Candace - Another Person Fired for criticizing Israel?! My Interview With Briahna Joy Gray | Candace Ep 5

Episode Date: June 14, 2024

Briahna Joy Gray joins me to discuss her recent firing from The Hill and how the criticism of Israel seems to be the only true red line on a bipartisan basis nobody is allowed to cross.  American Financing Act today! Call 800-795-1210 or visit http://www.AmericanFinancing.net/Owens NMLS182334, nmlsconsumeraccess.org. APR for rates in the 5s start at 6.799% for well qualified borrowers. Call 800-795-1210 for details about credit costs and terms. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

All right, guys, happy Friday. Nothing too controversial today. Just one question. Is America a sovereign nation or are we being controlled by Israel? I know, I know that question someday is probably going to get me arrested. I know this anti-Semitism bill is making its way through Congress. And yeah, I don't know if we're going to be able to have free speech anymore. So let me get it all out while there's still time. Well, what we have coming up for you is Breonna Joy Gray. She's the former press secretary to Bernie Sanders. And she probably has something to say about that question because she was recently fired from The Hill. She claims it's because she criticized Israel. Is Breonna just anti-Semitic? I'm going to let you decide because I believe that you can decide

when you hear people in their own words. That's what's coming up today on Candace. All right, so it's getting pretty weird out there. I think we can all agree. You know, I'm not going to say it, but like, you know, it seems like our country is being held hostage by Israel. Okay. I'm going to get in so much trouble for that. I don't even care. It's, it's, it's something's cracking. It's catalyzing. The conversation is moving because we are seeing people that are having their entire livelihoods destroyed for critiquing a foreign nation. That is an absurdity. You know what else is an absurdity? Think about this. In 2020, the United States government announced that it was considering banning the Chinese social media platform TikTok. That was upon

a request from then President Donald Trump. He viewed TikTok as a national security threat. So he signed an executive order that same year, banning TikTok in just 45 days if it was not sold. And guess what happened? That executive order got blocked. The app survived until the app got on the wrong side of Israel. You guys remember this? After October 7th, things on TikTok weren't trending in the pro-Israel way. In fact, it was very much trending in the pro-Palestinian way. And the ADL's John Greenblatt said, yeah, no, this is a problem and we have to deal with it. Let me jog your memory. Here's what he said. The same brains that gave us all these other amazing innovations need to put our energy toward this, like, fast. Because, again, like, we've been chasing this left-right divide.

It's the wrong game. The real game is the next generation. Seems like a really nice guy. He just needs to deal with this generational problem that is TikTok. And, boy, did he move fast. Yeah, the anti-Semitism bill, which is horrific, made its way through the House and it got passed somehow. Yeah, forget your First Amendment, guys.

If you've got something to say about Israel, yeah, you're going to be in big trouble. Forget your First Amendment. If you even accuse someone who is Jewish of having more allegiance to Israel than they do to America, you are going to be in trouble. Forget the First Amendment, you guys. If you have any inclination as a Christian that you have a right to believe in the story of Jesus Christ, that is our doctrine, he's our Lord, he's our Savior, well, you better be very careful if you're going to talk about how the Jews played any sort of role in his persecution. Yeah, because that's what's in the anti-Semitism bill. Being a Christian

will pretty much be banned if it gets passed. So yeah, things are pretty strange. And it makes sense when you consider the fact that Thomas Massey, my favorite congressman in the entire world, because he seems to be the only one that will stand up to AIPAC, recently went on Tucker Carlson and he had this to say. Take a listen. Everybody but me has an AIPAC person. What does that mean? An APAC person? It's like your babysitter, your APAC babysitter who, uh, is always talking to you for APAC. They're probably a constituent in your district, but they are, you know, firmly embedded in APAC. And every member has something like this. Every, I don't know how it works on the Democrat side. Um, but that's how it works on the Republican side.

And when they come to D.C., you go have lunch with them. And they've got your cell number and you have conversations with them. So I've had like. That's absolutely crazy. I've had four members of Congress say, I'll talk to my APAC person. And it's really what we call them, my APAC person. And it's literally what we call them, my APAC guy. I'll talk to my APAC guy and see if I can get him to, you know, dial those ads back. I'll talk to my APAC person. I was going to talk to you guys about this topic, but I got to go call my APAC person because I got to see what

I'm allowed to say. Does that seem normal to you? He goes on later to talk about how they should have to register, obviously, because you have a foreign country that is impacting American politics and that should be illegal. But of course, Thomas Massey is playing in some, wading into some dangerous water, so to speak, because we know that there was once a president who wanted to make AIPAC register as foreign. And he ended up shot, coincidentally ended up shot. So Thomas Massey better be careful. And it's not just what's happening down in D.C. It's also what's happening in media. We are seeing people get plucked, plucked, plucked, not because they're anti-Semitic, but because they're not pro-Israel enough. They're not happy, I guess, when an innocent Palestinian kid dies. That's what it seems like. If you are not completely doing the work of AIPAC and if you are not willing to support every action that Bibi Netanyahu does, then the media will perpetuate you as an anti-Semite who should lose everything. And that

is wrong. And there is somebody who claims that she recently just went through that. As I told you at the top, her name is Brianna Joy Gray, and she was fired. According to the headlines, it was because of her shocking response to the sister of a Hamas hostage. I'm going to let you hear what Brianna said to the sister of the Hamas hostage. And tell me if you're completely shocked by it. Take a listen to Brianna while she was at the Hill interviewing this young woman. I'm just going to push back against the implication that in Michigan, which has the largest Muslim and Arab population in America, that there is any threat of terrorism from our own people. And I would like to clarify also that

one of the rationale that was presented for 9-11 was discussed with America's support of Israel's continued occupation of Palestine. So that's neither here nor there. I really do hope that Netanyahu agrees and Israel agrees to the ceasefire deal that could bring all the hostages, including your sister, home. And I'm sure many people watching are praying for her safety. Thank you. Me too. And I really hope that you specifically will believe women when they say that they got hurt. All right.

Thanks for joining. Stick around. More Rising coming up next. There it is. Shocking. She seems to have rolled her eyes when the young woman told her to believe women. I mean, that hashtag, just believe women, of course, is something that makes me roll my eyes as well. We want to believe our hard facts and we want to be able to discern what is actually happening. But I'm not going to contextualize anything that I'm going to allow her to speak on behalf of herself. We'll have that coming up for you guys in just a second. Well, I can tell you one thing that happens when you get fired. You start to worry about your everyday bills. And I can tell you that, unfortunately, that's the climate for a lot

of Americans right now. It's just gas prices so high, food prices so high. And if you own a home, yeah, you're probably thinking a lot about whether or not you can afford those bills as well. And if you're thinking about that, I want you to call my friends at American Financing. Interest rates have dropped into the fives, which is nearly a quarter of the average credit card rate. American Financing is saving their customers an average of $854 a month by tapping into their home's equity and wiping out high interest credit card debt. $854 a month is like a $10,000 raise. Credit card interest rates are insane and most of us are still carrying a balance from month to month. So call American Financing and take care of that today. If you call today, you may not have

to make next month's mortgage payment. Call American Financing at 800-795-1210. That's 800-795-1210. Or visit AmericanFinancing.net slash Owens. All right, ladies and gentlemen, we just showed you the clip and monologue of Breonna Joy Gray. You heard what she had to say, obviously speaking to a victim's sister. I thought she sounded compassionate. I didn't see the interview before I read the headlines. The headline that I saw reads, this is from the Daily Mail, Breonna Joy Gray is fired after her shocking response to sister of Hamas hostage. So I was like, wow, what did Breonna say? She must have just been off the rails crazy. It's not what I got. Very, very excited, Breonna, to have you join us here today.

I know you're in the midst of a firestorm. How are you doing? I'm doing all right. And I really do appreciate you reaching out, Candice, as someone who has been through this not so unique experience. I was going to say unique experience, but increasingly it's happening as I think more and more journalists who might not have focused on this particular issue in the past find themselves doing so, informing themselves and finding themselves on the quote unquote wrong side of this issue when it comes to censorship. So I really do appreciate you reaching out.

And it's interesting to have you and I speaking because we are not on the same side of the political aisle. I mean, you are a person, your background, you were the spokesperson for the Bernie Sanders campaign. I mean, I was very much identified as a Trump supporter about as far as you could beat in the media's eyes when he was running in 2016. And yet we do find ourselves allied in the belief that people in America should be able to criticize the actions of foreign governments without having their entire livelihoods risked. This is not normal. And yet there are so many people who know, like I know and like you know, that if you are in media, you got to be careful talking about Israel. Why is that? free speech except for when it comes to Israel, progressive except for when it comes to Palestine. I mean, there is this Palestine-sized hole or exception in a lot of people's principled stance

against various issues. And I say progressive except for Palestine because there are similarly people on the left who say that they care about various groups, who say that they are anti-war, but who very similarly will look the other way or frankly become very oppositional when suddenly the people that we're talking about who are being under siege in a conflict are in fact Palestinian. Yeah, and it's particularly interesting to see the way the media reports on these incidents. And I see it already in how they're speaking about your firing because they don't actually say what it is that you said that was controversial. I saw this when Alpha Daily Wire, Andrew Klavan does this episode.

He's like she was saying things in a way, but he can't actually point to what I said because actually there was something that I said that was controversial. Unless you view a certain race to be just above and above critique really is what it is. If you view a certain race to be above critique. And I found that when I was being lied upon by a man named Rabbi Barclay. I mean, he lied so badly about me that PJ Media wound up taking the article down after I interviewed him, because I was genuinely curious. Like, how could you, you say you're a rabbi, you're supposed to be a leader in your community, and you're a rabbi, you're supposed to be a leader in your community and you're publishing lies about things that I never said. And when he spoke to me, he was very honest. And I realized, okay, he's actually just a racial supremacist. He's telling

me that he believes that, you know, if Jewish blood is shed, it does in fact matter more. When it is Jewish history, it matters more. And I appreciated his honesty. And I could see why we were going to be on the wrong side of this issue, because I don't believe in racial supremacy, whether it's coming from BLM leaders talking about their list of demands for white people. I don't believe in racial supremacy if it's white people. And I certainly am not going to accept it if it's Jewish people. I just that's not something that anyone should accept. Well, it'll come as no surprise to you, Candice, that I feel differently about,

when we get more specific about your qualms with BLM. But with respect to Israel, I do think that what has become increasingly clear to people is that the ideology that sort of justifies a Jewish state created in the middle of an Arab land really requires a commitment to basically expelling, ethnically cleansing, and even committing what has been described by the ICJ as a plausible genocide against the population so that there can be a Jewish majority. And I know that's a sort of uncomfortable fact, but it's one that I think many people are coming to when you start to question why it is that Israel has made the choice to treat 5 million people who are in constructively occupied territory in both the West Bank and Gaza as second-class citizens for years and years, not to mention the 20% of Israel's population who are subject to about 60 different laws that discriminate against them in terms of housing, employment, and in other kinds of arenas. And it all comes down to when you start to listen to people explain why they think it's acceptable to, for example, kill over 270 Palestinians and murder so many children the way we saw just a few days ago in Gaza to rescue three hostages. You have people very openly saying it's justified. It would have been justified to kill 500, 1,000 Palestinians if it meant

getting three hostages back. And I certainly understand prioritizing hostage exchange. And this is what I told to the sister of the hostage that I spoke to on Rising last week. Certainly, if you want to prioritize hostage exchange, I agree with that. And we should be talking about the protests that are being put on by the families of hostages in Israel against Netanyahu, because they rightly perceive him as being the primary obstacle to prioritizing hostage exchange over what he has said is his priority, which is eliminating Hamas. All that being said, there are ways to get the hostages back. It is evident and could have gotten back months and months ago if that were in fact the priority. But instead, the cost, the value of Palestinian life is perceived as so cheap as

compared to Israeli lives that we've seen and said that they would rather do these military organizations with the help of the U.S. government using a U.S.-built pier that cost $300,000, was told it was a humanitarian pier, using an action that was in fact a war crime, using a humanitarian vehicle to Trojan horse military officers into a refugee camp and then kill almost 300 Palestinians in the effort to get three hostages back and also losing an Israeli soldier at the same time. Does that really seem worth it? I think the average person says no. And the only reason you come to a yes is if you really very cheaply value lives that are not Israeli. And that's where I'm getting at where I say it actually is, we're talking about how it's just racial supremacy.

You know, I don't know a single person who was not horrified about what happened on October 7th, who obviously wants every hostage to be returned because we value the lives of the innocent full stop. It doesn't matter to me if that's an innocent Palestinian life or whether it's an innocent Israeli life. And as soon as I was saying this is equal to me, suddenly all of these attacks started.

And I really did feel like what was happening after October 7th is very reminiscent to me of what was happening after 9-11 and growing up in the 9-11. And I look back on that time because I realized that there was this sort of media insistence. We didn't have social media. We didn't have other perspectives being given to us. There really was no sense of an independent media. But I look back on that and I realized I was almost brainwashed to believe that Muslim life had no worth. Thinking about how scared I was every time I saw a Muslim wherever I was, whether it was an airport, anywhere. And I actually believe that the media in America was successful in dehumanizing Muslims. I'm not a little girl anymore. I'm an adult. I am

a woman. I'm a mother, which is the most important thing. And I just remember after October 7th, I was I was very due to give birth looking on Twitter and seeing these children. These children happen to have the same complexion as my daughter because I have a mixed child being blown up and then having people tell me that I shouldn't care about that. And I said to myself, OK, I totally understand people wanting to have their hostages returned. I can totally understand people wanting to make sure that their family is safe. But what I cannot understand is how you think you are a good person when you devalue the life of a child. You're a monster. I don't care who you are. I don't care if you're an American commentator.

I don't care if you're a rich billionaire. I don't care if you're the average person on the street. When you applaud one hostage being returned and yet you know thousands of people who are similarly innocent were killed in the process and you go, oh, well, too bad, you become a monster. And I know that there are so many people who agree with me in media who are scared to say that because they are fearful

of having their jobs. They're fearful of losing their jobs, rather. So can you speak to exactly how you found out you were being terminated and on what grounds you were terminated? Yeah, I mean, the email that I posted to Twitter is the entire record of contact that I've had with The Hill. So I usually worked Monday through Thursdays. We had just shifted through a Monday to Wednesday schedule at my insistence, in part because of how hostile the environment had become, not just on air with my co-host, who I'm, you know, obviously, the point of the show is for us to debate, and we have a good working relationship off screen. But with the staff behind the scenes, new producers that had been hired, who ostensibly were there to exert some broader editorial guidance over the show,

but seemed to focus very specifically on minimizing the extent to which we could cover the Israel-Palestine conflict. There were a number of indicators for months now that they were unhappy with the tenor of the show. Obviously, my co-host Robbie was there to push back. I don't know if they found his pushback to be inadequate, but they kept wanting to have specific kinds of guests on the show, which I, of course, was open to. I have never turned down a guest for ideological reasons. I cannot say the same for guests that were aligned with my ideological perspective and my coast, I have to say. But I noticed that when they were trying to find guests that presented a pro-Israel point of view, unlike the kind of guests that I seek to bring on who have some kind of issue area expertise,

let's say because they're a journalist,, let's say because they're a journalist or let's say because whatever tweet that they last seen of mine that they didn't like, which obviously puts me in a really tough position as a host who wants to be gracious and sort of moderate and not get into a back and forth with a guest. But the guests started increasingly coming on with this kind of ideology. So there were indicators like that. I got a message from on high that we were not allowed to interview Norm Finkelstein. I know you sat down with him for a really terrific interview that I watched and I thought was really well done. And the argument was that he was a Holocaust denier.

Norm Finkelstein, as you're aware, is the one whose parents both survived the Holocaust and knows the horrors of the Holocaust much more intimately and personally than most people alive today. And the final straw was when we got an indication that this most recent guest, the sister of a hostage, wanted to come on. It was pitched to me specifically that she wanted to come on to talk to me, not to be interviewed by both myself and my co-host, but that she wanted to talk to me. And to me, that was a clue that it was gonna be another one of these interviews where a guest who has a really legitimate point of view, obviously, as someone who has been living in the limbo of not knowing whether or not someone she loves

more than almost anyone else in the world is safe, that is a perspective we absolutely should have on the show. But I was worried that exactly what happened would happen and that she would turn this into a referendum on my own personal political views and try very specific untruths on a news show that it's my job as a reporter and journalist to push back on and fact check in real time. Yeah, I can't think of anything, you know, grosser than utilizing the victimhood, the true victimhood of your sister to advance a political ideology. That shouldn't be the case, you know. And you are absolutely correct that there does seem to be this media environment

where they are propagandizing. They're propagandizing because if you truly believe in free speech and you truly believe that the best idea wins, then you should have no problem sitting down and having a meaningful debate. Right. So to call Norm Finkelstein a Holocaust denier when his parents survived the Holocaust, it's absurd. It's so absurd. They don't want him on the show. Right. They don't want him on the show because, of course, once he speaks, you realize it's completely ridiculous to make that sort of an accusation. But we're seeing that happen on so many networks that purport to be about free speech. And I am somebody who has moved so much in my political ideology from where I was on the left and then realizing that I felt

I know that we disagree here, that I had it completely wrong, which should show people that I am willing to move, right? If you actually present an idea to me and I find your idea to be valid, I am happy to jump on your side. And yet you see on this one issue, the loudest, most platformed pro-Israel voices don't want to debate. They don't want to debate. I've reached out. I've tried to have people on for a debate. They don't want to debate. And the only people that don't want to debate their ideas while they're sitting and they're talking down to you and they're telling you that they're right and you're wrong and you're an anti-Semite are the people that are lying. That's my view. You're a liar, okay? Because I'm Candace. I don't have all of the degrees that the rest of these people have who think that they're so smart and they're so brilliant.

Wouldn't you just think that you would slam me in a debate? I'm so dumb and you're so smart and you're so wise and you just need to teach us things. If the Israel argument is valid, sit down and debate it with somebody who is against the Israel argument. That's it. And let people watch it and let people observe it and let people move their opinion one way or the other. But I do want to ask you, Brianna, because we don't have much time here. A lot of stuff is also happening in Congress. I don't know if you caught Thomas Massey. He's my favorite congressman ever. I make Thomas Massey stand. He sat down with Tucker Carlson and he said essentially every Republican in Congress except for him has an AIPAC handler, an AIPAC handler. We have seen the strength of AIPAC. We have seen the strength of the ADL.

We we talked about in monologue, which you didn't get to see how Trump couldn't get this thing done. He wanted to ban TikTok, you know, because he had concerns about China. Suddenly, John Greenblatt swoops in and it's gone. It's a TikTok has got to go or at least it passes in the House. And immediately you start to realize who's actually controlling Congress. Yeah. And it's not it's not just Republicans. I followed the Massey-APAC challenge very closely because it mirrors, frankly, the kind

of challenges we've been seeing on the left for quite some time. The left, you know, not liberals you know, liberals who I am frequently a critic of, I think I critique more than any other group, is not what I'm talking about here. I'm talking about real progressives, you know, to the left of Bernie, frankly, have frequently found themselves in the exact same situation as Thomas Massey. Because it is, again, the one and true only red line on a bipartisan basis that nobody on either side of the aisle is allowed to cross. So you've seen these mounting AIPAC challenges from candidates like Anita Turner in Ohio's

11th district. Summer Lee was able to survive her challenge. You're seeing Jamal Bowman in New York getting challenged along these lines. And you're seeing a lot of, I know that you have an interest in kind of the craven weaponization of identity politics and the exploitation of race to lend cover to what are frankly, in this case, kind of a foreign policy agenda, but are often sort of corporate policy agendas. And there's often overlap between the two. As we're talking about Israel, we cannot talk about defense contracting and Boeing and why there is so much incentive to continue this war along with so many others.

But what you see is that particularly people like Richie Torres, Congress members who are black and brown, are often weaponized to advance the interests of Israel in this case. Hakeem Jeffries, also from New York, frequently famously says Israel is the sixth borough. Mayor Adams, unsurprisingly, is a big advocate for Israel. And I think they try to disguise the extent to which there is a conflict of interest there between the average working class American and the interests that are being pushed by a foreign lobby by dressing it up in the veneer of a trusted Black representative. On the other hand, and I think we talked about this a little bit before we started recording, those Black representatives and leaders, political leaders that don't fall in line are subject to particular scrutiny and particularly forceful pushback. And I think that's part of what you experience,

is part of what I experienced. The Stop Antisemitism account recently decided to post a picture of a random black high school student who had said that they want to free Palestine, really targeting in particular black people because I think they're capitalizing on this stereotype that because there is, I think, a longstanding tradition of Black people kind of empathizing with the situation of Palestinians, because frankly, it is familiar that we have historically also been tarred with the label anti-Semite. And it's a method to effectively shut down conversations about this issue. That's exactly right. And I do actually totally agree with you that there does seem this particular targeting of black American voices. And I can't figure that out. I don't know why it is, but you're labeled anti-Semite from Michael Jackson. Me, and I'm

going, what are you talking about? There's literally no record of this. I've worked for Jewish companies my entire life. How did I just become a raging anti-Semite simply because I have questions about what is happening to these innocent Palestinian children and why we are treating them like their lives don't matter. Again, my position is that what we're seeing operating in the media are racial supremacists. And I think that they're taking the wrong side here. I feel it. You can sense it in the air. People are starting to ask questions. People are seeing what is happening to people. There seems to be an awakening on this issue. And let me tell you, if this awakening speeds up, and I think it is, it's death of children as long as they get back one person, as opposed to saying, no, this conflict needs to come to an end because too many children are dying.

I have no regrets in what I've said. I have no regrets in the way that I've been treated in the media because at the end of the day, my relationship doesn't matter with the boss. It matters with God. And they are all going to have to account to God one day. And you can see these psychopaths in media, you know, that are trying to sell you something different and tell you that there's something wrong with you or you're perverted because you feel bad for a dead child that you are seeing on your screen. Yeah, I wouldn't want to be those people when you have to meet the ultimate boss one day and really account for what you've created and, you know, throughout your life. Yeah, Candace, I would love to just speak to that Jewish supremacy point, if I could, to clarify for some people who might hear that phraseology and find it to be a little bit dissonant. I just want to say that, obviously, I think we can all understand that any supremacy movement is a problem. It is, we are, I think, so rightly appalled by the horrors of the Holocaust, and we have been so, that has been emphasized and taught to us so strongly in our education as we grow up, rightly so, that I think the idea of even thinking about Jewish supremacy is sometimes difficult to wrap your brain around because we're so focused on the opposite, right?

Anti-Semitism and the relatively recent historical tragedy that ended up killing two-thirds of the world's Jewish population in a horrible Holocaust, right? You know, and I want to just really address that dissonance because what I'm talking about, and I think what you were talking about when we're talking about supremacy, is an ideology that I think is required to support Zionism, but which is not fundamental to Judaism as a whole. Correct. And there has been this effort-

Judaism is not Zionism. Right. There's been this effort to conflate the two because we all abhor the notion of being anti-Semitic, right? And I think there is a sensitivity to that that Zionists are aware of. And so they know that it's easier to, you know, marginalize someone for being anti-Semitic than anti-Zionist because what is Zionism? Zionism is a particular political belief that thinks that there should be a Jewish state established in a part of the world that is overwhelmingly Arab. And when you do that, it requires you to establish a democratic majority to not allow Palestinians to, for instance, have the right of return. That a Jewish person who was

born in New York or Philadelphia or Iowa is able to have the right, even if they've never stepped foot in that region, to move there, whereas a Palestinian who has keys to the house that they owned before they were expelled in the Nakba in 1948 is not allowed to visit the country, where Palestinians who work in Israel via work permits are forced to wait for hours at checkpoints or who need to get better hospital care if it is available to them in the occupied territories have to wait even if their health is imperiled because there's different roads and different rules for Palestinians, for Arabs in Israel. This is an apartheid state. It's a two-tiered state that specifically gives different rights, superior

rights to people who are Jewish as opposed to people who are Muslim and Arab. And I say Arab and Muslim separately because there are Christian Arabs in Gaza who have their churches being bombed, who are themselves being killed. Justin Amash, a libertarian former Congress member, had multiple family members killed by U.S.-backed airstrikes earlier in this conflict. And you almost heard nothing about it, no condemnations from Congress for a former sitting U.S. Congress member, Palestinian American Congress members, own young family members being massacred by Israeli bombs with American political cover. That's what we're talking about here. And all of the problems of the region can be traced back to the insistence that Palestinians and Jewish Israelis cannot have the same rights within the state of Israel. Because if that happened, there would be demographic parity, the same number of Palestinians as Israelis. And that would, we're told, necessarily imperil the safety of Jewish Israelis. Now, let me ask you this, Candace,

does it make sense to you to simultaneously be making an argument that Israel is a democratic country that we should be loving and supporting? Because look, 20% of the population is Arab and we all live peacefully. Isn't that wonderful? But also to be making the argument that we can't have any more Palestinians because they're inherently violent. They're inherently regressive. They will ruin our society if they come into the country. That's what I'm speaking to when I talk about this dehumanization of Palestinians that's happening right now in the media. It's disgusting. And like I said, you know, I would say I'm agnostic on the issue. I want to learn more, which is why I'm trying to have a debate with somebody who is radically pro know, radically pro-Zionist. I don't have an issue with the fact that you're radically

pro-Zionist. What I have an issue with is that you speak down to people as if you are a superior and you won't debate your ideas, right? I have an issue with the fact that you are speaking about, you know, the Arab population, who, by the way, are Semitic. You're talking about anti-Semitism and these are Semitic people. You're speaking about them in this way that makes me uncomfortable. You know, my grandfather grew up in a segregated South. I'm not comfortable with the way you're speaking about them. And when you try to shut down my conversation and you speak to me in that same way, you are acting like a racial supremacist. And we have to have the courage to call that out. And of course, it's not all Jewish people. Some

people genuinely just are like, I want the hostages to be returned. You know, I am concerned. You know, I followed some Jewish influencers who have been so understanding. You know, there are people that you listen to them and you're like, this makes sense. They're not being pushy. They're not being supremacist. They are obviously concerned. They grew up in Israel. You know, their family grew up in Israel as Jews, you know, because this was after 1945 or, you know, within the last 30 years. And they are not disgusting in the way that they are talking about this issue. But it feels like a lot of people in the media are. And that's what makes me uncomfortable. They are very disgusting and matter of fact, and oh, well, we've got bigger

bombs and who cares how many Muslims you kill? I care because I'm a Christian and I'm not comfortable with the amount of death that is happening to children. How dare I call myself a pro-life conservative and then stay mum on this issue? How dare I call myself a Christian, a child of God, and then be mum on this issue because I care about money? And so that's kind of where I want people to really consider listening to this podcast. Are you comfortable with the amount of death of innocent children? And to check yourself, have you been brainwashed to believe that it doesn't matter if an Arab child is killed? Are you comfortable? And let me also push you on this to my listeners. If you say it's okay when a state does this, then you better hope you remain friends with that state, because if they ever turn their arms against you and you've already set the groundwork for believing that it does not matter when innocent children are murdered, when they are waking up to bombs being dropped on them, then you're going to have to stand by those words. Okay? Yeah. I mean, I would also point out, I think your point about children is really well made.

I remember, I believe you were pregnant when you were talking with Norm Finkelstein, and I could tell how much you were impacted by him, you know, also bringing up the lack of maternal health care that's available. I mean, maternal health care, forget that. I mean, clean water and food available to so many pregnant women in Gaza, babies that have been born into this conflict who have been killed by this conflict. I mean, the whole thing is terrible. But we're also having new reporting just over the last few days about a torture camp that exists in Israel where, and I'm sorry this is so graphic, but Palestinian men have been having metal electric rods inserted into their rectums as a kind of torture. We've had ample reports of rapes that are substantiated. And I got to say, I'm sorry, there have been ample reports discrediting the New York Times reporting about the, quote unquote, mass rapes that happened on October 7th, including most recently in the Times of London, really destroying all of the sources that were used in that initial reporting. Reporting that was so controversial even within the New York Times that its own podcast, daily podcast department, declined to do a podcast on the story because it

was so riddled with obvious inconsistencies and reporting errors. So that was headline news. That was front page news. When Joe Biden lied about there being 40 beheaded babies, that was front page news. And the retraction is just a blip. His people coming forward and saying, oh, he didn't actually see that. It didn't actually happen. That's just a blip. And meanwhile, the Times finally reported on this torture camp where they're sodomizing Palestinian prisoners. It's at the bottom of a lengthy article that did not get the above the fold treatment that the original reporting did. And so, again, you're seeing the asymmetry and the value of life.

One other point that The Intercept and some other organizations have been tracking the use of language when describing Palestinian deaths versus Israeli deaths. And words like barbaric, savage, horrible, kind of more emotive words are used 60 times as frequently when discussing Hamas killing Israelis versus Israelis killing Palestinian civilians. And so we are all being taught by the media how to interpret this crisis in incredibly subtle ways and also in very overt ways. And that's, I think, a reason why it's so important for you to be independent, to be able to speak out boldly without worry that you are going to be censorshipped by a parent organization the way they attempted to censor you and the way I have been censored. And I personally am very grateful for the existence of independent media platforms. I want to say, everybody, like, you know,

don't lose your values, you know, like, just do not lose your values in the sea of everything going on. There are so many hot button issues. People are scared, whether we're talking about, you know, people scared to speak up about transgenderism and children or whether you're talking about, you know, what's happening in Palestine and Israel. You should speak your values and expect that when you do something that is right, the world will open up to you. So Brianna, I am wishing you the most luck.

Can you allow us to know where we can follow you and how they can support you? Let my listeners know how they can support you. Yes, you can find me at patreon.com slash badfaithpodcast. I have a weekly podcast that comes out free every Thursday. You can catch it on YouTube or wherever you get your podcasts. And if you subscribe at Patreon, you can get an additional Monday episode for $5 a month. This Monday, today, as we're recording, I just released a really thorough, deep dive into the months-long effort to oust me at the hill and actually,

frankly, get into some issues around transgender issues and politics as well in that episode. And I want to extend the invitation, Candice, to you also. I know that we disagree about a lot of things, but I have been impressed by your willingness to have open debate and conversation and be receptive to different points of view. I've seen it in the context of Israel, and I would love to continue this conversation on a number of other issues if you ever have the time. I know you're a very busy woman. Absolutely. We should debate BLM. I mean, everything. This is the beauty. Let's debate it. Somebody's right, somebody's wrong, and let the public, trust the public to decide. Don't propagandize them. Allow them to listen to both of the debates and to decide what they

agree with. Brianna, thank you so much for joining us. And I wish you all the luck in the world. Thank you, Candace. I appreciate it. All right, guys, I hope you enjoyed that conversation. I'm obviously going to get into so much trouble for it, but it's OK. It's OK. You can follow us on Instagram. You can follow us on Twitter and you can follow us on TikTok.

Our handle is the same across all three. It is at Candace O Show. And don't forget, have you joined Club Candice? Come on, these mugs. I mean, they're only going to be here for a little bit longer. These Standice cups, way better than a Stanley cup. Join clubcandice.com, you guys. We'll see you next week. you