Call Her Daddy - Riley Keough: Nepo babies, Addiction & Grief

Episode Date: January 15, 2025

Join Alex in the studio for an interview with Riley Keough. Riley reflects on her unconventional childhood as Elvis’ granddaughter, discusses her famous friendships with Dakota Johnson and Zoë Kravitz, and reveals the time she secretly got arrested. She also opens up about her complicated mother daughter dynamic and experiences with commitment issues, addicts, and grief.

What is up, daddy gang? It is your founding father, Alex Cooper with Call Her Daddy. Riley Keough, welcome to Call Her Daddy. Thank you. I am such a big fan. Thank you for being here. Thank you for having me. Of course. I huge Daisy Jones and the Six girl. Oh, cool. Like binge the whole thing and sitting. Really? Loved it. Thanks for watching. My husband was like, all right, you could take a break. I'm like, no, no, no, it's kind of one of those

where you just gotta get. Keep going. Yeah, yeah, I gotta get to the end. Yeah, that's the way. It was awesome. What was your favorite part of playing that role? I think getting to learn like to sing and play guitar was my favorite part because it was,

I think that's one of my favorite things about acting in general is learning like a whole new skill set and this one was like very in like normally you do a few rehearsals or do if you're you know training to do I don't know to be a dancer or whatever I don't know like I've never done something so involved. I haven't had to fully learn to sing and play guitar. So I found that really fun. Wait, you were doing full voice lessons. We were doing, yeah, we had band practice every day and it was a year long, but we needed it.

None of us, a few of us had never picked up an instrument or sang. So. Was there ever a point in your life that you would have considered a music career? Never. No. Never, no, I still would never. I'm not a singer.

I feel like you have a good voice unless they auto-tuned it. It's fine. They didn't auto-tune it, but I have a fine voice. I just got by, but I'm a realist. The fact that you're telling me they didn't edit your voice, you have a good voice. They didn't edit it, I think.

You call them, they're like, oh babe, that shit was auto tuned. You're like, fuck. I think they, I don't think they auto tuned it. I think the whole point was because it was meant to sound 1970s that you wouldn't do that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You sounded gorgeous, a guy leaving.

I felt proud that I was able to do it because there was like a conversation about potentially getting like vocal stunt doubles or something. Oh my God. And so I felt really determined to make it work and I feel proud we made it work. You know, I don't think I'm like the best singer in the world and I, you know, that's fine.

You made it work with Lime Color. I made it work. I love how you're like, oh, like I, no, no, no, I like never sang. From my research, you and Dakota Johnson were in a band together in New York City. Don't lie to my face. I know.

This is so funny. This comes up so often and I think that we need to do something here because yes, we were in a band, but the band was me and her sitting with her brother around a table in her apartment in New York with photo booths doing covers of songs. But here's the thing, neither of us were confident singers,

so we would just kind of like all sing together. Oh, so you were all competing for like the lead role. We were all the lead vocalists. You're all the lead. Wait, what was the band called? Fokey Porn. Fokey Porn? Perfect for Call Our Daddy.

Wait, I'm obsessed. I had a band at one point and I was like so committed. Did you really? Yeah, but it was so bad. What did you do? So yeah, well, here's the thing. You know, I started as like the electric guitarist. Cool.

But that is like loosely saying that. The only song I could- A loose electric guitar. Yeah. I relate. I'm a loose guitar player. I like looked incredible holding it. But the minute I would get going,

I was giving nothing. I knew how to play the like, da, da, da, da, da, da, whatever that song is. I could do those like three little things. That was all I knew. Our band was called the Aliens. It was a big deal, it was in my basement. And then we changed it to Green Jelly.

Cool, were the other people in the band also loose musicians? Everyone was loose. Okay. Everyone was loose. Okay. We were kind of just there for the vibes. Yeah. Our sign was on like printer paper with like a little marker. Right. It was edgy. It was the thing. I actually paid my neighbors at one point like 25 cents to come watch us perform. Wow. They were upset that we wasted their time. So like, I'm a big band girl. So Dakota and I didn't get like that far into it. We kind of like it lasted maybe like three days.

And then it was over. The band broke up. Good to know. Good to know. We how do you guys know each other? Like when did you become friends? We became friends because we both grew up in LA. I had a friend who was friends with her boyfriend and we met at an in-and-out parking lot. Then we went to all the same parties in LA at 16, 17, and I'd see her out and about. And then I became friends with her boyfriend.

And then, so I went to go see his band play and she was always there and she was like the coolest girl. The coolest. The coolest. She still is. She is. And then we just, I don't know, became friends. Don't you love when like people are obsessed with like celebrity friendships? We're like, no, no, no, come on, tell us more.

We're like, we're just friends. We're like being hung out. We're at in and out tell us more. We're like, we're just friends. We're like being hung out. We're at in and out, bitch. Sometimes we hang out and talk on the phone. I think is it makes people feel like closer to you guys of like, you guys are obviously both like very cool, interesting people. And so I think to know that you guys are friends,

people like, I'm like, come on, give me more tea. I can give you tea, I just don't really have any, but if there's anything you can think of. I'm gonna get it out of you. I'm a tea giver. Okay, okay, good. You did show up today and be like, we don't have to cry. I just don't want you to feel pressure.

I don't want you to feel pressure at all. If you hate any of my questions, let me know. We can pivot. Deal. Okay, good. How do you think of- Hate. What? Hate. I'm just kidding. I'm like, good. How do you think of- Hate. What?

Hate. I'm just kidding. I'm like, let's sit in silics. I do love that you were 30 minutes early and you brought no one. Yeah. Can I tell you, I've had people come to my studio with 20 people, 10 people, five people,

but the solo. Solo is a first. Here's my answer. I'm not like technically on like a press tour right now. So I'm not, I have no problem going places all by myself. You know? I love that for you. And I like, I actually enjoy it.

I am the same way whenever I go on a podcast, which is rare, I'm like, no one come with me. I'm gonna let it rip. Let God go with me. The cool thing about not having a publicist here, so I can say whatever I want. For sure. Then she's gonna call you after and be like, what was it?

You're like, I don't remember. We talked for almost an hour. Like, who knows? Just let it be. You know what I mean? It's fine. You're not gonna get canceled from this. How would your friends describe you?

Oh my gosh. That's such a hard question. I don't know. I have no idea. Like in what way? Like there is like a... Like how would they describe you? Like if Dakota was in the room right now,

like what would she say about you? Oh, we should, we could call her also. Do you want to? Let's call her. Hold on. That will be fucking funny. Go get your phone. So she didn't answer.

Okay, let's call another friend. Okay. All you're asking is how would you describe me as a friend? How would you describe me as a friend? I'm on a show, give me didn't answer. Okay, let's call another friend. Okay. All you're asking is how would you describe me as a friend? How would you describe me as a friend? I'm on a show, give me a good answer. So do you want them to be famous or not? I mean, famous is fun. Famous is more fun.

They're like all called John. It's so funny, because people, I do this a lot of the time, a lot, and where people will be like, how would your friends, or what friends could we speak to about you for this interview? And I give like my, all my closest friends, and they're like, but what about like famous ones? They're like,

they're like, no, no, no, we don't care about Cassidy. Like, we don't want, you know, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So funny. Okay. Should I try Zoe Kravitz? Yeah, let's give her a go. The Neppo baby phone. I'm obsessed. Okay. Yeah. Oh my God. Hello. Hi, wait, you're on air. ["Diamond Lover"] Hello. I'm chewing, sorry. So what are you eating? What are you eating?

I'm eating toast. I'm eating raisin toast. So good. I'm eating raisin toast with butter. Okay, so I'm on a podcast and they asked me to call a friend to describe how you would describe me. As a friend. As a friend. As a friend. I would describe you as a ride or die. Like you

are down for whatever you will always show up all the time. You're very consistent, like me. I feel like me and you will like not talk or see each other for like six months. And then it's like we just pick up where we left off. And I think you're really good at keeping secret. Gonna tell those on this pod. I feel like actually. And you're incredibly loyal and you're funny.

You're funny as hell. And you're honest. Keep going. You always text me back. That's so cute. And it's true. I think so. You're welcome.

All right. Love you. Love you. It's true. Thanks. You're welcome. All right. Love you. Love you. Bye. Bye. One more. One more. Okay.

You're just like, you're such a bitch. You're just like a bitch. I'm a bitch? Really? Really? You're the nicest person in the world. Okay. I love you.

Okay. Love you too. Bye. I'm obsessed. Thank you for coming. Thank you. Okay. I love you. Okay, love you too. Bye. I'm obsessed. Thank you for doing that.

First of all, imagine if you're like, I'm just kidding, I'm not on a podcast. I'm just like feeling needy today. Keep going. Yeah, right. Okay, that feels pretty accurate. I don't know. I didn't really hear much.

She said I was loyal. She said you were loyal. I blacked out. I'm really good at keeping secrets. I got nervous. You're like, no, no, I am on air. She said you were loyal. I blacked out. You're really good at keeping secrets. I got nervous. You're like, no, no, I am on air. Don't say anything crazy. Don't say anything.

I got nervous of what she was gonna say. No, all of that was lovely. Okay. And when she said you were a bitch, I'm like, that is the complete opposite of what I'm getting. You are very like gentle soul. Thank you. I think that I would say I am a loyal friend.

I do really care about my friends and you know, I hope, I think. Allegedly. Allegedly. Okay, let's talk about the book. It is so fascinating, like what you wrote about. From Here to the Great Unknown, first of all, just to like tell the daddy gang,

my audience, like how did this book come to be? This book came to be because my mother was in the middle of writing her autobiography. And in December, she came to me and said, you know, I need help. Like she couldn't, she didn't really, I think she just got to a point where she was feeling frustrated and she didn't like talking about herself. So writing an autobiography was difficult and she asked if I would help her. And then she passed away a month later. So I just found myself,

like it was just this thing that I had to do. So I just completed her memoir, which was very intense. How long did it take you? Oh my gosh. Probably about a year. Yeah. Wow. Start to finish.

How do you think like having that project to work on after your mom passed like helps you work through your feelings? Well, I think that when I started working on the book, it was only like three, four months after she'd passed away. So it was very like intense and I didn't really want to be doing it to be honest. It felt like this thing I had to complete. And so I was a little bit resistant in the beginning and it's also like, it's very out of my comfort zone

to write a story or tell all the things, like my family's personal, all these vulnerable things about my family. It's not something that I would do otherwise. So it was, there was a lot, I felt very resistant, but ultimately I was doing it for her and it's what she wanted. And I knew how much she wanted to finish her autobiography

and share her story so people could understand her more. And also so she could relate to people. And she's been through so much. And I think that largely why she did this was to kind of share her experience in grief and addiction and these very human things. And so, yeah, so I would say that I did it, but I wasn't like really excited to do it. No, I think like hearing you even say that is interesting when you said like, my natural reaction isn't to just like spill all family secrets.

And I think just to clarify for anyone that is not like familiar with like your family lineage, like you are Elvis's granddaughter, your mom was Elvis's only daughter. And so I get what you're saying is like, it's a very famous family that you come from. So to write basically like a big book, being like here's detail by detail what went down.

Usually we don't get that from very famous families. Yes, and you know, particularly in my family growing up and with my mom, she was extremely private. She hated talking to the press. She didn't want to be famous. She was born into a situation she really didn't enjoy. And growing up in the world we grew up in was very private, very secretive, very like everything was a security issue. There was no talking to friends about things. Our family stuff was, you know, everything was very private.

So it was a lot of, I had to push through that sort of uncomfortable feeling of like sharing all this information. But the other thing is, is like as a person, I'm a very honest person. And I also couldn't imagine, so was she, like she was uncomfortably honest. So I think I couldn't have imagined a version of her book

where she didn't share all these things. So. Yeah, and like go all in. Your baby photo was sold for $300,000 on the cover of People Magazine. Like that is insane. What's insane is like $300 then was like a million. $300,000.

$300,000, sorry. $300. It was like a million dollars. Yes. It was like supposed to be a million dollars. Like you're so wanted. Well. Well.

Used to be. Can you like looking back at your childhood, obviously growing up in this famous family, what is something that was definitely not normal that you got pretty used to because you were just like, oh, I thought this was our reality. Like all of it. Yeah.

You know, like if I shared the day to day growing up, it would probably be like, you know, crazy to. Give us a little, come on. Well, it was just a lot of like thing, like it was very like high security and like if we're going somewhere, it was like lots of people following us and very like intense and chaotic

and like going through, you know, I don't know. Like. How are you so calm? I don't know. I'm not at all. You're like internally unburnt. Internally, I'm burning down all day. It's the external, you're keeping it all together,

but internally? Yes. Good to know. How would you have described yourself as a kid? I was very quiet, really internal. I wasn't, I got called shy a lot, but I actually wasn't shy. I just was very internal.

Like I just didn't have a lot to say and just was, yeah, I was very quiet. I was like that actually most of my life until I started to realize that people would perceive that as rude. So I've really pushed myself to, you know, come out of my shell. It's like right now, I don't wanna be talking,

but I have a camera in front of me. Gotta be here. Hi everyone. Oh, that's so interesting. So if you're going through something in your life, whether it's a fight with your partner or a friend, do you just go silent? No. No, no, no.

I'm very emotional. I'm just not somebody, like at a dinner party. If a lot of people are talking, I prefer to listen. It's just that. It's not like I'm like internalized. I'm very open with my emotions. I'm just not like a big chatter. Love, love.

Welcome to an hour sitting down with me. Let's go, girl. I am now, I wasn't. I've changed. You're doing great. I I am now. I wasn't, I've grown, I've changed. You're doing great. I don't know. I hope. Where am I?

The book obviously switches between like your mom and her perspective and then yours. How do you think you guys were similar as teenagers? Wow. I think I also had a moment of like, she had like her rebellious moment. I also had that like where I would sneak out and you know, hang out with people I shouldn't,

wasn't allowed to and getting arrested and you know. You got arrested? I did. Is this mugshot bad? I've never said that. No, you're like, wait, this is why publicists and civil sixth law. Where's my publicist?

Come in. No one's here to save you. Wait, that's kind of like. I was arrested once. Yeah. Is it good mugshot? I never saw it. What?

I know. You need to make t-shirts. I know. I was a minor. So luckily I think it was like. Oh, so it's like an underage. Yeah. A lot of people that I know got those.

Those were like, I was like so terrified to get one cause I like needed to go play like soccer. And if you had one, you couldn't play. It was a whole thing. But like I was there. I just was like- You got a mug shot. You didn't get a mug shot.

But now in hindsight, I'm like, huh, would have been like a little edgy. You know, I've been a good girl. So I had an edgy moment. No. What was it for, just drinking? It was for- Oh God.

I can't say this. It was for breaking and entering. Wait, where? So it was actually, so I went to a party at my friend's house, but I didn't know that it wasn't my friend's house. It was a house for sale. And so most people, like the police came and most people like got away. And then about 10 of us got arrested. My mom was pissed.

Did she try to like get it not in the papers? No, she was like, this is on you girl. Yeah. Oh my God. Luckily it wasn't in the papers. Was your mom someone that would punish you? Like, are you getting grounded? I was grounded.

Oh yeah, I was grounded for like three months. And I was grounded on my like 16th or 15th birthday or something. Yeah. That's tough. I was grounded and she was in Las Vegas and I had to call her and tell her to come back from Vegas and take me in prison. I've never told anyone this. I'm obsessed. I feel like mom I'm in jail. She's like I'm on the strip,

bitch. What? No. So she's like I can't get there so she sent my aunt to come get me and so you know I had a moment. I had a moment like a moment as a teenager, and she also did love. Yeah. Okay. You write a lot about like the different relationships that your mom had romantically throughout your childhood. When you were five, your parents got divorced because your mom wanted to marry Michael Jackson. How was this explained to you as a kid, like that they were getting divorced? So my mom, I was like, we were in Florida and I was sitting on her lap and she said,

I'm, me and your dad are getting a divorce. And I took like the way I received it was that he wasn't my dad anymore. And it was like, it's so memorable to me because I just was destroyed. I didn't understand what a divorce was. So I just thought like, he's not my dad now. But the great thing was shortly after,

like they were so close and they really cared about keeping them, you know, our family dynamic the same. So he was at our house and staying over. And so he was there a lot. So I think I kind of forgot about it, which was amazing. So you got to see a very loving relationship between the two of them, even though they got divorced. Yeah, like a really unique,

like it was a very unique experience, especially in the 90s, you know, to have both of your parents, sort of like brother and sister, really close, living together both of your parents, sort of like brother and sister really close living together. He lived with us for a lot of my life when my mom had other partners and other husbands, he would live in the guest house. And so my what was modeled to me was when you break up with someone you stay friends

with them. And I really like apply that to most of my relationships because that was kind of all that I, that was what I saw with my parents. And it was really beautiful. I mean, they were like best friends and I don't know if they should have been married. We, when you break up with someone or they break up with you

and you're staying friends with them, have any of your past relationships been like, Riley, like we broke up. Why are like, are you still trying to say so amicable and are people ever confused by like how amicable you are? No, because I think that like it was never a forced thing. I think I just, I don't know how I did it. There was like one relationship that there was no friendship there, but for the most part, all the other ones, I don't even know. I wasn't like consciously thinking about it.

We just ended up friends. And it's just kind of like how you were raised to think that's how you go about it, which is probably in hindsight, like, I don't know, do we think it's a better way to go about it? Like, is it- Well, my feeling was always like, this is a person hindsight, like, I don't know. Do we think it's a better way to go about it? My feeling was always like, this is a person that I love, that I spend a lot of time with.

Why wouldn't I have them in my life? If, you know, unless it was like some like crazy, unhealthy situation. Yes. Of course it's uncomfortable for a minute, but I think ultimately, if it's someone that I really cared that much about, then I'd ultimately, if it's someone that I really cared that much about, then I'd want them in my life somehow.

We just skirted past the big name, Michael Jackson. Okay. Let's go back for a second. So on top of like your family already being obviously so famous, how did your life get even crazier when Michael entered the picture? Cause he had his own slew of like paparazzi

and people following him and a media empire essentially. Our life wasn't crazier because that was already there that already existed like the press and the crazy the paparazzi and you know all that. But her life I think when she saw Michael's life there were things that he had that she didn't have. Like she didn't have a plane at the time or, you know, things like that. And so her, she want, she then was like, oh, I'm, I should have a plane and I should have a, you know, this and that. And so our life in that way kind of got bigger because she, before that she was with my dad and my dad, their life was very simple, not, not with

the press and the craziness, but in terms of like at home, like she didn't have 10 million assistants and you know, she didn't need all of that and I think that changed. How did your mom try to protect you and your brother from the paparazzi during all this? It's so funny because I get tagged in these photos all the time where we're wearing like a hat and glasses

and I'm like, what does that do? It's so weird. Stunning. Like a hiding, I don't know. I guess they attempted to hide our faces, but it was like impossible. What is the most like extravagant thing Michael did for you and your brother? There was a lot of like closing down things for us um well it was kind of like the only way that our family could do things like uh if we wanted to go to a toy store or like something like that like or ride

rides or you know so so it wasn't that i don't know if it was necessarily done for us or if just for like our family situation where we had to shut the you know the toy stores and stuff but there was one memorable time in London where we were in the toy store so it was just my brother and I in the whole toy store and we were just like going floor to floor to floor and like filling up our thing and yeah that was the first thing that comes to mind but I don't know if it was for us or just like the way that our life was, you know. It's so interesting, like hearing that, because now I know obviously you have a daughter growing

up with such lavish things around you. Have you thought to yourself that was so normal to you? And how are you going to parent differently than how your mom parented you? I think she was such an amazing parent and she wanted us to have, I think like her father did, these amazing experiences all the time. For me personally, I want, I think that the problem there could be for some that when you're used to so much,

it's hard to find joy in simple things. And so I really want my children to be able to find joy in just playing in the backyard and doing normal kid stuff and not need like elephants and circus and like all these things all the time. So that's probably what I would do differently. But I think her intention was really, you know,

wanting to give everything she could to her kids. Have you had a hard time, like finding happiness in the simple things since you were around such wealth and big moments? I think that there was a time in my life where I was like, oh, we're not gonna, you know, let me think of a good example of this. Like even going to dinner growing up was like 50 people. It was like a big deal. Everything was a big deal all the time. So there was more of like a

loneliness that I experienced in my 20s when our life was a bit different. I was just used to having so many people around and everything being so intense that I felt a little bit lonely when my life was smaller, I think. I think that's like a relatable concept. I think like I always talk to my friends who when you get older and you're like life is changing

and families and Thanksgiving's like, even if you look at what we see in like Hallmark movies and everything like the bigger seems happier, right? Like a big family at a table and everyone is there. And when you have a smaller unit, it feels like this isn't as fun, this isn't as, when really like it could be more intimate and you can have stronger connections

and it doesn't mean it's not fun, but there's this feeling. It's that, it's that exact phenomenon, but like probably just a little different, but yes, it's like probably the same feeling you'd get if you came from a huge family and had big family gatherings all the time and then it was just you or you moved somewhere and you're just like, what? This feels lonely.

Absolutely. Obviously, finishing because I have to acknowledge it with the Michael stuff, like, obviously, before your mom's relationship with him, there were allegations of abuse and that he assaulted children. Then your mom went on to marry him and you spent a good amount of time with him. Like, were there any adults in your life that were like, wait, I don't know if you should be spending time at Neverland. I don't know if we want you to be there. Like, was your dad nervous? I was never told anything. So even as it's and it's actually not something I ever asked as an adult. Why do you think? I don't know. I think it just like was what it was. Like I didn't,

I don't know. It just never came to mind, I guess. I would imagine that my dad was really heartbroken and reading the news and I'm sure that I I'm just imagining. I would imagine he said all kinds of things to my mom, that we didn't know about, but nothing like the way my parents parented was very much like we don't fight around the kids, we don't ever say anything around them. There was no, like we didn't know anything. We didn't know about any allegations, we didn't know. We had no awareness of that. As an adult, when you look back on that

time of your life, like how do you feel about it now? I mean, the one thing I know is that they were in love and that their love for one another was genuine, you know, because I was there and I remember everything else like I don't know because I wasn't there for, you know. When your mom would break up with these people and she would like find a different partner at some point in your life, like how do you think that affected your own attachment style? That's really interesting. I definitely would be really upset. When she would

break up with people, Michael, her other partners, I would cry. I'd get mad at her. I really was upset. I'd get mad at her. I'd be pissed, not knowing what happened, but I was always just mad at my mom for the breakups. So it really affected me. My attachment style, the one thing I know is that like throughout, through all of her relationships, everyone would always go, she should have stayed with Danny, who's my dad. And so I always have this voice in the back of my head that's like, she should have stayed with Danny. And I, I know that she was, you know, someone who, when things got boring, or mundane, or difficult, she was like, see ya. You know, and I think that there's this part of me that feels like,

I don't know, staying with, if you're so lucky to find somebody who is like your kind of best friend in the way that they were, to try and like, you know, make it work. Yeah, that was what I thought was interesting. The book was like basically saying like, when your mom was when she was passing, like, wasn't he like the last person there

basically for her? Yeah. And through all of these different relationships. Didn't she date like Nicolas Cage? These big moments that were press moments. But really, the through line was like it seemed like your mom and dad like always kind of stayed by each other's side, which I can imagine for your own like romantic situation, I know you're married now, but like prior to your husband,

were you ever feeling that through line of like, ooh, this is getting boring, I'm gonna run or have you, you know what I mean? I definitely had that when I was younger. When I was younger, I was very hard to pin down. I was not interested in sticking around and I definitely didn't have the best track record there. So that I think would tie to sort of my mom's way of like,

moving on once the thrill is, you know, whatever. That when I was a teenager, I was like, uh, that makes sense. Yeah. I'm curious. Like, was there any part of you that was ever nervous to get married? No, which is so stupid. I was, I mean, I was young. I was 25 when I got married.

I was a little girl. You weren't nervous. I wasn't nervous. I was young, I was 25 when I got married. Oh my God. I was a little girl. You weren't nervous? I wasn't nervous, I was so excited. I didn't know what marriage was. I hadn't been in a relationship longer than three years. I didn't think about it. Yeah, I love that for you. That's really interesting to hear

because I know why I love these type of conversations is you never know what you're gonna get because some people could be in your situation being like, I know why I love these types of conversations is like, you never know what you're gonna get. Cause some people could be in your situation being like, I was so petrified because I didn't want to do what my mom had done, or you know, you're gonna like play out what she was doing, but you're like, no, I like went right into it. Yeah, I didn't really think I was, yeah.

It wasn't impulsive or anything. I just like knew that he was the person. I knew he was the person that I was meant to have kids with. I just knew it. So I don't know. And neither of us were like, neither of us ever put any pressure on it either. It wasn't like, we still don't.

We're not like, our marriage will never fail and we're gonna be together till we're 80. We're both kind of like, if we ever were unhappy, we would get divorced. Right, if you're realist. We're realists, we're like, whatever. You talk about how your mom was very open with you and that sometimes could feel like a curse.

What do you mean by that? There were just not a lot of boundaries. It was very like everyone knew everything about everybody. And everyone was involved in everybody's. If I was breaking up with a boyfriend, like she was involved. It was like that kind of a thing. Um, she, everyone, you know, my brother, my dad, like we were very enmeshed, I think.

Um, wow. Yeah. So would you ever find yourself though, like roles reversed? I feel like sometimes people get to the point where they almost become the mother to their mother. Did you ever play therapists with your mom? Yes. mother to their mother. Did you ever play therapist with your mom? Yes, I think that there was a certain point probably in my mid-20s when I sort of became more of the caretaker in the relationship and I think it was around when she became addicted

to opiates because she was always sort of the like leader in our family and then she had, sort of the like leader in our family and then she had, you know, fell into her addiction. And at that point, I sort of, yeah, our dynamic changed a lot. Can we talk about that? Because so many friends and I have these conversations now, I have people that write in and it's like, such a mindfuck when you become the adult in the dynamic with your parent because you're like, wait, no, it's inevitable. It's like such a mind fuck when you become the adult in the dynamic with your parent, because you're like, wait, no. It's inevitable. It's so weird and hard.

And it's like, you have to have so, you either have to have so many conversations or you don't. And it just is what it is. And you're left feeling a little bit like an identity crisis because your parent who you could always go to and be like the child to, you're kind of now like, why are you relying on me so heavily for things that like- I think the weirdest part about it in my experience

is they don't notice they're doing it. Yes. You know? And you're like, wait, who's seeing this? It's such an unsaid thing. No, you're so right. Like they're not aware, but you're aware. Yeah. And then it's awkward, because you can't say,

I don't wanna be your parent. Like, grow up. What is going on? And that's why I think it's such a mindfuck, because then the people or the person that you're most likely going to in your past go to to complain about something like that is your mom. So you go to the other one. Right.

So you go to your dad. And then he's losing it, too. And you're like, oh, shut. You're all going insane. It's really interesting watching my parents get older now. I'm like, do you feel like you have that dynamic with your parents? I started to in a moment and I have been doing a lot of therapy. Yeah. And they have like my mom and I have talked about

like our therapy journeys, cause I'm like, we gotta try to not make this happen. Like we, even if we're equals as adults, but I think and it's- What are the ways if you're comfortable in sharing that you find yourself in that situation? Like how- I think like as basic as like calling me for help

on everything where you're like, how did we get here? How did we get here? How did we get through life where. I have to say like that is something that I really am going to try my best. I don't know if it's just inevitable, but like as a parent, like I don't ever want my kids to feel like they have to take care of me.

Or unless they literally do. But I mean, emotionally. I don't want my children to feel like my happiness is their responsibility. I feel the same way, but I also feel like so many people have that point of like, I'm gonna do it so differently than my parents.

And it feels like every generation says that. And then when we keep fucking up. I think there's another, you know, I think you just have to accept that you're gonna do stuff wrong. Yeah. And you're gonna end up like your child is gonna end up talking to the therapist about you. It's just part of being a parent.

So I, for me, I just, I try and not, you know. Read into it. Or read anything at all. I don't read. I sit and sit. I don't read, but I think there's so much pressure, you know, to improve on the future generations as you know, whatever.

And so I think, I don't know. I don't know what the fuck I'm talking about. No, it's such a, no, no. You're like, and pivot. And pivot. No, I know exactly what you're talking about. Also, I love't know. I don't know what the fuck I'm talking about. No, it's such a, no, no. You're like, and pivot. And pivot. I know exactly what you're talking about. Also, I love that you having a daughter, like did your mom ever talk to you about the trauma

and the grieving process of like losing her father and like how she dealt with that? Cause I feel like you write a lot in the book of like seeing her in a moment, like crying and drinking and crying over Elvis's death, but then it's like how- She never talked about her grief. She only would talk about him.

So she never would, I don't think she processed her grief. Like I think that because her grief was so public, she would hide a lot of her feelings because they felt personal, like something she could keep to herself. So I think because of that, she didn't really talk about the grief so much. And I think in her late 40s and like when she was 50, she started realizing that she hadn't really ever talked about it to anybody. Which I think is also common with older generations,

nobody was talking about all their things. ["Darling, I'm here for you"] You obviously have experienced grief. I mean, you lost your brother and your mom in the span of a couple years, two years. How have you thought about like how to process grief in terms of one for yourself, but also for your daughter? Cause right, like you watched your mom not be able to handle it till she was about 40, 50 and start to feel it. Like have you taken different steps? The only like step that I've actively taken

is to like feel my feelings. It's a good step. It's a good step girl. Which is a lot harder than it sounds. Yes. You know? And some of them have been extremely unbearable. And whether that's grief or anxiety, sadness,

like I think that feeling my feelings has been the only conscious thing that I've done and trying to be present in my feelings. Could you give, just because I know there's so many people that do deal with family members that have addiction, like how did your relationship with your mom change when she became addicted to painkillers? Well, I've had a lot of family members

who have had addiction issues that I will and won't say on air because it's their personal story, but more than just my mother. And it's been a really interesting life because I've been surrounded in a way with people suffering from addiction, but there's never anything I can really do about it. And I found myself kind of going like, what is the lesson here? Like to be around people harming themselves and nothing I do will change it.

And so the only thing that I could do was surrender to what is, you know? And of course, I mean, with my mom, it was years of me trying to drag her into, you know, rehab or get her help or like so much effort, you know? And thinking like, this is gonna be effective every time and not really being present in the fact that the person sitting across from me

is not participating in my plan, you know? So I just was, I mean, that was, I tried really hard to, you know, keep all of these plates spinning. And then ultimately it resulted in like, you know, addiction sort of resulted in the loss of two of my family members. I was kind of forced to surrender.

And I think that it's a really hard line because you can't do nothing because you feel like, you know, you have to. You, someone you love is suffering. You have to do everything you can to help alleviate the suffering. So I wouldn't necessarily like take back all of the effort that I put in,

but it's just, just a weird lesson in like, I don't know. I don't know what, I actually don't know. No, I think that's a good answer though, because I feel like there's so many people that go through it and you feel like you're kind of like going in circles at some point. It's like the same thing with, it's a way more extreme version of when someone

doesn't wanna go to therapy and you're trying to get them to go to therapy. It's like, you can't make the person go to therapy. With addiction, it's like this person you can try to help, but at some point you also in a weird way have to like give yourself some grace that like. Yeah, something my mom always would say is she'd say tough love doesn't work.

And that was, I didn't give tough love. That was that's not part of who I am. But to other people around her who would try and like, force enforce things. Yeah. And I really agree with that. Like, I don't think that personally, like, unless the unless the person is really causing harm, or is a threat to you and your safety or you know, then that is very different in addiction. But I never withdrew love in moments of difficulty through addiction. And I really believe that, you know, I think there's a lot of like when you watch those TV shows that are like about, you know, whatever addicts and stuff, and they're dragging them out of, you know, these are human beings that are in pain. Yeah. So I think that always operating from a place of

empathy, to me was always felt right. I one of the things that you wrote in your book that I felt like was so sad for you, because it goes back to that like isolating feeling was when you kind of talked about being seen as a narc by your family. You're like, I was, my brother is telling me to leave the club and I didn't know why. And I was like, oh, he's sending me home so he can start doing drugs in the club. And he didn't want you around. Like, how do you think that affected the way you acted around your family? Because I think the people that aren't doing the drugs, like I've had a situation like this

where like someone trying to hide it from you and then you also just kind of feeling like not wanted. And as much as you don't wanna be a part of the drugs, you also feel like you're being alienated because you're the only quote unquote sober one. Yeah, it was a really strange experience because I never was, we were never having the same experience. Like in my experience, I was always being very,

I was being firm, but I was always very gentle. And to them, it was like, you're making me feel so bad. Like they took it, everything was really, was received really intensely. And it wasn't my experience. So I think there's so much like shame around addiction that it's really hard to like

have, you know, honest conversations. Yeah. But I, you know, like, I, you know, honest conversations. Yeah. But I, you know, like, I don't know, it wasn't like, I'm in the room, everybody's like, leaving me out or something, you know, it was a, it was a slow burn. When you went through this, like, two year span of grief, essentially, or like the beginning of who did you lean on? Like who do you go to when you're you need someone to support you? I really leaned on people who had had similar experiences because it felt so isolating. I had

friends who had lost loved ones in various ways. And I found that to be the most comforting because I just wanted them to tell me that I was gonna be okay, you know, from someone who had experienced it and say, like, you're gonna survive this. And because in the moments, in the moment itself, particularly losing my brother, I didn't see a way that I could. So I wanted to just talk to people who had lost a sibling,

had lost someone in a sort of more shocking sort of way, like the way I lost my brother, people who had experienced suicide. I just wanted to hear just from them. But then I had an amazing group of friends around me and husband. But it's a really isolating experience. It is. I appreciate you talking about it and I think that's what was wonderful about you writing about your experience in the book is like you saying you wanted to go to certain people that had experienced it because you, as much as you love certain friends,

it's like if they don't understand, if they've never gone through it, you're kinda like, okay, I don't need you to like hold my hand right now. I literally need like answers. Yeah, I would go on like Reddit. I would literally go on forums and go like, and just cause it was, it was such an isolating experience

and like read people's experiences and like blogs. And like I talked, DM'd with people on Instagram who DM'd me, who had also lost their siblings. Like I would just talk to them and be like, did you feel this way? Did you feel this way? Cause it was so lonely. So I, anyone who had experienced it, I would just talk to them and be like, did you feel this way? Did you feel this way? Cause it was so lonely. Right.

So I, anyone who had experienced it, I would literally talk to. Oh my God, you on Reddit. I know. I love that for you. Are you also a Reddit sleuth though? Are you? No, no, no.

I'm not like, I'm not, I don't, I just do a Google. I'm not like, I don't have an account. You're like XXXRFMNNQQ. Narc25. Imagine you're like the biggest Reddit sleuth and this all comes out one day. We find your account. No. Okay. I read that you're a certified death doula. Yeah. Can you talk to me about what that entails and how you got into that? Yeah. I got into it because a friend of mine was a death doula and because of what I was just saying,

how I felt like when my brother died, there were no resources and I was literally going on Reddit. I found a community of people who worked in like the death world and I didn't know that that existed. And she was a death doula. And I just thought if I could make myself of use

at all to people who were experiencing anything like this, I would. So I did my death doula training and got certified. It's essentially like what a birth doula is for dying and you're taught how to be with the dying person. Do you find like that kind of also continues to heal you while you work with other people or is it at all triggering if something is similar that they're going through that you've been through? I wouldn't say triggering. I would say you're very empathetic.

It's hard to... Because you've experienced something, you're very much with them emotionally, because it's a shared law, like an experience of grief. So, yeah, I think it's just... It's not that I'm triggered and thinking of my own situation, but I'm very much emotionally with the person. Yeah.

When you were in the press with like all of that shit about the estate and everything and legal and all of this, like how does it feel when your family is so publicly like in the news like that? And that I feel like was the first time you were at the forefront. So that's actually true. Like my family's been since I, my first memories is my family's in the news 24 seven, like growing up every where I would go, my family are on the front of every magazine, like as a child, like that was very normal. But my mom received all of it.

You know, when my mom died, that was the first time I received all that energy, which was very intense. And it made me really empathize with her. You know, it's funny when I, I've been doing press for years, like I've been acting for a long time. And typically, it's a pretty good experience. When I went out to do press for this book, the vibe I got from certain interviewers was aggressive. Like, tell me this thing. Tell me the answer to this. Why

did this happen? Like a more like, like putting me on like in the hot seat kind of experience, which I've never like as an actor, I'm just having a nice time doing press, you know? And I was like, wow, because it's like related to my mom, I'm getting the energy my mom would get, you know? And it's so interesting. And maybe it's because of the name and how media was different back in the day and there were just like the core tenants of who was famous and there weren't

that many famous people. It almost is like they're carrying on that sense of entitlement in media of like, we deserve to know this and we will go to the end of the earth to get the picture and the shot and the information and you're really like we I'm like wait this does not happen anymore you're like next question like wait you can't say that yeah I can fight yeah but then I realized like what she would have been

dealing with yeah it's so interesting. Like every generation it changes and it gets different. Like in the way that you probably feel about your grandfather so different than the way that your mother felt about her father and how your daughter will feel about her grandfather. Like this empire that he was. That's what's so interesting is reading this book and hearing you talk about it for most of us. This has been a very long time since Elvis was at the center of the conversation.

It's really wild. I don't quite understand either. It's like there's still movies all the time. It's amazing that somebody could impact people so much. It's really unique. And I really appreciate it because of course, we love our family and want other people too as well. But I do often go like, there's always like in my inbox,

like this movie and that movie and Elvis's. And I'm like, wow, it's really- Still poppin'. Still poppin'. Still poppin'. You're like, go, Granny Annie. Oh my God. Okay, in a way with this book now finally being out, do you feel a sense of relief?

Like not that it's being put to bed, but you got to tell this story and now it's like the next chapter of your life is beginning. I do feel relief because it felt like this thing that I knew was coming that was gonna be this big thing and I did sort of want it to be over. You know?

I think this is like my last podcast by the way. Woo! You're like I'm done. So going out with a bang. I love it, I love it. And I, yeah, I don't wanna think about my trauma all day every day, you know? I feel like we didn't get too crazy, right?

No. You wanted to laugh more. No, I didn't wanna laugh. To be honest, I had no expectations. Did your friends think you were coming in to talk about sex? I literally, we can. I mean, I'm an open book.

Maybe you're gonna have to come back on and we'll have to do like a different Caller Daddy episode. Great. Where we get into the tea. We'll do a tea episode coming soon. I'm very, very appreciative. Thank you so much for taking the time. Thank you for having me.

I know this is like a lot, so thank you. No, I appreciate it.