Cameron Hanes - Keep Hammering Collective - KHC 198 - Erin Ton

Episode Date: June 18, 2026

Erin Ton holds 91 FKTs (Fastest Known Times), a feat surpassed by only one other woman. In 2023, she returned to the mountains where she first hiked with her family as a child, and summited 57 of Colorado’s Fourteeners in 14 days, smashing the previous record. She stands out on the trails not only for her speed, but also for her attire, often hiking in high heels! Erin and Cam cover highlights from Erin’s unique experiences like hiking mountains in heels, her transition from law school to trail life, and her drive to inspire other women athletes. It also touches on reflections of fulfillment and future plans. Follow Erin: https://www.instagram.com/erin_ton7/  Follow along: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/cameronrhanes Twitter: https://twitter.com/cameronhanes Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/camhanes/ Website: https://www.cameronhanes.com Timestamps: 00:00:00 – For the Love of the Mountains & FKTs (Fastest Known Time) 00:11:25 – Erin’s First FKT 00:16:48 – FKT for MT. Pisgah 00:19:24 – 209 Recorded FKTs & What Her Goal is 00:23:19 – Michelino Sunseri Grand Teton Federal Misdemeanor 00:28:44 – Grand Teton FKT Goal & FKTs in Oregon 00:33:30 – Hiking the Mountains in Heels 00:38:57 – Erin’s Biggest Goal: 7 Summits Project 00:44:38 – Law School to Trailheads: A Love of Traveling for Work 00:53:18 – Inspiring Others Through Running 00:55:20 – Strength of Women Athletes and Trash Talk in the Sport 00:57:49 – Animal Welfare & Hesitations About Cam 01:03:54 – Learning to Shoot a Bow & Climbing South Sister 01:07:31 – Goals for MT Hood 01:10:43 – Colorado Culebra Peak Speed Record 01:15:27 – Erin’s Sponsors (Teva, Now Foods, Nomadix, COROS)  01:18:00 – F**k, Marry, Kill: FKTs, Hiking in Heels, and Traveling 01:20:43 – Thoughts While Pursuing FKTs 01:22:03 – Pursuing a Lifestyle of Fulfillment 01:26:34 – Is a 50K an Ultra? 01:28:10 – Why FKTs or Races? Any Future Plans for Racing? 01:32:42 – Final Thoughts Thank you to our sponsors: Montana Knife Company: https://www.montanaknifecompany.com/ Use code CAM for 10% off  Ketone IQ: https://www.ketone.com/Cam use code CAM for 30% off your first subscription Grizzly Coolers: https://www.grizzlycoolers.com/ use code KEEPHAMMERING for 15% off LMNT: Visit https://drinklmnt.com/cam for a free sample pack with any purchase Sig Sauer: https://www.sigsauer.com/ use code CAM10 for 10% off optics MTN OPS Supplements: https://mtnops.com/ Use code CAM for 20% off & Free Shipping

Every step I take, I move my truth. Every time they tell me stop I use. Every comment hate that makes my feel, gather up my energy, and boom. I hear them talking, saying the way that I'm moving so reckless. That is a part of my mind I've been blessed with. Giving my blood so I am relentless. All right, welcome to shit talkers. No, not shit takers weekly.

I'd like to see if you could talk some shit. That'd be fun. Bummer. I can hear hoping to talk some shit. We can still do it. We can still do it. There's no holds barred. But this is a Keep Hammer Collective.

with Aaron Tund. Great to have you here. Thanks for having me, Cam. It's been an incredible couple days here in Eugene. We've had fun, haven't we? Yes, I will say I am not used to the 90 plus degree temperatures, though. It's, I mean, it's, we're not used to it because generally it's not this hot here even. I mean, or I mean, we'll get a couple days like over 100. And I guess it's been warmer lately, but this is warm for us too. So yeah, you're not alone. Good heat training for me. It is. So, man, we've done a lot. We've done a lot. But what the, I've had, I've had fun doing everything. And we'll get to everything, including shooting the bow. But, uh, so people that don't know. And I didn't really know that much about you. I guess Chris is the one who sent me a message. But once I found out and like, hey, what's this girl about? You're a freaking beast. And now I saw it firsthand, just how good you are in the mountains. Tell me, where did that start? Well, where, where, did you develop this talent or learn about it? Yeah. So I don't come from a traditional athletic background for the majority of my life. I didn't identify as an athlete at all. And if you had told

me that I would be a professional athlete full time making a living off of this even six years ago, I would not have believed you. What did you think you were going to be doing? I thought I would be sitting in an office. Yeah. Yeah. I graduated undergrad in 2020 during COVID. And my plan was to take one gap year and then go to law school. And in the meantime, I moved home to Colorado, which is where I'm originally from, and downloaded Strava at the time, was hiking all the 14ers. I'd see people running up and down them. I'm like, what are they doing? And that's when it clicked. Like, this is an actual sport. There's a whole world to this. that I knew nothing about.

And so at the time, it was more of just a personal challenge, you know, how many minutes or seconds can I shave off of each of these Strava segments? And that's when I learned what FKTs or fastest known times were. And that was in 2020? Do you think? I believe I set my first FKT in 2021. Okay. Well, so I think we skipped a few things because, so you went from,

you're just hiking 14 or so tell me what was the lure there? Like, is that because you're just, you're just hiking 14. you grew up there, everybody just kind of knew of the 14ers in Colorado and what is there, 58 of them, I think? Or 50, anywhere between 53 to 58, depending on who you ask. There's some weird, arbitrary rules that there has to be at least 300 feet of prominence from the saddle that connects it to the nearest peak. I see.

Yeah. Yeah. I see. I know there's something, like one day, me and Courtney did three. So I think that's probably where if you don't draw far enough down, you don't. this doesn't count as a 14er, right? Is what they're saying from the saddle? But yeah, so I get that some of them are close.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, but the ironic part growing up in Colorado was that I had all of that in my backyard, right? Like I grew up just east of Boulder and the flat urns are right there, access to some awesome hikes, but I never took advantage of that growing up because it was just normalized. Yeah. It took me moving out of Colorado to get. go to college in upstate New York to realize all I had taken for granted right there.

That's how it usually works, right? Yeah, it's funny how it works. You don't know what you got until it's gone. Yeah. So, but that's interesting. So you got, went back home, had this, you were drawn to the mountains, finally in life, even though you were there the whole time. So you started hiking them.

And then when did the speed part start coming in? Because I would assume at first, most people, they don't care how long it takes to get up. You just want to bag the 14er, right? Or were you always pushing? Tell me about your first couple. When you're deep in the backcountry and everything depends on your gear, your knife can't be the weak link. That's why I teamed up with Montana Knife Company

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I think I was naturally gifted at power hiking and just moving efficiently. So for me, like the steeper and the more vert, the better. And I think the draw was how much space, how much distance can I cover in a condensed period of time? Because it got to the point where I was wanting to check off a couple peaks in a day. And I realized the only way to do that was to move quickly through the mountain environments. Gotcha. So you've always been like, hey, let's get this done. Because some people go out there, they're there for the day.

You know what I mean? Or like speed is, they just want to enjoy it, have a picnic. It's all good. And that's great too. I mean, because they're in the mountains and nature's amazing. So I have no issue with it. But that's where most people start. And then I'll, but you started with like, hey, let's get these done.

Yeah. And I did do some hiking and long distance backpacking while I was in college too. I co-founded like a backpacking club at Cornell with a friend of mine. And so we'd make weekend trips up to the Adirondack Mountains or the cat skills in upstate New York. Oh, okay. And we tried to cover pretty big distances over the course of two days. So I think something in my brain clicked, like, oh, it's fun.

Like it could be a personal challenge to see how far you can go in a short period of time. And like, how far would you get back then? Do you remember? I mean, over the course of two days, we'd probably do some. hikes that were 30, 40 miles, which seemed like a lot at the time. It's a lot. I'm like, I can run that. I know.

Yeah. A few hours. You're at the next level now. But yet for most people, that's a long way. In the mountains, 30 or 40 miles is, that's an effort. Absolutely. Especially upstate New York. I don't think it gets enough credit.

It may not have the high altitude of Colorado or peaks out west, but the terrain out there is very rocky, very rudy, very muddy. like very rugged is it so do you think these trails like that we've been doing here are better than or is a country more rugged back there or what is it not as high but just is it more the roots i know are hard we don't have a ton of those we get up above timber line it's just rock basically so what's what's the difference between the two um out west we tend to have a lot more switchbacks in our trails out east you pretty much just go straight up the mountain which personally I prefer, which I think is why I'm drawn to mountains that require off-trail navigation.

Yeah. Like one of my longer-term goals is finishing all the 13ers in Colorado. You know, everybody talks about the 14ers or the 14,000 foot peaks, but there's over 60013ers in Colorado, which not a lot of people know. And they're not nearly as popular or trafficked. And so they actually test your, you know, route finding and orientering abilities a lot more. Yeah. That's a lot of 13,000 footers, man. Yeah.

I think Chris and I, we've chipped our way to about somewhere between 250 and 300 of those. Really? Yeah. That is a lot of work right there. But or not a lot of work, a lot of living. Because we love it. It's just like some people would say that's a big effort. and it is, but when you love it, it's just what you do.

Absolutely. And those are my favorite days in the mountains where it's centered around the adventure. And we love looking at maps and studying maps and drawing lines and figuring out, can we connect, you know, five, six, 13ers in a day? Like, will this ridgeline go? Will it cliff out? And we just go out there and explore and find out. Yeah.

So you're not necessarily focused on the speed or the athletic elements necessarily, but you'd get that in the process. Mm-hmm. It's, yeah, I mean, I didn't know, I'll just be honest, I didn't know, I think I knew FKT's probably talking about mostly like the AT. I've seen Jeff Garmeyer did that and I think Tara Dower did that. So it gets, that gets quite a bit of coverage.

It seems like the PCT doesn't get as much for whatever reason, but the AT does. But that's where I was kind of exposed to the FKT world, is just you. just following and seeing what people were doing. When did you said your first one was in 2021. So did you just you found one and you're like you saw the time and you said, I think I can beat that or how'd that happen? Yeah. So my first FKT was on a local peak called Mount Morrison, which sits up just above Golden

Colorado and it's short, steep, punchy little climb. I think you gained about 2,000 feet and like a mile. and a half, two miles. Pretty steep. Yeah. And yeah, the thing about like when you don't have a lot of background, you progress really fast. And you can see those incremental changes really fast. And so I think just kind of analyzing my pattern, I realized that, you know, if I just kept putting in the work, I could get there eventually. And that first one you got, how much did you get it by? Probably not very much. I don't remember off the top of my head. I've actually gone back since then like one or two years ago and it makes my initial time look incredibly soft,

which is cool to see how far I've come. Yeah, it's crazy. It's so I don't know if we even said it, but FKT stands for fastest known time. And so give me the definition of that. Like, it's pretty straightforward, but I know there are there are rules or guidelines. Yeah. So, There's a whole organization, a website surrounding FKTs, and it's meant to be an online database of iconic routes all over the world. And they can look very differently, very different, everything ranging from the AT,

like you mentioned, to the Manitue Incline, for example, in Colorado, which is very different than the Appalachian Trail. So what inspires me most, are big high altitude mountains all over the world. How fast can I run up them? How fast can I run up and down them? There's just something that appeals to me

about the aesthetic of that. So when I'm out there, I record it on my watch GPS and then you upload those files to the website. They have regional editors who specialize in certain regions all over the world and they sit through the data to make sure it's legit, write a little trip report. And that way people can access. that website as a tool and a resource.

Yeah. If they want to challenge themselves and go fast. And it's history, you know, because it's like, you know, we're humans out here. We're sharing this existence, you know, in these places. And I think it is kind of cool to know, like, oh, somebody, because I know I've been on stuff. And then you look at like how, well, I was thinking like the Grand Canyon. Like if you look at the FKT for that rim to rim to rim, you're like, I think, does Jim Walmsley have it? I believe so.

Yeah. Have you seen the YouTube video of him running it? No. Is it nuts? I don't know who is chasing him with the camera, but kudos to him as well. It's it's, it's, you should look it up. Yeah. Entertaining to watch. Right.

I mean, his strides, he's just like tall and gazelle. Yeah, gazelle and you're like, you see, but you see his time because I looked up the FKT time for that because me and Courtney did that and I was just like, it's like six hours or something crazy. Yeah. Insane. Unfathomable. So that that's just fun.

So it's like the FKT, it is a great resource and it's just fun to look up. Yeah, absolutely. And they're meant to be primarily like very competitive, historic, iconic routes and routes that anybody would want to repeat even if they're not necessarily going for speed. Yeah. I do. This is probably where it gets into shit talkers, but I do think it's getting to the point where it is starting to be a little over-saturated with routes that are probably more conducive for just being like Strava segments.

Yeah. And they're more so just like only known times versus like these really competitive. Yeah. Yeah. Because it's like they're all lumped in together. So you could have the AT or the or the PCT, which is over 2,000 miles. And that's the same as Piscca, which you tried to get today at 1.4 miles. That's kind of weird.

Right. Or is Piscka fastest on time or is that a Strava segment? That's the Strava segment. Oh, okay. So that's the difference. Yeah. Okay. So that's what you're saying.

That makes sense, like that little hike here that I always do, that doesn't seem like it should be an FKT, right? Is that what you're saying? I mean, it just depends on almost the community surrounding it too. Like I don't think distance necessarily dictates whether it should or shouldn't be an FKT. Like the Manitue incline, that's really short. Yeah. But it's so, so competitive.

And you've had some of the best. athletes, Olympians, like go after it for. That's fun, I guess. Yeah, it's fun. Because even like we've talked about the Strava segments on the track you ran out on today, and that's Olympians. So it's like it's just fun. I think just to look at where you fall in comparison, not you, but all of us.

It's just having, you know, some people are into data, and it's fun just to pour over it. And it's cool. So yeah, I was going to, I wanted to ask about PISCA this morning. So I did not know. I mean, the fastest women's time is freaking fast. What was it, 1430? 1431. 31.

And you got 1444 today. How did that feel? Oh, it's a tough climb when you're actually trying hard. That's what I said. If it doesn't hurt bad enough, just run a little faster because it hurts. Yeah, I think I matched her exact splits to the halfway mark, the bench. And then apparently I lost 13 seconds in the upper half. Dang.

Did you, what would you do different now? What do you think? I brought poles with me. Okay. Because in the first half, that's where there are a little bit more of those steep, punchy climbs. And I was surprised I didn't use them all that much, actually. So I think if I were to go back for a second time,

I would experiment and see if that makes a difference. You should have thrown them in the brush. Yeah, that's but dude So my fastest ever is 1448 So you beat that It's like I'm not not I'm not acting like I'm anything But I know how bad that hurt me And you beat it today so I mean I was like

When when I saw your screen or the whatever that was that you On your story I was like I don't know I don't want to say I was I wasn't I was impressed I wasn't surprised how about that because I saw you run South Sister, so I knew you were a beast. But I was still, like, pretty impressed. That's a fast time. So, great job. Yeah, I have nothing else.

I beat camp by four seconds. You did, you did. It's definitely a trail runner's mountain versus, like, a mountain runner's mountain. Yeah, for sure. And I consider myself in the latter category. Okay. Definitely a mountain runner. I know, but with your training today on the track.

Yeah. So even just that, that training, there, I think that would pay off on Piscay because that is more just pure running, essentially. Yeah, I mean, we saw how fast Marco was able to cruise up there in 100 degree heat and he hasn't done much trail before. That's another thing is like that I want to run like him. I mean, looks just fluid and looks easy, doesn't it? Yep.

Yeah. So that's our goal. I mean, you're closer to him than me, but that's still my goal. But I just can't. Everything we've done is just like it's a whole podcaster story in itself. It's like we could talk about the South sister forever. But yeah, so tell me, oh, just before we get too far down the road, how, okay, I know you told me you had over 200 FKTs and you mentioned something like you have 20 more.

Is that I done I hear that? Or like, what does that mean? There's, I think if you were to go to the website today, I have like 203. there's like five or so that I just haven't uploaded yet and gone in and uploaded my files and written a trip report yet. Okay. So I think once all is said and done, I'll be closer to 209. 20.

But what did you mean when you said you had 20 more? Is that like, did you say that or did I make that up? No. Yeah. Yeah. Good memory. So the highest ranked person on the site is a man and he has 227, I believe, by quantity. Gotcha. So to be number one, that's the goal. Okay.

Yeah, which isn't really like a competition in and of itself, but it's just cool. No, no, it's it. Hey, life's competition. Hey, come on. Is that guy still getting them? I think so. I believe he's European. Oh. So I don't know too much about him or the rest that he does. You just know what he got. Yeah. Well, I know you're so young. I don't even know what you're going to end up with. I mean, yeah. Yeah. Do you have a goal? You know, people ask me, Aaron, when are you to stop? When are you to be satisfied? And for me, like, I'm not assigning a specific number to it.

It's more so I'm just drawn to doing certain routes. And like, I got into running for the love of exploration. And that's exploring both natural environments and also exploring what my mind and my body can do in those environments. Yeah. And so if I'm inspired by a particular route, then. Yeah, I'm going to go after it. Go get it.

Yeah. Well, it's strange, too, because I've always said that I like to adventure more than I like to race. Like, you know, I always just say, like, I'm always just training just to be able to keep up with Courtney on an adventure. Racing is like not even on the table. But it's what I like about the adventure is it's different than a race. And it's kind of like a, I don't know. You're just appreciating nature, but that's what FKTs are, it's kind of like the in-between between racing and adventuring is both.

It's like you're still, you said if you're inspired by a route, which, you know, in a race, they don't care if you're inspired by the route. You just run the route. But like when we do these adventures, yeah, we want to care about the country, we want to learn more about it. But then also you're tying in this time aspect to it, which is fun. I love it. Yeah, absolutely.

And there's a lot of places across the states. where they can't necessarily hold sanction races, like the Grand Canyon, for example, but you still want to know, like, how fast can somebody get across that thing? Yeah, yeah. But there's like different categories, too. There's open course and closed course.

So closed course is there's a trail and you have to stay on that trail the entire time to keep it consistent. But for a lot of the mountains that I climb, like true mountaineering mountains, you're not on a trail a lot of the time where you're climbing up glaciers. So it changes over time and it's just how fast can you get from point A to the summit and back down. And which ones is that open or closed?

That would be closed. Closed. So yeah, that's where like the creativity becomes a factor because you go up there on multiple scouting missions and you're thinking about, okay, if I cut this switch back, would that make it faster and more efficient and how can I cater to? this route to play to my strengths. And then, yeah, that brings up like the whole Mikolino situation, the Grand Teton too. That's what I was going to ask you about. So it's kind of a tactic open versus closed, but then there is just shortest distance point A to point B.

What was the issue with him? Why was that a problem? Is that because he was going after the one where we're supposed to stay on the trail or what? Yeah, I think it's, that was a nuanced case. And my bone to pick is more so with FKT. I think that if they were going to go in and retroactively flag his record, they should have made it very explicit on the FKT page. Hey, if you're an athlete who wants to go after this,

you have to abide by National Park rules. You can't cut the switchbacks. You have to stay on the trail, which he was kind of stuck between a rock and a hard place. because historically a lot of the records did chop that same switchback. It was like an old climbers trail. And Killian is like chopped it and Anton. So, yeah, it puts you in the place of do I violate the national park rules to run on the same route that everybody else's run on? Or do I give myself a disadvantage and take a route that's slightly longer just to keep things copacetic with National Park Service?

Well, so who turned them in or whatever and why? What was that about? I think he kind of turned himself in with just his Strava segment. I mean, like the park rangers looked at it. Oh, I see. It was very visible where he chopped it. Oh, but the other runners had done that too, but they must not pay attention to that time or what? Or it just the Rangers?

It wasn't enforced as much. I think, yeah, for some reason, they really latched on to Michelino and wanted to blow that up. make an example out of him. I know all about that. You must say. Yeah. So I want to have Mikulino on here too because how sick is that to be president or I mean pardoned by the president over something like trail running as nuts.

That's nuts. I don't really know how that all went down. But yeah, a lot of drama in the trail running scene these days. Yeah. Yeah, but I do think FKT is experiencing growing pains and ironing out some of these finer details going forward. Because, you know, routes change over time. Even Mount Albert, for example, in Colorado, I have the women's round trip, FKT on that one. But they've recently been doing some trail work on it.

And so the old route that I took up and down it is different than the new route. So in theory, a woman could come in and run it slower than I did and claim the FKT. Oh, right. Yeah, because it's a different route. Yeah. But like just purely speaking, who's the fastest, you know, up and down the Grand Teton? It's McLean. Who's the fastest woman to run up and down Elbert?

It's me. Nice. I think especially since FKT is owned by Outside Magazine as like a corporation, they're just trying to save face, which I get. Yeah. I mean, I think Ultra is going through growing pains right now. now too. So it's like we have these grassroots things that we love just because it's our passion. And then all of a sudden it gets muddied up with, I don't know, opinions and different things. And then once it's always, people always point to this. I don't know if this is an issue,

but once money gets involved, like sponsorship athletes or like it in Ultra, you know, it's these companies are paying a lot to sponsor a race and races are charging quite a bit for these big multi-day things. So yeah, it's like anything that gets popular, there's going to be some growing pains. But I did, okay, that reminded me, could you get the Grand Teton one, do you think? Out in the mountains, there's no room for wheat gear. When I'm packing out meat in the heat or loading up for a long-range training trip, I need a cooler that holds the line every time. That's why I use grizzly coolers. These things are bearproof, rugged as hell, and keep ice locked in for days, literally.

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and teams across professional collegiate and high school sports leagues. Element is offering listeners of the podcast a free element sample pack with any purchase at www.wdrinklminti.com backslash cam. Also try new element sparkling, a bold 16 ounce can of sparkling electrolyte water. It's on my to-do list. I don't think it's going to happen this summer just because I have some other objectives on the schedule. but yeah, I climbed it once before and it's such an... Is it hard?

It's low fifth class scrambling on the standard route up it. It's nothing crazy technical, but certainly a place where if you fuck up and make one wrong step, like you're going to die and you're going to think about your death for a few seconds before. Yeah, so it's real. It's a real mountain. Yeah, yeah, that's good. It's what is the FKT, do you know? For women, it actually had a lot of action last summer.

I believe it's 345 round trip. And how many miles? I want to say like 13, 14, 7,000 feet of climbing. Ooh, yeah. That's legit, dude. And 13 miles? Wow. What do we do in the South sister?

We did five in, that's like six miles, right? 5,000 and six miles. Yeah. Oh, that's fun. Yeah, what did you think of the South Sister? But you've, I mean, you've done, how many have you done here in Oregon now on this trip? I've actually got my first FKTs in Oregon on this trip. Couple down in Southern Oregon, Thielsen, McLaughlin, yeah, just slowly chipping away at some of the volcanoes, Broken Top, South Sister.

Yeah, now with you. And now, yeah, just keep hitting the cascades, huh? Yeah. Yeah. It's awesome. Hoping to target Mount Hood and Rainier next. Oh, man. Yeah, those are legit.

I can't wait to fall along on that. That's going to be sick. But yeah, it's fun. Like, I had never done it. And I was just looking at that time that we had to go for. I'm like, oh, we got that. But then, I mean, it's not, it got a, I mean, it wasn't hurting too bad, but you definitely got a push.

have to push for sure yeah yeah it's uh it was it was fun though yeah and that's why i think you made the comment that like oh she goes pretty hot out of the game and i like to build up that cushion yeah which has bit me in the ass before because then if it's a longer effort and i go out way too hard well then i just can't sustain that and i blow up right um but for sure stuff like that mentally it's nice knowing you have a little bit of time in the bank yeah no we got to the top and we had like and more feet to gain and we had, I can't remember what it was 20 minutes or something like that. But then we had to run across the top because the true summit is on the other side of the of the mountain. So it feels like you're there, but you're not there yet. So we got a little more work,

but we still still got it by like nine minutes. It was just fun just being. I told James, I said, I just wanted to do it with you just like to see what it takes to get an FKT. because I'd never been with anybody going for one or like how fast you have to go or how hard it was or how much you cared about or like watching splits or seeing what. So I just was like, cool, this is going to be fun just to see how you do it. And I was surprised because you started Devil's Lake there at the bottom on the highway. And I didn't know how fast you're going to take off. Like I'm old. So it takes me a little bit to get going.

I don't know if I can even get going to your speed. Well, you run a way faster marathon than I can even imagine. So I was actually nervous deep down. So I'm like, man, I hope I don't disappoint. No, you were so tough. But yeah, you went off pretty, I thought pretty fast. And I was just like, God, just trying to hang on. And then we got up to the bench.

And then it's kind of sort of flat, kind of rolly over to the base of the hill of the mountain. And then it's just kind of a slog up. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That plateau area got pretty windy too. It did.

It did. It got windy. It was weird because the plateau is windy, but the summit wasn't. I mean, summit was beautiful. And I think we're the only ones up there for a little while. Yeah. Which on a Sunday, it's South Sister, that's rare. Yeah.

And initially, I had in the back of my mind that we might go for the round trip, which I'm really glad we didn't because just up there and soaking in the summit views and the blue skies with everybody all around. It was awesome. Just chilling out. Yeah. Yeah, not in a big hurry to because yeah, if you go for the round trip, you can't really appreciate how pretty it is. Yeah, just touch the summit and flip around. Yeah. All right. So we got that one, but that's cool. So tell me about this. Like this is you are, this reminds me of. Uh, true wearing his jeans like a little bit, uh, just people say, oh, it's a gimmick or this or that. It's just like, what are you talking about it? You're talking about it. And so whatever. Um, but so true. But so true. it ran marathon and jeans and then you did all the nolan's 14 in high heels right so i didn't do not the nolan's line i've done it multiple times before i've got a long history with nolins yeah um but i

so my long-term goal is to climb every 14 are in colorado in high heels and i've done 29 14ers in them thus far including part of it uh you know people always ask about rolling my ankles and i never do that. I think they've actually helped build up ankle stability and strength in a weird way. It's more so just loose scree and boulder hopping, stubbing my toes and blisters. So I will have to bandage or tape up my heels. Have you, I thought you'd have closed towed. Like you don't like that, like over open toad? I've never tried that before. I feel like most of the, close-toed heels tend to be pretty pointy. And so they just shove your toes.

For sure. Yeah, that's true. More bunions than I already have. That's true. Yeah. Yeah, the guys you like the feet pictures, I don't know if they want to, you might not be their client. Yeah. Well, I've jumped.

There's probably a market for that. Probably is. There's so many weird fuck. Nasty feet. Yeah. So tell me about these though. Like, tell me about the details of that. Yeah.

Who made those and why? I have actually never taken this specific pair out yet. This was made by one of my sponsors, Teva, and you may have heard of them as like the sandal company. And when they first reached out to me a couple years ago about becoming an athlete, I was like, you want me to run in the mountains on really technical terrain and sandals? But they're trying to grow their trail running and mountain running line of shoes. So that's part of my job as an athlete for them. They send me prototypes.

I take them out into the field, test them out, tell them what works and what doesn't work. Yeah. So, yeah, they really latched on to this project and they were excited about it. It's got the mounds on there. Yeah, because currently the pair of heels I've been wearing are just cheap heels from like Target. There's nothing on the bottom. No vibrant soul like these. Yeah, but I've climbed some of the more technical 14ers in heels, including Capital Peak,

which has like this infamous knife's edge feature where there's a few thousand feet of exposure on either side. Yeah, I'd want a little grip if I was you on that one. For sure. But yeah, these will be good. So you've, have you had any like, have you had any instances where you're like, why am I doing this? I'm going to like roll your ankle. You said your ankles are tough, but or close calls like slipping.

and you've been like, this is stupid. Have you had any like that, or has it been like successes? Not yet, thankfully. Not gone wood. Yeah, I think if I felt like it was interfering with my running in my actual athletic career, I wouldn't do it. It has to interfere. You can't be just as fast on these as you are in shoes, are you?

Well, it's not running up in these. It's more so just my rest days where I want to hike at the pace of an action. average person. Oh, so you're not getting FKTs in these. No. Right. Gotcha. Okay. Yeah. Unless there's a separate FKT category for just the heels. We got Gideon's FKT category. You could wear these in your non-binary thing, couldn't you? Yeah, that would give me the certification. Maybe Truitt needs to try the heels and the jeans.

Or maybe just really short cutoffs in these. Then James, that'd be James style right there. I like where your mind is going. Yeah, no, I don't know. But yeah, it's cool because obviously, like, I looked at your page. And so by design, but I look at your page, what I notice is a high heel post. You know what I mean? So it works.

It draws people in. Then we're like, what's this girl up to? What she's doing in the mountains with high heels? And then they can find out more about you, what you're interested in, what you stand for, what you believe in. And the high heels got them there. So I think that's cool, you know? Yeah, absolutely. It's always interesting hearing, like, people I meet on the trail who recognize me, like, where they found me from, if it was the heels or the FKTs. Yeah. What's the breakdown? Is it more heels or FKTs?

In the beginning, it was definitely the heels. As time is progressing, it's more so. Yeah. The actual athletic. Yeah. No, you're good. I love it. But yeah, so whatever it takes to get them to get them there, get them on your page, sweet. Then they can find out, hey, you're doing cool stuff and you're badass. And so the goal here in Oregon, you got a couple big ones, hood, rainier. What's like the biggest ticket item? Like, what's your biggest goal, would you say? Is it Everest?

So speaking of Everest. Or is that a secret? We can take that out too if we have to. No, I open book. So in January, I went down to South America to kick off my seven summits project. Okay. So over the next two to three years, I'm hoping to set the woman's records on each of the seven summits. For those who don't know, it's the highest peak on each of the seven continents.

And you've done a couple already? I did Akuncagua in January, so it's almost 23,000 feet tall or 7,000 meters. Yeah. It's in Argentina. Oh, nice. And then in August, I'll go to Africa and go after the Kilimanjaro speed record. How aggressive is that one? Not as aggressive as it should be, in my opinion.

There's still a lot of meat on the bone. Gotcha. You start looking at some of these records. on these higher altitude peaks, and there's a pretty wide margin between the men's and the women's times, just because I don't think as many women are competing in this space. Right. Yeah. So in some cases, it's almost double.

I think, so Kilimanjaro is about a marathon round trip with 14,000 feet of climbing. You go all the way up to almost 20,000 feet. The men's current record, my friend Tyler Andrews, who just got the Everest Oxygen record. I think he did it in like 630. round trip whereas the woman's record is closer like 1030. Oh, okay, yeah.

Yeah. So you're at least eight hours probably. I mean, maybe faster, but quite a bit faster than the existing then. So that's a good one. Yeah, I mean, you said you're doing that. Was that July or August? That'll be August. August, yeah.

And you said, I should go. That would be super fun. But yeah. So that's on, and what is that? continent that's Africa right and then our what's Argentina what continent is that South America yeah and then so tell me the other peaks and so is Denali here right yep that's the highest peak in North America it's 20,000 feet and it's a hard one not necessarily because of the elevation like 20,000 feet is

pretty reasonable compared to climbing Everest 29,000 feet without oxygen but just the elements on Denali are real you know you have to haul your own sled up to base camp at like 14,000 feet from where you get dropped off at 7,000 feet, I believe. And so I'll probably do that, scout the mountain, and then you have to come all the way back down to 7,000 feet. And that's where the record starts. Oh, really? Yeah. Okay. Okay, then, so that's, then what else? Tell me the other ones. So we got Danali, Akinkagua in Antarctica. It's Mount Vinson. And the crux of that one is definitely the financials. Oh yeah. Yeah, just the logistics of getting down there. It's it'll be like

$50,000 minimum for me and then we're talking you know I want to have a camera person or a film crew out there. It's at least double. Yeah. And then so yeah, Kilimanjaro, Asia is obviously Everest for Australia and the Indonesian continent. It's one called Carston's Pyramid. And it's like 16,000 feet. I think the hardest part of that one is navigating the local geopolitical situation. Right. A little unstable or what? Yeah.

I mean, there's like a lot of local tribes down there. And they want, you know, the money to go to them directly. Understandably so. So I think they're bit hesitant with foreign companies, you know, coming in bringing clients on that peak. I got you. So it's more so just getting access and being allowed to find the peak. Got to convince them that's a good idea. Yeah. To let you do it. Yeah. Was that seven? Was that all of them? The only one I didn't mention was Elbris. And again, like Russia.

Oh, I didn't even know where the hell that was. Yeah. Russia. How high is it? Oh, gosh. I forget. I think it's 16,000 feet. Okay. Okay. Is that a hard one to get to also because of the, yeah, situation? Yeah. So with a lot of these, it's not even necessarily like the physical abilities that are the biggest challenge. Yeah. I think on some of these, too, it's like for the women, they just can't go by themselves and do it. You know, like a guy conceivably could, but like you wouldn't, you wouldn't want to put a woman in that situation. So it's like that may, that's a barrier of entry because some of those places are a little wild. I mean, a little, you know, whatever.

Yeah. For Akinkagua, I was able to. able to go down there entirely solo and do that one. But I was working with an expedition company who had also worked with previous record holders on that one. So they kind of understood, you know, what my intentions were, what I wanted to do, how to structure it. Yeah. That's handy. Do you start say something? Yeah, Elbrose says 185. 18. 18. Thanks. Fax check. Yeah, that's how, but But okay, so then think about this, how sick is it that you get to travel the world and do cool shit? Yeah. And there's not one day where I take it for granted.

Like, I always knew that I wanted to travel in my future, but I never knew how that would come to fruition. Yeah. Like, growing up, like, we go on a family vacation, you know, once or twice a year, typically to the beach. And, like, that was something you looked forward to. But now it's like, this is a part of my job. Like, how fucking cool is that? I get it into a job. Yeah.

That's, and this is like a job probably like you created this job, right? I mean, how many other paid female FKT runners are there or climbers or mountaineers are there besides you? There's probably not many. Yeah, I mean, there's a number of climbers and mountaineers, but I like to, you know, occupy the space kind of in between running and mountaineering. Yeah. I think as we progress, the world of like speed

mountaineering is only going to grow. But I mean, off the top of my head, there aren't a lot of other people, especially women who are making, you know, full-time living off of what I'm doing. You know, most of them also do racing and ultramarathons and- Yeah, for sure.

And how did this come to be? I mean, you said you wanted to travel. When did you figure out you could make money doing it? And it could be a job. I didn't know that it was gonna work out initially. And that was, that was, was the gamble where I had to roll the dice. You know, I went for the majority of my life, I was very studious, focused on academics, like get into an Ivy League school. I did that. And then I was

there. It was like little fish, big ponds. I had to find some other way to differentiate myself. But yeah, I mean, the first couple years, you know, where I was intending on going to law school, It was a grind and a hustle. And I was, like, living in the back of my car. You know, I did the whole car camping thing. And I just drive and camp at the trailhead and run mountains every single day, like a true dirt bag, you know, only scraping. And, you know, a few thousand dollars a year. I picked up a part-time job at a local running shop.

Shout out BP Runco. And in Gold. Yeah. It's local run shop. Very community-oriented. That's where I learned a lot about trail running. But, yeah, it was only after I did a rim to rim to rim to rim to rim of the Grand Canyon in Arizona. It was just shy of 100 miles, and I tagged the brand of the shoes that I was wearing in a post, and they later reached out.

And was like, how would you consider joining our athlete team? And I think that was solidification, like, okay, I do have what it takes to. make a future in this sport. One of the hardest parts of hunting is glassing big country to find animals you know are there. That's why I run Sig Sauer Zulu imaging stabilizing binoculars when I'm covering a lot of ground and need to see everything. These binos are a complete game changer. After long climbs, when your heart rates up and your hands aren't steady, shaky glass makes it hard to stay locked in. With image stabilization, everything settles down.

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coffee or an energy drink, and that's just how I've always operated. But since Mountain Ops sent me their new big sticks, I found myself reaching for something between meals a lot more. I started throwing a couple in my truck to have after a long run at Piska or Spencers, and I'll be honest, they actually taste pretty good, which isn't something I usually say about meat sticks. They're made with whole muscle beef and pork. So the texture and flavor feel like real food, not something overly processed. Each stick has 20 grams of protein and it's a big one at 2.2 ounces. So when you've been putting in miles, climbing and grinding all day, it actually gives you something back. It's not just a quick bite. It's real fuel that holds you over and helps you recover. I still eat the same way I always have

and nothing is replacing that. But when I need something quick that still lines up with how I live and train. This is what I reach for. Mountain Ops, big stick. Get 20% off today using code cam at mountainops.com. I could imagine like, because I think about my kids, I don't know what your parents are like, but when the goal was to be a lawyer, and then instead you're living in your car,

as we call it dirt bag, and just running mountains, how was that, was that accepted? Was everybody like, yeah, that sounds like a great idea? Or what was it? Yeah, no, I'm fortunate to have very supportive parents. That being said, I do think there was some hesitation initially. You know, just always being asked like, hey, Aaron, are you thinking about law school eventually?

Like, I was studying for the LSATs going. But, yeah. Would you just lie for a while and just say, good, yeah. I'm excited. Yep. But no, my parents are super proud of me and what I do now. And yeah, it's truly a dream. So you said you wanted to be a lawyer or law school.

What was your major, just like your bachelor's? I studied government and got a minor in anthropology. Oh, nice. Anthropology. I like that class too. That was like, it seemed like I liked it. I don't know. I was never that smart, but.

Yeah, I was taking a bunch of anthropology classes for some of my elective credits and found that I actually loved those classes and enjoyed them way more than my government classes. Right. It was kind of a happy accident. So the government, how come government? What was the interest there? Just going to law school.

It was a very, you know, linear path. It made sense to study government and political science before going in that direction. And then did you want to be like a lawyer in D.C. or something? What was your, what was the, like if you had a vision, what was that? I didn't have a particular location picked out, but I wasn't opposed to the city life, which like reflecting back on now, I was crazy. I would go nuts in a big city. Yeah, but I was interested in like environmental law, animal welfare, that kind of stuff.

And I always wanted to make a difference in the world and give back. you know, that can get very crippling over the time, over time with, you know, you just feel like you have the weight of the world on your shoulders. And so, so many people need help. Yeah. You know, it's like, so if you're like, if I want to help people, it's overwhelming. It's just like there's, there's not enough of you to help everyone. So I get that, yeah. Yeah. And I think, you know, I was younger. I was bright-eyed and bushy-tailed, but eventually you get to the the point where you realize you have to help yourself first and you have to be in a good mental headspace first before you can help others. And so for me, you know, hiking, running, being alone

in the mountains, that was my own time to recharge. And so initially I think it came from more just like internal kind of selfish reasons. But I don't think that way anymore. And I've now realized by being immersed in this world that you can make a different. through running. So how are you impacting others who running now? I hope I'm inspiring others to rethink what life has to look like. Yeah. I think we're prescribed this very linear path, you know, go to college, get a good job,

climb the ladder, you know, white picket fence, kids, all that. we're blessed to have free will and might as well take advantage of that like it's a big wide world out there there's so much to see and do like push that comfort zone and like and inspire others to do the same is kind of what you're saying yeah yeah give back yeah it's uh and i i know i can understand that because if my goal was to be a bow hunter sponsored bow hunter people would be like and it was people was like what that's not a thing so wasn't a thing now it's a thing you know so and and i get your point to where now i hope other young guys watched my trajectory and like oh okay well maybe i could do something similar so for for young women seeing you out there and it's just like your attitude your smile um having fun out there it to me it feels like it gives permission to young women to be like i don't have to like just follow the you know stay in the path everybody takes or path of least resistance or just like whatever's the expect live up to expectations. The status quo. Yeah, you can just be like, you know what? Maybe I'm just going to do

something that strikes me and moves me and see if it maybe moves others. That's what it feels like to me. And you're like made for it because it's like your face and your smile and your big bright eyes. It's like people like see you and they're like, I want to find out more about her. You know what I mean, you got this inviting thing. So I think you can definitely impact young women out there. And it's incredible. I love seeing it. And then also, I love seeing what a beast you are because, yeah, it's like you could, that's what I always say about, I have these, these older girls on here, and they will trick you. And you will trick people because not like maliciously, but guys are always about this ego. I'm going to beat you. No, you're not. I'm going to kick your ass. No,

but girls are always like so sweet and cool and then you get them in the mountains and they crush you but they're acting nice guys guys will like they want them they want you to they want you to know that they're better than you but it's like like i talk about with corny or cat or sally or you and it's just like it's like so deceiving because you're so nice but then so tough you know it's just like it's I just love it it's my favorite part of it so you're doing great yeah well I can I'm like don't get me wrong I'm very competitive like with FKTs if there's a time that I want to be like I'm going into it like wanting yeah to like kick the the prior record holder's ass yeah well and I yeah I do think there is like this expectation within endurance sport that you know women have to be

you know, very, very kind and put on a pretty face. Yeah. I don't know if that's like if the, you mentioned a list of women, like if that just comes from like societal and cultural norms that are imposed. Like, yeah, we've just learned that behavior over time. Killed a, sorry. But yeah. Murdered spider.

Let's bring some more trash talking into trouble. I know. Well, I remember there what, God, I think that Sabrina St. I think somebody like maybe it was like last year or year before but I thought they were saying she How maybe he was the only fans thing now I can't remember what it was but it's not very often that That women are outside of like that expectation thing you know what I mean like I would love if I love Confidence you know and normally is the guys barely have permission to be cocky you know it's like you They guys still get judged for talking shit

But women never do it. I would love to see it. So let's hear it. Who are you going to talk? Like, let's talk shit on somebody. Who do we hate? No. Let me think.

Oh, while we think of that. So you talked about animal welfare, talking about all the stuff, helping animals. And then you're here with me. Cam Haynes himself. That is. That I can't believe you're sitting here across from me. That's disgusting. Now, so what, did you have reservations about coming?

I'm a big bow hunter. You love animals. Now you know I love animals too, probably. It's just we come from different directions, but we love the same thing. Animals mountains, right? So tell me about how this, if you had reservations or how this came to be. Yeah. In all honesty, I definitely had my hesitations coming here.

and meeting you. Like, if you had told me, you know, a few years ago that I'd be sitting here, I would have not believed you. I mean, I was literally like a card-carry member of like the animal rights and the vegan clubs at my college. But, you know, like I was mentioning to you, it's just this world and the society that we live in are way too polarized. And it doesn't leave a lot of room for productive conversation. Like would it have been much easier for me to go on a podcast like ritual for example where I know he's plant Absolutely, but like coming here. I'm hoping to like challenge other people's way of thinking and vice versa Like you've also given me a brief glimpse into your life and it's you know open my mind did

Yeah open my mind way more than it was. Yeah, it's it's I don't know what it is but I don't feel and I'm not trying I don't want to be the more tribalism stuff but I don't see a lot of hunters or maybe just hunters I'm around but like talk shit to about vegans I don't I'm sure there are some I'm sure I have before but it's just I think it's just great that because I think what you said like initially I think Chris kind of got the connection going but then you said something like you're a vegan and you know whatever and is that it's a lot different lifestyle than what what I lead is what I think what the message was and I think I just said like you're a badass and I don't give a fuck what you eat it's like I just want to talk and find out more about you because I don't care I just want to I just want to learn about different

types of people and and that's it I mean I just want to learn what motivates you and what makes you special and I don't care where people come from or what their upbringing was or even what they believe in at this time. I do care about what you believe in at this time, but it doesn't affect anything. I just want to, I think we can learn and grow from anybody. Yeah. And I learn and grow, to be honest, from people unlike me. If everybody I hung around was just like me, that would suck. That would be boring.

I want to be around different people. It's what it keeps me hungry to learn and hungry. It's like energized. And it's like I love being around the complete opposite of me. And so I'm thankful you're here. I'm not saying you're complete opposite of me, but I just love different people. No, I'm thankful to be here.

And I really admire that characteristic of you. You know, like you're just curious. You can tell you're a curious person. And you want to push yourself, challenge yourself, and grow. Yeah, because I've even seen like on some of your posts of us, there are people, you know, it's just kind of the way it goes. It's, yeah. But you're writing, and I think Chris wrote some really good stuff too.

It's like we have to get, I don't know if we need to give people permission to not be dickheads, but to be like, hey, no, we're, yes, we are different and it's okay. We don't have to make this line in the stand or sand and plant this flag and say, yeah, you're not welcome here. And so your writings, Chris's comments and writings, and hopefully my approach gives people permission to be like, yeah, it's okay. Yeah. Well, and if you actually meet a person and dig a little deeper, you find that there's a lot more in common than there is different. And that's something I try and keep in mind and remind my. myself is that like everybody thinks that they're making the right decisions. Like I like to believe, you know, most people are good-hearted and, but we all come from

different backgrounds and experiences and those guide our paths and the decisions that we make. Yeah. You know, everybody just, you know, cares for their family and wants to do good for their neighbors. And yeah, we all have different worldviews. Yeah. And sometimes they clash. For sure. But if we don't have these conversations, nothing's ever.

going to be done about it. Yeah, you remind me a little bit of Harvey Lewis. He's like a backyard ultra runner. He's just a stud. But he's vegan also. And he just people were, he wanted me to come. He's invited me to come to the mid-state smile, which is in Tennessee. It's like you do a mile every 20 minutes. It's the last man standing, just a different format. And he's just like, want to send me a few messages and we're completely opposite of each other. You know, he's Ohio, vegan. I'm out here in the West. I hunt. And he's just like, Like, you know, people made a comment like negative about me to him. He just said, I think we'd have a lot to talk about.

I think this world needs to do more talking. And so that's the attitude. It seems so obvious. And people should know that that's what it would take to make this world work at its best. But sometimes you've got to say it too. And like he was challenged with that from somebody. And he said, no, conversation is the key to everything to working all this stuff out. So I appreciate that you are so willing and open to do it.

And I mean, shooting a bow, you're good. I mean, you were good at shooting a bow. And so it says Chris also. But I just love like, what I always say is I want people to leave here with a story. And so I hope we've done a lot of stuff you hadn't done before. And, you know, you just have good stories to share with everybody once you leave here. Yeah. No, Chris was asking me last night if I had a good day.

And I'm like, I had a great day. I feel like I've lived multiple lives. And one day, I was challenged with the archery. I was challenged on PISCA with you. PISCA, yeah. When you sandbag us all and told us, you were to take it easy on a hundred degree day and then thanked us all. What did you think of the finisher?

I always call that, where you run down and run up that other hill on the other side. That always hurts. That's brutal. But it's, I just love stuff like that. And I love what I love. So I always take off. And I don't know if what if this is just me.

I always take off. And there's a thought that you're going to drop everybody. But I love when I hear people because we're like, okay, I guess they're sending it too. And it's this fun. It's just cool. It's cool to send it on mountains. But if you're the only one doing it, it's not that fun. But everybody was was into it yesterday.

Hot as hell. We pushed to get up to the summit. Marco crushed, what did he get, 13 something? 13 and change. Yeah. And then still, everybody wanted to sprint up and do my finisher to the swing heel. So I was like, dude, I'm in heaven. I'm in heaven watching new people shoot bows, hang out, do my sauna in my cold tub,

eat some bear pepperoni you didn't, but we're still working on that. I just love sharing my life with people. And I love seeing people appreciate it, like really like, You know, even though it's not something you've never done, you're so into it. And it's just, man, it's that energizes me. So I can this is like, I always say, you know, you say, well, thanks for this. Thanks for doing this. Thanks for sharing this.

As I said before, this is all for me. So this is all me and I'm selfishly doing this. And if you enjoyed it, then I don't even care, but that's great. Yeah. No, I appreciate being here and it's very evident how, how much you care about giving back. And, you know, it's like, it's so easy to get caught up on social media with all the comments and everything.

Oh, yeah. No, it's, yeah, the giving part, it's like, I think that's what we're supposed to do. I just think that's how the world, I think that's how communities are supposed to work. There's always going to be people who got, have more than others. There's going to be people that struggle more than others. I think if we like I always say I have more than I deserve I think that it's my obligation to share and I and it feels good it's not even an obligation I want to just like I want to have you here to so but it's for me giving to others is for me also I just I'd love sharing you know I've had some lucky

breaks some people don't have lucky breaks in life and I want to share my lucky breaks with others And I just think that's how we're, that's how humans, that's a human condition, I think. That's how we're designed to, to live. But maybe not. Yeah. No, we're pretty lucky to be where we're at now. So we might as well make the most of it. I think so.

Yeah. I think so. So is Mount Hood next on the list then if we get the, did the winds lay down? So we work with a high altitude meteorologists in a lot of our projects. Yeah. And he's awesome. And he's saying that end of the week, so like Thursday, Friday, Saturday, the winds are supposed to die down.

So likely do one summit in advance as a scouting mission. Yeah. Conditions are like. Is that usually the play is one to scout, make a plan, and then hit it? For bigger objectives, especially like hood, depending on the conditions that it's in and it can have like some rock fall and ice fall, more consequential terrain. I'd like to scout that in advance. There are a handful that I've just on-sided and just run out the gate first time.

Yeah. And I asked you yesterday, have you ever not got, or like, how often do you not get them? But it sounds like you almost always get them. It's a seldom occurrence, but it has happened, which is, you know, forced me to put my ego in check. You mentioned Nolan's earlier. And that's such an iconic. For those who don't know, it's about 100 miles. It traverses 1414ers across the Sawwatch Range in Colorado.

So you start near Salaida on Mount Chavano, and then you end near Leadville on Mount Massive. Oh, man. And it's not a traditional trail or race course. A lot of it is off trail, like backcountry navigation, very steep climbs. And that one I've attempted a few times to get the women's record on. it and when you have an objective of that scale it's like a puzzle and there's so many pieces that have to fit together perfectly in order for it to happen yeah on that day or over the course of two days in the case of nolens and so yeah i haven't been able to dial down nutrition and just body

mind weather like everything has to come together so that makes sense is how close have you got to it i've gotten almost to the halfway mark and at that point it It was a really tough decision to drop because I was well ahead of the women's record at that point, but I just wasn't feeling properly starting to bong and I knew it wasn't going to be sustainable until the finish. Yeah. Yeah. So you're on pace, but still got some work to do.

Well, that's the thing. Like I have such high expectations for myself to you. Like I know what time I'm capable of on a course like that. The current women's record is between 45 and 46 hours and I like to get it close to to the 40, 41, 42 hour mark. And you were on pace that time, that last time. Yeah. It'll happen.

Just takes the perfect, yeah, perfect storm, basically. But yeah, that's a good one. I didn't know it was almost 100 miles. So how much climb? 40,000 feet of climbing. Dude, that's legit. That'd be a sick one to get, though. Somebody said something, like I saw a comment.

It's probably just some retarded comment. but ask her about the Colabera or something like that. What's that about? So there's a peak in Colorado. It's called Culebra. Oh, that's a 14er. It's the southernmost 14er in Colorado. And so a couple years ago, I was going after the woman's self-supported speed record

for all the Colorado 14ers. So how fast can I climb them in one consecutive push? No outside of a system. assistance and entirely by myself. And I made the decision to intentionally omit Culebra from the record. Oh. So there's a handful like of peaks. At the time, it was four peaks that were on private property in Colorado. And most of them like about Lindsay, the Ticalabron Loop, if you're familiar with that one, the landowners want people to be able to access recerees,

fish on their lands, but they don't want the liability if somebody gets hurt. Because there's been like a case before in Colorado Springs where mountain biker was injured on, I think it was like the Air Force property. He broke his leg, sued the landowners and won like $7 million. So that's at the precedent. All the landowners, you know, we're understandably scared. Like if somebody gets hurt hiking our peak, we don't want to be sued for $7 million. Calabra is kind of an exception in that it's owned by an oil billionaire from Texas who probably spent very little time on the actual land and they charge people to hike it. Oh. That peak or any of the surrounding 13ers. They don't really need the money. They make a lot of

their money from hunting and this land has had a lot of history. It was originally given to like Spanish and Mexican homesteaders who had access to all the hunting and the resources on the land. And this landowner, he's tried to build a fence around it. So in recent years, there's been lots of articles and uproar surrounding it. Because, you know, they were the ones who were originally given access to those resources. And he's trying to inhibit that so he can make a profit off of guided hunting operations. Yeah. So yeah, I wanted, because I think when it comes to FKTs, the crux should be, you know, the mind and the body. What can they do? It shouldn't be the gatekeeping. Can you get access to this peak? And a lot of like other record holders who have pursued this record,

they have a personal relationship with like the guy who manages the property. And so whereas normally if you do pay, you have to show up at the gate 6 a.m. Sharp, no exceptions. They've been able to like bend the rules for the right, which I don't think is right if you're trying to have that even playing field for sport. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Now that makes sense to me. Yeah. Is that in the San de Christos? It is. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. So pretty close to the New Mexico border. Yeah. I hate to say it. That might be where I hunt. Do you know Carlos? No. Okay. So good. I'm glad. Is that the landowner?

Yeah. Well, I believe the landowner is William Harrison. Carlos is just the guy who manages the property. Oh, good. Well, I'm glad I don't know either of them. So. I'm not, I'm not contributing to that mess. But I do, I hunt, I've hunted in Santa Christos. And, but there's, there's a few landowners that own, like, big sections of that range. So, um, I hunt on Bobby Hills property, which that's not who you're talking about. But, uh, I know like, yeah, that's, that's a coveted area. It's like for sheep hunting, for sure.

I mean, because I think there's sheep up there on that peak. and people get serious about sheep. And also, Texas oil guys, you know what they're serious about? Money. There you go. So it's just, yeah, I get that. Well, that makes sense because I do agree with the FKT where you want it accessible to whoever. Go do it.

It shouldn't have to be the money, you know, hindrance for money that like, oh, this guy could have got it and he's, you know, an amazing shape, but just didn't have the money. So, yeah, I like that. Yeah. And it took a lot of back and forth with FKT, but eventually they did go in and create a separate category of anybody who wants to go after this record in the future. It only includes the public lands. Yeah, that's good. Well, good job. So you, that was because of you? That was because of me.

Awesome. I love it. Well, I'm glad I asked now. Oh, I was going to ask you before we forget. I mean, I don't know how long we've been talking, but tell me about your sponsors. Because I think that that's, it's sick to, to. you basically created a category you're a female fkT athlete crushing it out there very marketable put out a great product like inspire people as we talked about so who helps this happen like how

what sponsors saw something in you believed in you and now they're helping facilitate this yeah so as i mentioned teva uh with the heels they've been incredible um and And they've created what's called the Bureau of Adventure. So they're kind of trying to maneuver away from our athletes only race and compete. Like they're really, they also have kayakers and, you know, athletes from all different backgrounds and part of their team and really trying to emphasize the adventure element, which I think it makes it a lot more relatable to widespread audiences as well. Adventure cells.

Yeah. Yeah. And it's like if the prototypes work for me in really rugged backcountry terrain, that also speaks for how it's going to work to the average consumer. And like, for example, I brought a pair of their prototypes. It's kind of a trail runner, a hybrid with a more traditional mountaineering boot up to the summit of Akuncagua. And that's what I set the record in. So I brought a pair of their prototypes all the way up to 23,000 feet. So how cool is that?

That is. Yeah, they probably love that. That's the type of testing they need. Yeah, because you know, it's going to hold up there or hold up anywhere. Is that your only sponsor or do you have others? I also work with a brand called Now Foods. They make supplements. And then nomatics, they make like ultralight, travel towels, and then Khoros.

So I've recorded all my FKTs as far on the KOROS watch. And so it was a natural fit. Gotcha. Yeah, that's a key piece to what you do. But yeah, I see a lot more sponsorship categories available for you out there. So I think you're going to get more and more. Yeah, it's awesome. I'm glad that they're helping. I'm glad you're able to create a career for yourself and just like out there crushing it.

And I'm glad Chris sent me a message about you. Gideon has some retarded questions. I can't wait. We'll cut all these out. I've heard the lore. We don't even, I mean, we're not even recording. We were just making him, it feel like he's actually playing part of this. If you've heard the lore, then you know what's coming for this first question.

Oh, no. Which is a fuck Mary kill, if you've ever played that. Yeah. So the rules are one is a one night stand, like you only get to do it one more time. One is you get to do it for the rest of your life. That's Mary. And then one you have to get rid of. And your three categories are FK.

hiking with heels and traveling. Ooh, that's a tough one, dude. One forever, one wants, one never. I'm going to say traveling forever. I hope to be doing that, even when I'm old and can't run as fast, probably kill the heels and fuck FKTs. Yeah, there we go. Marrying an adventure.

Yeah. Okay, I like it. Yeah, you can give up the heels. That's fine. Except that was your ticket to stardom. This is what launched you. I knew how to get in there. But they're fun.

Like it removes some of the seriousness of professional athletics. And normally, you've been around me. I'm wearing like running clothes most of the time. So it is fun to be able to get dressed up and embrace that more feminine. side of me. I know. You've had dresses on up there, right? Yeah. Oh, I do the whole thing. Yeah. That's sick. I just, that's just being creative and being unique. Yeah. That's what we need. I love it. It gets a lot of pushback from mostly an older male audience, you know, saying,

I'm just seeking attention or it's reckless. And I think that's actually what has transformed it into more of a long-term project versus just kind of started out as a joke. Yeah. Hey, I'm going to show it is possible to do them all on high heels. And I'm also going to be like a badass athlete and chase records on the same mountains too. So what do you want to tell those like cranky old white dipshit? Get off your couch. Get off your keyboard. Yeah.

Yeah. Get your, yeah, thumb out of your ass and go do something. Go touch some grass. Yeah, don't worry about me. It's a big world out there. Yeah. Yeah. Everybody's got an opinion, right?

Yeah. I love it. As you know. Yes, of course. And we, we love them. We appreciate all opinions. Yeah, it's all love. It's all love.

This is shit talker's weekly vibe, too. I'm just curious about when you're pushing hard and you're in the pain cave, for lack of better words, where do you go in your mind? I think for me it almost becomes a state of meditation. I'm asked, Aaron, what do you think about when you're out there on trail or pursuing FKTs? And most of the time, it's not these very profound thoughts. It's just in the zone, focusing on my breathing, one step in front of the other. Yeah, that's a good one. I liked the other day, I like seeing passing people and like everybody's out there doing the same stuff, saying hi.

You know, oh, good to see. It's just like everybody's in a good mood up there. It's just like, that's, I don't know, it's so appealing, so fun. Nobody's ever being a dick on the mountain usually. Yeah. Unless you're hiking the 14ers and heels in Colorado. Really? Were they judging you on that? Some people? In person, most of the time, people are like, that's badass. That's awesome.

But I've had some like cranky old men saying, I shouldn't be up there. Like a lot of time people just seem at the trailhead and they don't think I'm actually climbing the peak. They think I'm there to take some pretty photos. I'm like, no, I'm going to the summit. See up there. Try to keep up. That's what you need to tell them. You know any more? Yeah. You said earlier, you know, you hope to inspire people to look at different options, different lifestyles.

What do you think that lifestyle is? What would be your ideal lifestyle for people to go and chase instead of this white picket fence thing? We're kind of fed. You know, I think everybody's different. I don't think there's one universal answer. Like for some people, it is the white picket fence and the children and that's what brings them fulfillment.

I just wish that we were presented with more opportunities earlier. It's like, you know, doctor, lawyer, nobody ever says bow hunter. Nobody ever says, you know, going out and running on trails and getting dirty in the mountains. Like, you're not taught that that is a viable career path. Yeah, that's true. It's this, you know, for all the ills social media has, it is pretty powerful that you can like make your own career. You know, I mean, I don't want to say influencer, but we sort of are. But there's influencers, you know, the gamut that it ranges is, you know, whatever.

It's like, I don't know, there's unlimited opportunity. But turning something you love, a passion into a moneymaking endeavor, that's real. That can happen. And that all that is is, as I said, make people care about what you're doing, attention his currency. So that it's like those two things. I don't care what you are. And that that's the whole premise to Rogan's podcast is he just would find people that interested him that he thought, that is weird. That's or that's cool or that's unique or that's never thought of that. I want to talk to them. I'm going to learn more about it. That's why I was on there. Some weird bow hunter out here

carrying rocks up the mountains. And he's like, you know, I want. So that was and to give people permission to be like, I think your point is we're not taught that, but your example is showing that you can do this. I'm giving you permission because I did it. Here's how I did it. Here's what I do. Find what moves you and make it a job. Absolutely. Yeah.

And that being said, I do recognize it comes from a place of privilege. Like, you know, when I was just starting out, you know, barely grinding by, like my parents helped me out. my family help me out and not everybody has the the freedom to do that but i hope that people get the message that you know if you're working a job you hate or just like not happy in life it doesn't have to be that way like you can make those microchanges and get closer to where you want to be like don't feel like you're ever stuck in that situation right yeah it's a there's a big world out there so much potential and the world is more accessible than it's ever been because of social media. So we can build these brands or build a following, which then in turn leads to a brand.

I mean, you could have a whole merchandise line. I know that. I can just see, I see a picture. Maybe you do have a merchandise line, but I see a picture of you up on top of a mountain with high heels like an image. And, you know, that's a T-shirt for people that are into you and want to support you. And there'd be a lot of people that would like that. Yeah. And there'd be a lot of women that would be like, man, she's my whatever, like my inspiration to chase my own dreams. And so I think that, you know, your story is powerful one, powerful, definitely for women, but for anybody because instead of taking the path as a lawyer, the, the very predictable life, you'd mention a few things along there, you did something completely different. And so that can give other people,

like that had the Ivy League dreams and the lawyer dreams to be like, maybe that's not, maybe it's okay to have another dream, a different dream. And because people always like, well, how much do lawyers make? And you're always like kind of tricked into this thing about it's money, it's status, it's materialism, it's accumulation of shit we don't even need. And you're giving them permission to be like, hey, make money being a dirtbag mountain climber. Yeah. Crush FKT.

So I think it's amazing. What else you got, bro? I got the opportunity for you to talk a little shit while I try to build my army. Is a 50K a real ultra? Ooh. I see what you're doing. Hot take. Oh.

Okay. 50Ks have gotten really fucking fast. And the elites competing at those are so talented beyond like, what I could even imagine right now. But if you are getting into Ultra for the experience, you know, to experience all the emotions, the happiness, the pain, the suffering, I don't know if you can squeeze that out of a 50K. He can because he takes, he DNFs all the time.

DENF King. It depends on how long you take. So you said the fast people that are done in three hours, yeah, they're not getting that whole pain cave stuff probably but james takes seven hours that's the hardest thing you ever did you know like how you're kind of the queen of fk t's i'm the what's the the cuck of dfs the cuck of dfs that's your new hey we got a merch line for you too the dnf cuck and it'll be a cellar to you with your butt plug in my parents are going to listen to this podcast

What did you get ripped in? Oh, no. Are they going to listen? We better cut that out. No, no, please keep it in. Really? Sorry Aaron's mom and dad. That was, I was, we were out of line.

We apologize. Last question is kind of a two-parter, but why FKT is over races and is there any future prospects for racing? for the second question definitely yeah i never say never to anything and i do have a list of like bucket list races like hard rock for example yeah like the san juans are hands down my favorite mountains in in colorado um just unbelievably gorgeous and that that race is very um in line with like where my strengths are as a runner altitude lots of climbing um but Yeah, for the time being, I mentioned the Seven Summets project. That is my focus. And I just love, like, the self-sustainability element of it. So, like, with FKTs, you can be supported, unsupported,

self-supported. And I like that feeling of being totally reliant on myself. You know, if I get myself into the Grand Canyon, I'm in charge of getting myself out. I have to bring all my food and water. I can't rely on aid station. Yeah Racers are too soft Was that Did she what was the first question? I can't remember

She answered it was just Y FKTs Oh Y FKTs Yeah Yeah Oh Barclay Yeah I know Yeah Chris Chris attempted Barkley too

That's a whole other animal That's legit Well what I What I mean If you do that seven The peaks and seven continents all that and you get the FKTs, I'm like, I want to see you on fucking Time Magazine or something. I mean, that is incredible.

That's an accomplishment that needs to be celebrated. And if Time Magazine doesn't put you on, we'll put you on Keep Hammering Collective after you do that. There you go. Keep hammering, Time Magazine. Yeah, it's about the same. Are you guys making a documentary about that? Um, you know, it really just depends on how much funding for media. we can get like Akkenkagua. I did that entirely by myself. I could get some, you know,

iPhone photos and footage, but when I'm there, my focus, my one goal is getting the record on the mountain and doing the best I can. But it would, I think it would make for a great film or documentary in the future. Dude, that's like a Netflix thing. I mean, you have what it takes. I mean, you got to be marketable. You are. You got to be a beast. You are. It's a, it's a, it's a, it's a, a once in a lifetime adventure makes awesome cinema. Fucking easy to sell, dude. I mean, that should be an easy sell.

Going to go to some pretty incredible places, experience the cultures. I mean, I asked for a reason. I know, I know. Because I've had this whole, like,

I'm supposed to have this call with Netflix and it's like, I want to do a series on outliers. You know what I mean? Because it's like, that's my, all I care about is hanging out with fucking cool people

that do amazing shit. So it's like, let's just have a show on it. And so we just, I don't know if this experience here was like to the level for Netflix, but similar to this and just filming, that's an episode. And I know it would work, but yeah. I can see it. Yeah, I'd be sick.

But anyway, point is your, this goal is, that's an easy sell. I mean, especially nowadays, it's, you know, documentaries are so popular. And then there's not a ton of them. They're women focused. So I just think it's, it's so easy. So easy to.

Yeah. Yeah. And it connects to what we were talking about earlier, about inspiring the other. Yeah. Like when, before I identified as an athlete, you know, I'd watch like Free Solo with Alex Honnold. And it gets you to start thinking differently about the way you see the world

and what our abilities are in the world. Yeah. And I think that even part of the story is that you, that path, I talked about it already, but the path of you were going to be a lawyer and then, you know, that you veered off that. So we talked about giving people permission. I mean, it's just that story has to be told. If you can't fucking sell that thing, we'll do it. God dang.

And I have to shoot a bow. Yeah. At the top of each peak. That would be sick. Could you imagine? I mean, that's like your pose on each, on each. mountain but on top of Everest sorry China this is like I am more I love thinking about I love thinking about stuff like this yeah because it's just like this is what people need to see

there's so much shit on TV this is real and this is you know can change people's lives so was that all you had all right well man I've had the best time it's been so fun uh yeah We've been, we've made it a week. We've had Marco here too and you guys here. And we're just like, I don't even, I don't even know what day it is, but I'm like, we'll make a whole week of this shit. Yeah, but we've crammed a lot into not a lot of time. I know.

I've had so much fun with you guys and super thankful. And I'm very, I'm very grateful that to be able to share South Sister with you. And, you know, we were kind of deciding what we're going to do. Like, we don't do big mountains with everybody. Sometimes we just do Piscay. I've done Diamond with a few people. but I'm so glad that it ended up because we're considering diamond or something else. And then I saw you're doing these other peaks.

And then somehow I think Taylor told me that the permit was still open till the 15th where you didn't need a permit to do South Sister. And I was just like, well, fuck, let's do that. Yeah, it was perfect. Let's send that. And it was, I'm just. And then to see you at the bow rack and doing so well and even sharing that experience with Marco and Chris too, was everybody shot good.

Wayne just loves teaching people. And it's just, yeah, I mean, I just love sharing my life. So I'm very, very thankful for you. Thanks for coming. Thanks for being so willing to do everything. And yeah. Yeah, well, it's amazing what you've built here. And yeah, giving back to athletes.

And yeah, I can't thank you enough for having us here. You're the best. Thanks. Well, I appreciate you. All right, guys, keep hammering. That's it.