Chilluminati Podcast - Episode 159 - The Assassination of JFK Part 2 - Hard for JFK

Episode Date: July 2, 2022

Muddying the waters Patreon - http://www.patreon.com/chilluminatipod BUY OUR MERCH - http://www.theyetee.com/collections/chilluminati Special thanks to our sponsors this episode ButcherBox - http://www.butcherbox.com/chill Promo Code: Chill Jesse Cox - http://www.youtube.com/jessecox Alex Faciane - http://www.youtube.com/user/superbeardbros Art Commissioned by - http://www.mollyheadycarroll.com Theme - Matt Proft End song - POWER FAILURE - https://soundcloud.com/powerfailure Video - http://www.twitter.com/digitalmuppet

Bring the flavor to any fiesta with new Modelo Celada Sandia Picante, a mix of authentic Mexican beer, vibrant watermelon flavor, and a hint of chile. Modelo Celada Sandia Picante, bite for bold flavors, bite for authenticity. Drink responsibly, Modelo Celada Flavor Beers imported by Crown and puts Chicago Illinois. Hello everybody and welcome back to Chiluminati Podcast, episode 158 or 9. It's one of the other. Nine. As always, I am one of your hosts, Mike Martin, joined by the Stan Laurel and Oliver Hardy of LA. Alex and Jesse, hello. Who's in LA? Alex and Jesse, the Stan Laurel and Oliver Hardy of LA? No, who's in LA?

I get the bit, but I'm trying to figure out how to respond. Yeah, that's what I'm trying to figure out. I just, I couldn't figure it. Welcome back everybody. It's who and what are in LA? Third face. Just like we're doing on this, we'll figure it out. It's a little workshop it. Yeah, third base though, you know? I like this. I'm like, I know those two. I know who those are. Who's in Los Angeles, that classic bit? No, but who's on third base? Yeah, Shirley. Don't call me Shirley. Anyway, RIP that guy. Yeah.

Who? What? Guys, welcome back to part two of JFK episode one. This is the second part of the first episode on JFK. You know, man, for my, for our own show's growth's sake, I have to unfortunately label this part two and not part one, part two. Okay, but whatever it is arose by any other name, this is part two of episode one of JFK. If you know, if you know the insider lore, okay? Last time we ended with some nonsense about some rock or something. I don't know. I don't know what Jesse was talking about there at the end of the episode. But before we get into anything at all, first, I wanted to start us off with some words from President John F. Kennedy himself from Mathis. If you wouldn't mind just reading

these words. Oh my God, we're diving right in. Just dive right in. Yeah, go ahead. I'm not ready for this. All right, here we go. I got it. What's it? Give me, help me, boys. I'm not doing it properly. Just do it like this. You have to talk like this. All right, I'll go with that. That works. This is my message to the American people. This presidency, this administration, this opportunity to represent the values of our entire great nation. I owe it all to an old greenstone. Wizards are real. Yes, it's true. And that's my website, patreon.com slash jlumenati.pod. Not only can you get free episodes. You suck. Can I, do I need to do this? No, it sucks. Here we go. This is garbage. Why'd you have this? Here we go. And that's my website,

patreon.com slash jlumenati.pod. Not only can you get ad free episodes behind the scenes, content and a giant playlist of exclusive minisodes, but also monthly digital posters, free monthly ish merch in our newest show, Rotten Popcorn. We do live, watch along of weird movies. My name is John Fitzgerald Kennedy. I'm a ghost and I approve this message. Why do you have that? That was incredible. Oh man, they were right. John, JFK is still alive. He's coming back. He's going to arrive on the capital here. Yeah. I thought recently there was also the belief that JFK was about to arrive too. Anything's possible now. Spoilers. Spoilers. We're going to talk about it in the minisodes,

so get ready, baby. I feel the need to go to patreon.com slash jlumenati.pod now, though. The president told you to. The president told me to. Look at that. You got, we just did a Rotten Popcorn on a documentary about an alien encounter. None, all three of us had never heard of. And it took twists and turns that I was not expecting. Maybe feel things for some inside myself. I felt feelings. Oh, it made me feel things too. Yeah. Yeah. Jesse loved it. He said, I loved that. He actually came out the other and saying, I'm a believer. Oh, I came out the other end. All right. He said, thank you so much for showing me this wonderful film.

Was it seeing Jacques Vallée on camera that just made you rock hard? You know what? Jacques Vallée is interesting. I'll give him that. That is a G. Yeah. I like Jacques Vallée a lot. Yeah. He's a cool dude. But you know, I don't think there's any Jacques Vallée cross-conspiracy into JFK, unfortunately. Well, we'll see. But yeah, last time we were here, we were working our way through Jesse Ventura's book. They killed our president 63 reasons to believe there was a conspiracy to assassinate JFK, which, again, is not a great book, but rather a useful one for the way I wanted to structure this series. I left off talking about whether or not it was actually plausible

based off the evidence that, one, a single person could have actually carried out this assassination with a poorly configured carcano bolt action rifle from the sixth floor window of the Texas School Book Depository Building. And two, that that person could have possibly been Lee Harvey Oswald, based on the testimony of various people who saw him at various stages, various stages of eating lunch that day in the moments before and after the shooting took place. Most people, of course, will tell you that, yes, both are not, well, both are not only possible, but likely. And again, I'm just laying out the inconsistencies, not saying whether or not I believe any of this stuff is convincing evidence on its own that comes later in my JFK theory episode,

which I'll do later. For now, this is all about fleshing out the various big reasons why people see this thing as so frustrating and so mysterious. And I hope that by the end of episode one, that you at least feel like maybe it's possible that there is more at play here than what people will have you believe. Also, again, this disclaimer, John F. Kennedy was a real person and his assassination was a real act of violence. Therefore, we're going to be discussing some seriously disturbing imagery and subject matter throughout the course of this series. This was the high profile murder of a sitting U.S. president. Videos and pictures you Google after listening to this may disturb you, so proceed with caution. It also happens to be one of the most notorious

moments in world history and therefore extremely ingrained into our national culture at all levels. And so sometimes it is easy to forget that it really happened. And I'm sure that at some point during this, one, two, or all three of us are going to be flippant about this in ways we haven't been about other murders on the show. So let me apologize for that in advance. And after the fact, for things that I've certainly already done. Also, please remember that until the very end, I'm going to be reporting on what other people think happened today. I said that already. If you don't like what you hear, don't shoot the messenger, at least until the end when I tell you what I really think. And finally, even though I promise I'm going to try and do this to the best

of my ability, I'm not an expert, I'm just an internet comedian. So I'm probably just going to make some mistakes, maybe even some egregious ones. So again, just let me apologize for that in advance. And now without further ado, let's get the show on the road. Internet comedian is such a phrase. Oh, I'm an internet comedian. No, you can't play. He puts it out there. He's immune now. He's immune to all all criticism. And listen, if you watch the video of JFK's brains getting blown out and it turns you on, call a doctor immediately. Why would that be where you would go? He's always listen. You never know who's listening out there, man. We have worldwide

reach, you know, we got to make sure that there might be somebody out there who's like actually rock hard. I'm a huge fan of internet comedians and murder. Both turn me on. He's got to hit that. He's got to hit that level. He's just got to test the boundaries real quick. The standards. I don't like that. I don't like the idea that that's our fan base. That's where he's on. Testing the boundaries of moral decency. That's us, man. Listen, if our numbers are anything to go by whenever we talk about murdering people, more people tune in. Boom, boom, boom. I don't know about that. There's always the one guy that's like, you need help, all of you. Oh yeah. There's always that one guy. We're on the same page. You don't want to kill anybody.

I just want to be murdered by an alien's dick. What? It's what? He's on fire today. Did you say that? Just to like upset? It's wild. Destroy me, daddy. Destroy. I don't have a kid somewhere listening to this. I want you to know that. That's unfortunate because this is marked as 18 and up. No, I can't believe it. Listen to this. And he's out of control. You said you wanted an alien to murder you with that. First off, how dare you put it on the alien that it has to have a dick? That's rude. Fair enough. Fair enough. Yeah. It's intergalactic. Planetary. All right. So just slamming on one of the planetary machines and milk me till I'm dry. Like I don't know. Do whatever you want. I don't care. Oh shit. Alex put on his glasses. It's time

to start 16 and 17. The other rifle. Yeah, exactly. Since the beginning, I've been talking about the 6.5 carcano rifle, which was used to assassinate the president because a 6.5 carcano rifle was almost definitely found at the scene. And it was one that was the property of Lee Harvey Oswald. So it all kind of makes sense, right? But there has also been enough confusion around the make of this weapon that I feel it is absolutely worth discussing. So let's start with the fact that initially the police who discovered the rifle, one of whom was very knowledgeable about guns because he used to own a sporting goods store, came to the consensus that it actually was a 7.65 millimeter Mauser rifle that was found instead. In fact, here is a quote from the second of two

reports, police reports from Deputy Sheriff Eugene Boone, in which he makes that determinations for Jesse to read. Here we go. Do you feel like you need more adventure in your life? You're probably right. At MotorSportsland RV Centers, we've been helping people just like you experience outdoor adventures for over 55 years. You might be looking to visit the many national parks around Utah or travel the country. You might need a hunting lodge or just an easy way to stay on that piece of property you own. Whatever your needs are, we're here to help. Come visit a MotorSportsland RV Center or motorsportsland.com today and let MotorSportsland help you get away. In the northwest corner of the building, approximately three, three feet from the

east wall, there are well and on the row of cases books, I saw the rifle would appear to be a 7.65 millimeter Mauser with a telescopic sight. The rifle had what appeared to be a brownish black stock and blue steel metal parts. Right. Now, normally this is exactly the type of thing you'd chalk up to something as simple as the fact that both of these rifles, the Garkano and the Mauser would have been recognized by anyone of that era as rifles of enemy combatants that they might have fought in World War II. And it's possible that they just referred to all the style of rifle as Mausers in the same way that we call tissues, Kleenex, or we call search engines Google, or maybe they were just all totally mistaken or talking out of their asses could be true also.

But just so we're totally clear about how weird it was that this gun was switched from Mauser to a Garkano in subsequent reports. Here is a quote from Deputy Sheriff Robert Craig, who was also in the room that day for Mathis to read. Here we go. Whoa. All right. Here we go. I believe I believe day. Lieutenant Carl Day, who was in charge of the Dallas Police Crime Lab pulled the rifle out and handed it to Captain Fritz, who held it up by the strap and asked if anyone knew what kind of rifle it was. By that time, Deputy Constable, Deputy Constable Seymour Weitzman had joined us. Weitzman was a gun buff. He had a sporting good store at one time and he was very good with weapons

and he said it looked like a Mauser and he walked over to Fritz and Captain Fritz was holding the rifle up in the air and I was standing next to Weitzman, who was standing next to Fritz. And we were no more than six to eight inches from the rifle and stamped right on the barrel of the rifle was quote 765 Mauser. And that's when Weitzman said it is a Mauser and pointed to the 765 Mauser stamp on the barrel. So that's not just like somebody conflating two rifles in their head, right? That's like that's a Mauser. And if that's not enough evidence for you, here's a clip of the sheriff saying that on video matching up to real footage of them looking at it. So you can really see it if you want. And I'm interested in what you guys think about that. What do you think is

happening here? You know what? No, this is the perfect video. The link we were just sent is to the BTO classic Bachman Turner overdrive taking care of business, which by the way, hilarious, but absolutely not what I think you're supposed to be sending us. Taking care of business. I don't know why that I hope that didn't happen for all these. I want to let you know I'm so glad in care of business. That sounds great. It's a devil to fucking with your files, dude.

Well, you're going to just have to take my word for it. This opens it up to conspiracy, even more so. They're messing with your own stories. So granted, Deputy Sheriff Craig also had a few other weird things. Imagine all of this is being said with the backdrop of taking care of business. I promise that there is a video of this out there, but Deputy Sheriff Craig also had a few other weird things he coincidentally saw that ran counter to the official story. He was eventually fired from the sheriff's office before getting in a really bad car accident, getting shot in the shoulder, having his depression deepened by painkillers and then left

by his wife. So it's kind of hard to tell what his motivation may have been to share this information. He was also found dead of a point blank gunshot wound to the chest in 1975. And while it was almost certainly self-inflicted, there is a lightly discussed possibility on the Internet of him being silenced for speaking the truth. Is that true? I have no idea. Obviously, Mathis can tell you how frustrating it is to believe extreme things and have people conflate you with the other crazy people who believe those things. Well, because there's unfortunately a fine line between the same crazies and the crazy crazies. I know. Exactly right. So that's, you know, it could be that that we're looking at here. Who knows?

Jesse, one day you'll be on my side, I promise. Who knows if it's even crazy crazy crazies? Which one are you? Same crazies. I'm a same crazy Jesse. We'll let the listeners decide that. Also, to muddy the waters even further, Frank Ellsworth, who was an agent of the Department of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms, heard about the shooting from his office. That sounds like a place where you confiscate everything you could ever want and you are just lit and loaded all day. That's kind of the vibe. Every day, taking care of business. That's kind of the vibe. You just keep it in a room and don't

use it. He heard about the shooting from his office down the way, ran over to check out the scene. And when he got there, he said that cartridges were found on the sixth floor of the depository, but that the rifle was actually found on the fourth floor and that it wasn't until later, and that's talking about the Mauser rifle, and that it wasn't until later, like after 1.30, which by the way, the shooting happened at 12.30. So this is much later when they did a second search where he was actually there helping out searching himself that they found the carcano. So he was there for two guns, which is crazy. And then there was this very specific sounding quote from an NBC Dallas Fort Worth news reporter called Tom Whalen, which I'll have Jesse read

for you now. It was also reprinted in an official NBC book that was called There Was a President about this. So that's this quote here. All right. You get up every morning from your alarm clocks warning, take the 815 to the city. There's a whistle above and people pushing people shoving. Alex, I don't think this is. What's happening right there? Actually, what it really says is the weapon which was used to kill the president in which wounded Governor Connolly has been found in the Texas School Book Depository at the sixth floor on the sixth floor. British 303 rifle with a telescopic lens, three empty cartridge cases were found beside the weapon. It appears that whoever had occupied the sniper's nest had

been here for some time. So yeah, people make mistakes for sure. But also some very specific things were said by very specific people based on very specific facts, which makes it seem at least possible that even if Oswald did fire shots that day with a carcano rifle, there may have been at least one other gun there for some reason, which would be a really suspicious fact of it proved true. But is it really is a what another another right? It's just another type of rifle. Yeah. Okay. They're both like I said, they're both rifles that were used against American soldiers in World War Two. So they would kind of have an idea of what they are. Did we talk about last week? Did we talk about Oswald shooting a cop in the face with a pistol after he left the bookstore?

We did not. After he left the bookstore? Yeah. Yeah. Oswald shot a fucking cop in the face after like the assassination hit. Oh, yes. We're going to get to that today. Okay. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Because that's even if the man didn't just fucking kill JFK, he certainly shot a cop in the head. Well, let's talk about we'll talk about that later. We'll talk about that later. Talk about that. And is it really well established that he was there at all? It's another question. Apparently, there was a partial print off the left trigger housing of this gun that matched Oswald on three points of identity. But even the courts with the lowest requirements require six points of identity, and many require up to 12 points of identity before

you can even legally describe it as a match. And the only other print on the weapon, a partial prompt print came from a piece of the gun, which was only visible when the gun was taken apart. So those are the only prints that were on the gun. Another thing that's especially creepy when considered after that last fact is that on November 24, just two days after the assassination, while the very recently killed Lee Harvey Oswald was being stored at a local morgue, we know from a blurb in the next morning's newspaper that a team of FBI agents came by to see the body that evening once the crowded died down. Oswald's funeral director, Paul Grooty, who happened to be there at the time, reported that they were there to take fingerprints,

even though they would have had plenty of those on file by that point, since he'd been there live at the police station the previous day. And by one account, according to Governor Ventura's sources, they were even said to have had the rifle on hand and said they were using it to make some sort of comparison. So who the fuck knows what was going on. And while Oswald had a positive paraffin test on his hands, which confirmed he was maybe recently in contact with a firearm, but maybe also that he just got P on his hands or fingerprinting it from the police station on his hands, he also definitely tested negative in the paraffin test on his cheek, which is a very hard test to fail if you've recently discharged a rifle against your cheek, especially if you're

holding it nice and tight to make a world class like marksman shot from a window, you know, we've already we've already talked about that. So is Oswald a super fishy dude? Yes. Does he seem like he would be a weird guy in real life? Absolutely he does. Is he the type of person you would imagine would shoot a gun at the president? Probably. But if he did this all by himself, why is it so hard to place him in all these different places? And if he didn't do it alone, what was he getting himself involved with that he was in like on the board at all? You know what I mean? So one big theory, and this is now we're moving into 18 and 19, which is called Agent Oswald, one big theory, which according to this book has been corroborated by two

special ops CIA people, has something to do with a supposed false defector program being run by the CIA and the Office of Naval Intelligence out of Nag's head, North Carolina. And apparently, one of these CIA guys is a very extreme dude called William Robert, aka Tosh Plumlee. What is his name is Tosh Plumlee. I'm looking at Tosh Plumlee. Yeah, he's supposed to be this badass secret agent pilot who like flew all these missions and he was maybe also the whistle blower in the Iran Contra affair. And to justify all these claims and to show this guy's really who he says he is, he points to a letter from 1991 that Senator Gary Harry wrote. Gary Hart wrote, sorry, I don't know why it says Gary Harry, somebody, BTOs back in my maybe Gary was Harry, Gary

Harry Hart, Gary Hart wrote to Senator John Kerry, he wrote a letter to John Kerry. I'll have Mathis read an edited version of that letter right now. It's a little bit chunky, but I'm proud of myself for finding this letter, because the link cited in the ebook is broken. And honestly, it paints a pretty interesting picture of what kind of things might have been going on behind the scenes in the government back then. So I'm going to try and drop this in the, no, it's too big for Slack or to zoom. Yeah, it's in Twitter for you. All right, here we go. Dear Senator Kerry, the following information is provided at the request of Mr. Tosh Plumlee and is to document specific contacts he made with my Senate office during the years of 1983 through 1985. In March

of 1983, Plumlee contacted my Denver Senate office and met with Bill, Mr. Bill Holland of my Senate staff. During the initial meeting, Mr. Plumlee raised certain allegations concerning US foreign and military policy toward Nicaragua and the use of covert activities by US intelligence agencies. And yeah, we skip a little bit here and then we go to Mr. Plumlee raised several issues, including the covert that covert US intelligence agencies were directly involved in the smuggling and distribution of drugs to raise funds for covert military operations against the government of Nicaragua. He provided my staff with detailed maps and names of alleged covert landing strips in Mexico, Costa Rica, Louisiana, Arizona, Florida and California, where he alleged where he alleged

aircraft cargoes of drugs were offloaded and replaced with contra military supplies. He also stated that these operations were not CIA operations, but rather under the direction of the White House, Pentagon and NSC personnel. My staff brought these allegations to the attention of the Senate Armed Services Committee and the Senate Intelligence Committee at the time, but no action was initiated by either committee. Sincerely, Gary Hart. Sincerely, Gary Hart. It sounds very much like what we know of American history at this time. Yeah. And I give you this background on the guy. Yeah, I know exactly. I give you this

background on the guy so that maybe it makes a little more sense when I tell you that in a sworn affidavit, he explained that he and Lee Harvey Oswald went through early government intelligent training courses together. And here's a quote from him for Jesse to read about that, to give a little background. So here we go. Actually, I dropped it in Twitter, but I could have probably dropped it in. It's all right. Also there. I didn't zoom to. I first met Oswald at illusionary warfare training, propaganda, language, instruction, false identities, maintenance of cover stories, et cetera, at Nagshead, North Carolina in 1957. Oswald was taking language courses at the same complex where I was taking

illusionary warfare training classes. These courses at the time were referred to as Spook School and were preparatory to going covert in international operations. Everybody who was there was CIA or military intelligence, or at least they were in some form of government training for their particular covert mission. Yeah. So that was going on. He says he saw Oswald there pretty wild. He then goes on to say that he ran into him again in Hawaii when Oswald was there shipping out as a Marine. And then again, quote unquote, operationally in Dallas in 1962, a year before the assassination, when he ran into him in an alleged Cuban safe house apartment behind a house on North Beckley Street in Oak Cliff, which was double weird since the place was being used

as part of a gun running operation at the time. And it's also where he lived five nights a week while he was working. But I guess when he asked about, I guess when he asked about him, he was told there was he was there on the part of the Office of Naval Intelligence. So he said, oh, Oswald, he's here for ONI. That's what they said. Captain Edward G. Sewell and Captain Gilbert C. Cook, who are both stationed local to the Dallas area, corroborated that Oswald really was with ONI. And then he had been active at both the Hensley Field and Bachman's Lake ONI facilities there. And according to CIA officer Victor Marchetti, the ONI connection is how Oswald got to be involved with the false defector op out of Nag's head. Here's a quote about what they were doing for

Mathis Tereed. And honestly, as you listen, tell me it is not exactly what you already thought you knew about Oswald if you like pictured him and what he was doing. One of these activities was an ONI officer of Naval Intelligence program, which involves three dozen, maybe 40 young men who were made to appear disenchanted, poor American youths who had become turned off and wanted to see what communism was all about. Some of these people lasted only a few weeks. They were sent into the Soviet Union or into Eastern Europe with the specific intention the Soviets would pick them up and double them if they suspect them of being US agents or recruit them as KGB agents. They were trained at various naval installations both here and abroad, but the operation was being run out of

Nag's head North Carolina. Yeah, so that's pretty nutty. This was also later confirmed again from a quote that supposedly from co-chairman of the US Senate subcommittee to investigate the JFK assassination, Senator Richard Swiker, though I can't find anything but an indirect attribution to him through this other JFK book Brothers by David Talbot, where he says, quote, the accused assassination, meaning the accused assassin, meaning Oswald, was the product of a fake defector program run by the CIA. So that's a quote from this guy. I can't really source it any other way besides that. Then there's this weird quote from this guy, David Atley Phillips, but one point was actually the director of Western Hemisphere Operations for the CIA,

really, who not only openly stated that he thought the assassination of President Kennedy was the product of a conspiracy, which likely involved American intelligence officers, but also here's a quote from him for Jesse DeRede, which makes this even wilder. So here we go. I was one of the two case officers who were handled Lee Harvey Oswald after working to establish his Marxist Bonafide days. We gave him the mission of killing Fidel Castro and Cuba. Okay. I don't know why he killed Kennedy, but I do know he used precisely the plan we had devised against Castro. I just want to put this out there because I just got to whenever you're getting quotes from X CIA people, take that shit with 900 grains of salt. Oh, yeah. Absolutely.

They are just because they're not officially with the CIA anymore, doesn't mean they still don't work with the CIA for just putting out misinformation and confusing people and keeping people off the track. I do want to, but they wouldn't. This is what I'm talking about, extreme beliefs. It's hard to, but it's hard to not hear that and be like, that's crazy. But also it's like, could happen, McWorld, you know what I'm saying? That's what the CIA is all about, man. I mean, I will point you to the UFO phenomenon, how many times did they deny it until they just didn't anymore? Exactly. Exactly. And here's a few more weird things about Oswald that I'm going to list off that are going to make you get a question mark

above your head, like a video game character. Number one, a military doctor once stepped in and prevented Oswald from getting in trouble for contracting a venereal disease because he got it quote, in the line of duty and quote, something to think about. No, no idea what that could mean. Number two, while he was stationed in Tokyo, Oswald was known to hang out with sex workers at this one fancy club who were suspected of women passing American intelligence to the communists. That's another thing that's true about Oswald. Number three, Oswald failed a Russian proficiency test on February 25th, 1959. But six months later, he was seen speaking perfect fluent Russian by two native speakers. Number four, the CIA said Oswald wasn't debriefed when he came back from

the Soviet Union. But according to a CIA officer who spoke with PBS's show Frontline in 2003, Oswald actually was debriefed and that he knows because he read the report himself. And five, not only was a spy camera allegedly found amongst Oswald's belongings, but his notebooks were full of data about guns and spy photography. And there was tons of encrypted text in there too, including according to a link in the book, which led to a deleted Google Doc, the unlisted phone number of Jack Ruby, but more on Jack Ruby a little bit. Also, this book fucking sucks. It's fucking, it's, it's, it's hard. Is it a slog or was it just like chaos? It's just a very hastily put together book. Not a lot. There's a lot that I left out for very, like,

good reason. Yeah, I believe you. I think it's, like I say, it's a great way to survey a lot of the weird things about this situation. But I really don't want to back a lot of it up. I don't want to buy into a lot of it. There's a lot of that I don't want to buy into. Right now, I want to circle back around to the fact that very often for this theory to work, it seems like Oswald might need to be in two places at once. But what if instead of being able to teleport, there was evidence out there of secret agent Lee Harvey Oswald having something Governor Ventura calls in this book, a quote, intelligence double. Or more clearly, this book lays out a situation in which quote, the only explanation that's viable is that U.S. intelligence

has been running to Oswald's as part of an operation and quote, the book says, this made me think of a movie and I was going to say the movie, but I realized math is wouldn't even get it. So I'm not going to bother. Tell me the movie. Tell me the movie. Maybe I have, you know, it's a huge spoiler. Okay. For that movie. I'm trying to think in Manchurian candidate. Like, no, no, no, the movie about twins is David Bowie is in the movie. Yes. Okay. We're in there. Okay. We're in there. Okay. So not the one about the twin girls who swap places. Not even remotely close. No, no. All right. So this book, so this book says this is a very common thing that spies do and that sometimes they even use identical twins to pull this off. How else can you so

cleanly explain away so many minor yet significant differences in everyone's different accounts of seeing him at work that day? Or even the conflicting facts that they would say about him just like as a person was the person who came back from Russia who'd lost weight and had thinner hair, the same Oswald who left for Russia. Did you know his height said 511 on his Defense Department ID, even though he was only recorded to be five nine when he was arrested? You tell me he lied. Even when he was younger, it seemed like there were two versions of him. When his childhood doctor said he had spent time in the youth house prior to examination, the Warren Commission found that he had only ever been recorded at the youth house after meeting with the doctor.

And when the doctor measured him at four foot six, one month later, his school in New York had him down at five foot four. This is when he was a kid. Oh, yeah. When the Warren Commission showed Oswald's half brother, John Pick photographs of Oswald from ages two to 12, he recognized him instantly. During the only surviving picture of him from when he was 13 and spending a year and a half in New York City, John Pick said he didn't even recognize him. And there's weird like medical history anomalies to about Oswald. Here is a quote for from the book for Math History about that. I'm going to drop that in the zoom there. There are a lot of indications of stark differences in the past of Lee Harvey Oswald that imply they were actually two different individuals.

Mortician Paul Grootie was asked twice if he noted a mastoid scar on the left side of Oswald's neck or scars below or scars or that one more time or scars near his left elbow. In 1945, Oswald had a mastoid mastoid ectomy operation, a Harris hospital in Fort Worth, a three inch mastoid scar was noted on his Marine medical records. In 1957, Lee shot himself in the arm with a 22 derringer. Yet neither the three inch mastoid scar nor scars from the bullet wounds were observed by Grootie or noted on his 1963 report. Jack Ruby shot Oswald who had no such scars. In January of 1957, military records show Lee Harvey Oswald was treated for tonsillitis. He was treated again for tonsillitis in 1958 and given injections of penicillin. But according to an

FBI report, Dr. Philbin of Dallas, Texas had removed Oswald's tonsils 12 years earlier in January of 1945. So yeah, there's some medical contradictions in his files. And then the book reminds you that quote, these are not theories and then points to a URL where you can supposedly find the medical records except the URL is literally mind serpent dot com slash American underscore history slash arm strong slash tonsillectomy slash tonsils. And twice it let me twice it let me to a dead end. And one time it tried to install a fake version of flash for my browser and gave me a virus. So I'm going to go ahead and say that they are theories. Yeah, I'm going to go with they are absolutely theories as well. Also in 1980, we've got that computer

as we can finally mind the Bitcoin. Exactly. Also in 1981, when the guy who first pushed Soviet body swap theory, a British lawyer and investigator called Michael Edo's spent 15 grand of his own money to actually exhume and test the body that was supposed to be Oswald. They tested it and officially determined that it was indeed Oswald in the grave. Wasted 15 grand to figure that out. However, the funeral director who originally buried Oswald's body refuted this explanation because he said the body that he buried was given a craniotomy during the autopsy while the one that was exhumed clearly had not been given a craniotomy. Who said this, the funeral director who originally buried Oswald's body, Grootie. The book also mentions

that J Edgar Hoover himself had read reports about Oswald as early as June 1960. And there were enough simultaneous sightings of him in America and Russia in the FBI files that even though there was no mention of this by the Warren Commission, Hoover himself issued a memo to his field offices saying someone might be using Oswald's identity and to be on the lookout. Now, from here, this part of the book goes super deep on these two versions of Oswald. They got one called Lee, who was the quote unquote normal one, and one called Harvey, who was the government spook one. But honestly, it's great. They get a little too far into the weeds, figuring out which one was which. By the end, and let me felt a little tricked, confused to say, and at the end,

the evidence to point to this is so I'm not going to delve into that super far. But before we go, I got one or two more things to read. First one for Jesse to read from the book. Here we go. Bang. In early 1964, Warren Commission member and Georgia Senator Richard Russell was very troubled and asked Army Intelligence Colonel Philip Corso to quietly conduct an investigation into the Oswald Corso soon reported to Senator Russell that there had been two United States passports issued to Lee Harvey Oswald, which had been used by two different men. He obtained this information from the head of US passport office, Francis Knight. He also reported to Senator Russell that there were two birth certificates in the name of Lee Harvey Oswald, and they too

had been used by two different people. He obtained this information from William Sullivan, head of the FBI's domestic intelligence division. Corso said he and Senator Russell concluded the assassination had to be conspiracy. Yeah, so that's nuts. And then probably wireless of all, at least to me, is this quote from a controversial book by John Armstrong called November in Dallas 1997 conference presentation Harvey and Lee Harvey and Lee about Oswald's wife Marina, which I'll have Mathis read for you now. Here we go. She insisted on seeing Oswald's body during his autopsy. Marina entered the room stood next to the body of Lee Harvey Oswald and did a most curious thing. She raised his eyelids and looked at his eyes. Four months later, she told a French journalist,

I had two husbands, Lee, the father of my children and infection and kind man and Harvey Oswald, the assassin of President Kennedy. Sounds kind of like the man was of two moods constantly because wasn't he notoriously violent and beat his wife? You see, Mathis, that's the problem with having extreme beliefs is that you ride the line. I'm still over here thinking about that damn movie. The more you say the more I'm like, did they read this book and then make that movie? It's very, it's very possible. Sounds kind of like NWK. That's a joke that I wrote in my notes. Anyway, even though it's fun to think about things like this, perhaps we're missing an

even simpler question about Oswald killing the president, which is what the next section's about. It's called why? Number 20, why? Literally, that's just the whole question for this part. Why did Lee Harvey Oswald shoot John F. Kennedy? What was his reason for doing it? What was his motive? Well, if you know he's a weird, shifty, communisty outsider, you could probably sort of imagine some sort of reason in your head, especially if you watch tons of like Tom Clancy shit all the time or something. But in reality, there are a couple weird inconsistencies that pop up when you take a closer look. First of all, the House Select Committee on assassinations could not establish a motive and neither could the Warren Commission. So here's a quick quote

from the New York Times for Jesse to read. The day the Warren Report findings were released. Why did Oswald do it? To this most important and most mysterious question, the commission had no certain answer. It suggested that Oswald had no rational purpose, no motive adequate if judged by the standards of reasonable men. After his arrest, he told the police that my wife and I like the president's family. They're interesting people. He said, I'm not a malcontent. Nothing irritated me about the president. Yeah, I mean, yeah, yeah, right. That's what he would say, right? That's what he would say, right? Yeah, well, not only that, but like, you know, and this goes back to just the idea of conspiracy overall. It's like, it could just be like, and it likely is, first of

all, keep in mind this man did attempt to shoot a fucking general before this, missed, but did take a shot at him. But moreover, it's where conspiracy fills in the gaps. If people have a hard time sometimes swallowing the reality that the world is chaos and he might have just been mentally ill and fucking took a shot because he wanted to change the world. He was also violent and notoriously like, as we talked about last episode in a bit this episode, a turncoat and all this shit, like the man could just be off the chain. Well, I think the craziness of him as a person, whether there's multiple people that are him or whatever, his more out there characteristics, I think are just like one little piece of the overall pie of like, you look into the backstory of

like what JFK was, was about, and you look into his personal life and you look in like what he was trying to do. You look into the mob, the CIA, they're like, there's so much that like, if you just keep picking all the little weird pieces, don't make any sense. And so the thing that makes sense is like massive conspiracy. Yeah, exactly. Or maybe there was a massive conspiracy. Could be. I mean, that's the other thing too is like, again, especially with JFK because it's had decades to accumulate crazy conspiracies and new information and just straight misinformation and twisted truths that it's like, like you said, the beginning all this, it's so hard to just dig through and find what's even reliable to present as even just a theory. It's really true. It's

so much. It's like over a thousand books on this. You know, it's nuts. You can literally find a book confirming whatever weird conspiracy you believe in. But that's why it's so important to look at what we know as the facts and then kind of just have to go from there. You gotta read department of truth. You got to check that out. That's great. Sorry, a little ramble there. But yeah, it's important. I just think I think it's important to listen to us to remember moving forward. He did take an assassination attempt prior to the president. This is not the very first. I definitely started with that for a reason. You know what I mean? Yeah, exactly. Like he this isn't this fits his profile. Another problem is that no formal recording or transcript exists of Oswald saying

his version of what went down. And what little we have cobbled together has come from the notes of agents who talk to him that day. Strangely enough, in 1978, the People's Almanac actually hired an expert on the assassination, someone called May Brussel, to compile every single known statement or remark that Oswald made between his arrest and his death. And after putting 14 years of research into the topic altogether, she concluded that when he did talk, he was telling the truth. First, I'll have Mathis read his comments from when he was arrested at the movie theater after allegedly just killing the president in cold blood. So here's a list of those for Mathis to read. A few quotes here. I don't know why you're treating me like this. The only thing

I've done is carry a pistol into a movie. I don't see why you handcuffed me. Why should I hide my face? I haven't done anything to be ashamed of. I want a lawyer. I am not resisting arrest. I didn't kill anybody. I haven't shot anybody. I protest this police brutality. I fought back there, but I know I wasn't supposed to be carrying a gun. What is this all about? Yeah. And then let's have Jesse read everything that Oswald said while in the police car on the way to the station and a little bit after at the police station. Oh boy, gotta scroll up for this one. Again, what is this all about? I know my rights. All I did was carry a gun. Nothing irritated me about the president. John Kennedy had a nice family. I had nothing personal against John Kennedy.

I really don't know what the situation is about. Nobody has told me anything except that I'm accused of murdering a policeman. I know nothing more than that. And I do request someone to come forward. Give me legal assistance. When asked, did you kill the president? Oswald replied, no, I have not been charged with that. In fact, nobody has said anything to me yet. The first thing I heard about the first thing I heard about it was when the newspaper reporters in the hall asked me the question. I didn't do it. I did not do it. I did not shoot anyone. I didn't even know Governor John Connolly had been shot. Well, I really don't know what this is all about, but I had been kept incarcerated and kept in communicado. So what do you guys man,

so you cannot shut his stupid mouth? Does he sound guilty? A couple of times he was also characterized as being cocky, possibly because he thought O and I was going to bail him out of the mess that he was in at the end. And then maybe you slowly was just like realizing that he was fucked and just starting to like sort of legalize his way out of it. Who knows? Here's a few more quotes from him that I that might show this side of him, which I'll just read myself. Call the FBI. Tell them you have Lee Oswald in custody. I've spoken to Lieutenant Frank Martello, the interviewing officer at the time of his arrest in New Orleans. Everyone will know who I am now. This statement was made. Actually, it's more like this. This was this because it says this

statement was made in a somber manner as though now his cover was blown, not as though seeking fame, but in fact, quite the opposite. Let me try that again. Everyone's going to know who I am now. I refuse to take a polygraph. It has always been my practice not to agree to take a polygraph. I'm waiting for someone to come forward to give me legal assistance. This one's to Marina, his wife. It's a mistake. I'm not guilty. There are people who will help me. Everything is going to be all right. If they ask you anything, you have a right not to answer. You have a right to refuse. Do you understand? You are not to worry. You have friends. They'll help you. This one's to his brother, Robert. Don't believe all the so-called evidence.

And then when his brother stared into Lee's eyes for a clue, Lee told him, brother, you won't find anything there. Then he said, my friends will take care of Marina and the two children. And then, yeah, I know. As the police like, yeah. Go ahead and see. Sorry. Continue. As the police started to unfairly single him out in lineups and pushed him around and silenced him for a day or so, maybe a situation kind of dawned on him a little bit because that's when another word shows up that we love to say in connection to this mystery. And that word just so happens to be the next, the name of the next section, 21, 22 and 23, which is Patsy. What were you going to say? Yeah, yeah. I mean, I just go back, I just go back to thinking what his wife said

about him. And there's two different types. So there's two different Oswald's loving family man and the crazy one that would shoot the president. I mean, if this man, I'm not saying he did suffer from any sort of mental illness, but if he was known to just flip, it would be, you could see the moment where he takes the shot, whether he hit him or not, whether, you know, there were other shooters or not. I still believe he was trying at the very least. And you could see maybe in the moment of him taking the shot, you know, that adrenaline rush, he can, you know, it feels it. And then when all is said and done, he realizes kind of like it settles on what actually just happened, whether he believes he actually hit or not. You could see him maybe fall back into that

kind of more passive of like, I didn't do anything. It wasn't me. You know, if he's, if his wife's like there's two different hymns, I don't think she meant that literally. I think she meant that because he was a fucking violent man or just was. Or did she? No, never mind. We're at Andrew W.K. You're right. But like, it's important to put out like he did beat his wife. He was a terrible civilian. Never mind this. He's not like an innocent victim for 100 percent. Sure. And so, and there's a lot of people who really want to paint him like that. It's just not true. Yeah. I will not contest that, but I will contest whether or not he shot the president of the United States. I sent you a clip. Check it out. This very famous clip is about a minute long. I'm excited

for it. I'm sure you know it. I'm sure. I'm just hoping it's the song again. Yeah. Yeah, this is the this is the clip where he's like walking down the under in the base. Like this is like a very famous clip of him. He's being shoved away. He's trying to say that he needs representation, legal representation. Then he says the famous thing right at the end. He says, I'm just a patsy. Hey, I'm listening still. He does. I mean, I don't want to judge anyone. But first of all, Google a bull video if you guys want to see it. Very, very good. He just he just sounds like he's just the way he says it. It sounds it's out of it, which to me is like exhausted. Yeah. I have over the course of my

many years. I think Alex probably witnessed like I think Alex probably is has been there too. We talked to a lot of people and sometimes like just randos on the street. I have people approach me because apparently I have one of the most approachable faces on earth. I feel that way too. And I've talked to a lot of people who are not all there and he has that vibe of just like there's a little something like missing from him. And I don't know if that's little something missing. Is this kind of something where you like King Kimmel person or if it's the kind of something where he's like lying. I don't know what I'm being accused of. I literally didn't do anything wrong and this is overwhelming. I don't know what it is, but

clearly in that footage he is a little out there. Yeah. Yeah. And he doesn't scream it like like so many people like you know kind of like pretend he does. He just kind of like I'm I'm just a patsy. I'm just it's like so weak and like I'm just a patsy. Do you think he's a patsy? No, no. I think if he's a patsy he's in he's unaware that he's being used as such. That's what I mean. Like do you think he do you think he like just realized he was a patsy shortly before this? Maybe. Maybe because again I still sit on the side that he may even again I still think he took the shots even if he hit nothing and he missed and it was somebody else. I still think he was in the bookstore that day taking the shots because he just seems like that kind of person and maybe he didn't

he didn't think about how difficult a shot it was going to be. That wasn't his thought. He just was like I work in a place that's right next to where they're going. Right. Might as well use it. I have an excuse. I can be there like this is a whole it just it just all fits. Yeah. Well I say if he is a patsy there better be some evidence of the government or whoever set him up for the fall. Right. Like yeah if we're going to say that it's possible that he actually was a patsy we need that. So that's exactly what I'm going to do. But first of all let's take a second to reexamine another like popular and well known fact of this whole mystery which is what we know. We know that Oswald owned an Italian carcano because he

ordered it by mail under the name a Hiddell which was then delivered to a post box post office box which was owned by Oswald. This is like one of the sort of like facts that everybody knows if you know the timeline of the murder. This provides the needed paper trail which connects Oswald to the rifle. But let me ask you this if you had such risky high profile plans and you were trying to be stealthy and not get caught in the way that it seemed like he was doing with a fake name and such why not just take advantage of the fact that in 1963 in the state of Texas you could buy a gun in person without a permit or any kind of even keeping a record of the purchase. You know and instead of you know ordering a rifle under a fake name by mail even though

that same fake name is on an ID card in your wallet which can be instantly connected to you and then send it to a PO box which is literally under your real name anyway and then when the police ask you say you don't even own a rifle. When was the rifle purchased? I'm gonna get into that right now. Okay so while you're chewing on that I promised I was going to show you government manipulation of Oswald so here we go. January of 1963 Thomas Dodd of Connecticut was putting together committee hearings to look into whether or not the mail order sale of foreign firearms was harming domestic business specifically with regard to Italian carcano rifles and specifically from one of the retailers Oswald was said to have ordered his guns from,

Clines of Chicago and if that's not weird enough Senator Dodd also used to be an FBI agent loyal to Hoover was one of the heads of the Cuba lobby and he was also looking into the fair play for Cuba committee which Oswald was said to have been embedded in as an undercover operative and as a matter of fact two sources close to Senator Dodd have even anonymously confirmed that at least one called carcano rifle had indeed been ordered for Oswald in the name of this committee investigation at some point in 1963 which was subsequently corroborated by Agent Ellsworth the same guy from alcohol tobacco and firearms who said the Mauser was found on a different floor. He said that an undercover operative possibly Oswald or quote unquote one of the Oswald's was operational in

Dallas and that one of these Oswald lookalikes was actually a local gunsmith who illegally sold full automatic weapons to the anti-castro Cubans as well. He was actually called down to the police department on the day of the assassination he thought they wanted him to talk about Oswald but they really wanted to talk about another guy John Thomas Mason another guy who apparently was a dead ringer for Oswald with close ties to Texas oil baron HL Hunt and the far right minute men group as a follow-up to a conversation they'd had the day before about gun running. So he was down at the station thinking that they were going to ask about Oswald and they were just like no we want to talk about this other guy who had that guy just happened to look like Oswald.

Also the snub-nosed smith and wesson 38 revolver Oswald bought in a similar manner to the carcano was also purchased from a company under the committee's investigation which was called seaport traders of Los Angeles so that's two weapons ordered from these sort of like mail order rifle things in this fake name that's on his government ID. Also Oswald is on record ordering his pistol just two days before Senator Dodd's hearings began and indeed these sample statistics do include a purchase made from seaport traders and shipped to Texas which could have very well been him. Can I cut in here? Yeah. It's important to remember maybe the reason he bought the Italian carcano rifle is because he paid under fucking twenty dollars for it. It's true.

It was super fucking cheap. It's true but what I'm saying is somebody literally said it was Oswald. Somebody in the government literally said it was Oswald who did this. You know what I mean? So it's at least corroborated by an official, right? Yeah. And if we know anything about what's important in America it's gun profits and we know that in the same hearing the carcano rifle itself was fingered as one of the biggest threats to domestic gun profits. So if there was a motive to make the carcano rifle into the rifle of a very bad man this could be it. Also LA police lieutenant Manuel Pena who later was a head investigator on Kennedy's brother Bobby's assassination was the same guy who traced the telescope site from Oswald's rifle,

the telescope site, the telescopic site that was from Oswald's rifle to seaport traders. And also also while Dodd was literally being paid by the American Security Council to convince the government to get rid of Caster and Cuba and directly engage in warfare in Vietnam, he was also on the Senate Internal Security Subcommittee which was pushing weird stories about Oswald being a commie loving fanboy KGB assassin who was trained in minx to kill. And also we know that on November 8th just a few weeks before the assassination Oswald actually wrote a letter to Mr. Hunt to a Mr. Hunt. We don't know which Mr. Hunt it was asking for some clarification. It's been suggested this could possibly reference future Watergate burglar and current CIA Cuba guy

E Howard Hunt Jr. He's one of the guys who broke in in the Watergate Hotel. But we also have evidence from ex-military officer Richard Case Nagel, Nagel, Nagel saying that Oswald was also connected to the Baron H. L. Hunt, which again links him back to the gun running. But either way, it's a pretty interesting little letter. So let's have Mathis read the letter really quick. Here we go. Yeah. November 8th, 1963. Dear Mr. Hunt, I would like information concerning my position. I am asking only for information. I am suggesting that we discuss the matter fully before any steps are taken by me or anyone else. Thank you. Signed Lee Harvey Oswald. Pretty sus little letter. Pretty sus little letter considering he shot the president just two weeks later.

Another big piece of evidence that you see a lot when people do videos or books about this are the photos of Oswald posing in the backyard with the carcano rifle he used not only to shoot at Edwin Walker, but also JFK a little bit later. So here's those. That's the series of all three pictures from the backyard. There he is holding the frigging rifle. And even though we all know that this can only ever be circumstantial evidence, it's one of the main pieces of proof people point to regarding Oswald being the shooter. It was on the cover of Life magazine, for example. But what if these pictures aren't exactly as they seem? For example, Major John Picard, Pickard, who was once head of photography analysis with the Canadian Defense Department,

did a professional investigation of the photos and determined them to be fake. This was also the conclusion of other experts, including Detective Superintendent Malcolm Thompson, who used to be the president of the Institute of Incorporated Photographers in England, and another who was a photographic consultant for the House Select Committee on Assassinations, whose name hilariously was Jack White. Also Oswald himself said the photo was sus. And here's a quote for Jesse DeRede from Oswald himself about that. So here we go. In time, I'll be able to show you that this is not my picture, but I don't want to answer any more questions. I will not discuss this photograph without advice of an attorney.

That picture is not me. But the face is mine. The picture has been made by superimposing my face. The other part of the picture is not me at all. And I have never seen this picture before. I understand photography real well, and that in time, I'll be able to show you that this that is not my picture and that it has been made by someone else. The small picture was reduced from the larger one made by some persons unknown to me. Yeah. And actually, according to the experts, there are some problems. For one, the shadow of his nose does not match the direction of the shadow from his body, even with his head tilted. So you can actually look and just see that if you and what you think of that on the actual picture

there. Also, the leftmost photo of this series is called 133A. It was not found until 1977 when it was discovered among the possessions of a rich Dallas Russian called George de Moran Shield, who knew Oswald and had intelligence connections. And the weird thing is, his whole family insists that this photo was planted among his belongings and that he never had it while he was alive. They also believe the background to possibly be the same image in all three pictures just warped. And the level of similarity between the backgrounds and all three photos is basically a statistical impossibility, since it would require Oswald's wife Marina to have been holding the camera almost perfectly still to within a fraction of an inch each time she hit

the shutter, especially considering most accounts say Oswald actually took the camera from her between shots to help her advance the film. Jack White, not the musician, attributes this to something called key stoning, which is similar to what you do to the image of a projector when you want it to like match to a screen when you don't have the angle 100 percent perfect, you kind of keystone the image by tilting it and changing it a little bit. Also, Marina denies ever taking those pictures, which begs the question of who did. And also, the body of the person in the photo might not be Oswald's. Strangely, Oswald appears to be wearing no ring in photo A, a ring on his right hand in photo B, and a ring on his left hand in photo C.

And it was also strange that they'd be wearing a pullover shirt in these photos because one, he never wore them. And two, they didn't find a shirt like that among his possessions. And just in case you're not convinced yet, here's a little snippet of an interview between Detective Thompson and one of the photo experts and the Dallas police for sorry, Detective Thompson who is one of the photo experts and the Dallas police for you guys to read. It's like a little scene for you guys. So here we go. Sorry, here we go. No worries. I was zooming in on the pictures. In general, I have come to the conclusion that we have a montage of three pictures to make one end product as we see it here today. So does it strike you as strange that

in their search after all connected with the assassination of the president, that they would find such damning evidence the next day? It does. It does seem unusual. One would think that the officers involved would be highly experienced officers would know and have been trained to carry out the search of premises. Is there any possibility in your mind that those two photographs are genuine? I don't think there's any possibility. Having examined them from a considerable amount of time, it is my considered opinion that they are not genuine. So what do you think of those pictures? Do you think are you seeing what I'm seeing?

Are you seeing what I'm saying? Shadows, rings. I see the rings. I do. So can I? I kind of see the rings when they're zoomed out, but when you zoom in, it's hard to tell because it's a picture from the fucking 60s or whatever. If we had a real film, it would look better. God damn, I wish I could. So I went into Adobe Photoshop as you were talking, and I took the three pictures and took the left picture and the right picture, cut them out, put them over the central picture, and then changed the opacity. Opacity. Opacity. You got it. And made it so that I put the heads because I was looking because the thing you said was,

the heads were pasted on, or at least he said. And the heads, here's the thing. The heads, here's the thing. In all three shots, the heads are like, I'm going to say 99.9% the exact, like when you take a photo, I don't know if this dude is trained professional Instagram photo person. You know what I mean? Where they always have like the Kim Kardashian same face. These are the exact same face three times. I'm looking at them right now. It's they're a little opposed over each other. They fit perfectly. I'm not willing to like, but I feel like his expression, his mouth expression on each one is different. I'm telling you, it looks like he might be smiling in the third one. He looks like kind of frowning in the second one in the first

one. He just looks like he's just different is is is a little bit of lighting. And in one, here's interesting in one, he has a little bit more hair. It's yeah, I don't know. It's it's a little weird. I like, I'm not really willing to come down on either side of this photo manipulation thing, because it's kind of it's easy to look at old pictures and get caught up in stuff. But it's definitely a weird enough looking picture that I there is some question. It is strange. That's for sure. Two, two, two more things, if I may pop in. If we didn't talk about it, he got the rifle eight months prior to the assassination attempt for one and two, that was kind of left out of his confessions or talking about why he was arrested.

He was spotted going into the movie theater with a pistol without paying. He just went right in and didn't pay. He didn't do anything, which is pretty saucy. Yeah. But the the rifle, like I say, he bought it exactly in the right timetable for that for that mail order foreign guns investigation, which is at least significant in some way. But lastly, for this section, let's circle back to the clip that I showed you at the beginning where Oswald said he's just a patsy. Apparently, in 1970, a new way of determining the possible truth of a statement that someone made on tape was invented. So first, really quickly, let's have Mathis read us some background about it from an article about it in 1975, during the time of the House Select Committee on Assassinations.

Here we go. The PSE was invented in 1970 by a group of intelligence experts who sought to improve upon the traditional polygraph. Two of the PSE's inventors, Alan D. Bell Jr. and Charles H. McGoiston, both retired lieutenant colonels from Army Intelligence, discovered that the frequencies composing the human voice shift from eight to 14 times every second. But when the speaker is under stress, this frequency modulation disappears. What remains are the pure component frequencies of the voice and a strong indication that the speaker is lying. So this type of analysis is admissible in court and has been used for hundreds of times by law enforcement for that reason in a dozen or more states. And basically, that's what they did for Oswald's voice in that clip that I showed you earlier

about the Patsy. The analysis was carried out by an ex-Army Intelligence guy who literally wrote the polygraph manual, a man called Lloyd H. Hitchcock. Here's what he found. When Oswald denied shooting the president, officer tipped it, or anyone at all, according to the PSE test, he meant it and was telling the truth. When his charts were interpreted and a determination of truth was made, there was no other probable or plausible interpretation of his results. And thirdly, of all the statements examined, the one where he denied killing the president was especially likely to be true. So if it's possible that Oswald didn't kill the president or that he wasn't acting alone, who else was there, which brings us to 24 and 25, which I will call

backup. Okay. Yeah. So for the first account of some other people on the scene who might have had something to do with President Kennedy's assassination, let's have Jesse read a quote from another JFK book, Jim Mars Crossfire, to give us a rundown. And this one is one I'm going to have to dump on Twitter for you. Crossfire! The greatest board game ever made. The greatest board game ever made. Oh boy. Okay. Let me see where this starts. At the time that Kennedy was first hit by a bullet, two men standing near each other on the north sidewalk of Elm Street acted most strangely. One began pumping a black umbrella while the other waved his right arm high in the air. As Kennedy's limousine began to gently descend, the gentle descent to Dealey Plaza, a man can be

seen standing near the street side edge of the Stemons Freeway sign holding an open umbrella. He holds the umbrella in a normal fashion and the top of the umbrella almost reaches the bottom of the sign. In photos taken minutes before Kennedy's arrival, the umbrella is closed and immediately after the shooting pictures so the umbrella was closed again. The man's umbrella was only open during the shooting sequence. Furthermore, he is, as seen in the Zapruder film, once Kennedy is exactly opposite the man with the umbrella, it is pumped almost two feet into the air and then lowered. At the same time, oh my goodness, the second man in photos, he appears to be of a dark complexion, perhaps a black man or Hispanic,

raised his right hand into the air, possibly making a fist. This man was located on the outer edge of Elm Street sidewalk opposite the Umbrella Man, who was on the inner edge. The man with the open umbrella was the only person in Dealey Plaza with an open umbrella. Under the warm Texas sun, there was no reason to carry an umbrella, open umbrella, at the time. So here is a picture of that for you guys to look at, I hope. Unless it's a museum, valid size parameters. No. Oh, no. A lot of conspiracy happening on this very podcast. Error and valid size parameter 980. Maybe I can make it happen. There we go. Did that work?

Let's find out. Invalid parameters. Invalid size parameters. Maybe the resize thing is the problem. At the end, it says resize. There it is. Guiazzo or snapshot it or whatever. Got it. Oh, how'd you get it? Up in the web bar thing. Oh, delete resize? Delete the resize bit. And just stick with the JPEG. Hey, there it is. Man with an umbrella. Man with the umbrella. So he couldn't be just hiding from the sun? Oh, I've seen Umbrella Academy. I know exactly who that is. Yeah. Yeah, it's weird, right? So to people today, these guys are known as Umbrella Man and Dark Complexioned Man. And I think they even use an Umbrella Man in Umbrella Academy,

which is what you said. I think he's one of the character's fathers or something. But even crazier than their behavior during the shooting is their behavior after. And apparently, while everyone was either, everyone else was either diving towards the ground, taking pictures of what was happening or running towards or away from the grassy knoll, these two guys just sit down right next to each other on the curb together like their friends. So I got a picture of that right there for you. You just see them just literally sitting on the curb together, very close to each other. Which ones are they in this image? They're the guys sitting together on the curb. On the right? Yep.

Is that the same, man? One thousand percent positive. They're the same people. 100 percent. Then the Dark Complexioned Man. You can see the Umbrella they're sitting in the street too. Then the Dark Complexioned Man pulls out something that looks like a two-way radio. I'll have that picture of that as he's walking to his seat. You can click on that and see. Or let me put that. Where are you sending this to? Let me put it in the Zoom. I don't know why I put it there. You can see him in that picture kind of reaching for something in his back pocket. He looks like he's wiping both his hands on his ass like anybody else would. So then here's a picture I'm talking into the radio. Okay, yeah, give me something. Give me

more. An illustration. Send it in Zoom, you mofo. Oh, shit. Stupid. I'm stupid. Okay. Here is the picture of him talking into the radio. Yeah, give me that picture. And here is an illustration of what that picture says is happening. It's a picture from a film, so it's really hard to grab. It's really unclear. Yeah. So here's the thing. To me, this looks like one of those things where the human mind creates things out of nothing. And if you go back to the first image where it was like, oh, this, he has a radio thing going on here. There's two question marks pointing at stuff. And one math is talking about the question mark pointing at his butt. It looks like a man like wiping his butt. I don't know if they're saying he's getting a radio, but the part where I think

they're saying that's the antenna, it looks like it's just the stairs. Yeah. Like it's just the stairs. I can't say for sure. I can't say a hundred percent, but I at least see the pose that they're saying in the drawing. And I will say the image of, like if I had to make an illustration, so Alex sent us two images and one is from the video and one is an illustration of the two men sitting there and it looks like the guy's talking to a radio, but I could equally make the exact same illustration of their turning to look at what's going on and directly in front of, or I guess behind that man is what appears to be a cop on a horse or something. I don't know what that is. That could be like a tail. It could be any, like that line, this like white line could also be

the sun's reflection off of the black sheen of something. Yeah. And that dark spot near his chin could just be the shadow being cast. They very well could be. And obviously this is very crazy stuff. So obviously they looked into these guys and though they still don't know who dark complexioned man is, Umbrella Man was identified as self-described quote conservative type heckler Louis Steven Witt. The story goes that the umbrella he had was meant to evoke a British politician called Neville Chamberlain who was famous for this distinctive black one he carried because Professor Kennedy's, I mean, Professor President Kennedy's father Joseph was a supporter of Chamberlain who was later criticized for his policy of trying to appease Adolf Hitler during

World War Two and he heard the Kennedy family hated black black umbrellas now as a result. And I mean, just during the timeline, we're in the height of the Cold War and we're messing around in Vietnam, but we aren't actually engaged in a Vietnam War. It's true. And that's very like, you know, people are thinking that he was that Kennedy was going to pull out. People fucking hated John F Kennedy like half the country fucking hated this guy. We wanted to stop like an operation into Cuba, was it not? Like Bay of Pigs, right? He did not sit in the airport. If you're thinking, OK, like just to give you guys some context real quick about the Bay of Pigs, because maybe we're not putting this together, there's a bunch of anti-Castro Cubans that are

like part of this plot in all these different stories that I'm talking about. The idea with them is that they're Cuban people that Americans were training to do the Bay of Pigs, right? And then they sent them there and then Kennedy called off the air support in the middle of the attack and left all their brothers out there to die. So of course they're pissed, right? So that's what's going on. That's kind of part of this, too. I don't know how real it is, but that's a thing. Meanwhile, in actual Vietnam, we're not at war yet, but we have people on the ground over there and like basically the rumor was that Kennedy was going to pull people out after after the re-election and like his after 1964, I think they said he was going to pull everyone out. So that is also a

thing where I can imagine if you were thinking protest. Yeah, like Chamberlain and like how he was like, I'm going to appease the Nazis and that kind of thing. I can see how that would be a like screw this guy kind of protest. Right. And this is a story that you hear all the time. And most of the time you hear the story about the Umbrella Man in a kind of like lightly humorous and educational way that has a lesson about conspiracy theories getting at a hand and not believing everything you read. But according to the transcripts, what really happened was that someone told Louis Witt that the Kennedys hated seeing open umbrellas and since he wanted to go be a dick to JFK, who he greatly disliked, he grabbed one and went to Dealey Plaza to be a dick.

It was actually the House committee itself of actually the Warren committee itself that added the speculation about Neville Chamberlain later. So it's actually not in his testimony. And also his testimony wasn't as G shucks and rock solid as that cute anecdote might have it seem either. For one thing, he said he had no plan that he had just wandered down there to try and find the motorcade and open his umbrella to piss off the president. He wouldn't really commit to anyone in any picture actually being him. Didn't seem confident or willing to confirm it. And then he said the man next to him was a quote Negro man, unquote, whom he didn't know. And even though they sat there so close to each other for minutes, all he remembered him saying over and over was,

quote, they done shot them folks. And finally, before we move on to the other weird group of people in the Plaza that day, here is one more quote from Crossfire for Mathis to read to get your brains working, friends. Based on the available photographs made that day, none of what statements were inaccurate account of the actions of the umbrella man who stood waiting for the motorcade with his umbrella in the normal over the head position and then pumped it in the air as Kennedy passed, which bizarre story unsubstantiated and totally at variance with the actions of the man and the photographs resulted in few if any researchers accepting Louis Steven Witt as the umbrella man. And yeah, I do think that's a little extreme to say. I do think most

people at least believe that man to be wit. There's certainly something a little off about the whole thing. And I am not just talking about how low key race is the whole dark complexion man situation is as weird as all that is. It's not even close to how weird things get around these three guys in this very famous picture in which they seem to be getting arrested on the day of the assassination. Here's five links to pictures of them. They're very well documented gentlemen. There's probably even way more than this out there. If you want to Google it, you go, here's the links for you. Cool. Goodness. The story with these guys is that they're supposedly three tramps that the cops had found in the train yards behind the grass. You know, because that's exactly that's exactly

where the fence behind the grass, you know, said they were found squatting inside of a boxcar. And according to the FBI, their names were Harold Doyle, Gus Abrams, and I kid you not, John F. Gedney, super close to the president's name. Apparently they were just three railroad tramps. They were arrested, they were questioned, and then they were let go. But no one has ever been able to really put pictures of these guys next to pictures of the tramps like here's this guy as the tramp, here's this guy as the tramp, here's this guy as the tramp. There's never been any pictures corroborating that those guys are the guys in the pictures in that way. And of course, because of that, there's a lot of other people that have been pegged as one of these admittedly

very clean and dapper looking railroad tramps who were literally hiding in a train car right next to the spot where the possible second gun was suspected to be. Big names have been brought up mostly from superficial connections and similar faces like Watergate burglars, E Howard Hunt, Jr., who I already mentioned, and Frank Sturges, who you probably know the name of, if you know about the Watergate scandal, you're watching Gaslet right now. And one of our alternate, one of the alternate patsies from our part one, Thomas Valley, he's another guy that they say was one of these tramps. Also CIA agent, Dan Carswell, and also pilot, Fred Lee Crisman, who was actually subpoenaed by Jim Garrison in the Clay Shaw trial that was portrayed rather

inaccurately in the movie JFK. But experts from the House Select Committee on Assassination have eliminated them all with either expert testimony or alibis. So none of those people that I just named, even though they're very popular candidates are very likely to be those people in those pictures. But when Lois Gibson, the forensic expert with the actual world record for the most forensic successes, was brought in to do her own personal analysis, she positively identified three completely different people, Chauncey Holt, Charles Rogers, and fairly infamously at this point, Charles Harrelson. First of all, yes, Charles Harrelson is the estranged father of actor Woody Harrelson. I was about to say. Perfect. He is a professional hitman who was

convicted of assassinating a federal judge called John Wood in 1979 and was sent to prison where he died of heart disease in 2007. Oh my God. Notably, before his arrest, he was high on cocaine in a six hour police standoff and confessed not only to murdering the judge, but also President John F. Kennedy. He didn't say much about it after it happened. But here's one quote from him for Jesse to read. Remember, he's high on cocaine. Well, do you believe Lee Harvey Oswald killed President Kennedy alone? Well, I'll get back to that. Without any aid from a rogue agency of the U.S. government or at least a portion of that agency. I believe you're very naive if you do. Yeah. Honestly, OK, we're going to call back here just a minute. But like again, to the to the point of JFK

having a million enemies even within his own government, it's important. I just wanted to I had to fact check this because it's been a while. But to give you an idea, JFK butted heads with Alan Dulles so much Alan Dulles at this time was literally running MK ultra. Yeah, this is the guy that we created the eight ball like he didn't retire in 1962. So he was he butt heads with Kennedy all the time because everything he was doing, Kennedy didn't want them doing. And so like the CIA fucking hated. I mean, just hated Kennedy like for clarity's sake. Again, just go over you listen to that man. We're in the middle of the Cold War. There are a large number of people. I mean, we were at the point where they were like, are you a communist? Are you like

people are going crazy because they thought they were fighting for the soul of the world? And I wish they were thinking that today versus Russia. We must stop the Soviets, that kind of thing. And just for clarity's sake, Kennedy is killed. And then less than a year later, we are at full war with Vietnam. We're like at full scale. We're just putting it out there. Next. So that's Charles Harrison. And LBJ had a huge dick. Oh, hell yeah. And he loved it. All right. Yeah. Got to push that boundary at all times. Next guy was we said we said Charles Harrison. Next guy is Charles Rogers, aka Richard Montoya, aka real life sully from Uncharted. He was a seismologist, a pilot and naval intelligence officer who quit his job with

Shell Oil abruptly as a monologist. Do you know him? Oh my God. He quit his job with Shell Oil abruptly in 1957. He allegedly did some sensitive off the books work with the CIA. And apparently in 1965, authorities discovered the chopped up bodies of his parents in the freezer at his house, which earned the name the icebox killer. But when the cops showed up to grab him, he had already snuck out in a private plane and was declared dead in absentia 10 years later, and no clues to his whereabouts have ever been found since. And finally, we have Chauncey Holt of the three of them. He has been by far the most open, confess to it publicly. He's written stuff. He's even made a little movie about it. And just like his name,

he's got kind of a wacky pedigree. He was a master forger, a weapons expert and was skilled at finances and accounting. And his time as a crack criminal went all the way back to time. He spent with actual crime genius Meyer Lansky, who was basically the guy who laundered all the mob's money and first got them into legitimate business genius. Truly Holt was apparently the one making all the fake IDs to help with the assassination. And he says that they when they got discovered in the boxcar, they just lied and said they were working undercover with the good old Department of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms, flashed their IDs and were immediately released without ever being arrested. Here's an account of what Holt was up to from Special Agent

Jack Shelton, Zack Shelton of the FBI for Mathis Street, Special Agent Zach Morris of the FBI. Here we go. Zach Morris. This is going in Twitter. Sorry. Oh, OK, gotcha. Blah, blah, blah, blah. I got to refresh it for it to pop up. Is this loading? There it is. Chauncey Holt, an expert forger affiliated with both the mafia and CIA, began producing IDs for Lee Harvey Oswald, including all of his aliases around April 1963. In June, Holt delivered the IDs to Guy Bannister in New Orleans, at which time Holt was photographed by news reporters in the same photo with Oswald. In and around October, Holt was instructed by his handler to prepare Secret Service identification pins for the president's trip to Dallas. On November 16th, Holt received a letter

from mobster Peter Liccavole stating that Chuck Nicoletti was at the Grace Ranch in Arizona and for Holt to come and drive Nicoletti to Dallas. On November 21, Holt drove Nicoletti to Dallas. On November 22nd, Holt delivered the Secret Service pins. He drove into the railroad yard in a white 1959 Oldsmobile station wagon. This was corroborated by the testimony of Lee Bowers. When the shots rang out, he reported to the boxcar of the freight train, as he had been instructed and met up there with Charles Harrelson and Charles Rogers, known to Holt as Richard Montoya. All three of these individuals were detained by the Dallas Police Department and later released. Several photographs were taken of these three men,

and they are known as the three tramps. Lewis Gibson, respected forensic artist, verified the three as Holt and Charles Harrelson and Charles Rogers, two violent criminals. So, yeah, who the heck were those guys? And what about after the shooting? What was the deal with Oswald shooting Officer Tippett and sneaking into a movie theater? What about that guy, Jack Ruby, who ended up shooting Oswald on live TV? If this was a conspiracy, was that part of the plan? Find out in the next section cleanup, 26, 27, 28. Here we go. I don't have to read anything, do I? Nothing about like a green anything? No, no, no. Green nothings yet. All right, we'll see. So, the story, as we officially

know, goes that after doing his business in the schoolbook depository building, where again, he was seen in the lunchroom area 90 seconds after the shots were fired, first he slipped away towards the bus stop and got on a bus. This is Oswald we're talking about, but the bus was going too slow. So, he got off and walked a little further towards the Greyhound station before ultimately taking a cab back to the house in Oak Cliff that he slept in during the week while at work. He came in quickly. He changed his dark coat out for a light one and went on his way. While he was walking along 10th Street, he was spotted by police officer J.D. Tippett, who was in a patrol car nearby. In Oswald, Officer Tippett supposedly saw someone

who fit the description of the shooter that had gone out on the radio, tried to stop him, and was shot down cold blood by Oswald with his snub snub nose revolver. At 1.04 p.m., just 34 minutes after President Kennedy had been shot, Oswald's housekeeper, Erlene Roberts, looked out to see him standing at a bus stop, and by 1.06 p.m., Officer Tippett was dead on the floor. But the first weird thing about this story is that the description that went on the radio, as I said last time, wasn't a good description of Oswald at all, who again would be 24 years old and 30 pounds lighter than this. Here is that description for Jesse to read for Beta. Attention all squads, the suspect is believed to be a white male aged 30, 5 feet 10 inches,

slender build, 165 pounds, armed with what is thought to be a 30-30 rifle. No further description on information at this time. Also, it's vague, but in a moment of panic where the fucking cop, I mean, the president was just shot, I also imagine anything close somebody might just try and stop him on the off chance. Sure, this is pretty far away from the schoolbook depository, just to be clear. They were making a center around the city center where the attack was, and this was just the guy in this area who happened to see this guy. Also, I should point out that for a suspect that was allegedly armed with a rifle, according to the radio, it's very strange that what people reported seeing was a patrol car kind of like pulling Oswald over to

talk to him from the curb to the sidewalk. He didn't immediately get out of the car, he didn't have his weapon out, and according to everyone on record, it looked like they were talking, quote, amiably, end quote, almost like two friends before tipping, tipping, tippet finally did get out and Oswald shot him three times or five times. Nobody's sure exactly. Yeah. I if you know, if that's true, to me, and again, this is all obviously just my own personal conjecture, the dude probably panicked. Yeah. He probably thought, oh, shit, I'm caught as soon as the cop tried to step out and he probably just like, fuck, and just like shot him. It's very possible. Also, from the house where Oswald's landlady saw him, the area where tippet fell was

literally a mile in the other direction, which is a pretty far distance to travel in just two minutes. So much so that since there wasn't a single witness who saw Oswald sprinting or even walking between the bus stop and the shooting location, eventually the time of officer tippet's death was eventually moved forward in the Warren Commission by 10 minutes to 1 16 p.m. Just because it wouldn't fit. But was it Oswald? After all, who did this? There weren't a huge amount of people who saw it and only 12 were mentioned in the Warren report. But there were at least three more witnesses whose accounts weren't included in the Warren Commission and all three claimed to have been threatened with violence relating to it. First was Akilah Clements, who was sitting

up the street on her porch when she saw officer tippet get killed. She said she actually saw two men attacking tippet and that the one with the gun was, quote, short and kind of heavy on end, quote. But even wilder, she says that the Dallas police warned her that if she mentioned this to anybody, quote, she might get hurt. And then there was Domingo Benavidez, who actually, and when did she come out? Wait, when did she come out to say all that? Do we know when she came forward during the time? All three of these guys actually. Then there was Domingo Benavidez, who actually testified that he had, quote, really got a good view of the killer and that the guy did kind of look like the guy in the papers. But that, quote, I remember the back of his head

seemed like his hairline sort of went square instead of tapered off. It kind of went down and squared off and made his head look flat in the back. And sure enough, he too says that he was threatened by police who told him not to repeat it. Did he say he saw one or two people? Do you know? He said that he got a good view of the killer. And I don't know if that at what point or if they ran in different directions or what. Then there's Warren Reynolds, who did not see the shooting, but was sitting in his office near a second story window when he saw the shooter running from the scene and gave chase. He lost him in a nearby parking lot, but directed officers west to where they eventually found Oswald hiding in the movie theater. Reynolds eventually did

talk to the Warren Commission and did say the man he saw was Oswald. But it's also true that in January and February of 1964, Reynolds also survived an attempt on his life where a man hiding in his basement came and shot him in the head. And then a man tried to lure his 10 year old daughter into a car with money. And then after he was fully recovered, someone still had the balls to sneak onto his porch and unscrew the light above his front door. Officially, he said that he thought the reason he was being targeted was that of all the witnesses that day, he was the only one who aggressively tried to catch Oswald and that a lot of people who saw him talk about the shooting on TV or heard him on the radio thought that he literally led the cops all the way into the movie

theater. However, according to Robert J. Groden, the staff photographic consultant to the House Select Committee on Assassinations, who eventually himself went on to be a pretty prolific JFK writer and ended up as the consultant on the good but factually incorrect Oliver Stone movie JFK, which I've mentioned before is a very good gateway drug into the JFK verse, even though you got to know that it's fucked up and kind of wrong. He said that Reynolds told him that before he was attacked, he would have told the Warren Commission that the shooter didn't look like Oswald to him. So just something to think about. Also, just after a bystander grabbed tippets radio and told the police he'd been killed,

patrolman H.W. Summers called in saying that he'd met a quote eyeball witness to the getaway man apparently armed with a 32 caliber dark finish automatic pistol, unquote, and that the dude had black wavy hair, a light Eisenhower jacket, dark pants and a white shirt. Also, Sergeant G Hill, who was there that day, said, quote, the shell at the scene indicates that the suspect is armed with an automatic 38 rather than a pistol. And again, police literally arrested Oswald with a revolver and he went out of his way to say it wasn't a pistol and that it was an automatic pistol. And then what about the fact that Oswald was shot dead on live TV? Let's watch that clip right now. It's another one that's just like absolutely crazy. This this is like this never happens.

This type of. Yeah, this was shocking. Officially on November 24th, two days after the assassination, Jack Ruby was in town to wire money to an employee of his at 1117 a.m. at the Western Union on Main Street, according to the stamp of completion on the cash transaction. He had his wife, a.k.a. his pet doxened Shiba with him. He called him. He called the dog his wife. And after that, he walked half a block to the HQ of the Dallas police, entered the basement, and while Oswald was being transferred from the building to an armored car in full view of a network TV pool camera, he stepped out from the crowd with his 38 Colt Cobra revolver and shot him once through the left front of his abdomen, through his spleen, through his stomach, through his aorta,

through his vena cava, through his kidney, through his liver and into his rib before stopping somewhere in the right side of his body. Detective Billy Combest, who knew Jack Ruby, yelled, Jack, you son of a bitch. Then immediately went back down to where they had taken Oswald in the jail office and asked him, do you have anything you want to tell us now? Oswald shook his head before falling unconscious for good a little later, and he was pronounced dead a little less than two hours later at 107 p.m. at Parkland Memorial, the same hospital where they took President Kennedy two days before. The the clip is wild to watch. It's not nearly as graphic, obviously. You just watch this guy run up. We get the back shot of him, and then you just see him pull out. You pull something

out. It's hard to see, and then you hear the gunshot. It's fucking nuts. You see Oswald just go like collapses to the ground. And in the in the the reporters like he's been shot. He's been shot. Oswald has been shot. He's been shot. He's been shot. It was so calm. So calm. Recording was a different thing back. I mean, like you think back to like, oh, the horror, like the reported stuff. I mean, like what's fascinating about the clip that you sent us is it's the CNN version from one of the shows. I'm sure they've done about it, but they clearly added music. Well, yeah, besides that, they like did something to the frame rate and like touched up the image, and which is great. But it also is jarring because suddenly it isn't like old timey photo. It just

looks like a black and white. It's because it's because it's on video, which runs at 30 frames per second rather than 24. So it looks like a soap opera. Jack, you son of a bitch. It looks like it's happening like you're watching a play rather than it being like old timey footage. It's wild. It's really crazy. According to Jack Ruby himself, he did it to redeem the city of Dallas after letting Kennedy die, that he was depressed over the assassination of the quote to the point. Sorry, he was depressed over the assassination to the quote point of insanity and also quote, he wanted to save Mrs. Kennedy the discomforture of coming back to trial. So the first thing I want to point out about this is how wild this would probably be to watch on news live, which is

just crazy. Yeah. But also like what the fuck? How did a fucking gunman get through during a prison transfer at a police station? And why was the dude holding on to Oswald, the one dude dressed in bright white in a sea of black and blue suits unless he was trying to guide the shooter to Oswald for sure? That's just something that people say. I don't know if that's true. Here's a quote. I mean, it is true. Like literally, it's true. The guy is the only guy wearing white is the guy holding Oswald, but it is a wild thing to think about. Here's a quote from the House Select Committee on Assassinations report for Mathis to read to show just how sus all of this was. I'm going to drop that right here for you. Yeah, yeah. Ruby's shooting of Oswald was not a spontaneous act in

that involved at least some premeditation. Similarly, the committee believed it was less likely that Ruby entered the police basement without assistance, even though the assistance may have been provided with no knowledge of Ruby's intentions. The committee was troubled by the apparently unlocked doors along the stairway route and the removal of security guards from the area of the garage near the stairway shortly before the shooting. There is also evidence that the Dallas Police Department withheld relevant information from the Warren Commission concerning Ruby's entry to the scene of the Oswald transfer. Yeah, that sounds like cops fucked up and they do what they always do and bury it. Yeah, they cover their ass. Also, in a private note to one

of his attorneys, Joe Tonohill, during his trial, Jack Ruby wrote, quote, Joe, you should know this. My first lawyer, Tom Howard, told me to say I shot Oswald so that Carolyn and Miss Kennedy wouldn't have to come to Dallas to testify, OK, which kind of throws some shade over his whole given motive. You know, that he said that I that he made in his testimony. But then there's also the testimony of Seth Cantor. Seth Cantor was a White House correspondent who was actually a passenger in Kennedy's motorcade, who said that he went to the hospital after Kennedy was shot and saw Ruby there at about 1 30 p.m. on the day of the shooting, asking him if he should close all his clubs for the three days of the weekend or whatever out of respect. And that he may have even seen Ruby

tampering with evidence at the hospital. But the Warren Commission decided that he was probably mistaken and his testimony was dismissed. This made Cantor upset, which spurred him to research Jack Ruby for years and release his own book on him, who was Jack Ruby, where he had this to say, which I will have Jesse to read. Here we go. I want to go back. Just remind me. I want to go back to the tippet bit after a minute. Sure. The mob was Ruby's friend and Ruby could well have been paying off an IOU the day he was used to kill Lee Harvey Oswald. Remember, I've been used for purpose the way Ruby expressed it to Chief Justice Warren in their June 7th 1964 session would not have been hard for the mob to maneuver Ruby through the ranks of a few

negotiable police to kill Oswald. I can I can see I can definitely think I can see the I can see Ruby problem may have gotten the idea of self to kill him. But if people knew him and whatnot, I can also see the cops or one or maybe one or two cops being like working with them or letting him in or just creating an opportunity for for these certain things to happen. Yeah, I can get some speculation out there because everybody knows that Ruby has these mob connections. People are saying that Oswald had Ruby's number like encrypted in his notebook, which I want to take with a grain of salt. People are saying that when Jack Ruby saw Oswald at one of the gun running houses one time, he was like, oh, yeah, me and that guy used to hang out at our

birthday parties when we were kids. There's all these weird things out there that are like, did Jack Ruby know Lee Harvey Oswald before this and speculation that maybe Ruby was supposed to convince some cops to kill Oswald, but then it didn't happen. So he went for it himself when he was down there. And that's why he was there that day was to convince some cops to do it. So there's some there's some stuff. What did you want to say about tippet? Well, because I because I remember reading to that the reason that the there was a reason that the shell casings didn't match or something, and I found it and I just think it's important we kind of throw that out there. Out of the four, I just read this real quick out of the four bullets

recovered from tippet's body, only one or none, depending on who you talk to, could be positively identified as having been fired from Oswald's revolver. The others quote unquote could have been fired from that revolver, but there was no certain match. And there was a reason for that when the revolver was test fired by the FBI, it was reported that it was leaving inconsistent microscopic markings on the bullets, i.e. two consecutive bullets fired from it could not be matched to each other. This was because the revolver had been rechambered for 38 specials, but not rebarreled for 38 specials. So the bullets were slightly undersized compared to the barrel, making their passage through the barrel erratic extensive damage to the bullets mutilation was

also noted. So the gun itself, what the barrel itself was too big for the bullet. So when he fired them, they bounced and would nick off the barrel kind of erratically, and it would just mark each bullet to look entirely different than the last. Even that is like suspicious. Even that is like some kind of weird trick for making your gun bullets hard to trace. You know what I mean? Like even that is weird. But yeah, I mean, like I say, obviously there's some weight that you should give to the official story. Like I don't want anybody to misunderstand what I'm saying here. I'm just no, no, no, and I'm not trying to shit like throw as much information out there as I can remember. I'm just trying to get you guys to think about these things a little

differently as I, you know, lay out a little bit more and a little bit more. And then eventually, you know, we'll hear some more stuff. Yeah, yeah. But with this first real mention of the mob in our story, I think it's time to bring part two of episode one to close. But before I do, I have one last quote for Mathis to read that's going to wet your guys' whistles for what lies ahead. Well, yeah, what's next week is a special week, isn't it? We still got it. We still got it. Okay, all right. Yeah, here we go. The malefic force of intelligence came into existence. So the psychic messages told us with the last of the megalithic peoples, and it appears that this above all other considerations

was the reason why the megalithic priesthood needed to pass on their knowledge. Nope. But what was this force? And how did it come to exist? Gainer's automatic writings suggest that it was not a living intelligence. If living is the right word as such, but more like a machine similar to a computer, exactly what this means we can only guess. However, we can perhaps make a conjecture. Nope. Part three of episode one coming next week. We'll see you guys there. How dare you? How dare you? Goodbye. Goodbye. He's looking dead in the camera just like... What? Yeah, yeah. What are you doing about this? JFK. God damn it, Alex. Anyway, me and my wife were sitting outside indulging on our porch one night enjoying ourselves.

I needed to go to the bathroom, so I stepped back inside, and after a few moments I hear my wife go, holy shit, get out here. So I quickly dash back outside. She's looking up in the sky. I look up too, and there's a perfect line of dozen lights traveling across the sky. Meet Nate. By day he works in I.T., but when he gets on the bike he becomes... Nature Nate. An outdoorsy type with his head in the clouds and a weak supply of trail mixing his cargo pants. Nature Nate leaves no trace except for native wildflowers. If a tree falls in the forest, he'll help it get back up. And Nature Nate rides with Geico, because getting specialty coverage for his motorcycle is the natural choice. Geico Motorcycle, expert coverage for both

your sides.