Change Your Brain Every Day - Dealing with Depression

Episode Date: May 2, 2017

In this episode of the Brain Warrior’s Way Podcast, Dr. Daniel Amen and Tana Amen have a discussion on a topic that has been very personal for Tana: Depression. Learn the many causes and risk factors for depression, the 7 different types of depression, and natural methods a Brain Warrior can use to attack depression.

Welcome to the Brain Warriors Way podcast. I'm Dr. Daniel Amen. And I'm Tana Amen. Here we teach you how to win the fight for your brain to defeat anxiety, depression, memory loss, ADHD, and addictions. The Brain Warriors Way podcast is brought to you by Amen Clinics, where we've transformed lives for three decades using brain spec imaging to better target treatment and natural ways to heal the brain. For more information, visit amenclinics.com.

The Brain Warriors Way podcast is also brought to you by BrainMD, where we produce the highest quality nutraceutical products to support the health of your brain and body. For more information, visit brainmdhealth.com. Welcome to the Brain Warriors Way podcast. Welcome to the Brain Warriors Way podcast. I'm Dr. Daniel Amen. And I'm Tana Amen. Today, we're going to talk about depression. And unfortunately, you know more about it. Way more than I want to know.

Than you want to know. In fact, it's affected my family quite a bit. So my mom had a couple of very, really bad episode of depression when I was sick. So I had thyroid cancer. I was diagnosed with thyroid cancer that had metastasized, kind of rare for the type of cancer I had. Came back multiple times, which meant multiple treatments and surgeries and all sorts of things. But it was not really prepared for the treatments the way I think I could have been

or maybe should have been. So at the time that I had to go through treatments, it was different than it is now. And they used to take you off of your medication for long stretches of time. So they removed my thyroid. They removed my thyroid gland and then they took me off of thyroid medication for a couple months. And I was not prepared for what was going to happen. I remember what they said. They said, don't plan on going to school because you're not going to be able to focus. Okay, well, that didn't tell me.

That did not prepare me for what I was actually going to experience. I was so weak I couldn't climb stairs. The brain fog was so bad, I couldn't put a sentence together coherently. There was just this horrible fog. I couldn't add two and two. And then the depression that came over me was this black cloud that enveloped me. And I think the combination, it wasn't just the thyroid medication. No one prepared me for much of anything. Here I had the biopsychosocial spiritual, the four circles we talk about.

So my physiology had changed. My psychology, the idea that I could even get cancer and have to go through this at that young age freaked me out completely. The fact that I had to drop out of school, didn't get to engage in my dreams while all my friends were moving on in school and doing all these things. So you became socially more isolated. Right.

And then spiritually, was there any of the why me? Oh, no. I began to think God hated me. So I went from believing in God to thinking, well, if there is a God, he hates me. And then I started praying that God would just let me die. So I literally prayed that I would get hit by a truck because there was just no point to waste oxygen. And I just remember the pain. It's a pain you can't go away from. To this day, it motivates me. To this day, the fear of that pain motivates me to do things, just to never go back. Well, and fear of that pain motivates me to do things to never go back. Well, and one of the interesting things, and you said depression runs in your family.

Right. When you were a teenager, you actually figured out that if you exercised a lot, that your mood was better, your focus was better, your body image was better. It elevated my mood and it cleared the cobwebs. The only way I knew how to describe it at that time was cobwebs. So I felt like I'd wake up and it was kind of fuzzy. And then I'd exercise and I'm like, oh, everything's clear. Like I can think. And so as we talk about natural ways to heal depression, exercise clearly is one. And many people don't know they use it as an antidepressant. And when they get hurt, when they blow out their knee, when they pull a muscle, when they get hurt, they actually get depressed. Well, and you just touched on another thing.

I couldn't exercise during that period. So the thing that I had used for almost 10 years at that point as something that made me feel good on top of the medication, on top of the other stacked issues, I now couldn't exercise. Yeah. And so two huge issues we've already, three, it's genetic. So depression can be genetic. Medical. Can be because of thyroid deficiency. Or other hormones. It's blatant. So depression can be genetic. Medical. Can be because of thyroid deficiency. Or other hormones. Yours was blatant.

Or other hormones. I mean, they killed your thyroid and then they didn't replace it immediately. Right. My mom. And then you couldn't exercise. And for my mom, hers started with early menopause. She didn't know. She was triggered in early menopause with some stress.

Very common. Right. That menopause can also trigger depression. And the major symptoms are you feel sad or blue, negative, that pain. Hopeless. Hopeless. Helpless. Worthless.

Yes. You can have active suicidal thoughts, which you didn't have, but you had passive suicidal thoughts. Just wanting to die, yeah. Wanting to die. Like I would never do it. I just didn't want to live, right? And then the other things besides the hopelessness is I literally just couldn't will myself to get out of bed. Couldn't do it. So lower motivation. Things that are usually pleasurable are no longer fun anymore.

Nothing. Decreased concentration. I don't even like talking about it. Increased brain fog. Well, I mean, you know why. It's obviously important because depression has gone up 400%. I know, but it actually causes like a PTSD reaction. You're like, I just don't ever want to do that again.

It's so scary. It is. It's awful. Yeah. You know, having had treated it for the last 35 years. Yeah, I can just so empathize with people. And it doesn't just devastate the person. It devastates their families.

It devastates the people that work with them. I mean, it really has a very negative ripple effect. And I think, you know, depending on your environment growing up, I think I was sort of looking back, I was kind of primed in a sense because my environment wasn't super stable. No, you had a lot of stress. There were a lot of stacked. A lot of trauma in the past. Right.

So I was primed. I didn't handle stress well. About, well, I mean, and let's just talk about, because I think you are illustrative of so many different things. You're the one who told me about the study, that children who grow up in stressful environments that grow up with chaos and trauma in their lives, that it has the same effect on their developing brains as a soldier coming back from war. The PTSD. In fact, when we posted that, we got like 13 million views to that.

Because so many of us had pretty crazy upbringings. Mine was crazy. And the chronic stress damaged your microbiome. Because so many of us had pretty crazy upbringings. Mine was crazy. And the chronic stress damaged your microbiome. Plus, I was constantly on antibiotics. Right. And when you have early chronic stress and early, often, antibiotics, it's disrupting your microbiome. And its ability to produce serotonin the neurotransmitter that actually helps you feel happy so bad gut means you're more vulnerable to depression birth control

pills at the time i don't remember actually i don't remember because that also depletes serotonin and and so if you just look at the stack. So in other words, I'm the perfect case study because of those stacked events. I told you that when we met. I know. I'm a psychiatrist's dream. Whatever. I have no idea what that's supposed to mean. That's actually not.

We didn't meet with you as a patient. No, definitely not. Right. So. But it's, you know, it's, there's a lot of things. And I know every time I talk about these stories, people write to me because they, I never would tell this story. I would never, do you remember that first time you told me to tell my story? I'm like, you're out of your freaking mind. It took me decades

to build these walls and no one's going to see behind them. Um, it's like, you know, behind the curtain type of thing, because you just think people are going to judge you for the awful stuff you've been through. But the truth is, the minute that I started talking about them, I couldn't even handle the emails and the messages coming into my Facebook page because… The people don't judge you. No, they've experienced it. And they need to know that there's hope. So, that's what I found out. And since I have known you and you've been working really hard on being well, you've not had an episode of major depression. No, but I know I'm vulnerable.

So I am a warrior. So I believe in having a warrior mindset. You don't wait till fight day to start training. You've got to train every day. You've got to train every day. You've got to be prepared. So let's talk about natural ways to attack. Okay. Well, I'm a little intense. So if you're asking me, yeah, a little bit. So if you're asking me, I'm just one of those people. That surprises me.

I know. Why do you think I married you? You are the yin to my yang. I always say he grounds me. I'm not asking you. We're talking together. Natural ways to go after depression. Yes. So, I mean, because of experiencing it and because I do have that little bit of PTSD, that fear of ever, ever going back to that place, I just do it all. I mean, I literally do it all.

So, for me, having that 10 minutes to meditate and pray and ground myself, literally ground myself and focus on healing energy and gratitude. Yeah, you don't let me bother you. I don't. I'm like, don't come in the room. Don't talk to me. I don't care. Don't talk to me. Exercise. You have boundaries. I have boundaries. Wait, so let's do one by one. Meditation and prayer fooled us because what we actually discovered is those increase brain

activity and increase the chemicals that help people feel normal and happy. Oh, I'm just balanced afterwards. It's very interesting. And then exercise for sure. So I start my morning off by hydration. So lemon water with some ginger, hydrating, detoxing, because your brain needs hydration. And then the fastest way to make it feel better is to hydrate. Then I do the meditation prayer, then exercise. And my daughter has that same

desire for exercise as her medicine. So we do it together. She has the same genetic vulnerability to depression. Yeah. She's more anxious, but we exercise together, and she loves it. So every morning we go to the gym, and that's sort of our routine with that. And food. I mean, we eat ultra clean. And she got so mad at me yesterday. She's like, why did you pass on your digestion to me?

Because she's so sensitive. Which is what mothers do. Right. She's so sensitive to food. So she eats probably cleaner than i do i mean she's that she's that rigid with her food because she feels every little change in her diet and because she's a c-section baby she didn't pass through the birth canal that her microbiome didn't get loaded uh and there's a whole interesting issue around C-section babies having more gut issues than babies who are born naturally.

Right. And then I take supplements. I take supplements. I am vigilant about managing my thyroid. And I have all these people write to me all the time about all the thyroid disease issues they've had and wanting to not take medication. I think it's a mistake. Okay. You're asking as much as we try to do things naturally.

Now, if you're just trying to balance it out and you're just starting and it's just slightly off. Okay. But if you've had Hashimoto's disease, you've had thyroid cancer, you've had Graves' disease or whatever it is, you know. Take your medication. Take your medication because it's too important and too hard to control. If you needed glasses, you wouldn't try to do it naturally. Absolutely. And I manage my hormones and I do supplements to make me feel better.

Especially omega-3 fatty acids. Absolutely. Vitamin D. And, you know, as we talk about, depression's not one thing. No. It's seven different things in the brain. And so you have to know your type. I wrote a book called Healing Anxiety and Depression, where we talk about the seven different types. We talk about them in The Brain Warrior's Way or also in my newly revised Change Your Brain, Change Your Life book.

So there's a way to talk about it. But basically, if you have pure depression, depression without other things, SAMe and omega-3 fatty acids can help. What about vitamin D, though? Especially higher in EPA. Vitamin D is absolutely essential for your brain. My vitamin D was like 13. Right. Didn't never knew it. Right. And you live in Southern California where the sun is out 330 days a year. And why did no one ever tell me that? I, you know, it's beyond me.

So what's your vitamin D level now? It's about 90. And how much do you take a day? I started off having to take 10,000 units because it can vary with people, not only based on skin color, but also if you have a thyroid condition or if your gut's not healthy, you might need more. Now I'm down to 5,000 units a day. But I had to take 10,000 units a day for about two years to get it to finally balance out. Right. And on BrainMD, we have vitamin D3, which is the supplement that's the one you should be taking for vitamin D. My doctor likes mine high, though. Also, Neurovite Plus, our multiple vitamin, has 2,000 international units of vitamin D.

So I'm actually taking 7,000. You're actually taking 7,000. So multiple vitamin, fish oil, vitamin D. if you have the over-focused type of depression, worried, rigid, inflexible, argumentative, oppositional, things don't go your way, you get upset, then boosting serotonin can be very helpful. And one of the supplements I really like is saffron because it's been shown head to head in studies to help support mood. So do you remember when Chloe was young, she was very rigid, very inflexible, would freak out when things didn't, she got surprised or things didn't go her way. She would really freak. So on her chore chart, flexibility became one of her chores she had to work on, literally. It was a daily practice for her.

And now she's not like that. She's actually an amazing child now, but we worked really hard on it. But she does take supplements. And she notices. They help her not to be so rigid with thinking things have to be a certain way with school. And serotonin med support can be really helpful. The other thing you do, I remember when we first met, and I fell in love with you immediately. It took you longer to fall in love with me. But one of the things we did is we went to a Byron Katie workshop.

Oh, yeah. And one of the skills I just think everybody should know and they should actually learn it in second grade. And I have a new book coming out in September called Captain Snout and the Superpower Questions.

For kids, yeah. It's about learning how to kill the ants. The automatic negative thoughts that steal your happiness and rob your joy. Yeah, I had to work really hard at this idea of talking back to thoughts initially really hard. And now I automatically jump to, is that true? Is it true? Probably not. And then turn it around. So once you get practice at it, you can start

talking back to them quickly. You can turn those thoughts around quickly, but I worked at it and it's not comfortable. So a natural treatment for depression, exercise, omega-3 fatty acids, and learning not to believe every stupid thought you have. So the exercise is whenever you feel sad or mad or nervous or out of control, write down what you're thinking and then question it. And the act of writing it down helps to get it out of your head. And so many times this week, I don't know why this week, but I'm working with patients and it's like, he made me crazy. He made me depressed. But then you're a victim. She made me this. And I'm like, okay, so let's write that down. And we ultimately change it to, I allowed him to make me crazy. Because then you have control. Right. Because if you allowed it, then you can stop it. But the cognitive therapy part or the therapy for your thoughts is just a critical piece of that.

Two little things really quickly that I really like in addition to that are, you know, you and I talk a lot about this because I can get fairly intense with things, is does this have eternal value? Am I going to care about this in 10 years or 20 years? Does it matter really? If I'm not going to care about this in 10 years or 20 years? Does it matter really? If I'm not going to care about it in five years or whatever, why am I getting all worked up over it? It's not going to matter.

Now, some things you will care about. Some things are too big. If it's your child's health or, I mean, yes. Okay, there are some things that are. But my computer crashing or whatever, yeah, you know, it's just not worth it. So, and that's happened to me in the middle of a book. And I started to freak out. And then I'm like, you know what? 10 years worth it so and i'm that's happened to me in the middle of a book and i started to freak out and i'm like you know what 10 years from now not gonna matter so it

really helps me to bring it back to you know into focus and then the other thing is is in addition to talking back to thoughts focus on one thing you're grateful for at least one thing and really focus on it because most of us have a lot to be grateful for. Where your focus goes. Your energy flows. Right. Awesome. You're listening to the Brain Warriors Way podcast. Thank you for listening to the Brain Warriors Way podcast.

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