Chilluminati Podcast - Episode 294: Heavens Gate Part 1 - Guinea and Pig

Episode Date: April 13, 2025

Mike, Jesse and Alex finally tackle the UFO cult with a great taste in sneakers, Heavens Gate! MOFFMIN PLUSH MERCH - http://www.theyetee.com/collections/chilluminati Thank you too - All you lovely people at Patreon! HTTP://PATREON.COM/CHILLUMINATIPOD ZocDoc - http://www.zocdoc.com/chill HelloFresh - http://www.hellofresh.com/chill10free Jesse Cox - http://www.youtube.com/jessecox Alex Faciane - http://www.youtube.com/user/superbeardbros Editor - DeanCutty http://www.twitter.com/deancutty Show art by - https://twitter.com/JetpackBraggin http://www.instagram.com/studio_melectro SOURCES Heaven's Gate: America's UFO Religion by Benjamin Zeller

Hello everybody and welcome back to the Chiluminati podcast episode 294 as always I'm one of your hosts Mike Martin joined today by the Marshall Applewhite and Bonnie and Annette Nettles of LA. Jesse and Alice. Why do I recognize that? You will know that in the whole. Don't worry. You'll know why.

That sounds like that sounds like fictional characters to me. You'll you'll know why. I don't know. I don't recognize those names at all. You don't rec. Oh, what the fuck is happening? My microphone. Hello. Mathis, where are you? You guys have been like falling apart all day. And what's going on? I'm doing great. Listen, first of all, I look and feel great. I want to just let math is just literally shrinking like, like, like a little, like he's turning into like a little mouse where it's just like I

Can barely hear it was Marshall Applewhite and who's Bonnie Nettles as I'm done looking at my microphone settings I like the name Bonnie Nettles, so I'm just happy to take it like I don't know what it means about me Who's the other person? Marshall Applewhite Marshall Applewhite. Yes, sir. Definitely sounds like, uh, he's a sheriff in a town that don't take no gruff from kids, but like those kids happen to only be one type of kid. You know what I'm saying? Okay. Like something's a little wrong with that sheriff.

That sheriff's got like Applewhite. No, that guy is like, it's not a town. Yeah, well, we'll see. I'm wrong with this year. Knowing what I know. Oh yeah. I'll be curious to hear. You'll know in a little bit through the course of this episode, you'll learn

exactly who these people are. Great. But before we do that, we only got a few more days or is it a couple more weeks left? It's the end of the month. End of the month. So couple like two and a half more weeks. I don't. But the thing is, the reason that I don't want to say that you It's the end of the month. End of the month. So a couple of like two and a half more weeks. I don't but the thing is the reason that I don't want to say that you

have till the end of the month to do this is because I don't know if we're going to have enough. Yeah. Okay. Fair. Exactly. Because I would say I don't know exactly how many we have. I would say that like of the amount that there is we have sold close to 85% of it. And the people who do not know what we're talking about. We're talking about Moffman, baby. Oh, yeah. Right. Talking about Moffman.

He's in demand. Like not on the same page. Right, right. No, yeah. This little cloned cryptid is flying off the shelves and he is, uh, there's just not that many left. So if you're planning on getting one, I'm, this is not like a sales tactic. This is me just telling you, it seems like you have a long time, but there's really not that many left. So if you're planning on getting one, this is not like a sales tactic. This is me just telling you,

it seems like you have a long time, but there's really not that many left. I didn't expect it to sell this well. If people love it, it's a cute little guy, man. He's a cute little boy. And even the people who have one of the older ones now, I have like, they get them a little buddy that can go along with them.

So yeah, thank you guys so much for supporting it and like buying those things as crazy as you have been. We are super excited that you've enjoyed it and we have many ideas as to like what we want to do after, but yeah, get it while you can get it. While supplies last it's over at the yeti.com slash Jaluma naughty and uh, yeah, get that stuff. We've got more also coming very, very soon over there. Have a gander. What's good for the geese is good for the gander is that that's what, that's what they always said doing because I, you know what I see these days? The kids love the blind boxes. Have we considered doing blind boxes of little figures, but it's cryptids high out of their minds. Listen, all I want

to do is just say all I want to do. Boston big bean boys, little bean boys. And there's all these different versions of bean boys. Bean boys, something happened. Don't worry about the bean boys. Listen, don't you worry about the bean boy? I'm just putting out ideas. He's come saying why do you have Boston Big Bean boy coffee? The ideas are already out there in the ether trust why we not have Don't you worry about the bean boy. Why do we not have bean boy brand canned beans? Don't don't worry about the bean boy. The so you'll be I see you'll feel like you're as high as the by summer. By summer's end, you'll know about the bean boy.

How about that? All right. By summer's end. I like that we're still in spring. We're not even technically spring. We're spring. Tell that to my tell that to my pores. And if you want a little bit of a preview before that drops, people over at Patreon, you get to tend to get a previews and early drops on stuff coming up. That's true

I do stuff on here, but we tease it even more on there. They knew about my mom man They yeah, they knew about that mob man way early just saying yeah They knew it was coming really much before everybody else and we tease them so hard. Oh my we were relentless No, who's we're over there. You know who's not into teasing the subject of today's episode boys. Oh, thank God. All right. I was wondering where you're going with that. I thought you were gonna say patreon.com slash to the 90 part. I was like, no, today, we are taking another large project that I've had on the books for a long

time. And that combined two of my favorite things in the world, aliens and true crime mashed together in a rather famous ones that you will know immediately a topic that we're going to be talking about. I want to qualify this by saying aliens with a heavy, heavy quote unquote, and then comma actual capital T, capital C, true crime. Yeah. Yeah, it's more true crime subcategory Aliens, I think themed it's like how a party is still just a party and you call it a Halloween party because it's themed That's that's what kind of aliens we're talking about

You can kind of come you can all not to the point not to the extreme point of that is but we're what we're talking About today can be kind of compared to the Rayleigh ins that Alex covered. It's like way, way long ago. It's like bad ending Rayleigh ins. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Cause today is part one of a huge deep dive into none other than the famous 1990s cult heavens. Oh, heaven's gate. Yes. Make sure you got your, that's just crazy people. Make sure you got your shoes and your fucking feet Yeah, put on put on your white Nikes or Ditas or whatever the hell they had Yeah, yeah exactly bring your sheets and get ready to fly Yeah, this is a big one

This is a big boy and we're gonna be going deep into this and we're gonna see you're gonna hear a name That has come up in multiple episodes across all genres that we've done on this show. Cause that's how the universe fucking works. Uh, yeah, you hear, you probably hear heaven's gate and immediately think of Rancho Santa Fe, March, 1997, 39 people dead, laid out with neatly matching Nikes and dark uniforms, purple shrouds kind of covering the whole bodies. I don't know if you were, I was a kid, I was 11 years old at the time and I, I remember the news like my mom and dad watching.

I remember this happening for sure. I remember OJ and I remember this. I don't know if this is a fake memory or not, but I feel like I remember a newscaster like in the building with the dead bodies like standing there and talking to the Nikes. I feel like I saw something like that. I feel like I saw something like that. I feel like I saw something like that. I might be from the X-Files, though. Yeah, I feel like that's one of those memories that was like made up.

Yeah, I mean, yeah, because there's no way they would show just a bunch of dead bodies on TV like that. They're covered. They're covered. Yeah, they're completely covered. All that was was the feet. You know, they were just Nikes and then the purple. That's definitely that that footage does exist. But I don't know if that's news footage.

Yeah. It might've been a documentary or something. I don't know. I've definitely seen that footage before, but I don't know that it was like broadcast to people. Yeah, but maybe I'm wrong. I could be, I don't know. It was the nineties, dude. I was just a kid. I don't really remember. But yeah, this thing did hit the, the, the news, like an enormous bomb, a mass suicide, UFO cult, a ton of other bizarre, tragic things that happened that just kind of fell into the list of weird cults America has kind of generated in the past. As an American, I want to say that nothing about humanity's

fucking psychosis and psyche surprises me anymore. No, yeah, not anymore. My soul is destroyed. The light has gone out of my eyes and I am just along for the ride now, yeah, not anymore. My soul is destroyed. The light has gone out of my eyes and I am just along for the ride now, my friends. Yeah. The only time I see the light return to his eyes is the flicker of the flame from whatever he's smoking out of that. Whenever, whenever somebody subscribes to the Patreon, my light flickers back on just a little bit.

Just a tiny bit. My light flickers back on. You say, I do. I do. I do believe in doobies. Perfectly dark and empty. Yeah. Yeah. And honestly, to most of the world,

including every, most people in the U S had the same reaction as, as Jesse did at the very beginning. This shit was just pure insanity. A bizarre, weird thing that had, they didn't understand how people could believe, but you have to understand this cult is rather unique in many, many ways compared to other cults that we have talked about and that we will cover in the future as we

move forward. This was a cult where the people inside the 38 members plus their leader, Marshall Applewhite, now you know who he is. There he is. Glad I didn't take that guy. This wasn't about ending things in like a despair of the end of the world kind of scenario. It was in there kind of like very meticulous constructed worldview, a graduation, an exit from human containers.

And it was just that their death was simply a necessary step to board a real spacecraft trailing the hailale-Bopp comet and ascend to the evolutionary level above human or known as Tila. Doobie Brothers. Oh, no, no, yeah, close, close. Tila? Tila, T-E-L-A-H. Tila Tequila was on to Tila.

Yeah, yeah. To even like begin to unpack how this group kind of even arrived at that conclusion, you can't just start at the end where everybody already knows what happened and see it as the insanity. You have to spool it all back way back to this kind of the source as with most cults. You need to understand not just the one individual who is seen as the key leader, but the two who is deeply personal struggles, and intense spiritual searching fused to create this weird movement between Marshall

Applewhite and Bonnie Lou Nettles, who is the other person I called one of you. Now, would you say she's more or less culpable? Oh, she's equally as culpable. She's but I this is stuff we are not going to touch until next episode. So I don't want to but like, I don't know if a certain event happened in Bonnie's life. If it didn't, if it would have led to everybody dying. I think one thing ended up leading to everybody dying. The other thing you have to keep in mind too is like, unlike a lot of other cult leaders,

Marshall Applewhite is extremely not charismatic in so many ways. These people, including Applewhite, when we really dive into who these people were, the cult for them and their escape via human body were all deeply rooted in how much they just didn't feel like they fit in this world. And that like, they they just social outcasts, you know, like prime cult. Yeah, like people weren't being forced to stay. They weren't being

forced like a lot of other people where they don't get to keep their things and all this stuff. Like this was truly a group of people who, at least until I would say maybe the very end, fully was in on all of this. And I'll leave it at that because there's a lot I want to talk about, but that's going to be more later on. So as we dive into the two people individually, again, Marshall Applewhite and Bonnie Lou Nettles, you need to understand the strange brew of like cultural energies swirling around in America in the early 70s, which is when this all kind of got going. Because Heaven's Gate wasn't just born overnight.

It evolved over close to 25 years. It wasn't just a suicide cult, though that's what the label that stuck at the end of it all. It was, to its adherence, a highly demanding, all encompassing quote unquote classroom, that path that's designed to strip away every vestige of humaness of you and prepare them for a literal physical transformation into extraterrestrial beings because heaven was an actual physical place that they would go to.

You know, there's just wasn't alien that kind of aspect of things. Yeah, Jack Kirby kind of weird shit out in the cosmos. That's the Rayleigh in element too. Yes, exactly. As I said, it's like the closest thing I could think of that we've talked about that is to compare it to but the Rayleigh are like the beer B tier heavens.

They're the, the, the Brailleens are like a little groovier and they just kind of seem to want to eat chimichurri sauce and meat. I don't know. You know, is that, is that the best way to describe them? They're just like, they just like want to get their shirts off and like, is that, I feel like when we were talking about them, there was like, there's some weird clone stuff, but that's not like some stuff that fell off. A little off like the people. It's like mostly like what they do is they just like meet up. I mean, if we're talking comparatively,

one group is very much alive and the other group killed themselves. So like, you know, I wasn't going to go there, but yes, yes. Fair enough. But who had better fashion? Oh, Rayleigh's. Oh, well, you know what? It's kind of a toss up. It's kind of a toss up. The Rayleigh's are pretty groovy.

Also the fashion of, uh, the, the heavens gate cult was very much like we base it off of the end, right? I don't know what it was like. I don't know what they were wearing day to day. We just base it off of the end. Right. I don't know what it was like. I don't know what they were wearing day to day. We just base it off their final outfit choice. I will say that that pass through is cutting off their own balls. What now? Marshall Applewhite just you know, balls were weren't necessary.

So pardon went through castrations for this call. I thought you said they weren't doing that kind of stuff. When did I say that? Didn't you, didn't you say this was like, you know, this is like groovy cult, everyone's hanging, but then they, they got to a point where their bodies were such a meaningless thing to them that they were such no, like they didn't manage cut their balls off to remove the desires that they didn't want to worry about anymore.

Yeah. Was there one guy who just didn't do that? We're literally exactly correct. There's one dude who was so fucking horny and saved his life. He left the cult because he just wants to come. I'm not cutting my dick off. That guy that guy gets it. Yeah. Yeah, there was one dude who was just like, no, no, I like this thing. I'm so glad. Yeah, there was one dude who was just like, No, no, I like this thing. I think you're all crazy. This is my little guy in here. I don't want to take my little this

might one of my only happy things. I'm starting to think you're all insane people. Wait a minute. This is not what I thought it was. Yeah. This whole improbable journey started with the collision of these two souls though, Apple White, the preacher's son who would be turned tormented music professor, at least in his own mind, wrestling with his identity and his own sexuality and definitely his own sanity, along with Bonnie Nettles, the nurse, the nurse, the nurse and

mother diving headfirst into astrology, theosophy, which made dingle some bells out there. And of course, what else for any good cult channeling spirits from other dimensions? Obviously. And they're meeting in 1972 wasn't just a chance encounter. At least it was in their minds, cosmically ordained. It sparked an immediate, intense, but strictly platonic partnership that became the crucible for their unique ideology. They would begin weaving together threads from radically different traditions.

Apple white's background provided a framework that was rooted in Protestant Christianity, particularly the dramatic end times prophecies of the book of revelations. And Nettles contributed the esoteric language and concepts of the New Age, including spiritual evolution, ascended masters, and crucially for this cult, a belief in UFOs and benevolent space aliens coming to pick them up

from this horrible planet. And the timing? Couldn't have scripted it better. It was the early 70s, which was filled with like this disillusionment after Vietnam, widespread questioning of government and traditional institutions, a hunger for alternative forms of spirituality, the counterculture's message of dropping out and seeking enlightenment through unconventional means that prime the generation to look beyond mainstream in

some spheres. Just got everybody ready for being like primo co-father. Yeah, exactly. The 60s were filled with the abuse and lead of serial killers. And the 70s were the coming of age as all the free love people from the 60s. You know, and like, and you add to this the surge of UFO sightings around this time, the popularization of theories about ancient astronauts and the government coverups. There was a perfect storm for this particular cult. And they got to exist into the early days of the Internet,

which also really made them have like a kind of a concrete stamp on the on the cultural memory and into this cultural soup stepped quote unquote, the two of them, or as they called themselves, the two as they first, uh, yeah. They offering a radical path that promised transcendence escape and a literal journey to the stars. This is where the story truly begins. Now I'm the quiet mansion in 97 where everybody died, but in the messy lives of the fervent beliefs that converged decades earlier. So as we dive into the deep, deep

shit, let me just go ahead and shout out my main source. The book is called Heaven's Gate America's UFO religion by author Benjamin Zeller. Also, the UFO documentary. I can't remember the name of it. I watched it on Internet Archive there. I watched about three or four documentaries. There's a ton out there. There's so much shit you can go ahead and just watch about this that is valuable and entertaining.

This endless count like stuff and hours of listening to fucking Marshall Applewhite himself to learn how utterly meaningless and dribble dribble this dude just spills. He never answers questions. It's constant just vague nonsense. And I'm going to give you a taste of that in a little bit. So yum, yum, yum, yum, yum. Let's start all the way at the beginning. Marshall Herf, Applewhite Jr. or her to those who knew him early in his life. Well, how do you spell how do you spell her just for e E.R. FF.

That's really in there. That's really his middle name. OK. That is actually his middle boy, Herff, and his nickname. And that what people referred to him as her. He was born on May 17th, 1931 in Spur, which is a tiny town in West Texas. And his father, Marshall Herff Applewhite, senior, was a respected family. Yeah, it's just that's

a that's a man you think you wouldn't want to pass that on to your son that feeling feels mean, you know, like, just change his middle name at the very least. His father was a respected Presbyterian minister, a calling that kept the family moving frequently. This upbringing undoubtedly immersed young Applewhite here in religious language and expectations shaping his world, shaping his worldview, even as he later wrestled with its constraints.

Accounts kind of suggest that childhood marked by both promise and the pressure from his parents. He was recognized early on for his intelligence and talents. And after graduating from high school in Corpus Christi in 1948, he attended Austin College, a Presbyterian affiliated school in Sherman, Texas, and then graduated from there in 1952. His college years were marked by leadership roles. Maybe unsurprisingly, he was involved in student government, sang in the acapella choir,

and was part of the campus group for students considering ministry, suggesting a period where he seriously contemplating following his father's path that he did actually kind of pursue a little bit further. He even went on to the union theological seminary in Virginia for two years, from 1952 to around 1954. Um, but another current was pulling him in a stronger direction. Marshall possessed significant artistic gifts, particularly in music and drama. He had, according to his friends at the time, a compelling baritone voice, excellent diction,

and a natural stage presence that could hold an audience captive. He also loved opera. He loved opera. So this is a type of stage presence that we don't love anymore in today's modern time. We're talking about like when Dracula comes out on stage. Yes, like everybody just goes, oh, wow. How impressive. Yes. Yes. It's exactly that time period. And honestly, if I hadn't read that, I never would have guessed that that he was perceived that way because after listening to that man's voice again for hours, I had felt my brain physically turning into a thick viscous goo.

He is mind numbing to listen to. And I'm going to play you one example right now as his charisma from a tape called Well, let me just he'll kill he's gonna say the name of the tape. This is just here we go. We're going to talk to you about the most urgent thing that is on our mind. And what we suspect is the most urgent thing that is on our mind and what we suspect is the most urgent thing on the minds of those who will connect with us. We'll title this tape Planet Earth about to be recycled. You just shoot from the hip? Your only chance to evacuate is to leave with us.

Planet Earth about to be recycled. Your only chance to survive or evacuate is to leave with us. Thank you so much to ZockDoc for sponsoring today's episode. And listen, I'm a millennial again. or evacuate is to leave with us. Thank you so much to Zoc Doc for sponsoring today's episode. And listen, I'm a millennial. I get, I don't like being on the phone talking to people. What's that? You're trying to trigger my millennial anxiety. No, thank you. And because of that, it took me a while to get to the doctors,

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Thank you to ZocDoc for sponsoring today's episode. Charisma! That baritone. Silky tone. You know, you know what's crazy about that is if you hadn't said this is a cult thing and I didn't know what Heaven Gate was, I would have said what heaven gate was, I would have said to you, man, I can't believe you found that, uh, audio recording in fallout

of a group of people that went crazy and you discovered their lost barracks or whatever. So what it sounds like on that tape, I watched the tape. Um, you're right, Alex, cause he's doing like the thing where he's looking up and rolling his eyes around when he's Like this tape is called and he's just fucking Improving unlike the shape. They're like we're gonna call he's like we're gonna call it. Uh And then he says some shit that sounds like that like the name of an episode of Pokemon Dragon Ball Z planet Earth about to be recycled. Your only chance of survival is with us. Can you

imagine taking that to the printer? I don't know. Like in the video itself is like if he's sitting in front of a blue blank screen, super zoomed into just his shoulders, and the top of his ball that like his head and his ball that is kind of like wide eyed, empty gaze. That's what most people remember about all the video footage of the cult is his face, and eyes and the way he just kind of

looks out of it. Yeah, here, I'll send you a link to you boys and I'll try to make it in the show notes as well. But this is a part of the video itself. I just grabbed it and you can just see What this dude is like doing and how he looks. Oh, yeah That's our boy with his crazy crazy eyes It looks literally like fucking David Byrne or some shit like it looks like some kind of weird fucked up Andy Andy Warhol art film it is a little bit of in Iron Man 3 when the What was it the Mandarin would give speeches to?

Little Wizard of Oz vibe like yeah granted. This is like at the end of like what would be his life This is the end of the cult there. You know, this little video clip, we're seeing him at what I would consider his worst, but still like all of his speeches through all of them. Listen to all just sound like this of just like this droning drivel. So I don't know what they were talking about in terms of what really makes me check out just listening to his voice. Like it's really not.

I feel like that's also part of it. Yeah, I drone the way it like can influence and like dull your senses. And the next thing he says is like, cut off your balls. It like makes me feel like, okay. Yeah, like it makes people feel like it's like special or like, like the word of God, you know, like the priests do that thing in Catholic church that's like chanting. That's kind of like, like the word of God, you know, like the priests do that thing, uh, in, in Catholic church that's like chanting. That's kind of like, and you're like, what was that? They like say stuff. I don't know the words, but they have like, you know, like they say like a thing and then everybody in the whole church kind of like in this kind of dead way kind of goes,

yeah, it's kind of just feels good. It just feels good. He's like, I really can't stay. Anyway, yeah. So back to him. His, his love for opera though, like his genuine love for opera is the thing that actually pulled him away from the seminary. After fulfilling his military service obligation in this army signal corps from 1946 to 1950, um, 1954 to 1956, he pursued his musical ambitions, eventually earning a master's degree in music with a focus on voice from the university of Colorado, uh, at Boulder by 1959.

You can't tell me that this dude didn't know he's doing then. If he was trained in voice, that's not just like I learned to speak. It's also I learned to breathe, control what I say, how to communicate this. Yeah. No, it's the way I think it's. I think it's telling that his message. Well, no, maybe not. It's not telling because there's only 38 people, which is kind of small for a cult that like got this famous for

what they had to do a lot. They had to do a lot, but also they were extremely restrictive about who was allowed in and you had to be particularly like mundane in a lot of ways to be let in. It's we'll get again, we'll get to it. We'll get to it. But yeah, I agree. No, he definitely knew what he was doing in terms of like training with his voice, but I still listen to him and I just, I don't get it. You know, it doesn't, I don't to it. But yeah, I agree. No, he definitely knew what he was doing in terms of like training with his voice But I still listen to him and I just I don't get it. You know, it doesn't I don't get it He doesn't feel charismatic. He just feels insane Because I mean, yeah anyway

So yeah this early pivot for him choosing the stage essentially over being a priest wasn't just a career adjustment It really signaled a fundamental tension between his inherited expectations from his parents and his personal inclination, a struggle with identity that would echo through his, out throughout his life because he was also, which would be revealed later, um, gay at a time where being gay was not great. The fifties, sixties, seventies. So he in having a father,

90s, early 2000s, 70s. So he in having a father. 80s, 90s, early 2000s, 2010s. Presbyterian. Doesn't really rock right now, I feel like. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, you're a hundred percent correct. But you know, in his unique situation of having a Presbyterian preacher father, that's all doom and gloom anyway, to compound it with the 50s look where you couldn't even talk about it openly, really. Like it's, it's a rough spot. 100.

It's per his professional life though following graduation was a mix of achievement and instability mimicking what I imagine is how home life was. He taught music including a stint as an assistant professor at the University of Alabama in the early 60s. He tried and failed to make it as an actor in New York City. He found more traction back in Texas, landing a position around 1965 or 1966. I couldn't find the exact date to lead the music department at the University of St. Thomas, which is a Catholic university in Houston. Here he did actually seem to flourish for a time where he could merge his religious beliefs and his love for performing.

He became, he was becoming a recognized figure in Houston arts community, directing the choir at St. Mark's Episcopal Church and performing roles with the prestigious Houston Grand Opera. He juggled multiple roles, working also as a rehearsal conductor, part-time English teacher,

and even briefly an occupational therapist. But this period of professional activity was overshadowed and ultimately derailed by deep personal struggles. By the time that he led a cult. Yeah, yeah. By the time he started heaven's gate. No, much his own personal struggles, much of it stemming with the struggle with the sexuality in a deeply unaccepting environment. He like literally put himself in a Catholic college. Whispers followed him from Alabama that suggested his departure was linked to having an affair with a male student. There's no way for me to confirm whether that actually happened or not.

I wasn't able to. But it's like a pretty prevalent rumor as to why that's why he was kind of pushed out. Um, but whether it's true or not, this narrative kind of foreshadowed the crisis at the end that ended his time in St. Thomas in 1970. He was abruptly dismissed or forced to resign. And the official explanation cited emotional turmoil or health reasons of an emotional nature. But substantial accounts point to another relationship with a male student as the immediate cause for him to be released. Damn.

Yeah. Which is just like, if that's... Having read about the 1970 case, I think that the previous reason was also he was definitely like dating a student. The university president himself later described Applewhite as seeming quote mentally jumbled and disorganized near the end. Around the same time, his musical ambitions also faltered. He withdrew from a lead opera role, citing vocal problems, but also acknowledging significant quote unquote personal problems.

And a subsequent attempt to run a delicatessen in New Mexico in 1971 failed very, very quickly. A really hard pivot, which sent him back to Texas, kind of to be adrift again, his career ambitions now fully in tatters. Yeah. It almost felt like just like a panic I don't know what to do. So let's open a delicatessen It's weird like you ever been in that mindset before in your own life admittedly. Yeah, I'm like I Wanted to thought like screwed if this doesn't work out. Let's go be like a baker or work on McDonald

Like if this doesn't work out, I'm gonna go do a job But I don't have to boss anyone around and people just yell at me and I'm like that's. If this doesn't work out, I'm going to go do a job where I don't have to boss anyone around and people just yell at me and I'm like, that's what I want. I feel like you have a million dollars to start a deli. Yeah. Isn't the rule of thumb, like if you're starting any food business, you expect two years of like basically being in the red before you can even break even. Yeah.

Like, it's hell no, it's insane. So yeah, I don't know. Whatever he did, he immediately failed. But this pattern I don't know, whatever, he did it. He immediately failed. But this pattern to me anyway, isn't just like- He immediately failed. Yeah, he did, he just fucking wasn't just like, immediately, it just didn't do well. Like I said, to me this pattern doesn't seem like,

kind of like a random pattern of like bad luck for the dude. It was much more, at least seemingly, again to me, a destructive cycle that is just directly linked to his inability to reconcile his sexuality and the prevailing social and religious condemnation of where he was working along with that of his parents. He even would eventually marry. His marriage to Ann Pierce, which produced two children,

had ended after she reportedly discovered his involvement with another man. His own father's rejection upon learning of his orientation obviously just sent him further down the depression path. Though he lived openly as a gay man for a time in Houston's Montrose neighborhood, which is notably accepting of gay people, this didn't really bring him any peace. The damage was already done a subsequent relationship With a woman and a due to her family's disapproval

his reported longing for a sexless devotion a connection free from physical Complications. Yeah Come on now, have you ever seen the what is it on TLC, the show of like the gay guys that are married to women and the women know, and it's like this weird like conversion? Oh, I was thinking more about like, this guy's definitely gonna tell people

to cut their nuts off and join a cult. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's where my head was. Yeah, honestly, it also reminded me of the crazy artist who was like, couldn't handle his horny penis and so like cut his own dick off. Father was also a preacher. That it's like, it's very similar.

Yeah, but it's crazy. Yeah. Sexless devotion for relationship. Like I said, a connection free from physical, what he called complications, I think speaks volumes about his internal conflict. Like this just speaks openly about what is would be a chilling as Jesse put it precursor, shall we say to the cult later obsession with uh celibacy to the extreme.

Is that just death? No, that's the that's the castration part. Though I guess technically, I mean, technically, technically, the constant clash for him between his inner self and the external world leading to repeated professional and personal failures just was the perfect breeding ground for a man in complete psychological distress. And the dam finally broke in the early 1970s with the death of his father around 1971, which would be a huge problem for his own mental state,

deepening his already very present depression. He was financially strapped to borrowing money from friends. And then the truly alarming symptoms began. Auditory hallucinations, vivid dreams. Really? Yeah. At least according to him. And what else but what else but the finishing touch for any cult leader? Emerging grandiose delusions, including seeing himself as having a divine Christ like mission. Because obviously Christ and God repicked the man who's losing his mind. Obviously. His behavior became erratic enough that he actually voluntarily checked himself into a psychiatric hospital. He was like, yeah, I better do this.

Yeah, yeah. Really? Yeah, he literally was like, I'm yeah, maybe I need to and he went in around 1971 1972. And while his sister later emphasized a near death experience from a heart blockage as the catalyst for his transformation, the psychiatric psychiatric hospitalization narrative is more widely corroborated and fits the timeline of his escalating psychological crisis. And it felt more like the sister was trying to do almost reputation

damage control and saying that he was breaking because of years what actually happened? Yeah, yeah, exactly. But from what we can get from interviews of people who were there paperwork and stuff, it seems like no, he was maybe losing his mind a little bit due to all the mental health issues that he wasn't being wasn't being addressed. Some speculate that he may have sought hospitalization, partly hoping for a cure to his homosexuality, reflecting, again, this misguided psychiatric approaches of the time, because he just thought it was something wrong with his brain. Retrospective analysis by scholars suggests that these symptoms align strongly

with the onset of paranoid schizophrenia, typically manifesting in one's late 30s or early 40s. And Applewhite was at that time. Right around that age. And while he'd experimented with hallucinogenics previously, maybe seeking spiritual insight or trying to just simply find an escape from his emotional turmoil, conventional therapy had apparently just failed him. So. The, you have now Applewhite in an institute in 1972, his career destroyed, relationships

failed, grieving his father, financially desperate, deeply depressed, tormented by his own sexuality, and now experiencing undeniable psychotic symptoms with hearing voices, believing he was divine. His grip on conventional reality was shattered. It was, he was too far in a lot of ways. I don't want to say anybody's too far gone, but he is really far from... I'm gonna be honest, I kind of wish I thought I was like a Christ-like figure because... Right? It would make all like getting up in the morning and like getting through my day like just a little easier.

Like genuinely, I feel like it would be a little easier. Pete Slauson Yeah, only a little easier though? Peteus I don't know. I mean, depends on how I'm actually doing, but Pete Slauson Sure, sure. Peteus It just feels like if I didn't care that much, it would feel better. Peteus You've never thought that way and I can tell, as someone who frequently sees himself as a Christ-like figure, too much stress, someone who frequently sees himself as a Christ like figure, too much stress, so many people looking up to you trying to like, what should we do? Oh, great one. And it's like every

day I didn't figure it out yourself. No, that must be tough. There will be like a mortal who wants to just use your powers for a day or two and you don't have to worry about it. But it's too much. No, I've watched Bruce Almighty. Oh, OK. I didn't know if that existed in your reality. Oh, I've seen I've seen the good word. Right. Bruce Almighty. So it's in this.

We don't want it is what I'm saying. No, no. You know, I catch this smoke. What was the one with? What was the other reality shattering? Not reality. The other one, the Bruce Almighty sequel, Evan Almighty with Steve Carell. Yeah, that one. I didn't see that one. That's all right.

All right. So it's in this. So just in this context of where this man is in this utterly mental destructive reality destroying place. man is in this utterly mental destructive reality destroying place. It's where he is where he encounters Bonnie Lou nettles and crucially, the strange complex belief system that they would forge together and let me tell you I try. We will try to explain it next week what this belief system is it is fucking nonsense

regard Either way, it doesn't it doesn't why is all I can think of Helena Bonham Carter from Fight Club What's up with that? I've only seen fight. What's her name Marla a long time ago. Yeah. Well, whatever you guys you guys if you're out there If you know, you know, you got it. Yeah, you know, it's up Yeah, it's you know You know, you out there if you know, you know, you got it. Yeah, you know, it's up Yeah, it's you know You know, you fucking know, you know, you know, okay This complex strange belief system that they would forge together appears almost tailor-made to address his

Marshall Applewhite specifically his deepest wounds the rejection of his physical body, the absolute suppression of sexuality and severing of all of his earthly time, all testicles. Oh, I'm sorry. I didn't realize the Boston baked bean boy. That's where he came from. He's where he came from. He's Marshall Applewhite's testicles. Oh, that's not the Laura one. That's really, that's really, you know what? I'm not, I'm not sure that blind box thing anymore. I don't want to. That's not, I need to like think before I let him talk.

Why is Marshall Apple's testicles in the box and they Bean Boy? Nobody's seen him in the same room before? Oh, fuck. Are you telling me? Oh God. I don't like this. No, I can't be part of his lore. That cannot be part of his lore.

All right. Find out, you vote on Patreon.com slash ChaluminatiPod. Is Bean Boy Marshall Applewhite's balls? Yes or no? Oh no, dude. All right, find out you vote on patreon.com slash Chaluminati pod is bean boy Marshall Applebyte's balls. Yes or no, no, just kidding. Not a real poll, but you can make a fake one on our subreddit We can do that So the severing of all earthly ties and of course the promise of escape to a higher level It's as if the cult's core tenants provided a cosmic rationalization for and a radical solution to the very

conflicts that were tearing him apart. Bonnie Lou Nettles, huh? Nothing. I just, it's, I don't know. It's, it's makes perfect sense to me. That's all I said. Huh. Okay. Bonnie Lou Nettles presents a kind of a different, though equally compelling

path toward that fateful 1972 meeting to born Bonnie Lou Truesdale in Houston on August 29th 1927. She was like, I want to sound British. Yeah, yeah. Her early, her early life seemed outwardly far more conventional than Applewhite's. She grew up in a Baptist family, though friends noted her church attendance later seemed more social than deeply pious. She pursued a path. Yeah, no, like, no one else who goes to church.

I would say she's more of a social Christian than anything I would characterize as deeply pious. Well, think about it, man. She's got, that's around the 30s and early 40s, you know, as she's growing up. What else are you gonna fucking do? Every school church. No, you're right. You're 100% right. I mean, that's got, that's around the thirties and early forties, you know, as she's growing up. What else are you going to fucking do? Pete Slauson No, you're right. You're 100% right. Pete Slauson I mean, that's not changed. The vast majority of people I know who go to church

go to church because it's like the social thing. Well, I got to show up. If I don't, they'll all judge me. Jared Slauson Yeah, yeah. Funny, the judgment of others is a lot of it. Pete Slauson It's a big part of the brand in most churches. Jared Slauson Yeah, no shit. She also pursued a practical, some would say caring profession, graduating from Herman Hospital School

of Professional Nursing in 1948 as a working, and working as a registered nurse. And in December, 1949, she married Joseph Segal Nettles and described him as a successful businessman. Segal? Segal, S-E-G-A-L. Oh, not Seagull.

I thought you said, I thought you said Joseph Seagull, like... I didn't say it like that. Yeah, like it was his nickname. They called him old Seagull. I thought you meant like his name was Joseph Seagull Nettles. Spelled like that. Is that Seagull? That's Seagull probably, huh? That's fine. Just the way you said it, it sounded like Joseph Seagull Nettles. You just didn't have it in front of me. I just didn't have it in front of me. I just want to know. Yeah.

It changes it for me. Like depending on which one. Oh, a great deal. Agreed. Yeah, that's all. Yeah. Discreet is described as a successful businessman and they raised four kids. And for over two decades, this picture of middle-class domesticity held strong, but beneath the surface, particularly by the late 1960s and early 70s, Bonnie was embarking on an intense inner journey exploring realms far removed from traditional Baptist faith or suburban life. Her marriage began to unravel, partly attributed to her husband's disapproval of her burgeoning spiritual interests,

and they divorced in 1973. The personal upheaval coincided with and was fueled by her deepening immersion in the esoteric. And when she left Houston with Applewhite in early 1973, she made the difficult decision, at least she said it was difficult, to leave her three younger children with their father, In 1873, she made the difficult decision, at least she said it was difficult, to leave her three younger children with their father.

Her eldest daughter, Terry, already an adult at that point, and was already deeply concerned about her mother's mental state, was left on her own. And like Applewhite, Nettles was at a major life juncture, a point of crisis, and transition that made her receptive to radical change. Bonnie's spiritual explorations were wide-ranging and deeply felt.

She developed a profound interest in the occult, astrology, various forms of other mysticism, and her involvement wasn't casual. She formally joined- She fucked this shit. Dude, just wait. She formally joined, in a way, what we're about to mention, is responsible for Heaven's Gate. She formally joined the Houston Lodge

of the Theosophical Society. I already know this is gonna make me annoyed. In America, okay, she formally joined the Houston Lodge of the Theosophical Society in America in February 1966 and remained a member until 1973. Theosophy, if you may remember, was founded in the late 19th century by who else but Madame Helena Blavatsky. Yeah. And with the partner Henry Henry Steel, all cop again, one day we'll do Blavatsky. And it is because of Blavatsky's belief as she's been brought up in multiple episodes before that set Bonnie on this path of hidden masters and theosophy that when she crashed

in the influence of evil, like for real, it's crazy. And and when she so when she met Applewhite who was in his delusions it was a perfect chemistry to create this insane cult without Blavatsky's influence who is maybe arguably in a lot of ways one of the most influential figures in history whether like people don't like it or not. In the shadows definitely. It's crazy that this may not have existed without her when i read her name it's just it's like a you it's like a fucking expanded universe she's so crazy she's a Thanos everywhere yeah she's a Thanos yeah and because of her this her belief theosophy offered a complex syncretic system blending elements of Eastern religions, which is, you know, Hinduism, Buddhism, Western esotericism and pseudo science, key theosophical concepts like the evolution of

the soul through reincarnation, communication with hidden spiritual masters, the secret masters, sometimes conceived as extraterrestrial in some branches of theosophy, right access to knowledge, gnosis, and the veneration of science would all find echoes, albeit transformed within heaven's fucking gate. Their beliefs are direct knockoffs of theosophy. Offshoots like the I am movement, which was popular in the mid 20th century, emphasize communication with

embodied ascended masters, offering guidance from spiritual or extraterrestrial realms, providing a direct precedent for the kind of communication that Bonnie Nettles believed she was engaging in. Nettles didn't just study these ideas. She practiced them. She became an amateur astrologer, even writing a newspaper column on the subject. She actively cultivated what she believed were her psychic abilities, holding regular seances in her home to channel spirits.

Her primary contact was allegedly a 19th century Franciscan monk named Brother Francis, but why did you say it like that? This is the most boring name that like she has this regular spirit that you made him sound like my plug downtown. Brother Francis. Right. Yeah, exactly. It's brother Francis.

Um, but she also believes that she believed to have channeled spirits from the planet Venus as well as Marilyn Monroe herself. Well, obviously, everybody's got to have one channeling session. You got to say what's up to Marilyn at least. Yes, give her a wave. Yeah, this firm believes she had an ability to communicate with these frickin ghosts, be they human spirits or extra extraterrestrials. What the aliens aren't ghosts.

I shouldn't have said that aliens are just like the spiritual. They could be ghosts of ourselves. If you think about it. Fuck, you might be right. I shouldn't have said that. Aliens are just like these spiritual beings. They could be ghosts of ourselves if you think about it. Oh, fuck. You might be right. Yeah. You might be right. Yeah. If you think about it. You're goddamn right.

This is all central to her own identity. Furthermore, prophecy and destiny were major themes in her personal belief system too. She consulted multiple fortune tellers who she believed predicted her encounter with Marshall Applewhite, describing a tall, fair haired, like complexioned man, which is the most vague fucking description you can give and apply to literally anybody. But hey, work. He said, she said, Oh, you know, he look like a man. That is, do you think our viewers know that reference?

I surprise you don't to be honest, though, that TV I used to watch that on my little tiny TV and all the shows I believe that little tiny TV in my room every night is a new part of the Mathis Lord that I did not know about. I'm taking it with me. Yeah, yeah. Every little piece you learn about me that you feel like helps build the pictures one one hundred one yeah so she described this like very generic man and she laid a tiny TV dude okay yeah like a little tiny like box yeah no I know exactly what you didn't have a radio built into it no no damn yeah those were the terry Potter yeah I had one of the VH to like a little VHS player way later after DVDs were a thing. I got that. I remember that. But hell yeah. Yeah.

She she later came to interpret this meeting not just as faded though this meeting with Applewhite, but as specifically arranged by extraterrestrial spirit guides. This this predisposition to see events through a lens of prophecy and otherworldly alien intervention just primed her for the intense connection she was about to feel when she met Marshall Applewhite. And it's impossible to overstate Bonnie's role as the ideological, not only catalyst, but center in the formation of Heaven's Gate.

In ways that we don't understand unless you do the research. Bonnie is the true core, the true heart, the true leader of Heaven's Gate. And while Applewhite brought his undeniable charisma and performance skills that were so touted and in a fractured Christian background. So Applewhite was the face essentially, the decided face of Heaven's Gate.

The charismatic face, if you will. And while it was Nettles who provided the essential esoteric and extraterrestrial content, her established worldview, steeped in theosophy from Madame Blavatsky. Like actual like like Crowley and occultism. Yes, that is what's the center of Heaven's Gate. I don't think most people know this. I didn't know her.

It's her beliefs. It was Heaven's Gate is built around her, her beliefs. Steeped, like I said, in Madame Blavatsky's theosophy, astrology, spirit and extra-terrestrial channeling, prophecy and a belief in UFOs and ancient astronauts, all offered the interpretive framework that transformed Applewhite's potentially terrifying psychotic experience that he checked into the hospital for with voices and delusions of grandeur into what he now saw as evidence of divine contact.

This all was not him going crazy. It was evidence that he was the chosen one. And she didn't just validate his experiences. She also became the interpreter for his experiences, filtering what he said he experienced through her specific metaphysical knowledge and vocabulary, infused his personal mental crisis happening in front of her with her spiritual system that may have felt like to him fixed everything but in

reality merely just slapped some duct tape over it for the foreseeable future she was in essence the architect providing the blueprint and materials that Marshall Applewhite's charisma would build into this new real religious reality. That's fucking crazy, dude. It's nuts. I did not know any of that. And I know I've watched I've watched like more than one documentary about this in my life, I would say nobody knows Bonnie Nettles name, nobody. And we'll talk about that. Obviously, we're gonna talk about why and what happened and like why your name is Nobody. And we'll talk about that.

Obviously we're going to talk about why and what happened and like why her name is forgotten. It's all very, very important, but it's really important that you understand why I wanted to rewind that like, yeah, Marshall Applewhite is the face. You know him, you see him as the leader. He kind of presented himself as such, but the one pulling the strings, the one he built or built, there's the he, they built this around, was her.

And the convergence of these two people, searching troubled individuals in March of 1972, remains a pivotal, if slightly murky, because we don't really know the exact details of how that meeting went down, but it became the pivotal moment in the Heaven's Gate origin story. The setting, most accountants have said, was a Houston hospital where Bonnie Nettles worked as a nurse. Applewhite's reason for being there, however, is where the narrative kind of diverges depending on source. We don't know if he was simply visiting a friend recovering from surgery as he and another later recounted, or if he was there due

to a serious heart condition, perhaps connected to this near death experience from the heart condition her sister talked about. Heart condition? Yeah. Her sister's story was that he had a near death experience because of a pulmonary something, and that's what made him see and start hearing God. But most accounts contradict that and say that he was just starting to lose it and like slip on reality.

His dad dying, his suppressed, you know, sexuality, all that stuff was just coming to a head. So or there was an, and there's another third version as to why he was at the hospital. As somebody by the name of Evan Thomas claimed, and a man by the name of Balk considered most possible is that a patient in a psychiatric unit, possibly seeking treatment for his profound inner conflicts, maybe even a cure for his homosexuality, is where he met Bonnie, while he was in the hospital. All we know is that he was in the hospital in March of 1972, but we don't know the details

of that meeting. We don't know if he was in there for mental health, we don't know if he was in there because of surgery he had, or if we don't know if he was in there visiting a friend who had surgery because we don't have the paperwork. We don't have the records of this. We don't know. We just know they met in the hospital and that we've heard multiple stories as to why. Honestly, to me, he was probably in there for his mental health when she met him. That seems to track the most. There are other even less common accounts that place their initial meeting elsewhere,

like one in Applewhite's drama classes where Nettles reportedly attended it, or through Applewhite tutoring Nettles' daughter. Applewhite himself in his later writings often glossed over the specifics of how they met, which is why we don't fucking know because he doesn't really talk about it. He preferred in his writings anyway, to emphasize the sense of destiny and immediate recognition that kind of defined their encounter. He wanted to frame it as a moment of godly fate of divine intervention.

This was meant to happen. We had had to occur. It doesn't matter how it happened. It just did. And that's it. But it doesn't really honestly, and at the end, does it really matter? Regardless of the precise location they're met, the impact was immediate and electric on both of their lives. The sources no matter what we talk who the source is consistently described no matter what a powerful, instantaneous connection between the two of them, like a eyes locked a feeling of having known

her forever. I mean, you guys know I've had we meet somebody that like you've never met before. But there's something about he become immediate friends, or you just like this girl is special, or and listeners out there maybe just like, it's very rare. But that's what happened here, where it was just the chemistry was right. And it was like, shit, I belong with you. Not in a sexual way, but not in a nala. Well, I guess ended up together sexually. Yeah, yeah, not not quite that

way. Both felt this uncanny sense of predestined reunion, perhaps maybe from past lives, she would go on to wonder. Nettles already steeped in prophecy and channeling by now, saw Applewhite as the fulfillment of predictions that were made by the fortune tellers she went to, and even perhaps extraterrestrial guides. Applewhite desperately seeking someone to help him understand his disturbing inner experiences

and mental health saw in Bonnie, the astrologer and mystic, the guide that he needed all this time. He famously at one point recounted running to his car to get his birth certificate so she could immediately do his astrological chart. He was so excited to like learn what the stars had in store for him. He just talks about all the time. I would run out there and get his birth certificate. So he's just so he's just a dude who really truly in his core was looking for some sort of guidance in a life that he had, he felt he had very little control over. Just straight up psycho. It's the Occam's razor of every, every person who ends up in this mental health situation.

He needed parents, generational trauma and support like you need to support it. Definitely need support. But I feel like he there was something deeper inside this man that there were support systems, but it wasn't ones that gave him what he was exactly looking for. So his search religion, his yeah, like his search religion is he looking for some higher power, higher authority to guide him in a confused life. But in many of those religious spaces, the person that he was, being gay, was frowned upon. So that wasn't the place for him. So you can see him hopping around from place to place to place to place, trying to find where he fits in, where he both A,

is accepted and B, is given that sort of spiritual need, which is why he isn't settling on like a Judeo-Christian thing. He's trying everything. So even the idea of her being like, hey, I have mystic abilities, he's like, oh my God, tell me all about it. And so I get it. I understand where he's coming from as a person who just really wants to feel like there's more to what's going on around him. But that's also the same reason that people get involved in cults and you see people become cultists because there's like, there must be more. Why is life the way it is? There must be more.

And then they get dragged in by people who are like, yeah, yeah, sure. There's more cut your balls off. And you're like, okay, I guess less means more. He just learned that the hard way that no matter how much he like tried to follow his religion, he couldn't pray the gay away. Because you just can't. That's who you are. There's nothing you can do about it. And he couldn't find it. And so now that comes this woman who's like, No, no, no, I have the

real answers. And it's fine. Don't worry about it. Here's the reality. So he goes out and gets his birth chart. And of course the chart, he gets his birth certificate to read his chart. And of course the chart they determined, confirmed their past connection from past lives and their shared vital mission in this lifetime that they're both experiencing right now.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I got a question. What chart, what chart? His astrological signs, his chart is like star chart when he was born, was a son coming up, all that shit again, just like those who love going to psychics or tarot card readers, whether there's any validity, validity, validity, validity. It's like a valid Italy. Yeah.

I'm Sally Tucci and this is validity. It's like a valid Italy. I'm Stanley Tucci and this is Validly. If there's any validity to any of that, mostly at the end of the day, people just want to be told everything's going to be cool. Everything's going to be all right. And so even if, even if you're like, I don't believe in the idea of a tarot card reader or a fortune teller, they are providing a service to people who just want to be told, Hey, you're going to, you know what, you're going to, you just want to be told, Hey, you're gonna, you know

what you're gonna, you're gonna be all right. So even though I may think it's all hogwash, I do kind of enjoy it. I do. I will, I will go get it like a tarot reading from time to time just to be like, yeah, that was fun. How'd you do that? Yeah. I love reading your personality, right? So I'm like, how'd you do that? It's like a tool made for introspection, you know? Yeah, Exactly. It's a way. It's a literally way exactly that for you to like probably think about things You wouldn't otherwise because you're a you're framing it in a unique way for your brain. Yeah, it's interesting I loved how to be honest. It's nice to have someone Read you as a person to see you and probably the way you see yourself

You know what I mean? Like you get someone who's not a friend who you don't really know to be like, ah Looking for love our way. They're like, how'd you know that? Oh My god, this is about me You have feel breaking down My god, thank you so much toFresh for sponsoring today's episode. And are you tired of figuring out what's for dinner night after night, especially on those busy weekdays? Well, you don't have to worry anymore or get tired of it.

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That's up to 10 free HelloFresh meals. Just go to hellofresh.com slash chill10fm. Remember HelloFresh is America's number one meal kit. Happy cooking. The interpretation of this astrological feedback, I guess, it's what provided the framework for both to attempt to and successfully recontextualize their recent struggles and suffering.

Their personal crises were no longer just failures or tragedies that happened in their lives. They were part of a confusing but ultimately meaningful transition guided by higher forces. Applewhite quickly came to view Nettles as his indispensable spiritual partner, the sage who possessed the knowledge that he lacked, perhaps even initially acknowledging her as the senior member in their partnership. Their bond was incredibly intense, forming the absolute core of this movement as I've said time and again.

And yet crucially, I have to remind everybody was always described by both themselves and early followers as entirely platonic and non sexual. This which is also unique for a cult leader, because most cult leaders, they're all about the fucking they're fucking their wives, maybe they have three wives. And then before they can marry the person in the cult, they got to sleep with them. And then it's like, yeah, this is very, I wouldn't say unique marry the person in the cult they got to sleep with them and then they it's like yeah This is very I wouldn't say unique but rare in the cult world in this dynamic mirrored Apple lights expressed desire for a sexless devotion like wife and his deep seated conflicts around physical

intimacy while still simultaneously Establishing the foundation for the extreme celibacy that would become a defining characteristic of the cult as a whole. They became an inseparable unit, and on New Year's Day 1973, they both left their old lives in Houston behind to fully embark on their shared quest. The very ambiguity surrounding their first encounter is just one of the parts where it adds to a lore, a shared mythos.

Whether Nettles believed aliens arranged in what, or Applewhite felt it was destiny, they instantly frame their meeting not as happenstance, but as a cosmical, cosmoloc, cosmically, good lord, significant event. This pattern of weaving personal experience into grand supernatural crazy narrative and or in finding divine meaning and crisis and confidence or in coincidence rather.

This is their fundamental mode of operation from here on out. It allowed them to interpret everything that followed recruitment successes and failures, societal reactions, astronomical events, as further evidence confirming their unique mission in the reality of what they called the next level. This is the intellectual and spiritual ferment shall we call it, following Apple White and Nettles 1972 meeting ferment. Yeah, like I like that. Yeah, I like that produced kind of just like a weird theological synthesis. It was emerging of streams, a mix of like, kind of mix and match theology born from her theosophical esoteric world and his very Protestant Christian world.

A familiarity with biblical narratives on his part, particularly the dramatic prophecies of the Book of Revelation, a vocabulary of sin, salvation, and divine mission inherited from his upbringing, in the performance-skilled, honed perhaps for the pulpit but now redirected, Nettles provided the vibrant, often startling colors of esoteric and the burgeoning New Age movement, a working knowledge of theosophy, astrology, spiritualism, a deep belief, at least according to her, in channeling spirits and alien intelligences, and a framework emphasizing spiritual evolution and hidden knowledge. And as Robert Balk aptly summarized, which we'll talk about him in more detail in the future,

Urb Applewhite supplied the Christianity and Bonnie Nettles supplied the spiritualism. Their initial joint ventures clearly illustrate this blend, and the Christian Art Center operated briefly in 1972 out of the Unitarian Church where Applewhite was music director, offered classes spanning religion, art, music, astrology, meditation, and mysticism. The name itself kind of suggests an attempt to bridge traditional Christianity with alternative practices.

It's quick demise though, possibly hastened by concerns over Nettles' se on activities that she was doing Which is not very okay in a church sure let led them to establish What was now what was known as quote-unquote the no place K and o w not the no like then Yeah, yeah sounds like it's from like yeah, so it's easy to see Fantasy shit or something. Yeah, that's it the no like, yeah. So it's easy to see fantasy shit or something. Yeah. That's the no place. This is kind of a metaphysical center where the esoteric and

the new age elements kind of became more dominant here. The name played on multiple meanings looking at self knowledge, know thyself and utopian placelessness, no place to play on words. And they sold their theosophical materials alongside other texts, which was a confluence of Nettles and his background. And it was during their time period of kind of relative withdrawal and moving away from those people they knew well and kind of just fusing together as a unit.

They had did a ton of studying, a ton of discussion, primarily between late 1972 and mid 1974 that the foundational concepts of their new unique worldview really began to solidify in the merging of their two beliefs became kind of unseparable. A cornerstone was their radical reinterpretation of the Bible itself, the Christian Bible, filtered through who else's but Bonnie's esoteric and UFO lens.

And by July, 1973, while camping near the Rogue River in Oregon, they experienced a key realization. They were the two witnesses, quote unquote, prophesized in Revelation 11. That's them! The Bible was talking about them the whole time. And this passage was central. They embraced the narrative that they would preach a final message, be killed by antagonistic

forces, the beast from the Revelation, lie dead for three and a half days, And then, and then they get to come back. Is that it? Bingo. Wow. Spectacularly resurrect and ascend into a cloud. And that cloud applying their materialistic and extraterrestrial cloud belief. Yeah. It was unequivocally in their world, a UFO. The cloud was a spacecraft from the next level. They even produced a MIMI, a MIMIograph

pam- a MIMIograph pamphlet. I don't know how to spell this, but, or how to pronounce this rather pamphlet around this time. And I cut this from the newspaper. It was called statement number three, that basically just to boil down a lot of rambling, hinted at Jesus's return in the form of a Texan, clearly implying and talking about Marshall Applewhite. That whole pam pam for them, they wrote out was basically a weird way of being

like, yo, Marshall Applewhite is actually Jesus guys. That's so fucking bold. Like, like whatever, you know, but like that's so fucking bold. It's funny is what it is. I have all of all the things. This guy's the one that's like, cut off your balls, guys. You know what? I'm Jesus. I'm Jesus. You need your balls.

It always gets there, though, doesn't it? It really doesn't like remind me. Genitals are always involved in some way. It always gets there though, doesn't it? It really doesn't remind me. Genitals are always involved in some way. Remind me to, to, unless you're doing it, we got to do Waco. Take Waco and take Waco. I'll take Waco. Cause I feel like go for it.

Yeah. I'm making a note because Waco is the exact like everything's fine. Everything's fine. It's fun. I'm Jesus. Every time it gets there and then it's like, and now we have to fight the government. It's like, what, bro, what again, that one guy who walked away is the real hero of the story. You know, like, yes, I'm all right. I'm keeping this thing.

I love this guy. I love touching my penis. I can't need this thing. I'm sorry. I need it. Um, yeah. And in this integration of UFOs into the Bible, it wasn't about just one Bible passage either. It became the fundamental organizing principle of their cosmology. They reasoned that Jesus hadn't merely ascended into a spiritual heaven. No, he had boarded a spacecraft and traveled to a literal physical next level. You have to understand when I say next level, I'm not like using playful words. It's capital N, capital L. That's what physical heaven is called. Headed to the next level. To the next level. It's like the good place. Capital T, capital G, capital P.

Yeah, exactly. It's a good place. G capital P. Yeah, exactly. And then, oh, again, as they call it, the evolutionary level above human Tila. Remember, right? Tequila tequila. They likewise, the two of them were not mere humans. Now they were emissaries from that same physical extraterrestrial level sent to Earth on a crucial mission. Well, yeah. Applewhite's writings from after his 1975 imprisonment state

from his, after his 1975 imprisonment, because he got caught stealing, state explicitly explaining his realization that they were aliens, extraterrestrials inhabiting human bodies, possibly what he deemed walk-ins who had entered adult bodies prepared for them. Their reading was, yeah, I know, it's more of a disassociation mixed with depersonalization and schizophrenia.

Um, all right. Their reading wasn't confined to just scripture anymore. They consumed science fiction works by the authors like Robert Heinlein and Arthur C. Clarke whose visions of space travel, advanced beings, and transforms consciousness resonated with and I would even argue helped them develop and shape their narrative. And while present from early on, they consciously recognized later that the UFO angle was actually a potent tool for attracting attention in both from a potential followers within the burgeoning UFO subculture and from the media and they fucking embraced it. They called themselves the UFO cult. That is what

they did. And intertwining with this with cosmic drama, intertwined rather with this cosmic drama was the demanding path of personal transformation that they called human individual metamorphosis or HIM, which also served as an early name for the group before they settled on heaven's gate. They just called themselves human individual metamorphosis, that's what they were. Human individual metamorphosis. We are here to play jazz from instruments that we made with our own hands. We are going to paint our message on our bodies with music.

I just picture for me still watching Daredevil. I pictured a group showing up at Xavier school and they're like, we are the human individual metamorphosis. And now we're here to fucking take over like a bad guy version of the X-Men That's not led by Magneto, but led by somebody dumber Yeah All right, you know, that's what my brain when I was like, you've clearly never read. Yeah, no I'll tell you guys about the X-Men one. Please. That's not That my X-Men would never To me my X-Men

Come to me. Welcome to die To me, my X-Men, come to me. Welcome to die. Yeah, this wasn't just spiritual growth. This was it was presented as a literal physical process to reach next level to qualify for boarding the spacecraft. One had to quote unquote overcome all aspects of human nature. This meant ruthlessly eliminating attachments to material possessions, earthly relationships,

the family and friends, careers, and most emphatically, your balls. All forms of sensuality. Of your balls. And sexuality, yeah, you had to get rid of both sensuality of your balls and sexuality. Yeah. You got to get rid of both sensual and sexual. They taught that this rigorous overcoming process would trigger actual biological and chemical changes within the body transforming

the human vehicle or container with air quotes into a perfected genderless extraterrestrial form suited for life in space. The space caterpillar, shall we say. Achieving its space butterfly state. Capital G goaded form. Yeah, a space butterfly state. A crucial point in this early theology was the absolute necessity, by the way, of achieving this transformation while alive in a physical body. Death was not was a failure. If you died before you could perfect was a coming failure, you failed and all that would lead to was getting thrown back in the reincarnation cycle and being stuck going through another.

Okay, I see what they were going for. Yeah. You're trying to like, be free. You're trying to break the wheel like Khaleesi in seasons one through five of Game of Thrones. Yeah. Almost the entire show until it all related to the show. One of the early linchpins holding these ideas together in their early public message when they're trying to get people was the dramatic prophecy of the demonstration. This was rooted directly in their self identification as the two witnesses of Revelation 11,

where they proclaimed their mission would culminate in a shocking public spectacle. They would preach their truth, be assassinated by earthly authorities or other and take antagonistic forces representing the beast lie dead for exactly three and a half days, a detail that they emphasize and drew right out of revelations, 1111. And then miraculously, of course,

resurrect their bodies healed and replaced by next level technology before visibly being levitated off the ground into their bodies healed and replaced by next level technology before visibly being levitated off the ground into a UFO waiting in the cloud. This was what they thought was gonna happen, which is, it's wild because it's like pretty normal until they say, and then we're gonna wake up in new technological bodies

and we'll be like technologically ascended. This, the purpose of this prophesized event, it was to be the ultimate irrefutable proof. The demonstration validating their divine authority, the reality of the next level, and the truth of their seemingly unbelievable claims about metamorphosis and UFOs. It was the dramatic climax that all cults need designed to shock the world into recognition that they were right all along. However, when they attempted to share this message during their initial travels in 1974, targeting churches and metaphysical groups both equally, they encountered mainly what

do you expect but rejection, skepticism, and a ton of ridicule. The predicted martyrdom did not occur, of course, yet the prophecy itself contained an inherent resilience. Crucially in its early formulation, the demonstration prophecy, while specific in its sequence of events, death, resurrection, ascension, lacked a definite timeline, one of the things that most cults get wrong. Most cults slap a timeline right at the beginning, which puts them on a clock. But if you are able to start a cult without defining a timeline, you can drag that fucker

on as long as you want. And this ambiguity would be the key. The failure of the martyrdom to happen immediately didn't invalidate its core belief at all. It simply meant the timing wasn't right yet. It hasn't happened yet. It allowed Apple White and Bonnie and any very, very early isolated followers that they were able to get to maintain their belief system while living in a state of constant high stakes anticipation, always ready for the prophesized climax to

happen every day. It just keeps you on fucking edge and it constant, high stakes anticipation, always ready for the prophesized climax to happen every day. It just keeps you on fucking edge and it keeps you hooked. The prophecy provided a very powerful narrative framework that was obviously scripture mixed with theosophy and bestowing significance upon them without demanding immediate empirically verifiable fulfillment. This flexibility stands, like I said before, in stark contrast to later, more specific prophecies that would happen because eventually you need to re-up the high

on your followers and new prophecies need to happen. And these prophecies, like the ones that would eventually be tied to the Hale-Bopp comet, whose failures forced more significant and complex theological adjustments. It's in its initial adaptable form. It was served as sort of potent, but these later ones would end up in a way being the destruction of Heaven's Gate in conjunction with what happens with Bonnie Nettles later as well. The period after Marshall Applewhite's early release from released from jail in early 1975, just so you know, he served roughly six months out in Missouri for keeping a rental car well beyond its return date. That's like the most lame fucking reason to get thrown in jail.

He just pretty funny. It's like some alcohol. Yeah. It's after this because he had met Bonnie at this point. He had to go to jail for a little bit. And then when he came out, he reunited with Bonnie who had worked as a nurse during his imprisonment and they resolved to find their crew from this point on the individuals that were destined to join their rider.

Yeah. Yeah. You got to find your right and people ride and die. Correct. Got to ride and die. Yeah. Yeah, you got to find your people. Yeah, ride and die. Correct. You got to ride and die. Eventually you will die. Applewhite's time in prison isolation, as he termed it, had apparently solidified his conviction that they were not merely human messengers, but actual extraterrestrials inhabiting human bodies, perhaps since birth as walk-ins, implying that the soul of the original human that was supposed to be there was pushed out and sent into the reincarnation cycle again, I guess. It doesn't really elaborate on that. Their recruitment strategy, though, would involve a blitz of public meetings across California and Oregon during 1975.

They would advertise through flyers, sometimes hand-delivered and potentially newspaper ads in some areas. At these gatherings, they presented themselves as emissaries from the next level, inviting attendees to join an experiment, quote-unquote, in human evolution. The core message was demanding and unambiguous. Perspective followers had to walk out the door of their current lives, abandon their careers, possessions, relationships, and all earthly attachments to prepare for boarding a literal spacecraft. A poster used for a meeting in Canada College in Redwood City, California,

exemplifies their appeal. It said, quote, If you have ever entertained the idea that there may be a real, physical level beyond the earth's confines You will want to attend this meeting. Yeah. Yeah, you will want to attend this meeting Their identities and the group's name remained really fluid during this phase still Apple white nettles were the two or the UFO to It's kind of just all they went by at this point. That's so lame. It's so that's everything about this show. So lame bro. Apple white is so fucking lame.

He's just a lame dude. He let math is down dude. Yeah. Well he's fun. He's funny lame. I'll give you that. And honestly when you cut the balls off you have my attention. Anybody willing to go that far for their delusions.

You haven't bored me. You're just weird. No, no, I'm out. They also ended up getting a lot of nicknames that they adopted. They like adopted nicknames for themselves. First was a baffling one. Bonnie was known as Guinea and Marsha Applewhite was known as pig. That was their Guinea and pig. Guinea and pig.

Yeah. Yeah. And then there was like a more, I don't know, was it fairy tale? Ask. I don't know. Like Apple. I don't know what you call this, Pat, but, uh, Apple white would be called Bo and Bonnie would called be called peep. Oh, peep together.

They're Bo peep. Okay. A little Bo peep. Okay. Yeah, I got it. Yeah. Yeah. These kinds of nicknames eventually evolved into the more familiar.

What Nettles would be called TTI representing the higher octave or tuning in and doe for Apple White, which was the musical note. The group itself was often just the group or sometimes Guinea Pig, reflecting the leader's initials nickname. Sometimes The Group just called themselves The Guinea Pigs or The Group, before eventually formalizing for a bit on what I said earlier, human individual metamorphosis, him. And later names like Total Overcomers Anonymous, which is just the worst name in the world, bro. Total Overcomers Anonymous. is just the worst name in the world, bro. Total over-conamers anonymous. Eventually though, they finally would settle

on what we all know, Heaven's Gate. That was finally adopted, but hilariously, it was only adopted near the very end of their journey. They just didn't really have a solid name. Now, the first follower was a woman by the name of Sharon Morgan. And she had joined and then left back in 1974 after only four months.

Her departure and kind of subsequent actions by her husband led to the charges led to the charges against the two that you try to bring them to court. But this is where momentum kind of began. A crucial meeting occurred in April 9th. And I say say crucial because this is really where they get their first real person in Studio City, Los Angeles hosted at the home of psychic Joan Culpepper and the audience of roughly 40 to 80 people largely consisted of members from another Metaphysical group led by Clarence Klug which focused on self-initiation. I love that name by the way Clarence Clarence Clugg, which focused on self-initiation. I love that name, by the way, Clarence Clugg.

Clarence Clugg? Clarence Clugg. Clarence Clugg. His little group focused on alchemy and interpretations of Revelation, of course, and Clugg's group, already familiar with concepts of transcendence, bodily transformation, even incorporating tantric practices for some, and allegorical readings of scripture, he was reportedly experiencing internal turmoil and a decline in his own membership of his group, his own little cult, making them particularly receptive to, again, I say charismatic with quotes, the charismatic message of, bow and

peep, baby. Even Culpepper, later a critic, acknowledged their initial power describing their aura of love and understanding and Applewhite's hypnotic eyes. Yeah. Those eyes. They, they are fucking weird. I can't tell if there's emptiness behind them or not, but they are. They're interesting every night for you. This kind of like praying on a dying cult, which is something that Jonestown leader did, by the way, well, I'm gonna I can't wait to do Jonestown one day, but he did the same thing. He kind of prayed on dying groups

of people like groups of cults. The result was significant between 23 and 27 individuals, including most of Clugs remaining followers committed to join their nascent movement man. They just really like alright club Well your prophecies didn't work out So maybe this guy's will then just goes right over to fucking Paul to Applewhite and Nettles And later that year the recruitment focus shifted north the Waldport Oregon meeting the Waldport Oregon meeting on September 14th, 1975 held at the Waldport Inn under the provocative banner, UFOs, why they are here, who they

have come for, when will they leave, drew a crowd of about 150 to 250 people. And the two of them presented their message, blending vaguely biblical themes with explicit claims about extraterrestrial origins, including for figures like Jesus, Ezekiel, and Elijah, and the promising of leaving Earth on a UFO for a better life on another planet and completing their training. Some attendees interpreted this as the second coming. The impact was again dramatic. In the days following, another estimated 20-30-ish local residents abruptly abandoned their lives,

jobs, homes, families, possessions and disappeared to follow the two. This mass departure caused a local media frenzy for a bit and brought the group national and brought the group some national attention, including a segment on the CBS Evening News with Walter Cronkite himself. It was this like he just like walked into this place and just scooped up 20 to 30 people. And then similar meetings were held across the San Francisco Bay Area shortly after, including gatherings at Canada College and until Tilden Park, Berkeley. Who were these individuals that were willing to take a leap? The profile painted by earlier reports from most of these people and sociological studies

is pretty consistent. They were predominantly young, though with exceptions, of course, like John Craig, who was a successful middle-aged businessman and former political candidate who joined them. But most of them were often single and overwhelmingly characterized as quote, long time seekers of truth. Many came from middle-class backgrounds and included students, meditators, former hippies, uh, individuals that have just immersed themselves in the cultic world, uh, or subscribed to new age culture. To me,

everybody here just didn't feel like they belonged in the world that they were in. That's just kind of the template, right? Yeah. Vulnerable people looking for a place that they can find answers as you guys said earlier. They weren't really like social outcasts per se, but rather people that were just searching for meaning and purpose or community outside of what conventional society had offered. Many were veteran seekers, having previous explored various

spiritual paths like Scientology, Yoga, Zen, and other offbeat cults like Clugs. They've tried the others. People talk about how they tried hallucinogens, tarot, astrology. For this specific demographic, Nettles and Applewhite, their message, however strange it is to us, resonated and it clicked, felt logical, offered a compelling answer to their their quest and joining joining demanded

immense sacrifice, severing ties, like I said, with everything to them that meant they were serious, this had to be a test to show that they really, truly were ready to ascend. The recruitment method itself acted as a powerful selection mechanism too. The process was deliberately accelerated, an intense but brief public meeting,

a follow-up session for the truly interested, like they do one, get a bunch of people, then weed all the people who are not really interested and do another one, and then an immediate high stakes decision, potential recruits had only a few days to completely dismantle their former lives and catch up with the group, which was already getting ready to move on. Like if you want to be with us, we leave in three days.

And if you want to be with us, you have to let go of everything. If you don't, best of luck to you in the next cycle, we're moving on. And this gives you, it gives you the Fafo like, like, uh, like don't want enough Fafo. Let's talk around and find out what is like the first. You don't want to miss something. Oh, well, that's where I fear of missing out. Yeah. You're missing out. So you're telling me that, that basically they hit them with like, look guys, you could

kill yourself right now and join us on the next level or, or miss out and wait till next time. In which case that's going to be a while for you. So you might want to get on board now. So essentially that wasn't it yet. Cause remember at this point their cult was your bodies are going to evolve and you're going to become a sexless alien creature and leave. I'm already out. Physical body. Yeah. Well, yeah.

That's why that other dude left was like, I like my penis. No sexless alien creature. No, no, I'm fine being. Look, guys, I heard of a deal with the sexless human creature. Am I right? And then you leave. Yeah. I imagine it went like this meeting one where a bunch of people came, they gave the hits they're

like, aliens, Jesus is an alien, heavens real, we can leave. Then the second one when they got the people were interested like, look, it's what we said is true, but it's going to require a ton of sacrifice and evolution, a severance of your desires, and it's going to be very hard, but the end will be worth it. They didn't give them the hard pitch until they got the man's like, listen to the news these days. That's crazy. to be very hard, but the end will be worth it. They didn't give them the hard pitch until they got the listen to the news these days. That's crazy.

I know. Wild. But once the, you know, after the, this provided there, this structure precluded gradual integration or the formation of strong social bonds before making the commitment. Instead, it's selected for, for individuals with a high degree of preexisting motivation, people who are already ready for radical change and a willingness to act right now based on the immediate perceived truth or what they believe to

be the plausibility at the very least of their message, which to them filtered out everybody other than true believers. And to some degree, I can see the thought, the very broken thought behind that. But the reason that true believers is because they're very vulnerable and making an impulsive decision like that is very hard to go back and fucking undo. So you kind of essentially trap yourself in a weird way. Once the initial groups of followers had committed, Heaven's Gate embarked on a period of intense nomadic existence that defined its first couple of

years, roughly between mid like the mid 1975 through 1976. The crew as they call themselves because they weren't really Heaven's Gate yet. And they began to see this. Yeah, I know. They it's like the gang. Yeah, the hom the crew, the homies, the bros. These guys traveled extensively primarily across the western and midwestern US. Their lifestyle was very Spartan, often involving camping in remote natural settings along rivers in Oregon and national forest in Wyoming, near reservoirs in Colorado. They sometimes even found temporary lodging in the homes of sympathizers or on farms,

but movement was constant and often just unpredictable, reinforcing their isolation from mainstream society. Financial resources were extremely limited, especially early on. Members lived near poverty, sometimes donating blood for cash or taking temporary, low-paying jobs like clerking or being a server to fund their travels. They relied heavily on donations, eventually by pooling the resources members brought upon

joining having given up all their other personal assets. They acquired several campers making their wandering slightly less precarious. Here's the other part that I don't really, I don't think I made very clear. They didn't give up their money and give it to Marshall. They left it all behind. They didn't like, they had some belongings and some stuff, but it wasn't like he or my cult leader take all my money. No, they were scrambling.

They were all living. They were just bad at culting, I see. Yeah, he was just bad at culting. Yeah, yeah. He should come to me first. I would have been like, my man, you gotta get the money. Then you get the women, then you get the power. That's what it's about.

He wouldn't have done it. And life within the group quickly evolved into this highly structured, like regimen aimed squarely at facilitating what was known as the overcoming process, the shedding of all human attachments and characteristics. The core rules were demanding, relinquish your material possessions, like I said, no family, coming process, the shedding of all human attachments and characteristics. The core rules were demanding. Relinquish your material possessions like I said, no family, all that stuff, quit jobs,

worldly distractions were strictly forbidden. That means even while they were traveling, no popular music, no reading materials besides approved texts, which were primarily just the Bible initially, and no following the news, no recreational drugs, no alcohol, no tobacco, even reminiscing or talking about one's past was discouraged, though not against the rules. Daily life soon followed meticulous schedules,

which is key to any cult. Later, this would solidify into the adoption of uniform androgynous clothing to further minimize individuality and gender distinctions. That's what they did in middle school. Yes, yes. I find this interesting too because a lot of cults do this metaphorically. They remove people's individuality by, yes, severing them, but they keep them on really

high work schedules. Jonestown, for instance, constantly had their leader blaring his his things over megaphones 24 seven while they slept or not. The point is to make you think like the cult leader to be like him, but rarely do they make them wear and like, physically outwardly express this uniformity. But here here it was part of it. The androgynous clothing and all that stuff. Right.

Essential and maybe even most challenging for most of these people though, was the absolute prohibition of all sexual activity, including masturbation. What's the point of joining a cult if it can't be wild sex cult? It's cause that those are the fake cults. This is a real cult. That's going to go to space. That's stupid. That's not a real call.

That's a dumb call. In space, dude, no one can hurt you cream. Yeah. I hate you, dude. You're welcome, dude. You have to keep quick. You have to keep it quick if you want to be funny like me. You know what I mean? You got always swing for the fences like Babe Ruth. Go for all the easy ones.

Well, there ain't any creaming of spades. You're in an androgynous alien body. This rule, deeply rooted in Apple White's personal struggles very clearly, was enforced through the check partner system. Which is a lot like the Speaker of the Houses and His Sons, Let's Check What Porn We Watch system. That's real fun. What is the name of that app that they use? I can't remember, but... I don't want to know. Speaker Mike Johnson. Jesus fun. What is the name of that app that they use? I can't remember, but Speaker Mike Johnson. Jesus Watch. Jesus is watching. Check it. They don't jerk it. Two tabs on each other's fucking porn. Very normal. I don't want to know.

I want to know. Do you want to know if your son's watching porn? No, I don't. First of all, I don't want to know that I have a son. Second of all, don't tell me that he just sits around all day watching porn. Well, not if you're keeping tabs on his porn watching habits and texting him like a good father should. You're right. Well, first off, uh, what?

Second off. Oh, you didn't know this, Jesse? No, I'm aware. Okay. It's just a lot of weird people. And I just, yeah. If we can't lead a cult, join politics. Um, so basically, yeah, yeah, it really is.

Uh, this was a, so yeah, yeah, it really is. This was so yeah, he had me he enforced this non sexuality verse with the Czech partner system. Members in this system were paired up, often heterosexually, but deliberately mismatched to minimize attraction, like trying to put people who they don't think have chemistry together. And or sometimes same sex if the individual was gay to force confrontation of those desires, huh?

He genuinely thought That the Czech partner system would work best if you put people who Sometimes are attracted to each other to force the individuals to confront their desires so they can overcome them Right, that's what would happen. All right. Well, that doesn't happen for you. If you walked in and say, you know, your girlfriend or whatever is lying in the bed and she's naked, like, come fuck me. You don't think you could stop yourself. Like, I don't need human temptations anymore. Am I in a cult? Is it just like Thursday? Yeah, I would I would have quite every like hold on. I guess if you're in a cult, what is you yourself? You yourself are in a cult and it's check night It's check partner night you go home and as you walk in the person they hit paired you up with somebody you have pretty good chemistry with in this call and is very attractive is like a baby she's like in lingerie and Now do I buy into this call or am I like the guy who's like nah, I'm keeping my balls. I Well, I was gonna say it's you in the call. I don't know why you got into this call or am I like the guy who's like, nah, I'm keeping my balls. I, well, I was gonna say it's you in the call.

I don't know why you got into the call. I'm just saying, Jesse, you buy in at this point, but this happens to you. She's a red head too. And, uh, Oh F the cult then. No matter how much you believe. No, I don't believe that much.

How could you have let this happen, man? I'll take the call down from the inside. You kidding me? I'll go to the police. I'll be like, I love her officer. I love her so much. Get my baby out of there. My baby out of there.

You failed the check system, Jesse. Oh, damn system. Oh no. When you get paired up with somebody, you were expected to monitor each other constantly, reporting infractions and creating a catalytic conflict designed to expose and overcome human weakness like attraction, irritation, and frustration. Like attraction. Yeah, that's one of the few in this whole case.

One of the many human weaknesses. So many. One of the many human weaknesses, exactly. Partners were rotated frequently to prevent deep emotional bonds from forming because maybe they'd go off and play. Communication was also managed with periods of enforced silence known as tomb time. Tomb time? Yeah, that's too weird.

As in like hanging out in the tomb? Like a little tomb time? Yeah, a little tomb time. I don't love that. Keep yourselves in check. I don't love it. I gotta in check. I don't love it. I got to be honest. They don't love that. No, that sounds great.

It was implemented to quiet human chat. Tim, the tomb man, Taylor. I don't think so, Tim. I don't know. Well, that's what I said. Welcome back to. I would say I don't think so, too. I'm Jackie Wells.

I'd say, hey, tomba. You tomba. That's a great game. Toma. It was again, quiet human chatter. Tomb time was to shut up everybody up and to have them focus and to be able to have them in a, be able to focus better essentially. Now how do you, what kind of tomb do we have today? I don't think so, Tomba. That's it. That's all you get to say. Okay. essentially. Now, how do you, what kind of tomb do we have today?

I don't think so too. That's it. That's all you get to say. Okay. The combination of constant mobility, geographic isolation, and these intensely demanding rules created totalistic, like totalistic, totalistic. It was like its own culture separate from everything else. Completely. It just cut members off not only from their external support systems, but it prevented them from developing support systems within the cult itself. You weren't allowed to get close to anybody. So you're just isolated anyway. That's how they work. So you can't all realize together.

Wait, this is stupid. This formative period for the cult was completely filled with like internal and external pressures. The leaders faced legal issues stemming from their earlier activities. Financial hardship was a constant concern. The mysterious disappearances, particularly in Oregon, Oregon generated negative media attention and public suspicion. And occasionally distraught family members would track the group down, leading to difficult confrontations. Nobody got killed.

People just left the fuck of cult. And sometimes people quietly left town and didn't tell anybody and joined the cult, which is why people had those towns. They would just like, they'd come in, do their shtick, and then people wouldn't even tell their family and would just vanish. And maybe perhaps partly reacting to this external pressure

and potentially feeling that they had recruited a sufficient core group at this point over these couple of years. Uh, though membership numbers fluctuated pretty heavily and estimates vary depending on the source. Bonnie Nettles made a pivotal announcement in the spring of 1976 around April 21st, quote, the harvest is closed. There will be no more meetings. The harvest is closed. There will be no more meetings. Harvest is closed.

Yep. This declaration marked the end of the crew, their initial with their initial phase of active public proselytizing and gathering new initiates. And now from this point, the group turned decisively inward. Yeah. And then they all had to migrate from the crew servers over to the crew two servers because Ubisoft said you don't actually own games.

You own the crew. Yeah, exactly, correct. Same thing. The focus shifted entirely into the intensive processing and indoctrination of its now existing members. The classroom phase began in earnest. And later that summer, the two gathered the remaining flock which was around 85 to 90 individuals who answered the call, and in the remote, isolated Medicine Bow National Forest in Wyoming, there they instituted a far more centralized

and rigid structure yet again. No longer just messengers. Tea and dough or, you know, apple, white and nettles asserted absolute authority and booboo BB and booboo being a bone peep. They asserted absolute authority over all aspects of the members lives, becoming the sole source of teaching and direction. The decentralized family units were dissolved in favor of a single, hierarchical community akin to a roving monastery of sorts.

This reflected the new emphasis on conformity and obedience. They expelled 19 members later that year who were deemed insufficiently committed, unwilling to follow the stricter rules or disrespectful of the leaders authorities, which in turn kind of created a deeper fervor for the people who were still in there. Because now not only were the gates closed, but fuck, they're serious. They're willing to throw people out, which usually doesn't happen in a cult. Most of the time they go through the extreme. They're like seriously.

To be people in. Yeah. This, they were like, you're out. Goodbye. You're done. Um, this organizational kind of consolidation proved very effective, at least initially the high rate of defection slowed after the initial purge and the boundary between the group and the outside world became sharply defined,

reinforcing their sectarian identity at this point. Even when financial necessity later forced members temporarily back into outside jobs because they just needed money, the group's cohesion still largely held, cemented by their shared commitment and the intensified internal focus. shared commitment and the intensified internal focus. Human individual metamorphosis had weathered it's chaotic and like kind of early phase and transformed now into a more disciplined, centralized and isolated, much more religious movement, I would say. And I, it's essential for me to just say it again and reiterate how

demanding these rules were perceived internally. They weren't simply endured. They were embraced as necessary disciplines, the essential spiritual technology for achieving the promised physical metamorphosis into the sex, sexless being denying every facet of humanness from sexuality and even enjoying food. You are no longer like this is this is how intense it starts to get. You are no longer allowed to enjoy food, personal possessions, no joy at all. That was the work.

It was the difficult but necessary labor requirement to overcome humaneness and prepare for the UFO for its ultimate filtration. It's insane. And I just have to frame this extreme deprivation as the direct path to salvation. The leaders made the lifestyle meaningful, even desirable because the punishments now were part of the religion to ascend.

Most of the time in cults, punishments are for stepping out and to bring you back into line. Here, the punishments, if you don't punish yourself, you get kicked out. The punishments are the cult. So even further in like very nefariously ingrained this very unique psychology into these cult members that a lot of other cults didn't have. And to truly grasp why a movement like Heaven's Gate could gain

traction, attracting dozens, then hundreds of seemingly ordinary people to abandon their lives for this crazy world is again, the swirling culture of 70s America. It helped clear out the solution wanted to fucking go. Yeah, that's it. It's like that dude who went to Alaska. Yeah. And like lost all his shit out there. Oh, wait, what? Wait, I don't know.

You know, they made a movie about him. It was like, he just like left society behind and like, okay, went out into a van and then he like died because he didn't know how to live out there. But messed up. Pretty cool story. Yeah, I'll have to go look it up. I don't know anything about it. So it sounds wild.

The most distinctive element of the movie is the fact that it's a movie that's like because he didn't know how to live out there, but messed up. Pretty cool story. Yeah. I'll have to go look it up. I don't know anything about it. So it sounds wild. The most distinctive element of the, the, this, this cult though, was the UFO zeitgeist of the seventies that they were tapping into this widespread public fascination and obsession with UFOs sparked obviously by the post-World Two sightings like Kenneth Arnold's flying saucers in 1947, the Roswell crash that we've covered extensively belief in E.T.'s visiting was very mainstream. Even Gallup polls that I dug up showed a majority of Americans believed UFOs were a real phenomena back then.

This interest was sustained by ongoing sighting reports often still kind of do man. Yeah, I wonder if the majority I wonder if the majority do believe still. Yeah, you might be right. It might be the majority feel like they do. Yeah. This interest was sustained by like I said, ongoing citing reports, often ambiguous official investigations like the Air Force's Project Blue Book concluded in 1969, but left many unconvinced thanks to the jail and Heineck afterward in a growing subculture dedicated to collecting

accounts speculating about origins and alleging government coverups. The idea of a cosmic water gate that authorities were hiding the truth about alien contact and heaven's gate was the answer in currency for them. And of course, legends surrounding area 51 in Nevada began to percolate too at this point. This cultural preoccupation provided the perfect farming ground for the emergence of UFO religions and contact team movements. Groups like Jordan Adamski's followers, the Aetherius Society and Unarius Academy of Science claimed direct communication with benevolent, spiritually

advanced brothers, often delivering messages of cosmic wisdom, warning about nuclear war, promising the future salvation via spacecraft, that humans were the center of all and the most important things in the whole wide universe. These groups frequently took UFO beliefs with elements of theosophy or spiritualism and binded them together positioning the aliens as akin to the ascended masters of Madame Blavatsky or angels. The development of ancient astronaut theory, which was popularized by Eric Von Deineken's bestseller, chariots of the gods, probably.

Isn't it Donaghet? Maybe. Years of listening to Coast to Coast AM at an overnight job. Donnig it. Maybe years of years of listening to coast to coast a.m. at an overnight job. I'm almost sure you turn out that for I think that is yeah, it might be dying to get. Yeah. Eric von Donoghue. I believe is what they would is what they're done again. Donnig Donnig. I think that at least that's what George Norrie I think you used to say. Yeah. His bestseller the chariots of the gods from 1968 provided another layer that kind of suggested aliens had visited earth and antiquity and were responsible for myths, religions, megalithic structures and ancient aliens,

the TV show, baby. We got it because of him. Um love that show. It's fun. This theory offered a like for reading ancient texts and including the Bible allowed them to take these as records of extraterrestrial encounters and merge them into the Heaven's Gate beliefs. Heaven's Gate core narrative, benevolent, highly evolved aliens from the next level arriving in a spacecraft to offer physical ascension to a select few prepared to leave the corrupt earth behind fit perfectly within this already existing cultural and religious niche that had bubbled up. They quite skillfully, if I may add, leverage the public's fascination to use it as their hook.

Again, they call themselves the UFO cult. to use it as their hook. Uh, again, they call themselves the UFO cult and the conversion of convergence of all of these factors, the widespread spiritual seeking and openness to alternative beliefs fostered by the new age movement, the lingering countercultural rejection, UFOs and so on and so on created the unique perfect storm. As we said, right at the beginning that created heaven's

gate and allowed it to take root. Apple white and Nettles Nettle's message resonated precisely because it spoke to all of these currents simultaneously. It offered a radical path of rejection, transformation, and transcendence, all framed within the culturally familiar and authoritative language of Christian revelation. Their initial success wasn't just due to charisma or doctrine alone, but to me, the kind of incredible congruence between their specific ideological brew and the specific anxieties,

aspirations, and available narratives in 1970s America for a particular segment of the population and again It speaks how small the cult was that was already searching for something radically different The two of them offered a story that seemed however bizarrely to make sense of everything Man that is fucking crazy, dude. Yeah, this is we end here. Um, got one little bit left and then we'll wrap it up. But I know it's a bit of a longer one. Uh, at the heart of with Marshall and Bonnie at the heart, their intense platonic bond, which was forged in that mythical origin point of mutual crisis became the engine for the

cults movement moving out movement moving on from here. Applewhite provided the captivating stage presence. He even included his own musical talent, repurposed it to tell his own prophecies via song to the cult. Kind of sick. Yeah, it's kind of cool. And a framework derived from his Presbyterian upbringing, which helped him kind of like bring a sense of doom and immediacy to all of his messages. Nettles contributed the vital esoteric

content drawn from her deep dive into Madame Blavatsky's Theosophy, astrology and all that other stuff. The lens through which Applewhite's apparent psychological breakdown could be reframed, like I said, as this divine communication that all these people in the cult now believed. And the radical message found resonance within the specific cultural climate. And with these targets now fully on board, Nettles declared and with Nettles having

declared the harvest closed, the real difficulties became harvest is closed. Because starting in part two, or in part two as we move on to end this, we'll talk about the event that happened to Bonnie Nettles that would send this already off the walls cult into one that would be willing to take their very own lives after castrating themselves as well.

And why, you probably don't know Bonnie Nettles until today. And that's what we'll pick up next week for Heaven's Gate, part two. All right. Fucking hell dude. Thank you guys so much for listening. We're off to do, yeah, Heaven's Gate's super fun. It's so 70s flavored.

It is, it is. And at the end with it's like, it is very 90s flavored the way it all ends. It's interesting how it does kind of move and morph with the decade. We're kind of examining it in at the time. Wild style. Yeah. So we'll we're off to go to patreon.com slash human iPod.

We got to go do a mini-sode for you all. Thank you all so much for your support. Do you again head over to the yeti.com slash illuminati. Go check that out. Also, personal plug head over to twitch.tv slash pod by night. Oh, our second campaign after our five year campaign and taking six months off in between is going to be beginning on Saturday around two p.m. The pod Mark Mir. Yeah, no, Mark.

You're not on this one. There's a friend of the pod bub dot Tracy and a few others Is the pod bub dot Tracy and a few others and a bunch of others anyway, uh, that's it for us Thank you guys so much again. We appreciate you. We love you. Goodbye Lavanda anyway Me and my wife were sitting outside indulging on our porch one night enjoying ourselves I needed to go to the bathroom So I stepped back inside and after a few moments, I hear my wife go,

holy shit, get out of here. So I quickly dash back outside. She's looking up at the sky in awe. I look up too, and there's a perfect line of dozen lights traveling across the sky. So I'm gonna be a good boy Thanks for watching!