Chilluminati Podcast - Episode 2 - Skinwalkers - The Evil Druid Prestige Class

Episode Date: February 19, 2018

Episode 2 is here and this week we tackle Skinwalkers of Navajo legend. Fact or fiction? Or a mix of both? Is Jesse a furry?

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Shop Drunk Elephant Skincare now, exclusively at Sephora. Well, let's get into skinwalkers. I don't know if you guys saw the post I made on the Chiluminati Twitter, but did you see that webpage I was deep diving into with the space stars and like, I was like, it's a whole website dedicated to Skinwalker Ranch that just documents everything. And they have all kinds of reports and shit on it and it was just going through that website. It felt, again, very similar to Amityville, where I just felt like I was diving into this person who just discovered GeoCities and decided to make their own website.

It's just like... Did you ever listen to Astonishing Legends? I have not. That is where I found out about this. Oh, really? They were the same, like specifically about Skinwalker Ranch. They were like, we just like went into this on like a recommendation and like by the end, we were like, holy fuck.

Yeah. It's wild. It's so I probably spent the better half of, by the way, hello everybody and welcome to the Chilluminati podcast episode two. We should probably get into it officially. I'm super excited. This is going to be a really fun episode. This week, we're going to be talking about the legend of the Skinwalkers, which is an

ancient American Indian Navajo kind of lore thing. There's a lot to it that I didn't expect to. And the first half of the two weeks between episodes, I spent diving into Skinwalker Ranch before I was before I made like an executive decision of let's just do Skinwalkers for right now because yeah, it's a lot. Yeah, Skinwalker Ranch might be one of those things where we might have to do like two episodes on it at some point. Yeah, it's just like the Warrens.

It's like there's a lot to say. There's a whole, whole lot to say. But before we get into the episode, I want to say a couple of things. First, we are now officially up on iTunes. We're on SoundCloud. We're on Stitcher, tuner, you name it, Google Play, you name it, we're on it. I have submitted for Spotify. So if you listen at any one of those, especially iTunes, and you enjoy the podcast, hit the

five stars. We already have 19 or 18 five-star ratings on iTunes just in the first episode, so thank you so much. I appreciate that. Also, there should be a nice little musical intro that plays at the beginning of this episode. And I want to thank Matthew Proft for that musical intro. It's legit, it's so good.

It's really good. It is incredibly good. The musical stuff sent our way. But that is exactly what we kind of envisioned right away. So thank you, man. That's awesome. It was like within 24 hours. Yeah.

It was like within the 24 hours of the episode going live, people, he was just like, here you go. And I'm like, holy shit, that's perfect. That's perfect. Anyway, so thank you guys so much for the support on the first episode. We are super excited to keep doing this for you. I know a lot of people are like, we want, I want weekly, I want weekly, let's do this for every bi-weekly for a while and see how it pans out.

And then if people are super into it, I'm down to go weekly as long as the other boys are as well. But quite a shift from going from Amityville to Skinwalkers this episode. Yeah. We went to Crazy Town right away. I mean, the thing is, if you're going to do this, right, if you're going to do a podcast like this, is there really any other thing than diving into Crazy Town as soon as possible? That's another great name for this podcast is just the Crazy Town podcast.

I mean, it went, wait, just wait, man. When we get like, when we start doing UFOs, Jesse's going to lose his mind. Here's the thing. No, UFOs, I will never argue on the possibility of life existing out in the universe. That'll never be an issue for me. I just think UFO, if I was an alien from another galaxy, I'd be like, nah, I don't need to stop over there. Like, you keep driving through that town.

You don't stop. You're like, oh, they got McDonald's. I'm out. There's no reason for me to go there. But here's what's good. You'll lose your mind about Jesse when we eventually get there. There's the theory and the belief that UFOs are from another planet out in space or whatever. Are you saying it's time travel?

I'm saying that there's also the possibility that UFOs are actually from a parallel dimension and can warp space and time to breach that line between our realities. Again, again, let me just put this out there. You're from a different parallel dimension. You said yourself, I want to go to Earth 2017, 2018. Why would you do that? Wow. There's all the times you could travel.

Okay. Now, pass on that. But here, like, I don't want to get into it. But the reason they do it and the reason that they're here is because humanity and humans are able to access a very particular type of energy. And I'm not going to get into it. Easier than that. Is that energy called the bullshit?

Dude, again, wait till we get there. Because that is. I don't know how much Alex knows about what I'm talking about. I do. I do. I do know what you're talking about. And I am like, I am also like off work. Like as soon as we finished the first episode, I was like, oh my God, there's so many things

that I want to like, you know, talk about. And I already started like doing research on some things. I like got, I tracked like an urban legend down to its very first appearance, ordered the book from the 80s, reached out to the author, got a statement from the author. That's so great. Like with UFOs, man, like, like there's so many different theories of like, do you subscribe to like the, I think it's like the dominant 12 alien species, which include like the grays and the tall whites and the Nordics and the reptilians.

Yeah. I can't wait. I can't fucking wait. No, the answer is no. I do not subscribe to that. I do not subscribe to the ravings of lunatics. No, I don't. I don't.

Every once in a while, Jesse, you run across one of those stories that I don't know what it is. There are. Yes. There are some stories. I truly believe that there's the possibility that maybe 0.5% of alien related stories could be true. But the other 99.5% is bullshit.

People make it up because they want to feel important about the, uh, the recent like declassification the government did of like project with black book or whatever. That's what I'm saying. But, but I don't, I wouldn't say that. Oh yes. Well, that's clearly one of the 12 dominant, of course, like who knows what that could be. It's an unidentified flying object.

It could be anything. Who do? Like, what do we know? True. It's right. But for them to be like, it is definitely one of the tall white Nordic men like no, no, that's not real. That's not a real thing.

Stop it. Stop it. You just, you combine two alien races together. My bad. I'm so sorry. There's so sorry. There's the tall lights, which are the, they're in charge of the, the grays, which were commonly, we commonly run into.

Right. Everyone thought the grays, oh, I know this bullshit. I mean, everyone thought the grays were like the aliens, but actually the grays are really like the organic, the like organic robot things that like do the work. Yes. Like, I know all that bullshit. Here's the thing. His bullshit.

I refuse to subscribe to nonsense. I'm sorry. This show, you guys don't even know what sort of great arguments we have baked into the future. Okay. Okay. Okay. We got to, we got to focus up today though.

Two of the shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo, shoo Let's start today, I'll see, let's set the scene for you You're driving down a dark road in New Mexico, the middle of the night Your tow truck is, is bumbling down this busted up road and in the distance Am I the tow truck driver or am I the passenger? Yeah, you're the driver, you're the driver, alright? Question, oh, is there anyone in the passenger seat, in the passenger seat and is it a ghost that I picked up on the side of the road? It is, it is actually a, a, a small gray from a crashed alien spaceship that you are

Is that gray a ghost I picked up on the side of the road? It is a ghost of a gray of, oh yes, it's exactly what it is Oh my god, it's Jesus, it's Jesus Christ riding with you Yeah, I mean Jesus always rides with me, dude Yeah, okay, so, and you see like the glint of, of like a, of an animal's eyes in the middle of the road in the distance And it's probably a coyote, but the closer you get, the more you realize those eyes are more human than their animal And then that coyote, as you drive by it, looks at you and you notice its face is contorted half human, half beast And as you drive by it, it starts sprinting down the road with you

Keeping up 60 miles an hour, and then it gets up off of its two, uh, its four legs and it's now a human, a man Still beast jewel, but keeping up with you and chasing you That's impossible, that's it, you know, a man can run on two legs Because he's a skinwalker, he's no longer just a man That's not, nobody became, you said he became a man Well, he looks like he's a beast jewel He's like a beast man Yeah

Alright, look, look, in this scenario, if someone was a beast If I, first off, I noticed that some beast had the eyes of a man Which, if I noticed that, you know what, I'm doing good, I'm pretty good that night And then, if he starts following me, I'd be like, what the hell is this? If he turned into a man next to me, I'd run my pickup truck into him I'd take my tow truck and slam it into him, and then I'd report to the police and be like, that guy was a beast man If it were only so easy Right, if it were only so easy

Let's get into what a skinwalker is So where do they come from? What is a skinwalker? Well, a skinwalker comes from Diney, which is the native term for what we call Navajo culture By the way, while we're here at the top of this episode, guys, we do not have great, like, grasp on the way that these words Oh, no, whoa, we're gonna get into some weird shit, so So let's just all agree that, you know what, we're gonna try our best Right And we're gonna do our best, and if you think we're wrong, tell me in the comments that's totally fine

Or do your own research and tell me where I'm wrong there So this is like a Native American thing Yes, this is a Native American thing All right, all right, there are some Native American stories that I am truly inclined to be like So all right, all right, I'll let you take me on an adventure You might get there, by the time we start talking about the ranch, whenever we get there, then you're gonna start feeling like, whoa Yes All right

So, um, as I said, they are derived from Diney or Navajo culture They're witches, witches are seen as the polar opposite of ceremonial people, where ceremonial people will sing to heal and protect people Witches do the opposite, everything they do is evil and intended to hurt or curse and whatnot And that's kind of where skin watchers, skin walkers are, that's what they are in Diney culture, they're witches and they're evil Witches, it's like black magic kind of Exactly, witches are associated with harm to the community, transgression of societal standards Especially those relating to family and the dead, very, very, um, kind of broad evil doers The, okay, here's a word, now, pardon me if I say it wrong

The Yinaldushi is the type of witch that we know as skin walkers So there are different types of witches and the one we're focusing on here is the Yinaldushi Nal-d-lushi Yeah, Nal-d-lushi Skin walkers is what they're known as Um, they are believed to take forms of animals in order to travel in secret and do harm to the innocent In the Navajo language, the Yinaldushi actually translates directly to, with it, he goes on all fours Uh, perhaps the most common variety is seen in horror fiction by non-navajo people

Is the one variety that, uh, specifically referred to as And that is the type that Like I said, they're the type that turns into a beast man, can turn into animals, terrorizes innocent people So werewolves is what you're saying Very, very werewolf-esque, but you gotta understand werewolves, they have that full moon where they can't control themselves and they get bitten Usually it's an accident if you become a werewolf, whereas in this case, you're like almost like a druid Like an evil wolf So this is, uh, the wolf guys in Twilight then

I have never seen As a person who's never seen that movie, I, yeah, I assume I've seen it up in the trailers to know They apparently can turn into wolves at the flip of a switch So it's like, it's kind of like that, it's kind of like that, except like they're like Straight up, actually villains Yep, nope, they're straight up I mean, how do you know that? Why are they villains? That's just what they are

Because we'll get in here, here, you want to know why they're villains? Because they're a weapon of choice and a lot of the reason that they, uh, One of the things they have to use to kill somebody in order to become one of these things, which we'll get into the, that ritual in a little bit Is something known as corpse powder or corpse poison, which is anti-j-j-a-n-t-j Meaning literally witchery or harming is a substance made from powdered corpses The powder is used by witches to curse their victims Corpse dust is composed of ground infant bones or often twin infants Specifically bones from the fingertips in the back of the skull

The ye now delusci Blow it into the faces of their victims or down the chimney of the victims homes soon. That's cold, right? That's it's awful Soon after I've soon after they've inhaled it and breathed it in taken into their system Their tongue will start to swell and blacken they undergo convulsions and die Not not long after sometimes however, it just they just end up dying from what is seen as normal disease I you know what I don't believe that for a minute. I'm which part yeah the like like if they had gone into specifics like

the dust causes you to Have a blackened tongue and it swells then you go into convulsions and die and that was it period It's like okay this powder everyone knows like oh that must be a skin walker But then dot dot dot sometimes however victims simply just die because Uh, it seems like a normal disease, which is that's the bs factor. That's like the you kind of remember You gotta remember this is like part of their folklore also. So you know a lot of the time, you know, even if it's not Actually like one of these stories that we'll get into later like You know, it's it's kind of like a folk thing that like you know, oh sometimes when somebody's sick. It's actually like a witch

Yeah, that's what I yeah. No, I'm I'm hedging my best. I just feel like it's a little much to have the dot dot dot and then more things I'm saying it's quite possible because if there is a skin walker out there listening to this and they want to prove to the world They exist by killing me. I believe I believe you exist. Don't don't I don't need that It does give him the black tongue shit. Give him the black tongue shit. Don't give him I don't want the black tongue shit. No, man Rather than put that on me I mean I'm with alex is like the the whole disease thing that probably comes from

Older times where they couldn't explain where does where the hell somebody got sick? So they were probably just like, oh, it must be. Oh, absolutely But that's but I think that's the whole I think that's the whole thing at least so far from what I've heard It's the idea of we can't explain x y and z. So we put the blame on This other supernatural other worldly thing that scares kids and keeps people in line It's the it's the old like middle ages thing of like we'll just keep coming up with crazy terrible things that if you don't do this This is gonna happen to that kind of actually was gonna say you see that a lot in folklore around the world where Literal like kids disappearing could be just blamed on monsters or this certain disease is blamed on on witches and

Hell we were dealing with that colonial times. We're blaming the witch trials and all that stuff. So um another reason too though Jesse a counterpoint that you may not know the specifics is because traditionally navajos hesitate to discuss any Lore or witchcraft with anybody that's non navajo or who they just simply do not trust So can I ask you a question or or is it possible that they're like Hey

You white idiots stop asking us questions about stuff that isn't a real thing. We're trying to live our lives Well, it's not well, it's not central to their to their religion. You know what I mean? Like it's not really I I'd say this is like one of those things that you pull down the black case book and like talk about because I mean While it does stay in folklore most of the time the stories that you don't want to tell people are the ones that are And hard to swallow. There are still a ton of stories happening today Of people seeing skin walkers and like I said, there's a whole skin walker subreddit and everything I saw a video of a of a border patrol guard Um, he was just talking on camera interview style

about how he Multiple times have come across animals that would then stand upright like a man and run off cackling Like just weird weird weird shit. But then again, but why would an animal why would a skin walker show up and be like Ha ha ha got your bitch and run away. It doesn't make sense. Actually, it's a very good question um, one of the reasons is the They they they dedicate themselves and a lot a lot of the time to a coyote like god And that particular god is the god of trickster of tricking people and then they they revel in the idea of Causing immense fear and terror and those that they come across. They don't necessarily want to kill all the time

um, a lot of the time they just want to fuck with you and It's like even it's like pr for you. Yeah, it's evil pr Yeah It just makes everything very convenient that like they they're tricksters So they disappear all the time and that's why you never see them But I saw it right and I was like, yeah, of course you did because they're tricksters. I just All right. All right. This is an audio podcast But I do again just like that kid on the stairs who turned out to be that dude from that paranormal investigation at amityville

like oh, yeah I I implore you to go look up some evidence like some video or picture evidence of some skin walkers because some of the stuff out there is Not tight No, not at all. Um, and I don't think I wrote this down in the notes but one of the things that people say is they people will actively go out there and try and track skin walkers and 99% of the time they either are led to a dead end or led back to their own home And they blame that on the on the skin walker tricking them as opposed to them Getting lost and not finding anything

just saying So, uh, specifically animals associated with witchcraft like this usually include include the tricksters such as the coyote But include other creatures usually those associated with death or bad omens They might also possess living animals or people and walk around in their bodies by locking eyes with them Skin walkers may be male or female, but they are typically male Uh, skin skin walker stories told among Navajo children may be Complete with life and death struggles and the typical kind of fairy tale that you would tell children to not have them go out at night Or be home by a certain time type deal

or they usually end with the the The Navajo being killed or the kid being kidnapped Or the fat or it's a stalemate where the the skin walker will just be scared away very rarely if ever do the stories have anything to do with the Navajo winning the fight or Coming out victorious at the end of an encounter with a skin walker That usually does not happen the best that usually happens in any of the stories is that the skin walker is spooked off for one reason or another Um, let's see non-native interpretations of skin walker stories typically take the form of partial encounter stories on the road Which is the thing I was describing the beginning where the person is temporarily vulnerable

But then escapes from the skin walker in a non-traditional way seen in Navajo stories that take place away from home Sometimes Navajo children take euro-derived folk stories and substitute generic killers like the hook Which is a killer with a hook for a hand from the 50s in England And then they'll replace that was on the car And they'll replace that that killer with a skin walker to replace the story So like jesse was saying earlier a lot of you can see already that a lot of their their lore and a lot of their Stories are muddled with other stories around the world Yeah, it's definitely like a bogeyman like a cultural bogeyman. Yeah, it's but they're also they're also maybe something going on out

Yeah, I mean the thing that that interested me. I think when I was just researching is just like the countless stories that are still popping up about Uh skin walkers and encounters with them in new mexico and and all this other stuff and like They're every time you hear somebody tell one of these stories. They're always fucking horrifying like they're yeah Never never never like ghost stories are scary skin walker stories are like body horror Yeah, I'm not used to like I'm not used to like The imagery of an animal like seeing an animal and then watching it get up and run away. Yeah, you know what I mean the way that like that's like

That's like something that I think to to like people who know about this are like You know, that's like the trope Yeah, but like I don't think about that or like associate that with horror in my mind normally And like imagining that happening like scares the shit out of a ton of the art out there and uh The the drawings of people what people saw are horrific Like the the person underneath this this animal skin The animal skin is like dripping with blood and it has like excessive limbs that are long and scraggly and they're just they look

Terrifying they're they're awful. Yeah um But what like I said earlier like I just it feels like it's immediately always muddled with other stories and a lot of things like this Lose a lot of their credibility once you start mixing in folklore of other things And just replacing the monster of that particular story with a skin walker and being like oh It was a skin walker when in the original story. It was a hook-handed killer so yeah, um The cool thing though is and what we're going to get into right now because that's

I went diving for like where did skin walkers like where did this originate and because the Navajo are Uh, or at least they they were and maybe still are super secretive. It's really hard to figure out Where it all started and why this is beginning and it might even just be impossibly because I'm sure they're the the story of skin Walkers has been a Around for a very very long time before we even started colonizing. Yeah, I don't know how much I don't know how much recording of their folklore they do traditionally. There are stories Um of the Navajo people before colonization actually working with skin walkers occasionally But it always ends up bad and for them and that's kind of how it seemed that the skin walkers became almost like this

um They would use like the skin walkers to spy on Uh colonists because they could be animals And so they were almost like an enemy of my enemy is my friend situation for a while But eventually the skin walkers just became an enemy of both Uh, so there was a point in time There are stories that float around of the Navajo working with them for a little bit But the stories are rare and they're deep deeply buried in the recesses of horrifying websites that hurt your eyes to see

But they're out there. They're out there shout outs to yellow text bro yellow text on black backgrounds at twinkle You know that good stuff. It's really really good. Um But the cool part about the the cool part about skin walkers and the part that I really fucking enjoyed was just How you become one their weaknesses their powers and what they can do And this is what we're going to get into now So the aunt genie, which is the practitioners of the particular type of witchery are people who receive their supernatural power by breaking a cultural taboo Performing witchery on another innocent person upon the initiation of the aunt genie A person is said to gain the power to become a yin al dushi, which is what we talked about before with he who goes on all fours

Uh, this is done via a song and dance ceremony used to curse instead to heat instead of healing Which is how the healers and the spiritual leaders of the navajo usually did it It's kind of like a the negative version of that song and dance. Uh, it's like going prestige classes I wrote down here. It's like going prestige class in an mmo or something or in a video game or dnd Um, and then after that's performed you are now a a ye nal dushi Nal dushi nal delushi Nal delushi But before that that can take place

What the person has to do in order for you to become one of these in order for you to go through the ceremony This curse ceremony where others curse you and make you be you become the skinwalker You actually have to kill somebody Um, or do something horrible usually that so this is this is what makes them the correct other than a normal uh shamanistic character who would uh Commume with nature and gain like the power to become a wolf or something

This is you kill someone to gain these powers. Thus, you're the back. So you actually your class your class quests are all Yeah, so you actually have um, so Basically before we get into like the specifics, uh, although men and women can become one of these Like I said, usually it's men who do it And it's believed that only women who can bear no children or childless women are the ones that can become witches Otherwise for some reason they can't become one. Uh, and the details are kind of vague and not really there I will say after a curse area look at google for skinwalkers uh, most of them

most of the illustrations and or Dark night photos were of what appeared to be guys. However, I did see several like very sexy wolf chicks. Of course So, you know, I'm more you're more receptive now I'm in I mean I feel like if I ran across a sexy, uh, wolven female in the forest, they'd be like, you know what? Hey An area of life where you're outnumbered men to women like 30 to 1 so for every sexy wolf woman There's like 30 horrific coyote men

Around yeah, but you're implying that a sexy wolf woman wants to be with the sexy wolf man When really she could be with me, but she's But she's super evil down with that. She's super evil Yeah, but I'll overlook that That's nice. That's good. Does that make you a furry? I mean for this scenario, yes, I just want to make sure I just want to make sure we're on the same page She's she has the power to become a wolf woman. Hell yeah, I'm in I'm in so In that culture within skinwalker culture. There's actually ranks as well

Um, and there is the post the highest possible rank is called the klyziati, which means pure Evil in order to to become pure evil in order to to achieve this highest rank in skinwalker culture which culture You get a multiple choice of things you can do To become that evil. It's great all really cool. Yeah, so you can kill a close blood relative Tight you can just bang one of your family in incest Very cool, right? Or you can just bang a corpse. You can bang a corpse necrophilia Someone take all this out of context like alex is going very cool Then you can bang a corpse necrophilia. That's another way you can achieve this highest rank

nice nice Or let dude you can do all three kill a close blood relative then fuck your close blood relatives corpse Yeah, there you go. That's three in a row. Yeah, then you get all of it I mean then you you would have does that make you does that make you More evil than the most evil. I know i'm curious what that would that give you is that like the s rank of me You just get it. You just get a cool mount. You just get a cool mount and a alternate color for your weapon. Awesome. Oh, you get a new artifact. Oh So actually when you complete one or more of these acts, it's actually said to destroy Your inner humanity completely allowing you to become fully initiated in the way of witchery

So these are the acts that you would do to Just become as evil as possible and it's like selling your soul for for power more or less So I can imagine it's like well, I'd like to keep part of my soul But I really like to turn into an animal so I'll be like a low ranking skin walker I'll just blow some corpse dust on somebody that's not a close blood relative. Maybe it's a neighbor I hate a lot and he's kind of a dick and he keeps like Pissing in my farmland in the middle of the night because he's trashed. So if I just blow some corpse dust in in farmer john's face He'll die. My life will be better and I can turn into an animal. I won't be fully evil. I'll still have some of my soul

But I'll get some sweet powers I'd do it. I get it. I get it. I get why somebody would do that. That's what i'm saying. So Skin walkers specifically are usually seen as coyotes wolves fox eagles the usual But it's also said that they actually can take the form of Any animal they choose a decision based on what abilities they need So this is where like the druid aspect that I see in like dnd or video games come in They can turn into what if they need an ability They can just turn into that animal no problem. They need to fly turn into a bird

They need to run really fast turn into a wolf or a cat of some sort of coyote Anything that they need to do they have the ability to just do and it has There's no real Specific rules. In fact, some navajos actually believe that skin walkers have the ability to steal the face of a person And just be that person So then my question is does that mean maybe trump is just a skin walker? It's possible Like a really bad one who has like yeah, that's why his face is so orange

It just doesn't look natural Because he didn't yeah, he locked eyes with a with some guy That's what it was trump locked eyes with a skin walker years ago And that skin walker has been puppeting that body around way too long Way longer than he should That's great um So yeah, they can they can steal faces possibly which is just a weird power

Other abilities that they are said to possibly have if you ever lock eyes of the skin walker They can absorb themselves into your body. They can read your mind They can freeze you up with fear to the point where you can no longer move scream or do anything And that's the type of shit that always freaks me out right and it's like night terrors And when they and the the reason they do this also jesse When you're asking is because they could kill you But if they scare you they feed off of that energy That's what the skin walkers feed off of your fear and your terror

So outside of you know, this trickster coyote god, they are also literally sustaining themselves off of your fear but I guess I don't know if that limits the horror of a skin walker if I know that they're just there to scare the shit out of me Just to feed off of my fear. It means they're probably not gonna kill me Let me ask you this like have you ever even just been walking through the woods And just seen like a deer. Yes like at night. Yes I used to live in an area where there was a ton of deer and their glowing eyes are fucking scary as shit Like that shit is just scary already. Yeah, but that's but that's like built into your human dna

Yes, like that aspect of us is what we 4 000 years ago You know long than that a million years ago. We were like eight men Like it's what kept our asses alive Right, but that's exactly what I mean like now imagine if it was a skin walker and like it doesn't my life doesn't need to be necessarily in danger For me to like literally shit myself and be ruined forever by the by the encounter But I think that it that the the legend the myth is feeding off of that

natural inherent human emotion of like i'm alone at night I'm ultra aware hyper aware that anything could come get me. I'm alone And so it feeds off of that as well and I just as you know as much as I want to truly if if Even if you're saying like back in colonial times These skin walkers allied with the native people to spy on the colonists And they get their whole thing they get off on fear

Why isn't there hasn't been like the great skin walker war? Where the skin walkers to have I just don't it's not their style. It's not their style Their style then makes no sense. Well, they also have weaknesses. Yes, which we're gonna get into their weaknesses are fucking Metal I love their weaknesses so much because it's so gamey. It's so like So video gamey and it's it's probably stupid to say it's video gamey because I'm sure video games Obviously rip from lore not the other way around But as somebody who is probably who's introduced to a lot of this lore

First from like books and video games and dnd. I love it. It's just wild. It's super cool. Um So uh just a little bit more about what skin walkers look like In human form, they're very hairy. They usually wear the pelts that hilarious. Yeah, of course They usually wear the pelts that they were wearing during their initiation, which is the only thing they were wearing their initiation Any wounds that they receive in human or animal form translate back and forth So there's no like I gash you in the chest But if you turn into a coyote that gash is now gone. No it translates. You can't you can't like heal yourself like that Um, what if I snap your antler off?

Yeah, good question. What happened? I assume the antler would stay missing in animal form But what kind of wound would that be in human form? Just like a really weird bald patch on the top of your head Just think your hair is missing But that's like not it's not hair though. I just There's there's a lot of questions here that are unanswerable because they can't answer them mythology wise It no one cares, but like if this is a real if this was a real thing I just oh, okay. I'm gonna Hands off for the moment. We're almost done getting through like the basics of skin walkers because again

If we really wanted to we could probably spend an entire two episodes going through like the history and like but yeah It takes a minute it takes a minute to like understand exactly what they are But the real Shit of this comes from the story right and I think we'll probably hit more of that when we eventually hit skin walker ranch Because I think skin walker ranch is going to be a doozy of an episode Yeah, and like I said, it might even be like a two-parter at that point. We'll see However skin walkers are not you know, they're not invulnerable. They have weaknesses And they're very like cliche weaknesses

So one of the weaknesses before we get to their deaths is straight from vampire lore They cannot enter the home of somebody else unless they are innervited in So skin walkers cannot cross the threshold of a home Um, but that therefore they've actually developed the ability or always had the ability one way or the other to make any sound They wish from animal forms to crying babies sometimes just to draw the person out of the home To uh to get them to to step away from the safety of their home There's actually a story that I read of a man who lived on a farm Um, and all he heard all of his sheep going crazy

So he stepped outside and what he saw was all of his sheep in the corner of a pen Shivering and the goat that was part of the the flock off on one side Standing on his back legs with his hooves crossed in like badass villain style laughing at the sheep And then he eventually saw the man and then like went back down to to to goat form And then went back with the herd and just mingled with them And so my question would be why wouldn't you just kill the goat right then and there? Why would you just let him go back with the sheep? Because I would be too busy scaring the shit out of myself like I that that is like

I don't know. I would know if I don't know if I would ever touch that goat again That goat is clearly not a goat I guess I guess I just I don't know. I wouldn't I would be too scared They can look at me and take my face or something And there's a lot of stories like that too where like they realize it's a skin walker The skin walker goes back to being an animal and then they just like leave the animal alone It's like why why would you why do you do that? Why do you see your goat from your pen standing upright laughing?

And then he sees you and then he goes he gets all scared and goes back to goat form And then you're just like, oh, well, I guess that's just that's my life now Well, like All right. All right. All right assuming Assuming we believe that this is even a real story to begin with and not gibberish Uh-huh. If I was this Skin walker. I don't understand how the skin walker feeds off fear. Correct. The skin walker then sitting there as a goat laughing at the uh

uh sheep Would then be freaked out and like oh, I'm just a goat Instead turn to the guy and be like what up and freak out the man too because that's more fear, right? I don't understand why I agree like when I read that I was very confused And I think if there is any truth to skin walkers and I'm not saying that there isn't because I like to try and be like I I'm that I'm that guy with the poster on as well It says I want to believe right like I that's literally on my wall in my Yes

So my guess is that if there is any factual Aspects of it It's it's buried underneath the the the fantastical stories that have been told over and over again That have muddled maybe what the true powers of a skin walker are With what people believe or wish the skin walkers had for powers I maybe the skin walkers are less powerful than the stories tell Um if if they exist and maybe they can only turn into animals and stuff because there's a lot of stories like that Jesse where

Just the the outcome of the story is like I don't understand why that's the outcome like why are you just being okay with it or whatever Why would you not run to the house or just take your sickle and just be like you know what goat you are good I got great milk out of you, but it's time to i'm hungry for goat meat You got to go right it just seems like a story that you would tell as sort of a like a scary story around a campfire that is inspired to uh Create fear, but also sort of like have the mind wonder I get all of that, but I just think it's you know, it's one of the many of the examples of

um terrible bumps in the night kind of stories from all parts of society and mythos all Are different to the point where it's the even the fundamental Basis of what these creatures are has to change in order to keep up with the way people tell the stories So eventually you have a character like the skinwalker who is Also like a vampire now and can become not just a wolf, but any animal in order And it just keeps expanding to the point where it becomes Borderline. All right. I can't believe this now. Yeah. Well, how about well, how about this?

How about this though like 10 years ago for example, right? I was sick in bed with a fever. Okay, and I you were cursed to bed. Yeah. I was cursed by uh Corpse poison, right? Uh, no, but no, but I was I was sick in bed and I woke up and I couldn't see Okay, and I was completely blind. There was nothing on my face. It was daytime And I I was like touching my face and trying to figure it out and instead of like Getting up and going to the doctor. You know what I mean? Yeah, I was in that like I just woke up Sort of like dream haze. Oh, yeah. Yeah. That's gonna be very scary

Yeah, and so I was very very scared. I felt like panic in my whole body But instead of doing anything about it. I just grabbed my sheets Put them back over my head and tried to fall back asleep and when I woke up again, and I could see again I never I was just happy for things to be back to normal Did you ever ever go to the doctor? Yeah, so wait, what do you mean though? What what is the what is the purpose of the story? I guess I'm asking

If the goat goes back to normal Right. Yeah, like You know, maybe I wouldn't investigate further Oh, because you in your mind, you're like, maybe if I just go to sleep and wake up everything will be normal I don't have to deal with this again. So so it's it's you're saying that he possibly Would then be like, oh, I must have it must have been hallucinating like you're just like, oh, shh Like fuck like what the fuck was that? I don't know am I crazy? I would I would think that I was crazy before I believed that I saw a goat standing on its high legs

But I but the Stories are the information that I was given is that these these skin walkers Feed off fear right right and so if they feed off fear, why didn't he keep confusion is in fear confusion It's confusion. Yeah, well, maybe it's like it's like a great trick and you're like, oh man He's gonna be of all night trying to figure out if I'm real, but if I I guess I'm saying I'd probably be a gluttonous skin walker. Give me that fear, baby. I just don't I I'm not I can't I can't presume to understand The intricacies of Navajo black magic, but maybe it's maybe there's quotas Maybe you just maybe you just got to do what you got to do like maybe it was like all right today

Like the voice from the blackness tells you like go laugh at those You know what I mean like I don't know I don't I don't question I don't question the Uh mythos behind stuff like this. I feel I don't this is the way I always feel about things like this where especially if it's a native story or if it's a story from like a Celtic culture or a um Something where the average like Joe on the street

Because it's not their way of life It's very very different and so they want to put a Because it's so different because it's ancient It must be special and must be mythical and supernatural and and so they add more um Importance to what is being told rather than just I'm sure if you talked with the vast majority Of native peoples they'd be like it's just you know, it's it's it's a myth. It's a myth. Yeah And it's something like if someone started talking about how they truly believed in the ancient Greece

Legends and myths And we're like, yeah, no, that's totally true. Uh, oh man that minotaur. He's out there. Yeah. Yeah Or maybe they're just not like that Maybe they're just not telling the real shit because they don't trust you though, you know But and I think that's that's another part of it too is people think Because we as a society, especially in America Wronged the native people so much that they're keeping stuff from us So that must also be it because they don't trust us and it's one of those things where

Okay, sure maybe Maybe but I don't think that we'd go this long without someone I don't I don't know it just doesn't I mean I see what you're saying like It's interesting too because you talk about other cultures and like Naturally when we're researching these things you do come across skinwalker type monsters and other cultures and

While they have kind of like the same base set of powers They're their purpose and what they do and why they're around and how they become those things are wildly different Than what the navajos say so that's the stuff that's less like I don't know like you read these stories and you're like, okay Like this happened. I don't know what it was right for sure Yeah, but you know the navajo do because they have a story about something like that So they say oh that that was a skinwalker right, but you never know you never know what's actually out there Yeah, that's the thing about this that really scares me. Yeah. No, I I agree I I agree with you just like I can't imagine driving around midnight in like the middle of the desert and coming across something

That you just can't quite figure out what it was and But Anyway, moving on. Um, so that's one of their weaknesses. They can't they can't cross into your home unless you invite them in Um other things that can kill them. Uh, there's two Known ways of being able to kill skinwalker one if you know the identity of this is classic trope If you know the identity of a skinwalker and speak their full name The skinwalker would either die or get sick really really sick and die or just get really really sick from all the wrongs that they've done Um, depending on how severely bad their wrongdoings were I guess, uh, again the

The explanation of it is really vague. It's very much like you can speak their name in full and either they'll die Or they'll get sick one or the other What will happen? Well, I guess it depends on how evil they are So they did they kill their family member and then fuck the corpse right? Just are they like a low-ranking skinwalker? Are they like a high-ranking skinwalker and I guess that'll depend on where they rank We'll determine if they die But the coolest way to kill a skinwalker

The best way is what I said earlier where you put a you shoot the Shoot the a bullet in the back of their neck with the bullet that was dipped in ash Which is how hellboy kills a skinwalker Is it really I don't know. No, no, no, I just like I don't like a bullet like that's That's probably not in the navajo legends. Have any of you read Dresden files. I'm curious No, no, I've never actually read it as much as I as much as I like I'm like always being recommended it Have you have you Jesse at all? No, okay, so I've only read the first book of the Red Dresden files. First of all phenomenal first book

I'm looking forward to reading more, but apparently so Dresden files Long story short is a fiction novel series about a wizard in modern day living in Chicago Who's like a private eye and deals with all the supernatural crimes around city really kind of cool cool premise And I guess he deals with skinwalkers pretty often As information brokers and stuff So I was just curious if they if you had read it if they represent some of the weaknesses of skinwalkers From fact or if they just make them up No, I gotta get into I I should just take now that I'm like on here. I feel like I should take the dive

I mean, it's a they're really easy reads. Like they're yeah, that's what I've always that's what I've always heard It's that they're just kind of like pulpy. I blasted through the first book in like a day and a half and I was done Um, was that like recently? Uh, yeah, it was within the past six months Cool. Yeah, there's like 13 or 14 books. They're they're good. They're fine. The first one. All right Um, but that that's and that's like the two known ways to kill a skinwalker speak his full name like any typical Paranormal thing to get rid of it. You speak. It's like mix'll pick from Superman or whatever his name is or pixel plumber, whatever Um, and then he'll either die or get really sick. I guess like I don't know if I would ever risk just speaking the name of

A skinwalker because if he doesn't die and he just gets really sick I'm assuming he has like a small list of people who probably know his name in full And if he just doesn't die, he just goes looking for these people and starts killing them to make sure nobody ever knows his name Um, that's what I would do as a skinwalker if I got really sick and I was just like, oh somebody spoke my name All right. Well, there's like five people who know me Skinwalker strats. Yeah skinwalker strats um And uh in the bolt in the back of the spine and that's like the two ways to kill them and that's your basic navajo lore

Uh, that's your basic skinwalker navajo lore. They're normal people who want to become these witches in order to do so they Hurt or or injure or kill a civilian an innocent if they really want to Get rid of their soul completely they kill somebody that they know that's a club A close blood tie incest or necrophilia And you gain these abilities to turn into an animal or possibly a human and possibly mind control and possibly mind read and get All these really neat powers and you so you subsist off of fear and you kind of What your purpose is and what you do is?

Really vague and unknown and why they're around and there's also theories out there that I really didn't want to get into Because they're ridiculous that actually involve aliens Um, which we will now we can talk about more at skin walker. I was gonna say when we get to skinwalker ranch I think that's what we're going to start talking about the skin walkers and their potential alien ties that they have um, the thing about a lot of Just supernatural stuff is if you try hard enough you can tie it to aliens every time every Single time when I went to skin walker ranch. I was like, oh ufo's of course, of course ufo's so Um, yeah, there's there's possible things. So jesse you have been dunked headfirst into the quick learning of what a skin walker is

What do you think? truthfully, I Love the concept of a skin walker. I think it's very cool the idea of Someone who can change their shape and I think it's something that a lot of people would want But I like the twist that it's a bad thing right to to be able to do this people who do this are actually evil Um, I would love to know the good version of it And if they have like a cool supernatural underground war because that would be great, but I also think that

everything you said Still has that vibe of a very cool myth and something that in uh Like ancient I don't even know ancient but hundreds of years ago native culture was A thing that was used to explain supernatural stuff or things that appeared supernatural And was used as sort of a don't go out late at night because there's just skin walkers out there used to Uh, also if you were just an asshole and you wanted to make like a scary story and freak people out I feel I feel the reason why it's a trickster

God related kind of thing is because you need to hide the evidence that way but also it's kind of um a good Not just convenient, but like the person telling the story is the embodiment of that trick right that the people telling the story They're making bs up tricking you into getting scared and they're part of that Trickster god mentality, right? I think it's it's very cute and cool I don't necessarily believe any of it, but I think the the the lore behind it's fascinating

And I can't wait to see how this translates into Skinwalker rants or whatever the hell that is and how this all I'm Really curious where we're about to go this this this creature gets so much scarier in Like primary sources. Yes, that's and that's what we were a few that I picked So there's a fuck ton of stories out there and I found a website that was kind of that kind of aggregated some of the Best ones out there. So that's where I grabbed three stories from one we can each read And there's some really like creepy shit involved in them

Jesse before we get into the stories You did mention the good version of it the good version of it of a skinwalker is really just the way they talk about it It's just the spiritual healers They don't call what they do magic or witchcraft They just call it healing via the spirits and they have the ability and again I didn't really put it in here because it didn't really matter all that much but From what I understand the the Navajo healers have the ability to make like Special holy totems that will keep skinwalkers away

They can like say prayers to heal those who have been cursed by a skinwalker So like they have like the priests in each village that can hope help negate the the skinwalker curses and stuff And can create a barrier of protection from them That's like the good that's like the good the light versus the void if you want now I'm just imagining like Navajo Salem's lot like That'd be a that'd be a great story Um, yeah, that would be good. All right. So we've got three stories. I'll read the first one

It's relatively short. Alex will read the second one and Jesse will read the third one which Is yeah, okay. I've got all three there. So these are pretty creepy And they they've not read through these at all yet. So I'm psyched. Yeah, these are really really fun So I'll start with the first one This one is a bow. I from my understanding like a young teenage girl This happened to her when she was like a young teenager My grandmother on my mother's side has always been very superstitious. No, no, no, come on. No, that's not a good That's not a good voice for her

Come on. That's a great voice for a young 13 year old girl Just I'm going with it. You can't stop me. No For lack of a better word, she's not religious, but she does believe in a lot of paranormal stuff Bye everyone. Thank you for listening Listen, it's not that long Her mother was full blooded Navajo and her father was Irish either way She'd never been anywhere east of Montana and grew up in Nevada One year when I was in grade school

We went to visit her most of the visit was pretty uneventful typical boring old people stuff Except she always kept her curtains drawn shut and would always peek out the window when someone asked what she was doing She would simply reply Yenna delushi is watching me This went on for nearly the entire visit until a few days before we were due to leave My grandmother and my then a baby brother. He's 19 now lol We're in front of the yard that evening planting flowers when all of a sudden my grandmother starts shouting Insert little brother's name here get away from that creature. It's not safe

Of course being in Nevada we all assumed that my brother had found a scorpion or a rattlesnake So we all ran outside to see my grandmother clutching my little brother and shaking in terror against the side of the house Standing out in the yard was a large black great dain sized dog It was staring at my grandmother with an intensity I'd never seen before It looked up at us gave us a little huff and bound it off I don't remember if it moved unusually fast or not, but do remember it had really deep yellow eyes When my mother asked of my grandmother what happened. She kept repeating The Yenna delushi has found me. She then moved a couple weeks after that

Woof there you go. That's the that's the last out of the three. That's like the last weird one um Not sure why the dog Ran off and huffed he like seemed frustrated I guess And the idea that this thing has been hunting her grandmother for however long and every day she's peeking out It's kind of creepy. I can't imagine being hunted by this Animal creature the skinwalker and then just having to move two weeks later because she This great dain sized dog creature found her and ran off

That's funny because late in my grandmother's life. She uh She started to talk about these ghosts this ghost or something that was like in her house And that was like kind of like it was similar. It's like, you know norm for the most for the most part It was always a normal visit to grandma's house, you know, she'd cook or whatever hang out But then like every once in a while like she'd be like, man I didn't get any sleep last night because like this ghost was just like walking around the house and I was like in my room terrified of this ghost Just like really weird to hear my grandmother talk like that because she never

That's actually interesting because my grandmother grew up um In the 20s and she's my great-grandmother rather Uh, she's still alive today and she will always talk about How she had two little kid ghosts living in her apartment when she was a kid or in a house that she lived in And at night they would always run up and down the hallway and eventually jump onto the bed that they were sleeping in They wouldn't see anything, but they would feel it kind of so it's so creepy. It's just like I don't know what that is. I it's weird because my grandma never talked about

She was never like into that shit and then all of a sudden like there's a ghost in my house What I think I think it has to do with that Idea that your parents or your grandparents as a child You see them differently than any other person right because they're your grandparents or parents and they're special and they're above Uh, everyone else and it's not until much later in life you discover The weird quirks that your parents had or that your people in your family had and so you realize. Oh, they're human too So I think a lot of people don't they they the idea that you're weird out by that. I think is like it You not expecting someone who you're so highly of having

Right like human being paranoid flaws. Yeah. Yeah, I feel you. I feel you. How about this one? This one. I'm ready. Alex I was spending a month with my cousins at my grandma's house always the grandma Yeah, I know it was august and my cousin's ages range from 10 to 15 and I was the oldest being 15 the most credible then Yeah, I was staying with a 10 13 and 14 year old We stayed up telling scary stories often but one night a few weeks in we decided to make a campfire out back My grandma's house is in a rural suburb The neighbors aren't too far when you're driving down the road to her house

But in the backyard it's thick forest with man-made paths through it Each house is on a hill. So only part of the basement was actually underground That isn't important until later though. So we're towards the east side of a yard in a smallest patch of open land You couldn't see the neighboring yards from there and there was probably three quarters a mile to each side of us That belonged to my grandma. Okay It was maybe 11 at night and we were playing truth or dare after telling scary stories And my 14 year old cousin dared me in the 13 year old to go walk through the paths for 10 minutes or so I said yes right away as I wasn't easily scared and rather level headed

But my younger cousin was a bit more hesitant We didn't bring a flashlight because it wasn't pitch dark yet and we could see enough to not die We were walking through the paths for about five minutes and could barely see the fire through the trees when we decided to turn In the middle of the path was a large dog-like creature Hunched over with its front hands an inch from the ground What I remember most was how its eyes were so fucking bright white And it was humanoid dog shaped with a human-like head But a dog-like body but human hands and feet

It looked right at us And I know I was paralyzed with fear as it dashed away the opposite way from us towards a creek that ran through the yard Eventually my cousin and I screamed bloody f and murder and the other cousins and my grandma ran to us I don't remember much here because I was really disoriented and I couldn't think properly But I did wake up in bed. So I assumed that I was brought up to the house All the kids slept in the basement in a big room with sliding glass doors to the outside as the room was on the side that wasn't underground My bed was pressed against the big glass window and I couldn't see my cousins playing outside down below The house is in michigan

So it gets slightly chilly even in the end of august and there was a slight breeze So I put on a jacket and ran to join them outside skipping breakfast and not wanting to miss out on anything fun When I got down I could tell they weren't playing but rather running to get my grandma Her dogs both of them were dead ripped up that night. We went to bed early I woke up at maybe two in the morning because I felt something hit my head My cousins were all sitting on the double bed opposite me on the other side of the room There was one bunk bed and two double beds the double beds for me and my 14 year old cousin They were being quiet and staring at me the 13 year old nodded his head towards the window. I froze

They all looked afraid. Oh man. I'm getting goosebumps. I don't know. I don't know what's about to happen I turned my head slightly to the side and I saw a really messed up looking face pressed to the window with gaping eyes looking down at me I screamed so fucking loud and it bolted my grandma called the police after I told her what happened and they found nothing I went home after that and I've never been there during the night again Yikes First of all, I love the idea of being like, come on jimmy. It's fine. We'll go into the forest jimmy's like, but isn't it dark? She's like, I can see fine enough that we won't die. Yeah, we won't die We're not gonna die

also the visual of waking up to your cousin's like nodding at the window and there's this fucking Monster looking in just staring down at you not knowing why they're scared. Yeah I feel like for most of that Uh, I think it seems very much like ideas stolen from movies. However That's a very I don't believe the story, but it's a very good story because it's specific. Yes, right? I like good Scary stories are specific and that story was like here's what took place and here's the property And I'm giving you an outline of what this looked like and this is what I was doing and I like that story I don't believe it, but I like that story. That was a good one. I gave you the longest one Jesse

So enjoy animals getting animals getting fucked up is like a big part of the skin walker vibe Yeah, it's so weird like They always talk about how skin walkers want to scare you but every time you find them and you're or you scream loud enough They run away But it's also that yeah, and and again I guess you did scare them But then if they want to scare you and suck up your energy, do they get like a real quick buzz? It's like a five-hour energy shot and they're out. I don't

I don't know. I don't get it It makes me wonder if that goat in the pen didn't want to get caught because he had a really good life Scaring the sheep at night and that's what he was feeding off. It's a good gig. That actually reminds me. Have you seen the movie the witch? Yes, that was such yes. That's actually a really cool movie. Yeah, that's a fuck. That's a that's a that's one scary goat And like that's what I'll say one of the only movies to do like old timey talk and make it sound kind of natural Yeah, that's real. That's real and there's dead babies in that movie too It's just like another part of skinwalker legends So maybe that's right and the the the witch in it can like look like a hot woman

Yeah, so maybe that was just maybe they should have called that movie the skinwalker just say holy crap The witch was a retelling of a skinwalker happening told through christian eyes. Yeah, boom Oof, okay All right last story Go for it. Oh boy. Okay. You gave me a good one I Decided to join my bestie carrot for a three-day stay at her grandmother's place in the res Her grandmother lives near a place called tuba city, arizona. I'm going nowhere, but surrounded by rural homes

We go to college together and I was kind of interested to know about navajo tradition The first day we stayed was pretty chill and nothing out of the ordinary But then her grandma not that old around 67 think around 67 Bless this girl for saying 67 is not that old. She knows how to kiss ass. She's good It might even saying around 67 like it's a very specific number to say around for She probably knows she's exactly 67 and wants to just cast some doubt on it right grandma's reading She's being polite to grandma. I get that. Yeah That's why she's like not that old because grandma is reading this story. Yeah

Uh, so that a stray dog came out of nowhere and wouldn't leave to me It did act kind of strange and ugly. It was kind of ugly looking ugly looking Yeah Black shaggy coat look like it makes between a german shepherd in a lab That night we were watching a movie in the living room. So I guess What she's saying is that the grandma was just like there's a dog on the property. Is that what she? Yeah, it looks like I can't get rid of this fucking dog. Yeah

Yeah, she basically said a stray dog came out of nowhere and wouldn't leave her leave her alone All right, I just feel like that's I feel like that's a weird transition the first day We stayed was pretty chill nothing out of the ordinary, but then the grandma's like there's a stray dog that showed up We got to progress. You got to progress. You know, it's like a horror story. So, you know, oh, that's weird I get it. I just what a weird like grandma's like no, there was nothing weird happening But then a dog showed up like, oh, okay, sure, um That night we were watching a movie in the living room

Had big windows and looked out onto the front where cars were parked nothing fancy With the curtains wide open grandma was in the kitchen cooking dinner and we were watching a movie Next to the window is a medium bookshelf where we kept the dvds Karen went to put a dvd back that we just watched But she freaked out because that stray black dog was staring at us through the window standing on top of the wood box outside Not something normal dogs do from my point of view or hers Usually my dog, which is a house dog scratches at the door to be let in Res dogs aren't allowed or res dogs aren't house dogs

And dogs inside houses are frowned upon in Navajo tradition meant to protect the house the owner The other dogs seem to stay away from this dog. Karen opened the door and yelled at it to get off that box It ran off behind the shed cut time out Why is the grandma letting the stray dog just hang out? I guess because she has other dogs. I mean like if you have land so far if you have like land like what are you gonna do? I guess but I guess my fear being a dog owner, you know my past would that this stray dog would cause problems with my other dogs Right, you know what I mean, but I Maybe it's different continue. I apologize

We went to tuba city and get some groceries. Can't handle tuba. Yeah, look Sounds like every time we say tuba city, it's like Brass and so put out also the actual text says we went to to to tuba city. Oh, sorry. That's my bad To to to you know, we went to to tuba city To get some groceries to get some groceries Came back to the house The dog was nowhere to be seen nothing unusual grandma went to visit some people So it was just Karen and I but five o'clock we heard someone trying to open the door. Both of us looked out since

There had been no car heard no dogs barking Looking out in the living room window to the door There was the dog trying to open the door with its paws Two paws wrapped around a brass door knob standing on its hind legs that would freak my shit That's that's totally seriously. Well, I don't know that I believe this story If I did see that I you're right. That would be the scariest thing ever If a dog was like

I would be like I would like hit the door That's what I would do Or I invite the dog in and be like bro. Can you talk? Are you a talking dog? You just open that door and he'd be like, uh, yes, I can open doors now jesse I'd be so thrilled. I have a friend. I have a new best friend. I have a friend This is like the worst sourcing for a story ever But I have a friend who had a childhood friend

Who swore who swore up and down for the rest of his life that one day he was sitting on the porch with his dog And like another guy and the dog was just like sup guys How high was this guy? And I can see like the bloodshot eyes of the dog and he's like sup, bro He just loved the he just loved the vibe. Yeah, I forgot to toy story. Yeah I love it. That is the story. He swears His dog was just like

sub guys guys. I love that. That's great. Oh, it is so good Anyway, um the story here's the here's the part that I that I truly have issue with all right Yeah, so let's rewind a little bit looking at the living window to the door There was the dog trying to open the door with its paws two paws wrapped around the brass door knob Standing on its hind legs. I thought that was Weird, but wasn't really freaked out. Karen was she opened the door and chased it off Grandma came back later and Karen told her grandma didn't like what she heard. Me neither. I wouldn't like it either Yeah, no, I if I had seen that I wouldn't be like, well, that's weird. I'd be like that's freaky. Yeah. Yeah

Got ready to sleep. We slept in the spare bedroom since it had two beds One window with curtains open a little we turned off the light But there was sound coming from top of the roof Pitter patter footsteps and scratching sounds and panting It then sounded like it jumped off onto the large plastic water barrel. They had At first we heard what sounded like barking But as it grew louder the other dogs seemed to be barking at something also But all of a sudden something was running around the house barking and it was

No dog. Nope. It wasn't The barking sounded human a male voice barking like it knew we knew it wasn't a dog Just like a wuff God, yeah, like wuff wuff wuff ruff Ruff ruff ruff Thank you for leading just like that adding the w's and the r's and the a's Panting again by the window. We started freaking out Karen decided to in my opinion was stupid open the curtains to look out

There was the stray dog on its hind legs looking into our bedroom, but this time it stunk and What I thought were two black holes in the neck Another pair of eyes twinkled Think of those ugly glossy spider eyes staring back at you and the paws were deformed Looking hands with overgrown somewhat thick and sharp fingernails But this time it stunk I don't know how we have that information this time it's stunk

And what I thought were two black holes in the neck were eyes. Yeah, so it's like a hood maybe so like someone in a Costume so my understanding is like the way that skin walkers work when they turn into an animal. They uh The the pelt that they wear is what like it covers them it becomes the animal so my guess is that He was like a half human half animal form and like his human eyes were probably where the neck of the animal would be I'm imagining that seen in aliens uh four when she goes into the room and sees like all the ripplies Kill me. Yeah All right, again

Both screaming and shutting the curtains closed grandma came running through the door and seeing it First thing she did was grab ashes from the fireplace Load three shells into the shotgun from under the bud. Yeah, bless herself in navajo and went outside to shoot it Yelling in navajo about how the thing wasn't welcome there and to get the hell out of here for to go linger somewhere else Uh them both being traditional first of all I just All right. All right. I feel like this story is literally someone who listened to this podcast went back in time and wrote this story because it has all the tropes of what a

Skinwalker is right and then it even has like the way to kill a skinwalker, right the ashes in the shotgun shell right, right, right Then both being traditional the next day they called a messing man to come over and put cedar in He prayed over everyone with cedar smoke and an eagle feather blessed the place made us eat bitter herbs called eagle's gull Or something and gave me an arrow head Apparently I need to carry it for protection and a little pouch called corn pollen seems to work pretty well Great man said that I have no probably hasn't probably hasn't seen a skinwalker since You know, you know what? That's true. That's true. It also keeps away tigers and uh

Aliens hobos. Yeah. Yeah The medicine man said that the dog was a skinwalker, which in navajo is a long word, but I'll call them yoshis Okay, great The body of a stray dog, which was killed by the skinwalker made An illusion so we wouldn't know it wasn't a real dog He also says that usually yoshis tend to harm people by using some sort of human bone straw to spit at someone Think spitballs only deadlier and get human bones on uh into them Doctors can't detect it, but the medicine medicine man said uh that they pulled a piece of human skull out of grandma's right shoulder

Pretty big about two inches long one centimeter thick. What it was real because we watched them pull it out of Out of her that was intense. So that's like the corpse powder. She's talking about So they personally think it was like a dart He shot a dart at like how grandma get hit with it. I have so much she went She ran out she ran out there to shoot that fucking yeah She went out there man She ran out there to confront him with a handful of ash and three shotgun shells like and he was like And spit a thing at her as she came at him

I guess There's there's like a lot of details in this story, but there's also like important details missing Well, I think I think this is if if we had ignoring let's take a minute Ignore the supernatural elements, right? Mm-hmm Just look at the three stories we had yes the first story is like My grandmother is superstitious. I'm not superstitious But she believes in some stuff and I went to go visit her and she said that this thing's watching her and like it was scary But uh, then she moved like it's an okay scary story, but there's a lot of details missing right? Yeah the second story

Has details it has like a build-up. It has more details, but doesn't present Too many details, right? Yeah It gives you enough information that it seems believable This story that I just read is literally a play-by-play of what the list we went through of how you would describe a skin walker Right right. Yep. And so and so thus it becomes less believable So all I'm saying is if we can do anything for you Listener right now if you would like to create a fake story about a skin walker Please go with number two a solid story with some details like I was in my backyard

Which happens to be located and give us like a good description and then mention the thing coming to get you But then like don't give us like but then I took Shotgun shells and dipped them in ash and shot it at him But it turns out like don't do that grandma became an action hero and ran outside Shotgun Also, we live in modern day. If you see one of these things take your phone out immediately and yeah I think that's the that's the biggest issue. I think with all of supernatural

Beings at the moment is that people are like Before it was my camera was shaky and I couldn't do this and it was dark now cameras can take photos in the dark Now cameras are super high quality. Now you have everyone has one on them. So there's no excuse not to attempt to I I guess the go-to is I was frozen in fear. I don't know. I just There's you know catching up with let me just say there are some pretty Fucked up videos and images of skin walkers out there. I agree. There are some fun ones out there And I would I would recommend you guys but the the thing as with most things paranormal on camera is they're not Super in focus or they're not like they're kind of far away

They're hard to see but there's some weird shit out there that even when looking at I'm like I would like to have somebody look at this so they can tell me what's wrong with this video Because I'm still not good enough to know if there's something that I can debunk in it Yeah, there's some pretty I mean look if you want to go scare the shit out of yourself There's plenty of ways to do that with skin walkers YouTube is a great place to scare the hell out of yourself nowadays if you really want to oh my god But that's what youtube was the incredible. I think one of my favorite uh Starting points for slender man, right? Yes, even though everyone understands slender man's bs

The original videos that viral video marble hornets. Who's oh my god. Yeah, that stuff's fascinating. It's very scary. Yeah, so I definitely think that the fear factor in these stories and using it to scare is real Yes, I think they make for fascinating stories. I just don't know how believable any of it is But I think at a story level like deep down inside The fear that we all feel about being alone at night and seeing terrifying eyes Or being out in the woods and then a dog just being there, right? It instills a fear that's like a primal fear in us that you should be afraid like if you saw a dog in the woods Damn, right. That's that's terrifying. Damn, right. It's just the the added idea that that this is some sort of

Uh evil character out to get you is something that I think is added to the mythos to make it Uh something that you can scare kids with or it defines good versus bad that kind of thing. Yeah, I agree Uh, I I think a lot of it is rooted into mythology and gets muddled if there is a truth One of the cool things about last episode is there are a lot of people who are sharing their ghost stories in the comments So if you have a skinwalker fucking story Or some the or some footage or uh, yeah hit hit the sub reddit up We've got a sub reddit up and running. Um, there's a ton of cool conversations happening there now Drop your stories over there because I would love to read

Your personal hauntings or your personal skinwalker stuff if you got pictures videos That's a place to share it man because I will I will devour that stuff in a night easily It's really really cool. And let's be respectful of the people who actually Believe that they encountered these things and not of course hoax us, please right So, um, that's skinwalkers man. That's a that's a one hour blast through skinwalker lore and a couple of spooky stories I have to deal with skinwalkers. Um, again, I think we'll be getting into much more detail Once we do tackle skinwalker ranch. So that's going to be a future episode even maybe a soon episode. We'll see

Uh, and uh, if you guys again, um stories share them away, but I think that's going to wrap up Chiluminati podcast episode 2 jesse, do you feel enlightened or at least educated now? I love the concept. I like I said before I think skinwalkers are a very cool idea It definitely you're right feels like the evil rival to a druid in like a dnd setting I think it's very cool. I love the idea I don't know that I believe that they're real, but I think In a mythological sense you can add them to the to the canon of fantastical creatures that define great stories

Yeah, and so I definitely am down for digging into the lore behind skinwalkers and sort of what roles they play in Uh The stories of the navajo people. I think that'd be fascinating to look at navajo I would love to do just an episode about navajo lore in general because their lore is fucking cool Like it's all about nature and all this you know, like the nature gods and stuff. It's really wild I love it a lot. It's dope. Alex. What did you did? What about you? Did you know much about skinwalkers coming into this or not? I I only knew about skinwalkers from what I

Listened to uh, there's in a paranormal podcast. That's pretty good. You guys should check out called astonishing legends Okay, and they like they like deep dive into topics over weeks and weeks and weeks sometimes And uh, they you know, they're a little bigger than us so they can like reach out and get some really cool guests on there sometimes Uh, which we can someday do, you know, I reached out I reached out to an author and he uh, he wrote back to me. Uh, but uh, yeah, but uh they they like talked to the people from skinwalker ranch and I was just it was horrifying

It was like a such a long episode and there was so much to chew on and it just like, you know Driving in the car is a very like Sort of like pensive time And so, you know, you let your mind sort of like run wild with these ideas as you're listening to them And it just really captured me but I I had not heard about them before that Cool Yeah, uh, I would love to eventually do like a deep dive multi-part episode on something against skinwalker ranch is a really good idea I think for for our first one, but uh

We'll leave it there. Um, if you guys, you know, enjoyed the episode now I'm gonna do the typical pimping stuff if you listen to us on itunes, you know hit us with five stars Leave a rate a rating and a A review up there that helps massively with brand new podcasts And any of the other stuff that you use if you use stitcher a tuner or any other stuff drop us a review there Helps a great deal. Um, we appreciate the overwhelming support on the first episode. I really did not expect The amount of people who were into it to be into it on episode one I figured it'd be a little bit more of a build

But people are really into this shit and I love it. So I'm letting you guys enjoy it when people are unhappy with the government I don't know why this is a thing, but when people are unhappy with the government it always becomes like ripe time for, uh Like paranormal stuff. Yeah, so It's awesome. Yeah, it's really it's really cool. And I'm glad that you guys are having a good time Yeah, and uh, if you guys really like it and the the show continues to grow Grants, we're only on episode two, but uh, if things go really really well We would like to make it weekly if that's something we can feasibly do. So, uh, again

Reviews and all that good stuff are going to help us a great deal as a brand new podcast, but thank you guys so much for watching I hope you all enjoyed, uh, jesse, where can people find you on the internet? My good sir. Oh my goodness. If you just google jesse cox, uh, I'm all over the place I'm jesse cox on twitter jesse cox on twitch jesse cox on youtube Uh, yeah, just find me and enjoy that sweet sweet, uh Nonsense I provide which is what we do in spades. Alex. What about you? Where can people find you brother? Oh my god, where can't they find me find me on super beard bros Find me on the dex find me on the fine star wars podcast that i'm with jesse on a lot of the time

find me, uh On twitter fasciani a find me Yeah, easy enough and you can find me at mathis games pretty much anywhere on the internet You can follow this podcast at chilluminati pod on twitter again. The subreddit is up and running you can go check it out there What is it our illuminati pod? Our illuminati chilluminati pod. Yep arch illuminati pod easy enough Well, we'll work on getting that that place fully decorated and with graphics and stuff over time But uh, thank you guys for watching. We'll be back in a couple of weeks with episode three

We'll decide what we're gonna do for that over the next couple of days Appreciate you and we'll see you next time. Bye. Bye. It is so easy to get stuck doing the same thing day after day What you need in your life is adventure at motor sports land We've been helping people just like you experience outdoor adventures for over 55 years Whether it's with a travel trailer fifth wheel or motorhome You can bring the convenience and comfort of home up to a breathtaking mountain side Next to your favorite lake or across the country Whatever your needs are we're here to help come visit a motor sports land rv center or motorsportsland.com today and let motor sports land

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