Cameron Hanes - Keep Hammering Collective - KHC 143 - John & Jenn Rivet

Episode Date: August 9, 2025

John & Jenn Rivet have been Livin the Dream together for over 35 years. Together they’ve been outfitting for over 30 years with a combined experience of 60+ years. They have both been avid outdoorsmen since a very young age whether they were fishing, hunting, trapping, camping, farming, mining, hiking in the wild, off-roading, quadding, or whatever took them outdoors! John has been guiding Big Game animals and more for over 37 years. They are also manufacturers of hunting scents & calls, as well as fishing tackle manufacturers and developers.  Join us for a conversation about bear hunting, connections made through bear camp and the upcoming Bush Dragon 3 film. Follow along: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/cameronrhanes Twitter: https://twitter.com/cameronhanes Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/camhanes/ Website: https://www.cameronhanes.com Follow John & Jenn: https://www.instagram.com/johnnyrivet https://www.instagram.com/jennrivet_  Book a Hunt with the Rivets: https://therivetco.com/  Thank you to our sponsors: LMNT: Visit https://drinklmnt.com/cam for a free sample pack with any purchase Sig Sauer: https://www.sigsauer.com/ use code CAM10 for 10% off optics Ketone IQ: https://www.ketone.com/Cam use code CAM for 30% off your first subscription Black Rifle Coffee: https://www.blackriflecoffee.com/ Use code KEEPHAMMERING for 20% your first order MTN OPS Supplements: https://mtnops.com/ Use code KEEPHAMMERING for 20% off and Free Shipping Hoyt: http://bit.ly/3Zdamyv use code CAM for 10% off Timestamps: 00:00:00  The Rivet’s Spring Bear Season & Baiting Bear 00:05:51  Rivet’s Bear Hunts: Why Hunting Big Boar is Important 00:09:36  Hunting Bear Out-of-State: First Time Hunters 00:11:48  Bear Appearance & Color Phases - Sows VS Boars 00:16:13  You Get What You Pay For 00:17:21  Shooting the right bear 00:19:09  The Rivet’s Business Success: John’s Struggles of the Past 00:24:43  Serving God Through Work 00:27:40  Ad Break (LMNT & Ketone)  00:29:49  Advice for People Who Want to Hunt with the Rivets 00:36:27  Stories & Connections from Bear Camp 00:39:13  Advice to Other Outfitters 00:43:59  Waiting for the Perfect Shot - Be Patient 00:45:47  Tactacam Reveal Trail Cameras 00:48:27  Managing Bears: Success for the Rivet’s Clients 00:50:54  If You Want to be a Guide - You Better Love People 00:54:26  The Kawasaki Side by Side 00:56:24  How the Story Ends: Getting Cam’s Giant 01:01:44  Grand Kids & Passing on Traditions 01:07:03  OutroBadass Raptor Giveaway:⁠https://cameronhanes.com/pages/hennesseyraptor⁠ 

Every step I take I move my truth. Every time they tell me stop I use. Every comment hate that makes my feel. Gather up my energy and boom. I hear them talking saying the way that I'm moving so reckless. That is the part of my mind I've been blessed with. Giving my blood so I am relentless. All right.

This is the keep. Am I on 16 over here? You're on 16 and 17. And their camera's on? Yep. I didn't see that. That's the close-up one. We can't use that one for two people.

Oh, gotcha. The normal ones all. That's perfect. We don't want any close-ups as we age. Well, this is the Keep Hammering Collective with John Rivett, Jen Rivet, the Rivets, and here we are talking about bear hunting. In Oregon, again. In Oregon.

This is awesome. I know. I love when you guys come, make your summer road trip out of Alberta. This is our fourth podcast together. Four. Four? Two at the skinning table and two in here. That's great.

Well, right now, we're on the heels of we just previewed Bush Dragons Three. Yeah. So what do you guys think of Bush Dragons three? It's a lot of tears at the end there and you killed Scarface. It brings you back into the moment. Yeah. It's kind of surreal.

It's so cool to have photos and videos because it brings back all those memories of I know. It took place. Yeah. It's a that call that night. Well, it brought me back like all the long days we had. And then I saw I had, there was a clip where I had a white like paper coffee cup because me and James were out there.

We were going to go sit a little bit and we were just like, okay, let's just grind it out. But we were freezing. And so Jim's like, okay, I'll put together a pack and brought coffee and snacks and sandwiches. And that was a game changer on that day. Yeah, that was nice. But we sat some long days in the rain. And yeah, it was a grind. That was a long days.

You know, it's cold when you're hanging on to your thermos. cell warming up your hands on your thermosel. I know. I always putting that thermocel on my neck for whatever reason. It's like feels good when your neck gets a little warm. But yeah, what a year. What a hunt.

So explain to me how did your guys a spring go. I know how my hunt went. So busy. Incredible. Crazy busy. It's nonstop. When we get back from our U.S. trip from the winter and we get home when we start baiting bears, it's nonstop for two months solid. Morning tonight, we don't sit down on a couch or a chair until we go to bed.

When we go to bed is when we lay down and that's it. That's when we stop. Yeah. Which is usually pretty late. Which is very late, depending on how many bears or how late you get in from the bush. Yeah. If you're baiting 50 to 60 bates, to keep all those full, you've got to bait them for sure once a week. Right.

So to do 60 bates, you got to do 10 a day. Eight to ten a day to keep. That's so much work. Yep. So much work. Always 3,000 pounds in the back of the truck and trailer full of equipment and gear and bait. So what do you guys, for stocking up for season, what do you guys get for oats and beaver? And what's the protocol?

Oh, my gosh. We picked this spring to get started, we pick up like 30, 40,000 pounds of oats. Deep friar grease to mix with that. Usually a thousand gallons of that to start. start with. Then we end up picking up more during the season still, but at least we got a good supply to start with, get everything going. I don't think people realize how much work that is. And the beavers. And beavers. How many beavers? Hundreds. Hundreds. Three hundred this year. And they're 20 bucks apiece. So it adds up fast. You do a thousand beavers. You just spent $20,000.

Well, all those things you just mentioned. And the frosty. And the little treats. And all the other little stuff like the little, if you see the little white marshmallows on the ground, those are little treats just so that they can move around a little bit and hopefully they'll give you a little bit better of a shot. A pallet full of pancake syrup. We pull out all the stops for the bear. They get to really have a buffet. And you can do it cheaper.

You can do it with less, but I refuse to. I know outfitters do. They go bait with a five-gallon pail. I'm like, what's the second bear going to eat? Right. We got 10 bears, 20 bears, 30 bears come into one bait site. You need two barrels full of food. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. I see, and then I see like little things. Like I see bear hunters or like guides or outfitters where they'll just throw the beaver on top of the barrel or something. Yeah, yeah. You know, where the bear comes in, grabs it. You grab it takes off and then that's it. Yeah.

You know, there's guys that put him in a cage so that the bears can't take it and they got to rip little pieces off. But then again, they're on the ground. We hang ours on purpose. It's more for the evidence of sex. You see the genitals. Boom. It's a bore. Okay.

Is he big enough? Yeah. Yeah. And then you like want them to work for it a little bit just so they're not just running off with it. We usually hang in them at six, seven feet. And it gives you an idea on the size of the bear too because I'll stand up when I'm hanging it up and I'll just hang it above me here. And I'll let you look when you're over there. And when a big bear comes in and he stands up and he's taller than me, it's usually a pretty big bear.

Well, and you guys do a great job with the barrels for that's another way for gauging size. Yeah. If the bear's back is to the top of the barrel when he's walking on all fours, it's a seven foot class bear. bear if he's that much over top of the barrel, he's getting up in that eight foot range. And then if you want a 400 pound bear, a giant bear, you want the bear to be as wide as the barrel. So when you're looking at him straight on or straight behind, you want his width to be the size of that barrel. That barrel full of baits, 350, 400 pounds. Right. So you can kind of equate it to the bear where can I put the bear inside the barrel? Yeah, he's probably too small.

Or they put the barrel in the bear in the bear? Yeah. It's a big bear. Right. Yeah, that's, uh, I don't know. I just can't watching that footage back again. It's just, I mean, we said we like the hard hunts. We like the ones we got to earn. I mean, of course, we'd killed either of those bears the first night. I'm happy that it took that long. It's great. Been happy.

But when it's day nine, man, it just means. Two week bear hunt. It just means that much more. Our hunts are five days long. That's it. Five days. Yeah. So basically.

So for people who say, oh, could I stay two weeks? Yeah, you want to pay for two weeks of hunts? Yeah. If there's room. If there's room. Yeah. But right. You guys have been sold out.

It worked out good for you to stay next week. We had seven hunters in. We got room for eight. Yeah. So you were the eighth guy. Yeah. I just paid for two weeks. Yeah.

And they were a great bunch of people too. Yeah. No, that was good. It's a, I think people, also there's, it's not guaranteed. You know, I mean, a lot of people will see this footage. and they'll be like, oh, it's just, you know, shooting fish in a barrel or whatever. But, you know, when you're focused on only big old boar, it's never guaranteed. Yeah, that's right.

I mean, what do you say to people who, I mean, I hear your spiel gin. You do a great job with these new hunters coming in, but explain it to people listening. Oh, the spiel that I give in the beginning or just. Just like what we're focused on like the big old boars and why that's important and why you got, why you're so adamant about that's what we hunt. And we don't hunt sows. Because the big boars, once they spread their seed, they'll always be replaced with something else. If we start shooting the sows, then you're taking away your breeders.

You're taking away your future population. So we like to keep the big old sow. We like to keep all the sows. It's your live bait too. That's sows there. There's a big boar going to be coming to follow her. Because the big, it kind of sounds corny. But I believe the bigger the boars are, the bigger the sows they like.

I mean, you get a seven foot sow. I haven't seen like a little six foot or boar her to accept them ever. I never have. Maybe it does happen. If there's nothing left in the forest. In the area maybe, but. But they know who lives out there. The sows know where the boars are, who they are.

And if there's not one close to her, she'll go get one. And they want to dominate. She'll go get a dominant board. A couple days. She'll walk 10 miles and she'll go find one. Yeah. She only won back. And they know which one is the, I guess, the dominant one in the area.

They do because they'll go after it. Because other boars will come in and the big old sow. They'll chase them out. They don't want anything to do with them. They're just waiting for whichever guy they're waiting for, whichever board they're waiting for. They know who's got the best jeans. Yeah.

Just like a white tail. Yeah. Where he leaves, where he makes a scrape and a rub and the branch above, he leaves all of his DNAs left there from top to bottom. Right. The bears do the same thing. Bears do the same.

The big boars will come in. They'll rub their backs on a rubbing tree. They'll take and drag their genitals across little branches and stuff. Then the sows will come in and they'll smell it. A lot of times they'll come and rub themselves, like walk over it as well. So they're leaving their each other's, scent. They know who it is from the smell. And they know it. I see, I see those big old boars come in,

like there's brush and they're just walking right over, just kind of dragging under all their junk. Yeah. But then their scent is left there and then everything that comes around, they know. Even the other, you'll see some of the, well, even at some of the beats that you sat at, some of the younger boars will come in and they're so sketchy. Like they're just looking because they know, they smell them. They know that big guy's there. So they're always on like alert. How is it? Because I know hunters come up. that maybe have never killed a bear and they're just, they can't tell the difference really. It's like, yeah, because we saw a seven foot sow.

We saw a giant chocolate, like color face sow that almost anybody would have shot and thought it was a bore until it was laying their bed. So how do you like, because you know some guys, if they haven't killed, to them a bear is a bear. Yeah. Right. Yeah. They don't know any different. They don't know any different.

But it's, I mean, I think you explained to well why. it's important. Yeah. But still, I know, I know what it's like to go out of state to spend thousands of dollars. You want to have something to take home. Because when people get home,

it's always like, did you get your bear? Yeah. And to explain to them, I mean, it's just the way it goes. But it's, we're very focused on just old boars.

And that could mean you go home without a bear. And we had some first time hunters, like first, first time hunters this year. Never, like I asked the guys this year, first bear hunt. Well, yeah, I said, what else?

Have you hunted anything else? He's like, no, this is my first hunt ever. Not a squirrel. Not a bird, nothing. I was like, okay. But the spiel that I do at the beginning of the hunt is we have a full mount. One of my, it's a chocolate color face black bear in there. And I have it a full mount.

And I'll spin it around and I'll show them shot placement. I'll try to describe how you can sex the bears, what to look for, kind of the sizing on the barrel, all those different things. So they can kind of get an idea. Because if you're coming, I'll say from a city, this guy came from Georgia, going out there, he doesn't know what's a big bear, what's a small bear? Like, is a, you know, a bear two feet high? Is that tall? Like, they don't know. They have no idea.

The key to our success on that, on size and on males, is the spiel that you give them to get them prepared. Like, you'll talk for an hour and kind of run them through everything that we do. I try to, and the other thing, too, is when if you want to go just for a bear, our place isn't the place. I'm just being honest. When we get people coming up, we want you to go for our average, we like a seven, foot, give or take. Yeah, seven foot, pulled a young skull. Because most guys, if you're hunting, you want a beautiful coat, and they want the skull,

and then all of that meat. Let's face it, on a little two-year-old bear, you're not getting a skull. The coat could be nice, but it's going to be small. We'll call it a toilet seat cover. That was a joke 30 years ago. You know, a smaller rug, which is great if it's your first, and you're not going to get that much meat. Right.

But then you're getting into that four or 500 pound bear. You know, you're looking at seven and a half, eight feet depending on the bear. You've got to stand on a tailgate of a truck to hold a whole, high, catching the ground. And why is it that those old, those old boars, the coats are usually good. They're not rubbed up. I wonder why that is. They don't have all that woolly under fur like the young ones do that they want to rub it.

It's itchy. It's hot. The warm weather's coming and they just want to get it off. Because those giant ones, they seem like they always have good coats. The coats are always nice on the hands. They just look like they just went to the salon before they walk in. They're just so beautiful. And you can, I mean, there's no doubt like, well,

You know, that first bear I killed, that eight-footer in the morning, he didn't, like, first looking at him, like the scarface that I killed, the one with the messed up one ear that kept coming in, I couldn't get a shot. There's no doubt that bear was giant. But that other bear was about just the same. And in videos, he doesn't look that big. He didn't have that same. It's a different genetic.

On the trail camera, some pictures look big and some pictures like, is that him or is that a different? one. Is that a younger one? Because when I killed him, you were like, I thought you shot maybe a smaller one. Like it wouldn't be small anyways. It'd still be a seven foot bear. Yeah, be big. But not the eight footer. Yeah. Yeah. And just the big ears on them. Yeah. It goes against everything that the experts say, you want to bear with no ears. No, not true. Every giant bear, 22 inch bearers that I've guided, I've had giant ears. Yeah. It's just. Really. Yeah. It just depends. And even, well, Scarface that I killed, we had somebody say, oh, that's a sow, probably because its wrists maybe looked a little small because its feet weren't it wasn't they weren't as big as that

first bear I killed for whatever reason but it just goes to show you cannot until they're laying in there and you're looking at it like bear how big how you don't know yeah you got these little there's little things you could look for like a crease in the head is usually a good side yeah but the ears the wrist the muscle the feet size all of that my favorite thing to do as these experts that say they can judge a boar or sow just by looking at them walking with no genitals. I sent him a picture of a bear and I'm like, what do you think this is? Right.

It's usually the opposite. Yeah. Well, I mean, that chocolate sow. Oh my gosh. I don't know who would have said that was a sow. Yeah, right. Yeah, if she comes in by herself, like that's a big bore. Yeah.

And see, that's the other thing with the whole make sure you identify male or female because like that chocolate sow, she came in. We didn't know she, well, we knew she had cubs because we heard him. we've seen him far off in the tree. But an average hunter or first time hunter sees that come in. They're going to be like, oh, my gosh, this is a seven plus foot. And her color was beautiful. But you shoot her, then she's got three babies.

I know. So that's why we identify sex. Yeah. And when they're new little newborns, you know, size of a cat, those ones, they don't necessarily have them with her. She might have left them a few hundred yards away in a tree. We saw a sow. Remember that was lactating, cat? And her cubs, I don't remember.

I don't remember ever seen her cubs. I don't think we did. No. No. Yeah. But she was in multiple times. Yeah. Well, safety.

Yeah. You think about it, those big boars around. Those babies are in there that we've seen it before. Years ago, Joe talked it on about how many years ago on his podcast. Years ago it happened. We had a boar come in and grab a cub and tear him up and eat them. Yeah. So that's the risk of Sal would take by bringing in her cups to the bait.

Yeah. Yeah. It's, uh, yeah, I think. And then there's another thing, people, bear hunters. do is they'll go for a big black bear and then if they see a color phase it's yeah anything they'll kill it that could be a hundred pounds yeah and that's we need to not I mean that's not part of what you guys yeah because it's the old saying oh color phasers just don't get that big right no they do yeah Jen's killed a eight foot color phase giant I've killed too eight foot you just got

let them grow well an eight foot and a seven and a seven I'm a little spoiled and that's got that's that's that's like a unicorn yeah I'm getting the color, the color, every color. Yeah. I have one more to get. Yeah, I got one more to get. I've got two white ones. We have white color phases.

Wow. They're not albinos. They're just white. But the same thing with the color phase. If you let them grow, they'll get big. Oh, man. So if you see a six foot bore this year, next year he'll grow a little bit within two, three years. You're going to have a beautiful, you know, great size color phase.

It doesn't take long to grow good bears. If you let that six and a half go, he's seven next year. Yeah. And that's what most people, most camps that I've been to, it'd be like if it's a six-foot bore, you shoot it. You know, that's even big for a lot of camps. It is. Yeah.

There's places where it's five footers, four and a half footers are getting shot. Yeah. Or any bear. Yeah. And it's for you guys, a six-foot bore, I mean, you're not even really looking at. The more east you go typically, like in Canada, the smaller people shoot. Just because it's camps that are, it's a fishing camp and they have bear. hunt's on the side and they don't manage them. They're not growing big bears. They're just shooting

whatever's there. Like if they put you on a bait, some of them have a school bus and they drop off 30, 40 hunters on this road every mile, boom, boom, boom, boom. Yeah. And when you see a bear, that's your bear. Like, you come back that night and you say only one came in. He's about five foot. They're like, that was your bear. That's your opportunity. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, we're 100% on opportunities. Yeah. A lot of guides say. Yeah. So you get what you pay for. Like I say, you don't have to come hunt with us, but I say go west. Further west you go where they know of the Manitoba, Saskatchewan, Alberta, British Columbia. The bear hunts are managed a lot better.

It's one thing that is challenging is you get, you have so many big bear up there. It is a little stressful making sure you're shooting the right bear, you know, because you might have a giant in, but I've seen, we've seen Sal's look giant. So I know like the first bear I killed, which was an eight-foot bear, we had a hunter have that bear in the first night

and didn't shoot it. It's an eight-foot bear. Yeah. This isn't like to slight them. It's just hard. It's hard. And especially if you're sitting, you know, ground to tree stand, it's a different angle, right?

Obviously. And when you're up in a stand, it looks different. Like, you can't see the bear over the barrel as easy as when you're eye to eye. Yeah. It's so much easier to identify sex from the ground. Yeah.

binoculars straight on. If it's a bore, the penis hair sticking out underneath it when you're up above, it's a lot of stuff. And we don't like to leave. We don't normally leave people on the ground by themselves. There's a select few just because of risk, also because how much experience do these people have? If it's their first bear hunt, hey, buddy, yeah, sure, we're going to sit in a lawn chair,

12 yards from this bait. As you know, if the bear senses the fear in that person, he's going to get harassed a lot more. Yeah, I mean, we saw that. They can tell. And I have to think about that myself because I think, oh, I can sit anywhere and I got no problem with the bears. But that's different. But that's me with no fear. It doesn't even raise my heart rate.

So I got to think to myself, okay, that's a lady sitting there by herself. It's different. She looks smaller. Yeah. There's different smells. It's different. But that's a difference between what, 36, 37 years of experience doing it to somebody that's coming in for the first time or maybe the second third time. It's just it's all different dynamics.

I'm comfortable. Well, yeah, when you mentioned the 36, 37 years, did you guys ever anticipate that your business would be where it's at now? We believed it would. Yeah, I always believed it would. But when it happens, it's like, this is amazing. When you're sitting at UFC, you know, close to the ring and you're like, wow, Joe Rogan, this is freaking cool. When you're young and you, you know, everybody has it, you have to have a vision, sorry, I can't speak. Vision for your future.

And we had this big picture because we knew other outfiters and four. friends that have been other places that were really successful and we love the way it sounded. And it was just like, kind of, how do you get there? Well, how you get there is you can't stop. Every day you just go. And we've had ups and downs, market crashes, COVID, you name it, all these different things, injuries, you name it, but you just got to keep going. And it was in 1996. It was actually prophesied over me at our church camp when I got baptized. Our pastor spoke that, and God had told me the same thing. I felt that myself. that there's going to be people that we'll be able to reach with the gospel because of the business that we're into.

I mean, you get people come spend a week with you. We've got guys that are billionaires, millionaires, and they get to spend a week in the forest with somebody where we're all equal. It doesn't matter how much money you got or as little or as much as you have. We're all equal in the woods. Yeah. We all have to go poop and wipe our butts. I don't, but I know others do. Well, how come does it mean this much to you?

that, I mean, John's emotional. I see. He's always emotional. I see your eyes a little wet. I'm emotional because God's done so much for me. That's why I'm emotional. That's what I want to know. Growing up at 11 years of age, my dad leaving at 9 years old.

His parents getting divorced. Not knowing where he was for two years. Yeah. His mom on welfare. I've become a drug dealer at 11. My big brother's selling drugs. Mom's on welfare. If we're eating bacon, it's because mom stole it from the store.

Yeah. So you see where you come from. That's why we're always, I mean, that's why we're always thankful no matter what's happening, up, downs, whatever. It's like you've got to find something to focus on, something to be thankful for, because where we started from and where we are now, it's all God. Of course, God puts people in your path, brings clients in, businesses, all these different things. But as far as we're concerned, it's still God.

He is the deciding factor if we just listen to him. And the more we serve God, the more he blesses us. We wouldn't be here sitting together without. him trust me it's no way i would have put up with you that long i wouldn't have with you this long either i'm so blessed to have you i mean it's it's i don't know it's weird because like i love hunting with you because you're so emotional and you're so tough yeah she's tough jen's tough she has to be tough to survive too jinn is tough and like a great bear guide she is the best bear guide good at keeping people in line yeah and not to say you aren't you aren't you

You're just different. You're like your whole heart is in this. And then you're like the, I don't know how to, like the task master kind of. Okay, this is what we got to do. Totally. Here's a plan. The list maker. It's such a great combo.

It is. It would suck. Oh, it wouldn't work. If you were both like emotional about it or you were both like gin. We just go head to head all the time. But that's the balance. It's the yin and yang. He's more the optimist.

And I've always been more the realist. It balances. If we're both optimists, yeah. Because I just trust everybody. Yeah, he trusts. They could screw me once or twice and I'll trust him again. And I'll be like, oh, I'm just, yeah. He listens to that now after 36, seven years. Yeah.

Well, how amazing is it? You talk about this is God and the- Our outfitting business to us is our ministry. That's where God wants us. That's where he planted us. We got told we missed our calling. We should be pastors. And I'm like, past, you are.

Everybody should kind of whatever. It's like, well, if you're in the church and you're speaking to everybody in the church, whether it was kids ministry that I did or coaching, all these different things, it's great. It's fantastic. But everybody's there. They're already someplace. We're in a different area where they're coming to us. They're in our home with our family for a week.

And it's just my thing was always from years and years ago, 35 years ago, it was like, we didn't have money. We were poor. We're fairly poor, raising four little kids. You don't have a lot of money. and we'd be like, hey, come over to the house for dinner. We'll feed them, love on them, and you build a relationship. So kind of my of the outfitting is, yeah, we want you to have a great hunt, have a great time, enjoy the outdoors.

But it's also, you don't know who these people are. So you can love on them a bit, feed them, maybe give them somewhere so they can actually just go, because we've had clients in that it's like they're so wound up. They can't even sit to focus. They just need to take a breath and relax. And for us, it's just, okay, why are they here? Why do we need to know them? What are like, you know, help us help them.

Or help them just, us just love on them. Just love them. Just give them space, whatever they need. Well, tell everyone you meet about Jesus and if necessary, use words. Well, that reminds me of Roy, because Roy would always say that hunting, what does his missions feel? And he could reach people through hunting that he wouldn't have otherwise been out to reach. And it's kind of what you're explaining. Yeah, yeah.

It's different than being in an office, like a guy that you work with or say at a school. Like, it's just a different. I really thought when I was young and I came to Jesus at 14 after quitting selling drugs and started my fishing tackle business at 14 and hunting products already, making moose calls and that kind of stuff. I don't know. Where was that leading to on that one? You thought you'd be somewhere else?

Oh, yeah. No, I thought if I really gave myself to God, like gave my life to him that he's going to send me somewhere I don't want to be or make me do something I don't want to do. That's what I thought. Yeah. from growing up in some sort of religion. And it's so the opposite. Like, I'm doing what I love.

I'm doing what I enjoy out in the outdoors, fishing, hunting, and making a living at it. Yeah. So I see it as you serve God. It doesn't matter who you're working for. If you make it where you're working unto the Lord, the blessings come from him. Your employer might not pay you enough,

but if you're working for God, the blessings come. Yeah. I've seen it over the years. I was different. I didn't get raised like that. I left home at 16. Things were rough at home. So for my, I came from till now, yeah, it's a big change.

I never thought this is where I'd be at 15, 16. I was going to go into law or teaching or something. I didn't know. And my parents changed a lot. They became Christians, too, over, you know, many years. But when I was young, girls didn't play sports. I wasn't allowed to play hockey. Girls didn't really hunt.

I could go fishing. But anything else, it was like, no, that's for the guys. Isn't that amazing how Christ changes people's lives and it's for the better? Like, it's so good. So what if it's all a fairy tale? What if it's not true? I know it is real. But people would say that.

What have I lost? If I've followed Christ and I've got a better life and better family and better friendships and everything better. And if I get, if I die and there's nothing, what have I lost? I've had a better life. Winner, winner. It's been a win. And it's like, I've never.

never, well, I don't know what we can attribute to Christ changing people's lives, but I've never seen somebody say Christ changed my life and have it be bad. I've never seen them say, I got screwed over because of... I've always said, try Jesus. Yeah. And if it doesn't work out for you, we'll give you all your problems back. I mean, we still have problems with Christ, but he helps us go through it. Right. He helps us go through the storm. He doesn't always stop the storm, right? He helps us through the storm. Yeah, we weather it. Yeah. We get stronger. Yeah. We were just talking out at Wayne and Lisa's about just having that foundation where you can fall back on.

Because there are storms that come. Health, kids, teenagers, family, business, whatever. You have to as a couple have something to fall back on where you're the same where it can be, okay, this is as far as we fall. This is what our foundation is. And now we know who we are. And now we've got to come back up. For us, that's always been Jesus.

It's so cool to see God transforming lives right now. I mean, your friend, Jellyroll. You see what God's doing in his life. I know. I'm excited to announce a new sponsor to the podcast, Element. Element was created by former research biochemist Rob Wolf and has enough sodium, potassium, and magnesium to move the needle. And get you feeling and performing your best.

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We've had some amazing people in camp. And it's, I love just sharing, well, it's what I love to do. Yeah. I love sharing what I love with people. somebody with you to share a camp with an experience bow hunting. You know how it goes. When you love something and then you're like having somebody else and you're like looking at them going, are you loving this too? Yeah, yeah, totally. That's why we have such a good time because we love it.

It's a passion. Yeah, we're all on the same page. And you just want these new people coming in. It's like there's, it's, I've been frustrated a little bit with some people, you know, there's whatever. people are going through hard times, but that I felt like weren't appreciating the opportunity or the hunt or a camp as much as they should have. And it's like, who's for me to judge?

Yeah. But, I mean, what advice do you have for people coming up on their first bear hunt, like to make it a success? Well, what would you say? Well, I mean, everything from the packing, the traveling aside, it would be. Don't pass up on the first night. What did shoot on the last night? Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We had a guy this year. He's like, I don't know if I should.

and it was just shy of a seven foot, but it was a slender bear, nice boar, nice hide. Yeah. I don't know. And I was like, would you shoot this on the last day? Oh, absolutely. I'd shoot it tomorrow. I says, well, then you probably should shoot it today. Yeah.

One of his first archery, clients that have the best success and have the most fun are the ones that come relaxed. And whether they kill or not, they're going to be happy. They're going to be successful, whether they bring an animal home or not. And those are the ones that do the best and end up killing something really, really cool because they're not putting pressure. run themselves. They're not stressed every day of, man, am I going to get one? I got to get one because I got to tell everybody at home that I got one. And they're so happy if somebody else in camp gets it.

It's like years and years ago would be like you get this little, you'd see people get a little jealous. Did you save him that bear? Did you put that guy at a special bait? Like, do you save this for a cam? And I'm like, no, you tell us, obviously we're going to try to get you all on a bear. And it's like, we don't, we, you can't save a bait. We don't tie them there. We can't chain them there. It's like they're nomadic. They move all the time. And when I'm in a camp with a camp with a, bunch of hunters or something. I'm just happy somebody's succeeding because it's part of the team, right?

I'm like, he got a bear. Great. He got a bear. Whatever the animal. Yeah. And I will say, I've been, I'm not trying to say like I'm perfect because I've been there on short timelines and I'm like, I only have a few days. I've got to get.

So I know what. There's pressure on those ones. There's pressure on me when that's. Well, and then this year's the opposite where I ended up, yeah, I wanted to, I mean, I had, I was pressure and I wanted to succeed. But I was like. when the pressure was gone and I killed that first bear, that's when I killed Scarface. So it was like, you could never do that when you had your day job because you got to get back to work.

Could never, but it was like maybe I killed him because I was like content. Yeah. Right. There wasn't that. That's right. That's right. Because they can feel that. Yeah.

And they got him, you were all relaxing. I was like, oh, I was like, oh, this is gravy. Yeah. And of course, he shows right up. So I think I've, I've been thinking about that a lot about the energy. that you put out. And that's why I say, like, what advice would you have for hunters coming up? I would just say, make sure your energy is pure, you know?

True. And it's okay if you don't kill, but somebody else kills. Maybe even if you're just pretending, be happy. And who knows? Well, you prepare all the controllables you can. Like you're packing, you're shooting. If you're planning on shooting in a stand or shooting from a sitting position, practice it. Yeah.

We have guys that come up and I'm like, so you're sitting in a stand, have you practiced? Oh, no. But they knew. Or sitting in a chair or do you have to stand? I'm like, practice that. Please bring the broadheads that you've practiced with. Yeah. That you're comfortable with.

The ones that practice and prepare, like for a year ahead of time, they do it really well. And just practice movement and being quiet and all that stuff, just like you're hunting a way to tell. We had a big group of traditional bow hunters. They had built their own bows. They had built their cedar arrows. They had some of them had stones for the. Yeah. They did the whole thing from top to bottom.

point. What do you call it? What do you call that a stone? Oh, the arrowhead. The arrowhead? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, they made them on a stone. I had one. And did everything with the sinew from their last animal. Like, it was, that's awesome. Can you get us a five to 10 yard shot? Yes. Can you lower the tree stand? So we're lower down. Like at about 10 foot. So I got all that prepared for them. And they practiced like that from home. They bought what ladder stands you use? Okay. They went and bought the same ladder stand. They set it up at five or 10 feet. And they were shot every day. Yeah.

And they got nice pairs. Yeah. That's what it takes. With a stick in a string. Yeah. Yeah. I think if you're not, I think the devil's in the details, basically, like, you cannot over prepare getting ready.

It's like the little things because even I've seen people that hadn't practiced shooting that go to shoe like this and their camp hits their leg. Yeah. It's so different to shoes sitting down. It is. Oh, man. Better practice. If you haven't done it.

It's hard to pull. It's hard to draw. How do you expect to be? be successful in crunch time. You got to overcome, you got to overcome the odds. Yeah. So put the odds in your favor. Zippers, bino cases, noisy jackets, sometimes gals with long hair.

I'm like, you just got to make sure because if you're drawing tight and you get your hair wrapped in that cam, it's going to hurt. Yeah, that's brutal. Just lots of little things. And it's like until you're in that situation, they're like, oh man, I should do this. I should do that. Like the guys too, it's like, and figure out if that's where the bait is going to be, how you got to, because a lot of people sit straight on to the baby, right, where the bear,

and I'm like, are you going to shoot like this? Yeah, it's tough. I know. You know, turn your chair a little bit, get your angles, right? It's just, so once they get in there, if I'm sitting, usually guys that haven't hunted before, we'll try to sit with each one of them the first night. We really try. And if there's too many that are first timers, I'll take two, two buddies that'll come sit.

And it'll just be kind of a, I give them the spiel at camp. And then when we go out there and they're like, hey, and I'm like, you guys are going to just watch, and you're going to tell me. I'm not going to tell you. it's a bore, just look with your binos, do the whole bit. And they're like, okay, okay, okay. So these two guys this year, they were awesome, like picked it up like that. They listened to everything, which for a lot of guys, it's hard to listen to a chick telling

them what to do, especially hunting. Not so much anymore, but 20 years ago, it was tough. Yeah. And they listened to everything and they're like, I says, what's tough? They're all whispering because they're at the bait. And I'm like, good on you. Yeah.

They listen. That's good. I love how when you come with somebody or you bring somebody with you to Bear Camp and you'll sit with them instead of splitting up and increasing our chances you want to sit with that person and share in the hunt you might lose two three days out of your hunt out of the five days but it's so cool to see that friends want to be with friends and sharing the experience and and help them through it too and yeah i love that moms and daughters are like siblings or husbands and wives it's cool bringing their kids bringing their family it's really cool i love

i loved having that big camp uh we had i mean we had Caleb who's WMPT. Yeah, Caleb's awesome. Oh, man. Caleb brought five people with him this year. Caleb Brewer, yeah. I mean, that whole group was, you know, it's... Double amputee, and his goal is to climb up that ladder stand 15 feet with those legs.

Yeah. How special is Bear Camp? It's amazing. And that's all, I just want people to appreciate what it is and how lucky we are to do it. Yeah. A lot of people looking from the outside and it's just like, oh, you're just going to kill a trophy. No.

you want to get what you came for. Obviously, every hunter does. Or if fishermen you want to go out, you want to catch a fish. It's just a different dynamics of all the different people that are coming in. Like watching Caleb climb the ladder. And I mean, it's tough. That's a tough ladder just with mobile legs. And I'm like, is it okay if I film you?

And he's like, yeah, sure. And he gets up there and he gets in there. And I'm like, dude, you're awesome. He says, ah. And I'm like, no, no, no. There's people that are fully capable that don't want to do that because it's a little hard. Or I'm a little big or I'm a little scared. And I'm like, this is freaking amazing.

Yeah. This is his third year, so he's kind of a veteran now so you can help all the other guys that he brings and tell him what to do or what not to do. And see, that's the other thing too is when you're in, you just love to encourage each other. He razzed people back and forth a little bit too because that's hunting camp, but it's fun. Yeah. I enjoy it. I love that whole group. That was probably the best part of staying another week.

Yeah. They were stoked when they found out you're there. They're like, what? It is fun with full camp because there's excitement every day. night guys are coming back and they got stories to share this bird came right up to me he was trying to pull me out of the tree stand trying to bite my boot i know i love hearing the stories yeah because being close to bears rare you know and most people haven't so they their stories are you know riddled with emotion because they're like i had a bear this close from you know you could see yeah and you can

watch those bears just do what they do and that's you know in these other camps where people have been and then they come with you guys if they see a glimpse of a bear there's an arrow on the way or something and you're not really appreciating like just observing the animal yeah that's that's a cool should we share a few tips on on success even that other outfitters could could take from yeah or bear hunters bear baiters course um in the past the beaver's been the top eight yeah their beaver carcass they're smelling it from 10 12 miles and they're coming in from far and they're making mistakes for it because they want that beaver. They kill beavers all the time. They sit on beaver runs where they're coming in and out of the water to get food. Where we live,

that's one of their food sources. Beavours everywhere. So we'll never hunt without a beaver. But you've seen it, the frosting, the icing, whatever color it is, they're in the rut and they're not giving a crap about the beaver anymore. And they'll stop for that icing and take some legs and you take an arrow. Is that trying to get calories? It's the calories. They know what gives them the most calories. Right. And the less energy they can use for the most calories. Those pails are 70,000 calories each.

So you can put on some weight for the fall eating that stuff. Where the beaver is protein, it's all meat. Look, naturally, they'd get into a blueberry patch or whatever and just eat berries. They just lay there and eat everything around them. And then when it's empty, they move, get up, lay down, eat everything around them. So they're not using any air. Yeah. Exactly.

So the theory when people, or the story that people used to say, well, they love donuts. Yeah, they do. They like pastries. They like. At our place, they dend up for six to six to six. seven months. They need calories. Yeah.

Under the ground. And those sounds are to get really nice and chunky so they can keep those babies. Right. So calories are key. All right. So what's your other tip? Another one? What was the other one I was going to share?

There's lots. Some of them we're not sharing. No. We don't want people too good. For just general and hunting, especially their clothing. Movement and clothing. Quiet clothing. Yeah.

And people that chew tobacco or smoke cigars or do that type of stuff at the beat. And being warm and dry, the warmer and drier you are, the less you're going to move. Because if you're cold, you're like, drunning. Oh, yeah, definitely. Well, and I don't think people realize you can get away with a lot. I mean, this video will show you, but not always because when that big bore, the first bore came in and he was close and I drew back and my elbow hit a little, and you're like,

well, they saw you. You've been seeing these bears, like, not that bear though. that bear hadn't. And so I did a teak. And he's just like, I knew it. I knew I saw something. Then I heard it and I'm gone. Yeah, totally.

It's like you have to be almost perfect on those giant boroughs. Yeah. Another, a good tip is not to move. Don't move your neck. Just use your eyes. Move your eyes from side to side look and instead of going. Yeah. You know, the less movement, the better on those giant animals.

I saw one thing that, and I don't know why I did it, because normally it's a pet peeve of mine is people pointing because your hands is such flashing. My hunters do it all the time. And I normally like if somebody does that, I'm like, keep your hands down. But I saw like on that video and I don't know if I knew the bear couldn't see me or he was, must have been behind a tree. But I was just like when the first time the big bear came in, I pointed. Yeah.

Well, he was kind of off to the side. I was watching myself going, what are you doing? But anyway, that's a huge mistake. people make all time is they were so used to in regular life saying, oh, see that? Yeah. You just can't do that. Yeah, right. One big one for bear hunting, in my opinion, is,

case of the bear is coming in, whatever bear is coming in and the guys get hyped. And they're like, oh, bear bear, and I'm like, I always tell them, sit still, let them come in. Because they're watching you. They smell you. They know something's there. I don't care what you're seeing over there. He needs to come into the bait anyways for us to identify. How big is it?

And I'm like, let them come in, let them get comfortable, let them start eating. Then we'll do judging because they want to know. You're not going to shoot them over there. No. It needs to be here. But if they start fidgeting and doing all that movement, prepping and, like, you know, amped up, the bear is like, oh, something's off. Especially the big ones.

They're like, let them come in and get comfortable. And then you can move a little bit. You hear how loud they are when they eat. Yeah. Then you can do your little baby movements just like white tail and get ready. Yeah. I think people get lulled into like a false sense of security thinking they can get away with more. Yeah.

Because those younger bear might be in and you might have been on to do a jumping jack, who knows that's not the big bore. Yeah. Yeah. You can't do that with the big boar. When you have one on camera or on a bait, don't shoot anything else. Yeah. As soon as you kill something else, you're making it harder to kill him.

He might be 200 yards away when you kill this bear. Death moan, blood trail, you know, all the noise. He knows there's death there. Some of them leave after that. They smell that blood. They've checked it out. After you've left with the bear, they smell the blood, something died. They hurt the death moan.

You make it harder to kill them. That's why some of those bears are hard to kill because they, they, you know, seen death they've been there well i i know another thing i think people force shots sometimes which you might watch this video and you'd be like you could have shot a million times i'm just so paranoid about losing a bear and i haven't lost a bear like i think i've i don't know how many bear i've killed with you guys but all one arrow kills didn't go anywhere i appreciate that that you wait for the perfect shot well it's no need to push it no and people will see it if it's you'll see it bear are so hard to see angles or see right where that leg is because there's no crease.

You may think he's broadside and he's not. No. And then like even like on that where it got, you know, past shooting light on this one part, but on the camera it looks like you can see pretty well with your eye looking through a peep one eye like this. Yeah. It is tough to see.

Black fur. And knowing whether if that leg is here or here is a big difference. Yeah. Because you say, well, if it's back a little bit and you're like, oh, I got to be behind the shoulder. Well, now you're one long. lung liver guts. Yeah.

Because you thought that that lake was like perfect. Yeah. Oh, the other tip for people. Okay. First of all, this black rifle energy drink. I've been so good. I've started to drink him now.

So any other energy drink, I've tried almost all of them. And I start to, my, my head feels weird, like a bit woozy, weird taste in my throat, sometimes almost wanting to vomit. Like my body doesn't want it. And I talked to my doctor in Salt Lake and he's like, it's a taurine. Oh. Okay. So there's no touring.

I tried one of these at the. No dyes. At TAC in Utah. Evan was there. And I had no bad, like totally normal, like drinking a Pepsi or a Coke. Awesome. And she reads the ingredients like, hey, there's no taurine. And there's no dye.

We don't need it colored. Clear is fine. So, yeah, this is my new. Yeah. That's my favorite, too. He's a happy camper now. That's my favorite flavor, that wild frost is money. But did you say your other tip?

Yes, I didn't say it, but I will. That's what I call the squirrel. Totally. You do squirrel chases. And you've seen it this spring. The Tacticam reveal trail cameras. Game changing. Cellular cameras.

Yeah. So we have 60 bates we're baiting. We bait them all once a week. So Monday you're baiting this eight or ten bates and Tuesday you're doing these and you're checking chips and changing batteries. You used to that. And by the end of the week, you've been to all the baits and you're checking a camera on Friday. And oh, crap, that giant was there on Monday, Tuesday with a sow.

Yeah. He's gone. But you didn't know. Yeah, you missed it. You get two to three days with a hot sow until he finds another one. I'm sure you might be able to get on him again. And a hot sign means when she's ready to breathe. Yeah.

Yeah. He'll hang with her two, three days. He'll get her in the heat and breed her. Yeah. And now we can go live right now. I can check all my cameras at home right now. And I can go, oh, you know, there's a big bore with a sow right now. He just showed up today.

We got two, three more days to kill him. That's how. Put somebody on it and boom, we get him. I think that was a huge reason why I killed those two giants. Totally. Totally. In the morning, we had the first eight footer on a sow in the morning. We're like, if they're there in the morning, they're going to be hanging around.

So we went out there real quick. He came right in. Yeah. We would, without the tactic, Ken, we wouldn't have known that. Yeah. And then where Scarface was, I screwed up. We had him in multiple times where I didn't get him killed. He got that sow bread.

We saw another sow with these mangy cubs. And then all of a sudden the cubs were by themselves. So we were like, that's almost to come in. If Scarface is a dominant bore, there's a chance he's going to be. So we were back there and he was with that. So in previous years, Scarface was hitting two to three different, two baits for sure. Okay. So this year, to give us a better chance of killing him, I quit baiting the other one.

Yeah. Because we'd be hunting that one. He'd be over there. So we quit baiting that bait, left it alone, even though it was a great bait. And now everything was coming to this one. They were close enough together that you're getting some of the same bears. And just make me go to that one where you got them at. During the rut, they travel.

They travel. They travel. They travel. They travel. They travel. They travel. But I think that is another little key where why you guys are different, I don't I want to say better.

Constantly adjusting and planning and tweak and stuff. Well, the fact that you would give up a bait. So most outfitters would be like the more baits, the more hunters I can take. Right. If they have 60 baits that are like, hey, I could take 60 a week if I can get the guys to work. Where you had a bait that you just said was a good bait. You gave it up to increase your chances at this scarface, the giant, which has been hunting for years. So you gave up a producing bait.

just to make it to make your other bait even better. Yeah, exactly. Well, that's, that attitude is reflected in a lot of different decisions you guys make, which is why you're the best big bear outfit or out there. It's hard work. If you're lazy, don't do bears. Well, because you're going to cut corners and you're going to try to do the easy way. If our clients, we're successful, right?

But when our clients succeed, it makes us more successful. Whether, whatever they come for, it's just. Jen's always said, we don't want just fans. We want raving. fans. Right. They want people to tell everybody of what they experienced. Yeah.

Like an example, this fall, even though we're not taking any bear hunts this fall, we do them all in the spring. I say that. And yet there's always one or two that end up coming in the fall. Yeah. But we're going to bait all those baits up and spend $20, $30, $40,000 baiting this fall to make sure those bears are healthy, to make sure they go in the den fat and produce more babies. Because as they go in healthy, they're making more babies. But that's the type of management. If I can say it that way, that we can do.

And more bears are finding it. More bears are showing up on it. So next spring, when the clients are coming. You can do or you choose to do. We choose to do. Right. So management as in. Because anybody could.

Yeah. It just costs money and there's no benefit really other than down the road. Yeah. But I want the success so bad for my clients and to be the best at it that I'll spend extra money to make it happen. Yeah. That's what that's why you're so special. That's why your guys's outfit is the best in the world because of

decisions like it's a million little decisions that make it what it is right now yeah we work hard we do i joke during the season this year i'm like if we just had 60 hours in a date i might get caught up just there's so many things everything that's going on i mean it's great and it's busy and then when it ends you're like yeah isn't it so much fun to be at the skinning table no matter who killed one and you got some luke brian plan and i love it i love it in the demer box and we're skinning and talking and just enjoying life and cutting meat and I don't know I think that I don't know what I like debating I like being out I like the skin I like I just love it all yeah um it's late nights we get get in late eat late it's a whole different schedule than most normal you know hunting but uh I love everything

about it it's like it's and part of me I always want to protect it's like it's so special so I'm Like, I just want all the best people. The best people in camp. You know what I mean? And we've been lucky. Been lucky there. Yeah. But it's, I feel like, you know, we talked about a little bit,

but sharing it with people I care about, I don't think it gets any better than that, does it? Yeah. It's like we, the friendships we've made and you guys have made in the bonds in Bear Camp. Yeah. It's incredible. I mean, we spend the winter in the U.S. just visiting all of our clients and hanging out with them and getting spoiled,

flying on a private jet or going somewhere that we could never go. Yeah, and it's from bear hunting, basically. Well, just the relationships from there. Yeah. And it's not just us wanting to change people's lives and help them and stuff. It's a lot of people that come in. They all have input. They all have, you know, wisdom in different areas, whether it's business, godly stuff,

whatever, family. And it's just you get to interact with people like the pastor said 30-some years ago that you would never normally encounter. Yeah. Like you're the guy that was part of, the Patriot Missile, right? His company and his guys all came up. This is probably about 20, 25 years ago. So this is a guy worth mega, mega money, knows all business. Yep. Yep. He's passed away now. Yeah. Two guys from New Hampshire that had like big companies. They'd bring like eight employees three

times a year just to come hunt with us because they loved us. One died in New Zealand, falling off the mountain, shammy and tar. But just them impacting us. Some of those guys called me their pastor. Johnny, I don't go to church, but you're my pastor. And there are some of the ones that said you missed your call And you're like, no, Cliffy, if I wasn't here and you weren't here, we wouldn't have got to meet. Just love, you got to love people. You want to be a guide? You better love people. Yeah.

Because you're going to be serving people. Definitely. Sometimes it's rough. After a long day, you can run into a crisis or an oops or whatever. It's like, okay, might say a couple choice words. That would be me. But then you just, you move on. So the Bible says to store up for yourselves treasures in heaven or moss and rust do not corrupt.

I'm sorry. Say it again. Yeah. So the Bible says to store up for yourselves treasures in heaven where moth and rust don't corrupt. Because here are your truck's going to rust, right? Right. Eventually that truck will be a pile of up. Tell me what that means. So to me, that's relationships.

It's people. Okay. Because what's going to matter when we're gone? So the treasures don't mean anything. You and Roy. It's your relationships. Yeah. One old pastor says you never see a Hearst with a U-Haul behind it.

Right. Exactly. We've heard that. You can't take it with you. You can't take it with you. But with God, it's different. you kind of can because when you get your family involved, your friends involved,

and they all start following, you have that resolve that I will take them with me. I get to see them again. Yeah. Yeah. And you said something like you might have a few choice words that you're not, that's not to clients. No,

no, no, just like a hard day. No, that's like when something happens or. I don't want people think there you get to ask you. No, no.

That's not me, not to clients ever. Me and him maybe, but, or when I, yeah. Jen, have you ever thought of divorce? And she's like, no, but I've thought of throat punching you before.

That, I confess. I confess that. While you're sleeping. It's just stuff. Like, I get a bit of a potty mouth when I guide. Especially when, like, you crash your truck into trees. Or you're doing 180s on the road. Dude, trying to drive in that mud.

My gosh. With a trailer? You see me when it starts to rain, how pissed off I get. Because I know things are going to break. And we have to go. If it was just me hunting, I wouldn't be going. Like, we'll wait until it dries out. because we're going to break something.

We're going to break something on the trailer or the four-wheeler or the truck. Yeah, that mud is brutal on your equipment. But the driving, because it is, it's the craziest mud ever. It's like driving on ice. It's just all over the road. Things change this year, though. We've got some new Kawasaki's. Oh, man.

Yeah. Neil. You know how much I fixed on my machine before. Fixing, fixing, fixing, fixing, five side by sides. And all we did is fix. You've been in camp and there's not a week goes by that I'm not changing an axle or a bar. or something. It keeps that terrain so tough on it.

Yeah, the Kawasaki's. Oh. I know what's good and bad on a machine. I've went through it from front to back and all the problems that were with the other brand, the Kawasaki is built perfect. There's no other machine with a three-year warranty. It doesn't exist. Right.

In the four-wheeler world, it rocks. It's six-month warranty on all the companies. Wow. They have a three-year warranty. That's how much they believe in it. That's a great sign. Yeah. Yeah.

It got us in a note. That's for sure. Yeah. I mean, those, was, it comes to a 32 inch tires, right? Yeah, the big crew cab we just got, it's got 32 inch wheels from the factory. You don't need to lift it. You don't need to do anything to the clutch.

Yeah, that gives so much clearance like that. Garmin navigation screen, you can connect your hunting dogs to it. It's just everything. Air conditioning. It's a game changer. It's raining. Oh, who cares? Get in.

We're going for moose. Well, ours is a twin tour. So when we get back, September 1st, grouse open, so we'll be taking grandbabies in their car seats for a little pot pot bride, we'll call it, and go look for grouse. That's going to be so fun. But that's the other things, too. We want to pass us on to our kids and our, we've got grandkids now.

It's important. Yeah. It's going to be fun. I just thought of something that we need to put in that video. And I want you to talk about it. We have to put in the video. Oh, my gosh. The text.

Oh, my goodness. Yeah. You're going to make me cry again. You're freaking, I just thought it. That was like, see, for me, what we're doing out there. I mean, we're making a film, right? So for us, that's the. success. That's, there's going to be people watch it and they're going to book hunts.

Like that brings business for us for the future for 26 and 2027 and 2028. And so you had so much good footage. You had the whole story except the kill finally. So for us to get the big bear for me is it's emotional because it's what we prayed for it. You did everything we could. Tell me about that sex. Tell me about that text you sent me. I still have it in my phone. So I'm laying in bed. on day eight the night of day eight i'm going to bed you're still awake because i text you and god

showed me god showed me the story show me at the end of the story i text you and i says cam i know how the story ends because you were getting down a little bit not getting them we needed to get them and i said cam i know how the story ends it ends with you getting that giant the next day you kill them in half an hour sit yeah and a second one to boot yeah i think the text was like I know how the story ends. You can't ask God for help hunting? Yes, I can. Of course I can.

He cares about all the little things. You said you kill the giant at bait at number eight, I think, is what the text said. Yeah. And that's exactly what happened. Yeah, exactly. I did say, I didn't say which bait. Yeah. Scarface.

We're putting that in the film. Yeah. Because that's, I don't know. I don't know how to explain it other than it's a God thing. Yeah. But I remember laying there, it'd been eight days. of hunting, hard, just trying to do everything perfect. Having so much time invested that we need, can we just get a break?

Yeah. I text the friend in Tennessee and I says, hey, Tim Scott's his name. I says, Tim, can you pray for us? We need to get this giant. And he didn't pray for you to kill the big bear. You prayed for whatever would glorify God. And look what we're doing now. Yeah.

That's pretty cool. The Bible says seek first God's kingdom and his righteousness and all these things will be added on to you. It's incredible. I see it every day. There's no denying it. It's real. It's not a fairy tale. We are so blessed to have been brought together to share this lifestyle that we love and to do it to glorify God and to have each other, you know,

surrounded by love and friendship and all the experiences we've had is just are we the luckiest people in the world yeah if you don't think you have anything to be thankful for if you're born in north america be thankful you won the lottery right there you don't even know it yeah we're so lucky to because there's so many places where they can't even dream really because it's right they can't get out of there it's like so it's it's we can have a dream and change it and it can happen. But that's because we're here. Thank God. I mean, here's these two kids from Alberta and Ontario. And here we are here. We've been in the States for three weeks now. We spent a week in Salt Lake, attack, visiting our clients over there, some of our partners over there.

And then go through Idaho, spend four or five days there, do a podcast with our friend Bam Bam, and go to church with them, another transformed life. And then here we are here. We're at Endicott's for the week and spending time with you shooting and went up Pisca and now doing this. Went to church? Yeah, Cam took us to church. Pretty cool. Yeah, at your prayer meeting there with Wayne and the guys. Yeah.

Had two Bible studies at Wayne's. We had a Bible study at the University of Oregon with some coaches. Amazing. God is good. Yeah, we, I don't know. I don't know if we deserve it, but we've been blessed. No, we don't. It's unmerited favor.

That's grace. That's God's grace. There's nothing you can do that you do. deserve it. It's just grace. Salvation is by grace. Well. Everything is by grace. And when you get into those like a few years ago and stuff when I had a cancer scare and all that different stuff and you look back at that and it's like it's just grace. You're just thankful. Every day. Every day I'm thankful. Yeah. And you got to reflect on where you came. I know. It could be hard sometimes. Because we are flawed. I get distracted. I get,

I want more. Like, oh, I've had this success. Okay, what next? So it's like sometimes we do have to look ourselves in the mirror and just be like, okay, we made it. We are so lucky to be here. Yeah. God made us that way, though.

Yeah. Always being satisfied of where you are, but always going after more. Yeah. Yeah. It's a balancing act for sure. Because you only fail if you don't keep going. Right. You only lose if you stop.

You get up one more time, then you fall and you win. Yeah. Well. And there's too many things. I mean, you're a new grandpa now? Can I say it like that? We got three grandkids here at our end.

Thank you for bringing KJ a gift, too. It's a whole different, as you'll see as they get older, it's a whole different dynamic. Like I love being a mom. I loved raising my kids. That was my purpose in life. And now I see grandbabies and I'm just like,

not that it's a second chance. Everybody's like, oh, you get to raise them again. I said, no, no, it's just, it's totally different. But it's just like my babies had babies. This is our lineage going on. Like we can pass on everything that we've learned and the hunting, the fishing, the outdoors, all of this different stuff and involve them in it. And now from where we leave off, they get a launch and they get a, whether they choose to keep on going or whatever, I just love it.

Look at Hazel. Yeah. Oh, yeah. She's so amazing. She's when you got to the gate. She's amazing. Oh, yeah. I love Hayes.

She's running up Piscut. She's like, keep hammering. Keep hammering. Keep hammering. because she went all the way up Piscay and just about all the way down and not just walking, running up and down, grabbing, going after lizards. She's the best. And then, oh, I got to show you the picture after of her on top of the monument.

Oh, yeah. Keep hammering. Oh, love that. So I'll be 56 August 28. Okay. A few weeks from now. Yeah. Two, three weeks.

And you're two years older than me, I think. I'm 57. You're 57. Yeah. And so, I don't know. I can just picture. us if Jesus tarries that will be 85. I'll be guiding and you'll be coming up to hunt still in our 80s. Yeah. I hope so. It's, uh, yeah, I think when you talk about, yeah, that would be

something special about it. As long as you don't die when you're running a 250 miler. God, you never know at my age. But, uh, I think with the grandkids, as opposed to the kids for me, I always felt like I had to be, there's more pressure raising kids. then the grandkids, the grandkids, I can just be like, well, that's not my job. I can just enjoy this part of it. When I was raising the boys and Taryn, it's just like, no, you guys, this, this. I was just like, it's like, I don't. We have more relaxed.

Yeah, it's just more relaxed. Yeah, it's just different. You're in a different place in life. We have more wisdom. You know, we have more experiences. Right. And it's the parent's job to raise them. I mean, we'll endorse whatever, you know, they want.

We're going to support that. But we get a love on them because you don't get to see them all the time. So you get a love on them. You do special stuff with them. Grandkids all have guns already. That's great. The new one. The new one's getting one.

This Christmas. She's two months old. Addison had one. She was three months old and she got a gun for Christmas. That's awesome. Little 22s. Leaving a legacy right now. For sure.

Yeah. Hazel's got her first bow. She has a Hoyt. She's been shooting it and she's on fire. She's six. Yeah. So let's go. She's going to be a killer for sure.

Oh, yeah. The Bible says that a wise man leaves an inheritance for his children's children. Oh, there you go. And it's not necessarily financial. It can be. It can be everything. But godly, I mean, everything that we do, the hunting, the fishing, the stuff that we do to have them involved in that and be part of that, it's, and then those kids will be hunting, you know? Yeah.

Our kids are all boath hunters. Well, it's the legacy of it. If you don't teach your kids all of this stuff, who's what's the next generation going to? You know, continue it. Yeah. Taking them to church. Just look at society right now, anywhere as you go, like the hunting, the fishing, the outdoors, so much of it has been lost because there's so many people that live in

the big cities and they don't leave and, oh, hunting's bad. Oh, don't go fish. Oh, we don't want to go to the woods. It's dirty. Yeah, so what's our legacy? I wonder. Yeah. Same as farming.

Everybody's like, oh, farming. Oh, forget those farmers. Don't forget those farmers. That's why you in the city are eating. Right. Like, they forget the circle of life, I think, sometimes. You know what we've been eating for a couple days at Endicots? The end of cot girls killed three bears with us this spring, big bears.

The gals came back and canned it all. They canned all the bear meat. And the canned meat is so tender. When you eat a piece, you're like, this is the best beef I've ever had. And it's black bear. Lisa made us bear enchiladas. To my request, because she's made them before. And it's better than any restaurant we've been to.

Wayne loves canning that bear meat. Oh, my gosh. He always is talking about how good it is. And the girls did it all themselves this time because Wayne's building the house. Yeah. It was delicious. It was good. They're pretty handy, those girls.

They are. Yeah, they get right in there. They can hunt on their own. They can skin, butcher, like taking home coolers full of meat. But that's parents that took them out. Yeah, right. For sure. I mean, I know I understand there's some kids that don't have that opportunity.

Or, you know, it's not part of their family. That's where it's cool where they have these little things. People are like, man, those girls can shoot. They better. It's their dad. Yeah, I mean, and also we got to give credit to Lisa for dragging them up to Alberta. Totally, that's a good mom to take her. Spend all that money.

Without her husband to do it on her own to take her daughters up bear honey. Crossing borders. That doesn't happen very often. Yeah, exactly. This year, three generations of Indicots. Yeah. That was cool. Right.

That was cool. True. True. All went home with grizzy coolers full of bear. Full. The whole box of her truck was full. Yeah. That was cool.

That is, yeah, that's what it's all about. Well, I'm just super thankful you guys. We had a chance to podcast again. We had a chance to watch a Bush Dragons three. That was cool. Yeah, so Bush Dragons 3 is coming out soon, be on a lookout for that. Yeah. It's like a flashback of memories.

You're like, whoa, those days, all those hours, all those moments. And then you probably won't be able to get in, but you could take a shot and send John and Jen a message on Instagram or Facebook and ask about there's always room for a few hunters. We have three weeks every year that's sold out to repeat clients that keep coming like you and other people. But there's always a couple weeks. So we got like 16 spots or so that we can. And slap people in too. So there's always wrong. People like, you got any room?

How long is your wait list? Just I got room for you. Just send your money. Yeah. And tell us when you'd like to be there. That's the tricky part. Okay. Wow.

I know you won't get a better hunt for big bear. So our next podcast will be at the skinning table in Bear Camp. Yeah. I hope so. If you kill something. Now we've got to get nine footers old. There's always every other color. No.

How about a big close to eight, What color phase? That should be on the docket for next year. Just giant bears. Giant. Giant bears. You got to take them. But I'm talking for a cam.

Yeah, yeah. There's something about. We've got some of those. Those giants, man. They make your heart pound. We have one of those that's been hunted for five, six years. Another one. Nobody's seen them live.

Okay. Challenge accepted. Yeah. Big old choccal. Yeah. You know what? With the reveal tactic cam? Yeah.

get them. We'll get them next year. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Well, I'll be there. And hopefully I see anybody listening that wants to hunt with John and Jen. Yeah.

And reach us on Instagram is the easiest way. Yeah. Reach out. And you won't get a better bear guide than Jen, but you won't get a better. If you don't want to kill a bear, come with me because I won't let you shoot. Well, I'm so picky. You won't get it like a more loving, emotional bear guide than John. So we'll just, that's your strength.

On most days. On most days, yeah, yeah. Except when everything's breaking down and it's muddy and it's pouring and nothing's going right. It's so nice to drive Kawasaki's and not be fixing. Such hard work. Well, it'll be great. I appreciate and love you guys so much. Thank you.

Thank you for coming. We had a blast. We'll see you back in Alberta next spring. I can't wait. All right, guys, keep hammering. All right. Someone to blame. They said the hate.

It fuels my pace. I am Roy Tuff. I am the change. The fuel. In dirt, feeling like Cam Hates.