Cameron Hanes - Keep Hammering Collective - KHC 034 - Brian Barney

Episode Date: August 21, 2023

Join us for an engaging discussion with Brian Barney, an influential leader in the bowhunting community with a great perspective on archery and the outdoor industry. Listen in as Brian shares his experiences and insights from decades of bowhunting and writing. Brian reflects on the impact of mentors and the power of hard work.   Follow along: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/cameronrhanes Twitter: https://twitter.com/cameronhanes Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/camhanes/ Website: https://www.cameronhanes.com   Connect with Brian Barney:  https://www.instagram.com/brian__barney/   Thank you to our sponsors: Santa Cruz Medicinals: scmedicinals.com use code KeepHammering for 15% off Ketone IQ: https://hvmn.com/CAM use code CAM for 20% MTN OPS Supplements: https://mtnops.com/ Use code KEEPHAMMERING for 20% off and Free Shipping Leupold: https://www.leupold.com/ Black Rifle: https://www.blackriflecoffee.com/ Use code KEEPHAMMERING for 20% your first order Hoyt: http://bit.ly/3Zdamyv Bass Pro/Cabelas: https://www.basspro.com   Timestamps:  0:00:00 Intro  0:07:30 Learning, Writing, and Hunting  0:14:20 Life is all about perspective   0:21:44 Appreciation for Bowhunting and Mentorship  0:24:00 Lessons From Overcoming Tough Times  0:29:21 GoRuck  0:30:00 Breeo  0:35:00 Navigating Negative People  0:40:00 Motivation and Doubt in Hunting  0:53:00 The Bow Only Mindset  0:56:30 Bowhunting is in our DNA  1:02:12 Wayne And The Bow Rack  1:06:00 Be Undeniable  1:11:08 Achieving Success Through Mentoring and Mindset  1:17:38 Becoming A Great Archery Shot  1:25:30 Closing  

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I had them talking, saying the way that I'm moving so reckless. That is a part of my mind I've been blessed with. Giving my blood so I am relentless. This is a Keep Hammering Collective. I'm with Brian Barney. Brian, thank you for coming to Springfield, Oregon. Thank you for the invite, man. It was amazing.

We were able to grind and go have an adventure together. It just doesn't get any better. So tell me, you've been watching. I think you've seen the show and maybe seeing some of the podcast. How was it? Was it what you expected? Was it different? Or what do you think? Yeah. I mean, I think I expected to go hard and I expected to grind. But it's different when you're in that moment, too. It's like you can have all these expectations. But until you're there climbing the mountain, until you're there in the heat, you don't really know what to expect.

So I knew we were going to go for it. And yeah, you definitely met my expectations, if not exceeded them and able to grind. And then to like when you share an adventure, when you share difficult things together, it's really like this amazing experience that's like a closer friendship than you get like sharing a beer with somebody or something. So yeah, it was everything I could have hoped for. Oh, good. Well, I mean, you know, to catch people up to speed, Brian works for Eastman's. And Eastman's is like for those that don't know, you know, in the hunting industry or hunting community. community, they're, you know, man, they've been in the game forever. Gordon Eastman started filming hunts back in the, what year was that?

Do you know? He had like the 60s or 70s exploring Canada for doll sheep, Northwest Territories. Yeah, he was like one of the first ones to do it, outdoor films. He's a pioneer. Absolutely. And so the Eastman's family has just been so steeped in tradition. And for those that don't know, again, I worked for Eastman's for about 10 years. and they launched the bow hunting magazine eastman's bow hunting journal i was involved in that

and they gave me my first shot at a real job in the outdoor industry it's like the you know the debt i'm indebted to them for that opportunity because here was i i was some dipship bow hunter from oregon which oregon isn't known for trophy anything or great hunting or anything noteworthy and they gave me they're in wyoming some of the best hunting they've been you know involved in filmmaking for forever and they took a chance on me. So you fast forward to when I left 2008 and then Brian comes in and it's almost like, I don't want to say mirror the same journey, but it's a similar story. Tell me how you got started with Eastman's. So similar. Well, the same as Gordon was a pioneer. You were a pioneer for bow hunters and paving the way. And you paved the way through

grit, determination and hard work and also consistent results, being able to air. consistent trophies and then writing about them. And you got yourself noticed by writing stories and telling about your adventure, by honing your craft and becoming a proficient bow hunter. And so you really paved the way. And to be honest, like a lot of my mentality came from like running to the post office box to get your articles when you were the editor of Eastman's Bow Hunting Journal. It was just like out of all the literature that I wrote and or all the literature that I read and all the information I took in, like your spoke to me, like your mindset, but really your passion for it, like how much you loved it and how you put absolutely everything into

it. So me, as a young 20-year-old kid that moved from the Pacific Northwest to Montana, I immersed myself in the world and I embrace that mindset and I embraced that passion for it. And I fell in love with the process and with the journey of improving and becoming really good with my bow and really good in the most rugged wildest places in the lower 48. And I started finding consistent success. And so I started writing about that success and talking about my adventures in different places. And, you know, it probably took me twice as many articles to get noticed. But after you get published 10 times in the magazine, finally they start to pay attention.

Go, hey, kid, yeah, we're thinking about giving you a chance for an actual paid article. I've been writing for free this whole time. but it's not writing for free. It's also like I'm reinvesting in myself. I'm betting on myself. And to become, to make a living in the outdoor industry is a bit like trying to become a movie star. There's not many guys that make it. And everybody tells you that it's not possible.

You can't hunt for a living. But I had this belief in myself and in the direction where I was going. So really, you know, I just followed the path that you laid down of hard work and dedication and really working hard to hone my craft at bow hunting, started getting noticed. They gave me a chance at staff articles, then gave me a chance at doing some film work. And every chance I was given, I proved myself and came out on top.

And then, you know, I had this idea to start the podcast. And now we've been going eight years strong. And I just, you know, I had more information that I wanted to get out there. There's so many nuances to bow hunting and becoming proficient about it. And so it really started to connect with hunters and took, off. And yeah, now I'm to the place where I've really made a good name in the hunting industry. And I just want to continue to strive forward and be at my best and be a student of the game and get even better. Man, I'm not at my limits yet. No, no. The goal is to get better every day,

better today than yesterday, better tomorrow than today. And I saw the effort you put forth and everything that we did with the lift, run, shoot. I mean, for those that don't know, most people in the archery industry probably know Brian is a great shot. But the work that he put in in the training today and running yesterday is like that's what sets him apart also because there's a lot of great shots out there that don't kill. You know, I mean, you can be a great shot standing on the line on a course and that's much different than when the chips are down. When you've, you know, you've had to earn every opportunity. The mountains are unforgiving. The mountains aren't giving you any breaks.

The animals aren't giving you any breaks. And so I see why you're successful because I see how hard you work in the training and the preparing. and I've watched your journey and over the course of your career too. And it's, I mean, I love it. I love it when hard work is rewarded. You know, that's how life is supposed to be. Life isn't fair all the time. Sometimes it doesn't work that way.

But for you, it has worked that way. And it's great to see. I was curious, you said you started writing, what was your first article? My first article was a Nevada Muley that I killed. And I killed him on a solo trip. And I was by myself 11 days deep into the Nevada backcountry, and it's in this giant wilderness in there.

And I'd done some mule deer hunting, and I'd definitely hunted around my home state. But this was a big adventure hunt for me. And so by yourself, 10 days in the wilderness, or longer, 12 days, whatever, it took me to kill this buck. You don't get to hide from yourself very much. Like, your true colors come out and you have to face yourself in difficult things. and so I was able to arrow this great buck in the Nevada backcountry. And so that was my first article.

But, man, I didn't pay attention in high school like I was supposed to. I was too into sports. I was, you know, I'm really good at learning about the things I'm interested in. And then I go all in. So I didn't pay as much attention as I should have with my spelling or my grammar. And so it's something that I'm all self-taught. So when I started getting interested in writing articles, it's like this difficult format where you have to be able to express your passion for it.

And you have to be able to take readers on this journey with your wordsmithing. And so, like, it was something that I really had to work at and hone my skills and write a bunch to really let my passion come forth, like, on the paper. And so, yeah, something that I had to work at. But that was my first article was Nevada backcountry, a great big giant buck that I erode deep into the hunt. That's great. And yeah, as much like my journey, my first articles, I didn't get paid. Then I remember I got paid $25.

I wrote for Oregon Hunter Magazine. And just like you, writing is not easy. You're trying to paint a picture with words. And you want to put the reader there. And it took me a while to figure that out. You know, I was so, I was so interested in just telling my story from my perspective. And then I was like, well, wait, I'm not, this isn't for me to read. I already know what happened.

I need to take the reader there. And that is, it sounds easy. Words make it sound easy. But to do it is difficult. And so, yeah, I remember I'd send articles into, you know, the dream was to get in Bo Hunter, one of the big magazines, right? Bo Hunter Peterson's. And they were like, no, you suck.

So, yeah, rewrite it. Try again. I never wanted to rewrite anything. But I remember, you know, I would see Eastman's, and it was a big, glossy magazine, giant animal. And that was like for a Western hunter, that was the dream to make Eastman's, you know, and I have to hand it to them. They've navigated the changing landscape of media because at the time it was Eastman's Bone or Eastman's Journal, then Eastman's Bowling Journal. Then there was like a trophy hunter magazine. There was other magazines that were very similar, but they were all trying to kind of copy Eastman's, you know, Eastman's set the standard essentially. So to make that, was a trophy hunter magazine. So to make that was, was like that was the pinnacle at that time. But now magazines are, they're still around.

I mean, Eastman still has a magazine. But they've done a good job. And I mean, it sounds like you were the, you kind of suggested the podcast maybe. And maybe that was your push. But in general, they have other podcasts. They have magazines. They have internet-based information.

And it seems like they've just evolved. And so I've got to hand it not just to Gordon first for paving the way, then Mike for having this vision of making it, you know, he had, you know, a few other people involved. And then his kids became involved, Guy in Aikisman, who I think run the show now. But it's been impressive what they've been able to do as far as how everything's changed and they're still there at the top. Yeah, they're adapting to a changing landscape, which is great. Yeah. And being able to excel in those different media formats, which is awesome.

It's like doing the podcast right now, like how beautiful our podcast, man. And I mean, well, they've only been around, like I've had mine for eight years, but they're not that old. But it's something that you can do while you're active, while you're doing other things, while you're getting a workout, while you're getting a run, while you're driving to work, you can be taking in this information. And this information that's given out on these podcasts have taken guys like me and you a lifetime to learn, to hone our craft at bow hunting and to figure out how to stalk animals or to shoot effectively or like your mindset for people to be able to listen into your podcast and get your

mindset and mentality that you take into bow hunting but really that you take into life. You know, it's amazing that everybody can tap into that and listen to that in their headphones and apply it to their own life. Now that information is out there and you put it out to guys just like I don't hold any secrets back. I talk about everything that makes me a successful Western bow hunter, all the lessons I've learned. I put that information out there, but then it's up to the people to take that information and to apply it to their own lives.

So people hear this podcast and then they have to act on it and they have to start taking those steps to gain that mentality. And mentality isn't something that you can just wish you had. You have to grind and earn it. Like you've got to put in the work day and day out. You've got to be in uncomfortable situations over and over and over again to callous your mind to build this mentality. And now you've done a great job of doing it. Now you're sharing it with everybody that listens into this podcast and everybody has an opportunity to take that and go make something out of themselves.

That's beautiful, man. Yeah, yeah. Well, you know, when you say that, I think, I don't think it's my mentality because I feel like I'm learning from my guests. You know what I mean? I don't think I do anything noteworthy. Other than maybe suffer a little more than other people want to. But, you know, because you talk about earning that mentality.

And then I think about, you know, we did a lot. a good run yesterday, you know, a few thousand feet of gain. And as, as you can attest, I like doing it. That'd be hard enough anyway. So in my head, I'm like, how do we make it harder? Oh, it's going to be 90 today. Let's do it when it's the absolutely hottest part of the day. And then when we're on that straight stretch heading towards Piscuit, it's absolute, you know, heat coming off the asphalt, we've already got it in 15 miles. That's where for me personally, I'm like finally because anybody else would be like they'd be you know I don't really like running in the heat I like running in the morning when it's cool yeah well no shit who doesn't but this is why we're doing it because nobody else wants to do it I mean did that make sense yesterday I mean oh 100% man that's that's a difference and you do it too right is that is that your goal also 100% yeah absolutely but yeah it's a you're embracing it so the same way people are learning from this podcast you know you're learning from this podcast you know you're learning. from your guests and your your influences and the people that you're friends with,

and you're taking that mentality and applying it to your own life and your own passions. But yeah, the difference between you is like you're always looking for it to be tougher. Yesterday you're running in a black shirt, which is hotter, which you never took off. You're running on the asphalt, the hotter it got, the happier you are. And you told me at the end, I wish it would have got hotter for us. So it's like that's your mentality is you're always looking for it to be tougher. And I think embracing difficult situations like that, like life is all about perspective. It's all about how you look at it.

And you can look at it and go, man, this is shitty. It's super hot. And you can give in to that and give up on the hunt. Or you embrace and go, man, I wish it was hotter. Now I'm really improving. And yeah, on that last stretch that got hot on that asphalt, you picked up your pace and went even faster and tried to hurt even more, you know? So that's what you've done a really good job of embracing is your perspective on things

and wanting it to be difficult. And me, like, you can show me a great four point buck that's easy a mile from the trail. I'm going to want to go 10 miles back to go find that buck that nobody's found. Even if he's not as big, like I want it to be difficult. I want to hurt. I want to push myself because the more you put into something, the more it means to you when you achieve it. I agree.

Well, how is it that two, so you're from Washington originally. I'm from Oregon. Those are, if you had to pick the worst states in the West, those two would be right at the top the list. So how does two guys from, I mean, we shouldn't succeed in hunting because the best hunting, of course, everybody knows, Wyoming, Utah, Colorado, Montana, everywhere but Washington in Oregon. So how did you find your way to the industry and to the top of the industry where now you're a respected name? How did that happen? Yeah, I think, you know, like being a quality

bow hunter, you know, it's not just being a good shot. It's not just being physically fit. It's like so multifaceted of all these different skill sets you have to work out at and become proficient at. But I think, I think the bottom line is like, is like, Like with all these people that you have in that sit across from you, like it's passion. It's a love for it. It's this burning desire to do whatever it takes to find success. And whatever it takes isn't just on a seven-day hunt or a 10-day hunt. It's a bow-hunting lifestyle 365 days a year where you dedicate yourself and you think about it every day.

And every night when you lay your head down on the pillows, like, did I do everything I can do to be the best bow-hunting? hunter I can be and it's the long game it's not a week worth of work a month worth of work a year worth of work it's years of your life of dedicating absolutely everything you have to that craft so i think for me you know it all starts with the passion and the love for it and not just falling in love with the results of standing behind a great big six point bowl or not just falling in love with the results of the accolades of people from the industry or social media for me it's an absolute love of bow hunting. It's a love of the endurance of it. It's a love for

the adventure in wild places. And so I think for me, it's like everybody else that you've interviewed, it comes down to passion and a love for it, don't you think? Yeah, yeah, of course. I mean, because you know, we talk about, so why would you, you know, you run in the heat of the day, to me, that's nothing compared to the challenges of a hunt. You know what I mean? So if you can't do that, yourself to do that, you're probably not going to succeed in the mountains because there's so much

harder. It's so much harder than training. That's what I always say. If your hunt is a hardest thing you've done, you're probably going to fail because you're just not prepared for it. So we push ourselves in training because we know the hunt's going to be difficult, but we might got to make the training even that much harder. And because of that, but the reason why you're able to do that is because it's deep inside you. It's your heart. It's your passion. It's what drives you every day. It's what you think about as you said 24-7. And if you don't, you know, I mean, I'll be honest. I haven't had many just straight up hunters on here. It's always, you know, some fighters dabble in hunting and this and that are very passionate about hunting. But you are just, you are a bow hunter.

And I haven't had people on here like this because I've been involved in the industry for so long And I've seen so many, God, I don't know what to say. There's ego, you know, I have an ego too. So I can't really blame people for having an ego. But hunters, they like to talk shit sometimes. And it's so competitive. People want to stand out. Do they want to stand up because they love bohunting?

Or do they want to stand up because they love attention? And if it's attention, I don't like that. That irritates me. If you love bow hunting, you're not usually talking shit about another bow hunter, right? If you love attention, then you're talking shit about people who get more attention than you. You have always been somebody who I've listened to your podcast. I read your writing. I see what you're doing.

I don't see you talking shit. I see you wanting to get better. Embracing the challenge, loving the passion of what we do. And so I'm like, that's the guy I want because you listen to a lot of guys who might call themselves, you know, whatever. People love talking about how tough they are. And for hunters, it's like, listen, yeah, hunting can be hard, but you're doing it one month out of the year, right? I mean, if you're just hunting and you're not training, you're not doing all this, that's one month.

That's not, you're not that tough if that's all you do. If you're training for that one month for 11 months, now you've got my attention, all right? And the guys who do that aren't the ones talking shit. That's you. You train every day to be the best for a month. Is that right? I mean, well, I mean, you hunt more than a month. But for me, my whole world revolves around September.

And that's bucks and bowls. But I just appreciate your mindset, the way you carry yourself, you're respectful, and you fucking work your ass off. So that's why you're here. as my first just all out, straight up, bow hunter. I love what you stand for. Man, it's like the best compliment I could get. And man, it's, it just, it means so much to me that you would invite me here to Oregon and invite me to work out and invite me to be on the podcast.

It's a big platform and it's, it means the world to me that you'd share, you know, some of the following. that you've worked so hard and that you'd share it with a fellow bowhunter and not to say competition, but really sharing it with your competition. And so, like, it just absolutely means the world to me. And there's just, like, nothing but respect on my side of the work that you put in. And not only, like, the opportunity to come here and be on a platform or, you know, maybe pick up some listens on my podcast, but the opportunity to learn from you and the work that you put in and your mindset and your approach to bow hunting. Like, I'll get more out of that than I'll ever get anybody listening to the podcast or

anybody following me. So just to be able to learn from you and be invited here, like, man, it's a dream come true. Like, you've worked really hard to create this and to invite, you know, an average guy, blue collar carpenter to be on your podcast or, you know, an average bow hunter. Like, man, it's, um, it's, it's, it's. amazing. And so, yeah, I just want to fill those shoes and be able to have some good workouts with you and learn from you and lay down a good podcast. But this is such a huge opportunity

for me to learn from you. And man, I mean, it's like a lot of the mentality I had started by, you know, reading your articles and reading your book and your passion for it and passion for bow hunting. That's where a lot of mine stem from. Now, you know, it's like anybody can look at a Kobe, Brian or Michael Jordan and say, I love that guy's jump shot. They're not going to become that guy. But you have to make your own path in life and find your own path. So a lot of that lit a fire under me. And then, you know, as I started seeing success, as I started like being fulfilled in the bow hunting world in these huge adventures, I started making my own path and then carving my own way through it. But that, you know, it all started by running to my mailbox,

reading your articles. Your articles, you talk about writing. You are so good at writing. Like to be a young 20-year-old kid and to get your magazine. And back then, there wasn't podcasts. There wasn't videos or not many that you could watch. There was this magazine that showed up in Mind Bailbox every other month and it had your writing in it in the beginning.

And it had your articles in there. And you talked about your passion for bow hunting. And it was like, man, it was the one thing that spoke to me. And I, you know, I wasn't set up to succeed as a kid, you know. Like, you know, a broken family. I lost my mom fairly young at 19. I, you know, like, you know, everybody's been through tough times. Life isn't easy for anybody.

And you can get caught up and feeling sorry for yourself. You can get caught up in making excuses for things. Or you can go out and you can go bust your ass and make a really good life for yourself. And that carries over to everything. I do. It's not just bow hunting that I succeed at. You know, it's a father, a husband, it's my business, it's my personal investments. Like, I take that mentality into everything I do. But it's a big part in what you wrote in those magazines. So, like, just the weight of your words and now you being able to reach all these people on your platform and give them this information, you're

going to have, like, a lot of go-getters that, you know, maybe they're great bow hunters, but maybe they're just great at life, man. I mean, that's a pretty beautiful thing, you know. And it all started with just like that, like reading that passion that came off those pages, man. It's such motivation. Thank you. It's, you know, I want to say, I didn't know, I didn't know you lost your mom when you're 19. I mean, what happened?

A suicide. Really? Yeah, she just got to a really dark place. She held her, like she was a really good mom throughout life and a lot of it was a single mom or I had a stepdad that was an alcoholic and abusive and yeah, I mean it wasn't the best life. But, you know, my mom, we had a very clean house. We had dinner together every single night, which I still carry that tradition into my family. She was a good mom that always supported my wrestling and came to my events. and she just got to a dark place.

She had lost her job and then, you know, it's almost like she had too much pride to just go get a job and go make money. She wanted another good job like she had. And, you know, I'm sure drugs and alcohol played a part in it and she got to a dark place. And yeah, I mean, it was a bit of a shocking surprise that I'd, yeah, I was 19. Man, it's just tough to lose your mom at 19. And then also I have a younger sister that found her at 60. You know, so it was really tough on her as well. And so now my sister lives in Montana.

She's got a great family of her own. And I, you know, I, there was like some weird stuff around the death. It was like in a car with the exhaust pipe in the window. And there was like this weird thing, like note written on the dartboard that said Mark did it, you know. And there was like all this weird stuff surrounding it. Like I still don't know. You know, I've accepted that she killed herself. But I still don't know.

You know, I don't know. The cops said, well, there was no. broken entry or there was no, but who knows? He could have been there. He was fairly abusive as well, you know, so I don't know he could have been behind at all, but you talk about tough times and we all go through tough times in life. But yeah, that was a real challenge for me for sure. Oh, I'm sorry. I mean, it's, yeah, life deals us hard times, but, you know, that's not a typical one. And yeah, I'm sorry to hear that. It's, but yeah, I don't know. It's awful. But she'd be proud of me now and proud of my sister now.

And, you know, she was a really good mom that always provided, always cared for. She just got to a really dark place. And I feel bad for people to get there. But, you know, I have to know that that same thing that happened to her. Like, that's in our DNA and something I have to keep tabs on, you know. And not that I get depressed or I get negative, but my life can definitely get out of balance. So I have to live a fulfilling life and I have to keep myself up. And I just, I know that, you know, that's half of my DNA, you know.

So it's something where I have to keep tabs on my sister. And she keeps herself up and has a great family. But I, you know, I have to watch out for my own family. And I just know that my mom would want me to live a happy and fulfilling life. She'd want me to care for my wife, care for my kids. And so I just try to carry that on. And, yeah, I mean, the pain cuts really deep, even now, 20 years down the road. But, you know, you can't change it.

And you just have to make the most out of this life with the time that you have. Yeah. Yeah. Well, you are. I mean, as you said, I'm sure she'd be proud if she could see you now and could see the impact you're having on others. I think that that's one thing that stands out. So knowing that, it's like, then I think about the podcasts I've listened to with you

and your mindset and it makes it makes more sense because you're always the twist you put on everything is a positive one you know you're looking at how do i get better how do i improve you know i've even heard you say and i had a hard time to be honest i had a hard time uh not not accepting it but like getting it 100 but you'll say well you shot a buck shot out a buck and i can't remember if it was an axis buck or mule deer buck but you hit a tree or maybe you missed it but you were proud of the process because you know you did everything right you released a great arrow and it just missed or it did something so you were like to me i can't turn a fucking miss into a positive dude i can't i would just be like the owner i don't care about anything other than i just missed that fucking

chance so but you look at the positive i'm like oh i cut a cut loose a great arrow and now it makes sense and it's like okay well yeah that's part of brian's journey that's what he does So do you know the story I'm talking about? Oh, 100%. Yeah, to elaborate on it. Yeah. I think we all can agree. No one likes a plumber's crack.

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I just hope that you have the same level of confidence in your equipment as I have in mind. Because I know if I get one opportunity with my Hoyt, it's going to pay off. Loophole optics has been providing my binoculars and eyewear for the, the last few years. I like that it's an Oregon company and they make such high quality glasses, all I've really used. And if you can't find what you're hunting, it's going to be tough to kill. So loophole optics has really played an integral part in my success these last few years. Thank you, Loopold, for supporting the podcast. So I just know that executing correctly, that more animals will die, that if I can execute good shots, like my odds are going to go

up of killing those animals. My perfect shots, I'm going to make more of them. And I would rather execute properly and miss that animal than to punch my trigger and kill that animal. That doesn't feel good to me. So for me, it's getting control of my shot process and my mind executing correctly. And I know when I execute correctly, 95 or 99% of those animals are going to die. Now, if I cheat that process and I punch my trigger, I get my pin just where it needs to go and I say, now, I know that my odds, I'm still going to kill a lot of those animals, but it's going to go down to 70%. So that's exactly right. As I had snuck up on a big axis buck, I had made a great stock, and I had crawled up,

and I was in this herd with all these deer around. And I've wanted to kill a giant axis, which is a 30 inch is what those guys consider a giant. And so I'd crawled up, and this 30-inch axis buck walked out, and he was broadside, and he was 45 yards, and he just stepped out beyond the tree where he exposed his vitals. So the tree is blocking like the guts liver. I can see the lungs in the heart and then there's the shoulders. So I have this tight window to stick my area.

How far? 45 yards. Okay. So I drew back. I'm from my knees and my pin is just wavering from the shoulder to the tree, the shoulder to the tree right in those vitals. And for those that don't know, you can't hold your pin exactly steady. It's not like a crosshair on a rifle. It's like that pin is going to move a little bit.

bit. Got to trust the float. Yeah, exactly. And so I trusted the float, kept pulling on my shot, the shot broke, and I hit the edge of that tree by maybe a half inch. You know, I can't believe it didn't graze off the tree and then get them in the vitals. So I had missed them and hitting that tree, and it hurt. I hate missing, you know, but I had executed correctly. And I know when I execute correctly, animals are going to die. And now for the rest of the season, like, to execute that way, I know I'm going to kill some great bucks and some great bulls. And I know eventually I'll kill my 30 inch axis. And it happened this year on great execution, executed my shot, perfect arrow. He went and died. He was 32 and a half tall. I killed my 30 inch buck. It just took me a little

bit longer than I thought. But yes, I can look at the positive of that stuff because I did execute correctly. And so for me, it's all about perspective. I don't get bogged down by the negative or I try to grab the silver lining and I, man, I fail. To be a quality bow hunter, to be good at anything in life. Like failure is the building blocks to success. Like you have to fail over and over and over again. And now you can either get drowned by your failure or you pick yourself up. You get back after it and you go find redemption and put that perfect arrow into an animal.

And so I just try to look at things that way. And the only reason I'm any good at bow hunting is I've made every mistake. I've missed every animal. I've blown stocks, I've blown shots, but I look at it and I assess it and I go out and improve from it and I'm better the next time around. And it's like you want to learn from your mistakes and see what you did wrong. You have to drop your ego and you have to really look at that encounter and drop your ego and go, okay, what did I do wrong? How could have I been better?

But then you also have to forget it. It's like Tom Brady's thrown interceptions in the Super Bowl too, but he's not thinking about that when he's making a pass. It's like you're not going to succeed every single time. You're going to have these failures. Learn from, get better. Go on to the next one and go get them. Yeah. No, that's great.

Definitely great advice. I mean, easier said than done. For sure. So, yeah, that's awesome. I mean, I'm glad that redemption happened. And it probably, just like, just as we've learned in life, you know, you fail, then it makes the success that much sweeter. So I'm sure that 32 inch buck this year fell like even better than normal.

right yes um i do like that so how do you as you you're around negative people i mean everybody is there's a lot of a lot of people who are you know i mean life is full of challenges some people yes they see the glass half full some see it half empty so how how do you navigate around people with a negative mindset what's your what's your trick yeah it's um it's definitely difficult it's like um You can't lead a horse to water. You can't make them drink. Like, you just try to spread positivity. And I try not to let that negativity affect me.

And I try not to buy into it. It's like, you know, everybody wants to shoot somebody down to make themselves feel better. And thank goodness, you take a lot of the grief because your following's 10 times as big as me that you deal with a lot of negativity. And guys love to hate you. They love to post negative. they love, it's like it makes them feel better to like put you down and go, oh, Cam only does this because of this reason or, you know, and it's the same with me.

As guys will, they'll come up with a reason of why I'm successful. And it's like to make themselves feel better. And so I just, if it affects you, then that's when they're getting to you or that's when they're winning. And so I just, I try to pay no attention to what anybody's saying. it's like water off my ducks back. Like I just try to ignore it. Don't give it any energy and focus like on my own life and just realizing that,

you know, like I have my family, like I have real things that I have to do. Like I have a business I have to run and a podcast I have to run. And the bigger you get like the more hate you deal with. But I just try not to give it any energy and try to focus on myself and self-improvement. And I'm really trying to be at my. best and that's you know at my best is not just running a race or not just on a bow hunt it's also being my best in life like interactions with people doing what i say i'm going to do following through like there there's all these um uh ways in life that you're going to be tested in this in this mind

space and so i just i just don't give it any energy and i focus on what's right in front of me and what's important to me and i let the let the rest fall away and it doesn't always work like sometimes it gets to me or I see a negative comment or something negative around me and like put a little thought into it. But it's like a mental exercise that's just going, hey, you're thinking about this too much. He's getting to you, you know, or this is getting to you. Why are you thinking about some comment when you're out here running in the woods? Like it's like now he's getting to me. So I just try not to let it get to me and I try to be at my best every single day and put forth the best effort I can and then let the chips fall where they do. So I'd say that's, that's where

I try to keep that positive energy around me, just the way I look at the world. Yeah. Well, you know, if I think back on all the guests I've had here and I think you're, you know, I've just started this so I'm pretty new. But if we've had, you know, 30-some podcast, but if you think about, and I always say, I want to talk to outliers because I want to learn, my journey is to still improve every day and I can learn from people who are who have been successful in their field. And each of those outliers who've been on here, the 30-some guests we've had and I've spent days with training, doing different things, so positive. The people I've had on here, they're not talking shit about anybody. They're freaking giving their best to their life. And so I think there's a

lesson to be learned just as you explained from all these people. And we've had, you know, Olympic gold medalists. We've had, you know, UFC fighters. We've had. We've had, you know, UFC fighters. We've had incredible ultra runners, they're just focused on doing their best and like, how can they improve and being grateful and thankful for the life they've been afforded and they earn it. And they don't have time to be worried about somebody behind them. You know what I mean? So I like, I like that. And it made me reflect on who I've talked to here on this podcast. And it makes a lot of sense. It's, you know, and it made me also think about to my journey. And I, like back in the day, I did fight that because I thought that people, you know, you know, I had to prove people wrong.

And so that was like, that's probably not the greatest approach to things. But then I think about the sweet part of that too. And I remember writing the read maybe the articles that you resonated with you back in the day. And I still remember everything about these hunts, but I wrote an article called Dreamcatcher. I wrote an article called Blood, Sweat and Bowls. And when I think back to those experiences in the mounds by myself, having to overcome, and then share that journey in the pages and then maybe think that maybe it influenced a young bohunter like you, it's like, God, why was I even thinking about people who weren't on my side?

But it's so weird. It's like maybe we just, we got to learn and mature and it's just part of the process. Well, you spawned a different way, too. took the David Goggins approach where you use that negative energy for your own positive, right? As you used it for motivation. So, yeah, it's not always the healthiest mind space to be in for sure. But it's also gotten you to where you needed to go.

And so there is some of that, like proving yourself or proving people wrong. You know, I don't get in that headspace too much, but I'm constantly trying to prove it to myself. Like each and every hunt, like I have to show up on the map. Like these bulls, when you show up, like, they don't know your Cameron Haynes. They don't know I'm Brian Barney. Like every elk season and to kill a Montana mature six-point bowler wherever I'm hunting, like those bulls don't know I'm Brian Barney.

They don't know that I've killed a bunch of bulls or that I'm a successful bowhunter. I have to go out and prove it every single year. And I have to have this drive and this mentality for every hunt I go on. And for every bull that I want to kill, I'm starting over at square one. These bowls don't know anything. And they're wild. Their instincts are keen. Like they're really tough animals to kill.

Like I think, you know, to bow hunt and to arrow a mature bowl is one of the toughest challenges you can take on. And I just mean that you really have to get good at all these different skill sets. And then you have to capture lightning in a bottle and be clutch when you're given the opportunity to make a stock or to make a shock. to make a shot. And so, you know, like you have to find that inner motivation to show up on each and every hunt and be at your best. And so you just spun a lot of that negativity into your own positivity into driving you to be better on these hunts and to be successful.

So, you know, it's like we all have different journeys and we do mature and have a healthier mindset as we get older and we get better at life. But you used a lot of that for some good motivation and erode some good. critters because of it too. Yeah. I mean, I can't lie. I mean, I still use it now. Yeah. As you said, I do get a lot of shade thrown my way, but it's all right because fuck, I won. I'm not supposed to be here. I'm not supposed to be having this podcast and have people know me. It's like, no, I'm supposed to be from some little, you know, little town in Oregon. And so we've already won, haven't we? Oh, 100%. I mean, you can't, if I lost everything right now,

it's like, I still won. I love it. Yeah, that, you know, you said how you know, you're proven yourself every time because as, as we know, neither one of us have killed a bull yet this year, right? I haven't killed one. You haven't killed one. We got to, we, I don't even know how many I've killed, but I know I haven't killed one this year. So, like, all the pressure. And sometimes I get on these hunts and it is so hard or there's so much pressure. You're thinking about it so much. And maybe things just don't go right, right out of the gate or maybe it's a different year or it's hot or the moon or whatever. And you're like, have I got lucky for all these? I mean, I don't, it seems like it's never going to happen. It seems almost impossible. And that's like, I think even though we've done it, I still have doubts at times.

But that's why I work the way I do. So I can refer back to be like, no, I've freaking busted my ass for this. It's going to happen. But do you have doubts ever? Yeah. Well, that's really encouraging to hear that I'm not the only one. Yeah. Absolutely. Sometimes it seems like mission impossible. Like you say, it may be the year, the unit

that we're hunting, the elk that we're hunting. But sometimes I get there and I think, how have I ever erode a bowl? Like this is the most difficult thing on planet Earth. And these hunts, you make the best plans for them. They never go as plan. It's like you can lay the best plan and you get there and you're just going to face challenges that you couldn't foresee. They're not going to be elk in this unit. You're going to have to keep moving around and finding them. You're going to run in. into hunting pressure. Maybe the bulls are with the cows, and so they're in these huge groups, so you're trying to beat all these eyes of the cows.

And so you get on these hunts, and, like, part of the skill set is being able to adapt and evolve to the conditions that you're given. So creative thinking is rewarded, and you have to, you know, this is chestnut checkers, and so you get there, and that bull is not going to be standing at 40 yards broadside on every hunt, no matter where you're hunting at. You know, it's going to be difficult. And you might just get this sliver of opportunity, but I've done it for long enough that I know if I continue to grind,

that even though it may seem like I may never arrow a bull on this hunt, it's like eventually I'll get an opportunity. So day seven, day eight, day nine, I'll earn an opportunity. I've killed a lot of bulls and bucks on the last hour or the last day just because I continue to put forth effort because I believe in myself, I believe in my skills, and I believe that I can make it happen because I've done it before. And so, yeah, I definitely, you know, doubt creeps in.

I run into tough conditions. Sometimes on a hunt, it feels like there is no way I'm going to be able to arrow a bowl on this hunt. But I'm going to give it my all. So when I, if I don't arrow a bowl, I can put my head down at night and know that I gave it my absolute all on this hunt. And there's a lot of these hunts for a Montana, a big, mature six-point bowl where I have 20 days in or last year I drew a Shyrus Moose tag. I had 30 days in to trying to kill that moose.

And there was a lot of days where I never saw moose. And I put thousands of dollars of gas money in my truck. I took so much time off work. Day in, day out, I continued to grind. And I used this system of glassing from vantage points. Driving roads is a big part of it as well because you're covering a lot of country and then also still hunting. And so this combination, but I just kept believing in the process and putting forth

effort and I wasn't going to shoot any bull. Like you didn't have to be a world record, but I wanted to shoot a Shyrus bull that I was proud of that was a good mature bull. And eventually I got an opportunity and moose aren't known as being the spookiest animal. But when you've been hunting 30 days and you finally find a shooter bull, like I can't risk it. And so I was hunting this thing in a foot of snow and I caught him in a willow bottom with a cow. And so I was waiting through a foot of water through this in November.

So it was super cold, 20 degrees out. And so I am soaking wet and it took hours on this stock. And I finally got an opportunity. Put a perfect arrow in the bull. He took 10 steps. Put a perfect arrow in him on the other side. And he died right there. And it was like, it meant so much to me because I just continued to grind and put

forth this effort. So 30 days later, here I am with my first moose and it's a Chiris bull. Just because of that belief and that effort and that day in, day out, mentality and eventually it paid off. Yeah. So, I mean, that sounds great. That's a great story. But have you ever been?

Because the reason why I say this, I've done this before myself, where I've had so much success for so many years and the failures people don't know about because I overcame them and still killed. But I've had hunts recently where I'm like, you already create this story. It's almost like an excuse.

But I, you know, a Texas white tail hunt, which isn't supposed to be hard. But I had the hardest time last year. So I had created this story about, hey, sometimes hunts don't go. You can give all you got. You created this. You're already making this excuse about why you didn't kill, right? Or on the last bear hunt I just did is like, you know, I could say, well, I was waiting for a big bear and I just didn't see one.

So you kind of creating this ready-made story to make yourself feel better because you're, because there's a hint of what other people think because of you've had so much success. I mean, so you go through all these things and I don't care. I don't care. Well, I can't speak for other people. I just don't. I come across like I'm confident. I believe I work hard, but still in my head, I can't lie to myself.

And there's times where I'm like, I don't know if I'm going to get it done this time. How am I going to people know I'm hunting? I'm going to make a post about it because I post about everything else. what am I going to say? And it's like it almost feels weird worrying about it, but it's just part of the world we're in. And then funny as it may seem, I had created this excuse in my head

and I overcame even that, my own brain and still killed. Do you doubt yourself or do you like on that moose hunt? Had you already created like something you could say about why you didn't kill? Yeah, there's always an excuse. There's always a reason. and you can put in that reason in your own mind at any point in time. But yeah, I mean, doubt starts to creep in. Here I am 29 days hunting a moose.

And I haven't got a chance at a bowl and the ruts over with. Now I'm into late season. It's general rifle season. The orange army is out there and I'm still out with my bow trying to kill a moose, you know? And so, yeah, there's definitely self-doubt that creeps in. And it's just like that's the test. Could you have used a rifle? Oh, yeah.

Oh, so it's any weapon. Yeah, yeah. I could have used a rifle from the very beginning or even towards the end, but for me, it's bow only. Yeah. Okay. There's just no other way I want to do it with any species I hunt. It's so intimate.

It's like, you know, and rifle hunting is great for experience and it's great to see some success. But for me, it's like a rifle hunt ends at 200 yards and a bow hunt is just beginning. It's a higher level of hunting. It's a higher level of skill set that's, it's needed. And really for me to use a rifle, for you to use a rifle, it'd be cheating. It'd be way too easy you know. And so, like, once you

get to a point, it's like, it's bow or nothing. So I hunt a lot of general rifle seasons with my bow. All my late season, rut mule deer, it's general rifle season out and guys with orange, and I have my orange and my bow, and you talk about some funny looks I get, you know, walking around with my bow with orange. And it's

legal in Montana in a lot of these states. But just putting this higher degree of difficulty on myself. But yeah, I mean, I think doubt creeps in for all of us. Like, that's what we're trying to overcome. And you have these, you know, we call them excuses. Maybe they're legit reasons. Like, oh, it was so hot.

It was so smoky. I couldn't glass or, gosh, the weather came in and it got nasty. And it was a snowstorm for four days. There's always a reason or an excuse that we're unsuccessful. And you can put that in your own mind or you just continue to put forth effort. And so for me, for that moose, it wasn't so much self-executive. helped out like, yeah, I'd hate to post a picture of a sunset and tell you how I wasn't successful because of this reason and that reason. But the reality is, is like these hunts

are really tough and that might happen. I have to be okay with it. So for me, it was almost the mindset of like, I'm not going to get this tag again. It took me 20 some years to draw this tag. I am going to get the most out of this experience. I am going to go every single day I have the chance. I'm going to put all my effort in. If I don't kill one, I saw over 40, moose, I pass smaller bulls, and that's how it happened. But I am going to give it my absolute all, everything I have till the very last day of the season. And if that's the way it goes down, then you'll see a pretty fucking sunset.

No, it won't happen, you know, but it did happen because effort pays off. And if you keep that mentality, you keep putting forth effort, you don't take the easy way. Like I could have started like not putting effort forth, like, oh, I'm just cruising roads or I'm just going through the motions, but instead, every day I believe I'm going to find a bowl. This might be the one. This might be the day. And the day I killed that bowl, so I had a rule, moose are so big and so heavy, and I don't ask for help. So I don't call a bunch of people to help me pack out.

It's like, if I kill a moose, and I did have help packing it out. I had a buddy that came and help me. But I'm not the one that's going to call everybody I know to try to pack it out. Like, it's on me. And so I made these rules. Okay, well, I can't, you know, a moose is so big, so heavy, I might be my myself. I don't have horses. So my rule is two miles from the road.

That's where I want to kill one at. And so, you know, I was three miles in when I found the ball, of course, you know, and then killed him back there because that's the way it goes. But just continuing to put forth effort to find that bowl. And eventually it comes to fruition. It's like effort pays off and it might not be, you might be on a tough hunt and give your all and it doesn't come through. But to put that effort throughout that entire hunt and then on the next hunt, like you're going to see success. Effort pays off.

Yeah. Yeah. It's a, I think that's, you know, you saying that is maybe why we've connected even from afar because of that mindset, the bow only mindset. It's not something everybody has. I mean, as just like with you, a lot of my hunts because they're landowner tags or they're, you know, different tags, it's any weapon, right? I mean, if you go to Santa Carlos, you can use a rifle. You know, I mean, and it's, or like, say, the place I hunt in Utah, rifles are illegal, right? But there's something about bow only that, I mean, it's hard.

And it's like, I could see, like on your moose hunt, I could see people in the same situation saying, yeah, I bow hunted and they would make it sound. I passed up some bulls with the bow, but I wanted something special. I could have killed them with a bow, but instead I found this big one and killed it with the rifle. And so then they kind of save face because they're saying that, oh, they could have had success with the bow, but they didn't want to because the bull wasn't big enough. So this is a story they're spinning. But with the attitude of it's a bow only or nothing, that's a different level. That's a special mindset. And I can, I remember, you know, the hunting industry can be funny.

but I remember I was in Utah and I hit this buck and I hit it a little back. Let me think what I did. Yeah, I hit it a little back. So this deer, I thought it was going to be, you know, I'd go get him. He'd be bedded up. He ended up, it turned it into a rodeo. I was hunting this outfit. This is late.

This is in November. I'm the last hunter. They're pulling up everything. They're getting out of there. So they can't leave until I'm done hunting, right? And I hit this buck. Everybody knew I'd hit this buck. So they're like, you know, I could easily, the buck went in and abetted down kind of in

this Aspen Grove and could easily have taken a rifle and finished it. Right. And that's probably what a lot of people would have done. And that would have been fine too. That's 100% legal. You could do that. But I'm like, no, I don't, you know, hey, we got a rifle right here. You want to get that buck killed.

And I'm like, I'm going to get it killed. But I'm going to get it killed with my bow. And it took for, I mean, it was like a long stock. And then I had the buck spotted and I boots off. And I'm like so slow, so slow. I could have shot it many times at the rifle. And it took forever to get in. And I got so close to that deer.

I got like, God, it might have been 17 yards. Eased over. Shot him, got him killed, got the buck. But it's like, you know what that's like. You know what that situation would be like. And I just think a lot of. Most people would be like, yeah, and maybe even some of them would have shot it with the gun and still had their bow there. You know what I mean?

Can't do it. I mean, it's like, you know, the biggest regret of my hunting career probably is the grizzly hunt that they had to shoot out with the gun because I, you know, fucking made a poor shot. And it's just like I can't even hardly get over that memory. And it's been one time in 35. 34 years of bo-hunting in one time and that's like it just haunts me so it's like I love your approach to bow only and that's my that's my my thoughts on it it's like and I think that really it's a I don't know it's a small group of people who share that mindset I mean what are your thoughts on that yeah it is it's so much more difficult and it isn't just about killing some big animal with me

It's, man, bow hunting, it's in our DNA. Like, hunting is the reason why humans survive the last 200,000 years. And so it's like there's something in your DNA, and the most intimate experience in nature you can get is this predator prey relationship. And it's this in close proximity of these animals that are so turned on and like so switched on and their instincts are so keen,

and the only thing they're thinking about is survival. To get in and to make those right moves and keep that element of surprise and to be so close to that animal, like, it is so visceral. It's like this experience that can't even be described by words like us sitting on the podcast. It is so intense to have your heart beating out of your chest

being so close and having that buck or bull not know you're there. and then try to keep your stuff together to deliver a perfect arrow. It's like difficult to harness that. It's like one thing to be a really good shot on a target. It's another thing to be able to transition that to be a really good shot on animals. And this is like it's like really harnessing this power of your mind and harnessing this control over body and everything you have. And it's it's so difficult. that it feels so good when you have success that you've worked so hard for.

It's like climbing Everest. And once you have those feelings that you have gotten close and you have eroded this great buck that you're proud of and done everything right, whether it took you a 10-day hunt or whether it took you five years of applying all this effort to kill this buck, like, that's our Everest. And so once you climb Everest and you get those feelings and the satisfaction of, of being able to overcome all these challenges and put it all on the field and come out on top. Like after you have that, it's like everything else, it just wouldn't be the same.

I don't need to post some picture of some great big Bucker Bowl I killed with a rifle. That means nothing to me to getting close and put a perfect arrow. That's something I'm immensely proud of that I want to share with our community and share with my friends and family because I'm proud of it. the effort it took, the control it took, everything that went into this hunt, the challenges that I face, being immersed in nature and all the elements in coming out on top. Like, that's my Everest, and that's what drives me year after years to go have these adventures. And man, these adventures are out there for everybody out there. And it's to be able to, like life is so nerf now.

It's like you go get water from your tap. You have a comfortable house that maybe it's AC controlled. You've got heat in the wintertime. You get in your vehicle. You drive to and from work. Like it's so protected. You've got your seat belts, everything fairly safe. And don't get me wrong.

You need like car wrecks or major accidents that can happen. But to immerse yourself out there in nature where your decisions directly affect your safety. And like you have to have, like you have to make good decisions, you know. And you have to go out. You really get to test yourself. physically and mentally. Like you get to embark on an adventure, you know, and that's available for everybody to go do and embark on. And like once you do that and are fulfilled by these moments out there, like in the most extreme places in the lower 48, like you probably hook like

me and you are where you just can't get enough of it. And it drives you to be a better person and a better bow hunter. And really it feels like what I was put here to do. Like it's, It's directly tied to my DNA, I think. Yeah, and I think, you know, you talk about how safe society is and comfortable. And it's like, it reminds me of the Goggins quote. It's like, I think we're always going to have a place like to, for those adventures. Because as Goggins says, it's so easy to be great nowadays because everybody else is a pussy. And it's like, and it's like as society gets easier to live to survive, then yeah, those adventures are going to be, you know, heart.

That's a big gap from somebody who's got an easy. easy life to somebody who loves a challenge and us over here are going to be still enjoying it. One thing, I think that I'm so lucky in that, you know, and I don't know what type of people you were around, but I was around Roy growing up who has, you know, it's the same, but only mindset. Wayne, you met Wayne, and it's, you know, archery is, we've never even talked about a gun or a rifle or a shell or like any caliber anything it's like archery only for life and i was pretty lucky to grow up around those guys and i loved i loved you meeting wayne because you got the full wayne experience a full herd bowl experience i don't think you ever met roy did you no yeah um you would

have god roy you know everything we're talking about roy was the one you know he was the one you know he was the one that set the standard for all this mindset, all this shit, all, everything we're talking about. Roy, yeah, you would have, you would have loved listening to every word he said. But I'm so thankful you got to meet Wayne yesterday. Tell me about Wayne. Oh, man. And today you saw him. Oh, yeah.

Wayne is, he's incredible, man. He runs the bow rack, right? That's a bowshop. Yeah. Man, it is a one in a hundred or one in a thousand bow shops. That Wayne has so. much passion for bow hunting. It's so much passion for archery and his knowledge is so vast. I know a lot about bows and bow tuning and accuracy. I've worked my whole life and gone deep down

the rabbit hole of it. And Wayne knows multiples more than I do. It's just so knowledgeable, good with working with him because he sees thousands of those bows and his passion for it and is his confidence in what he believes in in those bows and then his willingness to share that information. And man, I was just so impressed. And then I was really glad that I got to have a conversation with him today, you know, like about some bow hunting and some places that he hunts and chasing elk around. Like, man, I could talk to that guy all day long.

Like, he's got that same passion for archery and bow hunting. So it's no surprise. that his shop is doing great and really blowing up because it's better than the than every bow shop that I've ever been to just by the leadership there. So yeah, he's he's one of a kind, man. What a what a great human being and great guy for the archery industry and great buddy of yours. And anybody that has Wayne set up a bow for him, consider yourself lucky. You are getting years of knowledge put into that bow. And not only that, but he cares.

He's like, it isn't good enough. He tweaked with the timing on my bow yesterday for 25 minutes going back and forth with strings twisting and just like absolutely micro-adjusting because he was not satisfied with it until it was absolutely perfect. And that was pretty incredible to see. So I definitely like took some knowledge away just from what he. He showed me yesterday, so it's going to make me a better bow hunter in the end, just this short interaction that I got with him, you know?

And so I'm super impressed, man. That guy's one of a kind. He is. He is. And I saw, then I saw, I'm not saying your bow wasn't shooting accurate before, but I saw it today in person. And, like, you know, you broke the balloon at 174 yards. And then not only that, because that's just kind of getting a spot to hold.

And that, it is hard. It's, I mean, one mistake at that distance, and you're missing the whole target. But you did amazing there. But then once we got an even closer where now it's like, I can't remember what we shot at, but you know, 90 yards on an elk. And we're like, oh, an inch high. You know what I mean? And so we're like, oh, yeah, pretty good shot, but an inch high.

You know, it's like 90 yards. But it's like that type of who can, not many people can be that precise with a bow. And you were today. And, you know, we were shooting those closer. shots, but still long shots in the grand scheme of things for archery and just talking about inches of precision. And I saw your bow was just like so accurate. I was so impressed with your shooting. I mean, I think, I think, I think your mindset is top notch. I think your shooting is right there. And it's no wonder you've had this success. Because with those two and then the

passion, that's our goal. And I've heard you say it. I remember I said it. I remember I said it. to Dan State when he came down here. My goal, and I don't give a fuck, you can, you can criticize everything I do. My approach, where I hunt, how I hunt, what I say, which you can't deny, I am undeniable. I will get shit killed every time no matter what you say. And I see that in you.

You know, I see, and I've heard you say it too. Your goal is to be undeniable, right, regardless of circumstances. Is that, I mean, do we share that mindset? 100% man I love that that fires me up yeah that's exactly right is you want to show up to the trailhead

of any hunt of any unit and be undeniable and man I hunt I mean you know it's competitive nowadays like a lot of guys want these quality hunts so I mean the majority of places I hunt are over the counter

they're easy to draw one to three point units and you're showing up at the trailhead like Montana success rates on a bull elk with a bow and arrow or six percent. One in 20 guys fill their tag that year. And that's just a bull elk. That's not a mature six point bull elk. So what are the odds when you go to a big, yeah, 1%.

But somehow I'm able to buck the odds year after year after year because of the work that I put in. And it's the preparation, like you said, it's the mindset, it's the shooting, it's the physical fitness. It's the instincts that you hone to make the right moves at the right times. It's, you know, all these different facets come into play to be successful. And so you have to be really well-rounded, but you have to be good at each one of these. And so I put in the work, dedicated myself for the last 20, 25 years to bow hunting.

And so when I show up to a trailhead, yes, I feel like I'm undeniable, the same way you show up for a hunt and feel like you put in all the necessary work and you show up and no matter which challenge you're going to face, what hurdles are going to be in front of you, what conditions you're going to come across, like you are going to find a way. And that's the exact same mentality I have. I'm going to find a way one way or another to be successful. Yeah. And I think, you know, it's easy for people to take shots like where I hunt because I hunt,

I've worked my ass off to hunt the very best fucking elk country. It's like I'm not going to apologize. It's like it's taken a lot of sacrifice to get these opportunities. But even for you, people could say, well, you work with Eastman. So you got the inside scoop on all these areas. And it's no wonder. And people could say, oh, well, if I had those opportunities, well, anybody could do that. I'm like, fucking show me then.

Anybody could? So you could, then fucking do it. I don't see anybody doing it. I don't see anybody killing a bunch of big bulls every year. I don't see people mimicking your success. So could anybody do it? Or is that just you talking out of your ass? Anybody can.

If they have the passion and they apply themselves wholeheartedly, like the opportunity is out there. And yeah, you get to hunt some great places for the biggest bulls around, but those bulls don't know your Cameron Haynes. Those bulls don't know what you've achieved, and there's still wild animals with keen instincts that get hunted all year long. and you're hunting them in wild country. Like those elk, those mule deer have, you know, they've evolved from thousands of years from avoiding mountain lions and bears.

And a mountain lion is way sneakier than I could ever hope to be to jump on their back and kill them with tooth and claws. And so these animals have evolved for all these years. And you don't hunt these places because elk are easy. You hunt these places to have a chance at a mature bull elk. And these mature bull elk that you are killing that are 10 years older, older. Man, they have been called to every way from Sunday. They have been chased by every different bow hunter out there. Like, they have survived all these years because their instincts are so keen,

and you're able to go out there and match wits with those animals and put a perfect arrow into them. Like, the only reason you're able to do that is because you have worked tirelessly at your craft to be at your absolute best when you hit the trails or hit the mountain. So is it available to everybody out there? Absolutely, 100%. you're not going to achieve it in the first year. You're going to have to put 20 years in like me and you have. You're going to have to go fail.

You're going to have to miss shots. You're going to have to have failed hunts. You're going to have times where you can't find an animal. You're going to have times where you can't stalk an animal. You run into hunting pressure. You're going to have to face all these challenges that me and you have faced over the years and overcome them year after year. You're going to have to work on your skill sets to be the very best bowhunter you can be

and then you can achieve it. Absolutely 100%. We're nothing special. At least I'm not. It's a long grind. No, I know I'm nothing special. It's just taken, you know, 34 years, you know. So, I mean, if you're expecting overnight success, you need to probably like, like, play the lottery, I guess, because bow hunting is not the key.

But you know what? So we talk about the difficulty and we talk about that anybody can do it. And I want to just reference, you know, I just had that lift run shoot event here this last week. and it's like incredible, but also you've been involved in a similar with a similar type of event with Ryan Lampers, right? And what the Western Hunting Summit? Or what is it? Yeah, exactly. Western Hunting Summit. So tell me about the guys you have coming there and what's what's so empowering about that experience for you and for them. Yeah, it's it's mentorship. It's being able to mentor these guys and get them on the right path. And actually the deal is, is you can

get there way quicker than I did, like being able to learn from guys like you and guys like me. And so Lampers had this idea for these summits for mentoring, and he does such a great job at bringing in, like, really knowledgeable hunters. And so I've done every summit with them. And we get a group of 20 to 30 guys that come in that are hungry to learn and become better. And so these guys sit in on this information and they're able to shoot 3D courses. We're able to do big hikes and big rucks together. We did one Bear Summit where we covered like over 60 miles and three days. And we take these guys backpacking and we teach them all the skills and teach them a lot of these lessons that we've learned over the years. And so yeah, it's been really fulfilling.

And then, you know, I give these guys my contact information. They're able to text me or ask me questions that apply directly to their hunting. But yeah, I've seen some guys come into these courses and to just grab hold of this mindset, grab hold of like everything that I'm telling them, everything that Lampers is telling them, be able to become one of these consistently successful bow hunters just by adopting like these same things that we're talking about today. And really, it all starts with your mind. You just have to decide that's what you want. You have to decide that you're going to work towards it every single day. give it your best. So I've seen guys come into this summit. We've been doing it for seven or

eight years now. And now some of these guys are just as successful as I am each and every year because they're putting in the work, because they're honing their craft, because they're improving it. And they can actually, like the next generation will get there quicker than I did because they have podcasts to learn from. They have guys to learn from. They have all this information that they can apply to their own hunting, which then they can cut their learning curve. So they don't have to make every single mistake I made. They're going to make some mistakes and have to learn from them, but they're able to get there a lot quicker.

And it's all just because they want it, you know? And they go for it. And now it's been amazing to see these guys come up and be consistently successful. Yeah, I think, I mean, it's so fun sharing what we love with other people who are just as interested. You know, I mean, yeah, they don't have the experience, but that's, you know, they're going to earn that because there's, you know, there's no shortcut to experience. But just knowing that they're on the right path.

And yet this hurdle or this challenge, yes, we face this too. And here's how we overcame it. So it kind of, it makes them feel better that sometimes people fail and they're just like, maybe I just suck. No, you don't just suck. Everybody has done this. But we have to push through. I just really like, I like, I don't know Ryan Lamper's that much, but I follow him

and I love what he stands for. Hillary seems great. I mean, his wife, you know, she's been great. I just, it seems like that event and that bringing people together like that. I just love that you're involved because if you're talking to the guys, they're getting the real story. You know what I mean? And it's just, it's great to see.

I know on this last one, people are, you know, they just want authentic, to hang around authentic people who, who love what we love. And it's just like, man, it's, it's. so empowering and energizing and it just fills my soul to see people. I was with, you know, 100 people for three days didn't hear one negative word. It was crazy. It was like, you know, it makes all this, I don't know, it just gives, it gives the best feeling to me. And it seems like, man, I think about the long journey and all the struggles and all the doubt and all the people trying to keep you down. And it's like, and it was for this. And it was for this. And

like, that's okay. Because if this was a reward, I'm good. It's all worth it. That event looked amazing, man. You had some really good speakers in there and different subject matter. Those guys are going to be able to take that information and run with it. And they're going to see success. They're cutting their learning curve. It's like, yeah, you can put 10 years of grinding in the mountains and make every mistake like I did. Or you can come to one of these events and learn from these consistently successful hunters and cut that learning curve by multiple years to start seeing that success sooner. So these guys that are coming to these events, you know, they're taking the first step to self-improvement and they're embracing it. You put them through the ringer of tough

times of runs and workouts and shooting and shooting. It's not just like shooting in your flip-flops in your backyard. You got the herd bull standing over you telling you everything you're doing wrong. Like you've got to drop your ego a bit. And these guys are willing to do that. and willing to put in the work to be great. And since, you know, because of that, they will be great. Yeah, I was curious. I'm going to get you, I'm going to, we're going to wrap this up here pretty soon because I'm going to take you out to Wayne's.

I love showing Wayne's barn and all his archery history, and I know you'd appreciate it. I haven't taken any guest out there yet because, you know, a lot of the people knew it, but you would, the history of archery is, God, is so special. and as Wayne says, the history of archery is the history of mankind. So I want to show you this. But I was interested in hearing. So if you think about where you started to where you are now, because what I see now is just a phenomenal shot dedicated to being a great physical condition

and a student of the game, right? So what was the biggest difference from where you started to how you got here? What did that take? I mean, think about how you shot back in the day. What was that, what did you change to be a great shooter? To be a great shooter, you have to be willing to make change. You have to be willing to drop your ego. And any change in your form, you have to get a little bit worse before you get better.

So you make a form change and all of a sudden you're not shooting as good as you used to. You're shooting worse. But you know that that's the correct move to your form and that if you continue with it, you will rise above it and be better than you ever have been. And so I think I've just gone deep down the rabbit hole. I'm willing to ask questions. I'm willing to drop my ego and take advice from people. I'm just constantly taking in knowledge from good shooters, people that are better shooters than me.

And I put in the work like day in, day out. I put the arrows down range. I learn from it. I'm not afraid to put twists in my bows. I'm not afraid to work on my bows. I'm not afraid to make change. And so I think it's just my dedication to the craft and my being a student of the game, like always wanting to be at my very best.

And so, yeah, I think that's a lot of it is just my approach to it. The work I've put in adds up over the years and just putting so much effort into being good at archery because I know every successful hunt comes down to making a shot. So I have to be my best and, you know, I'm not to the, there's more improvement for me down the road. I want to continue to improve and continue to put in the work, continue to learn, continue to get better because there's no limit to where you can go in bow hunting and in life. Like there's no ceiling. It's one of the things I love about it is that you can continue to improve and continue to show up at the trailhead and be even better, you know. and so there's still better shots than me out there.

And so there's still improvement to be made. There's knowledge to be gained. And so I'm going to continue on the same path that I've been on. But it is just those things that I think makes me the shooter that I am. And also shooting high pressure situations, you know, like shooting next to Cameron Haynes or shooting next to Wayne Indicott or shooting in front of a group of people or, you know, really putting the pressure on myself to make a good shot. Like, you know, that comes, like, that helps when you're shooting at a big bowl or a big buck.

And then also, like, transitioning, you know, I said it once on the podcast, but, you know, you can be a great shot on a target. But then you have to transition that great shooting to one arrow on an animal and being a great shot on an animal. And that's the really tough transition that people have trouble with. And so for me, it's been a lot of experience. Like I hunt a lot of high opportunity places. So not all my kills are great big bucks or great big bowls. Like I've killed a bunch of white tail doze. I hunt antelope every year.

I hunt axis deer. Like hunting different species in different environments improves your skill set in different ways. And so, you know, I hunt coos deer down on the border. I hunt like anything they'll let me hunt with my bow. I'm going to go hunt it. And then, you know, like just getting that execution or that trigger time. Like being able to execute good shots on animals, like, like, then you start to really hone that skill to where you can be at your very best. And also like not getting rattled or shook up with big antlers, you know.

It's like been here before. I know what I need to do. I know what my job is. I know I need to execute a shot. But really, it's like experience has been a great teacher for me. You know, I don't know how many white-tailed does I've killed, but they give me five tags in Montana. and stalking white-tailed does down there in the river bottom improves your skill set, improves your shooting.

And so when you execute perfect shots on them, like that, you know, that really transposes and really helps when shooting at other animals. And so, you know, experience has been a big part of my success. But yeah, I'd say that's kind of my archery journey for sure. Yeah, that makes, I mean, as, I don't know, interesting as it sounds to get good at killing. you got to kill. That's all there's to it. And if that's that's our goal and we go out with the bow,

I mean, yes, we want the journey. We want their memories. But hey, we're trying to get an animal on the ground because of what it offers our life and sustaining our life with the meat that we get from that hunt. But it's animals dying. And to get good at it, you got to kill it. It's, you know, I like that high pressure, or mention you had. And that's, you know, that mimics what I've thought for a long time, you know, when Cabela's opened here in town, my hometown, they said, do you want to come cut the ribbon to open the building? And I said, well, no, but I'll shoot it. And so came up with this plan to shoot the grand opening ribbon. And yeah, I loved having all those TV cameras around and the big crowd of people. And yeah, it looked really bad if you screw that up. But that's the

pressure that's, it's different than with an animal, but we're dealing with a lot of pressure. an intense moment. And so that simulates it a little bit. And as you said, it's like you can recreate that with the people you're around with the pressure you put on yourself, maybe the situation like the Cabela's grand opening. But yeah, that's the key. And it's like there is no formula for becoming the best bohunter in the world. There's a lot of different things you can do and it's going to be hard and you're going to have to earn it and you get to get that experience. But man, there's just mostly being immersed in a lifestyle and appreciating what archery is and what bow hunting is. And it's a never-ending process.

You know, I mean, I still, I had, you know, I killed 11 animals last year. And it's not like I can just be like, oh, it's perfect. 11 for 11. No, I'm thinking about I hit a white tail buck low. I lower than I wanted. I hit I hit made perfect shots on a few bowls a couple bowls I could have made better shots

I got him killed so if I just focused on the kill I'd be like oh yeah I'm perfect no I can be better I screwed up I made it harder than it needed to be and I don't want that animal to suffer and because of me I could have made that suffering less and so I'm like I put a lot of pressure myself, no, I need to be better. I can't just focus on yet worked out. No, there's

these little things that we can improve on and we can focus on instead of just focusing on, oh, I punched my tag. It's like, no, this is, this is like a never ending process of improvement. Makes me smile, man. It's like, it's why you're great. It's the drive, the drive to become better. And it's easy to have that motivation and to have it wane and just go, yeah, I'm good enough. I killed 11 animals next year. I'm just going to, you know, I'll kill some more this year. It's like easy to rest on your laurels. It's easy to look at your mounts in here, to look at the mounts in my house and say,

yeah, I'm great bow hunter, you know, man, I'm good, you know. I'll be good this year. I'll figure it out. But instead, you just get back to the grind and you put in the work, this inner motivation, this inner drive, this student of the game, always wanting to improve and always wanting to get better. Like, that's why we're successful. that inner drive, man, that's it. You nailed it.

Yeah. Well, Brian, thank you so much for coming all the way out to Oregon. It's been, I mean, it's, you know, you say you follow me coming up. It's been an honor having you out here because I really respect you and I look up to you and I respect what you've built for yourself. And just the way you go about it and your mindset, it's, there's not a lot of people in the hunting industry that I think get me or that I respect, you know, in turn, but you are one of them. Thank you very much.

You are an outlier in this game that we call bow hunting, and I appreciate you. Thank you. Yeah, thanks so much, man. It's been amazing. So, yeah, it's my pleasure and just can't thank you enough for having me on and sharing the mountain with me. And, man, your trail run is just amazing, too. How you have all those trailheads linked together to those road systems.

That was a really special run that I can't stop thinking about. And, yeah, you're able to take me to some dark places, which is really good. You know, I had to grind to get it in the end. But, yeah, I can't thank you enough. All right. Take care. Yep. Thanks.

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