Cameron Hanes - Keep Hammering Collective - KHC 206 - Sh*t Talkers Weekly 32 with the Bow Disciples

Episode Date: August 3, 2026

We’re back with a new Sh*t Talkers Weekly episode! This week we’re joined by James Visser and Brianna Curley from The Bow Disciples to talk archery and hunting hot takes! The Bow Disciples is a community of dedicated bowhunters and outdoorsmen united by a passion for the hunt, conservation, and living the bowhunting lifestyle. Through authentic storytelling, education, and adventure, they inspire hunters to sharpen their skills, respect the traditions of the sport, and pursue every hunt with purpose. Follow Bow Disciples: https://www.instagram.com/bowdisciples/  Follow along: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/cameronrhanes Twitter: https://twitter.com/cameronhanes Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/camhanes/ Website: https://www.cameronhanes.com Timestamps: 00:00:00 – Friendly Archery Competition, Bentley, & Drake Music 00:03:11 – Hot Take: 430 Grain Arrows are the Perfect Weight 00:04:58 – Hot Take: Bigger Shaft Arrows Aren’t Necessary  00:08:06 – Hot Take: Lighted Nocks Reduce Accuracy 00:10:37 – Hot Take: Wraps Changes Arrow Flight 00:10:37 – Practice & Accuracy: Effective Ranges for Hunting 00:12:23 – Laws and Petitions Against Hunting 00:15:46 – Influencers Giving Away Hunting Spots on YouTube 00:19:24 – Ketone Shots & Episode Disclaimers 00:29:25 – Cam’s Favorite Guests, Tom Brady, and Lebron James 00:32:21 – Fancy Cars, Gold Teeth, & Keyboard Warriors 00:38:52 – Creating the Life You Want: Put Yourself Out There 00:52:07 – Cameramen vs Fan Bois: Respect in the Industry 00:56:31 – Hunt Camps, Celebrities, and Real Personalities 01:04:14 – Vegas Indoor Shooting Competitions 01:09:55 – Pressure in Archery Leagues 01:16:51 – ALP, Bentley Giveaway, and MKC Total Archery Challenge 01:20:10 – Gavin Newsom 01:21:32 – Rising Stars and Dorks in the Hunting & Archery Industry 01:29:41 – Competition in the Industry: There’s Cake for Everyone 01:40:58 – Social Media Analytics, Engagement, & Diversity in Content 01:47:00 – Are AI & Lizard People Killing the Environment 01:53:36 – Final Thoughts Thank you to our sponsors: Ketone IQ: https://www.ketone.com/Cam use code CAM for 30% off your first subscription Hoyt: http://bit.ly/3Zdamyv use code CAM for 10% off LMNT: Visit https://drinklmnt.com/cam for a free sample pack with any purchase ALP: https://alppouch.com/ use code CAM for 10% off your first order Grizzly Coolers: https://www.grizzlycoolers.com/ use code KEEPHAMMERING for 15% off MTN OPS Supplements: https://mtnops.com/ Use code CAM for 20% off & Free Shipping

Every step I take I move my truth. Every time they tell me stop I use. Every comment hate that makes my feel. Gather up my energy and boom. I hear them talking, saying the way that I move it's so reckless. That is a part of my mind I've been blessed with. Giving my blood so I am relentless. This is to keep crammering collective.

Shit Talkers Weekly number 32 with special guests, not Gideon, not that fuck up. Two real special guests. James Visser. Brianna. Are you guys married yet? No, not yet. Not technically. It's Brianna Curley, technically.

Oh, that's right. Okay. Well, soon enough. Same same. So James, this is his, this is not the fuck up James, the other James, your second appearance on the show. Two time, baby. I love it. I love it. Yeah. We have to link up and shoot every time we can, though, because it's always too much fun. That was fun. I mean, you're a good shot. Thank you. That was great. So we had a little 3D course out here, went out and shot, got some shot some content because content's king, baby, right? Oh, dude, we stack. And yeah. And I'll say today, which normally this doesn't go this way, I went out to a big lead. Big.

That was not, I was not expecting that because you've been shooting so much and you're so good. And then I was like, I was like, God, am I going to freaking crush him today? No. So it got back. We were at one point at the final target and I fucked up the final target. Damn. So whatever. And we destroyed a few.

Yeah. A few victories and a few Eastons took just diggers out there today. We did the steel bear, which has, you know, like a maybe like a little bigger in a softball, smaller than a volleyball hole at 90. what was it, 93? 94, I think the second time, yeah. Yeah, so. And you couldn't really see it. That was the tough part.

Yeah, it was sort of hidden in the grass. Hidden in the grass, yeah. But we ended up finally getting one. So it was good. Yeah, awesome place to shoot too. We had to take the Bentley. Nothing. Nothing says, you know.

No, we didn't get one. You got one in the hole. So it was, it almost hit steel. Yeah. You're close. But it was a clean shot in the hole. Good shot, 994 yards, barely able to see. where you're aiming. Good job. Good job. The whole course was awesome. Like people definitely got to go

watch the video. I'm not sure if it'll land on. I think it'll sort of land on both our channels in ways. So check it out multiple versions. And yeah, it's super fun. And first time in a Bentley for me. And that thing rips, boy. Yeah. Yeah. It's a little bit dangerous how fast it goes. But we had the Drake bumping. Oh yeah. We had Drake big time. We had to. We had. We're coming back from the sticks, shooting bows, on a gravel road and a bintly. What else fits? Bumping drink. That's right.

It has to be drink. How often has that ever happened in the history of mankind? Very few. I bet never. So we just set the standard, baby. We did. And all you freaking Karen's out there that want to like talk shit on us, welcome to the show. So what are we going to talk shit about?

What are we going to talk shit about? I mean, first things, I know you guys kind of cover a lot on shit talkers, right? It's sort of a pop culture pod. Yeah, anything. But we can talk shit in the industry. Oh, I mean, I'm in on whatever. You want to, James, why don't you toss a subject in here in the ring? Shit.

Hold on. Let me change your my camera view. All right. That's shit talker subject. Let's go with, let's just start with some hot takes. Give me a hot take you don't think people will agree with. Throw yourself in the fire a little bit here. Okay.

Oh, I got one here. What is it? I don't think Camel liked this one. I think for most people, most adult men shooters, I think that arrow that's like 430 grains is perfect. Yeah. On almost every North American animal. Like, I don't think we need to be 550 plus. Well, I think if you shoot over 60 pounds, that's ego.

I only draw 52 pounds, dude. So, you know. Right. Huh? Yeah. What do you draw? You said you only draw 52 pounds? Yeah, because over 60s.

Ego. We're ego lifting at that point. Yeah, right. Yeah, no, you would never ego lift. No. Or not. No. Most I'm making fun of the dip shits.

You say, what do you need 90 pounds? You're going to hunt a fucking dinosaur? Shut the fuck up, pussy. Yeah, what are you hunting a walrus, dude? Come on, man. Hit the gym. Yeah. I know.

I agree. I will say. I think you should draw the weight and shoot the 450 grain arrow, dude, and just be throw up shooting freaking laser beams. Or shoot the weight, 491. Is that what you shoot? Yeah. Oh, I thought you were like a 570 guy.

No, I'm fine with 491. 491, yeah, I'm under 5. But 491 hits hard. Yeah, it's hard. So here's my hot take. Okay. Okay. So is everybody familiar with the Olympics?

Yes. Okay. So the Olympics is a competition, right? people who go to the Olympics in archery only shoot one shaft that X-10, the parallel pro. Yeah. So why the fuck would any dipship bow hunter think that they shouldn't shoot that? Yeah. And shoot so victory?

What the fuck's that? No, victory is durable, bro. Let me, let me. Wait, wait, so are we trying to be, what, are we going to be kicking it off rocks or trying to kill something. Dude, both. You know what I mean? I want something. Ridgin, bro. Shout out to the rival X. Good, great shaft. I don't even know what the, I hear these people talk about these shaft names and I'm like, what is this that from Kmart? I never even heard of this

shit. What was that joke somebody said to you at Reading when? Oh, it was pretty good, yeah. Shaft names are for your mom. Dude. Yeah, exactly. It was one, but basically they were joking about Easton. Or Easton. Little Jimmy over here. That's my shaft Yeah, you guys have nice shafts

I've lately I've been shooting these fat shafts Prickin big old girthy bass Okay so here's another thing Yeah Okay He's cooking right now No So we get the line cutters right

Is that what you're doing? That's what I'm doing yeah The fat shaft so What okay This is another thing I don't get So Easton I'll take a shot at Easton Came out with the 5.0s It's just like why the fuck do I want a bigger shaft

I want small So my insert that goes or the ulcer is bigger than the shaft which means the broadhead goes in cuts a hole that's bigger than my shaft there's no friction so it's going to penetrate more because it's a four mil shaft what why is do people want to shoot fat shafts hunting oh dude let me tell you so the rival X kind of catch the the lung the line of the lung precisely precisely with that shaft dude let me tell you why the rival X right it's a 5.5 millimeter you like that is it bigger the small smallest shaft you can shoot with all internal components, right? So I can shoot a cinder block with that thing and it's just fine, you know. So it didn't hold up to that steel. What? I didn't see that footage.

We're talking about cinder blocks. Of course. It's totally different. Yeah. Different topic. You have a hot take. No, no, I want to finish your. Oh, or so long.

Yeah. Okay. Why do you want to shoot an inferior shaft? Dude, I don't. I think. To make bohunting harder. Is it too easy for you? It is pretty, I mean, dude, here's the thing, right?

What about the ego? Nobody makes arrows straighter than victory. They're the best arrows. I know the guys. I know them well. I know them possibly better than anybody. I guess the people in the Olympics don't want to win a gold medal. Otherwise, they shoot victory, apparently.

Yeah. Page is a Easton gal. She is. Yeah, she's an Easton gal, yeah. Isn't she like one of the best shooters ever? She's very good. Yeah. Very good.

Another hot take I have. is so people, people talk about, oh, I don't want the components on the fucking lighted knock. I wouldn't be able to see. So if you're putting a lighted knock on your, on your arrow, you're giving up accuracy. I agree with that. Do you think if they made you more accurate, wouldn't they shoot those in Vegas? Yes. How many people in Vegas shoot a lighted knock?

I did not see any. That would be zero. So why? Why would that be? Yeah. Well, I think that like you said, the group size, when I've shot, let knocks, which is only a few times, my groups were not as good. Right.

So I think to your point, I don't think they're... So they don't help you hunting. So you want to be able to see the arrow hit in the guts? Yeah. Instead of not see a hit in the lungs and have it go pile up. Well, also, I want to add to this a little bit. I believe that animals, when they jump strings, I think most of the time they're seeing. You stole my hot cake.

I think they're hitting it off vision, right? So I think a lit knock is just going to show up like a even more. I think it a thousand percent is. I think people not only sacrifice like their, their accuracy, as you said, because it's automatically not going to be as accurate as a regular knock is going to be. But then you're also sacrificing your, what's, I don't know what a good hiddenness. I don't know what a good word other than that is, you know, like if you've done all this work to stock in or, or, you know, get up in your tree stand, wherever you are, and, stay out of sight of this animal, up what you do all these things or downwind, and then you throw a bright light at it at 300 plus miles an hour. Yeah. Why would you do that? Right.

And as you know, you guys just hunted Axis. Those things can stand there till the arrows like, I don't know, 40 yards from it, see it and be gone. Mm-hmm. So I don't know if they're seeing it. It feels like they could be seeing it because their eyes are really good. Of course they can hear, but I just know that it's not going to help, you know, tying a flashlight to your arrow and throwing it at an animal. It's just like, it seems counterintuitive.

And I do shoot a wrap with bright flesh because I want to find my arrow after I shoot, but I'm not going to give up accuracy to find my arrow. I'm going to have something bright. And like if I can't find it, then I'll just stick to the blood trail and go 50 yards from the double long. And there's my animal on maybe my arrow too. But, dude, I, I,

I, yeah, go ahead. You hunt with a rap. What kind of Western hunter are you? Yeah. I do.

I can't, I can't get over it. So ever since I'm from the east and wraps are like, no big deal. Right. Pretty much anybody will put a rap on their arrow.

Yeah. I came out here and was just berated for, I mean, just slapped over the head and told I was an idiot for running a rap. And so then I went a couple years

with that one. And they're like, I can't believe you would do that to your arrow. It's just going to fly like absolute shit. Why? Because the weight on the back? It's going to be horrible. Okay. A wrap is a lot less than fucking lighted components. That's like 23 plus grains sometimes. Six grains on the back of my air. My arrow is already the size of a goddamn, gosh darn, I don't know what you say here. It's the size of a crossbow bolt.

It's like a couple inches off. I could shoot the thing through a crossbow. I don't think those six grains is going to make a difference. No. I know the six is a lot less than 20 some. And also I shoot that 55 grain half out, I guess is what it's called. Is that what that is on mine? I think so. Is that a half out? I believe so. Because it doesn't go, it's not internal.

But anyway, I like the extra weight, the 55 grain out front with 100 grain broadhead. So I got 155 out front. That's why those arrows fly so good. And people also commented on that I shoot forefletch. And I'm like, no, I want to be able to steer that thing. Because again, like we talked about with the shots today, hunting shots, I might not do everything perfect, right, hunting. I might be on one leg like this, doing something weird.

If I do a fucked up release, I want the arrow to correct itself. And four Fletch helps steer that better than three. Do you find that obviously, I would assume, now you pull a lot more than my little self, but can you, your effective range, like how far out you can shoot, do you find that that's lessened, like, how far out because of the forefletch? Like, do you get a drop off at all? No, I mean, they're very accurate out to further I'd ever shoot at an animal. Yeah.

I mean, I shoot out at, you know, 160 all the time. Point made right there. Like, just, James says this all the time. Just get closer. Yeah. Just be better. Yeah, my philosophy is shooting. We took some long shots today, but I need to be able to hit accurately at double the distance

I'd ever take hunting. So if I can shoot, stay in the long. that say 160, then maybe I could shoot at 80. 80 is a long shot. That probably wouldn't happen. So it'd probably be more like 140. I could hold them pretty good. So 70 yards would be my limit on animals.

And I think if you can hit accurate double, then yeah, now we're on to something. I don't like people. And this has happened before too, and I'll talk shit about them, where they practice out to 60, the animals at 75, they never shoot 75. 75. They shoot 60, but they take the shot at the animal at 75 and there's a whole little high. It's like, what are we doing? Yeah. You, we owe it to the animal to either not shoot, get closer or practice it more distance and get, get that talent up to where you can make that kill or don't take the shot. Yep. So that's my feelings on it. No, I agree. I think closer is always better. And my favorite shot's 20 yards, TPL baby. That's where I want to get to every time. But I do. Speaking of veins real quick, um, Greg Poole, guest of your show and our show. And our show.

I know him well. Big guy, very large dude, but knows a ton about Archie. Maybe the biggest. Maybe the biggest. What is it? Is that six inches? Yeah. Six inches?

But, dude, I went up there, right? Greg FaceTimed me before we ever went up there and filmed with him. I had met him one time and he was like, let me see your target arrows. And I show him. And he's like, nah, you got to get up here. We've got to redo your arrows. And basically, I was shooting with zero offset and zero helicoil. at all. And he was like especially for indoor. You only have 20 yards. We need to get that arrow

spinning as fast as possible to correct. So he put like absolutely torque tail of coil on it. And dude, when I went and shot the next time, it was like shots that I felt broke like maybe ooh, that might be out of the 10. Pulled them back. Where they would be in the 10. And it was like so much more forgiving. So to your point, I think a lot of times, um, now if you're someone like Brianna and your short draw low pounded, you can't afford to have that as twisted. But, um, Depending on what you're doing, you can really twist them up pretty good or run four. And for those that don't know, the faster it spins, your arrow is going to drop off out there at extended distance. Because you're losing a little energy with the spin.

So I do have four. I got some offset on it, but it steers those broadheads. Perfect. And I always practice out here in the yard. I think you pulled one of my arrows that had a fixed blade head on there. I practice with fixed because I want to know if I'm doing something wrong and that fixed blade broadhead tells me. And then I put a carnivore on to hunt. And then that's more like a field point. But I still want to be technically doing everything right, you know.

And that fixed blade tells me whether that's happening or not. Yep. Any thoughts over there? People who say that hunt influencers are ruining hunting. Oh, boy. Can I go first? Can I go? Popcorn.

Yeah. Yes. Yeah, it's a black hat. All right. Look, we're in Oregon right now. Yes. Right? Perfect.

state to make the example I'm about to make. Oregon just had a ballot measure or something that was like going to get out to the ballot if it reached enough support to literally ban hunting, trapping and I believe even farming, right? And fishing. And fishing. Now, I understand that some people are selfish and would rather hunt with zero people in the woods.

And trust me, I want that too. You know what I mean? But the reality is that states like California and like Oregon are where that we're both from are. pushing harder and harder to get rid of hunting. And they start with the cute shit like California with the bobcats and the mountain lions and they've tried bears multiple times. Orkin just said, we're going to try everything, right?

And the problem is if we don't have strength in numbers and bring more hunters into the fold to fight this stuff, we are cooked. So I understand both sides. I understand wanting to draw a tag every year, wanting less people at the trailhead. I get all that. But do you want your grandkids to be able to hunt one day? You just had a grand kid. Yeah.

in 20 years it's very possible that the U.S. could be like Europe because you know what if one of these Lib-Tard states gets it across the finish line California or Oregon, who's one of those states, and they get hunting banned, all the other states are going to be licking their chops and going, we can get it out of here too. So if we don't have numbers, we're cooked. Yeah. And they do that in Oregon. Oregon was one that allowed the drug use. Remember that? So we're like the petri dish of stupid decisions. And if that would have got enough signatures, that would have been the, like the litmus test for these other states to be like, see, we, now we can do something. What, it almost worked to our benefit because it was so crazy and so out there, which that was by design.

They know they wanted to see what they could get away with and see how many people don't even read the measures. Because basically they'd say, hey, do you want to sign this petition? And on the back, it'd say, like, stop cruelty to animals. But everybody, nobody wants cruelty to animals. Yep. Right. So that makes it easy for people to be like, oh, yeah, I want to treat animals as well. They didn't read all the details to it.

So they got a lot of signatures like that. But what it allowed us to do is it's so crazy that it allowed me to talk about it a lot, allowed people out there in the community to talk about it and to educate because it's not just that we need everybody hunting. We just need everybody to understand hunting and not to be psycho anti-hunters. Just like, we just want you in the middle. You don't have to hunt, but just don't hate and want to kill us. and take away everything that we're passionate about. And then if you're, you know, understand it a little bit.

If we do a good job educating the non-hunters, then we have a lot more chance of success in protecting what we love, the hunting heritage. But that gave us an excuse to talk about it a lot. So, I mean, it was good. It didn't get enough signature, so it's not going to be on the ballot. But it's a test.

And that test isn't going to go away. They're going to keep going back to the well. They play the long game. You know what I mean? They're patient. almost like the wars in the Middle East. We go over there, do whatever, come back. They're just going to, they're not giving up over there.

This is all they care about in the Middle East. It's like, hey, no, we'll be doing this for centuries. So we'll wait you out. And we just have to kind of have that attitude too about this is a long game, but we've got to fight every day. Yeah, I'm going to take it from a different perspective because, not their side, because Mark and I talked about this in the hunt we were just on. And, you know, a Libtar would come back and say to counter, well, no, the people who are just

talking about it, doing pods, they're okay. What we don't want are, you know, the influencers just posting all their hunts, giving away all these spots, yada, yada, yada. Okay, well, if we didn't make those types of videos and you have, I mean, the source of information and knowledge nowadays is YouTube University, it's the internet. They're not going to a book. They're not going to grandpappy to teach them how to hunt or whatever. They're getting into it as adults.

They want, you know, a lot of them that we talk to want, you know, they just want whole foods. They want to do it naturally. So if you didn't have these types of videos out there, you just want someone flinging arrows and rifles in the woods and just hoping you don't get shot by a stray hunter out there. Why wouldn't you want to, and out of unselfish reasons, and I think it's selfish for the people who think that way, that you want your space private and Kip's secret to yourself, why wouldn't you want to help another person be better? Yeah. Get better. Like, be a better shot.

Be a better hunter. Be more effective. Because in the end game, it's only better for the animal that's potentially not going to get gut shot or shot in the leg and then get left to be eaten by a mountain lion. or just die of its wounds and then it's not used at all. Yeah, it's gone to waste. That to me is just selfish. Yeah. And I feel like that is more so what these, you know, keyboard warriors are arguing is that they don't want these hunting videos out.

They don't want their spots blown out. Yeah. And obviously, like, people that make content, we're always trying to not blow out spots. Like, I don't even say. But I'm not dropping an on-ex paint on the street. you know. You know, so good on you. Because we have had a couple people who have gone in from James's like

long time spots. And they have Google imaged, screenshot the videos, Google imaged the mountain ranges and found where those located. Good on you. Yeah. If you're going to find a good hunting spot, I'm good on you. I don't know. There's a guy that you can pay like $500 to that'll find.

You send him like a photo, he'll find it. That's crazy. Wasn't that a true, James? Do you talk about that before? We haven't talked about it, but there's a guy who he became popular because he used this, like he played this app that was basically be Google Images and you'd have to find where you're at in the world. And he was like autistic about it.

And so now people pay him to send him an image and he'll find like, he could find like what flight you were on, what day, what seat on the plane you're at. It's insane. Yeah. I mean, you're just putting more money in the economy. You're just stimulating people's jobs at that point. Like more power to them is capitalism, I guess. I don't know.

Well, the people who like, uh, want to keep everybody out of hunting because of whatever, they don't want, you know, even like that video we shot today, to your point about educating viewers, we talked about a lot of things like trajectory of arrows, you know, get your arrow depending on the distance, depending on where the, the obstruction might be, arrows up there hitting things. It's going to cause you to hit the animal poorly or something. You have to practice that or at least think about. it to to consider it while you're hunting. So we went through a lot of things in that shoot today

that could help new hunters. You know, if they watch that video, you know, they're, they're thinking about different things in a different way. And that's, that's a positive. Dude, for sure. What is happening back here? She's her key town. I was waiting for her to take a sip of that. Was it a little tart there? I'm so waiting it to go down. Yeah. It tastes like Gatorade. You should, oh my goodness. Just see how easy James swallow stuff. Yeah. Oh, that's going to take me a while to get the rest of it down. I've been training my whole life for that.

Yep. I was not prepared. He's a throat goat. A throat goat is crazy. I know like chasing with coffee. You know it's bad when coffee has to make it, has to wash the taste. What exactly what is in this thing? Cat piss.

Yeah. That actually is a better tasting one. You should have saw the first version. Really? I also have a problem with even putting like electrolytes in my water though. Like I'll do, we try, we use clear protein now, which is great. But it's something about that like added salt taste that just. Yeah.

It sends me over the edge. This is not salty. I'll give it that. But it is something. James, you got to do yours. I'm going to try this one. Yeah, it's already open. Yeah, that's fantastic.

At least a 12 out of 10. What am I at 7-11? Is this a slurpy? Yeah, I know. Basically is slurpy. It's tasty, dude. It is. The fact that you were prepared for my response to that sip.

Yeah, but these are the good ones. I cut the cameras to you. The Blue Raspberry is like, I wish you had some of the original. But the originals, it's like a little harsh. Yeah, a little harsh. It leaves something to be desired. But, hey, if it helps you like mental acuity, Maybe I'm in.

And I need that. I didn't go to college. Take two guys. It's like eating your greens as a child. Come on. Oh, here we go. Come on. Come on.

Down the hatch. Be the shot. That's one serving. You're supposed to. Is there any left in there? A little bit. Come on. Oh, come on.

I can't. Yes. Yeah. There you go. I've never been able to take, like, shots of liquor or anything. Yeah. I can't do it. I've always had to take like at least three chugs to get.

one single shot down. And James was like, just keep swallowing. Just open up your throat. And I'm like, wow. James can coach you apparently. James could, he could. He could swallow the biggest, he could swallow the biggest mouthful of anything. Dude, some might say load.

I just open up my throat. I don't even have to swallow. That's what James says. He was just let it roll right down. Oh my gosh. Wait, what? We are off the radio. Click that chat.

Yeah. Yeah, he tries to coach me, but it hasn't happened. Yeah, lots of coaching. And when does this coaching occur? Oh, yeah, you know. A day or hopefully tonight, you know. Restaurant. There are great.

This is a good topic. This really is a good topic. And back to it. Yeah. You wanted to do shit talkers. Yeah. Welcome to shit talk. Thank you.

And we didn't say. I feel blessed to be here. It's important to say that it's all love. Oh, that's right. Oh, is it? Yeah. Oh, no, I'm sorry. No matter.

it's either all love or just passion. Yeah. One or the other. Yeah. Or just... I thought we were here today. I thought it was all hate. That's what I was going for.

It's love. Even me talking about this... Yeah. Fucking victory. Victory arrows, that was love. Yeah. Shout out to victory. Shut out to victory.

I know him well. If it comes off as hate, it's just because your perspective's wrong. Right. You need to look in the mirror. Yeah. To be honest. That's a you thing.

Yeah. Because this is love, baby. I love. If we can't have tough conversations, we have to. I mean, this is how a relationship kind of progresses. Yes. Right? Yes.

So this is just a tough conversation about arrows and archery and bows. I use ketone IQ when I need to stay sharp for the long haul. Long runs, lifting before I shoot my bow, even when I'm podcasting, anytime I want steady focus without crashing. What I like about it is how it feels. It helps me stay locked in during long efforts and mentally demanding. sessions, not jittery, not wired, just clear and steady. Ketones are your brain's preferred fuel source. So instead of that spiked caffeine feeling, the focus feels calm and controlled. It lets me push

without leaning on caffeine or sugar. I'm not chasing another cup of coffee or something sweet just to get through a workout or a long day. I can train, work, and think without that roller coaster of energy. Physically, I feel ready to go. Mentally, I'm locked in. That combination matters when you're putting in long hours and real work. Visit ketone.com backslash cam for 30% off your subscription order, plus receive a free gift with your second shipment. Or find ketone IQ at Target stores nationwide in the hydration and protein aisle and get your first shot free. I've been shooting Hoyt for over 20 years now. And they're a lifetime partner of mine. That's not something I take lightly. I stay with partners that prove themselves.

And Hoyt continues to do that year after year. They shattered the industry standards and built the AX90, the first 90 pound bow to exist and be offered to consumers. Why? Because I want a hard-hitting arrow delivered with enough force to push through, say, a rib or the edge of a shoulder blade. Because it's bow hunting. Not every shot is going to be. perfect. But when the animal reacts, or maybe I don't make the most perfect shot, I still want to deliver a lethal arrow and a 90-pound bow gives me more room for error. Unfortunately, they don't offer discounts on bows, but if you want to grab some Hoyt merch or selected accessories, you can use my code, CAM for 20% off. If you're serious about archery and you want something you can rely on,

shoot a Hoyt. Get serious. Get Hoyt and keep hammering. All right. Let me ask you guys this question. I'm going to ask both you guys this question, James and Cam. Aside from me, who's the favorite guest you've had? Obviously, I'm number one, but after that. Brianna. Brianna, let's go. There you go. All right. That's fair. I'm secretly number one. That's fair. What about you, James? The next one. The next one? Come on. Who is like Tom Brady? Oh, Tom's coming on.

Which championship is your favorite? Oh, my favorite Tom Brady championship, for real, though, has to be the Bucks. Went to the Bucks, won a championship. What about the Falcons? That would be my second. But you can't beat the Bucs, dude. Just think of the storyline. Dude leaves the team, leaves the coach.

They sort of had a beef, right? Who was responsible for the Super Bowl? Was it Belichick or Brady? That was always the question. And then Tom leaves and goes and gets one. year one. There it is. That answers your question. And then Belichick stayed and fucking sucked it up. Didn't win one after that. Speaking of All-Stars leaving teams. Oh boy. How about LeBron? Yeah, we got to get into it. Did you see the 76ers coming? No. No. No, that was out of left field for me.

Yeah. I thought it was going to be back to Miami or back to Cleveland. Do you think it's a good fit? Do you think, are the 76ers? Do you think they're, they're top tier to win the championship now? I mean, the thing about it is on paper, they got an amazing roster. Do they meld together? Do they mesh? Can they play together as teams? Because we've seen this before. I remember with the Lakers, they had Gary Payton, Carl Malone. They had all these stars.

And they just having stars doesn't, because you have to have people that are willing to take the back seat sometimes. There's only one ball. If you got five superstars out there who, and the problem is like, LeBron's kind of past the stage of worrying about this, but they're all fighting for money, right? The better stats you have, the bigger contract you're going to have.

These players have a lot of extended family depending on them. Yeah. A lot of people coming with their hand out. They're multi-millionaires. Everybody wants money, right? Like, oh, you signed a hundred and some million dollar deal. Hey, could you hook a brother up? Yeah.

And so they're still competing and still got to put up the stats. Yeah. And for some of them, it's not always about winning. It's about, hey, this is my job. Yeah. So if everybody's not on the same page about, hey, I'm going to take a backseat if it means the team wins and we can win a championship, that all sounds good. But if everybody's not on board, who knows?

Yeah. Yeah. Speaking of, you know, cool, rich athletes going for big contracts. I don't like to talk about this too much. But I actually have one friend with a Bentley and a gold tooth. Whoa. Yeah. I do.

I do. I do. Yeah. I don't talk about it too much. Friend is used. loosely. Yeah. I mean, depends, you know. I don't like to talk about it, but yeah. Let's

get into the shit talking. Is that a poor reflection on what can happen in the archery community or a positive reflection? Because some might say, this fucker's gone off the rails. Or some might say that is sick. That's the bad guy, man. If I had it

up to me, I would be showing up to every tournament in the Lambeau or something ridiculous. Yeah. And I'm a couple years out from that, but you know your boy is showing up in a hurricane one day for sure. I think it's a tough look, bro. Okay. I like it.

Yeah. What do you think? Yeah. I think it. Brianna likes trucks, dude. She's out, I think. I'm out on a, I'm out on all cars, pretty much. You know this.

But, but do I think that like doing wilder things in a sport that's usually so yeah. Cookie clutter, concise and conservative? Yeah. I think it's absolutely fantastic. I think that's why he stands out so much in like just like the archery. Because we'll do hunting videos, but they aren't our best performers or anything. He's just archery specific, like archery anything.

And that opens the door to all the perfect target shooters. Do you get hate for this? Do I? Yeah. Not so much anymore. Occasionally. Yeah. Not as much anymore for sure.

Yeah. I don't know what happened. must just be more likable nowadays. Well, I think people realize that you could shoot. I think you're good. I think you're good. Crazy character out there. What people like to do is somebody who has a big following, they want to say that it's not

worthy, basically. Or you're just like, I don't know, out for attention or you're like for me, they'd say like, oh, we go on the best hunts and you guided and you couldn't do it on your own type thing. And so they want to, you know, kind of shit on the accomplishments. But when you're shooting so well, what are they going to say? Yeah. I mean. Yeah, that's like you're hunting too.

It speaks for itself, you know. What do you got? 400 inches now? Yeah, but it's like, yeah. I mean, but there's always, people can always caveat that with saying, oh, you know, paid to go to the best spot. I'd like to see you kill a blah, blah, blah on my fucking, my shithole area. And I'm like, well, I wouldn't go to that area.

But I have been like when I was coming up. and didn't have any money if I would kill any five point or bigger bull. It's like I wasn't looking always for 400 inch bulls. It's like part of the evolution as a bow hunter is you pay your dues. Then if you do it right, then you get to reap the rewards. You still have to prove it. I mean, it's still hard. But if you can, then the results speak for themselves.

I think it's crazy or it's very fascinating to me how people just black out. They just forget that part. Like they just head to their keyboards and start, you know, about, you know, how you're just paying. Yeah, to do, you know, the most expensive and, you know, crazy things and blah, blah, blah. And it's like, do you know where they came from? Do you know what they first hunt? Did you ask any questions before you just assumed? We have one.

I don't know the name. Or I would say it. I would. But this dude comments on everything. Absolutely. I didn't know who was. I pretty much steer clear of all the comments and things like that because James knows that I've, you know.

She can get a little spicy. Yeah. Me, I'm pretty even keel. So I got an argument one time at a beach with a dog beach about my dog with a very, very, very large man. And James got very, very, very uncomfortable. But I have no problem speaking my mind. She doesn't. That's that military background, you know.

background, you know, she ready, you know, little battle. You know, little people syndrome, I guess, I don't know. But so finally one day James tells me about this, this dude and this one comment and he reads it to me. I think you put it on social media or something. And so then I start seeing all the different comments. And it was one, I think it was from the pod we did with Josh and Brandon. And something about like, this dude doesn't know what he's talking about.

He's just over here for the attention. Like, he'll say anything. And basically I just commented back finally. And I was like, where, what's your address so I can ship our, you know, biggest fan award to it just came in the mail today. And he hit me back with something about how we should, you know, be quiet. And then I said, well, you must be a Lib Dard because you apparently don't like the First Amendment. Yeah. But unless it applies to yourself.

Right. So there are just, there are people out there who I think, want things a very specific way. And if you stand out of that box in any way, they feel like you've made it a little too big. And then all of a sudden that you're doing it for attention. And it's like, but did you look back at any of the older stuff

or, you know, read up on the person before you started shit talking? No, not whatsoever. But I find those people very comical. And I would love to comment to more of them. but James holds, he holds my leash back a little bit. I got to pull back the garden dog, you know. Well, all I know is, you know, now we have social media,

but before that is you killed an animal, you went down to the bow rack, and you put it on the bulletin board, right? So it's like we've all, as hunters, you're always proud of the accomplishment because it's hard. It's really hard to be successful. And people can say this isn't the same,

but the cave dwellers, had had pictures of like the hunt right from back thousands of years ago so it's like the hunt has always been special and always been celebrated we're doing that now in the way that we do media now and it's like there's just the way it goes it's always changing yeah it's not a cave wall and it's not the bulletin board of the bow rack it's on my instagram page yeah serving the same purpose it's all i'm still proud of it i still worked my ass off for that i've never been on an easy fucking bow hunt. So yeah, I'm going to, I'm going to feel good about it if I'm successful.

And I know I'm bringing me home to my family. So what's the problem? What is issue? That is the question I cannot answer. Is it because you're not successful? Yeah. So you don't want to look at my success. Is that the problem?

Typically, I think jealousy is always the main culprit. Yeah. Right. Whether it comes down to success rates or skill or money, whatever it is. Usually when someone is, you know, really. pent up or talking shit or leaving comments of hate i think it's pretty much 100% of the time i'll give i'll say 99% of the time i think it comes back to uh jealousy is what i think i could be wrong i don't claim to know everything but that's that's what i think it is usually it is and usually it might

even be feelings that they don't know 100% what it's why they feel that way yeah it's like i just they feel they look at something and it triggers some emotion Who knows why. But if it's a picture of you, then you're the bad guy, right? And that's just how it works. But, you know, part of it is too, it's hard balancing everything. I will say this. I had a full-time job my entire career.

And so I've been retired now three years. Yesterday, I shot four different times during the day, right? I shot in the morning, midday, or mid-morning, midday, than in the evening. when I had a job, I could shoot maybe one time. And by the time I got home, it was dark. So if I didn't shoot before work, I wasn't going to middle shoot that day. Can I be a better hunter now because I have more time? Yeah.

Yeah. So sometimes that's the way it works. We do the best we can with the time that we have. Is our hunting and our shooting going to suffer a little bit probably? Because if you're raising kids, if you're married, if you have a full-time job, that's just the way it goes. But for me, I was able to still somehow find a way to, succeed even despite all that and now when you have more time then you're like god this is so much

nicer build a shoot we went out whatever i don't even know what today is tuesday is a tuesday yeah we're out we went out and shot tuesday afternoon i didn't have to be at work did you no we were just that bo-tech shot that was work that was my lunch break right so yeah so it's you can talk shit about it um and i and i understand because not everybody's in this position so i get that you would feel maybe a little jealousy for that, but that's not to say that you can't earn the same type of opportunity. I mean, were you born rich, either of you? No. Did anybody hand you this opportunity and say, hey, we want you to be a professional archer, okay? Here's your bow. Here's some money. You just have, did somebody say that to you? Never. No, you fucking earn it. Yeah. And if you

can't figure a way to fucking earn it, then think harder. Yeah. Work harder. Yeah. Do something different. You know, it's like we were talking about this and I, and I told True at too, make people care. Because there's a lot of great archers out there, great bow hunters. They might have a dream of being a career hunter or being a pro in some way. You got to make people care because if you make them care, whether they love or hate, that attention is currency, you can make money doing that. But first, figure out a way to make them care. These great bow hunters out there who haven't quite cracked the code or maybe they don't, maybe it's not an important. to them. And that's fine. That's more power to you. If you don't, if that's not your goal,

great. If you just want to work and hunt on the weekends, awesome. But if you want to be, quote, somebody, figure out a way to make people care about what you're doing. And that's hard. That's bars right there. Super hot fire bars right there. It, I mean, it's good advice, but also it's very, very difficult because there's so much competition for attention right now. Millions of things, people out there doing crazy stuff. How are you? you're going to stand out. Yeah. Yeah.

And then when you get the shot too, I mean, it's like you can't, you just can't drop the ball. You know, whether it's like you get you sign your first sponsor and maybe they just are giving you a free product or something, but you had. That starts. But you had better be the top guy as far as giving them what your deal says, whether that's pumping out tons of content on your own page, maybe giving them some photos to use whatever it is.

Make sure that they never have to track you down to do your job. You just sign the deal and you take care of it and over deliver. Right? For us, that's always been huge. We never have a sponsor come back and say, y'all aren't doing enough. Never. Element was created by former research biochemist Rob Wolf and has enough sodium, potassium, and magnesium to move the needle. And get you feeling and performing your best.

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friggin just smoking it right now i can't even believe how much and and we had only set it up like like a week ago, this Dropbox account and I had it filled like that. And they're like, you know, so I think you got to seize the, seize the day when it comes. Sees opportunity. Like, think about the first day that Cam and I met and I met James and we all met the same day at performance archery. How many times, like that was a risk, right? I could have easily been like, no, I'm not going to shoot Cam a message to see if he wants to shoot with me. He's never going to respond to me. At the time, we were decent in size, but nothing compared to now. Like we've had a big run these last couple of is partly things to doing stuff with you and other people and really growing and just going for it full steam.

But that day is a good example of what can happen in life when you say, even if Cam doesn't reply, I'm at least going to shoot him a message and see if he wants to shoot arrows with me. You responded, we did it. We went and shot arrows and we got along well and, you know, made some cool stuff. And then you said, all right, let's do it again. And then this time we said, let's do it again, you know, and we've sort of built like a rapport and this and that. But that doesn't happen if I don't send that. first message.

Exactly. So you've got to just, you got to just send it in life, you know, and you're never going to get a yes if you don't even ask. Yeah. And I think a lot of it just comes down to,

like people just don't want it bad enough. So you may see somebody else who's doing everything that you dream of doing. And then immediately following that comes the must be nice. I'm too busy. all of the excuses start rolling in. And I don't have enough time. And like I've seen this just in like switching from getting out of the Navy into,

you know, full time with James into now full time with multiple other clients. And sometimes I'll feel busy. And then I'll realize that's for three days straight. And then I have no work for two weeks. Right. You do, but it's work you want to be doing. Yeah.

And I think there is always time in your day. You just don't realize you have. wake up earlier, stay up a little later, you know, what other ways can you make yourself more efficient? And it all comes down to, is it like your dream? Do you want it bad enough then? And I just don't think people do. So then that's where the excuses and the, you know, deep-seated, unknowing jealousy starts to kick in because it's something that deep down they know they want, but on the surface, are not willing to work to get. Because like I said, we didn't start out rich.

You've worked your entire life and have only been retired for three years, but yet have been doing this longer than that. 40 years. You know? So like, did they do the same thing? We are cooking right now on this pod. Well, I'm in, I am inspired right now. Well, I just want to say too, like part of it also is your attitude and your personality and what you bring to the table.

And like that's a superpower of your guys is you have fun. You, and we joke around like the fun bunch, right? But it's always about fun. So you have a smile on your face. It makes people, that attracts people. If somebody's always bitching about something, do you want to fucking watch them? I don't. But so part of it is, do you?

have the confidence to put yourself out there, to send that DM, because I could have went, what the fuck, you think I got nothing else to do down here? I'm fucking busy as shit. No, I don't have time to go shoot a bow. Then you feel I'm kind of a dick. You're like, fuck, that sucked. I thought he was cool and he's not. But you took the shot, right? And just having a confidence to maybe be shot down or maybe not get the reaction you're hoping for, but you put yourself out there. So part part of it is you have to believe in yourself. You have to be confident enough to maybe take a hit if it doesn't go well. But then if it goes well, who are you when you're there?

You know, are you having, are you, do you actually love this or is your goal just to be famous? Because if your goal is just to be famous, none of the shit's going to work. No way. You have to love the process. Bro, it's too, it's too dense. There's too much to do. I mean, bro, like, bro, like we still do all of our own editing. Like I edit all the videos.

She does all the photos. We do all our own email campaigns, like write all the stuff to sponsors. Like, we're a two-man show. And it's like, there's a lot to do. And if you don't have the love for it, you're never going to do it because it's relentless, right? I mean, we're doing two full-length videos every single week year-round on YouTube. That's a lot of output plus shorts every day, posts every day, stuff for sponsors. Like, this trip for Botech, and to see you.

We literally landed in Hawaii at 6.30 in the morning, whatever day it was. Sunday. and we flew out Monday, cooked. We're both hammered. We just friggined for two weeks straight, pounded hills hunted a hardest shit for access deer, you know, and came back and you think we didn't want to stay home and just frigging lounge for a couple days now,

but we got to go do stuff. You know what I mean? It is what it is. Get back on a plane. Got to do it, right? Yeah. And I love it. And I think Brianna does too.

And I think obviously, clearly you do 40 years of killing it, being the top of the game, just like your book title, how to get to the top and stay there. Like that don't happen if you don't number one love it and number two have a work ethic that is Almost nobody is matching you know what I mean yeah and that's the only thing that's been a key to our success is I think just the the amount of output and being super relentless and persistent that's hustling that's hustling and and then and then talent yeah But it takes more than just talent yeah it takes that fucking grind yeah yeah you have to want I've always said and I don't think you're giving yourself enough credit both of of both you and Cam is like someone will always be more talented than you.

Someone will always be better. Someone might even come just as close to working as hard, but, and you see those people on Instagram, you can see them and they have four followers. Yeah. Because their personality and who they are as a person, if they're genuine or not, it sucks. And so it has to be a mix of all that,

but you also have to be a person worth being in a room with the people you find yourself. in. I ask myself this question all the time because I've been afforded opportunities. I don't feel like I deserve. You know, there's people out there that are way more talented than me on a camera. And I'm like, why am I sitting in this room and they're not? They're having a hard time finding work. And I think it comes down to who you are as a person when you're in that room and what kind of story you have to tell. And then the people around you will give you more opportunities because they like being around you, you know? Well, part of it with you,

them, James. And I do a really good job of sucking dick. Jeez, oh, Pete, dude. Being the throat has opened so many doors for you. Well, yeah. Most of your back door. Yeah, that's 99% of my opportunities.

But I'm just saying for the general person, you know, hey, listen, no one's going to beat me with the throat goat. No way. Let me say this. And this is serious because I've had camera guys and this fucking pissed me off. So camera guys, I'm around. maybe it's Luke Brian Jason Aldeen

they're over there hey could I get a picture and I'm like do not fuck this up by fanboying out to these fucking celebrities they got fucking people asking them for shit

all the time I'm invited because they're like a safe space right they don't have to be on they don't have to protect themselves of what they say what they do but now I got a camera guy over there fanboying

so to James's credit he doesn't we've been around some big stars, some of the biggest. I've never seen him say, hey, could I get a picture? Yeah. You know what I mean? So it's like, but he's more than willing, if I say it's okay, to share awesome photos, to share content with wanting nothing in return.

Just like, and usually it goes through me. He's not even like a lot of people say, hey, do you mind if I send whoever pictures, they want that contact so then they have that person in their phone so then they can hit him up on the side for their own side deal. James says, sends me stuff, I send it to whoever the celebrity is. So it's like even little stuff like that, if he was a guy wanting pictures, whatever, I'd be like, yeah, I don't think it's going to work out, dude. Fucking see ya. Yeah. Dude, there's just a different feel. Like, I don't know what it is. We, not to the same extent as you, but I mean, I've gotten a chance now to be around people that I never would have thought. And I just

come in there like it's just a regular old buddy. I try to act zero different. And I, because I'm not acting. Nor is Brandon. We're just being ourselves. And that's always the case. Like the first day, again, at performance, there was no weird vibes. It was like, yo, what's up? Good to meet you, man. Let's friggin. Yeah. Shoot some bows. And that was it. There's no goofy shit. And I do think, to James and your point, I think sometimes, you know, people maybe aren't fully themselves in their content. And it's so easy to see when you get in like a room of folks and you're just like, this is not quite what I expected. You know what I mean? And it's, and it's just like, and it's And then the people that have the talent and the work ethic and all that and are very clearly authentic, right?

Greg Poole says it all the time. Greg, Greg is like, he's got all these connections and can line people up with brands. But Greg's very picky who he chooses to do that with. And for him, he always says the number one thing is authenticity, right? And he's like, if someone is not authentic, I know immediately. And I'm not going to line them up with somebody. Right. You know?

Yeah, it's such a big one. And I understand, especially in the day of social media, everybody wants that picture to post. Yeah. Right. Everybody, you want a picture of jelly roll. If I could have a picture with jelly roll, fuck, my page would blow up, right? I know how it works. I know, but you can't let that fuck up the big picture because you might get that picture of jelly roll. That's the last fucking time you're ever going to be around them, unfortunately. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because the ride's over now. For sure. Where like even for me, like, he'll send me unreleased songs because I'll give him honest feedback. If I would post one of those fucking songs, oh, you're pumped. Yeah. It's over.

Yeah. I'm, so it's like, it's just little stuff like that. But, and I know I understand not everybody's going to be around a celebrity, but that, that authenticity, treating people like real humans and not just like a star that somebody just like trying to take stuff from all the time. It's, it's, it means a lot because they have to deal with that shit every day. And they, they, every human is going through something. You don't want to add to it. No. You don't want to add to any stress by like, as who. who's going to come around that how that guy who's just like then you made you act you made them feel a certain

way that wasn't positive yeah right yeah so i'm always like if somebody's gonna think about me i want it to be positive because everybody has a first impression or a first thought when somebody says hey do you know james williams and i'm just like oh my gosh that's or like or do you know hey you know james williams yeah that fucking guy's good he's he's a little weird he's a little He's a little weird. He's a little weird, but fucking his photos are tits. His photos slap. Yeah.

So it's like when somebody, and I tell my kids this too, when somebody says your name, there's going to be a thought. What's that thought going to be? Yeah. Positive or negative. Good point. Dude, I want to talk about what you said about, you know, being around Luke Bryan or Jason Aldean.

Well, by the way, I'm a huge Al Dean fan. I think he has more country hits than anyone ever in country. I really believe that. He's a lot. Dude, so many, for decades, bro. His shows, electric. I don't know if you've been to one. It's so much fun.

But like you said, when you're with them and you're in sort of a safe space for them where they're like a little bit, I always say that hunt camp, when you're in a hunt camp, you get to see the real people by like day four. Day one, everyone's maybe got their guard up on their best, and their best behavior. And then by like midway through, some dude that might be the more gal that's like the most buttoned up. Normally you get to see who they really are if they had zero judgment. in their life.

And if you can show up and be relatively the same on day one as day four, then that just shows you're being that person all the time. Yeah. And that's pretty rare. For hunt camps, I've been in a lot of them. And where you really find out is when a few people have got some kills and they haven't. Yeah. Because then either they think they got put in the shitty spot, oh, you're saving the good

stuff for this guy. This guy you're fucking me over. If somebody can be the last one to kill and someone. still have a good attitude, that's a good person. Yeah. Because that, that doesn't always happen. Everybody's there for like, I mean, there's a little, you know, you spend a lot of money to go on an out-of-state hunt.

You don't want to come home and tell the old lady didn't kill. Sorry. Sorry about that five grand. You want to bring your animal home. So that really, that really sets into motion, that authenticity piece. And Hunting Camp, as you said, Truth Surum comes out at Hunting Camp. Big time. Big time.

And then not even there, but on the mountain especially. You can't fake it on the mountain. Yeah. And there's no boardroom there. There's no pressure. So like you're around people and eventually midway through camp. You're comfortable with everyone and you let your guard down. Yeah.

You're the most honest. You're the most raw, you know? Yeah. And I think that, again, I know some people that day one on camp are the same as day seven or whatever. And that just shows that authenticity that Greg was talking about. And I think that's pretty dope. Yeah. It's, uh, I mean, hunting camps for me can be.

can be stressful sometimes. I know like I know I was in Idaho like a couple years ago. I think can or fail me. But anyway, I show up there. I'm hunting mule deer. Kill that kill that one on the wall right there. That little small one the top one? Yeah. A little tiny bar. No, it's one on the left. But it's it's like a nice buck. Yeah. Um, anyway, get out there. Get my bow out. Here comes. There's 20 people out there watching me shoot. Yeah. Of course. I'm like, it's just the way it goes. It's all good. But it's, you know, things change.

And it's just for me, when I look at that, sometimes you want to be able to shoot your bone and just kind of get dialed in by yourself just because like, you don't know. I mean, travel. I hope I'm going to shoot good. If you shoot shitty, everybody's there filming everything. But now I'm just like, when I go into that setting now,

I'm like, no, I wanted this. This is what I, this is what I wanted. I wanted people to care about me. They care. Yeah. I can't bitch about it. Watch me shoot. Yeah.

And so, yeah. I still work. So, like, I'm still in that process. And James has just kind of never, never cared what people think. You know, like he just comes out his authentic self. And, you know, people love watching him and he doesn't mind whatsoever. Just that's how he's always been. And James will tell you, me.

Four years ago, it's a very different person when it came to shooting. And if I were shooting poorly, I was the one you did not want to be around. It's hard. Yeah. This is hard putting yourself out there. And so I still have gotten a million times better at not being an absolute dick if I start to suck. But there's still that pressure, I guess, that, you know, if you go out there and you're just having one of your your bad days or you're just not performing and like most of the time it'll be at like

attack and you get you know 48 to 50 pounds with a 24 and a half inch draw you know a little baby bow there's a lot more i am accounting for like we were talking about in that video today or that's me all of the time up in the trees your arrows way the fuck up that we're normally not this french it's not this one i'm worried about this one up here that's way harder yeah and um and so if you're having one of those it could just be not you it could just be the course is not built for someone your size. And so I still, to this day, will struggle with, like,

trying to keep the attitude up just simply because it's this thought that, like, well, I really didn't want to come out here and suck in front of these people. And then we put out a video that, you know, a week before where, oh, I beat, you know, like there was one at Tack in Tennessee where I beat everybody. You know, James, Josh, Brandon, beat them all.

And then the next video, they're come out and they're filming with me and I'm missing every other target. And they're like, damn, they must have fake that. And so you just feel like what are people thinking about you? And it's something I have to try to remind myself a lot because I'm a very competitive person with myself. Like being a band music kid, my whole like that's my degree. you focus on perfection. And if you focus on it so much that you're worried about what others are thinking, it eats away at your confidence when you're out there.

And so I still struggle with that. I haven't gotten over it. So like going out, we shot at Hunt Camp and I'm just, I like didn't get my bow like shoot in front of people until like week two. Yeah, right. I was like, I haven't been out here a while. I should probably shoot the bow. And at one point, I was shooting and someone said something about like kneeling because you may need to take a kneeling shot.

And so like I was in full draw and just went from one knee to two to down on my butt. And they're like, oh my God, that was so graceful. And I'm like in my head like, oh, thank God we practiced that. But I don't know. It's just it's interesting like having to get to that point where you, it's not that you don't care. It's just that you become more comfortable with the fact that you know that that is going to happen, that people are. watching that people are, you know, paying attention to you. Yeah.

You feel judged for sure. I mean, I go to hunt camp a lot with guys and they're never out shooting their bow. And these are guys. It's like feel the same way you feel that they don't want to, they don't want to look, they don't look like they suck, you know? So instead, they just won't practice and then the animal suffers. Is that supposed to be better in some way? You know, it's like, but I understand how being self-conscious about.

that because shooting a bow is hard when you're feeling pressure and eyes on you it's even harder you know and so I get it I totally get it and yeah just the way it goes I don't think anybody's immune to it I mean you do a really good job at it but it's also because you have a lot of confidence in your shot so you earn that confidence you know and you'll I would guess but you'll put yourself out there in front of anybody anybody and shoot against them And that is a superpower. But that didn't come, you didn't take a shortcut to get there. It's a fucking grind.

Yeah, yeah. Dude, until, let me tell you, there's one great equalizer, right? Where it's going to get you. That's going and shooting indoor, bro. Go get on the Vegas line. There's nothing that feels like that, bro. I bet. That feels crazier than having a giant bowl in front of you.

Really? Oh, dude. The pressure? I don't know how to describe it, bro. It's like you freaking black out. I have never seen James Shake holding a bow. Dude, it's freaking crazy. How'd you shoot?

I shot really well, so I shot for me. I mean, so our indoor journey was only six weeks. I had never shot an indoor league, nothing. So I went from not doing any indoor to six weeks shooting the biggest shoot in the world, doing Vegas, right? And in practice, I was shooting, I would say, anywhere between 298 and 300s towards the end. So I was like hitting 300s and a lot of 299s, 290s. and I had to go do an outdoor tournament in Arizona, like the weekend before Vegas. And I was like, man, I really just want to shoot indoor.

But I had to go do it. It was part of the series, right, to win a buckle that we were filming. So I went out there, won that tournament. And it felt so easy, dude. Like it's eat. When you go from shooting indoor to outdoor, bro, it's like a cheat code. It's like you took the donut off your baseball bat and just can swing. Really?

It's so easy. Yeah. So I felt like it was a cake walk. Came back in and shot indoor. I had two days to practice until we went. to Vegas and dude I had a rough day of practice right it was just a bow was moving everywhere I felt like I couldn't shoot well but I still shot a 299 right and I was like thinking of myself I go you know what if I if I go to Vegas and with all the pressure people say there will be which I didn't

think there would because I'm used to shooting in front of cam and page and you know what I'm shooting from people all time on camera whatever and I'm like but if I shot a 297 in Vegas I would be like really stoked and this was I felt like shit today you know You know? So I get to Vegas and dude, I'm like, the first practice days goes by. I'm shooting with this guy, Towson and Kayla and I'm shooting. And I frigging shoot really good in practice. And I wasn't nervous at all.

And I'm like, oh, this is, I'm good, bro. Yeah. But then the competition day comes, bro. And I'm on the line and I remember I can feel it like festering about 20 minutes before. And I'm like just pounding water, dude. Like I probably drank a gallon and a half of water. You drink more than that because he had a polar-top sized. Cup.

Yeah. And just knowing him, like, I can tell when the nerves are there, when something is different than his usual behavior. You don't often see nerves from him if ever. But that was when he was on Cup 5 of a polar pop before it had even started. I was like, oh, no, he's nervous drinking. Oh, dude. I'm friggins up there on the line and then you have two practice ends and then the game starts

right and you've got to shoot 30 arrows. So the practice end one starts and I could at this point I'm like fully I'm like all right I do this is whew I'm like sweating I had to have a guy go get a towel like a shooter towel because my hands were all clammy dude I draw back on my first practice end and normally my pen like stays within the 10 like this and this sucker was rigging moving to the red and I'm like oh boy this could be a rough day right so I'm like well buddy you just got to got to try got try to put him in the middle. And I friggin shot a 297, right?

297, I think it was a 19-act, maybe 18-X. And then the next day, oh, and by the way, the kid I was shooting with was really good. He was a young kid. I wish I could remember his name. I think it was Lane. Shout out to Lane. He was shooting right next to me. And then I had a disabled girl shooting right in front of me.

You shoot like nuts to butts, right, with people. And he shot really well. He shot a 296, and he was like, he told me he's like, dude, my goal was to shoot good. I was hoping I'd meet you here and we're getting to shoot side by side. Like, this is crazy. I just want to try to like get close and score. And he put up a 296, right? Shot really good.

We were both like towards the top of the flights and in our flight. And the next day, it just goes to show how the nerves are. I step in there, a little bit less nervous, but still nervous. I shoot another 297, but with one more X, so I got a little bit better. I'm watching him shoot every round, you know, because you switch off. So he would shoot, I would shoot. and I'm watching him shoot and he walks back to set his bow down and I'm like dude you only shot two arrows go shoot a third one and he was like no I shot three and I look and he hit my target bro

he missed by like this much right just totally shanked one and shot a zero and I'm like and he was good you know what I mean but that goes to show how that pressure is bro and then I so I and then the next day we got moved to where the pro shoot like the main floor where pages shooting you know um because i was in flight three of 25 and uh i ended up i was clean through eight rounds bro i had a 300 going and then i dropped two nines the last two rounds um so i ended up with 298 so i shot uh 892 out of 900 okay so solid i was pretty damn good i won 150 bucks come on we rich i'm gonna go get a bentley let's go you know what i mean but that's impressive dude indoor first Vegas first first first ever indoor at all

Because most people, their first one, probably really struggle. Oh, dude. Everybody says, like, all the pros and everybody who goes every year, they're like, you're going to drop a minimum of whatever your average score is, drop a minimum of 10 points off of that score. And that's a minimum. And I shot about what I do in practice, so it just, you know, held it together. I mean, dude, like, have you ever done like an indoor league or anything ever?

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conquer more I don't yeah I mean a million years you got the bow rack yeah you should give it a go one time

just show up and shoot the indoor league bro I'm not I'm not good at that shit yeah I'm not good at that

the nerves are freaking crazy James is and I don't know I don't know this year I don't know what it is

I don't yeah she's doing it it's just because there's no the nerves are the pay I mean you got to hit the X you got to get a 10

so you can't fuck up that's what's hard yeah Yeah, it's soft for me. And I don't have the patience for it. How many people like do the flyer like that kid? A lot.

Yeah. That'll happen. And what happens a lot. You'll hear it two to three times per round, like a whole game, at least two to three times. Now, there's a lot of people shooting. So it's probably not as much as you would think. But they'll blow a whistle or whatever it is. They shoot their own target.

And to tell everybody to pause essentially because they got to go pull some. somebody else's arrow out of somebody else's target. In front of everyone. It's because like halfway through the round, you just shoot five ends and then you flip-flop. So if you're shooting the top target, you go to the bottom, and people will just, they're blacked out. I mean, they're so tunnel-visioned.

They shoot the wrong car. You can shoot top the whole time and now you switch them and you just naturally shoot top. So Greg taught me a good lesson. Like we filmed a whole series about it, so if anyone's watching is interested in trying indoor out, number one, I would encourage it from a hunting standpoint. It's going to make your shooting

better in your knowledge about Bose way better. But Greg said, he told me, he said, I want you to say it out loud when they switch to target. I want you stand there by yourself and just say, top target, bottom target, like say it, do not shoot the wrong one. Yeah. And dude, I fricking almost did one time. I drew and I was like on it and I went, oh, there's arrows in that one.

Look down, all, had there not have been arrows, I would have shot the wrong. Like, they'll shoot the wrong one when they're staring at arrows. Like, yeah. How do you not know those are not? your arrows but they're just they're blacked out pressure yeah yeah yeah i can't believe how good because how many people shot 300s like don't doesn't like a million people go in clean and then have to do a shoot off uh in the pros yeah so i was in the flights and nobody shot a 900 oh okay top score was at 899 so i was only you know only whatever seven off that all right but page get this this is brutal right

so page and i we were shooting we ended up shooting about the same schedule every day So we never got to watch each other shoot. She would be shooting while I would be shooting. So we never got to like watch each other shoot. In the third day, she had a 900 going. So she shot 300, 300. All she has to do is shoot one more 300. All she has to do is shoot one more 300.

And she's in the finals, right? And I'm like, dude, I finally am going to get to go watch her shoot. So I walk over there and she was on end nine or might have even been end 10. It was one of her last two. And she was clean, right? So she only had to shoot like five more. arrows in the 10 and she makes the shoot off. The very first arrow I pull up and watch her shoot, she shoots a nine, bro.

And I'm like, I watch it. I'm like, Brianna, I think she just shot a nine. And I was like, oh, she's going to hate me, bro. Like, I couldn't believe it. But she didn't even see me, I don't think. But of course, I'm feeling guilty. I only watch one arrow. It's a nine.

That's so I can't imagine. You're cook because she's a pro, right? So I think there was five or six women that shot nine hundreds. And they made the shoot off. And she didn't. Oh. And she's one arrow, dude. That's it.

Yeah. So unforgiving, dude. It's, it's pretty crazy how people that are so good at that then either don't hunt or aren't good hunters. Yeah. That's the cool part about Paige is she is a beast of a hunter. I know. That's what I like about the same with Levi.

I mean, I don't know if he, does he shoot fingers. I don't think he does a ton of indoor. I think he mostly. Mostly outdoor. And I could be the target shooters like cook me right here. But I think he does a lot of unmarked stuff. Okay. I still think that's even crazy, you know, which like,

crazy. How good of a hunter can that make you because the amount of coming Western was the biggest shock from when you like, you're ranging bushes and stuff to like, well, if you walks this way, it's about that. And like the first couple times I went with him, I was just so like, I don't know, just pent up, I guess from like not knowing the exact yardage. Yeah. I just did not enjoy that whatsoever.

So to have the skill to be that good at unmarking something, like what type of hunter, at least at that point when it comes down to the wire, can that make you, you know, help you to be able to take those types of guesses. And then like with him, too, they go for those 14s, which are you might get a five if you miss the 14 and you don't even know the yardage. Oh, yeah. So drop to, drop de velo. I'm sorry, an out of your mouth. An Alp. An Alp. An Alp.

Shout out to some. Congrats on Alp, dude. Are you and Tucker best buddies? We are. Yeah. Cool. We're tight. What do you guys bond about?

Well, he said he likes this hat, even though he likes drinking whiskey and smoking and smoking cigarettes and not, he likes doing easy things, he said. So, but this is an easy socks, right? Is that on your website? Yeah. How many entries is that for the Bentley if someone buys that hat? I don't even know. A lot, though.

A lot. Yeah. It's pretty much guaranteed. win. Cameron Haynes.com, go get entered for the Bentley. You have till September to get entered. That's right.

I'm going to get in there, though. I'm going to win that, and the people are going to say it's ready. And we will sell it because we're not paying $700 in insurance. That's wild. I had never had an Elp, an Alp until the Montana Tack. Yeah.

And they work, I guess, with like, are the people who are grizzly coolers. Yeah. And so they, Montana Knife was having this. Montana Knife was having this. Montana Knife was having this. having this party in the evening. We usually never go to them.

James wants to get back immediately and get in the hot tub. Yeah. And so we went and in front of, they give you two drink tickets, you go up to the bar and there's just these open coolers filled. Without. And I am a pouch addict.

I quit vaping last year. I haven't been able to quit the pouches, but you know, I think that's all right. other than the enamel on my molars, say otherwise, but you know. You could always get a gold one. And I was like, I look over, I'm like, are these, are these free? And they're like, yeah, like we cannot take them home, so take it.

I started stuff in every pocket I have. I was like, James, here's your pockets full, here's my pockets full. Yeah, they're nice. I was loaded down and I never even had them, but I was like, yeah, pouches are expensive. They are. Especially where we live and you can't even get flakey. And so I tried one and I think it's the drifter series that I am in love with because I'm normally not like a citrus or fruity flavor pouch person, but it's like a citrus or a fruit.

With the ice flavor of a vape and I hadn't had a vape in a year. So I put one of those things in and I was on like cloud nine. Yeah. This is amazing. And so now. A little bump to get the head straight. straight. Oh, yeah, it's fantastic. I'm, I sound like an addict over here, but I truly am. No, you just sound passionate. Yes, that's what it is. I'm very passionate about nicotine pouch.

Al's going to give Brianna a call for this episode. I'll tell you what, whatever commercial you want. An addiction. It's just, it's just very passionate. It's a love for nicotine pouches. I'm passionate about bow hunting. Me too. Passionate about pouches. I am passionate about boats. Especially when you live in a state that you can't buy flavors like yeah you gotta go to like these do they out door hidden rooms are they outlawed in the flavors yeah all flavors for the lip pillows and for uh and for vapes so fucking gavin for a while at least probably still now i'm gonna tell my hot take oh boy i'm gonna tell him look don't toast me in the comments right here i'm just speaking off odds right if i was a gambler

i do think gavin's the next big guy we'll be moving to news i do i hate to tell you for president i think he is god probably he's as slimy as it takes yeah yeah what do you think is that a hot take or you think it's possible no that's politics is such a fucking cesspool yeah he'd be perfect for it yeah he looks like the joker straight up dude he looks like the villain for sure yeah yeah yeah but we all keep voting like i don't i don't i don't understand it well we're gonna too we're all we're all kicked yeah this whole west side the whole coast you got anything over there you pretty quiet. He's fastering.

I don't really have anything to add to your guys' industry talk since I'm just a, hot dog. I'm just, uh, what, what do you call it? Cock gobbler? Yeah, that's what I was looking for. We want to talk about the cock goblin industry. Yeah. I'm in.

Yeah, he's an expert. That's where his passion really lies. Yeah, you want to talk about passion. Oh, my goodness. Oh, my goodness. So, okay, how about this? How about this? Who is, okay, we'll go with

Rising Star, the industry, and biggest dork in the industry, heal. In our industry. Yeah, hunting, bow hunting. Now, is it hunting specific, or can it be more archery too? How about hunting and archery, one of each? All right, all right.

In archery, it's got to be my girl, she shoots exes. Her content's great. Who is it? Her name is Kayla. That's just archery. She's an archery. She does hunt, but her content's all archery stuff.

She shoots X's her handle, and she does a lot of, like, educational stuff. And she's relatively new at archery, but she's quite good. She did Vegas as well. I think she's done it twice. And she just has a very good way of getting a message and a point across that helps other people shoot. And she posts a lot. She's very persistent and shoots a ton. Okay.

So for archery, I would say her, for hunting, that is tough. Um, hmm. And you don't watch a lot of it. I don't watch a lot of honey. I don't. Uh, I'm going to loop back to that. Do you have one? I don't know.

We're kind of in this, uh, I feel like almost a little bit of a low right now and like rising. Oh, I got one. I always go to YouTube. I got one. I like, I like Joey Visser a lot, actually. He has very good content when he puts it out. It's a mix of rifle and bow.

Not a relative of mine just happens. I have the same last name. not a very good looking guy I'm gonna throw out a different one but Joey makes great stuff does he okay I didn't know either of those two so that's good

well he's not he is a good hunter but he's always behind his camera is Ethan oh Ethan Byrne very good yeah his he does more like James and I are very different in our oh is that what's his face is Joel's brother

yeah uh excellent content yeah I love like if I were it I want it to look like I'm watching a paid TV movie on YouTube. Whereas James loves raw. But to me, it's like the ability

to get that type of content even though they're like, well, you're the cameraman, not the hunter. It's like, cameraman has been the same place as the hunter is. I just think they got there. It's not a 600 power lens on the front of that camera. They're filming from across the canyon, you know? They're behind them most of the time.

And so his video footage is just on another level, I feel like, and his storytelling, And he's starting to finally dabble in creating his own stuff and going out to film himself and other people. Oh, good. And he's one, I think, if he just sticks with it, you know, he could do amazing content. And he's such a quote. When we talk about authentic people, you know, he is as like authentic as it comes.

You know, he's a very, a very Christian man. But it doesn't like, there's no fakeness. to who he is. Like, you'll still hear a curse word and you'll hear the jokes or whatever. There's no, like, he won't hang out with James because it's James and he's Christian Light and, you know, I'm real Christian or whatever.

He's just a very real person. He's one, he's like at the very beginning stages of what he, I think, wants to do and could do. His pictures are crazy too. I mean, his photos and video. And then one more I just thought of is my guy, Travis Sloan. He's from South Africa.

He filmed all my Africa stuff. Number one, phenomenal, phenomenal filmer. And you know how it is, because you've hunted with a lot of filmers. You can tell when a filmer's a very good hunter. And he's very good. Like, we got stuff done that we shouldn't have got done. We spot and stock to everything and got some tough stuff across the line. Yeah.

And with excellent footage because he has that hunting talent. And then he does do his own hunting content as well. That's top, top shelf. So those would be a couple of them. And the biggest dweeb. Yeah. I know who it is. I know who it is.

It's Matt Rinella. Oh, that's loving you. You're going to have to bleep his name. I'm going to be on his page for sure. Yeah, believe it. No, no, no, no, no, no, no. Leave that fucking dip shit's name in. We're going to be on his page, guarantee.

Matt, no. I don't know that name. You mean Cuck Renella? Yeah, geez, O Pete. But it has to be. Yeah, he's just, I think he's just miserable. but that's all right. Yeah. He needs, he needs love too. It's all love. It's all love. It's all love. It's all love. What about yours? Are you going to be able to do. You can answer that question. Oh, well, so I do like a rising star, Wayne's son, Nathan Indicott. He works really hard. He's a good bow hunter. He films all his own stuff. So it's hard. You know, it's like in the wilderness up here. But I just, I like the passion. He's like so just grew up hunting. with Wayne as his dad and just works really hard.

And he makes puts films out there. He filmed his dad's sheep hunt like a couple years ago. Wayne drew a sheep tag. There's not many bow hunting sheep videos out there. And got that one done. So I like Nathan. Yeah, let's see. For the biggest dweeb.

God, I know a lot, but not in, do I, who do I bitch about, James? In hunting. Oh, I know one. I know one that he does. Yeah. Yeah. Who?

I can't say it. I know one, dude. Yeah. Just go like this. Who? Oh. Yeah. Is that who you're going to say to you?

Yeah. I missed it because I don't have the headphones on. Oh, well, we've had, we've, we've had some ups and downs. I don't like people talking shit. No, if you talk, if you don't like me, then fucking don't like me. I'm good. A lot of people don't like me. like me. But don't act like you like me to me and then go and talk shit about me. Facts.

Too many in this industry. Yeah. Um, that, uh, there are some people I've told him now at this point. I just, if he's going to do something, I'll be at home. Yeah. Like, I just, I can't put myself around them. Um, the, the amount you'll hear like in one room when they're with them on the camera. And then the next, it's like every other bad thing you can think of is being said about them. Yeah. You know, that they're saying about other people. I'm like,

she was feeling filled with them like 30 minutes ago. And just the negativity that breeds from it. I guess, yeah. And like the passive aggressiveness that like, you know, because James is a big joker. And jokes are great, you know. But like when the jokes be just become this like passive, like every joke, like it seemed like everybody's like just being passive aggressive to each.

We're all just calling it jokes, but none of you actually like each other. Yeah, and nobody's actually laughing. Yeah. I'm like, he just took a hit at someone. He just took another one. I'm like, we had like a secret little like World War III battle over here just with our words. It's my least favorite trait about people.

And that's why, again, James kind of says I can be a bit. I'm going to get him canceled one day or something because I just have no problem saying how I feel. And if I don't like you, I don't like you. if I don't like the way you treat people. It's just not for me. It's not a behavior or trait I like to put myself around. So there are some people now.

I'll just like, I'll just stay home for that trip or whatever. I can't. Like there's a lot of that in this. I get it. It's a business industry. Like people still need to make money. Businesses need to make money. The content creators, it is their full-time job.

People have to understand they need to make money. But you also can't, like, lose the human nature of just being kind. Yeah. And that, I feel like, it's pushed to the wayside sometimes. And I'm like, oh, gosh, I can't do it anymore. Yeah. It's a, I think some of it, I don't know, it was weird. There was a whole group of guys in the hunting industry when the women came in and they

were getting a lot of attention. They were talking shit about the women. Breached, yeah. Right. And yeah, we've been breached. And my, my, and I saw it all, it's like, you know, the bowhunting bonnies or whatever the fuck that people would say. Huntresses. Huntresses.

Yeah. And my thoughts on it where at that time is like if this is a competition, it's business, this competition. If you're going to get knocked off whatever little corner of the industry you're in by, by a girl who's doing her thing too, then I guess you're you're not that fucking good. Right? Yeah. Because I've never, I like competition. I want to be better.

So part of it like with me and John, I think was competition a little bit. For me, I've been competing my whole life. I don't give a fuck. Yeah. Oh, you're better than me.

I guess I better get to work, right? I don't really look at it that way, but I know part of it is this mindset of there's only so many, so much resource out there or there's on, and we say it we talk about cake and then rogan taught me this that there's enough cake for everybody i was like no i want it all you know and i'd say you know boot on their neck fuck you this is competition but i matured right and i'm like no we can all like we're collaborating we i want you to win

yeah you know of course and that is just it works so much better for everybody but i understand men and ego and competition and things like that and you're fighting for every scrap you can get I get it. But if you're worried about yourself and just being as good as you can be, everything else will take care of it. You'll get where you want to go. You don't have to, this guy doesn't have to fail for you to succeed.

No, and if anything, I always make the argument that I think that the bigger any, the bigger any creator gets, you know, it really is, here it is right here, rising tide does raise all ships. If we bring more viewers and more people into the space, number one, that helps our ballot measures and stuff. Yeah. People against hunting because we have more allies, whether or not they hunt or not.

But also from a content creator side, if, you know, some guy brings in a whole bunch of new audience into the space that's interested in archery and hunting content, all that's going to do is help mine numbers too. Yeah, for sure. So it's not actually a bad thing. I do know how in our heads we can start to get, like, competitive with it. But I do agree with Joe that I think it's actually wise. to try to grow the whole ship, the whole lake. Well, not just that, but just on the business side of it, like, and not even for a selfish reason, but you could call it Carmel, whatever you want to call it, but like if you go out

and granted it be a person that you feel, you know, deserves the help or, you know, the hookup or whatever it is, the connection, you know, because there have been times that if James is like, I probably shouldn't have like offered this person to this company or whatever. But say it is a person and you give them that connection, you introduce them in that text message or email or whatever, you know, nine times out of 10, that person's going to come back and they're going to appreciate that. And, you know, they're going to look to help you out at some point. So why would we, you know, put our boot on their neck and say like, you're staying down so I can go up? Because there's going to be a time where that boot's going to be on your neck. Yeah. And maybe it's that person who could remove that boot and why would they want to at that point when you just burned them however long ago.

Yeah. So I think rising tides raise all ships is a great phrase just because I think that ultimately everybody ends up benefiting in the long run. And companies will come up with more money. They'll figure out where to get the money from, you know, if they want both you and somebody else on the team. If you're valuable. Yeah. you're valuable and if the lake's growing. Yeah. Yeah, that's, when I think back on me, you know, not being good at that

and not understanding that is so well. It's like, me and Waddell right there, that was like 2004 or something like that. And we were both shooting there for Under Armour. I'm acting like I'm his buddy right there. He was like my enemy. He was like competition.

And he called me and he's just like, he said, hey, you know, my contract's coming up. I know we're dealing this underarm. or let's be on the same page and like, you know, here's where I think we could offer. And he's talked about like the bass fishermen kind of worked together on these sponsorships. So everybody kind of knew about like what what the market was.

And my attitude at that time was like, I'm not fucking telling you anything. I'm getting mine. Yeah. You know, because he was actually bigger than me at that. He was like as big as it gets. Out huge. And so I looked at him like, no, I want to be where you're at. So no.

I maybe pretended like, oh, yeah, that sounds good. I remember he called me. I remember I was talking to him in like one of our first houses on the phone. And I wasn't authentic. I was being fake and I was being, you know, conniving. And I wasn't being real. And now, you know, we talked about that and how we were kind of, you know, in competition with each other all those years ago.

And now we just want to celebrate each other, you know. when when he went on rogan i was as happy as anybody yeah because fucking waddell was on rogan yeah and that was that's huge for hunting so i haven't been perfect i just want people to know like no one has i don't have the fucking answers i'm flawed just like anybody i might like i'm all about everybody winning today tomorrow i might be like fuck that guy and that's not right either you know so it's like i'm still working on this myself but i just know in the end It works like and there's some people that I would say when we talked about it like the if you work hard it'll take care of itself. Well like with Sitka, I fucking worked my ass off wasn't enough. You know, I'm not with sick anymore. So can you get like, then I'm like, am I too expensive now? Because I've worked too hard now. I've priced myself out of the industry. So it's like whatever. I mean if if that's a negative where you. you got too big to where they can't pay you,

that's still a win. Yeah. That's still a win for me. I don't, I don't care. But it's like being involved in something like this that takes so much work and you got to earn your breaks. You have to have people believe in you. You have to do things the right way

because eventually it comes out. If you're not treating people right, that's gonna come out. Everybody's gonna find out about it and you're not gonna get to where you wanna go. So I just think just talking about it, hopefully helps somebody. Because I'm not, as I said, I'm not sitting here and saying, I have all the answers and I've done it perfect.

I've fucked up every which way you can. I just want to share my mistake, so hopefully it helps others. Yeah. And I actually love recently that, you know, especially that episode with Greg and so, you know, the one, the couple we've done together, I haven't obviously heard them all. But like, I love that you are open about the business stuff. And we try to be as well because, you know, we're sort of earlier in the game, you know, so we can kind of help. help out maybe the up-and-comers that are, you know, trying to break in a little bit. And you, you know, have been in forever.

And now you have these huge, you know, big deals that you're talking about. So I think it's important to talk about that stuff to let the, you know, the Kayla who's 25 or 26 and she's on the up come on the upswing. It's important to let them know that it is possible. Yeah. Because if no one ever talks about it and it's all secretive, then it's like, yeah, I know. That's how it's always been. Yeah, and I don't like that.

We have to make decisions what's best for the business. You know, and that's every, that's every company here. So it's just good understanding that. And you can't take business decisions personally, which I used to all the time. And I would feel hurt if somebody didn't want to renew or didn't believe in me. And now I'm just like, it's the way it goes. That's life. Yeah, I do that as I've, you know, been doing this stuff on my own now for almost a or a little over a year.

I'm still again in that like in that phase of I you have to know your value or try to figure out what your value is for whatever it is your offer and just finding that alone is hard especially when you're just starting out because you feel automatically like you're not as good as like this company that has 30 workers that does the same thing you do and offers the same quality of work or whatever but you're just a one man show you don't. You're not a, you know, S-core, C-core, whatever. And so immediately, and James gets me on this all of the time, he's like, you undervalue yourself, like, nobody's business. But then you get so timid because you're like, well, I don't want to be turned down. I don't want to, you know, because there's always that feeling like, are they turning you down because you just cost too much? Or are they turning you down then because you're brand new in this? And they don't feel like you can accomplish what they need or you don't have the skill to do it. And so then you start offering, you know, you start rambling.

You're like, well, I could do it for this much. And by the end of it, you're, you know, valuing yourself at a quarter of what you're worth. It's easy to do. And at the end of the day, you just have to be like, nope, this is my value. I can negotiate within a certain limit if I know that, like, what I do is going to eventually prove to them that here's, you know, monetarily what I've brought in for you. So now we can work up. we'll start with a short-term contract, whatever, all the cases, you know, that you could,

you could argue in there. But I have to still say, like, I can't go below this point because then, I mean, you're just cutting yourself down at that point. And so I'm still, I still struggle with having to, like, put that cap at, like, I can't go beyond this. It's difficult. There's times where I've had to look at different deals and say, okay, I'll prove my, even though I've proven myself for over 30 years,

I haven't proven myself to you yet. So let me do that. So sometimes it's that too. Yeah. Yeah. And I think that's just necessary sometimes. And it does, I think, it proves your value and it creates this level of like trust and respect within the whoever you're working with that you're willing that to,

you know, cut them that essentially deal or whatever it is. And like for me, it's just in the marketing world and say, okay, I brought an X amount of dollars for you were at the time of renegotiation for a contract. You know, I cut off X amount, but I'm willing to bump it up to this because you were able to prove that what you do is valuable to them, whether it's putting a number on it or whatever the case may, views, whatever the case may be. And so like James says that was fine, and especially when it comes to like renewal time and you're going through all the analytics and like, oh, that's a rough time.

Oh, that's my favorite, buddy. It's a lot of work, but I love nothing more than, all right, here's some channels that I know. Channels are creators, I know you're probably paying more than me right now, and here's their numbers stacked against ours and amount of posts. And I always, I always like where those end up most time, but engagement in it, views, watch time, all of those things. And your stuff's like perfect for that because you, you, both of us actually, you have a lot of different ships going on. You got the Instagram, you know, the YouTube, where all. all the different socials and, you know, it's just a dense package, you know. And it's the more well-rounded you could be, you know, we post on everything, right?

Five, five, six platforms plus Spotify, Apple. Like, there's a lot of stuff. And, you know, if you're a one-trick pony and all you have is, you know, just TikTok, well, brands are, you know, what happens if your TikTok gets hacked? And now you have nothing, you know, it's, it's tough. So I think the more saturated you could be across all the different platforms, a new ones pop up. up all the time. It's like a moving target. It's like playing whack-a-mole trying to keep up with all these platforms popping up. But then, I mean, if let's just say our YouTube got deleted or something, well, at least we have four other platforms that we can rebuild off or are already good size. You know what I mean?

So I think that's another big factor that maybe some up-and-comers are missing is putting all their eggs in one basket rather than trying to grow a bunch of them. Yeah. And I'll add on to that too, where you've, you've kind of done this. The reason why I'm bigger than most in the hunting industry is because I was able to tap into running, lifting, shooting, bow hunting, celebrity type, you know, involvement with hunting. And so I gained people through all those channels, right? If you're just an archer, you got one shot of people. So you going indoor is actually really, it's kind of like what I've done, but still an archery,

but it's indoor and hunting. And then there can be outdoor too. You can actually have three different people that follow you for those three different reasons. Different crowds of people coming. That makes the pot that much bigger, right? So being diversified in your message, but then also you have to be able to convert those people to consumers. That's all the businesses care about. like are people buying our product because of you yeah that's that's hard to prove that's the question

that's hard to prove so what i used to always do back in the day before we had like instagram would be analytics i'd always i knew how they worked how they'd be like per thousand dollars here's your impressions so i would go through how many books i sold how many magazine articles i'd written how many tv shows i had appeared on add up all those impressions right and then Per thousand, per thousand dollars, if you pay me, you know, $1,000, you get this many impressions. If you pay me, you know, 100,000, you get this many impressions, right? So it's like, it's just impressions per thousand because that's what they understand. They understand numbers and reach.

Yep. And the more eyeballs you get to, then that's the greater likelihood, a certain percentage of those is going to buy their product. So it's like you have to get out in front of people. How do you get in out in front of the most people? Well, that has to be diversified message because there's people. in the hunting industry right now that they grew and now they're they're falling off because more competition comes in so they're losing some people their message isn't any different it's they're doing the exact same thing they've always done but there's more competition so they're

going backwards any sponsor's going to be like well you're a fucking has been yeah yeah you were you were hot now you're down here yeah so you got to hustle dude if you want to stay i mean you know i think your example of you doing the running stuff and then also like the stuff you've done with high profile people I think is is a perfect example or us on the on the target stuff like I told you in the car for me it had always been on the schedule to at some point do a competition arc in the content and you know bring in a whole fresh batch of eyes that had never seen our stuff because they're into competition and indoor and 3D ASA stuff and now we've absorbed a lot of that audience and we're going to continue to do so by pushing into that which it not

only helps us, but it helps the sport of Target archery as well. I can't tell you how many people we met that are like, oh, dude, I just got into Target because I was watching your stuff. Target's tiny. It's tiny. You have compared to hunting. And I love, I love being around people in here and I'm having them come up and say, I'm only here at Vegas because I was watching your stuff and I wanted to give it a try. And we'd only done it for six weeks. Imagine next year with a year in, right? And then in the future, I have more plans like, okay, in the future we'll pull this lever and, you know, jump, jump into this different pool, right? And you've got to always kind be hitting that moving target and having foresight to know because you can't you can't it's hard to do

the exact same thing forever right even like you know jim shocky i think the best show i love that show uncharted he did right very very good but notice jim only did it for a couple seasons and then he morphed it into something else jim's always done that right sort of changed what he's doing and i think you have to do that and always be evolved better and evolve along the way yeah yeah no and he and also at that time so brandon was basically making the best produced films and TV shows in the industry easily like if you went to the golden moose awards it was like the shocky awards yeah right they won everything that doesn't last forever yeah that shit does not last forever so you better be always thinking how do we evolve yep and it's uh if you're not then you're you know you're a flash in the pan and then

gone yeah so just to stick around you better be hustling yeah it's uh it's fun you're you're You got anything over there? No. You guys covered it. You fucking idiot. Is he on his phone doom scrolling over there? I just looked at Google Trends and there's nothing good. Is AI going to kill the entire environment?

No, AI sucks. I think people are like, James, how about this? So you're gay porn? Do you watch real gay porn or AI? People look really real. Depends if the people haven't given me something real, then I have to go. go to AI. Yeah.

People like real. I think it's going to make real even more valuable is a point. Once I'm on like page 18 or 19 of Pornhub, I know it's about time to go to AI. Yeah. That's when you're in the shadow realm, dude. Once you hit about page 15, you're really searching for that hidden gem, dude. They got that many pages? Oh, dude.

I'm an easy sell, I guess. But what about all these people who keep saying that AI, there's a lot of articles out Apparently, I was informed that AI is sucking up all the water in the environments that they're, they're, whatever you call those like departments. They just banned data centers in 42 counties, I think. So people definitely don't want them. It just depends whether or not representatives listen to us, which they have a history of not doing. They don't really care what we want. It doesn't feel like anymore.

I just think that like, I mean, it's 2026. and when was the first, you know, spacecraft launched to space. Allegedly, like what? Yeah, that's a whole other time. We've had hot debates about this. Was the moon landing real? Yeah. And then before that, like, you know, World War I, I mean, 126-ish years ago, and we're still

like stabbing people with bayonets, you know? So we're all like freaking out about the water's getting absorbed for these AI, you know, headquarters or whatever, data centers. How long is that going to last before AI is, hits its next evolution? And is this, computers is the biggest example here. Computer used to be the size of this room. Right, exactly. And how long did it take for it to get to my cell phone?

How many years did that take? Here's the thing too is a lot of people think these data centers are for AI. I don't think that's the case at all because one data center can contain all of human history and they're searching on the internet. Yeah. These data centers are to keep our personal data, what they've been collecting ever since the internet started. And to keep that, to keep how you search, like where your eyes go on your phone, now our iPhones do facial recognition. It's not to get into your phone. It's because they're watching how you interact with these apps.

Do you know you can literally move around on your iPhone with your eyeballs? I just learned this a few weeks ago. So you can go into your settings, set it up. You do this little test. So it follows your eyeballs around. You like follow this dot around on the screen. And then once it's done, it's not that great. But I guarantee you within the next couple of years just because they just introduced it that it'll be perfect.

That you can scroll with your eyeballs. You can open up tabs with your eyeballs. Like you don't touch the screen at all. So like you just look at it. And in the corner, there's this little thing over here. So say you want to like close that screen and open up another one. You just look with your eyeballs over to that. It opens up a tab, shows you multiple little options of what you want to do.

You look at that with your eyeballs. It opens it. I was like, I haven't even touched my screen once. This is insane. My eyeballs are doing everything. But so if that has just come around that quickly, then like how quick computers went from the size of a room to my iPhone. How quickly are these, you know, AI data centers going to be sucking up all the water in the environment before they, they are also the size of, you know, a computer modem.

Keep saying sucking and James is going to get all. I saw him over there. I'm starting to tingle up right now. He's not poor and I'm pulled up right now. That eye test is why his whole algorithm is Hogwatch. Isn't it? Spandex hogwatch? Like that's his whole, every explorer screen is that.

But mine just knows when to zoom. Yeah. Your eyes are telling it too. Yeah, I mean, here's an interesting question, is if our society today crumbled in a thousand years, how would anybody prove that we had the internet? Maybe the data centers? Well, I mean, if we crumbled, though, in a thousand years, nobody's using them, don't you think they would? Well, is it this why they say the lizard people, like live underwater? Yeah, that's who controls our planet, it's the lizard people.

Supposedly Gavin Newsom's a lizard person. I would, I could believe it. I think he is. Yeah. The lizard people are apparently from like there's a, gosh, Brandon went down this crazy loophole with me one day and attack. And I was, I was down a rabbit hole of like the lizard people are essentially from the future, but it's not the future. We live on like this loop kind of thing. It's like a Christopher Nolan movie.

If you made a movie, I wouldn't be able to follow it. That's the problem. But like the lizard people are from kind of the future. and so they had technology far beyond us, which is why they've been able to stick around but live underwater. Okay. And are able to be undetected.

Yeah. Do you have any tinfoil in here? Where's the tinfoil in here? The lizard people. We're not still recording. Brianna. Off the rails right now. Well, it was a wild thing.

How many lip pillows did you have? I know. Well, they might have contained more than nicotine, apparently. Jeez, O.P. Martha. Yeah. But it was a wild topic. Yeah.

I went down that rabbit hole. There's not a lot of evidence. Did the rabbit hole have water in the bottom of it and lizard people hiding down? They actually took me in. Introduced me to them. I mean, that's exactly what a lizard person would say. James takes in his buddies. Don't you?

Take them all in? Yeah. Yeah. I help all of them into. my rabbit hole. Oh my god. Into my rabbit, into my rabbit holes.

Oh, my goodness. And that shit talker's episode 32, it's been, dude, are you kidding me, bro?

We're off the meals right now. Yeah, he's just mad. He can only do DP instead of triple pantry. Oh my goodness.

I love it. I got ear holes. Is this the most chaotic? Oh, shit. Look at you. There are micros out there that would fit in there.

You know. And it's all love. It's all love. Yeah. No, this is not even close to the most off the rails we've been. Oh my goodness. No, we've went way too far. This doesn't even have to be edited. Yeah. I love it. Just fucking posted. Yeah, just post it. Just another Tuesday. Just post it. Yeah. Well, this has been fun, you guys. Shit. Been, you gotta end on the lizard people. I know. Shooting bows and having fun and talking shit. Yeah. Does, hey, does that, does life get any better? No, it doesn't. It doesn't. No. I'm super thankful you guys swung by.

Um, yeah, so since Botech's leaving, this would be the last time probably. Yeah. I know. Now I got to come up just to visit you alone, you know. Why are you up here? Well, I just driving through town. Yeah. Oh, I, well, okay, to be honest, I'm so happy for you guys' success.

I'm glad you guys are crushing it. It's, I love seeing that. I love seeing all the fun stuff you're doing. I watch your, you know, you're, when you're shooting, when you're, whatever post you make, I just love, you know, you're hustling. And it's like, it's that's the key people sit and wait for things to happen you're making it happen both you guys and it's like i love to see it and you're being rewarded and it's just makes me feel good so i'm very

thankful for both of you i'm thankful for the time we spent together today and i just want to continue success for you so keep it up dude same to you yeah appreciate you guys and uh yeah i'm super grateful that you you know when i message you gave us that shot now you know i'd consider us having a friendship you know and i just love it so i appreciate it And of course, I always love watching you win. And I'm always rooting to see us keep, keep going, baby. Let's just keep running it up. We will.

We will. All right, guys, that wraps it up. That shit talkers 301 or two or whatever the fuck it is. Keep hammering. Keep hammering.