Change Your Brain Every Day - Live Like Aubreigh: A Mother’s Mission After Tragedy

Episode Date: October 13, 2025

When Heather Wyatt lost her bubbly 13-year-old daughter Aubreigh to suicide after relentless bullying, her world shattered. But instead of letting grief consume her, Heather turned her pain into purpose. In this deeply emotional and inspiring episode, Dr. Daniel Amen and Tana Amen sit down with Heather to talk about the warning signs parents often miss, how antidepressants can affect young brains, and practical ways to protect kids from social media bullying. Heather shares her journey through trauma, faith, and advocacy—and how the “Live Like Aubreigh Wyatt” (#LLAW) movement is helping families across the country heal and find hope again. This episode is heartbreaking, raw, and ultimately redemptive—a must-listen for every parent, teacher, and teen.

So on September 4th, 2023, you and your family's life changed forever. The Ocean Springs School District is mourning the loss of one of its students today. Parts are heavy at the Ocean Springs Middle School. The school district says one of its students, eighth grader, Aubrey Wyatt, has died. Share with us what you remember about that day. I found Aubrey. Now we know she had been gone for a few hours, but it doesn't process in your head. So I was tried to do CPR on her, and Taylor was screaming at me to stop.

She was like, you can't, and the police and ambulance and everything showed up. It was chaotic. I remember begging God to take me. I came out of the room and the corner went in there. It was a lot. Every day you are making your brain better or you are making it worse. Stay with us to learn how you can change your brain for the better every day. Are you struggling with anxiety, depression, obsessive thinking, past emotional trauma, ADHD, or brain fog, and don't know where to turn?

Are your relationships a mess and you don't know why? Have you had a brain injury? Concussion or just don't feel the same after COVID? Is your memory worse than it was 10 years ago? Or do you have a parent or grandparent with dementia and want to work on prevention? Yes, prevention is possible. But the sooner you start, the better. For 35 years, we've been changing people's brains and their lives.

lives using brain spec imaging and a personalized natural approach to brain and mental health care. And we have some of the best publish outcomes anywhere. Go to amenclinics.com to learn more. And when you call us, mention podcast 10 for a 10% discount. Welcome to the Change Your Brain Everyday podcast. We are very excited to have Heather Wyatt, who is a devoted mom to Taylor and Riker, and the proud mother of Aubrey, whose life and legacy inspired the creation of the Aubrey Wyatt Foundation, a non-profit dedicated to supporting teens and families through therapy, resources, and mental health awareness. Following the tragic loss of her 13-year-old daughter, Heather turned her grief

into purpose, sharing her story to break stigmas and bring hope to others. With over 3 million social media followers, she inspires and reminds people daily that they are never alone. Heather is also an upcoming author working on a memoir that chronicles her journey of faith, resilience, and advocacy. Welcome to the Change Your Brain Everyday podcast. Thank you. It's good to be here. You came all the way from Mississippi. You're just deeply honored.

Would you be open to sharing a bit about your daughter, what she was like as a person? She was very outgoing, very bubbly, laughed all the time, silly, always had the funniest pranks. She's very close with all of us. She and she almost acted like a second mama to her little brother. And then her and her sister were very close. They were close in age and just also close to each other. So tell us the story of what happened.

So Aubrey experienced bullying from the time she was in fifth grade. It was on and off. It would be individuals she was close with that she would consider a friend. And then they would lash out. They would make videos about her. They would pick on her. They would have like slimmer parties. and then tell her, oh, you can't come, and then the next week they would be friends with her again.

And through our faith, something we had always taught is just forgiveness, kindness, compassion. And so initially when this started, we thought, oh, maybe this is just some teenage stuff. But it continued to a point that I told Aubrey, she could no longer stay the night with these people, that they weren't good friends that, you know, I needed to step in and make those decisions. But it escalated. It continued at school. She would get physically assaulted by them. And then she got to a point where she was scared to tell

because she would say that they were going to call her snitches and things like that. They would call her vulgar names, make group chats about her, and then a week later be her friend or attempt to be her friend. And it went on a long time. So I think over time that wearing down, along with mental health and things like that, she began to not value herself.

She began to not find worth and felt unwanted and unneeded. She felt like there was no way out. Why were they targeting? Do you know why they were targeting all right? I don't. I don't. I think some of it is just that inner girl jealousy, that inner girl group, mean girl thing that they do among each other.

Because when I was doing my research, she looks like a very cute, normal girl, her age. Yeah, she was your typical average teenager, beautiful, just I think that within that age, there's a lot of jealousy and wanting to be better than the other. and I think also they have things going on in their personal lives that we may not know about. And Aubrey was at easy target. She didn't lash back out. But what did we say earlier, hurt people, hurt people.

And if you don't feel from what Hershey, you bleed on people who didn't touch you. Absolutely, yes. And I think the fact that Aubrey didn't lash out, she didn't get back at them. So she didn't really stand up for herself with them? No, and she continued to forgive them. and it's a good quality, but it also put herself in a situation, I think, to continue to allow to be that target.

Right, because there is a point where it's okay to draw boundaries. Right, right. And I think that that's hard. I mean, as a teenager, you just want your friends and knowing where to draw that boundary and understand, okay, this isn't a friend. This is actually someone that's trying to hurt me and make me feel less than I am. So I think that that's hard. What was that like for you? It was hard.

It was hard. especially because I was a teacher in the same school district that she was in. So when I would advocate for her or ask them to do things, I was also limited with how aggressive I could be with my approach. So I would reach out to the principals, our superintendents, the teachers. The teachers knew they would email. They would say that their hands were tired, which as a teacher I completely understand, and all you can do is send it up the ladder.

And so for me, it was heartbreaking. I reached out to the parents. I went through every avenue that I knew possible at the time to do to try to help her. And it just wasn't enough. Did you see any signs? I did not. I will say her seventh grade year, she struggled a lot with anxiety and depression due to this. She had been sexually assaulted by a young boy at a baseball game.

We had reported that as well. I think in the school said that because it was there, it was up to them. There were just so many things that I also was unaware of as far as what I could do and assumed that the school had my child's best interest at heart. And so seventh grade was rough. That was when a lot of the bullying and things were going on. And when seventh grade ended, we went into summer, and she was so happy. I mean, literally a couple days before she passed away, she was picking out Christmas gifts.

She was picking out vanities. She seemed happy. She had just started eighth grade. She had been in eighth grade one month. So for us, seventh grade, she did have that anxiety, depression. We knew it was bullying school year. Did she see somebody for the anxiety? She did. So she saw her pediatrician regularly, and then she saw counselors,

therapists on and off since she was in fifth grade. We would increase as needed, decrease. And she had started one just because she had hit teenage years. She needed to see someone that was more experienced in that. So I don't know if it's like this everywhere, but in Mississippi, there's not a lot of resources. And there's definitely not a lot of pediatric therapist counselor. So she was on a wait list to go into that next phase while being maintained by her pediatrician. She had actually just gone into July to her pediatrician for a checkup, waiting on that wait list to be seen by someone. And was she on medication?

She was. She was low dose of anxiety medicine. I want to say five milligrams. Of what? Do you remember what it was? I want to say Prozac, but I'm not positive. positive on that. It was, I believe, it was with a P. So I want to say for a side, but I would have to go back and look. Was it an SSRI? It was. It was. It was an SSRI. Which in some

people can disinhibit them. Right? There's concern about using those in adolescents. And it has a black box warning. Yes, yes. That may increase suicidal... Right, which is something we found out after. You know, I'll say... The pediatrician didn't tell you that? No. Yeah.

I think where Aubrey was at in seventh grade, that was probably our best option. And then we went into summer, and Aubrey did seem, I guess, better. So we assume, oh, it's the medicine working. Well, little do we know. it's because she's not in school. She's not around kids anymore. And I think that's a tough thing, too, with the social media is you're at school all day.

You used to be able to go home. And if you were being targeted or bullied, it ended at home. Oh, no. And now it's worse. And just like you said, the other kids make videos. Yeah, well, it's worse because now they're not being monitored. Right, right, exactly. And so.

Because I'm also a child psychiatrist. And when I started, there was no social media. no cell phones. And there was none of this mass bullying, right? With social media, you can get fame, but you can also get a lot of shame. And it's so potentially toxic, right? It's almost like bullying square or exponentially, you feel exponentially assaulted because it's not just that friend group, it's all of the friends of the friend group and all of the friends of the friends of the friend group. The comments, the likes, the being attacked online at that point then.

Oh, yeah. Was that what she was feeling? Oh, yeah. Definitely. And at one point, because I'd reach up, she even would send their parents the videos. They knew what their kids were doing. Did you ever get any support from the parents that they were doing anything? They would not, nothing.

And I think that was, for me, as an adult, with a developed brain that was hard. So I can only imagine what it felt like for Aubrey to think, oh, my gosh, this is never going to end. But they're not going to stop. Their parents are going to make them stop. The school's not going to make them stop. And she has an older sibling. Did the older sibling ever experience anything like that? No, I think that Taylor hung out with a different dynamic of children.

And so for Taylor, I don't think that she experienced it because of the children she was hanging out with. We live in a very small town. Everyone knows everyone type of thing. So there weren't a lot of school choices? Oh, no, no. There's one elementary. There's one middle school. and there's one high school.

So on September 4th, 2020, you and your family's life changed forever, share with us what you remember about that day. That's like you just had, that's like an anniversary. Yeah, oh yeah, we just had her two-year anniversary. It was awful, awful, screaming, crying. I found Aubrey. it was traumatic now we know she had been gone for a few hours

but that didn't doesn't process in your head so I was tried to do CPR owner and Taylor was screaming at me to stop she was like it's a camp and the police and ambulance and everything showed up. It was chaotic. I remember begging God to take me. I remember just being angry once I came out of the room and the corner went in there. It was a lot. What was the morning, like, go through the day with me.

So, you know, Slaver Day, I'd woken up. I always did a home workout in the morning, so nothing seemed to off. It was around seven when I woke up. I, um, sat on the couch, got everything ready, started my workout, and I got hot, which Wouldn't have been, like, out of the ordinary. But normally, Aubrey in the middle of the night, would always go turn the air down because she liked it colder. So when I would work out, it would already be cold.

So it's like, oh, that's so weird. Why am I hot? So you notice something off right away. Yeah, I was like, why I'm working out, and I'm getting hotter than like the air. The routine was off. And so our living room in a hallway connected. So I went to go to turn the air on in the hallway.

And kind of like the peripheral. I saw her and, well, and I saw her vanity on the floor. And my first thought was, this child already thinks she's getting her vanity because that's what she'd been picking out for Christmas. So I was like, oh, my goodness. And then I turned and saw her and ran and started screaming. and then Taylor came. Taylor had to help me cut her down.

Thank God. Riker was in the far end of the house. God's blessing, he didn't hear anything. He was on his iPad. It's what he did when I worked out. I was like, this is your iPad time. Thank God because he didn't hear anything, isn't it? It's just chaos.

So she had passed away in the middle of the night? Yeah, they think that it was about 2 a.m. It was about 10 when I found her. So I'd gotten up at 7, did everything, started that. I think now from 45 to 10, and when they got there. And she never talked about a plan. She never talked about it at all? Never.

Do you think she was on social media in the middle of the night? I do. I do. She had posted. They were in her draft. She had two videos, and we've shared them on my social media since then. And it just said no. It was to a song that said, no, it's for the better.

And it was her crying. And it was nine three. So it was a couple hours before she did. Do you notice anything different the night before dinner? Nothing. Nothing. We had, that was, she had been. So you have no idea what triggered it?

I don't, I don't, I don't know if she saw a video. I don't know if it had just been building up and she had just kept a straight face all summer. I don't, I don't know what happened tonight. That's going to be very hard not understanding. Yeah. And feeling like you don't, you didn't see or not. Yeah. We are so sorry.

I can't. I think. I have no words as a mom. Yeah. I mean, we went through her phone. We had her phone sent off. I mean, we've obviously found things but nothing that was specific to that night that would have been like a trigger.

I just tried to tell myself that impulsivity. it takes 10 seconds to make a decision that lasts forever you know what I've told my patient's suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary feeling it is and and it doesn't just affect you right it affects all the people you love so if you hate all the people you love do this I think it's hard when even as an adult so I struggle with my mental health after Aubrey passed. And as an adult with those thoughts, it was hard because you don't, in your immediate thought,

you literally don't think outside of that. You're not considering everything else. It's like your brain gets in a tunnel. Yes, yes, exactly. And the tunnel has no windows and no doors. So even as a normal grief that happens. A good counselor, well, he'll break through some of that and go, if you do this, you've just increased the risk of Riker and Taylor doing it

because you're teaching them, this is how grown-ups solved problems. Right. And we've had two people now do it. Yeah. And so that's why counseling is so important to just get out of your own head. Yes. So even in normal grief, normal grief is so hard. Now you add the trauma and the loss of a child.

Yes. It was a lot to, it took a long time to be able to fully grieve. And almost immediately after Aubrey Pass, I knew the importance of therapy, so I immersed myself and the children into that. But then it became battles within the school district and then legal battles. And for a year and a half, it was constant fighting with, systems because of what had happened with Aubrey. And so in the midst of grieving, in the midst of parenting, then I'm fighting legal battles. I'm fighting schools. I left teaching my whole world. When you lose a child, your world. So there are so many things you lost.

It was such a combination of train wreck. It was an utter train wreck. Because it was just one thing after another to a point. You're like, why? What's the point? Like, what's the goal here? Like, what am I supposed to be doing? And are you still living in the same place? No.

Well, we still live in the same city, but we didn't move houses. And I think that that did help. I think for some that maybe they don't need that. I think for us, it just felt like a dark place. What are some things people said or did that were helpful after the loss? Um, one thing that really stuck out is, um, another person that had gone through similar things said that grieving is like you're in the water with a buoy and the waves are just coming and coming. And some days those waves are going to push you under and you're going to come up and you're going to try to catch your breath and you're not going to be able to. And then some days, the waves are a little less. There's always going to be waves. You're always going to be treading water now. but some days are easier than others. And that, on those hard days, I remind myself,

okay, this is a day that the waves are just going to keep coming. So equally important, what are some of the things that people have said that you wish they hadn't said that weren't helpful? I don't know that I wish they wouldn't have said it because I know their intention was good, but like, she said in a better place. Well, like, I know, but I'm still hurting. But I know they mean well. you guys go to church? Do you have a faith? Yes, yes. We've always been immersed in church.

We went to Baptist and things like that, and we kind of just ended up in non-denominational. But yes, we are big in a church. Aubrey was actually at a church retreat the summer before she passed. That was her first like big away win. And it was wonderful, actually, for her. But yes, big in a church, our faith is what keeps us going. So she is in a better place. She is in a better place. At least for me. Oh, yes.

Well, and that is one thing. That helps. And sometimes the illness wins. Yes. Right? If she had cancer, you would feel awful and you would grieve. Yes, yes. But you would feel different.

Right. Because you would go, well, that's not a choice. Right. And but suicide is often. the illness wins. Yes. And, you know, I'm not a huge fan of SSRIs for children. Especially if you don't look at their brain.

See, what we do here is if we would have seen her, we would have went, well, let's look at your brain. And our SSRI is the right thing. And if you have a really busy brain, they're the right thing. But Tanna got depressed in her 20s. It was the wrong meant for me. When she had thyroid cancer and it was the absolutely long thing for her. And for some people, it's magical.

Because she had a sleepy brain. And what Prozac does, or Zoloft or Lexapro, all the SSRIs, serotonin is an inhibitory. Neurotransmitter calms things down. Well, if she started with low activity, it can disinhibit her. and created disaster. And someone has a busy brain, it can be magical. So what do you, if you don't mind me asking, what was the solution, if not a SSRI? So maybe it would have been something like Wilbutrin, which is more stimulating, antidepressant.

Or I love saffron. And saffron in 28 randomized controlled trials showed to be equally effective. is antidepressants, but without those kinds of side effects. But of course, we don't know because we weren't, we're not able to survive. I'm just telling you what I would do. No, but it's great to have that knowledge, especially with my experience. But one of the reasons I love talking to you is the mission I have is to end the concept of mental illness by creating a revolution in brain health.

And I always think about four big circles, you know, what's going on in her brain? What's the biology? What's the psychology? So she had a lot of, we call them ants, automatic negative thoughts, the thoughts that come into her mind. And she didn't learn how to control them, right? I talk about killing the ants, right? And then there's the social circle. She's being bullied.

That likely, as you said, the trigger, when you feel. feel ostracized. And there's a spiritual circle. So why do you think you're on the planet? Why do you care? But you gave her a spiritual foundation. So odds are social problems, psychological issues. And you said something else that's really important is she was sexually assaulted. And so that trauma can diswept her brain. right is there a history in your family of depression mom's side dad's side not really i think like myself i've struggled um more like postpartum um and more so after the fact but um not that we're aware of doesn't mean no but not that substance abuse no yeah so you know the hard hard

to know. What would you recommend to families who've gone through this? First is definitely therapy is needed. I think that it's almost impossible to be able to navigate those feelings

while navigating your children's feelings without help. There's just no way that I would have known the things to say, the ways to help them when I didn't know myself. Well, I think that, you know, a parent, losing a child is, I can't even begin to imagine.

And then the way you lost her is so hard. How are the other children doing? I think that they're doing better. Of course, with the two-year mark, everyone's kind of, it's been rough. But I think in general, they're starting to be with. with their friends again, they're engaged in sports again. They're returning to their lives. I know that there will always be an emptiness there,

but I see them socializing again and getting out of the house. How long does it take them? Taylor didn't leave the house for over a year. She would go to school. She would not stay the night anywhere. And then Riker being so young. Same school? He was in, he's in private school now.

We did pull him out. Taylor was so close to graduating that she did not want to change schools and disrupt her path. Disagreed, but I wanted that to be something she was confident in. She has an issue. So she has a high school. She had her own network. Yes, yeah.

And if she would have had to change schools, that means she would have lost not only her sister, she would have lost her. And that was a big thing. is she said I lost enough, and I don't want to lose anymore. So, but I think that they're maintaining. There's always going to be those moments that they struggle more, and then the day-to-day. Well, and the big thing is you have to be okay. Yeah.

So you have to take care of you. Yeah. You've got to do what you need to do. Absolutely. It's the most important thing. Because they'll be okay if you're okay. Yes, yes. And which that is one thing I've noticed.

they definitely can feed off of my energy. Right, because it's going to make them afraid. Right. And so that is one thing that I've tried to, we're okay. Let's talk about it. Like if Riker gets emotional the other day, he was crying, and he was like, I'm sorry. I'm like, no, no, no, you're allowed to cry. All the tears are all the hugs you wish you could give Aubrey.

So just letting him know that it is okay to be sad too, but, you know, allowing those moments and then picking up and you've got to. go back to basketball and baseball. You've got to keep living. Hydration is more than just water. Your brain needs the right balance of electrolytes. I add smart electrolytes to my water every morning for fast hydration, brain support, and all-day energy.

There's no sugar, just clean ingredients. Try it at brainmd.com with code podcast. 20 for 20% off. So you started the hashtag, um, LL law, L law. Yeah, so live like Aubrey Wyatt.

Live like Aubrey Wyatt. So I never, I didn't, I had no idea that things would end up where they are with social media and how big things got. I had no idea. Um, initially after Aubrey passed,

I had a friend call and say, hey, we're going to try to sell some shirts to try to help with fundraising costs. I was a single mom teacher. So I was like, sure, you know, I think that would be great. She said, do you want to do Forever 13 or do you want to do Live Like Aubrey? And I was like, let's do Live Like Aubrey, because I want her name remembered. Just thinking this is going to stay in our small town. Well, then the shirt said Live Like Aubrey. And then as it continued to expand and reach different levels on social media,

it became her full name with, like, Aubrey Wyatt, and it just soared. And it just, I think, to me, it just meant, you know, despite it all, be kind, despite it all, be compassionate, despite it all, like, no matter what she was going through, she was smiling and happy, and she was, she didn't lash out. She didn't bully back. She wasn't cruel back. So for me, I think that's what the live like Aubrey means is to just continue to live in grace and compassion. But for it to have taken off like it did, it means there's, it's touching a nerve. It's touching a nerve and there's some sort of need. Who are people that are following, that are reaching out to you that are leaving comments?

Yes. So tons and tons and tons of teenagers, moms, moms, parents. parents. I've had so many young people reach out and say, you saved me. I'm seeing your story and I don't want to do this to my mom and I can't do this to my family. I've had so many parents reach out and say, because of what you've shared, I'm looking more into this with my child. I'm checking their phones. I'm checking their social media. I'm taking their mental health more seriously. I'm not just downplaying it. And so I think, yeah. I'm looking. I'm Absolutely.

And I said that from the beginning is that if my pain could have purpose and if I could just make sure that one other family did not have to go through what I was going through, then I could be okay. I'd never be good again, but I could find some grace in this. And that's already happened. And so it continues to allow that. See, I would challenge that thought. I'll never be good.

I would challenge that because. it wasn't your choice. Yeah. And yes, you love her and we'll always love her. But that wasn't your choice. And one of the things I do with my patience is, so let's write that down. Okay. I'll never be good.

And then go, this is from the work of my friend, Byron, Katie. Is that true? You'll never be good. Can you know more than God? Mm-mm. And the second question, was that absolutely true, which would be no. How does that thought make you feel? I'll never be good.

I think I tell myself, I don't know, because in my eye, I mean, I'll never be good, never be complete, never be whole. But I guess in that is taking that away. And I don't know what the future holds. I don't know what God has to replenish me with. I don't know. Yeah, but it makes you feel bad. Yeah, yeah. And how would you feel if you didn't have that thought?

I would be great, but it's hard to not. You'd feel better. Yeah. And so my favorite one is the fifth question. So is it true? Okay. Is it absolutely true? How does the thought make me feel?

How would I feel if I didn't have the thought? Great. Then you take the original thought, I'll never be whole. And you just turn it to the opposite. Okay. I will be whole. And that's where you meditate. You question the thought.

And when you start questioning them, they don't have to stay. But if you don't question them, you believe them and then you act as if it's true. Hello. As a mom, and I'm listening to you, go through that little exercise. Am I picking up some guilt? Like you almost feel like you can't let it go? Like, you can't be whole. Like, you can't, that's what I'm picking up.

Yeah. You're, I could feel you holding on to it. Like, I'm not allowed to be whole. And I would just challenge it. Right? Because I think God would want you to be whole. Yeah. God doesn't want this for you.

I agree. I don't think that God does at all. I do think that evil exists in the world. A hundred percent. And so I think that. But that's not from God. Yes. Oh, absolutely. No, no. So I think that it's just one of those battles where...

Absolutely. Who am I going to listen to? But as a mom, I'm picking up that you can't let that go because I don't deserve it. I have a new book coming out in December called Change Your Brain, Change Your Pain. And it's about the intersection of physical and emotional pain because they run on the same circuits in the brain. and I mean it's clearly emotional pain for you and for her but one of the things that drives both physical and emotional pain is repressed rage and you've got to have a lot of that I have a lot of that was nice yes even though probably internally she was furious but she ended up turning it on herself right and so one of the lessons is when you're angry you have to find ways

to express it tana's got two black belts uh martial arts is being so powerful it's so empowering hitting things no hitting big padded men there's no therapy like it i love that that is wonderful i will say to add in that um so prior to Aubrey passing i worked out and And so that was one thing to kind of, I no longer do that. It's, I don't know, it reminds me of that day. So maybe you find something else. And so that is where the past several months I have tried to attempt to, I wanted to try to work out, so I was like, this would actually be great.

But it was too much of a trauma response, I guess, immediately. Have they ever, your therapist helped you with, like simple techniques to deal with the trauma? We have tried a few. Some have worked. There was one. And I couldn't get the image out of my head. I struggled with that.

I had nightmares. And it was wonderful. She was like, I just need you to create a container. Whatever you want. Close your eyes. We did all this. Put the image in the container. It took so long.

I thought it would be so easy. And it took so long. It was lots of tears. And talking through that, and it just felt like I was shoving Aubrey away when I was putting. But she's like, you're not, you're just shoving that image. You're putting it there until you can deal with it in little pieces and not the. So like things like that, I think of help, but. Have you ever tried the MDR?

I have not. I've heard great things. It's phenomenal. It's so good. Because I don't want you shoving away any of the images. I want you to go into them so that you can. take the energy out of them. So it's not the same thing.

I'm not even beginning to say that this is the same thing because I have a daughter. So I can't even begin to imagine. But when my mom passed away, I grew up in a very crazy environment traumatic. And I was very close to my mom. But when she passed away, I had so many conflicted emotions. And I couldn't sort of grieve cleanly because there's so much anger and conflict mixed in with the love and the, I'm like, I can't get this. great. And so I was very frustrated. And I've done EMDR before for my past. But when I did

the EMDR, the craziest thing happened and it happened pretty fast. I was able to resolve that conflict so that now, it's not like the memories go away. They don't. So rather than putting them in a container, they're there. But I'm able to, like, I now think about my mom with so much love and all of that conflict went away. Not the memories go away. But the conflict went away. So now I just have all these very positive emotions, which makes me measure, but it's not the same. It's clean.

It's clean grief. And I know one thing that helped me was that my mom wouldn't, my mom had great faith. And she would not want me to do this. Her biggest fear would have been something happening to her and us not being okay. So I had to start disciplining myself. I'm like, why am I going to make that true for her? I'm not okay. And so disciplining my brain every time I started to.

to go to that dark place. I'm like, okay, I can miss her. I can love her, but I need to discipline myself away from that dark place because I'm going to honor her by being okay. I love that. So to get more information on that, is that just something that I would go to my therapist? It's a very specific type of therapist. Okay.

They have to be certified for it. Okay. And it's life changing. I'll send you a lot. I'll send you love that. Okay. Okay. And EMDR IA and EMDR International Association.

It's for trauma. and does that have a list of physicians and providers and they do it by Zoom now so it's so easy oh i love that okay i would life change it yeah we actually somebody we love that we recommend all the time dr. roundsen who trained me on how to do it and life changing yeah is it it's so daily weekly so it depends on you his first and it depends and it depends on how much trauma you've actually had because it's often the brain you bring into the trauma, right, finding her that if that's like it in your life, then maybe in five or ten sessions, you just feel like yourself. If you grew up in chaos like Tanna did, well, maybe it's 50

sessions. But it's life-changing. His first gift to me, when we were dating, was 10 sessions of EMDR. I'm like, I knew I should know date a shrink. This is why I didn't want to date a shrink. Was it a good gift? It was a great gift. So I went for this. I wasn't going to go, but I ended up going because I'm like, I'm not doing therapy.

But I went and I did the 10 sessions and I'm like, whoa, like it's weird how it works. It's like a shortcut through therapy almost. It's very strange. But then I realized I needed to keep going because I had a lot of unresolved, like childhood trauma. And so I kept going for almost two years because I'm like, I'm going to be a better mother. I'm going to be a better wife. And I don't want you to think of your life is over because of the choice you didn't make.

And this is so important with survivors, family survivors of suicide because it wasn't your choice. And sometimes the illness wins just like with cancer. And I love that you said that. I don't think I've ever heard it phrase like that. Sometimes the illness wins, just like with cancer. And I don't know. It just takes a weight off my chest. And one of the things as a mom, you know, we've got between us, we have four kids.

We adopted my two nieces because they also grew up in my family. So one of the, like I just feel like these years are the most dangerous years. Because it's one thing, like, we've created an environment where like I'm very clear with them. I want you to be brutally honest with me about all the hardest things. There's nothing you can say, think here, or do that I haven't said, thought, heard or done. Right.

So one of the four. And we make that very safe for them to talk about anything. But I also make it clear. I'm like, the reason these years are so scary for me and everyone thinks that it's only like that 13 to 18. No, no. When they go to college is really scary. Yes.

So, but I tell them it's like one of the reasons this is so scary. You don't have an adult brain yet. Your brain's not fully developed yet. But because you are this age, you have independence. You can make independent decisions. You can make adult decisions that have adult consequences, even though you don't have an adult brain. It's terrifying.

It is. But you can't change it. You're also a victim of the changing society with cell phones and social media. And I believe it was a Trojan horse. that got unleashed on our society with no neuroscience study on development. And all the studies that have come out are bad. And girls are in general. The kids who get cell phones before the age of 13 have a higher risk of suicide.

And they're anxious. That's not in the Apple box. Right. Right. There's no warning that it's not you have access to the world. It's the world has access to you. And it's, my heart hurts for you. Me too.

And for this situation. What helps you stay grounded and connected? I think, obviously, faith. I think my kids definitely do. And then just knowing that I have to keep going, there's hope out there. It's going to be okay. I may not see Aubrey Earthside ever again, but I will see her heaven side.

And so taking away that permanence of she's gone forever. So when I have those impending doom feelings, I try to think on that. Taylor and Riker need me. God has you here for a purpose. You're going to see her. And when you do, it's actually forever this time. And Aubrey's legacy, the work I'm doing is helping other people. and God's allowing something good to come from all of it.

So I try to just remind myself almost like a mantra of those things just to say ground. So one thing that might be helpful, when the feelings overwhelm you, there's a technique I like called havening. Okay. And it's so when you have that sense of impending due, there's an area in your brain called the amygdala. It's like danger, danger, danger. And if your frontal lobes are sleepy, maybe you're jet lagged or a glass of wine or whatever, it just overwhelms you. Havening is bilateral, just means both sides, you stimulate both sides of your brain at the same time.

And it's similar to EMDR, but if you just take your hands and go like this, like if you're on a plane, and go into the feeling, not away from it, right? Because so many people in this situation, they'll drink or they'll smoke pot because it's like, I just can't feel what I feel. But the problem is when the alcohol wears off or the marijuana wears off, the feeling comes back and it's worse. Right. But if you go into the feeling and you do bilateral hemisphere stimulation, so just rubbing your hands like this, or my favorite is just doing this, you go into it for maybe 30 seconds.

I mean, feel it. And then distract your mind and go somewhere you really like, whether it's the mountains or the beach or whatever. And just do this for a couple of minutes. And then when you're done, it's like that sense of impending doom has just sort of washed away. It's very powerful. There's a website called havening, like safe haven,

haven. Haven. Haven. dot org that the research shows is it just sort of calms that part of your brain and then I want you watching your thoughts and you don't have to believe every stupid thing that sort of pops in your head and the brain's sneaky and anything that reminds you of her. Well, true.

Yes. And if you haven't worked through the gild, the bad thoughts, I should have done this, I should have done that, right? Because that's just common. Especially from that. Yes. Then it will come. And it'll come right before your period.

It'll be worse. It'll come if you've not slept well. And I call them ants, automatic negative thoughts. They'll infest you when your hormones are a little bit off. or you haven't slept or times of stress. And you need to become a master aunt killer. And it's something I wish somebody would have taught Aubrey how to do. We're working on creating this national brand health revolution.

And I believe every child should learn how to manage their mind. I do too. I think that would be wonderful, especially just to know. if I'm if I'm watching this episode and I am I'm if I'm a child who's struggling or if I'm a parent who has a child who's struggling or if I'm a parent who has lost a child to suicide like I'm I'm thinking of it from this perspective it's it's you know we can't control the bad things in the world that happen around us but we can connect more and you know if you're that child things can feel so hopeless they can can feel so big in your world, but they're not that big in our world. I promised you. Right. And if you have those parents who you can't talk to, there are other people you can talk to. Yes. I think that's the thing that I want to get out there. It's like, we tell our kids. There's nothing you can say, think, here, or do that we haven't said heard thought or done. And if your

parents aren't those parents, you need to find someone you can talk to. Right. Right. And if you're a parent who's in the situation, the guilt isn't, you know, going to help you move forward. And so getting treatment for that. And, you know, yes, you want to be able to see what's happening with your child if you can. But if you can't, you need to be well. Yes. You need to be okay for your kids. Yes.

And for yourself, yes. Yes. I agree. I agree. You know, it's clear you found purpose and sharing vulnerability on social media. So tell us more about the foundation. So when, because Aubrey was on a wait list, that was part of the, drive with that is I knew that there were a lot of other preteens and teens that were on a

wait list also. And I just did not want financial reasons or waitless to prevent a child from getting the help they needed. If they're telling the adult and the adults trying and it's just not there for them. So we are, you know, we're a year in, so we're still working on building that up. But we've put out resources on our website. We have a map, and you kind of just click on your state and find the resources there. We're constantly updating it as we find them out. There is quite a bit out there, but there's also those wait lists and insurance barriers and things like that. But the website provides resources, and then it also directs them to the 988 number to get immediate help and things like that.

resources for parents and children. There's resources on there for parents to help them understand. There are resources on there for children, their videos. But the goal is just to be able to provide that and to be able to provide grants if it's a financial reason and just spread that. We ultimately want to be able to kind of go into schools and spread that and talk about what you're saying. Go to a trusted adult. Go to someone. You have to be able to talk about those things. And then eventually, we want a place that kids can go to rehabilitate. A lot of what we have is an inpatient for 10 days, and which saves children, but it's not long-term. Right.

So the goal would be to have a place that kids can go and receive the therapy they need, maybe get it. the direction and dig into their brains like what you're saying. Gained some skill. To why they're thinking that way, I think that the ants, kids knowing that and learn when those thoughts come in, what they can do. That's long-term goal, being able to create places like that for children, teens. But right now, just resources, grants, and just getting that out there. I love that so much.

Is there anything you've never been asked about this that you wish somebody would ask you? I think that you guys kind of asked a few of those questions with did all, you know, what was going on with Aubrey. Because back home to everyone, she was happy and bubbly. And so I think just knowing that she still had those struggles and asking about that. that what was behind that smile, what was going on. Lots of people know now, but initially, I don't think that anyone understood and asked. And I think that now it is known. That was one thing that I said.

Well, and if you have to be perfect, then you don't share your bad thoughts. Right. Yeah. Yeah. I think a lot of girls are that way. Yeah, I can see that because you have that perfectionism about yourself. You have to be a good girl. There's a facade.

Yeah. Where can people follow you or learn more about the foundation? So the foundation has a website, Aubrey Wyatt Foundation.com. There's the Aubrey White Foundation Instagram, Aubrey White Foundation on Facebook. I have my personal social medias that I still share on those as well. and that's Heather Wyatt on Facebook, TikTok, YouTube, all of those. And we share on both the foundation and my personal ones, the different information and resources coming out.

I am so glad you came today. Me too. You're so great. And I want you to challenge that thought. I won't know. You've been less saying to change your brain, everyday podcast and if you have these thoughts know that they're common right especially since covid COVID created this inflammatory bomb in the brain and more people than ever before have

the thoughts just because you have a thought doesn't mean it's true doesn't mean it's helpful And the consequences to the people you love are staggering. And I have seen that over the 45 years. I've been a psychiatrist. Reach out for help. There is help available. And if you can't do it in your family, do it with someone at church or someone in school.

Yeah. I just, as someone who was not Aubrey's age, I was 23, I had cancer and I was 23, and I went through a severe depression. I didn't want to live anymore. I didn't really have the thought of taking my life, but I didn't want to live. And I used to actually pray that God would just let me die because I was just wasting oxygen on the planet. And I think back to that time, it was so dark. And I'm looking at my life now, and I'm like, wow. Like, if you're people could realize, like it, it's not going to stay that way. Like, I look at my life now and how much I've been able to do turning that pain into purpose. And so I think that that's just a really

important thing for young people to, or anybody who's having those thoughts to realize is that there is hope. Yes. And it can change so radically. But you've got to give it that chance to change and you've got to reach out. Yes. And that, I have a book coming out in a couple of weeks, type of the Aubrey Wyatt story and it kind of goes into obviously a couple of months prior to Aubrey's passing getting to know her but then that journey after with what you're talking about and that grief and obviously still working through it as I'm writing but just those ups down those highs lows like you're talking about and just that journey throughout it it's like God just let me go yes yes what um what was your point is coming out when

So it's in editing right now. So we anticipate the end of October that it will be released. We just released the cover yesterday. So the end of October is our goal for the Aubrey Wyatt story. I'm sorry what you were about to ask something. Oh, for how long did you struggle with that? So I struggled for probably six to eight months. And I remember people telling me to snap out of it, which is one of the most irritating.

things. Yes. So please don't say that to people who are in depression. If I could snap out of it, I would snap out of it. Yes, I agree. So it was really hard. I remember my mom being frustrated, like, what's the matter with you and get out of bed? And then they put me on Prozac. And I wasn't depressed anymore. But it almost ruined my life. Right, right. So it just wasn't the right medication for me. Your brain matters. Amen Clinics helps people with brain scans and targeted treatment across 11 cities. Atlanta, Chicago, Dallas, D.C., Miami, New York, Seattle, Scottsdale, Los Angeles, Orange County, California, and San Francisco. Learn more at amonclinics.com. All right, leave us a comment, question, review, subscribe, and the Aubrey Wyatt story

is coming out at the end of October. Thanks for listening. Thank you.