Casefile True Crime - Case 53: EAR-ONS/Golden State Killer | Update
Episode Date: April 26, 2018This is an important update on the EAR-ONS/Golden State Killer case in Case 53 (25.04.18). For all credits and sources, please visit casefilepodcast.com/case-53-original-night-stalker-part-5. ...
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                                        From the biggest stadiums
                                         
                                        To the coziest holes in the wall
                                         
                                        From house parties to porch hangs to pride celebrations
                                         
                                        From your favorite fuzz shop to your local Indians vibe
                                         
                                        From noodle bars to sports bars to salsa bars
                                         
                                        There's a Molson with your name on it
                                         
                                        Canadian ultra
                                         
                                        XL
                                         
    
                                        Molson
                                         
                                        Everyone in
                                         
                                        Must be legal drinking age
                                         
                                        Wow, what a fucking day. What a week actually
                                         
                                        First we get the news that there's a suspect in custody for the 1999 murders of Laura Bible and Ashley Freeman
                                         
                                        Now this
                                         
                                        That's fucking unbelievable
                                         
                                        To all the victims survivors their families who fought so long and so hard for justice this day really belongs to you
                                         
    
                                        To get this result after all these years. I can't find the words to describe it
                                         
                                        It was actually Debbie Domingo and Michelle Cruz who contacted us about doing an episode
                                         
                                        Which turned out to be five episodes on the East area rapist the original night stalker golden state killer
                                         
                                        They were constantly out there talking to anyone who'd listened to get publicity on the case
                                         
                                        Bruce Harrington as well who speaks in the press conference that will follow
                                         
                                        Survivors of the East area rapist who bravely reported the crimes and those who later spoke out
                                         
                                        Jane Carson who you heard talk on your series all of them. They never gave up
                                         
                                        this day belongs to them and
                                         
    
                                        Don't underestimate just how hard-working and how dedicated law enforcement were to cracking this thing
                                         
                                        Bit of a story when we were in the States last year
                                         
                                        We actually met up with Orange County DA investigator Erica Hatchcraft and the Contra Costa County DA investigator Paul Halls
                                         
                                        We met them separately, but after meeting both I remember saying
                                         
                                        you know what I
                                         
                                        Think they'll solve this and
                                         
                                        That wasn't based on anything they told us about the case
                                         
                                        They didn't give us any groundbreaking info or anything that you didn't hear in the episodes to make me think that
                                         
    
                                        It was just them themselves. They're dedication. They're knowledge. They're passion. I couldn't have walked away from those meetings any more impressed
                                         
                                        I remember thinking if that's the quality of people they have working this case
                                         
                                        Then I think there's going to be a good result here and
                                         
                                        Obviously, there's a ton of other hard-working dedicated investigators crime scene forensic officers and many more who made this happen
                                         
                                        Who I don't know and therefore calm down
                                         
                                        There's limited information available at the moment about this suspect
                                         
                                        Everyone's obviously got tons of questions and I'm sure most of those will be answered in time
                                         
                                        But essentially Joseph D'Angelo came up on law enforcement's radar somehow
                                         
    
                                        How they started looking at him. We don't know
                                         
                                        As a result of whatever it was that led them to D'Angelo, they started a surveillance operation on him
                                         
                                        From that surveillance operation they obtained DNA from an item he discarded and
                                         
                                        That DNA then led to an arrest
                                         
                                        Of course, nothing has been proven yet. These are just allegations
                                         
                                        They said in the press conference that they had certain information on how D'Angelo might react when confronted
                                         
                                        So they came up with a plan and confronted him as he was walking out of his house
                                         
                                        D'Angelo was shocked
                                         
    
                                        imagine what was going through his head and
                                         
                                        Something was going through his head because in the press conference one of the officers said that it looked like he was searching
                                         
                                        his mind to execute a formerly made plan
                                         
                                        But he never got the chance
                                         
                                        What we do know about D'Angelo is that he was a police officer in Exeter from 1973 to 1976
                                         
                                        So that puts him right in the area of Visalia
                                         
                                        The Visalia ransacker operated from 74 to 75 and there was always that debate of whether or not the Visalia ransacker was the same offender
                                         
                                        I'm not saying D'Angelo was the Visalia ransacker. He hasn't been charged with those crimes and even if he is charged
                                         
    
                                        They still have to be proven in court. I'm just pointing out his work history
                                         
                                        D'Angelo then moved to the Orban police department where he worked from 1976 to 1979 until he was fired for shoplifting
                                         
                                        He stalled dog repellent and a hammer
                                         
                                        Orban is about a 40 minute drive north from Rancho Cordova where the first East area rapist attack occurred in 1976
                                         
                                        The same year D'Angelo was employed by the Orban police department
                                         
                                        Again, nothing has been proven here. These are just allegations. I'm just pointing out D'Angelo's work history
                                         
                                        There's all sorts of information flying around but one thing that caught my eye is that apparently at one time
                                         
                                        D'Angelo was engaged to a woman named Bonnie
                                         
    
                                        The East area rapist whispered I hate you Bonnie to one of the survivors during an attack
                                         
                                        The survivor's name is not Bonnie
                                         
                                        Again, this proves nothing. I'm just pointing out that D'Angelo was engaged to a woman named Bonnie
                                         
                                        And that the East area rapist whispered the name Bonnie during an attack
                                         
                                        There was also lots of speculation flying around that this was somehow linked to Australia
                                         
                                        The DNA match came from a Nozzi database and it's linked to Mr. Krule, but none of that's true
                                         
                                        Without speculating too much another thing that caught my eye is that D'Angelo had a child born in 1981
                                         
                                        It was his first child
                                         
    
                                        The Golden State killer committed several murders in 1981 up until the time D'Angelo's first child was born
                                         
                                        After D'Angelo's first child was born the Golden State killer stopped
                                         
                                        The next murder wasn't until five years later in 1986 the murder of Janelle Cruz
                                         
                                        After that as far as we know the Golden State killer didn't kill again
                                         
                                        Now further information may come to light as the investigation rolls on that there were further attacks between 81 and 86 or after 86
                                         
                                        But so far as far as we know according to the timeline that we have
                                         
                                        That was the last attack
                                         
                                        I thought it was pretty significant as far as the timeline goes, but again
                                         
    
                                        It proves nothing
                                         
                                        There will obviously be lots more information coming out over the following days weeks months years
                                         
                                        And we will do an in-depth update in time
                                         
                                        Probably a whole new series will be needed for all of the updates and new information that comes to light
                                         
                                        But again, I'd just like to make clear nothing has been proven in court yet. These are simply allegations
                                         
                                        But we'll end this one with some snippets from the press conference that was held only a few hours ago
                                         
                                        I'm Marie Schubert. I'm the district attorney of Sacramento County
                                         
                                        Before I start I'd like to just do some introductions on who is here today
                                         
    
                                        Um, we have in addition to myself Sheriff Sacramento Sheriff Scott Jones
                                         
                                        Ventura County District Attorney Greg Totten
                                         
                                        Orange County District Attorney Tony Rackakis
                                         
                                        Contra Costa County District Attorney Dianna Bepton
                                         
                                        Alameda County District Attorney Nancy O'Malley
                                         
                                        Sacramento FBI special agent in charge Sean Regan
                                         
                                        The United States Attorney for the Northern District McGregor Scott
                                         
                                        Assemblyman Jim Cooper
                                         
    
                                        Bruce Harrington the brother of Keith Harrington
                                         
                                        Irvine Police Department Chief Mike Hamill
                                         
                                        And our crime lab director Chip Hollick
                                         
                                        Let me first by saying this
                                         
                                        The answer has always been in Sacramento
                                         
                                        For over 40 years
                                         
                                        Countless victims have waited for justice
                                         
                                        Over these years hundreds of individuals
                                         
    
                                        Have sought justice for these victims and their families
                                         
                                        Many have dedicated their
                                         
                                        virtual entire
                                         
                                        Professions to seeking this answer
                                         
                                        For many of us
                                         
                                        It was more than a professional commitment
                                         
                                        It became personal for many of us
                                         
                                        for me
                                         
    
                                        Here in Sacramento County
                                         
                                        In June of 1976 I was 12
                                         
                                        I grew up in the east area of Sacramento near the cluster of where these crimes began
                                         
                                        My sisters ranged from 10 to 16 at the time
                                         
                                        As I have said many times
                                         
                                        Over the last 18 years at least for me
                                         
                                        For us here in Sacramento
                                         
                                        It was a time of innocence
                                         
    
                                        In 1976
                                         
                                        No one locked their doors
                                         
                                        Kids rode their bikes to school
                                         
                                        Parents let their children play outside
                                         
                                        The only thing we were told as a family was you just needed to be home before dark
                                         
                                        We did not have things like cell phones or social media
                                         
                                        And then for all of us here in this community that lived in this community during this time it all changed
                                         
                                        For anyone that lived here in this community here in Sacramento
                                         
    
                                        The memories are very vivid
                                         
                                        You can ask anyone that grew up here
                                         
                                        Everyone has a story
                                         
                                        But it must be remembered that it was not just Sacramento
                                         
                                        That this this case deeply affected
                                         
                                        This entire state
                                         
                                        And then in June of 2016
                                         
                                        At the 40th anniversary
                                         
    
                                        For the beginning of this series the east area rapists a press conference was held here in Sacramento
                                         
                                        Hosted by the Sacramento County Sheriff's Department and the FBI
                                         
                                        Attended by many agencies across California that have dedicated their
                                         
                                        Careers and professions to coming to some kind of answer
                                         
                                        The message was clear
                                         
                                        In 2016
                                         
                                        The magnitude of this case demanded
                                         
                                        That it be solved
                                         
    
                                        There were upwards of 50 rapes
                                         
                                        12 murders
                                         
                                        Crimes that spanned 10 years across at least
                                         
                                        10 different counties
                                         
                                        northern
                                         
                                        central and southern california
                                         
                                        And it was that day in june of 2016
                                         
                                        That we
                                         
    
                                        in public safety
                                         
                                        Reiterated our commitment
                                         
                                        To the victims and to justice
                                         
                                        In this case the east area rapists the golden state killer
                                         
                                        And it was that day
                                         
                                        That we embarked upon what I call our journey for justice
                                         
                                        A journey by people across borders
                                         
                                        across all professions
                                         
    
                                        police officers fbi agents
                                         
                                        crime lab employees
                                         
                                        victim advocates
                                         
                                        prosecutors
                                         
                                        community leaders
                                         
                                        elected officials
                                         
                                        All with one mission
                                         
                                        To find the answer
                                         
    
                                        To give victims a voice and ultimately to identify this person and bring him to justice
                                         
                                        We brought together we brought teams together
                                         
                                        Not long after that press conference
                                         
                                        We dedicated more resources more people and we created what I have called
                                         
                                        team justice
                                         
                                        An incredible collaboration of individuals with one mission
                                         
                                        There are things about that journey and that commitment that each of us knew
                                         
                                        The answer was and always was going to be in the dna
                                         
    
                                        We knew we could and should solve it using the most innovative
                                         
                                        dna technology available at this time
                                         
                                        We all knew that it would take passion
                                         
                                        We all knew that it would take persistence
                                         
                                        Last wednesday
                                         
                                        At 8 15 in the evening. I received an email
                                         
                                        From the daughter of sherry domingo who was murdered in southern california
                                         
                                        Her name is debbie. She was 15 at the time
                                         
    
                                        Last wednesday she emailed
                                         
                                        In essence my paraphrase
                                         
                                        Hi, Anne Marie. I thought the editing for the recent documentary was brilliant
                                         
                                        She quoted from the show quote
                                         
                                        This case will be solved because of sheer persistence
                                         
                                        She went on to say I have those words posted in a few places in my home
                                         
                                        And my workplace so I can see them at various times throughout the day
                                         
                                        Thank you for that persistence. I have faith
                                         
    
                                        We all knew as part of this team that we were looking
                                         
                                        For a needle in a haystack
                                         
                                        But we also all knew that the needle was there
                                         
                                        In the last six days and I emphasize the last six days
                                         
                                        That passion
                                         
                                        That persistence
                                         
                                        And the knowledge finally came to an answer in this building behind us here
                                         
                                        Our crime lab
                                         
    
                                        Crime lab employees dna analysts who worked tirelessly
                                         
                                        In the last few days to provide that answer
                                         
                                        Yesterday an arrest warrant
                                         
                                        Was issued
                                         
                                        A complaint was filed
                                         
                                        Charging that individual with two counts of murder with special circumstances for the murder of brian and katie maggiore
                                         
                                        Here in sacramento in february 1978
                                         
                                        It is fitting that today is national dna day
                                         
    
                                        We found the needle in the haystack
                                         
                                        And it was right here in sacramento
                                         
                                        And with that I would like to introduce our sheriff scott jones
                                         
                                        Good afternoon
                                         
                                        Before I talk a little bit about this case. I'd like to make just a couple preliminary comments
                                         
                                        Um when I became sheriff in sacramento in 2010
                                         
                                        There were very few outstanding cases that drew the passion and the interest and the dogged determination to solve
                                         
                                        As the east area rapist
                                         
    
                                        The sheriff that I took over from sheriff john mcginnis who's here with us today
                                         
                                        Told me about the importance of it
                                         
                                        And I don't know that I fully appreciated it at that time
                                         
                                        But I can tell you that without exception
                                         
                                        Weekly and sometimes more I get telephone calls or emails to this day
                                         
                                        From former employees former detectives
                                         
                                        community members from all over this country
                                         
                                        That believe that they know or at least have some information on who the east area rapist
                                         
    
                                        was
                                         
                                        I committed then to do everything that I could to solve it and had a lot of conversations early on with district attorney schubert
                                         
                                        About how we could do it and those discussions really touched the passion of both of us to solve this case
                                         
                                        Both of us committed
                                         
                                        The best and the brightest our hand-picked folks to oversee the resolution of this case
                                         
                                        And gave virtually unlimited resources and freedom to pursue whatever leads and technology currently existing
                                         
                                        So I can tell you that
                                         
                                        Over the last few days as information started to point towards this individual
                                         
    
                                        We started some surveillance
                                         
                                        We were able to get some discarded dna
                                         
                                        And we were able to confirm
                                         
                                        What we thought we already knew that we had our man
                                         
                                        And yesterday afternoon in a perfectly executed arrest
                                         
                                        My detectives arrested
                                         
                                        James joseph de angelo
                                         
                                        72 years old
                                         
    
                                        living in citrus heights
                                         
                                        I can tell you that although it was dna
                                         
                                        ultimately
                                         
                                        That led us
                                         
                                        down the right road
                                         
                                        There were a lot of places that road could have led
                                         
                                        I don't want to
                                         
                                        Under score I can't underscore enough the absolute human factor
                                         
    
                                        The dogged determination of not only the detectives working on this case
                                         
                                        But the passion of the district attorney
                                         
                                        Myself the community
                                         
                                        And the victims
                                         
                                        All too often we forget about talking about the victims
                                         
                                        And today we at least brought the first step towards closure
                                         
                                        For those victims of these horrendous crimes
                                         
                                        So I want to thank not only the district attorney in the crime lab
                                         
    
                                        And the dna that helped us get here
                                         
                                        But my own detectives and the detectives from all of these folks represented by the the leader standing behind me
                                         
                                        When we put together this working group
                                         
                                        two years ago
                                         
                                        We now hear from bruce harrington brother of keith harrington and brother-in-law to paddy harrington who were murdered in dana point 1980
                                         
                                        51 rapes
                                         
                                        And 12 murders
                                         
                                        Today I'd like to speak to the multi generation hundreds and hundreds of multi-generational victims of this
                                         
    
                                        Staggering crime spree
                                         
                                        It is time for all victims
                                         
                                        to grieve
                                         
                                        and to take measure
                                         
                                        One last time
                                         
                                        To bring closure
                                         
                                        To the anguish that we've all suffered for the last 40 some odd years
                                         
                                        It is time for
                                         
    
                                        The victims to begin to heal
                                         
                                        So long overdue
                                         
                                        For law enforcement Bravo Bravo Bravo
                                         
                                        Their tenacity their patience
                                         
                                        Their unrelenting focus
                                         
                                        A shout out for tony ricacas
                                         
                                        For steve cooley for lisa con
                                         
                                        Ah, mary schubert jane scully larry pool
                                         
    
                                        The names go on and we've known many many of them over the years
                                         
                                        Today is also a reaffirmation of the power
                                         
                                        And the public safety that's associated with forensic dna technology. I began my quest
                                         
                                        In the mid 90s when dna finally came of force into the world of forensic science
                                         
                                        My brother and his wife were killed in 80
                                         
                                        So it was 15 years until we finally heard that there was a dna sample taken from our crime scene
                                         
                                        And as the years rolled on there were other dna samples that became
                                         
                                        Common to one unknown
                                         
    
                                        perpetrator
                                         
                                        And
                                         
                                        It's been a struggle to bring dna and california to the forefront of that forensic
                                         
                                        crime scene investigation tool
                                         
                                        Surprisingly when I looked at the situation in the late 90s california was
                                         
                                        a laggard
                                         
                                        virginia
                                         
                                        florida some of the other more progressive states
                                         
    
                                        On the east coast were light years ahead of california
                                         
                                        I spent time in sacramento in the early 2000s
                                         
                                        Appearing before assembly and senate public safety committees fleeing that they
                                         
                                        Embrace the power of
                                         
                                        dna and frankly I
                                         
                                        Ran into a buzz saw of opposition
                                         
                                        So
                                         
                                        In 2003 it became apparent that nothing was going to happen through sacramento
                                         
    
                                        senator burton
                                         
                                        On the senate public safety committee my nemesis. I shamed you then and I shame you now
                                         
                                        You were wrong
                                         
                                        Dna what what it's all about. It's a three-legged stool the dna where the powerful database allows
                                         
                                        The sample
                                         
                                        To be checked to against all cases against those who've been wrongly accused
                                         
                                        Of against those that have been wrongly convicted in their sitting in prison
                                         
                                        Over the years innocence projects have flourished at law schools in particular
                                         
    
                                        Using dna to try and exonerate those wrongly committed
                                         
                                        I hope they continue. They are a robust and
                                         
                                        Active part of the harnessing of dna technology
                                         
                                        technology
                                         
                                        dna also
                                         
                                        Solves current crimes
                                         
                                        This isn't a current crime. That's an old crime, but it's finally solved by dna dna also looks out and
                                         
                                        Cuts down on future crime by using that database to
                                         
    
                                        Exonerate those that have been wrongly
                                         
                                        Suspicioned and otherwise
                                         
                                        Allow current crimes and to be solved efficiently
                                         
                                        I end with a plea to the voters
                                         
                                        because we are back
                                         
                                        Circulating another petition this year right now
                                         
                                        Go out to your walmart go out to your
                                         
                                        To your markets and you'll find people gathering signatures
                                         
    
                                        There is a
                                         
                                        Keep california safe proposition
                                         
                                        Just like there was the dna prop 69 position back in 2004, but here we now now in
                                         
                                        Spring and summer of 18 filing another petition to
                                         
                                        Build up to improve to build upon and create an even more robust
                                         
                                        dna database in california. We need signatures
                                         
                                        We need 500 000 signatures by mid-june. It'll be on the november ballot vote for it
                                         
                                        And you're going to ask yourself. Why is it that we're having to circulate?
                                         
    
                                        Signature petition again, and I will tell you
                                         
                                        The Burton Burton alkylates that are still controlling the public safety committees
                                         
                                        In the assembly and the senate again
                                         
                                        Have disappointed their job
                                         
                                        And made a mockery of the name of their committee the public safety committee
                                         
                                        so vote for that
                                         
                                        Proposition and again
                                         
                                        To the entire reservoir of victims out there
                                         
    
                                        My sadness is with you
                                         
                                        For the 51 ladies who are brutally raped
                                         
                                        In this crime scene sleep better tonight. He isn't coming through the window
                                         
                                        He's now in jail and his history. Thank you
                                         
                                        Everyone i'm sergeant shon hampton the spokesman for the sacramental county sheriff's department right now
                                         
                                        Sheriff jones and district attorney and rie schubert will be answering questions
                                         
                                        I understand there's a lot of questions. Please be patient. There's no way we will get to them all, but we will do our best
                                         
                                        I can ask three interrelated questions. Maybe this goes. I'm not sure which one
                                         
    
                                        So you talk a little bit about the dna collection
                                         
                                        Apparently you targeted him. Why did you target him for details on how you collected that dna?
                                         
                                        And what does it link it to is only those four crimes with which he's out
                                         
                                        charged for their others
                                         
                                        In terms of the type of dna the only thing we're prepared to say at this time is that
                                         
                                        it was linked through dna using
                                         
                                        current and innovative techniques to do that
                                         
                                        As for the other crimes that we know in california as your list that you've been handed
                                         
    
                                        There's many of them that match by dna. It is the same dna as those that have been charged in the ventura case
                                         
                                        Um as mr. Totten mentioned
                                         
                                        But those that they just haven't been charged yet that we're just haven't gone to that point
                                         
                                        This has happened at a very lightning speed is what I would say
                                         
                                        I'm simply going to say he was identified through dna
                                         
                                        Uh technology can you corroborate that there was a tip that came in to either the fbi or one of your offices last week?
                                         
                                        No, that's no, that's not correct. It's not correct. No
                                         
                                        Sorry
                                         
    
                                        It was um, I can tell you and obviously i'm going to have to be a bit circumspect because this is still a very active investigation
                                         
                                        I mean as we speak there are warrants being served and interviews being conducted
                                         
                                        But what I can tell you is this has all happened in a very rapid
                                         
                                        Last few days or a very compact period of time during that time. We were able to surveil him
                                         
                                        um, we got a feel for some of his
                                         
                                        Um activities or lack thereof got kind of some information regarding his routines
                                         
                                        Um, we got some information relative to what he might do if confronted or apprehended
                                         
                                        Based on the information we were able to glean from that surveillance. Uh, so we developed a plan
                                         
    
                                        To wait for him to come out of his residence rather than try and approach him in the residence or when he's out
                                         
                                        Um out and about in a in a vehicle
                                         
                                        Um, and so when he came out of his residence, we had a team in place that was able to take him into custody. Um,
                                         
                                        he
                                         
                                        Was very surprised by that. Um, it looked as though he might have been
                                         
                                        Searching his mind to execute a particular plan. He may have had in mind
                                         
                                        Obviously speculation on my part, but he was not given the opportunity
                                         
                                        It happened almost instantaneously and he was taken into custody without without incident at all
                                         
    
                                        Sargell Sargell
                                         
                                        Well, I can't speak to that
                                         
                                        Specifically, but I can say generally, you know, until we got a working group together and we're able to associate our
                                         
                                        You know, our east east area rapist was someone else's golden
                                         
                                        state killer
                                         
                                        Until we were able to collaborate and really start looking at the the mo's the the manner in which he carried out his crimes
                                         
                                        And see the linkages between the crimes and the dna that that that tied many of them together
                                         
                                        Um, that was a real breaking point for us and allowed us to not only get more manpower and more brainpower on
                                         
    
                                        This case but allowed us to get more clues and follow up on more leads
                                         
                                        In the back
                                         
                                        Well, I can I can confirm that that's the information we have at the moment now, obviously part of our
                                         
                                        Um
                                         
                                        ongoing investigation is to kind of work backwards to try and fill in a lot of the gaps that we have about his life
                                         
                                        From then well actually from before then to now
                                         
                                        We're aware of the same information that that you just described. So
                                         
                                        We're obviously going to be looking into see whether that a hammer or a dog repellent played into any of the attacks
                                         
    
                                        But it's again, I just just to reiterate
                                         
                                        It's all very very swift and those those details will be investigated and meet it out in the coming days and weeks
                                         
                                        Sure, I can tell you that he is the next officer a police officer in two different agencies
                                         
                                        One in the exeter police department, which is down in visalia from approximately 1973 to 1976
                                         
                                        Um, that was roughly during the time as the visalia ransacker cases were occurring
                                         
                                        I can then say that he
                                         
                                        Applied for and got a job with the arbor and police department. It was employed there from roughly
                                         
                                        1976 to 1979 until he was fired for for what you just heard
                                         
    
                                        Why
                                         
                                        Well, very possibly he was committing the crimes during the time he was employed as a peace officer
                                         
                                        And obviously we'll be looking into whether it was actually on the job or whether it was, you know, something that
                                         
                                        By on the job, I assume you mean during the time he was employed. Yeah, I don't know that yet
                                         
                                        But obviously that's a question that we're going to want to answer as well
                                         
                                        Thank you. Does a new book all be gone in the dark generate any new leads in the case or help please be arrested?
                                         
                                        I'm glad just that question because that's a question
                                         
                                        We've gotten from literally all over the world in the last 24 hours and the answer is no
                                         
    
                                        Um, other than the fact that it like like uh, as was indicated the media kept this in the public eye and kept public interest
                                         
                                        It kept interest and tips coming in
                                         
                                        Um, other than that, there was no information extracted from that book that directly led to the the apprehension
                                         
                                        Did he live at that location by himself any other people that residents does he have a family?
                                         
                                        He does have a family. I'm not prepared to talk about what his family is but he does have adult children. Um
                                         
                                        That that's really all I'm prepared to say at the time
                                         
                                        Uh, we don't we well, we don't have a full picture yet. We're still filling in that timely
                                         
                                        No question
                                         
    
                                        Sure, there's um
                                         
                                        And again, I have to be a bit circumspect here
                                         
                                        But what I said in my earlier comments that you know, the dna actually got us to a road
                                         
                                        But the road had many destinations possible destinations
                                         
                                        I can first say that even backing up from the dna that we would have never got to a dna
                                         
                                        Sample or ability to to compare it without the dogged determination of the detectives on this case
                                         
                                        So it's not like it ultimately would have come to us anyways. That's just simply not the case. This was
                                         
                                        a true convergence of
                                         
    
                                        Emerging technology and dogged determination by detectives. So once we got information that led us to a general
                                         
                                        I mean, it's almost like the da pointed us east so we could exclude northwest and south
                                         
                                        But we still had to do a lot of investigative follow-up and drill down from that direction of east until we got to this person
                                         
                                        We did a lot of exclusions of other folks got this person that looked like he might be our guy
                                         
                                        And then we're able to get at least an initial
                                         
                                        Um discarded dna sample that gave us
                                         
                                        More confidence that this was our person and we're able to continue and get a better more workable sample of dna
                                         
                                        So
                                         
    
                                        I will just say at this point it was discarded dna sample was it his favorite dna somebody in his family who who tested
                                         
                                        I'm sorry, I couldn't hear the question
                                         
                                        So I I'm absolutely certain there will be a trial there remain questions
                                         
                                        And I don't want to speak for the prosecution
                                         
                                        But obviously there there will have to be some organization as to who who and where and and when but I can guarantee you
                                         
                                        I mean in this case, um, you know justice was delayed
                                         
                                        It wasn't swift, but I can assure you it will be sure
                                         
                                        Let me just say something in terms of the prosecution
                                         
    
                                        There are many jurisdictions involved. I think I mentioned there's 10 counties and so sorry fog
                                         
                                        So those decisions are going to be made in the immediate future this right now as I said before this has occurred in the last six days and so
                                         
                                        Um
                                         
                                        We have to take time and do it right and get together and meet in the best method as
                                         
                                        District Attorney Rukakis said so
                                         
                                        That will take some time. Yes, sir. Had his name ever come up before last week in any of these investigations to your knowledge
                                         
                                        The answer is no
                                         
                                        I think the sheriff mentioned that a sample was collected from him
                                         
    
                                        Abandoned samples so that's what ultimately changed the tide and I will say this because everybody's got questions about the dna
                                         
                                        The answer of your questions is going to come out in a timely fashion
                                         
                                        But this case is still active
                                         
                                        And so, you know as much as you want to know and I understand it
                                         
                                        We can't answer the specifics on the exact type of technology, but that will come out. All right one more question over here
                                         
                                        We have I will say we have interviewed some family members without actually identifying who they are or what relationship they are
                                         
                                        We have interviewed them and they are as cooperative and um,
                                         
                                        Certainly, uh, it's quite a shock to them as you might expect
                                         
    
                                        Well, we're trying to backtrack that so we're still working on the the actual timeline from then to now
                                         
                                        All right one more
                                         
                                        They're tied up a loose end in this long story there had been one point some discussion that
                                         
                                        The person in these cases was linked to something happened in australia
                                         
                                        I heard that yesterday, but that's not do you have any information in that universe or that's just still an open loose end
                                         
                                        We have no information the person's linking to australia
                                         
                                        So, um, I think it's just about wraps it up for us today
                                         
                                        I understand I understand listen. I understand there's a lot of questions
                                         
    
                                        We have a lot of work to do on the back end. There's a lot of folks behind me to have to get back to work
                                         
                                        So I appreciate your time. I appreciate your patience
                                         
                                        We will try to field interviews as information comes available and I thank you again for coming today
                                         
                                        You
                                         
