Calm Parenting Podcast - FAFO Parenting Will NOT Work With Strong-Willed Children #452

Episode Date: February 23, 2025

FAFO Parenting Will NOT Work With Strong-Willed Children #452 "F* Around & Find Out" is the classic idea that you allow your child to learn from the natural consequences of their actions. It makes sense in theory. But it will NOT work with our kids. This approach can backfire badly and cause more damage than you think. It is critical to understand your child's very nature so you don't create more power struggles. This is the FINAL week of our Winter Sale on the Get Everything Package. Begin 2025 with hundreds of practical strategies that really work with your strong-willed kids. Visit https://celebratecalm.com/products and make 2025 DIFFERENT. AG1 AG1 is offering new subscribers a FREE $76 gift when you sign up. You’ll get a Welcome Kit, a bottle of D3 & K2 AND 5 free travel packs in your first box. Go to https://drinkag1.com/calm  HAPPY MAMMOTH Get 15% off on your entire first order at https://HappyMammoth.com with the code CALM at checkout.  HUNGRYROOT.COM Get 40% off your first box PLUS get a free item in every box for life. Go to https://hungryroot.com/ and use code CALM. ONE SKIN Go to https://oneskin.co and use code KIRK at checkout for an exclusive 15% off your first purchase. COZY EARTH Wrap yourself and your kids in Cozy Earth luxury...with 40% OFF! Visit https://cozyearth.com/ and use my exclusive 40% off code CALM.  IXL LEARNING Get an exclusive 20% off an IXL membership when you sign up today at https://IXL.com/KIRK. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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So a hot topic now trending on Instagram and TikTok is the idea of FAFO parenting. F around and find out or fool around and find out. And it's the classic idea practiced by generations of parents that you allow your child to learn by experiencing the natural consequences of their actions. Here are just a few common examples to start. If the child doesn't wear a jacket in cold weather, the child gets uncomfortably cold

and the thought is the child will choose to put a jacket on to keep from being cold. If a child breaks his toy, then he can't play with it anymore and you won't replace it. A child plays roughly with a cat, the cat scratches the child, the child learns his or her lesson. This idea is nothing new and most of us grew up learning from natural consequences, right? We kind of effed around and found out that it wasn't pleasant and many of us learned and then adjusted our behavior and actions accordingly. Obviously we practice common sense and we do not allow behaviors that ultimately lead to danger for the child, right?

You don't let a child FAFO by playing in the middle of the street, forgo wearing a helmet when doing a dangerous activity, or letting your kids sleep outside wet for extended periods in the cold, right? That's common sense. Look, we believe in natural consequences, but we are even bigger fans of going a step further and giving kids ownership of their choices within our boundaries.

A guiding principle we practice is, hey, when we step back, it gives our strong-willed kids an opportunity to step up. When we step back from lecturing, micromanaging, controlling our kids, it gives them space to step up and be responsible for themselves because when we're micromanaging them, we're actually being responsible for our child. And so this podcast should be over, right? But it's not. And here's why. Because FAFO

parenting will not work well with a strong-will child or with many of our kids who are adopted, who struggle with attachment disorders, have PDA, are highly sensitive, and many of our ND kids with ADHD or ASD. You have to practice an alternative approach to go a few steps beyond and if you happen to express any doubts about the limits of natural consequences many other parents and even professionals will judge you. They'll call you soft, say you're making excuses for why you can't be tough, and they'll shake their head at your inability to just grasp this simple concept. Well, I call these people FW people, F-ing wrong. So, or foolishly wrong. So, let's work through this because it is foundational to

disciplining, teaching, and raising our kids. One caveat before moving forward. Feel free to practice FAFO parenting and let kids experience natural consequences. Just be sure your motives are healthy. See, the healthy form is controlling your own anxiety and giving your kids freedom to make choices they will learn from. But some of us had parents who practiced this, but there was something unhealthy in it, right? For some of you, it was just pure neglect. Some parents were distracted by work and failed relationships, and they didn't prioritize you. Many of our parents just didn't have the tools to deal with their emotions and struggles, so we were left on our own to figure life out.

Some parents were resentful toward their kids. Well, my life's been hard, so yours should be as well. There's like that bravado and false pride and punishing soft kids. Obviously, none of those motivations are healthy. So as you listen to FAFO advocates on social media and read the comments, watch for the strain in those comments because you'll kind of hear that resentment. I know that's not your motive, but I wanted to acknowledge that many of you have been hurt by disinterest, by neglect, and by resentful parents. And that's not what we're after. Okay, big point number one. FAFO parenting is easy.

Raising a strong-willed child is not. Here's why. Think about this. In FAFO parenting, we let the child experience the natural consequences of their actions. The child gets cold and learns from it. That makes sense, but that doesn't really affect the parent, only the child. So the concept is beautifully simple and easy to enact. Hey, go for it. Be cold, be wet, be hungry.

Doesn't affect me. But when raising one of our kids and when I say our kids, let's just say that means strong will kids, neurodivergent kids, kids with PDA, ADHD, adopted, kids with attachment disorders, you know all of the people listening to this, you know what that means right? When raising one of our kids it will affect and bother you and push your buttons because you have kids who will do things very differently than you would do them. They will suffer the natural consequences and just not care. Our kids will do things and it's not

always intentional that just irritate us. They will do their homework lying upside down, procrastinate until 2 a.m., they'll take a shower outside with those, they'll get ready for school in weird ways and sometimes act oblivious to their own actions and that will provoke your own anxiety and control issues. So if you have a more naturally compliant child, by all means use natural consequences and they'll likely learn from their lessons and they will course correct. But it's more than likely that your child is going to experience natural consequences and it will just

bother you without changing their behavior. Here's why. Big point number two. The biggest fallacy with thinking natural consequences will work with our kids is that you are assuming these kids are actually motivated by consequences of any kind, whether that's natural or imposed by the parent as some form of punishment. It is based on a fundamental misunderstanding of our kids. Our kids have a very high need for intense emotional engagement and brain stimulation. Many of our kids have brains that are just physiologically

under stimulated and that's why many of your kids if brains that are just physiologically under stimulated. And that's why many of your kids, if they're on medication, it is a stimulant medication. We have kids who are intrinsically motivated by the challenge of breaking rules or doing things differently. They often prefer to do things the hard way and purposefully choose the harsher consequence because they prefer the challenge. We have kids who will purposefully defy you because they value their agency and independence, their desire to do it their own way, their ownership far above any consequences. They don't take care if you take away their things, but do not take away their agency, their voice, their

freedom. We have kids who will not give in. They will not cry uncle. They will not acknowledge that they have lost. I am not saying any of these traits or attributes are right or wrong. They just are. This is their nature and most people around you simply won't understand that. Perhaps even your spouse and parents don't understand or they don't want to understand that. Why? Because this requires something of you beyond simple parenting maxims like, oh, kids will learn from natural consequences. Actually, no. No, they will not. And sometimes, maybe even rarely they will, but not always. FAFO parenting and consequences are based on

the belief that human behavior is rational. We take an action, experience a consequence, and then adjust our actions. But much of our, I would say most of our human behavior is driven by deeper emotional needs, trauma, anxiety that we often aren't even aware of. And younger children are impulsive. They don't always rationally put two and two together in the moment. So while it's necessary to give consequences to set boundaries and clear expectations, consequences are severely limited in their effectiveness in actually changing human behavior. Connection, showing, teaching, creating successes, affirming kids, way better.

Sometimes there is something deeper going on underneath the surface that is driving this behavior in your kids and in you and I. We all have issues. We're all doing something in our life that isn't completely healthy and it's not just about willpower. There are often things driving that. External motivation does not work well with our kids. We need to motivate them internally. So let's look at this with some specific examples of natural consequences that could work and those that may actually backfire. Many of us have kids who struggle with an overly

rigid diet. Some kids are eating uncontrollably and they're feeling a lot of shame. Any behavior around food that is affecting your kids physical or mental health needs to be taken seriously. If your child's eating habits are interfering with their daily life, it might be time to seek support. And that's why I'm excited to introduce you to Equip. Equip is an evidence-based eating disorder treatment program that provides you is an evidence-based eating disorder treatment program that provides you with virtual evidence-based care so your child can heal at home. Each family has access to a team of eating disorder experts that include a

therapist, dietitian, medical provider and mentors with lived experience. Your family gets dedicated wrapararound support that helps your child achieve lasting recovery at home. If you're concerned at all about your child's relationship with food, don't wait to get an expert's advice. Visit equip.health.com for a free consultation with Equip. That's Equip.health slash calm. So guess who's been stealing my AG1? Mrs. Calm. She's trying to make that transition from so much caffeine or smoothies in the morning to starting her day with AG1. And she said, I feel good knowing I'm starting my day putting really healthy ingredients in my body. It's a quick easy habit. There's no cleanup. There's no cleaning blenders and that's huge to her. I've

noticed an uptick in energy and mood and that's why I've been enjoying and partnering with AG1 for so long. Look, Valentine's Day is coming up. Why don't you and your spouse create a healthy habit together? It's more likely to stick that way and it's great modeling for your kids. AG1 is offering new subscribers a free $76 gift when you sign up. You'll get a welcome kit, a bottle of D3 and K2 and five AG1 travel packs in your first box. So make sure to check out drinkag1.com slash calm to get this offer. That's drinkag1.com to start your new year on a healthier note.

We have jokingly but truthfully said for the last 25 years, most of our strong will kids will come down in the morning in the winter and they will not wear a jacket. And then parents will say, well honey, if you don't wear a jacket, you'll catch a cold. But now you're lying, right? As the parent because you don't catch cold from, you'll catch a cold. But now you're lying, right? As the parent, because you don't catch cold from cold weather, it's from germs. The real issue is I don't want to be embarrassed and have the teachers and other parents

to think I'm a bad parent for sending my child to school in shorts and a hoodie in the winter. But the premise of FAFO parenting is solid here. You allow your child to go out in cold weather without a jacket and experience firsthand the discomfort of the chilling cold as a natural consequence, and they'll come back in and get their jacket. That makes sense to me. Here is my caveat.

Some of our kids are very sensory kids, and their internal temperature runs very warm. They don't like getting too hot. They do not like feeling restricted by a jacket. They don't like the feel of it and that feel is so important to them. I know because I am like that. They don't like to be restricted by clothes or ideas. They often have trouble with fine motor skills. So zipping a jacket or buttoning pants or a shirt may be more challenging for them. So they just slide the hoodie over their head.

And this is important. The feeling of being cold is not a strong enough motivation for them because they like they dislike the restrictive feeling even more. Now at the bus stop they may steal or negotiate to wear another kid's jacket because they're resourceful like that. They may discover a warm place to stand over some great emitting warm steam. And this is really critical to understand. Challenges like this to be different than everyone else

at the bus stop or wherever with a jacket, right? Because they value their agency, their individuality, and they don't crave social acceptance. So they don't care if they're the weird one at the bus stop without a jacket, they don't mind that. They will often do this and they will do it to prove to their parents that you don't actually need a jacket. See, these things are actually very jacket. See these things are actually very motivating to our kids. We just don't want, we don't understand that or sometimes we don't want to understand

that because it makes us so uncomfortable and we often miss the fact that these very challenges that these are the challenges that spur our kids to develop workarounds from a practical side, waiting until the last minute to run from the warm house to the warm bus, adding an extra layer underneath, one day developing some uber comfortable base layer for skiers. Our kids often get in trouble at school for not wearing a jacket outside, and they simply will not give in no matter the consequences. And so in some cases they simply aren't cold or don't care.

So natural consequences may work with the winter jacket, they may fire backfire, or they may just cause your kids to invent something cool to replace a jacket. By the way, here's a downside. If you're going for a hike as we often do or if you're walking through the zoo when it's cold and your kids don't bring their jacket, well guess what? That affects you because now they are wearing your jacket and you are cold. So you always have to use these things with some measure of wisdom. Here is another common natural consequence that should

work with our kids, but likely won't. You say, hey, if you break your toy, then you won't have it to play with and I'm not buying another one. Hey, fair enough. That's why that's how parents have handled situations like this for decades. The limitation with our kids is that they often break things out of frustration fueled anger.

So it isn't some purely rational choice they will learn from. Instead, they get frustrated because their toy isn't doing what they want it to do. Our kids can be creative and they want the toy to operate some other way. And when it doesn't obey their wishes, they get frustrated and smash it.

Or you tell them to put away their toys and come to eat or sleep and they don't want to stop so they get frustrated and they smash the toy and then if we come in and talk all rationally well you just broke your favorite toy so you won't be able to play with that tomorrow and I'm not getting a new one you know what's going to happen all of their toys and some of your nice things are about to get broken. The real issue is not making a different choice. It's teaching your kids how to handle their inevitable intense

frustration because that's their nature. That's who your kids are. Does that make sense? Okay here's some other quick ones before bigger ones. Tidiness. I saw this one online. Well if a child keeps the room tidy they can find their toys easily but your ND kids are usually so overwhelmed and disorganized this won't motivate them. It will frustrate them so you have to go the extra step and begin teaching them how to organize because it's not a natural or easy skill for them. It won't work with our kids. Waiting their turn. Well, if a child waits their turn in a game, the game goes more smoothly. Well, who cares about it going more smoothly? Here's your child's response. I want to go first and then go again and then dominate because I tend

to control other people in situations and I'm not all that confident and things like games with other kids represent a lot of uncertainty and anxiety and I'm not sure if you've noticed but I haven't exactly mastered impulse control yet and don't see it as the top priority. See, this won't work well with our kids. Well, if children are fighting over a toy, the toy is put up on a shelf for 10 minutes. Fine. Then my brother doesn't get to play and I'll do something else. Not motivating. Putting on shoes. Well, if a child puts on

their shoes, their feet stay clean and dry. Well, who says your kids value their feet staying clean and dry? Some do, some don't. How many of your kids will put their shoes on and then happily stomp through the biggest mud puddles? So many of these fool around and find out ideas are based on what parents want their kids to value, not what kids actually do value. Getting wet. Hey, if a child stands in the rain, they get wet. I think that one's perfectly reasonable, probably works with many kids. Hey, a child plays roughly with a cat, cat scratches the kid. That's probably a helpful one. I get that. So look, I'm not throwing them all out. I'm not against it. I'm just saying with our

kids, much of the time it's not going to work. Here's a popular one. Getting hungry. If a child doesn't eat dinner, then they go to bed hungry. And a lot of dads lean into this one because it's how we were raised. And it seems so logical. And it should work. But I've seen this backfire in a lot of homes over the years. We have kids who will declare a hunger strike and will not back down and they will not be the first one to blink here. The parents will eventually give in and give them the food they want because what parent wants to be accused of starving their child or seeing their child waste away? Do not underestimate the persistence of our kids.

Now they don't have this persistence in doing chores or homework of course, but when they have a mission they believe in, oh they can outlast anyone. Hey don't eat your dinner or you'll go to bed hungry. Oh yeah, now it's a challenge. I will now use my strategic thinking skills and plan a late night trip to the pantry, making sure I leave no fingerprints and erase evidence with bleach. I will put 10 times more energy into sneaking around

and trying to figure out how to get this food at midnight than it would have taken just to eat my dinner. And it will be so incredibly satisfying to my brain when I eat those midnight snacks in the dark, savoring every bite. And I may just leave a wrapper on the counter so you see it when you wake up so you know I was there, I saw that food, and I conquered. And I crave, I crave that, and it spurs me on. And if that doesn't work, I will seek out food on the black market and begin hoarding food in my bedroom that you don't know about

because you can't find it amidst the mess. That is how the brain of a strong-willed child often works. Well, wouldn't it be easier to just eat what your parents have worked so hard to provide rather than have to go to these great lengths to secure alternative food? Of course it would be easier, but that's how you think and what motivates you. These are stove touchers. What do they seek more than anything? Especially adopted kids, kids with attachment disorders. A lot of our kids on the spectrum,

they want the brain stimulation. And now this becomes an elaborate game. They will throw all their energy into winning. Some kids feel important or alive, or get their parents intense emotional engagement which communicates, I care and you are important enough for me to get mad at you. See how that works? They'll do that when they do things wrong. So you have to be careful with these things. Well, does that mean you give in and make them whatever they

want all the time to cater to their every whim? Absolutely not. It does mean that you teach them how to make their own meals. You relax a little around food issues and listen to the recent podcast that I did on food and sleep issues so you don't create unnecessary power struggles and anxiety over eating or over any of these things. Look, natural consequences with, well, you're gonna get a lower grade if you don't do your schoolwork. Well, two problems with that one. Your kids may not even care about grades.

You and your teachers do, but they don't, and you're missing out on giving them tools to complete their work in ways that work best with their brain. And I'm gonna cover this on the next podcast on Wednesday. You could give consequences for your child quitting an activity and then they don't get to go anymore. They won't care because this is driven by anxiety. So in the next episode of the podcast I'm going to cover how to actually internally motivate your child when fool around and find out doesn't work,

when natural or punitive consequences don't work for your kids. And we will go through several examples and show you a different way. But for now, dig into this really contemplate on a deeper level. What is going on in your child's brain. If you have our programs, listen on to, listen on app to the program on stop power struggles with a strong willed child. It is insight into your kids that is just fantastic. You have to have that. The ADHD university program,

that is all about how their brains work, motivating, unmotivated kids and the No BS program. Do those to start because those will give you dozens of insights and strategies to use. Okay, I talked really fast. I hope that makes sense and helps frame this in a way that helps us moving forward so we don't create more power struggles. Subscribe to the podcast so you don't miss the next episode. I do appreciate you sharing it with others. I do appreciate you being open to different ways

of handling these situations with your strong willed kids because this is hard work and it will probably change you more than it changes them. All right, love you all. We'll talk to you next time. Bye bye.