Chewing the Fat with Jeff Fisher - 'Talking Walking Dead' S8 - Ep5 The Big Scary You

Episode Date: November 21, 2017

Jeff Fisher; Brad Staggs, Jason Buttrill and Maximus Fisher A weekly discussion on the latest events with an episode recap. A look at how the past is working for today and what the future may hold. Also thoughts on how the series could end and what the crossover event could be with Fear The Walking Dead... Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Welcome, season 8, episode 5, the big, scary you from the Walking Dead, which means this, this is talking walking dead. Welcome to it. Jeff Fisher here, Brad Staggs, Jason Butchro, Maximus Fisher, Talking Walking Dead, Season 8, episode 5. Before we get into the deep recap, first impressions, Mr. Stagg. It was a thinking man's episode. After two action-packed episodes, this was a, wow, I think I need a score sheet to figure out what they're talking about. Jason? Yeah, well, can I first give my impressions of last week's episode since you guys...

Once you're out, you're out. Did this podcast without me? You weren't here. Good gosh. I had to write a show. You're a little bit too busy for us from time to time. We understand. We brought in a filler.

Me and Ronnie Dangerfield. We both got one thing in common. What is that? No freaking respect. Oh, wait. No. So yes, we're going to like, double up.

So, yeah. So, but it segues into this episode because, like, the first few episodes were, to me, were they were good because we wanted to see some butt kicking from our group. And, but it was just so chaotic and we didn't know the plan. But last week's episode, and you guys might have said the same thing was, finally we just, you knew exactly what the objective was. You didn't listen. You didn't know you weren't part of it.

Well, yeah, I did. But I just said that for the benefit of the audience. Okay. Of course it did. Thanks. But, but, but, but yeah, we finally knew. the objective. It was clear. We got to see Carol being awesome.

And it was just very obvious what was happening in the episode, which was a big time plus for me for that. So I loved it. And Jerry. And in this episode tonight, or last night, I love this episode. This episode was good. I really did.

You got to see exactly like, you know, why Negan has the pull that he has on this group. You got to see, like, I don't know, like do all, like, evil dictators, do they feel as righteous, you know, as in their cause? Do they all feel like that, you know? And it was just, there was just so many good, like, I don't want to get too cerebral on it,

but it was a cerebral episode. It was, yeah, but I mean, it was just like, you know, power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely. And, you know, it's kind of like the story of Neon. You should put that on a bumper sticker. So your first impressions there, Maximus, you've already said that you thought it was a good episode. So first impressions?

Yeah, like I said, I thought it was a good episode. And the story was really good. Well, we got a little hint in Negan's backstory as well as a good back and forth between Nican and Gabriel. Who isn't the traitor? Yeah. Oh, that's right. Yeah. Care to elaborate Brad.

Well, I'm still confused because he still gave him back his gun. They knew each other. There's something going on, but they didn't really explain it. The first part of the tease was I thought for sure he was a traitor. Stop. Is he not to, is he not the traitor? I guess not. No, I guess not.

We'll be through his butt in that jail cell. I think that should have probably put an end in it. And they, you know, it ended up being, you know, him, the only reason that what Negan confessed that he was going to use him just to live to get back to the sanctuary, right? Yeah. It was just weird. And Negan rushed him at the very beginning to disarm him. But he didn't disarm him.

And then Gabriel tried to get away from him later by running into the. I'll admit that I was wrong. I still believe that he was, I still. There's something still going on there. They did not, yeah. Oh, no, there's not. No, I will say. What hint did you get that there's something going on with him?

I don't know, but it just didn't seem to make total sense what happened. I mean, if in fact, he let him keep the gun, but then maybe he just knew that Father Gabriel wouldn't shoot him in the head, which he should have done. Yeah, Niggins pretty smart about that. I mean, he's pretty smart about empowering people, but not really. And he pushed this down at the third. It's the entire episode. People are a resource.

Yeah. Gabriel was a resource in that case. It made no sense to take away as right to defend both Negan and him. Especially after he punched him in the face coming out. I cracked up so hard. Now, I will say that, let's back up just a little bit since, you know, you reminded us you weren't here last week. I will say that many people were happy and cheering with you when Jerry showed up to save the king in the previous episode. That was awesome.

And, you know, you were definitely mentioned by one person in my house, not by me ever. I jumped off of my couch and, like, it echoed throughout my entire house. So, like, my family came down. And, like, what are you yelling at? Jerry! I know. I was, like, giving a battle cry. Like, roo!

And what was his line? Dude, I need you to be the king. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. And, of course, Shiva's death. Yeah. Yeah.

That was sad. Did you cry? You existed. see? I was not expecting it that soon. You cried, didn't you? Zero's and ones died and you cried. I didn't, you know, I... Stop it. Even if I was...

Even if I was sad at that moment, seeing the king like revert back to speaking normal and not talking like he was ripped out of Henry Hays or whatever. Well, that's a Shakespeare. I was like, oh, God, finally. We will... Maybe now we won't get another irritating, stupid king speech. It's over with, hopefully.

What's wrong with the king's speeches? I mean, there's good speeches. We live in America, and we got away from the kings, right? And that stupid Shakespearean, oh, what a rogue and peasant slave am I? And still I smile. And Jeffrey, he smiles. Not one. It's what the people needed.

It's what they needed. So I'm with Jason on that. I had enough of the king. I had enough of them. But I got it too. You're right. It's kind of what the people needed. But if they needed that, we're saving.

They needed a leader. They needed somebody that's, and yeah, I think that that's, I mean, would you take him over Negan as a leader? I hate to say this, but you'd follow Negan. Yeah. You'd follow someone. I'd be more, I wouldn't follow either of them, but I'd be more willing to follow someone that can promise actual like they can promise safety or bat you know or can guarantee

safety versus someone who just sounds good it was giving them safety right he was keeping them safe until he got them all killed well he kept them safe until they all died this is something I didn't understand so is all of the kingdom's best fighters did they all go down

so now it's just family members that are left that and Carol and Jerry yeah yeah right and it's yeah right not so they're screwed yeah okay so let's get let's get back to and then we then we got the whole uh if you want to call it cerebral we'll call it cerebral i found i don't know this whole thing the writing something's not it doesn't feel right with these episodes really what it is what it is what's part

you're talking about i don't know i just are they losing their grasp on the audience i think they I could be, and the reason I say that is I was thinking that on the way here. I thought, I wonder if it's starting to slip. I think they are. I mean, when you have, look, I am for sure not a word police. And I am not any kind of Puritan whatsoever. And I know that may come as a surprise to you. That's a shocker.

I know. But, you know, I'm not. Okay, I'm just not. You can keep pushing this Puritan stuff on me. Don't shatter my image of you. But I mean, we really were pushing our fans into Negan talking about this is why they love me. I've got, you know, I've got balls of steel. And he's talking to before that, he's talking with the preacher and he's talking about rubbing one out.

Right. Just stop. That's Negan, though. He is exactly like that in the comics. Okay. But the comics, now we're getting, we're now. we're starting to get the crossover between comics and television. And at some point, television has to become a little bit like real human beings talk.

Not going to. We're talking about a show where people where the dead rise up and eat things and we're worried about the way they talk. Yes. Okay. They act like real humans. Negan is Negan. That's how he always acts. He's always been like that.

See, Max is at a disadvantage because it's new to him. now. I know. The world of the walking dead is new to you. Which isn't, there's nothing wrong with that. It's just you,

it's, but he's also, he's also coming to the television from the comic book world. Yeah, yeah. But that was imagination and this is real television. Yeah,

so just, yeah. Keep it on, keep it on. I don't know. It's just me. I agree with there. There's something weird.

There's something weird. There's something weird with, I felt uneasy about it because there's... I think I might be tired of Negan. Of the jokes or just of the conversation in general? I might be tired of Negan. I think that might be what... I'm just tired of this plot line maybe.

I think I am. And I think I am. And I love... And look, I love the Negan character. I do too. They've rammed it down our throats now. And then they made us sit through him becoming a little... sized in the trailer

with the tad with his I love the one woman but I cheated His wife really That was a good scene It was humanized him yeah I get that well yeah well they were Up until this point they've been Cartoony bad guys

You know what I mean? Yeah like so up until Up until last night You had no issue with doing what Daryl wanted to go do Which is go and blow a hole in the wall and everyone dies You have no issue with that whatsoever I still don't So what yeah well

But the workers. Right. So what they're trying to do, that's what they've been crazy. Maybe that's what I think you guys maybe you're picking up on is there's been this whole morality thing back and forth. You know, like, oh, we should kill him. Oh, no, we shouldn't. Oh, we should. Kill them all.

Oh, no, we shouldn't. We're human. They've been going back and forth on that. But the only way to do that is if you had to humanize Negan a little bit. You had to show that the people weren't following him blindly just because they're all evil. They're following him because they're scared of him. Yeah. Well, yeah, they're scared of him.

as you mentioned as what happens to dictators, but he's also providing them a life. Right. A life of at least some sort of continuity and a life of some sort of safety. And he actually believes that he's saving them. Yeah. That's what we got to lie.

He actually believes that. He thinks that without him, these people would be dead. He's just doing it in his way. And it proved to be kind of true. Yeah. I mean, what's her face? Yeah.

Regina. The workout lady. Oh, yeah. you know, shoots him, and here comes, Negan, says, now why did you go? Yeah. I mean, it kind of proved to be true, right? Yeah.

And then remember when he walked out, or when he first walked up, that random chick was like, thank God for you, Negan. Because people actually believe in him. They do. And one other thing, too, that is cool that we kind of see in this episode,

is that there are, at least in the soldier-wise, there are people worse than Negan in the Saviors. He just keeps them in line. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. That's true. Yeah, so I thought

This shit So that's another point, Max And that's a good point It's like without Negan This whole thing comes down This whole thing comes down The workers Who they've mentioned before

There's tons more workers And our lieutenants They're gonna overrun the lieutenants Because lieutenants are just Floodd thirsty You know whatever Without Negan Something bad happened

That's why only one guy Has to die And that's Nagan It's kind of A false statement Because if Nigan goes down Either the saviors Are gonna eat themselves

or somebody a lot worse than Negan's going to show up. Like Simon probably would be worse than Negan. Absolutely. Oh, yeah. The only two, I think, aren't worse than Negan out of lieutenants. And maybe three would be Dwight, Eugene, and maybe Gavin. Which one's Gavin? He's the kingdom.

He's the kingdom lieutenant. The guy that said that there was a shipment due from them, right? Yeah. Okay, yeah. Maybe him. No, that was his name. Huh. And I think that, I don't know.

I just, I just, I just, want something more to happen than it's happening, I guess, and I don't know what that is. You know, the whole Rick and Darrell fighting like little kids. That was a good fight. Little trouble in paradise. Why wasn't a good fight? It wasn't a good fight. We lost lives trying to get these weapons, and then these two dingleberries are going to fight

like 14-year-old kids and then blow it up? Yeah. We're not going to have the weapons that we've lost lives to get? Yeah, that's that. I mean, come on. Who are you, America? Oh, wait. That whole thing again.

again, that was just to show that there's an internal struggle between dark and light. Right. There's still, see, I guess I am getting a little bit sick of that. I'm tired of that. I got it. Yeah, we got it. There's a struggle between people going dark and people trying to maintain. And Rick wants to be good and we're trying to make this.

I got it. I got it. Right. Well, I mean, now's the time that we need to lay the groundwork of the light that's going to win. Yeah. Okay, let's do that. Yeah. That seems kind of sad, though, because then we're looking toward the end of the series.

Well, before we get to the end of the series, because I've got a couple of thoughts on that, too, because I listen to a podcast. I forget who it was. Max, remember who it was. It gave like 10 or 12 different possibilities for the ending of Walking Dead, and one of them, I think, makes a lot of sense, outside of, you know, the one that should be used, which was my idea. There could be years left, though. I mean, supernatural has been on the year for 13 years, so. At the end of this episode, we get Rick, you know, Rick and Darrell have got mad at each other. I thought they would make up and Darrell would give them a ride on the back of the motorcycle.

No. Well, they were going opposite directions. And then the helicopter. Okay. Well, before we get to the helicopter, Rick sees, we get the guy up in the stand, right, with a little birdie whistle. No, it was after the helicopter. So what was, who was that guy? Was that one of the trash people?

That was one of the scavengers, yes. So it was one of the scavengers Yes It was You could tell from the armor The hair and he pulled out a little whistle Yeah the dog whistle Yeah

But I mean we're sure that was We sure that was trash people I am 100% sure That was a scavenger I thought that was Don't talk down to me Don't do it I thought it was

I thought of the savior too And I thought How the hell they missed that out Or that that Right That whatever it was Lookout But so it was a garbage boy

That's my theory That's my theory? You just got done saying you're 100% positive, which is a theory or positive. I am 100% positive. That was a scavenger. He's 100% positive. That's his theory.

My theory on the helic... I was about to say my theory on the helicopter is that the helicopter belongs to the scavengers. Which, okay, let's go back to that scene, that horribly chroma-keed scene where he's standing on the garbage and we thought we saw a... Everybody made that big deal about the bird.

How did they miss the bird? That was not a helicopter. in that shot though. If that was a screw up or if that was put there in purpose, that was a plane. That looked like a plane to me. Did not look like a helicopter.

Uh-huh. A likely story. But it could have been, I mean, is there a possibility? It was a helicopter. Sure. Okay.

But it looked more like a plane. That's it, counselor. But I mean, if the garbage people actually have a helicopter, maybe they have a plane too. How would no one have heard it by now? They would have dismantled that thing and ate it by now.

I mean, Rick heard it. And then he was like, What the heck is that noise? He looks up and then the helicopter passes. We have not seen helicopters in a long time. Remember? I think the prison was the last time we saw helicopters, and that was like two or three flew over, right?

Seriously? I don't remember that. At the prison, at least there was a scene at the prison where at least two, and I thought maybe three helicopters flew over in formation. I remember seeing a helicopter like, was it in Atlanta maybe? Was that the prison? Mishon and Andrea, when the helicopter crashed, they were there, but that was before.

Was that before the prison? That might have been earlier before the prison. Yes. But there was a time in the prison when they were at the prison that they saw them fly over to. And I was, and I'm really surprised. And even with Terminus as we go through the episodes, we haven't seen a train. Yeah. No.

I was surprised about that. We used the tracks in the Terminus episodes, but as obviously as, you know, markers. But we didn't have seen a train. I'm really kind of surprised about that. I had so many theories in my head when I saw that because it was so abrupt. and out of nowhere. The helicopter just shows up. I personally don't think...

I mean, why even throw that in there unless it's going to be a huge plot point later? Right. And I don't... I'm not buying that it's part of the trash people. I'm just not buying that. It could be, but... What do you think about that?

It doesn't seem right to me. I mean, maybe. Oh, now he backs down off it. No, it's... No, I'm not backing down off where the person was the scavenger. No, no, helicopter. That was a theory.

That was my theory that that is... I never said it was a... 100%. He's so easily triggered. That was easy. That was too simple. I've all wound up, man. It felt like,

it felt like to me. Yes. It felt like to me, it felt like to me, like when Jesus told Rick, the world is a whole lot bigger than what you think. That moment just kind of stuck out to me

when I saw that. Like, are they pitching towards a plot lines later, you know, further on down the line? Like, and I was talking, Max earlier before this podcast was like I wonder if they're going to do like maybe it's after the whispers or something like that like a new world order type you know plotline like maybe you know

someone's starting to you know get bring things together better yeah which would lead lead into one of the plot lines for the ending of the show that was talked about and I thought that makes sense that would work in your plan where we're looking ahead to the you know new world order of getting things in in place as much as we can like before. The end of the show, the end of The Walking Dead, is actually the whole series has been Grandpa Carl telling the grandkids what life was like coming to today. So I thought that works. It's that flash forward thing that they did.

Yeah, I mean, Carl, Carl as a grandpa, has been telling the story of the walking dead. And his father. And his father and his grandmother, you know, your grandmother, you know, this is what got us here to where we're at now. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. That'd be kind of cool.

That would be. That would be kind of cool. Now, you know, they've claimed that no hospital, you know, it wasn't going to be the, wasn't going to be the. Coma theory. Yeah, wake up on a coma. But my idea, the only thing was is that they all didn't use the actual end that I, they only hear part of it.

My idea was that he woke up and it was all a dream and that, you know, it was the, a yellow brick road dream. Right. And you were there and you were there, you were there. But the ending wasn't just that. The ending was on the television screen, it's all started.

So the news reports are reporting that The Walking Dead have started. Reports of people not, you know, that would be the end. Right. So, I mean, you only heard half of it. Okay, you didn't listen to the end. So I could still do.

do it still happened it could it could it's still possible one thing i did want to talk about uh this was this is off topic of this but it's when uh during the meeting at the beginning of the episode where nigan snaps at simon going people are a resource that oh yeah scene and plus we was good we got to talk about a little bit about uh Gregory uh no uh Dwight and eugene and Eugene's catching on to Dwight from what i saw did you see the the Max and I were talking about the chest guys and the wet paint and I wondered what significance that held but remember when they threw the bag down

with the nose of it had the paint on it and Eugene was the one who caught that yeah yeah the rest of them didn't so that's what gave Eugene the idea when he saw the chest pieces that when they threw what bag down when they threw the bag from the armory down on the table at the meeting around the middle

to near end of the episode saying one of us they couldn't have gotten it in here without us knowing it and then Dwight and they're all like one of us did this and then Eugene's looking at the bag and he sees a little bit of pain on it he looks at his thumb that's what okay

I was trying to figure what the hell he saw on his thumb this is paint was the pain I got you I'm not real smart and then he looks at Dwight yeah so he knows yeah yes yes he does now now then we have you know we've got to preacher man in the cell. And what the heck happened to him?

Did he get bit? He had to get bit, right? He's faking it. Well, and okay. He's faking it. Let's back up to them in the trailer. I'm probably one of the few people in America that fake could fake the sweat. Well, okay.

So. There's no way you think. They've not settled on a protocol yet for the rubbing zombie guts on you. Because remember, Nick in fear of the Walking Dead, can just put the war paint on his face. and he walks right through them. Literally like two lines of paint. That's not supposed to work. Plus, when Rick and the rest of the day,

they put sheets over the last time they put sheets over them, right? And wiped down the complete sheets. Yeah. Right? So then, and then before that, they wiped it all over themselves. I figured they would get caught.

And then they just throw the stuff over their shoulders in this one. I mean, Negan, I mean, the walkers do start attacking them a little later. Right. Why? Because if they're covered, in goo, why would they attack them?

Because I think they weren't covered in goo though, right? The face is none of, Negan. They didn't have a war paint on. Right. Right. So some of it, you know, one Walker says, Hey. Hey, this is a human.

And all the other ones are going, Oh, yeah. That's what they were saying. So, I mean, it's clear. That's what happens. That's clear. Now they may say that in Walker language. Right, right.

So probably, you know what? It's a Walker language. Someone out there has, like they did, Klingon, someone has put together a walker language. It has got to be a walker language. It has to be some kind of warning. Somewhere someone has too much time on their hands. All right, so we're looking forward to next week anyway.

Maybe we'll get some, some of the previews did show that they're going to be, you know, Rick is going to be talking to a garbage pale lady. Yeah. Which is. I want her dead so bad. Her name was in the credit. again this time. Who was? What's her in a Polly McIntosh.

She's the she was in the credits last week and in the credits of this week. She's in the clips of the some of the previews and stuff. Oh. And one thing too is I love what Rick said is I'm here to make another deal. And if not, we're going to kill all of you. So why not do that anyway? Yeah. Right.

They are. Thank you. What's the struggle? I know. They already. They already betrayed you. Just why didn't you show up there as part of the plan? to take them all out. Thank you. I mean, I just don't. I mean, I show by yourself. Didn't they show him

naked like in a ConX box or something like that? No. Like getting like sweating. That was another dream, Jason. That was the fantasy part. That was a different show actually. Yeah. I don't know what. No, they showed him in front of, you know, in the pit with the, with the trash people again. Yeah, I could have swore in another scene. They showed a naked Rick inside like a box where he's like all sweating it out. Very possible. I'll have to rewatch that. I mean, it looks like they're interrogating it, like they're holding them there.

Right. Like hostage. Didn't they already do that a couple seasons ago? Yeah. It just, it's exactly both of my eyes. The whole struggle of light and dark and good and evil, we got it.

Oh, can I tell you my other theory on the helicopter really quick before you sign off? Of course. What if this is part of the crossover? What if it's part of that? What if it's part of that? What is? Abraham or...

No, he couldn't have been up there because... Madison or... Madison could be up in that helicopter. I was just saying this to Max. So I was just saying this now so I can get this out there. So it's one of our theories. So what if Madison becomes the next big bad guy? The whisperer chick.

Madison? Madison is Alpha? Really? Yeah. How did that happen? How would you get to that? So she left... Because last time we know it, they're traveling towards like Texas or whatever. Yeah, they're coming to Dallas.

So her and her daughter. We're coming to Houston. So we know that Alpha has a daughter and they're supposedly really close, right, Max? Well, they were kind of close. So Jadis is... No, not Jadis. No, not Jadis is Garbage-Madisholkins. Madison is the Whisperors.

That's what you think. It's just a theory. In the comics, Alpha, the leader of the whispers has a daughter named Lydia, I think. Yeah. She diverts and goes drawings Rick. and then Al Fuzzle like meh about it So it would be a heck of a crossover

It would be interesting It would be big Yes it would be But basically you're kind of red light You're kind of saying Talking about the end of that show Mm-hmm So yeah

That's a shame Yeah Oh dang We keep watching it But then again they're screwing with time too So I mean That's the whole thing They could show another couple seasons

Of how Madison devolves Or something like that Right, yeah. And then they hit the ride. Then they get this helicopter and then fly. They're supposed to be. She's going back home. The timeline is farther behind, though.

In fear? Yeah. Yeah. How much farther behind is it? 432 days and a half. Exactly. Excuse me. Max.

How much farther behind is it? I don't know. I don't watch fear. Good grief. Oh, yeah. See? You're supposed to be the. encyclopedia of knowledge in here.

There's nothing on fear in the comics. Nothing. Well, you can still go and research it. That's your assignment. Okay. By giving him assignments now? He'll come back with a list of things he learned about. I know that.

That's what I'm saying. He's got other things to do for me. I actually found a theory on, I actually found a theory, which is kind of funny. I told dad this theory, which he found somewhat ridiculous, that this whole time Rick has been a walker. that sounds pretty ridiculous

there was another theory and speaking because we were we were busy talking about different theories on what could be you know the end game of the Walking Dead and one of them was that Rick was a Rick was always been a walker he just hasn't been affected the way the others were

the theory is this Rick died in the hospital when the power went out when he was in a coma but when he turned we only find out at the at the CBC we find out that it it reanimates the brain cell

or the brain stem but nothing else about the brain okay this theory had what if this he had a mutated version of the virus where when he died it reanimated the entire brain but then wouldn't he still have rotted like a corpse don't bother me with facts maybe it's just because if the entire brain

reanimated everything reanimated because the whole brain is up and running again So he went into zombie remission. That's the... Kind of. But you're still a zombie right. And then we find... And then he died again later, wouldn't people think is...

The second time he died is when that one scene where him and Carl are alone in the house. Carl! Remember that? And then he passes out and then Carl thinks he died. That's where people think he died again. That's so stupid. That doesn't make any sense. These theories get so great.

And then he's animated again. One of my favorite, another theory that kind of works is remember when, is that this is actually their story, but they're actually doing the killing. There aren't any walkers, really. This is just band of people are going up the East Coast, killing people. And remember the radio report? And they used, in the one theory for this, they used the radio report that, what's his face? you know, what's his face, heard in the house when he was dying. When they went into the neighborhood to the wolf's neighborhood and the one guy died.

And he heard the radio report. Chad Coleman's character. Yes. And the radio report was talking about this band of criminals going up to East Coast, killing people and destroying people so that the radio report he heard was actually a report about them. Interesting. So how did you explain the fierce spinoff show? I don't. it's Hollywood

why you got to bring don't say these stories are so ridiculous why are you bringing me facts don't bother me with facts if you want to if you want facts you have to listen to another show this is talking walking dead by gosh thank you