Chewing the Fat with Jeff Fisher - TWD: Dead City S2 Ep1

Episode Date: May 6, 2025

Talking Walking Dead: Dead City Season Two, Episode One… Titled:  Power Equals Power   With myself Jeff Fisher, Jason Buttrill & Maximus Fisher   SHOW DESCRIPTION ON IMDB: In a war for control of Manhattan, Maggie and Negan find themselves trapped on opposite sides.   Each week we discuss the latest episode and what the future may and should hold. We also discuss all things Dead. Email the show [e-mail]   Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

When we last gathered at the table of the dead, it was November of last year for the season finale of season two of Daryl, the book of Carroll. Today brings us together for season two of Dead City. Negan and Maggie are back, along with some regulars and some new characters. Episode one, titled Power Equals Power. This is Talking Walking Dead. Welcome to it, myself, Jeff Fisher, Jason Butchell, Maximus Fisher, to Talking Walking Dead, Dead City, Season 2, Episode 1, the IMDB description in the war for control of Manhattan. Maggie and Negan find themselves trapped on opposite sides. Mr. Butrell, Mr. Fisher, welcome back to Talking Walking Dead. It seems like a lifetime ago. It's been too long.

I miss talking to you, did not miss seeing you. This is... How do you think I feel? Wait. So I enjoyed the episode. It was nice to have an actual Walking Dead spin-off Dead City show back to enjoy. There were a few things that, you know, I questioned during the episode.

But it's good to have it back. And it's good to have finally Negan back to kind of be a Negan. I guess. No, no, no. This, I was so confused on how they're writing Negan in this, in this episode that I had to go back and read synopsis of the comics. And I'm glad Max is here to maybe shed a little more light on this because I didn't read all of them. and I was just like, does this make sense for who he is? I didn't know.

I was, I know we'll get there, but I was very confused just on how he was, you know, delivering his speech at the church and all this stuff. Yeah. We'll get there. As with all things Negan related, I'm willing to give them a little space and, you know, flesh things out. explain maybe certain things. It'll come out later.

That's kind of how I'm approaching this. But episode one, I wasn't to... A little lackluster. A little lackluster. That's the best way to play with that. I guess I'll agree. I did like the episode, but I do agree. It was a bit lackluster in some parts.

But like you said, Jason, I'm willing to give it the benefit of the doubt, considering also like Jeffrey Dean Morgan and Lauren Cohen are both writers, like, writing their specific characters. on this show. So I am willing to give it a benefit of doubt to flesh it out throughout the episodes, especially because I liked a good chunk of this episode, but I agree some of it was a bit me. Like,

so, okay, I just got to ask this question. So I paused it, like right, I think, right after he was in, in the prison cell and like that guy was playing the violin,

yada, yada, I don't want to check through your time. That's fine. I paused it around there. And I was just curious, like, because sometimes you know how the show creates,

like to steal from the comics and put it in other versions of the show and makes you wonder if they're taking that story arc or maybe getting inspiration. Right. But that kind of reminded me of a synopsis from Rick back in Alexandria going, because wasn't Negan like in prison?

Yeah, he was in their jail cell in the basement of the house there. He was in Morgan's jail cell, yeah. Yeah. And he made some comments that really reminded me like in the comics he said something that was very Negan about how, like the worst part of his day was taking a crap in the

bucket. But the best part of his day was having Rick come and get the bucket. That was very much a reference. Very much reference. Okay, that's what I thought. Okay. That's kind of cool. But then it makes you,

I don't know, it just makes me long for a better version of Megan, I guess. I don't know. I get it with electric Lucille. Yeah, we might get it. That Croak gave him the, you know,

the electrified Lucille, which, you know, he obviously used right away at the meeting of the church. You know, so the show opens up with, and I know that I realize it's got to be show and it's theatrics, but it opens up with the garbage truck smashing down the street of cars. We haven't cleaned all the streets out yet. Cars are still blocking the streets in Manhattan. I mean, it was in charge of this dump.

No one. That's the whole point. I feel like those streets would have been cleared already. That's just me. Right. No, yeah, you would actually think. I'm not the city manager. I'm not taking care of Manhattan during the apocalypse,

but I just feel like those streets would have been at least cleared somewhat. I feel another call back to your squirrels. I feel like coming on. He's giving me flashbacks here. All right, so it's just me. Never mind. Yeah, yeah. That seat actually got me.

I was really into that because like just I guess with the music, you know, and the way they did it. Yeah. Yeah, that's going to be cool. I'm collecting walkers to make the fuel. Yeah, I get it. I get it the whole thing, the theatrics. It just bugged me that we still had cars blocking the street.

Dad, I don't know if, Dad, I'm just saying, I know you only worked there for a short period of time. But in case you don't know this, Manhattan is a big city. No, I got it. I got it. But I just feel like that would have been taken care of it. So again, I know, it's just me. So then we have And the Negan in the jail cell was awesome

I thought that was interesting And it was also interesting that The guard is playing as a violin For Negan And I don't know that Croat was real happy about that You know, Mr. Evil When he came down, he saw the violin Leading up against the wall

And gave it the look like I like that Yeah, he's trying to break Negan That's never going to work No There's only one way to like do you want to do. And they eventually find that out.

But I mean, yeah, breaking him was never going to work. No kidding. Yeah, the only way to break him is to say they actually kill his wife and son. And if that happens, you're going to lose after that. Which may happen. Yeah, so I completely forgot that that was a thing. Me too. So I, why did I think they were dead already?

They mentioned it in the beginning of season one. Like the beginning of season one, Maggie asked, where's your wife and kid? And he goes, I sent them on a train to Missouri. I was going to follow them. And then I didn't to keep them safe. That was the exact, that was the exact, like, basic wording. That was a long. Yeah, that was the beginning of season.

I realized it was the beginning of season one. But that was also a long time ago in the timeline. Okay, so remind me, why did he go crazy and kill those cowgirl community? Oh, the new Babylon? New Babylon. Why did he go off and kill that? Like, what sent him off on that? Why did he do that?

I don't think we know. I just know he did no yeah I don't know because okay and then so then we have you know maggie the maggie and hirchel you know struggle of trying to you know be themselves and mom and hirchel and i you know okay fine whatever i got it i got let's move on that's uh we need herzs i'm actually starting to kind of like herschel as a character but me too and i need herschel to turn into a Nigh Ganesh character and just be like, tell mom, okay, this is me now. And I'm the one, I'm the four-toed monster, okay? Yeah, I kind of, yeah, I keep waiting for him to turn into a, you know, a male Asian

Judith. Yeah. That would be kind of cool. Yes. Just to be that kind of badass. Yes. I, yeah. I, I, I, I kind of like the development.

I don't know why, but I kind of like the development between Maggie and, and, and, and, what yeah, yeah, yeah, that's his name. Hersch. Yeah, the kid. her son. Usually annoys me and his like little his kid stuff being the little bratty kid kind of annoys me. I still like

finding out about that. Right. And look, he was a prisoner right for a while. So I mean, he's really struggling with that. And so, you know, she's got to try to overcome that and she wants to live in the commune life. And you know, we all get along and plant our little vegetables and live together in harmony.

I get it. Okay. And so question number two. Why is she not going back to Alexandria? I don't remember that either. I don't think we got that answer. I really, because I remember thinking, I remember we all thought in the beginning when we see her here, we're thinking, oh, is this hilltop? Is this the new hilltop? Yeah. I don't know if it is or not. We still don't have that answer. So we have no clue, but I don't think it is the new hilltop because this seems like right outside of Manhattan. So I don't. Well, it's in the Northeast for sure. Oh, it's definitely in the Northeast. So it could still be near like that area considering Alexandria's in D.C., so it's only a couple hours away,

but yeah, it's definitely in that neck of the woods. And we know that they are, you know, according to what they were talking about is that, you know, the new Babylon world accepted their commune as part of New Babylon, but with restrictions, right? Maggie believes that they have restrictions and aren't, you know, they're a separate entity aside from New Babylon. We can't, Jason, we can't call these people

cowgirl group. If we already call... No, time out. Then we're going to get confused because if you remember... The original was cosplay. The original was the cowgirl group from Fear the Walking Dead.

We have to change it. Yeah. Well, you see, your angst is kind of one of my main points with this F-E shit. And all the spinoffs in general. It's getting very confusing

because all the... Yeah, yeah. All the lady bosses that they kind of double are really doubling down on. They sure are. Is there a male boss anywhere? No. I guess I guess the marshal who's now the colonel is kind of in charge, but not really. No.

And they brought in a new under boss who's a female who's underneath the female new Babylon boss. I'm just saying whenever they do this, don't you notice that they always lose? that's a good that's a good point all of the bad guys do lose in this show yeah i don't care yeah they're supposed to but all the rulers right we have watch her face uh queen damn or whatever her name is in manhattan and she's busy up in the upper deck of the church giving a little clap for niggins there there's no men she must be the most left like except like the like the weak dude in the corner that everyone wants to laugh at or put this face That's it.

I'm curious about the heads of the different, like the three groups of like the three crazies of Manhattan. Like in the church scene. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, we had the groups. Yeah, the different leaders, which is, which is interviews. And they're going to, you know, they're obviously going to fight amongst themselves for a little while until, until Babylon B people show up.

So, yeah, on that scene, Jeffie, you, I, so Max, you probably never saw the Warriors as a kid. I don't think. I don't think I did. I know Jeffy did. Exactly. All right. Okay. So that one scene where they both show, they show up and they're like showing those

gladiator walkers. Yeah. And it walks up on that like, that was the can you dig it scene. Right? Absolutely. I was like, is they film it at the same place? Because it looked like it. They very well make, they could have.

I was like, what? It was the same kind of park. Yeah, it was the same kind of park there in New York. Right. Absolutely. In Central Park. Yeah. I was absolutely there.

It's too perfect of a call. They had to have drawn inspiration or they were like giving an Easter egg or something. Yes. That would not surprise me at all. I don't know. I didn't see that set anywhere or written anywhere, but that's absolutely what it was. Yeah, 100%. Yeah.

100%. So, all right. So Negan is now, you know, playing the game to join the city together under Queen Dam and, Croat so that they are able to defeat the Babylon B people. So Manhattan is considered lawless, basically. And they, and because we know that the Babylon B people are coming. And so Maggie and Herschel and whoever else the, the Babylon B people have gathered,

are going to go and try to take Manhattan. Herschel isn't going. It's Maggie and Jenny. You know, Herschel's going to end up going. Oh, he's going to end up following them, but he's technically not going as of yet. Okay. So I'm just curious.

Question number three. Are the Commonwealth and what is, what's the other group, other big bad group? I forgot. Wait, the one from the Rick show. Yeah, on. CRM. Yeah, CRM's gone. Like CRM's gone.

Remember, Rick stopped them? So timeline-wise, is this like, is that, is that, is that, is that, is that, post that or do we even know we don't know that's my guess i mean commonwealth is still being run by ezekiel that's my guess that's still my guess but like we we don't know we well we do know this is after the main show obviously uh this is probably after the ones who live possibly and then darrell is kind of running concurrent with this so okay so but and this and the and i'm just trying to like rationalize all these different groups. So CRM, like that kind of went away, but like their infrastructure is still built, right? Yeah.

Yeah, their government is still built. Their military's gone. Okay, right. So they just allow cowgirls to. So Babylon be over them or is Babylon be a separate territory? I think Babylon be a separate territory because the civic republic is Philadelphia. The Civic Republic military was everywhere, but they were trying to take over, and then the Civic Republic military fell apart after Rick stopped them. So their government within Philadelphia is still working, but their military no longer exists. So their government in Philadelphia is kind of like the Commonwealth, I mean, the commune of Maggie, right? They're just their separate entity there.

And then we have the, then we have the Manhattan people, you know, surviving in Manhattan with, you know, know, with all the power from the dead bodies, which I love, by the way. I do love that. I do love that we're using the body. At some point, those bodies have got to run out, right? So, I mean, even Manhattan is going to have to branch out. Yeah. At some point. I think the goal is like, yeah, they use all the dead to get all their technology back and then they can build, you know, additional infrastructure, which that's what it seems like to me. Yeah, that's definitely the plan. That is definitely the plan. I just, I was just like thinking like, you know, one of the big CRM plot lines was, you know, they're flying helicopters all over creation.

And they've got like drop points and all these big buildings. And they've never once noticed that there's like these warring factions or cowgirls, you know, riding the planes. Nobody in Philadelphia went. You know, something's going on in Manhattan. Well, check that out. The girls are going crazy out there. The whole plan. The whole plan of the general in the ones who live.

I know you both don't remember this the plan of the general in the ones who live with the the the echelon briefing that whole thing that we were looking to see what is this briefing the whole plan was the CIA the military are going to take over and create like kind of a totalitarian government take over the main government of the civic republic and then they're going to march throughout the US

killing every single settlement no matter what and then they're going to branch out from Philadelphia and he gave Rick the option I will let your group live if you join. Stay with us.

Yes. And then obviously Rick betrayed him all that but the whole point of the Civic Republic military's plan was to march throughout the U.S. and kill everybody or as much as they could. Yeah and he had spies apparently within all these different groups.

in contact. It just feels weird that he's not noticing, you know, cowgirls and all these people. I don't know. He is. He plans to kill all of them. And then he died by Rick. Okay. Relax.

Okay. We got it. I mean, yeah. Apparently this lone little village, Alexandria was a lot bigger threat than these wild cowgirls of the plains. And the commune, the Maggie commune. then the Babylon B people, I mean, we, CRM was not as strong as we thought. That's for sure. That is for sure.

If that's absolutely true. So, okay. All right. Fine. So we're going with, we'll just leave that aside. Don't worry about those other factions. It's fine.

We're just going to worry about, we're just going to worry about the commune and we're going to worry about Babylon B. And we're going to worry about New York and Manhattan. And the three, was it only three? three factions that were running New York? For right now we have four factions. We have

Roat, Negan, and the old lady. And then we have the three barbarian troops as I'm calling them. Oh yeah. And the Illuminati. Where'd the Illuminati go? They're just completely gone. Right. They absolutely are. They're running. Oh, okay. That's what they want us to

think. That's what the Illamini always wants us to think. They're secretly controlling Madam Dam or whatever you call it. And that's very possible. Everybody has a boss. That's very possible. Yeah.

She's in communication. I mean, we absolutely know that they have spies, right? Because that's how Croat learned that the Babylon Bee people were going to gather and try to take over Manhattan. So they do have spies out there. Are those spies tied to the Illuminati or Queen Dam or whatever her name is in Manhattan? I just so. She's going to take off her Scooby-Doo mask at the end and be one of the Illuminati, guaranteed. It wasn't for those pesky kids.

If it wasn't for those kids, we would have gotten away with the two. That's right. That's exactly right. So, anyway, it's good to have it back. It really is good to have it back. I don't know that I like the electric Lucille that Crowat made for Negan. you know, I kind of, I don't know that I, I think I would have appreciated him just getting a new Lucille without the, without the zap and just beat a couple people right there on the altar of the church

and say, there's a new sheriff in town. I think he's going to do that soon. I think he might bring out like the three leaders of the, of the barbarian troops, kill one of them and went, okay, who's next if you don't follow me? Yeah, that needs to. Okay, and that kind of brings me to my issues with Negan and how he's being portrayed here. So I'm sure Max will correct me. I could be completely wrong.

But it just seems like Negan. I don't like this reformed Negan. It really annoys me. And I don't know. And again, Max, correct me if I'm wrong. I don't care if I'm wrong because that's this. I guess this is how I want the character to be played. But he never really seemed like he was.

in the things that I read, which is just like summaries and stuff, it never really seemed like he changed his mindset. Like he's still a guy that loves violence, but he's very pragmatic and he's not wasteful, but he still enjoys violence. And that's always when I love watching Jeffrey Dean Morgan play him, when that like glimmer comes back. So like if he sees something pragmatic and something he really needs to do,

I save his, you know, wife and child, then he is going to beat the absolute crap out of that dude and he's going to enjoy it and after he gets his blood splatter all over his face he's going to look up at the crowd and say who's next right yeah so that's what I wanted to see

but he was fighting himself the entire time and he didn't look like he was having fun and I was like this doesn't feel right yeah you aren't wrong that's kind of what they do you aren't actually wrong at all is Negan is that way he in the comics as well, Reformed Negan is a man

who tries to fight himself with that every single day. Because if you remember, when he gutted a guy and threw his guts, right, that was good. Yes, that was awesome. He tries to repress that as much as he can. That's the whole point, and he doesn't enjoy it,

but he does it for the sake of, I have to hold back. But he does enjoy it. But he does enjoy it. That's what brings him, his, his, that's what he has to struggle with. What he doesn't enjoy is holding back, but he knows he has to. Okay.

So I, I'm glad that that's, I'm not completely wrong there. Now, did that seem like how he, it was during that scene? It didn't to me. It looked like he just did not want to do it. Yeah, he was being forced to. I don't, I don't want to be me. I don't want to do this. I'm going to do it.

I'll, I'll just do it. And the speech was even, you know, for, you know, tired. Just title the whole thing, lackluster. Yeah, it was tired. Yeah. Yeah. I was like, there's no showmanship. There was nothing.

Right. Right. Because this is a showman. It's been a while since he's been center stage. I think this is also the first time he's been. Jeffrey Dean Morgan, we watched me and dad watched it on AMC Plus. So they had the kind of behind the scenes after. And one thing they did is Jeffrey D.

Morgan said, Negan in this scene knows he's being used. So he has to play the long game in order of, okay, he knows he. being used, they know they're using him, he has to figure out a way to play the long game on this. Okay. Yeah, but the long game is still him having to be naked, the negon that we love. Which I, which from the, from the previews, it looks like we're going to see at some point, but.

I hope so. That's good to hear because I didn't see, I don't think I saw any of the previews. I hope so. I hope so. I'm looking forward to it. I'm glad there's eight episodes. Definitely, Jason. I was like, you know what?

So, like, I'm sure you guys were the same. When he stepped up to the mic, you know, metaphorically, I was like, here we go. No, I think the, yeah, here we go. It wasn't when he stepped up to the mic. That's what, that wasn't what got me super happy. It was when he grabbed the bat and he did kind of like the gavel, tunk, tunk, dunk, dunk. Oh, oh, yeah. When he, yeah, I got hype when he, like, clearly the speech didn't work.

And he looked over at the Kroat and gave him that. Okay, now. Give me the bat. Give me the bat. I was like, here we go. And then it still just didn't really materialize. Yeah, still was still kind of downplaying it. And I know.

And that's, and again, okay, so like I said, it's been a while since he's been center stage. You know, he's been working up to, he's working up to the, working up to the Degan. So, all right. We'll let it, we'll let him work up to it. Madam Dan. Is that our name? I think so. Maybe I, I actually don't know.

Yeah. That's kind of gay. It's, uh, I wrote it down here. The dama. Okay, whatever. Madam Damn sounds better. When Madam Dam like looked at him and it was like clap, doing the little golf clap,

I was like, you haven't seen nothing. That was, that was like maybe 10% of him. You saw nothing. Like when, like season one when he, when he had to scare the raiders off and he took one of them,

slid his throat and then gutted him and spread his guts all over from the railing. That gave me so much hope on that. I was like, oh, yeah. I think that's the point is he wants to do that, but he's trying to hold it. Yeah, well, he needs to do it. Let's get to it. We only have eight episodes, seven left through June 22nd of this year, so let's get to it. Plus, it was a little embarrassing.

I'll just back up just a little bit. You know, the corral scene with the cowboy. Oh, yeah, like Maggie's, like, they're going to. test Maggie against all these walkers. I mean, that's, that's like saw and wood for Maggie. What do we? And she, it was, it was easy for it. I know.

It's just like, come on now. Yeah. What are we doing? I was just a little, I was embarrassed for her. It was going through so much. Anyway, I'm looking forward to the next episodes. Final thoughts. Just too much of all.

Okay. This might be kind of long. But I, I'm, I'm going to give it. I guess a little bit of breathing room and see what they develop. And I'm, I'm, it's earned it in my, in my mind that they can maybe get a couple episodes in to really let it pick up steam. I'm annoyed with the doubling down on these 90 pound girl bosses that are just ordering everyone around. Like, I've made fun of it, I think in every single spin-off show. And it just keeps getting worse.

And so like, I just feel like, guys, I know it's hard to come up with a new bad guy and make it interesting. but I feel like you're going in the wrong direction AMC. We can get Metro Negan back. And that is Dark Times. Those were dark times, yeah. But yeah, I feel like they're in the spinoffs. They're kind of going in a cartoony further and further away from the source material. So it's harder for them to actually come up with like the feel of why we love this show.

I hope that's not the case. But then once I lose all faith in it or I'm starting to doubt it, I guess a better way to put it. I see the previews for what they're doing very well. Like Daryl Dixon, the preview for that. Oh, season three of Daryl?

Oh my God. It looked like the road warrior in the Walking Dead universe. Yeah. Whoa. And Daryl's show has been awesome. Oh, awesome. Every season. Yeah,

they're doing something completely different with the cinematography, the way they shoot it, the story, everything is completely different in Daryl. So I'm just like, guys. Take those guys and bring them over to the other shows. Absolutely. I know this is about Dead City now, but I'm just, I'm thinking, how is Daryl going

to be without Laurent now? Like, without the kid. It's going to be really interesting. Yeah, I know. It'll be awesome. I enjoyed it. I'm really, I'm willing to give them a breathing girl, but they better deliver. Agreed.

I better have, I better have, I better have Deegan run the joint here in a couple episodes. No, one thing behind the scenes, one that I think you'll really like Jason. So Jeffrey D. Morgan doesn't have that good of eyesight. He needs to wear glasses or contacts, and they won't let him work glasses. Obviously, is Negan. So the cockroach scene, apparently they had, they had put, like, fake cockroaches on there, like, filled with, like, pudding or custard or chocolate, whatever. But then, no. But then they had actually put real cooked cockroaches.

And because he was semi-blind, he could not tell which was which. So he ate like five real cockroaches Before he ate the chocolate The look on his face with the nasty biting and stuff Was real Because he ate Because after every cut He was like these aren't chocolate

What are you guys talking about? He would Because he would go after the real cockroaches first For some reason Until he got to the fake ones That's messed up All right so we'll see you back here next week Thank you for listening to a talking

Walking Dead. I appreciate it. Jason Butchle, Maximus Fisher, myself, Jeff Fisher. Be sure to, if you're listening to this and you're not a subscriber to Chewing the Fat, which is the mothership show of this show, what are you doing with your life? You need to be a subscriber. Thank you, and we'll see you again next week on Talking Walking Dead.