Chainsaw History - Part One: Conjuring The Real Ed and Lorraine Warren Plus Annabelle

Episode Date: October 30, 2023

{ Visit ChainsawHistory.com see full show notes and research links, get access to our full back catalog, check out our bonus content, and support the show with a paid subscription! }We’re back! Podcasting siblings Jamie and Bambi return just in time for Halloween with an episode all about Ed and Lorraine Warren, the demonologist and clairvoyant couple made famous by The Conjuring movies starring Patrick Wilson and Vera Farmiga. Learn what Ed smelled like as a sixteen year old boy and how the nuns punished Lorraine for seeing into the future. Find out how their careers began as hobo artists collecting ghost stories before they learned how to monetize their hobby for fun and profit! We’ll take a look at the world’s most famous creepy doll: Annabelle. Were the Warrens truly battling the forces of Satan or were they just shady grifters? Research, skepticism, and swearing are all required to untangle this mess.In this episode recommend people donate to Feeding America to address growing food insecurity in our country. We also express support and solidarity with the Atlanta Forest Defenders and encourage you to learn more and help stop Cop City.

It's fucking chains on this three times. How's your brain feeling? My brain is feeling okay. I have a mild headache like all the time and then I get severe headaches three or four times a week. Yeah, severe headaches to migraines. So today I'm okay. But yeah, I went to the neurologist and I'm going to get Botox. Nice. Yeah. And they said because they basically covered my forehead because they basically cover my forehead and temples and then the back of my neck and my shoulders. So it should also give me some pain relief.

Hmm. So. Well, have the doctors considered an alternative explanation? Like, you're being attacked by demons. Hahaha. Hahaha. Uh, no, no one has suggested that I'm being attacked or sexualized by demons. Because that's because the people we're talking about today aren't here.

Because speaking of massive headaches. Oh, okay. Have you ever seen any of the conjuring movies? I have. I saw the first one. You saw the first one. What do you any of the conjuring movies? I have. I saw the first one. You saw the first one. What do you think of the conjuring?

Um, it was okay. Yeah, I liked the conjuring. If I don't like the conjuring movies in general, as movies. Yeah, as a horror movie, it was a solid seven. Yeah, it was decent. It had some good scares, some fun and it presented, you know, some heroes you could root for.

Yeah, the cinematography and it was really good. Well James one is a great director. Mm hmm. That movie. It was a good movie. I liked it. So just as a film goer and a horror fan, they said I sometimes like the weirder, more fringe stuff as a more horror dude.

But in terms of like mainstream pop, horror, conjuring, good movie. So because it's spooky season, it's October as we record this. My favorite time of year. Yeah, and we've been on hiatus for a little while. So I thought I would ease this back in. So instead of talking about anything super, like historically important or weighty,

you know, in terms of big events We would just get a little lighthearted talk about some ghosts and demons and werewolves and shit Haza so there we go. So yeah the conjuring films which at this point there are three Conjuring movies and a bunch of spin-offs. There's like three Annabelle movies two nuns One law your the curse of law, your owna, which is sort of like the one that's sort of on the edge. Yeah, that's like Mexican folklore too. So it's the, and that one's actually supposed to be

like the scariest one. Because I mean, the conjuring was, it wasn't that scary. Yeah. It was a decent movie, but it wasn't scary. It wasn't going for. So for anybody living under a rock or digging this up 100 years from now, the conjuring films present a pair of demon fighting ghost-busting heroes named Ed and Lorraine Warren.

So this attractive pair uses faith psychic powers and expert knowledge to battle the forces of Satan and free people from demonic possession. So outside of their work, they are presented as wholesome, selfless, and deeply compassionate people who do their work as a service to God, and they are deeply in love and have a damn near perfect marriage. Oh, and the whole God thing. It cannot be stressed enough.

They are very religious, not I want to say their Catholic. Yes, their Catholic. And let's just say that even though the movies certainly present them as Catholics and they're always talking to priests and doing all that shit, it tones down just how Catholic these people are because that's going to be a huge part of what we're talking about today. So we're going to look at the real life warrants and see how they hold out to Patrick Wilson and Vera from a got spoiler alert. Not great. Well, I mean, just from pictures.

Well, I mean, physically it's not even fair to compare them to movie stars. They are, you know, the movie warrants are very good looking. Yeah, and I have to say, and especially like I saw part of a documentary. I wanna say it's called the Devil's Road. It's called Devil's Road, and yeah, it is one of our research points for today.

Okay, yeah, I- Even though that is a blowjob of a documentary. Oh, it is. I was like trying to decide, I was like, is this a documentary or propaganda? So I kind of like, it's a it's a docu-ganda or yeah. It's like what's like most of those paranormal like anytime you're watching a documentary about these kind of topics and there's

like dramatic music and quick cuts and in dramatic voiceovers. The only really interesting thing was it did have interviews with the original people that were experiencing some of this stuff. So, yeah, and we're going to be talking about that and those people. And all of it? And all of it? And all of it? Okay, cool.

By the way, everybody, this is Chainsaw history, the podcast where we take beloved fixtures now in pop culture for over 10 years and reveal them to be slimy grifters and sex criminals. That is not true, that is, we've done other things. Sometimes we talk about... That's what we're doing today. Sometimes we talk about maligned women as well. We'll see if you think we're maligning this woman,

Lorraine Warren. Just- She's a team of line herself. As a disclaimer, we are a comedy podcast. I'm not a historian, but I did read The Halloween Tree by Raid Bradbury once. And yeah, I now know some stuff about the Mexican Day of the Dead. So I'm qualified. Awesome.

I am qualified to wear these headphones and talk into this mic by the powers vested in me. The power of mic can... Mike said I could. If you go to chainsawhistory.com, you can find ways to support the show. Check out our bonus content and other shows like the Value of Series where we read children's books to each other and no time for love, Dr. Jones, where we talk way too much about the adventures of Indiana Jones. So yeah, the Warrens aren't just fun weirdos who became famous for their demon battling exploits. They are shady grifters who get into some really ugly territory.

No. Like, this is the thing that sucks. Like when I started this, the whole idea was to do some a little more lighthearted, knowing that they're probably going to be fraudsters and assholes or whatever. And then it just gets darker than I wanted it to. As always does. Every time you learn too much about people, especially people who are admired by so many, well, people start out as complicated. That's just human beings. Also, when you, anytime you get something that's not to be too mean to Catholics, but let's just say stuff tied into the Catholic Church often takes you to some dark places involving

underaged people. Well, I mean, I'm not a big fan of organized religion, and neither was Jesus. So, Jesus was a real cold dude. He was probably also a socialist. So, like we're saying, we don't, we usually talk about people who actually have a real effect

on like history and events and like, you know, affected the course of how America especially went. I think it's safe to say the warrens benefited from and contributed to some significant cultural moments from the public obsession with ghosts and possession to the satanic panic of the 1980s. They suck. Yeah, well, and a lot of their, the techniques and stuff that they, not only that they used, but they, some of them that they invented, I think, that are used. Well, they were certainly pioneers. They made ghost hunting a popular thing to do. They were part of this first generation of people doing this and one of the first to really make a name for themselves. This is the reason the travel channel now sucks. Yeah, because that's all it is now. They are descendants and they are now all over it all the time.

No, we can't have great hotels anymore. We have to have ghost hunters times 500 or more. Ed Warren died just a couple years before YouTube was invented and thank God. Because that- Oh, no one wanted to look at his fat nasty ass. But he still did it, like trust me, he the amount of Ed Warren footage out there from even including their own TV show they did for a while.

So anyway, let's get into it. The research on this one was mostly articles and interviews. This was a lot of smaller things instead of the usual one or two books. I did read the authorized biography called the Demonologist, the extraordinary career of Ed and the Rain Warren by Gerald Brittle that I think came out in like 1980.

Okay, so that sounds like a blowjob. I don't recommend it. Yeah, it was totally a blowjob. And also had a very clear point to it, which is to scare the shit out of you, so you'd join the Catholic Church. Also watched the documentary, The Devil's Road, which was on Max. I hate everything. So the book, The Demonologist, is the closest we get to like an autobiography because it was kind of an author. Then the Warrens didn't really write their own stuff. They hired writers to do for them or came up with partnerships with writers.

The Demonologist gives us the version of the Warrens that the Warrens wanted us to have. They literally worked with this guy to present this message in this way. So this is how they're described in the introduction of the book. Quote, Ed and the Rain Warren are a cordial happy couple in their mid-50s who have a unique friendship and marriage and distinctly positive outlook on life. What the warrants have seen, however, and what they have learned over the course of their extraordinary combined career has given them wisdom way beyond their years." Oh, gross.

So the version we get in the movies very much matches this description. I mean, they sound so nice. Yeah, they sound so nice. Yeah, they sound too nice. They sound like saccharine. But this isn't the introduction to some boring biography, Bambi. This book is about kicking some demon ass. So the first few pages give us a scene

in which the warrants freshly returned from a haunted house in Long Island. Yes, that haunted house in Long Island are terrorized by a demonic presence. Ed confronts a swirling black shape with signs of the cross and the name of Jesus in order to save his wife from a psychic assault. So according to the demonologist, quote, what confronted Ed in the rain warning those early morning hours was not a ghost, nor was it something seen only by them. The same swirling black mass has been reported by others. Rather, this was the appearance of something far more ominous than a ghost could ever be.

The manifestation of a comparatively rare phenomenon known as an inhuman demonic spirit. A pretr-natural entity, the inhuman spirit is considered to be possessed of a negative, diabolical intelligence fixed in a perpetual rage against both man and God." Unquote. Oh, sounds so serious. So the forces of Satan have followed Ed and Lorraine back from New York from the house, and the house that would soon be known as the Amityville Horror House. And so we get this action and a taste of their most famous case before we even get to chapter one.

It's like Ed literally sees this tornado of black energy that he has to throw his cross at and yell at until it goes away to save Lorraine. Yeah, more than gonna do like a blessing on that house and then it never happened. Well, we're gonna get to that. So, but this was literally just like this little tease. Like yeah, this thing, like right after they went to the house for the it never happened. Well, we're gonna get to that. Okay. But this was literally just like this little tease, like yeah, this thing, like right after they went to the house

for the first time, you know, they got attacked in the middle of the night. And they were like, in through something at it, right? Right, screaming demons is something we're gonna be talking about a bit. So according to the book, Ed and Lorraine's work, quote, by necessity was not public. Instead, the warrants remained to the book, Ed and Lorraine's work, quote, by necessity was not public. Instead, the warrants remained in the background,

either working privately with individuals, experiencing true spirit-related problems, or as investigators, performing on-site research where strange or unusual phenomenon were in progress. Unquote. So it's this humility that explains all the books, movie deals, speaking engagements, and constantly being on the news.

Very humble. The humblest. But it's time to light the candles, hold hands, and conjure up the past. The story of Ed and Lorraine Warren begins damn near a hundred years ago, because it was on September 7th, 1926, that a thick-necked and large, foreheaded baby was born in Bridgeport, Connecticut. One that we could later think for the none too. The kid's name was Edward Warren Miny. Miny? Miny. Yep, Edward isn't actually Edward Warren.

So the very first lie is his actual name. You know, I would change that too. No, and fair. So according to Ed's IMDB page, and thanks not just for the Conjuring movies, but the many other movie deals he was involved with going way back before that. He's got so many. He's got a bunch of credits.

So his IMDB page says quote, he was the son of Pauline Dennis and Frank Edward Miny. His father was of Slovak and Czech descent and his maternal grandparents were Polish. I mean, Miny is a really terrible last name. So yeah, no idea exactly why winner how Ed decided to ditch his last name in favor of the middle name, whatever. But Manny is his last name on his official public documents.

Maybe he really, maybe he wasn't too fond of his father Frank. I mean, we really don't know a lot about Ed's dad other than he was a Connecticut state trooper. And apparently wasn't too keen on any of Ed's ghost shit. And fair. Yeah. Also, there is some rumor that Frank was abusive to his wife and children, which also makes sense. Yeah, that's fair to. Listeners, Google 40% of all cops, if you don't know what I'm talking about, and you can catch up with this. Ed reports that he was five years old when he first encountered the supernatural, the spirit of the former owner of his family's house.

He described it as a semi-transparent apparition wearing some sort of shroud. She scaled it the kid and vanished, just like, eh. Ed said he was scared, but there was no mention of whether he filled his little tidy whiteies. He was five.

So when Ed told his family about the incident, his dad roughly told him to forget what he saw and don't tell anybody else. Yeah, don't be a lunatic, don't ever tell anyone else, which is why we know about it today. Today. Just told everyone who would listen for the rest of his life. Ed came from, and this is going to shock you,

an incredibly religious family. No. They're Catholic immigrants. It didn't just come out of nowhere. He said that his grandfather had bequeathed his entire life savings to the church so that a stained glass window of Saint Michael could be installed in their local parish. Okay. And Ed was fixated on it. Quoting from the demonologist, quote, it was Michael, the archangel who drove Satan from heaven and is the patron saint of the exorcist.

Unquote. Oh, he does. So I was like, granddad made this window, you know, donated this stained glass window of the most bad ass of all the angels and adds like that I'm going to be that angel here on earth. Fountain demons or at least that's what we're told. Okay. Frank the cop dad reportedly never missed a mass a day in his life So naturally Ed went to Catholic school and says he paid attention to his spiritual education despite how much he hated dressing up for church Just maybe the one time me and Ed are on the same page

Okay, first of all how do you never miss mass? I have literally just missed days of my life. They're just gone now. This guy was serious about going to church. Because he says in Catholic school, you learn about the devil, demons, and spirits as a matter of fact. And he was trying to figure out all this ghost shit and psychic crap that was going on in his life.

So Catholic school was literally teaching him, because in Catholic school, there's no separation between the secular and the religious. It's just all part of your education and that demons and spirits are a very real thing. So he told the story about having recurring dreams of a nun visiting him, and not the mean nun from the movie.

Oh, I was about to say is this for the none came. I don't think so because so when he described these dreams to his father, his father said, no, that was that was my late, that was my sister. You're aunt Ed, a nun who apparently had painful health issues and it died before he was born. So Ed tells the author of the demonologist, quote, during one of my dreams, wow, where did that exit come from? I gotta get, I was doing my Ed all this time.

I gotta get back to my pepperage farm accent. There we go. Quote, during one of my dreams, she told me something that took on meaning only when I grew up. Ed would, she said, you will tell many priests the road to go down, but you will never yourself be a priest.

Well, I'm not a priest today, but I do work closely with him, and two of those who have been assigned to work in the area of demonology and exorcism." So the demonologist also tells us that the rain Rita Moran grew up only three blocks away from Ed. She was a smart girl who just happened to be clairvoyant. She just by happened stance. She says as a child that she didn't realize that not everyone has six senses or the ability to see through time. So one experience happened how do you see through time? Well, I'm sure about to find out. So for example, it was Arbor Day and they plant a tree, you know, as you do on Arbor Day,

quote, just as soon as they put the sapling in the ground, I saw it as a fully grown tree. I looked up into its massive branches filled with leaves blowing in the wind with no idea I was experiencing second sight. The nun standing beside me prodded my arm and said in her usual stern way, Miss Moran, are you looking up at why you looking up into the sky? I told her I was just looking into the tree. Are you seeing into the future? She asked me just to sternly. Yes, I admitted.

I guess I am unquote, you know, that's where everyone leaps to. You know which something this witchcraft earned her swift Catholic punishment where she was forced to sit and pray all weekend. So from that point forward, she kept her superpowers to herself. That's okay. Till it was... I was about to say, isn't that's not even what they said on Devil's Road? Yeah, well, don't expect consistency in the words.

Okay. All right, well... It changes over time and I could give you five different versions of just about any of this. So I'm mostly drawing from the demonologist here for as the sort of accepted canon. Okay. So that's the first. This is, I mean, I, I know like a smidgen about this.

It could fill a thimble and I still know that, wait a minute, that's already, I can, that's horseshit. The stories shift and become different, altered to depending on the audience and the context and everything. So, um, so, oras have nothing to do with the, okay, whatever. Well, she also say that she could see people's oras that she could see, like, that was, I didn't, I didn't quote that part of it. That was another thing she said she could see and just didn't realize it. Not everybody could do that. That wasn't one thing she said. But of course.

And they also told that in the nuns told her to never say that again. Yes, because you know, that's. And that was the last time she ever told anyone until, you know, then she did a lot. So you knew these two were going to get together eventually seeing as how they were neighbors less than a year apart in age who attended the same school and went to the same church. Destiny. Yeah, it's these two weirdos. We're going to run into each other. The story of their first meeting is actually romanticized in the conjuring three. So you haven't seen that one yet, but literally the meeting he was working as an usher in a movie theater, a very romanticized

version. So in the movie, it says that they met and then after she got out of the movie, he was walking with her home. They caught in a rain storm. They ran under a gazebo and then they kissed for the first time, you know, taking shelter from the rain is 16 year olds. And I want to say, I heard that. So I can't tell you where. Except so that's the movie version. That's the movie version. And then to spoil the very end of the movie. I didn't even see the conjuring three. So yeah. Okay. So just spoil the end of the conjuring three. It even ends with Patrick Wilson's version of Ed Buies, Lorraine and Gisebo so they can make out in their backyard. That's the end of the movies. I didn't mean to ruin it all for you. The Gazebo ending. But however, the real life

Lorraine tells us. That's very romantic. I know, but that's the movie version. Way to hear our romantic, the Lorraine tells it. She says at 16, she had zero interest in boys until a friend introduced her to a hyperactive theater usher. According, this is from the blog on the New England Society for Paranormal Research website. Quote, When she saw Ed, she thought to herself, Gee, what a nice looking young man. She later related how spivy he looked with his sharply crease pants and perfectly coiled hair. She recalled, and he smelled like Maxima.

Uncooked. He smelled like a bunch of zits. He smelled like Maxima. Just, like, face cream. Like a nasty little teenage boy. So after the girls, after the girls saw.

You know, for the record, I've had teenage boys, they do not smell nice. They smell the opposite of nice. Have you, for the record, I've had teenage boys. They do not smell nice. They smell the opposite of nice. If I want to strap around, give them jars of noxima. I strap around a middle school field trip once, and the bus ride almost knocked me out. It was horrible. Yeah, my high school girlfriend made me shave using noxima instead of shaving cream for

some reason. She was all about Noxima. Never understood that. So I don't know that smelling like Nima was a turn off. Apparently Lorraine was all about it. But she was 16 and never stood near a boy before. So, you know, after the girl saw their movie Ed offered to buy them all a Coke at a local soda joint. The first two girls got their sodas for a nickel each, but Lorraine ordered an ice cream float that said Ed back an entire dime. Quote, I always knew that she was a gold digger. Ed would be quoted later. What the fuck?

Yeah, these romantic. Quame into my right, it's so romantic. Afterward, Ed walked the girl. Gold digger? She's a gold digger. She fucking sent him back 10 goddamn cents in, you know, the 1940s. Ah, okay. We're just gonna continue on because we have no choice.

I would like to end the story here. It's like, goodnight, folks. Yeah, they left all of this out of the conjuring three, ended up in the cutting room floor for some reason. Afterward, Ed walked the girls home, because there's three of them, one at a time, and then Lorraine for the last. But being good Catholic kid, she reminded him

it wasn't appropriate for Ed to walk her to the door. So he ran across the street, so she could go the rest of the way alone. And apparently, she had another one of her psychic visions because she says that as Ed crossed the street. So she could go the rest of the way alone. And apparently she had another one of her psychic visions because she says that as Ed crossed the street suddenly, she could see him as he would one day be a full grown hulky. She's wait a minute. So she saw what he would become and she was like, I want that. Well, she saw the future. She knew she had no

choice. She that night she wrote in her diary quote, today, I met the man I am going to marry." And then she tried to drown herself in the bathtub. The sorry conjuring fans, the real life Ed and the Rain didn't make out in a gazebo or even hold hands. This is uptight Catholic romance. So we were in, so I guess I were in the early 1940s, and as you might remember, America was, you know, dealing with some shit. The whole world was dealing with some shit. It was not just us. It was a whole world war, as a matter of fact.

So, the Nesper website claims that Ed tried to enlist in the Marine Corps at 16 by lying about his age, but failed. And if you've seen the pictures of him, you can imagine. And I was like, no, no Steve Rogers. You're not, you're not joining right now, buddy. So, but then it says he volunteered to join the Navy the day of his 17th birthday. Now, I went online and found Ed's draft card, and that tells a slightly different story.

That's where I found out about his last name being Mini, was actually looking to that up. Like millions of other teenage boys he got forcibly recruited. And there's no shame in that, but of course he has to make it seem like he was such a hero. He had to go. I got to go fight some Nazis and fight the Japanese. Okay.

So if you go to the Nesper website, they'll find one of their blog entries titled, I'm going to die out here. It says on February 5th, the ship was, quote, somewhere in the North Atlantic, unquote. Then randomly in the middle of the ocean, an oil tanker collided with their ship.

The Spring Hill causing a fireball. They were ordered to abandon ship. The Spring Hill, causing a fireball, they were ordered to abandon ship, jumping into quote, icy, shark-infested waters of the unforgiving sea. Unquote. So it was in the middle of this freezing cold water surrounded by fire that Ed As a former lifeguard, he quote, by default, was an exceptionally adept swimmer. That's bullshit. Because it was expert lifeguard training. The blog tells us that Ed saw another guy struggling in the water. So using all of his skills, he assisted the fellow's sailor.

Quote, and so would the young sailor in tow Ed began swimming, but to where? As Ed swan, he realized the flames were everywhere and closing in to the left flames, same thing to the right and the center and behind. He was surrounded by fire. And to make matters worse, he witnessed sailors being attacked by sharks.

They didn't, they've been in the water for like three minutes and sharks are hurt. He just like leaping out of the water and just biting people in half. It's amazing. That's fucking great. I mean, it's so amazing. Okay, it's just, I was about to say, where are they, but just somewhere? Getting back to the quote. They're just somewhere in the ocean. And, and dying right in front of him. If the sharks didn't get him, surely the flames would. And the icy cold sea. Oh, how cold the water was It would be terrible to freeze to death in a firey

Well be eating my sharks. He had never felt cold like that before he began to pray holy Mary Mother of God, please, please save me. I don't want to die not here. Not now Please, please save me. I don't want to die. Not here, not now." As if the mother of God was truly listening, Ed saw directly in front of them, flames part, an opening through the opening, a lifeboat, a two sailors aboard, navigated its way through the small opening. Ed's prayers were answered. Thank you, Mother Mary. Thank you for answering my prayers." Okay, well, I'm glad that he was the only one that was worthy of survival. For his active heroism, Ed was granted survivors leave. Quote, he used the time to

rush home to Lorraine, having just enough time to be with her a few hours before having to return to duty. Now, other versions say that he married her in that and then had that quicky. That's what they said. They said he married her. They had one night. That's what other versions say that he married her in that and then had that quicky that's what they said they said they had he married her They had one night that's that's what other versions of the stories I this one just said be with her whatever and well then yeah, well, yeah, he married her and then she got pregnant that night Well, that's what they said there, but the daughter was important for several years later. Okay, so that's bullshit So unless she had a miscarriage or something like that because they only have one kid and she was not born until a few years later. Okay, so that's bullshit. Unless you had a miscarriage or something like that, because they only have one kid and she was not born until a few years later. Okay, that is not how that would represent it. Well, that's a thing. There's some inconsistency there, but we,

at least we know how old Judy Spirits is, like she's a person who's alive, like right now. So, now far be it for me, Vambi, to double check an American hero's war story as described in this amazing blog entry on a half-ass website that looks like it was like from 2003. But, you know, when two ships crash into each other and explode, usually people write that shit down. So here I found an article titled Death Toll Now 19-in-ship explosion from February 7th, 1945. Issue of The New York Times, slightly, you know, reputable paper. with 1945. A issue of The New York Times, slightly reputable paper. It breaks down this very serious real accident.

Quote. The Panamadium Tanker Pan Cleo had licensed New York Sandy Howe Pilot Board when she rammed American Tanker Spring Hill in Upper New York Bay. Specifically, she was anchored 1,000 years off Stapleton, Stanton Island. At 8.57 AM Monday, the impact is alleged to have touched off the explosion that all but destroyed

the Spring Hill and two thirds of her 120,000 drums of high octane gasoline in the most spectacular fire seen in the harbor and many years. Unquote. Sound serious. Yeah, it was very serious and

so the explosion definitely happened. And there's no way of knowing whether Ed really heroically saved some of the guys life through his amazing lifeguard skills. And I guess if you want to be super generous, technically being anchored right off statin island is technically somewhere in the Atlantic. I don't believe the waters were either super icy or shark-infested and people were being bitten in half. The reason why boats crashed into each other, because this was wartime and they were in New York Harbor. And there were, so literally, there was a third boat so close that some of the flaming gasoline

splashed and burned some of these other sailors. That's why it was so crowded. It wasn't just like they were in the middle of the ocean. And one boat just accidentally drunkenly rammed into the other one. So yeah, this horrible. But of course, the Nesper website has to change it to make it seem way more dramatic. I mean, it's dramatic enough. He really was on that boat and had to jump in the water. You know, like, and he was a fucking teenage boy. So it's like, and even if he's, I mean, even if they wanted to say, yeah, and he helped one of his fellow sailors out. Yeah. Of course, there's no one ever to corroborate that no dude, no name of, you know, it's just, yeah, she saved a random guy

and find whatever. I'll even given the benefit of the doubt. But still, the way it was written in that website really mischaracterized it. And there were no fucking sharks. Fuck you. All right. There might have been little sharks. Fish. There were maybe some fish either way. Ed and Lorraine got married while he was still in the Navy. According to Lorraine, their daughter, Judy was six months old before Ed came back from the war.

And I do know from this other story I heard at the end of that documentary, that yeah, he was he was stationed in Japan post-war when his daughter Judy was born. So, times were tough for the young couple in post-war America. Ed enrolled in Perry Art School, which was affiliated with Yale, actually. So it was an art school extension of Yale, I guess he was using some kind of GI benefits.

It was very fancy, fancy art school. So Lorraine tells of their early plans to become landscape artists. But they found an interesting angle. Quote, we needed a subject to paint. A good subject, something people could relate to. Well, haunted houses proved to be that subject. Ed would find a haunted house written up in the newspapers or get a lead on one from the

locals in town. Then we drive out to the side and our old Chevy. Ed would do up a complete sketch of the house and grounds. All the while of course the owner of the place would be peeking out the window wondering what the heck was going on. We were just kids then, so one of us would knock on the door, show them the sketch of the house, then offer it in exchange for information about the haunting. If the story was engrossing enough, we'd paint up the house for a collection and sell it later at an art show." Okay, that wasn't even from the documentary because that's not what they said. This is sort of their start is described in the most flattering terms possible.

They're post your years for young families. So like other descriptions kind of leave the impression that Ed had a hard time holding down a traditional job and he had done this art thing. So he kind of doubled down in his hobby slash obsession with the paranormal. So this weird couple would show up on the sidewalk in front of a house and then be drawing somebody's house. And then when they came out going, what the fuck are you doing?

We're drawing your haunted house. Can you tell us about the haunting? And they were like, oh, thank God, we thought you were going to rob us. The Nesper website reports the couple set up pop up stands in tourist areas all over New England to sell Ed's paintings. Tony Spira, the guy married to the Warrens daughter Judy,

keeps some of the art in the barn, still hosting the sign Ed Warrens barn door studio in art school. And they're fine, some are gothic and atmospheric. Others are just like middle of the road, American landscapes and houses. One is a cute picture of a witch flying a room through the moonlight with cartoony bats flying around.

So I'm gonna show you real quick. You can just react to this. What do you think of what you're seeing? You know, heads. Okay, I mean, it's a nice little drawing of a house. Yeah, they're fine. Look kinda, or you would just kinda see in somebody's wall but not think a lot about.

Dumbed to fail. Let's just pop up. Okay, so you want me to scroll through? No, I mean, you just take a look at a few of the paintings and you have any reaction or just... Okay, it's a picture of a house. Yeah, there you are. Yeah, I mean, yeah.

Oh, this one looks like a haunted house. Yeah, there are a few Yeah, I mean, yeah. This one looks like a haunted house. Yeah, there are a few that have more scary little elements. Little gothy. It's literally, it's like if you were going to have a mind-side picture of a haunted house, this is what it would look like. It's so generic, okay. That was the Ed Warren art that got everything started. Okay, well, I mean, he's not a bad artist.

He's fine. He's fine. But certainly not going to be, make him so rich with those paintings. No, I mean, he's nothing, you know, unusual or spectacular either. Right. It was really just this weird obsession he had that made them stand out. Lorraine reports that she was skeptical at first, because she grew up with zero paranormal experiences,

except her mutant powers, but didn't see ghosts or anything like that. She later said, quote, I was a little wary of the people with whom we spoke. I thought they were kind of suffering from overactive imaginations or were just making things up to get attention. In fact, some of the people told us stuff that sounded completely outlandish. Back then, unquote. Oh, key, dokey. It's interesting that Lorraine describes her transition from skepticism to belief as like

a gradual process because you'd think that like if this shit's real, like there'd be some dramatic, like anything like you'd see in any of these movies or the stuff they talk about, like stuff flying across the room or... Yeah, I mean... But she just said, there are over time I got into it, you know? Although I have to say, is someone who has witnessed some weird shit and stills, like, I would be more, like, willfully disbelieving as opposed to someone who's, like, would be considered a skeptic. But yeah, I, I'm not an open-minded skeptic.

I've actually seen some really weird shit. And I'm like, no, there has to be an explanation for it, even if I don't know what that explanation is. So I can see that being like, you witness a bunch of little shit and it kind of wears you down over time. Or Ed wore her down over time. Ed wore her down over time. He just brow-beater until she was like fine. So they spent like five or so years just wandering around the country, drawing people's houses and collecting all these spooky stories. And it was during this time,

Lorraine developed her superpowers that led her see beyond the veil of time. Okay, the demonologist, the book, claims that over the course of years, Ed's influence, quote, caused Lorraine's clairvoyance to develop significantly. Later in the 1970s, Lorraine was tested at UCLA, where her clairvoyance was judged as being far above average. Unquote. That's hilarious, because you know what? Now they've even attributed her bullshit superpower to Ed.

It's really okay. Well, it's just because of his fine-tuned her gift. Because she had the raw power here in the knowledge. Because even her pretend superpower is really just because of a man. Naturally. I love this story already. From the 1940s through the 1960s, the Warrens transition from Hobo artists slowly toward something

resembling a little more what you'd saw in the Conjuring movies. They founded the New England Society of Paranormal Research, Nesper, who we quote from quite a bit on their modern website. And I say modern, it looks like 20 years old. The couple collected strange stories and artifacts and build themselves out as experts on ghosts and demons. As interest in the occult grew in the 1960s, so to the opportunities to monetize. I'm sure they did. Okay, so basically it's just

like they collected all these stories and they were like, okay now how can we bullshit these be? Yeah, and then in the 40s and 50s, people didn't have much time for this nonsense, but the 60s was the beginning of interest in this sort of thing. And suddenly, they were just a little bit ahead of their time, but eventually culture caught up with them. So defenders of Ed and Lorraine will be quick to point out that they never charge anyone for investigation. They only charge for hard expenses like gasoline, hotel, and food and stuff like that. And so going all the way to the early years. But if you're a hobo,

we're nowhere to go. Yeah, and remember at the beginning, they started this by bribing people with art just to get in and get the stories. Because again, this is about Ed being obsessed. But over time, they built up this reputation as experts on the occult and spirits and demonology. And so like, you know, people started to kind of know, oh yeah, those are those guys who know about the ghost stories. So reporters would call them. And

eventually they managed to, like, I think it started in the 1970, I think, is when they started getting gigs lecturing at colleges. So, if they eventually become expert witnesses for like the police, I'm just gonna start throwing things. We're gonna talk about some of that. Oh, good. But not yet. Now I do need some more weed, like an assholes. This is also, so they were giving paid lectures at colleges

and tours of their occult history museum, which is featured if you saw the movie of the conjuring, then you know, and that was that creepy side room where they lock away all of the stuff, including the creepy doll that we're going to be talking about. The creepy doll. Yeah, we'll get into that. Oh, we'll get into that. In a few minutes, we're getting into that. So except in the movies, it's this place that lock away dangerous artifacts, and they don't want anybody to go in. In real life, they charged money and let anybody,

the fucking that he wanted to get in. And in fact, it's still possible to go there now. A used to reside in the basement, but has since been moved into a building that resembles a large shed in the backyard. Because of zoning laws and legal troubles, they can no longer just give paid tours to anybody, but they'll do like there's these groups. You can go in through groups that it's technically private,

but there if you want to, you can still arrange to get in. And then you can just go meet Annabelle for yourself. And so right now it's mainly just film crews that make scary videos to keep the legend alive and stuff like that, but you know, and if you want to go in, they will douse your hands with holy water first. It is a rule. So American pop culture has been very good to the warrants

as, because like from the 1960s through the 80s, like interest and belief in the dark and supernatural forces coincided with the books, movies, and television. So the 60s gave us Rosemary's Baby. And then the late 60s is when the novel version of the exorcist hit the best cellars list. And then of course, you know, years later, the 1970s, the movie came.

And so on. And literally so it's this weird thing, it fed into the belief, just like belief in aliens coincided with a lot of these goofy sci-fi movies from the 50s. So there's this weird feedback loop of culture and belief. Oh, people. You know, technology evolves, but people do not. People, we are dumb and easily fooled.

And then once we're fooled, we refuse to believe that we've been fooled. See, here's the hilarity. It's like a lot of Christians don't believe in evolution. It's like, well, I'm starting to not believe in evolution either because I don't think we've evolved. I think we're still just monkeys. Seriously.

So, everything we just talked about, this is just, this has been setting the table. It's time for the main course. So let's talk about Ed and Lorraine's most celebrated and terrifying cases, many of which have been made into books, TV specials, and now a multi-billion-dollar film franchise. Now, if Ed were still around, he would warn us that even thinking about these things too much is inviting dark forces into our lives and endangering our very souls. But for our podcast audience, he doesn't want you to think about it too much,

except for when you're listening to his podcast, his radio show. And the fact that he would never shut the fuck up about any of this stuff ever. But don't think about it too much. So we're risking not only our souls, but our podcast audiences as well. Yeah.

So go to help people, literally, with us, because we're gonna talk about it I say fuck Ed Warren jump in the hand basket y'all we're going for a ride. Let's talk shit about everyone's favorite creepy doll Annabelle you mean raggedy and yeah, so that's what we're about to get into So I don't need to tell anybody who Annabelle is at this point She's the most famous of the creepy dolls out there. She's more creepy than Robert the Doll down in Florida. I want to go visit Robert the Doll just because why the fuck not?

Unless at least Florida is better to go to the... It's Florida. You know, you don't want to go to Massachusetts. I mean, yeah. Connecticut. I mean, it sounds fine, I guess, but I mean, Florida has beaches. Yeah, however, so let's see. Yeah, it's one of those weird things.

Robert the doll looks sort of genuinely creepy. He looks sort of like Jared Kushner. I was about to say, even is it Robert the doll in the keys? So it's not even just Florida. It's a really fun, awesome, part of Florida. So however, we're not talking about Robert the doll. We're talking about Annabelle. And if you were to Google that name,

the first image that'll pop up in your feed is a like this Victorian doll with a frankly upsetting porcelain smiles and eyes that are just a bit too wide. And if you saw the conjuring, she was an important bee plot of that movie. They introduced the entire movie with Annabelle and then she pops up in the middle as this threat

just so they can tease the three fucking movies they've made since then. So yeah, we've had three Annabelle movies. She's racked up this huge body count in the cinematic universe at this point. And in fact, it's like a guess through the second movie, even tied to the Manson murders. I didn't see the Annabelle movies, but I literally saw some of the names of the characters, and they're all fucking Manson murders. Like, Tex Watson. Oh, wow. Okay.

So I guess I'll have to see at that point and see what the, I've heard that Annabelle II is actually good and that Annabelle III is at least entertaining. Like the Chucky movie. I heard the first Annabelle sucked and the second one was really good. Kinda like the original Ouija suck, but Ouija II was actually a really good horror movie.

It's like the Chucky movies. It's like the first one was scary and then after that they got more comical, but someone could say they went from scary to more entertaining. And in the movie versions, all the warrants can do is just lock the doll away. Because if you destroyed, it would only release the demon

and be even worse. So just keeping an anabelle locked away as the safest and best thing you can do. So, you have already spoiled what the real Annabelle looks like. She is, in fact, a raggedy Ann doll. Yeah, see, and in my head, in my head, see, she's locked in a cabinet not being able to commit crimes, but somewhere out there, Andy, is trying to take your soul. Andy Bell.

So, yeah, this is a doll literally made of pillow stuffing and cloth with yarn for hair And she has like a little yarn smile a little little placid yarn smile and and whether you believe in her Not you can understand why they redesigned her for the movies because she is not frightening to look at even remotely No, actually it's very funny because I was talking to my son and about the Anode Bell, and he actually has like dolls or creepy, which is funny because I collect dolls. And so, but yeah, he has this inherent dolls or creepy. You got mom's old creepy dolls.

I do. In fact, Aaron wouldn't even let me put her in the attic. She has to be displayed at all times. She changes hats with the season. Yeah, and now she's finally appropriate for Halloween. Well, she started out as a prop in my haunted deep party in Brehawnet House. Now she's convinced you to keep her up.

And she has, she's convinced me to keep her up. That's what they do. And you know what, mom had never named her and now I have. So, so Millie sits in my living room. Millie, Millie the doll. So we'll let you know if Millie starts killing animals and people or... Millie has never harmed anything or anyone.

She just sits there and she looks pretty. I like her. All right, so yeah. They made, they made, they made movie Annabelle scary. Even people who, like my son who thought that like dolls. They're into creepy dolls. Yeah, dolls are creepy inherently. Looked at the raggedy Annabelle was just like,

what the fuck? I'd be like taking one of her old cabbage patch kids and telling that was evil. It's haunted. Trevor's coming for us. All right, so the year was 1968, baby. And according to the demonologist, I'm just gonna spoke, I've been quoting,

an Episcopal priest called the Warrens to check in in a situation where two young women had contacted a spirit that had physically attacked someone. And the rain came with a tape recorder to document the interview, which is transcribed in the book. So the, here's the thing, the names are different. The book the demonologist gives the names I'm gonna use here, but then every other interview

and thing you'll find uses other names. So I say D-DRA apparently the real name is Donna. Okay. But either way, so nobody really knows. Well, I think that it's just like this for whatever reason that when it came to Annabelle, they changed the names and we'll talk about that in a second. So Annabelle was given to a nurse named D-Dra, the name and the demonologist, as a birthday gift.

She's like 28 years old. Who the fuck is a raggedy and old to a 28 year old woman? Yeah, so people she had like moved into an apartment and was like a little housewarming gift or a daughter. I'm going to give my daughter this doll. And apparently her daughter like to sleep with big pillowy dolls is kind of like you'd sleep with a side pillow. That's what she would use Annabelle for. Um, and this is before she was Annabelle. She's just raggedy and dolphin.

Apparently, supposedly from a secondhand store. This is like a used old raggedy and doll according to the story. Um, like from the first door, a thrift store, a thrift store, a thrift store raggedy and doll, that is her birthday.

Smells like an astray and armpits. What the fuck? Yeah. Yeah, great present mom. Thanks. Well, except this is what the story says. And then over the next year, they would just notice little weird things going on. So at first, they would just see the doll's shifted positions from when they left and

there were the dolls alone all day. The legs would be crossed or uncrossed. Or the arms would be different. The legs would be crossed or uncrossed. The arms would be different. The doll would, whatever, just some little things. Then suddenly the doll would be in a different side of the room or in another room entirely. It just got more escalated.

The doll moving around while they were gone, but just, they're always perfectly still. And then, like, odd poses. They said at one point, they saw the doll kneeling in a doorway. You can't even get raggedy into kneel. So, like, the moment she, they picked her up, like they could never get her to do it again, which she was like weirdly kneeling in position.

Then it started leaving notes. And they actually did that in the conjuring too. They should've- Did she ride in crayon? Little, this was to be pencil notes on scraps of parchment paper. And they're like, we don't even have parchment paper. And the notes would say things like, help us.

Okay, so how did the dog get the parchment paper? How did Raggedy Ann with no fingers pick up a fuck? It's her hands like a little pillow. At least Annabelle, they showed her where she could sort of almost hold a crayon, but Raggedy Ann couldn't even do that. But so they see these little notes. And so Dieter and her roommate Laura

ruled out someone punking them. So they were like, they thought maybe someone was sneaking in and fucking with them. So they did things like taping the doors and doing stuff. The rug's kind of to catch anybody coming in and out of their place. Nope. No one's coming in and out. Annabelle, which once again is just so far still just ragged in is just doing this. So this was about six weeks into this the the more intense shit going on related to the doll. Okay. All right. So this is where so six weeks into the doll. Okay. All right. So this is where, so six weeks into the doll,

moving around and writing notes and weird shit. So then they decided to contact a psychic medium. And this person comes in and they hold a seance to try to commune with whatever ghost is messing with this doll. And they learned that a little girl had died on the property, a seven-year-old girl named Annabelle Higgins.

So she's from the time before the apartments were even built, so she's this confused little ghost, apparently wandering around, and so she, the doll and these younger women were the first people she got attached to. She said she was the one moving things around, and so speaking through the medium, Annabelle Higgins asked for permission to stay with the girls, well, young women, and move into the doll. And so, Diedra and Laura said, yes, and gave permission, let them go into the doll. See, and this is why you can never trust a psychic medium.

Because, you know, look, I go wrong from here. Well, we're about to find out. Diedra's fiance, Cal, claimed the doll gave him recurring nightmares. He told one heroine story about how he had a third person nightmare. So he's literally looking at his own body, laying there in the cow at choice, taking a nap. And he's just standing there like an astral form or whatever, looking at it. And then he sees Annabelle crawling up his paralyzed body.

And then there are little hands going on his neck. And he's like, he's seeing himself thrash as Annabelle strangling him. And then he wakes up in a cold sweat. How does a pillow strangle you? Yeah, he's seeing himself thrash as Annabelle strangling him. And then he wakes up and a cold sweat. How does a pillow strangle you? Yeah, what's again? I mean, if she would have smothered his hands and mouth, I could at least... She doesn't have any fucking fingers. She doesn't have enough bone structure to like...

But this doesn't matter. It was a dream anyway, so this is super strong to dream Annabelle. Yeah, well, it's also like, okay, so it's so strangling someone's like in the movies not in like real life because strangling someone in real life is actually hard. Well, even he's admitting this is just a nightmare and he wakes up, but it's till he blames the doll, but dolls give it in these scary dreams.

Oh, another time he heard noises late at night. And he heard a strain, like, strange noises in the other room and then he just finds the raggedy and doll just in the corner. So he went to take a look at the doll and then suddenly he felt something behind him. And when he turned around and didn't, didn't see anything, he suddenly screamed and bloody claw marks appeared in his chest, soaking through his shirt, four down, three across. But magically, the cuts healed quickly and left no scars. Oh, okay. Well, there you go. Magic. So everything's fine.

An upstory. Yeah. Nightmares and quick healing cuts. Okay. Yeah. Night shirt was ruined. You'd throw it out. Okay. So nightmares and basically more nightmares. Cool. Ed determined that Annabel Higgins was an invention that the entity now inside the doll was never human to begin with. It was instead a demonic spirit. So Ed called in a priest who performed exorcism blessing on each room in the apartment to banish the negative mojo and the warrants put the doll in the car.

So on the way home their car started to stall on all the curves and they almost crashed. So Ed sprinkled Annabel with holy water so she'd knock that shit off until they got home. From the demonologist again, quote, for the next few days, Ed sat the doll in a chair next to his desk. The doll levitated a number of times in the beginning. Then seemed to fall inert. During the ensuing weeks however, it began showing up

in various rooms of the house. When the warrants were away and had the doll locked up in the outer office building, they would often return to find it sitting comfortably upstairs and Ed's easy chair when they opened the main front door. It also turned out that Annabelle came with a friend, a black cat that would occasionally materialize beside the doll. The cat would stalk once around the floor, taking particular notice of books and other objects in Ed's office, then returned to the doll's side and dematerialize from the head down.

Unquote. So, Raggedy Am was friends with the Josh Cat. Yeah. Okay. All right. I mean, it doesn't sound like any more bullshit than the other bullshit. So, let's just keep going. We got dematerializing cats.

I mean, if the bullshit is getting deep in here, should I get a shovel? It seems that Annabelle hates priests. Growing sounds were heard when one visited the Warren's weird basement. Another disrespected the doll and tossed it onto a chair. On the way home, the Padre's brakes failed. He was almost killed in an accident,

which also, by the way, seems to be like if you take the Warren's version of Annabelle that seems to be your primary way of killing people is is all that car accidents. Wow. I mean that demon knows a lot about cars. If that wasn't dramatic enough a year later they were having a party and a priest went to chat with the rain in a side room where Annabelle was hanging out because this is back before they locked her away. How many priest parties do they have? They are super Catholics. They are constantly hanging out with priests.

I mean, all they do is like hang out with priests and get, and almost dry. Get drunk with priests because that's... And drive off cliffs or whatever. So Annabelle wasn't locked away at this point. She's just hanging around the house. She's just chilling. So they get, so Lorraine goes to have a conversation with this priest in the side room, Annabelle's there, and suddenly a wall decoration

was described as a seven inch board tusk necklace. It just explodes and shards of this necklace just fly all over the priest and Lorraine. A board tusk necklace. I mean, board tusks are pretty long. What? So, they have this necklace. Like, at a bee?

Did they make beads? That's what it said. I got it. It wasn't just a large. It was just a, I don't know, it was just a necklace. And the necklace exploded. And then a guest with a camera ran in and snapped a picture. And that supposedly shows two beams of light

that are coming straight from above. Raggedy ends head pointed at the priest in this picture that the Warrens haven't shown anybody and is not available to see. But the author tells us all that there was evidence. There's a lot of people mysteriously disappeared. I'll tell you this. There's a lot of times I'll describe these pictures or recordings like these interviews

and stuff. Even though there are supposedly transcriptions or descriptions of something people are looking at, they won't just show you or let us hear it. All the best evidence is just locked away. It's too good. It's just too good to show us. Another time, Lorraine had, yeah, we got to ease you into this. Another time Lorraine had to move Annabelle because it was creeping out of contractor who was doing some work in the house. Like, lady, can you get this creepy doll? It's just staring at me. It's staring at me. So after hitting the black, so she's sightless, glassy eyes.

Well, it's not. It's her felt. Well, no, Raggedy Ann had buttons for her. Yeah, her button eyes. So Lorraine hits her, her, the doll and her hands with holy water. She picks it up and that's when the Warren's Tabby cat Marcy went bananas and started waddling and demanding to be let outside the moment Lorraine picked Annabelle up when she didn't want to be handled. The Warren Sun and Law Tony Spira says Ed built the

special case for Annabelle in the late 1970s, apparently just completely sick of the dolls bullshit. It was stained with holy water and holy oil, like the in the wood stain itself. Just mixed it in there into the varnish. I mean, that's the way to do it. Yeah, and had a prayer inscribed by a priest inside the case. Ed hand the letter to sign that reads, warning, positively do not open. That's outside of Annabelle's case to this very day. Yeah, I loved how it was like a Curio case in the movie, but it's really a coffee table.

It's just this tiny little box that I built myself. It's a little glass coffee table. Tony also said that one time a college student tapped on Annabelle's glass and talked shit about the doll and then died in a motorcycle accident in the way home. Because once again, you fuck with Annabelle, she will fuck with your ride. Okay, so again, no names, no details, no accident reports or anything. And even then, people get in fucking car accidents.

The fact that people who took a tour and then somebody gets a car accident dies's a correct one, dies. Yeah, it's not a... That wouldn't be rock solid, even if they did give us a name. But they won't even do that. Because supposedly the guys girlfriend survived and she 100% believes it's Annabelle or at least so they say. You just can't... She can't open that door into her own mind

because then it can psychically hurt you. So... How does that even, whatever? Okay. So, all that, that's the official version of Anabel. That's the one they want us to believe in. Honestly, though, it's her accomplice Andy. He's getting under there with his little, his little belt hands.

He's handy with a wrench. No one's looking for Andy. No one's looking for Andy. No one's looking for Andy. Annabelle's just like, I'm right here. But let's put on our skeptic hats for just a minute here. Here's a problem with most of the Warren's case files, whether you believe in any of it or not. There's like real people involved.

Like you said, you watched a whole documentary that had people giving you views, talking about it, or at least pictures of them. Did you notice how when they talked about Annabelle at the end, well, you didn't know that you saw the event, but they do. They don't, they're weirdly enough, none of that. The Amityville horror was the one they really wanted to focus on. Yeah, well, that's the most famous of all the things, even the, and we're going to get into where that goes. Coming up in part two, but, but every other story will cover has like verifiable human beings attached to it.

Except for the Warren's version of events, there is literally no one to corroborate anything about where Annabelle came from in the first place. All compelling evidence, including tape recorded interviews and photographs, they're all mentioning these texts and on the websites and shit have never been made available to anyone. So... Well, that's a thing if it was like bought into a thrift store. This is the late 1960s or 28 year old girl. There are there for all those years, certainly someone involved in this crazy story

could have come forward and said, yeah, I was the original owner of Anabelle or they could have just given the names and say like every other person has a name. These people have had two different versions of their name and just vague, vague, and so let but it gets worse. So let's keep going here. The specifics of the story have also changed and shifted around like different versions of

who threw Annabelle and then gotten to a car accident or different depending on when you hear the story blah blah blah and we'll give them credits like human marise flaw. But let's just look elsewhere. One other issue I have is while Ed Lorraine and Tony Spira speak of Annabelle as if she's the most dangerous thing they've ever encountered. They've spent years showing the doll off to anyone who would pay them to take a museum tour. Now that the museum is close to the public, Tony brings the doll out for paranormal festivals and even took the doll to Las Vegas a few years ago. Nice, did it gamble? I don't know. Supposed at a hot winter. So while I was writing the script for this very episode, I just stumbled onto a charity live stream happening for the YouTube

channel overnight. So these are like guys who they do overnight and big famous haunted locations. Okay. And they were doing a multi-day live stream where they were in the Warrens Occult Museum. One guy's literally in a middle chair, sitting right next to Annabelle. And I was riding the skirt and I just saw, and I kept it alive for a while while I was riding this. Just watching these chuckle heads, just goofing around.

They're at this point, they've been doing this for days or Santa Paul night. They're punch drunk. One guy at one point was air-humping right in front of Annabelle's case. So if Annabelle isn't, and everyone seems okay, but even though these guys, I think these guys are goofballs,

they were raising money for a worthy charity, trying to rate $666,000 towards feeding people, which, and they were halfway there. So, you know what, fine. I'll let it go. It's fine, plus, if Annabelleelle and Annabelle is apparently in support too, because she's not killing any of these people. Yeah, no, parent, you know what, maybe she likes being tri-humped, okay?

Yeah, that's probably the most action Annabelle's gotten in a while. So, if Annabelle isn't actually a demonic doll, where did they come up with the idea? One theory lets us blame Rod Serling. So, depending on the specific source, Annabel pops up in the late 60s of the year 1970, and I'm going to say actually probably 1970 for reasons I'm about to tell you. According to the website History vs. Hollywood quote, given the style of the real doll, it was most likely purchased new since that particular raggedy and doll with the Calico dress

does not predate the 1970s. So even though they say that it's this old thrift store doll, the dress soared right onto her. So someone actually did that. You reign went into the fucking store and bought a raggedy and all brand new because that style didn't exist before 1970. So again, this don't even match the year on their own official version of 1968. So either way, it was November 1st on 1963 when a memorably creepy episode of the Twilight Zone aired.

The talking Tena doll. Taki Tina. This episode is titled Living Doll. It tells the story of a jerk stepfather played by Telli Savales, who becomes angry when his wife buys a doll named Tauke Tina for her daughter. And so it's like they don't really make it clear. They show that like he's the stepfather. He'd married this single mother.

And you don't know. He may just be shooting blanks or maybe he's having like true sexual dysfunction. But he's very insecure about the fact he can't have children with his wife and Ollie stuck with his stepdaughter. So he's being a real asshole to both of them in this episode. So the doll begins giving a stepdad creepy and threatening messages.

As the story goes on, he becomes more increasingly unhinged throughout this episode. So first he tries to throw the doll away, and then he tries to destroy it. And the doll's like, has powers at this point. Like he tries to melt its face off of the blowtorch he can't he tries to squeeze its head with a vice. My name's Taki Tina and I don't like you very much. Indeed.

So literally at the end when he literally is like he was about he drove his wife is about to move out because he's gone completely crazy and you don't know all the way up to this point in the episode you're not sure if the doll is really doing it or that he's just crazy because it's always just him alone Having these experiences with the doll. So in the end he gives the doll back to the little girl But then he goes to bed and he wakes up in the middle of the night. Here's a weird noise He runs out and then trips over the doll at the top of the stairs rolls down the stairs breaks his neck and literally dies The lights fades from his eyes where he's staring into Taukeetina's eyes. And then mom finds husband and the doll

at the bottom of the stairs. She picks up the doll who says, my name is Taukeetina and you'd better be nice to me. And so it was like a very cool creepy episode of the Twilight Zone. Three kids, three kids, three kids, three of them. Now, Granite, have you ever actually heard the original, like, talking doll, the Edison talking doll?

Well, yeah, there's the Edison talking doll that at this point, Chatti Cathy was the popular one. Yeah, Chatti Cathy, that was from the 60s. Right. But however, like the original one, the Edison one, you could understand how people would thought, that is the creepiest fucking thing I've ever heard. I mean, that's probably where the entire like haunted doll came from just because that thing was fucking crazy.

Yeah, there have been haunted dolls stories going back to this is this sort of idea. But here's the kicker, Bambi. You know, the mom there holding the doll in the end of the episode. Her name was Annabelle. Well, there you go. So, yes, like they're not even gonna... They're not even trying. Not even trying too hard, why try?

So, like a few years later, they're like, let's just buy a raggedy and all. I mean, allegedly, Jamie's opinion, this is all complete bullshit based on what I've just said. But you're never gonna guess what? There was just too much Ed and Lorraine to cram into a single episode, no matter how much I wanted to. So now that we've ruined Annabelle,

we're gonna ruin the conjuring, all of it sequels, the Amityville Horror, a haunting and Connecticut, and even some more movies and books and shit. And maybe take a hard look and Ed and Lorraine's perfect marriage. All that and bad jokes in part two. Oh, okay.

Coming up, thank you if you're listening and sticking with us. We appreciate it, we've been gone for a while, but we're gonna try to at least be back semi-regularily. We're not holding ourselves too quiet as tight as schedule anymore. Fingers crossed. I got my charity this week.

I was laughing at the guys having the sleep over with Annabelle, but I do think it's awesome that they're raising money for feeding America. So in solidarity with these goofballs, these these ghost bros, I'm going to recommend the same. Feeding America is the largest hunger relief organization in the United States. They're a nationwide network of food banks, food pantries, and community-based organizations in the largest one in the country. So they work to end hunger and provide food to millions of people every year. You can learn more and support their work at feedingamérica.org. And I have picked what I'd consider to be the scariest thing happening here in the United States. And that's police wanting to train in urban warfare.

And that's police wanting to train in urban warfare. So my charity for now until we stop it is. Stop cop city. Well, stop cop city.org is the organization, but it's the Atlanta police. Well, if you look up, there's the Atlanta Solidarity Network. There's a number of, if you literally just look up the StopCop City movement, you will see a number of charities and bail funds and other things

to support the protest movement, that is trying to prevent a huge area forest from being raised, so a giant urban training center, so militarized police from all over the country and even the world will come here just to make the police even worse than they are now. So that's what I'm all about. Yeah, so police are scary and we should not train them to terrorize us. The last haunted house is if cops were shooting less people. Yeah,

the reals. And yeah, once again, remembering Ed Warren's dad, look up 40% of all cops. We'll talk to you later. See you in part two. All right, bye. See you. you