Change Your Brain Every Day - How to Deal with Difficult People with Winn Claybaugh

Episode Date: July 11, 2019

Human beings are a relational species. It’s important to our survival that we form meaningful connections with other human beings. But what do we do when we’re faced with people who seem hell bent on making things difficult for others? In the fourth and final episode of a series on the brain in the workplace, Dr. Daniel Amen, Tana Amen, and Winn Claybaugh go over the proper ways to approach people when there’s some friction involved.

Welcome to the Brain Warriors Way podcast. I'm Dr. Daniel Amen. And I'm Tana Amen. In our podcast, we provide you with the tools you need to become a warrior for the health of your brain and body. The Brain Warriors Way podcast is brought to you by Amen Clinics, where we have been transforming lives for 30 years using tools like brain spec imaging to personalize treatment to your brain. For more information, visit amenclinics.com. The Brain Warriors Way podcast is also brought to you by BrainMD, where we produce the highest quality nutraceuticals to support the health of your brain and body. To learn more, go to brainmd.com. Welcome back. We're here with Wynne Claybaugh, Be Nice or Else. And the one question we want you to think about for this podcast is who is the most difficult person that you interact with at work?

And what's the one thing you can do to actually make it better? Because when you take responsibility for your relationships, everything changes. So we began to talk, and we're going to talk about difficult people at work and how you deal with them. But we left off by talking about rules for gatherings. Right.

And I'm curious about that. Can you share with us? There's 10 gathering guidelines because we talked about the importance of communication, bringing people together. So number one is sit in a circle. For some reason, when people are sitting in a circle, it removes hierarchy. So we're all equal here. We're all important. You can't have any problems.

You can have a suggestion with two solutions. So the words that we use are very, very important. Something as one of them is sarcasm is not allowed. And the reason why that is, is you and I are best friends. We vacation together. We have fun with each other. We go to dinner with each other. So sarcasm is part of how we get along. It's our humor, how we relate to each other. In a staff meeting, it's inappropriate because staff meeting is also about coming up with new ideas, right? So we're going to just brainstorm wild, crazy ideas.

You come up with some crazy idea, and I find an opportunity to get a little dig in you, a little sarcasm at your expense. You know I love you, because we've been best friends for years, right? So I put that out there. You laugh. Everybody laughs. But are you going to be as free with your creativity next time?

No. What did I just do to my best friend? So in a staff meeting, sarcasm just isn't inappropriate. Other things like it's great to have a mind of your own. Use it only when it matters. And that's one of the gathering guidelines because people just like to talk. Well, you already said that idea, so do I need to repeat it too? Do I need to jump in on that too?

I have a mind of my own. Use it only when it matters. Interesting. And we recommend, and I have it, that gathering guidelines is poster size, hanging in the room where people are gathering. Because I've overheard people in a staff meeting say, you know, number five, number five, which is no sarcasm. It's like, we're in a staff meeting. No sarcasm here. So they remind each other, oh, we're in a h meeting and say, you know, number five, number five, which is no sarcasm. It's like, we're in a staff, no, not, not, no sarcasm here. So they remind each other, oh, we're in a, we're in a huddle. We're in communication mode. We're in staff celebration right now. Let's

stay focused to make sure that this is, yeah. Powerful words. Yeah. I love that. That was so helpful. So I know as the Dean of the school, you have dealt with some difficult people, whether it's students or business owners. Do you have some tips for our listeners on what are some of the things they can do to make the situation better and not a flame? Well, if we're talking about a difficult customer. Difficult, yeah. Or a difficult student. Or it could be a difficult student. Okay, a difficult customer. And by the way be a difficult student okay difficult customer and by

the way students are my customers uh customer when a customer complains the last thing that we want to do is place blame or make an excuse right right well you didn't get a good service today because so-and-so is out sick well i don't really care about that as a customer so we don't we don't place blame we don't make an excuse. It's basically, I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry you're going through this. How can I make this better? How can I make this a better experience for you?

People just want to be listened to. They want to be heard. And the same thing applies in a team member situation too. People just need to be heard. And so it's just that honest communication. What do they say? They praise publicly, but coach privately. So these are always private conversations. And sometimes we want to get that dig into a difficult employee to the masses. We want to do it publicly in front of the rest of the team, and that just is never going to go well.

So anytime that you have that difficult conversation, we call them fierce conversations where somebody is difficult and they're not performing at their best or they're, you know, doing something that's, you know, could compromise their job, compromise their employment. It always has to be a private conversation. And that people need to be listened to. People need to be heard because sometimes we don't know the story. You know, we don't know, but that something is going on at home. We don't know that they ran over their cat that day. We don't know the story and we need to have the story. I know. I know. But we have to have the information. And I agree with you. Sometimes it's simply the way that you speak to someone can

either elevate it or can escalate it or we can, you know, we can diffuse it. It's a skill set. It is. It's a skill set to know how to diffuse people. Yeah. Right. And, and, and to, and to be a great listener. I totally agree. And we spend years learning how to talk, how to read, how to write, how much time have we spent on how to listen? It's so true. And yet if we're talking about a customer, what's the customer's number one complaint? They don't listen to me. Yeah. And it's interesting because the environment that I worked in for so long, that wasn't a necessary skillset. Like being very assertive was just what you had to do and being, you know, just very intense and everyone's yelling and it's just very intense. So coming out of that and becoming a mother, boy, do you have to learn a

new skillset, right? You were, Daniel was very helpful with me with that. One of our cultural beliefs, what we train people is the philosophy of go in asking. I like that. Go in asking. Meaning when you go into those situations, ask questions. Because what we do is we go into a situation thinking that we have all the facts. We don't have all the facts. Right. You know, and every time that I go in without asking, I blow it. Because I assume that the reason why they're acting this way is because of this, this, and this. And I didn't have this piece of information that really would have helped the conversation. And so we always say that, Hey, you're, you're having a coaching session. Just make sure you go in asking. So when we sit down with that difficult person,

we're going to ask questions before we go in blasting, before we go in accusing, before we go in assuming that, that they are guilty. Let's just go in blasting, before we go in accusing, before we go in assuming that they are guilty. Let's just go in asking first. I like that. I have a phrase I like a lot. I actually used it this morning with the patient, be curious, not furious. Oh, I love that. And so that's very much similar to what you're saying is go in asking rather than blaming. Because when you blame, you lose almost right out of the gate. Absolutely. Because now you're a victim of the other person and you have no power. In Feel Better Fast and Make It Last, I have this mnemonic I love called relating. It's in the attachment chapter because we are relationship beings. We're not polar bears. Polar bears can be just happy alone, except for very few brief

moments, you know, when they're babies or they're having sex. Otherwise, they're happy. Humans are unhappy. And actually being isolated is a risk factor for dementia. But relating is ours responsibility. I'm responsible for this interaction. What is it I can do today to make it better? I know I can make it worse. It's empathy, seeing things from their standpoint, listening, just like you said, we don't listen. I mean, if you just listen to the news, they're screaming over each other. It's terrible. A is assertiveness. I mean, you have to be able to say what you believe.

Too often, anxiety causes other people to abuse you because you can't stand up for yourself. Time, actual physical time, just like you said, if you just went to your office and locked the door, people are going to make up stories about you. They need time. The I is really special. It's inquire. It's are your thoughts helpful or hurtful? So it's actually inquiring into the quality of your own thoughts and has noticed what you like more than what you don't. I mean, how do they train animals to do amazing things? It's positive reinforcement. And G is grace and forgiveness because all of us make mistakes. If you just take an inventory of the mistakes you've made, you're going to be more graceful with other people.

You made a good, one thing, one distinction was assertiveness. One thing we learn in martial arts, because people think of, oh, you're trained in martial arts, it's very aggressive. Actually, it's not. They make a very strong distinction between aggression and assertion. And so what they really focus on is not being aggressive, removing aggression and focusing on being assertive only when necessary. So it's very interesting.

Well, to come with all of that, we have to have what I call a reservoir. We have to have this full. And so we teach people it's your responsibility to fill this up. It's not anybody's job to make you happy. And so what do you need to do to fill this thing up every single day? And I love that. Whether it's at the gym every single day, whether it's, you know, time with my daughter, calling my 92 year old mother every single day to connect. Yeah. Tomorrow morning I fly to Las Vegas.

Oh, that's so great. Yeah. Taking, taking mom to see the Donnie and Marie show in Vegas before it ends. Yeah. Yeah. He's such a special person too. Great people. So it's, it's all those things. And if I'm not doing these things, if I'm not filling up my own reservoir, which again is my job, then of course I'm coming to work. I'm coming to any relationship empty. And when I'm empty, it's never going to go well. So true. So what is that one thing you can do to make your relationships better? Post that on social media and hashtag brainwatersway.com

leave us questions to learn more about when claybaugh's working go to win claybaugh.com w-i-n-n-c-l-a-y-b-a-u-g-H.com. You can also get the book and it's available everywhere. Be nice or else. We're so grateful for your friendship, spend your time. Thank you for being part of our family. And well, this is still a bit of a star struck moment for me.

You, you, you know that, right? You of all people with what you do. No, no, no.

Just because I was, I was a fan studying the of all people with what you do. No, no, no. Just because I was a fan studying the two of you and what you're all about. So I still get a little thank you. Well, you're a star yourself, so very special. Have a better brain and a better life. Stay with us.

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