as an adult why he did the things he did. It's not that I agree with them, but I mean, he had a job to do. I think my biggest issue with what Adam did was he would create these storylines on the show that were bullshit, but then he would go and feed them to the tabloids. So not only are you living this shit on the show, but then I'm having to answer questions and the tabloids and people are painting this picture of me, which isn't true at all. And again, I get it because the tabloids fueled the show. And, you know, at the end of the day, it's all fine. It's all worked out. But I had my issues with Adam for sure. I don't think he's

a good person, but I think he's a great producer. I'm actually kind of upset, though, because Stephen and I were supposed to have him on our podcast. And he, you know, had us going around and around and around. And then two days before we were supposed to film, he pulled out. And it's just shitty because, A, you could have told us up front. And, B, he totally opened up my career, right? Started my career. But we also started his career.

Like, without the cast of season one of Laguna Beach Adam wouldn't be what he is either so I just felt like why can't you come on it's a mutual respect thing answer some questions about how the show is created and we'll call it a day you kind of made him because yeah he had like the format but if you guys didn't show the fuck up and do your iconic scenes like there was not going to be a huge media mogul moment for MTV in that category so it's like Spencer did talk about what happened with Heidi did you know about that and do you know no because that was before I had come on the show um my issue with him was a bribing situation and him creating the storyline that I was doing drugs and was out of control.

I partied my ass off in my early 20s. I had a really good time. I don't regret anything. I was never out of control. It was never cause for concern. I was never not showering, which is like what Us Weekly had said, that I needed to go to rehab and all this shit. And so that wasn't cool I remember that yeah he bribed the girls to call me out on camera for doing drugs with a purse so but and

that was difficult and Adam and I got in a huge fight about it and because what I was doing then because then he fueled it to Us Weekly I would be on camera filming and I'd be like I know it was Adam like going around just running my mouth right And Adam called me and he was like, you have to stop saying that. I was like, but you did. That's also fucked. And I think that's where I think it's fair for you guys.

You're not discrediting the show. Even you sit here and you're saying great producer. He knows what the fuck he's doing. But I do think it's fair to clear your name because I was going to ask you that about like, there was that huge sin. I remember with the Hills where it was like, she's on drugs. She spun out and they like got you when you like just woke up and they were the girls were like trying to have an intervention and I was like is Kristen really on drugs

intervention and not that fucks with you because your kids are gonna watch that one day like and so I think it's fair for you to be able to at least clear your fucking name with yeah I party like I'm not gonna sit here and say I never did I had a lot of fun yeah I'm glad that I did I got everything out of my system but it was never I never needed rehab no one in my life was concerned about me like it it was totally under control I love if there's if you can be a partier that's under control but uh yeah and I yeah so and I just hope that low learned you always have to get that shit in writing, you know? Because she never got her purse. She didn't?

No. Stop. What kind of purse was it? I don't even remember. I want to say it was a Birkin. It was a Birkin. Shut the fuck up. Yeah, but you got to get that shit in writing.

Absolutely. I would have been like, give it to me first and then I'll show up. Exactly. Damn, no Birkin for Lo. Sorry, girl. And no rehab for Kristen. I hope it was worth it. When you look back, young Kristen is like in that moment, cameras around.

What were the perks of having this show in your life? And then what was like the most negative part that you look back on now with perspective? I mean, the perks were it was fun. I would get phone calls being in, you know, whatever class during senior year and MTV would be like, hey, can you fly to New York tonight to be on TRL tomorrow? I'm like, yes, absolutely. Like that stuff is fun. You know? I mean, so there was a lot of cool things going to the MTV VMAs and all that stuff was really fun. I mean, I was still in high school, so it's not like I was getting great dinner reservations and stuff, you know, but when I graduated high school and we moved up to LA, yeah. Like I never waited in a

line at a club or a restaurant. Like that was, it was fun. It was very, very fun. Um, and then the biggest downfall I'd say, and well, I guess, okay. More so back in the day was the tabloid world, that aspect of it. Now I'm not so much in the tabloids like I was back in the day, but what I don't like now is every time I feel like I do an interview, like what they take, they'll take nothing and turn it into headlines for clickbait. And that shit really pisses me off still. Like I just did another podcast

and we were talking about dating and I guess we were talking about Instagram. And I said that I only noticed the verified ones because they go to the top. I'm not like, and we were like joking around. So now all these fucking articles are like, Kristen's using Instagram as a dating app. And it go to the top. I'm not like, and we were like joking around. So now all these fucking articles are like, Kristen's using Instagram as a dating app. And it's like,

no, I'm not. That's not what I was saying. Right. No, I do. I totally get that. Like the spinning of the words and it almost makes you like not want to do

shit. It makes me not want to talk, which I think you do love to talk though. I know, but I feel like in the last few years I don't talk as much because I, I'm not, people probably don't know this about me. They probably think I love in the last few years I don't talk as much because I I'm not people probably don't know this about me they probably think I love all the attention I actually don't unless it's for something positive like my company like uncommon James or something that I'm

like all right that's great but I really I don't care about being in the press or the tabloids I really don't is MTV paying for everyone's therapy? They should be, but no. They didn't offer? No. And actually, Stephen told me on our podcast that they gave him a speech coach. And I'm like, really? Because I probably needed one out of everybody. And they didn't offer me that.

They offered him? Wait, back when he was in Laguna? Yeah. Did he need a speech coach? I didn't think so. I did. I'm like, that would have gone against the character they wanted me to be. Right.

Like rough around the edges, like wild Kristen. How do you think having your first relationship, like serious first love and relationship air on TV impacted your future relationships? Oh, um, I don't think my relationship being on camera affected my future relationships. I think just being in the press then affected my future relationships. And again, it goes back to that whole trust thing. Unfortunately, I've had to be careful with guys that I date because a lot of guys, or what I have found is a few different things. They get a little taste of fame and they lose their mind. They become addicted to it almost.

Or it's really threatening for a lot of guys so then they want they get really jealous and insecure about it so that's been really tricky for me wait when you say they get addicted like how can you immediately tell like oh fuck he's turned it takes me a second right um you can just tell like what I can't fucking stand is when a guy will plant bread clump bread crumbs. You know that. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. On Instagram. Like I dated a guy. I dated a guy who would come to Nashville and he would like tag the location. And I'm like, why? You've never tagged a location in your life. Why are you now?

That shit. I can't. Because it's so purposeful. Like he's looking to kind of be like I hope this gets picked up by someone and I hope there's an article like are they seeing each other like you're disgusting right you're like I don't even know you that well we're trying to get to know each other like before we actually start dating like chill the fuck out or what I've noticed if if it's not about the guy the attention they do not like that so then they're like oh you know like totally because it's not about you uh-huh so you married someone that was famous and was in the public eye how did you meet

Jay Cutler so I um well I got a call from my publicist in 2009 when I was still filming the hills and he said Jay Cutler wants to fly you to Chicago and take you on a date and I had no idea in 2009 when I was still filming the Hills. And he said, Jay Cutler wants to fly you to Chicago and take you on a date. And I had no idea who he was. And I just wasn't interested, quite honestly. So I said no. I obviously told my mom about it, though, because a year later, I was visiting my mom, who lives in a suburb of Chicago. And we were going to a Bears preseason game with my cousin for, actually,

my friend Matt Leinart, who was playing on the opposing team. And my mom said, you know, didn't Jay Cutler ask you out? And I was like, oh, yeah, I totally forgot about that. My cousin, who is like the biggest Bears fan, told me what an idiot I am. So long story short, I got his family passes to meet him after the game thinking I would never talk to Jay ever again. And, you know, but my cousin would be like over the moon about it. And he walked in and he was a lot cuter in person. And we hung out two nights later. And then honestly, we just moved so fast. I mean, we got engaged after eight months and it just moved. What initially attracted you to him? So at the time, I remember my life felt

very claustrophobic living in L.A. I couldn't leave my house without a million paparazzi every day. And I just was over it. Every guy in L.A. I felt like was a little bitch, to be completely honest. And I wanted someone who could like be the alpha because I felt like everything in my life, I was always the alpha. So I wanted to be in the passenger seat for once. Jay checked all of those boxes. um and honestly we just had chemistry like you can't pick and choose who you like like you know what I'm saying and so it we just had that spark and uh and yeah so with where I was

at at the time in my life it was he was perfect for me I wanted to discuss dating an athlete and marrying an athlete because I've dated I was gonna say a few I've dated a lot of athletes okay everyone knows I've dated a lot of athletes had serious relationships flings whatever and they're an interesting breed yeah was Jay your first professional athlete that you dated no I have a few under my belt as well you kind of already of already knew kind of the game. You know, it helps when you have them under your belt. Cause you kind of know. I get that world. So well, so well. You have like the whole playbook ready to go. Like musicians, fucking insane. I won't go near another one, but athletes, I could do that world. Oh, they're all the fucking thing. I can do that shit in my sleep. Absolutely. What were some of the perks of dating a pro athlete in your mind?

Well, in Chicago, I mean, he was a huge deal, you know? And so it was like instead of me always having to get a dinner reservation, like Jay could fucking do it. Like dumb shit like that, though. But it mattered at the time. Life was just it was easy and fun with him. Totally. You know?

Did you fit in with the other players' wives? Yeah, I did. You did? I did you did I did see I didn't as well because they would want me to go to a luncheon or like there's a lot of that shit which I wasn't I couldn't do no but like yeah we all got along you got along yeah but maybe you weren't like at all the luncheons with like oh god no I don't think I went to a bear's luncheon until like my last season there with them I was like all right they would always ask me and I'd be like ladies I gotta go to work and they'd like, but we have a luncheon at noon on Wednesday.

Yeah, you're like, sorry. Sorry. No, but they are sweet. They are sweet. What I found was most of them had been together since they were like 18. So many of them. And I guess I get it. And I think that's where maybe it was cool because you had a different dynamic where

like a lot of them try to stay with the people that knew them before they got big. Right. And you and Jay had a different dynamic because you both were big in your own right. So there could kind of be this just mutual like we both have our own things going on. Yeah. That makes sense. What were some of the hardest aspects of being married to someone whose job is to play football? Well, I mean, I love someone who has their own shit going on.

So that was great. But I think the hardest part was watching him get the shit beat out of him week after week. You know, football is a really tough sport. And so that was difficult, especially after we had kids, too. You know, then things just become even more serious. But other than that, loved the schedule, loved him traveling, loved him going like, I please go do you, you know?

Yeah. I also feel like football is like one of the better schedules. It's not bad all baseball it's like I'll see you never bye also that's why they have girlfriends in every city every single city they would always call it like road beef and I was like excuse me why are you saying this in front of me and my boyfriend's friends would always be like our road beef in like Minnesota I dated a baseball player who actually sent flowers to me and one of my friends on Valentineentine's day i mean this is so long ago but um yeah i was like oh like they have no shame no shame no shame they're like what no litter and totally told me he had a girlfriend up in san francisco like i mean oh yeah

i was like okay well hey there's something about the honesty wait they're like but like she's my girlfriend in that city you're like like, you're here. Why? Why not? Did you ever worry about Jay's behavior on the road when he was gone? I didn't. And that's why football is actually a good sport because they're gone for one night. They have curfew the night before. It's the night before a game.

As soon as the game's over, they get right on a plane and come home. There's no room. There's no room for that behavior. They do. And they have and they will continue to. But at the time, I didn't have any reason to suspect. How did the dynamic of your marriage change once Jay retired? I mean, it actually kind of didn't. And we started very Cavallari right away.

And so it kind of didn't. He was just around a lot more. OK, so you guys were getting to spend more time. A lot more time. Yeah. Initially, when you got engaged, you postponed the wedding. You said one of the reasons was you didn't want to be a stay at home wife. What made you think that you would have to be staying at home if you got married?

I mean, it was so much bigger than that, though. I think I probably said that at the time to like say something and move on but um basically I ended the or I called off the engagement the same reason I got a divorce same reasons I should say and so I guess if there's any takeaway from that is you can't ignore red flags people don't change and you got to trust your gut I was 23 when I met Jay you know I was a baby and at the time in my life getting married and having kids was the next natural step I'd gotten everything out of my system and I don't regret anything at all and I really am thankful for our time together but um yeah I just think you know now I'm so different dating I see shit a mile away and now it's like no I'm actually not gonna put up with that because you know, now I'm so different dating. I see shit a mile away. And now it's like, no, I'm actually not going to put up with that.

Because you know what it is now for me? It's a huge turn off. Instead of being like, oh, well, you know, maybe he'll change. Maybe we could fix him. It's like, no, no, no, no. Goodbye. I don't have time for that anymore. You say it wasn't because of loss of love that you guys got divorced, but because you

couldn't be in a toxic relationship anymore. What was toxic about it? So here's my only thing, because I have three kids with him. I'm very careful about what I say. If you and I didn't have microphones in front of us, I'd fucking tell you. But, you know, that's their dad. And my oldest Googles us now. And I just want to be very careful my mom never said anything bad about my dad growing up and I really respected that and I want to be that kind of mom and even if I don't say anything the headlines will say I fucking trashed him somehow so I just you know it was toxic I think period end of story that's all I kind of need to say when did your family and friends realize forever

they did okay because I know sometimes you can like try to hide it because I actually yeah okay I kind of hid it from some of my friends my mom knew every step of the way and my best friend Stephanie um who's in Chicago but like Justin my best friend he didn't realize it until he moved to Nashville and then he saw it firsthand when you get to a place where you are trying to hide stuff from your friends or your family, that's also a red flag for yourself. Like, why aren't you telling your friends? It's so true. And then it's like to get out. And then it's almost harder once you're so deep in it by yourself that then to try to. You're a lone ranger just on your own island. And then you're like, how do I even tell my friends? Because I've been faking this for so long. But you're saying your family knew. So you weren't fully alone. Yeah, my mom knew. My mom

knew. And, you know, because my mom went through some similar stuff with my dad. She was actually the perfect person for me to have. She understood what I was going through. And so that that was good. I also think it's really important if you do have issues with your your dad for, you know, obviously for girls, especially to work through that shit before you get married because otherwise we end up with our dad when you think you have any fucking issues with just even like your family yeah your parents that shit if you don't work on that you're about to turn right around and do the same fucking shit and so it can be a little bit of like a daunting process but you have to work through it or you're gonna marry your father exactly when you are breaking up with someone it fucking sucks yeah even if you no matter what side you're no matter what yeah and what is worse especially

with social media is like it's hard to see someone move on yeah how did it make you feel or does it make you feel like if you still see or when if he's like out with other people like I hope that he finds someone yeah I really do I mean I want him happy my kids benefit from that you know so I hope that he gets remarried and I mean I really do obviously the first time I heard about it it stung a little yeah that's anybody you know but totally and I'm friends with almost all of my exes and I I I think that that's a good thing like I really value the time I've had with everybody I've learned from every relationship I've had and I really want all of my exes to be happy and be in a great relationship

for young women listening it's fucking hard to end something that especially I'm sure when you have children like you've deep ties with someone there is love there because what you've created the world you've created with this person but when you know something's not right for you how did you like mentally work through ending it officially because that yeah it's scary it's really scary I mean it took me a few years to actually pull the trigger to be honest for you was it just time or were you finally like okay something happened like now I'm gonna do it no it was more just time it was like nothing major happened at the end you know it was just time and I remember always asking my mom like

well how am I gonna know and she would be like you'll just know and I did I just kind of knew and you know it's the scariest thing it's also the saddest thing I mean it's so many emotions but it can also be the best thing you know and so I really don't think anything good comes easy really like with anything in life and so but also you don't want to like just make an impulsive decision either. And I think that's why it's important to ride it out. I've also seen couples that have worked through shit and come out on the other side, you know? So, I mean, you, I think with any relationship, you just have to realize what are deal breakers for you, what's important to you and what's not. And I was really unhappy. I mean, and that was the bottom line and I was in an unhealthy

relationship. And so that to me is not worth it. Also, I didn't want my kids and that was the bottom line. And I was in an unhealthy relationship. And so that to me is not worth it. Also, I didn't want my kids thinking that was normal. And, you know, I wanted them to see me happy and see me eventually, not right now, but eventually see me with someone who really respects me and treats me the way I need to be treated. okay you are now recording a laguna beach rewatch podcast with your ex-boyfriend in high school i don't know if i could ever fucking sit down with my ex-boyfriend and be like, let's. And also the fact that you have to rewatch it. I know.

It's like, holy fuck. Do you see yourself ever hooking up with Steven again? No. I went to dinner with him almost two years ago and we kissed, which was fun. I mean, we had had a couple of drinks and yeah, we were, yeah, it was just fun, you know? Right. And then I was actually dating someone at the time, you know, I'm just making up for lost time. And so I think that was kind of what the issue was, was that I was dating someone else and it just kind of just didn't turn into anything.

Do you feel like you guys are like, because you know how everyone's like your first love? Like, do you think there's any way you would explore it again no I really once I'm done with someone I'm done it's like a light switch flips and I can't go back are you guys having that moment I actually feel like this is something I would think about in high school it's like are you guys having any of those moments where together you kind of regress back to the high school version of yourself together because you do you even know adult versions of each other well we've kept in touch and we would hang out a little bit before I got married and stuff but um and I think had we not gone to dinner almost two years ago I don't know that the podcast

would I don't know that we would have well I'm sure we would have had the same chemistry but it put me at ease because I was like I know that we still can you know banter back and forth have fun together so that was a good thing you need to take us through the last date you went on okay uh where did you go did you like the person Kristen give us the tea this is a good story okay okay tell us here we. Tell us. Here we go. So I hate actors, you know? I've always known that. Like, in my early 20s, I went out with a few, and I was like, they're the worst. But an actor asked me out.

I was like, all right. So this was in LA. This was probably, like, two months ago. And I went to Laurel Hardware. God, I hope he doesn't hear this. It's okay. It's fine. I've gone on dates there, too.

Let's just pretend it was me there. But you there. Who was it? We don't know. Keep going. We're all hardware. That's a good place for drinks. So he was slamming drinks like slamming drinks.

And then at one point he was telling me he does his own stunts. We were sitting at the bar. OK, it's fucking packed. He gets up to reenact a stunt that he had done, accidentally runs into the waiter and is like, oh, I'm so sorry I was like please sit the fuck down I can't just creating all this commotion in the middle of Laurel Hardware I am so turned off you did he tried to do a stunt reenacting a stunt in the middle of a packed restaurant I was like please sit down also like just drawing so much attention like oh my god

also why are you doing a stunt in laurel hardware sit the fuck down and to confirm anyone that's not from la that is a packed bar it is not a hardware store thank you very much it was so then did you talk to him afterwards he's texted me a couple times and i can't be i can't just like go someone right but i give him like a one-word response i don't even know if we're in a serious relationship. Literally. Okay. So you're just kind of like, I get that.

Wait, why do you think you can't go someone? I'm too fucking nice, which people would not know about me. I'm too nice. Really? Yeah. I wouldn't want to be ghosted either.

I would actually appreciate someone just being like, Hey, you know what? You're great. But like, didn't feel any chemistry. Totally. Which I said that to another guy.

I was like, Hey, I didn't feel any chemistry. And his friends were making fun of me for weeks about it I'm like I actually thought I was being like mature not wasting anyone's time I love that what can they say to that exactly he deleted my number and told all his friends and everyone's making fun of me I'm like okay well that's thank you for validating why the fuck I don't like you right and like I'm an adult and like sorry sorry, you can take the fucking truth. I'm trying not to waste anyone's time. Like,

let's move on. If you are not having a good time on a date, cause I feel like this is me and I'm wondering if it would be you. They won't know that I'm not having a good time. I'm going to like people, please it up and be like laughing. And then he's going to think we're leaving and I'm having the best time and I'm not going to want to talk to him. Are you,

do you give signs on a date if you're not into it? I know because it's the same thing. Like, I'll fucking show up to the party, you know? But what I've been doing is I won't go on dinner dates. Oh, okay. I will get a drink. Smart. They usually turn into dinner because, again, I'm too fucking nice.

But, like, this guy who was acting out stunts got dinner with him. I'm like, what am I doing? You're like, let's get the ravioli dude like i gotta go home fuck yeah so because i know because i need to come up with a better game plan like oh i have an early morning you know right actually this is another funny story i almost want to say who i was with in my early 20s okay you have to uncall her daddy come on all right i'll say it don't say it it's in your early this is going don't say it all right I'll tell you the story so I went on a date with a guy this

is my early 20s height of my partying career right okay he was vegan and he was sober and I was like um one or the other right pick one preferably both but or like be both so I was like I have an early morning well sorry went back to his house, or like be both. So I was like, I have an early morning. Well, sorry. Went back to his house, made out with him on his bed. I was like, I have a really early morning tomorrow. Got to, you know, changed in my car, went to hide. I'm such a dumbass.

Of course, there's paparazzi. The next day, he was like, my friend saw you at hide. I was like, oh, really? You're like, it's so crazy. I was on my way home, and I got an email that the event in the morning was canceled. So I thought, you were asleep. I'm going email that the event in the morning was canceled. So I thought you were asleep. I'm going to go to hide. I felt so bad.

I felt so bad. And he's really cute. But like at the time in my life, like I'm eating meat and I'm drinking a lot of alcohol. Oh, we can't do this. I actually respect the honesty, though, because I have done something similar where like if they're just not on your wavelength and especially when you're in your early 20s and you're like I am going to every club I want to be known at that club my job is to go out right now I don't think you understand that and so it's

like even if they're a great guy maybe if you met him later on by the way if I oh I've seen him not that long ago but like great guy you know like it's not meant for you. You were more interested in getting fucked up at Hyde. I wanted to go to Hyde, man. Okay. Sloshed. Can you tell us who is the most famous person you've denied? Denied? Um, what about initials?

Your publicist is having a panic attack. What about tell us the profession? I didn't deny a lot of people back in the day, to be honest. You're like, did you just hear I'm a people pleaser? You're famous? I'm staying on the date with the guy doing the stunt. Alex, everyone's getting it. I had dinner with him, all right?

Fine. No one's getting denied. OK, how about this? You see someone on Instagram you find attractive. OK. How do you vet these people to see if they're worthy of you DMing them and pursuing them? I won't DM. You don't?

No. I won't make the first move on Instagram. OK. So where I'm at currently in my life, I want to be pursued. I want to be fucking courted. I want the man to put in some fucking effort. And I think because guys now, so again, I was married. I was with Jay for 10 years.

This is my first time dating in the social media world. Like it's a fucking shit show out there. I hate every second of it. But guys are lazy as fuck now. And they're always looking for the next best thing. So it's like, no, I'm sorry. I don't have time for your little bullshit anymore. Like, let me see how serious you are and put in the effort so no I'm not making the first move I've

said ladies if you want something slide the fuck in but where you're at in your life also kind of dictates what you're gonna do so for you I totally hear you we're like I'm not I'm gonna sit on my couch drink my tea and wait for the men to come in and if they're not fucking sayonara bitch like I don't give a fuck yeah okay I think that's a good energy I did do was um I went to a show and I posted a story of this musician who I did end up dating so he saw it dm'd me so like that in a roundabout way is kind of like making a pretty casual yeah I like that that's a good way to do it yeah if you were going though to slide into someone's okay let's pretend like something hits you on a Sunday night the kids are gone you're bored you're like maybe I'll give it a

try what is what is he's gotta be fucking hot okay true I mean what are you gonna slide in with if you had to if you like what's my pickup line what would you say hey hi Chris is like I'm so lazy with it hi period okay this is a fun game oh god what would I say um it really depends on the guy the situation where he lives like if he lives in Nashville like it would be different than if he lived in LA right totally I don't know like shit I don't I don't know because like Nashville you could be like something about like like do you go to like exactly like something dumb like that yeah yeah or like hey like like are you in Nashville like something like that if they're in a different state yeah then it's like LA I come out here quite a bit so i feel like i'm gonna be in la and blah blah like what are you up to yeah yeah i do have good game like

oh we know we know thank you we watched it still got it you didn't like i do know that that's what i think that's the best part i remember watching on the hills when you came back and you with Brody, he was like drooling because it was just like, you know how to get the guy. Sweet Brody. I love him. Do you think that would ever go anywhere ever again? No.

I just saw him actually and I met his new girlfriend. Oh, nice. I love Brody. Yeah. But no, Brody's the only ex I ever went back to though. And it was because I was filming the hills. Interesting. Although on the show, we didn't actually date, but we hung out a little bit. I can't remember how it all, but what you saw on the show we didn't actually date but we hung out a little

bit I can't remember how it all but what you saw on the show was all bullshit like he and Jade pretended to break up but they never actually did like all that dude those fight scenes I was like Kristen how do you get yourself riled up to just scream at these is it easy for you to get riled up though when you're filming now not anymore but like back in the day oh yeah when you showed up I forget the scene but you showed up oh my god I remember your hair looked great you were looking great you showed up and you're like you want to oh my god you came in like fucking piranhas god I know I was hammered I watched that back and I was like oh Heidi and Spencer was my first day really filming Heidi and Spencer came with bottles of tequila and it just went south and when they show you

know what I was mad about though so before I started filming Adrena and I talked about how we know that they want us to fight and you know they want you to go after Justin Bobby and we're not gonna fall for that shit I was like yeah no we're not woo and then we're filming and she comes up to me and picks a fight and I was like what oh I said that's why I was like so it's gonna be like that so I was like what the fuck we just had this conversation that makes so much sense oh my god i forgot that so it's gonna be like that really yeah whatever i was like fucking am i crazy fuck all of you it's a game on that actually makes a lot of sense how you got that riled up in that scene guys just google kristen cavallari you

came at me like fucking piranhas and you will watch the glorious moment that Kristen was loses her shit. But it truly was such an iconic moment. And also, that's so good to know you were hammered because that line was so iconic. I'm better when I have a little buzz like that shit just comes out of my mouth. See, sometimes people look like idiots. Kristen's like, give me a fucking tequila and I will rock. I perform way better.

I love that. OK, when you're looking at someone's Instagram, now that you're learning how to date with social media, what is a photo? That laugh, guys, I can't. I feel like I've heard that since I came out of the fucking womb. I'm obsessed. It's the giggle. It's the cute one also where the guys are endeared.

And then it's also like sinister for women being like, oh my God, is she going to cut my face off? Or do I love her? Is she actually going to kill me? Okay, wait. If you're going to a guy's Instagram, he DMs you. You're like, okay, what could be a photo that you see that you're like, absolutely not? Like a shirtless selfie.

The model photo. It's like. Yeah. Like, sorry. Gym selfie? Yeah, no. We don't need to see it. No.

Be a man. A manly man who's not taking fucking shirtless photos in the mirror i agree we don't flex in your ass we don't need to see it cool bro no one cares i i agree with you mine were um the fishing photos when they're like holding the big fish in the photo and i'm like sir what that's your thing like i just can't i just I can't take it I'm from the northeast I just to be honest I would actually love to find someone who's not on social media or maybe they have one but like they really don't post you know like that kind of stuff that's the goal yeah when I met my boyfriend and I was like what show me your Instagram and he was like I don't have one

I was like I was like like I will marry you officially have a second date buddy it was that was so nice you're gonna find it yeah I think so too um does someone's prior dating history in the industry affect if you're gonna pursue them I would be lying if I said not at all but if you've dated some fucking trash buckets yeah it kind of stands out. Give us the definition of a trash. Just like a trashy girl. Got it. Yeah, like that. Because then I'm like, why would you be into me?

I'm not saying I'm a fucking saint, but you know what I mean? Like, I'm not saying I'm not trashy too, but I have like my own category. No, no, but I get what you're saying. If like you can tell the vibe of someone if they're dating someone completely different. Like you're like, I have my business. I have my kids. Like I don't got time to bullshit. Exactly. I'm just at a different phase in my life.

The shit I put up with when I was 21 is totally different than I will now. What is a non-negotiable for you now in a potential partner? A non-negotiable is someone who cannot take any accountability and who is insecure. I mean, honestly, I need someone who is so comfortable in their own skin because that's been the crux of most of my relationships. That makes sense. Yeah. Like you can't.

I've had that before, too, where it's like because then it comes to you just constantly having to build them up and you're like. And they're threatened by everything in my life. And it's like, I can't. I don't have time for that. I't babysit you yeah would you date an athlete again it's not at the top of my list I'm like I'm not gonna I'm not looking for one they like me for some reason um and so I wouldn't rule it out but I'm not looking for that and I would love to get I mean I'm fucking 35 now like they're all a little young for me now.

I've been attracting a lot of guys in their 20s, though. I don't know what that's about. I don't know what's going on. I mean, Kristen. I've just decided that 30s at least, OK? In my perfect mind, I'm like 45, a businessman, not on social media. No one knows who the fuck they are. But that's just not what I've been attracting.

So I don't know. But maybe you're also at a point in your life Where like since you're newly single And you're getting out there Like maybe that's also it's gonna shift But like you're giving some great energy That like the young bucks are like I know I'm like Like you guys know I have three kids right

Okay cool I just want to throw that out there It's like turning them on even more You're like It's like a 26 year old just asked me out I was like 20 fucking So I'm like you're hot But no like I can't

you're like are you going to hide tonight I've been there done that man I can't okay if you could go on a date tomorrow with any person of your choice okay who would it be like maybe Alexander Skarsgård is that how you say his name who is that oh google him someone google him please big little lies yeah I mean maybe his character wasn't the best in that show but you Who is that? Oh, Google him. Someone Google him, please. Big Little Lies. Yes. I mean, maybe his character wasn't the best in that show, but, you know, he's been another shit, right? You're like, I don't want to. Don't phase that off of that character.

You're like, it's not because of the character. It's because of him. Guys, don't get it twisted. Like, wow, you really worked through your shit. Yeah, so. Okay, that's a good answer. Okay, as we wrap up, you are everywhere. I feel like when I was prepping for this interview, I'm like, I can't keep up with Kristen

Cavallari enough. Do you feel exhausted by the fact that your income and your job is slightly dependent at times on you being in the public eye? Yeah, I do. Because honestly, if everything went away, I would be OK. But now that I'm a single woman, especially supporting three children, I have to keep my money coming in. Right. And so, yeah, it's kind of a, but in the same breath, what I'm doing now, I really love like the podcast, for example,

I've really enjoyed. And I do feel like because I live in Nashville, I can kind of separate a little bit and I go back to a really normal, peaceful life. And so I actually think I have a really good balance with everything right now. I think that's great. Yeah. And being on TV, sometimes I feel like we get a version of you. Like you said, everyone's I just learned that you weren't like the most confident girl in high school. And it's helpful to hear you be able to kind of like debunk those myths about yourself

through time what is something you feel like people don't understand about you that you wish you could just like set straight and they understood like who Kristen Cavallari is well I think there's obviously a lot of sides to my personality I do have that like fiery go-getter part that I think a lot of people do see I also can be very shy and very reserved. I'm a homebody. I recharge by being quiet and having alone time. And I just think people would be surprised at what a normal life I live. Like people always assume I have chefs and nannies and butlers. It's like, I don't have any of that shit, you know? And so I think, um, I don't know. I think I'm way more normal than people probably think. No, I love that you're

explaining that. Cause I think also like you could be in LA going to all the places, getting paparazzi all the time. Like it's, it takes someone to like specifically try to like maneuver the world and not be photographed all the time. And there's ways to do it. There is. Yeah. Um um but it's cool that you're like living in nashville you because isn't your house like not yeah i'm actually like 35 minutes outside of the city like out in the country so you're living a pretty normal life when you're there yeah i am and the other thing too is like i'm not seeking press like obviously i just did this video for my company with tyler cameron for uncommon james which i knew would get pressed but that's different that's for my company with Tyler Cameron for Uncommon James, which I knew would get press. But that's different.

That's for my company. I'm not like out there trying to like be in the press and be in the media and like only date someone famous. And like, I'm not I don't think like that. And so and I think because I am in the press a lot like and I actually roll my eyes at that shit. I'm like, how the fuck are they creating a story out of nothing? I actually just had to like talk myself off the ledge the other day because I was like okay look at it this way at least you're being talked about

people care it's like you know I have to just kind of like turn the narrative around in my head because otherwise I'll drive myself insane do you think it's helped you though that you have now this brand that like now you're not just fully it's not all about Kristen and who she's dating and your love life and your social life because that's what it originally was and now you have something you're like no this is my business yeah and this is like something that's completely independent of who I'm dating yes and that's how I can justify it I'm like well if people are talking about me my company benefits and so it's all good it's all good totally yeah Kristen thank you so much for coming on Call Her Daddy thanks for having me you're amazing oh my god we're gonna have to do it again