Chilluminati Podcast - Episode 13 - Gef the Mongoose

Episode Date: September 24, 2018

GET YOUR TSHIRT HERE - theyetee.com/products/chilluminati-logo We dive into the crazy world of scary ghosts and short men with big hats who like to braid some ladies hair. Soundcloud - @chilluminatipodcast Jesse Cox - www.youtube.com/jessecox Alex Faciane - www.youtube.com/user/Thenationaldex Art Commissioned by - mollyheadycarroll.com

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Don't let timezones get in the way of your team working well together. See why 99% of the Fortune 100 trust Miro to get good work done. From anywhere, get your first three boards free at Miro.com. That's M-I-R-O.com. Well, hello, everybody, and welcome back to some more Chilluminati podcast. This is episode 13. Buckle your seatbelts, put on your tinfoil hats.

Lucky number 13. This is an Alex. This is an Alex episode. Why do we do this? Why do we give him these platforms? Why do you give me a platform? Yeah. I don't know.

You know what? Today I have outdone myself. You have to be seen. You have to be seen. This is the weirdest. This is by far the worst and weirdest thing I've ever brought to the table. Oh, God. That's not a good promise.

It's a good promise. Are you guys ready for this? Do we want to just get right into it? What else do we need to talk about? Buy our clothes. Yeah, buy our hats. No, wait, they might not be out there yet. Buy our t-shirts.

Yeah, buy the shirt. If there's a hat, buy that hat too. Why not? It's probably good. Rate us five stars on all the things you listen to us on. Give us, put us on your Spotify playlists. Where else are we? Google Play.

We're on Google Play. We're on Spotify. We're on, what is this? Stitcher, tuner, pod beam. I believe you made up at least one of those. No, no, not at all. When I did my initial research of where to put podcasts, everybody's like, you got to get it on Spotify.

I tuned Stitcher, tuner, pod beam, and SoundCloud. I was like, all right, I'll make sure those are the six that I nab and Google Play. Both me and Jesse are ready to go pod beam. Yeah, dude. I'm serious. We both looked at each other with like, we were ready to say the P in pod beam.

We were like, there's at least like 10 people that listen to us on pod beam, all right? Shout outs to pod beam. Yeah, shout out to our stats. There's like 10 people. Incredible. What's it like on pod beam? Let us know.

Post on our Reddit. I don't know. My podcast is podcast attic. That's what I listen on. I'm an Apple guy, so I just use like to real. Yeah. I don't listen to this podcast. It's atrocious.

Whoa, first of all, rude. Second of all. The shit they say on there is crazy. It's crazy. I wouldn't listen to that. All right. I think that covers it. So let's just fucking get right into it

because you know how like, you know how like a comic book, like when it, when it's like not the strongest story, they like throw like a little, not that this isn't the strongest story, because this is the strongest story. You're really selling this, man. You know how at the, you know how at the end, you know how at the end of comics, they like throw a little mini comic in there?

Like an epilogue? No, no, no. Like if it's a little backup story, if it's like an Archie comic, there's like a fun times with Jughead at the back. Jughead gets a stubbed toe. Yeah. There's one of those at the end of this episode.

So we're going to go down two extremely weird roads today. Both good. Both involving Jughead. I, I, I, I, I encourage you, if you're listening to this, not to look this up before I finish telling it. Oh God. All right.

Because it doesn't have, it doesn't have a crazy twist like the Beatles one, but it's just a weird fucking story. There wasn't a crazy twist in that one. It was just a guy who went to an alternate reality. And then the Beatles were there. I feel like we need to talk about what a twist means. Can't wait for Jordan Peele to take over the Twilight Zone.

I'm excited for that. The fact that that whole thing was like just some songs that existed, but re-remixed. Yes. Yes. We're not going to talk about that part because that kills the magic of the madness. Well, you got to look at the reality and the fantasy on each end. We just got to,

sometimes there are stories where there's just more things that are not answerable than not answerable. And that's the Chiluminati promise. Yeah, exactly. Can we get that on a shirt? That's the Chiluminati promise. That's the Chiluminati promise. Some shit is fake.

Okay. All right. All right. All right. This is a crazy story. Don't look it up if you're following along. Don't look this up. It's going to be better for you not to.

This is about Jeff the Dalby spook. I want to give a shout outs to Anna Green at Mental Floss, Louise Hung at Exo Jane, and Matthew Dalton at the Wall Street Journal for their articles on this, which I used to research this episode. What is, I'm sorry. What is the name of this again?

Jeff the Dalby Spook. All right. Jeff the Dalby Spook, not Jeff the Killer. No. Admittedly. There's nothing. Look, there's, I'm going to start this off by saying, there is nothing terrifying, horrifying, or scary,

but anything named Jeff, if there was a horror movie and the monster's name was Jeff, everyone would be like, oh, Jeff. You know what's weird? You know what? I disagree. How does he spell Jeff?

G-E-F, and that's it. Oh, that's terrifying. Oh, never mind. That's terrifying. All right. Continue, please. Somebody's fucked up. Yeah.

Admittedly, this is like the squirrel on water skis news story of paranormal stories, but the facts are weirdly specific and it is hard to believe someone would make such a weird story up and it does get very scary at parts. So hold on to your- You are terrible at selling these stories.

Hold on to your bridges. Let me take you now to 1931. The village of Dalby on the Isle of Man, which if you don't know what the Isle of Man is, is actually pretty complicated. It is like a neat little British thing. It's like self-governing. It's called a crown dependency.

It's on a small island between Great Britain and Ireland. The head of state is Queen Elizabeth II, right now, who is like- She's also the Lord of Man. Okay. And it's been inhabited since like 6,500 BC, so maybe that's what this crazy ass story can be attributed to. Who knows?

But the fact is no one really knows. And it is actually creepy. Seriously, so get ready. Get fucking buckled in. Back in 1931 in Dalby, there's a family and they're called the Irvings. Okay? There's James, who's a retired salesman.

His wife, Margaret, and they have a 12-year-old daughter whose name is- Oh, man. It's Manx, so it's hard to pronounce this name. Vora? Vori? Vori. Vora.

It's V-O-I-R-R-E-Y. That's the name of this kid. So I'm going to say that name a lot very wrongly, so just spare me the angry comments. I'll just take an L on this one. But I'm going to think it's- I think it's Vora. Okay, all right. They were poor.

They lived in a farmhouse. You know, this is still the 30s. This rural aisle of man. They had no phone, no electricity, any- even no radio. And like any neighbor that they had was like at least a mile away. So this is like- this is a remote ass place, right? And one night they start hearing these weird sounds

coming from inside the walls of their house, like scratching sounds, and like weird vocalized sounds that like- what I say vocalized mean, like they sound like they came from like a voice. Like they're like, ah, ah, ah. You know, as opposed to like- as opposed to like an animal sound, you know, it's like very like voice-like. Right?

Sure. And so at first they're like, obviously this is a rat, no big deal. That's just scary. So they're like, you know, what do you do? You pound on the walls. They like got their like pots and pans and stuff, and like tried to get rid of it.

But like it never went away. And it just like sort of kept going. And it was like on and off in a way where it was like never quite like overwhelming enough that they were like, we got to get the fuck out of here. But it happened enough that it was like annoying, right? And it went on for days, like for days, until it really started getting weird.

And now it starts sounding like almost like a dog or maybe like a human baby is now scratching inside the walls. So it's like this voice is like fucking evolving, right? And they're just like, what in the fuck is this? What does a human baby scratching sound like? I'm just saying like the sound is like, like a little, like a little, you know, like a little baby. Like just in the wall, imagine if there was a baby in there,

what that might be like. Okay, sure, sure. Yeah. And they start getting desperate now. So they're like, what the fuck is this? So they're putting out traps. They're trying to like kill it somehow. Nothing is working.

And so finally he just is like, you know what? Law of the Jungle James, this like 55 year old farmer or whatever. He might even be older than that. He just like posts up and he like, he like, he like growls at the monster or whatever it is in the wall. And it like, like right back at him, like it copies him in like a really like weirdly similar voice to his own voice. So now everybody is like fucking losing their mind.

They're freaking out. It's just the point in the story where we go, we'd be out by now. This is where we would leave. I don't know. No, this sounds like to me it sounds like there's an animal in the wall. Okay. Yeah. They make a point of being like, it's not that annoying,

but like when it happens, it's like very scary. Okay. You know what I mean? Like if it's happening like twice a day for 10 minutes, I wouldn't be like, we got to get out of here. But I would be like, what the fuck is that? I don't know. Maybe knock down the wall.

It was the 30s. People put up with some bullshit in the 30s. That's true. That is fair. But so that obviously freaked everybody out, but not nearly as much as they freaked out when the things in the walls started mimicking other animals. Like I was reading about this and I like kind of got the sense that

they were like kind of just feeling like they maybe were just crazy because like they like the way they talk about it, they say like they start hearing it like making animal sounds and then they're just like, fuck it. Do a cat. And it's like meow. And they're like, do a bird. And it's like, like it like does this.

Like that's what's going on. Yeah. Like they're just like freaking out now. They're feeling crazy. This thing is like making whatever sounds they want. And so as time goes on, it graduates again from mimicking animals to mimicking Voda by like repeating nursery rhymes that she liked to say.

Because she was like 12 years old. So she's still like one of those like, la, la, la, la, la. It's like still the 30s. Nobody has video games or iPads. So they're still singing and skipping and shit or whatever kids do. Whatever you do when you don't have electricity. Yeah. Like breed or, I don't know, make mud pies.

I don't know what you do. I don't know what you do. Did you say breathe or breed? Oh, I don't think I said breed. I heard what did I say for some reason? I was like, what did I say? Read. Read.

Okay. Read. I heard breed. Now I was I was nervous about that. Don't worry about it. Technically, I mean, I mean, depending on their age in the 30s. Maybe it was a different time period. I don't want to.

I don't want to go down that road. You fucking creeps. You said it. Not us. I said reading. Yeah. Yeah. Sure.

Uh, so this thing was like now repeating nursery rhymes in a human girl's voice. And then finally it just started to talk in a high pitch voice of its own. And then it just straight up introduced itself to the family as Jeff. It's like, what's up? I'm Jeff. Like straight up. Right. All right.

And it's like, G, G, E, F. Yeah. He's not going to say that. He's spelled it out for him. He, he did. This is the point in time I'm out. I don't 30s or not. If something in my wall is like, hey, I'm Jeff.

I'd be like, I'm out. Yeah. I'll be like, you were an animal. No, I would have been like, hold up, Jeff. Time out. Time out, Jeff. Yeah. What's up?

What are you? Jeff, what are you doing, buddy? What's going on? What's, what's that? I just, uh, I've been here before you. It's my place. You live here, Jeff. You live, you lived in my, you lived in my wall.

One foot gap in the wall that I lay down in my sleep. But Jeff, there's nothing else to do. Yeah. But what are you? Are you like a homeless guy who moved into the wall? What are you, Jeff? I'm a- Oh, you, oh, you have no idea what Jeff is.

What are your kids, Brad, with the pig, and I'm a mix? Well, I thought we said that kid upstate, but okay. No, check this out. So Jeff said a lot of crazy shit. Jeff said that he's a mongoose who came from New Delhi and he was born in 1852 and he came to the Isle of Man when one of their neighbors needed mice catchers. And he said, if you're kind to me, I will bring you good luck.

And he said, if you're not kind, I shall kill all your poultry. He said, I can get them wherever you put them. He said he liked bacon and sausage and kippers, but not eggs. He said Margaret, the wife, was his least favorite person in the house. He even screamed at James one time. He said, read it out, you fatted gnome. When James was opening a newspaper, because he was getting frustrated with how slow he was opening the newspaper.

So this is a voice, just a recap. This is a voice. This is, this is a like, like a tramp or some sort of like homeless dude who's snuck into their house and is like, oh yeah, no, totally a weasel. And you should break, yeah, I'm a mongoose of some shit. You should bring me some food. This is like the 1930s version of pumped. Yeah, this is BS.

There's no way. So well, just to give you an idea of what we're dealing with, James said that he was a, and this is a quote, a little animal resembling a stote, a ferret or a weasel, yellow in color with a body about nine inches long. He saw it. It's long, bushy tail. He saw it.

Speckled with black. He saw it and it talked to him. He saw it and talked to it and everybody in the family did. And, but also sometimes they said it was an invisible sprite. Who like was a disembodied voice. So nobody, who knows what's the man who, like you, Alex enjoys diving into the, the weird and the strange. Honestly, when you say like a sprite or like a spirit of nature or something,

that makes a little more sense. Yeah. Like you're like talking mongoose. No, no, this makes sense. This is insane. This is not to your most receptive mind. No, this is stupid. Everyone in this family, everyone in this family are,

they're either liars or they were being like gas poisoned or something. Well, that's not what, that was like, it's either that or like, yeah, like their house is situated on some like natural gas area that like, the shit eating their house is hallucinogenic. The island man is slowly killing everyone on it and no one was aware. It's all those motorcycle fumes or whatever. Yeah. All right.

Look, so look, but the weirdest thing is Jeff maintains that magic and the supernatural have absolutely nothing to do with his powers. His quote that he's always quoted in every article is, I am not a spirit. I'm a little extra, extra clever mongoose. And then he also says, if I were a spirit, I could not kill rabbits. And actually when the family was like in his good graces, he actually supposedly killed like a fuckload of rabbits. Apparently he brought to them like over 50 rabbits,

which he strangled with his front paws, like as like an offering to them. So another thing about him is that he gives really weird presents like this. He's feeding the family like thirties. First off, why would a spirit admit to being a spirit? Let's think about that for a minute. Why not? If he's able to like fly around and be invisible and like choke rabbits to death. Maybe on a most literal sense, he's not a spirit.

Maybe he's more of a demonic presence. So all right. All right. So this is a thirties. Let's keep the story going because I want to know is this guy dead? Is Jeff dead? Okay. So another gift that he would give is to use his incredible sense of hearing

to give the Irving family gossip from around town. So apparently he was able to like from eyewitness testimony, he was able to repeat stuff back to the Irving's. They were like whispering to each other closely from like 15 to 20 feet away. He could just like hear it no matter what. So what Jeff would do apparently is that he would ride the bus around the Isle of Man and like collect intel. He would like collect intel for the family and then he would come back and like give him the inside dope.

I'm what was going on around the Isle of Man. I just had this image of this mongoose with like a 1930s fedora on, on a bus with like a newspaper being held up in front of him. And he's just like listening and just peeking over. Yeah. He just brings himself on the bus in like a little shoebox. All right. New theory.

New theory. All this is made up to cover the fact that this family had gossip on people and they like, we're like, no, we didn't hear it from you, from your friend. We heard it from a mongoose. Jeff talking mongoose who lives in the walls. Look at, see all these rabbits. He brought them. He doesn't like eggs, but he loves bacon.

Yeah. Oh yeah. This is all right. Please continue. This is, it reaches somebody going, oh yeah. And tell me more about this mongoose that you have. And then it's on the spot. Oh, he likes bacon, but hates eggs.

He swears he doesn't like eggs. He says he can get my sheep wherever I hide them. All right. So it's all fun and games, but eventually things get a lot worse. Everybody in the family has said they'd at least caught a glimpse of Jeff at some point. Oh, so no one might, hold on. This whole thing of them talking to him like didn't, people didn't just sit down and have a conversation with him in front of him, right?

Well, we'll see. We'll touch on that in a minute. So, okay, so hold on. So everybody, everybody claims to have seen him in the family, but apparently the only one that he would like, allow to stare at him and look at him directly was Vora. So she, cause she was like his favorite. And actually she, he liked her so much that he also had the family create a little partitioned

area of Vera's room that's called Jeff's sanctum. That's what they called it. And then it started to scare the shit out of her because sometimes he would just go in there and sit in there and just like ramble insane shit in his little hutch while she's like trying to go to sleep. But she's just like laying in there listening to this like little high-voiced freakish monster, like say shit. Like what?

And so one night she gets so scared that she goes to sleep with her parents and Jeff says, I'll follow her wherever you put her. And he tries to break down their door, but apparently it's not what you would expect it to be like for a mongoose to break down a door. Like, you know, like trying to scrape at it or whatever. Apparently they said that it, and this is a quote, the door bulged as though some terrific forest were thrusting against it. Like boom, boom.

Like something was like really trying to get into the door. So like at this point I was kind of thinking like poltergeists at this point. And so actually now you say poltergeists. Do you know the ages of the children in the family? How old were the kids? The kid? There's only one kid and he's, and she's 12. It's a she and she's 12.

Vada is 12. Yeah. Okay. I know Jesse doesn't believe in any of this shit, but again, going into like the paranormal aspect, and if you're thinking more poltergeist, activity poltergeist, in that study and like, you know, ghosts and stuff, they're not really spirits of people.

They're manifestations of energy, and they're usually very aggressive and violent and want attention. And they mostly come up when girls specifically hit puberty, and there's a whole lot of like energy coming around, and the house is just like unstable, angry, just high tension stuff. And that's when these poltergeists tend to come out and they feed off that shit, and they get very aggressive. Again, Jesse, no, you don't believe it.

And I'm saying there's not any evidence per se to prove it, but when poltergeists show up throughout recordings of stuff like this happening, almost always, there's a girl going through puberty around there. You're saying it's consistent with folklore. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Or it's straight up just a dude living in their walls. I mean, that's also very possible that there's a creep who's like,

I want to be in your little girl's room, and don't take her away from me. Also, of course, a person that they don't recognize could drive around town on a bus and pick up gossip and then go back, because no one's looking for a weasel, because it's not a weasel. It's just a creep. It's true, but that's not the only poltergeist thing that happened. Because see, both James and Margaret reported objects and furniture were moving around the house.

But weirdly, it's not even just them that experienced poltergeist stuff. See, because there was a paranormal investigator named Harry Price who said, and this is a quote, shrill screams accompanied by terrific knocking, loud bangs emanated from all parts of the house in quick succession as if the perpetrator moved with lightning speed. And that's important because this is the same guy who also apparently said that he thought the Irvings were all just sharing like a collective delusion,

which to me makes the fact that he said that other stuff happened like more believable. But it adds a little bit more credence and weight to it. Yeah. This guy even actually teamed up with a guy from the BBC X BBC guy, or I don't even know if he's X BBC, but he was a BBC guy and they published a book. This guy Rex Lambert and they published a book on it in 1936. And the conclusion is like not positive on Jeff existing.

And it's guided by things like hair sample tests and paw imprints that they had, which all came back as either inauthentic or inconclusive. And if we're talking about other experts that looked at it, Price was not the only one. And he also wasn't the only one who contradicted himself really. Because this other doctor, Nandor Fodor. I don't know if that's the right pronunciation. No, that's not.

That's not a real name. Nandor Fodor? Dr. Nandor Fodor. Get out of town. All right. Who's apparently both a psychologist and a parapsychologist. Said that he believed Jeff was part. He believed Jeff was a part of James's split personality,

but also that he's an actual real talking mongoose. That was his. That was his conclusion. That was his art. Sure. That is that Jeff was a split part of his personality, but also that he actually became a real like talking mongoose.

No. No, but so things started getting worse and worse. He'd start hissing at people. He bit Margaret a few times. He like sang all these annoying songs all over the house all the time. And apparently one time while she was yelling at him for singing a lewd lyrics version of Home on the Range, Margaret said, you know, Jeff, you are no animal. And he said, of course I'm not.

I'm the Holy Ghost. And, and he just kept bullying Margaret. And there's all these weird quotes that they have in the XO Jane article. And I'm going to just go through some of them now. This is, this is just a dude. This is just a dude. He was, he was posing Margaret with pebbles while she was on her way home. And he said, yes, Maggie, the witch woman, the Zulu woman, the Honolulu woman.

And he said, I'll split the, I'll split the Adam. I am the fifth dimension. I am the eighth wonder of the world. And he said, and he said, I am not evil. I could be if I wanted. You don't know what damage or harm I could do if I were roused. I could kill you all, but I won't. So it's crazy.

It was, it was pretty crazy. And of course it's like a very crazy story. So it spread around and not just on the Isle of Man. It actually like expanded through like the full UK as well. We already talked about Dr. Price and Dr. Fodor's investigations. There's also a bunch of news articles and interviews. There's even one reporter who said that he sat down and talked with Jeff himself. He did an interview with Jeff.

And after so much attention, after so much attention, James, James finally passed away like of natural causes. Nothing like, you know, Jeff related. He just died because he was old. But once that happened, Margaret and Vada moved away in like 1945-ish. Though Vada would maintain Jeff was real until her death in 2005. And her quote that she said about it in 2005 was like kind of creepy and kind of sad. She just said, she said, yes, there was a little animal who talked and did all those other things.

He said he was a mongoose and we should call him Jeff. But I do wish he had led us alone. There's the moral right there. Don't leave me alone. Yeah, but I should also point out that this guy, Mr. Graham, who is the guy who bought the actual farmhouse that they moved out of, did actually report unbidden that he killed a weird ass animal that looked like a weasel and that he thought might be Jeff.

So it wasn't a totally isolated, isn't it? He was like, yo, I actually did find this weird weasel on my property and I killed it. Jeff is just like about to introduce himself to like the new guy like, hey, I'm just like whacked over there. Just take some out. I'm from New Delhi, India. Just like whack, whack, whack. Yeah.

And so since then, the house was demolished. The Irvings have no living relatives anymore. And that's basically where it stopped for the most part. But the stories kind of always had fans. And in 2014, there was actually a symposium of experts on that was held, specifically for the Jeff case at the University of London Senate House Library to like determine what the fuck happened. And apparently what they found was that the case shares a lot of similarities

with tons of historic poltergeists who I didn't know this, but often they're known to appear in the shape of animals. And that that wasn't that specific of a case. It's actually a pretty like textbook, like old timey, like animal. You're telling me that this poltergeist was talking about like Adam splitting and like this poltergeist was very topical is what you're telling me. He picks up a lot of stuff on his bus rides. Yeah, his bus rides, man.

Such a fool. But obviously like there's also the hoax theory that it's just a hoax by the family or that Voda was like a vent. She got good at ventriloquism or something like that, which actually isn't crazy. There's sort of like a precedent for young kids that are like perpetuating a paranormal lie because it's getting them attention. Right.

And they like figured it out with like a human trick. There's like a famous girl who like she's still like knock ghosts by like cracking her toe. She like would be like knock three times that she'd like crack her toe. I don't like scare the shit out of people there. The one of the most famous poltergeists, the Enfield poltergeist. Well, there's a lot of unexplained shit that happened there. There were moments where they were like, that I think that's just her doing this because it's getting her

all kinds of attention in a very poor family. And one of the one of the paranormal investigators would hang out that she really saw as like a father figure because her dad wasn't in the picture. So she wanted to keep him around. So she would do she would do things on her own just to make sure he's like a kid acting out. Basically. Yeah. Yeah.

So that's like that's also not completely unheard of. Yeah, exactly. And in fact, considering that the hair samples ended up being dog hair and that the paw prints reportedly looked to be carved with a stick, one of one of these two things likely seems to be the case. But other things are still convincing to some. The question is still on the air according to the symposium of experts, whatever. There's a weird movie online about it that's like really like kind of like bizarrely shot

and it's experimental kind of it's mostly just straight on shots of Margaret and James. Actors acting as them. And it was kind of like it was kind of going to be like the Blair Witch kind of. But it was like the dude who made the screenplay for Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas. But nobody bought the story. So you just like shot this little like hour long passion project thing. It's called vanished. It's called vanished a video seance.

But I don't know. I don't know. What do you guys think? I think it's like somehow they like all convinced themselves that it was real. To and that's what I think. To paraphrase Captain James Tiberius Kirk. Oh hell yes. What does a poltergeist need with a bus?

That's all I'm going to say. That's all I'm going to say. There are things in there that make you think like. The fact that at the end, like you said, you just the paw prints look like they were done by a stick and the hair belonged to a dog. Makes you kind of question like, all right, what was actually going on? Also the girl was the only one it wanted to be with and like all those different things. There's a lot that doesn't make a lot of sense.

And the fact that and this goes back to every single time we have one of these stories. The fact that the family is like, yes, of course, we 100% were okay with it. It was annoying, but like it was fine. So you think so you think they were all in on it? No, I'm going to say yes, I'm going to say yes. I'm going to say even if the parents weren't willing like participants because they like would go along with this girl's fantasy, I think they no matter what everyone's involved, they have to be.

You think they're complicit at the very least. And I think that a lot of the times most of the reporters or the journalists that go and do things about hauntings and stuff like this are also complicit because they want the scoop and they want the book deal or they want, I think it's a lot of BS is what I think. But I think sometimes people get so adamant about something that like, you know, if they have status in a group like in a family or in like a company or something like that or like a church, you know, like, I feel like if that person is compromised and they're like sanity and they start to like be like, this is what the thing is, you know, like

they've already made their conclusion. Yeah. Well, I mean, I can just see it be like something that could really like there's if you believe this person, if you follow this person, if you're like, that's my dad or that's my teacher or that's my priest and they tell you something that's fucking insane, you know, it's I could see myself being like, I guess it's true since you said it. You know what I mean? Like I could see being susceptible to that, especially in the 30s when you're some people living in some like remote ass farmhouse somewhere, just having a mass delusion.

Yeah. That's what I think. But I also like to think that, you know, it just could be like a really smart mongoose. I would love it. Yeah. I would I would prefer if the story wasn't they were poltergeist that it wasn't any of that. So it was just a very smart mongoose. He was like a science experiment mongoose. No, he just was a mongoose who started learning. He likes to watch people. Yeah.

He's been alive for 85 years. And he serves whoever lives in the house until that neighbor beat him to death. Yeah, he's like a house off and he got beaten to death. He's like, how many rabbits do you want? Poor Jeff. Yeah. But speaking of mass delusions. Oh boy. I did tease at the beginning of this that I have another story for you guys.

So if if you'll have me, I think it's time to go back to Australia again for a quick mini story from 2016. I don't know how many it's actually going to be because it's looking at it now. It's actually a big a bigger story than I realized. But it's from 2016. It's about a family who unfortunately for everyone involved are called the trumps. Of course. Last name is Trump.

They are the trumps. There's Mark Trump. He's 51. His wife. I don't know how to say this either. Jacoba, Jacoba, Trump, 53 years old, 25 year old son, Mitchell Trump. There are two daughters, Ella Trump, who's 22, and Rihanna Trump, who's 29. Trump, Trump, Trump.

This version of events is from the Daily Mail. But I want to be I want to make I want to make it clear that this was like a very widely reported news story in Australia. You know, this is not like Batboy. This is like a thing that actually happened. There's interviews with the family. There's police accounts. I'm just going to go through the timeline of what happened.

It's pretty insane. You tell me what you think on Monday, August 29, 2016, the Trump family suddenly abandoned their red current farm in Victoria, Australia and drive off in their family station wagon. No credit cards, no cell phones. Everybody's just like, go, go, go, go, go. Get in the car, drive off. They drive towards Melbourne, like 20, 40 minutes. They realize Mitchell, the 25 year old son, he still has his phone.

Everybody's like, oh, shit. Like in pineapple express when they realize that they have the phone and they can be tracked. They freak out. They throw the fucking phone out the window. It's insanity in the car. They keep driving. They continue along this crazy journey. They're in Bathurst now.

That's fucking eight hours away by car. It's the next day. Mitchell gets scared. His family's just like lost their minds. And he just like pieces out from the family. He just like leaves when they stop somewhere and he tries to like take trains and buses home. But he has no money, but he just like dips out and he tries to go home. And the rest of the trumps just keep going for like another hour on the road.

Then they reach this place called the Genolan Caves, which are literally just like huge, beautiful caves. I don't know what they were doing. Maybe they thought they could like go hide in the caves. I don't know why they were going towards the caves, but that's where it happened. They keep going. By this point, Ellen and Rihanna, the daughters are also like really scared. And they get two hours further away to a place called Gulburn or Gulburn,

which now they're so far away from their house. They sneak away to call the police, try and get out, but they're still kind of paranoid and freaking out themselves separate from the family. So they steal a utility truck. So the daughters like themselves like separately steal a truck. Something happens along the way though. They end up separated. Ella stays in the truck trying to like drive home in the stolen truck.

But Rihanna is found in the back of some dude's car in Gulburn, just like catatonic, like Twin Peaks, just like totally stunned. So that's what's happening with the daughters. Everyone's in transit now. Everybody's like, this girl's over here in the catatonic state. This girl's like driving this stolen truck across the country. The son is like has no credit cards, no phone. He's trying to like find his way by bus and train home back home.

The mom and the dad are still like running some fucking place. It's fucking crazy. No money, no phones. They've been reported missing though now by their neighbors and the police are now starting to get involved. It's like insane. So that all happened in two days. Uh, but yeah, I know.

I'm just like, my mind is like, what, what the fuck? Yeah, I'm ready. I'm ready for the for the insanity. So Wednesday the 31st, Ella and Mitchell both get home. The police are there. Word is the family station wagon is back in Victoria with like around them in town. But a dude who officers assumed to be Mark flees the vehicle when they see him and escapes into a nearby park.

And he just like vanishes again. He's like gone. They're like, fuck, he's gone. And he's just like disappears. The suns. No, the dad Mark. He shows back up. They find him back in the hometown with the car

and he like pieces off into the bushes. Basically, it's like one of those cartoonish dive into the bushes and the cops like, well, he's gone. That's exactly what fucking happened. He just peaced out. He like got away. So that's Wednesday. This started on Monday.

That's what's happened by Wednesday on Thursday. Jacoba is found quite dazed and confused six hours away from Victoria in a place called the Yass. And she's taken to a hospital there and she's treated for like stress related illness. And eventually she gets transferred back to Gulburn to be with her daughter who was found in the car. So they're now both in hospital care, just both like extremely fucked up. And this is all verifiable, right?

Like this, this, this really happened. Yeah. Okay. Mark was finally found on Saturday. Two days later, September 3rd, wandering the streets two and a half hours away from Victoria by car at Wanga Rata Wengarata Airport and take it into custody in good health.

So that's Saturday. Okay. The following Tuesday, September 6th, Mark apologizes on public TV for wasting everybody's time does not reveal the cause of their insane trip. And by the following Monday, all charges against Ella Trump are dropped in the theft of the car. So that's where the mysteries left on the point of the like public version of this story.

There's been theories about psychoactive drugs. There's been theories like, you know, maybe they like all just like weirdly, you know, none of them are super young, right? Like Mitchell's like 25, Rihanna's 29, like maybe they all just like did acid is one theory that they all just like fucking freaked out. Another one is like a loan shark type situation, like financial troubles, like getting caught up with like cults, maybe there's all these different weird theories. But again, similar to the Jeff case, the prevailing theory among experts is just like

straight up shared delusions, which is where fatigue and fear and paranoia, like just like you just like are having a rough day. And this is the same thing. Like if you think if you've ever had and I'm everybody can kind of it's 2018, like we live in a crazy fucking time. Anybody can like identify with like being in that state of mind. It's the same state of mind that leads to you having like an anxiety attack, right? Like it's the same line of thought where stuff just like the world change like reality changes.

It seems unbearable. There's something wrong, right? And it can cause you to become like emotionally unstable and have like a break from reality with people. And actually there's a, there's a sociologist, a medical sociologist called Robert Bartholomew who here's a quote from him on this case who says, it is within this context that a car backfiring may be perceived as a gunshot or wrestling in the bushes is mistaken for a monster or a hostile gang member. So if you imagine like maybe the dad going insane and thinking like something's chasing him

or something's following him, he's having like an anxiety attack, some sort of crisis. And then the family is just like, what do you mean? He's like, we have to get in the car. Don't get your phone. This shit's going to be crazy. Like, you know, I don't know, like if you don't have your phone, if you don't have access to the internet, like how long is it going to take for you to be able to realize that what's happening isn't real?

And I guess maybe, yeah. I mean, it would explain the dad trying to ditch the cops as soon as he saw them, if he thought he was being trailed or followed or something along those lines. Yeah, the phone thing is, is definitely like a movie giveaway that it's something where you think, I think that's like too much of a cliche. Yeah, but I'm not saying that it's, it was a planned thing. What I'm saying is to me, it seems like the overreaction of a person who is freaking out, but the freak out is something that like, oh, we got to get rid of the phones.

Like no phones. We get rid of stuff because in reality, people can track you through a million different ways. Phones are just like the easy movie cliche version. Yeah. So like in his paranoid state, he just grabbed onto what he knew. Right, right. Like he freaked out and was trying to, because that seems like a government thing.

Like, oh, they are tracking us through the phones. Yeah. It's like I would never think to put on a tin foil hat unless I saw a conspiracy theorist in a movie put one on kind of thing. Right. Absolutely. Yeah. Like they're trained to believe that.

But speaking of that, as it turns out, the Trumps are not the first disappearing family in Australia. Because in 1988, there was a family called the Knowles family that fled together, like all piled into the car, same kind of thing. Similar like fatigue, stress, like sort of emotional crisis. But while the Trumps, when they, when they were interviewed, the Trump said, they thought they were being followed. That's one thing that they said. And they said it was a quote family matter.

Right. Which they didn't let on. I think eventually like, I don't know how true the story is. I was still reading articles about it and they were saying like, the daughter or somebody was like, no, no. Our dad just like had a breakdown and we didn't know what to do. What he really meant is that he discovered that there was a sale on the family matter is complete season that he really wanted to get and it was only in America.

He had to get here. He had to get here and you can't have your phone. Carl Winslow, man. Yeah. He's worth, he's worth running for. It's true. But basically, so the Trumps like kept it to themselves what happened. But the Knowles family from the 80s came out and said they were stalked by a UFO

that they saw above Noel Arbor and many, yes. Yeah. Yeah. Many people online draw a lot of parallels to that story. And if you go deep into the Knowles story, this is one of those stories where if you go into it, there's a lot of different people who are loved to like scream about this story in the comment section and stuff. But the story of the Knowles family involves

like they saw this ship over Noel Arbor and then it almost like saw that it saw them and like began following them and like shining lights on them and almost abducting them, right? Like they were saying like we almost got abducted. They were saying like this thing swooped down and like attached to their car and like started to take their car and they like fell off of it and stuff. But the thing that's crazy about that story is that in addition to there being reports of a UFO, other eyewitnesses report seeing like a crazy Blackhawk style helicopter that was going around in that area that had a winch on it that could have maybe picked a car up off the street.

So even if it wasn't fucking aliens, you know what I mean? Just some government, maybe some governmental stuff going on. At the very least it was, yeah, it was this fucking helicopter that just like swooped down to try and like pick some dude up off the road. So I don't know what the, I don't know what the Trump family saw, but if they're being mum about it, you know, it could be family delusion or it could be, you know, that they witnessed something that is beyond what is comprehensible by humans. And in that way, I feel like they're really similar to the to the Irving family.

You know, either it's totally fake or it's something so weird and unbelievable that we never, we never could ever imagine it like a mongoose that can hear really well and rides on the bus. I would never be like, I'm going to make up a ghost story to tell the press, you know, let me make it this story about this mongoose. You've literally got me looking up 1988 helicopters right now to figure out what this could be and if it would be in Australia at the time. I really, I really recommend looking into the Knowles case because I was trying to like get like a beat by beat account. I was trying to decide whether I wanted to do the Trump one or the Knowles one. And like the Trump one is very well documented because it's

from 2016. Right. You can verify a lot of the stuff. Yeah. There's a lot of stuff going on with like the cops. There's a lot of like accessibility there. The Knowles story. The reason I didn't do it is because there's so many different accounts of it. And one of them is like in the comment section of an article about the Trumps, somebody was like, don't believe this. Here's what happened. It's like a breakdown of what happened, but it's just like some dude in the comment section versus like no profile picture versus like the people themselves who are just like, we were driving along the road. We saw UFO try to pick us up maybe, but like even the quotes from the family are not verified across all the same sources. So right. I figured the Knowles family one would be better,

but I mean the Trump family will be better, but I definitely think that these are freakouts. Like freakouts with a family. Are humans capable of this though? Does this, have you, have you ever seen anything that leads you to believe that you could be like this mongoose? Yes. Oh, humans are definitely capable of being bizarre and out there and losing their mind. Yeah. I mean, like just personal experience. I have family that suffers from a lot of mental health issues and some of the stuff I have seen or heard them say they've seen put it this way. I have somebody who I visited in a mental hospital years ago and she told me that, you know, that earlier that day she saw a little monkey wearing a hat, riding a donkey, clapping a bunch of tambourines together.

Hear me out. It's possible. Hear me out. Maybe there was a little Spanish animal. You were that monkey. Hear me out. I was there. I was that monkey. No, I was riding the donkey. I think the human mind is both capable of many great things and also like completely breaking down. And remember reality is what your mind perceives, right? Like everything, everybody's reality is different. Everything that you see, you have no idea what other people see. Like you, you'll never know. You'll never know how other people view the world. We just all like share things. And that's like, we have a culture of like, oh, we all expressed ourselves and we kind of come to an estimation of what a thing is, but you're,

it's that 14 year old mind blow of like, your red might not be my red. No, my God. What does that mean? Like women see an extra shade of color than men. Like that's just a fact. Like there's, there's, there's things that, you know, with all the senses that go into your brain, that like, if your brain doesn't perceive things correctly, if there's a malfunction of the wiring of your brain, you can see shit and believe shit to be real. And that's just the way things work. So it's quite possible that this is all just in their head. What's the craziest thing that you've ever unquench questioningly? What's the like craziest thing you've ever like, just like, without question believed it?

Oh, I believed it until I walked up to it. I woke up, it was like, one of those like, I woke up in the early in the morning or like when the sun was still coming up. And I many, for multiple days in a row, and I believe it was stress related, I saw gigantic spiders crawling on my ceiling and my wall. And it was horrifying. And I was hiding and I was screaming until I had to like build up enough confidence to wait, to get up, walk over to the spiders and be like, they're not real, Mike. They're not real. And like have to touch them. And then just, they weren't there. And then they eventually they would just disappear. I've never, I've never had anything. It was awful. Crazy, like,

where it affected my reality like that. I've definitely had the whole like, out of the corner of my eye, see a thing or whatever. But I'd always be like, okay, I'm going to go look and there's nothing there. And so I'm like, all right, well, if the monster out of the corner of my eye didn't get me by this point, that is not going to get me. But I definitely have had friends or had people experience things that I'll never forget as long as I live. My friend Steve got high on something. I don't know what it was. It was back in high school. And he swears this day. He was in the passenger seat of the car. And he's like, Oh my God, check out that woman. She's beautiful. There was nobody there. There was no one there. And he's

like the woman in the red dress with the blonde hair. I'm like, we're not in the major. There's no one there, dude. And he's like, Oh my God. And he like, tried to get out and go talk to her. I was like, there's no one there. Like I like he lost his mind. Someone's so beautiful. She wasn't there, man. That's what I'm saying. Yeah. I mean, well, I mean, what I meant was more like, for me, like when I was young, you know, as you go, as you go through life, you pick up a couple friends along the way who are just like fucking liars, you know, and they'll just say, they'll just say shit that you don't think about. Like when you're a kid, you don't have the context of like, Oh yeah, that's obviously not possible. So like, you know, my dad was like, my dad works

there. My dad does this. And that's why I know like that kind of stuff Pokemon are real in Japan and you can buy them only in Japan. And they're real animals there. Like as a kid, I'm like, Oh, wow. Yeah, of course. I want to get that right. You know what I mean? Yeah. I totally know what you're talking about. There's this one. I don't I might have told it on this podcast before, but there was this time where I like left a party. I was not hammered. I was like, you know, I had been at a party for a couple hours. I had done some drinking earlier. I had like come down from my drinking. I was like, responsibly ready to leave at an early time because I had work in the morning. I got down into my car. I sat there and I looked up and then

up the street, I saw like a monster perched on the fence and I was sitting there staring at it for like 25 minutes, just trying to like put together what I was looking at. It was like this like leafy monster. And I eventually had to call my friend to come look at it to like verify that I was seeing it. And they were like, Oh my God, yeah, there it fucking is. It's right fucking there. And we like both were like, what do we do? How do we deal with this? And we just both like slowly open the door and just like walked out like like up the street and then we're like, Oh, it's a tree. It's a fucking tree. Yeah, it's a fucking tree. Let's wrap it up. But here's the thing. I think people suffer from shared delusions. And I think the idea that because you saw it and

you were so passionate about like you felt fear when your friends saw it. That's what he saw because he was his body. It's if someone believes my body language. Yeah. If someone's like, Oh, look at that cloud. That's a snake because you say it's a snake. People are most likely gonna be like, Oh, I'm going to look for the snake rather than I'm going to see the clouds and determine what it is for myself. And so I feel like that's the thing that happens a lot too. You prime the brain. Like when somebody's like, Look, there's a mongoose over there that speaks in English. You're like not looking for nothing or something impossible. A mongoose who speaks English. Who rides the bus to find out secrets. I love that story so much. I love the part that he just

is like, I'm incredibly powerful, but I choose not to do it. And then he gets beat to death by the next guy who lives there. So powerful. He probably just wasn't ready, but probably caught him slipping. He was busy snooping on someone else. This guy was like, Oh, you're snooping on me guys. Black dead Jeff was Jeff was resting on his fucking laurels. That farmer just came around with his fucking, you know, like, what are the guys from the fantastic Mr. Fox bogus Bunsen bean, you know, those guys, the evil farmers. It was one of those guys who's just like, Oh, fuck you. I ain't so great anymore. But there you go. That's an Alex episode, the story of Jeff and the story of the Trump family.

I love Alex episode. Man, I even like come at you guys with some with like some real spooky stuff. Jesse, the subreddit said, when are we going to get a Jesse led episode? Man, I'm gonna come at you with some real twisted stuff. Unprovable fdub stuff. I'm going to find it. I'm going to find it. Do it. I want it. I'm looking for that story that we're all in agreeance on is real. I'm still, I'm still chasing that dragon. I didn't think Jeff was going to be the one that convinced us. I didn't think that was going to be the one, but it was super fun. Yeah. I didn't think that was going to be the one that made us all believe it was real. But come on, dudes, talking fucking mongoose that snitch that strangles 50 rabbits by hand with its, with its front paws, with its

little front paws, which could be, now that you talk about like it might have been the little girl, maybe the little girl was like going through some like serial killer like tendencies. Like serial killers tend to start with mutilating animals as kids. Yeah. She's just strangling rabbits and stuff and threatening the chicken and stuff. Maybe the parents are like, it's fine, it's Jeff. It's definitely Jeff. It's absolutely 100% undeniably Jeff and not our daughter as they watch the daughter like squeeze the life from a rabbit before their eyes. She's like, Jeff is doing it. It's Jeff. That's doing it. The ventriloquist theory was like kind of like one of the bigger ones. Like I feel like a lot of people out there want that to be the one because

it explains so much of it, but I don't, how can I just, it seems so unbelievable to me that a 12 year old could like outsmart both their parents. I don't know, man. Just from some of the stories that I've read of like what, what kids are capable of as long as they like, they find ways to keep attention on the them. Kids will do a lot of stuff. Yeah. If you don't have video games, there's like a lot more free time. Right. And video games stopped all that crazy. Yeah. You know what? There should be a study that's like looks into like the rise of home gaming versus like like poltergeist activity and see if there's a correlation because I bet you there is. I feel I feel like it's a lot more like, mom, Johnny Fortnight is in my room and they're like, okay,

son. Sure. Johnny Fortnight. No, the guy from Fortnight. He's flossing his asshole in my room or whatever they do. Yeah. Yeah. He's teabagging me when I sleep, mom. Yep. He lives in the walls. Dude, I was just listening to my favorite murder and they had a story about this guy who was like living. He like asked this girl out on a date and he was like, she was like, no, you're weird because he was like kind of like serial killer. And then their mom died and of like cancer or something. And then they started hearing like all this weird tapping in their house. And there was like messages written in blood on the walls of like, I'll be back. I'm here. Your mother is here. Get out of the house like weird shit like that. I'm coming for you. I'm here for you.

And the dad thought that the kids were acting out because they were sad that he wasn't paying attention to them because he had to work so much because the mom died. But actually what happened was finally they got a message that was like, I'm in the house with you. And they were like, ah, and they went to the neighbors one last time and the neighbor was like, dude, you need to fucking come back here because these kids are not faking it. These kids are like scared as fuck. And he went into the house to see what the deal was. And there was a dude standing in his wife's bedroom in his wife's wedding dress with a wig on and a fucking hatchet and paint on his face. And it was the dude who his daughter dumped. Jesus Christ. And he'd been living and he'd

been living in the walls for months. Oh, it's like that movie. Yeah. And then he killed another two people by drowning them all in bathtubs in their house. Like a little bit later because he got out on bail. That sounds like a whole episode we could go down about this guy. It's fucking crazy. It's like a serial killer. It like just happened on my favorite murder. So I don't want to like go into it. But yeah, it'd be true. Yeah. Yeah. But it was just fucking crazy because it was like something in the walls, but it really was there. It was really a dude in the walls. God damn. Yeah. That that that that's my worst nightmare. Never mind a talking goose. It's just there's a man in my walls that just wants to kill me. Great. Yeah. I don't know. A mongoose is pretty

scary. Yeah. But if the farmer could just bash the mongoose in with a shovel, he was all talk. All right. He's right. He's literally all talk. He was all just talking. That was it. I feel it. Well, thanks for the fucking great story, Alex. Thanks. I was trying to take it to Wackytown. You know how it is. You took it to Wackytown, but there was enough like factual evidence there that it wasn't like, oh, we can just Google it and disprove it. Like it actually happened. Both of those things. Yeah, those things are both verifiable. They happened in newspapers. They happened in police reports. There's a real book about the Jeff Goose. The Jeff Goose. The old Jeff Goose. Guys, buy the shirt. Yeah. Yes. Buy the shirt. We've sold a lot, man. We have

a lot of people out there with our shirts now, which is great. Check that out. I actually regularly wear my shirt. Is that weird? It's comfortable. Yeah. Is it weird to wear my own show shirt? Like no, man. That's how these things get get out there. Word of mouth. Word of mouth. I never want somebody to ask me what Shalu Minati is and then have to be like, it's my own podcast. You know what I mean? No, just be like, it's a podcast. Yeah. And then they're going to see me again and be like, are you in the podcast? I'm going to be like, yeah. Why didn't you tell me that before? I'm going to be like, because I hate myself and I never want to talk to you again. No way, man. People love this podcast and we fucking love doing it. Yeah, it feels good, man.

So as a preview for the next lead episode that I'm working on, we're going back into the world aliens. So that'll be the next one. I'm so ready. We're going to talk a little bit about the theories why aliens abduct humans and what are the potential benefits of them doing so and why they care at all about us. So that look forward to that in the next couple of weeks. But thank you guys so much for listening. Jesse, thanks for believing parts of it. No, I believe none of this. This was all lies. The Trumps. The Trumps is real. You got to believe the Trumps. I believe that they had the dad freaked out and took the entire family with him and they all at different points in time had the courage to be like, my dad has gone insane.

Yeah, I believe that. What do you think about the helicopters? I think that's all BS. It's all added later stuff. No, that's real. What's the preview for the next Jesse episode? What is Jesse going to? Well, Jesse's first live episode is going to be a big one. I don't know. I want to do something that is real, but also like really bizarre. What's that one manuscript thing? That's like the Voynich manuscript. Yeah, like that's super cool. Yeah. Are those pipes in the Chinese mountain? Like something that is real, but no one understands why. But the answer is probably like, you know, drugs. Drugs. I mean, I think that's the answer. But you know, something interesting. Yeah, there's got to be something. The preview for the Jesse episode is that he spoils the

episode and the preview are all high. Just before we start. So you understand everybody was on. Yeah, this is not true. I'm lying right now as I tell this. Let's go. All right. Well, thank you guys so much for listening. As always, if you want to get in contact with us, there's the Chiluminati pod Twitter and the Chiluminati pod subreddit. And then specifically, if you want to reach each one of us individually, I myself and at Mathis Games, Jesse's at Jesse Cox and Alex at Fossiana A. We are pretty active over on Twitter constantly. Get Chiluminated. Get Chil... That's not going to catch. That's just... You tried. Get Chiluminated. You tried. Everything is Chiluminated.

You tried. And then if you want, you can always review us over on iTunes. We're almost at 500 five star reviews. So fucking cross that cross that line. I thought we crossed the threshold already. Is that true? We crossed for what? We crossed 400 and something. Oh, really? Let me double check. So when does it when does it start putting us on the best of lists or whatever? I have no fucking idea. I know there's some kind of milestone there, right? There must be. I imagine that there's there's like an inbuilt Apple thing that you have to cross before you worry. Yeah, we're 445 five star reviews right now. Yeah. So people like it. We love doing it for you. And again, check out our merch over at the Yeti.com. We're going to have

some new merch popping up over there very, very soon and some just stickers and stuff if you want to decorate your phones or your laptops or just slap it on your forehead. I'm cool with that too. It's like the cheap version of the hat. But we'll be back in a couple of weeks or so with a if not a Jesse let episode, a Mathis let episode. We'll see you guys next time. Bye bye. Bye. Another pointless video call where nothing gets done. I think you're on mute, David. Sorry, what did I miss? IT just approved Miro for the whole company. Miro, that's the online whiteboard for team collaboration. We can make these long video meetings so much shorter with Miro boards. We can share ideas, feedback and updates on them whenever actually see what we're

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