Chapo Trap House - 945 - Hashtag Fordow Fail feat. Libby Watson (6/23/25)

Episode Date: June 24, 2025

Libby Watson returns to the show! We discuss the weekend’s limited US strike on Iran and Trump’s baffling behavior around what already may be a winding-down conflict. We also talk Democratic & media responses, and where Iran might go from here. Then: all eyes are on Zohran in the NYC mayoral primary, voting is tomorrow, we discuss Zorhan’s campaign and his chances of bringing this all home. Finally, we celebrate the love & marriage of an old friend of the show with their NYT vows section announcement. Find Libby’s new show “What’s All This Then” wherever you get podcasts, and all her other links here: https://linktr.ee/whatsallthisthen New merch for the summer up at https://chapotraphouse.store

All I wanna do is hit the drum. All I wanna do is hit the drum. Hello, everybody. It's Monday, June 23rd, and we've got some chocolate for you. On today's episode, Felix and I are joined by our old pal Libby Watson, who is back with us. Libby, thanks so much for being here. Hello, thanks for having me again. It's been a while. It's been too long, Libby. And originally, we were going to have you on last Monday. And then it became clear that the United States was going to get involved in the war in Iran. So like this whole week, I'm like, oh, God, I'm gonna have to do serious episodes all week. You know, what more is there to say and Felix to echo your concerns. I was like, we got Libby coming up for Monday. What are we all thinking? Really don't want to do another serious episode.

But thankfully, Donald Trump has heard our concerns. He has responded by doing possibly the most farcical US.S. military in history. So, I'd like to begin there. I'm glad that we don't have to do a serious show, and I don't want to underplay the gravity of this situation. But thus far, U.S. war on Iran seems to be quite a dud from both sides. Well, yeah. So Iran, like, um, they did another, like symbolic strike, you know, flashbacks to true promise too. I, if you're an AOR fan like me, you remember true promise too.

It was like, uh, it was last year. It was a like, Hey, we could do this if we wanted to strike, which, you know, to be fair to Iran, would have worked like 10 years ago, but just doesn't work, at least on Israel during the suicide pact, murder suicide pact years. But this time they did it again. They did it at a basic in Qatar, which they did last time as part of TP2 and this time, you know, Trump is, he's losing interest because he just made a post.

I want to thank Iran for warning us before the ballistic missile strike, no one got hurt, which is like, I still stand by the core thesis of the series and conservative media we did, which is all these guys are George W. Bush, which is held out true. But George W. Bush was not this fat and lazy. He really, I think he thought about what does it mean to be a wartime president? And he thought about FDR making all those speeches,

going to Yalta so destroyed by Ozimpic that he died months later. And he was like, I don't want that. I don't want to go out like FDR. So it's, I mean, good times for AOR fans because it's looking like, you know, he did what Democrats do whenever, uh, like Democrats did this during COVID to make themselves look

busy, they would do the equivalent of striking Iran and state government, which is banning babes. Yeah, I'm just kidding. I don't think those things are morally equivalent, but I mean, it's the same idea. They were like, let's look busy, you know? And it sort of reminds me of like when two guys are fighting at a bar, but they don't really want to fight.

So they're just kind of like hitting their shoulders into the other guy. You know, yeah, just just kind of knocking into them or whatever. It's like, well, we need it. It's a cut. We need everyone to see that we got into a fight. You know, yeah, it does seem to be like, this is something for like, domestic political consumption here, because like, the line over the weekend from the Trump administration is,

we're merely bombing Iran, we're not going to war with them. And also like, JD Vance said, we are not at war with Iran, we are at war with Iran's nuclear program. And that's so, has anyone ever, like has Al-Qaeda ever been like, we're at war with Iran's nuclear program. And that's so has anyone ever done like has Al Qaeda ever been like we're at war with the DMV. Like we hate the Department of the Interior. We're at war with King Charles Fitzgerald and no one else. Well, it's just like the fact that like them and all of the leaders of their vassal states in Europe are just like Iran must never be allowed to have a nuclear bomb.

So that's why it's okay for Israel and the United States to preemptively bomb them. But also, Iran, you need to come back to the negotiating table right now. We all want peace. They bomb Iran's nuclear sites and then they're like, can't get mad at us. Can't get mad at us. No war. No war. We didn't say we're going to war with you.

No one can get mad at us and you have to negotiate in good faith because we all just want peace here. I don't know. I don't think we'll know the full story with like, there's been a lot of this, a lot of people saying, acting like they're secret agents, including the president. You know how Trump went, it was part of a deception plan that we negotiated with them. I saw after these strikes, which like for an hour, the website was unusable. It was a combination of like John Pedorits and like, you know, neocons who had some shine

in like 2014 because of Syria, who have totally fallen off like Jamie Kerchik. They all write for websites called like you know the corner the foot you know read my new expose an iranian sleeper cells in germany in the fudge i don't think i will i don't think anyone will all these guys who have totally fallen off you know posting uh we did it yeah how does that taste ayatollah's know, John put Horace wishes he worked at the fudge. That is his ideal publication. But, you know, unusable for an hour because they're all pretending, oh my God,

it's so it's a quick, you know, now it's a question of how fast can we get the Shah's grandson to Tehran because the people are rising up and we've destroyed their newt. We've destroyed their newt. They were going to kill us with and then, and you know, I'm, I'm a big proponent of just, uh, you know, you don't always have to post immediately besides, you know, saying these posts are bad, but just as far as like prognosticating an outcome, making predictions, you never have to make predictions because once again, you don't get anything for predicting anything.

No one gives you a prize. But time passes. It sounds like at the very least, they were able to move all their nuclear material, which is for guys who are winning for a certain fat, they get ignored. Pretty awesome. I mean me.

But, like, Fordham might not even been touched. Like, obviously touched, but not destroyed. It's deep, deep, deep under a fucking mountain. I'm not gonna pretend I know a lot about building mountain bases, but people that do are saying if you still have season tickets to Porto, don't throw them in the trash. You're probably still going to be able to go. Um, I made reservations for next week.

I'm not canceling. Yeah, no. Yeah. I, I, I support this game. My father supported this game. His father before him. I'm not canceling. Yeah, no. Yeah. I, I, I support this game. My father supported this game. His father before him. I'm not, no, I, I'm a true axis of resistance Homer. I mean that, but the Trump thing of like, I was doing negotiations to, uh, you know, to lull them into a false sense of security.

Um, during the triumphant period, uh, the two hours after the strikes, a Fox news anchor said that she was doing, um, willful deception too, which is like fucking great if you, it's like, you have, you have to keep being a news anchor after that, like I do, like no one who watches her like gives a shit. I'd never even heard of this lady, but presumably you don't want to be like, oh by the way I could be doing a military operation where I'm lying to you at any time, but I All all of this like Trump saying thanks for giving us the heads up Makes me wonder if he actually was like subordinate to Israel on on all this in part because

I don't know if he would I mean if Mary if Miriam told him to I think he would spring for it but like him just coming out and admitting it does it runs against what we know about it does seem like it was him trying to protect his ego like maybe the only report that for certain, I believe is the one where Netanyahu calls him and is like, I want to do this. And Trump is like, can you not, but you can if you want, like just disinterested and annoyed at the problem. And I think like he just, he gave conflicting signals, which obviously mean yes, and then he was like okay I have to

like you know I have to own this to not look like a loser well there is some insight to Trump's decision-making process comes courtesy of the New York Times today that writes Mr. Trump had spent the early months of administration of his administration warning Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu of Israel against a strike on Iran but But on the morning of Friday, June 13, hours after the first Israeli attacks, Mr. Trump had changed his tune. He marveled to advisors about what he said was a brilliant Israeli military operation, which involved a series of precision strikes that killed key figures in Iran's military leadership and blasted away at strategic weapons sites. Mr. Trump took calls on his cell phone from reporters

and began handling the operation as excellent and very successful and hinting that he had much more to do with it than people realized. Later that day, Mr. Trump asked an ally how the Israeli strikes were playing. He said that everyone was telling him he needed to get more involved. Then it goes on to say, the president was closely monitoring Fox News, which is airing wall to wall praise of Israelis, Israel's military operation, and featuring guests urging Trump to get more involved. Several Trump advisors lamented the fact that Mr. Carlson was no longer on Fox, which meant that Mr. Trump was not hearing much of the

other side of the debate. Oh, my God, he needs to have the right friends on television to tell him what to do. Yeah, and then like, and I just want to say one thing about this is that he's like he sees it he sees the Israeli attack on Iran presented on television. He's like, wow, very cool. Actually, this was my idea. And then like a day later, he's doing posts on Truth Social saying, no one raise oil prices,

okay? Like I'm monitoring the situation, but if anyone raises oil prices, they're going to be in big trouble. Well, it's just like the immigration thing where he was like, uh, you know, obviously going absolutely insane. Um, you know, like Gestapo mode with the ice stuff, but then being like, well, actually we shouldn't do this with hotels and restaurants because I just heard that that's bad when we do that.

So I don't, I don't want us to do that anymore, obviously. And then obviously they keep doing it because, you know, he doesn't know or care, but, um, I do think that like the lens of with Trump always has to be like, what is he seeing on TV and does he think this will look cool on TV? Like, I'm sure that he was convinced by someone that like, you know, a couple of high profile strikes or whatever, A, wouldn't be seen as war because JD Vance says, well, it's just not war. We'll just say we're striking them.

It's not war. We'll just say we're striking them. It's not war. And B, you know, someone convinced him that it's like, yeah, this could look really cool on TV. And look, all your friends on Fox are saying you look really cool when you do this. So. It's not like, don't raise our oil prices. Don't do it. It is so funny.

Yeah. I forget who, someone I followed said it's not a command economy, it's a scold economy. Yeah. Which is, it's so, like, do you remember, again, all the guys who write for the fudge made fun of, you know, like, Elizabeth Warren Democrats when they said, oh, it's not inflation, it's greed inflation, and they're like,

what do you, you can't just ask companies not to charge higher. And that's what they did with the tariffs. That's the whole strategy with the tariffs was like, okay, but actually don't what are you doing? Don't raise the prices on stuff. I didn't want you to do that. It's incredible. Yeah.

Yeah. I just, I mean, I, it's also like, who is it addressed at? Like, is it OPEC? Who does he think it's addressed at? the gas station That would be awesome if it's just like the lowest guy in the tote like a doctor who owns three gas station All the guys in New Jersey who still have to pump gas because of state law. Yeah If you like OPEC can raise prices, whatever.

But like, if you own a gas station, just take it on the chin for like a couple months for me. Right. I'll get you back, I'll then mow you. Another, just another one of the reactions from the White House that I really enjoyed is JD Vance who said over the weekend, I empathize with Americans who are exhausted after 25 years of foreign

entanglements in the Middle East. I understand the concern, but the difference is back then we had dumb presidents and this time it will be different. We've got an alcoholic in charge of the Pentagon now. We have a guy who's having shakes if he doesn't get his third gin and tonic before 11 a.m. But it's going to be it's going to be different this time. I again during the like, you know, one night period of celebration when they're acting like, you know, this is, you know, this was like the end of the Ben Shapiro book where they own Iran. They I saw someone say, oh, and by the way, I think everyone

underestimated Pete Hegseth. And it's like, why? Because like the planes didn't crash into the ocean. He's not actually flying them like, like, what would it take for you to like, not think that, like, if the planes tried to take off and Just like careen into a billboard and then Like yeah, no the planes that are two billion dollars a unit made it to their destination We've aerial refueling has been a possibility since fucking World War two

fueling has been a possibility since fucking World War two One of the b2s had to land back in Missouri because John Federman wouldn't put his seat belt on We're turning this bomber around right now, mr. Federman, okay Well, how about that the beat you-2 pilots passed their breath-laser test, the thing that everyone said was going to slow down this mission. They also said that there were no leaks, which is like, you mean the thing that everyone knew was going to happen for a fucking week? Yeah. Like, yeah, no one found out about it. Speaking of the B-2 bombers, I did really enjoy the reaction

where Pete Hegseth was like, you know, God bless our boys in those plans. And then, of course, the classic liberal media correction, they were like, actually, one of the pilots was a woman. Yeah. Yeah. She had to stop to ask her directions or what? And now if it turns out that the Fordow facility is still completely intact, I'm sure women are going to get the blame for that one. That's the one. Yeah, that's the one that the woman was supposed to bomb. She forgot

she was on her period and she had brain fog. Another aspect, I mean, like it was a, I guess it was sort of an indication of like, how this whole weekend would play out because like, you know, on Saturday, I'm seeing, you know, US strikes, Iranian nuclear sites, and I'm thinking, Oh, God, like, you know, like that, that sinking nausea feeling. Then I'm watching the baseball game. And then like, Fox tells it that, you know, if you'd like to keep watching the game, like switch over to FS1 because you know, like all Fox channels

are coming coming over to a you know, a statement by the President of the United States about US military action in Iran. And I'm wondering, Libby and Felix, did either of you guys watch the Trump's national address on Saturday night? Awesome. I unfortunately missed it because I was out being on the west coast. I was the wrong time for me. I will say, one of the highlights is at the end where he just says, I just want to thank everyone in particular, God, I want to just say we love you, God, and we love

our great military, protect them in particular, God, God. For me, the absolute best moment of this, I keep in mind, he's flanked by He loves you, God. But to me, for me, the absolute best moment of this, and keep in mind, he's flanked by Hegseth, JD Vance, and Marco Rubio, the whole crew, the whole gang. The heavy hitters. Yeah, yeah, yeah. The A-list, you know, the alpha dogs. And as he says, first, he says, I want to thank Netanyahu. I would like to thank Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. He thanked Israel for a fact that, by the way, every one of those bunker buster bombs I found this out today cost $500 million.

That is a common misconception. They probably cost $500 million to develop, but the only quota I've seen on per unit cost is like 20 million, which is like Oh, a bargain, yeah. It's a lot. It's like It's like It's like It's like

It's like It's like It's like It's like It's like It's like It's like It's like

It's like It's like It's like It's like It's like It's like It's like It's like It's like It's like And he said of him and Benjamin Netanyahu, he said, We worked as a team like perhaps no team has ever worked before. Perhaps better than any team has ever worked before. Any team like the 96 bolts.

Yeah, he said. Yeah. So like just like the spectacle of Trump thanking Israel on television for us doing them a massive favor. Yeah. Oh my God. You know what that sounds like? That is like when someone gets a cameo from like Eric Roberts or something to say like, you guys had a really great sales quarter, I heard. And I heard that you guys have like smashed all of your sales goals. So your boss just wants to say, well done. If I learn one thing about teamwork, it was on the Pope and Greenwich Village when I was working with Mickey Rourke. And we worked together probably better than any actors have ever worked together on a movie.

That is, that's like one quirk of, of cameos that I love is when like the guy will pretend that he like organically heard about like a medical device sales firm in Dallas having a really good quarter. Like Eric Roberts is like, I need to check the medical sales trade journals that I'm always reading. Yeah, for like Bloomington, Indiana or whatever. Yeah, yeah.

But the, like thanking Israel for asking us to do something for 30 years was like the perfect farcical cap on the entire night. But I love the like, oh, and by the way, like, thank you God thing. It reminded me of a UFC 116 when Brock Lesnar had that big, Brock Lesnar had this horrifying poop disease that almost ended his career prematurely in MMA. And he came back from the poop disease to defeat Shane Carwin in a come from behind victory to defend his title at

UFC 116 and in his speech afterward where he was like he was clearly a rock like Carwin was a really hard puncher and like rocked the shit out of Lesnar in the first round he said I'm so grateful that I have this amazing body that can do all these things. So I just want to say to God, God bless you, God. Well, I mean, like, it's just like, Trump's remarks were like they're only he was only on TV for about two or three minutes. And like, it seemed like he wanted to just get the get keep the show moving, like didn't want to say too much. Then he was basically like, any more questions? Pete Hegseth will be giving a press conference at the Pentagon tomorrow at 8am. You can see

him just start sweating. Oh my God. He was doing... He's gonna have a Henry Hill type day for Pete Hegseth getting up at 8am. I thought you were gonna say you're just gonna give a press conference that McCormick and Schmicks they got happy hours at 7. We'll be giving away tickets to Fog Hat later. You know that Pete was doing like the Elky Mat the moment he heard that? Yeah.

Oh my god if I go to sleep at 6 a.m. I'll have like enough of a party. I'll have two solid hours. But um, but now Felix, your point was like the, the unbearable triumphalism of like the Ayatollah, your days are numbered. Like the people of Iran are rising up and it's just like all the Zionists who were just like so hyped because, yes, you're right, Felix. They've been trying to get America to do this for 30 years. And then it seemed like we did. But then almost immediately after we're like kind of like, not really. And Iran's missiles are still slamming into Tel Aviv. Like on Sunday night, because like it, it sort of seems like they're trying to do the Houthi

thing. We're like, they're like, well, if you stop attacking us, we'll stop attacking you. We'll call it quits after this round of, you know, symbolic missile exchanges. But we're definitely still bombing Israel. We're definitely going to be still hitting them. We're going to be bombing the shit out of them. And like I said, like I don't know where this is all going to go. Obviously, like, you know, I mean, I'm making fun of it, but the stakes of this, like, you know, could it be higher or more, more horrifying considering like, does anyone have any real

faith that the United States and the Trump administration has some sort of fortitude not to get involved in like a much more serious war than the one they've already started? It does sort of make you wonder like is there anything that at this point Israel could not make us do? Right. Seems like the answer is no. Well Libby I was thinking about that with like another round of triumphalism on the internet over the weekend was all the people posting photos of Kamala Harris being like bet you wish you voted for her now she I know she would never have gone to war with Iran yeah and like look to a certain extent this is there there's cope on both sides here and I'll be I'll copy it maybe Kamala Harris wouldn't have preemptively

bombed Iran at Israel's request it's just if that's the case she's made no indication otherwise yeah because like like do you really think someone coming out of the Biden administration has the 40, like I said, has the either the ability or the inclination to say no to Israel ever? Yeah, like, I mean, Kamala, by all indications, she's not done with politics. And this is a very unpopular president. This war is incredibly unpopular, she said fucking nothing about it. And people posted the clip of her saying

that Iran is our greatest threat, which is, she's not unique in Democrats, and saying that, what is unique is the sheer terror in her eyes when she says our greatest threat, that's easy. Because the thing with Kamala is not that I 100% believe she would strike Iran. I don't know that for a fact.

What I do know- Guess we'll never know, because she threw the election, she did everything possible to make sure she lost the election. Well, what I do know is that more than any other Democrat who has run for president in our lifetimes, more so than Bill Clinton, she has no beliefs. And I don't mean that in that, like, she's a, you know, a genius, cynical operator.

I mean, she just has never thought about that part. And she has not thought about it so much that when she gets asked questions like that she goes oh my god what I know this one fuck and that doesn't instill a lot of confidence it doesn't instill a lot of confidence that like yeah I I don't think she would but like what if similar to Trump enough people convinced her, Hey, you're going to get yelled at if you don't do this. Yeah.

Which seems to move her on fucking everything else. It's the reason why in during her, you know, we call it a 2019 presidential primary debate that is how long it lasted during that she was like, I'm she. I'm I'm an a fab, you know, like she, she had a, she had policy positions that like even Elizabeth Warren would hear on that debate stage and go, what the fuck? What are you talking about? Yeah. She was a Medicare for Medicare for all who wanted or whatever. Right? Yeah. Well, that was Pete. That was Pete. I'm sure. Sure. Yeah, she was Medicare for Medicare for all who wanted or whatever, right?

Yeah. Well, that was Pete. That was Pete, I believe. Sure, sure. Yeah. She had some, I think she had like Medicare Advantage for all. I think that was her thing. You know, she was like, this is, this is really good.

Wait, so Medicare for Advantage for all. So it's like people who aren't on Medicare can now buy a supplemental private insurance for Medicare that they don't have. Yeah, I honestly, like I blocked it all out. I try not to think about what they what they all said at the time because it's so hilarious to think about now. But I mean, the other thing about this is that like, you don't even have to think about you don't even have

to theorize about what Kamala would have done. Because Chuck Schumer, who is the fucking Senate Democratic leader said, oh, I'm really pissed that he didn't, I'm really pissed that there's no War Powers Act. I'm going to vote for it. Yeah. So it's like, what the fuck? Libby, this is the next thing I was going to bring up.

The other thing, Donald Trump did the Democrats a huge favor by not consulting with Congress before he started this war because like, it just reveals like, yes, this is flagrantly unconstitutional and any Democrat not talking about impeaching him immediately for one of the greatest violations of the Constitution imaginable, you know we're full of shit. The line from the Democrats in Congress right now, like Adam Schiff, is this is a totally illegal war that we should have been consulted about first before agreeing to go along with it. Yeah, it's like I was supposed to be able to hold your hand while you press the button

and you started it without me. Like, it's a completely different objection. It's, it's. Yeah. I did the statement from the Democrats on the Senate for Relations Committee was complaining that they didn't get briefings. Which again, like again, I mean, like. We don't know what lies to tell our constituents. Please send around the talking points.

This all goes, like this goes back to another issue, another central issue, which is like, okay, so from 2016 to 2021, 22, about the posture was that, you know, Donald Trump is, he's at once like a fever over the Republican party that has to be broken, but he's also like, he's a madman. He's a fucking lunatic. He's a criminal. We're gonna throw him in prison using the powers of Merrick Garland.

And then like, you know, obviously their response to a close victory by Trump in a cost of living election against an incredibly unpopular incumbent administration was like, Oh, all right. Well, like, I guess the average person is that duck dynasty guy who died. And, and so they've, they've dropped that posture. And now, you know, before all that they were in favor of like him moving the embassy still, they

were in favor of killing Soleimani. And the central contradiction there, of course, was like, okay, should you agree with this mad man, this lunatic who should be in jail on like 80, 90% of foreign policy things, but you think he should call you first. But now, like now they've dropped that like he needs to go to prison thing, which it doesn't endear people to you or more conservative voters. It just, again, makes you look like, Hey, you got us. We were lying. Now with, now with this, it's like, uh, you know, the guy we're, we were lying

about, we admit he's great and he's bringing jobs back. His foreign policy thing is reckless and insane. And we would like the opportunity to agree with it. It's like, okay, then just kill yourselves. I don't know if you saw this, but I mean, like there are some Democrats in Congress who are like, you know, Ro Khanna has this War Powers Act right now, they continue to constrain President Trump's ability to, you know, get us so much further involved in this war. And again, just to be clear here, we have already gone to war with Iran.

OK, like there are levels of degrees, but like this is an act of war. We are at war with Iran right now. A Democratic leader, Hakim Jeffries, was asked today if he would be supporting Ro Khanna's War Powers Act. And his response was, I have to take a look at it. I haven't read it yet. Remember when? You can't imagine, yeah, yeah.

Look, Akim, I know you got a lot of other important stuff to be paying attention to right now, so. But maybe. I'm gonna start doing that with everything. Like when the IRS sends me a letter being like you didn't pay your taxes, I'm like, well, I haven't read it yet. I don't know, man.

Yeah. Remember, again, to fucking, this was more like a sick to you, whenever Trump would tweet something where it's like, we're gonna end birthright citizenship, something that would be on truth social, they would ask Kevin McCarthy, oh, have you seen, what is your response

to Trump's latest proclamation? And he would go, I haven't seen it. And that way it was like a running thing that if you would ask a Republican who was in anything but less like Anything except like, you know, an r-plus 90 district they would go. I haven't seen it Is it this is the exact same fucking this? Yeah Yeah

because like Republicans with Trump is like they just don't know what to do like they they I feel like they are completely paralyzed by feeling like basically everybody agrees with Trump and Trump won and I don't even know I don't know what their plan is other than just like wait for him to die and then all they've got is JD Vance Which honestly maybe kind of a good plan Well, I mean the double problem for the Democrats is that they all support a war with Iran but they know how unpopular it is and they need to find some way of supporting it and not supporting it at the same time because like you know doing and like

Less I want to say about this it goes back to the like the Tucker Carlson's humiliation of Ted Cruz And this old question about do you blame voters for getting it wrong? Or do you blame the politicians who ran the campaign that they voted or didn't vote for? Because like you know a lot of the triumphalism about like that they voted or didn't vote for? Because like, you know, a lot of the triumphalism about like, bet your sorry you didn't vote for Kamala now, like, you know, all you one issue voters have doomed us to this. I mean, like the corollary to that is that yes, like that so many people voted for Trump because they thought he was an anti war candidate or that like he cynically made overtures to like I'm the peace candidate and no more stupid wars, no more foreign entanglements.

Yes, obviously everyone who voted for him based on that pitch is a rube who got rooked as they, you know, rightly should. But like the ease of which the, you know, like the Democrats have just surrendered the viability of an anti-war position or just like the idea that they were willing to allow Tucker Carlson to be the voice against US empire and imperialism or interventions abroad is just like seeding that seeding the entire field to the far right and then imagine and then wondering why they get elected. Yeah, I honestly think they prefer for it to be to them like having Tucker be the voice that isn't a failure in their best of worlds where like, you know, things get fucked up so bad that, you know, the average voter just wants like,

Oh, it's like extensively left the center institutionalists like Joe Biden again. They would love a sort of, you know, and they tried this as hard as they could during the Trump years to brand anti-interventionism as like a bad misinformation Russia thing that can get you banned from all social media Yeah And it's just once again like if Kamala Harris would not have bombed around She could say so now and she could have made any indication that she was for peace on the campaign trail

now, and she could have made any indication that she was for peace on the campaign trail. Every attempt, I mean, basically any engagement with this issue at all indicated that she would do the exact opposite. So I mean, like, once again, the idea that you allowed yourself or allowed people to get rolled by an obvious fraud like Donald Trump, just because he would simply say, we've been we've done too many stupid wars, I'm not going to do any more. And I'm going to end the ones we already have. I mean, yeah, we're seeing now, but yeah, obviously he was full of shit about that. But like, why is it so easy for him to say that and people will vote for it because like he's the only candidate who is saying something like that.

Right. And obviously like the pundit, any online politics, fucking whatever, anyone who like believe Trump, especially like again, after we saw him as president, who believed that is completely risable. Everyone, if you actually believe that you are a fucking idiot. I don't know how many people in your life this describes. Um, or it wouldn't even be in my life. It would just be people I've known in my online dealings. But like, you know, I've, if you know enough people, you've seen people who've like switched over,

like the trauma of losing in 2020 was too much for them. Among the people I know that, you know, loose acquaintances who flipped over. It includes like someone who got me to like disproportionate to their follower account. Like, like someone who, like, so I always think like you have 1500 followers. How are you always getting me to what's the point? Yeah. Yeah.

Like how is it? What the fuck? Just generally like dopes. Yeah, like how is that? What the fuck just generally like dopes Dupes people who like their posts before this were like well you guessed it. I clicked on another fishing link So, you know not smart people who fall for that and to their credit a lot of these dumb guns that I've seen both Ones I know and I don't know They have been like, what the fuck? We didn't vote for this.

Wait, now they're telling me he did this stuff last time. Wow. Whoa. Whoa. Yeah. I mean, it's like the people that again, with the immigration stuff, the stories of people being like, well, I didn't think he was going to deport, you know, I don't know what the end of that sentence is moms or or kids or, and I thought he was just going-

My wife. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. I didn't think he was going to deport. Sometimes it's just me. I didn't think he was going to deport me. Yeah. You know?

And it's just like, I don't know. We got an information crisis, I guess, because I don't know where you could have gotten that. Yeah, but Will is right though, if you cannot say, hey, this guy in his last weeks in office, made it that much more difficult for us to ever have any sort of diplomatic relationship with Iran by assassinating two millions of Iranians, a national hero, if you can't even come out and say that's bad, if your only criticism was it may have been imprudent. Yeah, it's your own fucking fault.

Once again, you can complain the voters are being stupid or you can blame the politicians they're voting for. And just like, I guess the last thing I'll say in that regard is that, you know, like, there was a time in my life where I used to think that this would make a difference I'm not so certain anymore given the way things have gone over the last couple years But like I think it should be of note for the Democratic Party that like over the weekend every single Democratic politician or media figure who promoted the war in Iraq Was doing the exact same thing for the war in Iran. And I think it's just it's maybe worth considering if like they if those people had suffered any professional consequences for their disastrous judgment or outright deception, would we be in this position we are now? Something to consider. Like I said, I'm not even optimistic about that. But it's just something to consider given that not like every single person.

The only person who suffered any negative career consequences for supporting the Iraq war is Hillary Clinton in two presidential elections. And that's not nothing. That's not nothing. But everyone else is still on board the gravy train. And now they're telling you, look, this will be a limited strike and it certainly won't be like the Iraq war. Yeah. Yeah. It makes you wonder where the fucking popularist guys are. Because I saw some poll that was like, the question was, do you want war with Iran?

And the vote in favor was 5%, which is like, that's like margin of error of some guy pressing the wrong button on his keyboard type of stuff, you know? Yeah. of error of some guy pressing the wrong button on his keyboard type of stuff. You know? Yeah, that's literally 5% of the population works for the corner and fudge. It's all somehow have a billion dollars. The fudge is somehow like better funded than the New York Times. All those places are because it's always like, you know, a guy who founded like a website that you like an app you've never heard, like the dumbest thing you've ever thought of, and it has like 800 billion users.

It's like an app where you take a picture of food and it tells you if it's good or bad for you. Like if you take a picture of a hamburger, it says, I don't know, and it's worth $7 trillion. Those guys are always funding the fudge because they're always like, I'm politically homeless. I like Donald Trump, I don't like Donald Trump, but I love Israel. Where do I go?

What party is there for me? Yeah, exactly, yeah. So I founded the fudge to hire Judith Miller and Eli Lake. Well, this leads us to the next topic for today, which is, if you don't live here, maybe you're sick of hearing about it. But tomorrow is the New York City Democratic primary for the mayor. And we got a guy here. We got Zoran, and this is a big deal here in New York. And I want to talk about this for a second. And the first thing I'll say here is that like, as Hewlett said about predictions, I cannot nor will I offer a prediction in this race.

We all saw the polling that shows that Zoran has a lead now on the second ballot. All I would say is I'll believe it when I see it. But what's important is what the poll shows is that he very much can win tomorrow. He can win this primary. And everyone who wants him to win should be acting like he's five points down right now. I think he has a very good chance to do it. Like I said, I'll believe it when I see it. But we're on the verge of maybe something good and sort

of something bad happening. And I'd just like to talk about like, as this race has tightened up and the national media has, I think, as they're kicking themselves now, belatedly started to take an interest in this. Chris said something over the weekend that I thought was very on point, where it's like, anytime anyone who's like vaguely left wing and just like seems like a nice normal dude gets within spitting distance of winning an election They just come out with he's going to kill you And then that and that was the tenor of the the advertising a lot of shit

I saw over the weekend here in New York City including Eli Weisel's son Putting out an ad that compared Zoran to Hitler. I hate Elie Weisel's son. It's like you weren't in the camps, bro. You were the hedge fund manager for 30 years. Like, what the fuck? He's a hedge fund manager and he's I read his Wikipedia, which, by the way, he has enough free time to clearly write his own Wikipedia. Oh, that rocks. I'm going to check that out right now.

Yeah, it is. So'm going to check that out right now. Yeah, it is so... It's so long. It's so fucking long for this guy that no one... I have never... I've met all types of freaks, as I've alluded to. I have met people who are like, I was institutionalized for all 2019 because I tried to kill myself to bring back the sci-fi series, The Avergence. And I go, I've never heard of that, you're a maniac. Felix, it was The Expanse, by the way. And I don't regret my actions.

This is the lead-in to The Expanse. This person was even crazier than you. But, you know, he's a hedge fund manager, and like, who does this work on? Who's like, Oh, his dad told him all these stories about the Holocaust. And so he recognizes when he sees Zoran, that's really a camp guard and waiting. I saw another guy call it an existential threat. Existential.

Yep. Are you, have you made plans to move in case it happens? Right. You're not going to exist. If it does. And it's like a coin flip. Well, I mean, like I saw over the weekend, like Zoran got got like some death threat or something.

Someone was like, I'm going to blow up your car. And I thought the his campaign's response was that he doesn't own a car, which I thought was pretty funny. That's really nice. I love that. That's a real urbanist. But I was like, and then that guy Whitney Tilson was like, we all have to condemn violent rhetoric like this. You know, threats have no place in our discourse. And I was like, Whitney Tilson is the only reason he's running a campaign is that he's like a vessel for millions of dollars to be spent to send mailers to my house in New York City telling me that

Zoran is essentially going to kill all Jews. And it's like, if you believe that that were true, why would you get angry that someone threatened to kill him? If you're saying that he's the next Hitler, are you condemning Klaus von Stauffenberg for that Operation Valkyrie was uncivil or should have gone through the normal political process? Yeah, you're okay with killing like potentially two million Palestinians. Yeah. You know, you're okay with probably, I, Whitney Tulsin, has anyone asked him about the, um, the Fordow fail, as I'm calling it? Yeah, let's get that hashtag going everybody, Fordow fail. Yeah, all the AOR heads, we need you.

You know, presumably that's where all this stuff is worth it, but not like killing him is too far or like, I don't know, blowing up his city bike. One thing I saw just before I started recording today from Brianna Wu, fast becoming one of my favorite denizens of the discourse, is that she posts, responding to the poll that shows that Zoran is now the favorite in the mayoral primary, she writes, was talking with a Jewish friend this weekend and she noted a historical pattern. When Jews no longer feel safe in a city and leave,

it often collapses culturally and economically. Baghdad and Aleppo are strong examples. Oh my God. Now, two things I'd like to note about this point of view is one, I like that she is basically saying that the Jews do control the culture and economy of New York City. And the examples of Baghdad and Aleppo are telling because it's sort of like she's threatening to bomb New York City if we elect the wrong guy mayor because it was like, I wonder why the culture and economy of Baghdad and Aleppo collapsed recently.

Maybe she means like, I mean, if she means this example, she's awesome. The Baghdad that was sacked by Genghis Khan. Like Genghis Khan was like, no more Jews. We can go in. We can kill everyone in fucking Baghdad. She might mean that. I mean, like, I think it's so telling that Brianna Wu, I mean, a lot of people, they're so young,

they only know her as like the crazy Zionist lady. People who don't know, Brianna Wu was, she was a Gamergate figure. You know, the thing we said we would never talk about. The most important issue of the 21st century. It gave us Donald Trump, it gave us the nation of Iran. Iran did not exist in 2013 and then Gamergate happened. It gave us Israel. None of these things existed until Gamergate. It's the most important thing.

If you don't talk about it, you are complicit. So basically, she was just this crazy lady who made mobile games. She made mobile games where you are, I guess, like a cat person in space. And it was like, it had the most like tortured development cycle. It takes like a year to make these games, but it took her like a decade. It was like her war and peace. But when Gamergate happened, she just sort of like jumped on it and was like, you won't believe this, but a sniper tried to kill me and it's like you're right I don't I think you're a fucking lunatic but she was even like you know

during all this time you just you know the joke about um this is the most important news show you have to have a position that was a lot the, if you were on the like left liberal internet at the time, there was a lot of that. You were hackered to take a position on it, even though you did not have to. But even, you know, 2015, 2016, there was a realization among people that maybe this lady's a bit cuckoo. Maybe she likes saying that a bunch of things happened to her that in fact did not and It's so telling that after there's no cultural currency for that left You can't be someone who's like hey my mobile game that I've been working on for the past 30 years is finally

We're finally putting out a demo that you can't like juice donations or attention or media jobs out of that But she's like what's the next like victimhood thing I can get on Zionism? Well, one last thing which she says, when when Jews no longer feel safe in a city and leave, it often collapses culturally and economically. I think Brianna is actually staking out here a huge opportunity for Jews who want to stay in New York City after Zoran wins or if he wins, because like think how strong their cultural and financial power will be if they are the only Jew left in New York City. Like Felix, you will be running everything.

Oh my God. After everyone flees because of the existential threat of free buses. Oh my God. I hope you pigs are ready for some pain. No more stick and ball sports. It's all combat sports. Oh my God, I hope you pigs are ready for some pain. No more stick and ball sports, all combat sports, and Axis of Resistance livestream, if you guessed it. Mixed gender equinox, finally. It's not gonna be all men sexually harassing.

Just kidding, that does not happen to me there. Just like, another thing I've noticed from the weekend in the mayor's race is that is the endorsements that have come in for Cuomo are hysterical. They are awesome. They are absolutely like a fucking like a Transformers guy of fucking like... Jeffrey Epstein Associates? Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Glenn Dubin.

He got the Epstein trifecta. He got Bill Clinton, Glenn Dubin, and Larry Summers. But my favorite- When does Glenn Dubin even make endorsements? Glenn Dubin, like the only reason you know who Glenn Dubin is- Is because of Epstein. Yeah. Like literally, it's just like, oh, famous billionaire rapist pedophile. There's no one who's like, I really liked his fucking futures trades in 1997.

If you know who Glenn Newbin is because you work in hedge funds, you're already voting for Cuomo. It's one of those things where like, do you remember when Hillary Clinton endorsed the opponent of Nithya Raman in LA? And it was just like, what are you, why are you getting involved in this? Like when, like clearly a, a, like a group text has gone out being like, Hey, we, we got to bring in some big guns. Like we want randomly like Bill Clinton to weigh in on the New York City mayor. Oh, Jim Clyburn is another great example.

Yeah, no, Clyburn was my favorite. Yeah. That was the absolute best. A congressman from South Carolina. Yes. And like, they were like, Oh, like that, that carries a lot of weight. And like, look, it worked in the South Carolina primary when it was Bernie. But like, how many New Yorkers are know who fucking Jim Clyburn is? Well, it's just like, it's so telling as an example of the thing that like people on the

left are talking about, which is like, hey, it's it sure looks like all of the worst guys, you know, really don't want this to happen. And even if you don't follow politics, it's like, huh, I guess that would maybe tell me something about whether I should vote for this guy. Cause everyone who I hate seems to hate him. You know? I saw a great post that was like, why didn't Zoran try to win Clyburn support? And it's like, that would be what a great use of time that would be for him to travel to South Carolina and be like, I know be, what a great use of time that would be for him to travel to

South Carolina and be like, I know that you hate my entire program of politics and you have no connection with the state, the city, anything. But can you like take resources away from phone banking, from canvassing and try to get Jim Clyburn support. I love all the people who do this and they, there's like a little like trick, a little lie by omission where people talk about Jim Clyburn in these incredibly aggrandizing terms for this like complete cynical piece of shit.

And I think it's, they think that people won't look him up or know who he is and they're like, if I just talk about him this way people will assume he's like a respected civil rights icon like yeah like John Lewis. Yeah You know not a word healer from South Carolina black mayor Quinn Bay No, I mean like I was just like look No, I mean, like, I was just like, look, obviously, there are no moral victories here. And it's going to be gutting tomorrow if it's like razor close and he doesn't win. But I will say that it has been inspiring to watch like Zoran run really an old fashioned campaign campaign.

And I'm thinking about that, that thing he did the over the weekend where he walked the entire island of Manhattan from Inwood Park to the Staten Island Ferry. And you know, shout out our friend Donald Boringstein who's doing all of his own on his videos, which have been amazing. They've been so good. They've been a plus. And it was just like to see him just out in the streets of New York very clearly. He loves this city.

And like he got dapped up down the whole fucking island. There was a crowd of like 40 or 50 people following him just Just everywhere he was in the city, people were dapping him up. The energy is clearly all on his side. That being said, like, look, I've seen this movie before, but I'm just saying like, he's got a real chance. And if you're in New York City and haven't voted already, there is a good chance that, okay, tomorrow in New York City, it is going to be 110 degrees with like 90% humidity, probably the worst weather the city has ever experienced. Who do you think that favors? If you get out there and vote for Zoran tomorrow, there is a good chance that your vote will be

taking the place of two or three elderly Cuomo supporters. So I think that alone is worth suffering the heat. And it's worth suffering. And you know, there's any, anytime left you have to canvas I know this is like the last hour. But like I know all of our listeners to show really want to see Zoran do it. I really want to see him do it. So like this is worth it because it's in the palm of our hands right now. Yeah, all the qualmoses supporters who miraculously survived his first urge of his own supporters when he was governor. Mother, mother, mother, please. He's like, they are going to die in line tomorrow.

Like that is, you know, there is no greater way to eliminate old people than a, than a heat wave. Um, I was thinking of like, if they were trying to prove that Clyburn has a connection to New York and some of a populars guy being like, oh yeah, what's this? And it's just the kill this season dice scene with Clyburn and he was in this entire movie. It's a New York favorite. He's long been an affiliate of the diplomats. Yeah.

And then like, I guess the last thing I'll say about this is like, affiliate of the diplomats. Yeah. And then like, I guess the last thing I'll say about this is like, one of the most amazing things to me about this race was the New York Times' efforts to not endorse anyone in the race and then waiting for the last minute and doing an unsigned editorial saying Zoran is unfit to be mayor. Like, first they announced that we're no longer endorsing local races. Then they put out this bizarre thing where it was like the council of learned New Yorkers, including the CEO of Warby Parker and the guy who works at the Manhattan Institute.

And they were like, who are you voting for in mayor? And the results were too varied. It was just like there wasn't any real consensus. So then they waited another couple of days. And then they did this editorial where they just, it's a non endorsement endorsement of Cuomo because they're like though we regret we have to vote for this sex criminal like Zoran blah blah blah for reasons is dangerous and unfit for office. And they were like he recalls the like you know it's just like it would recall back the

mayor Bill de Blasio and I'm like was it really that bad? I mean I remember Bill de Blasio being okay. I mean, the city didn't fall apart under him. It was pretty fine. Yeah, he got the universal pre-K. Yeah, stop and frisk. Crime did not go up. In fact, it went down.

It was literally a joke to blame stuff on, like to say that de Blasio's New York was like this hellhole, like this 28 days later landscape or whatever, because it was just like fine, I guess. It's certainly not like the sort of specter that I think they are trying to raise. I also liked about that editorial that apparently it was written by David Leonhart who lives in fucking DC.

So what the fuck? Are you kidding me? Yeah, he lives in DC. I don't see how they're doing that with like, by the way, Bill de Blasio, his approval ratings like in New York, his base never abandoned him. And he did, he at least did one of the things

he said he was gonna do, which is what a fucking low bar, but a monumental achievement, especially for fucking mayor. And if we were just stacking them up, who disgraced New York War, Bill de Blasio or Eric fucking Adams? I know. And the fact that like Bill de Blasio's tenure as mayor of New York City, like invalidates like anyone who's

like on the socialist left from ever running for mayor. But Eric Adams being one of the most ludicrously corrupt crooks who's ever sat in Gracie Mansion, ever been mayor of New York City. That doesn't credit centrist Democrats at all. The fact that this guy is now personally in the pocket of Donald Trump because he had 56 federal indictments that were swashed. Can you fucking imagine what would happen if Zoran went out there and they were like, what do you like about New York? And he said, well, it's crazy. You know, one day you could be eating a chopped cheese and the next day it could be 9-11.

Because that's basically something that Eric Adams said. But, you know, I mean, like, all I'm saying is that there's a real opportunity to make all these people eat shit tomorrow. And I'd really like to see it happen. I really would like to see it happen. I'm still stuck on like the Glenn dude. Like, is there like a pipe fitter in

Rockaway who's like I'm waiting to see Well, I mean it just I mean like I don't think it is an exaggeration at all to say that the people who have endorsed Cuomo and are his loudest supporters are to a person um Zionist sex criminals. Yeah One of the other or both, but I repeat myself, like you could not get a worse collection of vile people coming together to tell you that the nice young guy is actually really dangerous for the city. So we have to, regrettably, we have to elect the guy with 13 sexual

assault allegations. Have we heard from Alan Dushhowitz on who he's going to be supporting? Because I've been waiting to endorse before I know who Alan Dershowitz is endorsing. Well, this is the thing is like, I keep hearing from the Democrats that like, we need to like, we need to sort of rebrand the party. We need to attract young people. We need energy. But like, anyone who would conceivablyably fit that description is not towing the line on Israel. So you're shit out of luck. You can have one or the other because no one under the age of 40 likes Israel anymore. And they're not going to. That's not turning around.

So you're going to be continued. If you're the Democrats, unless you want to change the brand, you are going to continually be stuck with the Zionist sex criminals running for office. That's your brand. It's going to be really interesting. As a resident of California, it's going to be really interesting to see what Gruesome Gavin does with that stuff as he tries to grow into the national spotlight, which I

think personally is going to fail enormously. I don't think there's any fucking chance that anyone is going to be fooled by him for a second because he is just so... You see, he looks like the guy from Futurama who gets bonitis. My bones! He's just the most obviously horrible guy. But I wonder, he's like, I don't know, maybe the youngest prominent Democrat who might run for president other than I guess Pete Buttigieg, you know?

So I just wonder what he's gonna do with all that stuff or whether he'll just keep talking about killing homeless people instead, because that seems to be his comfort zone. Libby, I see like a very DeSantis thing happening to him where this shit is not playing outside of your state. And it's weird because it's like, unlike DeSantis, he isn't making the case of being a liberal champion.

He is saying that he's gonna like meaningfully take on Donald Trump, which is, you know, something that the Democratic base does like a lot. But the problem is he has a record that suggests he's not doing that. He has to contend with his record. And I also, yeah, I just, I cannot imagine that act playing anywhere else. Like, he can do all the fucking podcasts he wants. He can

do the John Fetterman thing, the thing that every Democrat has been doing, of like, I actually greatly enjoyed duck hunting. You know, he can do that all he wants. It's just, no, you do not naturally occur outside of California. Yes, actually, okay, I have a prediction now. I think what Gavin Newsom is gonna do is he's gonna go down a Fedeman-esque route by creating a fake sort of-

Getting fat as shit. Well, yeah, he could do that. He could do that. He never would, he could not. No, he would die. That would show me that he at fat as shit. Well, yeah, he could do that. He could do that. He never would. He could not. No, he would kind of die. That would show me that he at least wants it. Yeah, yeah.

I like that. I think he's going to do like a sort of small bean mental health crisis where he's like, I have imposter syndrome and I have anxiety and like I'm taking a month off or whatever and create like a bunch of discourse around that. I think that's what he's going to do. And that would be very California of him too. He's got to get married though. Hmm.

Can't be, can't be a bachelor running for president. All right. I'll do it. Got to get a wife. Libby. I thought he, I thought he was, isn't he married to that? Like Jennifer Seabird woman? Is he married?

Hold on. Jennifer Seabird. I know she was like some actress. It was in like an ABC show. Yeah. Jennifer Seabull. Yeah, yeah, yeah, Jennifer Siebel Yeah, no, yes, his spouse is Jennifer Siebel Newsom. Okay, correction again. Surefully withdrawn. He's already he's already checked that box off He's married to Jennifer Siebel. I don't know if he has kids though. Does he have kids?

Yeah, he has four kids. Four kids? Fuck me. All right. He might have kids with yeah He has like at least one kid. Does he have kids with Kimberly Gargoyle? Yeah, yeah, he has at least one kid with Kimberly Gargoyle. Fuck, that rocks. She looks, it's so sad. Like she had a really, she had a really like unique look. I mean, this is a really popular look on shows like Reacher.

They love making the love interest look like this, but I call it the Irish Latina look. If you see it, you know what I'm talking about. Yeah, like on the most recent season. Yeah. Yeah. And the one before that, Reacher loves those Irish Latinas because they're the ones who'll go,

I know that you're homeless. Well, you don't have to be my boyfriend. You just have to fuck me, fuck me until we kill this guy. Every man's dream. But Kimberly Gargoyle used to look like a naturally occurring Irish Latina. And then, I don't know, I always think it's sad when people look, you know,

even when they're not beautiful Irish Latinas decide to look that insane because there's something in their brain that's telling them like, this looks awesome. You're killing it. And that means they're insane. Yeah, yeah. It's very much like Kristi Noem is another great example of this.

Like I realized recently that the person that I had been seeing on TV who everyone said was Kristi Noem was the same Kristi Noem who looked like a different lady five years ago. I was like, oh shit, that's the same. That's the same lady. She was, she was cute. Yeah. Yeah. She had like a cute look. Like she was, I mean, if I was a 14 year old and that was one of my mom, my, my friend's mom's, all I will say is that for, for men and women, powerful men and women in Donald Trump's orbit, being in close proximity to Donald Trump causes dysphoria of some kind.

Absolutely. Yeah, 100%. Yeah. All right. Last thing I want to mention before we move to the final piece of today's show, I would like to mention in the course of events over the weekend, I think it is important to note that Mahmoud Khalil was released from ICE detention in Louisiana, and is free and with his wife and child in New York City right now. He addressed his

supporters on the steps of the Cathedral of St. John the Divine just yesterday. And I would like to say to Mahmoud, welcome home. Yeah, it is, I mean, it is a crime that he was ever put through this. Obviously it's horrible that you get to miss the birth of his son, but it is, it is incredibly gratifying to see that at least, at least he made it out and is able to not only be with his family, but to immediately lead a rally his first day out, it just shows you

what kind of person he is. Yeah, and then if you stand strong for what you believe in, I know it seems impossible and terrifying, but if you stand strong, like you can you can make these guys crack. Because like, are there the reactions I've been seeing, they're sick to their stomach over this right now. And it's just like, you can make them crack, because you're stronger than they are. And you believe in something and they don't. Did you see what Jake Oshenfoss said? Yeah, he was like, he should be released, but we

shouldn't be listening to him talk because what he has to say is evil. He said he should neither be neither be in jail or have a platform. Platform like he should be they should remove his ability to speak. And like you gave him the platform by arresting him in the first place. Prison. Yeah, exactly. How many people had heard of him before that? You know, it's like a, you know, a crime that I guess they hadn't put like, come on, like, the whole reason we know who he is is because of that. And he did have a very funny comment that I saw quoted in the press about, like, the contention advanced by Marco

Rubio and others that he was being, he had been arrested for undermining the foreign policy of the United States. And he was just like, he was like, the implication here was that I was a threat to the US Israel relationship. He was like, I don't know if you see it, but it doesn't look like I've had much effect. Right. Exactly. Oh, Christ.

All right. Well, look, Libby Felix, as we've talked about today, the world can be a fairly frightening place with all the war and violence and social decay. So I think it's like time now at the end of the show to change gears a little bit and talk about love yes because there's still love in the world and I bring this up because I saw a wedding announcement in the New York Times this weekend and lo and behold it was our old friend Sean McElwee finally getting hitched and it

got a write-up in the New York. So in the spirit of love and human relationships, I would like to read now the Sean McElwee New York Times wedding announcement. This is beautiful. The headline, this is the New York Times vows section. One of the, probably the best section of the New York Times in my opinion. Does it say how long they were dating? Cause I want to know if this is the same girlfriend who he made bring chicken nuggets. No, no, it is not. It is not. This will be revealed in the article. But the headline to this wedding, the vows

announcement is debate is their love language. Oh, racial. It's already good. It's already good. Rachel Acheson intended to challenge Sean McElwe over political spending. Instead, they fell in love. God, this is like this is like before sunrise. This is like a Richard Linklater movie. I'm getting goosebumps just thinking about it. It's very push pull. Yes, it is. When Rachel Kelly Acheson and Sean Adrian McElwee

first met at a West Village coffee shop in June 2022. It was too tense to be a meet-cute. The first three paragraphs of this piece are pure diamond. Mrs. Acheson, at the time, the senior assistant to Mayor Eric Adams, was planning to chew out Mr. McElwee, a pollster with whom she shared a mutual friend. Mr. McElwee was conducting polling on behalf of Protect Our Future Super PAC, which was backed by Sam Bankman Fried, the crypto billionaire later convicted of fraud. So both of them met at a time when they were top advisors to two criminals. Yeah. What was the meat? Cute. Are you wearing a wire? Yeah. Are you? Yeah. Like that. That is the thing I hate about this. Like debate is a lovely like, okay, for anyone,

you know, this might be one of those things where I say something that I think everyone believes, but I reveal myself to be insane. But, you know, it's kinda hot to get into an argument. I think a lot of people feel that way too. Yeah, that one's a little. Not me particularly. Women being mad at me for any reason is like a nightmare to me.

Yes, anyone being mad at me for any reason, I don't wanna to hear it. I sometimes it's the way like there is a woman I was like in a we'll say it's complicated, we'll say a relationship for a while. Right. But in the days before we like fully broke the seal. I remember I went to this Halloween party with her and we had the stupidest fucking argument I have ever had. And you know, this is so 2017, you wanna know what it was?

It was, she was like, well, I think like, I think Compton's bad. You're morally better than that. And I was like, you don't understand that that's what I do. You know, this thing that no one, we were like hissing at each other. You don't understand, no, you.

And the entire time I was like, this is so fucking hot. And it was, I was so like transfixed by it that literally, I guess I could transfixed by it that literally, I guess I could say this now because this guy got me too'd. So I'm like, this shitty writer like met me there where I was bricked off like just thinking about this argument. And he was like, he was trying to talk to me and he's like, I saw the Kevin Burns Vietnam documentary. And I'm like not paying attention.

Oh, was this the guy who tried to cancel you for being rude to him about the Ken Burns piano? Yeah, yeah. I was like bricked the fuck up. Like my pants were probably dripping in pre-comp. He started talking to me about this. I'm not even looking at him. I'm like, oh yeah, I heard it was bad. And he writes it in his review of it that came out like a year and a half after the Ken Byrd's thing Did he was like I?

Met a left-wing podcasters should be a name. He was looking at Instagram while he talked to me He said he called my family compradors and it's like I was I was a rock hard not listening to you I said like three words to you. I, he didn't mean me. So I, there was no rebuttal, but, um, that's how I was so transfixed by it. And, um, it's a common, it's a common thing, but the weird thing is with this, there's no, like it's not debate. They don't care about any of this shit.

These are just like positions that like the next guy, the next unadited campaign finance gamer who pays them will pay them to briefly believe. It's just a funny little joke to them. It's not a real argument like is Comtown bad? Yeah, Felix, I really like the idea of your brain getting some wires crossed and then every time you listen to come town, you get an erection and you're like, what the fuck?

Yeah, for a while, for a while I would. He was my roommate. I think I would know if Nick was a Nazi. It was one of those things where it's like, I'm hearing myself say it. And it's like, I know when 30 years, I'm going it's like, I'm hearing myself say it. And it's like, I know in 30 years, I'm going to be like, I was such a fucking, why was I screaming his thing? Like why was I so mad about this?

Like I want to kick my ass at 30 years from now thinking about this. But at the time I was like animated by it, bricked up. Back to the New York Times, and really, I must credit, I'm so glad all the details of this meet-cute were captured by an FBI wiretap and preserved in the New York Times vows column. So it says, okay, so she was senior assistant to criminal mayor Eric Adams, and he was working at the time as a working for the protect our future super PAC, the initiative backed by crypto criminal Sam Pinkman Fry.

So he goes, she was angry about political spending in general, including the more than $11 million that the protect our future put towards Carrick Flynn, a long shot congressional candidate in Oregon. That's someone who Jack Reacher kills. As a proponent of effective altruism, Ms. Atchison felt strongly that the money should have gone to charity. What a fucking business. By the way, that was not the argument.

An Eric Adams employee saying, I think you're spending too much on campaign finance. It was, hey, you should have been bribing our guy. Yeah, exactly. There's something really funny to be about the fact that I just Googled Carrick Flynn and the first result is still his LinkedIn page. That's such a huge failure, Jesus. I read that name. Whenever I thought character was like, you know, he founded like, you know, what are those apps who are talking about? Like, you take a picture of your TV and the app tells you that's not a book.

You can't read that. You know, he made like 11 billion dollars. It's is it a book or not? That improves literacy. But no, he's he's just some guy with an office job. He's just a guy with a job. He's just a guy with a job. You know, he made like eleven billion dollars. Right. Is it a book or not? That improves literacy. But no, he's he's just some guy with an office job.

Yes. What was the deal with this guy? Why did Sean love Carrick Flynn so much? OK, I'm going to call this reading series Richard Linklater's Before Sundown. Back then, Mr. McElwee was the head of Data for Progress, a progressive think tank and polling firm that he helped found in 2018. In November 2022, five months after the coffee shop encounter, he was asked to step down amid betting allegations. The two are strong personalities with a

penchant for debate and forging connections. Their conversation that day, they said, also covering polling he had done on voter support for animal welfare laws, an issue she, a vegan since high school, was very invested in. So what began as verbal fisticuffs at the coffee shop quickly bloomed into romantic walks through Washington Square Park and jaunts to an East Village public pool. Ms. Acheson said that Mr. McElwes's experience with data for progress. He is in my mind a better person today than when I met him. Miss Atchison 33 is a food policy wonk who became deputy director and Mr. Adams

office of food policy. So she's the one who makes the smoothies for him. Have you seen like the awful Eric Adams smoothie that he makes? Oh, my it's like black, right? He, he just puts everything in there. Like, it's bizarre. It is one of the worst, like Dan Quinn has made a smoothie that looks like that. It is some very frightening food gore. And it, again, like most Eric Adams things, it suggests that he doesn't do this ever.

Yeah. And so he's been lying about eating. What does she think about Eric Adams' admission that he eats fish sometimes by the way? Yeah. Yeah. Hellgate reminded me of that, but like. He's a vegan that eats fish sometimes. Wait, he puts romaine lettuce in his smoothie. Yeah, romaine lettuce in his smoothie.

What is the fucking point? There's like no nutrition. It's just water. It's just crunch. There's no no nutrition. It's just water. It's just, it's just, it's not even that. There's no vitamins in that. I think, again, I think he's like, it was another weird lie where he's like, I make a smoothie every day. I used to, when I couldn't afford a blender, I would just step on the fruit. But he's never done it. Right. Like, ever.

So, yeah. She was deputy director in Mr. Adams' office of food policy. She left the administration at the end of 2024. Oh, convenient time to leave the Eric Adams administration, by the way, to start a nonprofit. She interviewed heavily with several other government agencies. Her food nonprofit is Food Policy Pathways, for which she is executive director. She was raised in Washington, D.C., and graduated with a bachelor's in philosophy from Boston University.

Mr. McElwee, 32, grew up in an evangelical family in Leidyard, Connecticut. He received a bachelor's degree in politics, philosophy, and economics at the King's College, a Christian school in New York City, before earning his master's in quantitative methods in social sciences at Columbia. Quantitative sciences? Quantitative methods. He got a master's in quantitative methods. Quantitative methods in social sciences at Columbia. I think that's too specific. I don't think you should be able to get a master's in that.

I think that's like one part of a master's you should be able to get a master's in that. I think that's like one part of a master's. As someone with a completely fake master's degree, I think you should have to have a better master's than that. Is it normal to be from an evangelical family in Connecticut? Yeah, yeah. That's normal, okay. Yeah, there's this shitload of evangelicals in America. Well, that's true, I suppose.

Just thinking about them in Connecticut is just strange and disturbing to me. That is weird. That is very weird. I mean, one of the funny things about Sean's rise was that he was formally like, I think he was a Kato guy at one point, but it was the fact that he had this very like, you know, he would be Kerrick Flynn in another life. He's very much a product of his background. you know, he would be Carrick Flynn in another life. He said he, you know, very much a product of his background. But he it's he brought that attitude into, you

know, whatever he did. Sure. Libby, this, Libby, you brought up the the chicken nuggets. And I think this next paragraph will sort of like, put a shine on that experience. Sean Sean is quoted here as saying, I think of bad relationships as lowest common denominator relationships, Mr. McElwee said, each person pulls the other down. If one eats poorly, the other will eat poorly. But a good relationship is a highest common denominator relationship.

That is so mean. This is Sean blaming his old girlfriend for him being fat. Yeah. Fat and evil. Yeah. Oh yeah. I love, you know, my last girlfriend, it just didn't work out. Nothing but the best for her.

She's total sweetheart. Love that girl. She didn't take me fat and evil. Like, can you think some fucking responsibility, Belle? Since meeting Ms. Atchison, Mr. McElwee has become more committed to healthy living. He also became vegan and neither drinks alcohol. He is the founder of PositiveSum Strategies,

a consulting firm that specializes in public opinion, strategic communications, and advocacy strategy. Wow, all three of those things, they specialize in? Amazing. PositiveSum is such a stupid name. Hey, word number goes up, polling. I know it's like zero sum, but it sounds stupid. It sounds like a guy who is trying to defeat allegations

that he doesn't know anything about math. Like, oh yeah, well, I've called my firm Big Numbers, so how about that? Oh, I don't know anything about math. Like, oh yeah, well, I've called my firm big numbers. So how about that? Oh, I don't know anything. Why did I get my master's degree in the quadratic form? And why is my polling firm called Square Root Poland? Ms. Acheson said she had been transformed by the relationship too. She had never pictured herself having children, but with Mr. McElwee, she does. Their lives became integrated quickly and seamlessly. In November 2022, she moved into Mr. McElwee's apartment in the Chelsea neighborhood of Manhattan, where they continued to live, and became engaged in August 2023.

On June 5th, the couple was married by Yan Feng Chang, an officiant at the Manhattan City Clerk's Office. Their parents were in attendance. Two days later, they held a celebration at Tamerlane Sanctuary and Preserve in Montauk, New Jersey. And OK, this is the point where like, yes, listener, if you're if you're hearing this tone in my voice, it is sour grapes that I was not invited to this event despite despite knowing Sean socially 10 years ago.

But like I am a little bit bitter about not being invited to this celebration of their relationship in Montague, New Jersey, because it included plant based nonprofit employees, hedge fund managers, alternate protein focused venture capitalists, and that's just Soylent Green. That is the Soylent Green people, the people who are turning homeless people into energy bars. They were in attendance at the wedding. Yeah, alternate alternate protein, not plant-based. It's an alternate.

It's made from something. I don't know what. Okay, so the protein capitalists and political consultants were invited to participate in community building breakout sessions, as they called them, which included salsa lessons, improv, a storytelling workshop and board games. Oh, if you like stumbled into this wedding, you would become Sayid Kato. If you are not exactly the people who like are supposed to be there, this would be a radicalizing event for you. God damn.

The drizzly weather cleared in time for the ceremony portion of what they called a learning wedding. Oh, fuck off. Fuck you. The drizzly weather cleared in time for the ceremony portion of what they called a learning wedding. Ugh. If you, if you.

Hey, looks like incrementalism worked on God. We push him to the left at our wedding. That's what I'd say. By the way, clouds. After a guided meditation and a pause for Miss Atchison's introductory speech, the couple exchanged their vows. Mr. McElwee promised to keep building together and made several references to the bride's preternatural ability to connect others. Guests were instructed to fill out a questionnaire before the

wedding and were sent a spreadsheet listing the other guests and their LinkedIn profiles. A plant-based catering company, Jam Cakery Events, provided food for the BYOB reception and in place of gifts, the couple requested that every guest write them a one-page letter in advance. The letters are compiled into a notebook to be read and enjoyed on their honeymoon. Is this attending a wedding or like applying to a job? Yeah, Jesus. This people have made having a party for your friends to celebrate you and your love together

into possibly the most interminable ordeal imaginable. All things considered the hours of time you've had to put in. Oh, we got invited to the wedding in August. Fuck, I have to update my resume. I love that it's BYOB. That is the perfect like judgmental shit. I don't drink, but I don't care if people don't. Yeah. Yeah. if I ever get married, even though I'm biologically incapable of processing alcohol, I will do an open bar. Because the point of a wedding is not like, to do breakout groups or to build or anything, it's for your cousin.

For your aunt and uncle to have fun. Your aunt and uncle to have fun. For your cousin to get bricked up, argue with a bridesmaid. I think having a wedding, not providing alcohol and then making people go to a storytelling workshop is one of the most evil things you can do to a person. That is fucking insane. Saying, yeah, here's the LinkedIn profile of 200 people that you're going to do a storytelling workshop with. By the way, there will be no beer.

Insane. You can bring your own like to the wedding where there's improv breakouts. Oh, fuck you. I really just want to thank my my my Nana and Pep Pep. They traveled a really long time to be here. They came across the country, they're very tired from the trip, but could we just get you into this game of Settlers of Catan we've got going. Sit down here grandma. Sit down here grandma. I didn't even think about that angle. Think about like, you know, they're probably, I don't want to make accusations, but I think that they have a grandpa who's like that the

elder Bundy who took over that place in Oregon in 2015. Or like, you know, the old guy from Duck Dynasty, the guy who made their family evangelical. They have like a Korean War veteran like Clint Eastwood and Grand Reno grandpa who had to go to that. And they're like, no, I've never met you before. Are you with my KPMG? It says, Felix, and it says, the letters were compiled into a notebook to be read and enjoyed on their honeymoon.

I'm just imagining them flipping through their notebook of well witches and then they just like open one page and a gun falls out and it's just the grand father saying, shut up, pussy. I mean, like the grandma, like presumably some of his, like, you know, like shit, not shit kicker, but like hot dog neck. I wear, you know, wearing a USS battleship hat relatives were at were at that. That was a fucking culture shock. And I

would actually be on their side for one. Those types. Well, to close out this vows announcement. I've never been to a wedding like this said Stanley Wang, a regular at McAlbee Atchison poker nights. The energy of the couple's first meeting was some kind of portent to rabble rousers who long for nothing more than a spirited discourse. Rabble rousers?

Yeah. What? What are you talking about? Supporting Richie Torres? What crazy rabble rousers supporting the pie in the sky radical Eric Adams. Two rabble rousers who long for nothing more than a spirited discourse. Oh my marriage for us will be a long debate. Mr. McElwee said to Ms. Acheson who wore a thrifted ball gown in front of their guests. When we debate, we grow and I vow to always debate

and grow with you. Oh, I'm debating taking my own life off. Maslotov, really seriously. Congratulations to this wonderful couple. Now, by the way, is there other betting markets on the success of this? Oh, fuck me, dude. Well, it's the end of casino. It's him, like all the like Sepulcherian, like NYPD captains who are his co-conspirators and he does this, why take a chance? They're on that. There is a house in New Orleans. They call the ride that McElwee atches in poker night.

Where you going, Jackoff? Bop! What about McElwee? He's solid, a Marine. He's big and fat, a Marine. He's soft and glad. Why take a chance? But you know what?

It is always worth taking a chance on love. I don't want anyone to get too cynical or jaded about that. Love is what makes life worth living. Absolutely. So sincere congratulations to the young couple. I think that about does it for us today. Libby, thanks so much for hanging out with us. And before we go, if people want more Libby Watson, you got a new sort of streaming project out there that I've been checking out.

Yeah. Would you like to tell our audience about it? Yeah, yeah. I'm streaming a few times a week, mostly playing Souls games, so like Elden Ring and Bloodborne and having a lovely time. Also got a new podcast. Could you do something a little bit more in tune with what our audience knows about? Yeah, sorry, I'll play the game where you kill JFK.

How about that? Excellent. That is a game by the way, that's a real game. JFK Reloaded. JFK Reloaded, yeah, I the way. That's a real game. JFK Reloaded. JFK Reloaded. Yeah. I've been wondering if I could get away with playing that on the platform, but also do want to mention a new podcast with me and Charlotte McDonald's called What's All This Then? We talk about Britain.

It's just a silly topic of British stuff every week. So like, you know, Tesco or Mr. Blobby or sausage rolls or whatever. It's a fun time. Come check it out. Mr. Blobby. Yep. Yeah. Right. So links to Libby stream and podcasts will be in the show description. Libby Watson, it's been too long. Thank you so much for hanging out with us. Oh, thank you for having me. I had a blast.

All right. Until next time, everybody that does it for us today. Bye bye. Please go and vote for Zoran if you're in New York City And do you do anything possible to prevent an old person from waking up tomorrow or get them to the polls very early? Love, no you just have to wait She said love don't come easy It's a game of give and take But I can't hurry love No you just have to wait You gotta trust, give it time Don't matter how long it takes